Re: 10.5 Bug - does install on Windows 7, but fails to start because of CEF 117
Hello Белрус, Thursday, October 5, 2023, 3:56:43 AM, you wrote: > Howdy! > Вы писали 05 октября 2023 г., 10:19:09: >> Howdy! >> Вы писали 04 октября 2023 г., 19:38:13: >>> Hello The, >>> BUG: >>> >>> Installer does not warn about incompatible OS Windows 7 >>> And you need to update your Requirements page at >>> https://www.ritlabs.com/de/products/thebat/download.php#windows >>> https://www.ritlabs.com/en/products/thebat/download.php#windows >> You are not alone: >> https://www.ritlabs.com/ru/auth-forums/forum3/topic16158/message55642/?result=reply#message55642 >> Hey, RitLabs! Is is true and Win7 isn't compatible for 10.5 or this is a >> bug? > RitLabs isn't a big brother and ugly monopolies, this is private > company. I do think you need to have alternative for an old users > with old OS to have new versions. What about some alternative > html-viewers that don't care about Win7 with killing CEF installation for an > old PC's? The issue is being able to take advantage of new tech. There must come a point where it is no longer practical to support older os's. Some software providers have put out a last version of their products for old os's that will never be updated again. > Best Regards, George Salnik > RitLabs Russian Forum Moderator > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Best regards, Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Failures to start The Bat
That's encouraging. I have been struggling with the av errors for a week or so. Happens on MS Server 2016 & 2019, but not on win 10. Must download from the ritlabs download page I see. Maybe I missed an update message. On 2023-01-16 1:44:06 PM, Manuel Ostertag wrote: - Original Message - From: "Spencer Morgan" Sent: Monday, January 16, 2023 10:21:39 [UTC -0500] Subject: Failures to start The Bat > Hello , > Had a problem trying to start The Bat today with access violations. I had the same problem, see attached error messages. The update to 10.3.3.3 solves the problem. -- Best regards Manuel 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html [276b91c5-b47c-4754-8b65-69ffba860ba8] 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 10.1.0.5
Gunivortus, > Hello Gleason, >> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/v10/thebat_32_10-1-0-5.msi >> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/v10/thebat_64_10-1-0-5.msi Thanks, but it was 10.2 that I did not receive a notice for. I do have 10.1.0.5. >> Did I miss the 10.2 announcement here? >>> Seems like it. The announcement also did not arrive here. > Ah, then it wasn't a mail error at my side. > Was curious, 'cause the 10.2 was announced by RitLabs in Facebook. :-) -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 10.1.0.5
Gunivortus, > Hello Stefan, >> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/v10/thebat_32_10-1-0-5.msi >> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/v10/thebat_64_10-1-0-5.msi > Did I miss the 10.2 announcement here? Seems like it. The announcement also did not arrive here. -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: New error connecting
Gleason, >>>>> !2022-09-24, 08:47:08: IMAP - Could not connect to the server. A >>>>> request to send or receive data was disallowed because the socket is >>>>> not connected and (when sending on a datagram socket using a sendto >>>>> call) no address was supplied >>>> Hi Gleason, >>>> could you please try again? >>>> If this message appears again, then please report it again. >>> Yes, same error as yesterday. >> The error occurs on MS Server 2016 and not on Win 10, I see. Perhaps >> I should run dism and sfc on the server. > dism/sfc finds no integrity violations. Suggestions? Resolved. My vpn is interfering. TB is ok. > Gleason > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: New error connecting
> > >> > !2022-09-24, 08:47:08: IMAP - Could not connect to the server. A > >> > request to send or receive data was disallowed because the socket is > >> > not connected and (when sending on a datagram socket using a sendto > >> > call) no address was supplied > >> > >> Hi Gleason, > >> > >> could you please try again? > >> If this message appears again, then please report it again. > > > Yes, same error as yesterday. > > The error occurs on MS Server 2016 and not on Win 10, I see. Perhaps > I should run dism and sfc on the server. dism/sfc finds no integrity violations. Suggestions? > -- > > Gleason > > > ____ > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: New error connecting
Gleason, >> > !2022-09-24, 08:47:08: IMAP - Could not connect to the server. A >> > request to send or receive data was disallowed because the socket is >> > not connected and (when sending on a datagram socket using a sendto >> > call) no address was supplied >> >> Hi Gleason, >> >> could you please try again? >> If this message appears again, then please report it again. > Yes, same error as yesterday. The error occurs on MS Server 2016 and not on Win 10, I see. Perhaps I should run dism and sfc on the server. -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: New error connecting
> > !2022-09-24, 08:47:08: IMAP - Could not connect to the server. A > > request to send or receive data was disallowed because the socket is > > not connected and (when sending on a datagram socket using a sendto > > call) no address was supplied > > Hi Gleason, > > could you please try again? > If this message appears again, then please report it again. Yes, same error as yesterday. -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
New error connecting
This morning I am getting this error !2022-09-24, 08:47:08: IMAP - Could not connect to the server. A request to send or receive data was disallowed because the socket is not connected and (when sending on a datagram socket using a sendto call) no address was supplied Yesterday I did not see that. Reinstalled TB, restarted computer, no good. Other clients do not report an error. -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 10.0.10 CEF run single checkbox
Stefan, > Hello George, > >> What does it mean? If I have many lagged HTML complex messages then >> I do need to mark this checkbox or unmark? > In your case, it's better to use multiprocess CEF, i.e. keep the checkbox > unticked. > >> I do prefer to open strange and complex HTML-new in the browser directly. > CEF built into The Bat! is a complete browser (equal to Chrome > version 101 since v10.0.3), so there is no practical difference in > viewing HTML messages in The Bat! or open them in the browser. > Actually, The Bat! is more secure as it may block downloading > resources from unwanted sites and do not have access to whatever > passwords stored in your browser (that could be fished out somehow)... The Bat has come a long way towards better functionality in the past 15 years. Much much better now. -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: v10 beta 4 - TBLauncher fails to start
Hello Ethan, hello list, hello Stefan, On Thu, 3 Mar 2022, at 10:16:37 [GMT +0100] (which was 10:16 where I live) Gwen wrote: BUG: 32bit Broken Installer or Launcher? TBLauncher32.exe does not start The Bat! when using P:\The Bat!\ as target directory for launcher and program files. Starting The Bat! "P:\The Bat!\Main\10.0.0.4\32\TheBat.exe" by hand with double-click works, program opens. Weird. My bat installation no longer has thebat.exe. That would be left over from tb v 9. I had the "no start" problem too, but solved it by saving the v9 "mail" directory aside. And then completely uninstalling v9. Install v10 to a new program folder, and move your saved "mail" directory inside the new tb program folder. You will need to tell v10 to use the "mail" directory to restore your mail account structure. Or you can simply abandon the old account structure and reenter accounts in v10 from scratch. -- Regards Gwen Using The Bat! Version 10 beta 4 (32-bit) on Windows 11 10.0 (Build 22000 ) -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: v10 Beta 1
Stefan, I am only now getting updated to v 10. I see you have cut 40 mb off the exe file size. No big list of dll's is visible. Could be its downloading all that from the new network account I had to create? No delay in program start up. That's pretty slick. > Hello All, > Finally, we are starting public Beta testing for v10 > Here is a repost from https://www.ritlabs.com/en/news/7745/ > We have waited for the new version for quite a long time and today > we are happy to announce the start of The Bat! v10 beta-testing! > Loyal The Bat! users have participated in beta-testing of The Bat! > for years, but now every owner of The Bat! v9 license has gained the > opportunity to test the next major version before it is officially > released. To take part in the beta-testing of The Bat! v10 you need > to register at our beta-portal https://beta.thebat.net. Fill in your > name, email address and input The Bat! v9 serial number (you can > check it in the “Help → About” menu). Thus, you will create your The > Bat! Network account. You will be able to view the revision history > of beta-versions and download the installation file of the > beta-version at this portal. We plan to implement further features > at our beta-portal in the future to make The Bat! testing even more > comfortable! > The users of earlier versions of The Bat! (starting from v7) also > have the chance to take part in the beta-testing of the newest > version. If you are one of them, just register at the beta-portal, > input your The Bat! registration key and apply for participation. We > will grant the access to beta-versions randomly. The earlier you > register, the greater the chance to get the newest beta-version! > All the owners of the older The Bat! versions can purchase the > license upgrade now and take the advantage of the free Smart Upgrade > program. The new key will be valid for all The Bat! v9.xx versions > and will allow the users to upgrade to The Bat! v10 without > additional charges and start The Bat! v10 beta-testing right away! > What is the essence of the beta-testing? You can help us find all > the faults and bugs of the newer version and thus contribute to its > quicker release. The Bat! v10 features the new Address Book and > Calendar (under the „Tools“ menu). It would be great if you test all > their functions that you use in your everyday e-mail-management. To > report the issues, please create tickets in our Support Center: > https://www.ritlabs.com/en/support/ Describe the exact steps to > reproduce the error so that we could quickly fix it. Please remember > to assign the The Bat! v10 beta category to your ticket. > To share your impression and general thoughts on the new version > you can just send an email to betafeedb...@ritlabs.com. We will read > all the emails and make conclusions! > Good luck to everyone! -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: %WINDOWSMAJORVERSION displays a 10 on Windows 11
> , >> Hello all, >> the macro WINDOWSMAJORVERSION still displays a 10 even when The Bat is >> running on Windows 11. >> Anyone else seeing this? I updated the OS via Windows Update, not via clean >> install. >> Is is a TB! or a Windows-issue? > It might be that 11 is the same as 10, except that 11 is a little closer to > ms not allowing unsanctioned software like The Bat. > You consented to exiting s mode, I take it. I ask because I am a software developer who contemplates not complying with draconian measures ms requires to be sanctioned. >> Best regards, >> mse -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: %WINDOWSMAJORVERSION displays a 10 on Windows 11
, > Hello all, > the macro WINDOWSMAJORVERSION still displays a 10 even when The Bat is > running on Windows 11. > Anyone else seeing this? I updated the OS via Windows Update, not via clean > install. > Is is a TB! or a Windows-issue? It might be that 11 is the same as 10, except that 11 is a little closer to ms not allowing unsanctioned software like The Bat. You consented to exiting s mode, I take it. > Best regards, > mse -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: TheBat! + ExpressVPN.
Rolandtelle, No problem here with Keepsolid's VPN Unlimited. > mercredi 13 octobre 2021, > Bonjour, > I never been able to use TheBat! with ExpressVPN and my Imap > accounts (no problem with Pop accounts). Each time I try to connect, I get > the following error: > Acces violation at address 01D8D0D6 in module > 'thebat64.exe'. Read of address 0050 > > A contrario, I have no problem using Thunderbird. > > Has anyone experienced the same issue? or anyone working fine with ExpressVPN > + Imap? > > Best regards > Roland > Message created with The Bat! Version 9.4.4 (64-bit) > under Windows 10.0 Build 19043 -- Gleason TheBat! 9.4.4.1 Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19043 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.4.4 MSI
MAU, > Hello Stefan, >> Version 9.4.4 MSI is available >> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/thebat_64_9-4-4.msi > Up & running. > As with recent MSIs, I am warned about being an application NOT from > MS Store. > Also, and this is not new, since I click on the Install button on the > wizard, I have to wait a significant amount of time until I am asked > if I grant permission to update my system. Yes, ms wants to discourage all software they don't sell. Not a good reason to buy from them in my opinion. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.4.3.5 Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19042 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.4.2.6 - HTML bugs
Thomas, > Hello Jernej, > On Mon, 19 Jul 2021 23:10:27 +0200 GMT (20-Jul-21, 4:10 +0700 GMT), > Jernej Simončič wrote: >> On Monday, July 19, 2021, 19:29:09, Stefan Tanurkov via TBBETA wrote: >>> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.4.2.6-x64.7z >> HTML editor is kinda broken at least since 9.4.2.5 – if I type a >> long enough line, TB seems to insert a hard break somewhere near >> 2/3rds of the first line, but the second line does not wrap at all >> (or wraps in a completely different place). Additionally, if I write >> an open bracket followed by a space like this: ( and then continue >> typing, I then can't go back and delete that space with the >> backspace key. Once the editor also managed to delete everything >> from the cursor to the end of message when I was just trying to >> delete a selected word (no idea how to reproduce this, it was >> completely random). I'm writing this as a single paragraph, just to >> demonstrate the weird wrapping that's happening. > Confirmed for 9.4.2.5. Please create a bug report. (The paragraph > below is a good example of the suddenly inserted hard LF.) > When will the three important HTML bugs (and please add this one as > the fourth) be fixed? It would be good to be able to use TB! in a business > environment again. > When I stretch the message edit window wide enough, all wrapping disappears. No hard lf present. When displayed in the message preview pane, those long lines of text disappear into the right margin. No soft lf. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.4.2.6 Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19043 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Three versions a The Bat! installed??
MAU, > Hello Thomas, >> I, on the other hand, believe that the installer should uninstall >> any older version. I consider this a bug. > Fully agree. On the other hand, this might be considered intrusive. Some people want to have more than one version installed. It might be enough to remove old entries in the installed program list if the new version is installed in the same place as the old. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.4.2.5 Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19043 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Three versions a The Bat! installed??
MAU, > Hello all, > Not sure if this a beta issue suitable for this list. > Today I was "cleaning" my machine and I was surprised to see Revo > Uninstaller report three different version of TB installed (See > Clip-2.png attached). So, I opened Win 10 Configuration/Applications > and saw the same 3 "installations" (See Clip-3.png). > Does anybody else see something similar? I have 3, all recent. My experience with something like that is that, if you uninstall the oldest, you also uninstall the more recent. Best to uninstall the old ones before installing the new msi next time. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.4.2.5 Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19043 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.4.2.1 Downloads not reachable
Stefan, > Hello Gwen, >> The download server is not reachable. > Yeah, thank you for noticing! Looks like Hetzner switched off > their datacenters for maintenance. It's a rare situation and the files should > be back online soon. Back now. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.4.2 Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19043 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: v9.4 MSI
MAU, > Hello Stefan, >> The Bat! v9.4 MSI are now available: >> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/thebat_64_9-4.msi > Up an running. > When trying to install the .msi I got a warning about not being an app > from Microsoft store. I had to change my Windows 10 configuration > settings to allow installing apps from "anywhere, but warn me before > installing". I had never seen this with TB msis or any other app. Turn off User Account Control? MS wants to discourage use of software where the dev's haven't paid them for the privilege of running on their OS. It looks to me like win11 is another step in that direction. It is true though, that I install all kinds of stuff, and have not yet been warned that the app was not from MS store. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.4 Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19043 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.3.4.18
Stefan, > Dear All, > Version 9.3.4.18 is available > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.4.18-x32-full.7z > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.4.18-x64-full.7z > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.4.18-x32.7z > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.4.18-x64.7z > Here is a short list of changes: > [+] Quote splitting (not in tables) in the HTML editor (Alpha issue) U&R Thanks. Been watching for that. > [+] Utilities | Edit HTML source code in the HTML editor > [*] Signature is using a separate class instead of HTML tag -- Gleason TheBat! 9.3.4.18 Alpha Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19043 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.3.4.16
Stefan Tanurkov via TBBETA, 404 error. > Dear All, > > Version 9.3.4.16 ALPHA is available > > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.4.16-x32-full.7z > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.4.16-x64-full.7z > > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.4.16-x32.7z > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.4.16-x64.7z > > Here is a short list of changes: > > [-] Various bug fixes for HTML editor - caret positioning, links handling, > DPI issues etc (Alpha issue) > [-] (#2123) QR Code Generator was not functional (Alpha issue) > > > -- > Best regards, > Stefan Tanurkov > CEO @ Ritlabs S.R.L. > > > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.3.4.7
Stefan, Is the below how you want automatic HTML to work? It looks like tb decided my reply should have some html characteristics even though I was replying to a text message. Daniel, Well, it means adding a new option. Why do you think it's needed? Well, for instance because you may be sending to a mailing list where HTML is not accepted or not appreciated (hint, hint), or because you are sending a message to a server that will process it automatically, but only if it's in plain text. Or simply because you as the user want to be in control of how your messages go out. Some people don't even consider html messages to be email because technically, the html part is an attachment. Or they hate Microsoft who forced html (and so, lots of fraud, deception and malware due to manipulated URLs) on email users. There are many reasons! :) Sounds like the old "I hate HTML" argument. HTML really, really isn't going to go away, no matter how you discourage it. There are only a few decent clients still around that don't do html, Sylpheed for one the last time I looked. How long do you suppose they can hold out that way? but pasting/inserting a picture should change format, the logic is pretty simple here. Good. While I have you: Do these "Up and Running" messages serve any useful purpose for you? If you do not need them, it would save a lot of traffic if we stop sending them. Yes, they are useful - it's much better than just a silence because we know that people actually tried to use it and it didn't fail to start :-) But that's precisely when a beta tester should send you a bug report! Anyway, I'll just keep ignoring those messages :-) I remember some years ago, getting a reply to my first in line U&R message saying, "Thanks, now I can go home and go to bed." He didn't want to do that until he was sure the new beta would fly. Subsequent bug reports could be handled in the morning. How many U&R's you get being a percentage thing. Desired is minimal, I went back to the previous version, and maximal, ok here. Best, -Daniel- ____ 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.3.4.7 Alpha Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 -- Gleason TheBat! 9.3.4.7 Alpha Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.3.4.7
Daniel, Well, it means adding a new option. Why do you think it's needed? Well, for instance because you may be sending to a mailing list where HTML is not accepted or not appreciated (hint, hint), or because you are sending a message to a server that will process it automatically, but only if it's in plain text. Or simply because you as the user want to be in control of how your messages go out. Some people don't even consider html messages to be email because technically, the html part is an attachment. Or they hate Microsoft who forced html (and so, lots of fraud, deception and malware due to manipulated URLs) on email users. There are many reasons! :) Sounds like the old "I hate HTML" argument. HTML really, really isn't going to go away, no matter how you discourage it. There are only a few decent clients still around that don't do html, Sylpheed for one the last time I looked. How long do you suppose they can hold out that way? but pasting/inserting a picture should change format, the logic is pretty simple here. Good. While I have you: Do these "Up and Running" messages serve any useful purpose for you? If you do not need them, it would save a lot of traffic if we stop sending them. Yes, they are useful - it's much better than just a silence because we know that people actually tried to use it and it didn't fail to start :-) But that's precisely when a beta tester should send you a bug report! Anyway, I'll just keep ignoring those messages :-) I remember some years ago, getting a reply to my first in line U&R message saying, "Thanks, now I can go home and go to bed." He didn't want to do that until he was sure the new beta would fly. Subsequent bug reports could be handled in the morning. How many U&R's you get being a percentage thing. Desired is minimal, I went back to the previous version, and maximal, ok here. Best, -Daniel- ____ 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.3.4.7 Alpha Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.3.4.7 is still an ALPHA
Stefan, Running here. Sorry, forgot to mention that 9.3.4.7 is still an ALPHA -- Best regards, Stefan Tanurkov -- Gleason TheBat! 9.3.4.7 Alpha Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.3.3.6 New HTML editor
Richard, > Hello Gleason, G>> Especially irritating for me. In html quoted text, pressing enter G>> should split the quote block and allow me to insert a reply to text G>> immediately above the relply. As it is, the reader has no visual clue G>> that my reply has been inserted. > As a work around you may want to BOLD your response. True. There was a time when The Bat was the only client that handled this correctly. All others required a treatment like you suggest. That has changed in recent years. > -- > Best regards, > Richardmailto:the...@newmangroup.com > -- > Using The Bat! v9.3.3 on Windows v10 19042 > > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.3.3.6 ALPHA Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.3.3.6 New HTML editor
Thomas, > Hello Stefan, > On Fri, 16 Apr 2021 12:13:23 +0300 GMT (16-Apr-21, 16:13 +0700 GMT), > Stefan Tanurkov via TBBETA wrote: > Hello Thomas, > I'd like to see a detailed changelog, if possible. Which of the > many bugs reported in my emails have you fixed? I have put a lot of > work in this and never received any reply. > Please excuse me, it's just a lot of small things from the list > combined from many sources and many of them could be resolved in a > single commit, so it's a bit difficult to keep trace of them :-) > So, here's an extended list of changes related to the new HTML editor: > + Add Image button > * Insert Link button is permanently visible > - Doubling image files > * Better algorithm to name image files, especially the ones inserted from a > Web browser > - image attachments did not have proper content type headers > - Forward text was empty in HTML messages > - Fix DPI/zooming settings to keep text wrapping in proper boundaries > This is what I remember :-) > Here is a reminder to help you out. You can print this list and > tick the bugs off one-by-one while you fix them to make the editor usable: > - size in Text-only and HTML differs from default: Not fixed > - In HTML format the Text has no padding at left: Fixed > - Also, when using , a linebreak is not always added, > sometime it is equivalent to just going to the next line with the > down-arrow.: Not fixed. It is irritating to not have control over the cursor. Especially irritating for me. In html quoted text, pressing enter should split the quote block and allow me to insert a reply to text immediately above the relply. As it is, the reader has no visual clue that my reply has been inserted. > - Missing caret, only a lightblue rectangle instead of caret: Fixed > However, I see part of the message in light blue suddenly. > - Multiple attachements called ..._csseditor are sent. (The ... is > alphanumeric characters; and there is not file type).: Fixed. > - HTML formatting tools are in two lines, even though the screen is > wide enough to put them into one. I cannot find a way to organise > them into one line.: Still two lines, even though the line break is at a > different place now. > - As already mentioned by someone else, highlighting some text and > using (by rght-clicking or by using crtl-C) will copy the > whole email to the clipboard, not only the highlighted text.: Not > checked yet. My cursor jumps around when I leave this text to highlight > something… > - I just forwarded a message (inline, not as attachment), and the > text part was left totally blank.: Fixed. > - Attachments cannot be added by dragging and dropping. A PDF file > I tried to add was simply not added. Even though the + inside a > square was shown while dragging, it was not added when dropping. > Only way to add an attachment is by using the paperclip icon and > chosing the file on the disk, which is very inefficient.: Not fixed. > - Pictures cannot be inserted into an email. Dragging and dropping > a .jog file resulted in an undefined small square at the beginning > of the line, instead of the picture shown below the line i.e. where I dropped > it.: Not fixed. > - Paste as Plain Text doesn't work.: Not fixed. > Additional bugs: (Remark:) The cursor just jumped around when I > clicked on the colon to edit; it jumped down two lines) > - If you put your cursor in the middle of a line and use > to delete all letters in front of the cursor, it will > not stop. Once the letters in front of the cursor are gone, it will > continue deleting the letters on the cursor and behave as if you hold the > button instead. > - Jumping cursor. Two examples described above, I think this is > additional info to the bug about the key sometimes adding a line and > sometimes not. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.3.3.6 ALPHA Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.3.3.3 crash at startup - fixed
Stefan, > Hello All, > We've fixed the crash at startup (big thanks to Marck!), so those > who experienced it could download fixed version from: > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.3.3-x64-fix.7z > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.3.3-x32-fix.7z The new html message editor is not splitting quoted text to allow inserting responses to specific lines. This ability is something I have always valued The Bat for. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.3.3.3 ALPHA Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Plug-ins (was: Update on the Beta work for The Bat - Calendar function)
Stuart, > Hello Stefan, > Enhancements needed, for interacting with calendars: attached picture is what > needs to be covered. > Outlook is your main opportunity, as you know, to carve out a teeny market > share from ordinary users on Win 10, > as well as commercial users that have to interact with M'soft Active > Directory environments, without > being forced to use Outlook. Also, the requested calendar-posting > capabilities needed will cover users > having to work with Teams, Zoom, etc. So, Google calendar, Outlook/Exchange > calendar entries, and iCal entries > covers most of the bases that really matter. Are we starting to get a picture of exactly how much complexity this proposed feature adds? For a teeny market share? > > Stuart Pye > somewhere is the States Yes, they are somewhere. > Monday, March 15, 2021, 10:34:29 AM, you wrote: >> Hello Thomas and Dear All, >>>> Yes, you are certainly right. A plug-in may be the way to go to >>>> satisfy everyone. >>> Thanks! I hope Stefan is reading this. >> I do read this. Yes, a good plug-in system is our long dreamed dream. As >> many probably know, the current plug-in system is based on compiled DLLs and >> it was not very popular through all years of its existence. This makes me >> thinking of developing a new way to extend The Bat! functionality... >> So, let's start a thread about plug-ins - please feel free to post anything >> you find suitable on this topic: views, wishes, concerns. I promise our team >> will read it carefully :-) (don't treat my smile like I'm joking, I just >> like to smile, but I am always serious about promises I make). >> Here is something for the start: >> We plan to implement Python bridge for system-related functionality, Python >> is a popular language and it has a lot of libraries for working with OS, >> network and even AI and Big Data. Plus, it supports multithreading out of >> the box which is good for a multithreaded program like The Bat! >> For stuff inside message viewer, alternative message editor and other areas >> where we can use a Chromium-based view, we this of use of something similar >> to web browser extensions which means it will be JavaScript+HTML+CSS >> It will be possible to create custom filter actions / conditions, >> viewer/editor commands, address book extension, template macros... >> OK, this is what is in my head on this topic now. Community feedback is >> needed :-) -- Gleason TheBat! 9.3.3.1 Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.3.3.1
Stefan, > Dear All, > While we are implementing big features... We made some archaeology research > and found some undocumented / improperly named macros that could be useful, > so we decided to make a Beta with small changes today :-) > Version 9.3.3.1 is available > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.3.1-x32-full.7z > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.3.1-x64-full.7z 404 not found. > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.3.1-x32.7z > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.3.3.1-x64.7z > Here is a short list of changes: > [+] Add %Account* macros for use in all types of templates > [-] "View messaging history" command from the Address Book did not focus > on the address in the address histroy pane > Here's a list of those %Account* macros: > AccountName > AccountConnectionType > AccountCheckOnStartup > AccountCombineSendReceive > AccountCombinedSendReceive > AccountFromName > AccountFromAddr > AccountFromAddress > AccountReplyName > AccountReplyAddr > AccountReplyAddress > AccountIsDefault > AccountSendServer > AccountSendPort > AccountReceiveServer > AccountReceivePort > AccountAutoCheck > AccountPeriodicalCheck > AccountPeriodicalCheckTime > AccountPeriodicalCheckUnit > AccountMemo > And a Quick Template for testing them: > ===8<==cut=here=== > AccountName - %AccountName > AccountId - %AccountId > AccountConnectionType - %AccountConnectionType > AccountCheckOnStartup - %AccountCheckOnStartup > AccountAutoCheck - %AccountAutoCheck > AccountPeriodCheck - %AccountPeriodCheck > AccountPeriodCheckT - %AccountPeriodCheckT > AccountId - %AccountId > AccountCheckOnStartup - %AccountCheckOnStartup > AccountAutoCheck - %AccountAutoCheck > AccountPeriodCheck - %AccountPeriodCheck > AccountPeriodCheckT - %AccountPeriodCheckT > AccountCombineSendReceive - %AccountCombineSendReceive > AccountCombinedSendReceive - %AccountCombinedSendReceive > AccountFromName - %AccountFromName > AccountFromAddr - %AccountFromAddr > AccountFromAddress - %AccountFromAddress > AccountReplyName - %AccountReplyName > AccountReplyAddr - %AccountReplyAddr > AccountReplyAddress - %AccountReplyAddress > AccountIsDefault - %AccountIsDefault > AccountSendServer - %AccountSendServer > AccountSendPort - %AccountSendPort > AccountReceiveServer - %AccountReceiveServer > AccountReceivePort - %AccountReceivePort > AccountAutoCheck - %AccountAutoCheck > AccountPeriodicalCheck - %AccountPeriodicalCheck > AccountPeriodicalCheckTime - %AccountPeriodicalCheckTime > AccountPeriodicalCheckUnit - %AccountPeriodicalCheckUnit > AccountMemo - %AccountMemo > ===8<==cut=here=== -- Gleason TheBat! 9.3.3 Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Update on the Beta work for The Bat
Title: Re: Update on the Beta work for The Bat Mark, There had to be a better way. Google can't be the only option either. Sorry for the HTML and pictures... Hello Thomas, Friday, March 12, 2021, 12:26:11 AM, you wrote: TF> I can neither read the appoinment date/time nor do I have access to the link. I don't even use thr Outlook calendar, I use the Google calendar. TF> I have no idea how to solve this problem. Are you kidding? Perhaps someone else has already answered, but if not [did not change my settings to English, but Dutch should do]: In The Bat! (or any other email-client) First save the .ics file to disk Then in Google Agenda Go to settings: Choose Import & Export Find the ics-file and choose import: Kind regards, Mark using The Bat! Version 9.3.3 -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Update on the Beta work for The Bat
Thomas, > Hello Gleason, > On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 19:53:52 -0500 GMT (12-Mar-21, 07:53 +0700 GMT), > Gleason wrote: >>> Software applications, especially those used in working envirnments, are >>> often integrated applications these days. Yes, it was different in the last >>> century and I was of the opinion then that an email client should be >>> limited to (stay focussed on) email. Times have changed. >> Doing something well is no longer a priority? > Doing only one thing well is just not enough any more, IMHO. > Like many others, I was a plaintext enthusiast and did not know why there > were people who wanted TB! to also accommodate HTML emails. I remember the > vivid discussions. I have changed my mind in the meantime. Times are moving > on. Yes, I remember the html email struggle. Since then, html email is pretty much everywhere. Calendars not so much. Corporate employees who are more or less constantly in meetings, sales people who meet directly with customers need calendars. Is that everybody? > Cheers, > Thomas. > Message reply created with The Bat! Version 9.3.3 (64-bit) > under Windows 10.0 Build 19042 > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Update on the Beta work for The Bat
Thomas, > Hello Gleason, > On Thu, 11 Mar 2021 09:35:56 -0500 GMT (11-Mar-21, 21:35 +0700 GMT), > Gleason wrote: >>>> We have also changed plans about the calendar which is going to be a major >>>> addition and decided to postpone its release to the second half of this >>>> year. >>> Pity about the delay, but looking forward to that! Will it be possible to >>> sync to CalDav online calendars, and will it be possible to send/accept >>> meeting invitations? That sure would be a killer feature! >> It would be a "me too" feature. Maybe new ideas in email handling have run >> out? >> My opinion: Email clients have better things to do than try to be pim's or >> calendars. >> Email clients that try to provide other complex features often end up not >> doing any of them really well. >> Sometimes the old linux idea of doing one thing and doing it really well, >> applies. > I respect your opinion. > On my side, I receive .ics attachments when companies or large organisations > make appointments. These days they often virtual appointments, so they also > include a link too. Obviously, this is some Outlook-internal format. I can > neither read the appoinment date/time nor do I have access to the link. I > don't even use thr Outlook calendar, I use the Google calendar. > I have no idea how to solve this problem. Now, I have to always send them an > email back and ask for a clear-text info, which of course is annoying for > them and looks bad for me. One person once asked me, "why don't you just use > Outlook like everybody else?" I have heard that. There was a time when I ran OS/2 when it was far superior to anything MS or Apple offered. Then I decided I wanted to go to University in a computer oriented program. I had no choice. Windows it was, but not 98, NT 4 was the best at the time. I have never been able to go back to OS/2, but my choice remains a server os, Server 2016 these days. Which is to say, you don't need to run Win 98 simply because everybody else is. And you don't need to have your calendar built into your email client simply because everybody else does. There are other ways. > Software applications, especially those used in working envirnments, are > often integrated applications these days. Yes, it was different in the last > century and I was of the opinion then that an email client should be limited > to (stay focussed on) email. Times have changed. Doing something well is no longer a priority? > I support the idea of a calendar, and I would like the option to synch it > with my Google calendar. Just my 2 cents worth. > -- > Cheers, > Thomas. > Message reply created with The Bat! Version 9.3.3 (64-bit) > under Windows 10.0 Build 19041 > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Update on the Beta work for The Bat
Alto, > Hello, >> We have also changed plans about the calendar which is going to be a major >> addition and decided to postpone its release to the second half of this year. > Pity about the delay, but looking forward to that! Will it be possible to > sync to CalDav online calendars, and will it be possible to send/accept > meeting invitations? That sure would be a killer feature! It would be a "me too" feature. Maybe new ideas in email handling have run out? My opinion: Email clients have better things to do than try to be pim's or calendars. Email clients that try to provide other complex features often end up not doing any of them really well. Sometimes the old linux idea of doing one thing and doing it really well, applies. I, for instance, need to switch to emclient or postbox if I need to do a search on a server imap folder that has some thousands of stored email. TB simply doesn't find the matches. TB, on the other hand, doesn't spend huge amounts of time indexing imap folders, which is good. Maybe there isn't a solution for this. Which means that if somebody could actually solve it, how wonderful. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.3.3 Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
TB hangs
Stefan, Using IMAP, 100+ folders and subfolders, no ofe. If you have automatic trim of old messages enabled, TB is in the process of checking for new mail, and you close TB, it hangs. Cannot finish timming, cannot finish checking for mail, cannot close. If you cancel the trim, TB is then able to close. -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: 9.3.2 Christmas Edition
Hello Jernej, Thursday, December 24, 2020, 12:39:36 PM, you wrote: On Wednesday, December 23, 2020, 11:46:17, Stefan Tanurkov via TBBETA wrote: https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/thebat_64_9-3-2.msi The taskbar pinned icon stopped working again… SP>> On Win 10, the pinned icon is persistent, for me. It survives reboots. It could be that Windows is not able to reliably support animation of icons in the taskbar. -- Best regards, Stuart Pye 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re[2]: 9.2.5.12 Existing color groups not changed after restart
TB, Hi On Sunday, November 8, 2020 8:34:35 PM you wrote: This is another bug! Chocodark theme html-letters goes to black on black. I already wrote about it I am sorry about my question but what would be the idea to send such coloured HTML messages? I have no idea. But you never know what somebody might want to do. My experience is that, if software offers an option, somebody will want to use it. So, offered options should at least work. Best regards, Martin mar...@postzone.org TheBat! 9.2.5.12 Pro (64bit, with OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.2.5.2 Shortcuts for themes
George, Вы писали 12 октября 2020 г., 11:56:09: Hello George, Please add ability to creata shortcut for every theme. Oh yes! Please do as George requests. I *need* to change my theme about 7 and a half times per minute and doing it from the menu is quite cumbersome and time consuming. ;-) Is this a pretty sarcasm? I don't prefer to use it any menu item, and use it shortcuts in all software. If menu don't have it shortcut - it's annoying. TB! not a toy, TB! is a working tool like Adobe InDesign for me. Are you ever ever see shortcut system in the Adobe Indesign or Photoshop? There is no my fault that you can't remember shortcuts and prefer to use it menu. About "per minute": I do receive 200+ messages in a day and use it dark theme now, and do beta-test of this dark theme and only for this morning I do change theme few times because some emails isn't readable in dark theme. 10+ times in a day this is few minutes of life. Still, the best criteria is what will most people find useful? Options can be useful, but they also add complexity which users who don't use those options will experience as unnecessary complexity. In my case, I don't use themes at all (mainly because I mostly don't prefer any of them), so best to have them tucked away in unobtrusive corner unless large numbers of people ask for shortcuts. -- Gleason -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.2.1.3
Martin, Hi Miguel On Saturday, July 11, 2020 6:25:52 PM you wrote: IMHO that's really not necessary – you *downloaded* a beta version so you know that you *are running* a beta version... I think it is, although not for me. But quite often we see on this list complaints about TB not doing this or that, or loosing a certain 'toolbar setup'. IMHO that is because some people forget they are using a beta and the risks involved. I don't agree with you. On a beta list we describe what TB is doing and what issues we found and what is missing - and we report this to the bug tracker. It is true. This also happens. -- Best regards, Martin mar...@postzone.org TheBat! 9.2.1.3 Pro (32 with OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.2.1.3
Miguel, Hello Martin, IMHO that's really not necessary – you *downloaded* a beta version so you know that you *are running* a beta version... I think it is, although not for me. But quite often we see on this list complaints about TB not doing this or that, or loosing a certain 'toolbar setup'. IMHO that is because some people forget they are using a beta and the risks involved. In which case, it seems the reminder has not helped. Perhaps there is nothing to be done for it. -- Best regards, Miguel A. Urech (Zarzalejo (Madrid) - Spain) Using The Bat! Version 9.2.1.3 (64-bit) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.2.0.5
Stefan, > Hello mse, >> * A few of the window icons are still missing, like Move messages >>to, Copy messages to, Save messages, Print Preview, Quick >>Templates, Folder and Account Properties, ... > Thank you! We'll fix it. > >>* What is the future of the Image Download Manager? I really loved >>the possibility to manually adjust which sources to download and >>which to block. > Download manager needs to be rewritten for quite a long... I think > we'll be working on it in the next release circle - sure enough we > don't want to leave things as simple as they are now ;-) Noticing. Creating email clients must be nearly the toughest job developers can face. Considering the years that they have invested in the effort, with their projects still unfinished. Looking around, there are no really complete stable email clients on offer. And only about three still under active development. TB!, TB, and eMclient. All three have been in the works for nearly two decades. It probably does have something to do with what we expect though, like selective blocking of download sources, or even blocking of images per individual messages. Do we think of the complexity of implementing such things? OS's are tough too, but they are profitable enough that MS can hire huge numbers of the best talent. So OS's don't count. Even though MS's best so far (win 10) is only recently getting close to being somewhat reliable. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.2.0.5 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Folder popup customisation is not permanent (OTFE)
Peter, > Hello tbbeta, > I want the "Mark all messages read" in the folder popup menu to > appear on position 1. I can configure this in the customizer menu > and this change will continue until I exit and restart TheBat. It is not > permanently saved. Not confirmed. The change is saved. My problem with the customizer window is that it is difficult for me to find the function I need. Entries cannot be dragged to a new location. If I remove the function, it is lost in an unsorted list when I go to move it back. > I vaguely remember that in the OTFE version a certain file has to > be deleted for this to work again. Which one was that? -- Gleason TheBat! 9.2.0.5 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.2.0.3
Miroslav, > Hello Gleason, >> I like it best if I can set it as an option in program setup rather >> than clicking on a button/link to download images for a specific email. > the first time you view an HTML mail, a window should open with the following > text. > [ ] Load all images and scripts > [ ] Always load all images and scripts > [ ] Do not load images and scripts > [ ] Don't ask me again > The selected settings should then be saved in the options. In addition, the > button for downloading images should still be available if you have selected > the option 'Load all images and scripts' or 'Do not load images and scripts'. On the other hand, I see no reason for email to have scripts. Ok, provide the option, but make it separate from images. > That would be my suggestion for viewing HTML mails in TheBat! > -- > Best wishes > Miroslav > BAT-MAIL.DE.VU - http://thebat.bplaced.net > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.2.0.4 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.2.0.3
Richard, > Hello, >>> ** Do not place as default download all images on the HTML Viewer ** MF>> Agreed! >>> ** Tooltip/hint on links of the HTML Viewer ** MF>> Agreed! > Agree to both. This is a very old argument. Perhaps soon on the horizon the day will come where we don't need to continue to hash this out. I, for one, wish to have an option to download all images automatically. I like it best if I can set it as an option in program setup rather than clicking on a button/link to download images for a specific email. No, I really don't want to open a browser to view an email. That doesn't seem to me to have any advantage of security, etc. To me it feels like an annoyance to need to do that. My email provider effectively filters out viruses and other nasties. I never see them. > -- > Best regards, > Richardmailto:newmangroup@gmail.com > -- > Using The Bat! v9.2.0.3 (BETA) on Windows v10 18363 -- Gleason TheBat! 9.2.0.4 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.2.0.3
Andrew, > Hello Gwen, > Wednesday, June 17, 2020, 11:27:43 PM, you wrote: >> If selecting some HTML message in message list two new The Bat! >> Chromium CEF processes are started and cause freezes for 2-3 sec. > Stefan, > 13 June 2020, 00:09:39 (Sat, 13 Jun 2020 00:09:39 +0930) I wrote: >> Would it be possible to release a "stable" build without DevExpress >> widgets _and_ without Chromium?.. > Lowering the stakes, how about a stable build just without the Chromium? Can't satisfy all the people all the time. Half the people half the time? Maybe, half the time. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.2.0.3 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.2.0.3
Stefan, > Dear All, > Version 9.2.0.3 (BETA) can be downloaded from > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.2.0.3-x32.7z > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.2.0.3-x64.7z > Here is a short list of changes: > [-] Different small and large icons for all windows are back > [-] HTML viewer popup menu positioning on high DPI > [-] Copy didn't work in HTML viewer This version remembers tool bar changes. Thanks. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.2.0.3 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.2.0.2
Gwen, > Hello Stefan hello list, > After start the UI deos not react for 5 seconds to keyboard and mouse, > this causes inoperable Windows with other programs, too. I don't see this here. But I do still see that TB doesn't finish shutting down. 5 instances remain in the Task Manager. It takes multiple requests to shut them down to finally get them gone. And Tool Bar arrangement does not persist when restarting TB. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.2.0.2 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.2.0.1
Ethan, It starts and runs for me here. Other problems though: hard to get it to shut down. Task manager shows 5 or 6 instances running. I had to End Task multiple times to finally get it stopped. Changes to the tool bar at the top are not saved when restarting TB. > June 12, 2020 > Hello Zygmunt, > Friday, June 12, 2020, 8:18:53 AM, you wrote: >>> Please get this updated archive for the 64-bit version: >>> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9.2.0.1-x64-fix.7z >>> Extract its contents into the folder where The Bat! is installed, >>> typically C:\Program Files\The Bat! > I can confirm this challenge. > I did follow the instructions and it did not work. > I had to move to the former release to send this message. > Any advice on what I should do to get the new beta to work. > Jerry > -- > Ethan J. Mings > President, > The Desk Consulting Group Inc. > Enabling your organization to anticipate the future with confidence! > 1-200 North Service Road W. - Suite 311 | Oakville, Ontario, Canada. L6M 2Y1 > Phone 905-825-9938 or 1-877-763-7776 | e-mail supportd...@thedesk.ca > Website https://thedesk.ca/main > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.2.0.1 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 19041 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.2.0.1
List, Hello Stefan, Friday, June 12, 2020, 6:16:13 AM, you wrote: [!] HTML engine is set to solely Chromium (CEF library) Not all messages are working with new HTML engine. Confirmed. Some don't display at all. -- Best regards, Stuartmailto:skcu...@fastmail.fm 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Kinda roadmap ;)
Luca, > Stefan Tanurkov via TBBETA: >> - within next few weeks, we will try to fix with top PITAs (please >> feel free to name your favourite ones), > What about refurbishing the text editor? I've been coping with no undo/redo > function for... how long? maybe 15 years? I'm fed up with it. The list is getting long. I suspect there are reasons why some of these have persisted so long. 1) there is no easy solution within the framework of the way TB works 2) Rit has been unable to duplicate the problem So let's not expect big results in a few weeks, and resist the temptation to get fed up. That doesn't help. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.1.18.3 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Does your CPU support hardware SHA1 acceleration?
Hello Tbbeta, Does your CPU support Intel SHA extensions? These are instructions introduced on Intel Goldmont microarchitecture. AMD added support in their processors for these instructions starting with Ryzen. There are seven new SSE-based instructions, four supporting SHA-1 and three for SHA-256. Does not. You can run The Bat! with /SHA1_BENCHMARK command-line parameter to figure out whether your CPU supports SHA1 acceleration instructions, for example: thebat64.exe /SHA1_BENCHMARK On my computer, running The Bat! as above gives the following results: --- SHA1 benchmark --- 150 data blocks of 1024 bytes took 1.3579 seconds to process by SHA1 using CPU instructions (hardware), 1078.7605 Megabytes per second; 2.1496 seconds to process by software implementation, 681.4596 Megabytes per second --- OK --- Could you please post your results here? Thank you in advance. -- Best regards, Maxim Masiutin 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat! 9.1.4 MSI files & Voyager
Maxim, > The Bat! 9.1.4 MSI and Voyager files are available at: > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/thebat_32_9-1-4.msi > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/thebat_64_9-1-4.msi > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/voyager_install_9-1-4-2.exe > It fixes the issues with mail dispatcher reported in 9.1.2. TB running well here. > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.1.4 Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat! 9.1 MSI files
Jernej, > On Monday, March 2, 2020, 13:42:17, Maxim Masiutin via TBBETA wrote: >> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/thebat_64_9-1.msi > Taskbar pinned icon stopped working again. Can't confirm. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.1 Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.16.9
Dimitar, > On Wednesday, February 19, 2020, 8:56:12 PM, you wrote: >> Maxim, >>> The Bat! 9.0.16.9 (BETA) is available at >>> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb90169-32.rar >>> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb90169-64.rar >>> What's new in 9.0.16.9 since 9.0.16.6: >>> [!] Added icons for the commands (menu items, toolbar buttons) that did not >>> have icons >>> [-] (#0001937) The items in the main menu Workspace -> Show >>> Connection Centre are not mutually exclusive >> The connection center does disappear now. Hide and Automatically >> remain both checked at the same time. > Dear Gleason, > I can't confirm that. The menu works as intended for me now - I can > check independently always, hide or auto. However, selecting "hide" > does not hide an already displayed connection centre window. It takes a few minutes for activity to settle down before the window disappears. > And as I > have IMAP accounts, "auto" will not hide it after manual checking a > POP account. I don't have any pop accounts to check, so I can't test that. >>> [-] (#0001923) After language change - button missing >>> [-] (#0001874) Editor: Menu-Item "Format" contains an unnecessary item >>> divider >>> [*] Enabled the TLS_DHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA256 cipher suite >>> [-] A memory leak is fixed (the TGoogleAuthTask object was not released) >>> [-] (#0001873) Can't changing font styles of selected text >>> [-] Fixed AV in customizing menus (64bit) >>> >>> 'Using TBBETA' information: >>> http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html > Best regards, > Dimitar mailto:dito...@gmail.com > TheBat! 9.0.16.9 (BETA) Pro (64-bit, non-OTFE) on Windows 10.0 14393 > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.16.6 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.16.9
Maxim, > Hello Gleason, > Wednesday, February 19, 2020, 8:56:12 PM, you wrote: >> The connection center does disappear now. Hide and Automatically remain both >> checked at the same time. > How did you manage to have both of them checked at the same time? In a previous version I had show always checked. I checked Hide. A check in Automatically appeared at the same time. That still happens. The difference now, is that, after a period of quiet time, the connection center does disappear. > Could you please click first "Show always"? Will it then be the only > option selected (checked)? Yes. > If yes, in which sequence do I need to > check the other items to have both of them checked at once? It is only necessary to check Hide to get them both to be checked. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.16.6 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.16.9
Maxim, > The Bat! 9.0.16.9 (BETA) is available at > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb90169-32.rar > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb90169-64.rar > What's new in 9.0.16.9 since 9.0.16.6: > [!] Added icons for the commands (menu items, toolbar buttons) that did not > have icons > [-] (#0001937) The items in the main menu Workspace -> Show > Connection Centre are not mutually exclusive The connection center does disappear now. Hide and Automatically remain both checked at the same time. > [-] (#0001923) After language change - button missing > [-] (#0001874) Editor: Menu-Item "Format" contains an unnecessary item divider > [*] Enabled the TLS_DHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA256 cipher suite > [-] A memory leak is fixed (the TGoogleAuthTask object was not released) > [-] (#0001873) Can't changing font styles of selected text > [-] Fixed AV in customizing menus (64bit) > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.16.6 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.16.6 / IMAP and Connection Center
Andrew, > Hello Thomas, > Wednesday, January 29, 2020, 10:25:41 AM, you wrote: >> I now took the tickmark off "periodical check" in my IMAP account so >> that it doesn't check, and it still checks and the Connection Center >> is shown always. The bug here is that it shouldn't check. >> https://bt.ritlabs.com/view.php?id=1887 > Can confirm, bumped the BT report. Confirm, the connection center cannot be prevented from appearing, no matter what setting you use, or how many times you close it. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.16.6 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Filtering
MAU, > Hello Thomas, >> Yes, the keyboard shortcuts are mentioned in the relevant paragraphs, >> but I could not find a summary list of keyboard shortcuts. That would >> be helpful. > Here is one: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/shortcut_eng.html > It was created 19 years ago and, as I never use keyboard shortcuts, I > doubt if it has ever been updated. It is interesting that the function that started this thread has been available since 2001. It is true that a keyboard shortcut can be useful in a case like this where there isn't any other way to access the function. But when there are 100+ shortcuts many of them arcane with multiple key presses, it becomes unlikely that I will remember many. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.16.6 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Filtering
Thomas, > Hello MAU, > On Fri, 31 Jan 2020 19:30:12 +0100 GMT (01-Feb-20, 01:30 +0700 GMT), > MAU wrote: >>> I was looking at my mail today and accidently did something that >>> filtered out everything but the emails from the currently selected >>> sender. View->Display->All Messages got them all back but I can't >>> figure out how I did it. Can anyone tell me what I did? >> You probably clicked Alt+Selected sender. You can use Alt on any column >> uf the message list to filter on a specific Subject, Date, etc. > I use this extensively, much faster than searches. To undo the > filtering, I use +<=>. Fabulous. Is there a list of these secret functions? > -- > Cheers, > Thomas. > Message reply created with The Bat! Version 8.8.9.12 (BETA) (64-bit) > under Windows 10.0 Build 18363 > ____ > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.16.6 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: [SPAM] Re: 9.0.16.2
Stuart, > Hello Martin, > Friday, January 17, 2020, 4:08:49 AM, you wrote: >> I am sorry, but I don't see such an option in my Windows 10 Pro 1909 >> 32bit version... >> Could you send me a screenshot? > In Windows 10 try right clicking on the task bar then select taskbar settings > right at the bottom. It brings up a large window that has the selection > "Combine > Taskbar Buttons". I only have 2 choices "Never" and "When taskbar is full". I > don't seem to have a general combine setting, but used to have in Windows 7. You might need to scroll down to see it. It is between Taskbar Location on Screen and Notification Area -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.16.2 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.16.2
Martin, > Hi The > On Thursday, January 16, 2020 9:54:44 PM you wrote: >>> But where to find this option? >> Right click on taskbar and select Configuration. > Yes - but there I don't find such an option to "combine" icons... On the Taskbar settings page there is an option to Combine Taskbar Buttons. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.16.2 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.16.2
Stuart, > Hello MAU, > Thursday, January 16, 2020, 1:05:42 PM, you wrote: >> Strange, but I don't see the icons you mention. > See attached. I suspect that those of us who don't see this have the option enabled to combine multiple taskbar icons for the same program into one taskbar entry -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.16.2 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18363 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.16: Clicking a URL in HTML message opens two browsers.
Ira, > Hello MAU, > Sunday, January 12, 2020, 8:53:57 AM, you wrote: MAU>> most of the times two browsers are opened simultaneously: Edge or MAU>> Chrome, whichever is default, and also Internet Explorer. Both MAU>> browsers will show the same page. MAU>> Has anybody else noticed this or something similar? Yes. I get IE plus the default browser which is Vivaldi for me. > Started for me a while back on MailWasher and then with The Bat with > this new computer. Here are 2 links from my email: > * > href="https://click.email.homedepot.com/?qs=6c773e9710fe0e559e918460fde8fd281a22a431c7aa0cf29cea80282d00808404c0fe43bbc4ad80fe498d72dac93431bf401517dd4a072520796aa510c17eb2"; > target="_blank"> src="http://image.homedepotemail.com/lib/fe601570746c07757c15/m/25/20191223_PIPX_FW49_TM_Reno_D_01.jpg"; > alt="Shop Now" border="0" width="724" style="text-align:center; > font-size: 24px; font-weight:bold; > color:#33;display:block;"/> > > > http://www.home-barista.com/forums/post691451.html";>La Pavoni > Europiccola Repair > > ** > Happens on the first, but not on the second. I wonder if it's Windows > misunderstanding the target="_blank"directive? > And as someone else pointed out it only happens when the system > browser is used for viewing. > -- Ira > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.16.2 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18362 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.8.3
Maxim, > The Bat! 9.0.8.3 (BETA) is available at > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9083-32.rar > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9083-64.rar > What's new in 9.0.8.3 since 9.0.8.2: > [-] Fixed issues with GMail OAUTH authentication > [-] If the Connection Center pops up when a modal dialog is active, The Bat! > GUI stalls Running well here. > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.8.3 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18362 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: The Bat! 9.0.6 MSI files: Toolbar positioning not holding when TB is restarted
Richard, > Hello Thomas, > Saturday, November 30, 2019, 12:27:53 AM, you wrote: > After having restarted the computer, I can fully confirm that all > toolbar customisations are lost. But this does not happen every time! > Having to friggle a lot until I get two toolbars onto the same > lines is highly annoying. They alwasy "click" onto the line above or > below. Confirmed. But not consistently. It is a little tricky to get the tool bar to position. But with a little patience, I can move it to where it clicks in place. The lock trigger must be a bit small. > -- > Best regards, > Richardmailto:the...@newmangroup.com > -- > Using The Bat! v9.0.6 on Windows v10 18363 -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.6 Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18362 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.28
Maxim, > The Bat! 9.0.0.28 (BETA) is available at > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb90028-32.rar > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb90028-64.rar > What's new in 9.0.0.28 since 9.0.0.27: > [-] Fixed issue with adding Tags, Flags, ColorGroups, etc on standard toolbar > (BETA issue) > [-] Fixed bugs in userdef.xml file handling in 64-bit version of The Bat! > (BETA issue) Running well here. > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.0.28 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18362 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.26
Ira, > Hello MAU, > Sunday, November 24, 2019, 5:34:52 AM, you wrote: MAU>> Hello Ira, MAU>> Are you aware (and when I say aware I mean aware) that you are using MAU>> alpha and or beta versions of TB? If you are not happy using them, MAU>> nobody forces you to do so. Revert to the latest release version that MAU>> you were used to, and pleasantly wait for the next release. > I am fully aware of that. I will point out that I've been pointing > out functionality that's been removed and seemingly replaced with > something that's both not as good, not as full featured and > seemingly not near ready for alpha. > I've been on many many betas and alphas starting in around 1985. > I'm here to try and help make one of my most important programs > better. I repeat myself because I got no replies and that new > "feature" seem to have dramatically reduced the functionality of The Bat. At > least it has for me. My philosophy is that, if a problem has been reported, and Rit asks if it is fixed now, respond. If Rit reports it as fixed and it isn't, let them know. Otherwise, I give them credit for knowing about the problem and not fixing it yet for reasons of their own. It is true that these things sometimes drag on for a long time, which often means that they were unable to duplicate the problem. No sense pestering them about that. > This morning I discovered that it's possible using that new > feature to create a userdef.xml, attached here, that will prevent > The Bat from starting. That was certainly unexpected and took a while to > figure out. > -- Ira -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.0.27 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18362 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.27
Maxim, > The Bat! 9.0.0.27 (BETA) is available at > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb90027-32.rar > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb90027-64.rar > What's new in 9.0.0.27 since 9.0.0.26: > [-] (#0001876) Size of message in Message pane header is black (BETA issue) > [-] (#0001825) Editor: Menu items under Options / Message Format are > duplicated (BETA issue) Running well here. > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.0.27 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18362 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.26
Maxim, > The Bat! 9.0.0.26 (BETA) is available at > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb90026-32.rar > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb90026-64.rar > What's new in 9.0.0.26 since 9.0.0.25: > [-] (#0001878) Dragging dashes from Commands to toolbar generates Access > Violation (BETA issue) > [-] (#0001877) Can not add group separator in Standard toolbar (BETA issue) > [-] Skins and ribbons were on by default before The Bat! reads configuration > file (BETA issue) > [-] (#0001875) Cancelling main password request causes hanging The Bat! (BETA > issue) > [-] Fixed a range check error when loading contents of an empty userdef.xml > file (BETA issue) > [-] The configuration toolbar was missing (BETA issue) > [-] "Set password" dialog was incorrect in high DPI (BETA issue) Running well here. > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.0.26 (BETA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18362 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.13
Viktor, > Hello Maxim, > Monday, October 28, 2019, 12:49:56 PM, you wrote: >> The Bat! 9.0.0.13 (ALPHA) is available at >> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb90013-32.rar > Just started this version after a week off. > Seems to run just fine. Thank you! > + No toolbar flickering for me twhen I move a message. > The ribbons are gone as it seems and the entire toolbar area is now > white for me...I bet there were some > background colors involved in my last (0.0.9) alpha. > + The AntispamSniper toolbar now merges as a peer between the other toolbars. Can't confirm. The anitspamsniper toolbar still does not merge for me. > Its appearance seems changed - when it's floating, it now shows the full > window title bar inclusing "close" comntrol, with a seemingly surplus white > bar above it: https://paste.pics/73KPH > But all of therse seem to me like an effect of the changed gear > behing the removed ribbons - is it so? -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.0.13 (ALPHA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18362 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.11
Jernej, > On Saturday, October 19, 2019, 19:18:24, Maxim Masiutin via TBBETA wrote: >> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb90011-64.rar > Switching between messages takes about 1-2 seconds in this version, > and the toolbar buttons blink while waiting for the new message to be > displayed (looks like they're being constantly redrawn). It looks like about 4 passes. -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.0.11 (ALPHA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18362 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.5 menu bar
mse, > Hello Gleason, >>>>> In the menu bar the "Search" field is to big so the bar of >>>>> AntiSpamSniper can't be inserted. G>>>> In my testing, the search field is not the problem. I always remove G>>>> it anyway. It persistently returns and I remove it again. >>> In that case, could you have a look at >>> https://bt.ritlabs.com/view.php?id=1818 >>> and confirm if this also applies to you? G>> I was going to insert a pic of the tool bar customizer, but I see that TB G>> will no longer allow me to do that. Attached. It is missing part of G>> the display. It will let me stretch the height, but not the width. I G>> don't see a way to change my tool bar setup, so I can't test your bug G>> report. > You are right, the width is fixed; at my setup, too. Didn't realize > that. > However you can still change toolbars by dragging an icon from the > commands column of the customizer onto the desired toolbar. The drag/drop prompt has an x over it which usually means that the drop isn't allowed. That is the case here, the drop does not work for any toolbar listed on the left. > Best regards, > mse > -- > Using The Bat! Version 9.0.0.5 (ALPHA) (32-bit) Pro on > Windows 10 (Build 18362) (64-bit) without OTFE > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.0.5 (ALPHA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18362 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.5 menu bar
mse, > Hello Gleason, >>> In the menu bar the "Search" field is to big so the bar of >>> AntiSpamSniper can't be inserted. G>> In my testing, the search field is not the problem. I always remove G>> it anyway. It persistently returns and I remove it again. > In that case, could you have a look at > https://bt.ritlabs.com/view.php?id=1818 > and confirm if this also applies to you? I was going to insert a pic of the tool bar customizer, but I see that TB will no longer allow me to do that. Attached. It is missing part of the display. It will let me stretch the height, but not the width. I don't see a way to change my tool bar setup, so I can't test your bug report. > Best regards, > mse > -- > Using The Bat! Version 9.0.0.5 (ALPHA) (32-bit) Pro on > Windows 10 (Build 18362) (64-bit) without OTFE > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.0.5 (ALPHA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18362 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.5 menu bar
Martin, > Hi list >> The Bat! 9.0.0.5 (ALPHA) is available at >> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9005-32.rar > In the menu bar the "Search" field is to big so the bar of > AntiSpamSniper can't be inserted. In my testing, the search field is not the problem. I always remove it anyway. It persistently returns and I remove it again. So, with the search bar gone and plenty of room for anitspamsniper, it still cannot be placed on the same line as the main toolbar. > In version 8.8.9 "Search" can be made very small so it can be put in > the first line. > https://i.imgur.com/NMGJkYM.png -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.0.5 (ALPHA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18362 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.5
Maxim, > The Bat! 9.0.0.5 (ALPHA) is available at > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9005-32.rar > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9005-64.rar > What's new in 9.0.0.5 since 9.0.0.4: > [-] Inbox analyzer gave an access violation error > [-] (#0001719) After adding a account with the mail account > assistant the The Bat! main window does not show > [-] Fixed the KillTimer issues (ALPHA issue) Positioning of the Antispamsniper toolbar is better. It can now be placed in a toolbar row, but not on the same row as the main toolbar. > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason TheBat! 9.0.0.5 (ALPHA) Pro (64bit, no OTFE) on Windows 10.0 18362 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.2
Peter, > Answering a message (Wednesday, October 2, 2019, 18:45) > Good evening Gleason, G>> There should be a global permanent option for this. For G>> grumpy old guys like me. > As grumpy old as me? :-) G>> You found a different way to turn off the ribbons? > BoC. See the attached image. Problem solved. Thanks. -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.2
mse, > Hello Gleason, >>> I#m quite OK with ribbons in general but >>> at the moment it doesn't use the possibilities that a ribbon offers, >>> like sub groups. As an idea to show what I mean: Take the tab >>> "Message" for example: >>> Tab Message >>> Sub group "Communicate" contains actions >>> New >>> Reply >>> Reply to all >>> Forward >>> Forward as text >>> Forward as attachments >>> Resend >>> Redirect >>> Edit as new >>> Sub Group "Categorize" contains actions >>> Flags >>> Colour Group >>> Tags >>> Memo (was Memo Editor) >>>Sub Group "Organize" contains actions >>>Move to Folder >>>Copy to Folder >>>Save as >>>Delete >>> Sub Group "Print" contains actions >>> Print >>> Print Preview >>> Print Setup >>> What are you thoughts, readers? G>> The problem with sub groups is that functions get hidden in the G>> hierarchy. "Now where is that darn Save As function"? And "Edit as G>> new"? Not here, not there. Menu bars can have groups too (sub G>> menus). In practice, they are minimally used, which should also be G>> the case with sub groups in ribbons. > OK, maybe this was not well described on my end. > I don't mean sub groups in the sense of sub menues which open on > MouseOver or Click. > I meant an optical group as you can see it in the tab "Options". > The second "Options" and "Select Skin" are what I think to be called > sub groups. Ok, I grant that would be an improvement on ribbons, and not much better than sub menus. A difference would be that it would be ok to have more use of groupings than of sub menus. > Best regards, > mse > -- > Using The Bat! Version 9.0.0.2 (ALPHA) (32-bit) Pro on > Windows 10 (Build 18362) (64-bit) without OTFE > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.2
mse, > Hello Victor, VK>> Also - does the "Home" tab do anything specific? VK>> https://paste.pics/6URAU VK>> Thanks & cheers VK>> Viktor > I realized that, too. > IMO the home tab (in MS Office it's the File-tab) is the perfect place for > the contents of the ribbons "Options" and "Help". > Also, the "Exit" Button should move from the Message-Tab to the > Home-Tab, last entry there. > As a general thought: Currently the ribbon layout is not really more > than a reformatted menu bar. I suspect it would be hard for it to be any more than that. > I#m quite OK with ribbons in general but > at the moment it doesn't use the possibilities that a ribbon offers, > like sub groups. As an idea to show what I mean: Take the tab > "Message" for example: > Tab Message > Sub group "Communicate" contains actions > New > Reply > Reply to all > Forward > Forward as text > Forward as attachments > Resend > Redirect > Edit as new > Sub Group "Categorize" contains actions > Flags > Colour Group > Tags > Memo (was Memo Editor) >Sub Group "Organize" contains actions >Move to Folder >Copy to Folder >Save as >Delete > Sub Group "Print" contains actions > Print > Print Preview > Print Setup > What are you thoughts, readers? The problem with sub groups is that functions get hidden in the hierarchy. "Now where is that darn Save As function"? And "Edit as new"? Not here, not there. Menu bars can have groups too (sub menus). In practice, they are minimally used, which should also be the case with sub groups in ribbons. > Best regards, > mse > -- > Using The Bat! Version 9.0.0.2 (ALPHA) (32-bit) Pro on > Windows 10 (Build 18362) (64-bit) without OTFE > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.2
Peter, > Answering a message (Wednesday, October 2, 2019, 16:15) > Good evening Gleason, G>> Minimize the ribbon makes it go away. Good. > After a restart, right? Right clicking on the ribbon presents a drop down with the option. Choosing that option immediately removes the ribbon. It is back again on restart. The option should be applied permanently. Don't make me choose it every time I start the program. G>> It should do that on sub windows too, like the message edit window. > It does here. Same thing, right click on the ribbon to get the option, which is not preserved. There should be a global permanent option for this. For grumpy old guys like me. You found a different way to turn off the ribbons? -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.2
Stuart, > Hello Maxim, > Wednesday, October 2, 2019, 5:28:54 AM, you wrote: >> The Bat! 9.0.0.2 (ALPHA) is available at >> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9002-32.rar >> https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9002-64.rar > Unable to start this version after starting once and shutting down. Please see > bug report 1816. It won't start for me because the previous exit is hung. Close previous with the Task Manager. This does not happen if I run The Bat on a computer where it isn't set to purge old messages at shutdown. I have 28,000 stored messages using imap. The Bat v8 did often die in the middle of trimming messages on shutdown. In that case, the progress bar would stop. I could then exit The Bat by cancelling the trim process. -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.2
Maxim, Minimize the ribbon makes it go away. Good. It should do that on sub windows too, like the message edit window. Beyond that, new is always new (the ribbon), you can't fight it. > The Bat! 9.0.0.2 (ALPHA) is available at > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9002-32.rar > https://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/beta/tb9002-64.rar > What's new in 9.0.0.2 since 9.0.0.1: > [+] The Preferences dialog now has a hourglass when it opens > [-] (#0001812) Fixed "List index out of bounds" error on startup (ALPHA issue) > [-] (#0001813) Fixed "Runtime error" on exit (ALPHA issue) > [-] (#0001814) Fixed the "Access Violation" error when selecting > text and then using F4 (ALPHA issue) > [-] Fixed various errors related to improper handling of > tbuser.der, like "Abstract Error", etc. (ALPHA issue) > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: [SPAM] Re: Icons for language options
Thomas, > Hello Gleason, > On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 17:18:41 -0400 GMT (28-Sep-19, 04:18 +0700 GMT), > Gleason wrote: >> Gleason, >>> Martin, >>>> Hi The >>>> On Friday, September 27, 2019 10:46:57 PM you wrote: >>>>> Hello everybody, >>>>> on Freitag, 27. September 2019 at 18:46 Martin >>>>> wrote >>>>> re Icons for language options >>>>> >>>>>> On Friday, September 27, 2019 4:34:10 PM Gleason wrote: >>>>>>> Your image shows a Latin based A and something perhaps oriental. I >>>>>>> suspect a single character font image won't be sufficient either. >>>>>> Why not use the letters of ISO 639? >>>>> I vote for that. >>>>> >>>>> DE for German. EN for English. >>>>> >>>>> But what about languages which are written in non-latin scripts? >>>>> >>>>> RU for Russian, but could this be in kyrillic script? How about Arabic? >>>> ISO639-1 writes "ar" and ISO639-2 "ara" for Arabic. >>> Would Somebody from Saudi Arabia know that? If so, then how about >>> from Morocco? TB does have Turkey, which I suspect is similar to and >>> different from other Arabic places. A person who uses the Turkish >>> variety would recognize the name of his own variant in the font used >>> in Turkey. >> Besides which, I suspect Turks don't think of themselves as Arabs in >> quite the same way that Egyptians and Lybians do. > They are not Arabs, they are Turks. And they changed from arabic > letters to Latin letters almost 100 years ago. No doubt they feel that way, sandwiched between Iran, the Middle East, Georgia on one side and Greece and Bulgaria on the other. Turkey is a complex place. The fact that they did at one time use the Arabic alphabet does say that they do share a good piece of that heritage. Wikkipedia says that minority languages in Turkey include the widespread Kurmanji, the moderately prevalent Arabic and Zazaki and a number of less common minority languages, some of which are guaranteed by the 1923 Treaty of Lausanne. So, yes, Arabic is spoken in Turkey even now, and that would mean the Arabic alphabet is used as well, but the only official language is Turkish, which itself has two variants in Turkey. > -- > Cheers, > Thomas. > Message reply created with The Bat! Version 8.8.9.12 (BETA) (64-bit) > under Windows 10.0 Build 18362 > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Icons for language options
Thomas, > Hello Gleason, > On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 10:34:10 -0400 GMT (27-Sep-19, 21:34 +0700 GMT), > Gleason wrote: >> Martin, >>> Hi >>> Please do not use flags for icons for language options. Country flags >>> don't reflect languages: German is spoken in Germany, Switzerland, >>> Austria and more. French is spoken in France, Switzerland, Canada and >>> much more. >>> So icon for language options shouldn't be a flag. There are better >>> icons for that. >>> Example: https://i.imgur.com/4dsdKej.png >> Your image shows a Latin based A and something perhaps oriental. I >> suspect a single character font image won't be sufficient either. >> Maybe the best way is to spell out the word in the font and language >> it represents. That way you aren't requiring a foreign language user >> to at least be able to recognize the word for their language in English. >> Some groups, like French Canadians for instance, really really don't want to >> use >> English for anything, even if they can. >> Of course there are many variants, like French in Thailand, Spanish in >> the Philippines. The Philippines is tougher though because their Spanish >> laps over into indigenous languages like Tagalog. Maybe Thailand >> is similar. > Not really, because nobody in Thailand (except people who come from a > French-speaking country such as France, or who learned it at school as > a foreign language) speaks French. More people here can speak German > than French, in my personal experience. And of course English and > Chinese, the two most important foreign languages. > The symbol for Thai language is quite easy and commonly used: ก But not present in the Latin alphabet. It might be true that Thailand is not a good example of the difficulty of referring to languages around the world with one or two Latin characters though. > That's the first letter of the Thai alphabet. > The Philipines is in a different situation: It was a Spanish colony > for a couple oif centuries, and the colonists left their language and > their religion. Thailand never was a colony, so there is only one > language here. There was, at one time a French Indo-China which was composed of certain parts of Thailand that were ceded to France by King Chulalongkorn. So says Wikkipedia. That all got rearranged during WWII when France lost much control over its colonies when Germany invaded. That doesn't necessarily mean that a lot of people there speak French. > -- > Cheers, > Thomas. > Message reply created with The Bat! Version 8.8.9.12 (BETA) (64-bit) > under Windows 10.0 Build 18362 > > 'Using TBBETA' information: > http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: [SPAM] Re: Icons for language options
Gleason, > Martin, >> Hi The >> On Friday, September 27, 2019 10:46:57 PM you wrote: >>> Hello everybody, >>> on Freitag, 27. September 2019 at 18:46 Martin wrote >>> re Icons for language options >>> >>>> On Friday, September 27, 2019 4:34:10 PM Gleason wrote: >>>>> Your image shows a Latin based A and something perhaps oriental. I >>>>> suspect a single character font image won't be sufficient either. >>>> Why not use the letters of ISO 639? >>> I vote for that. >>> >>> DE for German. EN for English. >>> >>> But what about languages which are written in non-latin scripts? >>> >>> RU for Russian, but could this be in kyrillic script? How about Arabic? >> ISO639-1 writes "ar" and ISO639-2 "ara" for Arabic. > Would Somebody from Saudi Arabia know that? If so, then how about > from Morocco? TB does have Turkey, which I suspect is similar to and > different from other Arabic places. A person who uses the Turkish > variety would recognize the name of his own variant in the font used > in Turkey. Besides which, I suspect Turks don't think of themselves as Arabs in quite the same way that Egyptians and Lybians do. >> For Russian it's "ru" resp. "rus" > Again, Latin ru/rus is not like the Cyrillic. -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: [SPAM] Re: Icons for language options
Martin, > Hi The > On Friday, September 27, 2019 10:46:57 PM you wrote: >> Hello everybody, >> on Freitag, 27. September 2019 at 18:46 Martin wrote >> re Icons for language options >> >>> On Friday, September 27, 2019 4:34:10 PM Gleason wrote: >>>> Your image shows a Latin based A and something perhaps oriental. I >>>> suspect a single character font image won't be sufficient either. >>> Why not use the letters of ISO 639? >> I vote for that. >> >> DE for German. EN for English. >> >> But what about languages which are written in non-latin scripts? >> >> RU for Russian, but could this be in kyrillic script? How about Arabic? > ISO639-1 writes "ar" and ISO639-2 "ara" for Arabic. Would Somebody from Saudi Arabia know that? If so, then how about from Morocco? TB does have Turkey, which I suspect is similar to and different from other Arabic places. A person who uses the Turkish variety would recognize the name of his own variant in the font used in Turkey. > For Russian it's "ru" resp. "rus" Again, Latin ru/rus is not like the Cyrillic. -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Icons for language options
Martin, > Hi > Please do not use flags for icons for language options. Country flags > don't reflect languages: German is spoken in Germany, Switzerland, > Austria and more. French is spoken in France, Switzerland, Canada and > much more. > So icon for language options shouldn't be a flag. There are better > icons for that. > Example: https://i.imgur.com/4dsdKej.png Your image shows a Latin based A and something perhaps oriental. I suspect a single character font image won't be sufficient either. Maybe the best way is to spell out the word in the font and language it represents. That way you aren't requiring a foreign language user to at least be able to recognize the word for their language in English. Some groups, like French Canadians for instance, really really don't want to use English for anything, even if they can. Of course there are many variants, like French in Thailand, Spanish in the Philippines. The Philippines is tougher though because their Spanish laps over into indigenous languages like Tagalog. Maybe Thailand is similar. -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 9.0.0.1 (ALPHA)
Ira, > Hello Maxim, > Installed and working, but my first reaction is I hate it. The > interface is painfully slow. if I drag my mouse across the ribbon I > can get 5 or 6 buttons lit up at the same time. And everything else > about working with the editor and messages seems slower than before. This is an alpha released with a lot of known issues. I would not expect it to perform well. > -- Ira -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: screenshots of the upcoming The Bat! v9
Maxim, I don't like ribbons either. But maybe that is the old guy, resistant to change view. Ribbons don't seem to be going away. Anyway, I don't think putting all functions in a toolbar is a good idea. Too much to search through for the function I am looking for. Is there a way of grouping/organizing that makes the location of a function obvious while not hidden in a multitude of other functions I almost never use? On the other hand, I have spent much time searching the old tool bar designer for functions I need, like Open Reply. Where could it be hidden, I wonder? Ribbon or not, making things easy to find is the problem to solve. > (cross-posted to TBUDL, TBBETA) > Hello, > What do you think about the screenshots of the upcoming The Bat! v9 > which is currently in development? > You can see the screenshots at > https://www.facebook.com/emailman/posts/10157552017414120 > If you like them, please put "Like". If you don't, please put "Angry". Thank > you! -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Most used eMail clients
Marek, > Hi, as always, false statistics based on false data. Raw numbers would be helpful. But the list probably does more or less give an accurate picture. 50% of people use gmail and iphone. Yes, I do run across a lot of people who use those. But neither system is a desktop email client (gmail is an email provider with optional web based interface). And forums and text messaging on phones are not considered. That is the big hole in the picture of what people actually use. My assertion was that the desktop email client is fading away, and the list does generally reflect that. More informative would be statistics of high performance email client usage, none of those below qualify. > Every secure email client will be out of this statistics, they are > writing it in description: > Since determining the client in which an email is opened requires > images to be displayed, the data for some email clients and mobile > devices might be over- or under-represented due to automatic image > blocking. >> Hello everybody, >> on Samstag, 20. Juli 2019 at 09:57 Lüko Willms wrote >> re Most used eMail clients (was: ...working on version 9 — will >> essential changes be implemented? (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt))) >> addressing Mr. Gleason: >> >>> But you mention only one of the "major players", namely >>> Thunderbird. More often used than Thunderbird is MS Outlook, MS >>> Outlook Express (or Live, as they call it now), and in a similar >>> range Apple Mail, which has for Mac users the same importance as >>> Outlook and Outlook Express for Windows users. >> The above is confirmed by statistics which are collected by a >> company named Litmus Email Analytics, and they include not only >> eMail clients for desktop computers, as I did, but for mobile >> devices, too. I have no clue on which way they do collect this 1000 million >> of emails. >> >> Here is their top 10 list for Juni 2019, taken from >> https://emailclientmarketshare.com/ >> >> #01 Gmail 29% +0.45 >> #02 Apple iPhone 27% -0.62 >> #03 Outlook9% +0.72 >> #04 Apple iPad 8% -0.43 >> #05 Apple Mail 7% -0.04 >> #06 Yahoo! Mail6% -0.52 >> #07 Google Android 3% +0.17 >> #08 Outlook.com2% -0.1 >> #09 Samsung Mail 1% -0.08 >> #10 Thunderbird0% -0.01 >> (Sorry that this is not in a table, but copying into a table in >> TheBat! does not work; I would have to either fill each cell >> individually or create an XLS file and insert this). >> >> I have marked those for desktops with yellow background. This >> confirms which I had written before. >> >> Gmail (i.e. Google mail) is being used both on desktops and on >> mobile devices. Gmail is surpassed by Apple if we add the three >> versions for iPhone, iPad and desktop tallied separately by this Litmus >> company. >> >> If the widely used Thunderbird is counted on less than a half >> percent of emails checked by this Litmus company, TheBat! and even >> more those unknowns which Mr. Gleason misunderstands as "major >> player" are completely out of the picture. >> >> >> Cheers, >> Lüko Willms >> Frankfurt am Main >> Germany >> using: TheBat! 8.8.2.8 (BETA) >> OS: Windows 7(NT 6.1 Build 7601 - Service Pack 1) >> CPU: AMD amd athlon(tm) 64 x2 dual core processor 4200+ >> MEM: 4097 MB -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt))
Lüko, > Hello everybody, > on Samstag, 20. Juli 2019 at 14:48 Ethan J. Mings wrote > re ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? > (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt)) > >> Moderator, can you please save us from this debate. It is really not >> helpful. > You are right. This Mr. Gleason has not the slightest idea of > HTML and MIME, but he insists on abusing HTML because he has no clue of how > to used it. > > Sorry for being rude, but fact, and this fact needs to be stated. > > It is time that Ritlabs ignores such foolery. > > A quote needs to be announced to the recipient's client as such, > by using the HTML tag for quoting, i.e. the BLOCKQUOTE tag. > > An email client which doesn't render quotes is quotes and does > not mark quotes as such, is useless. Thanks for your opinion. > Cheers, > Lüko Willms > Frankfurt am Main > Germany > using: TheBat! 8.8.2.8 (BETA) > OS: Windows 7(NT 6.1 Build 7601 - Service Pack 1) > CPU: AMD amd athlon(tm) 64 x2 dual core processor 4200+ > MEM: 4097 MB -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt))
Ira, > Hello Lüko, > Sunday, July 21, 2019, 8:34:03 AM, you wrote: > That's OK, but I also understand from your statement that you do > not understand the MIME structure of today's emails in the first place. > I'm a user, not an author. I don't care one tiny bit about rules or > structures having to do with how email is formatted for > transmission. I just want to read, send, organize filter and search my emails. > All that stuff you're arguing about has nothing to do with the > users of an email program. If it just reasonably displayed the email > without all the tabs and attachments showing all the individual > pieces and inline pictures and other noise id would be better at > being an email program. It does all the filtering, searching and > organizing stuff as well or better than anything, but it falls > behind on the most basic requirement of just displaying an email so > it's easy to read and understand. I don't care if other programs are > broken and make life hard, that's not my problem. It just makes the > puzzle a bit harder, but solvable. > There is so much time spent dissecting and arguing about why it > works the way it does or why it can't work the way it should, but > that's all noise. Just make it work like every other email program > ever written. Yes, that is one way. There is also something to be said for trying to improve on the way other programs do things. Not that The Bat's handling of attachments is an improvement. Sometimes, one person's improvement is another person's unnecessary complication. That would be the person who doesn't want to learn a new way. Rather than resist change, I think people sometimes simply don't want to be bothered with new learning. They are busy enough. It gets difficult for developers who want to attract new users with new ideas. Of course, new users aren't resistant since they don't have a previous way of doing things that seems good enough. > Or at least make it an option to hide all the noise. > -- Ira -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt))
Lüko, > Hello everybody, > on Samstag, 20. Juli 2019 at 19:17 Ira wrote > re ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? > (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt)) >> I'm not trying to understand the structure of emails, I just want to read >> them. > That's OK, but I also understand from your statement that you do > not understand the MIME structure of today's emails in the first place. > > No problem, but you should not keep others from getting an easy > look at exactly that structure, by which token those people in the > know would be able to help you resolving problems which might occur in your > email. >> Saturday, July 20, 2019, 12:41:09 AM, you wrote: >> >>> TheBAt! should have two separate lists, selectable by a TAB, one of >>> the real attachments, the other the nested list of all body parts. >> I see no reason to have a list of nested body parts, I just want >> the email displayed complete. In my setup, the html tab at the bottom of the message preview shows a complete message. It is not necessary to look at the other parts, unless you want to for some reason. >> Though I would be perfectly happy with >> a somewhat hidden way to get that list if I ever see a reason why I >> might care. It's an email program, just show me the email the way >> the sender saw it, certainly not as a list of attachments and >> pieces. > This list of attachments (and body parts) is aside, and you can > ignore it. I think that TheBat! even allows to not show it at all. >> If the sender did choose the "paperclip" to attach the file, >> it's not an attachment and should not appear as such. > > On the contrary, that is marked as an attachment and is > transmitted as such, so that it is not shown inline in the email's > text, but in a list of attachments. > > The problem with TheBat! is that it does not make a difference > between attachments on the one hand, and body parts to be shown inline on the > other. > Therefore my plea for two tabs in the column showing all parts as > "attachments", the one being shown as default for the actual > attachments, the other for all bodyparts in their nested structure. > > Cheers, > Lüko Willms > Frankfurt am Main > Germany > using: TheBat! 8.8.2.8 (BETA) > OS: Windows 7(NT 6.1 Build 7601 - Service Pack 1) > CPU: AMD amd athlon(tm) 64 x2 dual core processor 4200+ > MEM: 4097 MB -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt))
Lüko, > Hello everybody, > on Samstag, 20. Juli 2019 at 19:17 Ira wrote > re ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? > (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt)) >> I'm not trying to understand the structure of emails, I just want to read >> them. I'm sure what he wants to do, or if he is seeing what I see, but my attachment list shows attachments plus message parts. At the bottom of my message preview pane, I see message parts as tabs. Perhaps, he could use the tabs to view parts if he wants to do that, and ignore parts in the attachment list? > That's OK, but I also understand from your statement that you do > not understand the MIME structure of today's emails in the first place. > > No problem, but you should not keep others from getting an easy > look at exactly that structure, by which token those people in the > know would be able to help you resolving problems which might occur in your > email. >> Saturday, July 20, 2019, 12:41:09 AM, you wrote: >> >>> TheBAt! should have two separate lists, selectable by a TAB, one of >>> the real attachments, the other the nested list of all body parts. >> I see no reason to have a list of nested body parts, I just want >> the email displayed complete. Though I would be perfectly happy with >> a somewhat hidden way to get that list if I ever see a reason why I >> might care. It's an email program, just show me the email the way >> the sender saw it, certainly not as a list of attachments and >> pieces. > This list of attachments (and body parts) is aside, and you can > ignore it. I think that TheBat! even allows to not show it at all. >> If the sender did choose the "paperclip" to attach the file, >> it's not an attachment and should not appear as such. > > On the contrary, that is marked as an attachment and is > transmitted as such, so that it is not shown inline in the email's > text, but in a list of attachments. > > The problem with TheBat! is that it does not make a difference > between attachments on the one hand, and body parts to be shown inline on the > other. > Therefore my plea for two tabs in the column showing all parts as > "attachments", the one being shown as default for the actual > attachments, the other for all bodyparts in their nested structure. > > Cheers, > Lüko Willms > Frankfurt am Main > Germany > using: TheBat! 8.8.2.8 (BETA) > OS: Windows 7(NT 6.1 Build 7601 - Service Pack 1) > CPU: AMD amd athlon(tm) 64 x2 dual core processor 4200+ > MEM: 4097 MB -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Most used eMail clients (was: ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt)))
Lüko, So, to finish up as Ethan suggested, I suspect I would agree if I got a lot of email from people who use Thunderbird. I see almost none. So, for Rit, it is a design choice depending largely on their estimation of how many people use Mozilla clones. Hello everybody, on Freitag, 19. Juli 2019 at 19:54 Gleason wrote re ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt)) > In this case, the important thing is that the system works, Fact is, that the quoting in TheBat! is broken, is utter nonsense and does not work at all. When I get a message which quotes something I had written before, TheBat! does not render the quote as a quote. And I have no means to tell for sure what is a quote and what is new text in a message, and no link to the message being quoted. Normally quotes would be identified by enclosing them with a BLOCKQUOTE or Q tag. When I use TheBat!'s broken quoting, it get's completely gobbled up until recognition. You speak about a "list of major players" meaning apparently email clients. But you mention only one of the "major players", namely Thunderbird. More often used than Thunderbird is MS Outlook, MS Outlook Express (or Live, as they call it now), and in a similar range Apple Mail, which has for Mac users the same importance as Outlook and Outlook Express for Windows users. BTW, I tried to get a statistic of the number of the various eMail clients as shown by the X-MAILER header, but the search by TheBat! does not allow to select a given header and only search the content of that header field. And I could not export my full message store to MBOX format — nothing happens, unless I select each single folder at one time, but hat is too tedious to do. And the file format of the TBB and TBN files is not known to me. Cheers, Lüko Willms Frankfurt am Main Germany using: TheBat! 8.8.2.8 (BETA) OS: Windows 7(NT 6.1 Build 7601 - Service Pack 1) CPU: AMD amd athlon(tm) 64 x2 dual core processor 4200+ MEM: 4097 MB -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Most used eMail clients (was: ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt)))
Lüko, > Hello everybody, > on Freitag, 19. Juli 2019 at 19:54 Gleason wrote > re ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? > (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt)) > >> In this case, the important thing is that the system works, > Fact is, that the quoting in TheBat! is broken, is utter nonsense and does > not work at all. > > When I get a message which quotes something I had written before, > TheBat! does not render the quote as a quote. And I have no means to > tell for sure what is a quote and what is new text in a message, and > no link to the message being quoted. This, I think, is our misunderstanding. What you say is true when you are corresponding with somebody who uses Thunderbird. The fault is with Thunderbird, not The Bat. Thunderbird converts quoting to it's system when replying to you. And so all structure is lost. No other client does this. That means Thunderbird and Mozilla clones like Post Box. MS Outlook also does not trash The Bat's quoting. And it does trash Thunderbird's quoting. So, for instance, when I use Post Box to reply to MS Outlook, the reply I get back from Outlook has trashed quoting. Mozilla clones are not usable. > Normally quotes would be > identified by enclosing them with a BLOCKQUOTE or Q tag. > > When I use TheBat!'s broken quoting, it get's completely gobbled up until > recognition. > > You speak about a "list of major players" meaning apparently email clients. > > But you mention only one of the "major players", namely > Thunderbird. More often used than Thunderbird is MS Outlook, MS > Outlook Express (or Live, as they call it now), and in a similar > range Apple Mail, which has for Mac users the same importance as > Outlook and Outlook Express for Windows users. Those are not high performance email clients. They are clients for general users. Since general users have moved away from old style email, I can't imagine that those clients get a lot of users any more. > BTW, I tried to get a statistic of the number of the various eMail > clients as shown by the X-MAILER header, but the search by TheBat! > does not allow to select a given header and only search the content > of that header field. And I could not export my full message store > to MBOX format — nothing happens, unless I select each single folder > at one time, but hat is too tedious to do. And the file format of > the TBB and TBN files is not known to me. > > Cheers, > Lüko Willms > Frankfurt am Main > Germany > using: TheBat! 8.8.2.8 (BETA) > OS: Windows 7(NT 6.1 Build 7601 - Service Pack 1) > CPU: AMD amd athlon(tm) 64 x2 dual core processor 4200+ > MEM: 4097 MB -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt))
Lüko, > Hello everybody, > on Freitag, 19. Juli 2019 at 15:05 Gleason wrote > re ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? > (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt)) > >>>> Thunderbird - Must assign bcc by identity. Quote bar doesn't show on >>>> other clients. >>> Showing a bar to to mark a blockquote is the task of the >>> renderer. This is regulated in the CSS STYLE which does either >>> accompany the mail, or which is used by the receiving client by its default >>> STYLE. >> That's interesting. But my comment stands from my testing of different >> clients. If I send a quoted email from Thunderbird, no other client >> shows the quote bar. Only other Thunderbird installations do that. > This makes me think that you don't know anything about HTML and CSS. Yes, I do know what css is and how it shapes display. What I am saying is that, in use, my above statement is true and that is what matters. Other clients do not display Thunderbird quote bars. That makes Thunderbird unusable for me. The Bat with a similar system would also be unusable. > > But you insist on making strong statements trying to dictate the > world how use this markup language and presentation system. > > And you want that the eMail client hides to the recipient, what > is a quote from an earlier message, and provide the link to it, and > what is newly created by the author for that particular message. > HTML tags are not made to create an appearance, but they convey a > meaning. Only by tagging a piece of text as QUOTE Not if that tag makes no difference in how the quoted text is displayed. > can the recipient > know what is a quote and what not, and use the information in the > CITE parameter to the BLOCKQUOTE tag to look up the source of the quote. > > That you don't want to know what is going on, is your problem, > but you should not insist, that nobody should be able to use TheBAt! as a > sensible email client. > > From everything which you have uttered in this thread, it comes > out louder and clearer that you have no clue what HTML is and what eMail is > to be. > > But when you don't know anything about what you are talking about, then > better stay silent. > > And stop working against correcting TheBat! Stop trying to make The Bat unusable. > > Cheers, > Lüko Willms > Frankfurt am Main > Germany > using: TheBat! 8.8.2.8 (BETA) > OS: Windows 7(NT 6.1 Build 7601 - Service Pack 1) > CPU: AMD amd athlon(tm) 64 x2 dual core processor 4200+ > MEM: 4097 MB -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt))
Ira, > Hello Gleason, > Friday, July 19, 2019, 2:42:09 PM, you wrote: Gleason>> HTML being a moving target. That might have something to do with why Gleason>> browsers require such frequent updates. Good enough reason to let people Gleason>> use MS libraries to view html email like The Bat does. > Then stop showing emails without attachments as having a dozen or > more attachments. I can live with messed up display, but having to > dig through a list of attachment or tabs of different types of text > only to discover I'd already read it all is absurd. As for that > matter is defending it as the best there is and denying it's full of > issues. I would never argue its not the best there is, if with the > knowledge I have I didn't think that I'd be using something else, > but that does not change the fact that it's rather severely broken > with seemingly almost no hope of it ever being fixed. Or maybe it is simply that anybody who insists on trying to improve a product in the face of a dieing market for it and in the face of so little appreciation for their efforts must be a little crazy. So maybe we can forgive their oversights on that basis. > -- Ira -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt))
Ira, > Hello Gleason, > Friday, July 19, 2019, 2:42:09 PM, you wrote: Gleason>> HTML being a moving target. That might have something to do with why Gleason>> browsers require such frequent updates. Good enough reason to let people Gleason>> use MS libraries to view html email like The Bat does. > Then stop showing emails without attachments as having a dozen or > more attachments. I can live with messed up display, but having to > dig through a list of attachment or tabs of different types of text > only to discover I'd already read it all is absurd. As for that > matter is defending it as the best there is and denying it's full of > issues. I would never argue its not the best there is, if with the > knowledge I have I didn't think that I'd be using something else, > but that does not change the fact that it's rather severely broken > with seemingly almost no hope of it ever being fixed. But no more broken and demonstrably less broken than the other choices. I certainly don't deny it has issues, and as I said I have my own with it. I also understand what it means to produce and maintain a product like The Bat. So, I am perhaps a little less outraged by its faults, and impressed by what it does accomplish. > -- Ira -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: ...working on version 9 — will essential changes be implemented? (was: The Bat! v8.8.9 MSI (3rd attempt))
Ira, > Hello Gleason, > Friday, July 19, 2019, 7:10:47 AM, you wrote: Gleason>> Qualcomm, which produced the (at one time widely used) Eudora email client, now Gleason>> defunct. They gave it to Mozilla where it has gone no where. > It died because someone thought Thunderbird with a Eudora looking > theme would be enough, but Thunderbird is so far conceptually from > what Eudora was, it could never get close. I tried it. It called > itself Eudora, imported all my Eudora stuff, but then I had to use > Thunderbird which sucks so I kept using Eudora till it started > crashing and then moved to The Bat, something good enough for my > needs that I could live with it. But the list of the Bat's > idiosyncrasies is is long and troubling and no one seems to care to > fix them. You know, really basic stuff like properly displaying a message > with text and html. HTML being a moving target. That might have something to do with why browsers require such frequent updates. Good enough reason to let people use MS libraries to view html email like The Bat does. Maybe Rit thinks they have enough to do without constantly chasing evolving html. Thunderbird at least has the advantage of being able to tap into Firefox html display, which means Thunderbird's html is probably the best outside of MS libraries. My experience with programs that try to do various different things, is that they end up doing none of them well. Like, for instance, programs that try to do email and be a pim at the same time. Let MS take care of the html. Mailbird's html is quite good too if that matters to you. But in the end, choosing an email client is a matter of what you can live with as you say. > -- Ira -- Gleason 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
