Subject: RE: a warning to voice over users concerning IOS 6
Even if the App Store weren't accessible, we would still have had our
computers. Honestly when I read the subject line, I thought: Ah crap. We're
screwed now, but in the grand scheme of things, this is hardly the alarm it
was cracked
or any Apple products.--Joe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Marco Migotti
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 11:32 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: a warning to voice over users concerning IOS 6
I am thankful
Of Marco Migotti
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 11:32 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: a warning to voice over users concerning IOS 6
I am thankful to apple for voiceover, however, that doesn't make me a lover
of the apple company. I love my windows machine and when ms
If Apple will continue as is on naking its products accessible is exactly wasI
was asking myself awhile ago, especially with the talk these past few days on
here about the App store breaking Voiceover accessible, as I asked myself what
could I expect on ny next IPhone in Febuary of 2014 when
Theresa,
I'm not sure what you mean by the capitalist economy since all economies are
capitalist in nature. In fact I'd argue that without capitalism Apple would not
have any incentive to consider accessibility. I'm not sure where charities fit
into this conversation either. The fact is APple
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Joanne Chua
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 6:52 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple's commitment to accessibility [was Re: a warning to
voice over users concerning IOS 6]
Hi David
Chua
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 6:52 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple's commitment to accessibility [was Re: a warning to
voice over users concerning IOS 6]
Hi David,
If that is the case of what you said, we poor blind people, why Apple
should care on putting
Hi, Scott,
My response was regarding Joanne's sentiment that more should be done for blind
people because we need it. Well, not all economies are Capitalist, but that's a
side issue. In any case, my point was that I applaud Apple's commitment, but I
don't see them spending a lot of money on
Right, I agree with everything here. I'm just wondering though if Apple
didn't realize that creating an accessible mobile platform wasn't going
to give them an edge or open up new opportunities in government, small
business and educational facilities. I mean if Android had made this
paradigm shift
Hello,
Like Windows, Apple relied on a 3rd party program, OutSpoken, for blindness
accessibility back in the 90's. When Berkeley Systems went out of business,
another company bought OutSpoken from them, but only worked on the PC version
of OutSpoken for a couple years. The new company let the
Microsoft, Palm, and Apple were all trying to find the holy grail of
touch-screen access. Apple's first attempt, the Newton, was a spectacular
failure. Palm took an early lead, then Microsoft moved ahead and Palm folded.
Then, Apple found their first major success with the iPod with click
Sure, this info comes from the world blind union and is the most recent
published numbers I could locate. They state 39 million out of 6.7 billion meet
the US legal definition of blindness.
David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone
Even if the App Store weren't accessible, we would still have had our
computers. Honestly when I read the subject line, I thought: Ah crap. We're
screwed now, but in the grand scheme of things, this is hardly the alarm it
was cracked up to be.--Joe
--
You received this message because you are
I really, really hope something with the app store is the biggest
problem. I hope there is no problem, including with the app store, but
if there is, then I hope that would be the biggest thing. As we knew
and they have already proven, that can be fixed easily from their end.
Plus there are many
out.
Marco
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Joe
Sent: September-18-12 7:56 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: a warning to voice over users concerning IOS 6
Even if the App Store weren't accessible, we would still
, September 16, 2012 9:23 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: a warning to voice over users concerning IOS 6
Yup, I can confirm this. I tend to do very specific searches so hadn't seen
the full implications of this before. So I apologise for my previous post
which didn't really convey
Marc,
Before folks go running off on a tangent about accessibility, Steve Jobs, and
so forth I think it is important to point out:
1. Steve Jobs, although a great man, was not the exclusive determining factor
for Voiceover in Apple's products.
2. Just because Steve has passed on does not mean
@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Shawn Krasniuk
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 2:21 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: a warning to voice over users concerning IOS 6
Hi. I might also wait for others to report if the App Store issue is fixed.
I hate the fact that if I want to install
@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: a warning to voice over users concerning IOS 6
Hi. I might also wait for others to report if the App Store issue is fixed.
I hate the fact that if I want to install an app I have to connect my
iPhone
to Itunes. It's a load of crap in my opinion.
Shawn
Sent from
Hey Scott,
I totally understand what you mean. Like I said, I'm trying not to
jump the gun or anything -- it's more a paranoia of mine than a valid
fear. I fully acknowledge that Apple has too much money to lose if
they drop accessibility from their products, especially with the
communities that
Just two other points here. Accessibility like any other project may
have it's priority rise and fall as other projects priorities change or
as Apple perceives it's lead in the accessibility area growing or
shrinking. this is no different than any other project.
I agree that Apple has done a lot
You know I've not been much a fan of Chrome or the ChromVox, but you know I
understand it is still early in its development. WHat I am pleased by is the
fact that GOogle also is investing in accessibility and I hope other companies
will see the benefits and jump on the wagon as well. Do I want
Hi Sandy. Yes, I was talking about the App Store in IOS 6. If I have to plug my
phone in to buy apps and everything like that, I'll just wait until they fix it
and then I'll upgrade.
Shawn
Sent from my white Mac Book
On 2012-09-17, at 10:39 AM, viphone@googlegroups.com wrote:
--
You
over users concerning IOS 6
Hi Sandy. Yes, I was talking about the App Store in IOS 6. If I have to plug
my phone in to buy apps and everything like that, I'll just wait until they
fix it and then I'll upgrade.
Shawn
Sent from my white Mac Book
On 2012-09-17, at 10:39 AM, viphone
@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of
Shawn Krasniuk
Sent: Tuesday, 18 September 2012 6:15 a.m.
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: a warning to voice over users concerning IOS 6
Hi Sandy. Yes, I was talking about the App Store in IOS 6. If I have to plug
my phone
Do not consider 100,000 iPhones to blind folk to be much of a market in this
case. This number represents 0.3% of 1 quarter year of Apple's iPhone sales,
but includes all models of iPhones for the past 3 years. In other words, if
Apple were to stop supporting VO, they wouldn't even notice the
hi folks,
maybe this is the new big supricing bug for ios6. now the maybe fixed the tts
lost bug from ios5. ;)
in every ios release there is one bug that is very annoying and take apple a
year to fix. :)
think of the misspronauntiation of the tts in ios4 :)
hopefully I'm wrong ;)
Mvg
-Peter
Hello,
I must differ with you about Apple's accessibility compared with other
mainstream companies.
Apple is unique in that they are making all of their physical products as
accessible as possible (we cannot say all of their products since iCloud
accessibility online is only partial).
IBM
The fact is, before apple came out with their revolutionary touch-based screen
reader, it was not believed blind people could work with touch screens in such
a way. The closest thing was Mobile Speak who turned the touch-screen in to 4
large buttons, and created an invisible talking keyboard
David,
True, but my point is that although a small portion of the overall sales, APple
still considers this segment worth the investment. I would love to know what
the real numbers are across all Apple products including the Macs.
On Sep 17, 2012, at 4:19 PM, David Chittenden
Yes and that is why APple is so innovative. I have always felt that there would
be a way for blind people to use a touch interface and Apple made it happen in
a much more meaningful way than Code Factory did with their approach. I'm not
saying CF was wrong in their approach necessarily, but it
I agree with David here, but I also wonder how much of Apple's sales are
effected by their commitment to accessibility. For example, how many
government sales or small business sales or educational sales wouldn't
have even been possible if they weren't able to demonstrate that they
had an
I agree with everything you said. I never meant to imply that any one
was doing as much as Apple. I just wanted to point out that their are
other companies who do have a commitment to accessibility.
Furthermore, I think part of Apple's justification was related to
governmental regulations (not
track. Thanks to all.
Reggie
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Scott Howell
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 11:29 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: a warning to voice over users concerning IOS 6
You know I've
I don't feel that is relevant and no I do not take anything from CF as far as
what they accomplished. I do not believe though that Apple took anything from
what CF learned.
On Sep 17, 2012, at 5:23 PM, Kawal Gucukoglu kawa...@me.com wrote:
But you will agree or some of you will, Code Factory
Hi,
It might seems like there're only 100,000 vip iphone users in the
states, however, lets not forget those who's not in the states, and
who is using the iphone as much as the vip users in the states.
More so, perhaps 50% of these user, (those who users an iphone) would
have second Apple
Hi,
I really do think, the amount of voiceover users using IOS and Macs, is the
often mentioned drop in the bucket as far as pure numbers are concerned. I'm
not saying we are any more or less important than the average user. I'm just
saying, lets not over estimate our numbers, or, scheme in
You are correct for the Mac. For iOS devices, however, this is not the case.
Most of the professional proofs and studies clearly demonstrated that blind
peepul, as a whole, did not have the necessary spatial awareness, and
attempting to memorise, without good tactile clues, would be almost
The fact is, blindness, including legal blindness, is between .5% and .6% of
the world population. We are a very tiny minority of any population. Many
companies have discontinued products which were very popular amongst the blind
because the sighted were not interested. We do not matter when
over users concerning IOS 6
Yes and that is why APple is so innovative. I have always felt that there
would be a way for blind people to use a touch interface and Apple made it
happen in a much more meaningful way than Code Factory did with their
approach. I'm not saying CF was wrong in their approach
Hi David,
If that is the case of what you said, we poor blind people, why
Apple should care on putting voiceover in their touch screen products?
Not only that, Apple also advertise that their products are friendly
to people with access needs.
Just a thought
Regards
Joanne
On 18/09/2012, David
Hello,
Please forgive my cynicism in my final statement of those poor blind people. I
am preparing my proposal for my doctoral research. My proposed topic is how are
blind people able to adapt to touch screen devices, so I am currently reading
all the academic and professional research I can
The issue of blind folk and touch screens is quite fascinating. I've always had
trouble with spatial orientation, and if it weren't for the constant audible
feedback, I'd get losT on a Magic Trackpad for the Mac or the screen on my
IPOD. That said, I am really beginning to appreciate the
How do you know Apple wouldn't have lost any educational or governmental
contracts if they hadn't made IOS accessible? I recall a situation where
the DoJ blocked the use of Kindles (at least I think it was Kindles) to
distribute text books as ebooks. Plus, more and more businesses are
using and
to accessibility [was Re: a warning to voice
over users concerning IOS 6]
Hello,
Please forgive my cynicism in my final statement of those poor blind people. I
am preparing my proposal for my doctoral research. My proposed topic is how are
blind people able to adapt to touch screen devices, so I
Hello,
First, don't confuse timelines. Original Android accessibility was only with
physical buttons and keyboards, and this was after VO was released on the
iPhone.
Before VO was released on the iPhone, it was known that accessibility was not
very possible on a touch-screen. In other words,
of.
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of
David Chittenden
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 9:41 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple's commitment to accessibility [was Re: a warning to voice
over users concerning IOS 6
@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Joanne Chua
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 6:52 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple's commitment to accessibility [was Re: a warning to
voice over users concerning IOS 6]
Hi David,
If that is the case of what you said, we
Yup, I can confirm this. I tend to do very specific searches so hadn't seen
the full implications of this before. So I apologise for my previous post
which didn't really convey the enormity of this. Updating apps work as I
described, but this is very serious. Let's hope something can be done
[mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Jonathan Mosen
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2012 9:23 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: a warning to voice over users concerning IOS 6
Yup, I can confirm this. I tend to do very specific searches so hadn't seen
the full implications of this before
Wow, I sincerely hope that app developers who use VoiceOver have been
reporting these problems to Apple's accessibility team. This is
something I always fear with their redesigns, especially now that
Steve Jobs is no longer with us. Obviously I'm trying not to jump the
gun but the changes
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