On Wed, 14 Mar 2018 10:20:17 -0400
Scott Palmer wrote:
> > On Mar 14, 2018, at 3:01 AM,
> > wrote:
> >
> > There's a problem with this whole discussion. Participants are
> > mixing criticism of webapps with criticism of
arguments here- we should consider working
on that as well.
More tomorrow.
Best Regards
Toni
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: Neil C Smith <neilcsm...@apache.org>
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 14. März 2018 09:49
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache HTML/Java UI i
> On Mar 14, 2018, at 3:01 AM,
> wrote:
>
> There's a problem with this whole discussion. Participants are mixing
> criticism of webapps with criticism of Desktop applications which use a
> HTML5Component as their renderer. I don't know if I
>
>
> To help us out of this situation and save Java as a programming language I
> dedicated my days to smoothing out interoperability between Java and
> JavaScript with the goal to reuse the most flexible and portable rendering
> system of these days: the browser. My work has already been donated
Hi Toni,
On Wed, 14 Mar 2018, 07:35 , wrote:
> Regarding the architecture: In a plain DukeScript application we're
> starting a normal Java process. This process starts a HTML5Renderer using a
> "Presenter", e.g embedded chromium. The task of the Presenter is to take
>
heard what came out of this.
--Toni
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: Wade Chandler <wadechand...@apache.org>
Gesendet: Dienstag, 13. März 2018 15:19
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache HTML/Java UI instead of ... Oracle will remove JavaFX from
Oracle JDK
&
.
--Toni
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: Glenn Holmer <ce...@kolabnow.com>
Gesendet: Dienstag, 13. März 2018 18:58
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache HTML/Java UI instead of ... Oracle will remove JavaFX from
Oracle JDK
On 03/13/2018 12:13 AM, cowwoc wrote:
>
On 03/13/2018 12:13 AM, cowwoc wrote:
> Web-based development is cool because everyone is jumping on board. It
> isn't cool because it's better. Every week there is a new framework. The
> level of cross-platform compatibility doesn't begin to compare to Java.
> You have portability problems across
> On Mar 13, 2018, at 3:04 AM,
> wrote:
>
> Hi Wade,
>
> I agree, desktop isn't going away. At DukeScript we're using HTML4J Apis
> mainly for desktop applications. The Java Desktop Application is just using a
> HTML5-Component ("browser") to
le niche as
> the only ones doing archaic Swing development in a world that has much better
> concepts for UI development.
>
> --Toni
>
> -Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
>
> Von: Emilian Bold emilian.b...@protonmail.ch
>
> Gesendet: Dienstag, 13. März 2018 08:5
On Tue, 13 Mar 2018 at 08:56 wrote:
> > We need a way to render Swing on a web browser canvas!
>
> We were actually thinking about doing this using DukeScript a while ago
> to allow people to run their legacy applications. It would be doable.
Reminds me of this -
pache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache HTML/Java UI instead of ... Oracle will remove JavaFX from
Oracle JDK
HTML4J goes the wrong way in providing a migration path.
We don't need new ways to embed components into Swing. We could already embed
JavaFX stuff and now we can also embed HTML stuff (rendered
HTML4J goes the wrong way in providing a migration path.
We don't need new ways to embed components into Swing. We could already embed
JavaFX stuff and now we can also embed HTML stuff (rendered by JavaFX).
We need a way to render Swing on a web browser canvas!
Then, after Swing is fully in
First - we're talking 8 years from now. Eight years is a long time. That
doesn't mean don't be ready for it, but it does mean don't panic.
Secondly, what it means is that Oracle doesn't plan to develop AWT and
Swing after that point. That doesn't mean nobody will or could.
That said, the way
enstag, 13. März 2018 05:54
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache HTML/Java UI instead of ... Oracle will remove JavaFX from
Oracle JDK
On Mar 12, 2018 11:59, "Jaroslav Tulach" <jaroslav.tul...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "Oracle has begun conversations with int
: Matthias Bläsing [mailto:mblaes...@doppel-helix.eu]
Sent: March 12, 2018 1:37 PM
To: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: Apache HTML/Java UI instead of ... Oracle will remove JavaFX from
Oracle JDK
Am Montag, den 12.03.2018, 17:26 + schrieb Neil C Smith:
On Mon, 12 Mar 201
On Mar 12, 2018 11:59, "Jaroslav Tulach" wrote:
> "Oracle has begun conversations with interested parties in the Java
> ecosystem on the stewardship of JavaFX, Swing and AWT beyond the above
referenced timeframes."
>>>
>>
The official announcement is here
twisted logic it
can also be said that EE is dead too because its been spun off to Eclipse.
Ken
-Original Message-
From: Jaroslav Tulach [mailto:jaroslav.tul...@gmail.com]
Sent: March 12, 2018 11:59 AM
To: Apache NetBeans
<dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org<mailto:dev@netbeans
Hi,
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018, 21:52 , wrote:
> No, Electron is not involved so far, although it probably would work. On
> most of our supported platforms we have a "real" Java application talk to
> JavaScript via a Java-JavaScript Bridge. Similar to what you can do in a
>
März 2018 19:08
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org; Toni Epple <toni.ep...@eppleton.de>
Betreff: Re: Apache HTML/Java UI instead of ... Oracle will remove JavaFX from
Oracle JDK
Hi Toni,
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 at 17:51 <toni.ep...@eppleton.de> wrote:
> At DukeScript (http:/
> From: Matthias Bläsing [mailto:mblaes...@doppel-helix.eu]
> Sent: March 12, 2018 1:37 PM
> To: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Apache HTML/Java UI instead of ... Oracle will remove JavaFX
> from Oracle JDK
>
> Am Montag, den 12.03.2018, 17:26 + schrieb Neil C Smi
Hey,
On 2018/03/12 17:51:00, wrote:
> At DukeScript (http://dukescript.com) we have plenty of HTML4J
> renderers other than JavaFX (Chromium via JXBrowser, ios WebView via
> Multi OS Engine and MobiVM, Android WebView, plain Webkit,
> Instrumented Browser...) and we can even
As far as I can tell Swing and AWT were pretty much abandoned years ago except
for maintenance.
Ken
-Original Message-
From: Matthias Bläsing [mailto:mblaes...@doppel-helix.eu]
Sent: March 12, 2018 1:37 PM
To: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: Apache HTML/Java UI instead
been spun off to Eclipse.
Ken
-Original Message-
From: Jaroslav Tulach [mailto:jaroslav.tul...@gmail.com]
Sent: March 12, 2018 11:59 AM
To: Apache NetBeans <dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org>
Subject: Apache HTML/Java UI instead of ... Oracle will remove JavaFX from
Oracle JD
Hi Toni,
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 at 17:51 wrote:
> At DukeScript (http://dukescript.com) we have plenty of HTML4J renderers
> other than JavaFX (Chromium via JXBrowser, ios WebView via Multi OS Engine
> and MobiVM, Android WebView, plain Webkit, Instrumented Browser...) and
07
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache HTML/Java UI instead of ... Oracle will remove JavaFX from
Oracle JDK
Hey,
Am Montag, den 12.03.2018, 16:59 +0100 schrieb Jaroslav Tulach:
> > "Oracle has begun conversations with interested parties in the Java
> > e
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 at 17:36 Matthias Bläsing
wrote:
> My reading is a bit less *heaven will fall*:
> ...
> * The future of Swing and AWT is not yet decided
>
Same here! And I agree with you. That document doesn't say anything about
post-J2SE 11. I'm questioning
Am Montag, den 12.03.2018, 17:26 + schrieb Neil C Smith:
> On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 at 17:12 Geertjan Wielenga <
> geertjan.wiele...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
> > I really wouldn't be worried at all about something that will be
> > supported
> > "through at least 2026".
> >
>
> In a public,
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 at 17:12 Geertjan Wielenga <
geertjan.wiele...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> I really wouldn't be worried at all about something that will be supported
> "through at least 2026".
>
In a public, freely available JDK?
Best wishes,
Neil
--
Neil C Smith
Artist & Technologist
2018-03-12 18:21 GMT+01:00 Zoran Sevarac :
>
> I understood that the same way. Thats 8 yrs from now, and till that time
> JavaScript will hopefully die :)
>
Or maybe Panama finally reach the JDK and it is easy to use Qt
Indeed, lets look forward, I have not looked at JavaScript as always
being into heavy desktop Swing apps. Over the years it has helped me
with a demo app showing all kind of features a given system allows me to
use. Like a toolbox, which I run and say - hey that's the component I
need. Is
>
> as far as I can see, there's nothing about end of awt or swing support:
> "Oracle will continue developing Swing and AWT in Java SE 8 and Java SE 11
> (18.9 LTS). This means they will be supported by Oracle through at least
> 2026."
>
I understood that the same way. Thats 8 yrs from now, and
Hi,
as far as I can see, there's nothing about end of awt or swing support:
"Oracle will continue developing Swing and AWT in Java SE 8 and Java SE
11 (18.9 LTS). This means they will be supported by Oracle through at
least 2026."
Kind regards
Peter
Am 12.03.2018 um 16:59 schrieb
Ouch - just answered to the thread, but used the wrong article to
respond, sorry.
Regards
P.
Am 12.03.2018 um 18:12 schrieb Geertjan Wielenga:
Well, when I read the blog below from Oracle's Donald Smith, in charge of
all Java things, Swing isn't even mentioned, i.e., it is all about JavaFX:
Well, when I read the blog below from Oracle's Donald Smith, in charge of
all Java things, Swing isn't even mentioned, i.e., it is all about JavaFX:
https://blogs.oracle.com/java-platform-group/the-future-of-javafx-and-other-java-client-roadmap-updates
That means for AWT and Swing, everything is
Hi,
has everybody discussing here actually read the document ("Java Client
Roadmap Update")?
There's nothing about end of awt or swing support:
"Oracle will continue developing Swing and AWT in Java SE 8 and Java SE
11 (18.9 LTS). This means they will be supported by Oracle through at
Hey,
Am Montag, den 12.03.2018, 16:59 +0100 schrieb Jaroslav Tulach:
> > "Oracle has begun conversations with interested parties in the Java
> > ecosystem on the stewardship of JavaFX, Swing and AWT beyond the
> > above
> > > > > referenced timeframes."
> > > > >
>
> Forget about AWT, Swing and
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 at 16:33 John Kostaras wrote:
> If this is the case with the Java kingdom, then all these apps will move to
> other technologies that take advantage of the new hardware and the GPUs.
>
The Java kingdom does have quite a few of these things outside of the
And there is Apache pivot, being Apache maybe we could get help in any
migration if that was the path chosen
On 12 Mar 2018 16:39, "Peter Steele" wrote:
> To be clear (which i wasn't) i meant eclipse RCP is pretty popular, it
> uses swt as it's foundation. Could netbeans
To be clear (which i wasn't) i meant eclipse RCP is pretty popular, it uses
swt as it's foundation. Could netbeans use swt as it's foundations too?
On 12 Mar 2018 16:36, "Peter Steele" wrote:
> What about the eclipse RCP framework which uses swt? This would seem to be
> a
What about the eclipse RCP framework which uses swt? This would seem to be
a much better solution than having a html front end.
On 12 Mar 2018 16:25, "Neil C Smith" wrote:
> On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 at 15:59 Jaroslav Tulach
> wrote:
>
> > Forget
All very nice with HTML UI and the browser, but what about standalone apps
that need near real time performance. They cannot count on the browser and
on Javascript I 'm afraid. They need Swing and/or JavaFX or something
similar.
If this is the case with the Java kingdom, then all these apps will
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 at 15:59 Jaroslav Tulach
wrote:
> Forget about AWT, Swing and JavaFX - the future is HTML. In case you still
> care about Java, then your future should be Apache HTML/Java API!
>
Generally inclined to agree with you - definitely on forgetting
> "Oracle has begun conversations with interested parties in the Java
> ecosystem on the stewardship of JavaFX, Swing and AWT beyond the above
referenced timeframes."
>>>
>>
The official announcement is here and people are finally starting to
realize the truth: There is no future for
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