Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Matt Lind]

> I don't know, but an 'already determined (& rather bleak) fate'
> sounds alot to me like 'death row', which I really don't think at-all
> ever applied to XSI until.. (ice)

No, that's an error on your part.  'Fate' is a long term outcome based on 
development of events outside one's control.  It's not synonymous with 
death.  In this case it meant Softimage would never be the 800 pound gorilla 
some hoped it would be.  That fate was determined by customers already 
investing in other options due to the long string of broken promises and 
being late to market thereby damaging credibility.  Many of the tangible 
issues were later remedied, but not until after it was too late.

> I don't either recall that, I would think that if anything,
> whichever it's state, would have had a growth somewhat
> relative to what ICE seemed to bring, as opposed to the other
> way around, or -maybe- with a time delay if the prior version
> happened to have some issue (?)

Exactly my point.  2007 was the high point in your stats, and the same year 
which the issues with XSI 6.x occurred.  It takes a while for issues like 
that to become impactful on a global scale, but even more difficult to undo 
the damage once it's done.  Winter months are a popular time to hire in most 
industries.  Most hiring was likely front loaded before the XSI 6.x issues 
were widely known as many were likely still on XSI 5.11 at the time, so the 
damage in the jobs sector likely wasn't seen until later in the year.  Add 
in some of the observations of Luc-Eric and there you have it.  The numbers 
were already in decline before ICE was released and never recovered.  ICE 
did bring new eyes onto the product, but not enough to overcome the other 
shortcomings.  By that point ICE acted as life support keeping options open, 
and the timing of it's introduction was important too.

If ICE had already been on the market a few years, data would've illustrated 
whether it was helping sales or not.  If it wasn't making a big dent, 
Softimage would've been killed sooner.  But because ICE was *just* 
introduced at time of the Autodesk acquisition, Autodesk had to at least let 
the ICE hand run for a bit and see if it had any legs.  That bought 
Softimage at least a few years it wouldn't have had otherwise.  Avid was 
determined to get rid of Softimage to solve their other internal issues, and 
the only other taker in rumor was Dassault - do you really think Dassault 
understood media and entertainment well enough to give the kind of support 
Softimage needed?  I don't.  So you can knock Autodesk all you want, and the 
knocks may be perfectly valid, but on the flip side the alternatives weren't 
necessarily better or assure an improved situation.  For all we know 
Dassault could've pulled a Microsoft and dumped millions into the company 
only to suddenly pull the cord when sales didn't meet expectations. 
Autodesk at least let the boat sale for better or for worse.

If you don't remember XSI 6.x, then you must've been living under a rock or 
not pushing the software's feature set very hard.  Keep in mind that 
Softimage had strong games market and XSI 6.x's issues were especially bad 
for game developers.  So if you were working in film/video, you likely 
didn't feel the impact of that release as much as a game developer would 
have.  As I stated numerous times in the past, my studio didn't get any 
relief until Softimage 7.5, and we were then stuck on that release until 
Softimage 2013 SP1 because of all the show stopping issues in between.  I 
know of other studios in similar boats.  Some threw caution to the wind and 
pushed forward anyway only to later regret doing that.

What Maya or anybody else does at that point is almost irrelevant.


Matt



Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2016 20:49:41 -0400
From: Jason S <jasonsta...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com


On 04/21/16 5:26, Matt Lind wrote:
I never said XSI was on death row, I said it was viable with a small
cushion, but long term it's fate was already determined from the miscues
which occurred during the Sumatra release


I don't know, but an 'already determined (& rather bleak) fate'  sounds alot 
to me like 'death row', which I really don't think at-all ever applied to 
XSI until.. (ice)



On 04/21/16 5:26, Matt Lind wrote:
XSI v6.0 was released on the last day in 2006 (call it 2007) - the biggest 
lemon and disaster in XSI's history.  Granted, cause of the problem was a 
screw-up at Avid HQ erroneously divulging a release when one wasn't planned 
forcing the team to put humpty dumpty together again in an insanely short 
time, but the damage was done.


I don't either recall that, I would think that if anything, whichever it's 
state, would have had a growth somewhat relative to what ICE seemed to 
bring, as opposed to the other way around, or -maybe- with a time delay if 
the prior version happened to have 

Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Simon van de Lagemaat]

Ya Vancouver is quite small so laying fiber was, I think, much easier and
cost effective than in other cities.  How you are physically connected to
the data center will drastically change how you approach cloud rendering.
We're waiting for a new center to come online closer to us, even with the
PoP we suspect latency will be too high to use NFS mounts when the center
is somewhere in the midwest.

On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 1:56 PM, Steven Caron  wrote:

> San Francisco still struggles with fiber... why didn't 'Google Fiber' come
> here first? :) Many thousands of dollars per month... if you are using it
> or not. If they did metering like power bills maybe that cost wouldn't be
> so scary.
>
> We have played a little bit with Zync and talked directly with some Google
> product managers about using it. Internet speed and connectivity is still a
> hurdle but it is also something we are considering if we need to scale.
>
> Good point about the AC bill, one reason why GPU rendering can actually be
> expensive. Those things can get hawwt and really suck some juice.
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Steven Caron]

San Francisco still struggles with fiber... why didn't 'Google Fiber' come
here first? :) Many thousands of dollars per month... if you are using it
or not. If they did metering like power bills maybe that cost wouldn't be
so scary.

We have played a little bit with Zync and talked directly with some Google
product managers about using it. Internet speed and connectivity is still a
hurdle but it is also something we are considering if we need to scale.

Good point about the AC bill, one reason why GPU rendering can actually be
expensive. Those things can get hawwt and really suck some juice.

On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 1:32 PM, Simon van de Lagemaat <
si...@theembassyvfx.com> wrote:

> Fiber should be pretty cheap in most major cities by now, if not it will
> be soon.  I think the most difficult part of cloud rendering is that unless
> you're on a service like Zync you really need a couple of pipeline/IT guys
> to work out your imaging, mounting and data transfer tech and strategies.
> There's also a whole host of other issues like your distance to the nearest
> data center and whether or not you have a PoP to them. This can all affect
> whether you mount those cloud machines or treat as offsite and off network
> entities etc etc. It's all about latency.
>
> That said Google does provide some pretty decent instructional media to
> guide you, they are really trying hard to make cloud rendering a reality
> for most people.  I think it's going to be up to AD to decide how they want
> to deal with burst licensing.  Right now with Arnold it's pretty much rent
> and serve your own but I suspect that will change.
>
> We're not planning on rendering everything in the cloud to start but will
> instead leave it for OMG moments or to avoid compromising on quality in
> order to deliver on time etc. If the cost–benefit analysis works I could
> see letting our farm slowly age out and just focus on local storage and
> possibly replace the rack space with workstations using pcoip.  I'm sure
> we'll probably keep some local compute boxes however.
>
> Lots of options!  Less air conditioning!
>
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Steven Caron]

We have needed to do just this, ship hard drives to and from our clients
and it still sucks. 3 TB of data doesn't just come online instantly once it
is in the building.

But yea... scaling past your capacity is one of the major points for us
too. It still has a cost that needs to be evaluated per site and to Jordi's
point it still isn't so clear what was the right choice. If the internet
connectivity issue for our region was a non issue, I would be jumping for
joy :)

On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 1:29 PM, Eric Thivierge 
wrote:
>
>
> I've heard of places / services that will get those images onto a hard
> drive and ship them to you. Great if they have a local branch nearby. :)
>
> I think there is a need for cloud rendering as even studios who dump a ton
> of money into their local farm, they just run out of space and bandwidth
> with multiple shows running. They need cloud when they're maxed out and
> still need to scale out.
>
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Simon van de Lagemaat]

Fiber should be pretty cheap in most major cities by now, if not it will be
soon.  I think the most difficult part of cloud rendering is that unless
you're on a service like Zync you really need a couple of pipeline/IT guys
to work out your imaging, mounting and data transfer tech and strategies.
There's also a whole host of other issues like your distance to the nearest
data center and whether or not you have a PoP to them. This can all affect
whether you mount those cloud machines or treat as offsite and off network
entities etc etc. It's all about latency.

That said Google does provide some pretty decent instructional media to
guide you, they are really trying hard to make cloud rendering a reality
for most people.  I think it's going to be up to AD to decide how they want
to deal with burst licensing.  Right now with Arnold it's pretty much rent
and serve your own but I suspect that will change.

We're not planning on rendering everything in the cloud to start but will
instead leave it for OMG moments or to avoid compromising on quality in
order to deliver on time etc. If the cost–benefit analysis works I could
see letting our farm slowly age out and just focus on local storage and
possibly replace the rack space with workstations using pcoip.  I'm sure
we'll probably keep some local compute boxes however.

Lots of options!  Less air conditioning!

On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 1:09 PM, Steven Caron  wrote:

> and I agree with you on cloud, I am actually not crazy about it either,
> but a lot of people see it as the right way to scale. The cost becomes
> cheaper for some but could be more expensive for others. When someone makes
> the case to use it they *tend* to leave out what I think is the biggest
> issue... access to affordable, reliable, and fast internet connectivity! I
> don't know about other places in the world but for a business class
> connection in the states it can be thousands of dollars a month. Then some
> forget it isn't so much the upload of your assets, you can make an
> extremely efficient scene to upload but downloading those 2k (now 4k) exr
> sequences with many AOVs (don't forget about deep) can take much longer.
>
> BUT some would argue, you do all your work in the cloud... that is a whole
> other beast
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Eric Thivierge]

On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 4:09 PM, Steven Caron  wrote:

> Then some forget it isn't so much the upload of your assets, you can make
> an extremely efficient scene to upload but downloading those 2k (now 4k)
> exr sequences with many AOVs (don't forget about deep) can take much longer.


I've heard of places / services that will get those images onto a hard
drive and ship them to you. Great if they have a local branch nearby. :)

I think there is a need for cloud rendering as even studios who dump a ton
of money into their local farm, they just run out of space and bandwidth
with multiple shows running. They need cloud when they're maxed out and
still need to scale out.


Eric Thivierge
http://www.ethivierge.com
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Steven Caron]

and I agree with you on cloud, I am actually not crazy about it either, but
a lot of people see it as the right way to scale. The cost becomes cheaper
for some but could be more expensive for others. When someone makes the
case to use it they *tend* to leave out what I think is the biggest
issue... access to affordable, reliable, and fast internet connectivity! I
don't know about other places in the world but for a business class
connection in the states it can be thousands of dollars a month. Then some
forget it isn't so much the upload of your assets, you can make an
extremely efficient scene to upload but downloading those 2k (now 4k) exr
sequences with many AOVs (don't forget about deep) can take much longer.

BUT some would argue, you do all your work in the cloud... that is a whole
other beast

On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 12:39 PM, Jordi Bares  wrote:

> Fair point about the patents of course, it is a no brainer.
>
> I mentioned cloud because it is a subject it keeps popping out, specially
> since the Solid Angle acquisition and from where I stand can only make
> sense if there is a degree of certainty on costs and a clear advantage on
> scalability, both not easy at all to fulfil. If anything I believe it is
> going on the other direction altogether.
>
> my 2 cents
>
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Jordi Bares]

Fair point about the patents of course, it is a no brainer.

I mentioned cloud because it is a subject it keeps popping out, specially since 
the Solid Angle acquisition and from where I stand can only make sense if there 
is a degree of certainty on costs and a clear advantage on scalability, both 
not easy at all to fulfil. If anything I believe it is going on the other 
direction altogether.

my 2 cents

jb

> On 22 Apr 2016, at 18:55, Steven Caron  wrote:
> 
> I didn't see where Luc-Eric is claiming cloud rendering to be our saviors... 
> he just points out how rendering on the cloud makes logical sense.
> 
> The take away is those purchases don't have much to do with patents.
> 
> On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 10:50 AM, Jordi Bares  > wrote:
> Mmmm… I am not convinced at all Cloud is what is going to save the day, I 
> think you got it wrong.
> 
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Steven Caron]

I didn't see where Luc-Eric is claiming cloud rendering to be our
saviors... he just points out how rendering on the cloud makes logical
sense.

The take away is those purchases don't have much to do with patents.

On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 10:50 AM, Jordi Bares  wrote:

> Mmmm… I am not convinced at all Cloud is what is going to save the day, I
> think you got it wrong.
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Steven Caron]

Agreed! I don't believe that narrative of consuming patents as a reason for
purchasing Softimage.

On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 10:41 AM, Luc-Eric Rousseau 
wrote:
>
>
> I think all of this makes more sense than a story built around
> mythical patent folios.
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Jordi Bares]

Mmmm… I am not convinced at all Cloud is what is going to save the day, I think 
you got it wrong.

jb



> On 22 Apr 2016, at 18:41, Luc-Eric Rousseau  wrote:
> 
> Right now the press interviews are saying the Arnold acquisition will
> help "accelerate the drive to the cloud" and that Arnold is "Cloud
> Ready".  http://tinyurl.com/jmvc7ke  It's a perfectly logical
> explanation, rendering services is an obvious cloud service.
> 
> For softimage, the actual text of the softimage press release said
> "The acquisition is meant to strengthen Autodesk's position in the
> fast-growing video games market" http://tinyurl.com/65o3v8  Less
> obvious, but see what they did next.
> 
> Softimage, which also as a product "owned" the japan game market, was
> immediately put in the Autodesk Games group. Softimage's managers were
> made leaders of that.   Former softimage dev immediately went on to
> worked on an ICE-like game middleware, project skyline, while
> softimage game customers were gradually migrated to Maya.
> 
> I think all of this makes more sense than a story built around
> mythical patent folios.
> 
> On 21 April 2016 at 21:28, Steven Caron  wrote:
>> Pushing the topic back to the Solid Angle purchase...
>> 
>> https://twitter.com/arnoldrenderer/status/723139036517261313
>> 
>> For me, when or if Marcos and his team stop publishing to SIGGRAPH and
>> releasing papers without patenting first I will know Autodesk cares more
>> about "patents" than the talent and product they bought.
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Luc-Eric Rousseau]

Right now the press interviews are saying the Arnold acquisition will
help "accelerate the drive to the cloud" and that Arnold is "Cloud
Ready".  http://tinyurl.com/jmvc7ke  It's a perfectly logical
explanation, rendering services is an obvious cloud service.

For softimage, the actual text of the softimage press release said
"The acquisition is meant to strengthen Autodesk's position in the
fast-growing video games market" http://tinyurl.com/65o3v8  Less
obvious, but see what they did next.

Softimage, which also as a product "owned" the japan game market, was
immediately put in the Autodesk Games group. Softimage's managers were
made leaders of that.   Former softimage dev immediately went on to
worked on an ICE-like game middleware, project skyline, while
softimage game customers were gradually migrated to Maya.

I think all of this makes more sense than a story built around
mythical patent folios.

On 21 April 2016 at 21:28, Steven Caron  wrote:
> Pushing the topic back to the Solid Angle purchase...
>
> https://twitter.com/arnoldrenderer/status/723139036517261313
>
> For me, when or if Marcos and his team stop publishing to SIGGRAPH and
> releasing papers without patenting first I will know Autodesk cares more
> about "patents" than the talent and product they bought.
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Steven Caron]

Pushing the topic back to the Solid Angle purchase...

https://twitter.com/arnoldrenderer/status/723139036517261313

For me, when or if Marcos and his team stop publishing to SIGGRAPH and
releasing papers without patenting first I will know Autodesk cares more
about "patents" than the talent and product they bought.


On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 4:22 PM, Guy Rabiller 
wrote:

>
> You do not need to be in the business of licensing patents to benefit from
> acquiring some. First they don't get in your way anymore, second they get
> in the way of your concurrents, third they don't quit if they don't like
> what they see. Companies like Autodesk are quite sensitive about legal
> issues. At least the patents are still in their hands.
>
> On another hand, where is that $35 millions dollars team now ?  Tell me.
> No offense here but it seems the most valuable (tech speaking) members of
> the XSI dev team have left the boat by now. What a wise move from Autodesk
> if she really was after that team ! And where is that working business now
> ? No comment.
>
> All those millions for.. what for btw, fairy tails aside ?
> --
>
> guy rabiller | radfac founder | linkedin.com/in/guyrabiller
>
>
> On 21/04/16 14:39, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote:
>
> Oh my god, parents again?  Patents are worth nothing if you are not in
> the
> business of licensing patents, which Autodesk isn't in.  Where these
> millions dollar
> patents exactly, and how is that worth 35 miliions?  Hiring dozens of
> people in one
> shot plus a working business is worth millions, not some useless region
> dumb ass
> patent they never used.   Softimage`s I.P. was worth exactly zero.
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Jason S]

favor, only
  because.. whatever Autodesk says...
  
  Best,
  -J
  
  On 04/21/16 5:26, Matt Lind wrote:


  Don't put words in my mouth, Jason.

I never said XSI was on death row, I said it was viable with a small 
cushion, but long term it's fate was already determined from the miscues 
which occurred during the Sumatra release, and further exacerbated from 
later misreads and missteps in the market such as raising prices when 
everybody was dropping prices.

As for your assessment, your analysis is flawed.

I don’t' know where you got the XSIBase numbers considering the site has 
been offline for years.  In any event, I don't consider those numbers very 
valid, but for the sake of argument I'll go with it.

According to your numbers, 2007 was the peak with 275 jobs available.  It 
was followed in 2008 with a ~40% drop to 168 jobs - the biggest 
year-over-year change in the entire data set.  You point out ICE was 
released in 2008, which is true, but that didn't happen until August at 
Siggraph.  You pointed out Autodesk bought Softimage in 2008, which is also 
true, but that wasn't announced until October.  So, by your assessment, 40% 
of the annual jobs were lost in the months October, November, and December 
of 2008 because people dropped usage of Softimage overnight upon the 
announcement of the acquisition?  I don't buy that - here's why:

Let's assume 2008 was on the same pace as 2007 even though the trend in 
prior years was ascending.  With simple arithmetic 275 / 12 = 22.91 --> ~23 
jobs per month available.  3 x 23 = 69 jobs lost during last 3 months of 
2008.  275 - 69 = 206 jobs for 2008 if Autodesk were the driving factor for 
the reduction.  OK, but that still leaves 38 jobs unaccounted for (206 - 168 
= 38).

So what happened to cause the numbers to drop significantly in 2008? 
Hmmmlet me think...Oh, that's right, XSI v6.0 was released on the last 
day in 2006 (call it 2007) - the biggest lemon and disaster in XSI's 
history.  Granted, cause of the problem was a screw-up at Avid HQ 
erroneously divulging a release when one wasn't planned forcing the team to 
put humpty dumpty together again in an insanely short time, but the damage 
was done.  It required several service packs on short order to bail all the 
water out, and for many customers, like my company, we literally could not 
function on XSI 6.x with all it's bugs and corruptions, and the service 
packs often made things worse.  Our production almost shut down because of 
it.  We didn't get any relief until XSI 7.5 was released 18 months later in 
March 2008.  I think that's a better cause/effect explanation for the drop 
in jobs -  customers were turned off by the instability and irresponsibility 
of a company claiming to be a market leader making such a release.  Autodesk 
and co. added their 2 cents later and certainly didn't help matters, but 
they weren't the driving force.  If it weren't for ICE, Softimage would've 
been dead a lot sooner.


Matt




Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2016 21:01:30 -0400
From: Jason S <jasonsta...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com


On 04/20/16 7:27, Matt Lind wrote:

  
The couple of versions of extra dev was just the benefit of having the 
larger
staff for a short period of time.

You can look at Softimage's market share any way you like, but it all 
comes
back to they dropped the ball with 'Sumatra'.

  
  So it was already on death row?

Soft may not have had the largest userbase, but despite it's previous 
growing pains, it was not only doing just fine, (because it was pretty good) 
it was climbing up t'il 2007-08 regardless of how avid was doing  ... All 
until ICE came.

2003  90
2004  145

2005 160

2006  198
  2007 275


2008  168  <--  ICE
  2009  119
2010  109
2011  62
  2012   26

I-I-I-C-C-C-E!

(wait. what came practically at the same time as ICE?)

Today it's less of everything that's awkward about both Maya and 3ds, (now 
with passes? Match transforms? UV Unwrap tools?)
and it seems that it's to an extent because of the missing third,  but I 
wouldn't say that it exactly makes-up for it, and would qualify it as 
largely still missing for what it had going for it most.

But whatever now. 

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Bradley Gabe]

Just as everybody else, my comments are based on speculation synthesized
from tidbits of info gathered before, during, and since the SI acquisition.
Take that for what it's worth (Sorry if I am taking the thread too far off
topic).

Why did they buy SI? As with every other acquisition decision, it boils
down to the whims of a very small handful of executives, each with his own
plans and motivations. You could have one exec who loved SI because of past
associations, and another who loathed SI because of a history of nasty
competition. Both could agree to acquire SI because each could achieve a
goal by having it under their corporate control. You might have even had an
exec at Soft who would be willing to sacrifice the whole thing if it meant
he could get a foothold into a different company. It doesn't matter if
their end goals for SI were in opposition, only that it got acquired.

There's a simple explanation for why the acquisition didn't make sense to
the user base or many of the employees, it's because it actually didn't
make sense. It was never really about any of us, we're all just downstream
effects. Keeping that in mind, once the acquisition was made, there were a
handful of simple requirements:

1) Tell the employees whatever they need to hear, as long as we can keep
the good ones... or not, who cares. They don't have many choices to go
elsewhere anyways.
2) Tell the user base whatever they need to hear, as long as we can keep
the good ones... or not, who cares. They don't have many choices to go
elsewhere anyways.
3) Do the minimum necessary to not get in trouble for breaking anti trust
laws.

These 3 requirements were followed and met, especially number 3, and that's
that. Mission accomplished.


PS - Tinfoil makes you sweat if you wear the hat long enough.
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Guy Rabiller]

It makes sense for historians.

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guy rabiller | radfac founder | linkedin.com/in/guyrabiller



On 22/04/16 01:35, Mario Reitbauer wrote:
No real sense in discussing why Autodesk bought something or will buy 
something. They just did and will continue to do so.


2016-04-21 16:22 GMT-07:00 Guy Rabiller >:



You do not need to be in the business of licensing patents to
benefit from acquiring some. First they don't get in your way
anymore, second they get in the way of your concurrents, third
they don't quit if they don't like what they see. Companies like
Autodesk are quite sensitive about legal issues. At least the
patents are still in their hands.

On another hand, where is that $35 millions dollars team now ? 
Tell me. No offense here but it seems the most valuable (tech

speaking) members of the XSI dev team have left the boat by now.
What a wise move from Autodesk if she really was after that team !
And where is that working business now ? No comment.

All those millions for.. what for btw, fairy tails aside ?
--

guy rabiller | radfac founder |linkedin.com/in/guyrabiller 



On 21/04/16 14:39, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote:

Oh my god, parents again?  Patents are worth nothing if you are
not in the
business of licensing patents, which Autodesk isn't in.  Where
these millions dollar
patents exactly, and how is that worth 35 miliions?  Hiring
dozens of people in one
shot plus a working business is worth millions, not some useless
region dumb ass
patent they never used.   Softimage`s I.P. was worth exactly zero.

On 21 April 2016 at 01:30, Guy Rabiller > wrote:


All until Autodesk came.

Here is what happened in 2008:

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112=12030177=14271589

Then when Ronald Beirouti left (who created ICE), it was
definitely the end of ICE (and Softimage).
(https://groups.google.com/d/msg/xsi_list/ElbS6ZbjKEk/vMyh8CGhCpQJ)

Peoples still think Autodesk acquired Softimage from Avid for
XSI or for the developers team. It was all for the patents.
The rest is "accessory".

How many patents Solid Angle had ?



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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Guy Rabiller]

You do not need to be in the business of licensing patents to benefit 
from acquiring some. First they don't get in your way anymore, second 
they get in the way of your concurrents, third they don't quit if they 
don't like what they see. Companies like Autodesk are quite sensitive 
about legal issues. At least the patents are still in their hands.


On another hand, where is that $35 millions dollars team now ?  Tell me. 
No offense here but it seems the most valuable (tech speaking) members 
of the XSI dev team have left the boat by now. What a wise move from 
Autodesk if she really was after that team ! And where is that working 
business now ? No comment.


All those millions for.. what for btw, fairy tails aside ?
--

guy rabiller | radfac founder | linkedin.com/in/guyrabiller


On 21/04/16 14:39, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote:
Oh my god, parents again?  Patents are worth nothing if you are not in 
the
business of licensing patents, which Autodesk isn't in. Where these 
millions dollar
patents exactly, and how is that worth 35 miliions?  Hiring dozens of 
people in one
shot plus a working business is worth millions, not some useless 
region dumb ass

patent they never used.   Softimage`s I.P. was worth exactly zero.

On 21 April 2016 at 01:30, Guy Rabiller > wrote:



All until Autodesk came.

Here is what happened in 2008:

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112=12030177=14271589

Then when Ronald Beirouti left (who created ICE), it was
definitely the end of ICE (and Softimage).
(https://groups.google.com/d/msg/xsi_list/ElbS6ZbjKEk/vMyh8CGhCpQJ)

Peoples still think Autodesk acquired Softimage from Avid for XSI
or for the developers team. It was all for the patents. The rest
is "accessory".

How many patents Solid Angle had ?



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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Matt Lind]

Luc-Eric,

XSI 6.5 was a lemon if you were in games development.  One of the issues 
being it was not possible to get an OpenGL context.  Basically the 
equivalent of not having mental ray available to do previews, render 
regions, and so on.  How something that obvious gets past testing undetected 
is beyond me, but that's what happened.


Matt




Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2016 09:22:00 -0400
From: Luc-Eric Rousseau <luceri...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com"
<softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>


On 21 April 2016 at 05:26, Matt Lind <speye...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> So what happened to cause the numbers to drop significantly in 2008?
> Hmmmlet me think...Oh, that's right, XSI v6.0 was released on the last
> day in 2006 (call it 2007) - the biggest lemon and disaster in XSI's
> history.  Granted, cause of the problem was a screw-up at Avid HQ
> erroneously divulging a release when one wasn't planned forcing the team 
> to
> put humpty dumpty together again in an insanely short time, but the damage
> was done.

I cannot recall if XSI 6.5 was a lemon or fixed a lot of 6.0 trouble,
but it what it also did was raised the price of XSI by 1000$ for most 
people.

Also, starting in 2008 was the downfall of xsibase, which was beginning
to be blocked by google and web browser due to frequent malware infection.

I think xsibase's job count didn't represent japan or larger studios
(about 70% of softimage
seats), so I indeed wouldn't use it to extrapolate things.

Foundation was first released in 2004 and peaked around 5.11 and could cause
a SMB bump around 2006/2007

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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Angus Davidson]

Hi Maurice.

Thats right. I remember it correctly now.



From: Maurice Patel [maurice.pa...@autodesk.com]
Sent: 21 April 2016 04:58 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

I doubt it - issues with open source tend to lie in the fact that products 
often contain source code licensed from other companies or reused from other 
products that would need to be extracted and replaced requiring extensive 
rework and testing. That would have been the case with Softimage.

Maurice

Maurice Patel
Tél:  514 954-7134
Cell: 514 242-6549

-Original Message-
From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Angus Davidson
Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 10:51 AM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

*Sigh*  I am very well aware of what a patent is, However it was one of the 
arguments raised when AD was backpedaling with such ferocity when they realized 
just how badly they had PR'ed Up.



From: Luc-Eric Rousseau [luceri...@gmail.com]
Sent: 21 April 2016 03:27 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

On 21 April 2016 at 08:50, Angus Davidson <angus.david...@wits.ac.za> wrote:
>
> Wasn’t patents the excuse AD used to not sell it / Open source it ?

What? No.  It looks like you don't understand what a patent is.  A patent is 
published and documented, it's not protected by hiding source code that 
implements it. It's protected by being filed with the patent office.

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Eric Thivierge]

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 10:58 AM, Maurice Patel 
wrote:

> I doubt it - issues with open source tend to lie in the fact that products
> often contain source code licensed from other companies or reused from
> other products that would need to be extracted and replaced requiring
> extensive rework and testing. That would have been the case with Softimage.


That is how I remember it when the discussion was had years ago about it.


Eric Thivierge
http://www.ethivierge.com
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Maurice Patel]

I doubt it - issues with open source tend to lie in the fact that products 
often contain source code licensed from other companies or reused from other 
products that would need to be extracted and replaced requiring extensive 
rework and testing. That would have been the case with Softimage.

Maurice

Maurice Patel
Tél:  514 954-7134
Cell: 514 242-6549

-Original Message-
From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Angus Davidson
Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2016 10:51 AM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

*Sigh*  I am very well aware of what a patent is, However it was one of the 
arguments raised when AD was backpedaling with such ferocity when they realized 
just how badly they had PR'ed Up. 



From: Luc-Eric Rousseau [luceri...@gmail.com]
Sent: 21 April 2016 03:27 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

On 21 April 2016 at 08:50, Angus Davidson <angus.david...@wits.ac.za> wrote:
>
> Wasn't patents the excuse AD used to not sell it / Open source it ?

What? No.  It looks like you don't understand what a patent is.  A patent is 
published and documented, it's not protected by hiding source code that 
implements it. It's protected by being filed with the patent office.

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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Angus Davidson]

*Sigh*  I am very well aware of what a patent is, However it was one of the 
arguments raised when AD was backpedaling with such ferocity when they realized 
just how badly they had PR'ed Up. 



From: Luc-Eric Rousseau [luceri...@gmail.com]
Sent: 21 April 2016 03:27 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

On 21 April 2016 at 08:50, Angus Davidson <angus.david...@wits.ac.za> wrote:
>
> Wasn’t patents the excuse AD used to not sell it / Open source it ?

What? No.  It looks like you don't understand what a patent is.  A
patent is published and documented, it's not protected by hiding
source code that implements it. It's protected by being filed with the
patent office.

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=
 

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communication in error, please notify us immediately and destroy the original 
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Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. All agreements between the University and 
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Angus Davidson]

I agree with you. Autodesks decision to EOL instead of EOD Softimage totally 
screwed up a lot of EDu institutions as well. We didnt even come into their 
thinking at all.

From: Mirko Jankovic [mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com]
Sent: 21 April 2016 03:10 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

sry I mean 100% for artists

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 3:09 PM, Mirko Jankovic 
<mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com<redir.aspx?REF=QHckJxauJIirfO8AI21_QTCk_p7dRDWQaww41lu9xaYlCECM82nTCAFtYWlsdG86bWlya29qLmFuaW1hdG9yQGdtYWlsLmNvbQ..>>
 wrote:
it is fracion of AD's stream, but that software is 100% revenue from a lot of 
artist s that gets hit but their decisions...



--
Mirko Jankovic
http://www.cgfolio.com/mirko-jankovic<redir.aspx?REF=3LQjMJSbM-owLqnZSF2zR1rsi3SQTZXb2bHtxiHtnH4lCECM82nTCAFodHRwOi8vd3d3LmNnZm9saW8uY29tL21pcmtvLWphbmtvdmlj>

Need to find freelancers fast?
www.cgfolio.com<redir.aspx?REF=d3cocTptJU0g3MqCizdgWzRilbiD-IXm6f0_vUKeeQclCECM82nTCAFodHRwOi8vd3d3LmNnZm9saW8uY29t>

Need some help with rendering an Redshift project?
http://www.gpuoven.com/<redir.aspx?REF=75DOOhL9Fec22GIsEd4ZSbnSgA8gKs9eyfB4RXQkhsAlCECM82nTCAFodHRwOi8vd3d3LmdwdW92ZW4uY29tLw..>



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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Luc-Eric Rousseau]

On 21 April 2016 at 08:50, Angus Davidson  wrote:
>
> Wasn’t patents the excuse AD used to not sell it / Open source it ?

What? No.  It looks like you don't understand what a patent is.  A
patent is published and documented, it's not protected by hiding
source code that implements it. It's protected by being filed with the
patent office.

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Luc-Eric Rousseau]

On 21 April 2016 at 05:26, Matt Lind  wrote:
> So what happened to cause the numbers to drop significantly in 2008?
> Hmmmlet me think...Oh, that's right, XSI v6.0 was released on the last
> day in 2006 (call it 2007) - the biggest lemon and disaster in XSI's
> history.  Granted, cause of the problem was a screw-up at Avid HQ
> erroneously divulging a release when one wasn't planned forcing the team to
> put humpty dumpty together again in an insanely short time, but the damage
> was done.

I cannot recall if XSI 6.5 was a lemon or fixed a lot of 6.0 trouble,
but it what it also did was raised the price of XSI by 1000$ for most people.

Also, starting in 2008 was the downfall of xsibase, which was beginning
to be blocked by google and web browser due to frequent malware infection.

I think xsibase's job count didn't represent japan or larger studios
(about 70% of softimage
seats), so I indeed wouldn't use it to extrapolate things.

Foundation was first released in 2004 and peaked around 5.11 and could cause
a SMB bump around 2006/2007
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Mirko Jankovic]

sry I mean 100% for artists

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 3:09 PM, Mirko Jankovic 
wrote:

> it is fracion of AD's stream, but that software is 100% revenue from a lot
> of artist s that gets hit but their decisions...
>



-- 
Mirko Jankovic
*http://www.cgfolio.com/mirko-jankovic
*

Need to find freelancers fast?
www.cgfolio.com

Need some help with rendering an Redshift project?
http://www.gpuoven.com/
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Mirko Jankovic]

it is fracion of AD's stream, but that software is 100% revenue from a lot
of artist s that gets hit but their decisions...
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Angus Davidson]

True, but you don’t become a big business and stay there , if you don’t care 
about the 3.5-4%



From: christian [mailto:papag...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, 21 April 2016 3:07 PM
To: XSILIST <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

autodesk is a huge company with a wide range of programs and apps. stuff like 
maya and xsi is just a tiny fraction of their overall revenue stream (in the 
range of 3.5 to 4%).

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 2:53 PM, Angus Davidson 
<angus.david...@wits.ac.za<mailto:angus.david...@wits.ac.za>> wrote:
No they never cared about the business long term

From: Srecko Micic 
[mailto:srecko.mi...@gmail.com<mailto:srecko.mi...@gmail.com>]
Sent: Thursday, 21 April 2016 2:51 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Cc: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

So at the end AD just wanted devs and working business?

--
Micic Srecko
---
Mail: srecko.mi...@gmail.com<mailto:srecko.mi...@gmail.com>
Skype: srecko.micic
---

On Apr 21 2016, at 2:39 pm, Luc-Eric Rousseau 
<luceri...@gmail.com<mailto:luceri...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Oh my god, parents again?  Patents are worth nothing if you are not in the
business of licensing patents, which Autodesk isn't in.  Where these millions 
dollar
patents exactly, and how is that worth 35 miliions?  Hiring dozens of people in 
one
shot plus a working business is worth millions, not some useless region dumb ass
patent they never used.   Softimage`s I.P. was worth exactly zero.

On 21 April 2016 at 01:30, Guy Rabiller 
<guy.rabil...@radfac.com<mailto:guy.rabil...@radfac.com>> wrote:

All until Autodesk came.

Here is what happened in 2008:
http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112=12030177=14271589

Then when Ronald Beirouti left (who created ICE), it was definitely the end of 
ICE (and Softimage).
(https://groups.google.com/d/msg/xsi_list/ElbS6ZbjKEk/vMyh8CGhCpQJ)

Peoples still think Autodesk acquired Softimage from Avid for XSI or for the 
developers team. It was all for the patents. The rest is "accessory".

How many patents Solid Angle had ?
This communication is intended for the addressee only. It is confidential. If 
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destroy the original message. You may not copy or disseminate this 
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and recipients are thus advised that the content of this message may not be 
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[christian]

autodesk is a huge company with a wide range of programs and apps. stuff
like maya and xsi is just a tiny fraction of their overall revenue stream
(in the range of 3.5 to 4%).

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 2:53 PM, Angus Davidson <angus.david...@wits.ac.za>
wrote:

> No they never cared about the business long term
>
>
>
> *From:* Srecko Micic [mailto:srecko.mi...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, 21 April 2016 2:51 PM
> *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> *Cc:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> *Subject:* Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
>
>
>
> So at the end AD just wanted devs and working business?
>
>
>
> --
>
> *Micic Srecko*
> ---
> *Mail:* srecko.mi...@gmail.com
> *Skype*: srecko.micic
> ---
>
>
>
> On Apr 21 2016, at 2:39 pm, Luc-Eric Rousseau <luceri...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Oh my god, parents again?  Patents are worth nothing if you are not in the
>
> business of licensing patents, which Autodesk isn't in.  Where these
> millions dollar
>
> patents exactly, and how is that worth 35 miliions?  Hiring dozens of
> people in one
>
> shot plus a working business is worth millions, not some useless region
> dumb ass
>
> patent they never used.   Softimage`s I.P. was worth exactly zero.
>
>
>
> On 21 April 2016 at 01:30, Guy Rabiller <guy.rabil...@radfac.com> wrote:
>
>
> All until Autodesk came.
>
> Here is what happened in 2008:
>
> http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112=12030177=14271589
>
> Then when Ronald Beirouti left (who created ICE), it was definitely the
> end of ICE (and Softimage).
> (https://groups.google.com/d/msg/xsi_list/ElbS6ZbjKEk/vMyh8CGhCpQJ)
>
> Peoples still think Autodesk acquired Softimage from Avid for XSI or for
> the developers team. It was all for the patents. The rest is "accessory".
>
> How many patents Solid Angle had ?
>
>  This communication is intended for the addressee only. It is confidential. 
> If you have received this communication in error, please notify us 
> immediately and destroy the original message. You may not copy or disseminate 
> this communication without the permission of the University. Only authorised 
> signatories are competent to enter into agreements on behalf of the 
> University and recipients are thus advised that the content of this message 
> may not be legally binding on the University and may contain the personal 
> views and opinions of the author, which are not necessarily the views and 
> opinions of The University of the Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. All agreements 
> between the University and outsiders are subject to South African Law unless 
> the University agrees in writing to the contrary.
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Angus Davidson]

You have to see it as a process though. If you have invested 8 + years in 
people salaries setting up a pipeline to your specific needs its very difficult 
to change. There sheer amount of company IP and development you loose will 
probably cost a few people their jobs. Time = Money and there are a lot of 
firms that simply cannot afford to switch. Even if in the longer term it will 
be better, cheaper , faster etc.



From: Mirko Jankovic [mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, 21 April 2016 3:01 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

So even large seats with TD's will start paying subscription AND paying ton of 
their own TDs to do development.
Who is crazy here then?
They can get  Blender or even more realistically Fabric and develop their own 
tools then without spending and depending on AD at all


On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 2:55 PM, Angus Davidson 
<angus.david...@wits.ac.za<mailto:angus.david...@wits.ac.za>> wrote:
I agree. But we are not the target market. That is companies with large numbers 
of seats with TDs who can scripts and tweak it what they need. The solo person 
or small studio has never been their concern.

From: Mirko Jankovic 
[mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com<mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>]
Sent: Thursday, 21 April 2016 2:53 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

and looking at current tempo of actually making maya worth human interaction it 
could be usefull in how many decades?
it wont even reach intuitive level of Softimage in years

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 2:51 PM, Srecko Micic 
<srecko.mi...@gmail.com<mailto:srecko.mi...@gmail.com>> wrote:
So at the end AD just wanted devs and working business?

--
Micic Srecko
---
Mail: srecko.mi...@gmail.com<mailto:srecko.mi...@gmail.com>
Skype: srecko.micic
---

On Apr 21 2016, at 2:39 pm, Luc-Eric Rousseau 
<luceri...@gmail.com<mailto:luceri...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Oh my god, parents again?  Patents are worth nothing if you are not in the
business of licensing patents, which Autodesk isn't in.  Where these millions 
dollar
patents exactly, and how is that worth 35 miliions?  Hiring dozens of people in 
one
shot plus a working business is worth millions, not some useless region dumb ass
patent they never used.   Softimage`s I.P. was worth exactly zero.

On 21 April 2016 at 01:30, Guy Rabiller 
<guy.rabil...@radfac.com<mailto:guy.rabil...@radfac.com>> wrote:

All until Autodesk came.

Here is what happened in 2008:
http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112=12030177=14271589

Then when Ronald Beirouti left (who created ICE), it was definitely the end of 
ICE (and Softimage).
(https://groups.google.com/d/msg/xsi_list/ElbS6ZbjKEk/vMyh8CGhCpQJ)

Peoples still think Autodesk acquired Softimage from Avid for XSI or for the 
developers team. It was all for the patents. The rest is "accessory".

How many patents Solid Angle had ?

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http://www.cgfolio.com/mirko-jankovic

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and recipients are thus advised that the content of this message may not be 
legally binding on the University and may contain the personal views and 
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University of the Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. All agreements between the 
University and outsiders are subject to South African Law unless the University 
agrees in writing to the contrary.



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message. Y

Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Mirko Jankovic]

So even large seats with TD's will start paying subscription AND paying ton
of their own TDs to do development.
Who is crazy here then?
They can get  Blender or even more realistically Fabric and develop their
own tools then without spending and depending on AD at all


On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 2:55 PM, Angus Davidson <angus.david...@wits.ac.za>
wrote:

> I agree. But we are not the target market. That is companies with large
> numbers of seats with TDs who can scripts and tweak it what they need. The
> solo person or small studio has never been their concern.
>
>
>
> *From:* Mirko Jankovic [mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, 21 April 2016 2:53 PM
> *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> *Subject:* Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
>
>
>
> and looking at current tempo of actually making maya worth human
> interaction it could be usefull in how many decades?
>
> it wont even reach intuitive level of Softimage in years
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 2:51 PM, Srecko Micic <srecko.mi...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> So at the end AD just wanted devs and working business?
>
>
>
> --
>
> *Micic Srecko*
> ---
> *Mail:* srecko.mi...@gmail.com
> *Skype*: srecko.micic
> ---
>
>
>
> On Apr 21 2016, at 2:39 pm, Luc-Eric Rousseau <luceri...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Oh my god, parents again?  Patents are worth nothing if you are not in the
>
> business of licensing patents, which Autodesk isn't in.  Where these
> millions dollar
>
> patents exactly, and how is that worth 35 miliions?  Hiring dozens of
> people in one
>
> shot plus a working business is worth millions, not some useless region
> dumb ass
>
> patent they never used.   Softimage`s I.P. was worth exactly zero.
>
>
>
> On 21 April 2016 at 01:30, Guy Rabiller <guy.rabil...@radfac.com> wrote:
>
>
> All until Autodesk came.
>
> Here is what happened in 2008:
>
> http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112=12030177=14271589
>
> Then when Ronald Beirouti left (who created ICE), it was definitely the
> end of ICE (and Softimage).
> (https://groups.google.com/d/msg/xsi_list/ElbS6ZbjKEk/vMyh8CGhCpQJ)
>
> Peoples still think Autodesk acquired Softimage from Avid for XSI or for
> the developers team. It was all for the patents. The rest is "accessory".
>
> How many patents Solid Angle had ?
>
>
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
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> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Mirko Jankovic
>
> *http://www.cgfolio.com/mirko-jankovic
> <http://www.cgfolio.com/mirko-jankovic>*
>
>
>
> Need to find freelancers fast?
>
> www.cgfolio.com
>
>
>
> Need some help with rendering an Redshift project?
>
> http://www.gpuoven.com/
>
>  This communication is intended for the addressee only. It is confidential. 
> If you have received this communication in error, please notify us 
> immediately and destroy the original message. You may not copy or disseminate 
> this communication without the permission of the University. Only authorised 
> signatories are competent to enter into agreements on behalf of the 
> University and recipients are thus advised that the content of this message 
> may not be legally binding on the University and may contain the personal 
> views and opinions of the author, which are not necessarily the views and 
> opinions of The University of the Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. All agreements 
> between the University and outsiders are subject to South African Law unless 
> the University agrees in writing to the contrary.
>
>
> --
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>



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<http://www.cgfolio.com/mirko-jankovic>*

Need to find freelancers fast?
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Angus Davidson]

I agree. But we are not the target market. That is companies with large numbers 
of seats with TDs who can scripts and tweak it what they need. The solo person 
or small studio has never been their concern.

From: Mirko Jankovic [mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, 21 April 2016 2:53 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

and looking at current tempo of actually making maya worth human interaction it 
could be usefull in how many decades?
it wont even reach intuitive level of Softimage in years

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 2:51 PM, Srecko Micic 
<srecko.mi...@gmail.com<mailto:srecko.mi...@gmail.com>> wrote:
So at the end AD just wanted devs and working business?

--
Micic Srecko
---
Mail: srecko.mi...@gmail.com<mailto:srecko.mi...@gmail.com>
Skype: srecko.micic
---

On Apr 21 2016, at 2:39 pm, Luc-Eric Rousseau 
<luceri...@gmail.com<mailto:luceri...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Oh my god, parents again?  Patents are worth nothing if you are not in the
business of licensing patents, which Autodesk isn't in.  Where these millions 
dollar
patents exactly, and how is that worth 35 miliions?  Hiring dozens of people in 
one
shot plus a working business is worth millions, not some useless region dumb ass
patent they never used.   Softimage`s I.P. was worth exactly zero.

On 21 April 2016 at 01:30, Guy Rabiller 
<guy.rabil...@radfac.com<mailto:guy.rabil...@radfac.com>> wrote:

All until Autodesk came.

Here is what happened in 2008:
http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112=12030177=14271589

Then when Ronald Beirouti left (who created ICE), it was definitely the end of 
ICE (and Softimage).
(https://groups.google.com/d/msg/xsi_list/ElbS6ZbjKEk/vMyh8CGhCpQJ)

Peoples still think Autodesk acquired Softimage from Avid for XSI or for the 
developers team. It was all for the patents. The rest is "accessory".

How many patents Solid Angle had ?

--
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softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com>
 with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.



--
Mirko Jankovic
http://www.cgfolio.com/mirko-jankovic

Need to find freelancers fast?
www.cgfolio.com<http://www.cgfolio.com>

Need some help with rendering an Redshift project?
http://www.gpuoven.com/

 

This communication is 
intended for the addressee only. It is confidential. If you have received this 
communication in error, please notify us immediately and destroy the original 
message. You may not copy or disseminate this communication without the 
permission of the University. Only authorised signatories are competent to 
enter into agreements on behalf of the University and recipients are thus 
advised that the content of this message may not be legally binding on the 
University and may contain the personal views and opinions of the author, which 
are not necessarily the views and opinions of The University of the 
Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. All agreements between the University and 
outsiders are subject to South African Law unless the University agrees in 
writing to the contrary. 

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Graham Bell]

We're still ok with it and I think we're doing some nice stuff with it
considering we're not in the vfx/game space.

But yeah, often it's like 'cmon guys, pick up the pace abit'.
I wonder now that AD is subs based, if that will have any baring at all.

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 8:16 PM Greg Punchatz  wrote:

> "We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development
> pace has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates and
> some nice stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still
> pending."
>
> This has been our observation as well... some basic things like
> the scheduling part of a production management software has been left to
> die. It seems that they have slowed WAY down since the acquisition.
> So disappointed, I pushed for shotgun in our company, now I am looking for
> other solutions while Shotgun tries to get there shit together.
>
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Mirko Jankovic]

and looking at current tempo of actually making maya worth human
interaction it could be usefull in how many decades?
it wont even reach intuitive level of Softimage in years

On Thu, Apr 21, 2016 at 2:51 PM, Srecko Micic 
wrote:

> So at the end AD just wanted devs and working business?
>
> --
> *Micic Srecko*
> ---
> *Mail:* srecko.mi...@gmail.com
> *Skype*: srecko.micic
> ---
>
> On Apr 21 2016, at 2:39 pm, Luc-Eric Rousseau 
> wrote:
>
>> Oh my god, parents again?  Patents are worth nothing if you are not in
>> the
>> business of licensing patents, which Autodesk isn't in.  Where these
>> millions dollar
>> patents exactly, and how is that worth 35 miliions?  Hiring dozens of
>> people in one
>> shot plus a working business is worth millions, not some useless region
>> dumb ass
>> patent they never used.   Softimage`s I.P. was worth exactly zero.
>>
>> On 21 April 2016 at 01:30, Guy Rabiller  wrote:
>>
>>
>> All until Autodesk came.
>>
>> Here is what happened in 2008:
>>
>> http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112=12030177=14271589
>>
>> Then when Ronald Beirouti left (who created ICE), it was definitely the
>> end of ICE (and Softimage).
>> (https://groups.google.com/d/msg/xsi_list/ElbS6ZbjKEk/vMyh8CGhCpQJ)
>>
>> Peoples still think Autodesk acquired Softimage from Avid for XSI or for
>> the developers team. It was all for the patents. The rest is "accessory".
>>
>> How many patents Solid Angle had ?
>>
>>
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>



-- 
Mirko Jankovic
*http://www.cgfolio.com/mirko-jankovic
*

Need to find freelancers fast?
www.cgfolio.com

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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Angus Davidson]

No they never cared about the business long term

From: Srecko Micic [mailto:srecko.mi...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, 21 April 2016 2:51 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Cc: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

So at the end AD just wanted devs and working business?

--
Micic Srecko
---
Mail: srecko.mi...@gmail.com<mailto:srecko.mi...@gmail.com>
Skype: srecko.micic
---


On Apr 21 2016, at 2:39 pm, Luc-Eric Rousseau 
<luceri...@gmail.com<mailto:luceri...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Oh my god, parents again?  Patents are worth nothing if you are not in the
business of licensing patents, which Autodesk isn't in.  Where these millions 
dollar
patents exactly, and how is that worth 35 miliions?  Hiring dozens of people in 
one
shot plus a working business is worth millions, not some useless region dumb ass
patent they never used.   Softimage`s I.P. was worth exactly zero.

On 21 April 2016 at 01:30, Guy Rabiller 
<guy.rabil...@radfac.com<mailto:guy.rabil...@radfac.com>> wrote:

All until Autodesk came.

Here is what happened in 2008:
http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112=12030177=14271589

Then when Ronald Beirouti left (who created ICE), it was definitely the end of 
ICE (and Softimage).
(https://groups.google.com/d/msg/xsi_list/ElbS6ZbjKEk/vMyh8CGhCpQJ)

Peoples still think Autodesk acquired Softimage from Avid for XSI or for the 
developers team. It was all for the patents. The rest is "accessory".

How many patents Solid Angle had ?



This communication is 
intended for the addressee only. It is confidential. If you have received this 
communication in error, please notify us immediately and destroy the original 
message. You may not copy or disseminate this communication without the 
permission of the University. Only authorised signatories are competent to 
enter into agreements on behalf of the University and recipients are thus 
advised that the content of this message may not be legally binding on the 
University and may contain the personal views and opinions of the author, which 
are not necessarily the views and opinions of The University of the 
Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. All agreements between the University and 
outsiders are subject to South African Law unless the University agrees in 
writing to the contrary. 


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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Srecko Micic]

So at the end AD just wanted devs and working business?

  

\--  

**Micic Srecko**  
\---  
**Mail:** [srecko.mi...@gmail.com](mailto:srecko.mi...@gmail.com)  
**Skype**: srecko.micic  
\---

  

On Apr 21 2016, at 2:39 pm, Luc-Eric Rousseau luceri...@gmail.com
wrote:  

> Oh my god, parents again?  Patents are worth nothing if you are not in the

>

> business of licensing patents, which Autodesk isn't in.  Where these
millions dollar

>

> patents exactly, and how is that worth 35 miliions?  Hiring dozens of people
in one

>

> shot plus a working business is worth millions, not some useless region dumb
ass

>

> patent they never used.   Softimage`s I.P. was worth exactly zero.

>

>  

>

> On 21 April 2016 at 01:30, Guy Rabiller
[guy.rabil...@radfac.com](mailto:guy.rabil...@radfac.com) wrote:  

>

>>  
All until Autodesk came.  
  
Here is what happened in 2008:  
[http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112id=12030177l
inkID=14271589](http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112=120
30177=14271589)  
  
Then when Ronald Beirouti left (who created ICE), it was definitely the end of
ICE (and Softimage).  
()  
  
Peoples still think Autodesk acquired Softimage from Avid for XSI or for the
developers team. It was all for the patents. The rest is "accessory".  
  
How many patents Solid Angle had ?  

--
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Angus Davidson]

Wasn’t patents the excuse AD used to not sell it / Open source it ?

Softimage was bought and kept around until it could be killed because it wanted 
what was inside the devs heads.

Think of it this way. Think of how much better Maya has become since Soft was 
EOL’ed. Yes there are still underlying issues but it doesn’t totally suck the 
big one out the box  anymore.



From: Luc-Eric Rousseau [mailto:luceri...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, 21 April 2016 2:39 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

Oh my god, parents again?  Patents are worth nothing if you are not in the
business of licensing patents, which Autodesk isn't in.  Where these millions 
dollar
patents exactly, and how is that worth 35 miliions?  Hiring dozens of people in 
one
shot plus a working business is worth millions, not some useless region dumb ass
patent they never used.   Softimage`s I.P. was worth exactly zero.

On 21 April 2016 at 01:30, Guy Rabiller 
<guy.rabil...@radfac.com<mailto:guy.rabil...@radfac.com>> wrote:

All until Autodesk came.

Here is what happened in 2008:
http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112=12030177=14271589

Then when Ronald Beirouti left (who created ICE), it was definitely the end of 
ICE (and Softimage).
(https://groups.google.com/d/msg/xsi_list/ElbS6ZbjKEk/vMyh8CGhCpQJ)

Peoples still think Autodesk acquired Softimage from Avid for XSI or for the 
developers team. It was all for the patents. The rest is "accessory".

How many patents Solid Angle had ?

 

This communication is 
intended for the addressee only. It is confidential. If you have received this 
communication in error, please notify us immediately and destroy the original 
message. You may not copy or disseminate this communication without the 
permission of the University. Only authorised signatories are competent to 
enter into agreements on behalf of the University and recipients are thus 
advised that the content of this message may not be legally binding on the 
University and may contain the personal views and opinions of the author, which 
are not necessarily the views and opinions of The University of the 
Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. All agreements between the University and 
outsiders are subject to South African Law unless the University agrees in 
writing to the contrary. 

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Luc-Eric Rousseau]

Oh my god, parents again?  Patents are worth nothing if you are not in the
business of licensing patents, which Autodesk isn't in.  Where these
millions dollar
patents exactly, and how is that worth 35 miliions?  Hiring dozens of
people in one
shot plus a working business is worth millions, not some useless region
dumb ass
patent they never used.   Softimage`s I.P. was worth exactly zero.

On 21 April 2016 at 01:30, Guy Rabiller  wrote:

>
> All until Autodesk came.
>
> Here is what happened in 2008:
>
> http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112=12030177=14271589
>
> Then when Ronald Beirouti left (who created ICE), it was definitely the
> end of ICE (and Softimage).
> (https://groups.google.com/d/msg/xsi_list/ElbS6ZbjKEk/vMyh8CGhCpQJ)
>
> Peoples still think Autodesk acquired Softimage from Avid for XSI or for
> the developers team. It was all for the patents. The rest is "accessory".
>
> How many patents Solid Angle had ?
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Matt Lind]

Don't put words in my mouth, Jason.

I never said XSI was on death row, I said it was viable with a small 
cushion, but long term it's fate was already determined from the miscues 
which occurred during the Sumatra release, and further exacerbated from 
later misreads and missteps in the market such as raising prices when 
everybody was dropping prices.

As for your assessment, your analysis is flawed.

I don’t' know where you got the XSIBase numbers considering the site has 
been offline for years.  In any event, I don't consider those numbers very 
valid, but for the sake of argument I'll go with it.

According to your numbers, 2007 was the peak with 275 jobs available.  It 
was followed in 2008 with a ~40% drop to 168 jobs - the biggest 
year-over-year change in the entire data set.  You point out ICE was 
released in 2008, which is true, but that didn't happen until August at 
Siggraph.  You pointed out Autodesk bought Softimage in 2008, which is also 
true, but that wasn't announced until October.  So, by your assessment, 40% 
of the annual jobs were lost in the months October, November, and December 
of 2008 because people dropped usage of Softimage overnight upon the 
announcement of the acquisition?  I don't buy that - here's why:

Let's assume 2008 was on the same pace as 2007 even though the trend in 
prior years was ascending.  With simple arithmetic 275 / 12 = 22.91 --> ~23 
jobs per month available.  3 x 23 = 69 jobs lost during last 3 months of 
2008.  275 - 69 = 206 jobs for 2008 if Autodesk were the driving factor for 
the reduction.  OK, but that still leaves 38 jobs unaccounted for (206 - 168 
= 38).

So what happened to cause the numbers to drop significantly in 2008? 
Hmmmlet me think...Oh, that's right, XSI v6.0 was released on the last 
day in 2006 (call it 2007) - the biggest lemon and disaster in XSI's 
history.  Granted, cause of the problem was a screw-up at Avid HQ 
erroneously divulging a release when one wasn't planned forcing the team to 
put humpty dumpty together again in an insanely short time, but the damage 
was done.  It required several service packs on short order to bail all the 
water out, and for many customers, like my company, we literally could not 
function on XSI 6.x with all it's bugs and corruptions, and the service 
packs often made things worse.  Our production almost shut down because of 
it.  We didn't get any relief until XSI 7.5 was released 18 months later in 
March 2008.  I think that's a better cause/effect explanation for the drop 
in jobs -  customers were turned off by the instability and irresponsibility 
of a company claiming to be a market leader making such a release.  Autodesk 
and co. added their 2 cents later and certainly didn't help matters, but 
they weren't the driving force.  If it weren't for ICE, Softimage would've 
been dead a lot sooner.


Matt




Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2016 21:01:30 -0400
From: Jason S <jasonsta...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com


On 04/20/16 7:27, Matt Lind wrote:
> The couple of versions of extra dev was just the benefit of having the 
> larger
> staff for a short period of time.
>
> You can look at Softimage's market share any way you like, but it all 
> comes
> back to they dropped the ball with 'Sumatra'.

So it was already on death row?

Soft may not have had the largest userbase, but despite it's previous 
growing pains, it was not only doing just fine, (because it was pretty good) 
it was climbing up t'il 2007-08 regardless of how avid was doing  ... All 
until ICE came.

2003  90
2004  145

2005 160

2006  198
  2007 275


2008  168  <--  ICE
  2009  119
2010  109
2011  62
  2012   26

I-I-I-C-C-C-E!

(wait. what came practically at the same time as ICE?)

Today it's less of everything that's awkward about both Maya and 3ds, (now 
with passes? Match transforms? UV Unwrap tools?)
and it seems that it's to an extent because of the missing third,  but I 
wouldn't say that it exactly makes-up for it, and would qualify it as 
largely still missing for what it had going for it most.

But whatever now. 

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[David Saber]

Thanks for these numbers they represents what I felt in the industry 
around me as for XSI's popularity.
What year was foundation out? 2006? I think it propelled XSI's adoption, 
despite what some people say. The company I was working in at the time, 
switched from Max to XSI, partly thanks to Foundation. There were 50 Max 
seats, all changed to Softimage Essential, Advanced, and a lot of 
Foundations. And XSI gained ground thanks to that.
*This *is what happens when a company is independent and is fighting for 
its survival. It can't happen in a big administration such as Autodesk, 
so I.M.O. all Autodesk acquisitions are bad news.

David

On 2016-04-21 03:01, Jason S wrote:


** The 2003-2012 list was XSIBase job post count.



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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Tenshi .]

ty is even if they had
> done it right, the product had limited life.
>
> Shotgun is a different beast entirely.  that acquisition is post Marc Petit
> and therefore really shouldn't be compared to Softimage, Mudbox, or other
> earlier acquisitions in terms of management of the product.  Marc Stevens is
> running that sector now, and from a distant vantage point where I sit, it
> appears things are going to be run in similar manner to when he was GM at
> Softimage/Avid.  Lots of independent projects with each targeting specific
> needs in the industry.  The pros are building relationships with customers,
> ability to cut a product cleanly from the nest if it doesn't work out, and
> products having the autonomy they need to be competitive in their respective
> markets.  The cons are costs of buying products and lack of interoperability
> between them in seamless fashion, as well as the duplication of staff
> performing similar functions at the different companies.  Reduction of staff
> and merging operations is only one recession away - it's like a pendulum.
>
> That said, I think Solid Angle will likely be run autonomously like
> Softimage|CAT or Face Robot.  Products which hit specific needs and don't
> necessarily fold into the larger company portfolio seamlessly.
>
> Matt
>
>
>
> Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2016 11:04:44 +0200
> From: Olivier Jeannel <facialdel...@gmail.com> <facialdel...@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
> To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
>
> Well, if you remember it was the same profile for Ice.
> They had that supa-crew of ice developpers that gave us 2 or 3 generations
> of true big ice improvements (crowd, ice modeling, Build array from set,
> etc..)
> Then there was that moment when they fired a big part of the crew, saying
> that "everything will be the same", "you don't have to worry" shit, and
> then turned off the light 2 years later.
>
> But that's just me beeing negative...
>
> On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 10:49 AM, Graham Bell <bell...@gmail.com> 
> <bell...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development
> pace has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates
> and
> some nice stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still
> pending.
>
> >From a brand view AD might keep SA/Arnold separate in the same way Shotgun
> is, but behind the scenes it might be different.
>
> Personally, I'm surprised it took them this long to get it announced. ;-)
>
> On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:15 PM Jason S <jasonsta...@gmail.com> 
> <jasonsta...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Indeed shotgun is one (of quite few out of -many-) packages that wasn't
> seriously compromised post acquisition, which is probably why shotgun is
> pasted all over Arnold press release, and I too wouldnt be surprised if
> it
> was one of those few, yet many would argue that shotgun barely
> (significantly) changed since it was purchased, and moslty relies on the
> fact that it's quite complete as it is (perhaps not unlike SI).
>
> But there remains a good chance (if not a probability) that efforts on
> Arnold would be mostly be around what the parent company is after, or
> what
> the buzzword of the day may be at a given time, in this case "cloud", and
> for the rest to be slowly moved to the back simply by not touching it,
> and
> thus becoming like the next MentalRay.
>
> In either case it could then be considered as "just" another casualty.
>
>
> On 04/18/16 18:55, Steven Caron wrote:
>
> I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their
> decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional
> but
> if you reduce it to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to
> admit but it is a fact that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so
> of course you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.
>
> Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This
> case is different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they
> have at most two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different
> softwares, it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the
> Softimage purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example
> of
> AD staying out of way and more value being brought to the product
> (additional access to RV). These are reasons why I think this case is
> going
> to be different.
>
> I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for
> certain.
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W <a

Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Guy Rabiller]

if it doesn't work out, and
products having the autonomy they need to be competitive in their respective
markets.  The cons are costs of buying products and lack of interoperability
between them in seamless fashion, as well as the duplication of staff
performing similar functions at the different companies.  Reduction of staff
and merging operations is only one recession away - it's like a pendulum.

That said, I think Solid Angle will likely be run autonomously like
Softimage|CAT or Face Robot.  Products which hit specific needs and don't
necessarily fold into the larger company portfolio seamlessly.

Matt



Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2016 11:04:44 +0200
From: Olivier Jeannel<facialdel...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
To:"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com"

Well, if you remember it was the same profile for Ice.
They had that supa-crew of ice developpers that gave us 2 or 3 generations
of true big ice improvements (crowd, ice modeling, Build array from set,
etc..)
Then there was that moment when they fired a big part of the crew, saying
that "everything will be the same", "you don't have to worry" shit, and
then turned off the light 2 years later.

But that's just me beeing negative...

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 10:49 AM, Graham Bell<bell...@gmail.com>  wrote:


We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development
pace has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates
and
some nice stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still
pending.

>From a brand view AD might keep SA/Arnold separate in the same way Shotgun
is, but behind the scenes it might be different.

Personally, I'm surprised it took them this long to get it announced. ;-)

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:15 PM Jason S<jasonsta...@gmail.com>  wrote:


Indeed shotgun is one (of quite few out of -many-) packages that wasn't
seriously compromised post acquisition, which is probably why shotgun is
pasted all over Arnold press release, and I too wouldnt be surprised if
it
was one of those few, yet many would argue that shotgun barely
(significantly) changed since it was purchased, and moslty relies on the
fact that it's quite complete as it is (perhaps not unlike SI).

But there remains a good chance (if not a probability) that efforts on
Arnold would be mostly be around what the parent company is after, or
what
the buzzword of the day may be at a given time, in this case "cloud", and
for the rest to be slowly moved to the back simply by not touching it,
and
thus becoming like the next MentalRay.

In either case it could then be considered as "just" another casualty.


On 04/18/16 18:55, Steven Caron wrote:

I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their
decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional
but
if you reduce it to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to
admit but it is a fact that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so
of course you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.

Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This
case is different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they
have at most two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different
softwares, it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the
Softimage purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example
of
AD staying out of way and more value being brought to the product
(additional access to RV). These are reasons why I think this case is
going
to be different.

I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for
certain.

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W<artur.w...@gmail.com>  wrote:


Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
Why should this case be any different?

I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
development of Arnold.

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Jason S]

ing specific 
needs in the industry.  The pros are building relationships with customers, 
ability to cut a product cleanly from the nest if it doesn't work out, and 
products having the autonomy they need to be competitive in their respective 
markets.  The cons are costs of buying products and lack of interoperability 
between them in seamless fashion, as well as the duplication of staff 
performing similar functions at the different companies.  Reduction of staff 
and merging operations is only one recession away - it's like a pendulum.

That said, I think Solid Angle will likely be run autonomously like 
Softimage|CAT or Face Robot.  Products which hit specific needs and don't 
necessarily fold into the larger company portfolio seamlessly.

Matt



Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2016 11:04:44 +0200
From: Olivier Jeannel <facialdel...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com"

Well, if you remember it was the same profile for Ice.
They had that supa-crew of ice developpers that gave us 2 or 3 generations
of true big ice improvements (crowd, ice modeling, Build array from set,
etc..)
Then there was that moment when they fired a big part of the crew, saying
that "everything will be the same", "you don't have to worry" shit, and
then turned off the light 2 years later.

But that's just me beeing negative...

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 10:49 AM, Graham Bell <bell...@gmail.com> wrote:



  We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development
pace has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates 
and
some nice stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still
pending.

>From a brand view AD might keep SA/Arnold separate in the same way Shotgun
is, but behind the scenes it might be different.

Personally, I'm surprised it took them this long to get it announced. ;-)

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:15 PM Jason S <jasonsta...@gmail.com> wrote:


  

Indeed shotgun is one (of quite few out of -many-) packages that wasn't
seriously compromised post acquisition, which is probably why shotgun is
pasted all over Arnold press release, and I too wouldnt be surprised if 
it
was one of those few, yet many would argue that shotgun barely
(significantly) changed since it was purchased, and moslty relies on the
fact that it's quite complete as it is (perhaps not unlike SI).

But there remains a good chance (if not a probability) that efforts on
Arnold would be mostly be around what the parent company is after, or 
what
the buzzword of the day may be at a given time, in this case "cloud", and
for the rest to be slowly moved to the back simply by not touching it, 
and
thus becoming like the next MentalRay.

In either case it could then be considered as "just" another casualty.


On 04/18/16 18:55, Steven Caron wrote:

I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their
decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional 
but
if you reduce it to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to
admit but it is a fact that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so
of course you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.

Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This
case is different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they
have at most two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different
softwares, it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the
Softimage purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example 
of
AD staying out of way and more value being brought to the product
(additional access to RV). These are reasons why I think this case is 
going
to be different.

I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for
certain.

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W <artur.w...@gmail.com> wrote:



  Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
Why should this case be any different?

I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
development of Arnold. 


  

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Jason S]

ons are costs of buying products and lack of interoperability 
between them in seamless fashion, as well as the duplication of staff 
performing similar functions at the different companies.  Reduction of staff 
and merging operations is only one recession away - it's like a pendulum.

That said, I think Solid Angle will likely be run autonomously like 
Softimage|CAT or Face Robot.  Products which hit specific needs and don't 
necessarily fold into the larger company portfolio seamlessly.

Matt



Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2016 11:04:44 +0200
From: Olivier Jeannel <facialdel...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com"

Well, if you remember it was the same profile for Ice.
They had that supa-crew of ice developpers that gave us 2 or 3 generations
of true big ice improvements (crowd, ice modeling, Build array from set,
etc..)
Then there was that moment when they fired a big part of the crew, saying
that "everything will be the same", "you don't have to worry" shit, and
then turned off the light 2 years later.

But that's just me beeing negative...

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 10:49 AM, Graham Bell <bell...@gmail.com> wrote:


  
We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development
pace has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates 
and
some nice stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still
pending.

>From a brand view AD might keep SA/Arnold separate in the same way Shotgun
is, but behind the scenes it might be different.

Personally, I'm surprised it took them this long to get it announced. ;-)

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:15 PM Jason S <jasonsta...@gmail.com> wrote:



  

Indeed shotgun is one (of quite few out of -many-) packages that wasn't
seriously compromised post acquisition, which is probably why shotgun is
pasted all over Arnold press release, and I too wouldnt be surprised if 
it
was one of those few, yet many would argue that shotgun barely
(significantly) changed since it was purchased, and moslty relies on the
fact that it's quite complete as it is (perhaps not unlike SI).

But there remains a good chance (if not a probability) that efforts on
Arnold would be mostly be around what the parent company is after, or 
what
the buzzword of the day may be at a given time, in this case "cloud", and
for the rest to be slowly moved to the back simply by not touching it, 
and
thus becoming like the next MentalRay.

In either case it could then be considered as "just" another casualty.


On 04/18/16 18:55, Steven Caron wrote:

I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their
decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional 
but
if you reduce it to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to
admit but it is a fact that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so
of course you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.

Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This
case is different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they
have at most two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different
softwares, it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the
Softimage purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example 
of
AD staying out of way and more value being brought to the product
(additional access to RV). These are reasons why I think this case is 
going
to be different.

I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for
certain.

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W <artur.w...@gmail.com> wrote:


  
Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
Why should this case be any different?

I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
development of Arnold. 

  

  
  
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Greg Punchatz]

"We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development
pace has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates and
some nice stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still
pending."

This has been our observation as well... some basic things like
the scheduling part of a production management software has been left to
die. It seems that they have slowed WAY down since the acquisition.
So disappointed, I pushed for shotgun in our company, now I am looking for
other solutions while Shotgun tries to get there shit together.

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 3:49 AM, Graham Bell  wrote:

> We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development
> pace has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates and
> some nice stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still
> pending.
>
> From a brand view AD might keep SA/Arnold separate in the same way Shotgun
> is, but behind the scenes it might be different.
>
> Personally, I'm surprised it took them this long to get it announced. ;-)
>
> On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:15 PM Jason S  wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Indeed shotgun is one (of quite few out of -many-) packages that wasn't
>> seriously compromised post acquisition, which is probably why shotgun is
>> pasted all over Arnold press release, and I too wouldnt be surprised if it
>> was one of those few, yet many would argue that shotgun barely
>> (significantly) changed since it was purchased, and moslty relies on the
>> fact that it's quite complete as it is (perhaps not unlike SI).
>>
>> But there remains a good chance (if not a probability) that efforts on
>> Arnold would be mostly be around what the parent company is after, or what
>> the buzzword of the day may be at a given time, in this case "cloud", and
>> for the rest to be slowly moved to the back simply by not touching it, and
>> thus becoming like the next MentalRay.
>>
>> In either case it could then be considered as "just" another casualty.
>>
>>
>> On 04/18/16 18:55, Steven Caron wrote:
>>
>> I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their
>> decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional but
>> if you reduce it to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to
>> admit but it is a fact that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so
>> of course you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.
>>
>> Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This
>> case is different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they
>> have at most two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different
>> softwares, it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the
>> Softimage purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example of
>> AD staying out of way and more value being brought to the product
>> (additional access to RV). These are reasons why I think this case is going
>> to be different.
>>
>> I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for
>> certain.
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W  wrote:
>>
>>> Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
>>> Why should this case be any different?
>>>
>>> I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
>>> development of Arnold.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Softimage Mailing List.
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>> "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>>
>>
>> --
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>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
>
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Grahame Fuller]

Welcome back, Stephen.

gray

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Blair
Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2016 10:07 AM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle



On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 7:46 AM, Rob Wuijster 
<r...@casema.nl<mailto:r...@casema.nl>> wrote:

Yes, I can imagine Stephen was jumping with joy to be part of the AD family 
again... ;-)

Getting laid off by Autodesk was the best thing that ever happened to me ;)
Because I couldn't have planned a better career move.

I can't deny I had a sinking feeling when I first heard the news, but this 
acquisition has been nothing like the the last one.
So, I'm good, and I get to keep on doing my thing with Arnold and the rest of 
the Solid Angle gang.


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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Perry Harovas]

Same here.

Glad you were part of the acquisition.
You help has always been invaluable and incredibly appreciated.

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 10:12 AM, Angus Davidson 
wrote:

> Good to hear ;) Hope it continues to be awesome
>
>
> On 20 Apr 2016, at 4:07 PM, Stephen Blair  wrote:
>
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 7:46 AM, Rob Wuijster  wrote:
>
>> Yes, I can imagine Stephen was jumping with joy to be part of the AD
>> family again... ;-)
>>
>
> Getting laid off by Autodesk was the best thing that ever happened to me ;)
> Because I couldn't have planned a better career move.
>
> I can't deny I had a sinking feeling when I first heard the news, but this
> acquisition has been nothing like the the last one.
> So, I'm good, and I get to keep on doing my thing with Arnold and the rest
> of the Solid Angle gang.
>
>
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> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
>
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Perry Harovas
Animation and Visual Effects

http://www.TheAfterImage.com 

-26 Years Experience
-Member of the Visual Effects Society (VES)
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Angus Davidson]

Good to hear ;) Hope it continues to be awesome


On 20 Apr 2016, at 4:07 PM, Stephen Blair 
> wrote:



On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 7:46 AM, Rob Wuijster 
> wrote:

Yes, I can imagine Stephen was jumping with joy to be part of the AD family 
again... ;-)

Getting laid off by Autodesk was the best thing that ever happened to me ;)
Because I couldn't have planned a better career move.

I can't deny I had a sinking feeling when I first heard the news, but this 
acquisition has been nothing like the the last one.
So, I'm good, and I get to keep on doing my thing with Arnold and the rest of 
the Solid Angle gang.


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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Stephen Blair]

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 7:46 AM, Rob Wuijster  wrote:

> Yes, I can imagine Stephen was jumping with joy to be part of the AD
> family again... ;-)
>

Getting laid off by Autodesk was the best thing that ever happened to me ;)
Because I couldn't have planned a better career move.

I can't deny I had a sinking feeling when I first heard the news, but this
acquisition has been nothing like the the last one.
So, I'm good, and I get to keep on doing my thing with Arnold and the rest
of the Solid Angle gang.
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Rob Wuijster]

Yes, I can imagine Stephen was jumping with joy to be part of the AD 
family again... ;-)



Rob
\/-\/\/

On 20-4-2016 12:40, Srecko Micic wrote:

Interesting thing is that Stephen Blair is again at AD :D

--
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---
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*Skype*: srecko.micic
---

On Apr 20 2016, at 10:50 am, Graham Bell  wrote:

We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the
development pace has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There
has been updates and some nice stuff, but at the same time larger
chunks that seem to be still pending.

From a brand view AD might keep SA/Arnold separate in the same way
Shotgun is, but behind the scenes it might be different.

Personally, I'm surprised it took them this long to get it
announced. ;-)

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:15 PM Jason S > wrote:



Indeed shotgun is one (of quite few out of -many-) packages
that wasn't seriously compromised post acquisition, which is
probably why shotgun is pasted all over Arnold press release,
and I too wouldnt be surprised if it was one of those few, yet
many would argue that shotgun barely (significantly) changed
since it was purchased, and moslty relies on the fact that
it's quite complete as it is (perhaps not unlike SI).

But there remains a good chance (if not a probability) that
efforts on Arnold would be mostly be around what the parent
company is after, or what the buzzword of the day may be at a
given time, in this case "cloud", and for the rest to be
slowly moved to the back simply by not touching it, and thus
becoming like the next MentalRay.

In either case it could then be considered as "just" another
casualty.


On 04/18/16 18:55, Steven Caron wrote:

I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply.
Their decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because
we are emotional but if you reduce it to numbers, it made
sense. It is a truth I don't like to admit but it is a fact
that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so of course
you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.

Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing
lists... This case is different because they don't have 3
competing renderers now, they have at most two (ART in Max).
Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different softwares, it
wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the
Softimage purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is
an example of AD staying out of way and more value being
brought to the product (additional access to RV). These are
reasons why I think this case is going to be different.

I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will
see for certain.

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W
> wrote:

Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange
to us.
Why should this case be any different?

I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant
progress and development of Arnold.




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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Matt Lind]

Just speculation on my part, but I think the hiring of the Singapore team 
was made after the decision to send Softimage into maintenance mode.  The 
Montreal and Singapore teams co-existed as a means to get the Singapore team 
up to speed with the nuances of the application as Softimage was built with 
a lot of legacy and technology which wasn't terribly common anymore.  The 
couple of versions of extra dev was just the benefit of having the larger 
staff for a short period of time.

You can look at Softimage's market share any way you like, but it all comes 
back to they dropped the ball with 'Sumatra'.  While there were many valiant 
attempts to get back in the game, once studios backed Maya with a two year 
head start, it was really difficult to get any penetration as pipelines and 
working relationships with outsourcing had already been firmly established. 
Typically companies on the block spend a lot of money to promote themselves 
very actively to be attractive to a buyer.  Development of ICE and all the 
hype with it was largely a necessity and, quite frankly, a last ditch effort 
to get back into the game as they were otherwise on a slow ride into the 
sunset.  ICE helped change that for a while, until Autodesk bought them.

Softimage under Autodesk was, if you read the acquisition press release 
between the lines, to obtain the Softimage developers, not to obtain the 
product.  Marc Petit was the former head of R+D at Softimage for project 
Sumatra, so there was some old connections there to make it happen, and 
Softimage stayed an active product as long as he was head of Autodesk Media 
and Entertainment, but when he stepped down a few years ago, new management 
came in and that's when the decision to terminate Softimage got traction. 
So here we are.

Softimage had enough market share to remain viable, but not a whole lot of 
cushion above that.  When I used to run Mantom in the early 2000's, my phone 
used to ring quite regularly for training requests and momentum was 
building.  But after XSI v3.0 was shipped and the decision to raise it's 
price tag with it while Maya dropped their prices to halfliterally 
overnight my phone stopped ringing.  Regardless of what sales numbers 
employees would cite, the truth is finding work using Softimage was on a 
long slow decline for a very long time.  I saw it first in the educational 
channel as my part time gigs would slowly dry up from declining enrollment, 
followed by declining opportunities for freelance work.  Some would argue 
Autodesk killed Softimage with mis-handling of marketing.  While it's true 
they did a poor job with the resources they had, reality is even if they had 
done it right, the product had limited life.

Shotgun is a different beast entirely.  that acquisition is post Marc Petit 
and therefore really shouldn't be compared to Softimage, Mudbox, or other 
earlier acquisitions in terms of management of the product.  Marc Stevens is 
running that sector now, and from a distant vantage point where I sit, it 
appears things are going to be run in similar manner to when he was GM at 
Softimage/Avid.  Lots of independent projects with each targeting specific 
needs in the industry.  The pros are building relationships with customers, 
ability to cut a product cleanly from the nest if it doesn't work out, and 
products having the autonomy they need to be competitive in their respective 
markets.  The cons are costs of buying products and lack of interoperability 
between them in seamless fashion, as well as the duplication of staff 
performing similar functions at the different companies.  Reduction of staff 
and merging operations is only one recession away - it's like a pendulum.

That said, I think Solid Angle will likely be run autonomously like 
Softimage|CAT or Face Robot.  Products which hit specific needs and don't 
necessarily fold into the larger company portfolio seamlessly.

Matt



Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2016 11:04:44 +0200
From: Olivier Jeannel <facialdel...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com"

Well, if you remember it was the same profile for Ice.
They had that supa-crew of ice developpers that gave us 2 or 3 generations
of true big ice improvements (crowd, ice modeling, Build array from set,
etc..)
Then there was that moment when they fired a big part of the crew, saying
that "everything will be the same", "you don't have to worry" shit, and
then turned off the light 2 years later.

But that's just me beeing negative...

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 10:49 AM, Graham Bell <bell...@gmail.com> wrote:

> We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development
> pace has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates 
> and
> some nice stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still
> pending.
>
> From a brand view AD might keep SA/Arnold separate in the sam

Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Ed Schiffer]

>
> Interesting thing is that Stephen Blair is again at AD :D
>
> --
> *Micic Srecko*
>

ow my, I wonder how he feels.
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Srecko Micic]

Interesting thing is that Stephen Blair is again at AD :D  
  
\--  

**Micic Srecko**  
\---  
**Mail:** [srecko.mi...@gmail.com](mailto:srecko.mi...@gmail.com)  
**Skype**: srecko.micic  
\---

  

On Apr 20 2016, at 10:50 am, Graham Bell bell...@gmail.com wrote:  

> We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development pace
has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates and some
nice stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still pending.

>

>  

>

> From a brand view AD might keep SA/Arnold separate in the same way Shotgun
is, but behind the scenes it might be different.

>

>  

>

> Personally, I'm surprised it took them this long to get it announced. ;-)  
  

>

> On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:15 PM Jason S
[jasonsta...@gmail.com](mailto:jasonsta...@gmail.com) wrote:  

>

>>  
  

>>

>> Indeed shotgun is one (of quite few out of -many-) packages that wasn't
seriously compromised post acquisition, which is probably why shotgun is
pasted all over Arnold press release, and I too wouldnt be surprised if it was
one of those few, yet many would argue that shotgun barely (significantly)
changed since it was purchased, and moslty relies on the fact that it's quite
complete as it is (perhaps not unlike SI).  
  
But there remains a good chance (if not a probability) that efforts on Arnold
would be mostly be around what the parent company is after, or what the
buzzword of the day may be at a given time, in this case "cloud", and for the
rest to be slowly moved to the back simply by not touching it, and thus
becoming like the next MentalRay.  
  
In either case it could then be considered as "just" another casualty.  
  
  

>>

>> On 04/18/16 18:55, Steven Caron wrote:  

>>

>>> I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their
decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional but if
you reduce it to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to admit
but it is a fact that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so of course
you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.

>>>

>>>  

>>>

>>> Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This
case is different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they have
at most two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different softwares,
it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the Softimage purchase
and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example of AD staying out of way
and more value being brought to the product (additional access to RV). These
are reasons why I think this case is going to be different.

>>>

>>>  

>>>

>>> I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for
certain.

>>>

>>>  

>>>

>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W
[artur.w...@gmail.com](mailto:artur.w...@gmail.com) wrote:  

>>>

 Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.



 Why should this case be any different?



  



 I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
development of Arnold.



  



  

>>>

>>>  
  

>>>  
>>>  
>>> --

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>>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to [softimage-
requ...@listproc.autodesk.com](mailto:softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com)
with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.

>>

>>  

>>

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Stefan Kubicek]

Correction: ADSK bought softimage for $35 million.


On Wed, 20 Apr 2016 10:36:18 +0200, Tom Kleinenberg   
wrote:


That drop in market share was largely down to AD's inability to market  
it.


That was my perception as well, though I'd make that unwillingness,  
rather than inability.
Phasing out Softimage however was not so much a long term financial  
decision (they know they need to innovate to stay in business, and  
>innovation always needs investments now to make revenue later), I  
suspect it was more a question of survival for those who made the Maya  
deal. >Soft cost the $60 million to buy from Avid, if I remember  
correctly, Maya  cost them $185 millions! Writing 185 off is a lot even  
by Autodesk >standards. That would not have sat well with the board and  
investors, resulting in some heads on the chopping block. So in order to  
make it look >like a good decision to spend that much money on Maya,  
they had to go keep going with it, even if it meant weakening the whole  
ME section of >their business in the long run (which it still does). It  
seems that throwing good money after bad money is acceptable for them as  
long as long as >nobody notices it.

---
Stefan Kubicek
---
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Alfred Feierfeilstraße 3
A-2380 Perchtoldsdorf bei Wien
Phone: +43/699/12614231
www.keyvis.at ste...@keyvis.at
-- This email and its attachments are --
--confidential and for the recipient only--




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---
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---
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Stefan Kubicek]

On Wed, 20 Apr 2016 10:36:18 +0200, Tom Kleinenberg   
wrote:


That drop in market share was largely down to AD's inability to market  
it.


That was my perception as well, though I'd make that unwillingness, rather  
than inability.
Phasing out Softimage however was not so much a long term financial  
decision (they know they need to innovate to stay in business, and  
innovation always needs investments now to make revenue later), I suspect  
it was more a question of survival for those who made the Maya deal. Soft  
cost the $60 million to buy from Avid, if I remember correctly, Maya  cost  
them $185 millions! Writing 185 off is a lot even by Autodesk standards.  
That would not have sat well with the board and investors, resulting in  
some heads on the chopping block. So in order to make it look like a good  
decision to spend that much money on Maya, they had to go keep going with  
it, even if it meant weakening the whole ME section of their business in  
the long run (which it still does). It seems that throwing good money  
after bad money is acceptable for them as long as long as nobody notices  
it.


---
Stefan Kubicek
---
keyvis digital imagery
Alfred Feierfeilstraße 3
A-2380 Perchtoldsdorf bei Wien
Phone: +43/699/12614231
www.keyvis.at ste...@keyvis.at
-- This email and its attachments are --
--confidential and for the recipient only
Softimage Mailing List.
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Olivier Jeannel]

Well, if you remember it was the same profile for Ice.
They had that supa-crew of ice developpers that gave us 2 or 3 generations
of true big ice improvements (crowd, ice modeling, Build array from set,
etc..)
Then there was that moment when they fired a big part of the crew, saying
that "everything will be the same", "you don't have to worry" shit, and
then turned off the light 2 years later.

But that's just me beeing negative...

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 10:49 AM, Graham Bell  wrote:

> We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development
> pace has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates and
> some nice stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still
> pending.
>
> From a brand view AD might keep SA/Arnold separate in the same way Shotgun
> is, but behind the scenes it might be different.
>
> Personally, I'm surprised it took them this long to get it announced. ;-)
>
> On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:15 PM Jason S  wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Indeed shotgun is one (of quite few out of -many-) packages that wasn't
>> seriously compromised post acquisition, which is probably why shotgun is
>> pasted all over Arnold press release, and I too wouldnt be surprised if it
>> was one of those few, yet many would argue that shotgun barely
>> (significantly) changed since it was purchased, and moslty relies on the
>> fact that it's quite complete as it is (perhaps not unlike SI).
>>
>> But there remains a good chance (if not a probability) that efforts on
>> Arnold would be mostly be around what the parent company is after, or what
>> the buzzword of the day may be at a given time, in this case "cloud", and
>> for the rest to be slowly moved to the back simply by not touching it, and
>> thus becoming like the next MentalRay.
>>
>> In either case it could then be considered as "just" another casualty.
>>
>>
>> On 04/18/16 18:55, Steven Caron wrote:
>>
>> I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their
>> decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional but
>> if you reduce it to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to
>> admit but it is a fact that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so
>> of course you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.
>>
>> Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This
>> case is different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they
>> have at most two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different
>> softwares, it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the
>> Softimage purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example of
>> AD staying out of way and more value being brought to the product
>> (additional access to RV). These are reasons why I think this case is going
>> to be different.
>>
>> I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for
>> certain.
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W  wrote:
>>
>>> Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
>>> Why should this case be any different?
>>>
>>> I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
>>> development of Arnold.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Softimage Mailing List.
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>> "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Softimage Mailing List.
>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
>
> --
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Angus Davidson]

I was hoping shotgun would have been may available to EDU Institutions post 
acquisition , but sadly that wasn’t the case. I am more hopeful about Arnold.



From: Graham Bell [mailto:bell...@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, 20 April 2016 10:49 AM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development pace has 
appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates and some nice 
stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still pending.

From a brand view AD might keep SA/Arnold separate in the same way Shotgun is, 
but behind the scenes it might be different.

Personally, I'm surprised it took them this long to get it announced. ;-)
On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:15 PM Jason S 
<jasonsta...@gmail.com<mailto:jasonsta...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Indeed shotgun is one (of quite few out of -many-) packages that wasn't 
seriously compromised post acquisition, which is probably why shotgun is pasted 
all over Arnold press release, and I too wouldnt be surprised if it was one of 
those few, yet many would argue that shotgun barely (significantly) changed 
since it was purchased, and moslty relies on the fact that it's quite complete 
as it is (perhaps not unlike SI).

But there remains a good chance (if not a probability) that efforts on Arnold 
would be mostly be around what the parent company is after, or what the 
buzzword of the day may be at a given time, in this case "cloud", and for the 
rest to be slowly moved to the back simply by not touching it, and thus 
becoming like the next MentalRay.

In either case it could then be considered as "just" another casualty.

On 04/18/16 18:55, Steven Caron wrote:
I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their decision axe 
Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional but if you reduce it 
to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to admit but it is a fact 
that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so of course you axe Softimage 
and consolidate the dev teams.

Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This case is 
different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they have at most 
two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different softwares, it 
wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the Softimage purchase and 
axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example of AD staying out of way and 
more value being brought to the product (additional access to RV). These are 
reasons why I think this case is going to be different.

I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for certain.

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W 
<artur.w...@gmail.com<mailto:artur.w...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
Why should this case be any different?

I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and 
development of Arnold.




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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Graham Bell]

We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development pace
has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates and some
nice stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still
pending.

>From a brand view AD might keep SA/Arnold separate in the same way Shotgun
is, but behind the scenes it might be different.

Personally, I'm surprised it took them this long to get it announced. ;-)

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:15 PM Jason S  wrote:

>
>
> Indeed shotgun is one (of quite few out of -many-) packages that wasn't
> seriously compromised post acquisition, which is probably why shotgun is
> pasted all over Arnold press release, and I too wouldnt be surprised if it
> was one of those few, yet many would argue that shotgun barely
> (significantly) changed since it was purchased, and moslty relies on the
> fact that it's quite complete as it is (perhaps not unlike SI).
>
> But there remains a good chance (if not a probability) that efforts on
> Arnold would be mostly be around what the parent company is after, or what
> the buzzword of the day may be at a given time, in this case "cloud", and
> for the rest to be slowly moved to the back simply by not touching it, and
> thus becoming like the next MentalRay.
>
> In either case it could then be considered as "just" another casualty.
>
>
> On 04/18/16 18:55, Steven Caron wrote:
>
> I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their
> decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional but
> if you reduce it to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to
> admit but it is a fact that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so
> of course you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.
>
> Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This
> case is different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they
> have at most two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different
> softwares, it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the
> Softimage purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example of
> AD staying out of way and more value being brought to the product
> (additional access to RV). These are reasons why I think this case is going
> to be different.
>
> I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for
> certain.
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W  wrote:
>
>> Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
>> Why should this case be any different?
>>
>> I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
>> development of Arnold.
>>
>>
>>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Tom Kleinenberg]

That drop in market share was largely down to AD's inability to market it.
They seemed to be positioning it as an "Almost Houdini but not quite"
because it had ICE. They couldn't sell it as an animation package, as that
would canibalize Maya market share, an asset creation package as that would
canibalize Max's market share, or an all in one as that would eat both.

Arnold doesn't have that problem. Potentially, in 5-10 years, Beast is at a
point where Autodesk is pitching it as a viable rendering alternative
(CryEngine and Unreal seem to be going down that path). But who can predict
what happens when. I'd really like Arnold bundled with Maya in 2017.

The feeling I get is that Solid Angle has always preferred dealing with a
smaller number of studios - they had a working renderer long before it was
on general sale. As they now have released it to everybody I'm sure they're
flooded with 'idiot problems'. Maybe this will free them from tech support
and allow faster development times. Who knows? The future is bright... and
full of bounce light.

On 20 April 2016 at 07:32, Stefan Kubicek  wrote:

> From what I remember, XSI never had a higher market share then 10-11%,
> with Max having 45%+ and Maya 30%+ at that point in time (before acquired
> by AD$K). Not sure how the percentages are these days, I reckon XSI to be
> down at 1% or less, along the lines of Lightwave maybe.
>
>
>
>
>
> yeah, before AD purchased Softimage, SI users out numbered Maya and Max,
> but after their purchase, SI users become so few that they are forced to
> abandon it.
>
> On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 5:18 PM, Perry Harovas 
> wrote:
>
>> Steven Caron m wrote:
>>
>> "I am not trying to convince anyone to 'trust' Autodesk to do what is
>> right for you, I was just trying to convince people of the possibility that
>> Autodesk's best interest (in regard to the future of Arnold) is actually to
>> play nicely with others."
>>
>> I totally agree with this. Really.
>>
>> Unfortunately (and not maniacally) Autodesk has in its best interest to
>> give Maya the best version of Arnold first. It's sort of like saving the
>> best slice of pizza for your girlfriend. It works better for her, and
>> therefore makes you happy as well. It isn't to do anything to hurt others
>> interested in the pizza, it's just that you care more about what your
>> girlfriend thinks and therefore it is in your own interests to take care of
>> her first.
>>
>> Am I seriously comparing Autodesk's interest in Arnold to pizza? Not
>> really , but I am trying to simplify the relationship down to wants/needs
>> and point out it is only natural to want to take care of your own. Nothing
>> evil about it. Then you add money and business to the mix and it still
>> isn't evil, but it does become harder to resist for some corporate types.
>>
>> You can't blame them, you can only make decisions you feel comfortable
>> with.
>>
>> For me, Arnold is a truly great product, and if it ever ships with Maya,
>> it might make my time spent using Maya better than it currently is. But
>> it's definitely ruins my desire to seek it out from now on in C4D or
>> Houdini. That is really a personal decision, because I don't like buying
>> into large corporations that I don't have a baseline trust for. With Arnold
>> now being owned by a corporation I don't really trust anymore, I feel like
>> the best decision for ME is to seek out other smaller independent renderers
>> like Octane or Vray.
>>
>> In the end, oddly, picking a renderer can be a really personal choice
>> (once your basic production needs are met of course). This is not the case
>> in midrange studios and larger ones because the decision of which renderer
>> to use is riding on a lot more than "feelings", of course.
>>
>> But will it play a role in freelancer decisions?
>> It already has for me, and time will tell if that is the case for others.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> > On Apr 19, 2016, at 3:54 PM, Steven Caron  wrote:
>> >
>> > I am not trying to convince anyone to 'trust' Autodesk to do what is
>> right for you, I was just trying to convince people of the possibility that
>> Autodesk's best interest (in regard to the future of Arnold) is actually to
>> play nicely with others.
>>
>> --
>> Softimage Mailing List.
>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>>
>
>
>
>
> --
> ---
> Stefan Kubicek
> ---
> keyvis digital imagery
> Alfred Feierfeilstraße 3
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> Phone: +43/699/12614231
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Jim Yeh]

yeah, before AD purchased Softimage, SI users out numbered Maya and Max,
but after their purchase, SI users become so few that they are forced to
abandon it.

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 5:18 PM, Perry Harovas 
wrote:

> Steven Caron m wrote:
>
> "I am not trying to convince anyone to 'trust' Autodesk to do what is
> right for you, I was just trying to convince people of the possibility that
> Autodesk's best interest (in regard to the future of Arnold) is actually to
> play nicely with others."
>
> I totally agree with this. Really.
>
> Unfortunately (and not maniacally) Autodesk has in its best interest to
> give Maya the best version of Arnold first. It's sort of like saving the
> best slice of pizza for your girlfriend. It works better for her, and
> therefore makes you happy as well. It isn't to do anything to hurt others
> interested in the pizza, it's just that you care more about what your
> girlfriend thinks and therefore it is in your own interests to take care of
> her first.
>
> Am I seriously comparing Autodesk's interest in Arnold to pizza? Not
> really , but I am trying to simplify the relationship down to wants/needs
> and point out it is only natural to want to take care of your own. Nothing
> evil about it. Then you add money and business to the mix and it still
> isn't evil, but it does become harder to resist for some corporate types.
>
> You can't blame them, you can only make decisions you feel comfortable
> with.
>
> For me, Arnold is a truly great product, and if it ever ships with Maya,
> it might make my time spent using Maya better than it currently is. But
> it's definitely ruins my desire to seek it out from now on in C4D or
> Houdini. That is really a personal decision, because I don't like buying
> into large corporations that I don't have a baseline trust for. With Arnold
> now being owned by a corporation I don't really trust anymore, I feel like
> the best decision for ME is to seek out other smaller independent renderers
> like Octane or Vray.
>
> In the end, oddly, picking a renderer can be a really personal choice
> (once your basic production needs are met of course). This is not the case
> in midrange studios and larger ones because the decision of which renderer
> to use is riding on a lot more than "feelings", of course.
>
> But will it play a role in freelancer decisions?
> It already has for me, and time will tell if that is the case for others.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Apr 19, 2016, at 3:54 PM, Steven Caron  wrote:
> >
> > I am not trying to convince anyone to 'trust' Autodesk to do what is
> right for you, I was just trying to convince people of the possibility that
> Autodesk's best interest (in regard to the future of Arnold) is actually to
> play nicely with others.
>
> --
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> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Perry Harovas]

Steven Caron m wrote:

"I am not trying to convince anyone to 'trust' Autodesk to do what is right for 
you, I was just trying to convince people of the possibility that Autodesk's 
best interest (in regard to the future of Arnold) is actually to play nicely 
with others."

I totally agree with this. Really. 

Unfortunately (and not maniacally) Autodesk has in its best interest to give 
Maya the best version of Arnold first. It's sort of like saving the best slice 
of pizza for your girlfriend. It works better for her, and therefore makes you 
happy as well. It isn't to do anything to hurt others interested in the pizza, 
it's just that you care more about what your girlfriend thinks and therefore it 
is in your own interests to take care of her first. 

Am I seriously comparing Autodesk's interest in Arnold to pizza? Not really , 
but I am trying to simplify the relationship down to wants/needs and point out 
it is only natural to want to take care of your own. Nothing evil about it. 
Then you add money and business to the mix and it still isn't evil, but it does 
become harder to resist for some corporate types. 

You can't blame them, you can only make decisions you feel comfortable with. 

For me, Arnold is a truly great product, and if it ever ships with Maya, it 
might make my time spent using Maya better than it currently is. But it's 
definitely ruins my desire to seek it out from now on in C4D or Houdini. That 
is really a personal decision, because I don't like buying into large 
corporations that I don't have a baseline trust for. With Arnold now being 
owned by a corporation I don't really trust anymore, I feel like the best 
decision for ME is to seek out other smaller independent renderers like Octane 
or Vray. 

In the end, oddly, picking a renderer can be a really personal choice (once 
your basic production needs are met of course). This is not the case in 
midrange studios and larger ones because the decision of which renderer to use 
is riding on a lot more than "feelings", of course. 

But will it play a role in freelancer decisions?
It already has for me, and time will tell if that is the case for others. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 19, 2016, at 3:54 PM, Steven Caron  wrote:
> 
> I am not trying to convince anyone to 'trust' Autodesk to do what is right 
> for you, I was just trying to convince people of the possibility that 
> Autodesk's best interest (in regard to the future of Arnold) is actually to 
> play nicely with others.

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Jason S]

  
  

  

  

  On 04/18/16 18:55,
  Steven Caron wrote:
  Their decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us
  because we are emotional but if you reduce it to
  numbers, it made sense.
  

  

(right...)


  

  It is a truth I
  don't like to admit but it is a fact that Maya and Max
  user numbers are just higher, 
  so of course you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev
  teams. 

  

Of course!

  Soft userbase wasn't humongous (entirely relatively speaking
  which is I think is my point) 
  in it's rather niche segment perhaps like Houdini proportions
  relative to Maya, or even Maya is relative to 3DS. 
  
  But you can't purge something like Houdini (or Softimage) from
  existance, on the premise that it's market was smaller, and
  not leave a huuge gaping hole, in what a main package (in it's
  niche segment) may have provided in terms of advantages, which
  despite "softimagization" of other products including tweak
  tools, shader trees, ... to this day remains not just  a bit
  unique in it's main qualities. (not just concerning ICE)
  
  

  

  Others have touched on it,
  here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This case
  is different because they don't have 3 competing
  renderers now, they have at most two (ART in Max).
  Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different
  softwares, it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way
  Arnold is. Since the Softimage purchase and axing,
  AD has bought Shotgun. 
  
  This is an example of AD staying out of way and
  more value being brought to the product
  (additional access to RV). These are reasons why I
  think this case is going to be different.
  
  
  

  
  
  I am cautiously optimistic
  though, in 2 years or so we will see for certain.

  

  
  

Indeed shotgun is one (of quite few out of -many-) packages that
wasn't seriously compromised post acquisition, which is probably
why shotgun is pasted all over Arnold press release, and I too
wouldnt be surprised if it was one of those few, yet many would
argue that shotgun barely (significantly) changed since it was
purchased, and moslty relies on the fact that it's quite
complete as it is (perhaps not unlike SI). 

But there remains a good chance (if not a probability) that
efforts on Arnold would be mostly be around what the parent
company is after, or what the buzzword of the day may be at a
given time, in this case "cloud", and for the rest to be slowly
moved to the back simply by not touching it, and thus becoming
like the next MentalRay.

In either case it could then be considered as "just" another
casualty.


  
  On 04/18/16 18:55, Steven Caron wrote:


  I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in
my reply. Their decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us
because we are emotional but if you reduce it to numbers, it
made sense. It is a truth I don't like to admit but it is a fact
that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so of course you
axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.


Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing
  lists... This case is different because they don't have 3
  competing renderers now, they have at most two (ART in Max).
  Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different softwares, it wasn't
  'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the Softimage
  purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example
  of AD staying out of way and more value being brought to the
  product (additional access to RV). These are reasons why I
  think this case is going to be different.


I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will
  see for certain.

  
On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM,
  Artur W 
  wrote:
  

Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Steven Caron]

It certainly could happen. Again, I am cautiously optimistic that it won't.
You can choose not to be so optimistic and stop using Arnold ASAP, so no
decision Autodesk makes in the future will impact you.

But just so it is clear... I was addressing the idea that Autodesk's first
order of business would be to some how damage Arnold for C4D or Houdini
users. Then doing so force them to switch to Maya or Max?

I am not trying to convince anyone to 'trust' Autodesk to do what is right
for you, I was just trying to convince people of the possibility that
Autodesk's best interest (in regard to the future of Arnold) is actually to
play nicely with others.

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 12:30 PM, Phil Harbath 
wrote:

> I am definitely not sure what their motivation was but instead of
> investing in it they gave up on it.
>
>
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Phil Harbath]

I am definitely not sure what their motivation was but instead of investing in 
it they gave up on it.

-Original Message-
From: "Steven Caron" <car...@gmail.com>
Sent: ‎4/‎19/‎2016 3:21 PM
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

Not sure I follow... AD bought Mudbox to lure Softimage users over to Maya
or Max?

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 12:12 PM, Phil Harbath <phil.harb...@jamination.com>
wrote:

> Well, they kind of did that with mudbox,  sure you could use it with any
> program, however they made it more convenient with max and Maya.
> --
> From: Steven Caron <car...@gmail.com>
> Sent: ‎4/‎19/‎2016 3:07 PM
> To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
>
> I see what you are pointing out but again this is apples and oranges and
> that quote misses context :)
>
> Softimage != Arnold, full animation package with an API vs a rendering
> engine that IS an API... In Softimage's case AD is/was trying to convince
> us to switch to a competing product, in this case they are trying to sell a
> C4D user Maya through restricting their access to a rendering engine?
>
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Steven Caron]

Not sure I follow... AD bought Mudbox to lure Softimage users over to Maya
or Max?

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 12:12 PM, Phil Harbath <phil.harb...@jamination.com>
wrote:

> Well, they kind of did that with mudbox,  sure you could use it with any
> program, however they made it more convenient with max and Maya.
> --
> From: Steven Caron <car...@gmail.com>
> Sent: ‎4/‎19/‎2016 3:07 PM
> To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
>
> I see what you are pointing out but again this is apples and oranges and
> that quote misses context :)
>
> Softimage != Arnold, full animation package with an API vs a rendering
> engine that IS an API... In Softimage's case AD is/was trying to convince
> us to switch to a competing product, in this case they are trying to sell a
> C4D user Maya through restricting their access to a rendering engine?
>
>
>
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Scott Lange]

Oops…lol

 

--

“If we reduce AD's behaviors to 'corporate greed' like this forum tends to do, 
then alienating thousands of users is illogical.”

 

Didn’t they do that already? ;)

This is the Softimage list, isn’t it?

 


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  with "unsubscribe" in the 
subject, and reply to confirm.

 

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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Phil Harbath]

Well, they kind of did that with mudbox,  sure you could use it with any 
program, however they made it more convenient with max and Maya.

-Original Message-
From: "Steven Caron" <car...@gmail.com>
Sent: ‎4/‎19/‎2016 3:07 PM
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

I see what you are pointing out but again this is apples and oranges and
that quote misses context :)

Softimage != Arnold, full animation package with an API vs a rendering
engine that IS an API... In Softimage's case AD is/was trying to convince
us to switch to a competing product, in this case they are trying to sell a
C4D user Maya through restricting their access to a rendering engine?

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 5:50 PM, Ed Harriss <ed.harr...@sas.com> wrote:

> “If we reduce AD's behaviors to 'corporate greed' like this forum tends to
> do, then alienating thousands of users is illogical.”
>
>
>
> Didn’t they do that already? ;)
>
> This is the Softimage list, isn’t it?
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Steven Caron]

I see what you are pointing out but again this is apples and oranges and
that quote misses context :)

Softimage != Arnold, full animation package with an API vs a rendering
engine that IS an API... In Softimage's case AD is/was trying to convince
us to switch to a competing product, in this case they are trying to sell a
C4D user Maya through restricting their access to a rendering engine?

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 5:50 PM, Ed Harriss  wrote:

> “If we reduce AD's behaviors to 'corporate greed' like this forum tends to
> do, then alienating thousands of users is illogical.”
>
>
>
> Didn’t they do that already? ;)
>
> This is the Softimage list, isn’t it?
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Tony Bexley]

With Redshift, XSI is still alive and kickin' and will be for the next
couple years..

<3 Redshift

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 8:50 PM, Ed Harriss <ed.harr...@sas.com> wrote:

> “If we reduce AD's behaviors to 'corporate greed' like this forum tends to
> do, then alienating thousands of users is illogical.”
>
>
>
> Didn’t they do that already? ;)
>
> This is the Softimage list, isn’t it?
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Artur W
> *Sent:* Monday, April 18, 2016 3:30 PM
> *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> *Subject:* Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
>
>
>
> Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
>
> Why should this case be any different?
>
>
>
> I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
> development of Arnold.
>
>
>
> 2016-04-19 0:20 GMT+02:00 Steven Caron <car...@gmail.com>:
>
> Yes, some aren't excited about paying AD money but that is what I am
> saying... AD will need to keep these people happy or they will ditch
> Arnold. Breaking Arnold in C4D or Houdini is a lose lose scenario. They
> don't sell a Maya license and they don't sell an Arnold license. If we
> reduce AD's behaviors to 'corporate greed' like this forum tends to do,
> then alienating thousands of users is illogical.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:00 PM, Artur W <artur.w...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Yes, but as we know a lot of people pay them not very willingly. Matter of
> choice.
>
> So, conspiracy theory, all they need to do after they plant arnold within
> Maya and/or Max is to just mess SDK a bit. Not as if they haven't already
> on purpose or by accident.
>
> Vray suddenly having glitches and bugs, the promises of fixes prolong.
>
>
>
> Just imagining things, but who knows.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
>
>
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Ed Harriss]

“If we reduce AD's behaviors to 'corporate greed' like this forum tends to do, 
then alienating thousands of users is illogical.”

Didn’t they do that already? ;)
This is the Softimage list, isn’t it?


From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Artur W
Sent: Monday, April 18, 2016 3:30 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
Why should this case be any different?

I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and 
development of Arnold.

2016-04-19 0:20 GMT+02:00 Steven Caron 
<car...@gmail.com<mailto:car...@gmail.com>>:
Yes, some aren't excited about paying AD money but that is what I am saying... 
AD will need to keep these people happy or they will ditch Arnold. Breaking 
Arnold in C4D or Houdini is a lose lose scenario. They don't sell a Maya 
license and they don't sell an Arnold license. If we reduce AD's behaviors to 
'corporate greed' like this forum tends to do, then alienating thousands of 
users is illogical.

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:00 PM, Artur W 
<artur.w...@gmail.com<mailto:artur.w...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Yes, but as we know a lot of people pay them not very willingly. Matter of 
choice.
So, conspiracy theory, all they need to do after they plant arnold within Maya 
and/or Max is to just mess SDK a bit. Not as if they haven't already on purpose 
or by accident.
Vray suddenly having glitches and bugs, the promises of fixes prolong.

Just imagining things, but who knows.



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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Martin]

If Arnold is included with Maya, replacing MR, then great! That would be good 
news for people like me that don't render that often and when we do we have to 
use MR, and have to keep using and paying Maya's subscription for a very long 
time.

But Autodesk will probably sell it separated.

Martin
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Sebastien Sterling]

AD wants to get the equation as close as they can to people feeding them a
steady stream of income for minimal updates and maintenance. They are not
driven by any passion or creative fervour.

On 19 April 2016 at 00:55, Steven Caron  wrote:

> I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their
> decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional but
> if you reduce it to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to
> admit but it is a fact that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so
> of course you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.
>
> Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This
> case is different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they
> have at most two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different
> softwares, it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the
> Softimage purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example of
> AD staying out of way and more value being brought to the product
> (additional access to RV). These are reasons why I think this case is going
> to be different.
>
> I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for
> certain.
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W  wrote:
>
>> Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
>> Why should this case be any different?
>>
>> I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
>> development of Arnold.
>>
>>
>>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Steven Caron]

I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their decision
axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional but if you
reduce it to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to admit
but it is a fact that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so of
course you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.

Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This
case is different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they
have at most two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different
softwares, it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the
Softimage purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example of
AD staying out of way and more value being brought to the product
(additional access to RV). These are reasons why I think this case is going
to be different.

I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for certain.

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W  wrote:

> Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
> Why should this case be any different?
>
> I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
> development of Arnold.
>
>
>
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Angus Davidson]

Ugg sorry , best said way.

From: Angus Davidson [mailto:angus.david...@wits.ac.za]
Sent: Tuesday, 19 April 2016 2:52 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

Probably the said way of putting things into perspective. I am hopeful that 
this could be a win for EDU institutions and students whom may have previously 
not been able to go the Arnold route (We had to drop it after a year because of 
cutbacks , and it was painful to go back to mental ray at that stage)

Perry has also nailed it on the control issue. Have seen it happen many times 
before. Even someone with the best of intentions. Luckily for us we have 
switched to Octane and are very happy. If anything this might accelerate the 
switch to GPU renders like Octane and Redshift.



From: Perry Harovas [mailto:perryharo...@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, 19 April 2016 2:30 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

Marcos has a very level head on his shoulders.
He and his team have created stunningly simple and powerful software rendering
and done it in almost a ninja-like careful fashion.

I believe him when he says he feels it will be good for the company and users.

The one indisputable fact, though, is he now has no more real control.
He sold 100% of that control. He is now an employee in his own company.
History has shown that rarely works well. It isn't unique to Autodesk, and I am 
not
even talking about Softimage.

It is just, simply and starkly, business.

Only time will tell if this proves to be the right decision.

Everything we speculate is literally just that. Speculation.
Even what Marcos says from now on is just speculation.

Father time knows, but he only tells us one day at a time.
It will take years for him to tell his story.


On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 6:28 PM, Steven Caron 
<car...@gmail.com<mailto:car...@gmail.com>> wrote:
I am not excited on this acquisition either but it is easy to see that this 
isn't the same deal as the Softimage one. So don't confuse my statements for 
full support but rather a level headed look at what is really happening.

I don't see how having Arnold stop working in C4D and Houdini means those 
houses are forced to switch to AD products?

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:19 PM, Sven Constable 
<sixsi_l...@imagefront.de<mailto:sixsi_l...@imagefront.de>> wrote:
Well, a softimage costumer who didn't pay AD had to pay AD after the 
aquisition. Doesn’t stop them from killing it and they got basically ALL the 
former softimage costumers. Remember, not all C4D/Houdini companies are using 
arnold.  So AD could sell a few arnold lics to a maybe 50% of the C4D/Houdini 
houses or force ALL of them to switch to Max and Maya in the long run. 
Especially since max/maya are somehow comparable to C4D/H in the mind of AD.


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Perry Harovas
Animation and Visual Effects

http://www.TheAfterImage.com<http://www.theafterimage.com/>

-26 Years Experience
-Member of the Visual Effects Society (VES)
This communication is intended for the addressee only. It is confidential. If 
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University of the Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. All agreements between the 
University and outsiders are subject to South African Law unless the University 
agrees in writing to the contrary.




 

This communication is 
intended for the addressee only. It is confidential. If you have received this 
communication in error, please notify us immediately and destroy the original 
message. You may not copy or disseminate this communication without the 
permission of the University. Only authorised signatories are competent to 
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advised that the content of this message may not be legally binding on the 
University and may contain the personal views and opinions of the author, which 
are not necessarily the views and opinions of The University of the 
Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. All agreements between the University and 
outsiders are subject to South African Law unless the University agrees in 
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Angus Davidson]

Probably the said way of putting things into perspective. I am hopeful that 
this could be a win for EDU institutions and students whom may have previously 
not been able to go the Arnold route (We had to drop it after a year because of 
cutbacks , and it was painful to go back to mental ray at that stage)

Perry has also nailed it on the control issue. Have seen it happen many times 
before. Even someone with the best of intentions. Luckily for us we have 
switched to Octane and are very happy. If anything this might accelerate the 
switch to GPU renders like Octane and Redshift.



From: Perry Harovas [mailto:perryharo...@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, 19 April 2016 2:30 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

Marcos has a very level head on his shoulders.
He and his team have created stunningly simple and powerful software rendering
and done it in almost a ninja-like careful fashion.

I believe him when he says he feels it will be good for the company and users.

The one indisputable fact, though, is he now has no more real control.
He sold 100% of that control. He is now an employee in his own company.
History has shown that rarely works well. It isn't unique to Autodesk, and I am 
not
even talking about Softimage.

It is just, simply and starkly, business.

Only time will tell if this proves to be the right decision.

Everything we speculate is literally just that. Speculation.
Even what Marcos says from now on is just speculation.

Father time knows, but he only tells us one day at a time.
It will take years for him to tell his story.


On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 6:28 PM, Steven Caron 
<car...@gmail.com<mailto:car...@gmail.com>> wrote:
I am not excited on this acquisition either but it is easy to see that this 
isn't the same deal as the Softimage one. So don't confuse my statements for 
full support but rather a level headed look at what is really happening.

I don't see how having Arnold stop working in C4D and Houdini means those 
houses are forced to switch to AD products?

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:19 PM, Sven Constable 
<sixsi_l...@imagefront.de<mailto:sixsi_l...@imagefront.de>> wrote:
Well, a softimage costumer who didn't pay AD had to pay AD after the 
aquisition. Doesn’t stop them from killing it and they got basically ALL the 
former softimage costumers. Remember, not all C4D/Houdini companies are using 
arnold.  So AD could sell a few arnold lics to a maybe 50% of the C4D/Houdini 
houses or force ALL of them to switch to Max and Maya in the long run. 
Especially since max/maya are somehow comparable to C4D/H in the mind of AD.


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--




Perry Harovas
Animation and Visual Effects

http://www.TheAfterImage.com<http://www.theafterimage.com/>

-26 Years Experience
-Member of the Visual Effects Society (VES)

 

This communication is 
intended for the addressee only. It is confidential. If you have received this 
communication in error, please notify us immediately and destroy the original 
message. You may not copy or disseminate this communication without the 
permission of the University. Only authorised signatories are competent to 
enter into agreements on behalf of the University and recipients are thus 
advised that the content of this message may not be legally binding on the 
University and may contain the personal views and opinions of the author, which 
are not necessarily the views and opinions of The University of the 
Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. All agreements between the University and 
outsiders are subject to South African Law unless the University agrees in 
writing to the contrary. 

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Perry Harovas]

Marcos has a very level head on his shoulders.
He and his team have created stunningly simple and powerful software
rendering
and done it in almost a ninja-like careful fashion.

I believe him when he says he feels it will be good for the company and
users.

The one indisputable fact, though, is he now has no more real control.
He sold 100% of that control. He is now an employee in his own company.
History has shown that rarely works well. It isn't unique to Autodesk, and
I am not
even talking about Softimage.

It is just, simply and starkly, business.

Only time will tell if this proves to be the right decision.

Everything we speculate is literally just that. Speculation.
Even what Marcos says from now on is just speculation.

Father time knows, but he only tells us one day at a time.
It will take years for him to tell his story.


On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 6:28 PM, Steven Caron  wrote:

> I am not excited on this acquisition either but it is easy to see that
> this isn't the same deal as the Softimage one. So don't confuse my
> statements for full support but rather a level headed look at what is
> really happening.
>
> I don't see how having Arnold stop working in C4D and Houdini means those
> houses are forced to switch to AD products?
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:19 PM, Sven Constable 
> wrote:
>
>> Well, a softimage costumer who didn't pay AD had to pay AD after the
>> aquisition. Doesn’t stop them from killing it and they got basically ALL
>> the former softimage costumers. Remember, not all C4D/Houdini companies are
>> using arnold.  So AD could sell a few arnold lics to a maybe 50% of the
>> C4D/Houdini houses or force ALL of them to switch to Max and Maya in the
>> long run. Especially since max/maya are somehow comparable to C4D/H in the
>> mind of AD.
>>
>>
>>
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
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> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>



-- 





Perry Harovas
Animation and Visual Effects

http://www.TheAfterImage.com 

-26 Years Experience
-Member of the Visual Effects Society (VES)
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Mirko Jankovic]

"I don't see how having Arnold stop working in C4D and Houdini means those
houses are forced to switch to AD products?"

Softimage bneing EOL didn;t force peopl egoing other AD route as well..
agree they killed it for other reasons as well but still...

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 12:28 AM, Steven Caron  wrote:

> I am not excited on this acquisition either but it is easy to see that
> this isn't the same deal as the Softimage one. So don't confuse my
> statements for full support but rather a level headed look at what is
> really happening.
>
> I don't see how having Arnold stop working in C4D and Houdini means those
> houses are forced to switch to AD products?
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:19 PM, Sven Constable 
> wrote:
>
>> Well, a softimage costumer who didn't pay AD had to pay AD after the
>> aquisition. Doesn’t stop them from killing it and they got basically ALL
>> the former softimage costumers. Remember, not all C4D/Houdini companies are
>> using arnold.  So AD could sell a few arnold lics to a maybe 50% of the
>> C4D/Houdini houses or force ALL of them to switch to Max and Maya in the
>> long run. Especially since max/maya are somehow comparable to C4D/H in the
>> mind of AD.
>>
>>
>>
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-- 
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*

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Steven Caron]

I am not excited on this acquisition either but it is easy to see that this
isn't the same deal as the Softimage one. So don't confuse my statements
for full support but rather a level headed look at what is really happening.

I don't see how having Arnold stop working in C4D and Houdini means those
houses are forced to switch to AD products?

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:19 PM, Sven Constable 
wrote:

> Well, a softimage costumer who didn't pay AD had to pay AD after the
> aquisition. Doesn’t stop them from killing it and they got basically ALL
> the former softimage costumers. Remember, not all C4D/Houdini companies are
> using arnold.  So AD could sell a few arnold lics to a maybe 50% of the
> C4D/Houdini houses or force ALL of them to switch to Max and Maya in the
> long run. Especially since max/maya are somehow comparable to C4D/H in the
> mind of AD.
>
>
>
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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Sven Constable]

Well, a softimage costumer who didn't pay AD had to pay AD after the 
aquisition. Doesn’t stop them from killing it and they got basically ALL the 
former softimage costumers. Remember, not all C4D/Houdini companies are using 
arnold.  So AD could sell a few arnold lics to a maybe 50% of the C4D/Houdini 
houses or force ALL of them to switch to Max and Maya in the long run. 
Especially since max/maya are somehow comparable to C4D/H in the mind of AD.


sven

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Steven Caron
Sent: Monday, April 18, 2016 11:51 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

 

I doubt this, they want people paying them. A SolidAngle customer who didn't 
pay AD before (C4D or Houdini users) now has to pay AD!

 

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 2:44 PM, Jim Yeh <jimye...@gmail.com> wrote:

The first thing that AD will do is to make Arnold stop working with competing 
app...

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Frederic Servant]

Stay classy Olivier :)

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 9:21 AM, Olivier Jeannel 
wrote:

> As seen on FB
> Le 19 avr. 2016 02:06, "Sebastien Sterling" 
> a écrit :
>
>> AD wants to get the equation as close as they can to people feeding them
>> a steady stream of income for minimal updates and maintenance. They are not
>> driven by any passion or creative fervour.
>>
>> On 19 April 2016 at 00:55, Steven Caron  wrote:
>>
>>> I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their
>>> decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional but
>>> if you reduce it to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to
>>> admit but it is a fact that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so
>>> of course you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.
>>>
>>> Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This
>>> case is different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they
>>> have at most two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different
>>> softwares, it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the
>>> Softimage purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example of
>>> AD staying out of way and more value being brought to the product
>>> (additional access to RV). These are reasons why I think this case is going
>>> to be different.
>>>
>>> I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for
>>> certain.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W  wrote:
>>>
 Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
 Why should this case be any different?

 I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
 development of Arnold.



>>> --
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>>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
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>>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Olivier Jeannel]

As seen on FB
Le 19 avr. 2016 02:06, "Sebastien Sterling" 
a écrit :

> AD wants to get the equation as close as they can to people feeding them a
> steady stream of income for minimal updates and maintenance. They are not
> driven by any passion or creative fervour.
>
> On 19 April 2016 at 00:55, Steven Caron  wrote:
>
>> I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their
>> decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional but
>> if you reduce it to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to
>> admit but it is a fact that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so
>> of course you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.
>>
>> Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This
>> case is different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they
>> have at most two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different
>> softwares, it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the
>> Softimage purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example of
>> AD staying out of way and more value being brought to the product
>> (additional access to RV). These are reasons why I think this case is going
>> to be different.
>>
>> I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for
>> certain.
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W  wrote:
>>
>>> Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
>>> Why should this case be any different?
>>>
>>> I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
>>> development of Arnold.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> --
>> Softimage Mailing List.
>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>>
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Artur W]

Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
Why should this case be any different?

I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
development of Arnold.

2016-04-19 0:20 GMT+02:00 Steven Caron :

> Yes, some aren't excited about paying AD money but that is what I am
> saying... AD will need to keep these people happy or they will ditch
> Arnold. Breaking Arnold in C4D or Houdini is a lose lose scenario. They
> don't sell a Maya license and they don't sell an Arnold license. If we
> reduce AD's behaviors to 'corporate greed' like this forum tends to do,
> then alienating thousands of users is illogical.
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:00 PM, Artur W  wrote:
>
>> Yes, but as we know a lot of people pay them not very willingly. Matter
>> of choice.
>> So, conspiracy theory, all they need to do after they plant arnold within
>> Maya and/or Max is to just mess SDK a bit. Not as if they haven't already
>> on purpose or by accident.
>> Vray suddenly having glitches and bugs, the promises of fixes prolong.
>>
>> Just imagining things, but who knows.
>>
>>
>>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Steven Caron]

Yes, some aren't excited about paying AD money but that is what I am
saying... AD will need to keep these people happy or they will ditch
Arnold. Breaking Arnold in C4D or Houdini is a lose lose scenario. They
don't sell a Maya license and they don't sell an Arnold license. If we
reduce AD's behaviors to 'corporate greed' like this forum tends to do,
then alienating thousands of users is illogical.

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:00 PM, Artur W  wrote:

> Yes, but as we know a lot of people pay them not very willingly. Matter of
> choice.
> So, conspiracy theory, all they need to do after they plant arnold within
> Maya and/or Max is to just mess SDK a bit. Not as if they haven't already
> on purpose or by accident.
> Vray suddenly having glitches and bugs, the promises of fixes prolong.
>
> Just imagining things, but who knows.
>
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Artur W]

Yes, but as we know a lot of people pay them not very willingly. Matter of
choice.
So, conspiracy theory, all they need to do after they plant arnold within
Maya and/or Max is to just mess SDK a bit. Not as if they haven't already
on purpose or by accident.
Vray suddenly having glitches and bugs, the promises of fixes prolong.

Just imagining things, but who knows.

2016-04-18 23:51 GMT+02:00 Steven Caron :

> I doubt this, they want people paying them. A SolidAngle customer who
> didn't pay AD before (C4D or Houdini users) now has to pay AD!
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 2:44 PM, Jim Yeh  wrote:
>
>> The first thing that AD will do is to make Arnold stop working with
>> competing app...
>>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Steven Caron]

I doubt this, they want people paying them. A SolidAngle customer who
didn't pay AD before (C4D or Houdini users) now has to pay AD!

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 2:44 PM, Jim Yeh  wrote:

> The first thing that AD will do is to make Arnold stop working with
> competing app...
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Jim Yeh]

The first thing that AD will do is to make Arnold stop working with
competing app such as C4D, Houdini, or, most importantly (and maybe the
main reason they buy Arnold), NUKE, yeah, AD already killed Softimage so
they are not even going to mention it's name.  Then they will let the
development team go and let it die off, just like Softimage.  Yes, AD will
have lots of R time on Arnold, to study how to destroy another fine tool
just to show everyone how good they are at this.

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 9:02 AM, Jordi Bares  wrote:

> For once I am optimistic, AD has no product competing with Arnold, if
> anything Mental Ray will be left behind (as it should) and Arnold will
> reign as the 1st class product it is, nevertheless I will pay attention to
> AD next moves to see if they really intend to support all the other
> competitors now that they have a key product in their portfolio.
>
> My guess is that Marcos wouldn’t have sold it otherwise so this may be
> actually good news after all.
>
> If having more R time is the goal I think Marcos has done a great move
> and hopefully it will propel Arnold forward in big steps rather than
> finessing steps.
>
> I for once will sleep after an acquisition
> jb
>
>
> > On 18 Apr 2016, at 14:42, Morten Bartholdy  wrote:
> >
> > As if AD is known for keeping their promises...  :-/
> >
> > Morten
> >
> >
> >
> >> Den 18. april 2016 klokken 14:46 skrev Frederic Servant
> >> :
> >>
> >>
> >> Hi Arthur,
> >>
> >> Since I'm the developer of HtoA, that was my first question when we got
> >> briefed by Marc Stevens of Autodesk when we got disclosed, and his
> answer
> >> was a clear yes. They want more people to use Arnold, on any platform.
> >>
> >> Thus the development for the non-Autodesk products will continue as well
> >> (Houdini, C4D, Katana).
> >> --
> >> Fred
> >>
> >> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 1:36 PM, Artur W  wrote:
> >>
> >>> and what about HTOA?
> >>>
> >>> 2016-04-18 14:34 GMT+02:00 Artur W :
> >>>
>  SITOA is dead. Is that what it means?
> 
>  2016-04-18 14:32 GMT+02:00 Jordi Bares :
> 
> > It will be fine guys, Autodesk do not have any competing product so
> it
> > actually may be a good thing.
> >
> > jb
> >
> >
> > On 18 Apr 2016, at 13:27, Artur W  wrote:
> >
> > I don't believe it. NO. I refuse t believe this.
> >
> > 2016-04-18 14:26 GMT+02:00 Artur W :
> >
> >> FUCK YOU AUTODESK.
> >>
> >> 2016-04-18 14:18 GMT+02:00 Oliver Weingarten :
> >>
> >>> Hey there...some news..so it seems. Take a look
> >>>
> >>> "SAN FRANCISCO---Autodesk, Inc
> >>> <
> http://cts.businesswire.com/ct/CT?id=smartlink=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.autodesk.com=51321819=20160418005351=en-US=Autodesk%2C+Inc=1=9eb90e15e023b5c1020da047d81200d4
> >.
> >>> (NASDAQ:ADSK) has acquired Solid Angle, developer of Arnold, an
> >>> advanced,
> >>> ray-tracing image renderer for high-quality 3D animation and visual
> >>> effects
> >>> creation used in film, television and advertising worldwide.
> Acquisition
> >>> terms were not disclosed."
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> http://news.autodesk.com/press-release/autodesk-boosts-advanced-rendering-capabilities-through-acquisition-solid-angle
> >>>
> >>> Cheers,
> >>> oli
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Softimage Mailing List.
> >>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to
> softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> >>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> > --
> > Softimage Mailing List.
> > To unsubscribe, send a mail to
> softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> > with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Softimage Mailing List.
> > To unsubscribe, send a mail to
> softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> > with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> >
> 
> 
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Softimage Mailing List.
> >>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> >>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> >>>
> >> --
> >> Softimage Mailing List.
> >> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with
> >> "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> > --
> > Softimage Mailing List.
> > To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
>
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Jordi Bares]

For once I am optimistic, AD has no product competing with Arnold, if anything 
Mental Ray will be left behind (as it should) and Arnold will reign as the 1st 
class product it is, nevertheless I will pay attention to AD next moves to see 
if they really intend to support all the other competitors now that they have a 
key product in their portfolio.

My guess is that Marcos wouldn’t have sold it otherwise so this may be actually 
good news after all.

If having more R time is the goal I think Marcos has done a great move and 
hopefully it will propel Arnold forward in big steps rather than finessing 
steps.

I for once will sleep after an acquisition
jb


> On 18 Apr 2016, at 14:42, Morten Bartholdy  wrote:
> 
> As if AD is known for keeping their promises...  :-/
> 
> Morten
> 
> 
> 
>> Den 18. april 2016 klokken 14:46 skrev Frederic Servant
>> :
>> 
>> 
>> Hi Arthur,
>> 
>> Since I'm the developer of HtoA, that was my first question when we got
>> briefed by Marc Stevens of Autodesk when we got disclosed, and his answer
>> was a clear yes. They want more people to use Arnold, on any platform.
>> 
>> Thus the development for the non-Autodesk products will continue as well
>> (Houdini, C4D, Katana).
>> --
>> Fred
>> 
>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 1:36 PM, Artur W  wrote:
>> 
>>> and what about HTOA?
>>> 
>>> 2016-04-18 14:34 GMT+02:00 Artur W :
>>> 
 SITOA is dead. Is that what it means?
 
 2016-04-18 14:32 GMT+02:00 Jordi Bares :
 
> It will be fine guys, Autodesk do not have any competing product so it
> actually may be a good thing.
> 
> jb
> 
> 
> On 18 Apr 2016, at 13:27, Artur W  wrote:
> 
> I don't believe it. NO. I refuse t believe this.
> 
> 2016-04-18 14:26 GMT+02:00 Artur W :
> 
>> FUCK YOU AUTODESK.
>> 
>> 2016-04-18 14:18 GMT+02:00 Oliver Weingarten :
>> 
>>> Hey there...some news..so it seems. Take a look
>>> 
>>> "SAN FRANCISCO---Autodesk, Inc
>>> .
>>> (NASDAQ:ADSK) has acquired Solid Angle, developer of Arnold, an
>>> advanced,
>>> ray-tracing image renderer for high-quality 3D animation and visual
>>> effects
>>> creation used in film, television and advertising worldwide. Acquisition
>>> terms were not disclosed."
>>> 
>>> 
>>> http://news.autodesk.com/press-release/autodesk-boosts-advanced-rendering-capabilities-through-acquisition-solid-angle
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> oli
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Softimage Mailing List.
>>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
>>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>>> 
>> 
>> 
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> 
 
 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Softimage Mailing List.
>>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
>>> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>>> 
>> --
>> Softimage Mailing List.
>> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with
>> "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
> "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.


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RE: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Angus Davidson]

In the pdf they mention redshift and vray, Octane is still flying under the 
radar ;)


From: Stephen Davidson [mailto:magic...@bellsouth.net]
Sent: Monday, 18 April 2016 5:37 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

AD don't you DARE touch the amazing Redshift !
Adam, you should be ashamed of yourself for even mentioning it. ;)

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 8:43 AM Adam Seeley 
<adammsee...@gmail.com<mailto:adammsee...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Arnold today, Redshift tomorrow?



 

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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Stephen Davidson]

AD don't you DARE touch the amazing Redshift !
Adam, you should be ashamed of yourself for even mentioning it. ;)

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 8:43 AM Adam Seeley  wrote:

> Arnold today, Redshift tomorrow?
>
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Cristobal Infante]

Softimage was retired 2 years ago, and on that day Marcos Fajardo said it
would support Softimage for 1-2 years.

Anyone who can't see the end of Sitoa is still on denial..



On 18 April 2016 at 15:56, Olivier Jeannel <facialdel...@gmail.com> wrote:

> This is not a problem of "who" says "what" today in an article.
> The passion is gone, clearly. Sold.
> Too bad, and sad.
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 4:48 PM, Adam Seeley <adammsee...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Pack yer bags...
>>
>> "Our commitment
>> We are committed to expanding Arnold’s support for third party
>> applications such as Houdini, Katana and Cinema 4D. Autodesk will also
>> continue to support other renderers with products like 3ds Max and Maya."
>>
>> Obviously 3rd party Soft support will dwindle but I'm sure AD aren't too
>> fussed about giving it a helping nudge over the edge.
>>
>> Adam
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 18 April 2016 at 15:29, Eric Thivierge <ethivie...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Uh... the one in the first post of this thread?
>>>
>>> 
>>> Eric Thivierge
>>> http://www.ethivierge.com
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 10:14 AM, Ognjen Vukovic <ognj...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Eric i just saw that now.  Do you know which press release the article
>>>> was referring to, i would love to see that.
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 4:04 PM, Eric Thivierge <ethivie...@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> @Ognjen, have you even read the FXGuide article??
>>>>>
>>>>> 
>>>>> Eric Thivierge
>>>>> http://www.ethivierge.com
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 9:57 AM, Ognjen Vukovic <ognj...@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Is it safe to assume that there being no talk of Max getting arnold
>>>>>> that its next on the chopping board?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:52 PM, Nuno Conceicao <
>>>>>> nunoalexconcei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> SideFx is next, then WORLD DOMINATION!!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 2:15 PM, Javier Vega <
>>>>>>> javierelas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Resist, SideFX!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> *Javier Vega*
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> www.zao3d.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> móvil: *616 64 73 57*
>>>>>>>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>>>>>>>> (Barcelona)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 2016-04-18 15:10 GMT+02:00 Perry Harovas <perryharo...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I can't have any good feelings about this.
>>>>>>>>> That same horrible feeling in my gut that I had when Autodesk
>>>>>>>>> bought Softimage is back.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Remember what we are all told?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Trust your gut.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Apr 18, 2016, at 9:06 AM, Ed Schiffer <edschif...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> they'll surely continue Arnold, but not on the same pace I'd say.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> and probably end up StoA.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> what a horrible news.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 14:00, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>  I hope that will be something good this time, but I can't avoid
>>>>>>>>>> to feel an 

Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Olivier Jeannel]

This is not a problem of "who" says "what" today in an article.
The passion is gone, clearly. Sold.
Too bad, and sad.


On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 4:48 PM, Adam Seeley <adammsee...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Pack yer bags...
>
> "Our commitment
> We are committed to expanding Arnold’s support for third party
> applications such as Houdini, Katana and Cinema 4D. Autodesk will also
> continue to support other renderers with products like 3ds Max and Maya."
>
> Obviously 3rd party Soft support will dwindle but I'm sure AD aren't too
> fussed about giving it a helping nudge over the edge.
>
> Adam
>
>
>
>
> On 18 April 2016 at 15:29, Eric Thivierge <ethivie...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Uh... the one in the first post of this thread?
>>
>> 
>> Eric Thivierge
>> http://www.ethivierge.com
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 10:14 AM, Ognjen Vukovic <ognj...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Eric i just saw that now.  Do you know which press release the article
>>> was referring to, i would love to see that.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 4:04 PM, Eric Thivierge <ethivie...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> @Ognjen, have you even read the FXGuide article??
>>>>
>>>> 
>>>> Eric Thivierge
>>>> http://www.ethivierge.com
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 9:57 AM, Ognjen Vukovic <ognj...@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Is it safe to assume that there being no talk of Max getting arnold
>>>>> that its next on the chopping board?
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:52 PM, Nuno Conceicao <
>>>>> nunoalexconcei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> SideFx is next, then WORLD DOMINATION!!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 2:15 PM, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com
>>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Resist, SideFX!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Javier Vega*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> www.zao3d.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> móvil: *616 64 73 57*
>>>>>>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>>>>>>> (Barcelona)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2016-04-18 15:10 GMT+02:00 Perry Harovas <perryharo...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I can't have any good feelings about this.
>>>>>>>> That same horrible feeling in my gut that I had when Autodesk
>>>>>>>> bought Softimage is back.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Remember what we are all told?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Trust your gut.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Apr 18, 2016, at 9:06 AM, Ed Schiffer <edschif...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> they'll surely continue Arnold, but not on the same pace I'd say.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> and probably end up StoA.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> what a horrible news.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 14:00, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>  I hope that will be something good this time, but I can't avoid
>>>>>>>>> to feel an old feeling that I don't like, but we'll try to have hope.
>>>>>>>>> Autodesk will not try to kill Arnold.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> *Javier Vega*
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> www.zao3d.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> móvil: *616 64 73 57 <616%2064%2073%2057>*
>>>>>>>>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>>>>>>>>> (Barcelo

Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Adam Seeley]

Pack yer bags...

"Our commitment
We are committed to expanding Arnold’s support for third party applications
such as Houdini, Katana and Cinema 4D. Autodesk will also continue to
support other renderers with products like 3ds Max and Maya."

Obviously 3rd party Soft support will dwindle but I'm sure AD aren't too
fussed about giving it a helping nudge over the edge.

Adam




On 18 April 2016 at 15:29, Eric Thivierge <ethivie...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Uh... the one in the first post of this thread?
>
> 
> Eric Thivierge
> http://www.ethivierge.com
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 10:14 AM, Ognjen Vukovic <ognj...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Eric i just saw that now.  Do you know which press release the article
>> was referring to, i would love to see that.
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 4:04 PM, Eric Thivierge <ethivie...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> @Ognjen, have you even read the FXGuide article??
>>>
>>> 
>>> Eric Thivierge
>>> http://www.ethivierge.com
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 9:57 AM, Ognjen Vukovic <ognj...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Is it safe to assume that there being no talk of Max getting arnold
>>>> that its next on the chopping board?
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:52 PM, Nuno Conceicao <
>>>> nunoalexconcei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> SideFx is next, then WORLD DOMINATION!!
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 2:15 PM, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Resist, SideFX!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Javier Vega*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> www.zao3d.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> móvil: *616 64 73 57*
>>>>>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>>>>>> (Barcelona)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2016-04-18 15:10 GMT+02:00 Perry Harovas <perryharo...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I can't have any good feelings about this.
>>>>>>> That same horrible feeling in my gut that I had when Autodesk bought
>>>>>>> Softimage is back.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Remember what we are all told?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Trust your gut.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Apr 18, 2016, at 9:06 AM, Ed Schiffer <edschif...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> they'll surely continue Arnold, but not on the same pace I'd say.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> and probably end up StoA.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> what a horrible news.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 14:00, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  I hope that will be something good this time, but I can't avoid
>>>>>>>> to feel an old feeling that I don't like, but we'll try to have hope.
>>>>>>>> Autodesk will not try to kill Arnold.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> *Javier Vega*
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> www.zao3d.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> móvil: *616 64 73 57 <616%2064%2073%2057>*
>>>>>>>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>>>>>>>> (Barcelona)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 2016-04-18 14:58 GMT+02:00 Matt Morris <matt...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I can't see autodesk killing off arnold as they have no competing
>>>>>>>>> products. Maybe the push towards cloud rendering will put off some
>>>>>>>>> customers though.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 13:56, Leo Quensel <le...@gmx.de> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> God I am gla

Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Ognjen Vukovic]

The pdf does point towards a version for max, but the autodesk newsroom
article, states nothing about development of a max plug in, unless you see
something i dont.

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 4:29 PM, Eric Thivierge <ethivie...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Uh... the one in the first post of this thread?
>
> 
> Eric Thivierge
> http://www.ethivierge.com
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 10:14 AM, Ognjen Vukovic <ognj...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Eric i just saw that now.  Do you know which press release the article
>> was referring to, i would love to see that.
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 4:04 PM, Eric Thivierge <ethivie...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> @Ognjen, have you even read the FXGuide article??
>>>
>>> 
>>> Eric Thivierge
>>> http://www.ethivierge.com
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 9:57 AM, Ognjen Vukovic <ognj...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Is it safe to assume that there being no talk of Max getting arnold
>>>> that its next on the chopping board?
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:52 PM, Nuno Conceicao <
>>>> nunoalexconcei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> SideFx is next, then WORLD DOMINATION!!
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 2:15 PM, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Resist, SideFX!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Javier Vega*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> www.zao3d.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> móvil: *616 64 73 57*
>>>>>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>>>>>> (Barcelona)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2016-04-18 15:10 GMT+02:00 Perry Harovas <perryharo...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I can't have any good feelings about this.
>>>>>>> That same horrible feeling in my gut that I had when Autodesk bought
>>>>>>> Softimage is back.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Remember what we are all told?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Trust your gut.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Apr 18, 2016, at 9:06 AM, Ed Schiffer <edschif...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> they'll surely continue Arnold, but not on the same pace I'd say.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> and probably end up StoA.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> what a horrible news.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 14:00, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  I hope that will be something good this time, but I can't avoid
>>>>>>>> to feel an old feeling that I don't like, but we'll try to have hope.
>>>>>>>> Autodesk will not try to kill Arnold.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> *Javier Vega*
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> www.zao3d.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> móvil: *616 64 73 57 <616%2064%2073%2057>*
>>>>>>>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>>>>>>>> (Barcelona)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 2016-04-18 14:58 GMT+02:00 Matt Morris <matt...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I can't see autodesk killing off arnold as they have no competing
>>>>>>>>> products. Maybe the push towards cloud rendering will put off some
>>>>>>>>> customers though.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 13:56, Leo Quensel <le...@gmx.de> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> God I am glad I left this industry two years after Autodesk
>>>>>>>>>> acquired Softimage. They make everything worse and are now off to 
>>>>>>>>>> kill
>>>&

Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Eric Thivierge]

Uh... the one in the first post of this thread?


Eric Thivierge
http://www.ethivierge.com

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 10:14 AM, Ognjen Vukovic <ognj...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Eric i just saw that now.  Do you know which press release the article was
> referring to, i would love to see that.
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 4:04 PM, Eric Thivierge <ethivie...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> @Ognjen, have you even read the FXGuide article??
>>
>> 
>> Eric Thivierge
>> http://www.ethivierge.com
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 9:57 AM, Ognjen Vukovic <ognj...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Is it safe to assume that there being no talk of Max getting arnold that
>>> its next on the chopping board?
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:52 PM, Nuno Conceicao <
>>> nunoalexconcei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> SideFx is next, then WORLD DOMINATION!!
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 2:15 PM, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Resist, SideFX!
>>>>>
>>>>> *Javier Vega*
>>>>>
>>>>> www.zao3d.com
>>>>>
>>>>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>>>>
>>>>> móvil: *616 64 73 57*
>>>>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>>>>> (Barcelona)
>>>>>
>>>>> 2016-04-18 15:10 GMT+02:00 Perry Harovas <perryharo...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I can't have any good feelings about this.
>>>>>> That same horrible feeling in my gut that I had when Autodesk bought
>>>>>> Softimage is back.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Remember what we are all told?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Trust your gut.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Apr 18, 2016, at 9:06 AM, Ed Schiffer <edschif...@gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> they'll surely continue Arnold, but not on the same pace I'd say.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> and probably end up StoA.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> what a horrible news.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 14:00, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  I hope that will be something good this time, but I can't avoid to
>>>>>>> feel an old feeling that I don't like, but we'll try to have hope. 
>>>>>>> Autodesk
>>>>>>> will not try to kill Arnold.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Javier Vega*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> www.zao3d.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> móvil: *616 64 73 57 <616%2064%2073%2057>*
>>>>>>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>>>>>>> (Barcelona)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2016-04-18 14:58 GMT+02:00 Matt Morris <matt...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I can't see autodesk killing off arnold as they have no competing
>>>>>>>> products. Maybe the push towards cloud rendering will put off some
>>>>>>>> customers though.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 13:56, Leo Quensel <le...@gmx.de> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> God I am glad I left this industry two years after Autodesk
>>>>>>>>> acquired Softimage. They make everything worse and are now off to kill
>>>>>>>>> another product (and don't tell me that won't happen...).
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> *Gesendet:* Montag, 18. April 2016 um 14:51 Uhr
>>>>>>>>> *Von:* "Artur W" <artur.w...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> *An:* "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" <
>>>>>>>>> softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
>>>>>>>>> *Betreff:* Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
>>>>>>>>> Frederic, I am sure you mean well, but I actually try learning
>>>>&g

Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Luc-Eric Rousseau]

I think they meant the .pdf FAQ here
http://www.autodesk.com/solidangle

On 18 April 2016 at 10:14, Ognjen Vukovic  wrote:
> Eric i just saw that now.  Do you know which press release the article was
> referring to, i would love to see that.
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Softimage Mailing List.
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Srecko Micic]

LOL it took me 5 min to scroll down to read all reactions, but most of time I
see is FUCK, that says soemthing.

Oh well  I guess goodbye SitoA

  
\--  

**Micic Srecko**  
\---  
**Mail:** [srecko.mi...@gmail.com](mailto:srecko.mi...@gmail.com)  
**Skype**: srecko.micic  
\---

  

On Apr 18 2016, at 3:58 pm, Ognjen Vukovic ognj...@gmail.com wrote:  

> Is it safe to assume that there being no talk of Max getting arnold that its
next on the chopping board?

>

>  

>

> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:52 PM, Nuno Conceicao
[nunoalexconcei...@gmail.com](mailto:nunoalexconcei...@gmail.com)
wrote:  

>

>> SideFx is next, then WORLD DOMINATION!!

>>

>>  

>>

>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 2:15 PM, Javier Vega
[javierelas...@gmail.com](mailto:javierelas...@gmail.com) wrote:  

>>

>>> Resist, SideFX!  

>>>

>>>  

>>>

>>> **Javier Vega**  
  
[www.zao3d.com](http://www.zao3d.com)

>>>

>>>  

>>>

>>> Visita mi blog: <http://blog.zao3d.com>  
  
móvil: _616 64 73 57_  
08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet  
(Barcelona)

>>>

>>>  

>>>

>>> 2016-04-18 15:10 GMT+02:00 Perry Harovas
[perryharo...@gmail.com](mailto:perryharo...@gmail.com):  

>>>

>>>> I can't have any good feelings about this.

>>>>

>>>> That same horrible feeling in my gut that I had when Autodesk bought
Softimage is back.

>>>>

>>>>  

>>>>

>>>> Remember what we are all told?

>>>>

>>>>  

>>>>

>>>> Trust your gut.

>>>>

>>>>  

>>>>

>>>>  
  
Sent from my iPhone

>>>>

>>>>  
On Apr 18, 2016, at 9:06 AM, Ed Schiffer
[edschif...@gmail.com](mailto:edschif...@gmail.com) wrote:  
  

>>>>

>>>>> they'll surely continue Arnold, but not on the same pace I'd say.

>>>>>

>>>>>  

>>>>>

>>>>> and probably end up StoA.

>>>>>

>>>>>  

>>>>>

>>>>> what a horrible news.

>>>>>

>>>>>  

>>>>>

>>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 14:00, Javier Vega
[javierelas...@gmail.com](mailto:javierelas...@gmail.com) wrote:  

>>>>>

>>>>>>  I hope that will be something good this time, but I can't avoid to
feel an old feeling that I don't like, but we'll try to have hope. Autodesk
will not try to kill Arnold.  

>>>>>>

>>>>>>  

>>>>>>

>>>>>> **Javier Vega**  
  
[www.zao3d.com](http://www.zao3d.com)

>>>>>>

>>>>>>  

>>>>>>

>>>>>> Visita mi blog: <http://blog.zao3d.com>  
  
móvil: _616 64 73 57_  
08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet  
(Barcelona)

>>>>>>

>>>>>>  

>>>>>>

>>>>>> 2016-04-18 14:58 GMT+02:00 Matt Morris
[matt...@gmail.com](mailto:matt...@gmail.com):  

>>>>>>

>>>>>>> I can't see autodesk killing off arnold as they have no competing
products. Maybe the push towards cloud rendering will put off some customers
though.

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>  

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 13:56, Leo Quensel
[le...@gmx.de](mailto:le...@gmx.de) wrote:  

>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> God I am glad I left this industry two years after Autodesk acquired
Softimage. They make everything worse and are now off to kill another product
(and don't tell me that won't happen...).

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>  
>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> **Gesendet:** Montag, 18. April 2016 um 14:51 Uhr  
**Von:** "Artur W" [artur.w...@gmail.com](mailto:artur.w...@gmail.com)  
**An:** 
"[softimage@listproc.autodesk.com](mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com)" 
[softimage@listproc.autodesk.com](mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com)
  
**Betreff:** Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> Frederic, I am sure you mean well, but I actually try learning from
the history, which is: Autodesk doesn't care.

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>  
>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>> 2016-04-18 14:46 GMT+02:00 Frederic Servant
[frederic.serv...@gmail.com](http://frederic.serv...@gmail.com):

>>>>>>>>

>>>>>>>>> Hi Arth

Re: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Cristobal Infante]

Well it was always said that the Sitoa developement was eventually going to
end, who could blame them..

On 18 April 2016 at 14:06, Ed Schiffer <edschif...@gmail.com> wrote:

> they'll surely continue Arnold, but not on the same pace I'd say.
>
> and probably end up StoA.
>
> what a horrible news.
>
> On 18 April 2016 at 14:00, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>  I hope that will be something good this time, but I can't avoid to feel
>> an old feeling that I don't like, but we'll try to have hope. Autodesk will
>> not try to kill Arnold.
>>
>> *Javier Vega*
>>
>> www.zao3d.com
>>
>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>
>> móvil: *616 64 73 57*
>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>> (Barcelona)
>>
>> 2016-04-18 14:58 GMT+02:00 Matt Morris <matt...@gmail.com>:
>>
>>> I can't see autodesk killing off arnold as they have no competing
>>> products. Maybe the push towards cloud rendering will put off some
>>> customers though.
>>>
>>> On 18 April 2016 at 13:56, Leo Quensel <le...@gmx.de> wrote:
>>>
>>>> God I am glad I left this industry two years after Autodesk acquired
>>>> Softimage. They make everything worse and are now off to kill another
>>>> product (and don't tell me that won't happen...).
>>>>
>>>> *Gesendet:* Montag, 18. April 2016 um 14:51 Uhr
>>>> *Von:* "Artur W" <artur.w...@gmail.com>
>>>> *An:* "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" <
>>>> softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
>>>> *Betreff:* Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
>>>> Frederic, I am sure you mean well, but I actually try learning from the
>>>> history, which is: Autodesk doesn't care.
>>>>
>>>> 2016-04-18 14:46 GMT+02:00 Frederic Servant <frederic.serv...@gmail.com
>>>> >:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Arthur,
>>>>>
>>>>> Since I'm the developer of HtoA, that was my first question when we
>>>>> got briefed by Marc Stevens of Autodesk when we got disclosed, and his
>>>>> answer was a clear yes. They want more people to use Arnold, on any
>>>>> platform.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thus the development for the non-Autodesk products will continue as
>>>>> well (Houdini, C4D, Katana).
>>>>> --
>>>>> Fred
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 1:36 PM, Artur W <artur.w...@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> and what about HTOA?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2016-04-18 14:34 GMT+02:00 Artur W <artur.w...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> SITOA is dead. Is that what it means?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2016-04-18 14:32 GMT+02:00 Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It will be fine guys, Autodesk do not have any competing product so
>>>>>>>> it actually may be a good thing.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> jb
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 18 Apr 2016, at 13:27, Artur W <artur.w...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I don't believe it. NO. I refuse t believe this.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 2016-04-18 14:26 GMT+02:00 Artur W <artur.w...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> FUCK YOU AUTODESK.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 2016-04-18 14:18 GMT+02:00 Oliver Weingarten <li...@pixelpanic.de>
>>>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hey there...some news..so it seems. Take a look
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "SAN FRANCISCO---Autodesk, Inc
>>>>>>>>>> <http://cts.businesswire.com/ct/CT?id=smartlink=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.autodesk.com=51321819=20160418005351=en-US=Autodesk%2C+Inc=1=9eb90e15e023b5c1020da047d81200d4>.
>>>>>>>>>> (NASDAQ:ADSK) has acquired Solid Angle, developer of Arnold, an 
>>>>>>>>>> advanced,
>>>>>>>>>> ray-tracing image renderer for high-quality 3D animation and visual 
>>>>>>>>>> effects
>>

Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Ognjen Vukovic]

Eric i just saw that now.  Do you know which press release the article was
referring to, i would love to see that.

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 4:04 PM, Eric Thivierge <ethivie...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> @Ognjen, have you even read the FXGuide article??
>
> 
> Eric Thivierge
> http://www.ethivierge.com
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 9:57 AM, Ognjen Vukovic <ognj...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Is it safe to assume that there being no talk of Max getting arnold that
>> its next on the chopping board?
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:52 PM, Nuno Conceicao <
>> nunoalexconcei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> SideFx is next, then WORLD DOMINATION!!
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 2:15 PM, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Resist, SideFX!
>>>>
>>>> *Javier Vega*
>>>>
>>>> www.zao3d.com
>>>>
>>>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>>>
>>>> móvil: *616 64 73 57*
>>>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>>>> (Barcelona)
>>>>
>>>> 2016-04-18 15:10 GMT+02:00 Perry Harovas <perryharo...@gmail.com>:
>>>>
>>>>> I can't have any good feelings about this.
>>>>> That same horrible feeling in my gut that I had when Autodesk bought
>>>>> Softimage is back.
>>>>>
>>>>> Remember what we are all told?
>>>>>
>>>>> Trust your gut.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 18, 2016, at 9:06 AM, Ed Schiffer <edschif...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> they'll surely continue Arnold, but not on the same pace I'd say.
>>>>>
>>>>> and probably end up StoA.
>>>>>
>>>>> what a horrible news.
>>>>>
>>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 14:00, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>  I hope that will be something good this time, but I can't avoid to
>>>>>> feel an old feeling that I don't like, but we'll try to have hope. 
>>>>>> Autodesk
>>>>>> will not try to kill Arnold.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Javier Vega*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> www.zao3d.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> móvil: *616 64 73 57 <616%2064%2073%2057>*
>>>>>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>>>>>> (Barcelona)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2016-04-18 14:58 GMT+02:00 Matt Morris <matt...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I can't see autodesk killing off arnold as they have no competing
>>>>>>> products. Maybe the push towards cloud rendering will put off some
>>>>>>> customers though.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 13:56, Leo Quensel <le...@gmx.de> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> God I am glad I left this industry two years after Autodesk
>>>>>>>> acquired Softimage. They make everything worse and are now off to kill
>>>>>>>> another product (and don't tell me that won't happen...).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> *Gesendet:* Montag, 18. April 2016 um 14:51 Uhr
>>>>>>>> *Von:* "Artur W" <artur.w...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> *An:* "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" <
>>>>>>>> softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
>>>>>>>> *Betreff:* Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
>>>>>>>> Frederic, I am sure you mean well, but I actually try learning from
>>>>>>>> the history, which is: Autodesk doesn't care.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 2016-04-18 14:46 GMT+02:00 Frederic Servant <
>>>>>>>> frederic.serv...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hi Arthur,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Since I'm the developer of HtoA, that was my first question when
>>>>>>>>> we got briefed by Marc Stevens of Autodesk when we got disclosed, and 
>>>>>>>>> his
&

Re: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Stefan Kubicek]

Having no competing product didn't stop them from shutting XSI down.



I can't see autodesk killing off arnold as they have no competing  
products. Maybe the push towards cloud rendering will put off some  
customers >though.


On 18 April 2016 at 13:56, Leo Quensel <le...@gmx.de> wrote:
God I am glad I left this industry two years after Autodesk acquired  
Softimage. They make everything worse and are >>now off to kill another  
product (and don't tell me that won't happen...). Gesendet: Montag, 18.  
April 2016 um 14:51 Uhr

Von: "Artur W" <artur.w...@gmail.com>
An: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" <softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Betreff: Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
Frederic, I am sure you mean well, but I actually try learning from the  
history, which is: Autodesk doesn't care.
 2016-04-18 14:46 GMT+02:00 Frederic Servant  
<frederic.serv...@gmail.com>:
Hi Arthur,Since I'm the developer of HtoA, that was my first question  
when we got briefed by Marc Stevens of Autodesk >>>when we got  
disclosed, and his answer was a clear yes. They want more people to  
use Arnold, on any platform.
Thus the development for the non-Autodesk products will continue as  
well (Houdini, C4D, Katana).

--
Fred
 On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 1:36 PM, Artur W <artur.w...@gmail.com> wrote:

and what about HTOA?
 2016-04-18 14:34 GMT+02:00 Artur W <artur.w...@gmail.com>:

SITOA is dead. Is that what it means?
 2016-04-18 14:32 GMT+02:00 Jordi Bares <jordiba...@gmail.com>:
It will be fine guys, Autodesk do not have any competing product so  
it actually may be a good thing.jb

On 18 Apr 2016, at 13:27, Artur W <artur.w...@gmail.com> wrote:
 I don't believe it. NO. I refuse t believe this.
 2016-04-18 14:26 GMT+02:00 Artur W <artur.w...@gmail.com>:
FUCK YOU AUTODESK. 2016-04-18 14:18 GMT+02:00 Oliver Weingarten  
<li...@pixelpanic.de>:

Hey there...some news..so it seems. Take a look

"SAN FRANCISCO---Autodesk, Inc. (NASDAQ:ADSK) has acquired Solid  
Angle, developer >>>>>>>>>of Arnold, an advanced, ray-tracing  
image renderer for high-quality 3D animation and >>>>>>>>>visual  
effects creation used in film, television and advertising  
worldwide. Acquisition terms >>>>>>>>>were not disclosed."


http://news.autodesk.com/press-release/autodesk-boosts-advanced-rendering->>>>>>>>>capabilities-through-acquisition-solid-angle

Cheers,
oli
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Softimage Mailing List.
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>>>>>>>>>"unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.

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>>>>>>>the subject, and reply to confirm.


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--
---
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---
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Eric Thivierge]

@Ognjen, have you even read the FXGuide article??


Eric Thivierge
http://www.ethivierge.com

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 9:57 AM, Ognjen Vukovic <ognj...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Is it safe to assume that there being no talk of Max getting arnold that
> its next on the chopping board?
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:52 PM, Nuno Conceicao <
> nunoalexconcei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> SideFx is next, then WORLD DOMINATION!!
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 2:15 PM, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Resist, SideFX!
>>>
>>> *Javier Vega*
>>>
>>> www.zao3d.com
>>>
>>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>>
>>> móvil: *616 64 73 57*
>>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>>> (Barcelona)
>>>
>>> 2016-04-18 15:10 GMT+02:00 Perry Harovas <perryharo...@gmail.com>:
>>>
>>>> I can't have any good feelings about this.
>>>> That same horrible feeling in my gut that I had when Autodesk bought
>>>> Softimage is back.
>>>>
>>>> Remember what we are all told?
>>>>
>>>> Trust your gut.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 18, 2016, at 9:06 AM, Ed Schiffer <edschif...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> they'll surely continue Arnold, but not on the same pace I'd say.
>>>>
>>>> and probably end up StoA.
>>>>
>>>> what a horrible news.
>>>>
>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 14:00, Javier Vega <javierelas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>  I hope that will be something good this time, but I can't avoid to
>>>>> feel an old feeling that I don't like, but we'll try to have hope. 
>>>>> Autodesk
>>>>> will not try to kill Arnold.
>>>>>
>>>>> *Javier Vega*
>>>>>
>>>>> www.zao3d.com
>>>>>
>>>>> Visita mi blog: http://blog.zao3d.com
>>>>>
>>>>> móvil: *616 64 73 57 <616%2064%2073%2057>*
>>>>> 08922-Santa Coloma de Gramenet
>>>>> (Barcelona)
>>>>>
>>>>> 2016-04-18 14:58 GMT+02:00 Matt Morris <matt...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I can't see autodesk killing off arnold as they have no competing
>>>>>> products. Maybe the push towards cloud rendering will put off some
>>>>>> customers though.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 18 April 2016 at 13:56, Leo Quensel <le...@gmx.de> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> God I am glad I left this industry two years after Autodesk acquired
>>>>>>> Softimage. They make everything worse and are now off to kill another
>>>>>>> product (and don't tell me that won't happen...).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Gesendet:* Montag, 18. April 2016 um 14:51 Uhr
>>>>>>> *Von:* "Artur W" <artur.w...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>> *An:* "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" <
>>>>>>> softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
>>>>>>> *Betreff:* Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle
>>>>>>> Frederic, I am sure you mean well, but I actually try learning from
>>>>>>> the history, which is: Autodesk doesn't care.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2016-04-18 14:46 GMT+02:00 Frederic Servant <
>>>>>>> frederic.serv...@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Arthur,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Since I'm the developer of HtoA, that was my first question when we
>>>>>>>> got briefed by Marc Stevens of Autodesk when we got disclosed, and his
>>>>>>>> answer was a clear yes. They want more people to use Arnold, on any
>>>>>>>> platform.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thus the development for the non-Autodesk products will continue as
>>>>>>>> well (Houdini, C4D, Katana).
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Fred
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 1:36 PM, Artur W <artur.w...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>