Re: [Vo]:The real cost of coal

Patent rules in the U.S. have recently changed effective March 18, 2013 Priority is now first to file not first to invent LENR when it finally becomes economically viable (its been real soon now for 20yrs) will be an epic patent battle with every half brained idea posted somewhere in random sp

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 8:40 PM, David Roberson wrote: I assumed that you were describing an experiment where the exit direction > was measured...my mistake. You were right -- the setup was like this: d beam ---> | thin foil | ---> MeV particles ---> | Si detector | So the low energy d's

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

DJ Cravens wrote: Jim P. Yes, that was sad. ( I actually thought the number was $30 M from > Motorola and $20M from State water heaters ). > Was it that much? What a nightmare. I just remember hearing $20 million and feeling SO AGGRAVATED. Yet another lost opportunity for cold fusion. Oy veh.

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

I would not have expected any form of directionality when the input particles are of such low energy compared to the outputs. I assumed that you were describing an experiment where the exit direction was measured...my mistake. Dave -Original Message- From: Eric Walker To: vortex-l

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

I suspect that it is going to take a product at the local department stores to convince the normal public that LENR is real. Once they see for themselves how much money it saves them they will buy the products. It should be an easy sales pitch if the operational costs are 10% of what is curren

RE: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

Jim P. Yes, that was sad. ( I actually thought the number was $30 M from Motorola and $20M from State water heaters ). I wish I could make those beads. I don't think that Jim could recreate them either. But I now think that the layering of Cu then Ni and Pd , or Au and Pd was part of the

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

The hot fusion method that you describe has been explored for over 100 years using over 50 billion dollars. Several methods are being explored because they have promise, but not the ones you note because they have no promise. Hot fusion continues to receive support in an attempt to overcom

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 1:40 PM, wrote: The fact that no (or few?) reactions are detected on the front side shows > that > the reaction is not a typical hot fusion reaction. > If this is a reference to the Chambers experiment in 1990, it is an interesting detail that the particles were emitted f

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

I hesitate to put in my 2 cents worth, but this argument should be cooled down a few notches. Both of you guys are making fine contributions to the field and it would be much better for you to work together instead of against each other. Dennis, I think you should take Jed up on his offer to e

RE: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

You obviously try to twist things. Are you really expecting people to present papers and descriptions of demos before the demos? No company does that. Programmer?? For example, do you expect a programmer to post source code before the public release and show? Or release a journal paper and

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Edmund Storms wrote: Occurrence of a nuclear reaction is the only proof that matters. Once a > nuclear reaction is demonstrated to occur, making commercial energy only > requires good engineering. > I wish this were true, in and of itself. But people have known a

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

DJ Cravens wrote: > *I am in favor any step (sic) *to promote that, including funding people > who hate money. It is a means to an end. > > *Perhaps you should work on your style because I misunderstand you.* > Then you are obtuse, which is unbecoming of a professor. This is very simple: You m

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

DJ Cravens wrote: "Voice input and typos are fact of life for me." > Perhaps you should read and edit your material before you hit send. > > "You do not enough resources" (sic) > Meant: You do not HAVE enough resources. Have telegraphic style. Often drop words. Not voice input's faul

RE: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 22:21:47 -0400 Subject: Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process? From: jedrothw...@gmail.com To: vortex-l@eskimo.com I have never "complained" about lack of funding. This is like saying you complain of thirst, not that you have no water. You complain you cannot do the work.

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

DJ Cravens wrote: Strange, you expect a write up of a demo before it happens. > OF COURSE I DO!!! For goodness sake, haven't you rehearsed?!? Don't you know what the thing will do? Assuming it works. This is mind boggling!!! I cannot imagine anyone going to a conference or a trade show with a

RE: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

Strange, you expect a write up of a demo before it happens. You are not realistic. D2 Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 21:28:23 -0400 Subject: Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process? From: jedrothw...@gmail.com To: vortex-l@eskimo.com "nothing, anywhere, ever about the kind of device you plan to

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

DJ Cravens wrote: > "What would I tell them?" If they are real friends as you claim and they > think you trustworthy, then it should be simple enough to say > something like Kim said - that is, I have been there, I have seen their > system, and it looks like they have something. Stop the excus

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 8:19 PM, DJ Cravens wrote: > There is even a link to a picture of one of my devices. > > For the benefit of your critics, here is the link again: https://plus.google.com/photos/100517292944598113317/albums/5896172801049146737/5896172796425182786?pid=5896172796425182786&o

RE: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

"Voice input and typos are fact of life for me." Perhaps you should read and edit your material before you hit send. "You do not enough resources" (sic) "You have a responsibility to get resources, succeed and to bring this technology to the world, if it is within your power t

Re: [Vo]:The real cost of coal

blaze spinnaker wrote: > By your logic, the patent that Rossi has applied for is dead, kaput, and > can't be fixed. > I do not know enough about patent law to judge, but people have told me it is dead, kaput, hopeless. I hope for his sake that is not true. I read his patents. They do not seem

RE: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

"What would I tell them?" If they are real friends as you claim and they think you trustworthy, then it should be simple enough to say something like Kim said - that is, I have been there, I have seen their system, and it looks like they have something. Stop the excuses. I have never "compl

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

DJ Cravens wrote: > > I disagree that only an engineer can understand a CF demo. > A scientists or an engineer. Ordinary people cannot. I have a lot of dealing with ordinary people. They are not stupid, but this stuff is harder than you realize. You have been dealing with it for so long it seems

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

At 09:34 PM 7/10/2013, you wrote: Dr. Mitchell Swartz <m...@theworld.com> wrote: ==> The science papers we have written improving calorimetry and describing how to achieve CF/LANR have been censored by Jed Rothwell. I, and we, have always given permission to have

Re: [Vo]:Jet Energy - nanor/phusor question

At 04:53 PM 7/4/2013, Jack Cole wrote: In my electrolysis research, I found that the wire leads for my control runs made a significant difference. Obviously, thinner wire connecting to the joule heater resulted in less power being dissipated in the joule heater and more being dissipated in th

RE: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

"When people ignore you, you blame them." I did not say people in general ignore me. Just you. You say I have no papers and no one ref. them. Yet by your own site: a search shows 115 listings from "Cravens". I take that as an indication of number of papers and references to them. I am not

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

Dr. Mitchell Swartz wrote: > ==> *The science papers we have written improving calorimetry > and describing how to achieve CF/LANR have been censored by Jed Rothwell. > >*I, and we, have always given permission to have these papers listed > and shared. > No, you have not. You are only tr

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

At 07:34 PM 7/10/2013, you wrote: DJ Cravens <djcrav...@hotmail.com> wrote: I just did a search on LENR CANR and find 122 hits. I have papers, and people know them and reference them. My guess is you will scrub them now like Mitch S. But you keep saying these thi

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

DJ Cravens wrote: You again do not check before replying. > You complained that DGT did not send you their data, yet now you say you > are drowning in data. > I am not complaining that DGT has not sent me data. I don't give a damn about that. If they don't want me to know, I don't want to hear a

Re: [Vo]:The real cost of coal

Errr, by all, I mean most patents. :) I got excited there. Certainly all the patents I contributed to were initially rejected. On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 6:23 PM, blaze spinnaker wrote: > Alright, I see that in Europe there might not be a grace period as there > is elsewhere. Kinda bizarre. Th

Re: [Vo]:The real cost of coal

Alright, I see that in Europe there might not be a grace period as there is elsewhere. Kinda bizarre. The patents I have are in the US. But, anyways that's a pretty irrelevant detail. He could just disclose it all in the patent as you said. Anyways, as for being rejected, all patents (at leas

Re: [Vo]:The real cost of coal

Jed - question, do you have any patents? I do.

Re: [Vo]:The real cost of coal

blaze spinnaker wrote: This is a good reason to have a very hard time with this trade secret > approach that the LENR businesses guys are taking. They have no choice. They cannot get patents. > This is one of the reasons why I don't think Rossi has anything. If he > did, why not just discl

Re: [Vo]:The real cost of coal

This is a good reason to have a very hard time with this trade secret approach that the LENR businesses guys are taking. Think of the millions of years of life expectancy they could save if they just disclosed everything they had and then tried to patent it, rather than this trade secret approach.

RE: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

You again do not check before replying. You complained that DGT did not send you their data, yet now you say you are drowning in data. Make up you mind. NDA. Re read. I did not say for you to give your claimed big buck friends any NDA information other than to let them know you are convinc

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

Yeah, give them a call. Let us know how they respond. On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 4:27 PM, Daniel Rocha wrote: > Why don't you call them? > > > 2013/7/10 Alain Sepeda > >> >> It they call me, I will accept to sign any honest NDA. I can design an >> honest protocol to rule out fraud, but I know th

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

DJ Cravens wrote: re read what I wrote. I said a board room not a hotel room. > In that case I know nothing about it. > I personal resent you calling activities disgraceful and horrible. > I resent seeing people piss away $20 million. > I thought that Vortex rules prevented such thing

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

They don't need it. Trust me. Google translator for Japanese gives "Electron scanning microscope". 2013/7/10 Jed Rothwell > >> > That is true, but they make themselves look bad when they present frothy > advertisements at ICC17. It is embarrassing to watch. It is unprofessional. > > - Jed > >

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

Why don't you call them? 2013/7/10 Alain Sepeda > > It they call me, I will accept to sign any honest NDA. I can design an > honest protocol to rule out fraud, but I know that my voice will convince > nobody who is not already convinced. > > -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

On Jul 10, 2013, at 3:00 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote: This, I disagree with. Heat is the only thing that matters. Heat is worth money. Money is what investors want. They don't care whether it is nuclear or angel farts. The source determines the engineering behavior, the life-time, and the

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

DJ Cravens wrote: > I personally think that we need the public on our side and that means > taking demos and information to a new audience. But I guess it depends on > your desired outcome. If you just think of money then you may take a > different tactic than if you are just after public awa

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

Daniel Rocha wrote: They have no need to demonstrate anything openly to anyone. Including any > random people from this list. > That is true, but they make themselves look bad when they present frothy advertisements at ICC17. It is embarrassing to watch. It is unprofessional. If they do not wan

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

Alain Sepeda wrote: I would love it, but it seems no evidence can convince the mainstream... > True, but we do not need to convince the mainstream. As I pointed out at ICCF17, we have many friends. We need to convince them first, and work our way up toward the mainstream: http://lenr-canr.org/a

RE: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

We don't know if they are or are not planning a demo. At least one person of merit has said that they plan a engineering type paper at ICCF and a low key demo at NI Week. But that is rumor. I have tried and tried to get confirmation. I feeling is that they want a surprise factor. Also ther

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

Come to think about it, the High School reactor also uses a stark discharge into a liquid emulation of random diameter tungsten micro/nano powder and a potassium salt. They claim a COP of 4.** * * On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 2:16 PM, DJ Cravens wrote: > ?? yes it produces sparks or arcs or dischar

RE: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

re read what I wrote. I said a board room not a hotel room. It was a board room with board members, president of a company, technical advisors showing the results of the tests. It is things like that make inventors not trust you or your motives. I personal resent you calling activities dis

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

In politics, the power of unrelenting repetition is undeniable. For example, the business community has been repeating the meme that having your wages reduced to below the poverty level is good both for you as well as the country. Through the weight of this unending reputation over the decade’s

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

I would love it, but it seems no evidence can convince the mainstream... Making a solid test protocol is hopeless. It can convince you, but convincing you have no value for the mainstream MY mind. Nothing can, simply nothing else commercialization. I imagine they do demonstration just to be poli

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

*“Ask yourself: What are they doing now? What, exactly, is the benefit of having unknown outsiders publish fluff such as "on the order of 600°C"? On the order of! They don't have a thermocouple? That's ridiculous. It is unprofessional. It sounds like someone describing a fashion show in the Huffing

Re: [Vo]:new publication re LENR technology

Utah (a rather significant data point, wouldn't you agree Jed?) doesn't fit the ethnic interpretation of Morrison's regionalization. Its one of the "whitest", most northern European enclaves in the world -- including northern Europe nowadays. If I were to try to find a better description than "ur

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

They have no need to demonstrate anything openly to anyone. Including any random people from this list. 2013/7/10 Jed Rothwell > > No one is asking them to do that, least of all me. I say they should > describe the calorimetry that supports their claims. They can make this a > black-box presenta

Re: [Vo]:new publication re LENR technology

James Bowery wrote: > The reason CF was not accepted is it was discovered in the academy of a > rural culture and the elites are, as usual, highly identified with the > centers of population. This problem has only gotten worse since the > Wrights. > The "not invented here" syndrome. Yup, that

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

Edmund Storms wrote: Ignorance of one kind has been identified by Jed and many other people. > This kind of ignorance was demonstrated most clearly by Patterson years ago > and Rossi now. > Yes indeed. It is enough to make you weep. Thank goodness Rossi has overcome this enough to allow the Levi

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

In reply to David Roberson's message of Tue, 9 Jul 2013 23:40:10 -0400 (EDT): Hi, [snip] > >Robin, do you see any reason why the particles leaving the active region would >exit the opposite side when such a low energy input is applied? I would >expect to see a random distribution. > >This effec

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

blaze spinnaker wrote: > Perhap's it is your overt negativity towards them? > The role of temporal order in causality negates that hypothesis. - Jed

Re: [Vo]:Rossi update

James Bowery wrote: With Rossi's secret in the hands not only of his US partner but a > competitor, it seems likely that development will not much longer be > constrained by Rossi's limitations. > Yes! I hope that is true. That has been the pattern of history. A gifted inventor or a brilliant sc

Re: [Vo]:new publication re LENR technology

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JoTX-ORq9_Y&feature=player_detailpage#t=746s On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 3:24 PM, James Bowery wrote: > The reason CF was not accepted is it was discovered in the academy of a > rural culture and the elites are, as usual, highly identified with the > centers of popula

Re: [Vo]:new publication re LENR technology

The reason CF was not accepted is it was discovered in the academy of a rural culture and the elites are, as usual, highly identified with the centers of population. This problem has only gotten worse since the Wrights. On Sat, Jun 29, 2013 at 2:58 PM, Peter Gluck wrote: > My dear Friends, > >

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

LENR is EASY to demonstrate to any educated person. The problem is not that a plausible demonstration is impossible because skepticism is too strong. The problem is simply ignorance of two kinds. Ignorance of one kind has been identified by Jed and many other people. This kind of ignorance

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

> > > > >> They seem open to that sort of thing as far as I can tell. >> > > No, they are not. Not open to me, anyway. > > I am not going to speculate about why or wherefore. > > - Jed > > Perhap's it is your overt negativity towards them? Professor Kim seemed confident they have a breakthrough.

Re: [Vo]:Rossi update

With Rossi's secret in the hands not only of his US partner but a competitor, it seems likely that development will not much longer be constrained by Rossi's limitations. On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 3:01 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote: > David Roberson wrote: > > Now you have me worried. I suspect that w

Re: [Vo]:Barns and Noble picked me up

> From: fznidar...@aol.com > Sent: Tuesday, July 9, 2013 7:47:22 PM > > I'm at Amazon, Barns and Noble, and working with the Sidney Kimmel > group on something. If that not good enough for you, what is? I didn't mean any disrespect to you. Just that on the same day B&N fired their CEO : not usua

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

wrote: Well, I think the issue is that a third party has not proposed coming in > and doing a black box test. > That is incorrect. > They seem open to that sort of thing as far as I can tell. > No, they are not. Not open to me, anyway. I am not going to speculate about why or wherefore. -

Re: [Vo]:Rossi update

David Roberson wrote: Now you have me worried. I suspect that what you say is true about the > talent required to perfect a design the first time, but the ECAT does not > appear to have many working parts. The first telegraph had many moving parts. Too many. It was too complicated. They jettis

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

It does not surprise me to hear about your lack of a positive reception by major corporations. I have witnessed similar things before and it appears to be a combination of fear and disbelief that slows these guys down. Fear is very real when someone gets behind a new concept that might fail.

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

Well, I think the issue is that a third party has not proposed coming in and doing a black box test. They seem open to that sort of thing as far as I can tell. They may also be concerned about being accused of being frauds. Perhaps the data they have is so unbelievable, they know they will be

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

DJ Cravens wrote: I had a working device on a board table of a major corp, (actually two > different companies) and had their technicians measure and verify and it > went nowhere - back in the CETI days. > Are you are talking about the CETI demonstration they showed in the hotel next to Disneyla

Re: [Vo]:Rossi update

Now you have me worried. I suspect that what you say is true about the talent required to perfect a design the first time, but the ECAT does not appear to have many working parts. Rossi seems like a good hands on type of engineer which is what we need to progress. He does not appear to become

RE: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

I do not want to reveal my formulation at this time. However, I would say that K and other things that can lower the energy of vacancy formation are useful. I prefer Li if I use an alkaline. I often reduce my metal after placed in C with Li Al hydride. I have tried to use Ni foam (http://mt

RE: [Vo]:Rossi update

exactly. That is why effort must be made in public acceptance not company acceptance. Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 14:55:38 -0400 Subject: Re: [Vo]:Rossi update From: jedrothw...@gmail.com To: vortex-l@eskimo.com David Roberson wrote: Jed, Rossi might still be working out the remaining bugs in

RE: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

Thanks, but I am not really trying to compete with DGT or Rossi. I am just doing it to see if it can be done, and to give my swansong farewell before I retire to my arm chair. That is enough for me. I tried the commercialization path and got burned. never again. I have published papers o

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

As strange as it may sound at first, your approach is similar to what DGT is doing. DGT uses Ni foam to protect their powder from the high heat of the spark as you are doing. DGT: “We then had to protect the modified Ni crystals from the high temperatures around the glow discharges (3500 K at its

Re: [Vo]:Rossi update

David Roberson wrote: Jed, Rossi might still be working out the remaining bugs in his design. > That is reason enough to keep his cards close. I expect he is. Based on the history of similar ground-breaking, radically new technology such as telegraphs, railroads, Diesel engines and aircraft, I

[Vo]:Puzzling phenomena: Gamma-ray pulse precedes lightning flash

Japanese team sees gamma-ray pulse before lightning flash http://physicsworld.com/cws/article/news/2013/jul/10/japanese-team-sees-gamma-ray-pulse-before-lightning-flash Also see the preprint by the same team: Hardening and termination of long-duration gamma rays detected prior to lightning http

Re: [Vo]:Rossi update

Jed, Rossi might still be working out the remaining bugs in his design. That is reason enough to keep his cards close. Dave -Original Message- From: Jed Rothwell To: vortex-l Sent: Wed, Jul 10, 2013 11:07 am Subject: Re: [Vo]:Rossi update I wrote: The company doing the Marti

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

Thanks for the clarification Dennis. I wish you luck at the NI booth and perhaps DGT will have something that trumps yours, but it appears that you are in the running. Dave -Original Message- From: DJ Cravens To: vortex-l Sent: Wed, Jul 10, 2013 10:42 am Subject: RE: [Vo]:DGT or E

RE: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

?? yes it produces sparks or arcs or discharge I am not sure of the technical variations. I am using a modified strobe light circuit. I cannot see into the "good" brass sphere. I do have a cut away mockup of the sphere (I will have that with my demo). The terminal ending moves among the v

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

Daniel Rocha wrote: Sign an NDA, visit them and stop complaining! > 1. They have not invited me. 2. I never sign NDAs. I do not want to hear any secrets. An NDA covering everything would defeat the whole purpose of the visit. When I go to a laboratory, my purpose is to learn the facts and to r

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

DJ Cravens wrote: > Not everything is intended for science. > This kind of presentation is only good for fluffy public relations. > I see no reason that Defkalion should be assumed to be required to > display the science behind their inventions. > No one is asking them to do that, least o

Re: [Vo]:Bockris memorial

I added this IE link to http://coldfusionnow.org/john-o-mara-bockris-1923-2013/ On 7/10/13 10:05 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: See: http://www.infinite-energy.com/images/pdfs/BockrisMemorial.pdf -- Ruby Carat r...@coldfusionnow.org Skype ruby-carat www.coldfusi

Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

*Yes, think of the plasma globe type lights. I have a central electrode (actually W rod held by a Cu tube). It is within a brass sphere holding my material. But the material is only "stuck" to the lower half on the wall. * ** *If this info is not closely held, does this electrode produce a spark

[Vo]:Bockris memorial

See: http://www.infinite-energy.com/images/pdfs/BockrisMemorial.pdf

Re: [Vo]:Rossi update

I wrote: > The company doing the Martin Fleischmann Memorial Project could handle > this. I'll bet they could do it as well as General Motors or Mitsubishi > could, in one-tenth the time. They do not have many employees. > When it comes time to crank out thousands of identical e-cats per month,

Re: [Vo]:Rossi update

Jones Beene wrote: > However, as you imply, Charlie is a definite long shot unless he is > emblematic of a new business strategy… but it is not out of the question > that Sutherland has build a few Ecats to provide process heat. > Where did you get the idea this person is involved? Just from th

RE: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

yes, if you want data - go there and take it. Dennis Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2013 11:34:19 -0300 Subject: Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe... From: danieldi...@gmail.com To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Sign an NDA, visit them and stop complaining! 2013/7/10 Jed Rothwell reaction is quite mastered

RE: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

Jed, Not everything is intended for science. I see no reason that Defkalion should be assumed to be required to display the science behind their inventions. I would love to know their data, their theoretical models, . but.. When was the last time you saw CocaCola list their ingredi

Re: [Vo]:Rossi update

I think I can see what Analog means. A 4 decade old company with a few people is the ideal target for 1 million$ scam. 2013/7/10 Jones Beene > Good question, Analog > -- Daniel Rocha - RJ danieldi...@gmail.com

RE: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process?

To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:DGT or ECAT? Same Process? From: dlrober...@aol.com Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2013 22:38:55 -0400 That is very interesting Dennis. If I understand you correctly, you solve the thermal run away problem by extracting heat fast enough to keep the thermal posit

RE: [Vo]:Rossi update

Good question, Analog LOL … Yes indeed, this soap supplier is clearly no NASA nor even BLP … and yes, it is true that this kind of post from me would usually be tongue-in-cheek & cynical… but in this case, do not forget that Rossi has less than 7 employees and Ampenergo which owns the US rights h

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

Sign an NDA, visit them and stop complaining! 2013/7/10 Jed Rothwell > reaction is quite mastered (about 20 to 30 minutes after start). . . . >> > What is it with the people who visit Defkalion?!? They don't have > wristwatches? They don't carry pens or a pad of paper?!? "About 20 to 30 > minut

RE: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

You are exactly right. DGT have presented ZERO data. Every detail is anecdotal and probably non-existent. Not only that – their reported progress depends on trusting a company which admittedly stole the underlying technology. According to their own CEO, Defkalion acquired their process by way

Re: [Vo]:Rossi update

Jones, are you seriously suggesting that Rossi's US manufacturing partner is ...a soap company with 7 employees?!? http://www.charliesoap.com/companyinfo.html I thought debunking and ridicule was forbidden on this list? From: Jones Beene To: vortex-l@eskimo.

Re: [Vo]:News about Defkalion Europe...

Frederic Gilardone is quoted: > Currently, the temperatures obtained are of the order of 600 ° C in the > secondary circuit through the use of appropriate thermal fluids. > The reactor can be activated and deactivated in a short period of time and > the reaction is quite mastered (about 20 to 30