[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread shempmcgurk
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
 
  shempmcgurk wrote:
 snip
  Concentrated wealth in the hands of those responsible for 
creating 
  it is a GREAT thing and should be encourated.
  
   Bhairitu, if you tax it, it goes to government which will NOT 
use 
   it wisely.  It WILL be used more wisely by those that create 
the 
   wealth.
  
  History shows that not to be true at all.  Most are just greedy 
  bastards who care little about their fellow humanity.  People 
like 
  Bill Gates are a rare exception but as I stated earlier he has 
  always had a mood of detachment from his wealth which I 
  particularly noted in a local Seattle interview with him in 1991.
  
  You still don't get that a progressive tax means people won't 
try 
  to earn another dime if they are going to pay more in taxes.  So 
  the government doesn't get anything.  They're already wealthy 
and 
  anything more is just an ego driven power trip.   This lets 
others 
  have more of a chance.
 
 I was just reading in the Times about Richard Grasso,
 who, making $12 million a year, went through all kinds
 of contortions to obtain his $140 million retirement
 package.
 
 At some point in the accumulation of wealth, money
 ceases to be a medium of exchange and becomes something
 entirely different, having to do, as Bhairitu suggests,
 with ego and power.  Your attitude toward it changes
 in a way that makes it literally impossible to empathize
 with the person for whom, say, fresh blueberries are
 a luxury they can't afford.
 
 You no longer have to make choices based on what
 something costs.  Money becomes an abstraction with no
 practical consequences in terms of what you do with it,
 except those that have to do with how much *more* of
 this abstraction you are able to accumulate.



Alas.  You've just described big government!

A $2.8 trillion budget without any care what it costs, Congressmen --
 and Presidents for that matter! -- spend, spend, spend.




 
 When rich people talk about money, they're talking
 about something entirely different from what poor and
 middle-class people mean when they talk about it.
 They might as well be on different planets.


Of course.

Rich people, having the experience of vast wealth, know by 
experience that money doesn't buy happiness.  Poorer people don't 
have that experience.

That is why it is SO important that we ensure that the poorest of 
the poor have enough money to buy the basic necessities of life and, 
hopefully, a pint of blueberries whenever they  see and desire it on 
the produce shelves.

That is why, dear Billie Batts, you should join me in encouraging 
capitalist enterprises like Wal-Mart toward all success so that the 
poor which you invoke above have their blueberries.










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[FairfieldLife] Why Meditate

2006-06-25 Thread suziezuzie
I would be curious to know why people practice TM. Whether it be 
experiential reasons or philosophical or both, what are the reasons why 
you sit down once or twice a day and practice TM and the sidhis? What 
do you gain at the time you practice, afterwards, in the short run, 
long run and does an afterlife belief have anything to do with your 
practice? 






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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread Robert Gimbel
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel babajii_99@ 
 wrote:
 
  Free Saddam Hussein;
Both of his sons are dead;
And he is an old man now;
Tired and burned out.
Let him save his country from civil war;
Before he dies;
He never killed as many as we have;
So, we've failed to bring the American Style democracy;
But the hatreds go to deep;
We had a civil war too;
North and South;
The bloodiest to date.
Let them fight it out,
Amongst themselves.
 
R.Gimbel   Philadelphia,PA.
  
  
  -
  Yahoo! Groups gets better. Check out the new email design. Plus 
 there's much more to come.
 
 
 Having just read
 The article linked from here
 On Timothy Leary
 I can only imagine
 That Nimbel Gimbel
 Is heavily sedated
 On mind-altering
 Drugs

In attempting to justify this war, with false info;
And capturing the leader of this country;
I meant to point out;
That this whole Iraqi adventure;
Has been insane, and has produced
No good thing for America;
In taking an opposite viewpoint,
Of suggesting that we admit we were mistaken;
And that 'might does not make right'(shock  awe; mission 
accomplished);
Then suggesting the Democrats are weak on defense;
By not going along with(keep the course of insanity).
The fact is:
The U.S. has killed more Iraqis,
Then Saddam ever did.
Robert Gimbel






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Jesus is coming, and man is he unstressing!

2006-06-25 Thread off_world_beings
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, off_world_beings 
 no_reply@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ 
  wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajranatha@ wrote:
Kansas Pastor...
Pastor Hubbard seriously questions the group's claims, 
  however.   
In April, he and other pastors sent a signed letter to the 
  local  
newspaper stating that the TM group's members are welcome 
 but 
must recognize that they and the church are at 
 odds, competing 
for the eternal souls of people. 
   
   This makes me wonder what souls are going for
   these days. Do they have a monetary value or
   does one collect them like green stamps, and 
   get some kind of prize when you have a book 
   full of them?
  
  
  
  I think they only want the souls that listen to country music 
and 
  watch NASCAR racing. And definately no French allowed. Only 
 Freedom 
  Fries and 'W' Ketchup sauce in Heaven. Sorry Pal. 
  
  OffWorld
 
 
 
 OffWorld, you are one biased, intolerant full-of-racist-
stereotypes 
 individual...
 


Wow, right back at chya...
and you are one of the most miserable old fart humorless people 
I have ever seen.

And you know nothing of fundamentalist christians.
Like most Americans you bury your dumbass head in the sand so that 
you cannot see that the war in Iraq is the pure, and almost perfect, 
product of retarded American fundamenatalist christians. And that, 
with their arrogant, and visionless actions (in the name of their 
Fuhrer, Jesus) they have justified the murder of thousands of 
innocent children ( an act for which Jesus said , he would condemn 
them all ), and innocent Iraqi's.Whole families wiped out by 
YOUR American arrogance and fundamentalist beliefs that you defend 
here in your PURE ignorance above.

Your fundamentalist christian fascists that you defend 
so eloquently and perceptively, are also resposible for ripping 
apart family based tribal cultures around the world, and turning 
brother against brother unless they bow down to your Jesus and your 
American charity dollars.

But then, you, as a naive...hide your head in the sand...world 
ignorant...arrogant Americanyou would not know these things 
now would you. 
No-one in the world respects you Americans anymore. Americans HAVE 
SO MUCH to proove now to show themselves worthy of human civilised 
life, after their demon acts under their fundamentalist Bush and the 
others there. It seems impossible now for Americans to ever be 
respected again. it will take centuries. If you want to defend your  
demon fundamentalists then state it clearly now and live your 
ignorant fate.

OffWorld









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[FairfieldLife] Re: Hmm....turiiya(?) as described in Shriimad Bhaagavatam (bh. puraaNa) part 2

2006-06-25 Thread cardemaister
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 
 Shrii Shukadeva Gosvaamii to Mahaaraaja PariikSit:
 
 sthiraM sukhaM caasanam aasthito yatir
 yadaa jihaasur imam an.ga lokam
 kaale ca deshe ca mano na sajjayet
 praaNaan niyacchen manasaa jitaasuH
 
 (sthiram; sukham; ca; aasanam; aasthitaH; yatiH;
 yadaa; jihaasuH; imam; an.ga; lokam;
 kaale; ca; deshe; ca; manaH; na; sajjayet;
 praaNaan; niyacchet; manasaa; jita-asuH)
 
 SB 2.2.15: O King, whenever the yogii desires to leave this planet 
of 
 human beings, he should not be perplexed about the proper time or 
 place, but should comfortably sit without being disturbed and, 
 regulating the life air, should control the senses by the mind.
 
 http://vedabase.net/sb/2/2/en


2.2.16

manaH svabuddhyayaamalayaa niyamya
kSetra-jña etaaM ninanyet tam aatmani
aatmaanam aatmany avarudhya dhiiro
labdhopashaantir virameta kRtyaat

(manaH; svabuddhyayaa; a_malayaa; niyamya;
kSetra-jñe[sic!]; etaam; ninanyet; tam; aatmani;
aatmaanam; aatmani; avarudhya; dhiiraH;
labdha-upashaantiH; virameta; kRtyaat)

Swami Prabhupaada's translation:

SB 2.2.16: Thereafter, the yogii should merge his mind, by his 
unalloyed intelligence, into the living entity, and then merge the 
living entity into the Superself. And by doing this, the fully 
satisfied living entity becomes **situated in the supreme stage of 
satisfaction**, so that he ceases from all other activities.

--


labdha mfn. taken , seized , caught , met with , found c. ; got at , 
arrived (as a moment) Katha1s. ; obtained (as a quotient in division) 
Col 

 upazAnti [=upashaanti] f. cessation , intermission , remission 
Sus3r. Ragh. Hit. c. ; tranquillity , calmness.  

**labdhopashaantiH (labdha-upashaantiH): (someone having) found -- or 
stuff -- calmness??







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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread shempmcgurk
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk 
 shempmcgurk@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel 
babajii_99@ 
  wrote:
  
   Free Saddam Hussein;
 Both of his sons are dead;
 And he is an old man now;
 Tired and burned out.
 Let him save his country from civil war;
 Before he dies;
 He never killed as many as we have;
 So, we've failed to bring the American Style democracy;
 But the hatreds go to deep;
 We had a civil war too;
 North and South;
 The bloodiest to date.
 Let them fight it out,
 Amongst themselves.
  
 R.Gimbel   Philadelphia,PA.
   
 
   -
   Yahoo! Groups gets better. Check out the new email design. 
Plus 
  there's much more to come.
  
  
  Having just read
  The article linked from here
  On Timothy Leary
  I can only imagine
  That Nimbel Gimbel
  Is heavily sedated
  On mind-altering
  Drugs
 
 In attempting to justify this war, with false info;



Dear, dear Robert
I don't think
It was false information
That Gaddamn Saddam
Had 17 resolutions passed
Against him
By the United Nations
Because
He didn't comply with inspections
So right or wrong information
On whether there was WMD
Is moot
When all Saddy Baby had to do
Was let us in
And inspect
Which he didn't do
So who, pray tell, was providing
The false info?




 And capturing the leader of this country;
 I meant to point out;
 That this whole Iraqi adventure;
 Has been insane, and has produced



Insane
Is writing
That the U.S.
Killed more
Than Saddam






 No good thing for America;
 In taking an opposite viewpoint,
 Of suggesting that we admit we were mistaken;
 And that 'might does not make right'(shock  awe; mission 
 accomplished);
 Then suggesting the Democrats are weak on defense;
 By not going along with(keep the course of insanity).
 The fact is:
 The U.S. has killed more Iraqis,
 Then Saddam ever did.
 Robert Gimbel


Are you on drugs
Must be
To make such a statement











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[FairfieldLife] Re: Why Meditate

2006-06-25 Thread shempmcgurk
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, suziezuzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 I would be curious to know why people practice TM. Whether it be 
 experiential reasons or philosophical or both, what are the 
reasons why 
 you sit down once or twice a day and practice TM and the sidhis? 
What 
 do you gain at the time you practice, afterwards, in the short 
run, 
 long run and does an afterlife belief have anything to do with 
your 
 practice?


I do TM twice a day (plus sidhis) because it is the path I've 
chosen, which I did at age 18 and have done it regularly pretty much 
since then (I'm 51 now) with a few pockets of irregular practise 
dispersed throughout the 33 years.

I was always looking for something and I had criteria.  It had to 
be something that didn't require blind belief...I had been exposed 
to that growing up while going to church etc. and knew very much it 
couldn't be that.  Two other factors were also important but I 
didn't realize what they were until they were mentioned within the 
context of TM being explained to me but when they were, something 
clicked that that was what I was looking for.  And those two things 
were: (1) that the practise was scientifically or objectively 
verifiable; and (2) that it was easy and didn't require 
concentration.

And once I chose TM as a path, I pretty much knew that I'd be doing 
it regularly for the rest of my life...and for those few pockets of 
time when I wasn't regular, I distinctly experienced a difference, 
so I always went back to regular practise.

Is it experiential or philosophical reasons or both: Both. 
Philosophical for the reasons mentioned above (sorry, that's about 
as philosophical as I get) and, more importantly -- MUCH more 
importantly -- experiential.  I need to experience pure 
consciousness in the here and now while I am alive and not as some 
reward in heaven after I die.

What I gain: 

short term: a more relaxed life.

Long term: hopefully, higher states of consciousness.

Afterlife considerations: not really 'cause I want it all NOW.






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[FairfieldLife] 'Iraq War a Farce of Biblical Proportions'

2006-06-25 Thread Robert Gimbel



This war is a farce;  Howcan we bring democracy abroad;  While stealing our constitutional rights at home?The old regime in Iraq, was keeping Iran at bay;  As well as outsiders such as the bin Laden bunch of maniacs;  Saddam is not so insane as some that have followed him...The 'enemy of our enemy' was our friend, in the eighties;  Iraq was in a costly war with Iran.  The U.S. sold them arms to fight Iran.  Mr. Rumsfeld shook Saddam's hand,(Remember the Picture, pictures don't lie)We are in a much weaker position now;  In regard to Iran, and that is why they are flexing their muscle.  That is why they are so bold now;  Because we are bogged down, with our Saddam obsession.  Who, by the way, had nothing to do with the 'Events of 9/11'. 
   So,Why oh why are we sending our kids there to die;  To be maimed and their souls abused with horrible images,  They can't forever forget...Why do we have a President, so obsessed with Saddam?  Perhaps becauseSaddam had tried to have the Bush elder killed?  That is why we send our kids to die, day after day?There are many dictators in this world of ours.  Many in Africa.  But,  No oil in Africa?New Orleans has to save itself.  But for Bush's Saddam obsession,  Billions are not a problem.  Perhaps Mr. Bush is just a typical;  (As theysay in A.A.)  Like an alcoholic that just quits with no help.  Just an angry,'Dry drunk'.  It's about oil,
 stupid.  We could have had electric cars, ten years ago.As for L.S.D... the C.I.A. gave up on it years ago.  They decided it was an unreliable tool for brainwashing.Instead they decided to go with the "Mindwar Doctrine"  This involves control of the media, used to brainwash.  As well as stressors to weaken the resolve of the population.  And promoting the notion that the U.S.  Can do no wrong.We are in a very sick and dishonest state of affairs;  InWashington D.C.  And everybody,knows it...   
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[FairfieldLife] Re: 2400 Pundits to Germany?

2006-06-25 Thread cardemaister
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jyouells2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, bob_brigante no_reply@ wrote:
 
  http://www.globalgoodnews.com/world-peace-a.html?
art=1151176428109153
 
 


I'm afraid that might improve Deutschland's possibilities
to win the Soccer World Cup...






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Hmm....turiiya(?) as described in Shriimad Bhaagavatam (bh. puraaNa) part 2

2006-06-25 Thread cardemaister
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 

Oops! Typo: ninanyet -- should be: ninayet!
Fixed below. 


 manaH svabuddhyayaamalayaa niyamya
 kSetra-jña etaaM ninayet tam aatmani
 aatmaanam aatmany avarudhya dhiiro
 labdhopashaantir virameta kRtyaat
 
 (manaH; svabuddhyayaa; a_malayaa; niyamya;
 kSetra-jñe[sic!]; etaam; ninayet; tam; aatmani;
 aatmaanam; aatmani; avarudhya; dhiiraH;
 labdha-upashaantiH; virameta; kRtyaat)
 
 Swami Prabhupaada's translation:
 
 SB 2.2.16: Thereafter, the yogii should merge his mind, by his 
 unalloyed intelligence, into the living entity, and then merge the 
 living entity into the Superself. And by doing this, the fully 
 satisfied living entity becomes **situated in the supreme stage of 
 satisfaction**, so that he ceases from all other activities.
 
 --
 
 
 labdha mfn. taken , seized , caught , met with , found c. ; got 
at , 
 arrived (as a moment) Katha1s. ; obtained (as a quotient in 
division) 
 Col 
 
  upazAnti [=upashaanti] f. cessation , intermission , remission 
 Sus3r. Ragh. Hit. c. ; tranquillity , calmness.  
 
 **labdhopashaantiH (labdha-upashaantiH): (someone having) found -- 
or 
 stuff -- calmness??








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Hmm....turiiya(?) as described in Shriimad Bhaagavatam (bh. puraaNa) - - -

2006-06-25 Thread surya
There are 2 lines. One is line of science in which human effort gets 
results. The other line is Supernatural line in which powers are 
attained by God's grace only. Even demons did penance and got powers 
by the grace of God only. Now the middle age scholars mixed these 2 
lines and developed 3rd line in between i.e., by human effort, you 
can get powers. People are fooled like this. 

By human effort, like controlling breath, you can get health only 
which is not a power and this is completely first line only. People 
are attracted like this in the name of Yoga. To get powers, Ravana 
should have joined Yoga centre. Why he did penance for God Brahma? 
Yoga means achievement of grace of God by which only powers are 
attained.

Kundalini is your mind which is the base of your love and which is 
called as the serpent going with curves. Generally the mind of the 
people is curved by nature. Mind is energy and is propagated as 
waves according to science. These wheels are the family bonds and 
crossing them in a curved way is cheating those cheating bonds. This 
justifies that Maya can be crossed by Maya and a thorn can be taken 
out by another thorn. The first wheel represents earth, which is the 
bond with mother and is called as Mooladhara. Only from earth living 
beings like plants etc. (life) are born. The Kundalini sleeps in the 
Mooladhara wheel. This indicates your sleeping state of mind in the 
womb of your mother. 

The awakening of Kundalini means that you are delivered and came 
into world and you are trapped in bonds as your mind grows. So, 
there is no need of awakening the Kundalini, which was already in 
the awakened state. By closing your eyes, you are encouraging 
Kundalini (mind) to sleep. First you have to cut your bond/love with 
mother for the sake of God. The second wheel is `Manipura' of water 
representing the father. The sky having clouds is said to be the 
father in Veda. When water falls from the sky and unites with earth, 
life is produced. The bond with the father should also be cut as 
Prahlada left his father for the sake of God. Now, you may argue 
that Veda says mother and father are God (Matru devaha, pitru 
devaha). These words have two meanings as per the grammar. The first 
meaning is that mother and father are God. This is correct because 
in the world among all the people, they should be very highly 
respected and loved. The second meaning for these words is that God 
is mother and father. This meaning should be taken, when God comes 
into your life and competes with mother and father. The third wheel 
is Swadhistana (fire) representing the bond between wife and 
husband. The union of a couple takes place only due to heat (fire). 
Buddha left his wife and Meera left her husband for the sake of God. 
The fourth wheel is Anahata, of air, representing the bond with 
children. Veda says air is the strongest. This wheel is placed in 
the heart, which means that this is the heart or the essence of all 
the bonds. Buddha left his one year old son for the sake of God.

The fifth wheel is Visuddha of Akasha (space), which is in the 
throat, representing the bond with false gurus (preachers). A fraud 
guru preaches only nonsense, which represents nothing like space. To 
reach the God who is the Sadguru you must leave all the gurus. 
Prahlada left such teachers. The final wheel is Aajna, in between 
the two eyebrows, representing the `Jnananetra' i.e., the sight of 
knowledge. This is of mind. With the help of knowledge that is Vedas 
and Sashtras, you must decide the real form of God as Lord Datta and 
all other forms are only his various dresses. Vedas say that Datta 
is only the ultimate and real God (Brahman). Veda says that God 
should be one and that one God creates, rules and destroys the 
universe. Datta is only one and does these three works through His 
three divine faces. But, such ultimate God cannot be reached because 
Vedas say that even words, mind, intelligence, logic and even 
imagination cannot touch him. But, He comes in the human form and 
then only you can see, touch, talk and even spend your whole life 
with Him. Such human form is called DATTA.

Datta means the God who is given to devotees, you can meet Him in 
this world in human form only. Gita says that God comes in human 
form only (Manusheem……). Gita also says that if one worships 
formless, he or she gets sorrow only (Avyaktahi…). Gita also says 
that if you worship a statue, you are born as a stone (Bhutejyah….). 
A statue has only a limited use of being seen by devotees (Darsanam) 
and is not meant for worship. A human form only gives full 
satisfaction to devotees during worship.

Yoga means joining the God after cutting all the family bonds 
through cheating to avoid hurting as explained above. The bonds can 
be cut only when a new bond with God is formed. Without the new 
bond, the old bond cannot be cut. First attachment to God (Bhakti) 
should come and detachment from the relatives (Vyragya) is 

[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread nablus108
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 Free Saddam Hussein;
   Both of his sons are dead;
   And he is an old man now;
   Tired and burned out.
   Let him save his country from civil war;
   Before he dies;
   He never killed as many as we have;
   So, we've failed to bring the American Style democracy;
   But the hatreds go to deep;
   We had a civil war too;
   North and South;
   The bloodiest to date.
   Let them fight it out,
   Amongst themselves.

   R.Gimbel   Philadelphia,PA.

The fellow the americans wants us to think is Saddam Hussein is a 
relative and one of his 7 doubles. Saddam Hussein died in the first 
bomb-attack on Bhagdad. 

For more information, please see: 
http://www.shareintl.org/magazine/SI_current.htm
 
   
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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread Robert Gimbel
 
 
  Free Saddam Hussein;
Both of his sons are dead;
And he is an old man now;
Tired and burned out.
Let him save his country from civil war;
Before he dies;
He never killed as many as we have;
So, we've failed to bring the American Style democracy;
But the hatreds go to deep;
We had a civil war too;
North and South;
The bloodiest to date.
Let them fight it out,
Amongst themselves.
 
R.Gimbel   Philadelphia,PA.
 
 The fellow the americans wants us to think is Saddam Hussein is a 
 relative and one of his 7 doubles. Saddam Hussein died in the 
first 
 bomb-attack on Bhagdad. 
 
 For more information, please see: 
 http://www.shareintl.org/magazine/SI_current.htm
 
Well, it's hard to know what to believe, anymore, truely!
Robert G. from Philly...
{Original place of the Revolution, and the correlation of electicity 
with Lightning, amoung other things, long past gone...
What would Ben Franklin have thought?





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Re: [FairfieldLife] Why Meditate

2006-06-25 Thread Peter
I meditate instead of robbing banks.

--- suziezuzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I would be curious to know why people practice TM.
 Whether it be 
 experiential reasons or philosophical or both, what
 are the reasons why 
 you sit down once or twice a day and practice TM and
 the sidhis? What 
 do you gain at the time you practice, afterwards, in
 the short run, 
 long run and does an afterlife belief have anything
 to do with your 
 practice? 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Why Meditate

2006-06-25 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I meditate instead of robbing banks.

I meditate *and* rob banks.


 --- suziezuzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  I would be curious to know why people practice TM.
  Whether it be 
  experiential reasons or philosophical or both, what
  are the reasons why 
  you sit down once or twice a day and practice TM and
  the sidhis? What 
  do you gain at the time you practice, afterwards, in
  the short run, 
  long run and does an afterlife belief have anything
  to do with your 
  practice? 







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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread shempmcgurk
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablus108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel babajii_99@ 
 wrote:
 
  Free Saddam Hussein;
Both of his sons are dead;
And he is an old man now;
Tired and burned out.
Let him save his country from civil war;
Before he dies;
He never killed as many as we have;
So, we've failed to bring the American Style democracy;
But the hatreds go to deep;
We had a civil war too;
North and South;
The bloodiest to date.
Let them fight it out,
Amongst themselves.
 
R.Gimbel   Philadelphia,PA.
 
 The fellow the americans wants us to think is Saddam Hussein is a 
 relative and one of his 7 doubles. Saddam Hussein died in the 
first 
 bomb-attack on Bhagdad. 






Assuming the American military knows about this and is purposely 
foisting this Saddam relative upon us, why would they do that?  
Certainly, it is much more to the Americans' advantage to have had a 
dead Saddam on their hands.

Even though Adolf Hitler killed himself at war's end, insurgents 
continued fighting for Germany for about 4 years after WWII's end.  
But it is believed that had Hitler lived and put, presumably, on 
trial, insurgency in Germany would have not only continued longer 
but have been very, very strong.

A dead Saddam is to the Americans' advantage.





 
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Why Meditate

2006-06-25 Thread shempmcgurk
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ 
wrote:
 
  I meditate instead of robbing banks.
 
 I meditate *and* rob banks.





Fifteen to twenty minutes in the bank twice a day balanced by 
another three minutes in the bank and the rest of the day spending 
the money in the marketplace...is that how the analogy goes?






 
 
  --- suziezuzie msilver1951@ wrote:
  
   I would be curious to know why people practice TM.
   Whether it be 
   experiential reasons or philosophical or both, what
   are the reasons why 
   you sit down once or twice a day and practice TM and
   the sidhis? What 
   do you gain at the time you practice, afterwards, in
   the short run, 
   long run and does an afterlife belief have anything
   to do with your 
   practice?








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ 
 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
  
   shempmcgurk wrote:
  snip
   Concentrated wealth in the hands of those responsible for 
 creating 
   it is a GREAT thing and should be encourated.
   
Bhairitu, if you tax it, it goes to government which will NOT 
 use 
it wisely.  It WILL be used more wisely by those that create 
 the 
wealth.
   
   History shows that not to be true at all.  Most are just greedy 
   bastards who care little about their fellow humanity.  People 
 like 
   Bill Gates are a rare exception but as I stated earlier he has 
   always had a mood of detachment from his wealth which I 
   particularly noted in a local Seattle interview with him in 
1991.
   
   You still don't get that a progressive tax means people won't 
 try 
   to earn another dime if they are going to pay more in taxes.  
So 
   the government doesn't get anything.  They're already wealthy 
 and 
   anything more is just an ego driven power trip.   This lets 
 others 
   have more of a chance.
  
  I was just reading in the Times about Richard Grasso,
  who, making $12 million a year, went through all kinds
  of contortions to obtain his $140 million retirement
  package.
  
  At some point in the accumulation of wealth, money
  ceases to be a medium of exchange and becomes something
  entirely different, having to do, as Bhairitu suggests,
  with ego and power.  Your attitude toward it changes
  in a way that makes it literally impossible to empathize
  with the person for whom, say, fresh blueberries are
  a luxury they can't afford.
  
  You no longer have to make choices based on what
  something costs.  Money becomes an abstraction with no
  practical consequences in terms of what you do with it,
  except those that have to do with how much *more* of
  this abstraction you are able to accumulate.
 
 
 
 Alas.  You've just described big government!
 
 A $2.8 trillion budget without any care what it costs, Congressmen -
 -and Presidents for that matter! -- spend, spend, spend.

Not quite.  They have no personal interest in using the
government's revenue to multiply and accumulate ever-greater
amounts of it for themselves.  As abstract as the amounts
may seem, the funds are used to pay for goods and services.

  When rich people talk about money, they're talking
  about something entirely different from what poor and
  middle-class people mean when they talk about it.
  They might as well be on different planets.
 
 Of course.
 
 Rich people, having the experience of vast wealth, know by 
 experience that money doesn't buy happiness.  Poorer people don't 
 have that experience.

Right.  What poorer people know by experience isn't
about money buying happiness or not, but about money
making it possible for them and their children to eat
three times a day and have a roof over their heads.

 That is why it is SO important that we ensure that the poorest of 
 the poor have enough money to buy the basic necessities of life 
 and, hopefully, a pint of blueberries whenever they  see and desire 
 it on the produce shelves.
 
 That is why, dear Billie Batts, you should join me in encouraging 
 capitalist enterprises like Wal-Mart toward all success so that the 
 poor which you invoke above have their blueberries.

No, afraid not.  As you'd know if you did any reading
beyond your right-wing sources, Wal-Mart may enable
poor people to buy blueberries one week, but ultimately
at the expense of decently paying jobs in the town, not
to mention poorer-quality goods even at Wal-Mart.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Why Meditate

2006-06-25 Thread uns_tressor
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote:
 
  I meditate instead of robbing banks.
 
 I meditate *and* rob banks.

...and its the meditation which makes you so adept. 
But be on your guard if the FBI ever ring up the 
Washington TM centre for times of Introductory Talks!
It took TM to get me to saw a dead straight cut in 
a plank of wood, and to tune a guitar on the 5th/7th
fret harmonics.
Uns.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
snip
 Because
 He didn't comply with inspections
 So right or wrong information
 On whether there was WMD
 Is moot
 When all Saddy Baby had to do
 Was let us in
 And inspect
 Which he didn't do

Of course, he *did* let the inspectors in.  Bush
pulled them out even though--or actually, because--
they weren't finding any WMD, making nonsense of
his excuse for the invasion.

Bush has said several times publicly that Saddam
wouldn't let in the inspectors, which is manifestly
untrue.  Has he been lying blatantly about something
that's clearly on the public record, or is he just
so unaware of what went on that he really *believes*
what he says?






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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread uns_tressor
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel babajii_99@ 
 wrote:
 
  Free Saddam Hussein;
Both of his sons are dead;
And he is an old man now;
Tired and burned out.
Let him save his country from civil war;
Before he dies;
He never killed as many as we have;
So, we've failed to bring the American Style democracy;
But the hatreds go to deep;
We had a civil war too;
North and South;
The bloodiest to date.
Let them fight it out,
Amongst themselves.
 
R.Gimbel   Philadelphia,PA.
  
  
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 there's much more to come.
 
 
 Having just read
 The article linked from here
 On Timothy Leary
 I can only imagine
 That Nimbel Gimbel
 Is heavily sedated
 On mind-altering
 Drugs

Probably taken in suppository form. 
Some people will believe anything that is
typed up if it suits them for some reason.
A Saddam back in power might feature the Shi'ites
supported by Iran against the Sunnis backed
by Syria - and a few of the 36 suitcase size
Soviet nukes that are not accountaed for.







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[FairfieldLife] Fox News on Meditation

2006-06-25 Thread MDixon6569





I just heard Dr. Rosen on Fox news make some very nice 
comments on the value of Meditation. He was asked a question about people having 
more heart attacks that bring their jobs home for the week end. He said how 
important it was to leave stress behind and take the mind off of things that 
cause stress. He commented that while he doesn't meditate because he doesn't 
know how, his wife does, and is a totally different person when she finishes her 
meditation.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 6/24/06 11:53:51 P.M. Central Daylight Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  
  
  
  Free Saddam Hussein;
  Both of his sons are dead;
  And he is an old man now;
  Tired and burned out.
  Let him save his country from civil war;
  Before he dies;
  He never killed as many as we have;
  So, we've failed to bring the American Style democracy;
  But the hatreds go to deep;
  We had a civil war too;
  North and South;
  The bloodiest to date.
  Let them fight it out,
  Amongst themselves.
  
  R.Gimbel 
Philadelphia,PA.

I would be a liar if I said "I can't believe 
this!"
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Jesus is coming, and man is he unstressing!

2006-06-25 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 6/25/06 1:29:28 A.M. Central Daylight Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
they 
  have justified the murder of thousands of innocent children ( an act for 
  which Jesus said , he would condemn them all ), and innocent 
  Iraqi's.Whole families wiped out by YOUR American arrogance and 
  fundamentalist beliefs that you defend 

Off World , I take it then that you were against the sanctions 
or were for lifting sanctions against the Saddam regime because those sanctions 
were doing the very same thing, just in a different 
way.
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 History shows that not to be true at all.  Most are just greedy
bastards 
 who care little about their fellow humanity.  People like Bill Gates
are 
 a rare exception 

Well 280 billion annually in american philanthropy sort of deflates
your thesis. (Or are you concerned about the miserliness of Europeans
-- who have lower levels of philanthropy?)  

Sure I would love to see american philanthropy at a trillion or 10
trillion a year. European and Asian philanthropy matching such. It can
 happen. It requires a change of ethos. A softening of world
consciousness if you will. Its progressively happening. 

What will stop such in its tracks is confisgatory tax rates of 95-100%
 
 You still don't get that a progressive tax means people won't try to 
 earn another dime if they are going to pay more in taxes.  

I get it. And I think you You are dead wrong. Many such people will
spend every waking hour on how to shelter income. Very unproductive
for society to have many of its better minds engaged in such. 

And if I finally get your plan (let see if I do), it will lead to a
such surge of conspicuous consuption and a drop in savings and
investment -- two things that are huge drags on the economy.

So let me see if I get your plan. If one's ESTATE were to reach 12
mil, you would then tax marginal INCOME at 100% rates. If this is
true, then when net worth is 11,900 or so, rational (and irrational
alike) people will spend 100% of their income and save and invest
nothing. Being forced to spend everything, against their, long-honed
spirit to save and invest, they will spend their money primarily on
conspicuous consumption and toys. How this mitigates greed in society
at large is beyond me.

But I probably have misunderstood your plan. I can't imagine anyone
with a straight face suggesting something so destructive to the
economy and a savings/investment ethos -- which is at the core of
productivity (the basis for  wage increases for all) -- and to wildly
inflame greed, shallow values, consumerism, class jealousy and crass
materialism.  








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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 6/25/06 5:19:13 A.M. Central Daylight Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  
  
 Free Saddam Hussein;  Both of his 
  sons are dead;  And he is an old man now;  Tired and 
  burned out.  Let him save his country from civil war;  
  Before he dies;  He never killed as many as we have;  
  So, we've failed to bring the American Style democracy;  But the 
  hatreds go to deep;  We had a civil war too;  North 
  and South;  The bloodiest to date.  Let them fight it 
  out,  Amongst themselves.R.Gimbel 
  Philadelphia,PA.  The fellow the americans wants us to 
  think is Saddam Hussein is a  relative and one of his 7 doubles. 
  Saddam Hussein died in the first  bomb-attack on Bhagdad.  
   For more information, please see:  http://www.shareintl.org/magazine/SI_current.htmWell, 
  it's hard to know what to believe

I heard that!
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 6/25/06 8:56:54 A.M. Central Daylight Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Of 
  course, he *did* let the inspectors in. Bushpulled them out even 
  though--or actually, because--they weren't finding any WMD, making 
  nonsense ofhis excuse for the invasion.Bush has said several times 
  publicly that Saddamwouldn't let in the inspectors, which is 
  manifestlyuntrue. Has he been lying blatantly about somethingthat's 
  clearly on the public record, or is he justso unaware of what went on that 
  he really *believes*what he says?

Judy as I recall, Saddam would let in the inspectors 
from time to time but every time he did, he threw every obstacle he could in the 
way of the inspectors while doing their jobs, making it difficult if not 
impossible to do. Blix and others often complained of having to wait outside of 
a building they wanted to inspect for hours and hours while Saddam's people 
moved things out of another side of the building. Also numerous road blocks and 
accidents were staged to prevent the inspectors from getting to their announced 
destination in timely matter. Saddam was letting in inspectors, but there 
was no cooperation once they began their jobs.
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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  
 In a message dated 6/25/06 8:56:54 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 
 Of  course, he *did* let the inspectors in. Bush
 pulled them out even  though--or actually, because--
 they weren't finding any WMD, making  nonsense of
 his excuse for the invasion.
 
 Bush has said several times  publicly that Saddam
 wouldn't let in the inspectors, which is  manifestly
 untrue. Has he been lying blatantly about something
 that's  clearly on the public record, or is he just
 so unaware of what went on that  he really *believes*
 what he says?

 
 Judy as I recall, Saddam would let in the  inspectors  from time to
 time but every time he did, he threw every obstacle he could in 
 the  way of the inspectors while doing their jobs, making it 
 difficult if not  impossible to do. Blix and others often 
 complained of having to wait outside of  a building they wanted to 
 inspect for hours and hours while Saddam's people  moved things out 
 of another side of the building. Also numerous road blocks and  
 accidents were staged to prevent the inspectors from getting to 
 their announced  destination in timely matter. Saddam was letting 
 in inspectors, but there  was no cooperation once they began their 
 jobs.

He didn't make it easy for them, but they *were* getting
the job done nevertheless.  And Saddam was not the only
party getting in their way--the Bush administration did
everything it could to sabotage the inspectors and
denigrate their work.

They were in Iraq, doing their job, right up until Bush
pulled them out so he could invade.  They were *furious*.

For Bush to say Saddam wouldn't let them in is simply a lie.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I was just reading in the Times about Richard Grasso,
 who, making $12 million a year, went through all kinds
 of contortions to obtain his $140 million retirement
 package.
 
 At some point in the accumulation of wealth, money
 ceases to be a medium of exchange and becomes something
 entirely different, having to do, as Bhairitu suggests,
 with ego and power.  Your attitude toward it changes
 in a way that makes it literally impossible to empathize
 with the person for whom, say, fresh blueberries are
 a luxury they can't afford.
 
 You no longer have to make choices based on what
 something costs.  Money becomes an abstraction with no
 practical consequences in terms of what you do with it,
 except those that have to do with how much *more* of
 this abstraction you are able to accumulate.
 
 When rich people talk about money, they're talking
 about something entirely different from what poor and
 middle-class people mean when they talk about it.
 They might as well be on different planets.

Your speculations of how others', or perhaps your own, values and
motivations may change with substantial wealth is simply speculation
-- not a well reserched set of studies developing a concensus view of
researchers on this issue. Same with my speculations.
 
However, I assume your thesis is not a universal one. That is, when
you say, when rich people talk about money, they're talking about
something entirely different from what poor and
middle-class people mean when they talk about it. I assume you don't
really mean all rich people. There are ample cases of some if not many
wealthly not being much phased by wealth. Warren Buffet, as I recall,
 still drives an old Volvo and lives in a middle class home in Omaha.
Many of the net and PC fortunes are driving foundations and lead
jeans based lives. I know and am  aware of those of wealth who are
more down to earth and empathetic than most. 

So while Paris Hilton makes a great case against inherited wealth, and
it being associated with low social consciousness and shallow
maerialist values, such are not universal among the rich. (Was it
Paris or Nicole who asked, Whats Walmart?) 

It appears you are confusing correlation with causation. There
certainly is some degree of correlation between (often sudden) wealth
and shallow values among some nouveau riche. But it is clearly not an
overwhelming and universal trait in all, perhaps not even in a
majority of cases. (Particularly sudden) wealth does not create
shallow values, low  empathy with the non-wealthy, and low compassion,
even if a moderate correlation can be shown in some cases.

Nor can strong social values, strong empathy with others, and
expansive compassion be shown to be caused by lack of weath. Here   
the correlation is quite weak I would suggest.  I can think of an
abundant of examples where shallow values, low empathy with others,
and low compassion are quite manifest among the non-wealthy. (Take 
this list for example. :) )  







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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, MDixon6569@ wrote:
 
   
  In a message dated 6/25/06 8:56:54 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  
  jstein@ writes:
  
  Of  course, he *did* let the inspectors in. Bush
  pulled them out even  though--or actually, because--
  they weren't finding any WMD, making  nonsense of
  his excuse for the invasion.
  
  Bush has said several times  publicly that Saddam
  wouldn't let in the inspectors, which is  manifestly
  untrue. Has he been lying blatantly about something
  that's  clearly on the public record, or is he just
  so unaware of what went on that  he really *believes*
  what he says?
 
  
  Judy as I recall, Saddam would let in the  inspectors  from time 
to
  time but every time he did, he threw every obstacle he could in 
  the  way of the inspectors while doing their jobs, making it 
  difficult if not  impossible to do. Blix and others often 
  complained of having to wait outside of  a building they wanted 
to 
  inspect for hours and hours while Saddam's people  moved things 
out 
  of another side of the building. Also numerous road blocks and  
  accidents were staged to prevent the inspectors from getting to 
  their announced  destination in timely matter. Saddam was letting 
  in inspectors, but there  was no cooperation once they began 
their 
  jobs.
 
 He didn't make it easy for them, but they *were* getting
 the job done nevertheless.  And Saddam was not the only
 party getting in their way--the Bush administration did
 everything it could to sabotage the inspectors and
 denigrate their work.
 
 They were in Iraq, doing their job, right up until Bush
 pulled them out so he could invade.  They were *furious*.

From a March 20, 2003, column by Joe Conason in Salon (shortly after 
the invasion):

Nobody is paying much attention to Hans Blix except the BBC, which 
reported his criticism yesterday of the Bush 
administration's impatience with the inspection effort. He strongly 
suggested that the U.S. had expected no cooperation from Iraq when 
inspections commenced and that you would have a clash from the 
beginning.

Instead, he noted, We had made a rapid start. We did not have any 
obstacles from the Iraqi side in going anywhere. They gave us prompt 
access and we were in a great many places all over Iraq. As for the 
intentions behind Resolution 1441, Blix added: I somewhat doubt that 
when [the Security Council] got the resolution last November they 
really intended to give under three-and-a-half months for 
inspections.

Yesterday, the New York Times reported that the Pentagon has prepared 
an elaborate mission to find and test suspected chemical and 
biological weapons sites. Military sources told Judith Miller that 
they have a list of between 300 and 1,400 sites.

Apparently the information to be used by the Pentagon teams wasn't 
disclosed to Hans Blix. Indeed, he told the BBC that his inspectors 
had been dispatched on several pointless excursions by American 
intelligence. Would the Bush administration have withheld useful 
information and intentionally sent the U.N. inspectors elsewhere? 
Then when the U.N. teams found nothing, the inspection process could 
be declared a failure.

I'm very curious to see if they [the U.S.] find something in Iraq, 
said Blix drily.


 
 For Bush to say Saddam wouldn't let them in is simply a lie.








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  I was just reading in the Times about Richard Grasso,
  who, making $12 million a year, went through all kinds
  of contortions to obtain his $140 million retirement
  package.
  
  At some point in the accumulation of wealth, money
  ceases to be a medium of exchange and becomes something
  entirely different, having to do, as Bhairitu suggests,
  with ego and power.  Your attitude toward it changes
  in a way that makes it literally impossible to empathize
  with the person for whom, say, fresh blueberries are
  a luxury they can't afford.
  
  You no longer have to make choices based on what
  something costs.  Money becomes an abstraction with no
  practical consequences in terms of what you do with it,
  except those that have to do with how much *more* of
  this abstraction you are able to accumulate.
  
  When rich people talk about money, they're talking
  about something entirely different from what poor and
  middle-class people mean when they talk about it.
  They might as well be on different planets.
 
 Your speculations of how others', or perhaps your own, values and
 motivations may change with substantial wealth is simply speculation
 -- not a well reserched set of studies developing a concensus view
 of researchers on this issue. Same with my speculations.

snore

snip 
 It appears you are confusing correlation with causation. There
 certainly is some degree of correlation between (often sudden) 
 wealth and shallow values among some nouveau riche.

I don't believe I said anything about shallow values.
You might want to go back and read what I *did* write
again.







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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 6/25/06 10:43:22 A.M. Central Daylight Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
They 
  were in Iraq, doing their job, right up until Bushpulled them out so he 
  could invade. They were *furious*.For Bush to say Saddam wouldn't let 
  them in is simply a lie.

I would like to see the exact quote and speech in which Bush 
said "Saddam wouldn't let them in". Yes there were times when Saddam threw them 
out and wouldn't let them in, but after enough saber rattling and threats he 
would change his mind. Also if Bush said "Saddam wouldn't let them in", while he 
had to order the inspectors out before hostilities began, it could have been in 
the context that Saddam wouldn't let them in 
"unfettered".
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 6/25/06 10:53:56 A.M. Central Daylight Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Instead, 
  he noted, "We had made a rapid start. We did not have any obstacles from 
  the Iraqi side in going anywhere. They gave us prompt access and we were 
  in a great many places all over Iraq."

Again I would like to know when and where Blix said this. Too 
many others that where there complained of the obstacles they had to go through 
to inspect suspected sites. Also there were times and places the Iraqis 
absolutely forbid inspections. I don't recall Saddam ever giving the UN 
inspectors access to his forty or so Peace Palaces, which were big enough to 
hold enormous stock piles of weapons. Also, many Iraqi building complexes often 
took days to get permission to inspect or were flatly denieduntil enough 
pressure was place on them. All in all, Saddam sure made it look as though he 
were playing a shell game.
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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread shempmcgurk
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  
 In a message dated 6/25/06 8:56:54 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 
 Of  course, he *did* let the inspectors in. Bush
 pulled them out even  though--or actually, because--
 they weren't finding any WMD, making  nonsense of
 his excuse for the invasion.
 
 Bush has said several times  publicly that Saddam
 wouldn't let in the inspectors, which is  manifestly
 untrue. Has he been lying blatantly about something
 that's  clearly on the public record, or is he just
 so unaware of what went on that  he really *believes*
 what he says?
 
 
 
 
 Judy as I recall, Saddam would let in the  inspectors  from time 
to time but 
 every time he did, he threw every obstacle he could in the  way of 
the 
 inspectors while doing their jobs, making it difficult if not  
impossible to do. Blix 
 and others often complained of having to wait outside of  a 
building they 
 wanted to inspect for hours and hours while Saddam's people  moved 
things out of 
 another side of the building. Also numerous road blocks and  
accidents were 
 staged to prevent the inspectors from getting to their announced  
destination in 
  timely matter. Saddam was letting in inspectors, but there  was 
no 
 cooperation once they began their jobs.


Judy never met a mass-murdering dictator she didn't like.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread shempmcgurk
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, MDixon6569@ wrote:
 
   
  In a message dated 6/25/06 8:56:54 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  
  jstein@ writes:
  
  Of  course, he *did* let the inspectors in. Bush
  pulled them out even  though--or actually, because--
  they weren't finding any WMD, making  nonsense of
  his excuse for the invasion.
  
  Bush has said several times  publicly that Saddam
  wouldn't let in the inspectors, which is  manifestly
  untrue. Has he been lying blatantly about something
  that's  clearly on the public record, or is he just
  so unaware of what went on that  he really *believes*
  what he says?
 
  
  Judy as I recall, Saddam would let in the  inspectors  from time 
to
  time but every time he did, he threw every obstacle he could in 
  the  way of the inspectors while doing their jobs, making it 
  difficult if not  impossible to do. Blix and others often 
  complained of having to wait outside of  a building they wanted 
to 
  inspect for hours and hours while Saddam's people  moved things 
out 
  of another side of the building. Also numerous road blocks and  
  accidents were staged to prevent the inspectors from getting to 
  their announced  destination in timely matter. Saddam was 
letting 
  in inspectors, but there  was no cooperation once they began 
their 
  jobs.
 
 He didn't make it easy for them, but they *were* getting
 the job done nevertheless.  And Saddam was not the only
 party getting in their way--the Bush administration did
 everything it could to sabotage the inspectors and
 denigrate their work.
 
 They were in Iraq, doing their job, right up until Bush
 pulled them out so he could invade.  They were *furious*.
 
 For Bush to say Saddam wouldn't let them in is simply a lie.


Now THAT'S a novel experience: reading that Judy is calling someone 
a liar.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread shempmcgurk
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk shempmcgurk@ 
 wrote:
 snip
  Because
  He didn't comply with inspections
  So right or wrong information
  On whether there was WMD
  Is moot
  When all Saddy Baby had to do
  Was let us in
  And inspect
  Which he didn't do
 
 Of course, he *did* let the inspectors in.



I see.

Silly United Nations passing those 17 resolutions when Saddam was so 
co-operative.




  Bush
 pulled them out even though--or actually, because--
 they weren't finding any WMD, making nonsense of
 his excuse for the invasion.
 
 Bush has said several times publicly that Saddam
 wouldn't let in the inspectors, which is manifestly
 untrue.  Has he been lying blatantly about something
 that's clearly on the public record, or is he just
 so unaware of what went on that he really *believes*
 what he says?







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
Original posts

 I was just reading in the Times about Richard Grasso,
 who, making $12 million a year, went through all kinds
 of contortions to obtain his $140 million retirement
 package.

 At some point in the accumulation of wealth, money
 ceases to be a medium of exchange and becomes something
 entirely different, having to do, as Bhairitu suggests,
 with ego and power. Your attitude toward it changes
 in a way that makes it literally impossible to empathize
 with the person for whom, say, fresh blueberries are
 a luxury they can't afford.

 You no longer have to make choices based on what
 something costs. Money becomes an abstraction with no
 practical consequences in terms of what you do with it,
 except those that have to do with how much *more* of
 this abstraction you are able to accumulate.

 When rich people talk about money, they're talking
 about something entirely different from what poor and
 middle-class people mean when they talk about it.
 They might as well be on different planets.

Your speculations of how others', or perhaps your own, values and
motivations may change with substantial wealth is simply speculation
-- not a well reserched set of studies developing a concensus view of
researchers on this issue. Same with my speculations.

However, I assume your thesis is not a universal one. That is, when
you say, when rich people talk about money, they're talking about
something entirely different from what poor and
middle-class people mean when they talk about it. I assume you don't
really mean all rich people. There are ample cases of some if not many
wealthly not being much phased by wealth. Warren Buffet, as I recall,
still drives an old Volvo and lives in a middle class home in Omaha.
Many of the net and PC fortunes are driving foundations and lead
jeans based lives. I know and am aware of those of wealth who are
more down to earth and empathetic than most.

So while Paris Hilton makes a great case against inherited wealth, and
it being associated with low social consciousness and shallow
maerialist values, such are not universal among the rich. (Was it
Paris or Nicole who asked, Whats Walmart?)

It appears you are confusing correlation with causation. There
certainly is some degree of correlation between (often sudden) wealth
and shallow values among some nouveau riche. But it is clearly not an
overwhelming and universal trait in all, perhaps not even in a
majority of cases. (Particularly sudden) wealth does not create
shallow values, low empathy with the non-wealthy, and low compassion,
even if a moderate correlation can be shown in some cases.

Nor can strong social values, strong empathy with others, and
expansive compassion be shown to be caused by lack of weath. Here
the correlation is quite weak I would suggest. I can think of an
abundant of examples where shallow values, low empathy with others,
and low compassion are quite manifest among the non-wealthy. (Take
this list for example. :) )




  It appears you are confusing correlation with causation. There
  certainly is some degree of correlation between (often sudden) 
  wealth and shallow values among some nouveau riche.
 
 I don't believe I said anything about shallow values.
 You might want to go back and read what I *did* write
 again.
s

OK, sorry, I should have been more redundant in my writing and
included the tri-set of characteristics that i stated twice in the
short post, that I thought relevant to the discussion shallow values,
low empathy with the non-wealthy, and low compassion. 

In the causual form or writing here, I admit I did short-hand
shallow values, low empathy with the non-wealthy, and low compassion
to solely shallow values in the passage you cited. All aplologies. I
should have said shallow values, etc.. Or better, redundantly list
the tri-set a third time, It appears you are confusing correlation
with causation. There certainly is some degree of correlation between
(often sudden) wealth and shallow values, low empathy with the
non-wealthy, and low compassion among some nouveau riche.

Then you might argue, or even politely clarify, that you were only
referring to low empathy, and not shallow values and low compassion.
And you could have stated, if it were the case, as I infer from your
comments, that you disagree that that the same rich  that exhibit 
low empathy, typically also exhibit shallow values and low
compassion. Ok then. Thats a POV. Not one I find compelling, but if
thats your point, fine.

But I am heartened that you find nothing more wrong with my thesis
that you are confusing confusing correlation with causation -- other
than a lack of an etc., or a more clearly differentiation between
your point about empathy and my broader point of empathy, values
and compassion. 







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
 no_reply@ wrote:
   When rich people talk about money, they're talking
   about something entirely different from what poor and
   middle-class people mean when they talk about it.
   They might as well be on different planets.
  
  Your speculations of how others', or perhaps your own, values and
  motivations may change with substantial wealth is simply speculation
  -- not a well reserched set of studies developing a concensus view
  of researchers on this issue. Same with my speculations.
 
 snore

Yes, my comment was a bit leaden. But I could not think of a better
alternative to counter the, IMO, weak writing that conveys a broad
sweeping generalization about a group, as if its universal, when it at
best applies to only a portion of the group.

How would you suggest writers tighten up their phrasing to better
correspond to reality and not lead readers to erroneous impressions?

Perhaps something as simple as the following would do.

When [some] rich people talk about money, [it appears to me]they're
talking about something entirely different from what poor and
middle-class people mean when they talk about it.
[This segment of the rich] [They (excluded)] might as well be on
different planets [as far as I and my values are concerned].







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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  
 In a message dated 6/25/06 10:43:22 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 
 They  were in Iraq, doing their job, right up until Bush
 pulled them out so he  could invade. They were *furious*.
 
 For Bush to say Saddam wouldn't let  them in is simply a lie.
 
 I would like to see the exact quote and speech in which Bush  
 said Saddam wouldn't let them in. Yes there were times when 
 Saddam threw them  out and wouldn't let them in, but after enough 
 saber rattling and threats he  would change his mind. Also if Bush 
 said Saddam wouldn't let them in, while he  had to order the 
 inspectors out before hostilities began, it could have been in the 
 context that Saddam wouldn't let them in  unfettered.

Press conference, January 27, 2004:

Well, I think the Iraq Survey Group must do its work. Again, I 
appreciate David Kay's contribution. I said in the run-up to the war 
against Iraq that -- first of all, I hoped the international 
community would take care of him. I was hoping the United Nations 
would enforce its resolutions, one of many. And then we went to the 
United Nations, of course, and got an overwhelming resolution -- 
1441 -- unanimous resolution, that said to Saddam, you must disclose 
and destroy your weapons programs, which obviously meant the world 
felt he had such programs. He chose defiance. It was his choice to 
make, and he did not let us in.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2004/01/20040127-3.html


Press conference, July 14, 2003 (with Kofi Annan sitting
beside him):

The larger point is, and the fundamental question is, did Saddam 
Hussein have a weapons program? And the answer is, absolutely. And we 
gave him a chance to allow the inspectors in, and he wouldn't let 
them in.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2003/07/20030714-3.html


Press conference, March 21, 2006:

I also saw a threat in Iraq. I was hoping to solve this problem 
diplomatically. That's why I went to the Security Council; that's why 
it was important to pass 1441, which was unanimously passed. And the 
world said, disarm, disclose, or face serious consequences -- and 
therefore, we worked with the world, we worked to make sure that 
Saddam Hussein heard the message of the world. And when he chose to 
deny inspectors, when he chose not to disclose, then I had the 
difficult decision to make to remove him. And we did, and the world 
is safer for it.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2006/03/20060321-4.html







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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  
 In a message dated 6/25/06 10:53:56 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 
 Instead,  he noted, We had made a rapid start. We did not have any
 obstacles from  the Iraqi side in going anywhere. They gave us 
 prompt access and we were  in a great many places all over Iraq.
 
 Again I would like to know when and where Blix said this.

He said it to the BBC the previous day (March 19, 2003):

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/2867913.stm

I notice you snipped this from my Consaon quote:

Yesterday [March 19, 2003], the New York Times reported that the 
Pentagon has prepared an elaborate mission to find and test suspected 
chemical and biological weapons sites. Military sources told Judith 
Miller that they have a list of between 300 and 1,400 sites.

Apparently the information to be used by the Pentagon teams wasn't 
disclosed to Hans Blix. Indeed, he told the BBC that his inspectors 
had been dispatched on several pointless excursions by American 
intelligence. Would the Bush administration have withheld useful 
information and intentionally sent the U.N. inspectors elsewhere? 
Then when the U.N. teams found nothing, the inspection process could 
be declared a failure.

I'm very curious to see if they [the U.S.] find something in Iraq, 
said Blix drily.






 Too  many others 
 that where there complained of the obstacles they had to go 
through  to inspect 
 suspected sites. Also there were times and places the Iraqis  
absolutely 
 forbid inspections. I don't recall Saddam ever giving the UN  
inspectors access to 
 his forty or so Peace Palaces, which were big enough to  hold 
enormous stock 
 piles of weapons. Also, many Iraqi building complexes often  took 
days to get 
 permission to inspect or were flatly denied until enough  pressure 
was place on 
 them. All in all, Saddam sure made it look as though he  were 
playing a shell 
 game.








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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:

 
 Judy never met a mass-murdering dictator she didn't like.

Bush? Nixon? Oh, you said dictators, not almost or hopeful
dictators. My mistake.









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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
  no_reply@ wrote:
When rich people talk about money, they're talking
about something entirely different from what poor and
middle-class people mean when they talk about it.
They might as well be on different planets.
   
   Your speculations of how others', or perhaps your own, values
   and motivations may change with substantial wealth is simply 
   speculation -- not a well reserched set of studies developing a 
   concensus view of researchers on this issue. Same with my 
   speculations.
  
  snore
 
 Yes, my comment was a bit leaden. But I could not think of a better
 alternative to counter the, IMO, weak writing that conveys a broad
 sweeping generalization about a group, as if its universal, when it 
 at best applies to only a portion of the group.

I believe the portion you quoted above applies
across the board, even to people like Bill Gates.

The snore was because mine was a pretty unexceptional
observation, almost a truism; but you have a habit of
taking exception to such observations even when there's 
virtually no little excuse to do so, apparently just to
hear yourself talk.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes and Stepped up Basis

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:

 Few people are aware that any suggestion for the elimination of the 
 estate tax comes with the elimination of the stepped-up basis for 
 capital gains.  Currently, all capital gains get stepped-up of 
 their cost basis to market value on the day of death...so when your 
 heirs inherit an asset of your's with a capital gain the cost basis 
 on it is considered the market value on the day of death...in other 
 words, ZERO capital gains.
 
 With the elimination of the estate tax (as the law currently calls 
 for in the year 2010...and JUST the year 2010...it comes back in 
 2011) is the elimination of the stepped-up basisso the 
 government gives with one hand and takes with the other.
 
 So if and when the government eliminates the estate tax don't scream 
 that it is a give-away for the rich because the rich very well may 
 end up paying MORE on death than if there was an estate tax...
 
 By the way, that is the way it is in socialist Canada: there is no 
 estate tax but there IS a capital gains tax on death.

Shemp, 

While its a good point you raise about the (partial) take back due to
loss of stepped-up basis, I am unable to construct an example where an
heir would pay more taxes with an original basis and a 15% capital
gains tax vs an inheritance tax of ~35-46% on a stepped up basis. Can
 you provide one.

For example using current limits, if origianl basis in a house is 300k
and is sold by the estate for 1,300K (not unusual in todays inflated
RE market) then heirs would be subject to 15% x 1Mil capital gain =
$150k. (Unless the house had been placed in an irrevocable trust prior
to the willer's death. If so, then as I understand it, the basis is
stepped up, and is under the estate tax limit, thus no tax on the
house is due.)

In contrast, if no estate tax exepemtion were in place, the heirs
would owe 35%+ on the 1.3 mil = ~450k. Much more than the $150 with
the stepped up basis and estate tax limitations.

Can you clarify  when and how an heir would pay more taxes with an
original basis and a 15% capital gains tax vs an inheritance tax of
~35-46% on a stepped up basis? Thanks. 







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
 no_reply@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
   no_reply@ wrote:
 When rich people talk about money, they're talking
 about something entirely different from what poor and
 middle-class people mean when they talk about it.
 They might as well be on different planets.

Your speculations of how others', or perhaps your own, values
and motivations may change with substantial wealth is simply 
speculation -- not a well reserched set of studies developing a 
concensus view of researchers on this issue. Same with my 
speculations.
   
   snore
  
  Yes, my comment was a bit leaden. But I could not think of a better
  alternative to counter the, IMO, weak writing that conveys a broad
  sweeping generalization about a group, as if its universal, when it 
  at best applies to only a portion of the group.
 
 I believe the portion you quoted above applies
 across the board, even to people like Bill Gates.
 
 The snore was because mine was a pretty unexceptional
 observation, almost a truism;

That the rich lack empathy towards the non-rich perhaps it is almost a
truism to you and perhaps to your peers, but its far from universl. To
me, to imply its universal (which I infer from your comments) is a
cognitive error, a social myth, a quite empirically ungrounded
specualation. Perhaps if you (to coin an insult :)) that 'you read
my post' :) you would have seen a few examples and my personal
observation that a number of wealthy have high degrees of empathy
(empathy being the trait you observed or speculated was low among the
rich). Additionally, as I observed, (and am NOT claiming that you also
observed), there is a high degree of compassion and deep values among
at least some rich. And some notable exceptions, such as Paris Hilton.


but you have a habit of
 taking exception to such observations even when there's 
 virtually no little excuse to do so, 

I am not citing small exceptions, but quite large ones, in my experience. 

More broadly, I am campaigning against weak sweeping universal
generalizations made to an entire class,when there is little  evidence
for such universality other than your (quite limited,IMO) personal
sense of truisms.

 apparently just to
 hear yourself talk.

If you wish to start a new thread on The Massive Shortcommings of
New.Morning I could start it with at least several 100 points. But I
am biased. I am sure you cite 1000's of points, real or imagined. And
just let Unc get started. Perhaps you and others can start the thread
and I will add as my time, deep introspection and humor enable.

However, I do think such a topic should be in its own thread, and not
mixed in with discussions of ideas. Arguments and points taken should
be strong enough to stand on their own merits -- and not rely on
suppositions that the poster has weak character traits (my inference,
perhaps incorrect, of what you wrote above.) 

And some people will not be interesed at all in The Massive
Shortcommings of New.Morning, and skip over the post. Others will
jump right to it, like  some skip the front page to get to the comics.
I know I will, being a superficial kind of guy, I will jump right to
that thread, and ignore the substantive ones.








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
 no_reply@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
   no_reply@ wrote:
 When rich people talk about money, they're talking
 about something entirely different from what poor and
 middle-class people mean when they talk about it.
 They might as well be on different planets.

Your speculations of how others', or perhaps your own, values
and motivations may change with substantial wealth is simply 
speculation -- not a well reserched set of studies developing a 
concensus view of researchers on this issue. Same with my 
speculations.
   
   snore
  
  Yes, my comment was a bit leaden. But I could not think of a better
  alternative to counter the, IMO, weak writing that conveys a broad
  sweeping generalization about a group, as if its universal, when it 
  at best applies to only a portion of the group.
 
 I believe the portion you quoted above applies
 across the board, even to people like Bill Gates.
 
 The snore was because mine was a pretty unexceptional
 observation, almost a truism;

That the rich lack empathy towards the non-rich perhaps it is almost a
truism to you and perhaps to your peers, but its far from universl. To
me, to imply its universal (which I infer from your comments) is a
cognitive error, a social myth, a quite empirically ungrounded
specualation. Perhaps if you (to coin an insult :)) that 'you read
my post' :) you would have seen a few examples and my personal
observation that a number of wealthy have high degrees of empathy
(empathy being the trait you observed or speculated was low among the
rich). Additionally, as I observed, (and am NOT claiming that you also
observed), there is a high degree of compassion and deep values among
at least some rich. And some notable exceptions, such as Paris Hilton.


but you have a habit of
 taking exception to such observations even when there's 
 virtually no little excuse to do so, 

I am not citing small exceptions, but quite large ones, in my experience. 

More broadly, I am campaigning against weak sweeping universal
generalizations made to an entire class,when there is little  evidence
for such universality other than your (quite limited,IMO) personal
sense of truisms.

 apparently just to
 hear yourself talk.

If you wish to start a new thread on The Massive Shortcommings of
New.Morning I could start it with at least several 100 points. But I
am biased. I am sure you cite 1000's of points, real or imagined. And
just let Unc get started. Perhaps you and others can start the thread
and I will add as my time, deep introspection and humor enable.

However, I do think such a topic should be in its own thread, and not
mixed in with discussions of ideas. Arguments and points taken should
be strong enough to stand on their own merits -- and not rely on
suppositions that the poster has weak character traits (my inference,
perhaps incorrect, of what you wrote above.) 

And some people will not be interesed at all in The Massive
Shortcommings of New.Morning, and skip over the post. Others will
jump right to it, like  some skip the front page to get to the comics.
I know I will, being a superficial kind of guy, I will jump right to
that thread, and ignore the substantive ones.







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[FairfieldLife] The Massive Shortcomings of New.Morning

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
From adjacent post:

[to Judy]
If you wish to start a new thread on The Massive Shortcomings of
New.Morning I could start it with at least several 100 points. But I
am biased. I am sure you cite 1000's of points, real or imagined. And
just let Unc get started. Perhaps you and others can start the thread
and I will add as my time, deep introspection and humor enable.

However, I do think such a topic should be in its own thread, and not
mixed in with discussions of ideas. Arguments and points taken should
be strong enough to stand on their own merits -- and not rely on
suppositions that the poster has weak character traits (my inference,
perhaps incorrect, of what you wrote above.) 

And some people will not be interesed at all in The Massive
Shortcomings of New.Morning, and skip over the post. Others will jump
right to it, like  some skip the front page to get to the comics.
I know I will, being a superficial kind of guy, I will jump right to
that thread, and ignore the substantive ones.

==

OK Judy, the ball is in your court. Fire away. But try to keep your
points on The Massive Shortcomings of New.Morning in this thread, and
not as substitites for real points of criticism of ideas, concept or
POVs in other threads. 

Of course all others are cordially welcomed to chime in. Unc, Tom,
Jim, Peter all have good, perhaps at times entertaining, insights on
this topic.









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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ 
 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk 
shempmcgurk@ 
  wrote:
  snip
   Because
   He didn't comply with inspections
   So right or wrong information
   On whether there was WMD
   Is moot
   When all Saddy Baby had to do
   Was let us in
   And inspect
   Which he didn't do
  
  Of course, he *did* let the inspectors in.
 
 I see.
 
 Silly United Nations passing those 17 resolutions when Saddam was 
 so co-operative.

You know, Shemp, somebody who doesn't know you
very well might think you're just outrageously
stupid rather than outrageously dishonest.

Actually, you're both.  You're outrageously
stupid to think anybody is going to believe your
outrageous falsehoods.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ 
 wrote:
snip
  For Bush to say Saddam wouldn't let them in is simply a lie.
 
 
 Now THAT'S a novel experience: reading that Judy is calling someone 
 a liar.

Perhaps if you didn't lie so much, you wouldn't find
the experience so familiar.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
Judy, 

Again, I am heartedned that your manfiest critique of my observation
-- that you maybe confusing correleation with causation with regards
to being rich and empathy towards the 'non-rich' -- is a minor and
not substantive one, and focuses on my poor traits -- not a critique
of the thesis itelf.



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
  no_reply@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
   
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
no_reply@ wrote:
  When rich people talk about money, they're talking
  about something entirely different from what poor and
  middle-class people mean when they talk about it.
  They might as well be on different planets.
 
 Your speculations of how others', or perhaps your own, values
 and motivations may change with substantial wealth is simply 
 speculation -- not a well reserched set of studies developing a 
 concensus view of researchers on this issue. Same with my 
 speculations.

snore
   
   Yes, my comment was a bit leaden. But I could not think of a better
   alternative to counter the, IMO, weak writing that conveys a broad
   sweeping generalization about a group, as if its universal, when it 
   at best applies to only a portion of the group.
  
  I believe the portion you quoted above applies
  across the board, even to people like Bill Gates.
  
  The snore was because mine was a pretty unexceptional
  observation, almost a truism;
 
 That the rich lack empathy towards the non-rich perhaps it is almost a
 truism to you and perhaps to your peers, but its far from universl. To
 me, to imply its universal (which I infer from your comments) is a
 cognitive error, a social myth, a quite empirically ungrounded
 specualation. Perhaps if you (to coin an insult :)) that 'you read
 my post' :) you would have seen a few examples and my personal
 observation that a number of wealthy have high degrees of empathy
 (empathy being the trait you observed or speculated was low among the
 rich). Additionally, as I observed, (and am NOT claiming that you also
 observed), there is a high degree of compassion and deep values among
 at least some rich. And some notable exceptions, such as Paris Hilton.
 
 
 but you have a habit of
  taking exception to such observations even when there's 
  virtually no little excuse to do so, 
 
 I am not citing small exceptions, but quite large ones, in my
experience. 
 
 More broadly, I am campaigning against weak sweeping universal
 generalizations made to an entire class,when there is little  evidence
 for such universality other than your (quite limited,IMO) personal
 sense of truisms.
 
  apparently just to
  hear yourself talk.
 
 If you wish to start a new thread on The Massive Shortcommings of
 New.Morning I could start it with at least several 100 points. But I
 am biased. I am sure you cite 1000's of points, real or imagined. And
 just let Unc get started. Perhaps you and others can start the thread
 and I will add as my time, deep introspection and humor enable.
 
 However, I do think such a topic should be in its own thread, and not
 mixed in with discussions of ideas. Arguments and points taken should
 be strong enough to stand on their own merits -- and not rely on
 suppositions that the poster has weak character traits (my inference,
 perhaps incorrect, of what you wrote above.) 
 
 And some people will not be interesed at all in The Massive
 Shortcommings of New.Morning, and skip over the post. Others will
 jump right to it, like  some skip the front page to get to the comics.
 I know I will, being a superficial kind of guy, I will jump right to
 that thread, and ignore the substantive ones.








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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
snip

 Judy never met a mass-murdering dictator she didn't like.

The only way to convince Shemp you don't care for
mass-murdering dictators is to be willing to lie
about them, as Shemp and Bush do.








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[FairfieldLife] Vit B12 Methyl Form

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
Thanks card for posting the article on B12. For decades, as a
vegetarian (mostly -- with a 2-3 year trial exception of fish and
poultry ) and vegan at times, I have been aware of the need to
supplement ones diet with B12. 

I did not know the low absorbsion rate of the almost universally used
form of B12 used in supplements, cobalamin. I bought some of the more
absorbable sub-lingual methyl form yesterday -- its 500 mcg per tab
(hm that phrase has an oddly familiar ring to it). The RNI (Required
Nutritional Intake) is 1.5 mcg. So today, my brain may be functioning
at 300+ times its usual sluggish rate. :)

Actually, I do feel better, more energy, but that might just be from
the coffee I just had from my neighbor the meth manufacturer. :)
Hardly a controlled study.

But I suggest others look into trying the subligual methyl form of B12. 






Here is another article that states similar things as the one you posted.

First an excerpt:

A deficiency often manifests itself first in the development of
neurological dysfunction that is almost indistinguishable from senile
dementia and Alzheimer's disease. There is little question that many
patients exhibiting symptoms of Alzheimer's actually suffer from a
vitamin B12 deficiency. Their symptoms are totally reversible through
effective supplementation. 

Maybe someone can give MMY daily methyl -- sublingual B12, or shots,
and see if the TMO is suddenly transformed to something like the 70's.




a vitamin B12 deficiency may not manifest itself until after 5 or 6
years of a diet supplying inadequate amounts. Vitamin B12 functions as
a methyl donor and works with folic acid in the synthesis of DNA and
red blood cells and is vitally important in maintaining the health of
the insulation sheath (myelin sheath) that surrounds nerve cells. The
classical vitamin B12 deficiency disease is pernicious anaemia, a
serious disease characterized by large, immature red blood cells. It
is now clear though, that a vitamin B12 deficiency can have serious
consequences long before anaemia is evident. The normal blood level of
vitamin B12 ranges between 200 and 600 picogram/milliliter (148-443
picomol/liter).

A deficiency often manifests itself first in the development of
neurological dysfunction that is almost indistinguishable from senile
dementia and Alzheimer's disease. There is little question that many
patients exhibiting symptoms of Alzheimer's actually suffer from a
vitamin B12 deficiency. Their symptoms are totally reversible through
effective supplementation. A low level of vitamin B12 has also been
associated with asthma, depression, AIDS, multiple sclerosis,
tinnitus, diabetic neuropathy and low sperm counts. Clearly, it is
very important to maintain adequate body stores of this crucial vitamin.

The amount of vitamin B12 actually needed by the body is very small,
probably only about 2 micrograms or 2 millionth of a gram/day.
Unfortunately, vitamin B12 is not absorbed very well so much larger
amounts need to be supplied through the diet or supplementation. The
richest dietary sources of vitamin B12 are liver, especially lamb's
liver, and kidneys. Eggs, cheese and some species of fish also supply
small amounts, but vegetables and fruits are very poor sources.
Several surveys have shown that most strict, long-term vegetarians are
vitamin B12 deficient. Many elderly people are also deficient because
their production of the intrinsic factor needed to absorb the vitamin
from the small intestine decline rapidly with age.

Fortunately, oral supplementation with vitamin B12 is safe, efficient
and inexpensive. Most multi-vitamin pills contain 100-200 microgram of
the cyanocobalamin form of B-12. This must be converted to
methylcobalamin or adenosylcobalamin before it can be used by the
body. The actual absorption of B12 is also a problem with supplements.
Swallowing 500 micrograms of cyanocobalamin can result in absorption
of as little as 1.8 microgram so most multivitamins do not provide an
adequate daily intake. The best approach is to dissolve a sublingual
tablet of methylcobalamin (1000 micrograms) under the tongue every
day. That will be sufficient to maintain adequate body stores.
However, if a deficiency is actually present then 2000 microgram/day
for one month is recommended followed by 1000 microgram/day. Some
physicians still maintain that monthly injections of vitamin B12 is
required to maintain adequate levels in the elderly and in patients
with a diagnosed deficiency. There is however, no scientific evidence
supporting the notion that injections are more effective than
sublingual supplementation. 

http://www.yourhealthbase.com/vitamin_B12.html

and

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_B12






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread Bhairitu
Vaj wrote:


 On Jun 24, 2006, at 4:57 PM, new_morning_blank_slate wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 That's why a progressive income tax is a good thing. It is an
 disincentive to accumulating excessive wealth. It is better to have

 more

 millionaires than any billionaires. You would allow people to

 accumulate

 an estate worth up to $12 million and then the progressive tax kicks

 in.

 It's not there to make money for the government. Anyone who thinks  
 they
 need more than $12 million has to be sick.

 (Just watch the resident righties -- rich wannabes but never-gonna- 
 bees
 -- whine at this).



 Well I am not a resident rightie, but your conception of a progressive
 income tax is fine, but has nothing to do with the progressive income
 tax thats in place. Or the much more progressive one of the pre-80's.
 A problem with high marginal rates -- near 70% in pre-80's, is people
 spend an inordinate amount of time trying to shelter it or make it tax
 deductable via clever means -- elaborate business trips and meals,
 etc. Very unproductive energy for them and society. But understandable
 when sheltering $1000 saves you $700. And such systems lead to hugely
 complex tax codes, and an army of tax accountants -- all unproductive
 overhead on society. And such complex tax codes increases corruption
 in government where special interests are willing to pay a lot to get
 special tax breaks. And lots of research does indicate the strong
 correlation of low(er) marginal tax rates with economic growth.

 A flat tax (some say 17% would do it) with no or few deductions,
 starting at incomes over $30-50,000, (even a negative income taxfor
 incomes below say $15,000) would eliminate all the inefficiencies,
 overheads and drags on society from excessive tax accountants,
 searching for tax shelters and deductions, poor economic choices for
 tax reasons, etc. And would trigger greater economic growth -- which
 is the engine for productivity increases, and that being the driver
 for wage rate increases at all levels.

 Unless you are mistakenly saying income when you mean estate tax --
 and want to tax estates above 12 million. A fair proposal in my view
 -- particularly if there are 3-5 kids, 20 grand kids etc.
 But then again, few with estates above 12 million pay much estate tax
 -- its all in sheletered trusts.

 I suggest a flat tax per above, with an estate tax kicking in at
 $10-20 million.

 Just watch the resident ultra-leftists -- poor wannabes but
 never-gonna-bees,  whine at this :)


 Are you a CPA or Tax Attorney? You sure seem to know a lot about the  
 economic and financial world!


Vaj, you haven't read any of the economists?   I found it well worth my 
time to crack some of their books plus I have friends who are economists 
and teach it too.



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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread MDixon6569





Notice the dates on each of these press conferences, well 
after the invasion. Everybody knew the UN had been in Iraq looking for WMDs. 
Also, everybody knew Saddam had expelled inspectors before and eventually let 
them back in. Also obviously, everybody knew Bush pulled out the inspectors 
before the hostilities began. So the context in which Bush was saying "they 
wouldn't let inspectors in" was, they wouldn't let inspectors in unfettered to 
do their jobs or without trying to interfere. The big complaint at the time was 
the shell game Saddam wastrying to play or give the appearance of 
playing. So it is easy to call Bush a liar in this instance if you take his 
comments out of context. One thing Bush's political enemies constantly criticize 
him about are his communication skills and obviously the lack of clarification 
in his comments opened him up to attack, calling him a liar. But I think anybody 
with half a brain that has kept up with the conflict and is not a Bush hater 
knows exactly what was meant in those press conference 
statements.
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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk shempmcgurk@ 
 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ 
  wrote:
 snip
   For Bush to say Saddam wouldn't let them in is simply a lie.
  
  
  Now THAT'S a novel experience: reading that Judy is calling someone 
  a liar.
 
 Perhaps if you didn't lie so much, you wouldn't find
 the experience so familiar.

Lets put up to scientific scrutiny: Does i) shemp's nose
progressively grow longer, and/or ii) are his pants indeed on fire?
Submit articles for peer review to the Journal of Infancy Insults,
1008 InYourFace Lane, University of UpYourAss, Poodunk, FU, 6, USA.

  






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread Bhairitu
new.morning wrote:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  

new_morning_blank_slate wrote:



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote:
 

  

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate
no_reply@ wrote:
   



A flat tax (some say 17% would do it) with no or few deductions,
starting at incomes over $30-50,000, (even a negative income taxfor
incomes below say $15,000) would eliminate all the inefficiencies,
overheads and drags on society from excessive tax accountants, 
searching for tax shelters and deductions, poor economic choices for
tax reasons, etc. And would trigger greater economic growth -- which
is the engine for productivity increases, and that being the driver
for wage rate increases at all levels.

Unless you are mistakenly saying income when you mean estate tax 
and want to tax estates above 12 million. A fair proposal in my view
-- particularly if there are 3-5 kids, 20 grand kids etc.
But then again, few with estates above 12 million pay much estate 
 

  

 tax -- its all in sheletered trusts.
   



I suggest a flat tax per above, with an estate tax kicking in at
$10-20 million.

Just watch the resident ultra-leftists -- poor wannabes but
never-gonna-bees,  whine at this :)
 

  

This leftist has absolutely no problem with the 
suggestion. I'd make the estate tax level much
lower, but other than that, a flat tax with no
deductions is the way to go.
   



Ok, my final offer: :) a 17% flat estate tax above five million.  But
you hafta also support my 15 points towards real democracy --
yesterdays rant (IRV, etc.) Its a package deal :)

  

BTW, I do agree with some of your 15 points.  Probably more than you 
would imagine.  BTW, do you fancy yourself a Libertarian?  You read


that 
  

way.



I don't fancy myself anything. I don't take some platform and adopt
it. I think through each  issue and decide on the merits. My views
certainly are not universally libertairan. Ask me about pollution.  

Your views come off as Libertarian.



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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 6/25/06 12:00:21 P.M. Central Daylight Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED].. wrote:  In a message dated 6/25/06 
  10:53:56 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 
   Instead, he noted, "We had made a rapid start. We did not have 
  any obstacles from the Iraqi side in going anywhere. They gave us 
   prompt access and we were in a great many places all over 
  Iraq."  Again I would like to know when and where Blix said 
  this.He said it to the BBC the previous day (March 19, 
  2003):http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/2867913.stmI 
  notice you snipped this from my Consaon quote:Yesterday [March 19, 
  2003], the New York Times reported that the Pentagon has prepared an 
  elaborate mission to find and test suspected chemical and biological 
  weapons sites. Military sources told Judith Miller that they have a list 
  of between 300 and 1,400 sites.Apparently the information to be used 
  by the Pentagon teams wasn't disclosed to Hans Blix. Indeed, he told the 
  BBC that his inspectors had been dispatched on several pointless 
  excursions by American intelligence. Would the Bush administration have 
  withheld useful information and intentionally sent the U.N. inspectors 
  elsewhere? Then when the U.N. teams found nothing, the inspection process 
  could be declared a failure."I'm very curious to see if they [the 
  U.S.] find something in Iraq," said Blix 
drily.

Quite frankly I don't think the Bush administration trusted 
Blix to be able to find anything and since Blix notified the Iraqi's in 
advance of which buildings and sites he was going to, that gave the Iraqis the 
opportunity to move things or sanitize the site before he got there. Obviously 
the Pentagon wasn't going to tip off the Iraqis via Hans Blix with ever 
suspected site so they could be cleaned up before 
inspection.
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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Massive Shortcomings of New.Morning

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 From adjacent post:
 
 [to Judy]
 If you wish to start a new thread on The Massive Shortcomings of
 New.Morning

Did I say I wanted to start a new thread on The Massive
Shortcomings of New.Morning?






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 6/25/06 12:00:21 P.M. Central Daylight Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
In a 
  message dated 6/25/06 10:53:56 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  writes:  Instead, he noted, "We had made a rapid start. We did 
  not have any obstacles from the Iraqi side in going anywhere. They 
  gave us  prompt access and we were in a great many places all over 
  Iraq."  Again I would like to know when and where Blix said 
  this.He said it to the BBC the previous day (March 19, 
  2003):http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/2867913.stmI 
  notice you snipped this from my Consaon quote:

Sorry, I did not make myself clear here. What was the context 
in which this quote is taken,not the time or place of the quote. Blix may have 
been right at one point about not being interfered with. But that obviously 
changed or he is a liar. Too many people have come away complaining of Iraqi 
interference in doing the UN inspections and I remember Blix complaining of the 
same in interviews he gave in the media. 
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Judy, 
 
 Again, I am heartedned that your manfiest critique of my observation
 -- that you maybe confusing correleation with causation with regards
 to being rich and empathy towards the 'non-rich' -- is a minor and
 not substantive one

Oh, actually it's a substantive and major one: You're
completely wrong.

You also like to hear yourself talk.






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread Bhairitu
new_morning_blank_slate wrote:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  

History shows that not to be true at all.  Most are just greedy


bastards 
  

who care little about their fellow humanity.  People like Bill Gates


are 
  

a rare exception 



Well 280 billion annually in american philanthropy sort of deflates
your thesis. (Or are you concerned about the miserliness of Europeans
-- who have lower levels of philanthropy?)  

Sure I would love to see american philanthropy at a trillion or 10
trillion a year. European and Asian philanthropy matching such. It can
 happen. It requires a change of ethos. A softening of world
consciousness if you will. Its progressively happening. 

What will stop such in its tracks is confisgatory tax rates of 95-100%
  

You still don't get that a progressive tax means people won't try to 
earn another dime if they are going to pay more in taxes.  



I get it. And I think you You are dead wrong. Many such people will
spend every waking hour on how to shelter income. Very unproductive
for society to have many of its better minds engaged in such. 
  

Thanks for proving my point.  Anyone who would spend their time doing 
that is mentally imbalanced.   They are more in need of a psychiatrist 
than a financial adviser.   You must have missed my point about Gates 
being like Hurley on Lost.  Hurley in the series is the unlikely young 
kid who happened to win the lottery and worth millions.   Since he knew 
he was no expert on money he has financial manager taking care of his 
investments.  In a flashback episode they show him meeting with the 
manager and learning of companies he didn't know he owned.

If anything they need a serious course in meditation as they are too 
attached to their wealth.

And if I finally get your plan (let see if I do), it will lead to a
such surge of conspicuous consuption and a drop in savings and
investment -- two things that are huge drags on the economy.

So let me see if I get your plan. If one's ESTATE were to reach 12
mil, you would then tax marginal INCOME at 100% rates. If this is
true, then when net worth is 11,900 or so, rational (and irrational
alike) people will spend 100% of their income and save and invest
nothing. Being forced to spend everything, against their, long-honed
spirit to save and invest, they will spend their money primarily on
conspicuous consumption and toys. How this mitigates greed in society
at large is beyond me.

But I probably have misunderstood your plan. I can't imagine anyone
with a straight face suggesting something so destructive to the
economy and a savings/investment ethos -- which is at the core of
productivity (the basis for  wage increases for all) -- and to wildly
inflame greed, shallow values, consumerism, class jealousy and crass
materialism.  

  

Why when taxes went up under the Clinton administration did the economy 
improve?  That disproves your point.

I've already mentioned this isn't my idea, it was floated years ago and 
I think I first heard it around the 1980 elections which was back when I 
was reading a lot of the published economists. 

So which million are you working on your third, second, first or even 
your first 100K?  :)

While you're at it here are the tax rates from 1954 (during the 
Eisenhower Administration) which I believe were in effect up until the 
Reagan administration which implemented voodoo economics or the 
fallacy of the trickle down theory which I guess means piss on the poor.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internal_Revenue_Code_of_1954

We see there was a 91% tax on people earning over 200K a year.  Adjusted 
for inflation that would be somewhere over $1 million a year today.

Adam Smith and Thomas Jefferson were advocates of a progressive income 
tax.  I am a fan of Thom Hartmann's show who has written on the subject 
of progressive taxes.

At this moment the news is mentioning Warren Buffet giving away 85% of 
his wealth.  Buffet has been goading the masses for years about the 
unfairness of the tax code and their lack of doing something about it.

Someone once said: the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, 
or the one. :)




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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 6/25/06 12:06:10 P.M. Central Daylight Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
  "shempmcgurk" shempmcgurk@...wrote:  
  Judy never met a mass-murdering dictator she didn't like.Bush? Nixon? 
  Oh, you said "dictators", not "almost or hopefuldictators". My 
  mistake.

You conveniently left Bill Clinton out ofthis. Remember 
thousands of innocent Serbian civiliansbombed in order to reduce the 
possibility of an American pilot being shot down while attacking military 
targets, mostly cardboard tanks, from a height of over 30,000 
feet.
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
  no_reply@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ 
wrote:
   
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
no_reply@ wrote:
  When rich people talk about money, they're talking
  about something entirely different from what poor and
  middle-class people mean when they talk about it.
  They might as well be on different planets.
 
 Your speculations of how others', or perhaps your own,
 values and motivations may change with substantial wealth 
 is simply speculation -- not a well reserched set of 
 studies developing a concensus view of researchers on this 
 issue. Same with my speculations.

snore
   
   Yes, my comment was a bit leaden. But I could not think of a 
   better alternative to counter the, IMO, weak writing that 
   conveys a broad sweeping generalization about a group, as if 
   its universal, when it at best applies to only a portion of the 
   group.
  
  I believe the portion you quoted above applies
  across the board, even to people like Bill Gates.
  
  The snore was because mine was a pretty unexceptional
  observation, almost a truism;
 
 That the rich lack empathy towards the non-rich

Does the portion you quoted above say anything about empathy?







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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread Bhairitu
shempmcgurk wrote:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:


And I *do* want to make it clear the progressive tax would work 
  

this 
  

way: once you had an estate valued at 12 million the progressive 
  

tax 
  

would kick in.  
  

At what rate(s)? At the current 35-60% (aproximate numbers)
progressively? Or are you actually suggesting a a 100% tax after 12
million? If so  Wow! O to 100% taxataion at 12 million!!! Wow!!
Nothing AT ALL progressive about that. Progresive taxes have a long
hist ory, NO ONE that I can recall has ever suggesting anthing so
draconian.

Still, your proposal is far more liberal than current laws that 


start
  

taxation  at just over a million and then tax at 35 to 60 %
progressively.







In 2006, the estate tax exemption is $2,000,000 per person 
($4,000,000 for a married couple) and that's going up to $3,500,000 
per person in a few years.

The highest rate is 46% (it starts at, I think, about 38%).


  

And why did it go up?  Well those old homes that mom and dad bought back 
in the 30's and 40's for a song (not then but now) are sometimes worth 
as much as a $1 million.  Many including the own I own are worth over 
$600K which was the old exemption.  My aunt's home in the South Bay is 
probably worth over $1 million and it is nothing but she is just located 
in the right place (the house cost something like $2500 originally).

While we're at the minimum wage needs to go way up.  Oh boy, I'm sure 
we'll hear the whining here on that.  :)



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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 6/25/06 1:09:54 P.M. Central Daylight Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  
  In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
  "shempmcgurk" shempmcgurk@... wrote: --- In 
  FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
  "authfriend" jstein@  wrote:   --- In 
  FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
  "shempmcgurk" shempmcgurk@   wrote:  
  snip   Because   He didn't comply with 
  inspections   So right or wrong information   
  On whether there was WMD   Is moot   When all 
  Saddy Baby had to do   Was let us in   And 
  inspect   Which he didn't doOf 
  course, he *did* let the inspectors in.  I see. 
   Silly United Nations passing those 17 resolutions when Saddam was 
   so co-operative.You know, Shemp, somebody who doesn't know 
  youvery well might think you're just outrageouslystupid rather than 
  outrageously dishonest.Actually, you're both. You're 
  outrageouslystupid to think anybody is going to believe youroutrageous 
  falsehoods. 

Judy I'm sorry, But I find nothing stupid or dishonest about 
anything Shemp has commented on this post. There were 17 resolutions passed 
concerning the matter and Saddam did little or nothing to co-operate unless he 
was forced to do so.
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 new.morning wrote:
 
 BTW, do you fancy yourself a Libertarian?  You read that way.
 
 I don't fancy myself anything. I don't take some platform and adopt
 it. I think through each  issue and decide on the merits. My views
 certainly are not universally libertairan. Ask me about pollution.  
 
 Your views come off as Libertarian.

OK, you personally find my views similar to Libertarians. Your point
is? Any particular relevance that you attach to that? Or just making
causual non-related observations?






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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Notice the dates on each of these press conferences, well  after 
 the invasion.

duh

 Everybody knew the UN had been in Iraq looking for WMDs.  Also, 
 everybody knew Saddam had expelled inspectors before and eventually 
 let  them back in. Also obviously, everybody knew Bush pulled out 
 the inspectors  before the hostilities began. So the context in 
 which Bush was saying they  wouldn't let inspectors in was, they 
 wouldn't let inspectors in unfettered to  do their jobs or without 
 trying to interfere. The big complaint at the time was  the shell 
 game Saddam was trying to play or give the appearance of   playing. 
 So it is easy to call Bush a liar in this instance if you take his  
 comments out of context.

The comments were not taken out of context.

Even Bush is smart enough to say He wouldn't let the
inspectors do their jobs instead of He wouldn't let
the inspectors in if that's what he wanted people to
understand.

And it wasn't just a slip of the tongue; he said it
*at least three times*, at formal White House press
conferences, no less.

It isn't just me and Joe Conason.  Even the Washington
Post remarked on Bush's misstatement:

The president's assertion that the war began because Iraq did not 
admit inspectors appeared to contradict the events leading up to war 
this spring: Hussein had, in fact, admitted the inspectors and Bush 
had opposed extending their work because he did not believe them 
effective.

And again, according to Blix--the man who was there--
the inspectors were *not* having any trouble getting
access to the sites they wanted to see.  It was the
Bush administration that was trying to sabotage their
work, not Saddam.

Sorry, but you just can't spin Bush out of this one.


 
 One thing Bush's political enemies constantly criticize  him about 
are his 
 communication skills and obviously the lack of clarification  in 
his comments 
 opened him up to attack, calling him a liar. But I think anybody  
with half a 
 brain that has kept up with the conflict and is not a Bush hater  
knows exactly 
 what was meant in those press conference  statements.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  
 In a message dated 6/25/06 12:00:21 P.M. Central Daylight Time,  
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 
  
  
 --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
(mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) 
 ,  MDixon6569@,  MDi
 
  
  In a message dated 6/25/06  10:53:56 A.M. Central Daylight Time, 
  jstein@ writes:
   
  Instead, he noted, We had made a rapid start. We did not have  
any
  obstacles from the Iraqi side in going anywhere. They gave us  
  prompt access and we were in a great many places all over  Iraq.
  
  Again I would like to know when and where Blix said  this.
 
 He said it to the BBC the previous day (March 19,  2003):
 
 _http://news.http://newhttp://newshttp://news.http://news_ 
 (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/2867913.stm) 
 
 I  notice you snipped this from my Consaon quote:
 
 Yesterday [March 19,  2003], the New York Times reported that the 
 Pentagon has prepared an  elaborate mission to find and test 
suspected 
 chemical and biological  weapons sites. Military sources told 
Judith 
 Miller that they have a list  of between 300 and 1,400 sites.
 
 Apparently the information to be used  by the Pentagon teams wasn't 
 disclosed to Hans Blix. Indeed, he told the  BBC that his 
inspectors 
 had been dispatched on several pointless  excursions by American 
 intelligence. Would the Bush administration have  withheld useful 
 information and intentionally sent the U.N. inspectors  elsewhere? 
 Then when the U.N. teams found nothing, the inspection process  
could 
 be declared a failure.
 
 I'm very curious to see if they [the  U.S.] find something in 
Iraq, 
 said Blix  drily.
 
 Quite frankly I don't think the Bush administration trusted  Blix  
to be able 
 to find anything and since Blix notified the Iraqi's in  advance of 
which 
 buildings and sites he was going to, that gave the Iraqis the  
opportunity to 
 move things or sanitize the site before he got there. Obviously  
the Pentagon 
 wasn't going to tip off the Iraqis via Hans Blix with ever  
suspected site so 
 they could be cleaned up before  inspection.

Oh, please, M.  When are you going to wake up and smell
the coffee?








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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  
 In a message dated 6/25/06 12:00:21 P.M. Central Daylight Time,  
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 
 In a  message dated 6/25/06 10:53:56 A.M. Central Daylight Time, 
  jstein@  writes:
  
  Instead, he noted, We had made a rapid start. We did  not have 
any
  obstacles from the Iraqi side in going anywhere. They  gave us 
  prompt access and we were in a great many places all over  Iraq.
  
  Again I would like to know when and where Blix said  this.
 
 He said it to the BBC the previous day (March 19,  2003):
 
 _http://news.http://newhttp://newshttp://news.http://news_ 
 (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/2867913.stm) 
 
 I  notice you snipped this from my Consaon quote:
 
 Sorry, I did not make myself clear here. What was the context  in 
which this 
 quote is taken,not the time or place of the quote.

I gave you a link to the whole BBC interview!  What
more context could you want?

 Blix may have  been right 
 at one point about not being interfered with. But that obviously  
changed

At one point??  The interview took place *after the
invasion*.

 or he 
 is a liar. Too many people have come away complaining of Iraqi  
interference 
 in doing the UN inspections and I remember Blix complaining of the  
same in 
 interviews he gave in the media.

You'd better check your memory banks and see when he
made those complaints.  And how many of the complaints
from too many people came via the Bush administration?

Remember, it was in the administration's interest to
portray Saddam as not letting the inspectors do their
jobs.  Likewise it was in the administration's interest
to portray Blix as somehow incompetent.

And finally, remember that Blix was *correct*: The weapons
they were looking for did not exist.  Saddam had been
telling the truth.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 new_morning_blank_slate wrote:
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
   
 
 History shows that not to be true at all.  Most are just greedy
 
 
 bastards 
   
 
 who care little about their fellow humanity.  People like Bill Gates
 
 
 are 
   
 
 a rare exception 
 
 
 
 Well 280 billion annually in american philanthropy sort of deflates
 your thesis. (Or are you concerned about the miserliness of Europeans
 -- who have lower levels of philanthropy?)  
 
 Sure I would love to see american philanthropy at a trillion or 10
 trillion a year. European and Asian philanthropy matching such. It can
  happen. It requires a change of ethos. A softening of world
 consciousness if you will. Its progressively happening. 
 
 What will stop such in its tracks is confisgatory tax rates of 95-100%
   
 
 You still don't get that a progressive tax means people won't try to 
 earn another dime if they are going to pay more in taxes.  
 
 
 
 I get it. And I think you You are dead wrong. Many such people will
 spend every waking hour on how to shelter income. Very unproductive
 for society to have many of its better minds engaged in such. 
   
 
 Thanks for proving my point.  Anyone who would spend their time doing 
 that is mentally imbalanced.   They are more in need of a psychiatrist 
 than a financial adviser.   You must have missed my point about Gates 
 being like Hurley on Lost.  Hurley in the series is the unlikely young 
 kid who happened to win the lottery and worth millions.   Since he knew 
 he was no expert on money he has financial manager taking care of his 
 investments.  In a flashback episode they show him meeting with the 
 manager and learning of companies he didn't know he owned.
 

Interesting thing to say about Gates. His stated goal in life for several 
decades was to 
become the richest man in the world...






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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  
 In a message dated 6/25/06 1:09:54 P.M. Central Daylight Time,  
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 
  
 In [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
(mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) ,  
 shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 
  --- In  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 (mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) ,  authfriend jstein@ 
  wrote:
  
   --- In  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 (mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) ,  shempmcgurk 
 shempmcgurk@ 
   wrote:
snip
Because
He didn't comply with  inspections
So right or wrong information
 On whether there was WMD
Is moot
When all  Saddy Baby had to do
Was let us in
And  inspect
Which he didn't do
   
   Of  course, he *did* let the inspectors in.
  
  I see.
   
  Silly United Nations passing those 17 resolutions when Saddam
  was so co-operative.
 
 You know, Shemp, somebody who doesn't know  you
 very well might think you're just outrageously
 stupid rather than  outrageously dishonest.
 
 Actually, you're both. You're  outrageously
 stupid to think anybody is going to believe your
 outrageous  falsehoods.
 
 Judy I'm sorry, But I find nothing stupid or dishonest about  
anything Shemp 
 has commented on this post. There were 17 resolutions passed  
concerning the 
 matter and Saddam did little or nothing to co-operate unless he  
was forced to 
 do so.

No, M., sorry, *in context* (you're a big fan of context,
right?) Shemp's response was outrageously dishonest.  That
Saddam had not let inspectors in *at other times* is
irrelevant to the fact that he *had* let them in during the
period Bush was talking about when he said (three times)
that Saddam hadn't let the inspectors in.

That you can't see Shemp's remark was dishonest certainly
fits the pattern of your inability to see Bush's dishonesty.









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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
 
  new_morning_blank_slate wrote:
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:

  
  History shows that not to be true at all.  Most are just greedy
  
  
  bastards 

  
  who care little about their fellow humanity.  People like Bill 
Gates
  
  
  are 

  
  a rare exception 
  
  
  
  Well 280 billion annually in american philanthropy sort of 
deflates
  your thesis. (Or are you concerned about the miserliness of 
Europeans
  -- who have lower levels of philanthropy?)  
  
  Sure I would love to see american philanthropy at a trillion or 
10
  trillion a year. European and Asian philanthropy matching such. 
It can
   happen. It requires a change of ethos. A softening of world
  consciousness if you will. Its progressively happening. 
  
  What will stop such in its tracks is confisgatory tax rates of 
95-100%

  
  You still don't get that a progressive tax means people won't 
try to 
  earn another dime if they are going to pay more in taxes.  
  
  
  
  I get it. And I think you You are dead wrong. Many such people 
will
  spend every waking hour on how to shelter income. Very 
unproductive
  for society to have many of its better minds engaged in such. 

  
  Thanks for proving my point.  Anyone who would spend their time 
doing 
  that is mentally imbalanced.   They are more in need of a 
psychiatrist 
  than a financial adviser.   You must have missed my point about 
Gates 
  being like Hurley on Lost.  Hurley in the series is the 
unlikely young 
  kid who happened to win the lottery and worth millions.   Since 
he knew 
  he was no expert on money he has financial manager taking care of 
his 
  investments.  In a flashback episode they show him meeting with 
the 
  manager and learning of companies he didn't know he owned.
  
 
 Interesting thing to say about Gates. His stated goal in life
 for several decades was to become the richest man in the world...

He has said publicly that before he dies, he wants to
give away 96 percent of his fortune.

It's not impossible that's *why* he wanted to become the
richest man in the world: so he could give most of it
away.






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[FairfieldLife] And I thought *I* had OCD problems...

2006-06-25 Thread sparaig
For the past few days, I've been contributing to the wikipedia entry on 
Transcendental 
Meditation. Boy, is that fun in dysfunctional sort of way. Between Peter, 
Andrew Skolnick and 
myself, we've managed to completely rewrite the whole thing about 10x over.

http://www.wikipedia.org keyword: transcendental meditation. Click on the 
history tab to 
see what I mean...






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
 no_reply@ wrote:
 
  Judy, 
  
  Again, I am heartedned that your manfiest critique of my observation
  -- that you maybe confusing correleation with causation with regards
  to being rich and empathy towards the 'non-rich' -- is a minor and
  not substantive one
 
 Oh, actually it's a substantive and major one: You're
 completely wrong.
 
 You also like to hear yourself talk.

OK then. So it be written, so it is true. 

If only the world agreed with you, that your just saying it makes a
strong case, you would be in fat city.













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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
 no_reply@ wrote:
 
  Judy, 
  
  Again, I am heartedned that your manfiest critique of my observation
  -- that you maybe confusing correleation with causation with regards
  to being rich and empathy towards the 'non-rich' -- is a minor and
  not substantive one
 
 Oh, actually it's a substantive and major one: You're
 completely wrong.
 
 You also like to hear yourself talk.

OK then. So it be written, so it is true. 

If only the world agreed with you, that your just saying it makes a
strong case, you would be in fat city.

And again -- I think this is the fourth go around, I am heartened that
you have not offered a single direct critique of my observation  --
that you may be confusing correleation with causation with regards
to being rich and empathy towards the 'non-rich'.  














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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
 no_reply@ wrote:
 
  Judy, 
  
  Again, I am heartedned that your manfiest critique of my observation
  -- that you maybe confusing correleation with causation with regards
  to being rich and empathy towards the 'non-rich' -- is a minor and
  not substantive one
 
 Oh, actually it's a substantive and major one: You're
 completely wrong.
 
 You also like to hear yourself talk.

OK then. So it be written, so it is true. 

If only the world agreed with you, that your just saying it makes a
strong case, you would be in fat city.

And again -- I think this is the fourth go around, I am heartened that
you have not offered a single direct critique of my observation (aka
the observation)  -- that you may be confusing correleation with
causation with regards
to being rich and empathy towards the 'non-rich'.  

If you have any direct and substantial critiques of the observation,
please post your actual argument. Step by step. 

And, as you know,  simply addressing side issues really does not
address the core point. They simply divert attention for a second or two.











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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread Bhairitu
new_morning_blank_slate wrote:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  

new.morning wrote:



BTW, do you fancy yourself a Libertarian?  You read that way.


I don't fancy myself anything. I don't take some platform and adopt
it. I think through each  issue and decide on the merits. My views
certainly are not universally libertairan. Ask me about pollution.  

  

Your views come off as Libertarian.



OK, you personally find my views similar to Libertarians. Your point
is? Any particular relevance that you attach to that? Or just making
causual non-related observations?

It allows for a certain predictability in your responses.



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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread Bhairitu
sparaig wrote:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  

new_morning_blank_slate wrote:



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
 

  

History shows that not to be true at all.  Most are just greedy
   



bastards 
 

  

who care little about their fellow humanity.  People like Bill Gates
   



are 
 

  

a rare exception 
   



Well 280 billion annually in american philanthropy sort of deflates
your thesis. (Or are you concerned about the miserliness of Europeans
-- who have lower levels of philanthropy?)  

Sure I would love to see american philanthropy at a trillion or 10
trillion a year. European and Asian philanthropy matching such. It can
happen. It requires a change of ethos. A softening of world
consciousness if you will. Its progressively happening. 

What will stop such in its tracks is confisgatory tax rates of 95-100%
 

  

You still don't get that a progressive tax means people won't try to 
earn another dime if they are going to pay more in taxes.  
   



I get it. And I think you You are dead wrong. Many such people will
spend every waking hour on how to shelter income. Very unproductive
for society to have many of its better minds engaged in such. 
 

  

Thanks for proving my point.  Anyone who would spend their time doing 
that is mentally imbalanced.   They are more in need of a psychiatrist 
than a financial adviser.   You must have missed my point about Gates 
being like Hurley on Lost.  Hurley in the series is the unlikely young 
kid who happened to win the lottery and worth millions.   Since he knew 
he was no expert on money he has financial manager taking care of his 
investments.  In a flashback episode they show him meeting with the 
manager and learning of companies he didn't know he owned.




Interesting thing to say about Gates. His stated goal in life for several 
decades was to 
become the richest man in the world...

The founder of the company I used to work for stated in his high school 
yearbook that his goal in life was to be a millionaire.  He made it.  It 
also interesting to note he was born one month earlier than Gates with 
the same rising sign.  I once told him that now that he was wealthy he 
would turn into a Republican.  You should have seen the look he gave me.  :)




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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Massive Shortcomings of New.Morning

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
Re: The Massive Shortcomings of New.Morning

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate
 no_reply@ wrote:
 
  From adjacent post:
 
  [to Judy]
  If you wish to start a new thread on The Massive Shortcomings of
  New.Morning

 Did I say I wanted to start a new thread on The Massive
 Shortcomings of New.Morning?

No. There are actually many things you do not say. Not every post on
this forum must be directly related to something you explicitly
said.(No you did not say that. I inferred it as a possble hypothesis
for your constant asking such questions as Did I say that?. I have
other hypotheses. Wanna hear them?)

Though we could start a new chat group that must confrom to such
rules. What fun!

(And to short-cut your next possible question -- based on pattern,
'no, you did not explicitly say you wanted to do that. I thought it up
myself.' I am sure you are getting the hang of this by now.


My points, both implied and explicit, that you were evidently unable
to follow, were:

1) you made an observation of a personal nature on my traits as if
that were a valid substitute for an effective argument to the points
in my post.

2) I simply reminded you that usually such personal observations are
not a useful or valid substitute for an effective argument to the
points of a post.

3) And I asked if, suggesting was the implied tone and meaning, (note
the I, not you, thats a big clue here), we should start a separate
thread on that topic. 

The implication was that IF you have MORE observations of a personal
nature on my traits, then we could start a separate thread, so that we
could do the topic justice. 

4) And doing such will separate personal observations and attacks from
the arguments and discussion of substantive ideas. A good thing in my
view.



I know its a pretty complex chain of logic, but I am confident that if
you if you are still confusedre, if you re-read it, that it will be
become clearer. 

If not, if you still confused, please follow-up off-line so as
not to waste the forum's on such matters that some may find remedial.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 new_morning_blank_slate wrote:
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
   
 
 new.morning wrote:
 
 
 
 BTW, do you fancy yourself a Libertarian?  You read that way.
 
 
 I don't fancy myself anything. I don't take some platform and adopt
 it. I think through each  issue and decide on the merits. My views
 certainly are not universally libertairan. Ask me about pollution.  
 
   
 
 Your views come off as Libertarian.
 
 
 
 OK, you personally find my views similar to Libertarians. Your point
 is? Any particular relevance that you attach to that? Or just making
 causual non-related observations?
 
 It allows for a certain predictability in your responses.

Why you seek to predict my responses, which I infer is a type of
sterotyping, pegging, profiling, prejudgement heuristic that you find
of value (I don't), instead of actually reading the posts with an
unbiased mind, is not clear.

But if you are pegging me as a mainstream libertarian, your
predictions will fail miserably on some topics. Want to try gun
control, pollution and education?









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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 6/25/06 2:42:54 P.M. Central Daylight Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
. Even 
  the WashingtonPost remarked on Bush's 
misstatement:

That's my point. Misstatements. Obviously Bush was 
meaningSaddam didn't allow the UN inspectors in unfettered, because 
it was clear they were thereand had been there. It was on the front page 
of the news almost everyday.
__._,_.___





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Re: [FairfieldLife] Vit B12 Methyl Form

2006-06-25 Thread Bhairitu
new_morning_blank_slate wrote:

Thanks card for posting the article on B12. For decades, as a
vegetarian (mostly -- with a 2-3 year trial exception of fish and
poultry ) and vegan at times, I have been aware of the need to
supplement ones diet with B12. 

I did not know the low absorbsion rate of the almost universally used
form of B12 used in supplements, cobalamin. I bought some of the more
absorbable sub-lingual methyl form yesterday -- its 500 mcg per tab
(hm that phrase has an oddly familiar ring to it). The RNI (Required
Nutritional Intake) is 1.5 mcg. So today, my brain may be functioning
at 300+ times its usual sluggish rate. :)

Actually, I do feel better, more energy, but that might just be from
the coffee I just had from my neighbor the meth manufacturer. :)
Hardly a controlled study.

But I suggest others look into trying the subligual methyl form of B12. 






Here is another article that states similar things as the one you posted.

First an excerpt:

A deficiency often manifests itself first in the development of
neurological dysfunction that is almost indistinguishable from senile
dementia and Alzheimer's disease. There is little question that many
patients exhibiting symptoms of Alzheimer's actually suffer from a
vitamin B12 deficiency. Their symptoms are totally reversible through
effective supplementation. 

Maybe someone can give MMY daily methyl -- sublingual B12, or shots,
and see if the TMO is suddenly transformed to something like the 70's.




a vitamin B12 deficiency may not manifest itself until after 5 or 6
years of a diet supplying inadequate amounts. Vitamin B12 functions as
a methyl donor and works with folic acid in the synthesis of DNA and
red blood cells and is vitally important in maintaining the health of
the insulation sheath (myelin sheath) that surrounds nerve cells. The
classical vitamin B12 deficiency disease is pernicious anaemia, a
serious disease characterized by large, immature red blood cells. It
is now clear though, that a vitamin B12 deficiency can have serious
consequences long before anaemia is evident. The normal blood level of
vitamin B12 ranges between 200 and 600 picogram/milliliter (148-443
picomol/liter).

A deficiency often manifests itself first in the development of
neurological dysfunction that is almost indistinguishable from senile
dementia and Alzheimer's disease. There is little question that many
patients exhibiting symptoms of Alzheimer's actually suffer from a
vitamin B12 deficiency. Their symptoms are totally reversible through
effective supplementation. A low level of vitamin B12 has also been
associated with asthma, depression, AIDS, multiple sclerosis,
tinnitus, diabetic neuropathy and low sperm counts. Clearly, it is
very important to maintain adequate body stores of this crucial vitamin.

The amount of vitamin B12 actually needed by the body is very small,
probably only about 2 micrograms or 2 millionth of a gram/day.
Unfortunately, vitamin B12 is not absorbed very well so much larger
amounts need to be supplied through the diet or supplementation. The
richest dietary sources of vitamin B12 are liver, especially lamb's
liver, and kidneys. Eggs, cheese and some species of fish also supply
small amounts, but vegetables and fruits are very poor sources.
Several surveys have shown that most strict, long-term vegetarians are
vitamin B12 deficient. Many elderly people are also deficient because
their production of the intrinsic factor needed to absorb the vitamin
from the small intestine decline rapidly with age.

Fortunately, oral supplementation with vitamin B12 is safe, efficient
and inexpensive. Most multi-vitamin pills contain 100-200 microgram of
the cyanocobalamin form of B-12. This must be converted to
methylcobalamin or adenosylcobalamin before it can be used by the
body. The actual absorption of B12 is also a problem with supplements.
Swallowing 500 micrograms of cyanocobalamin can result in absorption
of as little as 1.8 microgram so most multivitamins do not provide an
adequate daily intake. The best approach is to dissolve a sublingual
tablet of methylcobalamin (1000 micrograms) under the tongue every
day. That will be sufficient to maintain adequate body stores.
However, if a deficiency is actually present then 2000 microgram/day
for one month is recommended followed by 1000 microgram/day. Some
physicians still maintain that monthly injections of vitamin B12 is
required to maintain adequate levels in the elderly and in patients
with a diagnosed deficiency. There is however, no scientific evidence
supporting the notion that injections are more effective than
sublingual supplementation. 

http://www.yourhealthbase.com/vitamin_B12.html

and

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_B12

Like many TM'ers back in the late 1970's I gave up on being a 
vegetarian.   I had too many bouts with hypoglycemia, anemia and vata 
derangements.   Using supplements will not often deal with the pH 
imbalance that occurs in some wannabe 

Re: [FairfieldLife] 2400 Pundits to Germany?

2006-06-25 Thread Bhairitu
So why are the Vedic Pundits Indian?  Why doesn't the TMO just train 
Germans to be pundits?  Or is this like bringing in Mexicans to mow your 
lawn?

bob_brigante wrote:

http://www.globalgoodnews.com/world-peace-a.html?art=1151176428109153





  




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[FairfieldLife] Re: And I thought *I* had OCD problems...

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 For the past few days, I've been contributing to the wikipedia 
entry on Transcendental 
 Meditation. Boy, is that fun in dysfunctional sort of way. Between 
Peter, Andrew Skolnick and 
 myself, we've managed to completely rewrite the whole thing about 
10x over.
 
 http://www.wikipedia.org keyword: transcendental meditation. 
Click on the history tab to 
 see what I mean...

Omigod, what a disaster.  Skolnick's going to turn
the entry into a rerun of his JAMA article if he's not
stopped.

I'm tempted to put in a paragraph or three on the JAMA
episode and point out that one of the people making
contributions to the entry is the author of the JAMA
muckraking piece and that he was sued by TM for it.

There ought to be *some* way of getting a person 
barred from editing Wikipedia entries when it can be
demonstrated that they have a personal interesting in
and a history of smearing whatever the entry is about.
Or at the very least, there ought to be some way of
identifying such a person's contributions in the
main entry.

(Laswon, please do me a flavor: Don't let Peter Klutz
keep putting in the phrase comprises of--it isn't
English.  You corrected it once, and he put it back in;
then you or someone else corrected it again--but he's
liable to put it back if you're not careful.  Minor
point, but the phrase is really illiterate.)

You're doing terrific work, Lawson, but if Andrew has
time on his hands, countering his distortions and
misstatements is going to be a full-time job.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Massive Shortcomings of New.Morning

2006-06-25 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Of course all others are cordially welcomed to chime in. Unc, Tom,
 Jim, Peter all have good, perhaps at times entertaining, insights 
 on this topic.

The topic is all about self importance, and thus 
boring. Judy nailed it. Often you seem to post 
for no other reason than to hear yourself talk.

You seem to be used to all this chatter going on 
in your mind all the time, to the point that you
don't perceive it as everyday, boring mindchatter
when you choose to externalize it. Trust us...it's 
mindchatter. 

There's a nice guy in there, if he just spent less
time trying to capture other people's attention... 







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
  no_reply@ wrote:
  
   Judy, 
   
   Again, I am heartedned that your manfiest critique of my 
observation
   -- that you maybe confusing correleation with causation with 
regards
   to being rich and empathy towards the 'non-rich' -- is a 
minor and
   not substantive one
  
  Oh, actually it's a substantive and major one: You're
  completely wrong.
  
  You also like to hear yourself talk.
 
 OK then. So it be written, so it is true. 
 
 If only the world agreed with you, that your just saying it makes a
 strong case, you would be in fat city.
 
 And again -- I think this is the fourth go around, I am heartened 
that
 you have not offered a single direct critique of my observation  --
 that you may be confusing correleation with causation with regards
 to being rich and empathy towards the 'non-rich'.

You seem to be having reading comprehension difficulties.
My direct critique of your observation is that it is
completely wrong.









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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
  no_reply@ wrote:
  
   Judy, 
   
   Again, I am heartedned that your manfiest critique of my 
observation
   -- that you maybe confusing correleation with causation with 
regards
   to being rich and empathy towards the 'non-rich' -- is a 
minor and
   not substantive one
  
  Oh, actually it's a substantive and major one: You're
  completely wrong.
  
  You also like to hear yourself talk.
 
 OK then. So it be written, so it is true. 
 
 If only the world agreed with you, that your just saying it makes a
 strong case, you would be in fat city.
 
 And again -- I think this is the fourth go around, I am heartened 
that
 you have not offered a single direct critique of my observation (aka
 the observation)  -- that you may be confusing correleation with
 causation with regards
 to being rich and empathy towards the 'non-rich'.  
 
 If you have any direct and substantial critiques of the 
observation,
 please post your actual argument. Step by step.

All you have to do is reread what I actually wrote.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Massive Shortcomings of New.Morning

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Re: The Massive Shortcomings of New.Morning
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate
  no_reply@ wrote:
  
   From adjacent post:
  
   [to Judy]
   If you wish to start a new thread on The Massive Shortcomings 
of
   New.Morning
 
  Did I say I wanted to start a new thread on The Massive
  Shortcomings of New.Morning?
 
 No.

Very good.  Then your intro is irrelevant, and
there's no need for such a thread.







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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread Bhairitu
new_morning_blank_slate wrote:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  

new_morning_blank_slate wrote:



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
 

  

new.morning wrote:

   



BTW, do you fancy yourself a Libertarian?  You read that way.
   



I don't fancy myself anything. I don't take some platform and adopt
it. I think through each  issue and decide on the merits. My views
certainly are not universally libertairan. Ask me about pollution.  

 

  

Your views come off as Libertarian.
   



OK, you personally find my views similar to Libertarians. Your point
is? Any particular relevance that you attach to that? Or just making
causual non-related observations?

  

It allows for a certain predictability in your responses.



Why you seek to predict my responses, which I infer is a type of
sterotyping, pegging, profiling, prejudgement heuristic that you find
of value (I don't), instead of actually reading the posts with an
unbiased mind, is not clear.

But if you are pegging me as a mainstream libertarian, your
predictions will fail miserably on some topics. Want to try gun
control, pollution and education?

Yes, I observed those already in your list.  In some surveys I actually 
even come out as a libertarian.  Your arguing on taxes and wealth is 
almost classic libertarian almost if not the Aynn Rand school of it.

And no one is 100% any one way.  I have many friends who fancy 
themselves as liberals who live very conservatively.




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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Free Saddam Hussein'

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  
 In a message dated 6/25/06 2:42:54 P.M. Central Daylight Time,  
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 
 . Even  the Washington
 Post remarked on Bush's  misstatement:
 
 That's my point. Misstatements. Obviously Bush was  meaning Saddam 
 didn't allow the UN inspectors  in unfettered,

No, it's not obvious at all, especially not after he
made the same claim three separate times.

 because  it was clear 
 they were there and had been there. It was on the front page  of the 
 news almost everyday.

So was the fact that there was no connection between
Saddam and 9/11, yet the administration has continued
to try to make that connection in the public's mind,
with a great deal of success.

Bush even made the connection *this year* in his State
of the Union.

What you don't seem able to recognize is that this
administration has no qualms whatsoever about misleading
and deceiving the public.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: And I thought *I* had OCD problems...

2006-06-25 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
snip
 There ought to be *some* way of getting a person 
 barred from editing Wikipedia entries when it can be
 demonstrated that they have a personal interesting in

Personal *interest* in...

 and a history of smearing whatever the entry is about.
 Or at the very least, there ought to be some way of
 identifying such a person's contributions in the
 main entry.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Vit B12 Methyl Form

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Like many TM'ers back in the late 1970's I gave up on being a 
 vegetarian.   I had too many bouts with hypoglycemia, anemia and vata 
 derangements.   Using supplements will not often deal with the pH 
 imbalance that occurs in some wannabe vegetarians which will only be 
 solved with the inclusion of some animal protein in their diet.
 
 Now just watch the wailing and gnashing of teeth raising this subject 
 causes. :)

Hey if it works for you, great. I tried fish and poultry for 3 years
after 30 years of veg, and found it didn't suit me, so I am back to a
neo-veg. No grains, grams of carbs no more than grams of protein, lots
of fresh veg, little fruit (focus on pomigranate,cranberry, blueberry
-- the high polyphenols and anti-oxidants). 

There are many many possible veg diets. One cannot say all are bad or
unsuitable because the type they tried was not good.
My own experience, and observations of others, is that TMO's load up
on carbs -- rice, dahl, chapati, little raw veg, lots of fruit. No
wonder they get back results with such high carb levels and low
protein. Its a miracle that longtime consmers of such are not all
diabetics (oops, MMY, Devendra, Amma, more, etc, all diabetics I think).

And did you use methyl form of b-12? If not, that clearly corrleates
with and could explain anemia,low energy, hypoglycemia, etc. And a
high carb, high legume consumption can correlate with vata
derangments. NONE of this is necessary in a well-structured veg diet.








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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Massive Shortcomings of New.Morning

2006-06-25 Thread new_morning_blank_slate
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate
 no_reply@ wrote:
 
  Of course all others are cordially welcomed to chime in. Unc, Tom,
  Jim, Peter all have good, perhaps at times entertaining, insights 
  on this topic.
 
 The topic is all about self importance, and thus 
 boring. Judy nailed it. Often you seem to post 
 for no other reason than to hear yourself talk.

I am glad it seems that way to you. Provides you with some amusement I
suspect. Good.

 
 You seem 

seem [to you] being the operative concept.

 to be used to all this chatter going on 
 in your mind all the time, to the point that you
 don't perceive it as everyday, boring mindchatter
 when you choose to externalize it. Trust us...it's 
 mindchatter. 

Another great concept I hope amuses you.
 
 There's a nice guy in there, if he just spent less
 time trying to capture other people's attention...

My motives for posting have not yet been hit upon. But keep trying to
Pin the Tail on the Donkey. Particularly as you find it amuses you. 











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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 new_morning_blank_slate wrote:
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
   
 
 History shows that not to be true at all.  Most are just greedy
 
 
 bastards 
   
 
 who care little about their fellow humanity.  People like Bill Gates
 
 
 are 
   
 
 a rare exception 
 
 
 
 Well 280 billion annually in american philanthropy sort of deflates
 your thesis. (Or are you concerned about the miserliness of Europeans
 -- who have lower levels of philanthropy?)  
 
 Sure I would love to see american philanthropy at a trillion or 10
 trillion a year. European and Asian philanthropy matching such. It can
  happen. It requires a change of ethos. A softening of world
 consciousness if you will. Its progressively happening. 
 
 What will stop such in its tracks is confisgatory tax rates of 95-100%
   
 
 You still don't get that a progressive tax means people won't try to 
 earn another dime if they are going to pay more in taxes.  
 
 
 
 I get it. And I think you You are dead wrong. Many such people will
 spend every waking hour on how to shelter income. Very unproductive
 for society to have many of its better minds engaged in such. 
   
 
 Thanks for proving my point.  Anyone who would spend their time doing 
 that is mentally imbalanced.   They are more in need of a psychiatrist 
 than a financial adviser.   You must have missed my point about Gates 
 being like Hurley on Lost.  Hurley in the series is the unlikely young 
 kid who happened to win the lottery and worth millions.   Since he knew 
 he was no expert on money he has financial manager taking care of his 
 investments.  In a flashback episode they show him meeting with the 
 manager and learning of companies he didn't know he owned.
 
 If anything they need a serious course in meditation as they are too 
 attached to their wealth.
 

A point that MMY has used in his explanation for why he's jacked the price of 
TM to the 
Moon: the wealthy run the world and need TM more than anyone, but won't use it 
if it is 
too common. A rich man does not go to a poor store.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
  
   new_morning_blank_slate wrote:
   
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
 
   
   History shows that not to be true at all.  Most are just greedy
   
   
   bastards 
 
   
   who care little about their fellow humanity.  People like Bill 
 Gates
   
   
   are 
 
   
   a rare exception 
   
   
   
   Well 280 billion annually in american philanthropy sort of 
 deflates
   your thesis. (Or are you concerned about the miserliness of 
 Europeans
   -- who have lower levels of philanthropy?)  
   
   Sure I would love to see american philanthropy at a trillion or 
 10
   trillion a year. European and Asian philanthropy matching such. 
 It can
happen. It requires a change of ethos. A softening of world
   consciousness if you will. Its progressively happening. 
   
   What will stop such in its tracks is confisgatory tax rates of 
 95-100%
 
   
   You still don't get that a progressive tax means people won't 
 try to 
   earn another dime if they are going to pay more in taxes.  
   
   
   
   I get it. And I think you You are dead wrong. Many such people 
 will
   spend every waking hour on how to shelter income. Very 
 unproductive
   for society to have many of its better minds engaged in such. 
 
   
   Thanks for proving my point.  Anyone who would spend their time 
 doing 
   that is mentally imbalanced.   They are more in need of a 
 psychiatrist 
   than a financial adviser.   You must have missed my point about 
 Gates 
   being like Hurley on Lost.  Hurley in the series is the 
 unlikely young 
   kid who happened to win the lottery and worth millions.   Since 
 he knew 
   he was no expert on money he has financial manager taking care of 
 his 
   investments.  In a flashback episode they show him meeting with 
 the 
   manager and learning of companies he didn't know he owned.
   
  
  Interesting thing to say about Gates. His stated goal in life
  for several decades was to become the richest man in the world...
 
 He has said publicly that before he dies, he wants to
 give away 96 percent of his fortune.
 
 It's not impossible that's *why* he wanted to become the
 richest man in the world: so he could give most of it
 away.


Yeah, but his behavior in the business world was NOT that of someone who had an 
ounce 
of altruism. He made very few charity-oriented remarks until afer he got 
married. And his 
most famous comment about charities before he got married was that he was going 
to 
wait until he was 65 and retired before he started worrying about that kind of 
thing.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: 2400 Pundits to Germany?

2006-06-25 Thread jyouells2000
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 So why are the Vedic Pundits Indian?  Why doesn't the TMO just train 
 Germans to be pundits?  Or is this like bringing in Mexicans to mow
your 
 lawn?
 
 bob_brigante wrote:
 
 http://www.globalgoodnews.com/world-peace-a.html?art=1151176428109153
 


It's harder to raise money with German pundits. Look how much the
Indian  pundits have raised by not being here...





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[FairfieldLife] Re: 2400 Pundits to Germany?

2006-06-25 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 So why are the Vedic Pundits Indian?  Why doesn't the TMO just train 
 Germans to be pundits?  Or is this like bringing in Mexicans to mow your 
 lawn?
 
 bob_brigante wrote:
 
 http://www.globalgoodnews.com/world-peace-a.html?art=1151176428109153
 
 
 
 
 
   
 


Because punditism is in their genes? MMY has made remarks (IIRC) that different 
pundit 
families have the genes required to cognize different parts of the Veda.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: And I thought *I* had OCD problems...

2006-06-25 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote:
 
  For the past few days, I've been contributing to the wikipedia 
 entry on Transcendental 
  Meditation. Boy, is that fun in dysfunctional sort of way. Between 
 Peter, Andrew Skolnick and 
  myself, we've managed to completely rewrite the whole thing about 
 10x over.
  
  http://www.wikipedia.org keyword: transcendental meditation. 
 Click on the history tab to 
  see what I mean...
 
 Omigod, what a disaster.  Skolnick's going to turn
 the entry into a rerun of his JAMA article if he's not
 stopped.
 
 I'm tempted to put in a paragraph or three on the JAMA
 episode and point out that one of the people making
 contributions to the entry is the author of the JAMA
 muckraking piece and that he was sued by TM for it.
 

its immaterial to the way Wikipedia works. As long as Andrew can back up his 
rhetoric with  
references to external sources, he's within guidelines. 


 There ought to be *some* way of getting a person 
 barred from editing Wikipedia entries when it can be
 demonstrated that they have a personal interesting in
 and a history of smearing whatever the entry is about.
 Or at the very least, there ought to be some way of
 identifying such a person's contributions in the
 main entry.
 
 (Laswon, please do me a flavor: Don't let Peter Klutz
 keep putting in the phrase comprises of--it isn't
 English.  You corrected it once, and he put it back in;
 then you or someone else corrected it again--but he's
 liable to put it back if you're not careful.  Minor
 point, but the phrase is really illiterate.)


Peter has a habit of deleting entire sections without vetting with the rest of 
the 
contributors so I don't see me as having any influence on the situation, save 
that I possibly 
made it worse by challenging Andrew on a point or two. He got angry after that 
and 
started quoting  3rd hand sources within the body of the article. The nastier, 
the better, 
IMHO.

 
 You're doing terrific work, Lawson, but if Andrew has
 time on his hands, countering his distortions and
 misstatements is going to be a full-time job.


Eh. Selective quoting is what Wiki is all about in these controversial areas, I 
suspect.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 new_morning_blank_slate wrote:
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
   
 
 new_morning_blank_slate wrote:
 
 
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
  
 
   
 
 new.morning wrote:
 

 
 
 
 BTW, do you fancy yourself a Libertarian?  You read that way.

 
 
 
 I don't fancy myself anything. I don't take some platform and adopt
 it. I think through each  issue and decide on the merits. My views
 certainly are not universally libertairan. Ask me about pollution.  
 
  
 
   
 
 Your views come off as Libertarian.

 
 
 
 OK, you personally find my views similar to Libertarians. Your point
 is? Any particular relevance that you attach to that? Or just making
 causual non-related observations?
 
   
 
 It allows for a certain predictability in your responses.
 
 
 
 Why you seek to predict my responses, which I infer is a type of
 sterotyping, pegging, profiling, prejudgement heuristic that you find
 of value (I don't), instead of actually reading the posts with an
 unbiased mind, is not clear.
 
 But if you are pegging me as a mainstream libertarian, your
 predictions will fail miserably on some topics. Want to try gun
 control, pollution and education?
 
 Yes, I observed those already in your list.  In some surveys I actually 
 even come out as a libertarian.  Your arguing on taxes and wealth is 
 almost classic libertarian almost if not the Aynn Rand school of it.
 
 And no one is 100% any one way.  I have many friends who fancy 
 themselves as liberals who live very conservatively.


To me, being socially liberal isn't about how you live your own life, but 
about how willing 
you are to let others live theirs.






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Progressive and Flat Taxes

2006-06-25 Thread Bhairitu
sparaig wrote:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  

new_morning_blank_slate wrote:



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
 

  

History shows that not to be true at all.  Most are just greedy
   



bastards 
 

  

who care little about their fellow humanity.  People like Bill Gates
   



are 
 

  

a rare exception 
   



Well 280 billion annually in american philanthropy sort of deflates
your thesis. (Or are you concerned about the miserliness of Europeans
-- who have lower levels of philanthropy?)  

Sure I would love to see american philanthropy at a trillion or 10
trillion a year. European and Asian philanthropy matching such. It can
happen. It requires a change of ethos. A softening of world
consciousness if you will. Its progressively happening. 

What will stop such in its tracks is confisgatory tax rates of 95-100%
 

  

You still don't get that a progressive tax means people won't try to 
earn another dime if they are going to pay more in taxes.  
   



I get it. And I think you You are dead wrong. Many such people will
spend every waking hour on how to shelter income. Very unproductive
for society to have many of its better minds engaged in such. 
 

  

Thanks for proving my point.  Anyone who would spend their time doing 
that is mentally imbalanced.   They are more in need of a psychiatrist 
than a financial adviser.   You must have missed my point about Gates 
being like Hurley on Lost.  Hurley in the series is the unlikely young 
kid who happened to win the lottery and worth millions.   Since he knew 
he was no expert on money he has financial manager taking care of his 
investments.  In a flashback episode they show him meeting with the 
manager and learning of companies he didn't know he owned.

If anything they need a serious course in meditation as they are too 
attached to their wealth.




A point that MMY has used in his explanation for why he's jacked the price of 
TM to the 
Moon: the wealthy run the world and need TM more than anyone, but won't use it 
if it is 
too common. A rich man does not go to a poor store.

So TM is now the Neimann-Marcus of meditation?  :)



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[FairfieldLife] Re: Vit B12 Methyl Form

2006-06-25 Thread Nelson
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new_morning_blank_slate 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote:
 
  Like many TM'ers back in the late 1970's I gave up on being a 
  vegetarian.   I had too many bouts with hypoglycemia, anemia and 
vata 
  derangements.   Using supplements will not often deal with the pH 
  imbalance that occurs in some wannabe vegetarians which will only 
be 
  solved with the inclusion of some animal protein in their diet.
  
  Now just watch the wailing and gnashing of teeth raising this 
subject 
  causes. :)
 
 Hey if it works for you, great. I tried fish and poultry for 3 years
 after 30 years of veg, and found it didn't suit me, so I am back to 
a
 neo-veg. No grains, grams of carbs no more than grams of protein, 
lots
 of fresh veg, little fruit (focus on pomigranate,cranberry, 
blueberry
 -- the high polyphenols and anti-oxidants). 
 
 There are many many possible veg diets. One cannot say all are bad 
or
 unsuitable because the type they tried was not good.
 My own experience, and observations of others, is that TMO's load up
 on carbs -- rice, dahl, chapati, little raw veg, lots of fruit. No
 wonder they get back results with such high carb levels and low
 protein. Its a miracle that longtime consmers of such are not all
 diabetics (oops, MMY, Devendra, Amma, more, etc, all diabetics I 
think).
 
 And did you use methyl form of b-12? If not, that clearly corrleates
 with and could explain anemia,low energy, hypoglycemia, etc. And a
 high carb, high legume consumption can correlate with vata
 derangments. NONE of this is necessary in a well-structured veg 
diet.
+++ Would this work with all people?
 I was thinking or the different requirements of say a rabbit and 
a tiger and would wonder if you could make a vegitarian out of the 
tiger.
 Being a type-O kapha barbarian, I don't care much for many 
vegetables myself.  N.






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