2011/11/10 benjayk <benjamin.jaku...@googlemail.com> > > > Quentin Anciaux-2 wrote: > > > > 2011/11/10 benjayk <benjamin.jaku...@googlemail.com> > > > >> > >> > >> Spudboy100 wrote: > >> > > >> > > >> > In a message dated 11/9/2011 7:27:48 AM Eastern Standard Time, > >> > benjamin.jaku...@googlemail.com writes: > >> > > >> > Probably the one that is most convincing is direct experience. Try > >> > meditation (my favorite is just doing nothing while being aware not > to > >> > snooze or think or search for something to do,etc...), or, if you are > >> a > >> > bit > >> > more daring and very cautious and well informed, psychdelic drugs (eg > >> > Salvia, Mushrooms, LSD, DMT) or suspend your belief that you are just > >> a > >> > person for long enough (then the reality of unity tends to reveal > >> itself > >> > spotaneously). If you are in the right mindset and maybe a bit lucky > >> you > >> > can > >> > experience states in which it is directly evident that there is > >> > fundamentally no other, just this consciousness that you are. > >> > > >> > > >> > I see, Benjamin. But unless one takes these visions as a solipsism, I > >> > would > >> > ask, what does this bring to the table? We humans are primates, and > >> for > >> > most of us primates, we are group animals. We need each other even > >> though > >> > we > >> > irritate each other. > >> What I am describing can be said to be a kind of solipsism; only I > exist, > >> but I being the consciousness that we all share, > > > > I can't make a meaning of that... we do not share a "consciousness", not > > in > > any definition of that term. > > > I am not speaking about anything definable. Whatever can be defined is just > a concept. You can't define your way to an understanding of consciousness, > just like you can't define things to find out what ice cream tastes like. > Trying to define the taste of ice cream is quite a futile endavour - the > most you could give as a definition is a paraphrase and this by itself > won't > make it clear at all what it tastes like. > > That we share a consciousness (or rather, are that one consciousness), can > only be recognized by the consciousness itself (that is, you), not inferred > through some apparent relation of objects or persons (or some description > or > definition). It is not hidden that there is just this consciousness now, > and > there is nothing else to find. That's why no else can have another > consciousness. It is nowhere to be found. Just your consciousness can be > found. > > Why would you believe that I have another consciousness, when you can never > access it, and I am even telling you that I don't have it.
Well fine, another zombi on the list then. > There is no > evidence for such an "other" to your consciousness. > The evidence is that I'm conscious, and I infer that "objects" that interact with me the way I do, must be conscious too, ie: have qualia, have a 1st person perspective. You say you don't... ok fine. > If you say you can infer it, then I ask by what means? We can infer > existence of other objects, but only because we already directly see that > different objects can exist as content of consciousness. But we never ever > witnessed something like a different consciousness I witness behavior, and for such behavior to occur, qualia must occur. > and so have nothing which > we could base the claim that there is different consciousness on. > Solipsism is false. > It is not even clear to me what other consciousness could even mean. Someone not being you. > Could > you attempt to give an explanation? > > Quentin > benjayk > -- > View this message in context: > http://old.nabble.com/The-consciousness-singularity-tp32803353p32820987.html > Sent from the Everything List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To post to this group, send email to email@example.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. > > -- All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to firstname.lastname@example.org. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.