On Monday, November 5, 2018 at 5:39:42 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 4 Nov 2018, at 14:53, John Clark <[email protected] <javascript:>> > wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 4, 2018 at 6:23 AM Philip Thrift <[email protected] > <javascript:>> wrote: > > *> If experience (Galen Strawson, The Subject of Experience) is the result >> of information (only) processing, * >> > > If? If information is not the thing that needs processing to produce > intelligence then what is? > > > then the argument for arithmetical (Platonic) reality holds. >> > > Only if somebody can show how information, or anything else, can be > processed without using matter that obeys the laws of physics. > > > > Information processing (computation) has been first discovered in > arithmetic, where there is no matter. > > The fact that the physical reality is Turing-complete explains how we can > build machine doing it, but unfortunately, if “matter” is taken seriously > as primitive, the person itself can no more be attached to any particular > body. > > Eventually, it is the very notion of primitive matter, or physicalism, > which needs to be abandonned if we assume Mechanism or Computationalism. > > Of course to get this, you need a bit more than the UDA step 3 … > > Please, try to convince someone else to explain what is wrong in the step > 3, as you did not succeed in making your point up to now. > > > And, despite the existence of books made of dead trees with black > squiggles made of ink with a high Carbon content pressed onto them, nobody > has even come close to doing that. > > > > It is born in that way. Study any book in the field. You are confusing > everyone on this. > > Bruno >
"Physics" to me is physics theories written in some language (in 2018, who knows what language it will be in 2118). It is a language that can be used to write the Standard Model and Einstein equation(s). *e.g.* *This version of the Standard Model is written in the Lagrangian form.* https://www.symmetrymagazine.org/article/the-deconstructed-standard-model-equation The language and the models written in the language are not the reality itself. It is a mistake to use "physical reality" to correspond to material reality. Material reality may not be be Turing computable. - pt -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
