[Gimp-developer] volunteer needed for preferences dialog
Hi, IMO it's about time to try to clean up the preferences dialog once more. Here are a couple of ideas on how the dialog could be improved: - I'd like to see the "Interface" group be removed. That would flatten the hierarchy which is kind of arbitrary at the moment. - The theme chooser should be moved to a separate page, the Interface page is rather crowded. - Input device configuration should either be redone or moved to another page. Having it on a page of it's own doesn't make too much sense. - The items on the session management page could IMO be moved to other pages. - Perhaps we should show the dialog with the Folders section collapsed. That would make the dialog smaller and less frightening. - We could IMHO remove a couple of options. They could stay to be configurable via gimprc but we don't necessarily need a GUI for all of these. Possible candidates for removal are IMO: - undo-preview-size - info-window-per-display - tearoff-menus - last-opened-size - use-help - perfect-mouse - cursor-updating - min-colors - install-colormap - stingy-memory-use - trust-dirty-flag - restore-session - restore-accels These changes are all rather easy to do so this is a nice job for a fresh contributor who isn't afraid to learn some gtk+ and gimp basics. Please do also not understand the above as a list of instructions. This is just how I would address the problem. If you pick up the job then it's up to you to decide how it is done in detail. Sven ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
[Gimp-developer] Gimp presentation at UNH
I'm giving a presentation to the Seacoast Linux User Group (SLUG chapter) of the Greater New Hampshire Linux Users Group (GNHLUG) at University of New Hampshire, Durham, NH on June 14th at 7PM (more detail may be added to http://wiki.gnhlug.org/twiki2/bin/view/Www/OurChapters). The presentation is a repeat of an introduction to GIMP 2.0 talk I gave to the MELBA chapter a month ago. Is there anyone on this list who is a) an experienced GIMP 2 user b) an experienced GIMP 2 developer c) GIMP 2 advocate d) any or all of the above who would like to collaborate with me on making a great presentation? Maybe you've made a presentation and have some materials to share. I've already put together a full outline for my previous presentation, and would be glad to share it as I get it published to my website. Thanks, Greg Rundlett -- FREePHILE We are 'Open' for Business Free and Open Source Software http://www.freephile.com (978) 270-2425 Our little systems have their day; They have their day and cease to be; They are but broken lights of thee. -- Tennyson ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] O'Reilly sponsorship deal
On Fri, Jun 04, 2004 at 11:26:15PM +0200, David Neary wrote: > Hi, > > Carol Spears wrote: > > On Fri, Jun 04, 2004 at 08:16:03PM +0200, David Neary wrote: > > > We will also have some ORA marketting materials for the > > > conference. > > > > also, does marketing tools mean tee-shirts? whee! > > No, it means books and banners, and some posters. But books are > still OK... > with any luck, you will be as wrong about this as you are about so many other things. thanks for your good work getting GIMPCon to work. Maybe it could be called a GIMP Convention now? carol ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
> This dialog is still available but it isn't any longer bound to the > "By Color Select" Tool. Choose "Selection Editor" from the Dialogs > menu. > > > Move the 'Fill' and 'Stroke' functions to the 'Selection' menu. > > I don't think these belong there since they do not manipulate the > Selection. Where do other apps put "Fill"? IMHO it belongs into the > "Edit" menu and I am surprised that the users didn't look for it > there. Fill and Stroke definately don't belong in the Selection menu (you could be filling or stroking a Path not just a selection). The Select menu keeps the selection options nicely seperate from manipulating the image (or drawable ie the contents of the selection). Although there was a problem adding things to Select menu does not seem like the right solution and it was one of the few suggestions in the report I strong disagreed with. The suggestions to provide much more information in the status bar (like the way Inkscape does) sounded like a good idea but would probably be rather time consuming work. Adobe Illustrator uses Edit, Stroke and Edit, Fill... (just one item for Fill which pops up a dialog with lots of options and fill types of all kinds). Photoshop also has "Layer, Filled Layer" (or similar) which allows you to choose a texture/pattern and inserts a new layer with that fill. I dont recall Jasc having any extra fill options besides using the bucket tool (and I double checked by looking at various sites including this one http://moonsdesigns.com/tutorials/psp8/tools.html ) Sincerely Alan Horkan http://advogato.org/person/AlanHorkan/ ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] O'Reilly sponsorship deal
Hi, Carol Spears wrote: > On Fri, Jun 04, 2004 at 08:16:03PM +0200, David Neary wrote: > > We will also have some ORA marketting materials for the > > conference. > > also, does marketing tools mean tee-shirts? whee! No, it means books and banners, and some posters. But books are still OK... Cheers, Dave. -- David Neary, Lyon, France E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
On Fri, Jun 04, 2004 at 09:07:24PM +0200, Daniel Egger wrote: > On 04.06.2004, at 16:20, Carol Spears wrote: > > >>If you could come up with some suggestions I'd certainly > >>appreciate that. > > >okay, how does photoshop translate their stuff into german? > > I expect they have a highly paid team of artists and > professional translators. > > Or do you mean that we should copy their translation by > visual comparison of the English and German version? > i could google, but i actually suspected that they did not have a german translation. the photoshop users i know are button pushers. i tend to agree with Sven that these translation problems are troublesome but at the same time a no brainer. especially when you look at what it costs to get a fully loaded gimp with continually growing translation base. one thing that a volunteer effort gets is a lot of volunteers and a lot of people who are free to have an opinion about this. as soon as i dump a bunch of money on some software, i would tend to be as happy as i can with my decision and start making it work regardless. and i still wonder if there is a way to complain directly to the photoshop and coral and all the rest developers about the stuff the people they paid did. most germans i know would enjoy a good typo, especially if it is a no brainer like the example that was given. carol ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
[Gimp-developer] Who's coming to GIMPCon?
Dave Neary writes: > A number of people have suggested that a list of attendees who have > confirmed they're going would be useful - so could anyone who plans to > be there reply to the lists saying so, please? I would like to come, if I can convince my boss to let me do it on company time. Maybe even if I have to use vacation days. Will know better on Monday. --tml ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
Hi, Daniel Egger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Any German speaker is welcome to touch the German catalog as > far as I am concerned. Bugs like this are a no brainer but > many strings should be handled with care, not only because > they're mentioned in several books but also because this could > make things worse and even break the application[1]. > > However I'd prefer if you could come up with a list of all > unsuitable items or those which are subject for discussion > so we can properly fix them altogether in both branches at once. Well, the very first thing that should be done is to update the german script-fu translation. It hasn't been updated after the mnemonics were added to the menu paths. So since then all Script-Fu menu entries aren't localized in the german version. That's a shame since it will probably only need about an hour to fix this. Sven ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
On 04.06.2004, at 16:20, Carol Spears wrote: If you could come up with some suggestions I'd certainly appreciate that. okay, how does photoshop translate their stuff into german? I expect they have a highly paid team of artists and professional translators. Or do you mean that we should copy their translation by visual comparison of the English and German version? Servus, Daniel PGP.sig Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
On 04.06.2004, at 17:05, Ellen Reitmayr wrote: uuu, that's a translation problem! in english the button says: 'Create Selection from Path' in german it says: 'Pfad aus Auswahl' (Create Path from Selection) I think Daniel Egger is the right one to tell that, no? Any German speaker is welcome to touch the German catalog as far as I am concerned. Bugs like this are a no brainer but many strings should be handled with care, not only because they're mentioned in several books but also because this could make things worse and even break the application[1]. However I'd prefer if you could come up with a list of all unsuitable items or those which are subject for discussion so we can properly fix them altogether in both branches at once. [1] Although the checks done by gettext are much better now than back in the good old days where GIMP would only crash in the Italian version but nowhere else... :) Servus, Daniel PGP.sig Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: [Gimp-developer] O'Reilly sponsorship deal
On Fri, Jun 04, 2004 at 08:16:03PM +0200, David Neary wrote: > Hi all, > > More good news. O'Reilly and Associates have agreed to be a major > sponsor of the conference, and with some luck (and a few more > donations) we will have enough money to pay some of the travel > expenses of most people coming to GIMPCon (try decoding that). > > In exchange, ORA are asking that we give them space for a > targetted Safari bookshelf, which we would offer as a service on > the website. I'm not sure what exactly is involved in integrating > this, I expect that I will get the info I need from ORA soon. > > We will also have some ORA marketting materials for the > conference. > does that mean there would be someone available to explain what happened to my bindings? it should be obvious to most that i did not actually read these excellent tomes they produced for me. there should probably be a hearty "welcome aboard" as i love these books and look forward to the day i might actually purchase more and test the new bindings. also, does marketing tools mean tee-shirts? whee! this company truly has some of the finest whores (ie people who would redo their work on broken crappy and wrong software after having done the work the right way originally) i have ever encountered. nice work. do we get some of them also? maybe some of their perl, python pros? isnt Safari a macintosh software? that seems silly, but fine. carol ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
[Gimp-developer] O'Reilly sponsorship deal
Hi all, More good news. O'Reilly and Associates have agreed to be a major sponsor of the conference, and with some luck (and a few more donations) we will have enough money to pay some of the travel expenses of most people coming to GIMPCon (try decoding that). In exchange, ORA are asking that we give them space for a targetted Safari bookshelf, which we would offer as a service on the website. I'm not sure what exactly is involved in integrating this, I expect that I will get the info I need from ORA soon. We will also have some ORA marketting materials for the conference. Cheers, Dave. -- David Neary, Lyon, France E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
Hi, Jakub Steiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Very interesting read. Hopefully we'll see some of the issues > addressed in future. reading about the difficulties to move a text layer made me do the following change immidiately: 2004-06-04 Sven Neumann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> * app/tools/gimptexttool.c (gimp_text_tool_class_init): allow to move a text layer using the cursor keys. Since it was just a single line of code to add I have also merged this little new feature into the stable tree. Now I'd like to add moving text layers using the mouse to the HEAD branch but I am not sure how the tool should behave. At the moment it does the following: - If the user clicks on a text layer the text tool is activated and connected to the text layer. This means that you can then manipulate the text layer by changing the text tool options. - If the user clicks on the text layer that the text tool is already active for, the text editor is opened. - If the user clicks outside a text layer a new text is created and the text editor is opened. I am not at all happy with the current behaviour and I don't know how moving the layer would fit into this. Perhaps someone has an idea on how to improve this? In the long run the text tool is supposed to allow editing of a text box. The user should be able to resize the text layer interactively with the text flowing in that box. It would probably be good to keep that in mind when thinking about a better text tool behaviour. Sven ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
On Fri, 2004-06-04 at 13:37 +0200, Ellen Reitmayr wrote: > Hi! > > Roman and I wrote the report of the usability tests we conducted in may. > It includes descriptions of problems the users were faced while > interacting with the software, as well as possible solutions. > > As the wiki is still down, please read the full report on > > http://www.relevantive.de/gimp/report/results_usabilitytest_05.04.html > > or > > http://www.kuhcampus.de/~roman/report/ > I would also like to thank you for executing the tests. I also appreciate some of the proposed solutions focused on providing an aid in figuring out the behaviour rather than trying to mimic Photoshop's functionality (since mostly it was the Photoshop users who were having problems). Selections -- I've had a little bit of a problem understanding the issues with modifier keys and selections: "Consider carefully if 'centered selection' should be the default when using shortcuts. According to this test, a non- centered selection is more convenient (but as the number of subjects was very low it is not possibl to make a general suggestion). However, if non-centered selection becomes the default, provide both, a checkbox in the options dialog, and a shortcut (e.g. pressing 'c' concurrently) for centered selection." Cenetered selection surely isn't the defaut, one needs to press Ctrl modifier. "Provide consistent behaviour: When keeping the key pressed while dragging the mouse, make the selections squared in all modes." This again sounds dodgy because the tools behave exactly as you describe they should. Select By Color --- I disagree with your proposed solutions to the select by color tool. We should be aiming to remove unnecersary popup dialogs rather than bringing them in. I wish the crop tool got the same treatment as the select by color tool actually. Also I don't agree a description of the aparatus of certain functionality bhaves in the UI. Only the basic behaviour description does. The rest should go to the help pages and manual. The remark about additional sliders was suggesting additional functionality like selecting by value or brightness? With RGB sliders you suggest using a non-interactive mode where the user specifies arbitrary color instead of using the image canvas? Measure Tool "Three out of four users did not see the info in the status line, and therefore first had to search where the information is displayed." That sort of scares me, because even you suggest putting explanations of other tool behaviour in the status bar... Transform Tools --- I wish the dialog went away completely an all the settings went to tool preferences rather than popping it up after selecting the tool as you suggest. Path Tool - I've already expressedmy comments in another email. Very interesting read. Hopefully we'll see some of the issues addressed in future. cheers -- Jakub Steiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Novell, Inc. ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
Hi, let me comment on some sections of the useability report (a very nice document, btw.)... > 2. Zooming > 2.1 Issue: Handling of the Zoom-Function > Both, the menu 'View Zoom' and the keyboard shortcuts are intuitive > and easy to use. Yeah, you tested this on german keyboards where Ctrl-+ does work without an additional modifier ;) > One testperson tried to use the mouse wheel and expected to zoom in > and out by that means. You can zoom in/out using a wheel mouse by pressing a modifier (Ctrl if I remember correctly). > As this did not work, he used the zoom function in the toolbox. He > tried the keyboard shortcut CTRL which worked fine, and stated that > there used to be a problem with this in the GIMP 1.2. Only, it did > not become clear what 'Threshold' meant in that context.? > > Suggestions: > > 1. Provide a short tooltip text to explain the 'Threshold' option. > 2. Provide a context sensitive help (F1) to explain the function of > the 'Threshold' option in that context. IMHO the threshold option should be completely removed. It can be made an option in the Preferences instead (if that's needed at all). > One user (Photoshop expert) had severe problems to make a free > selection as the fixed ratio option was still enabled from the last > session (as all settings, the selection modes are saved after a > session). We should probably disable auto-saving of the tool options. It seems to be more confusing than useful. > Provide the opportunity to manipulate the size of a selection: When > the mouse pointer reaches the edges of a selection, the user can > increase and decrease the size by simply dragging the edge. Provide > visual feedback next to the mouse pointer (corresponding to the > 'crop' tool). In case of elliptic selection, the size is changed at > the edges of the reference rectangle. This is non-trivial because the selection is actually a grayscale mask. If we wanted to solve this generally, we'd have to transform the grayscale mask that represents the selection. This would lead to ugly artefacts at the corner of the selection. I see no simple solution for this problem but to add vector-based selections. > Another issue is that the user-defined aspect ratio is overwritten > by the size of the recent selection as soon as the 'fixed aspect > ratio' mode is left. As the two Photoshop users often changed the > modes while they explored the GIMP's functionality, they were really > annoyed by that behaviour. Other than the mode itself, this option > is not an operation mode, but a user-defined setting. Therefore, it > should be saved. Yes, we should probably change that. While it is convenient to see the size of the selection being displayed in the tool options this info is also available in the statusbar. So it would probably be better to leave the entries untouched. > When the anchor is shown next to the mouse pointer, it must always > be possible to anchor the selection. I haven't been able to reproduce that problem. Of course the cursor feedback needs to match what happens. Can you give details on how to reproduce this brokeness? > The GIMP 1.2 user missed the former dialog which showed the colour > channels and provided a slider to set the threshold of the > selection. The dialog provided some kind of preview of the actual > selection, as in a complex image, it is quite hard to determine > which parts are selected and which are not. This dialog is still available but it isn't any longer bound to the "By Color Select" Tool. Choose "Selection Editor" from the Dialogs menu. > Move the 'Fill' and 'Stroke' functions to the 'Selection' menu. I don't think these belong there since they do not manipulate the Selection. Where do other apps put "Fill"? IMHO it belongs into the "Edit" menu and I am surprised that the users didn't look for it there. So much for my comments. Thanks for the usability testing. As soon as we have collected more feedback here, someone could sit down and put the results into Bugzilla enhancement requests. I think we should then be able to improve usability in GIMP 2.2 based on these reports. Sven ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
On Fri, 2004-06-04 at 17:05 +0200, Ellen Reitmayr wrote: > - Design (== new point + Edit Point; default) > - Add (== add point or segment; CTRL) > - Remove (== delete point or segment; SHIFT) > - Move All (ALT) > > What do you think? Shift is commonly used for adding to selection. It should remain consistent with everything else. The "cumbersome" shortcut of Ctrl+Shift is quite handy for delete since you hardly hit it by accident. I understand there is quite a learning curve involved with the path tool. On the other hand, compare the tool to what sodipodi implements. They have clear buttons for every action yet completing the same task means kilometers of mouse movement and millions of clicks. The delete key (and backspace) functionality would be a great addition. I also agree some better feedback on what to expect from the tool is due. I am thinking with better cursors a lot can be improved. However the chosen _modifiers_ and tool behaviour was very natural to get used to in my opinion and something I would love to see in one of the free vector editors. cheers -- Jakub Steiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Novell, Inc. ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] error in script-fu code....
Hi, Dov Kruger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Carol suggested that removing the interactive flag from png-save might > help. If I do that, I get an error that directly says that a parameter > is missing from png-save, which is at least perfectly understandable. The point wasn't to remove the interactive flag from png-save but to add the interactive/non-interactive parameter when calling your script. Sven ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
hi simon! > The "Edit" mode is not only about deleting, thats why it was hard for me > to come up with a proper name, that is distinct enough from "Design". Oh yes, I see - I'm sorry. > In the Edit mode you can *add* points on a segment. You can *add* a > segment to the path when a single endpoint is selected and you click on > the other one (this btw. is the same as connecting start- and endpoints, > which you wrongly describe in the report as "Design mode + CTRL", when > looking at the tool options you'll realize that CTRL is a shortcut for > switching into the Edit mode) Hm, here again, the shortcuts are not clearly communicated. As the tool is quite complex, it is not so easy to understand the whole functionality of a single shortcut (-> even the GIMP 1.2 user who attended some workshops thought that CTRL would connect start and end points only). > [...]Thats why it is not really an option to rename the Edit mode to "Remove" > mode, that simply isn't the reality. Yes, I see. But I had one more look on the path tool as implemented in GIMP 1.2. There, you had four modes: - New Point - Add Point - Remove Point - Edit Point Is it so, that 'new point' and 'edit point' are 'Design' now, while 'add point' and 'remove point' are 'Edit'? I wonder if it wouldn't be easier to re-implement those modes (a bit modified): Currently, the 'remove' function is not accessible from the Design-Mode, as the keyboard shortcut does not work. Even in the edit mode is does not become clear, how to delete a point (status message not clear as it only says 'try shift'). I would propose the following modes (each accessible via keyboard shortcuts): - Design (== new point + Edit Point; default) - Add (== add point or segment; CTRL) - Remove (== delete point or segment; SHIFT) - Move All (ALT) What do you think? > : Provide a hint in the status bar 'To connect start and end point, > : press CTRL'. > > When exactly should this displayed? Currently the Statusbar gives hints > what will happen when the user clicks now. It will give the hint "click > to connect the anchor with the selected endpoint", when the user is in > Edit mode and hovers over an anchor. the problem is that this is not clear in 'Design' mode. Maybe it is possible to display this message in Design mode only for the start and the end point, but not for comprised points? > > : Add a'Selection from Path' button to the tool option dialog. > > Whats wrong with the existing "Create selection from Path" that is there? > Actually I am a bit confused about this... uuu, that's a translation problem! in english the button says: 'Create Selection from Path' in german it says: 'Pfad aus Auswahl' (Create Path from Selection) I think Daniel Egger is the right one to tell that, no? Greetings, /ellen -- __ Ellen Reitmayr email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Usability Engineer mobil: +49.177.3325867 relevantive AG fon: +49.30.23455630 Zehdenicker Str. 21 fax: +49.30.23455639 10119 Berlinweb: www.relevantive.de ___ signature.asc Description: Dies ist ein digital signierter Nachrichtenteil
Re: [Gimp-developer] error in script-fu code....
Carol suggested that removing the interactive flag from png-save might help. If I do that, I get an error that directly says that a parameter is missing from png-save, which is at least perfectly understandable. The script, with Carol's suggestion commented out, is below. Anyone else with an answer, or with a good way to see where bugs in fu-scripts are in general? thanks, Dov (define (dl-png2transindexed2 file) (let* ( (img (car (file-png-load 1 file file) ) ) (d (car (gimp-image-active-drawable img))) ) (gimp-layer-add-alpha (car (gimp-image-get-active-layer img))) (gimp-by-color-select d '(255 255 255) 0 2 0 0 0 0) (gimp-edit-clear) (gimp-convert-indexed img 0 0 255 0 0 "") (file-png-save 1 img d file file 0 6 0 0 0 1 1) ;(file-png-save img d file file 0 6 0 0 0 1 1) ) ) (script-fu-register "dl-png2transindexed2" "/Xtns/Script-Fu/png2transindexed2" "png2indexed2" "Dov Kruger& Elena Zagrai" "(c) 2004 Stevens Institute of Technology" "2004-02-25" "" SF-FILENAME "File" "file.png" ) ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
[Gimp-developer] Yet another GIMPCon mail
Hi, This is an important one though. If you are planning on coming to GUADEC, but are waiting for confirmation fo support, please register for the conference as soon as possible at http://2004.guadec.org/register/ and request a travel subsidy there too. Since GIMPCon is a sub-event, it is unlikely that your full travel costs will be covered, but it is possible that a portion will be paid which will ease some of the pressure on the GIMP coffers. Since GUADEC travel subsidy requests will be considered next week at the latest, it is important to register immediately. As I said before, if you are paying your way, you can register for the "Hobbyist" caregory, and request that youre registration fee be refunded to you as well. Cheers, Dave. -- Dave Neary [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] error in code....
On Fri, Jun 04, 2004 at 06:19:19AM -0400, Dov Kruger wrote: > Carol, > > I'm not sure what you just said > > > Sven hinted at the answer earlier in this thread, or someone did. > > > > i am not sure why the run_mode stuff is in the argument lists for the > > different pdb calls, and this problem actually spills into gimp-python > > scripting and gimp-perl scripting but the argument for run_mode being > > non-interactive or interactive is not only unnecessary but certain to > > break any script. > > The only functions that I can find reference to interactive vs. > non-interactive modes are png-save, and I believe that the value 1 is > correct there. This script did work with the other technique, it's just > the new calls that are different. > okay, did you try it without the argument there? we can theorize all day long via email. i tried to save you the months it took for me to find the answer (or possibly to understand it) and before we discuss this too much, could you at least try my suggestion? > > the best documentation i found on the subject was on another dovs > > documentation. and looking over the updated stuff > > (http://imagic.weizmann.ac.il/~dov/gimp/scheme-tut.html) i cannot > > quickly find the warning. > > While it is always cool to find another Dov out there, and I was looking > at the code for examples of scheme, it doesn't have the answer to the > immediate problem. > > > anyways, forget the variable for interactive or non-interactive run_mode > > and probably you will only get errors that make sense. > try: (file-png-save img d file file 0 6 0 0 0 1 1) and dont ask me why. carol ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
On Fri, Jun 04, 2004 at 03:33:02PM +0200, Daniel Egger wrote: > On 04.06.2004, at 13:37, Ellen Reitmayr wrote: > > >7. German translation > >- Some words are misleading > > We've had many iterations through the translation already and > in many cases (I at least) were not quite sure how to translate > some phrases. > > If you could come up with some suggestions I'd certainly > appreciate that. > okay, how does photoshop translate their stuff into german? carol ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] error in code....
On Fri, Jun 04, 2004 at 05:39:01AM -0400, Dov Kruger wrote: > Based on advice from this forum, the script now reads: > > (define > (dl-png2transindexed2 file) > (let* > ( >(img (car >(file-png-load 1 file file) >) > ) >(d (car (gimp-image-active-drawable img))) >) > (gimp-layer-add-alpha (car (gimp-image-get-active-layer img))) > (gimp-by-color-select d '(255 255 255) 0 2 0 0 0 0) > (gimp-edit-clear) > (gimp-convert-indexed img 0 0 255 0 0 "") > (file-png-save 1 img d file file 0 6 0 0 0 1 1) > ) > ) > > This yields the following error: > > Error while executing > (dl-png2transindexed2 > "/home/dkruger/dev/matlab/sdv4/longislandsaltL10T24.png") > ERROR: too few arguments (see errobj) > > First of all, since it's probably obvious what I'm doing wrong, an > answer is always appreciated, but I'd like to know if there is any > mini-debugger available, or any way of seeing which line is the cause of > the error. The error message says to "see errorobj" but I didn't see > anything on the console, or a menu in the fu section that would show me > the underlying cause. > okay, first of all, i do not do script-fu. so this is a non-technical answer from a non-script-fu user. Sven hinted at the answer earlier in this thread, or someone did. i am not sure why the run_mode stuff is in the argument lists for the different pdb calls, and this problem actually spills into gimp-python scripting and gimp-perl scripting but the argument for run_mode being non-interactive or interactive is not only unnecessary but certain to break any script. the best documentation i found on the subject was on another dovs documentation. and looking over the updated stuff (http://imagic.weizmann.ac.il/~dov/gimp/scheme-tut.html) i cannot quickly find the warning. anyways, forget the variable for interactive or non-interactive run_mode and probably you will only get errors that make sense. carol ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Re: Usability test - Results available
On Fri, Jun 04, 2004 at 03:15:00PM +0200, Roman Joost wrote: > On Fri, Jun 04, 2004 at 02:59:37PM +0200, GSR - FR wrote: > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (2004-06-04 at 1337.31 +0200): > > > http://www.relevantive.de/gimp/report/results_usabilitytest_05.04.html > > > - Clearly mark the current layer > > > > Or is this a problem of translating the report? > No - this seems to be an issue of the default SuSE theme. The tests were > made on a SuSE distribution with an installed GIMP 2.0. They're using > QT and GTK+ themes together and it seems, that something is broken > there. > this is the type of thing i was worried about when the usability tests were being conducted by people who dont know linux or gimp and only know windows and photoshop. had there been someone present at the tests who had any experience with helping people with the gimp, there would have been someone there who knew how many of the gimp's "problems" are actually the problem of the distribution. when will the day come that linux users can test other software and have their opinions mean so much? carol ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
[Gimp-developer] error in code....
Based on advice from this forum, the script now reads: (define (dl-png2transindexed2 file) (let* ( (img (car (file-png-load 1 file file) ) ) (d (car (gimp-image-active-drawable img))) ) (gimp-layer-add-alpha (car (gimp-image-get-active-layer img))) (gimp-by-color-select d '(255 255 255) 0 2 0 0 0 0) (gimp-edit-clear) (gimp-convert-indexed img 0 0 255 0 0 "") (file-png-save 1 img d file file 0 6 0 0 0 1 1) ) ) This yields the following error: Error while executing (dl-png2transindexed2 "/home/dkruger/dev/matlab/sdv4/longislandsaltL10T24.png") ERROR: too few arguments (see errobj) First of all, since it's probably obvious what I'm doing wrong, an answer is always appreciated, but I'd like to know if there is any mini-debugger available, or any way of seeing which line is the cause of the error. The error message says to "see errorobj" but I didn't see anything on the console, or a menu in the fu section that would show me the underlying cause. thanks to all! ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
On 04.06.2004, at 13:37, Ellen Reitmayr wrote: 7. German translation - Some words are misleading We've had many iterations through the translation already and in many cases (I at least) were not quite sure how to translate some phrases. If you could come up with some suggestions I'd certainly appreciate that. Servus, Daniel PGP.sig Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
Ellen Reitmayr ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: > 6. Path tool > - The modes make the usage cumbersome I (naturally :-) have some comments about the path section in the test. You suggest to : Re-organise the three modes 'Design', 'Edit', 'Move': 'Design' stays : the same (adds points, forms the shapes), 'Edit' is renamed to 'Remove' : (removes points, corresponds to the delete key or 'shift'), 'Move' stays : the same (corresponds to the 'alt' key). Apply buttons for each mode, : and add tooltips that communicate the shortcuts. The "Edit" mode is not only about deleting, thats why it was hard for me to come up with a proper name, that is distinct enough from "Design". In the Edit mode you can *add* points on a segment. You can *add* a segment to the path when a single endpoint is selected and you click on the other one (this btw. is the same as connecting start- and endpoints, which you wrongly describe in the report as "Design mode + CTRL", when looking at the tool options you'll realize that CTRL is a shortcut for switching into the Edit mode) Pressing SHIFT in the Edit mode changes it from *add*ing to *deleting*, i.e. deleting nodes works by SHIFT clicking on the nodes (you can use SHIFT+CTRL to switch to the edit mode temporarily when you are in design mode), deleting segments (i.e. splitting up a path) works by SHIFT-clicking on the segment in question. Thats why it is not really an option to rename the Edit mode to "Remove" mode, that simply isn't the reality. I agree that the discoverability of the path tool has to be enhanced, but I am unsure how. You go on: : Allow the delete key to delete points. Thats indeed a wish I have as well, but this is not possible with the current tool infrastructure (tools only know about modifiers and cursor keys, all other keys are not available to the tools right now). : Provide a hint in the status bar 'To connect start and end point, : press CTRL'. When exactly should this displayed? Currently the Statusbar gives hints what will happen when the user clicks now. It will give the hint "click to connect the anchor with the selected endpoint", when the user is in Edit mode and hovers over an anchor. Displaying such a message to any other time will break this scheme. I am not sure what messages to sacrifice in favor of the suggested message. : Add a'Selection from Path' button to the tool option dialog. Whats wrong with the existing "Create selection from Path" that is there? Actually I am a bit confused about this... I'll appreciate some clarification from you on the suggestions quoted above. Thanks for the test. Bye, Simon -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://simon.budig.de/ ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Re: Usability test - Results available
Hi, GSR - FR <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > - Clearly mark the current layer > > I do not understand what does that mean, it seems to be marked, and > the name shown too in the default config for status bar string. Take > for example: > > http://www.gimp.org/screenshots/linux_screenshot2.png > http://www.gimp.org/screenshots/windowsxp_screenshot3.png > http://www.gimp.org/screenshots/macosx_screenshot1.png > > Or is this a problem of translating the report? It is a problem of the GTK+ theme that has been used. Someone needs to seriously kick SuSE's ass to have them fix the theme they ship by default. Of course with such a broken theme GIMP is hardly usable at all. Sven ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Re: Usability test - Results available
On Fri, Jun 04, 2004 at 02:59:37PM +0200, GSR - FR wrote: > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (2004-06-04 at 1337.31 +0200): > > http://www.relevantive.de/gimp/report/results_usabilitytest_05.04.html > > - Clearly mark the current layer > > Or is this a problem of translating the report? No - this seems to be an issue of the default SuSE theme. The tests were made on a SuSE distribution with an installed GIMP 2.0. They're using QT and GTK+ themes together and it seems, that something is broken there. Greetings, -- Roman Joost www: http://www.romanofski.de email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] signature.asc Description: Digital signature
[Gimp-developer] Re: Usability test - Results available
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (2004-06-04 at 1337.31 +0200): > http://www.relevantive.de/gimp/report/results_usabilitytest_05.04.html > - Clearly mark the current layer I do not understand what does that mean, it seems to be marked, and the name shown too in the default config for status bar string. Take for example: http://www.gimp.org/screenshots/linux_screenshot2.png http://www.gimp.org/screenshots/windowsxp_screenshot3.png http://www.gimp.org/screenshots/macosx_screenshot1.png Or is this a problem of translating the report? GSR ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Who's coming to GIMPCon?
Hi Simon, Simon Budig wrote: I want to come. I tried to register for the free floor space, but they present a form that the CGI is not willing to accept (it has no entry field for the invoice thingie the CGI is requesting for). However, I hope my registration to the event itself went well. If we want/need floorspace, it is available to us. I have brought it up already with the guadec organisers, so I just need to let them know how much we need. We should let them know soon though. I'm not sure what exactly needs to be arranged in terms of set-up to use the floorspace, though - this will be my first GUADEC. Cheers, Dave. -- Dave Neary [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Who's coming to GIMPCon?
Dave Neary ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: > A number of people have suggested that a list of attendees who have > confirmed they're going would be useful - so could anyone who plans to > be there reply to the lists saying so, please? Don't forget to register > at http://2004.guadec.org/register/ and request free accommodation if > you need it - there's floorspace for all, for a groovy atmosphere. I want to come. I tried to register for the free floor space, but they present a form that the CGI is not willing to accept (it has no entry field for the invoice thingie the CGI is requesting for). However, I hope my registration to the event itself went well. Bye, Simon -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://simon.budig.de/ ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
Hi Ellen, Ellen Reitmayr wrote: Roman and I wrote the report of the usability tests we conducted in may. It includes descriptions of problems the users were faced while interacting with the software, as well as possible solutions. As the wiki is still down, please read the full report on http://www.relevantive.de/gimp/report/results_usabilitytest_05.04.html I had a quick look through this, and it looks great. I'm sure that I'll have more comments later, I just wanted to thank yourself & Roman for all your work, and I hope that we can get many of your reccommendations into the GIMP soon. Cheers, Dave. -- Dave Neary [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Who's coming to GIMPCon?
Hi Roman, Roman Joost wrote: I'll come. If someone registered for the student flats and received a reply from the GUADEC organisation, let me know. I still didn't received anything. After asking in may, they said, they'll send the confirmation mails in few days, which didn't happen. This is becoming something of a FAQ for guadec - I've forwarder on your mail to guadec-list so that someone who knows more can fill you in on the details. Cheers, Dave. -- Dave Neary [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Who's coming to GIMPCon?
On Fri, Jun 04, 2004 at 01:22:13PM +0200, Dave Neary wrote: > Hi all, > A number of people have suggested that a list of attendees who have > confirmed they're going would be useful - so could anyone who plans to > be there reply to the lists saying so, please? Don't forget to register > at http://2004.guadec.org/register/ and request free accommodation if > you need it - there's floorspace for all, for a groovy atmosphere. I'll come. If someone registered for the student flats and received a reply from the GUADEC organisation, let me know. I still didn't received anything. After asking in may, they said, they'll send the confirmation mails in few days, which didn't happen. Greetings, -- Roman Joost www: http://www.romanofski.de email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] signature.asc Description: Digital signature
[Gimp-developer] Usability test - Results available
Hi! Roman and I wrote the report of the usability tests we conducted in may. It includes descriptions of problems the users were faced while interacting with the software, as well as possible solutions. As the wiki is still down, please read the full report on http://www.relevantive.de/gimp/report/results_usabilitytest_05.04.html or http://www.kuhcampus.de/~roman/report/ Here a summary of the major topics: 1. General Aspects: - Provide more hints, especially with respect to keyboard shortcuts, and explanatory texts. - Clearly mark the current layer 2. Selections: - Do not save operation modes among sessions - Keyboard shortcuts are not consistent - Fixes aspect ratio is difficult to specifiy - Subtracting a selection is difficult - Anchoring a selection is not always possible, even if the anchor symbol is shown next to the mouse pointer - Stroke dialog is not completely clear 3. Text tool - Toolbox colour is overwritten - Moving a text field is difficult 4. Journal - Handling of the journal is difficult 5. Clone tool - Setting the reference point is difficult 6. Path tool - The modes make the usage cumbersome 7. German translation - Some words are misleading ... and much more. When making comments, please refer the corresponding section! Greetings, roman and ellen -- __ Ellen Reitmayr email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Usability Engineer mobil: +49.177.3325867 relevantive AG fon: +49.30.23455630 Zehdenicker Str. 21 fax: +49.30.23455639 10119 Berlinweb: www.relevantive.de ___ signature.asc Description: Dies ist ein digital signierter Nachrichtenteil
[Gimp-developer] Final call: travel assistance
Hi all, Sorry to keep harping on about this, but things need to start moving pretty quickly now, if people need money in advance for travel. I have a fair idea now how much money we will have available, and I would like to be able to let people know by the start of next week whether they will be funded to come to the conference or not. Could anyone who needs travel assistance contact me immediately saying how much they need to get there? Also, please specify if you will need money in advance, or if you will require me to buy you an e-ticket. If you can afford part of your ticket, please say this as well. Thanks a lot, Dave. -- Dave Neary [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
[Gimp-developer] Who's coming to GIMPCon?
Hi all, As most of you know by now, the GIMP Conference will be held as a sub-event of GUADEC in Kristiansand, Norway from the 28th to the 30th of June (in 3 weeks time). A number of people have suggested that a list of attendees who have confirmed they're going would be useful - so could anyone who plans to be there reply to the lists saying so, please? Don't forget to register at http://2004.guadec.org/register/ and request free accommodation if you need it - there's floorspace for all, for a groovy atmosphere. Cheers, Dave. -- Dave Neary [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
[Gimp-developer] GUADEC updates for dgo
Hi all, I have made some updates to the GUADEC content on dgo, but I have not had time to do it properly - I basically copied in some xhtml from the guadec site, but dgo is docbook based. I've attached the current state of affairs - I replaced all the uls and lis with itemizedlists and listitems, but I'm not sure what to do with the as, the ps, the divs and the imgs. Could someone who has a few minutes please tidy this up and either commit it in gimp-web-devel or send it back to me? Also, if someone who knows how could add a link to this on the front page of the (temporary) www.gimp.org, that would be great too. Thanks a lot, Dave. -- Dave Neary [EMAIL PROTECTED] The GIMP Developers Conference 2004 GIMPCon 2004 Planning the next GimpCon The GIMP at GUADEC The GIMP Developers Conference 2004 will be held as a sub-event of http://2004.guadec.org";>GUADEC 5 in Kristiansand, Norway, on the 28th, 29th and 30th of June, 2004. GIMP related talks at GUADEC http://2004;guadec.org/schedule/Dave_Neary.jpg"; width="160" height="200" alt="Dave Neary"/> Dave Neary Programming a GIMP Plug-in Dave Neary Dave Neary's been hanging around free software for about 6 years. He started off as a leech, and then decided to turn into a leechee sometime around 1999, when he started working on the GIMP. His main interest in the GIMP is revitalising the relationship betweek the user and developer communities. He has also helped out a little now and again on other things, and is listed as a co-author of gnect. He is currently living and working in Lyon, France. http://2004.guadec.org/schedule/Oyvind_Kolas.png"; width="200" height="200" alt="Øyvind Kolås"/> Øyvind Kolås Custom widgets in GtkCairo Øyvind Kolås Øyvind is working on an application called Bauxite, which uses a node-based data structure similar to GEGL This application is both a standalone video editor and a comprehensive test bed of GEGL's node structrues. Øyvind is also working on the next generation XCF format. His primary interests in the GIMP is graph compositing. Other graphics talks at GUADEC Typography and graphic design for programmers Liam Quin The future of rendering in GNOME Owen Taylor GStreamer Internals Benjamin Otte Digital Photography in a GNOME Environment Hubert Figuiére Sponsors Many thanks to our generous sponsors, without whom GIMPCon would not be possible: http://www.fsf.org";> http://www.fsf.org/graphics/gnu-head-sm.jpg"; alt="The Free Software Foundation"/> The Free Software Foundation: The Free Software Foundation has consistently been the greatest supporter of the GIMP project, and has been the primary sponsor of each of the three GIMP Conferences which we have held. Many thanks go out to RMS and everyone else at GNU. http://www.macgimp.com";> https://www.archei.com/macgimp/images/mac_gimp_logo4.png"; alt="MacGIMP" height="30" width="60"/> MacGIMP: Mat Caughron sells the GIMP commercially with support and documentation, and has been generous on each occasion we have asked for his support. The GIMP is also fortunate to have a community of supporters who have donated smaller amounts to the project. Many thanks go out to all those supporters. More information on how to donate to the GIMP is available on http://www.gimp.org/donating/";>the GIMP home page. GIMP conference activities The GIMP Developers Conference, also known as GIMPCon, is a gathering of GIMP and GEGL developers from all over the World. It is a vital opportunity for the GIMP developers to meet each other and discuss the direction which the software will take over the coming years. There have been two GIMP Conferences previously, both in Berlin, and both graciously hosted by the CCC (the Chaos Computer Club), a much less chaotic bunch of guys than their name suggests. http://developer.gimp.org/gimpcon/2003/people-small.png"; alt="Last year's GIMP Conference"/> The GIMP Developers Conference 2003 Last year's GIMP Conference was a sub-event of the Chaos Communications Camp, a camping trip with broadband and laptops. During the camp, we discussed ways we could make the GIMP better both technically and as a community, which led up to the 2.0 release at the end of March. At this year's conference we will discuss, among other things, What we expect from a replacement for the PDB (Procedura
Re: [Gimp-developer] correct parameters for select-color?
Hi, Dov Kruger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Also, with apologies for my ignorance, Sven suggested looking at the > interactive menu, but I don't understand how to select color white > interactively, much less replace it. > If I select menu "selection->color" the tool changes on the main gimp > window, but I don't see a way to request color white, or make the > selection, and once that's done, how do I make it transparent? How about clicking on white spot in your image? You didn't try that? Sven ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
Re: [Gimp-developer] Extended tablet functionality
Hi, Thorsten Wilms <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=55367 > > Like stated there I'm willing to provide mockups, but after looking > at Painter Classic there is not much to mockup. Sure, there isn't much to mockup but the changes are definitely not trivial. What would have to be done before we can even consider to implement a rotated view on the canvas is to implement a filtered view on the projection instead of the simple-minded nearest-neighbour implementation that we use now. See also The point that I am trying to make is that this would be a welcomed contribution to the GIMP project. So if anyone wants to hack on this, we would happily accept a patch. Sven ___ Gimp-developer mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.xcf.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gimp-developer
