Re: [MBZ] Tampa

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

Oh it would make no sense to move out there. The Tampa/Orlando markets 
combined are smaller than my market here so I would presume the pay 
would be the same, possibly less.  It would only make sense if we wanted 
to move there anyway which I would not want to, but the wife does!  I 
would have to live way out of town to stick to my okie ways.


On 1/11/2016 7:13 PM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes wrote:

Tough to say without something to compare to.

Typical suburban home would be around 2,000-2,500 SF with a pool would cost 
around $250k or more depending on the area.  Not a lot of open land real close 
to Tampa, but I’m about 30 minutes away from downtown and another 20-30 minutes 
puts you in some rural areas where you could have a place comparable to what 
you have now, I suspect.

No income tax, but car and home insurance is more expensive.

Stay away from Whorelando.  You would hate it there and it’s a completely 
insane place due to the “attractions”.  The Mouse runs just about everything 
and pretty much sets the wage scales for anything that isn’t a professional 
job.  It’s a lot hotter and nastier in the warmer months, too.

If you have specific questions let me know.  Also, we’ve had this conversation 
before, Kaleb.  You NEVER come out ahead when you relocate. Period.  It sounds 
liek youv’e got a good gig and a nice place where you are.

Dan




On Jan 11, 2016, at 8:07 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
 wrote:

How expensive is it to live in the Tampa/Orlando area? We have an opening there 
and my wife wants to move there. It will never happen as why would I want to 
move there for the same job.

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Craig via Mercedes]

On Mon, 11 Jan 2016 17:23:17 -0600 OK Don via Mercedes
 wrote:

> Someone, perhaps on this list (?), recommended this stuff -
> https://www.amazon.com/HOUD1-Houdini-Lock-Lube/dp/B00C5JFKKE
> I bought some and used it in the 1957 locks in the Cessna - it made ALL
> the difference in the world. They are now as smooth operating as a new
> MB lock! I don't know what it does relative to water and freezing, but
> for a sticking, rough working lock it is wonderful.

That was I.

Yes, it works wonderfully, doesn't it. A professional locksmith in Los
Alamos used it on a lock I brought in. I bought a can from him and still
have most of it.


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Tampa

[OK Don via Mercedes]

No fuel gelling for one thing - -

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 7:07 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> How expensive is it to live in the Tampa/Orlando area? We have an opening
> there and my wife wants to move there. It will never happen as why would I
> want to move there for the same job.
>
>


-- 
OK Don

*“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of
our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain

"There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves."

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2012 Passat TDI DSG, 44 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] Tampa

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

> On January 11, 2016 at 8:07 PM "Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes"
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> How expensive is it to live in the Tampa/Orlando area? 


Not as expensive as it is to drag 50 defunct MBZ from Oklahoma to Florida. 

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] Tampa

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

Tough to say without something to compare to.

Typical suburban home would be around 2,000-2,500 SF with a pool would cost 
around $250k or more depending on the area.  Not a lot of open land real close 
to Tampa, but I’m about 30 minutes away from downtown and another 20-30 minutes 
puts you in some rural areas where you could have a place comparable to what 
you have now, I suspect.

No income tax, but car and home insurance is more expensive.

Stay away from Whorelando.  You would hate it there and it’s a completely 
insane place due to the “attractions”.  The Mouse runs just about everything 
and pretty much sets the wage scales for anything that isn’t a professional 
job.  It’s a lot hotter and nastier in the warmer months, too.

If you have specific questions let me know.  Also, we’ve had this conversation 
before, Kaleb.  You NEVER come out ahead when you relocate. Period.  It sounds 
liek youv’e got a good gig and a nice place where you are.

Dan



> On Jan 11, 2016, at 8:07 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> How expensive is it to live in the Tampa/Orlando area? We have an opening 
> there and my wife wants to move there. It will never happen as why would I 
> want to move there for the same job.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 


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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

That'll be dyed fuel, can't use it in wick lamps although it'll burn fine in a 
pressure appliance like a Colman lamp or lantern.
I need to check if the Jet A is dyed but at $4/gal I doubt it.

-Curt 

  From: Mitch Haley 
 To: Curt Raymond ; Mercedes Discussion List 
 
 Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 6:38 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices
   

You buy kerosene at the hardware store?
It's 3.599, taxes included, at the Charlotte Speedway station. 
http://www.speedway.com/StoreDetails?store=7515

> On January 11, 2016 at 2:02 PM Curt Raymond via Mercedes
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Our oil company puts a de-watering agent in the oil tank twice a year when
> they deliver. Theres a filter at the bottom of the tank that the burner tech
> replaces when he services it.
> I bought some "Ultra Pure Lamp Oil" to use in my Aladdin lamps in the house
> since it doesn't smell like straight kerosene does. It burns good but its
> expensive and freezes sold at around 45F. I put mixed it 50:50 with kerosene
> and found the smell is still gone and it doesn't freeze at least down to 4F
> we've had so far this winter. Interestingly I had another test bottle with 25%
> kero and it froze hard at around 35F. I want to experiment with more kero
> since the lamp oil is $19/3quarts and kerosene at the hardware store is
> $8/gal.Actually the next step is to try Jet A. A friend gave me a few gallons,
> it burns great in kerosene Colman equipment and I've been told its good in
> wick lamps but I haven't tried it yet. Smells like machine oil, none of the
> sulphur smell of kero but not quite like diesel either.
> -Curt


   
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[MBZ] Tampa

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

How expensive is it to live in the Tampa/Orlando area? We have an opening there 
and my wife wants to move there. It will never happen as why would I want to 
move there for the same job.

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Rich Thomas via Mercedes]

You know if you were Jewish you could just pour a little bit in your 
lamp and it would burn for 9 nights!  A little known benefit!


--R

On 1/11/16 6:55 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:

That'll be dyed fuel, can't use it in wick lamps although it'll burn fine in a 
pressure appliance like a Colman lamp or lantern.
I need to check if the Jet A is dyed but at $4/gal I doubt it.

-Curt

   From: Mitch Haley 
  To: Curt Raymond ; Mercedes Discussion List 

  Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 6:38 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices



You buy kerosene at the hardware store?
It's 3.599, taxes included, at the Charlotte Speedway station.
http://www.speedway.com/StoreDetails?store=7515


On January 11, 2016 at 2:02 PM Curt Raymond via Mercedes
 wrote:


Our oil company puts a de-watering agent in the oil tank twice a year when
they deliver. Theres a filter at the bottom of the tank that the burner tech
replaces when he services it.
I bought some "Ultra Pure Lamp Oil" to use in my Aladdin lamps in the house
since it doesn't smell like straight kerosene does. It burns good but its
expensive and freezes sold at around 45F. I put mixed it 50:50 with kerosene
and found the smell is still gone and it doesn't freeze at least down to 4F
we've had so far this winter. Interestingly I had another test bottle with 25%
kero and it froze hard at around 35F. I want to experiment with more kero
since the lamp oil is $19/3quarts and kerosene at the hardware store is
$8/gal.Actually the next step is to try Jet A. A friend gave me a few gallons,
it burns great in kerosene Colman equipment and I've been told its good in
wick lamps but I haven't tried it yet. Smells like machine oil, none of the
sulphur smell of kero but not quite like diesel either.
-Curt



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Re: [MBZ] Tampa

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

I have more than 80 probably

On 1/11/2016 7:38 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes wrote:



On January 11, 2016 at 8:07 PM "Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes"
 wrote:


How expensive is it to live in the Tampa/Orlando area?


Not as expensive as it is to drag 50 defunct MBZ from Oklahoma to Florida.

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] OK Which cars?

[Mountain Man via Mercedes]

--R wrote:
> When I win the Powerball Wed evening I am thinking the following Benzes
> (with a recognition that I could buy every one, in every color, every year):

For each of us at okiebenz? - kool!
After all, $1.3B should cover a new set of wheels for each of us.
mao

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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Our oil company puts a de-watering agent in the oil tank twice a year when they 
deliver. Theres a filter at the bottom of the tank that the burner tech 
replaces when he services it.
I bought some "Ultra Pure Lamp Oil" to use in my Aladdin lamps in the house 
since it doesn't smell like straight kerosene does. It burns good but its 
expensive and freezes sold at around 45F. I put mixed it 50:50 with kerosene 
and found the smell is still gone and it doesn't freeze at least down to 4F 
we've had so far this winter. Interestingly I had another test bottle with 25% 
kero and it froze hard at around 35F. I want to experiment with more kero since 
the lamp oil is $19/3quarts and kerosene at the hardware store is 
$8/gal.Actually the next step is to try Jet A. A friend gave me a few gallons, 
it burns great in kerosene Colman equipment and I've been told its good in wick 
lamps but I haven't tried it yet. Smells like machine oil, none of the sulphur 
smell of kero but not quite like diesel either.
-Curt
 

  From: Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
 To: Mercedes Discussion List  
Cc: Meade Dillon 
 Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 1:45 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices
   
Doktor M.B. used to post the annual Chevron diesel fuel report, and I
remember reading the section on fuel additives / cetane boosters, which is
not a straight forward problem.  Very few chemicals are effective, and I
had the impression that the cost / benefit analysis doesn't bode well.

A couple years ago (last I checked) MB posted on the BEVO site that the
only allowed fuel additives are for killing microbial growth and
de-watering / anti-gel.

Speaking of which, I need to de-water the tanks of my two oil burners,
haven't done that yet this cold season...



-
Max
Charleston SC

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 12:44 PM, Dwight Giles via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I know fuel  additives are verboten on this list but in the winter I add a
> couple ounces of Howes  Diesel  Treat to each tankful. Supposed to boost
> cetane, make donkeys fly etc but no gelling in over 10 years even with
> subzero temps. OM 602 will start @ 0F without block heater.
>
> Dwight Giles Jr.
> 1982 300CD
> 1990 300D
> Wickford RI
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

You buy kerosene at the hardware store?
It's 3.599, taxes included, at the Charlotte Speedway station. 
http://www.speedway.com/StoreDetails?store=7515

> On January 11, 2016 at 2:02 PM Curt Raymond via Mercedes
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Our oil company puts a de-watering agent in the oil tank twice a year when
> they deliver. Theres a filter at the bottom of the tank that the burner tech
> replaces when he services it.
> I bought some "Ultra Pure Lamp Oil" to use in my Aladdin lamps in the house
> since it doesn't smell like straight kerosene does. It burns good but its
> expensive and freezes sold at around 45F. I put mixed it 50:50 with kerosene
> and found the smell is still gone and it doesn't freeze at least down to 4F
> we've had so far this winter. Interestingly I had another test bottle with 25%
> kero and it froze hard at around 35F. I want to experiment with more kero
> since the lamp oil is $19/3quarts and kerosene at the hardware store is
> $8/gal.Actually the next step is to try Jet A. A friend gave me a few gallons,
> it burns great in kerosene Colman equipment and I've been told its good in
> wick lamps but I haven't tried it yet. Smells like machine oil, none of the
> sulphur smell of kero but not quite like diesel either.
> -Curt

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Re: [MBZ] OK Which cars?

[Rich Thomas via Mercedes]

yabbutt once the lottery commission and unkie and auntie take their cuts 
I'll only get $400-500mil.  Might not be enough to cover your desired ride.


--R

On 1/11/16 5:25 PM, Mountain Man via Mercedes wrote:

--R wrote:

When I win the Powerball Wed evening I am thinking the following Benzes
(with a recognition that I could buy every one, in every color, every year):

For each of us at okiebenz? - kool!
After all, $1.3B should cover a new set of wheels for each of us.
mao

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Re: [MBZ] Could be an R-class?

[Curly McLain via Mercedes]

I saw this thing and it looked to me like what an R-class should 
actually be, tarted up of course to wear the star, and with 
fragrance dispensers to cover up the smell of puking chirruns in the 
back.  Now that Fiat owns Chrysler, I guess that won't happen.


Coupla years ago we rented a diesel T meenievayan, badged as a 
Lancia, in Italy, which I guess is a Fiat in disguise too.  I shall 
admit to everyone now that I actually kinda liked it...


http://jalopnik.com/2017-chrysler-town-country-this-is-it-1752175922

--R


When the R came out, there was a dogcrypsler that looked very 
similar.  I suspected both were the same platform.  "Experts" assured 
me they were not.  However after I saw that post-merger dodge vans 
had ATE and other components from das vaterland, I still suspect 
there was some interchangeability between the R and the dodgcrypsler 
products.


I always hoped, during the marriage, for a MB version of the grand 
caravan with an OM engine and MB trans.  The new "Vito" is supposed 
to be here now, but Vito has a bad reputation for reliability, so who 
knows how good/bad it is.  The grand caravan is still the best small 
van option, unless you never haul anything but chirruns, then maybe 
an asian POS might be desirable.


I enjoyed driving the heap SDL on the 1300 mile trip, but I generally 
prefer the van for long trips.


The GC/T gets a bad rap.  It is an excellent vehicle.

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Re: [MBZ] Tampa

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

HAHAHAHA

On 1/11/2016 7:08 PM, OK Don via Mercedes wrote:

No fuel gelling for one thing - -

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 7:07 PM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:


How expensive is it to live in the Tampa/Orlando area? We have an opening
there and my wife wants to move there. It will never happen as why would I
want to move there for the same job.







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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[OK Don via Mercedes]

Someone, perhaps on this list (?), recommended this stuff -
https://www.amazon.com/HOUD1-Houdini-Lock-Lube/dp/B00C5JFKKE
I bought some and used it in the 1957 locks in the Cessna - it made ALL the
difference in the world. They are now as smooth operating as a new MB lock!
I don't know what it does relative to water and freezing, but for a
sticking, rough working lock it is wonderful.

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:50 PM, clay via Mercedes 
wrote:

> Use some Tri-flow.
>
> Locksmith gets all manner of business cleaning out the graphite and other
> snot people put in the keyholes.  He only uses Tri-flow to lubricate and
> free locksets
>
> clay
>
>


-- 
OK Don

*“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of
our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain

"There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves."

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2012 Passat TDI DSG, 44 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Dwight Giles via Mercedes]

Yes I bought  some too after receiving on this list. Completely  Freed up
lock keying on my 124 300D trunk lock with no disassembly. I think it is
amazing.

Dwight Giles Jr.
1982 300CD
1990 300D
Wickford RI
On Jan 11, 2016 6:23 PM, "OK Don via Mercedes" 
wrote:

> Someone, perhaps on this list (?), recommended this stuff -
> https://www.amazon.com/HOUD1-Houdini-Lock-Lube/dp/B00C5JFKKE
> I bought some and used it in the 1957 locks in the Cessna - it made ALL the
> difference in the world. They are now as smooth operating as a new MB lock!
> I don't know what it does relative to water and freezing, but for a
> sticking, rough working lock it is wonderful.
>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:50 PM, clay via Mercedes 
> wrote:
>
> > Use some Tri-flow.
> >
> > Locksmith gets all manner of business cleaning out the graphite and other
> > snot people put in the keyholes.  He only uses Tri-flow to lubricate and
> > free locksets
> >
> > clay
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> OK Don
>
> *“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of
> our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain
>
> "There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
> learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
> for themselves."
>
> WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
> 2013 F150, 18 mpg
> 2012 Passat TDI DSG, 44 mpg
> 1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

So will rain.  I think I need to tear apart the door and figure out how
moisture is getting in, or why it isn't draining out.


There's supposed to be flimsy plastic rain hat over the
lock inside the door.  It gets broken/torn very easily.

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] Tampa

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

> On January 11, 2016 at 8:41 PM "Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes"
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> I have more than 80 probably

Maybe she wants to move so far you can't take them with you. 

Mitch. 

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Re: [MBZ] Tampa

[WILTON via Mercedes]

Don't!

Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: "Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes" 

To: 
Cc: "Kaleb C. Striplin" 
Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 8:07 PM
Subject: [MBZ] Tampa


How expensive is it to live in the Tampa/Orlando area? We have an opening 
there and my wife wants to move there. It will never happen as why would I 
want to move there for the same job.


Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [MBZ] gelling WVO & diesel prices

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

Diesel is 1.99 - 2.29/gal. in the Rockville, MD area.  Cash price a nickel
less.

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 9:34 PM, Rick Hawkins Java via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Well in athens, ga the temp was down to about 24F last night. My 300td had
> 100% wvo in it and i was able to start it at about 42F around lunchtime.
> I'm sure the fuel was still colder. This evening i bought 5 gals of diesel
> for $2.09, at a local shop. It can probably be found for $1.95 or less
> around georgia and there's Kroger and their discount program, too. With the
> 5 gals, i'm about 50/50 diesel and WVO. I can operate to around 32F with
> that mix.
>
>
> thanks,
>
> xx rick
> Rick Hawkins
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Re: [MBZ] Tampa

[Rick Knoble via Mercedes]

The game is called "Germany or Florida" for a reason. I suspect Florida 
hillbillies make Okie hicks look debonair, and sophisticated.

Rick 
Who makes no bones about being considered a "Hoosier Hick". ‎‎
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Re: [MBZ] Tampa

[Curly McLain via Mercedes]

How expensive is it to live in the Tampa/Orlando area? We have an 
opening there and my wife wants to move there. It will never happen 
as why would I want to move there for the same job.


Sent from my iPhone


Tampa made the news a couple days ago as the least desirable city in 
the USA.  It has high crime, it is dirty and looks much like a turd 
world city.   On the plus side, there are some nice neighborhoods, 
great cuban sandwiches, palm trees and guava turnovers.   Oh, and a 
few old MBs.  You won't freeze your pitootie, or shovel snow, but you 
will sweat all year round, and in the summer it is unbearable.  The 
humidity will rust your tools and cars.  Okie city looks pretty good 
in comparison, and I think it is smaller (metro area)


If you go further inland, like Pasco county, the prices are lower and 
the population is more sparse, but you have a longer drive to tampa 
or mouslando airports.   That is a generally depressed area since the 
oranges are not grown there anymore.


Pass the shaker of salt as you read this...  I've never lived there, 
but know folks who do.  But the first sentence is hard  truth.  I 
have lived in coastal areas, so there is some credibility.


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[MBZ] gelling WVO & diesel prices

[Rick Hawkins Java via Mercedes]

Well in athens, ga the temp was down to about 24F last night. My 300td had 100% 
wvo in it and i was able to start it at about 42F around lunchtime. I'm sure 
the fuel was still colder. This evening i bought 5 gals of diesel for $2.09, at 
a local shop. It can probably be found for $1.95 or less around georgia and 
there's Kroger and their discount program, too. With the 5 gals, i'm about 
50/50 diesel and WVO. I can operate to around 32F with that mix.


thanks,

xx rick
Rick Hawkins
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs - was OT: Politics are angrier polls

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

I was trying to run 2x 3.xv LEDs off my 6v pack but the 6v is nominal, with the 
rechargable batteries I'm probably only getting 5.2v and my alkaline batteries 
are worn out and only reading 1v each so my problem was probably that I didn't 
have enough voltage to run them in parallel.
The problem for aiming is that I didn't really pay attention when I cut the 
piece of styrene the LEDs poke through so a couple of them just barely fit. The 
original system used a metal bar down the center as a stiffener and ground 
lead. I've got a couple LEDs leaning on the bar which makes them shoot off to 
the side. On one hand this reduces the overall brightness for reading, on the 
other hand it gives me a wider field of view so book placement is less 
important.I'm also debating adding another 10 LEDs to the array as well. Need 
to take it to camp and give it a shot before I make any decisions though.
3x 1.5v (or 1.2v in the case of rechargeable) cells like I'm using is pretty 
much the way all LED flashlights are today...

-Curt
 

  From: fmiser 
 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Curt Raymond 
 Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 2:49 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs - was OT: Politics are angrier polls
   
> Curt wrote:
> 
> Looking around I found a bag of through hole LEDs I'd
> bought but never used. Dropping one cell from my battery
> pack gives me 3.6v using rechargeable batteries which I
> tested and appeared to be acceptable with my 35ma LEDs so I
> rewired the thing with those.

Again, the LEDs don't really care what the voltage is - so
long as they only have 35 ma passing through.  This is NOT
how most electrical devices work.

Using no resistor means you are depending on the source
impedance to limit the current.  It so happens that NiCd and
NiMh cells have a much lower internal resistance than
alkaline.  Therefore the LEDs will be brighter with
rechargeable than with primary cells - even though if they
are both the same voltage.

> I finished it last night and testing shows that it works
> pretty well for a reading light (its intended purpose)
> although it could stand a little work aiming the LEDs
> better.

Good!  If it works, the math is academic. *smiles*

With the through hole LEDs, it _is_ possible to aim
them.  If you don't want the focused spot, you may be able to
turn them into very wide angle.  I have filed the rounded top
off of many of them to get rid of the lens.  If you do that,
be careful to not take off so much you run into the wires
inside.

> I think you missed the point of my diode, I've got a single
> pole single throw 3 position switch. On low it activates
> one string of lights, on high it activates both.

You're right.  I missed that. *weak smile*

> Also in my experiments LEDs must be used in parallel
> which matches my understanding of how they work. Because
> they are one way valves the electrical pixies won't pass
> through like they would a normal valve. Certainly when I
> strung them up in series they wouldn't do anything... 

The problem with parallel LEDs has to do with the nature of a
diode.  Below the voltage threshold, no current flows.  Once
the threshold has been exceeded, the diode (LED) will flow
_huge_ amounts of current.  It is practically a switch.  To
survive, the current must be limited.  Either from the
batteries internal resistance or from a resistor etc.

The threshold voltage is a "typical" value.  Each device will
vary by a little bit.  If there are two 3.6 V LEDs, and one
is actually 3.599 and the other is 3.601, the voltage may
never reach 3.061 because the 5.599 diode has conducted all
the current the limiting resistor has allowed through.  If
you engineered the circuit expecting the diodes to share the
current, and one has "robbed" it all, it won't last very long.

That said, the 3.6 V white or blue LEDs seem to behave better
than the 0.7 V single color LEDs in a parallel circuit.

And using battery power without a separate current limiter
does warp the math a bit. 

To run them in series, remember to add the voltages, so three
3.6 V LEDs will have a threshold voltage of 10.8 V.



  
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

True enough, I went with the MH-9000 because mine came with a 12v adapter and 
it gives a gazillion options for charging/discharging current and its got 
refresh and breakin settings.
If/when I buy one to keep at camp I'll probably do the BC-700 with an added 12v 
adapter.
-Curt
 

  From: fmiser 
 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Curt Raymond 
 Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 2:57 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs
   
> Curt wrote:
> 
> If you're going to play with
> rechargable batteries a good charger is a must,

I agree!

> The MH-9000 is the gold standard: 
http://www.amazon.com/PowerEx-MH-C9000-WizardOne-Charger-Analyzer-Batteries/dp/B003DIGKOG/

The LaCross BC-700 is a mighty sweet charger for a lot less.
http://www.amazon.com/Crosse-Technology-BC-700-Battery-Charger/dp/B000RSOV50/

  
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

HF has a couple options
The shed 
light:http://www.harborfreight.com/household/lighting/solar-shed-light-62549.html
says it has 4 SMD LEDs, so surface mount but it doesn't say how bright. We 
could be generous and say 100 lumens so 400 lumens. It does list 600mah of 
electricity but it says li-ion batteries which suggests some small obscure 
size. The reviews are poor...
The solar security 
lighthttp://www.harborfreight.com/60-led-solar-security-light-69643.html60 LEDs 
6v, NiCad, 900mah, much better reviews and should put out much more light but 
I'm dubious that the batteries will power it for long. If they're 35ma like 
mine thats 2100ma which way over matches the batteries. Oh and its MORE 
EXPENSIVE than the 80 LED unit on Amazon.
Sadly the Amazon unit also has 900mah batteries but it admits that they're AAs. 
I'd order a pack of 2500mah batteries when I ordered the unit if I wanted the 
light to be on any significant amount of time. I'd also order the 5w panel I 
suggested earlier, the 1w panel is going to need pretty much a full day of full 
sun to charge those batteries...

-Curt
 

  From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
 To: Mercedes Discussion List  
Cc: Dan Penoff 
 Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 3:09 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs
   
Very few, but our property abuts a very dense forest who's tree canopy extends 
over our property. As a result, even on a moonlit night it's still very dark 
out back.

I'm only concerned with having some light around the screen door that opens 
from the lanai into the back yard.

I considered one of the HF lights, but they didn't look very substantial and 
had poor reviews.

Dan

> On Jan 11, 2016, at 3:05 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> How many acres comprise the wooded Dan Penoff back 40?
> 
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 2:57 PM, fmiser via Mercedes 
> wrote:
> 
>>> Curt wrote:
>>> 
>>> If you're going to play with
>>> rechargable batteries a good charger is a must,
>> 
>> I agree!
>> 
>>> The MH-9000 is the gold standard:
>> 
>> http://www.amazon.com/PowerEx-MH-C9000-WizardOne-Charger-Analyzer-Batteries/dp/B003DIGKOG/
>> 
>> The LaCross BC-700 is a mighty sweet charger for a lot less.
>> 
>> http://www.amazon.com/Crosse-Technology-BC-700-Battery-Charger/dp/B000RSOV50/
>> 
>> ___
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>> 
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>> 
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs - was OT: Politics are angrier polls

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

You can buy LEDs with the resistor already integrated. In fact I think with 
some you can even buy a PWM switching power supply already integrated so you 
can run them at your chosen voltage. Thats what I'd intended to do but not what 
actually happened. 
The LEDs I ruined were surface mount package which wasn't as easy to solder as 
I'd hoped. Looking around I found a bag of through hole LEDs I'd bought but 
never used. Dropping one cell from my battery pack gives me 3.6v using 
rechargeable batteries which I tested and appeared to be acceptable with my 
35ma LEDs so I rewired the thing with those. I finished it last night and 
testing shows that it works pretty well for a reading light (its intended 
purpose) although it could stand a little work aiming the LEDs better.
I think you missed the point of my diode, I've got a single pole single throw 3 
position switch. On low it activates one string of lights, on high it activates 
both. The diode sits on the jumper from the high side so that it doesn't turn 
on when low is called for.
Also in my experiments LEDs must be used in parallel which matches my 
understanding of how they work. Because they are one way valves the electrical 
pixies won't pass through like they would a normal valve. Certainly when I 
strung them up in series they wouldn't do anything...
-Curt
 

  From: fmiser 
 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Curt Raymond 
 Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2016 7:35 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs - was OT: Politics are angrier polls
   
> Curt wrote:
> 
> Tonight while I was not watching television I learned how
> to wire in a diode. I'm rebuilding the light I use over my
> bed at camp converting it from fluorescent to LED.


> I'd wired the LEDs in 2 strings with a 3 position switch, I
> wanted one position to turn on one string and the other
> position to turn on both. I harvested a diode from an old
> computer power supply to make that work and I think it
> would work except I discovered that what I THOUGHT were 6v
> LEDs turned out to be 3.6v. You push 6v (ie 4 D cell
> batteries in series) into a 3.6v LED and it cooks off
> pretty quick, whoops! I'm curious how bright the LEDs will
> be at 3v, they were SUPER bright at 6.

LEDs don't work like that.  It is the _current_ (amps) that
matter.  The 3.6 V is not supply voltage - it is the voltage
drop across the diode when conducting.

And if you are supplying DC, you don't need a diode with it.

And it's usually not a good idea to wire LEDs in parallel.

So - do you know the current rating of those LEDS?  20 ma is
typical for "old fashioned" general purpose LEDS.  Newer,
brighter LEDs can be designed for a whole lot more.

The you subtract the LED voltage from the supply voltage (6
minus 3.6 equals 2.4) and then using ohm's law figure out
what size resistor you need to drop 2.4 V at the design
current.  So if those are 200 ma LEDs, and R=E/I, then
2.4/0.2 = 12 ohm.  Then we need to be sure you won't fry the
resistor.  Watts = current X voltage, so 2.4 X 0.2 = 0.48
Watt.  A half watt resistor would be big enough - just.  But
it's a good idea to always overrate wattage a bit.  I would
use a 1 W resistor.

With a 6 V supply, for each of the 3.6 V LEDs (if they are
rated for 200 ma), you would need a single one watt 12 ohm
resistor in series with it.

If that's not clear enough, let me know and I'll answer
questions or go into more detail.  *smiles*


  
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[MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

Left the house this morning and down the road the e300 did not want to go. 
Turned around and headed back. Died on the way but started back up. Got home 
checked it out did not see anything so left again and it was fine. Think with 
it sitting all weekend and it got down to 8 Sunday morning fuel might have 
gelled. Now am filling up at $1.41 a gal, wow.

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Curly McLain via Mercedes]

Citgo is Hooogo's all company!  Or the new guy that is Hooogo Jr.  I 
think they got run out of Texas at some point.


--R

On 1/11/16 10:15 AM, Curly McLain via Mercedes wrote:
Left the house this morning and down the road the e300 did not 
want to go. Turned around and headed back. Died on the way but 
started back up. Got home checked it out did not see anything so 
left again and it was fine. Think with it sitting all weekend and 
it got down to 8 Sunday morning fuel might have gelled. Now am 
filling up at $1.41 a gal, wow.


Sent from my iPhone


You need to buy winter fuel.

1.79 here if I drive 15 miles each way.  One station at 1.69 maybe 
12 miles R/T


Otherwise 2.19 mostly. with a few at 1.92-1.99

Citgo still at 2.49 with no customers.


mosta huey's stations got closed down because people quit going 
there, except a few -ists.  Thisun's still open.


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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

I keep a bottle "Diesel 911" in the trunk for just such an occasion,
haven't had to use that yet here in SC.  Imagine that!

$1.41 is pretty amazing, filled up both our oil burners at 2.19 / gallon
last week.  Local grocery chain sells loyal customers gas cards at a 20%
discount, so my price is really $1.75.

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:59 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> buck41 for dizzel?  That is a Wow.  I saw it upstate a coupla weeks ago
> for $1.79 at some truck stop, Loves or something, cheapest I have seen it
> in a long long time.
>
> --R
>
>
> On 1/11/16 10:55 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes wrote:
>
>> Left the house this morning and down the road the e300 did not want to
>> go. Turned around and headed back. Died on the way but started back up. Got
>> home checked it out did not see anything so left again and it was fine.
>> Think with it sitting all weekend and it got down to 8 Sunday morning fuel
>> might have gelled. Now am filling up at $1.41 a gal, wow.
>>
>>
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Curly McLain via Mercedes]

Left the house this morning and down the road the e300 did not want 
to go. Turned around and headed back. Died on the way but started 
back up. Got home checked it out did not see anything so left again 
and it was fine. Think with it sitting all weekend and it got down 
to 8 Sunday morning fuel might have gelled. Now am filling up at 
$1.41 a gal, wow.


Sent from my iPhone


You need to buy winter fuel.

1.79 here if I drive 15 miles each way.  One station at 1.69 maybe 12 miles R/T

Otherwise 2.19 mostly. with a few at 1.92-1.99

Citgo still at 2.49 with no customers.

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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Rich Thomas via Mercedes]

Viva la socialismo!

The theory is to get the residents as it only takes the truckers about 
40min to bypass the whole place.  It's for the chirruns ya know...


--R

On 1/11/16 11:05 AM, Dwight Giles via Mercedes wrote:

We are down to 2.39/ gallon in heavily taxed RI. The theory is get the
truckers.

Dwight Giles Jr.
1982 300CD
1990 300D
Wickford RI
On Jan 11, 2016 10:59 AM, "Rich Thomas via Mercedes" 
wrote:


buck41 for dizzel?  That is a Wow.  I saw it upstate a coupla weeks ago
for $1.79 at some truck stop, Loves or something, cheapest I have seen it
in a long long time.

--R

On 1/11/16 10:55 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes wrote:


Left the house this morning and down the road the e300 did not want to
go. Turned around and headed back. Died on the way but started back up. Got
home checked it out did not see anything so left again and it was fine.
Think with it sitting all weekend and it got down to 8 Sunday morning fuel
might have gelled. Now am filling up at $1.41 a gal, wow.

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Rich Thomas via Mercedes]

Citgo is Hooogo's all company!  Or the new guy that is Hooogo Jr.  I 
think they got run out of Texas at some point.


--R

On 1/11/16 10:15 AM, Curly McLain via Mercedes wrote:
Left the house this morning and down the road the e300 did not want 
to go. Turned around and headed back. Died on the way but started 
back up. Got home checked it out did not see anything so left again 
and it was fine. Think with it sitting all weekend and it got down to 
8 Sunday morning fuel might have gelled. Now am filling up at $1.41 a 
gal, wow.


Sent from my iPhone


You need to buy winter fuel.

1.79 here if I drive 15 miles each way.  One station at 1.69 maybe 12 
miles R/T


Otherwise 2.19 mostly. with a few at 1.92-1.99

Citgo still at 2.49 with no customers.

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Re: [MBZ] Solar FWIW

[archer75--- via Mercedes]

We did that the first five years of marriage, and that included two kids 
diapers. Clothes came out just as clean. That was during the late 1950s.
Gerry

> I saw something a coupla months ago, maybe in the paper, that the 
> current moderne laundry detergents work just as well in cold water as in 
> warm/hot water (this from a laundry detergent specialist). (And you 
> don't need a lot of it.)  So now I use cold to wash and rinse.  I can't 
> tell any difference but that doesn't necessarily mean there is no 
> difference.
> 
> --R
> 
> On 1/10/16 3:22 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes wrote:
> > Most of the energy in laundry is hot water and drying.
> > With a propane water heater and air-drying, a lot of modern high efficiency
> > washers should work fine off grid.
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> -
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2015.0.6176 / Virus Database: 4489/11377 - Release Date: 01/11/16
> 


-- 
arche...@embarqmail.com 

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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Rich Thomas via Mercedes]

Go buy one of those HF solar charger/LED panel things.  Not sure how 
long it would last but they look pretty bright.


I was a Lowes a coupla years ago and they were selling a whole bunch of 
discontinued solar LED sidewalk lights for $1 apiece, I bought a bunch 
of them.  They have a AA battery and little solar cell about 2"x2", 
charges the battery enough to run the light most of the night and it is 
fairly bright for a single LED.


Look on banggood or dx.com for cheap stuff to fool around with.

--R

On 1/11/16 9:54 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:

I was considering that before I ended up dropping my pack voltage.
I forgot to mention the specs on the light I built, 10x 35ma LEDs so about 
350ma, I'm using 2500mah AA rechargeables (Amazon basics, cheap and low self 
discharge) in D cell carriers, the case was originally designed for D cells but 
rechargeable D cells are expensive and the charger is expensive. The AAs should 
have power enough for 5 or 6 hours before the batteries sag too bad and they 
get dim. Thats more than I was getting before with the fluorescent bulbs and 
10,000mah D cells. I need to do some testing but I think this light will be a 
good way to use up D cells that aren't powerful enough to run the camp shower...
-Curt
  


   From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
  To: Mercedes Discussion List 
Cc: Dan Penoff 
  Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 9:48 AM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs - was OT: Politics are angrier polls

I got a bag of like 25 LEDs with dropping resistors for operation on 12VDC on Amazon for $8.00, I think.


Dan

Sent from my iPad


On Jan 11, 2016, at 9:22 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes  
wrote:

You can buy LEDs with the resistor already integrated. In fact I think with 
some you can even buy a PWM switching power supply already integrated so you 
can run them at your chosen voltage. Thats what I'd intended to do but not what 
actually happened.
The LEDs I ruined were surface mount package which wasn't as easy to solder as 
I'd hoped. Looking around I found a bag of through hole LEDs I'd bought but 
never used. Dropping one cell from my battery pack gives me 3.6v using 
rechargeable batteries which I tested and appeared to be acceptable with my 
35ma LEDs so I rewired the thing with those. I finished it last night and 
testing shows that it works pretty well for a reading light (its intended 
purpose) although it could stand a little work aiming the LEDs better.
I think you missed the point of my diode, I've got a single pole single throw 3 
position switch. On low it activates one string of lights, on high it activates 
both. The diode sits on the jumper from the high side so that it doesn't turn 
on when low is called for.
Also in my experiments LEDs must be used in parallel which matches my 
understanding of how they work. Because they are one way valves the electrical 
pixies won't pass through like they would a normal valve. Certainly when I 
strung them up in series they wouldn't do anything...
-Curt


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Re: [MBZ] Solar FWIW

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

True.

In fact, it's been this way for some time with the HE (high efficiency) front 
loaders. If you dig into the details, "hot" is relatively cool.

I have used liquid detergent and the energy saving cycle in our front loader 
for at least 10 years.  It does a fine job for the most part. If I've got 
something that's particularly dirty, it might go in the shorter cycle at a 
higher temperature.

I suspect it's more a matter of time and agitation.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 11, 2016, at 9:45 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> I saw something a coupla months ago, maybe in the paper, that the current 
> moderne laundry detergents work just as well in cold water as in warm/hot 
> water (this from a laundry detergent specialist). (And you don't need a lot 
> of it.)  So now I use cold to wash and rinse.  I can't tell any difference 
> but that doesn't necessarily mean there is no difference.
> 
> --R
> 
>> On 1/10/16 3:22 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes wrote:
>> Most of the energy in laundry is hot water and drying.
>> With a propane water heater and air-drying, a lot of modern high efficiency
>> washers should work fine off grid.
> 
> 
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs - was OT: Politics are angrier polls

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

I was considering that before I ended up dropping my pack voltage.
I forgot to mention the specs on the light I built, 10x 35ma LEDs so about 
350ma, I'm using 2500mah AA rechargeables (Amazon basics, cheap and low self 
discharge) in D cell carriers, the case was originally designed for D cells but 
rechargeable D cells are expensive and the charger is expensive. The AAs should 
have power enough for 5 or 6 hours before the batteries sag too bad and they 
get dim. Thats more than I was getting before with the fluorescent bulbs and 
10,000mah D cells. I need to do some testing but I think this light will be a 
good way to use up D cells that aren't powerful enough to run the camp shower...
-Curt
 

  From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
 To: Mercedes Discussion List  
Cc: Dan Penoff 
 Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 9:48 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs - was OT: Politics are angrier polls
   
I got a bag of like 25 LEDs with dropping resistors for operation on 12VDC on 
Amazon for $8.00, I think.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 11, 2016, at 9:22 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> You can buy LEDs with the resistor already integrated. In fact I think with 
> some you can even buy a PWM switching power supply already integrated so you 
> can run them at your chosen voltage. Thats what I'd intended to do but not 
> what actually happened. 
> The LEDs I ruined were surface mount package which wasn't as easy to solder 
> as I'd hoped. Looking around I found a bag of through hole LEDs I'd bought 
> but never used. Dropping one cell from my battery pack gives me 3.6v using 
> rechargeable batteries which I tested and appeared to be acceptable with my 
> 35ma LEDs so I rewired the thing with those. I finished it last night and 
> testing shows that it works pretty well for a reading light (its intended 
> purpose) although it could stand a little work aiming the LEDs better.
> I think you missed the point of my diode, I've got a single pole single throw 
> 3 position switch. On low it activates one string of lights, on high it 
> activates both. The diode sits on the jumper from the high side so that it 
> doesn't turn on when low is called for.
> Also in my experiments LEDs must be used in parallel which matches my 
> understanding of how they work. Because they are one way valves the 
> electrical pixies won't pass through like they would a normal valve. 
> Certainly when I strung them up in series they wouldn't do anything...
> -Curt
> 

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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

You can buy LEDs with the resistor already integrated.


Better to supply your own.

LED's, like _most_ semiconductors, may not be wired directly
in parallel.  Most semiconductors have a positive temperature
coefficient, which means they draw _more_ current as they heat
up.  Resulting in more heat, thus yet more current, and thermal
runaway, and device failure.  (Incandescent lamps have a negative
temperature coefficient, which means they balance naturally when
used in parallel.)

So, for LED supplies you either need a bunch of LED's in series,
with _one_ current limiter, or you parallel the LED _and_ its
individual current limiter, times N, or some kind of series-parallel
arrangement representing both approaches.

For a 12V supply I'd stack perhaps 3 3.6V LED's in series, and
use one resistor, making one 12V lamp bank.  Times as many banks
in parallel as you needed to get sufficient light.

Remember that a simple resistor as a current limiter represents
totally wasted power.  Less resistors/resistance == longer
battery life.

More complex circuits resembling switching power supplies are
not uncommon.  What you are after is a constant _current_ supply,
not a constant _voltage_ supply.


Certainly when I strung them up in series they wouldn't do anything...


Either you didn't wire them in the same direction, cathode to anode,
or you didn't have enough voltage to push any current through their
stacked junction voltages.  Either will keep the photons inside...

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Rich Thomas via Mercedes]

buck41 for dizzel?  That is a Wow.  I saw it upstate a coupla weeks ago 
for $1.79 at some truck stop, Loves or something, cheapest I have seen 
it in a long long time.


--R

On 1/11/16 10:55 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes wrote:

Left the house this morning and down the road the e300 did not want to go. 
Turned around and headed back. Died on the way but started back up. Got home 
checked it out did not see anything so left again and it was fine. Think with 
it sitting all weekend and it got down to 8 Sunday morning fuel might have 
gelled. Now am filling up at $1.41 a gal, wow.

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [MBZ] Solar FWIW

[Rich Thomas via Mercedes]

I saw something a coupla months ago, maybe in the paper, that the 
current moderne laundry detergents work just as well in cold water as in 
warm/hot water (this from a laundry detergent specialist). (And you 
don't need a lot of it.)  So now I use cold to wash and rinse.  I can't 
tell any difference but that doesn't necessarily mean there is no 
difference.


--R

On 1/10/16 3:22 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes wrote:

Most of the energy in laundry is hot water and drying.
With a propane water heater and air-drying, a lot of modern high efficiency
washers should work fine off grid.



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Re: [MBZ] Solar FWIW

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Anybody else not getting all the emails from the list lately?At first I was 
just getting them out of order, seeing replies before the original posts. I 
never got Mitch's email but I got Andrew's reply.
To Mitch's post why would you want forced air heat, hydronic (forced hot water) 
requires only electricity to run the blower into the furnace. I can run our 
furnace off my 1200w generator...
"Real" off grid people heat with wood ;)
-Curt
 

  From: Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
 To: Mitch Haley ; Mercedes Discussion List 
 
Cc: Andrew Strasfogel 
 Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2016 11:33 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Solar FWIW
   
By British beer - it's meant to be drunk at room temperature.

On Sun, Jan 10, 2016 at 3:22 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

>
>
> > On January 10, 2016 at 2:59 PM Meade Dillon via Mercedes
> >  wrote:
> >
> >
> > I think very few homes that were designed and built to be on the
> electrical
> > grid will have any reasonable chance of going "off grid" without radical
> > lifestyle changes, like taking your dirty clothes to a laundry-mat,
> > hand-washing your dishes, and installing gas-powered stove-top / oven /
> > refrigerator, and burning something in the winter to keep the house warm.
>
> Most of the energy in laundry is hot water and drying.
> With a propane water heater and air-drying, a lot of modern high efficiency
> washers should work fine off grid.
> Staber makes DC powered horizontal axis washers that load from the top.
>
> SunFrost makes DC refrigerators, but they aren't really that much more
> efficient
> than the best Energy Star models these days.
> A little camper fridge can run on a couple of gallons of propane a week, I
> don't
> know how much a full sized one would cost to run.
>
> You'd definitely want LP cooking appliances and a wood stove or LP boiler,
> or at
> least a forced air furnace with a high efficiency variable speed blower.
>
> Mitch.
>
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs - was OT: Politics are angrier polls

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

I got a bag of like 25 LEDs with dropping resistors for operation on 12VDC on 
Amazon for $8.00, I think.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 11, 2016, at 9:22 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> You can buy LEDs with the resistor already integrated. In fact I think with 
> some you can even buy a PWM switching power supply already integrated so you 
> can run them at your chosen voltage. Thats what I'd intended to do but not 
> what actually happened. 
> The LEDs I ruined were surface mount package which wasn't as easy to solder 
> as I'd hoped. Looking around I found a bag of through hole LEDs I'd bought 
> but never used. Dropping one cell from my battery pack gives me 3.6v using 
> rechargeable batteries which I tested and appeared to be acceptable with my 
> 35ma LEDs so I rewired the thing with those. I finished it last night and 
> testing shows that it works pretty well for a reading light (its intended 
> purpose) although it could stand a little work aiming the LEDs better.
> I think you missed the point of my diode, I've got a single pole single throw 
> 3 position switch. On low it activates one string of lights, on high it 
> activates both. The diode sits on the jumper from the high side so that it 
> doesn't turn on when low is called for.
> Also in my experiments LEDs must be used in parallel which matches my 
> understanding of how they work. Because they are one way valves the 
> electrical pixies won't pass through like they would a normal valve. 
> Certainly when I strung them up in series they wouldn't do anything...
> -Curt
> 

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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Dwight Giles via Mercedes]

We are down to 2.39/ gallon in heavily taxed RI. The theory is get the
truckers.

Dwight Giles Jr.
1982 300CD
1990 300D
Wickford RI
On Jan 11, 2016 10:59 AM, "Rich Thomas via Mercedes" 
wrote:

> buck41 for dizzel?  That is a Wow.  I saw it upstate a coupla weeks ago
> for $1.79 at some truck stop, Loves or something, cheapest I have seen it
> in a long long time.
>
> --R
>
> On 1/11/16 10:55 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes wrote:
>
>> Left the house this morning and down the road the e300 did not want to
>> go. Turned around and headed back. Died on the way but started back up. Got
>> home checked it out did not see anything so left again and it was fine.
>> Think with it sitting all weekend and it got down to 8 Sunday morning fuel
>> might have gelled. Now am filling up at $1.41 a gal, wow.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> ___
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>>
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>>
>>
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[MBZ] Could be an R-class?

[Rich Thomas via Mercedes]

I saw this thing and it looked to me like what an R-class should 
actually be, tarted up of course to wear the star, and with fragrance 
dispensers to cover up the smell of puking chirruns in the back.  Now 
that Fiat owns Chrysler, I guess that won't happen.


Coupla years ago we rented a diesel T meenievayan, badged as a Lancia, 
in Italy, which I guess is a Fiat in disguise too.  I shall admit to 
everyone now that I actually kinda liked it...


http://jalopnik.com/2017-chrysler-town-country-this-is-it-1752175922


--R

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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

That looks perfect although I can't tell how long the connecting cable is
between the lamp and the solar collector.

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:00 PM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Get one of the HF things, 40 bucks yer good ta go
> http://www.harborfreight.com/60-led-solar-security-light-69643.html Get
> the 20% coupon and it's $32.  Hard to go wrong.
>
> --R
>
> On 1/11/16 12:54 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
>
>> What I really need is a solar powered lighting fixture with a motion
>> sensor
>> to light up my back yard shed.
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:45 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes <
>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

The batteries will be crap but you can usually replace them easily enough. 
Those LED outside walkway lights generally use 1 AA each and when they show up 
they're usually badly discharged. I've found that if I charge them first they 
work way better. The solar panel is only marginally able to keep them up ever. 
They're NiCad, usually 600mah so if you want them to last all night you can 
replace them with NiMH 2000 or 2500mah. I've been using the Amazon Basics 
http://www.amazon.com/AmazonBasics-High-Capacity-Rechargeable-Batteries-Pre-charged/dp/B00HZV9WTM/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8=1452538179=8-2=amazon+basics+AA
 which are great batteries although this is a good use for the Harbor Freight 
ones too. Store bought rechargables like the Harbor Freight ones have bad self 
discharge so they'll eat themselves sitting on the shelf for a week. The Amazon 
Basics (or Eneloops) will last months before they lose significant charge.
If you're going to play with rechargable batteries a good charger is a must, 
The MH-9000 is the gold standard: 
http://www.amazon.com/PowerEx-MH-C9000-WizardOne-Charger-Analyzer-Batteries/dp/B003DIGKOG/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8=1452538148=8-3=maha+charger
-Curt
 

  From: Rich Thomas via Mercedes 
 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com 
Cc: Rich Thomas 
 Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 1:00 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs
   
Get one of the HF things, 40 bucks yer good ta go 
http://www.harborfreight.com/60-led-solar-security-light-69643.html Get 
the 20% coupon and it's $32.  Hard to go wrong.

--R

On 1/11/16 12:54 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
> What I really need is a solar powered lighting fixture with a motion sensor
> to light up my back yard shed.
>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:45 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
>


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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Dwight Giles via Mercedes]

I know fuel  additives are verboten on this list but in the winter I add a
couple ounces of Howes  Diesel  Treat to each tankful. Supposed to boost
cetane, make donkeys fly etc but no gelling in over 10 years even with
subzero temps. OM 602 will start @ 0F without block heater.

Dwight Giles Jr.
1982 300CD
1990 300D
Wickford RI
On Jan 11, 2016 12:30 PM, "Meade Dillon via Mercedes" 
wrote:

> I keep a bottle "Diesel 911" in the trunk for just such an occasion,
> haven't had to use that yet here in SC.  Imagine that!
>
> $1.41 is pretty amazing, filled up both our oil burners at 2.19 / gallon
> last week.  Local grocery chain sells loyal customers gas cards at a 20%
> discount, so my price is really $1.75.
>
> -
> Max
> Charleston SC
>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:59 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > buck41 for dizzel?  That is a Wow.  I saw it upstate a coupla weeks ago
> > for $1.79 at some truck stop, Loves or something, cheapest I have seen it
> > in a long long time.
> >
> > --R
> >
> >
> > On 1/11/16 10:55 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes wrote:
> >
> >> Left the house this morning and down the road the e300 did not want to
> >> go. Turned around and headed back. Died on the way but started back up.
> Got
> >> home checked it out did not see anything so left again and it was fine.
> >> Think with it sitting all weekend and it got down to 8 Sunday morning
> fuel
> >> might have gelled. Now am filling up at $1.41 a gal, wow.
> >>
> >>
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

So will rain.  I think I need to tear apart the door and figure out how
moisture is getting in, or why it isn't draining out.

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:05 PM, OK Don via Mercedes 
wrote:

> Of course, dumping water on the handle guarantees that it will freeze up
> again - - -
>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 11:56 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > I need a built in additive for my master door lock on the '83 300TD.  It
> > froze up again this morning and the lock deicer was ineffective.  I
> dumped
> > hot water on the handle - works every time, although a trifle
> > inconvenient...
> >
>
>
>
> --
> OK Don
>
> *“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of
> our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain
>
> "There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
> learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
> for themselves."
>
> WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
> 2013 F150, 18 mpg
> 2012 Passat TDI DSG, 44 mpg
> 1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Depends how big an area we're talking about, 80 lumens isn't very much, a 60w 
lightbulb is like 800. My Black Diamond spot headlamp is 130 lumens...
This is much more reasonable: 
http://www.amazon.com/Sunforce-82080-80-LED-Solar-Motion/dp/B00FDQPCR2/ref=pd_sim_60_5?ie=UTF8=41WUvC6iBFL=sims=_AC_UL160_SR157%2C160_=0SHY1TN78CARVB49EBARits
 got a 15 foot wire for the panel which I'm sure you could extend if you had 
to, its just going to be 2 wires.
Add a bigger panel 
http://www.amazon.com/ALLPOWERS-Portable-Battery-Cigarette-Charging/dp/B00QRHDIPY/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8=1452538480=8-10=solar+panel
 and it would always be charged even if you had some cloudy days.
-Curt
 

  From: Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
 To: Mercedes Discussion List  
Cc: Andrew Strasfogel 
 Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 1:23 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs
   
This would be perfect to light up my front steps.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B017JIEHIG/ref=sr_1_2_olp?ie=UTF8=1452536038=8-2=solar+motion+lights=new

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:06 PM, Andrew Strasfogel 
wrote:

> That looks perfect although I can't tell how long the connecting cable is
> between the lamp and the solar collector.
>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:00 PM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
>> Get one of the HF things, 40 bucks yer good ta go
>> http://www.harborfreight.com/60-led-solar-security-light-69643.html Get
>> the 20% coupon and it's $32.  Hard to go wrong.
>>
>> --R
>>
>> On 1/11/16 12:54 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
>>
>>> What I really need is a solar powered lighting fixture with a motion
>>> sensor
>>> to light up my back yard shed.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:45 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes <
>>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

My door handle works perfectly EXCEPT when temperatures dip below
freezing.  It's not a lock issue, it's a drainage issue or an issue that
allows water to penetrate into the keyhole and freeze about 1/4" deep into
the keyhole, blocking the key at that point.  Does anyone know whether
water is allowed to penetrate but drain?
.

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:45 PM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Doktor M.B. used to post the annual Chevron diesel fuel report, and I
> remember reading the section on fuel additives / cetane boosters, which is
> not a straight forward problem.  Very few chemicals are effective, and I
> had the impression that the cost / benefit analysis doesn't bode well.
>
> A couple years ago (last I checked) MB posted on the BEVO site that the
> only allowed fuel additives are for killing microbial growth and
> de-watering / anti-gel.
>
> Speaking of which, I need to de-water the tanks of my two oil burners,
> haven't done that yet this cold season...
>
>
>
> -
> Max
> Charleston SC
>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 12:44 PM, Dwight Giles via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > I know fuel  additives are verboten on this list but in the winter I add
> a
> > couple ounces of Howes  Diesel  Treat to each tankful. Supposed to boost
> > cetane, make donkeys fly etc but no gelling in over 10 years even with
> > subzero temps. OM 602 will start @ 0F without block heater.
> >
> > Dwight Giles Jr.
> > 1982 300CD
> > 1990 300D
> > Wickford RI
> >
> >
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

I need a built in additive for my master door lock on the '83 300TD.  It
froze up again this morning and the lock deicer was ineffective.  I dumped
hot water on the handle - works every time, although a trifle
inconvenient...

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 12:53 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I've only ever had one gas of gelled diesel, that was when I bought my '85
> 190D that had been sitting since September in New Jersey down by Atlantic
> City. By the time I got it back to MA in December the fuel didn't want to
> go, it would start but wouldn't go in any gear except first. I let it idle
> for half an hour and it was fine. It only had like 1/4 tank of fuel so I
> filled it up and it was fine from then on.
> -Curt
>
>
>
>   From: Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
>  To: Mercedes Discussion List 
> Cc: Meade Dillon 
>  Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 12:29 PM
>  Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices
>
> I keep a bottle "Diesel 911" in the trunk for just such an occasion,
> haven't had to use that yet here in SC.  Imagine that!
>
> $1.41 is pretty amazing, filled up both our oil burners at 2.19 / gallon
> last week.  Local grocery chain sells loyal customers gas cards at a 20%
> discount, so my price is really $1.75.
>
> -
> Max
> Charleston SC
>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:59 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > buck41 for dizzel?  That is a Wow.  I saw it upstate a coupla weeks ago
> > for $1.79 at some truck stop, Loves or something, cheapest I have seen it
> > in a long long time.
> >
> > --R
> >
> >
> > On 1/11/16 10:55 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes wrote:
> >
> >> Left the house this morning and down the road the e300 did not want to
> >> go. Turned around and headed back. Died on the way but started back up.
> Got
> >> home checked it out did not see anything so left again and it was fine.
> >> Think with it sitting all weekend and it got down to 8 Sunday morning
> fuel
> >> might have gelled. Now am filling up at $1.41 a gal, wow.
> >>
> >>
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Rich Thomas via Mercedes]

Get one of the HF things, 40 bucks yer good ta go 
http://www.harborfreight.com/60-led-solar-security-light-69643.html Get 
the 20% coupon and it's $32.  Hard to go wrong.


--R

On 1/11/16 12:54 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:

What I really need is a solar powered lighting fixture with a motion sensor
to light up my back yard shed.

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:45 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:





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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[OK Don via Mercedes]

Of course, dumping water on the handle guarantees that it will freeze up
again - - -

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 11:56 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I need a built in additive for my master door lock on the '83 300TD.  It
> froze up again this morning and the lock deicer was ineffective.  I dumped
> hot water on the handle - works every time, although a trifle
> inconvenient...
>



-- 
OK Don

*“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of
our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain

"There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves."

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2012 Passat TDI DSG, 44 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

Doktor M.B. used to post the annual Chevron diesel fuel report, and I
remember reading the section on fuel additives / cetane boosters, which is
not a straight forward problem.  Very few chemicals are effective, and I
had the impression that the cost / benefit analysis doesn't bode well.

A couple years ago (last I checked) MB posted on the BEVO site that the
only allowed fuel additives are for killing microbial growth and
de-watering / anti-gel.

Speaking of which, I need to de-water the tanks of my two oil burners,
haven't done that yet this cold season...



-
Max
Charleston SC

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 12:44 PM, Dwight Giles via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I know fuel  additives are verboten on this list but in the winter I add a
> couple ounces of Howes  Diesel  Treat to each tankful. Supposed to boost
> cetane, make donkeys fly etc but no gelling in over 10 years even with
> subzero temps. OM 602 will start @ 0F without block heater.
>
> Dwight Giles Jr.
> 1982 300CD
> 1990 300D
> Wickford RI
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Have you taken the door handle apart and really cleaned it? Back when I first 
had my '83 240D I used to spray a mix of WD40 and carb cleaner into the door 
locks to keep them moving. The guy I sold it to didn't so when I bought it back 
the driver's lock didn't work at all. I ended up having to cut it apart to get 
the wafers out so I could make a new lock.
Assuming you can still work the lock its really easy to take them apart, theres 
2 screws in the door jamb and one at the other end of the handle accessible 
once you have the door panel off. You might not need to loosen that one if the 
last guy in there didn't crank it down too tight. I always have to fight with 
the two rods a bit but with practice its not too bad, easier with the door 
panel off but as long as that one screw isn't too loose its not required.
I don't remember exactly what holds the lock cylinder in, I think its a pin you 
drive out. Leave the key in when you pull it so the wafers and their springs 
don't jump out. HOSE the whole thing down with brake cleaner, really soak it 
good. Then slowly pull the key and work each wafer back and forth while hosing 
it with some more brake cleaner. When its all really clean coat it with your 
preferred lock goop. I've got some PTFE stuff that works really well and repels 
water.
If you don't have the little door that covers the lock you need a replacement 
cylinder, MB doesn't replace just the cover. IIRC they're fairly expensive, 
used should be available. Its not hard to re-key the lock, just transfer the 
wafers over, make sure you move the springs too. Check it before you put it 
back in the car, my experience is that either there are different model 
cylinders or theres some variation in the cylinders so I had to swap wafers 
around or trim some a little to make 'em work.
-Curt
 

  From: Andrew Strasfogel 
 To: Curt Raymond ; Mercedes Discussion List 
 
 Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 12:56 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices
   
I need a built in additive for my master door lock on the '83 300TD.  It froze 
up again this morning and the lock deicer was ineffective.  I dumped hot water 
on the handle - works every time, although a trifle inconvenient...
  
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

I've only ever had one gas of gelled diesel, that was when I bought my '85 190D 
that had been sitting since September in New Jersey down by Atlantic City. By 
the time I got it back to MA in December the fuel didn't want to go, it would 
start but wouldn't go in any gear except first. I let it idle for half an hour 
and it was fine. It only had like 1/4 tank of fuel so I filled it up and it was 
fine from then on.
-Curt

 

  From: Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
 To: Mercedes Discussion List  
Cc: Meade Dillon 
 Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 12:29 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices
   
I keep a bottle "Diesel 911" in the trunk for just such an occasion,
haven't had to use that yet here in SC.  Imagine that!

$1.41 is pretty amazing, filled up both our oil burners at 2.19 / gallon
last week.  Local grocery chain sells loyal customers gas cards at a 20%
discount, so my price is really $1.75.

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:59 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> buck41 for dizzel?  That is a Wow.  I saw it upstate a coupla weeks ago
> for $1.79 at some truck stop, Loves or something, cheapest I have seen it
> in a long long time.
>
> --R
>
>
> On 1/11/16 10:55 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes wrote:
>
>> Left the house this morning and down the road the e300 did not want to
>> go. Turned around and headed back. Died on the way but started back up. Got
>> home checked it out did not see anything so left again and it was fine.
>> Think with it sitting all weekend and it got down to 8 Sunday morning fuel
>> might have gelled. Now am filling up at $1.41 a gal, wow.
>>
>>
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

What I really need is a solar powered lighting fixture with a motion sensor
to light up my back yard shed.

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:45 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> You can buy LEDs with the resistor already integrated.
>>
>
> Better to supply your own.
>
> LED's, like _most_ semiconductors, may not be wired directly
> in parallel.  Most semiconductors have a positive temperature
> coefficient, which means they draw _more_ current as they heat
> up.  Resulting in more heat, thus yet more current, and thermal
> runaway, and device failure.  (Incandescent lamps have a negative
> temperature coefficient, which means they balance naturally when
> used in parallel.)
>
> So, for LED supplies you either need a bunch of LED's in series,
> with _one_ current limiter, or you parallel the LED _and_ its
> individual current limiter, times N, or some kind of series-parallel
> arrangement representing both approaches.
>
> For a 12V supply I'd stack perhaps 3 3.6V LED's in series, and
> use one resistor, making one 12V lamp bank.  Times as many banks
> in parallel as you needed to get sufficient light.
>
> Remember that a simple resistor as a current limiter represents
> totally wasted power.  Less resistors/resistance == longer
> battery life.
>
> More complex circuits resembling switching power supplies are
> not uncommon.  What you are after is a constant _current_ supply,
> not a constant _voltage_ supply.
>
> Certainly when I strung them up in series they wouldn't do anything...
>>
>
> Either you didn't wire them in the same direction, cathode to anode,
> or you didn't have enough voltage to push any current through their
> stacked junction voltages.  Either will keep the photons inside...
>
> -- Jim
>
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

This would be perfect to light up my front steps.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B017JIEHIG/ref=sr_1_2_olp?ie=UTF8=1452536038=8-2=solar+motion+lights=new

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:06 PM, Andrew Strasfogel 
wrote:

> That looks perfect although I can't tell how long the connecting cable is
> between the lamp and the solar collector.
>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:00 PM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
>> Get one of the HF things, 40 bucks yer good ta go
>> http://www.harborfreight.com/60-led-solar-security-light-69643.html Get
>> the 20% coupon and it's $32.  Hard to go wrong.
>>
>> --R
>>
>> On 1/11/16 12:54 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
>>
>>> What I really need is a solar powered lighting fixture with a motion
>>> sensor
>>> to light up my back yard shed.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:45 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes <
>>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
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>>
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>>
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>
>>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Curly McLain via Mercedes]

What I really need is a solar powered lighting fixture with a motion sensor
to light up my back yard shed.



Go to HF.

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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

How many acres comprise the wooded Dan Penoff back 40?

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 2:57 PM, fmiser via Mercedes 
wrote:

> > Curt wrote:
> >
> > If you're going to play with
> > rechargable batteries a good charger is a must,
>
> I agree!
>
> > The MH-9000 is the gold standard:
>
> http://www.amazon.com/PowerEx-MH-C9000-WizardOne-Charger-Analyzer-Batteries/dp/B003DIGKOG/
>
> The LaCross BC-700 is a mighty sweet charger for a lot less.
>
> http://www.amazon.com/Crosse-Technology-BC-700-Battery-Charger/dp/B000RSOV50/
>
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

Yeah, now we're talking.  Thanks!

On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:55 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Depends how big an area we're talking about, 80 lumens isn't very much, a
> 60w lightbulb is like 800. My Black Diamond spot headlamp is 130 lumens...
> This is much more reasonable:
> http://www.amazon.com/Sunforce-82080-80-LED-Solar-Motion/dp/B00FDQPCR2/ref=pd_sim_60_5?ie=UTF8=41WUvC6iBFL=sims=_AC_UL160_SR157%2C160_=0SHY1TN78CARVB49EBARits
> got a 15 foot wire for the panel which I'm sure you could extend if you had
> to, its just going to be 2 wires.
> Add a bigger panel
> http://www.amazon.com/ALLPOWERS-Portable-Battery-Cigarette-Charging/dp/B00QRHDIPY/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8=1452538480=8-10=solar+panel
>  and
> it would always be charged even if you had some cloudy days.
> -Curt
>
>
>   From: Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
>  To: Mercedes Discussion List 
> Cc: Andrew Strasfogel 
>  Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 1:23 PM
>  Subject: Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs
>
> This would be perfect to light up my front steps.
>
>
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B017JIEHIG/ref=sr_1_2_olp?ie=UTF8=1452536038=8-2=solar+motion+lights=new
>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:06 PM, Andrew Strasfogel 
> wrote:
>
> > That looks perfect although I can't tell how long the connecting cable is
> > between the lamp and the solar collector.
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:00 PM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes <
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Get one of the HF things, 40 bucks yer good ta go
> >> http://www.harborfreight.com/60-led-solar-security-light-69643.html Get
> >> the 20% coupon and it's $32.  Hard to go wrong.
> >>
> >> --R
> >>
> >> On 1/11/16 12:54 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
> >>
> >>> What I really need is a solar powered lighting fixture with a motion
> >>> sensor
> >>> to light up my back yard shed.
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:45 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes <
> >>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> http://www.okiebenz.com
> >>
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> >>
> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >>
> >>
> >
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>
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

I might get one for the wood room where we store firewood for the week. Its got 
no lights at all. If I put it high it'd light the whole room and doorway to 
make night time firewood loading much easier. Should last pretty well for that 
job with just the little solar panel, it wouldn't be on more than an hour a 
week I wouldn't think.
-Curt
 

  From: Dan Penoff via Mercedes 
 To: Mercedes Discussion List  
Cc: Dan Penoff 
 Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 2:23 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs
   
Thanks, Curt, this is good stuff!

I've been sort of considering a solar motion lamp for the backyard, as we have 
no light out there and no circuits in the general vicinity that I could tap 
into to add a floodlight. We don't go out there much at night, but if we need 
to it's pretty darn dark. The property is wooded as well, which makes it even 
harder to see at night.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 11, 2016, at 2:12 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Yeah, now we're talking.  Thanks!
> 
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:55 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
>> Depends how big an area we're talking about, 80 lumens isn't very much, a
>> 60w lightbulb is like 800. My Black Diamond spot headlamp is 130 lumens...
>> This is much more reasonable:
>> http://www.amazon.com/Sunforce-82080-80-LED-Solar-Motion/dp/B00FDQPCR2/ref=pd_sim_60_5?ie=UTF8=41WUvC6iBFL=sims=_AC_UL160_SR157%2C160_=0SHY1TN78CARVB49EBARits
>> got a 15 foot wire for the panel which I'm sure you could extend if you had
>> to, its just going to be 2 wires.
>> Add a bigger panel
>> http://www.amazon.com/ALLPOWERS-Portable-Battery-Cigarette-Charging/dp/B00QRHDIPY/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8=1452538480=8-10=solar+panel
>>  and
>> it would always be charged even if you had some cloudy days.
>> -Curt
>> 
>> 
>>      From: Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
>> To: Mercedes Discussion List 
>> Cc: Andrew Strasfogel 
>> Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 1:23 PM
>> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs
>> 
>> This would be perfect to light up my front steps.
>> 
>> 
>> http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B017JIEHIG/ref=sr_1_2_olp?ie=UTF8=1452536038=8-2=solar+motion+lights=new
>> 
>> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:06 PM, Andrew Strasfogel 
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> That looks perfect although I can't tell how long the connecting cable is
>>> between the lamp and the solar collector.
>>> 
>>> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:00 PM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes <
>>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>> 
 Get one of the HF things, 40 bucks yer good ta go
 http://www.harborfreight.com/60-led-solar-security-light-69643.html Get
 the 20% coupon and it's $32.  Hard to go wrong.
 
 --R
 
> On 1/11/16 12:54 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
> 
> What I really need is a solar powered lighting fixture with a motion
> sensor
> to light up my back yard shed.
> 
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:45 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
 
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Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices

[clay via Mercedes]

Use some Tri-flow.  

Locksmith gets all manner of business cleaning out the graphite and other snot 
people put in the keyholes.  He only uses Tri-flow to lubricate and free 
locksets

clay


On Jan 11, 2016, at 9:56 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:

> I need a built in additive for my master door lock on the '83 300TD.  It
> froze up again this morning and the lock deicer was ineffective.  I dumped
> hot water on the handle - works every time, although a trifle
> inconvenient...
> 
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 12:53 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
>> I've only ever had one gas of gelled diesel, that was when I bought my '85
>> 190D that had been sitting since September in New Jersey down by Atlantic
>> City. By the time I got it back to MA in December the fuel didn't want to
>> go, it would start but wouldn't go in any gear except first. I let it idle
>> for half an hour and it was fine. It only had like 1/4 tank of fuel so I
>> filled it up and it was fine from then on.
>> -Curt
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>  From: Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
>> To: Mercedes Discussion List 
>> Cc: Meade Dillon 
>> Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 12:29 PM
>> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuel gelling and diesel prices
>> 
>> I keep a bottle "Diesel 911" in the trunk for just such an occasion,
>> haven't had to use that yet here in SC.  Imagine that!
>> 
>> $1.41 is pretty amazing, filled up both our oil burners at 2.19 / gallon
>> last week.  Local grocery chain sells loyal customers gas cards at a 20%
>> discount, so my price is really $1.75.
>> 
>> -
>> Max
>> Charleston SC
>> 
>> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:59 AM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes <
>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> buck41 for dizzel?  That is a Wow.  I saw it upstate a coupla weeks ago
>>> for $1.79 at some truck stop, Loves or something, cheapest I have seen it
>>> in a long long time.
>>> 
>>> --R
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 1/11/16 10:55 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes wrote:
>>> 
 Left the house this morning and down the road the e300 did not want to
 go. Turned around and headed back. Died on the way but started back up.
>> Got
 home checked it out did not see anything so left again and it was fine.
 Think with it sitting all weekend and it got down to 8 Sunday morning
>> fuel
 might have gelled. Now am filling up at $1.41 a gal, wow.
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[fmiser via Mercedes]

> Curt wrote:
> 
> If you're going to play with
> rechargable batteries a good charger is a must,

I agree!

> The MH-9000 is the gold standard: 
http://www.amazon.com/PowerEx-MH-C9000-WizardOne-Charger-Analyzer-Batteries/dp/B003DIGKOG/

The LaCross BC-700 is a mighty sweet charger for a lot less.
http://www.amazon.com/Crosse-Technology-BC-700-Battery-Charger/dp/B000RSOV50/

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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

Thanks, Curt, this is good stuff!

I've been sort of considering a solar motion lamp for the backyard, as we have 
no light out there and no circuits in the general vicinity that I could tap 
into to add a floodlight. We don't go out there much at night, but if we need 
to it's pretty darn dark. The property is wooded as well, which makes it even 
harder to see at night.

Dan

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 11, 2016, at 2:12 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Yeah, now we're talking.  Thanks!
> 
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:55 PM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
>> Depends how big an area we're talking about, 80 lumens isn't very much, a
>> 60w lightbulb is like 800. My Black Diamond spot headlamp is 130 lumens...
>> This is much more reasonable:
>> http://www.amazon.com/Sunforce-82080-80-LED-Solar-Motion/dp/B00FDQPCR2/ref=pd_sim_60_5?ie=UTF8=41WUvC6iBFL=sims=_AC_UL160_SR157%2C160_=0SHY1TN78CARVB49EBARits
>> got a 15 foot wire for the panel which I'm sure you could extend if you had
>> to, its just going to be 2 wires.
>> Add a bigger panel
>> http://www.amazon.com/ALLPOWERS-Portable-Battery-Cigarette-Charging/dp/B00QRHDIPY/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8=1452538480=8-10=solar+panel
>>  and
>> it would always be charged even if you had some cloudy days.
>> -Curt
>> 
>> 
>>  From: Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
>> To: Mercedes Discussion List 
>> Cc: Andrew Strasfogel 
>> Sent: Monday, January 11, 2016 1:23 PM
>> Subject: Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs
>> 
>> This would be perfect to light up my front steps.
>> 
>> 
>> http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B017JIEHIG/ref=sr_1_2_olp?ie=UTF8=1452536038=8-2=solar+motion+lights=new
>> 
>> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:06 PM, Andrew Strasfogel 
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> That looks perfect although I can't tell how long the connecting cable is
>>> between the lamp and the solar collector.
>>> 
>>> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 1:00 PM, Rich Thomas via Mercedes <
>>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>> 
 Get one of the HF things, 40 bucks yer good ta go
 http://www.harborfreight.com/60-led-solar-security-light-69643.html Get
 the 20% coupon and it's $32.  Hard to go wrong.
 
 --R
 
> On 1/11/16 12:54 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
> 
> What I really need is a solar powered lighting fixture with a motion
> sensor
> to light up my back yard shed.
> 
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:45 AM, Jim Cathey via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
 
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

Very few, but our property abuts a very dense forest who's tree canopy extends 
over our property. As a result, even on a moonlit night it's still very dark 
out back.

I'm only concerned with having some light around the screen door that opens 
from the lanai into the back yard.

I considered one of the HF lights, but they didn't look very substantial and 
had poor reviews.

Dan

> On Jan 11, 2016, at 3:05 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> How many acres comprise the wooded Dan Penoff back 40?
> 
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 2:57 PM, fmiser via Mercedes 
> wrote:
> 
>>> Curt wrote:
>>> 
>>> If you're going to play with
>>> rechargable batteries a good charger is a must,
>> 
>> I agree!
>> 
>>> The MH-9000 is the gold standard:
>> 
>> http://www.amazon.com/PowerEx-MH-C9000-WizardOne-Charger-Analyzer-Batteries/dp/B003DIGKOG/
>> 
>> The LaCross BC-700 is a mighty sweet charger for a lot less.
>> 
>> http://www.amazon.com/Crosse-Technology-BC-700-Battery-Charger/dp/B000RSOV50/
>> 
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Re: [MBZ] Using LEDs - was OT: Politics are angrier polls

[fmiser via Mercedes]

> Curt wrote:
> 
> Looking around I found a bag of through hole LEDs I'd
> bought but never used. Dropping one cell from my battery
> pack gives me 3.6v using rechargeable batteries which I
> tested and appeared to be acceptable with my 35ma LEDs so I
> rewired the thing with those.

Again, the LEDs don't really care what the voltage is - so
long as they only have 35 ma passing through.  This is NOT
how most electrical devices work.

Using no resistor means you are depending on the source
impedance to limit the current.  It so happens that NiCd and
NiMh cells have a much lower internal resistance than
alkaline.  Therefore the LEDs will be brighter with
rechargeable than with primary cells - even though if they
are both the same voltage.

> I finished it last night and testing shows that it works
> pretty well for a reading light (its intended purpose)
> although it could stand a little work aiming the LEDs
> better.

Good!  If it works, the math is academic. *smiles*

With the through hole LEDs, it _is_ possible to aim
them.  If you don't want the focused spot, you may be able to
turn them into very wide angle.  I have filed the rounded top
off of many of them to get rid of the lens.  If you do that,
be careful to not take off so much you run into the wires
inside.

> I think you missed the point of my diode, I've got a single
> pole single throw 3 position switch. On low it activates
> one string of lights, on high it activates both.

You're right.  I missed that. *weak smile*

> Also in my experiments LEDs must be used in parallel
> which matches my understanding of how they work. Because
> they are one way valves the electrical pixies won't pass
> through like they would a normal valve. Certainly when I
> strung them up in series they wouldn't do anything... 

The problem with parallel LEDs has to do with the nature of a
diode.  Below the voltage threshold, no current flows.  Once
the threshold has been exceeded, the diode (LED) will flow
_huge_ amounts of current.  It is practically a switch.  To
survive, the current must be limited.  Either from the
batteries internal resistance or from a resistor etc.

The threshold voltage is a "typical" value.  Each device will
vary by a little bit.  If there are two 3.6 V LEDs, and one
is actually 3.599 and the other is 3.601, the voltage may
never reach 3.061 because the 5.599 diode has conducted all
the current the limiting resistor has allowed through.  If
you engineered the circuit expecting the diodes to share the
current, and one has "robbed" it all, it won't last very long.

That said, the 3.6 V white or blue LEDs seem to behave better
than the 0.7 V single color LEDs in a parallel circuit.

And using battery power without a separate current limiter
does warp the math a bit. 

To run them in series, remember to add the voltages, so three
3.6 V LEDs will have a threshold voltage of 10.8 V.


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