Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

[John Thomas]

Unfortunately, pricing is all over the board, and there are schools that are 
buying 100 meg circuits. In CA Comcast territory, they offer 100 meg by 10 ( or 
20 ) for about $399 per month. Now, we all know that Comcast cherry picks where 
they provide service, so there are those that are a block away from Comcast 
facilities that have been quoted $10,000 or more to get connected.

In Oakland CA, there is a wireless provider that is doing 25 meg / 25 meg at 
$375 per month. In San Francisco Monkey brains is doing something similar.

John

Kevin Owen  wrote:
>It will be an interesting discussion for sure.  We currently have
>service built to many schools, most with the capacity to provide 100 +
>megs.  Most schools are purchasing somewhere in the 5 – 20meg range as
>that is what they can afford, including their current subsidy from
>E-Rate.  We are providing service to rural schools and they just can’t
>afford more.  Not sure how the FCC feels these schools will be able to
>afford 100+ meg connections and beyond that, where does the money come
>from to continue to fund E-Rate with what are sure to be large
>increased demands on the funding to support these larger pipes.
>
>Kevin
>
>
>From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
>Behalf Of Mike Hammett
>Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 12:35 PM
>To: WISPA General List
>Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd
>
>I think so. I asked the same question a few weeks ago and the response
>was something to the effect of, "Is this something WISPA members want
>to respond to?" The response seemed to be a resounding yes.
>
>Now I just hope that it's something that we can get a piece of vs.
>telling them to not do it.
>
>
>-
>Mike Hammett
>Intelligent Computing Solutions
>http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>From: "Kevin Owen" mailto:ko...@fsr.com>>
>To: "WISPA General List"
>mailto:wireless@wispa.org>>
>Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:42:13 PM
>Subject: [WISPA] ConnectEd
>Do we know if WISPA as an organization is currently reviewing or plans
>to review/make comments to the NPRM for the revisions to the E-Rate
>program.  Is WISPA following the discussions concerning the Federal
>ConnectED program that wants to see a minimum connection standard to
>all schools and libraries of 100 megs with a 5 year goal of having
>access to 1 gig of available bandwidth for all schools and libraries?
>
>thanks,
>
>Kevin Owen
>First Step Internet, LLC
>
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>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

[Brian Webster]

Right now the rule of thumb for adequate bandwidth to a school is 100k per 
student. Documenting what schools currently have is a hot topic for the 
national broadband map. We are diving deep on this topic in Illinois and it’s 
like herding cats. We did hear back from the Chicago City Schools and while we 
are trying to get a more definitive data set from them, they did state that the 
high school buildings typically have 50 meg and the elementary buildings 20 
meg. There are many more elementary school buildings than high school buildings 
in Chicago so the student population at each location is different and this the 
different bandwidth. 

 

Thank You,

Brian Webster

www.wirelessmapping.com

www.Broadband-Mapping.com

 

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Kevin Owen
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 3:50 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

 

It will be an interesting discussion for sure.  We currently have service built 
to many schools, most with the capacity to provide 100 + megs.  Most schools 
are purchasing somewhere in the 5 – 20meg range as that is what they can 
afford, including their current subsidy from E-Rate.  We are providing service 
to rural schools and they just can’t afford more.  Not sure how the FCC feels 
these schools will be able to afford 100+ meg connections and beyond that, 
where does the money come from to continue to fund E-Rate with what are sure to 
be large increased demands on the funding to support these larger pipes.

 

Kevin

 

 

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 12:35 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

 

I think so. I asked the same question a few weeks ago and the response was 
something to the effect of, "Is this something WISPA members want to respond 
to?" The response seemed to be a resounding yes.

Now I just hope that it's something that we can get a piece of vs. telling them 
to not do it.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com

 

  _  

From: "Kevin Owen" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:42:13 PM
Subject: [WISPA] ConnectEd

Do we know if WISPA as an organization is currently reviewing or plans to 
review/make comments to the NPRM for the revisions to the E-Rate program.  Is 
WISPA following the discussions concerning the Federal ConnectED program that 
wants to see a minimum connection standard to all schools and libraries of 100 
megs with a 5 year goal of having access to 1 gig of available bandwidth for 
all schools and libraries?

thanks,

Kevin Owen

First Step Internet, LLC  


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Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

[Mike Hammett]

I don't know. I know sessions were recorded at Vegas last year, but as a 
presenter, I never heard anything back on them. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 

- Original Message -

From: "Gino Villarini"  
To: "WISPA General List"  
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 3:05:55 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd 



Recorded? 


Gino A. Villarini 
g...@aeronetpr.com 
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. 
787.273.4143 


From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Mike Hammett 
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 3:52 PM 
To: WISPA General List 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd 


We had a session at WISPAmerica. Should have them more regularly. 



- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 

- Original Message -


From: "Gino Villarini" < g...@aeronetpr.com > 
To: "WISPA General List" < wireless@wispa.org > 
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 2:52:19 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd 
Erate how to on Wispapalooza? 


Gino A. Villarini 
g...@aeronetpr.com 
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. 
787.273.4143 


From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [ mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org ] On 
Behalf Of Kevin Owen 
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 3:50 PM 
To: WISPA General List 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd 

It will be an interesting discussion for sure. We currently have service built 
to many schools, most with the capacity to provide 100 + megs. Most schools are 
purchasing somewhere in the 5 – 20meg range as that is what they can afford, 
including their current subsidy from E-Rate. We are providing service to rural 
schools and they just can’t afford more. Not sure how the FCC feels these 
schools will be able to afford 100+ meg connections and beyond that, where does 
the money come from to continue to fund E-Rate with what are sure to be large 
increased demands on the funding to support these larger pipes. 

Kevin 




From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [ mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org ] On 
Behalf Of Mike Hammett 
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 12:35 PM 
To: WISPA General List 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd 


I think so. I asked the same question a few weeks ago and the response was 
something to the effect of, "Is this something WISPA members want to respond 
to?" The response seemed to be a resounding yes. 

Now I just hope that it's something that we can get a piece of vs. telling them 
to not do it. 



- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 




From: "Kevin Owen" < ko...@fsr.com > 
To: "WISPA General List" < wireless@wispa.org > 
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:42:13 PM 
Subject: [WISPA] ConnectEd 
Do we know if WISPA as an organization is currently reviewing or plans to 
review/make comments to the NPRM for the revisions to the E-Rate program. Is 
WISPA following the discussions concerning the Federal ConnectED program that 
wants to see a minimum connection standard to all schools and libraries of 100 
megs with a 5 year goal of having access to 1 gig of available bandwidth for 
all schools and libraries? 

thanks, 

Kevin Owen 
First Step Internet, LLC 

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Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

[Gino Villarini]

Recorded?

Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com<mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com>
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
787.273.4143
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 3:52 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

We had a session at WISPAmerica. Should have them more regularly.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com


From: "Gino Villarini" mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com>>
To: "WISPA General List" mailto:wireless@wispa.org>>
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 2:52:19 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd
Erate how to on Wispapalooza?

Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com<mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com>
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
787.273.4143
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org<mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org> 
[mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Kevin Owen
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 3:50 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

It will be an interesting discussion for sure.  We currently have service built 
to many schools, most with the capacity to provide 100 + megs.  Most schools 
are purchasing somewhere in the 5 – 20meg range as that is what they can 
afford, including their current subsidy from E-Rate.  We are providing service 
to rural schools and they just can’t afford more.  Not sure how the FCC feels 
these schools will be able to afford 100+ meg connections and beyond that, 
where does the money come from to continue to fund E-Rate with what are sure to 
be large increased demands on the funding to support these larger pipes.

Kevin


From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org<mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org> 
[mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 12:35 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

I think so. I asked the same question a few weeks ago and the response was 
something to the effect of, "Is this something WISPA members want to respond 
to?" The response seemed to be a resounding yes.

Now I just hope that it's something that we can get a piece of vs. telling them 
to not do it.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com


From: "Kevin Owen" mailto:ko...@fsr.com>>
To: "WISPA General List" mailto:wireless@wispa.org>>
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:42:13 PM
Subject: [WISPA] ConnectEd
Do we know if WISPA as an organization is currently reviewing or plans to 
review/make comments to the NPRM for the revisions to the E-Rate program.  Is 
WISPA following the discussions concerning the Federal ConnectED program that 
wants to see a minimum connection standard to all schools and libraries of 100 
megs with a 5 year goal of having access to 1 gig of available bandwidth for 
all schools and libraries?

thanks,

Kevin Owen
First Step Internet, LLC

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Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

[Mike Hammett]

We had a session at WISPAmerica. Should have them more regularly. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 

- Original Message -

From: "Gino Villarini"  
To: "WISPA General List"  
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 2:52:19 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd 



Erate how to on Wispapalooza? 


Gino A. Villarini 
g...@aeronetpr.com 
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. 
787.273.4143 


From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Kevin Owen 
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 3:50 PM 
To: WISPA General List 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd 

It will be an interesting discussion for sure. We currently have service built 
to many schools, most with the capacity to provide 100 + megs. Most schools are 
purchasing somewhere in the 5 – 20meg range as that is what they can afford, 
including their current subsidy from E-Rate. We are providing service to rural 
schools and they just can’t afford more. Not sure how the FCC feels these 
schools will be able to afford 100+ meg connections and beyond that, where does 
the money come from to continue to fund E-Rate with what are sure to be large 
increased demands on the funding to support these larger pipes. 

Kevin 




From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [ mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org ] On 
Behalf Of Mike Hammett 
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 12:35 PM 
To: WISPA General List 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd 


I think so. I asked the same question a few weeks ago and the response was 
something to the effect of, "Is this something WISPA members want to respond 
to?" The response seemed to be a resounding yes. 

Now I just hope that it's something that we can get a piece of vs. telling them 
to not do it. 



- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 




From: "Kevin Owen" < ko...@fsr.com > 
To: "WISPA General List" < wireless@wispa.org > 
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:42:13 PM 
Subject: [WISPA] ConnectEd 
Do we know if WISPA as an organization is currently reviewing or plans to 
review/make comments to the NPRM for the revisions to the E-Rate program. Is 
WISPA following the discussions concerning the Federal ConnectED program that 
wants to see a minimum connection standard to all schools and libraries of 100 
megs with a 5 year goal of having access to 1 gig of available bandwidth for 
all schools and libraries? 

thanks, 

Kevin Owen 
First Step Internet, LLC 

___ 
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Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

[Mike Hammett]

I think a higher USF fee on your phone bill. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 

- Original Message -

From: "Kevin Owen"  
To: "WISPA General List"  
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 2:50:22 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd 



It will be an interesting discussion for sure. We currently have service built 
to many schools, most with the capacity to provide 100 + megs. Most schools are 
purchasing somewhere in the 5 – 20meg range as that is what they can afford, 
including their current subsidy from E-Rate. We are providing service to rural 
schools and they just can’t afford more. Not sure how the FCC feels these 
schools will be able to afford 100+ meg connections and beyond that, where does 
the money come from to continue to fund E-Rate with what are sure to be large 
increased demands on the funding to support these larger pipes. 

Kevin 




From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Mike Hammett 
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 12:35 PM 
To: WISPA General List 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd 


I think so. I asked the same question a few weeks ago and the response was 
something to the effect of, "Is this something WISPA members want to respond 
to?" The response seemed to be a resounding yes. 

Now I just hope that it's something that we can get a piece of vs. telling them 
to not do it. 



- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 

- Original Message -


From: "Kevin Owen" < ko...@fsr.com > 
To: "WISPA General List" < wireless@wispa.org > 
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:42:13 PM 
Subject: [WISPA] ConnectEd 
Do we know if WISPA as an organization is currently reviewing or plans to 
review/make comments to the NPRM for the revisions to the E-Rate program. Is 
WISPA following the discussions concerning the Federal ConnectED program that 
wants to see a minimum connection standard to all schools and libraries of 100 
megs with a 5 year goal of having access to 1 gig of available bandwidth for 
all schools and libraries? 

thanks, 

Kevin Owen 
First Step Internet, LLC 

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Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

[Gino Villarini]

Erate how to on Wispapalooza?

Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com<mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com>
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
787.273.4143
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Kevin Owen
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 3:50 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

It will be an interesting discussion for sure.  We currently have service built 
to many schools, most with the capacity to provide 100 + megs.  Most schools 
are purchasing somewhere in the 5 – 20meg range as that is what they can 
afford, including their current subsidy from E-Rate.  We are providing service 
to rural schools and they just can’t afford more.  Not sure how the FCC feels 
these schools will be able to afford 100+ meg connections and beyond that, 
where does the money come from to continue to fund E-Rate with what are sure to 
be large increased demands on the funding to support these larger pipes.

Kevin


From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org<mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org> 
[mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 12:35 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

I think so. I asked the same question a few weeks ago and the response was 
something to the effect of, "Is this something WISPA members want to respond 
to?" The response seemed to be a resounding yes.

Now I just hope that it's something that we can get a piece of vs. telling them 
to not do it.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com


From: "Kevin Owen" mailto:ko...@fsr.com>>
To: "WISPA General List" mailto:wireless@wispa.org>>
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:42:13 PM
Subject: [WISPA] ConnectEd
Do we know if WISPA as an organization is currently reviewing or plans to 
review/make comments to the NPRM for the revisions to the E-Rate program.  Is 
WISPA following the discussions concerning the Federal ConnectED program that 
wants to see a minimum connection standard to all schools and libraries of 100 
megs with a 5 year goal of having access to 1 gig of available bandwidth for 
all schools and libraries?

thanks,

Kevin Owen
First Step Internet, LLC

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Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

[Kevin Owen]

It will be an interesting discussion for sure.  We currently have service built 
to many schools, most with the capacity to provide 100 + megs.  Most schools 
are purchasing somewhere in the 5 – 20meg range as that is what they can 
afford, including their current subsidy from E-Rate.  We are providing service 
to rural schools and they just can’t afford more.  Not sure how the FCC feels 
these schools will be able to afford 100+ meg connections and beyond that, 
where does the money come from to continue to fund E-Rate with what are sure to 
be large increased demands on the funding to support these larger pipes.

Kevin


From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 12:35 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

I think so. I asked the same question a few weeks ago and the response was 
something to the effect of, "Is this something WISPA members want to respond 
to?" The response seemed to be a resounding yes.

Now I just hope that it's something that we can get a piece of vs. telling them 
to not do it.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com


From: "Kevin Owen" mailto:ko...@fsr.com>>
To: "WISPA General List" mailto:wireless@wispa.org>>
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:42:13 PM
Subject: [WISPA] ConnectEd
Do we know if WISPA as an organization is currently reviewing or plans to 
review/make comments to the NPRM for the revisions to the E-Rate program.  Is 
WISPA following the discussions concerning the Federal ConnectED program that 
wants to see a minimum connection standard to all schools and libraries of 100 
megs with a 5 year goal of having access to 1 gig of available bandwidth for 
all schools and libraries?

thanks,

Kevin Owen
First Step Internet, LLC

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Re: [WISPA] ConnectEd

[Mike Hammett]

I think so. I asked the same question a few weeks ago and the response was 
something to the effect of, "Is this something WISPA members want to respond 
to?" The response seemed to be a resounding yes. 

Now I just hope that it's something that we can get a piece of vs. telling them 
to not do it. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 

- Original Message -

From: "Kevin Owen"  
To: "WISPA General List"  
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:42:13 PM 
Subject: [WISPA] ConnectEd 



Do we know if WISPA as an organization is currently reviewing or plans to 
review/make comments to the NPRM for the revisions to the E-Rate program. Is 
WISPA following the discussions concerning the Federal ConnectED program that 
wants to see a minimum connection standard to all schools and libraries of 100 
megs with a 5 year goal of having access to 1 gig of available bandwidth for 
all schools and libraries? 

thanks, 

Kevin Owen 
First Step Internet, LLC 
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[WISPA] ConnectEd

[Kevin Owen]

Do we know if WISPA as an organization is currently reviewing or plans to 
review/make comments to the NPRM for the revisions to the E-Rate program.  Is 
WISPA following the discussions concerning the Federal ConnectED program that 
wants to see a minimum connection standard to all schools and libraries of 100 
megs with a 5 year goal of having access to 1 gig of available bandwidth for 
all schools and libraries?

thanks,

Kevin Owen
First Step Internet, LLC
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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[MDK]

Matt, I commend your thoughts, and how you chose to write them.   I always 
admire people who speak clearly, but from the heart. 

I would like to add something, or perhaps just explain why I think this 
industry will never become the domain of a few large players.   Our industry 
requires a dedication to individual service.   Many in the beginning wanted a 
box to plant on the desk, so that NO interaction with the customer was needed.  
 Instead, we serve each customer individually.   Our deployments require that 
we learn and plot our coverage and service in place, on the ground, interacting 
with local people.  

There is no large company that can do that.We CARE about our own business, 
because it IS our own business, and thus, we CARE about our customers, 
something you cannot ever pay someone to do.   The employee who  can be paid to 
care, is indeed...rare.   Thus, we have entered an industry with a model based 
upon the highest ideal of business - that of true service.   The flakes will 
fail, the greedy will fail, only those with a true concern for doing what needs 
to be done, in return for a modest paycheck will be successful.   Some can 
instill or find that kind of employee to hire, but no HR department will 
accomplish it.  

I don't call us heroes... Certainly I am not anyone's hero.  I'm a villain, 
when the power fails at 8 pm on a school night, and everyone's connection dies. 
 But I do my best, and I really, DO care that someone needs and I have the 
means of meeting it, and so I get up and go out, missing my dinner, to get 
things back up and going. 

Any of you on this list who won't do that, you're the exception, not the rule.  
 I can with confidence that you have a passion to do things for other people... 
 And found a way to earn that paycheck... and meet the need.   I believe very 
few of you are in this, solely for the money.   

And I disagree about our image...  It should be a nameless, faceless guy, 
working out of his truck, doing the job for his neighbor, on a handshake.   
That's who we are, more than anything else.   It's who we should sell ourselves 
as, and in doing so, gain our customer's loyalty, as we're loyal to them. Our  
business operations, and our treatment of customers should reflect that, as 
well.  

I don't have the answer for the problems in DC.   I don't have the answer for 
how to get Congress and agencies to allow us to do what we know how to do, and 
have the answers for.   I just think we should be on the offensive, not the 
defensive, and seek to change the nature of the game.  

BTW, I read your site from time to time, it's quite good.   Keep it up.  



++
Neofast, Inc, Making internet easy
541-969-8200  509-386-4589
++


From: Matt Larsen - Lists 
Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2011 11:16 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules


Scottie (and all other non-WISPA members on this list)

I would like to repost something that I put on the WISPA Members list and on my 
blog at Wirelesscowboys.com - the WISP Manifesto.

I am advocating that we should change our strategies to put together our own 
numbers, fight government programs that harm our businesses with taxpayer money 
and show the world that we are heroes to our communities.   I would really 
enjoy commentary from anyone on the list.   ML


(This email started out as a response to Brian Webster's email and went WAY off 
on a tangent, so I'm changing the subject - sorry!) 


Brian, I'm going to disagree with you on a couple of points here.   

 I think that you are mostly right, but you are accepting the framing of the 
issues as the telcos and politicians want them to be framed.   That there is no 
way that we can win a toe-to-toe slugging match for spectrum, but this is not 
about a full on, frontal attack.This is guerilla warfare, and the game is 
played by a completely different set of rules.

 Think of it from the wisp operator's point of view..

 1) We've been given essentially no spectrum (the junk bands that we 
use were around long before WISPs were), 

2)We get no government subsidies, despite the existence of stimulus and 
rural development programs for broadband deployment, which actually..

3)Pours billions of taxpayer dollars into our competition, the same 
competition that has either delivered low grade broadband or none at all.

4)The USF program allows telcos to impose additional "taxes" on their 
services to go into a giant government enabled slush fund that goes right back 
into their systems.  

5)RUS only lends to ILECs and will not work with multiple entities in 
an area 

6)We are asked to turn over highly detailed information about our 
subscriber bases, tower sites and anchor tenants as part of the broadband 
mapping programs - informa

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Josh Luthman]

You should read a bit more.  Their presentation Thursday (maybe Wednesday?)
would have been a real eye opener for you.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 11:58 PM, Scottie Arnett wrote:

>  All this bickering reminds me why I have NOT joined WISPA yet. Do not get
> me wrong, I DO agree with the bickering going on from KY and OH about
> Connect "whatever state inserted here"!  Same as what is happening in TN!
>
> In my own opinion, WISPA is trying to play Big boy, with a front for big
> boy!  I have been on the general list for a long time following the steps
> that WISPA has taken. IN the last few years, my perception is they want to
> BOW DOWN to the FCC on issues that the Big Boys decide on most issues. They
> are playing second fiddle to what most of us actually want. We want someone
> to standup at the FCC and say, "HEY, there are other ISP's besides cable and
> telephone co's! We are serving as much or more of the digitally divided ppl
> than the telco's are cable co's ever thought about!
>
> Of course we can all pay our $250 or whatever to WISPA and it will all go
> to Steve Coran! He loves us all for fighting this. The bigger fight, the
> more he gets paid, whether we win or not. How about funding the Steve that
> used to be a WISP and later became a  lawyer. He knows what we are and what
> we stand for?
>
> Side step from my bitching about WISPA, I am tired of competing against
> money that you, I, and everyone else in the USA has paid in on taxes. Just
> take a look at my area and what I have to compete against,  I could give
> WISPA $100,000 and probably still not survive!
>
> Twin Lakes Telephone Cooperative... got a total of $36 million in BIP/BTOP
> funding for FTTH, North Central Telephone Cooperative...gota total of $50
> million for FTTH in many areas that we were already covering and they were
> covering with FTTH. Windstream in KY got a total of $26 million to expand
> their coverage to everyone else outside of the city limits,
>
> What it comes down too, is how much a$$ you can kiss, and how much you can
> afford to pay! I may join Wispa tomorrow just in case they can take my $250
> and do something useful in my favor for once? It is typical politics, the
> ones that can pay the most, get their way. Why do you think the go has
> auctioned off the good freq that most of us COULD have competed against the
> BIG guys, but could not afford?
>
> Yea, classify me the same a bedfast, I am at that point, prove me
> different, and I will join him in a counter!
>
> Scott
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
>
> *From:* Chuck Hogg 
> *To:* WISPA General List 
> *Sent:* Saturday, January 15, 2011 4:02 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules
>
> I didn't say that, but it is well known.
>
> Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to Connect
> Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a minimum $10k to
> be listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a partner.  Do they honestly
> think I can afford either?  Guess who was partners? HughesNet, WildBlue,
> Bellsouth (AT&T), Time Warner, Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in
> my area called them to see about access, even though I fully cooperated with
> CK, went to EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed
> them how to use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or WildBlue.
>  They knew I had that area covered, it was very blatant, but because I
> didn't pay them the money, they referred them to an inferior product,
> satellite service.  They were provided with MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for
> Kentucky.  The maps they did were immediately removed and taken offline as
> soon as their funding ran out.  It was done in spite of the Kentucky
> Government.  The TAX PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and they stole it from us all.
>  Guess what happened another year later?  Another company was hired to do
> THAT EXACT SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got MILLIONS again.
>
> I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open ended
> promised were made by them.
>
> None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people around
> the US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show their displeasure.
>
> Regards,
>
> Chuck
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum  wrote:
>
>> Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front
>> for the Bells."
>> I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this
>> list.  However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Scottie Arnett]

 I did my coverage with Connected TN about a year ago and have not heard from 
them since except for a revise.

Scott
  - Original Message - 
  From: Chuck Hogg 
  To: WISPA General List 
  Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2011 4:02 PM
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules


  I didn't say that, but it is well known.


  Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to Connect 
Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a minimum $10k to be 
listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a partner.  Do they honestly think I 
can afford either?  Guess who was partners? HughesNet, WildBlue, Bellsouth 
(AT&T), Time Warner, Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in my area 
called them to see about access, even though I fully cooperated with CK, went 
to EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed them how to 
use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or WildBlue.  They knew I had 
that area covered, it was very blatant, but because I didn't pay them the 
money, they referred them to an inferior product, satellite service.  They were 
provided with MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for Kentucky.  The maps they did were 
immediately removed and taken offline as soon as their funding ran out.  It was 
done in spite of the Kentucky Government.  The TAX PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and 
they stole it from us all.  Guess what happened another year later?  Another 
company was hired to do THAT EXACT SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got 
MILLIONS again.


  I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open ended 
promised were made by them.


  None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people around the 
US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show their displeasure.

  Regards,

  Chuck



  On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum  wrote:

Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for 
the Bells."  

I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this list.  
However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not more, for independent 
companies like most of us are.  They lobby for Broadband in general - they 
don't play favorites at the high level.  However, they have some very 
knowledgible, dedicated wireless guys.  And if you work very much with them, 
you'd see that wireles is all those guys are about.  

Dave Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC 




 
On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein  
wrote:

  At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
  >You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
  >nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
  >I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
  >mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
  >Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
  >potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.


  I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the
  public forum, not official correspondence.

  It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the
  Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to
  independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let
  them, because it hit home.

  Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this
  list.  Not everything has to be somber.


  >On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
  > wrote:
  > > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content
  > makes WISPA look.
  > > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and
  > businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.


   --
   Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
   ionary Consulting  http://www.ionary.com/
   +1 617 795 2701




  

  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
  


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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Scottie Arnett]

All this bickering reminds me why I have NOT joined WISPA yet. Do not get me 
wrong, I DO agree with the bickering going on from KY and OH about Connect 
"whatever state inserted here"!  Same as what is happening in TN!

In my own opinion, WISPA is trying to play Big boy, with a front for big boy!  
I have been on the general list for a long time following the steps that WISPA 
has taken. IN the last few years, my perception is they want to BOW DOWN to the 
FCC on issues that the Big Boys decide on most issues. They are playing second 
fiddle to what most of us actually want. We want someone to standup at the FCC 
and say, "HEY, there are other ISP's besides cable and telephone co's! We are 
serving as much or more of the digitally divided ppl than the telco's are cable 
co's ever thought about!

Of course we can all pay our $250 or whatever to WISPA and it will all go to 
Steve Coran! He loves us all for fighting this. The bigger fight, the more he 
gets paid, whether we win or not. How about funding the Steve that used to be a 
WISP and later became a  lawyer. He knows what we are and what we stand for? 

Side step from my bitching about WISPA, I am tired of competing against money 
that you, I, and everyone else in the USA has paid in on taxes. Just take a 
look at my area and what I have to compete against,  I could give WISPA 
$100,000 and probably still not survive!

Twin Lakes Telephone Cooperative... got a total of $36 million in BIP/BTOP 
funding for FTTH, North Central Telephone Cooperative...gota total of $50 
million for FTTH in many areas that we were already covering and they were 
covering with FTTH. Windstream in KY got a total of $26 million to expand their 
coverage to everyone else outside of the city limits,

What it comes down too, is how much a$$ you can kiss, and how much you can 
afford to pay! I may join Wispa tomorrow just in case they can take my $250 and 
do something useful in my favor for once? It is typical politics, the ones that 
can pay the most, get their way. Why do you think the go has auctioned off the 
good freq that most of us COULD have competed against the BIG guys, but could 
not afford?

Yea, classify me the same a bedfast, I am at that point, prove me different, 
and I will join him in a counter!

Scott

 

- Original Message - 
  From: Chuck Hogg 
  To: WISPA General List 
  Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2011 4:02 PM
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules


  I didn't say that, but it is well known.


  Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to Connect 
Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a minimum $10k to be 
listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a partner.  Do they honestly think I 
can afford either?  Guess who was partners? HughesNet, WildBlue, Bellsouth 
(AT&T), Time Warner, Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in my area 
called them to see about access, even though I fully cooperated with CK, went 
to EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed them how to 
use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or WildBlue.  They knew I had 
that area covered, it was very blatant, but because I didn't pay them the 
money, they referred them to an inferior product, satellite service.  They were 
provided with MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for Kentucky.  The maps they did were 
immediately removed and taken offline as soon as their funding ran out.  It was 
done in spite of the Kentucky Government.  The TAX PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and 
they stole it from us all.  Guess what happened another year later?  Another 
company was hired to do THAT EXACT SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got 
MILLIONS again.


  I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open ended 
promised were made by them.


  None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people around the 
US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show their displeasure.

  Regards,

  Chuck



  On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum  wrote:

Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for 
the Bells."  

I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this list.  
However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not more, for independent 
companies like most of us are.  They lobby for Broadband in general - they 
don't play favorites at the high level.  However, they have some very 
knowledgible, dedicated wireless guys.  And if you work very much with them, 
you'd see that wireles is all those guys are about.  

Dave Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC 




 
On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein  
wrote:

  At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
  >You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
  >nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[RickG]

Ditto here!

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 5:02 PM, Chuck Hogg  wrote:

> I didn't say that, but it is well known.
>
> Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to Connect
> Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a minimum $10k to
> be listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a partner.  Do they honestly
> think I can afford either?  Guess who was partners? HughesNet, WildBlue,
> Bellsouth (AT&T), Time Warner, Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in
> my area called them to see about access, even though I fully cooperated with
> CK, went to EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed
> them how to use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or WildBlue.
>  They knew I had that area covered, it was very blatant, but because I
> didn't pay them the money, they referred them to an inferior product,
> satellite service.  They were provided with MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for
> Kentucky.  The maps they did were immediately removed and taken offline as
> soon as their funding ran out.  It was done in spite of the Kentucky
> Government.  The TAX PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and they stole it from us all.
>  Guess what happened another year later?  Another company was hired to do
> THAT EXACT SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got MILLIONS again.
>
> I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open ended
> promised were made by them.
>
> None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people around
> the US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show their displeasure.
>
> Regards,
>
> Chuck
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum  wrote:
>
>> Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front
>> for the Bells."
>> I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this
>> list.  However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not more, for
>> independent companies like most of us are.  They lobby for Broadband in
>> general - they don't play favorites at the high level.  However, they have
>> some very knowledgible, dedicated wireless guys.  And if you work very much
>> with them, you'd see that wireles is all those guys are about.
>>
>> Dave Hannum
>> New Era Broadband, LLC
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
>>> >You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
>>> >nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
>>> >I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>>> >mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>>> >Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
>>> >potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>>>
>>> I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the
>>> public forum, not official correspondence.
>>>
>>> It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the
>>> Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to
>>> independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let
>>> them, because it hit home.
>>>
>>> Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this
>>> list.  Not everything has to be somber.
>>>
>>> >On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
>>> > wrote:
>>> > > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content
>>> > makes WISPA look.
>>> > > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and
>>> > businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>>>
>>>  --
>>>  Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
>>>  ionary Consulting  http://www.ionary.com/
>>>  +1 617 795 2701
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[David Hannum]

Sorry Chuck - did not mean to attribute to the wrong person.  Fred did say
it.  But none the less, here in Ohio, We've never been asked for a penny
from Connect Ohio other than when we hired Chip Spann via Connected Nation
to do some network design for us early on.  And perhaps CK opperates
different from CO.  I know they've been around a LOT longer.  I guess it's
kinda Fords.  You either love 'em or hate em, depending on your experiences
with them.  My main point is that not everyone has had such a negative
experience with CN, and in some cases, very good success working with them.


Dave Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC




On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 5:25 PM, Fred Goldstein wrote:

>  At 1/15/2011 05:02 PM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
>
> I didn't say that, but it is well known.
>
>
> I said it, and I stand by it, noting what Chuck said as an example.  Even
> before the federally-funded mapping projects, CK was operating -- it was the
> prototype for CN -- and it was referring people to BellSouth.  I think at
> the time it was a $20k fee to be listed.  $20k for BellSouth, $20k for a
> tiny local ISP.  Sort of a poll tax model.  Great for the big guys. But it's
> not the big guys who need someone to tell the public who provides service
> where they are.
>
>
> Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to Connect
> Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a minimum $10k to
> be listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a partner.  Do they honestly
> think I can afford either?  Guess who was partners? HughesNet, WildBlue,
> Bellsouth (AT&T), Time Warner, Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in
> my area called them to see about access, even though I fully cooperated with
> CK, went to EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed
> them how to use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or WildBlue.
> They knew I had that area covered, it was very blatant, but because I didn't
> pay them the money, they referred them to an inferior product, satellite
> service.  They were provided with MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for Kentucky.
> The maps they did were immediately removed and taken offline as soon as
> their funding ran out.  It was done in spite of the Kentucky Government.
> The TAX PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and they stole it from us all.  Guess what
> happened another year later?  Another company was hired to do THAT EXACT
> SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got MILLIONS again.
>
> I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open ended
> promised were made by them.
>
> None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people around
> the US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show their displeasure.
>
> Regards,
>
> Chuck
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum  wrote:
>  Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front
> for the Bells."
> I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this list.
> However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not more, for
> independent companies like most of us are.  They lobby for Broadband in
> general - they don't play favorites at the high level.  However, they have
> some very knowledgible, dedicated wireless guys.  And if you work very much
> with them, you'd see that wireles is all those guys are about.
>
> Dave Hannum
> New Era Broadband, LLC
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein 
> wrote:
>  At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
> >You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
> >nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
> >I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
> >mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
> >Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
> >potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>
> I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the
> public forum, not official correspondence.
>
> It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the
> Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to
> independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let
> them, because it hit home.
>
> Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this
> list.  Not everything has to be somber.
>
> >On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
> >< j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
> > > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content
> > makes WISPA look.
> > > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and
> > businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>
>  --
>  Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
>  ionary Consultinghttp://www.ionary.com/
>  +1 617 795 2701
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> --

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Fred Goldstein]

At 1/15/2011 05:02 PM, Chuck Hogg wrote:

I didn't say that, but it is well known.


I said it, and I stand by it, noting what Chuck said as an 
example.  Even before the federally-funded mapping projects, CK was 
operating -- it was the prototype for CN -- and it was referring 
people to BellSouth.  I think at the time it was a $20k fee to be 
listed.  $20k for BellSouth, $20k for a tiny local ISP.  Sort of a 
poll tax model.  Great for the big guys. But it's not the big guys 
who need someone to tell the public who provides service where they are.


Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to 
Connect Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a 
minimum $10k to be listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a 
partner.  Do they honestly think I can afford either?  Guess who was 
partners? HughesNet, WildBlue, Bellsouth (AT&T), Time Warner, 
Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in my area called them to 
see about access, even though I fully cooperated with CK, went to 
EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed them 
how to use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or 
WildBlue.  They knew I had that area covered, it was very blatant, 
but because I didn't pay them the money, they referred them to an 
inferior product, satellite service.  They were provided with 
MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for Kentucky.  The maps they did were 
immediately removed and taken offline as soon as their funding ran 
out.  It was done in spite of the Kentucky Government.  The TAX 
PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and they stole it from us all.  Guess what 
happened another year later?  Another company was hired to do THAT 
EXACT SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got MILLIONS again.


I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open 
ended promised were made by them.


None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people 
around the US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show 
their displeasure.


Regards,

Chuck


On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum 
<oujas...@gmail.com> wrote:
Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying 
front for the Bells."
I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this 
list.  However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not 
more, for independent companies like most of us are.  They lobby for 
Broadband in general - they don't play favorites at the high 
level.  However, they have some very knowledgible, dedicated 
wireless guys.  And if you work very much with them, you'd see that 
wireles is all those guys are about.


Dave Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC





On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein 
<fgoldst...@ionary.com> wrote:

At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
>You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
>nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
>I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
>potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.

I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the
public forum, not official correspondence.

It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the
Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to
independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let
them, because it hit home.

Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this
list.  Not everything has to be somber.

>On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
><j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
> > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content
> makes WISPA look.
> > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and
> businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.


 --
 Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
 ionary Consulting  http://www.ionary.com/
 +1 617 795 2701 


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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Chuck Hogg]

I didn't say that, but it is well known.

Second, Connect Kentucky came to me and asked us to be a partner to Connect
Kentucky.  I said sure, send over the paperwork.  It was a minimum $10k to
be listed on the associates part.  $50k to be a partner.  Do they honestly
think I can afford either?  Guess who was partners? HughesNet, WildBlue,
Bellsouth (AT&T), Time Warner, Windstream, Insight... so when a customer in
my area called them to see about access, even though I fully cooperated with
CK, went to EVERY meeting, provided them with full mapping data and showed
them how to use Radio Mobile, they referred them to HughesNet or WildBlue.
 They knew I had that area covered, it was very blatant, but because I
didn't pay them the money, they referred them to an inferior product,
satellite service.  They were provided with MILLIONS!!! to do mapping for
Kentucky.  The maps they did were immediately removed and taken offline as
soon as their funding ran out.  It was done in spite of the Kentucky
Government.  The TAX PAYERS OWN THAT DATA, and they stole it from us all.
 Guess what happened another year later?  Another company was hired to do
THAT EXACT SAME MAPPING again, and yes, they got MILLIONS again.

I tried MULTIPLE times to work with them, and MANY MANY MANY open ended
promised were made by them.

None of this is opinion, it's all FACT.  Ask MANY MANY MANY people around
the US that are under a Connect program.  Most will show their displeasure.

Regards,

Chuck


On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 2:41 PM, David Hannum  wrote:

> Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for
> the Bells."
> I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this list.
> However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not more, for
> independent companies like most of us are.  They lobby for Broadband in
> general - they don't play favorites at the high level.  However, they have
> some very knowledgible, dedicated wireless guys.  And if you work very much
> with them, you'd see that wireles is all those guys are about.
>
> Dave Hannum
> New Era Broadband, LLC
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein wrote:
>
>> At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
>> >You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
>> >nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
>> >I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>> >mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>> >Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
>> >potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>>
>> I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the
>> public forum, not official correspondence.
>>
>> It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the
>> Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to
>> independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let
>> them, because it hit home.
>>
>> Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this
>> list.  Not everything has to be somber.
>>
>> >On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
>> > wrote:
>> > > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content
>> > makes WISPA look.
>> > > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and
>> > businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>>
>>  --
>>  Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
>>  ionary Consulting  http://www.ionary.com/
>>  +1 617 795 2701
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[David Hannum]

Chuck said: "It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for
the Bells."
I would agree with that it is a well known "opinion" by many on this list.
However, from what we've seen, they lobby as much, if not more, for
independent companies like most of us are.  They lobby for Broadband in
general - they don't play favorites at the high level.  However, they have
some very knowledgible, dedicated wireless guys.  And if you work very much
with them, you'd see that wireles is all those guys are about.

Dave Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC





On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Fred Goldstein wrote:

> At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
> >You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
> >nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
> >I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
> >mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
> >Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
> >potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>
> I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the
> public forum, not official correspondence.
>
> It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the
> Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to
> independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let
> them, because it hit home.
>
> Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this
> list.  Not everything has to be somber.
>
> >On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
> > wrote:
> > > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content
> > makes WISPA look.
> > > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and
> > businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>
>  --
>  Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
>  ionary Consulting  http://www.ionary.com/
>  +1 617 795 2701
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[RickG]

Remember, it was on the general list...

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 8:26 AM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> WISPA talks to the FCC.  How do you think they respond to us when we ask
> for something knowing we "allow" such actions?
> On Jan 14, 2011 11:50 PM, "RickG"  wrote:
> > Josh, you're comparing apples to oranges. AFAIK, CN is not a competitor
> nor
> > a member.
> >
> > On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:43 AM, Josh Luthman
> > wrote:
> >
> >> WISPA is represented by its members.
> >>
> >> Would you appreciate your installer doing such acts against a
> competitor?
> >>
> >> Josh Luthman
> >> Office: 937-552-2340
> >> Direct: 937-552-2343
> >> 1100 Wayne St
> >> Suite 1337
> >> Troy, OH 45373
> >>
> >>
> >> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:40 AM, RickG  wrote:
> >>
> >>> Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is
> a
> >>> comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad
> people
> >>> cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things.
> Or was
> >>> it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own
> on
> >>> behalf of the enemy?
> >>> As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of
> >>> one person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a
> better
> >>> scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
> >>> Just my .02.
> >>>
> >>> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman <
>
> >>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
> >>>
>  The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes
>  WISPA look.
> 
>  We have our opinions. We are people. But we, as adults and businesses
>  or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>  On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>  http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
>  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> 
>  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> 
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> -RickG
>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> 
> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>>
> >>>
> 
> >>>
> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>>
> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>>
> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> >>
> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > -RickG
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



-- 
-RickG



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Fred Goldstein]

At 1/15/2011 08:25 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:
>You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
>nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
>I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
>potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.

I'm not a member (yet) so take that as a disclaimer.  This is the 
public forum, not official correspondence.

It is well known that CN is a marketing and lobbying front for the 
Bells.  Bob's satire was harmless, reflective of their value to 
independent ISPs, wireless and otherwise.  If CN is whinging, let 
them, because it hit home.

Bob's contributions have at times been a high point of this 
list.  Not everything has to be somber.

>On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
> > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content 
> makes WISPA look.
> > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and 
> businesses or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.

  --
  Fred Goldsteink1io   fgoldstein "at" ionary.com
  ionary Consulting  http://www.ionary.com/
  +1 617 795 2701 




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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Josh Luthman]

I most certainly don't read every post.  Sorry I missed that important one.
On Jan 15, 2011 9:50 AM, "chris cooper"  wrote:
> Ive said good things about CO staff in the past. Check the archives.
> One of the CO staff work for Intelliwave previously. I know for a fact
> that he understands WISPS, wants us to succeed and really cares about
> getting broadband to rural subscribers.
>
> Chris Cooper
> Intelliwave LLC
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Josh Luthman
> Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2011 11:38 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules
>
> Were you paid to say that or do you honestly feel that? That would
> definitely be a first praise to my ears.
> On Jan 15, 2011 9:26 AM, "David Hannum"  wrote:
>> Wow - it's amazing how different everyone's experiences with CN has
> been.
>> We've had just the opposite of most of the folks posting here. We've
> had
>> great support for our wireless efforts . . . everything from design
> and
>> engineering to going out and finding us money to do special projects
> with.
>> If we can understand that at the root, they HAVE TO BE technology
>> independent, they do have some very good wireless folks, Chip Spann
> and Bart
>> Winegar among them. As for the meeting that Robert was refering to,
> here in
>> Ohio they (Connect Ohio) have a grant that, to my way of thinking,
> helps me
>> or any other provider. They are offering training for folks who are
> not
>> versed in the Internet to drive adoption. Then, then in exchange for
>> providers offering some discount to the folks who participate in the
> class,
>> they will advertise your services, and encourage folks to subscribe.
> That's
>> what was presented to Robert. I don't see why he was so offended by
> that
>> proposition.
>>
>> Again, it's all in your perception. All I can say is that we have
> found
>> that they can be very helpful and are very willing to help. Do we take
>> every suggestion or service they offer? No way. But just because we
> can't
>> use something they offer does not make them bad. I can say without
>> hesitation, that I've not found them to be in the hip pocket of the
> telcos
>> or big boys at all. They've been very supportive of our efforts here.
>>
>> Dave Hannum
>> New Era Broadband, LLC
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 8:25 AM, Chuck Hogg 
> wrote:
>>
>>> You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised. However,
>>> nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick
> and
>>> I do. After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>>> mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>>> Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain. Because of the
>>> potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>>>
>>> On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman
> 
>>> wrote:
>>> > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes
> WISPA
>>> look.
>>> > We have our opinions. We are people. But we, as adults and
> businesses
>>> or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>>> > On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>>> >
>>>
>>> --
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Chuck
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
> 
> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>
>>>
> 
> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[chris cooper]

Ive said good things about CO staff in the past.  Check the archives.
One of the CO staff work for Intelliwave previously.  I know for a fact
that he understands WISPS, wants us to succeed and really cares about
getting broadband to rural subscribers.
 
Chris Cooper
Intelliwave LLC
 
-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2011 11:38 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules
 
Were you paid to say that or do you honestly feel that?  That would
definitely be a first praise to my ears.
On Jan 15, 2011 9:26 AM, "David Hannum"  wrote:
> Wow - it's amazing how different everyone's experiences with CN has
been.
> We've had just the opposite of most of the folks posting here. We've
had
> great support for our wireless efforts . . . everything from design
and
> engineering to going out and finding us money to do special projects
with.
> If we can understand that at the root, they HAVE TO BE technology
> independent, they do have some very good wireless folks, Chip Spann
and Bart
> Winegar among them. As for the meeting that Robert was refering to,
here in
> Ohio they (Connect Ohio) have a grant that, to my way of thinking,
helps me
> or any other provider. They are offering training for folks who are
not
> versed in the Internet to drive adoption. Then, then in exchange for
> providers offering some discount to the folks who participate in the
class,
> they will advertise your services, and encourage folks to subscribe.
That's
> what was presented to Robert. I don't see why he was so offended by
that
> proposition.
> 
> Again, it's all in your perception. All I can say is that we have
found
> that they can be very helpful and are very willing to help. Do we take
> every suggestion or service they offer? No way. But just because we
can't
> use something they offer does not make them bad. I can say without
> hesitation, that I've not found them to be in the hip pocket of the
telcos
> or big boys at all. They've been very supportive of our efforts here.
> 
> Dave Hannum
> New Era Broadband, LLC
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 8:25 AM, Chuck Hogg 
wrote:
> 
>> You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised. However,
>> nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick
and
>> I do. After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>> mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>> Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain. Because of the
>> potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>>
>> On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman

>> wrote:
>> > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes
WISPA
>> look.
>> > We have our opinions. We are people. But we, as adults and
businesses
>> or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>> > On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>> >
>>
>> --
>> Regards,
>>
>> Chuck
>>
>>
>>
>>


>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>>


>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Josh Luthman]

Were you paid to say that or do you honestly feel that?  That would
definitely be a first praise to my ears.
On Jan 15, 2011 9:26 AM, "David Hannum"  wrote:
> Wow - it's amazing how different everyone's experiences with CN has been.
> We've had just the opposite of most of the folks posting here. We've had
> great support for our wireless efforts . . . everything from design and
> engineering to going out and finding us money to do special projects with.
> If we can understand that at the root, they HAVE TO BE technology
> independent, they do have some very good wireless folks, Chip Spann and
Bart
> Winegar among them. As for the meeting that Robert was refering to, here
in
> Ohio they (Connect Ohio) have a grant that, to my way of thinking, helps
me
> or any other provider. They are offering training for folks who are not
> versed in the Internet to drive adoption. Then, then in exchange for
> providers offering some discount to the folks who participate in the
class,
> they will advertise your services, and encourage folks to subscribe.
That's
> what was presented to Robert. I don't see why he was so offended by that
> proposition.
>
> Again, it's all in your perception. All I can say is that we have found
> that they can be very helpful and are very willing to help. Do we take
> every suggestion or service they offer? No way. But just because we can't
> use something they offer does not make them bad. I can say without
> hesitation, that I've not found them to be in the hip pocket of the telcos
> or big boys at all. They've been very supportive of our efforts here.
>
> Dave Hannum
> New Era Broadband, LLC
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 8:25 AM, Chuck Hogg  wrote:
>
>> You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised. However,
>> nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
>> I do. After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
>> mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
>> Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain. Because of the
>> potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>>
>> On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman 
>> wrote:
>> > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes
WISPA
>> look.
>> > We have our opinions. We are people. But we, as adults and businesses
>> or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>> > On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>> >
>>
>> --
>> Regards,
>>
>> Chuck
>>
>>
>>
>>

>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>>

>>
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>>
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>>
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>>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[David Hannum]

Wow - it's amazing how different everyone's experiences with CN has been.
We've had just the opposite of most of the folks posting here.  We've had
great support for our wireless efforts . . .  everything from design and
engineering to going out and finding us money to do special projects with.
If we can understand that at the root, they HAVE TO BE technology
independent, they do have some very good wireless folks, Chip Spann and Bart
Winegar among them.  As for the meeting that Robert was refering to, here in
Ohio they (Connect Ohio) have a grant that, to my way of thinking, helps me
or any other provider.  They are offering training for folks who are not
versed in the Internet to drive adoption.  Then, then in exchange for
providers offering some discount to the folks who participate in the class,
they will advertise your services, and encourage folks to subscribe.  That's
what was presented to Robert.  I don't see why he was so offended by that
proposition.

Again, it's all in your perception.  All I can say is that we have found
that they can be very helpful and are very willing to help.  Do we take
every suggestion or service they offer?  No way.  But just because we can't
use something they offer does not make them bad.  I can say without
hesitation, that I've not found them to be in the hip pocket of the telcos
or big boys at all.  They've been very supportive of our efforts here.

Dave Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC







On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 8:25 AM, Chuck Hogg  wrote:

> You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
> nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
> I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
> mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
> Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
> potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.
>
> On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
> > The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA
> look.
> > We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses
> or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
> > On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
> >
>
> --
> Regards,
>
> Chuck
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Josh Luthman]

WISPA talks to the FCC.  How do you think they respond to us when we ask for
something knowing we "allow" such actions?
On Jan 14, 2011 11:50 PM, "RickG"  wrote:
> Josh, you're comparing apples to oranges. AFAIK, CN is not a competitor
nor
> a member.
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:43 AM, Josh Luthman
> wrote:
>
>> WISPA is represented by its members.
>>
>> Would you appreciate your installer doing such acts against a competitor?
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:40 AM, RickG  wrote:
>>
>>> Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is a
>>> comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad
people
>>> cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things. Or
was
>>> it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own on
>>> behalf of the enemy?
>>> As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of
>>> one person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a
better
>>> scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
>>> Just my .02.
>>>
>>> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman <
>>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>>
 The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes
 WISPA look.

 We have our opinions. We are people. But we, as adults and businesses
 or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
 On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:






 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/




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 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> -RickG
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>
>>>

>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>>

>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>
> --
> -RickG



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Chuck Hogg]

You know at the time I saw the email, I was surprised.  However,
nobody on this list knows about the joke of a deal CN is like Rick and
I do.  After the millions of dollars in tax revenue and all this
mapping, that public information was removed from their website.
Millions of tax paying dollars down the drain.  Because of the
potential WISPA problems, I won't tell you how I really feel.

On Saturday, January 15, 2011, Josh Luthman  wrote:
> The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA look.
> We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses or 
> representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
> On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>

-- 
Regards,

Chuck



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Blake Bowers]

Interesting video... Almost as good as the ones of Tower 5 and Tower 6..




Don't take your organs to heaven,
heaven knows we need them down here!
Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.

- Original Message - 
From: "Robert West" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Friday, January 14, 2011 9:15 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules


> When WISPA decides to bow down to the wishes of Connected Nation, a
> well-known and well documented anti WISP organization and smack me down 
> with
> parroted words that were told me also by the LATEST Connected Nation CEO
> boy
>
>
>
> We're done.  Please remove me from  the WISPA list and be happy.
>
>
>
> The world is cruel,  this be true.  But Connected Nation  Et tu, 
> Brute?
>
>
>
> Yes.  You.
>
>
>
> I will not be controlled.  I will not bow to the master Telco/Cable BS.
>
>
>
> I will, however, provide broadband internet to whoever and wherever I damn
> well please.
>
>
>
> Big Shot CEO of Connected Nation tonight on the cell phone as I was
> replacing a power supply 90 feet up in the blinding snow...  "Our people
> feel threatened by your video."
>
>
>
> So sad for them.  They are threatened  I bet they are.  I really bet
> they are.
>
>
>
> Waiting for the FCC to show up..  HA!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Robert West
>
> Just Micro Digital Services Inc.
>
> 740-335-7020
>
> Cell 937-903-1286
>
>
>
> Description: cid:image001.png@01CBB357.F6FCF250
>
> "Affordable Internet For Everyone!"
>
>
>
>





>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 




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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[RickG]

Very good point.

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 1:21 AM, Glenn Kelley  wrote:

> Is Bob a member?
>
> I could be wrong - but I thought this was just on the public list ...
>
> that being said - since Anyone can post - and Anyone can join the public
> list - Perhaps it might be good for WISPA to have a disclaimer @ the Bottom
> of all emails - stating
>
> "This is a public forum provided to the Internet Community at large.   The
> comments and or opinions expressed are not endorsed by WISPA and are the
> sole responsibility of the person making the posting."
>
> :-)
>
>
> Just my 2 cents.
>
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2011, at 12:43 AM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>
> WISPA is represented by its members.
>
> Would you appreciate your installer doing such acts against a competitor?
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:40 AM, RickG  wrote:
>
>> Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is a
>> comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad people
>> cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things. Or was
>> it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own on
>> behalf of the enemy?
>> As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of
>> one person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a better
>> scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
>> Just my .02.
>>
>>  On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman <
>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>
>>> The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA
>>> look.
>>>
>>> We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses
>>> or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>>> On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> -RickG
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>
> _
> *Glenn Kelley | Principal | HostMedic |www.HostMedic.com *
>   Email: gl...@hostmedic.com
> Pplease don't print this e-mail unless you really need to.
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



-- 
-RickG



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[RickG]

Josh, you're comparing apples to oranges. AFAIK, CN is not a competitor nor
a member.

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:43 AM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> WISPA is represented by its members.
>
> Would you appreciate your installer doing such acts against a competitor?
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:40 AM, RickG  wrote:
>
>> Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is a
>> comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad people
>> cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things. Or was
>> it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own on
>> behalf of the enemy?
>> As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of
>> one person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a better
>> scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
>> Just my .02.
>>
>>  On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman <
>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>
>>>  The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes
>>> WISPA look.
>>>
>>> We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses
>>> or representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>>> On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> -RickG
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>
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>



-- 
-RickG



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Glenn Kelley]

Is Bob a member?

I could be wrong - but I thought this was just on the public list ... 

that being said - since Anyone can post - and Anyone can join the public list - 
Perhaps it might be good for WISPA to have a disclaimer @ the Bottom of all 
emails - stating 

"This is a public forum provided to the Internet Community at large.   The 
comments and or opinions expressed are not endorsed by WISPA and are the sole 
responsibility of the person making the posting."

:-)


Just my 2 cents. 



On Jan 15, 2011, at 12:43 AM, Josh Luthman wrote:

> WISPA is represented by its members.
> 
> Would you appreciate your installer doing such acts against a competitor?
> 
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
> 
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:40 AM, RickG  wrote:
> Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is a 
> comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad people 
> cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things. Or was 
> it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own on 
> behalf of the enemy?
> As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of one 
> person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a better 
> scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
> Just my .02.
> 
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman  
> wrote:
> The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA look.
> 
> We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses or 
> representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
> 
> On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> 
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> -RickG
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> 
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> 
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

_
Glenn Kelley | Principal | HostMedic |www.HostMedic.com 
  Email: gl...@hostmedic.com
Pplease don't print this e-mail unless you really need to.




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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Josh Luthman]

WISPA is represented by its members.

Would you appreciate your installer doing such acts against a competitor?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:40 AM, RickG  wrote:

> Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is a
> comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad people
> cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things. Or was
> it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own on
> behalf of the enemy?
> As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of one
> person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a better
> scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
> Just my .02.
>
>  On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman <
> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>
>>  The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA
>> look.
>>
>> We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses or
>> representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
>> On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
>
> --
> -RickG
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[RickG]

Ya know, I've never met Bob but everyone on this list knows that he is a
comedian at heart and and his post was done in satire. It's too bad people
cant lighten up and enjoy life without taking offense to such things. Or was
it that his post so close to the truth it hurt? Why do we eat our own on
behalf of the enemy?
As far as making WISPA look bad, are we really judged by the actions of one
person? If so, WISPA needs to review the membership list and do a better
scrutinizing who is allowed to join.
Just my .02.

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 12:00 AM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA
> look.
>
> We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses or
> representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
> On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



-- 
-RickG



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Josh Luthman]

The problem was the lack of maturity and how bad the content makes WISPA
look.

We have our opinions.  We are people.  But we, as adults and businesses or
representatives, need too display a level of advancement.
On Jan 14, 2011 9:39 PM, "Blair Davis"  wrote:



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Blair Davis]

  
  
Ok...   What did I miss?

On 1/14/2011 10:15 PM, Robert West wrote:

  
  
  
  
  
When WISPA decides to bow down to the
  wishes of Connected Nation, a well-known and well documented
  anti WISP organization and smack me down with parroted words
  that were told me also by the LATEST Connected Nation CEO
  boy……..
 
We’re done.  Please remove me from  the
  WISPA list and be happy.
 
The world is cruel,  this be true.  But
  Connected Nation  Et tu, Brute?
 
Yes.  You.
 
I will not be controlled.  I will not bow
  to the master Telco/Cable BS.
 
I will, however, provide broadband internet
  to whoever and wherever I damn well please.  
 
Big Shot CEO of Connected Nation tonight on
  the cell phone as I was replacing a power supply 90 feet up in
  the blinding snow…….  “Our people feel threatened by your
  video.”
 
So sad for them.  They are threatened………. 
  I bet they are.  I really bet they are.
 
Waiting for the FCC to show up….  HA!
 
 
 
Robert West
Just Micro Digital Services Inc.
740-335-7020
Cell 937-903-1286
 

“Affordable Internet For Everyone!”
 
  
  




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[WISPA] Connected Nation Rules

[Robert West]

When WISPA decides to bow down to the wishes of Connected Nation, a
well-known and well documented anti WISP organization and smack me down with
parroted words that were told me also by the LATEST Connected Nation CEO
boy

 

We're done.  Please remove me from  the WISPA list and be happy.

 

The world is cruel,  this be true.  But Connected Nation  Et tu, Brute?

 

Yes.  You.

 

I will not be controlled.  I will not bow to the master Telco/Cable BS.

 

I will, however, provide broadband internet to whoever and wherever I damn
well please.  

 

Big Shot CEO of Connected Nation tonight on the cell phone as I was
replacing a power supply 90 feet up in the blinding snow...  "Our people
feel threatened by your video."

 

So sad for them.  They are threatened  I bet they are.  I really bet
they are.

 

Waiting for the FCC to show up..  HA!

 

 

 

Robert West

Just Micro Digital Services Inc.

740-335-7020

Cell 937-903-1286

 

Description: cid:image001.png@01CBB357.F6FCF250

"Affordable Internet For Everyone!"

 

<>


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Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[RickG]

Tom, As always you ask great questions. I'd love to see the answer!

On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 3:42 PM, Tom DeReggi  wrote:
>  I thought I'd add
>
> Why should we assume that the State's objectives will always be to get
> accurate coverage maps?
> Sure States with higher percentage of unserved areas would benefit from
> accurately showing userved areas.
> But what about the other more served states? Wouldn't they benefit by
> showing that their own states are more unserved than the realy are?
> Showing that a WISP covers an unserved area just means that that state might
> not qualify for Federal money to get fiber to those locations.
> Can we ever really rely on any mapping project to represent the WISP's
> interests, when the goal of the MApping is to develop a basis for possible
> future federal assistance to build fiber networks?
> Isn't most state's real mission to determine where there is and isn't fiber,
> to encourage the expansion of Fiber?
> What motive does the State appointed mappers have to cooperate and
> accommodate WISP's request for mapping?
>
> Tom DeReggi
> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Matt Larsen - Lists" 
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Monday, April 12, 2010 1:51 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data
>
>
>>I was on a conference call with the State of Nebraska broadband mapping
>> contractors and the Public Service Commission this morning and came away
>> with a bad feeling.
>>
>> Based on the Form477 data, and the PSC's broadband provider registration
>> information, there are 283 broadband providers in the state of
>> Nebraska.  But they only have complete information for about 25, and
>> signed NDAs from only 160.   I offered to them that they would have
>> better luck getting data if they weren't asking for so much
>> information.    The data template that they ask for includes:
>>
>> 1)  All subscriber addresses, and the type of broadband deployed at that
>> location
>> 2)  GPS coordinates for all of our tower locations, the types of
>> antennas provided and the frequencies in use at that location
>> 3)  Key "anchor institutions" that are receiving service from our system
>>
>> I have had a couple of phone calls and several emails back and forth
>> with the mapping subcontractors, and they (and the PSC) are still
>> adamant about the data collection requirements.   I thought that we had
>> negotiated to the point that they would accept a shape file and a
>> summary of the number of subscribers per census block, but the phone
>> call this morning confirmed that incomplete data submissions (ones that
>> do not include the tower verification information and subscriber
>> information in the format that they requested) will not be included in
>> the summary data, or the state broadband availability map that will be
>> released to the public.
>>
>> The contractors and the attorney for the PSC gave the indication that
>> the NTIA is mandating this level of data collection, and that their NDA
>> should be enough protection to ensure the safety of our proprietary
>> information.   My position, and the position of the majority of WISP
>> operators that I have visited with, is that I am not going to turn over
>> the information that they are asking for.   Full disclosure of all my
>> tower sites and the addresses of my customers is an onerous request and
>> fundamentally unnecessary to determine where broadband coverage exists
>> within the state.   I would prefer to run the risk of being overbuilt by
>> a government funded program in the future than to turn over information
>> to entities (NTIA in particular) that could be legally obligated to turn
>> over that information through a FOIA request.
>>
>> I don't know whether it is too late to push back at the NTIA to reduce
>> the data that they are requesting.   I can sympathise to a certain
>> degree with the PSC and the contractors, as they are just trying to
>> collect the data that NTIA has mandated them to collect.  But they are
>> simply asking for too much information.   In the end, it will be another
>> inaccurate representation of broadband coverage and that information
>> will be used to develop policy and programs that will make the
>> competitive environment for WISPs and other independent ISPs even more
>> difficult to succeed in.   That sucks.
>>
>> Matt Larsen
>> vistabeam.com
>>
>>
>>
>> On 4/12/2010 10:29 AM,

Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[RickG]

They can pry the info from my cold, dead, brain!

On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 3:04 PM, Tom DeReggi  wrote:
> "NDA should be enough protection to ensure the safety of our proprietary
> information"
>
> Thats the funny part. They have an NDA!. What good is the NDA, if you are
> agreeing to give them information that is intended and will be released to
> the public on a public web site?
> What else is there to keep confidential? Maybe only the agregate lists to
> make it quicker to import into a dta base.
>
> Its funny, I asked, what is going to be released to the public? They could
> not tell me that for sure as the system was still in development and design.
> So its not even possible to enter into an agreement clearly stating what
> we'd be agreeing to, because the agreement is not defined.
>
> Basically the way it is now is... They say... Provide us everything now, and
> we'll let you know.
>
> In my state there was no pre-planning process or open discussion on the
> requirements. What happened was that mapping providers got grants, and
> mapping providers started working.
> There was no stipulation in the grant program to require winner to
> accommodate ISP's interests or stakeholder's interests. There job was to
> create the most accurate and detailed map that they could.
>
> NEver a single discussion on how it would be best to display WISP type data.
>
> Its a Joke.
>
> I personally think we should all not cooperate simply to send the message
> that we will not get bullied into just compliance, without even being given
> the opportunity to be part of the planning process. They have no authority
> to just demand info from us.
>
> If they want to map the state, I'll be glad to go to a public work group and
> discuss it and come up with ideas. But this one sided, this is the way it
> going to work attitude is not going to fly.
>
>
> Tom DeReggi
> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Matt Larsen - Lists" 
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Monday, April 12, 2010 1:51 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data
>
>
>>I was on a conference call with the State of Nebraska broadband mapping
>> contractors and the Public Service Commission this morning and came away
>> with a bad feeling.
>>
>> Based on the Form477 data, and the PSC's broadband provider registration
>> information, there are 283 broadband providers in the state of
>> Nebraska.  But they only have complete information for about 25, and
>> signed NDAs from only 160.   I offered to them that they would have
>> better luck getting data if they weren't asking for so much
>> information.    The data template that they ask for includes:
>>
>> 1)  All subscriber addresses, and the type of broadband deployed at that
>> location
>> 2)  GPS coordinates for all of our tower locations, the types of
>> antennas provided and the frequencies in use at that location
>> 3)  Key "anchor institutions" that are receiving service from our system
>>
>> I have had a couple of phone calls and several emails back and forth
>> with the mapping subcontractors, and they (and the PSC) are still
>> adamant about the data collection requirements.   I thought that we had
>> negotiated to the point that they would accept a shape file and a
>> summary of the number of subscribers per census block, but the phone
>> call this morning confirmed that incomplete data submissions (ones that
>> do not include the tower verification information and subscriber
>> information in the format that they requested) will not be included in
>> the summary data, or the state broadband availability map that will be
>> released to the public.
>>
>> The contractors and the attorney for the PSC gave the indication that
>> the NTIA is mandating this level of data collection, and that their NDA
>> should be enough protection to ensure the safety of our proprietary
>> information.   My position, and the position of the majority of WISP
>> operators that I have visited with, is that I am not going to turn over
>> the information that they are asking for.   Full disclosure of all my
>> tower sites and the addresses of my customers is an onerous request and
>> fundamentally unnecessary to determine where broadband coverage exists
>> within the state.   I would prefer to run the risk of being overbuilt by
>> a government funded program in the future than to turn over information
>> to entities (NTIA in particular) that could be legally obligated to turn
>> over

Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[chris cooper]

NOFA for this grant can be found here:

http://broadbandusa.gov/info_lib.htm

This covers the data they are looking for.

Chris Cooper
Intelliwave

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Scott Reed
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2010 2:22 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

I agree.  Can someone point to where the NTIA has published the 
requirements?

Jack Unger wrote:
> It would be good to see some type of documentation that the data 
> contractors and the PSC are telling the truth about the NTIA mandating

> that they collect such detailed data.
>
> Matt Larsen - Lists wrote:
>> I was on a conference call with the State of Nebraska broadband
mapping 
>> contractors and the Public Service Commission this morning and came
away 
>> with a bad feeling.
>>
>> Based on the Form477 data, and the PSC's broadband provider
registration 
>> information, there are 283 broadband providers in the state of 
>> Nebraska.  But they only have complete information for about 25, and 
>> signed NDAs from only 160.   I offered to them that they would have 
>> better luck getting data if they weren't asking for so much 
>> information.The data template that they ask for includes:
>>
>> 1)  All subscriber addresses, and the type of broadband deployed at
that 
>> location
>> 2)  GPS coordinates for all of our tower locations, the types of 
>> antennas provided and the frequencies in use at that location
>> 3)  Key "anchor institutions" that are receiving service from our
system
>>
>> I have had a couple of phone calls and several emails back and forth 
>> with the mapping subcontractors, and they (and the PSC) are still 
>> adamant about the data collection requirements.   I thought that we
had 
>> negotiated to the point that they would accept a shape file and a 
>> summary of the number of subscribers per census block, but the phone 
>> call this morning confirmed that incomplete data submissions (ones
that 
>> do not include the tower verification information and subscriber 
>> information in the format that they requested) will not be included
in 
>> the summary data, or the state broadband availability map that will
be 
>> released to the public.
>>
>> The contractors and the attorney for the PSC gave the indication that

>> the NTIA is mandating this level of data collection, and that their
NDA 
>> should be enough protection to ensure the safety of our proprietary 
>> information.   My position, and the position of the majority of WISP 
>> operators that I have visited with, is that I am not going to turn
over 
>> the information that they are asking for.   Full disclosure of all my

>> tower sites and the addresses of my customers is an onerous request
and 
>> fundamentally unnecessary to determine where broadband coverage
exists 
>> within the state.   I would prefer to run the risk of being overbuilt
by 
>> a government funded program in the future than to turn over
information 
>> to entities (NTIA in particular) that could be legally obligated to
turn 
>> over that information through a FOIA request.
>>
>> I don't know whether it is too late to push back at the NTIA to
reduce 
>> the data that they are requesting.   I can sympathise to a certain 
>> degree with the PSC and the contractors, as they are just trying to 
>> collect the data that NTIA has mandated them to collect.  But they
are 
>> simply asking for too much information.   In the end, it will be
another 
>> inaccurate representation of broadband coverage and that information 
>> will be used to develop policy and programs that will make the 
>> competitive environment for WISPs and other independent ISPs even
more 
>> difficult to succeed in.   That sucks.
>>
>> Matt Larsen
>> vistabeam.com
>>
>>
>>
>> On 4/12/2010 10:29 AM, Tom DeReggi wrote:
>>   
>>> BTOP Mapping grants given to States are  Federal initiatives. The
states
>>> have to answer and report to the Feds on their progress.
>>>
>>> Basically they will report to the Feds, who they contacted, and who
provided
>>> info and who didn't. The State mappers have little authority to do
anything
>>> about whether you give them information or not.
>>> But the Feds potentially could.  Remember it is FCC policy/law to
provide
>>> Form 477 data, down to Census track.
>>>
>>> It may come down to a legal issue on whether the FCC has authority
to demand
>>> confidential information or not from provate companies.  

Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Tom DeReggi]

 I thought I'd add

Why should we assume that the State's objectives will always be to get 
accurate coverage maps?
Sure States with higher percentage of unserved areas would benefit from 
accurately showing userved areas.
But what about the other more served states? Wouldn't they benefit by 
showing that their own states are more unserved than the realy are?
Showing that a WISP covers an unserved area just means that that state might 
not qualify for Federal money to get fiber to those locations.
Can we ever really rely on any mapping project to represent the WISP's 
interests, when the goal of the MApping is to develop a basis for possible 
future federal assistance to build fiber networks?
Isn't most state's real mission to determine where there is and isn't fiber, 
to encourage the expansion of Fiber?
What motive does the State appointed mappers have to cooperate and 
accommodate WISP's request for mapping?

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: "Matt Larsen - Lists" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2010 1:51 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data


>I was on a conference call with the State of Nebraska broadband mapping
> contractors and the Public Service Commission this morning and came away
> with a bad feeling.
>
> Based on the Form477 data, and the PSC's broadband provider registration
> information, there are 283 broadband providers in the state of
> Nebraska.  But they only have complete information for about 25, and
> signed NDAs from only 160.   I offered to them that they would have
> better luck getting data if they weren't asking for so much
> information.The data template that they ask for includes:
>
> 1)  All subscriber addresses, and the type of broadband deployed at that
> location
> 2)  GPS coordinates for all of our tower locations, the types of
> antennas provided and the frequencies in use at that location
> 3)  Key "anchor institutions" that are receiving service from our system
>
> I have had a couple of phone calls and several emails back and forth
> with the mapping subcontractors, and they (and the PSC) are still
> adamant about the data collection requirements.   I thought that we had
> negotiated to the point that they would accept a shape file and a
> summary of the number of subscribers per census block, but the phone
> call this morning confirmed that incomplete data submissions (ones that
> do not include the tower verification information and subscriber
> information in the format that they requested) will not be included in
> the summary data, or the state broadband availability map that will be
> released to the public.
>
> The contractors and the attorney for the PSC gave the indication that
> the NTIA is mandating this level of data collection, and that their NDA
> should be enough protection to ensure the safety of our proprietary
> information.   My position, and the position of the majority of WISP
> operators that I have visited with, is that I am not going to turn over
> the information that they are asking for.   Full disclosure of all my
> tower sites and the addresses of my customers is an onerous request and
> fundamentally unnecessary to determine where broadband coverage exists
> within the state.   I would prefer to run the risk of being overbuilt by
> a government funded program in the future than to turn over information
> to entities (NTIA in particular) that could be legally obligated to turn
> over that information through a FOIA request.
>
> I don't know whether it is too late to push back at the NTIA to reduce
> the data that they are requesting.   I can sympathise to a certain
> degree with the PSC and the contractors, as they are just trying to
> collect the data that NTIA has mandated them to collect.  But they are
> simply asking for too much information.   In the end, it will be another
> inaccurate representation of broadband coverage and that information
> will be used to develop policy and programs that will make the
> competitive environment for WISPs and other independent ISPs even more
> difficult to succeed in.   That sucks.
>
> Matt Larsen
> vistabeam.com
>
>
>
> On 4/12/2010 10:29 AM, Tom DeReggi wrote:
>> BTOP Mapping grants given to States are  Federal initiatives. The states
>> have to answer and report to the Feds on their progress.
>>
>> Basically they will report to the Feds, who they contacted, and who 
>> provided
>> info and who didn't. The State mappers have little authority to do 
>> anything
>> about whether you give them information or not.
>> But the Feds potentially could.  Remember it is FC

Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Brian Webster]

Well that is a little more comforting. They don't need to be "Engineers"
because there is no formal degree for wireless engineers in the US.
Electrical Engineers only get about two weeks antenna theory when it comes
to wireless. If these three are really on staff, they are not doing a very
good job of oversight for the staff running the maps. I have seen results in
both Illinois and Michigan and can tell you their predictions are way off.

 



Thank You,

Brian Webster

 

From: David Hannum [mailto:oujas...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2010 3:23 PM
To: bwebs...@wirelessmapping.com; WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

 

I believe the folks doing the mapping (at least a significant part of it)
for Connected Nation are Chip Spann, Layne Wagner and John Determan.  All
three of these men have significant RF and WISP background.  Not sure if
they are actually "engineers' but  probablly 30-40 years combined wireless
(licensed and unlicensed) between them.  I'm not sure who is doing the
mapping in your state, but I believe these three are overseeing the mapping
for all of Connected Nations's contracts.

 

Kind Regards,

David Hannum

New Era Broadband, LLC



 

On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 3:13 PM, Brian Webster
 wrote:

Matt and anyone else who talks to the state level mapping organizations:

The next time you talk to these people you might ask them to provide you
with the names, resumes, and qualifications of the staff that would be
running your coverage maps if you were to provide all of the tower data they
are requesting. Also ask for a list of similar projects these people have
worked on in the recent past to justify their skill in creating an accurate
coverage map. IF they actually produce that data (and I doubt they will) I
would ask them how it is they feel these people are qualified to conduct
this level of work. From what I have seen at various state levels, they do
not have anyone with RF Engineering experience on staff, let alone anyone
with experience in the unlicensed bands so that they can produce maps that
show reality of what works vice equipment manufacturer specs.

Connected Nation is putting someone in charge of mapping WISP's using Radio
Mobile. While that is not a bad thing (you all know I think Radio Mobile
works great) these people don't seem to have much if any RF Engineering
Experience. If they do it seems to be in the cellular world and I can tell
you from experience, that those types can be all over the place with their
ability. There are experts who think they know what they are doing because
they can run some software, and then there are the ones who know the RF
theory in the first place and can really understand what the tool is showing
when they run a map, especially as it relates to knowing what to use for
settings within the program. Too many people just play with the settings
until it "looks" right.

What I am seeing in this mapping grant process is a bunch of GIS/Mapping
Companies that now think they are also RF Engineering Companies, many times
because they hire someone who can make a map in Radio Mobile and they think
that is good enough.



Thank You,
Brian Webster

 




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Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[David Hannum]

I believe the folks doing the mapping (at least a significant part of it)
for Connected Nation are Chip Spann, Layne Wagner and John Determan.  All
three of these men have significant RF and WISP background.  Not sure if
they are actually "engineers' but  probablly 30-40 years combined wireless
(licensed and unlicensed) between them.  I'm not sure who is doing the
mapping in your state, but I believe these three are overseeing the mapping
for all of Connected Nations's contracts.

Kind Regards,
David Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC



On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 3:13 PM, Brian Webster  wrote:

> Matt and anyone else who talks to the state level mapping organizations:
>
> The next time you talk to these people you might ask them to provide you
> with the names, resumes, and qualifications of the staff that would be
> running your coverage maps if you were to provide all of the tower data
> they
> are requesting. Also ask for a list of similar projects these people have
> worked on in the recent past to justify their skill in creating an accurate
> coverage map. IF they actually produce that data (and I doubt they will) I
> would ask them how it is they feel these people are qualified to conduct
> this level of work. From what I have seen at various state levels, they do
> not have anyone with RF Engineering experience on staff, let alone anyone
> with experience in the unlicensed bands so that they can produce maps that
> show reality of what works vice equipment manufacturer specs.
>
> Connected Nation is putting someone in charge of mapping WISP's using Radio
> Mobile. While that is not a bad thing (you all know I think Radio Mobile
> works great) these people don't seem to have much if any RF Engineering
> Experience. If they do it seems to be in the cellular world and I can tell
> you from experience, that those types can be all over the place with their
> ability. There are experts who think they know what they are doing because
> they can run some software, and then there are the ones who know the RF
> theory in the first place and can really understand what the tool is
> showing
> when they run a map, especially as it relates to knowing what to use for
> settings within the program. Too many people just play with the settings
> until it "looks" right.
>
> What I am seeing in this mapping grant process is a bunch of GIS/Mapping
> Companies that now think they are also RF Engineering Companies, many times
> because they hire someone who can make a map in Radio Mobile and they think
> that is good enough.
>
>
>
> Thank You,
> Brian Webster
>



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Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Brian Webster]

Matt and anyone else who talks to the state level mapping organizations:

The next time you talk to these people you might ask them to provide you
with the names, resumes, and qualifications of the staff that would be
running your coverage maps if you were to provide all of the tower data they
are requesting. Also ask for a list of similar projects these people have
worked on in the recent past to justify their skill in creating an accurate
coverage map. IF they actually produce that data (and I doubt they will) I
would ask them how it is they feel these people are qualified to conduct
this level of work. From what I have seen at various state levels, they do
not have anyone with RF Engineering experience on staff, let alone anyone
with experience in the unlicensed bands so that they can produce maps that
show reality of what works vice equipment manufacturer specs.

Connected Nation is putting someone in charge of mapping WISP's using Radio
Mobile. While that is not a bad thing (you all know I think Radio Mobile
works great) these people don't seem to have much if any RF Engineering
Experience. If they do it seems to be in the cellular world and I can tell
you from experience, that those types can be all over the place with their
ability. There are experts who think they know what they are doing because
they can run some software, and then there are the ones who know the RF
theory in the first place and can really understand what the tool is showing
when they run a map, especially as it relates to knowing what to use for
settings within the program. Too many people just play with the settings
until it "looks" right.

What I am seeing in this mapping grant process is a bunch of GIS/Mapping
Companies that now think they are also RF Engineering Companies, many times
because they hire someone who can make a map in Radio Mobile and they think
that is good enough.



Thank You,
Brian Webster

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Matt Larsen - Lists
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2010 1:52 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

I was on a conference call with the State of Nebraska broadband mapping 
contractors and the Public Service Commission this morning and came away 
with a bad feeling.

Based on the Form477 data, and the PSC's broadband provider registration 
information, there are 283 broadband providers in the state of 
Nebraska.  But they only have complete information for about 25, and 
signed NDAs from only 160.   I offered to them that they would have 
better luck getting data if they weren't asking for so much 
information.The data template that they ask for includes:

1)  All subscriber addresses, and the type of broadband deployed at that 
location
2)  GPS coordinates for all of our tower locations, the types of 
antennas provided and the frequencies in use at that location
3)  Key "anchor institutions" that are receiving service from our system

I have had a couple of phone calls and several emails back and forth 
with the mapping subcontractors, and they (and the PSC) are still 
adamant about the data collection requirements.   I thought that we had 
negotiated to the point that they would accept a shape file and a 
summary of the number of subscribers per census block, but the phone 
call this morning confirmed that incomplete data submissions (ones that 
do not include the tower verification information and subscriber 
information in the format that they requested) will not be included in 
the summary data, or the state broadband availability map that will be 
released to the public.

The contractors and the attorney for the PSC gave the indication that 
the NTIA is mandating this level of data collection, and that their NDA 
should be enough protection to ensure the safety of our proprietary 
information.   My position, and the position of the majority of WISP 
operators that I have visited with, is that I am not going to turn over 
the information that they are asking for.   Full disclosure of all my 
tower sites and the addresses of my customers is an onerous request and 
fundamentally unnecessary to determine where broadband coverage exists 
within the state.   I would prefer to run the risk of being overbuilt by 
a government funded program in the future than to turn over information 
to entities (NTIA in particular) that could be legally obligated to turn 
over that information through a FOIA request.

I don't know whether it is too late to push back at the NTIA to reduce 
the data that they are requesting.   I can sympathise to a certain 
degree with the PSC and the contractors, as they are just trying to 
collect the data that NTIA has mandated them to collect.  But they are 
simply asking for too much information.   In the end, it will be another 
inaccurate representation of broadband coverage and that information 
will be used to d

Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Tom DeReggi]

"NDA should be enough protection to ensure the safety of our proprietary
information"

Thats the funny part. They have an NDA!. What good is the NDA, if you are 
agreeing to give them information that is intended and will be released to 
the public on a public web site?
What else is there to keep confidential? Maybe only the agregate lists to 
make it quicker to import into a dta base.

Its funny, I asked, what is going to be released to the public? They could 
not tell me that for sure as the system was still in development and design.
So its not even possible to enter into an agreement clearly stating what 
we'd be agreeing to, because the agreement is not defined.

Basically the way it is now is... They say... Provide us everything now, and 
we'll let you know.

In my state there was no pre-planning process or open discussion on the 
requirements. What happened was that mapping providers got grants, and 
mapping providers started working.
There was no stipulation in the grant program to require winner to 
accommodate ISP's interests or stakeholder's interests. There job was to 
create the most accurate and detailed map that they could.

NEver a single discussion on how it would be best to display WISP type data.

Its a Joke.

I personally think we should all not cooperate simply to send the message 
that we will not get bullied into just compliance, without even being given 
the opportunity to be part of the planning process. They have no authority 
to just demand info from us.

If they want to map the state, I'll be glad to go to a public work group and 
discuss it and come up with ideas. But this one sided, this is the way it 
going to work attitude is not going to fly.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: "Matt Larsen - Lists" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2010 1:51 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data


>I was on a conference call with the State of Nebraska broadband mapping
> contractors and the Public Service Commission this morning and came away
> with a bad feeling.
>
> Based on the Form477 data, and the PSC's broadband provider registration
> information, there are 283 broadband providers in the state of
> Nebraska.  But they only have complete information for about 25, and
> signed NDAs from only 160.   I offered to them that they would have
> better luck getting data if they weren't asking for so much
> information.The data template that they ask for includes:
>
> 1)  All subscriber addresses, and the type of broadband deployed at that
> location
> 2)  GPS coordinates for all of our tower locations, the types of
> antennas provided and the frequencies in use at that location
> 3)  Key "anchor institutions" that are receiving service from our system
>
> I have had a couple of phone calls and several emails back and forth
> with the mapping subcontractors, and they (and the PSC) are still
> adamant about the data collection requirements.   I thought that we had
> negotiated to the point that they would accept a shape file and a
> summary of the number of subscribers per census block, but the phone
> call this morning confirmed that incomplete data submissions (ones that
> do not include the tower verification information and subscriber
> information in the format that they requested) will not be included in
> the summary data, or the state broadband availability map that will be
> released to the public.
>
> The contractors and the attorney for the PSC gave the indication that
> the NTIA is mandating this level of data collection, and that their NDA
> should be enough protection to ensure the safety of our proprietary
> information.   My position, and the position of the majority of WISP
> operators that I have visited with, is that I am not going to turn over
> the information that they are asking for.   Full disclosure of all my
> tower sites and the addresses of my customers is an onerous request and
> fundamentally unnecessary to determine where broadband coverage exists
> within the state.   I would prefer to run the risk of being overbuilt by
> a government funded program in the future than to turn over information
> to entities (NTIA in particular) that could be legally obligated to turn
> over that information through a FOIA request.
>
> I don't know whether it is too late to push back at the NTIA to reduce
> the data that they are requesting.   I can sympathise to a certain
> degree with the PSC and the contractors, as they are just trying to
> collect the data that NTIA has mandated them to collect.  But they are
> simply asking for too much information.   In the end, it will be another
> inaccurate representation of broadband coverage and th

Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Scott Reed]

ication... They bypassed that question.
>>>>
>>>> They said the Governor's office will be provided a list of providers that
>>>> complied and didn't. I asked, if they'd join my lobby effort to fight the
>>>> Governor's office to stop charging property tax on broadband investment?
>>>> They bypassed that question.
>>>>
>>>> Actually There were three big Round1 apps in Maryland. One was State
>>>> led, and got turned down for many reasons, mostly because it was focusing 
>>>> on
>>>> overbuilding served areas. ($100 million in Fiber). The second was Maryland
>>>> Broadband Cooperative that legitimately was focussing on rural unserved
>>>> parts of the state.  Neither got an award for good reasons. In Round2, the
>>>> Governor changed the plan, and actually incorporated the MVC as a
>>>> subcomponent of teh State's grant, so that it would add credability to the
>>>> application. Basically it was a political move that indirectly said we
>>>> now have one unified application, and to get the rural parts served (MBC)
>>>> you got to also look the otherway when we through in some served areas that
>>>> that state wants.  They are absolutely crazy if they think I 'll provide my
>>>> data before the BTOP Round2 protests and awards are finished.
>>>>
>>>> However, after that time period, we are very likely to provide full Census
>>>> Block coverage information to MBC. We want to be looked at as a ISP that
>>>> shares a possisitive vision for growth of broadband in the state, but we
>>>> will not give them everything they want in the form they want. We will
>>>> withhold things, such as we will NOT give any subscriber data, location or
>>>> count. We will simply disclose "coverage".
>>>>
>>>> Our position is to convey the facts that we can cover vast territory with 
>>>> in
>>>> palce infrastructure, and Funding is the primary limitation to expansion.
>>>> But it will never help us to disclose the volume of our subscriber count,
>>>> for the public to see.
>>>> And we'll make them take us to court before we'll provide it.
>>>>
>>>> I'd like to give an example, of D&B and Getting Leases. One thing we 
>>>> learned
>>>> is that Giving D&B info hurts you if you give them info that proves you 
>>>> dont
>>>> meet the qualification of lenders. For example, If a lendor wants to see
>>>> that you have over 10 employees, you would not want to tell D&B to list 
>>>> that
>>>> you have only 5.  Its better to not tell D&B anything, and leave the value
>>>> at ZERO, so there is no proof that you dont qualify. And as well, by
>>>> providing no information, one would not have to lie to try to prove
>>>> compliance.  The same thing applies to other fields, such as annual 
>>>> revenue.
>>>> Less is more, unless the data is possitive info. My point here is that what
>>>> you dont tell people, they dont know, and what they dont know they cant 
>>>> hold
>>>> against you. You only disclose the info that helps you.
>>>>
>>>> The same principle applies to marketing one's company.  If a provider is a 
>>>> 2
>>>> man company, would a fortunte 100 company select that provider as their
>>>> provider? Probably not. But the Fortune 100 company does not know that the
>>>> provider is a 2 person company, if no body tells them, and the provider's
>>>> reputation is good.   The day a provider has a few 100,000 subs, it will
>>>> help to disclose subs. But not when its a few 1000.
>>>>
>>>> WISPs need to continue to promote it's COVERAGE!!! We are STRONG when it
>>>> comes to Coverage, But I jsut dont get promoting subscribers, because we 
>>>> are
>>>> NOT strong in subscriber count proporationally to our competitors.
>>>> But I highly recommend that WISPs continue to show our coverage, at a
>>>> broader range, what ever range a WISP feels is not a risk to disclose.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Tom DeReggi
>>>> RapidDSL&  Wireless, Inc
>>>> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> - Original Message -
>>>> From: "Scott Reed"
>>>> To: "WISPA Gene

Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[jp]

e are very likely to provide full Census
> > Block coverage information to MBC. We want to be looked at as a ISP that
> > shares a possisitive vision for growth of broadband in the state, but we
> > will not give them everything they want in the form they want. We will
> > withhold things, such as we will NOT give any subscriber data, location or
> > count. We will simply disclose "coverage".
> >
> > Our position is to convey the facts that we can cover vast territory with in
> > palce infrastructure, and Funding is the primary limitation to expansion.
> > But it will never help us to disclose the volume of our subscriber count,
> > for the public to see.
> > And we'll make them take us to court before we'll provide it.
> >
> > I'd like to give an example, of D&B and Getting Leases. One thing we learned
> > is that Giving D&B info hurts you if you give them info that proves you dont
> > meet the qualification of lenders. For example, If a lendor wants to see
> > that you have over 10 employees, you would not want to tell D&B to list that
> > you have only 5.  Its better to not tell D&B anything, and leave the value
> > at ZERO, so there is no proof that you dont qualify. And as well, by
> > providing no information, one would not have to lie to try to prove
> > compliance.  The same thing applies to other fields, such as annual revenue.
> > Less is more, unless the data is possitive info. My point here is that what
> > you dont tell people, they dont know, and what they dont know they cant hold
> > against you. You only disclose the info that helps you.
> >
> > The same principle applies to marketing one's company.  If a provider is a 2
> > man company, would a fortunte 100 company select that provider as their
> > provider? Probably not. But the Fortune 100 company does not know that the
> > provider is a 2 person company, if no body tells them, and the provider's
> > reputation is good.   The day a provider has a few 100,000 subs, it will
> > help to disclose subs. But not when its a few 1000.
> >
> > WISPs need to continue to promote it's COVERAGE!!! We are STRONG when it
> > comes to Coverage, But I jsut dont get promoting subscribers, because we are
> > NOT strong in subscriber count proporationally to our competitors.
> > But I highly recommend that WISPs continue to show our coverage, at a
> > broader range, what ever range a WISP feels is not a risk to disclose.
> >
> >
> > Tom DeReggi
> > RapidDSL&  Wireless, Inc
> > IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
> >
> >
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Scott Reed"
> > To: "WISPA General List"
> > Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2010 10:38 AM
> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data
> >
> >
> >
> >> There as been some comment on this on the list.
> >> They just contacted us as well.
> >> My plan is to tell them to look at our website to get the coverage
> >> area.  The rest is company confidential information.
> >> I do remember some folks in IL refusing to give them anything.
> >> I have not seen anything that says we have to give them data.  They make
> >> it sound like it is a requirement, but I don't think that is the case.
> >>
> >> Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
> >>  
> >>> Does anyone here have any experience with Connected Nation / Connect Ohio
> >>> on
> >>> them wanting data from you for their mapping purposes? They are
> >>> requesting I
> >>> sign a non-disclosure agreement and then hand them over a list of all my
> >>> towers, coordinates, frequency's, antenna, cable loss, equipment
> >>> manufacturer, service plan speeds. Seems like they want a lot of personal
> >>> information. I am just wondering besides mapping purposes what the
> >>> secondary
> >>> uses of this collected data will be used for.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Feel free to email me off-list as well.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Kurt Fankhauser
> >>> WAVELINC
> >>> P.O. Box 126
> >>> Bucyrus, OH 44820
> >>> 419-562-6405
> >>> www.wavelinc.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ---

Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Scott Reed]

ake us to court before we'll provide it.
>>>
>>> I'd like to give an example, of D&B and Getting Leases. One thing we learned
>>> is that Giving D&B info hurts you if you give them info that proves you dont
>>> meet the qualification of lenders. For example, If a lendor wants to see
>>> that you have over 10 employees, you would not want to tell D&B to list that
>>> you have only 5.  Its better to not tell D&B anything, and leave the value
>>> at ZERO, so there is no proof that you dont qualify. And as well, by
>>> providing no information, one would not have to lie to try to prove
>>> compliance.  The same thing applies to other fields, such as annual revenue.
>>> Less is more, unless the data is possitive info. My point here is that what
>>> you dont tell people, they dont know, and what they dont know they cant hold
>>> against you. You only disclose the info that helps you.
>>>
>>> The same principle applies to marketing one's company.  If a provider is a 2
>>> man company, would a fortunte 100 company select that provider as their
>>> provider? Probably not. But the Fortune 100 company does not know that the
>>> provider is a 2 person company, if no body tells them, and the provider's
>>> reputation is good.   The day a provider has a few 100,000 subs, it will
>>> help to disclose subs. But not when its a few 1000.
>>>
>>> WISPs need to continue to promote it's COVERAGE!!! We are STRONG when it
>>> comes to Coverage, But I jsut dont get promoting subscribers, because we are
>>> NOT strong in subscriber count proporationally to our competitors.
>>> But I highly recommend that WISPs continue to show our coverage, at a
>>> broader range, what ever range a WISP feels is not a risk to disclose.
>>>
>>>
>>> Tom DeReggi
>>> RapidDSL&  Wireless, Inc
>>> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
>>>
>>>
>>> - Original Message -
>>> From: "Scott Reed"
>>> To: "WISPA General List"
>>> Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2010 10:38 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>>> There as been some comment on this on the list.
>>>> They just contacted us as well.
>>>> My plan is to tell them to look at our website to get the coverage
>>>> area.  The rest is company confidential information.
>>>> I do remember some folks in IL refusing to give them anything.
>>>> I have not seen anything that says we have to give them data.  They make
>>>> it sound like it is a requirement, but I don't think that is the case.
>>>>
>>>> Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
>>>>  
>>>>   
>>>>> Does anyone here have any experience with Connected Nation / Connect Ohio
>>>>> on
>>>>> them wanting data from you for their mapping purposes? They are
>>>>> requesting I
>>>>> sign a non-disclosure agreement and then hand them over a list of all my
>>>>> towers, coordinates, frequency's, antenna, cable loss, equipment
>>>>> manufacturer, service plan speeds. Seems like they want a lot of personal
>>>>> information. I am just wondering besides mapping purposes what the
>>>>> secondary
>>>>> uses of this collected data will be used for.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Feel free to email me off-list as well.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Kurt Fankhauser
>>>>> WAVELINC
>>>>> P.O. Box 126
>>>>> Bucyrus, OH 44820
>>>>> 419-562-6405
>>>>> www.wavelinc.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 
>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>>> 
>>>>>
>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>>>
>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>>>
>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wi

Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Jack Unger]

 disclose.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL&  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message -
From: "Scott Reed"
To: "WISPA General List"
Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2010 10:38 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data


   


  There as been some comment on this on the list.
They just contacted us as well.
My plan is to tell them to look at our website to get the coverage
area.  The rest is company confidential information.
I do remember some folks in IL refusing to give them anything.
I have not seen anything that says we have to give them data.  They make
it sound like it is a requirement, but I don't think that is the case.

Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
 
  
  
Does anyone here have any experience with Connected Nation / Connect Ohio
on
them wanting data from you for their mapping purposes? They are
requesting I
sign a non-disclosure agreement and then hand them over a list of all my
towers, coordinates, frequency's, antenna, cable loss, equipment
manufacturer, service plan speeds. Seems like they want a lot of personal
information. I am just wondering besides mapping purposes what the
secondary
uses of this collected data will be used for.



Feel free to email me off-list as well.



Kurt Fankhauser
WAVELINC
P.O. Box 126
Bucyrus, OH 44820
419-562-6405
www.wavelinc.com










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  -- 
Scott Reed
Sr. Systems Engineer
GAB Midwest
1-800-363-1544 x2241
1-260-827-2241
Cell: 260-273-7239




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-- 
Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
Network Design - Technical Training - Technical Writing
Serving the Broadband Wireless, Networking and Telecom Communities since 1993
www.ask-wi.com  818-227-4220  jun...@ask-wi.com









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Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Matt Larsen - Lists]

n it
> comes to Coverage, But I jsut dont get promoting subscribers, because we are
> NOT strong in subscriber count proporationally to our competitors.
> But I highly recommend that WISPs continue to show our coverage, at a
> broader range, what ever range a WISP feels is not a risk to disclose.
>
>
> Tom DeReggi
> RapidDSL&  Wireless, Inc
> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Scott Reed"
> To: "WISPA General List"
> Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2010 10:38 AM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data
>
>
>
>> There as been some comment on this on the list.
>> They just contacted us as well.
>> My plan is to tell them to look at our website to get the coverage
>> area.  The rest is company confidential information.
>> I do remember some folks in IL refusing to give them anything.
>> I have not seen anything that says we have to give them data.  They make
>> it sound like it is a requirement, but I don't think that is the case.
>>
>> Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
>>  
>>> Does anyone here have any experience with Connected Nation / Connect Ohio
>>> on
>>> them wanting data from you for their mapping purposes? They are
>>> requesting I
>>> sign a non-disclosure agreement and then hand them over a list of all my
>>> towers, coordinates, frequency's, antenna, cable loss, equipment
>>> manufacturer, service plan speeds. Seems like they want a lot of personal
>>> information. I am just wondering besides mapping purposes what the
>>> secondary
>>> uses of this collected data will be used for.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Feel free to email me off-list as well.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Kurt Fankhauser
>>> WAVELINC
>>> P.O. Box 126
>>> Bucyrus, OH 44820
>>> 419-562-6405
>>> www.wavelinc.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> -- 
>> Scott Reed
>> Sr. Systems Engineer
>> GAB Midwest
>> 1-800-363-1544 x2241
>> 1-260-827-2241
>> Cell: 260-273-7239
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>  
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>




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Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Tom DeReggi]

tion to expansion. 
But it will never help us to disclose the volume of our subscriber count, 
for the public to see.
And we'll make them take us to court before we'll provide it.

I'd like to give an example, of D&B and Getting Leases. One thing we learned 
is that Giving D&B info hurts you if you give them info that proves you dont 
meet the qualification of lenders. For example, If a lendor wants to see 
that you have over 10 employees, you would not want to tell D&B to list that 
you have only 5.  Its better to not tell D&B anything, and leave the value 
at ZERO, so there is no proof that you dont qualify. And as well, by 
providing no information, one would not have to lie to try to prove 
compliance.  The same thing applies to other fields, such as annual revenue. 
Less is more, unless the data is possitive info. My point here is that what 
you dont tell people, they dont know, and what they dont know they cant hold 
against you. You only disclose the info that helps you.

The same principle applies to marketing one's company.  If a provider is a 2 
man company, would a fortunte 100 company select that provider as their 
provider? Probably not. But the Fortune 100 company does not know that the 
provider is a 2 person company, if no body tells them, and the provider's 
reputation is good.   The day a provider has a few 100,000 subs, it will 
help to disclose subs. But not when its a few 1000.

WISPs need to continue to promote it's COVERAGE!!! We are STRONG when it 
comes to Coverage, But I jsut dont get promoting subscribers, because we are 
NOT strong in subscriber count proporationally to our competitors.
But I highly recommend that WISPs continue to show our coverage, at a 
broader range, what ever range a WISP feels is not a risk to disclose.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: "Scott Reed" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2010 10:38 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data


> There as been some comment on this on the list.
> They just contacted us as well.
> My plan is to tell them to look at our website to get the coverage
> area.  The rest is company confidential information.
> I do remember some folks in IL refusing to give them anything.
> I have not seen anything that says we have to give them data.  They make
> it sound like it is a requirement, but I don't think that is the case.
>
> Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
>> Does anyone here have any experience with Connected Nation / Connect Ohio 
>> on
>> them wanting data from you for their mapping purposes? They are 
>> requesting I
>> sign a non-disclosure agreement and then hand them over a list of all my
>> towers, coordinates, frequency's, antenna, cable loss, equipment
>> manufacturer, service plan speeds. Seems like they want a lot of personal
>> information. I am just wondering besides mapping purposes what the 
>> secondary
>> uses of this collected data will be used for.
>>
>>
>>
>> Feel free to email me off-list as well.
>>
>>
>>
>> Kurt Fankhauser
>> WAVELINC
>> P.O. Box 126
>> Bucyrus, OH 44820
>> 419-562-6405
>> www.wavelinc.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
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>
> -- 
> Scott Reed
> Sr. Systems Engineer
> GAB Midwest
> 1-800-363-1544 x2241
> 1-260-827-2241
> Cell: 260-273-7239
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[John Scrivner]

I submitted my data to them for showing my network on their map. The
coverage map looked reasonably close to what we cover. I see no down side to
allowing them to show that your area has broadband. I can see abig downside
if this map is used for policy making and funding of where to build and you
are NOT listed there.  To each his own but I would rather have WISPs
plastering their map myself. It would help our industry efforts I think.
Scriv


On Sat, Apr 10, 2010 at 9:26 AM, Kurt Fankhauser  wrote:

> Does anyone here have any experience with Connected Nation / Connect Ohio
> on
> them wanting data from you for their mapping purposes? They are requesting
> I
> sign a non-disclosure agreement and then hand them over a list of all my
> towers, coordinates, frequency's, antenna, cable loss, equipment
> manufacturer, service plan speeds. Seems like they want a lot of personal
> information. I am just wondering besides mapping purposes what the
> secondary
> uses of this collected data will be used for.
>
>
>
> Feel free to email me off-list as well.
>
>
>
> Kurt Fankhauser
> WAVELINC
> P.O. Box 126
> Bucyrus, OH 44820
> 419-562-6405
> www.wavelinc.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Brian Webster]

You can send those to me and I will convert them so long as they are vector
polygons and not the Google Earth image overlays you can create from Radio
Mobile.



Thank You,
Brian Webster


-Original Message-
From: Robert West [mailto:robert.w...@just-micro.com] 
Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2010 11:22 AM
To: bwebs...@wirelessmapping.com; 'WISPA General List'
Subject: RE: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

I offered to send them google earth overlays we use that come pretty close
to reality but they said they couldn't use them.  

Bob-


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brian Webster
Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2010 11:04 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

They are asking for detailed data for two reasons. One is to inform a
potential consumer where you offer service with what speed and price. All of
the other data is so they can run RF propagations for your whole network to
develop your service area. Problem with that is from what I have seen of
their work, they don't know how to do a proper RF prediction. They are using
Radio Mobile but they obviously don't know how to set it up or run
propagations that reflect reality in the WISP world. That being said, some
WISP's have been submitting proper GIS files to show their coverage area and
then giving the data for speeds and pricing. There are a few ways to
accomplish this. Radio Mobile plots will not work by themselves. Those are
image files and for the mapping each state needs to convert that information
to some sort of GIS Vector based polygon. Some RF tools will do this
directly otherwise you have to do a bunch of tedious conversion in other
mapping tools.

This process is pretty much the same in every state.



Thank You,
Brian Webster

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser
Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2010 10:26 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

Does anyone here have any experience with Connected Nation / Connect Ohio on
them wanting data from you for their mapping purposes? They are requesting I
sign a non-disclosure agreement and then hand them over a list of all my
towers, coordinates, frequency's, antenna, cable loss, equipment
manufacturer, service plan speeds. Seems like they want a lot of personal
information. I am just wondering besides mapping purposes what the secondary
uses of this collected data will be used for. 

 

Feel free to email me off-list as well.

 

Kurt Fankhauser
WAVELINC
P.O. Box 126
Bucyrus, OH 44820
419-562-6405
www.wavelinc.com

 

 

 





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Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Robert West]

I offered to send them google earth overlays we use that come pretty close
to reality but they said they couldn't use them.  

Bob-


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brian Webster
Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2010 11:04 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

They are asking for detailed data for two reasons. One is to inform a
potential consumer where you offer service with what speed and price. All of
the other data is so they can run RF propagations for your whole network to
develop your service area. Problem with that is from what I have seen of
their work, they don't know how to do a proper RF prediction. They are using
Radio Mobile but they obviously don't know how to set it up or run
propagations that reflect reality in the WISP world. That being said, some
WISP's have been submitting proper GIS files to show their coverage area and
then giving the data for speeds and pricing. There are a few ways to
accomplish this. Radio Mobile plots will not work by themselves. Those are
image files and for the mapping each state needs to convert that information
to some sort of GIS Vector based polygon. Some RF tools will do this
directly otherwise you have to do a bunch of tedious conversion in other
mapping tools.

This process is pretty much the same in every state.



Thank You,
Brian Webster

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser
Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2010 10:26 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

Does anyone here have any experience with Connected Nation / Connect Ohio on
them wanting data from you for their mapping purposes? They are requesting I
sign a non-disclosure agreement and then hand them over a list of all my
towers, coordinates, frequency's, antenna, cable loss, equipment
manufacturer, service plan speeds. Seems like they want a lot of personal
information. I am just wondering besides mapping purposes what the secondary
uses of this collected data will be used for. 

 

Feel free to email me off-list as well.

 

Kurt Fankhauser
WAVELINC
P.O. Box 126
Bucyrus, OH 44820
419-562-6405
www.wavelinc.com

 

 

 





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Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Brian Webster]

They are asking for detailed data for two reasons. One is to inform a
potential consumer where you offer service with what speed and price. All of
the other data is so they can run RF propagations for your whole network to
develop your service area. Problem with that is from what I have seen of
their work, they don't know how to do a proper RF prediction. They are using
Radio Mobile but they obviously don't know how to set it up or run
propagations that reflect reality in the WISP world. That being said, some
WISP's have been submitting proper GIS files to show their coverage area and
then giving the data for speeds and pricing. There are a few ways to
accomplish this. Radio Mobile plots will not work by themselves. Those are
image files and for the mapping each state needs to convert that information
to some sort of GIS Vector based polygon. Some RF tools will do this
directly otherwise you have to do a bunch of tedious conversion in other
mapping tools.

This process is pretty much the same in every state.



Thank You,
Brian Webster

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser
Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2010 10:26 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

Does anyone here have any experience with Connected Nation / Connect Ohio on
them wanting data from you for their mapping purposes? They are requesting I
sign a non-disclosure agreement and then hand them over a list of all my
towers, coordinates, frequency's, antenna, cable loss, equipment
manufacturer, service plan speeds. Seems like they want a lot of personal
information. I am just wondering besides mapping purposes what the secondary
uses of this collected data will be used for. 

 

Feel free to email me off-list as well.

 

Kurt Fankhauser
WAVELINC
P.O. Box 126
Bucyrus, OH 44820
419-562-6405
www.wavelinc.com

 

 

 





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Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Robert West]

I only sent them GPS coordinates with tower height and frequency.  Their
spreadsheet was pretty massive so I told them that if it's for mapping
purposes then what I gave them was enough for mapping purposes.

Bob-



-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser
Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2010 10:26 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

Does anyone here have any experience with Connected Nation / Connect Ohio on
them wanting data from you for their mapping purposes? They are requesting I
sign a non-disclosure agreement and then hand them over a list of all my
towers, coordinates, frequency's, antenna, cable loss, equipment
manufacturer, service plan speeds. Seems like they want a lot of personal
information. I am just wondering besides mapping purposes what the secondary
uses of this collected data will be used for. 

 

Feel free to email me off-list as well.

 

Kurt Fankhauser
WAVELINC
P.O. Box 126
Bucyrus, OH 44820
419-562-6405
www.wavelinc.com

 

 

 





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Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Scott Reed]

There as been some comment on this on the list.
They just contacted us as well.
My plan is to tell them to look at our website to get the coverage 
area.  The rest is company confidential information.
I do remember some folks in IL refusing to give them anything.
I have not seen anything that says we have to give them data.  They make 
it sound like it is a requirement, but I don't think that is the case.

Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
> Does anyone here have any experience with Connected Nation / Connect Ohio on
> them wanting data from you for their mapping purposes? They are requesting I
> sign a non-disclosure agreement and then hand them over a list of all my
> towers, coordinates, frequency's, antenna, cable loss, equipment
> manufacturer, service plan speeds. Seems like they want a lot of personal
> information. I am just wondering besides mapping purposes what the secondary
> uses of this collected data will be used for. 
>
>  
>
> Feel free to email me off-list as well.
>
>  
>
> Kurt Fankhauser
> WAVELINC
> P.O. Box 126
> Bucyrus, OH 44820
> 419-562-6405
> www.wavelinc.com
>
>  
>
>  
>
>  
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>   

-- 
Scott Reed
Sr. Systems Engineer
GAB Midwest
1-800-363-1544 x2241
1-260-827-2241
Cell: 260-273-7239




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[WISPA] connected nation mapping data

[Kurt Fankhauser]

Does anyone here have any experience with Connected Nation / Connect Ohio on
them wanting data from you for their mapping purposes? They are requesting I
sign a non-disclosure agreement and then hand them over a list of all my
towers, coordinates, frequency's, antenna, cable loss, equipment
manufacturer, service plan speeds. Seems like they want a lot of personal
information. I am just wondering besides mapping purposes what the secondary
uses of this collected data will be used for. 

 

Feel free to email me off-list as well.

 

Kurt Fankhauser
WAVELINC
P.O. Box 126
Bucyrus, OH 44820
419-562-6405
www.wavelinc.com

 

 

 




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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Robert West]

Yeah, they have to.  It's the only economical way to provide last mile in
the sticks in a hurry.  My issue isn't with that though, it's the energy
wasted on self promotion.  I don't have the answer on what they should do
and I don't know if they should do anything at all.  As I said before, those
who "have" can easily afford broadband now, I'm more interested in helping
provide to those who "have not".  And still make a buck or two of course,
I'm not THAT dumb!

Bob-



-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of chris cooper
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 3:27 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

Bob-

Take a closer look at the Connect Ohio newsletters.  Both the November
edition and the Fall quarter newsletter feature WISPs ;)  They speak
wireless everywhere they go.

Chris Cooper
Intelliwave


> Maybe I'm sensitive or easily put off but the last Newsletter that we
> received from the Connect Ohio division of CN had me "almost" confront
the
> CN coordinator at the meeting.  I know that the mission is to provide
> broadband to EVERYONE and that includes those who can already afford
> access,
> (?) but every newsletter I get seems to be pandering to who they are
> getting
> their money from and doesn't have much to do with providing broadband
in
> rural areas.  (Many examples of AT&T big shots in photo ops with state
and
> local politicians donating PC's to schools and similar activities)
>






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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Robert West]

Not me, I'm a realist for the most part.  I read their mission as to help
provide broadband in whatever manner it takes to do it.  In our area, as
someone mentioned, there is the fiber ring being built by Horizon Telecom
out of Chillicothe.  Very good!  We want that.  I'm for whatever it takes to
build middle mile into the rural areas but you will get a faster and more
bang for your buck out in BFE using wireless for last mile and CN knows that
and they will say so.  And to go further, if a Telco receives a big grant to
install DSL out in no man's land with 1 house for every 4 square miles, I'll
applaud that as well, believe it or not.  My goal isn't to get all I can for
me, I got into this to "help" provide access where there isn't any.  

But that kind of is my point when I jumped into this.  CN or Connect Ohio
doesn't look to me to be as interested in helping people who will never give
them the spot light as they are showing how much they can hob-knob with
state reps, congressmen, CEO's and how they helped someone with enough cash
to provide their own access.  All along, I'm out here trying to cut corners,
work deals and provide the best service I can at cut rate prices so that
those without the car collection, lake cottage and masters degree can afford
it.  To be perfectly honest, I really don't think they are providing a
service that we didn't already have, aside from the mapping, and that could
have been setup perfectly well by a non-profit or even a for-profit firm who
have a local interest in this.  I have received years of experience from the
wireless community in a span of less than a year and it's free for the
asking.  There are even many here who, for a fee, and that's expected and
respected, come and help you out of a jam or show you how to do things
differently at all hours of the day and night.  

To have this CN person whip in once a month, pull out MS Project or Power
Point and go over what we need to do for the next month and an hour and a
half later leave...     For the Telco's, not for the Telco's,
for the Wisp, for the Dog Catcher, I really don't care.  Less "Schmooze" and
more action in the areas that need it most without all the crowing is all I
ask.  I learned this one thing a long time ago, "The busiest person in town
is the one you never know about.  The laziest person in town is the one who
is constantly telling everyone how busy they are".  I see a lot of "We're so
busy" coming from the non-tech side of this bunch.  "Too much talkie-talkie"
as I say in my most politically incorrect fake Chinese accent.

Now, and I'm not trying to be a jerk (sometimes I don't have to trysigh)
Did you pay them for any their services and if so, do you want to tell us a
rough range of what it was?  Not looking for fuel to add to it, I'm just
really interested because they had such a hard sell when I talked to them
and I dropped them quick.  I would totally expect their tech guys to be
straight shooters and good guys because I suspect they are like us and are
never at the top of the food chain.  It's the "suits" who muck it all up for
us.  

I will never fault anyone for paying for info and for help when they need
it, so I'm no finger pointer.  I've wasted plenty of my own cash (and a lot
more of my parents when I was younger.  Ask them.  After a long pause, my
father may be able to bring himself to tell you) on my own personal tech
addiction.  :)

Bob-

 



-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of David Hannum
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 3:16 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

My only point (and this is my last one, then I'll go back to lurking) is
that the comments appear to me that maybe we (WISPA members) were expecting
Connect Ohio / CN to be a wireless only advocate.  However, at least in
Ohio, they received money to push broadband - regardless of the way it
arrives at the home or business.  Where we have requested help with our
wireless business, we have received great help and and great cooperation.  I
don't expect them to "favor" wireless over FTTH or DSL, because those
providers are paying taxes too.  But where they do help me, I expect it to
be unbiased.  Their wireless folks have been straight shooters, and 100%
dedicated to helping our wireless be successful.  What limited success we've
had so far, we owe in a big part to Connected Nation / Connect Ohio.

Kind Regards,
David Hannum
Managing Partner
New Era Broadband, LLC
www.newerabroadband.com



On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 2:31 PM, Marlon K. Schafer
wrote:

> Yeah, that's my recollection too.  We (wispa) almost joined an effort that
> they had going.  In the end we (wispa) decided not to participate.  I
think
>

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[chris cooper]

Bob-

Take a closer look at the Connect Ohio newsletters.  Both the November
edition and the Fall quarter newsletter feature WISPs ;)  They speak
wireless everywhere they go.

Chris Cooper
Intelliwave


> Maybe I'm sensitive or easily put off but the last Newsletter that we
> received from the Connect Ohio division of CN had me "almost" confront
the
> CN coordinator at the meeting.  I know that the mission is to provide
> broadband to EVERYONE and that includes those who can already afford
> access,
> (?) but every newsletter I get seems to be pandering to who they are
> getting
> their money from and doesn't have much to do with providing broadband
in
> rural areas.  (Many examples of AT&T big shots in photo ops with state
and
> local politicians donating PC's to schools and similar activities)
>





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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[David Hannum]

My only point (and this is my last one, then I'll go back to lurking) is
that the comments appear to me that maybe we (WISPA members) were expecting
Connect Ohio / CN to be a wireless only advocate.  However, at least in
Ohio, they received money to push broadband - regardless of the way it
arrives at the home or business.  Where we have requested help with our
wireless business, we have received great help and and great cooperation.  I
don't expect them to "favor" wireless over FTTH or DSL, because those
providers are paying taxes too.  But where they do help me, I expect it to
be unbiased.  Their wireless folks have been straight shooters, and 100%
dedicated to helping our wireless be successful.  What limited success we've
had so far, we owe in a big part to Connected Nation / Connect Ohio.

Kind Regards,
David Hannum
Managing Partner
New Era Broadband, LLC
www.newerabroadband.com



On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 2:31 PM, Marlon K. Schafer wrote:

> Yeah, that's my recollection too.  We (wispa) almost joined an effort that
> they had going.  In the end we (wispa) decided not to participate.  I think
> Rick would remember more about that than I do.
>
> marlon
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Chuck Bartosch" 
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 11:32 AM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation
>
>
>  > Been lots of discussion about this. Without repeating all that
> discussion,
> > I think the conclusion has been, "bad for us". Telco tool.
> >
> > Chuck
> >
> > On Dec 16, 2009, at 2:30 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:
> >
> >> Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?
> >>
> >> My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
> >> information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
> >> remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to
> >> avoid them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that
> >> stuff anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag
> >> holding water.
> >>
> >>
> >> -
> >> Mike Hammett
> >> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> >> http://www.ics-il.com
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> 
> >>
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> > Chuck Bartosch
> > Clarity Connect, Inc.
> > 200 Pleasant Grove Road
> > Ithaca, NY 14850
> > (607) 257-8268
> >
> > "When the stars threw down their spears,
> > and water'd heaven with their tears,
> > Did He smile, His work to see?
> > Did He who made the Lamb make thee?"
> >
> >>From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Marlon K. Schafer]

Yeah, that's my recollection too.  We (wispa) almost joined an effort that 
they had going.  In the end we (wispa) decided not to participate.  I think 
Rick would remember more about that than I do.

marlon

- Original Message - 
From: "Chuck Bartosch" 
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 11:32 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation


> Been lots of discussion about this. Without repeating all that discussion, 
> I think the conclusion has been, "bad for us". Telco tool.
>
> Chuck
>
> On Dec 16, 2009, at 2:30 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:
>
>> Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?
>>
>> My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any 
>> information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't 
>> remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to 
>> avoid them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that 
>> stuff anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag 
>> holding water.
>>
>>
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions
>> http://www.ics-il.com
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>>
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>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
> --
> Chuck Bartosch
> Clarity Connect, Inc.
> 200 Pleasant Grove Road
> Ithaca, NY 14850
> (607) 257-8268
>
> "When the stars threw down their spears,
> and water'd heaven with their tears,
> Did He smile, His work to see?
> Did He who made the Lamb make thee?"
>
>>From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger!
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Robert West]

I understand that but the way the thing reads, she can go anyplace now, that
sounds like a cell card which she could have had already at the lake.  As
far as class, access to broadband is limited only by cash, for the most
part.  WildBlue is already available as long as you can see sky as well as
probably high speed data from a cell company.  My issue was the beating of
the drum that someone who I assume already had access by virtue of
disposable cash (cottage, vintage cars, etc.) can get her email.  Why hold
someone up like that as an example of what can be accomplished when I'm sure
there are more compelling stories from the have nots?  

Just my thoughts on it.  



-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of David Hannum
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 10:58 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

Bob,

There's not a lot of money in Meigs County Ohio where we are, but where the
folks with money live in our county is where the broadband aint.  The
customers we are picking up are all across the board.  Including the upper
class who are sick of paying for satellite.  Satellite is an option, but
wireless is better.  You can't VPN or remote access (in a usable manner) via
satellite.  So just because somebody can afford a cottage does not mean they
have broadband.  Besides, those are the folks who buy the packages you have
the greatest margin on.  Among our key clients is a doctor, who is also the
county cornorer and the EMS director.  It helps patients and the county that
these folks can now work from home.  The need for broadband transends class.

Dave




On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 10:12 AM, Robert West
wrote:

> Maybe I'm sensitive or easily put off but the last Newsletter that we
> received from the Connect Ohio division of CN had me "almost" confront the
> CN coordinator at the meeting.  I know that the mission is to provide
> broadband to EVERYONE and that includes those who can already afford
> access,
> (?) but every newsletter I get seems to be pandering to who they are
> getting
> their money from and doesn't have much to do with providing broadband in
> rural areas.  (Many examples of AT&T big shots in photo ops with state and
> local politicians donating PC's to schools and similar activities)
>
> Here is the word for word front page article in their newsletter.  This
> alone caused me to rethink any participation in their "efforts" or lack
of.
>
>
> ( Link is here  http://www.connectohio.org/ )
>
> How broadband changed my life
>
> I am a 48-year-old married mother of four with what you can imagine is a
> very busy life. My husband and I enjoy traveling, collecting and showing
> vintage cars, spending time at our cottage on Lake Erie and sailing. Our
> children range in age from 17 to 22, and we are currently hosting a
> 17-year-old exchange student from Brazil. Broadband has had two major
> influences on my life:
>
> 1. It has allowed me to log on to my work network from anywhere. I can
work
> from home or check e-mails from the cottage. No longer am I tethered to my
> desk at work in order to get work done.
>
> 2. It has allowed me to  further my education. I have recently gone back
to
> school to obtain my master's degree in Management Information Technology.
> With my busy lifestyle, there is no way I could have realized this dream
if
> I had to attend classes at a bricks and mortar school. The speed and
> convenience of broadband allows me to take all of my courses online, from
> anywhere.
>
>
> Uh. Here's my keywords in this.  Vintage cars (plural) Cottage on Lake
> Erie, sailing, exchange student, Masters Degree in Information Technology.
>
> If I had to guess I would say that this person probably already had
> broadband before CN came along in one form or another and from the way it
> reads where she can go anyplace and be online, sounds like a wireless card
> from a cell company.
>
> Where is the relevance in this to what we are trying to accomplish?  Just
> sounded like they were spotlighting someone that the people in charge
could
> identify with instead of the single unemployed mother in rural Appalachia
> who is now able to sell her recipes or quilts or whatever to a world
> market...blah, blah, blah.  A REAL change in someone's life, not just so
> some well to do middle aged educational tech coordinator can check her
> email
> while riding in one of their vintage cars or in the sail boat
>  Shsh.
>
> "Look, look!  We helped your sister and now she can get her email while
> relaxing at the cottage on the lake after a long day of sailing!"
>
> Makes me sick.
>
> Bob-
>
>
> -Original Message-
> Fro

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[David Hannum]

WildBlue and Hughsnet work for for folks who can't get ANYTHING else and can
AFFORD it.  We're picking thos folks up right and left.  I've had both
before.  Better than dialup - but just barely.  Cost is a killer.  And a
Windows update FAP's you out.

Dave

On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 10:40 AM, Chuck Hogg  wrote:

> If it wasn't WildBlue or HughesNet, DSL or Cable, it was the Wireless
> from ATT.  We beat out all of those services with the exception of
> Cable, it's 10MB for $50/mo (without TV).
>
> Regards,
> Chuck Hogg
> Shelby Broadband
> 502-722-9292
> ch...@shelbybb.com
> http://www.shelbybb.com
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Robert West
> Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 10:13 AM
> To: 'WISPA General List'
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation
>
>  Maybe I'm sensitive or easily put off but the last Newsletter that we
> received from the Connect Ohio division of CN had me "almost" confront
> the
> CN coordinator at the meeting.  I know that the mission is to provide
> broadband to EVERYONE and that includes those who can already afford
> access,
> (?) but every newsletter I get seems to be pandering to who they are
> getting
> their money from and doesn't have much to do with providing broadband in
> rural areas.  (Many examples of AT&T big shots in photo ops with state
> and
> local politicians donating PC's to schools and similar activities)
>
> Here is the word for word front page article in their newsletter.  This
> alone caused me to rethink any participation in their "efforts" or lack
> of.
>
>
> ( Link is here  http://www.connectohio.org/ )
>
> How broadband changed my life
>
> I am a 48-year-old married mother of four with what you can imagine is a
> very busy life. My husband and I enjoy traveling, collecting and showing
> vintage cars, spending time at our cottage on Lake Erie and sailing. Our
> children range in age from 17 to 22, and we are currently hosting a
> 17-year-old exchange student from Brazil. Broadband has had two major
> influences on my life:
>
> 1. It has allowed me to log on to my work network from anywhere. I can
> work
> from home or check e-mails from the cottage. No longer am I tethered to
> my
> desk at work in order to get work done.
>
> 2. It has allowed me to  further my education. I have recently gone back
> to
> school to obtain my master's degree in Management Information
> Technology.
> With my busy lifestyle, there is no way I could have realized this dream
> if
> I had to attend classes at a bricks and mortar school. The speed and
> convenience of broadband allows me to take all of my courses online,
> from
> anywhere.
>
>
> Uh. Here's my keywords in this.  Vintage cars (plural) Cottage on
> Lake
> Erie, sailing, exchange student, Masters Degree in Information
> Technology.
>
> If I had to guess I would say that this person probably already had
> broadband before CN came along in one form or another and from the way
> it
> reads where she can go anyplace and be online, sounds like a wireless
> card
> from a cell company.
>
> Where is the relevance in this to what we are trying to accomplish?
> Just
> sounded like they were spotlighting someone that the people in charge
> could
> identify with instead of the single unemployed mother in rural
> Appalachia
> who is now able to sell her recipes or quilts or whatever to a world
> market...blah, blah, blah.  A REAL change in someone's life, not just so
> some well to do middle aged educational tech coordinator can check her
> email
> while riding in one of their vintage cars or in the sail boat
> Shsh.
>
> "Look, look!  We helped your sister and now she can get her email while
> relaxing at the cottage on the lake after a long day of sailing!"
>
> Makes me sick.
>
> Bob-
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
>  Behalf Of Chuck Hogg
> Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 6:59 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation
>
> I think once you have been doing it at least 2 years, you will begin to
> have a change of heart.  We were in our infant stage.  We begged for
> help and cooperation on helping us get access to multiple locations.
> They essentially said, "Good luck!".  All they did for us was cheerlead
> across KY about how to bridge the technology gaps.
>
> We had to get almost every independent ISP in KY to let the government
> know how bad they were doing.  They mapped areas 

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[David Hannum]

Bob,

There's not a lot of money in Meigs County Ohio where we are, but where the
folks with money live in our county is where the broadband aint.  The
customers we are picking up are all across the board.  Including the upper
class who are sick of paying for satellite.  Satellite is an option, but
wireless is better.  You can't VPN or remote access (in a usable manner) via
satellite.  So just because somebody can afford a cottage does not mean they
have broadband.  Besides, those are the folks who buy the packages you have
the greatest margin on.  Among our key clients is a doctor, who is also the
county cornorer and the EMS director.  It helps patients and the county that
these folks can now work from home.  The need for broadband transends class.

Dave




On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 10:12 AM, Robert West wrote:

> Maybe I'm sensitive or easily put off but the last Newsletter that we
> received from the Connect Ohio division of CN had me "almost" confront the
> CN coordinator at the meeting.  I know that the mission is to provide
> broadband to EVERYONE and that includes those who can already afford
> access,
> (?) but every newsletter I get seems to be pandering to who they are
> getting
> their money from and doesn't have much to do with providing broadband in
> rural areas.  (Many examples of AT&T big shots in photo ops with state and
> local politicians donating PC's to schools and similar activities)
>
> Here is the word for word front page article in their newsletter.  This
> alone caused me to rethink any participation in their "efforts" or lack of.
>
>
> ( Link is here  http://www.connectohio.org/ )
>
> How broadband changed my life
>
> I am a 48-year-old married mother of four with what you can imagine is a
> very busy life. My husband and I enjoy traveling, collecting and showing
> vintage cars, spending time at our cottage on Lake Erie and sailing. Our
> children range in age from 17 to 22, and we are currently hosting a
> 17-year-old exchange student from Brazil. Broadband has had two major
> influences on my life:
>
> 1. It has allowed me to log on to my work network from anywhere. I can work
> from home or check e-mails from the cottage. No longer am I tethered to my
> desk at work in order to get work done.
>
> 2. It has allowed me to  further my education. I have recently gone back to
> school to obtain my master's degree in Management Information Technology.
> With my busy lifestyle, there is no way I could have realized this dream if
> I had to attend classes at a bricks and mortar school. The speed and
> convenience of broadband allows me to take all of my courses online, from
> anywhere.
>
>
> Uh. Here's my keywords in this.  Vintage cars (plural) Cottage on Lake
> Erie, sailing, exchange student, Masters Degree in Information Technology.
>
> If I had to guess I would say that this person probably already had
> broadband before CN came along in one form or another and from the way it
> reads where she can go anyplace and be online, sounds like a wireless card
> from a cell company.
>
> Where is the relevance in this to what we are trying to accomplish?  Just
> sounded like they were spotlighting someone that the people in charge could
> identify with instead of the single unemployed mother in rural Appalachia
> who is now able to sell her recipes or quilts or whatever to a world
> market...blah, blah, blah.  A REAL change in someone's life, not just so
> some well to do middle aged educational tech coordinator can check her
> email
> while riding in one of their vintage cars or in the sail boat
>  Shsh.
>
> "Look, look!  We helped your sister and now she can get her email while
> relaxing at the cottage on the lake after a long day of sailing!"
>
> Makes me sick.
>
> Bob-
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
>  Behalf Of Chuck Hogg
> Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 6:59 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation
>
> I think once you have been doing it at least 2 years, you will begin to
> have a change of heart.  We were in our infant stage.  We begged for
> help and cooperation on helping us get access to multiple locations.
> They essentially said, "Good luck!".  All they did for us was cheerlead
> across KY about how to bridge the technology gaps.
>
> We had to get almost every independent ISP in KY to let the government
> know how bad they were doing.  They mapped areas of potential for
> cable/dsl co's and pushed WildBlue like it was going out of style.
>
> Regards,
> Chuck Hogg
> Shelby Broadband
> 502-722-9292
> ch...@shelbyb

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Robert West]

Sure!  And let's see  You are a small business owner located in
KENTUCKY.  You pay taxes in KENTUCKY.  You employee people in KENTUCKY.  

How much of the WildBlue or Hughesnet subscription dollars stay in KENTUCKY?
Or ATT or DSL, Cable...  etc.  

What a flippin' no brainer!  

But it's dollars over brains, in most cases.

Glad you ran them out.  I usually don't know what in the hell I'm talking
about but I can see that one very clearly.



-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Chuck Hogg
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 10:41 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

If it wasn't WildBlue or HughesNet, DSL or Cable, it was the Wireless
from ATT.  We beat out all of those services with the exception of
Cable, it's 10MB for $50/mo (without TV).

Regards,
Chuck Hogg
Shelby Broadband
502-722-9292
ch...@shelbybb.com
http://www.shelbybb.com


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Robert West
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 10:13 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

Maybe I'm sensitive or easily put off but the last Newsletter that we
received from the Connect Ohio division of CN had me "almost" confront
the
CN coordinator at the meeting.  I know that the mission is to provide
broadband to EVERYONE and that includes those who can already afford
access,
(?) but every newsletter I get seems to be pandering to who they are
getting
their money from and doesn't have much to do with providing broadband in
rural areas.  (Many examples of AT&T big shots in photo ops with state
and
local politicians donating PC's to schools and similar activities)

Here is the word for word front page article in their newsletter.  This
alone caused me to rethink any participation in their "efforts" or lack
of.


( Link is here  http://www.connectohio.org/ )

How broadband changed my life 

I am a 48-year-old married mother of four with what you can imagine is a
very busy life. My husband and I enjoy traveling, collecting and showing
vintage cars, spending time at our cottage on Lake Erie and sailing. Our
children range in age from 17 to 22, and we are currently hosting a
17-year-old exchange student from Brazil. Broadband has had two major
influences on my life:

1. It has allowed me to log on to my work network from anywhere. I can
work
from home or check e-mails from the cottage. No longer am I tethered to
my
desk at work in order to get work done. 

2. It has allowed me to  further my education. I have recently gone back
to
school to obtain my master's degree in Management Information
Technology.
With my busy lifestyle, there is no way I could have realized this dream
if
I had to attend classes at a bricks and mortar school. The speed and
convenience of broadband allows me to take all of my courses online,
from
anywhere.


Uh. Here's my keywords in this.  Vintage cars (plural) Cottage on
Lake
Erie, sailing, exchange student, Masters Degree in Information
Technology.

If I had to guess I would say that this person probably already had
broadband before CN came along in one form or another and from the way
it
reads where she can go anyplace and be online, sounds like a wireless
card
from a cell company.

Where is the relevance in this to what we are trying to accomplish?
Just
sounded like they were spotlighting someone that the people in charge
could
identify with instead of the single unemployed mother in rural
Appalachia
who is now able to sell her recipes or quilts or whatever to a world
market...blah, blah, blah.  A REAL change in someone's life, not just so
some well to do middle aged educational tech coordinator can check her
email
while riding in one of their vintage cars or in the sail boat
Shsh.

"Look, look!  We helped your sister and now she can get her email while
relaxing at the cottage on the lake after a long day of sailing!"

Makes me sick.

Bob-


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Chuck Hogg
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 6:59 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

I think once you have been doing it at least 2 years, you will begin to
have a change of heart.  We were in our infant stage.  We begged for
help and cooperation on helping us get access to multiple locations.
They essentially said, "Good luck!".  All they did for us was cheerlead
across KY about how to bridge the technology gaps.

We had to get almost every independent ISP in KY to let the government
know how bad they were doing.  They mapped areas of potential for
cable/dsl co's and pushed WildBlue like it was going out of style.

Regards,
Chuck Hogg
Shelby Broadband
502-722-9292
ch...@shelbybb.com
http://www.shelb

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Chuck Hogg]

If it wasn't WildBlue or HughesNet, DSL or Cable, it was the Wireless
from ATT.  We beat out all of those services with the exception of
Cable, it's 10MB for $50/mo (without TV).

Regards,
Chuck Hogg
Shelby Broadband
502-722-9292
ch...@shelbybb.com
http://www.shelbybb.com


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Robert West
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 10:13 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

Maybe I'm sensitive or easily put off but the last Newsletter that we
received from the Connect Ohio division of CN had me "almost" confront
the
CN coordinator at the meeting.  I know that the mission is to provide
broadband to EVERYONE and that includes those who can already afford
access,
(?) but every newsletter I get seems to be pandering to who they are
getting
their money from and doesn't have much to do with providing broadband in
rural areas.  (Many examples of AT&T big shots in photo ops with state
and
local politicians donating PC's to schools and similar activities)

Here is the word for word front page article in their newsletter.  This
alone caused me to rethink any participation in their "efforts" or lack
of.


( Link is here  http://www.connectohio.org/ )

How broadband changed my life 

I am a 48-year-old married mother of four with what you can imagine is a
very busy life. My husband and I enjoy traveling, collecting and showing
vintage cars, spending time at our cottage on Lake Erie and sailing. Our
children range in age from 17 to 22, and we are currently hosting a
17-year-old exchange student from Brazil. Broadband has had two major
influences on my life:

1. It has allowed me to log on to my work network from anywhere. I can
work
from home or check e-mails from the cottage. No longer am I tethered to
my
desk at work in order to get work done. 

2. It has allowed me to  further my education. I have recently gone back
to
school to obtain my master's degree in Management Information
Technology.
With my busy lifestyle, there is no way I could have realized this dream
if
I had to attend classes at a bricks and mortar school. The speed and
convenience of broadband allows me to take all of my courses online,
from
anywhere.


Uh. Here's my keywords in this.  Vintage cars (plural) Cottage on
Lake
Erie, sailing, exchange student, Masters Degree in Information
Technology.

If I had to guess I would say that this person probably already had
broadband before CN came along in one form or another and from the way
it
reads where she can go anyplace and be online, sounds like a wireless
card
from a cell company.

Where is the relevance in this to what we are trying to accomplish?
Just
sounded like they were spotlighting someone that the people in charge
could
identify with instead of the single unemployed mother in rural
Appalachia
who is now able to sell her recipes or quilts or whatever to a world
market...blah, blah, blah.  A REAL change in someone's life, not just so
some well to do middle aged educational tech coordinator can check her
email
while riding in one of their vintage cars or in the sail boat
Shsh.

"Look, look!  We helped your sister and now she can get her email while
relaxing at the cottage on the lake after a long day of sailing!"

Makes me sick.

Bob-


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Chuck Hogg
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 6:59 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

I think once you have been doing it at least 2 years, you will begin to
have a change of heart.  We were in our infant stage.  We begged for
help and cooperation on helping us get access to multiple locations.
They essentially said, "Good luck!".  All they did for us was cheerlead
across KY about how to bridge the technology gaps.

We had to get almost every independent ISP in KY to let the government
know how bad they were doing.  They mapped areas of potential for
cable/dsl co's and pushed WildBlue like it was going out of style.

Regards,
Chuck Hogg
Shelby Broadband
502-722-9292
ch...@shelbybb.com
http://www.shelbybb.com


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of David Hannum
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 12:16 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

I'm not sure I've ever posted to the list here before.  But I have to
chime
in on this.  While New Era Broadband is a fledgling in the WISP arena,
we
owe our existence to Connect Ohio, especially their wireless guys Chip
Spann
and Layne Wagner.  I've read everything everyone has said about CN and
Connect Ohio.  From 100% first hand experience, I disagree with about
90% if
it.  First, CN & Connect Ohio are technology & vendor neutral.  So if
y

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Robert West]

And everyone just LOVES wild blue, except of course the people who actually
have to use it.



-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Chuck Hogg
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 6:59 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

I think once you have been doing it at least 2 years, you will begin to
have a change of heart.  We were in our infant stage.  We begged for
help and cooperation on helping us get access to multiple locations.
They essentially said, "Good luck!".  All they did for us was cheerlead
across KY about how to bridge the technology gaps.

We had to get almost every independent ISP in KY to let the government
know how bad they were doing.  They mapped areas of potential for
cable/dsl co's and pushed WildBlue like it was going out of style.

Regards,
Chuck Hogg
Shelby Broadband
502-722-9292
ch...@shelbybb.com
http://www.shelbybb.com


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of David Hannum
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 12:16 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

I'm not sure I've ever posted to the list here before.  But I have to
chime
in on this.  While New Era Broadband is a fledgling in the WISP arena,
we
owe our existence to Connect Ohio, especially their wireless guys Chip
Spann
and Layne Wagner.  I've read everything everyone has said about CN and
Connect Ohio.  From 100% first hand experience, I disagree with about
90% if
it.  First, CN & Connect Ohio are technology & vendor neutral.  So if
you
are looking for someone that is 100% in the WISP corner, you won't find
it
with them.  That said, if you want WISP help, they will be 100% behind
you.
As for the comment that they are a telco tool . . .  We have not found
that
to be the case in any way, shape or form in our dealing with them.
Note:  I
said in OUR dealings with them.  The maps?  No matter who would make
them,
the are only as good as the info voluntarily submitted by the carriers.
In
our case, Windstream was just stupid in what they claim to cover.  But,
Connect Ohio could only go with what they were given.

The engineering, tech support, help with putting funding proposals
together,
all of this has added up to a great experience for us.  We are a new
company
- just been online since June of this year.  We just put our third
access
point up a couple of weeks ago.  But I have to say, to this point, CN/CO
and
Chip & Layne have been good for us.   Your results may vary.

Kind Regards,
David Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC
www.newerabroadband.com






On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 11:35 PM, RickG  wrote:

> Same here. -RickG
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 3:45 PM, Chuck Hogg 
wrote:
>
>  > Bad for us.  They pushed WildBlue and HughesNet over us because
> > WB/Hughes paid them $10k to be a partner.  They also provided the
> > mapping for Bellsouth/ATT and Insight (cable co) and identified the
> > areas that they should serve.  In my guestimate, it hurt us to the
tune
> > of 50-150 customers.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Chuck Hogg
> > Shelby Broadband
> > 502-722-9292
> > ch...@shelbybb.com
> > http://www.shelbybb.com
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
On
> > Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:30 PM
> > To: wireless@wispa.org
> > Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation
> >
> > Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for
us?
> >
> > My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with
any
> > information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I
don't
> > remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so
to
> > avoid them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of
that
> > stuff anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper
bag
> > holding water.
> >
> >
> > -
> > Mike Hammett
> > Intelligent Computing Solutions
> > http://www.ics-il.com
> >
> >
> >
> >

> > 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >

> > 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
-

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Robert West]

Maybe I'm sensitive or easily put off but the last Newsletter that we
received from the Connect Ohio division of CN had me "almost" confront the
CN coordinator at the meeting.  I know that the mission is to provide
broadband to EVERYONE and that includes those who can already afford access,
(?) but every newsletter I get seems to be pandering to who they are getting
their money from and doesn't have much to do with providing broadband in
rural areas.  (Many examples of AT&T big shots in photo ops with state and
local politicians donating PC's to schools and similar activities)

Here is the word for word front page article in their newsletter.  This
alone caused me to rethink any participation in their "efforts" or lack of.


( Link is here  http://www.connectohio.org/ )

How broadband changed my life 

I am a 48-year-old married mother of four with what you can imagine is a
very busy life. My husband and I enjoy traveling, collecting and showing
vintage cars, spending time at our cottage on Lake Erie and sailing. Our
children range in age from 17 to 22, and we are currently hosting a
17-year-old exchange student from Brazil. Broadband has had two major
influences on my life:

1. It has allowed me to log on to my work network from anywhere. I can work
from home or check e-mails from the cottage. No longer am I tethered to my
desk at work in order to get work done. 

2. It has allowed me to  further my education. I have recently gone back to
school to obtain my master's degree in Management Information Technology.
With my busy lifestyle, there is no way I could have realized this dream if
I had to attend classes at a bricks and mortar school. The speed and
convenience of broadband allows me to take all of my courses online, from
anywhere.


Uh. Here's my keywords in this.  Vintage cars (plural) Cottage on Lake
Erie, sailing, exchange student, Masters Degree in Information Technology.

If I had to guess I would say that this person probably already had
broadband before CN came along in one form or another and from the way it
reads where she can go anyplace and be online, sounds like a wireless card
from a cell company.

Where is the relevance in this to what we are trying to accomplish?  Just
sounded like they were spotlighting someone that the people in charge could
identify with instead of the single unemployed mother in rural Appalachia
who is now able to sell her recipes or quilts or whatever to a world
market...blah, blah, blah.  A REAL change in someone's life, not just so
some well to do middle aged educational tech coordinator can check her email
while riding in one of their vintage cars or in the sail boat  Shsh.

"Look, look!  We helped your sister and now she can get her email while
relaxing at the cottage on the lake after a long day of sailing!"

Makes me sick.

Bob-


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Chuck Hogg
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 6:59 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

I think once you have been doing it at least 2 years, you will begin to
have a change of heart.  We were in our infant stage.  We begged for
help and cooperation on helping us get access to multiple locations.
They essentially said, "Good luck!".  All they did for us was cheerlead
across KY about how to bridge the technology gaps.

We had to get almost every independent ISP in KY to let the government
know how bad they were doing.  They mapped areas of potential for
cable/dsl co's and pushed WildBlue like it was going out of style.

Regards,
Chuck Hogg
Shelby Broadband
502-722-9292
ch...@shelbybb.com
http://www.shelbybb.com


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of David Hannum
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 12:16 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

I'm not sure I've ever posted to the list here before.  But I have to
chime
in on this.  While New Era Broadband is a fledgling in the WISP arena,
we
owe our existence to Connect Ohio, especially their wireless guys Chip
Spann
and Layne Wagner.  I've read everything everyone has said about CN and
Connect Ohio.  From 100% first hand experience, I disagree with about
90% if
it.  First, CN & Connect Ohio are technology & vendor neutral.  So if
you
are looking for someone that is 100% in the WISP corner, you won't find
it
with them.  That said, if you want WISP help, they will be 100% behind
you.
As for the comment that they are a telco tool . . .  We have not found
that
to be the case in any way, shape or form in our dealing with them.
Note:  I
said in OUR dealings with them.  The maps?  No matter who would make
them,
the are only as good as the info voluntarily submitted by the carriers.
In
our case, Windstream was just stupid in what they claim to c

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Chuck Hogg]

I think once you have been doing it at least 2 years, you will begin to
have a change of heart.  We were in our infant stage.  We begged for
help and cooperation on helping us get access to multiple locations.
They essentially said, "Good luck!".  All they did for us was cheerlead
across KY about how to bridge the technology gaps.

We had to get almost every independent ISP in KY to let the government
know how bad they were doing.  They mapped areas of potential for
cable/dsl co's and pushed WildBlue like it was going out of style.

Regards,
Chuck Hogg
Shelby Broadband
502-722-9292
ch...@shelbybb.com
http://www.shelbybb.com


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of David Hannum
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 12:16 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

I'm not sure I've ever posted to the list here before.  But I have to
chime
in on this.  While New Era Broadband is a fledgling in the WISP arena,
we
owe our existence to Connect Ohio, especially their wireless guys Chip
Spann
and Layne Wagner.  I've read everything everyone has said about CN and
Connect Ohio.  From 100% first hand experience, I disagree with about
90% if
it.  First, CN & Connect Ohio are technology & vendor neutral.  So if
you
are looking for someone that is 100% in the WISP corner, you won't find
it
with them.  That said, if you want WISP help, they will be 100% behind
you.
As for the comment that they are a telco tool . . .  We have not found
that
to be the case in any way, shape or form in our dealing with them.
Note:  I
said in OUR dealings with them.  The maps?  No matter who would make
them,
the are only as good as the info voluntarily submitted by the carriers.
In
our case, Windstream was just stupid in what they claim to cover.  But,
Connect Ohio could only go with what they were given.

The engineering, tech support, help with putting funding proposals
together,
all of this has added up to a great experience for us.  We are a new
company
- just been online since June of this year.  We just put our third
access
point up a couple of weeks ago.  But I have to say, to this point, CN/CO
and
Chip & Layne have been good for us.   Your results may vary.

Kind Regards,
David Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC
www.newerabroadband.com






On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 11:35 PM, RickG  wrote:

> Same here. -RickG
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 3:45 PM, Chuck Hogg 
wrote:
>
>  > Bad for us.  They pushed WildBlue and HughesNet over us because
> > WB/Hughes paid them $10k to be a partner.  They also provided the
> > mapping for Bellsouth/ATT and Insight (cable co) and identified the
> > areas that they should serve.  In my guestimate, it hurt us to the
tune
> > of 50-150 customers.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Chuck Hogg
> > Shelby Broadband
> > 502-722-9292
> > ch...@shelbybb.com
> > http://www.shelbybb.com
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
On
> > Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:30 PM
> > To: wireless@wispa.org
> > Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation
> >
> > Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for
us?
> >
> > My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with
any
> > information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I
don't
> > remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so
to
> > avoid them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of
that
> > stuff anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper
bag
> > holding water.
> >
> >
> > -
> > Mike Hammett
> > Intelligent Computing Solutions
> > http://www.ics-il.com
> >
> >
> >
> >

> > 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >

> > 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> >
> >
> >
>


> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> >
>


> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[MDK]

Mike, that is one of the best creative exercises in the use of the english 
language I have seen here  You just made my evening :)



--
From: "Mike Hammett" 
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 11:30 AM
To: 
Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation

  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag holding water.
 




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Robert West]

David,

Glad to hear you had good results, I'm sure some have.  When they first
started in my area I gave them a chance but all they talked to me was what
they could do for me and how much it would cost, as in their fees.  That
went against my thinking of "working together" and was more of a paid
consulting firm. I figured if I wanted to pay someone I'd shop around, not
pay someone who was already getting my money from one pocket via the
government to come and "help" me for a dip in my OTHER pocket.  Once they
started talking money to me when all I was looking for was some information,
I went into "Oh, hell no!" mode and dropped them.  (They of course called me
every other day or so for a couple of weeks "Just to touch base" they would
say, like that salesperson who you will NEVER buy anything from yet will
call you all the time and act like they are your best buddy)

Any time since then, when I may have been having a lack of medication or
forgot my "hell no" moment and sent an email to them looking for this or
that, I never got any response, I just assumed it was because they knew I
wasn't a paycheck. But I was only assuming so I'm probably wrong as my wife
occasionally reminds me.

Did you pay them anything to help you set things up or how did you go about
it?  I'm not trying to be a smartass (I don't have to try, trust me) Was
just interested in the process you went through to get to where you are now
and what they did for you.  Maybe they have mended their ways, if so tell
us, man!

Bob-


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of David Hannum
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 12:16 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

I'm not sure I've ever posted to the list here before.  But I have to chime
in on this.  While New Era Broadband is a fledgling in the WISP arena, we
owe our existence to Connect Ohio, especially their wireless guys Chip Spann
and Layne Wagner.  I've read everything everyone has said about CN and
Connect Ohio.  From 100% first hand experience, I disagree with about 90% if
it.  First, CN & Connect Ohio are technology & vendor neutral.  So if you
are looking for someone that is 100% in the WISP corner, you won't find it
with them.  That said, if you want WISP help, they will be 100% behind you.
As for the comment that they are a telco tool . . .  We have not found that
to be the case in any way, shape or form in our dealing with them.  Note:  I
said in OUR dealings with them.  The maps?  No matter who would make them,
the are only as good as the info voluntarily submitted by the carriers.  In
our case, Windstream was just stupid in what they claim to cover.  But,
Connect Ohio could only go with what they were given.

The engineering, tech support, help with putting funding proposals together,
all of this has added up to a great experience for us.  We are a new company
- just been online since June of this year.  We just put our third access
point up a couple of weeks ago.  But I have to say, to this point, CN/CO and
Chip & Layne have been good for us.   Your results may vary.

Kind Regards,
David Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC
www.newerabroadband.com






On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 11:35 PM, RickG  wrote:

> Same here. -RickG
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 3:45 PM, Chuck Hogg  wrote:
>
>  > Bad for us.  They pushed WildBlue and HughesNet over us because
> > WB/Hughes paid them $10k to be a partner.  They also provided the
> > mapping for Bellsouth/ATT and Insight (cable co) and identified the
> > areas that they should serve.  In my guestimate, it hurt us to the tune
> > of 50-150 customers.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Chuck Hogg
> > Shelby Broadband
> > 502-722-9292
> > ch...@shelbybb.com
> > http://www.shelbybb.com
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> > Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:30 PM
> > To: wireless@wispa.org
> > Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation
> >
> > Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?
> >
> > My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
> > information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
> > remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to
> > avoid them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that
> > stuff anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag
> > holding water.
> >
> >
> > -
> > Mike Hammett
> > Intelligent Computing Solutions
> > http://www.ics-il.com
> >
> >
> >
> > -

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[David Hannum]

I'm not sure I've ever posted to the list here before.  But I have to chime
in on this.  While New Era Broadband is a fledgling in the WISP arena, we
owe our existence to Connect Ohio, especially their wireless guys Chip Spann
and Layne Wagner.  I've read everything everyone has said about CN and
Connect Ohio.  From 100% first hand experience, I disagree with about 90% if
it.  First, CN & Connect Ohio are technology & vendor neutral.  So if you
are looking for someone that is 100% in the WISP corner, you won't find it
with them.  That said, if you want WISP help, they will be 100% behind you.
As for the comment that they are a telco tool . . .  We have not found that
to be the case in any way, shape or form in our dealing with them.  Note:  I
said in OUR dealings with them.  The maps?  No matter who would make them,
the are only as good as the info voluntarily submitted by the carriers.  In
our case, Windstream was just stupid in what they claim to cover.  But,
Connect Ohio could only go with what they were given.

The engineering, tech support, help with putting funding proposals together,
all of this has added up to a great experience for us.  We are a new company
- just been online since June of this year.  We just put our third access
point up a couple of weeks ago.  But I have to say, to this point, CN/CO and
Chip & Layne have been good for us.   Your results may vary.

Kind Regards,
David Hannum
New Era Broadband, LLC
www.newerabroadband.com






On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 11:35 PM, RickG  wrote:

> Same here. -RickG
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 3:45 PM, Chuck Hogg  wrote:
>
>  > Bad for us.  They pushed WildBlue and HughesNet over us because
> > WB/Hughes paid them $10k to be a partner.  They also provided the
> > mapping for Bellsouth/ATT and Insight (cable co) and identified the
> > areas that they should serve.  In my guestimate, it hurt us to the tune
> > of 50-150 customers.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Chuck Hogg
> > Shelby Broadband
> > 502-722-9292
> > ch...@shelbybb.com
> > http://www.shelbybb.com
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> > Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:30 PM
> > To: wireless@wispa.org
> > Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation
> >
> > Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?
> >
> > My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
> > information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
> > remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to
> > avoid them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that
> > stuff anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag
> > holding water.
> >
> >
> > -
> > Mike Hammett
> > Intelligent Computing Solutions
> > http://www.ics-il.com
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> > 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> > 
> > 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> >
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
>
>
>
> 
>  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[RickG]

Same here. -RickG

On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 3:45 PM, Chuck Hogg  wrote:

> Bad for us.  They pushed WildBlue and HughesNet over us because
> WB/Hughes paid them $10k to be a partner.  They also provided the
> mapping for Bellsouth/ATT and Insight (cable co) and identified the
> areas that they should serve.  In my guestimate, it hurt us to the tune
> of 50-150 customers.
>
> Regards,
> Chuck Hogg
> Shelby Broadband
> 502-722-9292
> ch...@shelbybb.com
> http://www.shelbybb.com
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:30 PM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation
>
> Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?
>
> My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
> information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
> remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to
> avoid them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that
> stuff anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag
> holding water.
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Brian Webster]

You guys are missing the point. Before the NTIA mapping grants were awarded,
there were no specific rules as to how the mapping was to be done and how
the data was supposed to be available and in what form. Now with these
broadband mapping grants there is a national standard that they ALL
(including connected nation) have to adhere to. The rules as they are
written are sound and will produce good information that will be accessible
to all.

Not only will the states be conducting these mapping efforts, but they are
required to turn copies of the data over to the NTIA who is charged with
creating a National Broadband Map by congress. The days of connected nation
creating their own rules are gone. Now don't get me wrong, I don't trust CN
any farther than I can throw them but they are still required to meet the
terms of the contracts in any states they have been awarded funding by these
grants.


Thank You,
Brian Webster




On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 5:56 PM, Robert West wrote:

> Their "Connect Ohio" site has an interactive map where you can choose what
> type of data you want in the map.  That map.  Jesus, what a pain in the
> butt that thing is to use.  About the worst piece of online software I ever
> had to deal with.  But for a quick check on the census I've found it okay
> to
> use with only minor "inappropriate" words uttered.
>
> Bob-
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Josh Luthman
> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 5:30 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation
>
> I concur with Robert.  I went to the first or second Connect Ohio meeting
> and came out laughing at what a waste of time, money and effort it was.
> Then I realized I'm paying for it and the smile went away.
>
> What did you find for census and mapping data?
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> --- Albert Einstein
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 5:25 PM, Robert West
> wrote:
>
> > We have them here in Ohio.  I'm back and forth on it.  On one hand, the
> one
> > time I tried asking for some info from them they wanted to charge me some
> > consulting fee and so a spectrum analysis of the area had nothing to do
> > with
> > what I was asking so I shut them out.  Then I started going to the
> meetings
> > again, had one this morning as a matter of fact.  They really don't seem
> to
> > be anything more than a group that is collecting government monies and
> > giving the politicians an excuse to say they are doing something.  Every
> > meeting I've gone to has been a waste of time and from what I have seen
> > it's
> > because they take the lead but don't do anything with it. Leadership with
> > no
> > action  You may as well do nothing.
> >
> >
> > The only bright spot I have had from them is a central place to go to
> find
> > the census and mapping data.  Other than that it's been a waste from my
> > prospective.
> >
> > Bob-
> >
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> > Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:30 PM
> > To: wireless@wispa.org
> > Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation
> >
> > Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?
> >
> > My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
> > information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
> > remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to
> avoid
> > them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that stuff
> > anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag holding
> > water.
> >
> >
> > -
> > Mike Hammett
> > Intelligent Computing Solutions
> > http://www.ics-il.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> 
> > 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> >
>
> 
> > 
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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Robert West]

Their "Connect Ohio" site has an interactive map where you can choose what
type of data you want in the map.  That map.  Jesus, what a pain in the
butt that thing is to use.  About the worst piece of online software I ever
had to deal with.  But for a quick check on the census I've found it okay to
use with only minor "inappropriate" words uttered.

Bob-



-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 5:30 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

I concur with Robert.  I went to the first or second Connect Ohio meeting
and came out laughing at what a waste of time, money and effort it was.
Then I realized I'm paying for it and the smile went away.

What did you find for census and mapping data?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
--- Albert Einstein


On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 5:25 PM, Robert West
wrote:

> We have them here in Ohio.  I'm back and forth on it.  On one hand, the
one
> time I tried asking for some info from them they wanted to charge me some
> consulting fee and so a spectrum analysis of the area had nothing to do
> with
> what I was asking so I shut them out.  Then I started going to the
meetings
> again, had one this morning as a matter of fact.  They really don't seem
to
> be anything more than a group that is collecting government monies and
> giving the politicians an excuse to say they are doing something.  Every
> meeting I've gone to has been a waste of time and from what I have seen
> it's
> because they take the lead but don't do anything with it. Leadership with
> no
> action  You may as well do nothing.
>
>
> The only bright spot I have had from them is a central place to go to find
> the census and mapping data.  Other than that it's been a waste from my
> prospective.
>
> Bob-
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:30 PM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation
>
> Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?
>
> My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
> information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
> remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to
avoid
> them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that stuff
> anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag holding
> water.
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
>
>

> 
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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Josh Luthman]

I concur with Robert.  I went to the first or second Connect Ohio meeting
and came out laughing at what a waste of time, money and effort it was.
Then I realized I'm paying for it and the smile went away.

What did you find for census and mapping data?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
--- Albert Einstein


On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 5:25 PM, Robert West wrote:

> We have them here in Ohio.  I'm back and forth on it.  On one hand, the one
> time I tried asking for some info from them they wanted to charge me some
> consulting fee and so a spectrum analysis of the area had nothing to do
> with
> what I was asking so I shut them out.  Then I started going to the meetings
> again, had one this morning as a matter of fact.  They really don't seem to
> be anything more than a group that is collecting government monies and
> giving the politicians an excuse to say they are doing something.  Every
> meeting I've gone to has been a waste of time and from what I have seen
> it's
> because they take the lead but don't do anything with it. Leadership with
> no
> action  You may as well do nothing.
>
>
> The only bright spot I have had from them is a central place to go to find
> the census and mapping data.  Other than that it's been a waste from my
> prospective.
>
> Bob-
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:30 PM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation
>
> Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?
>
> My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
> information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
> remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to avoid
> them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that stuff
> anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag holding
> water.
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
>
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Robert West]

We have them here in Ohio.  I'm back and forth on it.  On one hand, the one
time I tried asking for some info from them they wanted to charge me some
consulting fee and so a spectrum analysis of the area had nothing to do with
what I was asking so I shut them out.  Then I started going to the meetings
again, had one this morning as a matter of fact.  They really don't seem to
be anything more than a group that is collecting government monies and
giving the politicians an excuse to say they are doing something.  Every
meeting I've gone to has been a waste of time and from what I have seen it's
because they take the lead but don't do anything with it. Leadership with no
action  You may as well do nothing.


The only bright spot I have had from them is a central place to go to find
the census and mapping data.  Other than that it's been a waste from my
prospective. 

Bob-



-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:30 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation

Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?

My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to avoid
them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that stuff
anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag holding
water.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com





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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Butch Evans]

On Wed, 2009-12-16 at 14:40 -0500, Shaddi Hasan wrote: 
> I must have missed this discussion, but could someone point me to some
> threads where this conclusion was reached, or what some of the rationale
> was? Not trying to argue just trying to understand.

THis was discussed primarily on the member's list, if I recall
correctly.

-- 

* Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*
* http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *
* http://www.wispa.org/ * Wired or Wireless Networks   *
* http://blog.butchevans.com/   * ImageStream, Mikrotik and MORE!  *





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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Chuck Hogg]

I submitted my information to them, actually exports of RM.  Gerard
introduced him to RM, but didn't train him by any means.  We may have
benefited from people searching for our service from them, but they have
long been gone in our area and their loss of coverage maps has had no
impact on new signups.

Another issue I have with them, KY paid millions to them for the mapping
project.  It was live during the time the contract was active.  Now that
it is not, the data is gone and they won't let anyone access the
mapping.  So 2 years of work down the drain.  The maps were largely
inaccurate, but it had other census data, public utility data, and other
things that was interesting to look at. 

Regards,
Chuck Hogg
Shelby Broadband
502-722-9292
ch...@shelbybb.com
http://www.shelbybb.com


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brian Webster
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 4:42 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

The way connected nation has to abide by the broadband mapping grant
rules,
is quite different from the way they have operated on past projects. The
recent threads about them were based on the fact that they appear to
have a
clueless person using Radio Mobile to generate WISP coverage maps. One
person had said they were allowed to submit their own Radio Mobile maps
to
the state rather than have them create the RF plots. I would recommend
that
as a WISP you generate your own coverage maps (or hire someone to do
that
for you..shameless plug) and submit those results.

Remember all of these state mapping projects will become the national
broadband availability map. Consumers will use this as a tool to search
for
service. If you don't participate you will not get the benefit of that
free
marketing engine. Also you will have people applying for more grant
money in
your own service area should you be the only one servicing that
location.
Once these official maps are published there will not be any challenge
process, rightfully so I might add. If you don't want to participate in
letting people know where broadband exists, why should you be allowed to
try
and stop someone who is willing to tell consumers where they can get
broadband.

Thank You,
Brian Webster



On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 3:45 PM, Chuck Hogg  wrote:

> Bad for us.  They pushed WildBlue and HughesNet over us because
> WB/Hughes paid them $10k to be a partner.  They also provided the
> mapping for Bellsouth/ATT and Insight (cable co) and identified the
> areas that they should serve.  In my guestimate, it hurt us to the
tune
> of 50-150 customers.
>
> Regards,
> Chuck Hogg
> Shelby Broadband
> 502-722-9292
> ch...@shelbybb.com
> http://www.shelbybb.com
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
On
> Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:30 PM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation
>
> Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?
>
> My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
> information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
> remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to
> avoid them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that
> stuff anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag
> holding water.
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
>

> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>

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>
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--

Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Brian Webster]

The way connected nation has to abide by the broadband mapping grant rules,
is quite different from the way they have operated on past projects. The
recent threads about them were based on the fact that they appear to have a
clueless person using Radio Mobile to generate WISP coverage maps. One
person had said they were allowed to submit their own Radio Mobile maps to
the state rather than have them create the RF plots. I would recommend that
as a WISP you generate your own coverage maps (or hire someone to do that
for you..shameless plug) and submit those results.

Remember all of these state mapping projects will become the national
broadband availability map. Consumers will use this as a tool to search for
service. If you don't participate you will not get the benefit of that free
marketing engine. Also you will have people applying for more grant money in
your own service area should you be the only one servicing that location.
Once these official maps are published there will not be any challenge
process, rightfully so I might add. If you don't want to participate in
letting people know where broadband exists, why should you be allowed to try
and stop someone who is willing to tell consumers where they can get
broadband.

Thank You,
Brian Webster



On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 3:45 PM, Chuck Hogg  wrote:

> Bad for us.  They pushed WildBlue and HughesNet over us because
> WB/Hughes paid them $10k to be a partner.  They also provided the
> mapping for Bellsouth/ATT and Insight (cable co) and identified the
> areas that they should serve.  In my guestimate, it hurt us to the tune
> of 50-150 customers.
>
> Regards,
> Chuck Hogg
> Shelby Broadband
> 502-722-9292
> ch...@shelbybb.com
> http://www.shelbybb.com
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:30 PM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation
>
> Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?
>
> My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
> information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
> remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to
> avoid them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that
> stuff anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag
> holding water.
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Chuck Hogg]

Bad for us.  They pushed WildBlue and HughesNet over us because
WB/Hughes paid them $10k to be a partner.  They also provided the
mapping for Bellsouth/ATT and Insight (cable co) and identified the
areas that they should serve.  In my guestimate, it hurt us to the tune
of 50-150 customers.

Regards,
Chuck Hogg
Shelby Broadband
502-722-9292
ch...@shelbybb.com
http://www.shelbybb.com


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:30 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation

Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?

My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to
avoid them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that
stuff anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag
holding water.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com





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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Nathan Stooke]

Hello,

We are in the same state and chose not to give them the data either.
Not only would it take us a good while to get the data they wanted we did
not feel good about the setup.  Until the state makes us or CN changes we
will not be giving them any info.

Thanks


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 1:30 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Subject: [WISPA] Connected Nation

Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?

My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to avoid
them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that stuff
anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag holding
water.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com





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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Adam Kennedy]

Do they make a Visine for that?


On 12/16/09 2:55 PM, "Jack Unger"  wrote:

Last year the WISPA Board went through an E X T E N S I V E review and 
discussion about Connected Nation. CN wanted WISPA to "join" which would have 
meant that they co-opt us. The Board's conclusion was "Bad for WISPA. CN is 
Telco tool".

Of course, CN didn't go away. They kept on consolidating their political power 
and they apparently got several State governments to grant them statewide 
mapping franchises. Now their (probably inaccurate) maps may become the 
"official" broadband coverage maps.

CN approached me again last April. I accepted their offer to "check out" their 
maps. I looked at their Minnesota State Map. It appeared to show that DSL was 
available in every square inch of the State. I found and still find it hard to 
believe that. I stopped talking with them at that time.

I'm still trying to figure out how to handle the little problem known as CN.

jack


Chuck Bartosch wrote:

Been lots of discussion about this. Without repeating all that discussion, I 
think the conclusion has been, "bad for us". Telco tool.

Chuck

On Dec 16, 2009, at 2:30 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:




Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?

My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any 
information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't remember 
the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to avoid them.  They 
sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that stuff anyway.  Most any 
contract is about as effective as a paper bag holding water.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com




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--
Chuck Bartosch
Clarity Connect, Inc.
200 Pleasant Grove Road
Ithaca, NY 14850
(607) 257-8268

"When the stars threw down their spears,
and water'd heaven with their tears,
Did He smile, His work to see?
Did He who made the Lamb make thee?"

>From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger!






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--
Adam Kennedy
Senior Network Administrator
Cyberlink Technologies, Inc.
Phone: 888-293-3693 x4352
Fax: 574-855-5761



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Jack Unger]

Last year the WISPA Board went through an E X T E N S I V E review and
discussion about Connected Nation. CN wanted WISPA to "join" which
would have meant that they co-opt us. The Board's conclusion was "Bad
for WISPA. CN is Telco tool". 

Of course, CN didn't go away. They kept on consolidating their
political power and they apparently got several State governments to
grant them statewide mapping franchises. Now their (probably
inaccurate) maps may become the "official" broadband coverage maps. 

CN approached me again last April. I accepted their offer to "check
out" their maps. I looked at their Minnesota State Map. It appeared to
show that DSL was available in every square inch of the State. I found
and still find it hard to believe that. I stopped talking with them at
that time. 

I'm still trying to figure out how to handle the little problem known
as CN. 

jack


Chuck Bartosch wrote:

  Been lots of discussion about this. Without repeating all that discussion, I think the conclusion has been, "bad for us". Telco tool.

Chuck

On Dec 16, 2009, at 2:30 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:

  
  
Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?

My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to avoid them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that stuff anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag holding water.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com




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--
Chuck Bartosch
Clarity Connect, Inc.
200 Pleasant Grove Road
Ithaca, NY 14850
(607) 257-8268

"When the stars threw down their spears,
and water'd heaven with their tears,
Did He smile, His work to see?
Did He who made the Lamb make thee?"

>From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger!






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-- 
Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
Consulting, Technical Writing, Editing, Training, Wireless Mapping
Serving the Wireless, Networking, and Telecom Communities Since 1993
www.ask-wi.com  818-227-4220  jun...@ask-wi.com









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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[David E. Smith]

On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 13:40, Shaddi Hasan  wrote:

> I must have missed this discussion, but could someone point me to some
> threads where this conclusion was reached, or what some of the rationale
> was? Not trying to argue just trying to understand.


The first two that come up in a search of the wireless@wispa.org archives:

http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/2009-April/043708.html
http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/2008-January/031644.html

(Those are the first posts in their respective threads, just follow along
with the links at the bottom of the page)

David Smith
MVN.net



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Shaddi Hasan]

I must have missed this discussion, but could someone point me to some
threads where this conclusion was reached, or what some of the rationale
was? Not trying to argue just trying to understand.

On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 2:38 PM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> Chuck of ShelbyBB was able to get rid of the Kentucky one.  As far as I
> know
> every other state has yet to build the immunity to the disease.
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> --- Albert Einstein
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 2:32 PM, Chuck Bartosch  >wrote:
>
> > Been lots of discussion about this. Without repeating all that
> discussion,
> > I think the conclusion has been, "bad for us". Telco tool.
> >
> > Chuck
> >
> > On Dec 16, 2009, at 2:30 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:
> >
> > > Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?
> > >
> > > My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
> > information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
> > remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to
> avoid
> > them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that stuff
> > anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag holding
> > water.
> > >
> > >
> > > -
> > > Mike Hammett
> > > Intelligent Computing Solutions
> > > http://www.ics-il.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> 
> > > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > > http://signup.wispa.org/
> > >
> >
> 
> > >
> > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> > >
> > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> > >
> > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> > --
> > Chuck Bartosch
> > Clarity Connect, Inc.
> > 200 Pleasant Grove Road
> > Ithaca, NY 14850
> > (607) 257-8268
> >
> > "When the stars threw down their spears,
> > and water'd heaven with their tears,
> > Did He smile, His work to see?
> > Did He who made the Lamb make thee?"
> >
> > >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> >
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Josh Luthman]

Chuck of ShelbyBB was able to get rid of the Kentucky one.  As far as I know
every other state has yet to build the immunity to the disease.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
--- Albert Einstein


On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 2:32 PM, Chuck Bartosch wrote:

> Been lots of discussion about this. Without repeating all that discussion,
> I think the conclusion has been, "bad for us". Telco tool.
>
> Chuck
>
> On Dec 16, 2009, at 2:30 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:
>
> > Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?
> >
> > My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any
> information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't
> remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to avoid
> them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that stuff
> anyway.  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag holding
> water.
> >
> >
> > -
> > Mike Hammett
> > Intelligent Computing Solutions
> > http://www.ics-il.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
> --
> Chuck Bartosch
> Clarity Connect, Inc.
> 200 Pleasant Grove Road
> Ithaca, NY 14850
> (607) 257-8268
>
> "When the stars threw down their spears,
> and water'd heaven with their tears,
> Did He smile, His work to see?
> Did He who made the Lamb make thee?"
>
> >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger!
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation

[Chuck Bartosch]

Been lots of discussion about this. Without repeating all that discussion, I 
think the conclusion has been, "bad for us". Telco tool.

Chuck

On Dec 16, 2009, at 2:30 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:

> Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?
> 
> My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any 
> information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't 
> remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to avoid 
> them.  They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that stuff anyway. 
>  Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag holding water.
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> 
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

--
Chuck Bartosch
Clarity Connect, Inc.
200 Pleasant Grove Road
Ithaca, NY 14850
(607) 257-8268

"When the stars threw down their spears,
and water'd heaven with their tears,
Did He smile, His work to see?
Did He who made the Lamb make thee?"

>From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger!






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[WISPA] Connected Nation

[Mike Hammett]

Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us?

My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any 
information if the things I heard in the past are still true.  I don't remember 
the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to avoid them.  They 
sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that stuff anyway.  Most any 
contract is about as effective as a paper bag holding water.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com




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Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee

[Chuck McCown]

A little artistic license was involved.
But to answer John's question, yes we are an ILEC.
But the RBOCS beat us up too.
- Original Message - 
From: "Jack Unger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 3:37 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee


> BORC
>
> Chuck McCown wrote:
>> Now that is something I can agree with, RBOC spelled another way is BORG.
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: "John Scrivner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: "WISPA General List" 
>> Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 3:14 PM
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee
>>
>>
>>
>>> I think WISPs should start looking less at ILECs as being an enemy and
>>> realize that in 99% of the cases it is the RBOCs who are the real
>>> problem. I work with some of the ILECs around me and most are great
>>> people who are running a business just like the rest of us. Many ILECs
>>> are WISPs these days too. Like it or not the ILECs are part of our
>>> culture now. If I remember right you are actually an ILEC aren't you
>>> Chuck?   :-)
>>> Scriv
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jan 31, 2008 3:19 PM, Chuck McCown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> But, but, but... we LOVE small rural ILECs...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> - Original Message -
>>>> From: "Jack Unger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>>> To: "WISPA General List" 
>>>> Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 2:07 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> There is a growing controversy centered on the "Connected Nation"
>>>>> (Connect Kentucky, Connect Ohio, Connected Tennessee etc.)
>>>>> political-business efforts.
>>>>>
>>>>> The reason is that it appears that the primary beneficiaries are the
>>>>> ILEC phone companies and their drive to extend their power, influence
>>>>> and business dominance. This occurs (of course) at the expense of 
>>>>> WISPs
>>>>> and small non-ILEC broadband providers.
>>>>>
>>>>> Here are some links so you can read up on it.
>>>>>
>>>>> (Commentary)
>>>>> http://www.drewclark.com/connect-kentucky-article-raises-bell-lobby-specter/
>>>>>
>>>>> (Original Art Brodsky article) 
>>>>> http://www.publicknowledge.org/node/1334
>>>>>
>>>>> jack
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> George Rogato wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.connectedtennessee.org/mapping_&_research/availability_maps/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>
>>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
>>>>> Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
>>>>> FCC License # PG-12-25133
>>>>> Author of the Cisco Press Book - "Deploying License-Free Wireless 
>>>>> WANs"
>>>>> Vendor-Neutral Wireless Training-Troubleshooting-Consulting
>>>>> Phone 818-227-4220   Email <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 
>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>>> 
>>>>>
>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>>>
>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>>>> http://lists.wispa.o

Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee

[Jack Unger]

BORC

Chuck McCown wrote:
> Now that is something I can agree with, RBOC spelled another way is BORG.
> - Original Message - 
> From: "John Scrivner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 3:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee
>
>
>   
>> I think WISPs should start looking less at ILECs as being an enemy and
>> realize that in 99% of the cases it is the RBOCs who are the real
>> problem. I work with some of the ILECs around me and most are great
>> people who are running a business just like the rest of us. Many ILECs
>> are WISPs these days too. Like it or not the ILECs are part of our
>> culture now. If I remember right you are actually an ILEC aren't you
>> Chuck?   :-)
>> Scriv
>>
>>
>> On Jan 31, 2008 3:19 PM, Chuck McCown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> 
>>> But, but, but... we LOVE small rural ILECs...
>>>
>>>
>>> - Original Message -
>>> From: "Jack Unger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>> To: "WISPA General List" 
>>> Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 2:07 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee
>>>
>>>
>>>   
>>>> There is a growing controversy centered on the "Connected Nation"
>>>> (Connect Kentucky, Connect Ohio, Connected Tennessee etc.)
>>>> political-business efforts.
>>>>
>>>> The reason is that it appears that the primary beneficiaries are the
>>>> ILEC phone companies and their drive to extend their power, influence
>>>> and business dominance. This occurs (of course) at the expense of WISPs
>>>> and small non-ILEC broadband providers.
>>>>
>>>> Here are some links so you can read up on it.
>>>>
>>>> (Commentary)
>>>> http://www.drewclark.com/connect-kentucky-article-raises-bell-lobby-specter/
>>>>
>>>> (Original Art Brodsky article) http://www.publicknowledge.org/node/1334
>>>>
>>>> jack
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> George Rogato wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> http://www.connectedtennessee.org/mapping_&_research/availability_maps/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 
>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>>> 
>>>>>
>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>>>
>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>>>
>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>   
>>>> --
>>>> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
>>>> Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
>>>> FCC License # PG-12-25133
>>>> Author of the Cisco Press Book - "Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs"
>>>> Vendor-Neutral Wireless Training-Troubleshooting-Consulting
>>>> Phone 818-227-4220   Email <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 
>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>> 
>>>>
>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>>
>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>>
>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>>
>>>> 
>>>
>>> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>
>>>   
>> -

Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee

[Victoria Proffer]

I like the Broadband Mapping that Virgina Tech is working on:
http://www.ecorridors.vt.edu/maps/broadbandmap.php

I would like to see more of this type of mapping on a national level.  I
have added our WISP to the map and I check back often.  I am encouraged to
see other WISPs listing their services.

Victoria
St. Louis Broadband
www.stlbroadband.com

On 1/31/08, Chuck McCown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Now that is something I can agree with, RBOC spelled another way is BORG.
> - Original Message -
> From: "John Scrivner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 3:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee
>
>
> >I think WISPs should start looking less at ILECs as being an enemy and
> > realize that in 99% of the cases it is the RBOCs who are the real
> > problem. I work with some of the ILECs around me and most are great
> > people who are running a business just like the rest of us. Many ILECs
> > are WISPs these days too. Like it or not the ILECs are part of our
> > culture now. If I remember right you are actually an ILEC aren't you
> > Chuck?   :-)
> > Scriv
> >
> >
> > On Jan 31, 2008 3:19 PM, Chuck McCown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >> But, but, but... we LOVE small rural ILECs...
> >>
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -
> >> From: "Jack Unger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> To: "WISPA General List" 
> >> Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 2:07 PM
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee
> >>
> >>
> >> > There is a growing controversy centered on the "Connected Nation"
> >> > (Connect Kentucky, Connect Ohio, Connected Tennessee etc.)
> >> > political-business efforts.
> >> >
> >> > The reason is that it appears that the primary beneficiaries are the
> >> > ILEC phone companies and their drive to extend their power, influence
> >> > and business dominance. This occurs (of course) at the expense of
> WISPs
> >> > and small non-ILEC broadband providers.
> >> >
> >> > Here are some links so you can read up on it.
> >> >
> >> > (Commentary)
> >> >
> http://www.drewclark.com/connect-kentucky-article-raises-bell-lobby-specter/
> >> >
> >> > (Original Art Brodsky article)
> http://www.publicknowledge.org/node/1334
> >> >
> >> > jack
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > George Rogato wrote:
> >> >>
> http://www.connectedtennessee.org/mapping_&_research/availability_maps/
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> 
> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >> >>
> 
> >> >>
> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >> >>
> >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >> >>
> >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
> >> > Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
> >> > FCC License # PG-12-25133
> >> > Author of the Cisco Press Book - "Deploying License-Free Wireless
> WANs"
> >> > Vendor-Neutral Wireless Training-Troubleshooting-Consulting
> >> > Phone 818-227-4220   Email <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> 
> >> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >> >
> 
> >> >
> >> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >> >
> >> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >> >
> >> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 

Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee

[Chuck McCown]

Now that is something I can agree with, RBOC spelled another way is BORG.
- Original Message - 
From: "John Scrivner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 3:14 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee


>I think WISPs should start looking less at ILECs as being an enemy and
> realize that in 99% of the cases it is the RBOCs who are the real
> problem. I work with some of the ILECs around me and most are great
> people who are running a business just like the rest of us. Many ILECs
> are WISPs these days too. Like it or not the ILECs are part of our
> culture now. If I remember right you are actually an ILEC aren't you
> Chuck?   :-)
> Scriv
>
>
> On Jan 31, 2008 3:19 PM, Chuck McCown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> But, but, but... we LOVE small rural ILECs...
>>
>>
>> - Original Message -
>> From: "Jack Unger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: "WISPA General List" 
>> Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 2:07 PM
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee
>>
>>
>> > There is a growing controversy centered on the "Connected Nation"
>> > (Connect Kentucky, Connect Ohio, Connected Tennessee etc.)
>> > political-business efforts.
>> >
>> > The reason is that it appears that the primary beneficiaries are the
>> > ILEC phone companies and their drive to extend their power, influence
>> > and business dominance. This occurs (of course) at the expense of WISPs
>> > and small non-ILEC broadband providers.
>> >
>> > Here are some links so you can read up on it.
>> >
>> > (Commentary)
>> > http://www.drewclark.com/connect-kentucky-article-raises-bell-lobby-specter/
>> >
>> > (Original Art Brodsky article) http://www.publicknowledge.org/node/1334
>> >
>> > jack
>> >
>> >
>> > George Rogato wrote:
>> >> http://www.connectedtennessee.org/mapping_&_research/availability_maps/
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> 
>> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> >> 
>> >>
>> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>> >>
>> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>> >>
>> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> > --
>> > Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
>> > Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
>> > FCC License # PG-12-25133
>> > Author of the Cisco Press Book - "Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs"
>> > Vendor-Neutral Wireless Training-Troubleshooting-Consulting
>> > Phone 818-227-4220   Email <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > 
>> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> > http://signup.wispa.org/
>> > 
>> >
>> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>> >
>> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>> >
>> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> 




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Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee

[John Scrivner]

I think WISPs should start looking less at ILECs as being an enemy and
realize that in 99% of the cases it is the RBOCs who are the real
problem. I work with some of the ILECs around me and most are great
people who are running a business just like the rest of us. Many ILECs
are WISPs these days too. Like it or not the ILECs are part of our
culture now. If I remember right you are actually an ILEC aren't you
Chuck?   :-)
Scriv


On Jan 31, 2008 3:19 PM, Chuck McCown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> But, but, but... we LOVE small rural ILECs...
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Jack Unger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 2:07 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee
>
>
> > There is a growing controversy centered on the "Connected Nation"
> > (Connect Kentucky, Connect Ohio, Connected Tennessee etc.)
> > political-business efforts.
> >
> > The reason is that it appears that the primary beneficiaries are the
> > ILEC phone companies and their drive to extend their power, influence
> > and business dominance. This occurs (of course) at the expense of WISPs
> > and small non-ILEC broadband providers.
> >
> > Here are some links so you can read up on it.
> >
> > (Commentary)
> > http://www.drewclark.com/connect-kentucky-article-raises-bell-lobby-specter/
> >
> > (Original Art Brodsky article) http://www.publicknowledge.org/node/1334
> >
> > jack
> >
> >
> > George Rogato wrote:
> >> http://www.connectedtennessee.org/mapping_&_research/availability_maps/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> > --
> > Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
> > Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
> > FCC License # PG-12-25133
> > Author of the Cisco Press Book - "Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs"
> > Vendor-Neutral Wireless Training-Troubleshooting-Consulting
> > Phone 818-227-4220   Email <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> > 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee

[John Scrivner]

I am a founding member of Connect SI which is a broadband and economic
development initiative aimed at improving economic development, in
part, through better access to broadband in the 22 southern most
counties of Illinois. This is similar but not exactly like the other
initiatives referenced below. I have invited all WISPs in this region
to join forces in this effort. Most just turn their noses up at it and
say it is just to help the ILECs. It has helped me and I am not an
ILEC. I started getting asked to meetings in front of schools,
healthcare, municipalities, etc. as a direct result of my involvement
in this effort. So far the ILECs have been part of the effort but have
not controlled the agenda and have played fair.

I have been involved in building list servers for various interests in
Connect SI to help them communicate and we have designed and built a
simple database solution which allows people, businesses, schools,
etc. to ask for broadband. The system logs the requests and forwards
the requests on to all vested network providers in the Connect SI
region. The providers who shun the effort do not get to see the
requests. If I acted as other WISPs and shunned the effort then I
guess I would have a similar opinion that it is designed to only help
the ILECs. Since I am involved in helping the effort helps me as well.

I find that many WISPs either lack the desire or just distrust any
effort which is something they do not own or control completely. I
used to be the same way. I have been burnt before. I do not open
myself up to being a target. I also do not automaticaly distrust
efforts which are maybe different than how I might attack a problem. I
often think that think tanks, government interests and educators take
a wrong turn in policy building such as community  broadband
development projects. Instead of simply ignoring the efforts this time
I decided to be part of the plan. In doing so I was able to build many
valuable contacts and open doors that were always shut before. It does
not hurt to go into these community building efforts like this and
decide you are going to make them work for your own interests as well
as those of tthe group.

If others try to make things go wrong you have some control if you are
inside. If you do not take part then your voice does not get heard and
your interests will inevitably be ignored. I have little doubt that
ILECs control many of the referenced iitiatives dicussed below. I also
doubt that many of the WISPs have tried to be part of these efforts.
If they did then I am guessing those that did are laughing all the way
to the bank wondering why all the WISP competitors around them have
ignored the opportunities.

If you are a WISP and someone asks you to attend a planning meeting
for any broadband initiatives in your area I strongly suggest you take
them up on it. You only share what information you want to share with
them and being there means they tell you everything they are planning.
It is the only place to be in these efforts from my perspective. If
others here have been active in any of the referenced efforts please
share your thoughts. From my end I see little to dislike when I am one
of those inside the effort.
Scriv



On Jan 31, 2008 3:07 PM, Jack Unger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> There is a growing controversy centered on the "Connected Nation"
> (Connect Kentucky, Connect Ohio, Connected Tennessee etc.)
> political-business efforts.
>
> The reason is that it appears that the primary beneficiaries are the
> ILEC phone companies and their drive to extend their power, influence
> and business dominance. This occurs (of course) at the expense of WISPs
> and small non-ILEC broadband providers.
>
> Here are some links so you can read up on it.
>
> (Commentary)
> http://www.drewclark.com/connect-kentucky-article-raises-bell-lobby-specter/
>
> (Original Art Brodsky article) http://www.publicknowledge.org/node/1334
>
> jack
>
>
>
> George Rogato wrote:
> > http://www.connectedtennessee.org/mapping_&_research/availability_maps/
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> > 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
> Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
> FCC License # PG-12-25133
> Author of the Cisco Press Book - "Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs"
> Vendor-Neutral Wireless Training-Troubleshooting-Consulting
> Phone 818-227-4220   Email <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> --

Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee

[Chuck McCown]

But, but, but... we LOVE small rural ILECs...

- Original Message - 
From: "Jack Unger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 2:07 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee


> There is a growing controversy centered on the "Connected Nation"
> (Connect Kentucky, Connect Ohio, Connected Tennessee etc.)
> political-business efforts.
>
> The reason is that it appears that the primary beneficiaries are the
> ILEC phone companies and their drive to extend their power, influence
> and business dominance. This occurs (of course) at the expense of WISPs
> and small non-ILEC broadband providers.
>
> Here are some links so you can read up on it.
>
> (Commentary)
> http://www.drewclark.com/connect-kentucky-article-raises-bell-lobby-specter/
>
> (Original Art Brodsky article) http://www.publicknowledge.org/node/1334
>
> jack
>
>
> George Rogato wrote:
>> http://www.connectedtennessee.org/mapping_&_research/availability_maps/
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> -- 
> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
> Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
> FCC License # PG-12-25133
> Author of the Cisco Press Book - "Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs"
> Vendor-Neutral Wireless Training-Troubleshooting-Consulting
> Phone 818-227-4220   Email <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> 




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Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee

[Jack Unger]

There is a growing controversy centered on the "Connected Nation" 
(Connect Kentucky, Connect Ohio, Connected Tennessee etc.) 
political-business efforts. 

The reason is that it appears that the primary beneficiaries are the 
ILEC phone companies and their drive to extend their power, influence 
and business dominance. This occurs (of course) at the expense of WISPs 
and small non-ILEC broadband providers.

Here are some links so you can read up on it.

(Commentary) 
http://www.drewclark.com/connect-kentucky-article-raises-bell-lobby-specter/

(Original Art Brodsky article) http://www.publicknowledge.org/node/1334

jack


George Rogato wrote:
> http://www.connectedtennessee.org/mapping_&_research/availability_maps/
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>
>   

-- 
Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
FCC License # PG-12-25133
Author of the Cisco Press Book - "Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs"
Vendor-Neutral Wireless Training-Troubleshooting-Consulting
Phone 818-227-4220   Email <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>






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Re: [WISPA] Connected Tennessee

[Ryan Van Dolson]

Thanks for the link.  I've briefly toyed around in my mind with the idea to
start a wisp in south Hamilton / Bradley counties area.

On Jan 31, 2008 2:44 PM, George Rogato <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> http://www.connectedtennessee.org/mapping_&_research/availability_maps/
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
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>
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>
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[WISPA] Connected Tennessee

[George Rogato]

http://www.connectedtennessee.org/mapping_&_research/availability_maps/




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