]
Subject: Re: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
It's already April 1st here, so I'll bid the list and its participants
farewell. It's been fun and, I hope, at least a bit helpful for some. And
a final big thank you to Clif.
--
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http://www.oliver.com
Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
Behalf Of Don Kibbey
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:13 PM
To: 'U2 Users Discussion List'
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Dude, your like the dog that just won't stop humping the guests leg.
Get
over
As stated earlier, kindly leave the guests alone. They are tired of your flaming.
If your not interested in learning some legacy techniques then kindly just go away
and code up some wonderful stuff in vb against a nice fat Oracle data store.
Bye!!!
Don Kibbey
Financial Systems Manager
Universe - was: The lists are closing
Our UV Developers here have over 25 years of Experience doing the stuff
the do... I personally am not interested in learning the details of UV
since nobody really uses this kinda stuff at Corporate Level.
I am simply surprised why UV is still used
PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
Behalf Of David T. Meeks
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:37 AM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
While one could make the argument that Pick has not
embraced emerging
technologies as rapidly
Hewkin
-Original Message-
From: Joe Eugene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 30 March 2004 16:34
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Damn it... Don't you anything something better to do!
Moderator Stopped this Thread!
-Original Message
worked and happy Hewkin
-Original Message-
From: Joe Eugene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 30 March 2004 16:34
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Damn it... Don't you anything something better to do!
Moderator Stopped
We're pickies, we don't need to understand XML, or whatever, so long
as we can do what's required of us. Yeah, we could learn XML, if
required.
Joe suggests we can't learn XML, lets see fellow pickies, XML is
hierarchical what do we know that could possibly help us understand that :).
In a message dated 3/30/2004 12:35:32 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
You are partly correct when you say UV treats all data as strings. However,
if the UV programmer is careful he/she can get it to do maths processing.
Variables within UVBasic are string unless the result
I am probably in the best position to compare apples with apples.
I have both UniVerse and Oracle on the same IBM p660 4 processor box with
6Gb RAM. The 800,000 customers are replicated from UniVerse to Oracle,
although the Oracle version is only a subset of the attributes required by a
Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 2:32 PM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: Re: [ADMIN] Re: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
In a message dated 3/30/2004 12:22:53 AM Eastern Standard Time
Then perhaps you should take your own advice and HIT DELETE
-Original Message-
From: Joe Eugene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[unsightly rubbish snipped]
IF you feel my comments are without SUBSTANCE...
WHY NOT ARGUE BACK with some Valid Proof...
Instead of start Calling People Names...
- Original Message -
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: U2 Users Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2004 5:35 AM
Subject: Re: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
In a message dated 3/30/2004 12:35:32 AM Eastern Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
You
for others...
anything on the right hand side of an assignment symbol (in this case =)
is an expression
Cheers
Trevor Ockenden
OSP
- Original Message -
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: U2 Users Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2004 5:35 AM
Subject: Re: Modern Universe
In a message dated 3/30/2004 7:34:27 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Trevor,
I *think* the issue is that the mv runtime does typecast variables
on the fly, transparently. Which means that assigning a number or the
result of a numeric expression (AVAR = 1 * 3) results
another
topic ...)
Cheers,
Wol
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of Jeff Schasny
Sent: 30 March 2004 23:37
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: RE: [ADMIN] Re: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Then perhaps you should take your own
.
Joe Eugene
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
Behalf Of Tony Gravagno
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 1:30 AM
To: 'U2 Users Discussion List'
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
I can't say if MV is slow or inefficient
Joe
1) Check again... one of IBM's partners is Epicore
http://www.epicor.com/www/ which is using a Unidata database and XML
technology in several of their products.
3) Our company has two divisions one on Oracle and one on Unidata. The
Unidata side has two programmers compared to the 8 on the
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 1:30 AM
To: 'U2 Users Discussion List'
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
I can't say if MV is slow or inefficient as far as database handling
compared to various relational DBMS environments. Since the tests
themselves (TPC, etc) are biased
and performance stuff.
Joe Eugene
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
Behalf Of Tony Gravagno
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 1:30 AM
To: 'U2 Users Discussion List'
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
I can't say if MV is slow
. Meeks
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:37 AM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
While one could make the argument that Pick has not embraced emerging
technologies as rapidly as the 'Big Three', it HAS done so.
U2, for example, has support
]
On
Behalf Of Donald Kibbey
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 11:24 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
So, what's your point? Use C# against the UV database if that's what
you
want to do (I and others have been doing this for a couple of years
now
PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
Behalf Of Jeff Schasny
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 11:20 AM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
At the risk of being rude (which I don't really mind all that much).
Your
comments simply verify my initial
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
Behalf Of David T. Meeks
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:37 AM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
While one could make the argument that Pick has not embraced
is Lost there...
Joe
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
Behalf Of Donald Kibbey
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 11:24 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
So, what's your point? Use C# against the UV
Joe,
I shouldn't even dignify this crap with a reply, but anyway ...
1. Populate UV and Oracle with around 10 Million records.
2. Write fairly complex Web Application against it.
3. Run a Web Application Stress tool(around 1000 Users)
switching Databases within the same DB Machine.
We've
Hi,
Having been part of this list for only a short period I have found the
discussions very useful and the answers to questions posed have always
worked, even though we use Universe as our database, most of the solutions
are universal across the MV community.
I for one will be sorry to see the
Eugene
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
Behalf Of David T. Meeks
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:37 AM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
While one could make the argument that Pick has
You want Pick on the web... simple, use Visage!
Patrick Will Williams, President
American Computer Technics, Inc.
919-567-0042 Raleigh, NC
- Original Message -
From: David T. Meeks
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 6:37 AM
Subject: RE: Modern Universe
Users Discussion List'
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Joe,
I shouldn't even dignify this crap with a reply, but anyway ...
1. Populate UV and Oracle with around 10 Million records.
2. Write fairly complex Web Application against it.
3. Run a Web Application
Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn
- Clark Gable as Rhett Butler in Gone with the Wind
At 12:01 PM 3/29/2004 -0500, you wrote:
With all due respects, Sir, you are beginning to bore the hell out of me!
-- Clint Eastwood as Gunnery Sgt. Thomas Highway in Heartbreak Ridge
-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of Will
Sent: March 29, 2004 3:02 PM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: Re: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
You want Pick on the web... simple, use Visage!
Patrick Will Williams, President
American Computer Technics, Inc
: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
Behalf Of David T. Meeks
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 11:56 AM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
So, UV does everything on the BackEnd, but SQL Server does your data
warehousing.
And you
In a message dated 3/29/2004 11:07:24 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
1. Populate UV and Oracle with around 10 Million records.
2. Write fairly complex Web Application against it.
3. Run a Web Application Stress tool(around 1000 Users)
switching Databases within the
In a message dated 3/29/2004 11:27:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
e.g. We pull XML Reports from our Vendors Real Time. I have to parse
through the XML and give UV/PICK Guys a FLAT TEXT File... cause either
UV Cannot handle the storage and Retrival of XML Data Using
Please Speak LOUDER!!!
*throws you a raw steak*
Will raw steak Johnson
In a message dated 3/29/2004 12:26:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Going MainStream and staying with BIG THREE is Better for the
future of the Company's Needs. BIG THREE has A LOT OF
INVESTMENT
in
I think Joe may realize a couple things:
1) He doesn't know enough about the system to criticize it.
2) The IT people in his UV shop didn't know much either.
Many Pick guys get into Pick because they know their business market but not
much about technology, and Pick makes it easy to write
Raleigh, NC
- Original Message -
From: Michael Spencer
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:12 AM
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Last I looked at Visage, it:
1) required javascript skills
2) had no published price
3
Hi Joe
I have worked with variety of databases and I think using one
performance statistic to evaluate the capabilities of one database
against another is meaningless. As a professional I consider all
databases for any business requirement and select on their merits. To
discount MV products
PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of Will
Sent: March 29, 2004 3:02 PM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: Re: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
You want Pick on the web... simple, use Visage!
Patrick Will Williams, President
American Computer Technics, Inc.
919-567-0042
Joe,
Here's a few things to consider. MV environments (including
UniVerse), allow for small teams to develop and adjust business rules
more quickly than you can you can in Oracle, Sybase, or Informix.
Published statistics show that MV environments are roughly twice as
efficient in disk
List
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Charles,
Our Customer Information is stored in UV and accessed via PICK.
This FILE (as UV ppl call it) contains around 500,000 Records in it.
Everything is INDEXED Per UV Standards.
Here is simple WILD CARD Search Test.
RESULTS
Joe,
Have you checked the file sizes? Have you checked the index
parameters? I'll make you a bet. You bring me in for a week (i'll
probably need most of that week to prove my results, the fixes will take
less than a day) and I bet you we can make a meaningful improvement in
your response
, David (SST - Adelaide)
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 8:55 PM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Hi Joe,
Perhaps you could share your actual searches, code and database
structure? Were you searching 20 million records in a single column
table
PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
Behalf Of djordan
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 7:43 PM
To: 'U2 Users Discussion List'
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Hi Joe
I have worked with variety of databases and I think using one
performance statistic to evaluate
Ockenden
OSP
- Original Message -
From: Joe Eugene [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: U2 Users Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 12:06 PM
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
This is what I meant ... TYPO
RESULTS
Machine: 950 MHZ Athlon
Database
years of experience simply cannot make it perform
well.
Joe
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
Behalf Of Trevor Ockenden
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:17 PM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: Re: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Ockenden
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:10 PM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: Re: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Joe
Have I missed something here. You refer to the QUAD as having MSSQL
SERVER
2K as the database so where does the UV (or PICK) files fit
You are correct. It was your Trivial things and stupid comments that I was
answering.
Regards,
T.
--
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Joe Eugene wrote:
I have heard stories where several corporations migrated to RDBMS,
Never heard any LARGE Corp(Hershey, GE, BOfA etc) switch to UV/MVDBMS.
Of the many companies who have migrated from MV to an RDBMS you always hear
the fanfare of their initial decision but rarely of the years of
Joe
Thanks for the direct reply.
I have had some experience with 'mainstream' databases and due mainly to my
lack of knowledge and experience I found them to be cumbersome, inefficient
and expensive for the type of applications I was dealing with.
Having said that, I have seen some fantastic
Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, 30 March 2004 2:01 PM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: Re: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Joe why are you on this list?
What is the point of hanging around haranging (sp?) us if you are not
interested in learning anything as you put it?
Why
PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Trevor Ockenden
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:55 PM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: Re: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Joe
One final point. You find it hard to believe people on this LIST get so
defensive.
May I suggest that if we
teasing
This is a test, right? Y'all got together off-list and cooked this up to
see if I was going to follow through or just roll over and let things
free-wheel for the duration.
/teasing
Seriously, this kind of name calling, mud slingly, and vitriol is
disturbing in its lack of
Dont you still get it...? Think a little bit HARDER!...
Joe Eugene
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 11:31 PM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Subject: Re: Modern Universe - was: The lists
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Moderator
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 12:09 AM
To: U2 Users Discussion List
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [ADMIN] Re: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Importance: High
teasing
This is a test, right
.
Cheers
Trevor Ockenden
OSP
- Original Message -
From: Joe Eugene [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: U2 Users Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 3:06 PM
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
Trevor,
I am a member of serveral other Technical Forms
Well the list is certainly going to go out with a bang then :)
- Original Message -
From: Joe Eugene [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: U2 Users Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 1:24 PM
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
PICK is LEGACY Technology
28, 2004 7:24 PM
Subject: RE: Modern Universe - was: The lists are closing
PICK is LEGACY Technology and does NOT Support alot of advanced
level computing we have today. I belive PICK is Similiar to Legacy DB2
that used ISAM type of DataBases Access. Even IBM has moved DB2 (Now UDB
I can't say if MV is slow or inefficient as far as database handling
compared to various relational DBMS environments. Since the tests
themselves (TPC, etc) are biased because they themselves are defined based
on relational constructs, I suspect we'll never get real numbers that we can
all agree
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