Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons

2020-05-17 Thread geni
On Sun, 17 May 2020 at 05:12, Gnangarra  wrote:
> Personally I think WLE, WLM need bigger budgets all round with sponsors
> from retail outlets offering photography prizes and WMF & Affiliates
> offering the primary prize that lets people buy gear like cameras and lenses
>


The size of those contests means the average content has little chance
of winning. On top of that phones are in most cases good enough.
Attempts to throw money at the problem haven't been that effective.
Wikimedia UK has equipment for loan but use levels vary. Providing
tickets to things has some success but again rather mixed. Ultimately
you tend to run into the problem that wikipedia editing tends to be a
solo activity and most people don't want to deal with formal links to
organisations.

Geni

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons

2020-05-17 Thread geni
On Sun, 17 May 2020 at 08:33, Fæ  wrote:
> A "share" link on image pages would go a long way to fixing this. If
> folks on instagram, flickr etc. got used to seeing nice images with
> links back to Commons, we might expect 1% to 4% of those readers to
> follow the link back to the source, so if a few go viral, that might
> actually attract a few high quality photographers.


Pretty sure the most common license terms would breach the upload
conditions of one or both of those sites. The problem is that most
websites ask for a non exclusive license to whatever they want want
with an image without giving credit which pretty much limits you to PD
or MIT

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons

2020-05-17 Thread geni
On Sun, 17 May 2020 at 04:05, Benjamin Ikuta  wrote:
> Has there been, or should there be, any research into this, or why people 
> don't contribute more broadly?

Perhaps although similar research with regards to wikipedia has never
produced particularly useful results.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] ¿Qué te está haciendo feliz esta semana? / What's making you happy this week? (Week of 1 March 2020)

2020-03-03 Thread geni
On Mon, 2 Mar 2020 at 08:34, Pine W  wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
> * Preface *
>
> "What's making you happy this week

Smithsonian image release mostly

https://www.si.edu

So not only does it include a lot of interesting images (and less
interesting images of plants) but also 3D scans of things like the
apollo 11 command module. Which yes we now have a copy of:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Apollo_command_module_smithsonian_high_detail.stl


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Snøhetta and Wikimedia

2020-01-19 Thread geni
On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 at 00:50, Pine W  wrote:
>
> There are ways that Wikimedia rebranding consultations could be done
> collaboratively, politely, and with careful stewardship of donor's money.
> This is not one of them.

Eh questionable. The community is difficult to engage at the best of
times and tends to be reflexively conservative about such things. It
may well be that it is impossible to get any meaningful agreement on
rebranding.

> I think that it's time for some people in WMF to move on.

This kind of thing has happened from time to time despite significant
staff turnover over the years. Probably just a natural function of
certain organisations. All we can really do is try and limit the
damage.

>but I've had enough of poor coordination,

Unavoidable from time to time since there is too much going on for any
one person to keep track of.

>questionable financial decisions,

Again a function of size. It would frankly be concerning if every
editor agreed with every financial decisions. There is also the long
standing problem of balancing the risk of wasting money with the risk
of paralysis.




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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Movement Strategy: Draft recommendations are here!

2019-08-14 Thread geni
On Mon, 12 Aug 2019 at 21:34, Aron Manning  wrote:
.
> The draft already refers to 2 articles (1
> ,2
> )
> that explain the need for ND. I'll ask for further sources that show the
> benefits of NC and ND licensed materials.
>
> Aron

1 refers to images that are public domain in terms of copyright and
the latter is mostly talking about trademark or stuff so broad that
you couldn't usefuly copyright it in the first place. ND isn't a
useful protection in these cases (it might be of some use for current
individual artists but they can publish their work elsewhere).

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Introducing Wikimedia Space: A space for movement news and conversations

2019-06-26 Thread geni
On Tue, 25 Jun 2019 at 22:19, Yair Rand  wrote:
>
> I'm getting so many red flags.
>
> Established by WMF via secret (non-transparent) process, with no community
> involvement? Non-wiki environment, with the same scope as existing wikis?
> WMF-decided conduct policies? Every single moderator is a WMF employee?
> Forum using closed groups, with non-transparent communication?
> (Closed-source software, unless I'm mistaken?) So far outside Wikimedia
> spaces that the only place it was even _announced_ was an off-wiki mailing
> list?
>
> Is there something the Wikimedia Foundation would like to tell us?
>
> -- Yair Rand
>


While I agree that a good tracking mount, a reasonable telescope and
some CCDs would be a better use of the money (there are some
satellites I want pics of) I don't see anything particular nefarious
here. Improving communications is a long term goal and shifting away
from mediawiki appears on the face of it a good way to do that (we are
after all on a mailing list at the moment. In practice experience
suggests that most people are too busy doing what they are already
doing to get involved in such projects and that mediawiki is so
central to what we are do that most people are pretty comfortable with
it.


So this falls well within the WMF’s nominal goals and is a fairly
understandable approach. I still think we would be better off spending
the money on the kit needed to get a pic of Kosmos 482.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Fram en.wp office yearlock block

2019-06-15 Thread geni
On Fri, 14 Jun 2019 at 11:32, Todd Allen  wrote:
>
> The only case of "harassment" apparently cited here was "I kept writing
> garbage articles, and someone kept flagging them as garbage! Harassment!
> Bad!"
>

I think there is general agreement that such flagging could have been
handled better.


> If you don't want your articles to be flagged as garbage, FIND YOUR SOURCES
> PRIOR TO WRITING THEM, AND CITE THEM. That's rather a requirement anyway.

Ah questionable. If you look at Prod blp the standard is at least one
source. This is one of the reasons that DKY is such a flashpoint. Its
meant to be a fairly light weight thing for new editors but at the
same time it's often the first time people encounter more extensive
standards and at the same time the fact it appears on the main page
means that at least some people view it as rather important. On top of
that you have more experienced editors using as GA lite who struggle
to understand why other editors have such a hard time meeting what are
to them such miminal standards.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Fram en.wp office yearlock block

2019-06-15 Thread geni
And you are suggesting that the WMF are taking admin status into
account something I can't seem them agreeing with.

On Fri, 14 Jun 2019 at 11:37, David Gerard  wrote:
>
> and you're *seriously* positing that the WMF would ban an admin for
> doing only what you describe?
>


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Fram en.wp office yearlock block

2019-06-15 Thread geni
On Sat, 15 Jun 2019 at 00:04, David Gerard  wrote:
>
> If you really think Fram's framing of events here is even plausible,
>

What you are calling Fram's framing appears to be a the WMF's version
of events as told to fram. The WMF does look slightly better if you
remember that T arw trying to improve behaviour through threat of
blocks not file a diff heavy arbcom case.


 >let alone the story

Given that the other versions of "the story" are T's PR waffle or
conspiracy theories it understandable that people are going to go with
the option that at least gives them something to work from.




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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Bounties…

2019-01-25 Thread geni
On Fri, 25 Jan 2019 at 16:07, John Erling Blad  wrote:
>
> I was thinking about actually bounties, like in bug bounties from
> larger software vendors. We have some "bugs", like spellchecking,
> which is pretty easy to quantify, and that can be done as part of
> bounties with cash. Yes, the ugly word, paid editing! OMG!
>
> But quite frankly, why should we not? ¢1 per fixed single word typo
> that leads to one-less spelling error? Perhaps even $1 per
> spellchecked page? Delayed one week to see if anyone reverts the
> edits?
>

You've just created a financial incentive to include spelling errors.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] convert from BitCoin to FoldingCoin and other proofs of useful work

2018-11-02 Thread geni
On Thu, 1 Nov 2018 at 07:23, James Salsman  wrote:
>
> Geni, it's the "Day of the Dead" now so I want to attempt to resurrect
> this thread.
>
> Is FoldingCoin still vulnerable to a 51% attack? What is a 51% attack?

You've had 6 months to do this basic research.

> Do you think it is reasonable for the Foundation to convert bitcoin to
> FoldingCoin as part of its program to source clean electricity?

No. Cash is more efficient.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Vad gör dig lycklig den här veckan? / What's making you happy this week? (Week of 26 August 2018)

2018-08-30 Thread geni
On 29 August 2018 at 21:53, Pine W  wrote:
> What's making you happy this week? You are welcome to write in any language.



Great Dorset Steam Fair happened. 522 full size steam engines. 2008
classic commercial vehicles, 40 diesel heavy haulage, over 200
tractors, 20 odd classic plant,  120 stationary engines, 94 classic
cars and a lot of other stuff (motorbikes, bikes, classic dairy, steam
organs, steam fairground etc). I've got ~1600 to go through and start
adding to this year's commons category:


https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Great_Dorset_Steam_Fair_(2018)

The fair is still a great source of photos for wikipedia articles.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] New Wikimedia Foundation has soft launched!

2018-08-22 Thread geni
On 22 August 2018 at 09:24, Antoine Musso  wrote:

> So your concerns will be acknowledged once they make their way to
> Phabricator. You can login there with your wiki account.


This would be the site who's privacy policy says

>Because we believe that you shouldn’t have to provide personal information to 
>participate in the free knowledge movement, you may:

>Read, edit, or use any Wikimedia Site without registering an account.


Okey cheap but is does display at certian lack of attention on your part.

The problem is you are asking us to learn our way around yet another
bit of software in order to raise issues. Not just learning how to
submit but also how to navigate around to see what is going on. Sure
I'm tech savy and I can work it out if I need to (although I don't see
how to zoom into tickets from this page without subscribing to them
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/tag/wikimediafoundation.org/ ) but
its another barrier to entry, another bit of software I need to keep
track of.




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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimedia Foundation Inc. working with Go Fish Digital, a company that whitewashes Wikipedia

2018-07-27 Thread geni
On 23 July 2018 at 14:50, Gregory Varnum  wrote:
> Just a quick note that the Foundation will be replying to this soon. However 
> the people involved were participating in Wikimania and currently traveling - 
> so it may take us a few days to collect the information necessary for an 
> informed response. Thank you everyone for your patience.
>
> -greg
>

How much longer do you anticipate this taking?


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] International Commons Contest WLL Recruiting International Team

2018-06-25 Thread geni
On 25 June 2018 at 08:37, Rupika Sharma  wrote:
>  Hello friends,
>
> We are pleased to announce that *Wiki Loves Love* is recruiting volunteers
> for the international team.
> Application deadline: August 1, 2018
>
> *But What Is WLL?*
> Wiki Loves Love (WLL) is an international photography competition of
> Wikimedia Commons that is to take place — with the subject love
> testimonials — in various locale places. The primary goal of the
> competition is to collect photos of love testimonials through human
> cultural diversity such as monuments, ceremonies, snapshot of tender
> gesture, and miscellaneous objects used as symbol of love; to illustrate
> articles in the worldwide free encyclopedia Wikipedia, and other Wikimedia
> Foundation (WMF) projects.
>
> *Positions Open:*
> Communication and media
> Community liaison
> Community outreach
> Finance team
> Tech team: to design banners and templates
>
> Find out more on: https://t.co/D1yeNclTRm
> Don't forget to spread the word!
>
> Cheers!
> Rupika Sharma


To be blunt. Who are you? I can't find any links to user accounts or
existing chapters. Just a throwaway Gmail address and medium account.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] GDPR and Wikimedia content?

2018-05-29 Thread geni
On 28 May 2018 at 18:06, Todd Allen  wrote:
> I'm not even aware that we'd be subject to GPDR.

We are. Its really broad. We are dealing with the personal information
of people in the European union while engaging in economic activity.

> If we were going to
> allow it in any case that doesn't happen today, that would need to be
> agreed to by the community, in which case the best thing to do would be an
> on-wiki RfC.


RfCs don't pay €20 million fines. Its hard to get into specifics
without hitting [[WP:BEANS]] territory so for now wait and see is
probably the only viable option.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] GDPR and Wikimedia content?

2018-05-28 Thread geni
On 27 May 2018 at 22:32, David Gerard  wrote:
> I'm a big fan of the GDPR and why it had to be created. (I'm doing a lot of
> the bureaucratic work on the tech side at the day job and am getting very
> used to thinking of ways something could constitute Personally Identifying
> Information.)
>
> But I'm wondering how we'll approach it for the Wikimedia sites. Not just
> the log data - but the content.
>

Wave around article 85 a lot.

> We already have problems with Right To Be Forgotten, and well-cited content
> being removed from the search engines.
>
> What do we have in place to deal with this when - not if - we get GDPR
> requests to remove information about a person from the site?

Wave around article 85 a lot. The content is a fairly minor problem.
Trying to cleanup after users who've inserted their personal
information into talk pages presents more of an issue.


> I don't mean just the letter of the law, in the EU or the US - I mean also,
> how we can handle this *right*. Because there are multiple competing
> legitimate interests here, and the editing communities tend to take a lot
> more care than they're strictly required to by law, because we are here to
> get things right. (This is why our DMCA numbers are ridiculously low for a
> top 10 site, for example.)

At the moment all we can really do is wait and see how it develops.
This is why you have sites trying to block the EU even if they are not
aware of any issues. 4% of turnover and no caselaw?

I'm not seeing a rush at OTRS yet but that is probably going to be
ground zero on working out what to do with this stuff.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Nini kinakufanya uwe na furaha wiki hii? / What's making you happy this week? (Week of 13 May 2018)

2018-05-14 Thread geni
On 13 May 2018 at 01:31, Pine W <wiki.p...@gmail.com> wrote:
> What's making you happy this week?

The Gaia data release 2 data is out. Gaia being an ESA spacecraft that
is measuring the the position of about a billion stars:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaia_(spacecraft)

The most straightforward application is you can chuck pretty much any
star in the milky way that we have an article on into the search
function at:

http://gea.esac.esa.int/archive/

And get an accurate distance to it. For example wikipedia says WR 25
is about 7500 lightyears away. Once you've converted through from
milli arcseconds (mas) Gaia says 68500 (divide by a 1000 then divide 1
by that number to get the parsecs distance then multiply by 3.26 to
get lightyears).

Beyond stars the improved Cepheid variable measurements will allow us
to update the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nearest_galaxies
article with better data and hopefully get a new study on what is an
isn't in the local group (most of the sources I'm finding for that are
from around 2000 and things have moved on).






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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Does anyone know what wikimedia france are up to with the Request Network ?

2018-04-27 Thread geni
On 27 April 2018 at 16:42, Romaine Wiki  wrote:
> It can be interesting to use blockchain technology in our movement for
> transparency purposes.
>
> Romaine


Not really. At best you end up with a less efficient version of a
downloadable database. People claiming that "blockchain technology" is
useful for things are either cyptocurrency advocates (with the usual
conflicts of interest) or third parties trying to be nice to them.

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[Wikimedia-l] Does anyone know what wikimedia france are up to with the Request Network ?

2018-04-27 Thread geni
According to their twitter feed they have announced a partnership with
something called the "Request Network‏" for cryptocurrency donations.
Also this article here

https://www.wikimedia.fr/2018/04/27/wikimedia-france-annonce-partenariat-fondation-request-network-accepter-donations-crypto-monnaies/

Ok. I don't approve but I'm not french so not its not an area where I
can reasonably expect anyone to pay any attention to my opinions.

What concerns me is that they have retweeted something claiming the
partnership is with the wikimedia foundation rather than just
wikimedia france:

https://twitter.com/wikimedia_fr?lang=en

Is some form of clarification possible?

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Amazon Echo' use of Wikipedia; CC license compliance?

2018-04-18 Thread geni
On 16 April 2018 at 06:23, Rob Speer <r...@luminoso.com> wrote:
> Right, this worries me too.
>
> I know that Wikimedia doesn't enforce the copyright on the content
> themselves, because they don't hold the relevant copyrights, the authors
> do. But there seems to be no guidance for what _anyone_ can do to address
> and correct large-scale violations.


Because is you know enough about copyright law to be able to do
anything you can already answer that question.

So here goes:

*1 be reasonably wealthy or otherwise have access to significant
amounts of money for legal costs

*2 Be American. While you can sue for copyright infringement from
overseas it greatly complicates matter

*3 Be prepared to use your real name.

*4 Make sure you have registered your work with the U.S. Copyright
Office. Not strictly required but it makes things more straightforward
and allows you to go for statutory damages

*5 Chose a case where you are pretty much the sole author of the
article or image in question.

Got all those ducks in a row? The good news is that most smaller
companies will settle at the first threatening letter although you may
suffer a certain amount of reputational damage from suing small
businesses. If a small company decides to fight and its a fairly
straightforward case you are looking at costs of over $100K. More
complicated case against a big company? Millions.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikidata] Knowledge Integrity: A proposed Wikimedia Foundation cross-departmental program for 2018-2019

2018-04-17 Thread geni
On 17 April 2018 at 09:39, David Cuenca Tudela <dacu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Additionally I think it would be interesting to have some research done on
> which references are DISPLAYED or CLICKED the most on several Wikipedias.
> We know already which sources are cited the most, but on which sources do
> users hover their mouse the most? Can we also identify which statements are
> involved?

Absolutely not. Leave that kind of spying to advertising companies and
three letter agencies. We have standards.



> Finally I believe it would be that a tool to assess the
> openness

Look for https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Open_access


>/accessibility of the sources of any given article could be really
> interesting.



Would turn into an argument over definitions. For example is the
Mabinogion accessible? Public domain, copies can be found on various
websites but I don't speak welsh. Limiting it to English gets to the
next problem. Is this accessible:

https://www.aanda.org/articles/aa/full_html/2014/11/aa21621-13/aa21621-13.html

Its in English but I don't have a degree in physics.

Where there are more obvious limits it gets more complicated. You may
be tempted to lump all paywalls together is it really fair to lump
something that costs €1 for total access in with something that
charges $40 for one article. Does the currency it charges in make a
difference?

Books too have their fun aspects. Try automating judging the relative
accessibility of Birmingham's Electric Dustcarts and 7000 years of
jewelry.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] convert from BitCoin to FoldingCoin and other proofs of useful work

2018-04-12 Thread geni
On 12 April 2018 at 14:50, James Salsman <jsals...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Only works if most people aren't trying to scam you
>
> What else works that way?
>

Thing where most people don't have money on the line. Its
Cryptocurrency. If your first thought isn't "how could a scammer
exploit this" you are doing it wrong.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] convert from BitCoin to FoldingCoin and other proofs of useful work

2018-04-11 Thread geni
On 11 April 2018 at 22:37, James Salsman <jsals...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Proof is stochastic, by random audit of submitted results, as I
> understand the situation.

Only works if most people aren't trying to scam you. Which if you've
had any experience with concurrency you will realise is not the case.

Oh and since the thing is GPU mined and not very popular there are a
bunch of people who could carry out a 51% attack tomorrow.

> In regard to the earlier responses, I the Foundation should offer to
> convert Bitcoin to FoldingCoin for those who wish to contribute
> Bitcoin.

But the foundation wants actual money (US$ mostly). Why convert
bitcoin into anything other than cash (which is what it does at the
moment)?


geni

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] convert from BitCoin to FoldingCoin and other proofs of useful work

2018-04-11 Thread geni
On 10 April 2018 at 22:45, James Salsman <jsals...@gmail.com> wrote:
> The Foundation has been accepting BitCoin donations. Unfortunately,
> BitCoin is very wasteful in terms of electricity, and is therefore a
> dirty cryptocurrency.

They all are. The only difference is that bitcoin is Asic mined so
doesn't directly drive up the price of graphics cards.

> I recommend that the Foundation immediately cease accepting BitCoin,
> and require donors who wish to donate in cryptocurrency to convert to
> FoldingCoin instead. Please see: FoldingCoin (FLDC)


FoldingCoin is the one where you give fake results to Folding@home
(since the maths is NP hard there is no real time way to check if your
results are real or not) in return for tokens that have little in the
way of actual value.


> This conversion will place the Foundation at the forefront of
> cryptocurrency technology,


The forefront of cryptocurrency technology is coming up with new and
exciting ways to scam people. The Foundation should not be getting
involved.


> As other cryptocurrencies based on proofs of useful work
> instead of useless work emerge,

Is gaming a Proof-of-Research useful? Because if so Gridcoin exist. In
theory burstcoin could be used to provide archival storage although
there are a bunch of ways of doing that without driving up hard disc
prices.


> the Foundation should consider those.
> FoldingCoin is based on proofs of useful prediction of protein
> folding,

No it isn't. The problem is it is based off the old folding@home which
works on the basis that most people aren't trying to scam the system.
If FoldingCoin ever became popular that would no longer be the case at
which point it becomes proof of results given to results to
Folding@home with no requirement that those results be real.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] What's making you happy this week? (Week of 4 February 2018)

2018-02-03 Thread geni
On 4 February 2018 at 06:13, Pine W <wiki.p...@gmail.com> wrote:
> What's making you happy this week?
>


I discovered we got an article on a ridiculously obscure media format
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HiPac ) due to a techmoan episode:

https://youtu.be/Q_9IBIcsYj4?t=996

Now we just need a photo of the thing.

Meanwhile Norwich continues to be Norwich:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti_urination_devices_in_Norwich


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Fwd: [Publicpolicy] Update on FISA 702 reauthorization

2018-01-21 Thread geni
On 21 January 2018 at 12:56, James Salsman <jsals...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Do you think merely avoiding the most mass-produced and arguably
> widest backdoor is a step in the right direction?

Security though obscurity against state level actors? That is not
going to work. And yes I know you seem to think that exploits are
deliberate back-doors but that position requires an alarming degree of
faith in the competence of the average programmer.


> That they need not risk losing their prized exploit capabilities
> because they can't use them against open source hardware
> makes us safer or less safe than if they could use them but
> we spent less money?

Open source hardware is going to have exploits. From the POV of a
state level actor burning those exploits is cheap since pretty much no
one uses open source hardware. Thus the risk associated with
compromising someone using open source hardware is pretty low. For
someone using something more mainstream the risk is rather higher.
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Fwd: [Publicpolicy] Update on FISA 702 reauthorization

2018-01-20 Thread geni
On 20 January 2018 at 22:43, James Salsman <jsals...@gmail.com> wrote:
> The NSA surveillance which was reauthorized by Congress can not depend
> on eavesdropping alone with new HTTPS cyphers. It needs compromised
> hardware to work,


Meltdown suggests otherwise. In any case EternalBlue and Stuxnet made
it clear that the hardware is irrelevant.

The reality is that the WMF doesn't have the resources to prevent a
state level actor from gaining access to its servers. Switching to
little used, little supported and more expensive hardware simply
weakens the WMF position even further since attackers no longer have
to factor in the risk of burning a valuable exploit. So not much
changed since 2013.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] What's making you happy this week? (Week of 14 January 2018)

2018-01-15 Thread geni
On 14 January 2018 at 19:05, Pine W <wiki.p...@gmail.com> wrote:
> What's making you happy this week?


We appear to have buried the hatchet with Jason Scott

https://livestream.com/internetsociety/wikidaynyc/videos/168540333

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] A fundraising banner we'd like to try in a short test

2017-11-16 Thread geni
On 14 November 2017 at 22:12, Samuel Patton <spat...@wikimedia.org> wrote:
> If you have thoughts on this design, please share them here. There will be
> more opportunities for you to weigh in if this banner variant looks
> promising enough to keep testing.
>
> Regards and sincere thanks for all you do.
>


Covers up half the periodic table on:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Periodic_table?banner=dsk_p1_lg_right10=US=1

In fact lets just face it this thing does not like tables:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canon_EF_400mm_lens?banner=dsk_p1_lg_right10=US=1

It overlaps longer equations (see around the Efficient methods section):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Approximations_of_%CF%80?banner=dsk_p1_lg_right10=US=1

I suspect it also breaks with lilypond but I don't have an example to hand




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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Copyfraud by the British Museum

2017-07-28 Thread geni
On 28 July 2017 at 21:36, Fæ <fae...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Nobody believes that claiming copyright on 2,000 year old works


And this is where your failure to understand English and Welsh law and
the history of artifact handling become a problem.

Your mistake is in assuming the only work here is from the 2000 year
old sculptor and bronze worker. This is of course not the case. The
reality is both items will have been subject to a certain degree of
cleaning and "restoration" (you don't give British museum catalogue
numbers so I can't look up exactly what). This is pretty common for
any ah "headline" item that didn't go straight from the dig to a
museum. Victorian collectors wanted complete statues for their
collection and even today things can get a lot of work done to them
(the Crosby Garrett Helmet for example).

The Roman statue presumably entered the UK pre-1972 (if it didn't we
have bigger concerns than copyright) which means there is a good
chance it is from the imaginative restoration era. Has the restorer
been dead for 70 years? I don't know and I don't think you do.

The jug won't have come out of the ground looking like that. Has
enough work been done to qualify for copyright or is it old enough for
life+70 to have expired? I don't know. Do you?


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Copyright enforcement?

2017-06-05 Thread geni
On 5 June 2017 at 18:32, The Cunctator <cuncta...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Both Google and Graphiq are using pretty much the entire Wikipedia corpus
> for their results.


However due to the way their output is structured it falls under "you
can't copyright facts".


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Naive questions: what could do the movement with 1B dollars/euros?

2017-05-17 Thread geni
On 17 May 2017 at 18:08, David Cuenca Tudela <dacu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Are there any activities that could have a meaningful impact if we ask
> donors for such amount of seed money? Are there reasons to do so?


Space program. A billion should get you a couple of dawn clones and if
you focus on flybys rather than orbits you can visit a bunch of
asteroids.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Fwd: [PRESS] Turkish authorities block Wikipedia

2017-04-30 Thread geni
On 29 April 2017 at 22:11, Juliet Barbara <jbarb...@wikimedia.org> wrote:
> Thank you, everyone, for your messages regarding the situation in Turkey.
> As you can imagine, this has been a very busy time for the Wikimedia
> Foundation's Legal, Communications, Technical Operations, and Community
> Engagement departments, and we apologize for not being able to respond to
> Wikimedia-l sooner.
>
>
> We are planning to publish a statement on the Wikimedia blog soon. In the
> meantime, we have been handling media and other inquiries with the
> following short statement, which we shared with the Communications
> Committee (ComCom) earlier this morning:
>
>
> "The Wikimedia Foundation has learned that access to Wikipedia has been
> blocked in Turkey as of Saturday, April 29th. Wikipedia is a rich and
> valuable source of neutral, reliable information in hundreds of languages,
> written by volunteers around the world. We are committed to ensuring that
> Wikipedia remains available to the millions of people who rely on it in
> Turkey. To that end, we are actively working with outside counsel to seek
> judicial review of the decision affecting access to Wikipedia. We hope the
> issue can be resolved promptly."
>
>
> We will continue to do our best to monitor this discussion, but I ask for
> your patience as we are managing inquiries coming in from multiple places.
>
>
> If you are receiving media inquiries about this, please contact
> pr...@wikimedia.org and we will be able to assist you. At this point, we
> believe that the most valuable point Wikimedians can make on behalf of
> Wikipedia is explaining its value as an educational resource.
>
>
> Thank you!
>
> Juliet
>


FWIW the two articles the Turkish state is apparently complaining about are:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State-sponsored_terrorism#Turkey

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_involvement_in_the_Syrian_Civil_War#Turkey


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikipedia, right, but on the blockchain

2017-04-25 Thread geni
On 26 April 2017 at 00:06, David Gerard <dger...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Advertising-funded Wikipedia that micropays participants from
> advertising revenue, on the Ethereum blockchain! The important bit is
> to give them startup money.
>
> "Lunyr: Decentralized Wikipedia on the blockchain"
> https://medium.com/@cryptojudgement/lunyr-decentralized-wikipedia-on-the-blockchain-4072606d5fc5
>
> I have a number of thoughts on this, all negative:
> https://davidgerard.co.uk/notes/2017/04/25/wikipedia-right-but-on-the-blockchain/
>
> Jimbo wasn't impressed either:
> https://twitter.com/jimmy_wales/status/856060215577464833
>
>
> - d.
>


Hmm they are taking their user interface from here:

https://www.behance.net/gallery/16219877/Wikipedia-Redesign-Concept


Which was the one that happened to be the target of the critique here

http://jgthms.com/wikipedia-redesign.html


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] What's making you happy this week? (Week of 2 April 2017)

2017-04-04 Thread geni
On 4 April 2017 at 07:28, Pine W <wiki.p...@gmail.com> wrote:
> What's making you happy this week?
>


Turned out that buried in my images from an editathon at Birmingham
Museum Collection Centre in 2015 there was an image of a pair of
inflated caterpillars.

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:A_pair_of_inflated_caterpillars.JPG


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Help! Can't save on any Wikipedia

2017-02-22 Thread geni
On 22 February 2017 at 12:06, Enock Seth Nyamador <kwadzo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Am good now :). Thanks all.
>
> Best,
>
> - Enock
>

this is one of the reasons I keep a secondary browser for wikipedia
stuff only. I'd recommend seamonkey
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SeaMonkey or Vivaldi
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vivaldi_(web_browser)


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Should the Foundation take a position on a general strike?

2017-01-29 Thread geni
On 29 January 2017 at 17:58, Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijs...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hoi,
> Our movement is impacted by the new ukaze that prevents many of our staff
> going home for a holiday or see their family and it prevents many members
> of our movement to visit the office of the WMF. So it does have a serious
> and negative impact on our efforts.

Do does the WMF actually have any staff from the countries affected?



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Should the Foundation take a position on a general strike?

2017-01-29 Thread geni
On 29 January 2017 at 18:11, James Salsman <jsals...@gmail.com> wrote:
> The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and the Director of National
> Intelligence have just been replaced on the National Security Council,
> by Steve Bannon, the editor of Breitbart News who has a long history
> of promoting white nationalist positions and centralized censorship of
> the internet:
>
> http://www.businessinsider.com/trump-attacks-plan-transfer-oversight-icann-from-us-wrong-censorship-2016-9


Yes we know. You want to talk politics? Fine lets talk politics. The
US right already tends to view us as rather left leaning. Cementing
that impression gains us a bunch of enemies and nothing else. A strike
by the WMF isn't going to impact them very much. You want a effective
general strike? Go talk to the power station workers and the
Electrical grid people not the WMF.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Should the Foundation take a position on a general strike?

2017-01-29 Thread geni
On 29 January 2017 at 15:01, James Salsman <jsals...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Should the Foundation take a position on a general strike?
>

No. This is very much a case where the foundation sits and waits.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Keeping historical documents related to Wikimedia

2017-01-14 Thread geni
On 12 January 2017 at 22:20, Rogol Domedonfors <domedonf...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Fæ, Surely no grant-giving body would even talk to the Foundation if it
> could not show them a plan for the medium to long term.

Umm are we looking at a different set of grant funded projects here
because I've seen quite a few burn out over far shorter periods.

In any case for online stuff we still live in a world where 5 years is
long term and the foundation would have to quite spectacularly screw
up not to last that long. Beyond that they can point to the licenses
and database dumps. The software is open source the content is under a
free license. Even if Wikipedia isn't around the software and content
will be. Degrees of survival out to 10 years are fairly easy to
guarantee without special planning. Beyond that things always get a
bit speculative and long nowish.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Music industry threats to safe harbor?

2016-12-19 Thread geni
On 19 December 2016 at 18:38, Vi to <vituzzu.w...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I wouldn't call DMCA safe harbor(s) "how Wikipedia is allowed to exist". At
> a glance I'd say it would (at worst) impact on some (most) wikis way to
> handle copyvios/the thin red line around fair-use, but most of our
> ecosystem shouldn't be affected. So, what am I missing?
>

Without some form of safe harbor the likes of AP and getty would have
a fairly solid case for statutory damages for every single one of
their images uploaded even if we deleted them fairly quickly. We could
probably argue it down to $200 per image but it would still add up.

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[Wikimedia-l] Are inline donor banners something we view as acceptable?

2016-12-01 Thread geni
Screenshot of what I mean:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Inline_donor_bannerbass.png

Inline ads are generally considered to be something that gets into
scummy advertising territory (for example even adblock plus's rather
questionable Acceptable Ad policy doesn't accept them).


On a related note the FAQ appears to be out of date:

https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/FAQ/en

Unless we are still in the 2015-2016 fiscal year.

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[Wikimedia-l] We appear have been partially blocked in France (probably accidentally)

2016-10-17 Thread geni
Apparently on the orders of the french government orange added us to
their blocked terrorist sites list. This did apparently have the fun
effect of  DOS the government page people were redirected to, Source
(among others):

http://www.lemonde.fr/pixels/article/2016/10/17/une-erreur-bloque-l-acces-a-google-pour-les-clients-d-orange_5014900_4408996.html



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] A new Wikipedia fork: InfoGalactic

2016-10-10 Thread geni
S

On 10 October 2016 at 19:13, David Gerard <dger...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "INFOGALACTIC: an online encyclopedia without bias or thought police"
>
> Home page: http://infogalactic.com/info/Main_Page
> Announcement: 
> http://voxday.blogspot.com/2016/10/project-big-fork-infogalactic.html
> Roadmap: http://infogalactic.com/info/Infogalactic:Roadmap
>
>
> - d.

So the neoreactionaries have their wiki just like the more traditional
far right have Metapedia.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] New functionality: cross-wiki search results

2016-09-07 Thread geni
On 7 September 2016 at 18:51, Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijs...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hoi,
> It is a pity because Wikidata has so much more to offer in missing
> information in any language.

Fixed the citation issue yet?


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Why are articles being deleted?

2016-06-25 Thread geni
On 25 June 2016 at 13:14, Vi to <vituzzu.w...@gmail.com> wrote:
> As a deletion I'd say we totally lost at en.wiki, we can maybe tie on other
> wikis.
>

As so many projects have learned so painfully in the last decade the
English Wikipedia knows what they are doing.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia Announcements] Wikimedia Foundation Form 990 for FY 2014-2015 now on-wiki

2016-06-07 Thread geni
On 5 June 2016 at 02:28, Liam Wyatt <liamwy...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Not to put too fine a point on it... But are you saying that Sue remained
> the most highly paid contractor to the WMF, and at a significantly higher
> rate than when she was the actual ED, until FIVE DAYS ago? That is, well
> beyond any 'transition period' (and in fact longer than the employment of
> the person who replaced her)?


Its now been a full working day. Can we have a clarification on this point?

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Disrupting journal publishing

2016-05-10 Thread geni
On 8 May 2016 at 23:28, James Heilman <jmh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Basically the DOAJ search function is not returning accurate information.
> James
>


Well the good news is that they've just deleted 3.3K journals to try
and improve on that:

https://doajournals.wordpress.com/2016/05/09/doaj-to-remove-approximately-3300-journals/

Now if we can just find a way to get stuff accurately listed by
language it will be a lot more usable.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Account of the events leading to James Heilman's removal

2016-05-10 Thread geni
On 10 May 2016 at 15:35, The Cunctator <cuncta...@gmail.com> wrote:
> One very serious element of this decision-making really should be the fact
> that Google is blatantly violating the CCA-SA by reusing Wikipedia content
> without making their derivative work open.
>
>
>- *Share Alike*—If you alter, transform, or build upon this work, you
>may distribute the resulting work only under the same, similar or a
>compatible license.
>

They would argue that they are using the facts not the presentation of
those facts and facts are not subject to copyright.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Disrupting journal publishing

2016-05-08 Thread geni
On 8 May 2016 at 22:56, James Heilman <jmh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> @ Andrew per "The majority of OA journals do not charge publication fees"
> Which ones are you thinking of?
>


DOAJ lists 10294 without article processing charges and 1355 with.
Taking the far more limited DOAJ seal stuff (BTW if we really want
something to throw money at funding DOAJ to employ someone to exclude
more junk from their database would be useful). We get 173 with and
199 without.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Disrupting journal publishing

2016-05-08 Thread geni
On 8 May 2016 at 21:51, James Heilman <jmh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Yes there are more than 10,000 open access journals. Ours are different in
> that we do not charge the authors fees for publication. I am not sure of
> another OA journal like this.


DOAJ lists 10,294 (including one I've actually cited the Journal of
Lithic Studies)



geni

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Disrupting journal publishing

2016-05-08 Thread geni
On 5 May 2016 at 19:17, Chris Sherlock <chris.sherloc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> If a free online business model can figure out how to fund copy-editing and 
>> automatic standards enforcement (for example, people make awful bibtex 
>> entries, including Springer's auto-generation system), and a university 
>> institution willing to host the journal's archives, the entire utility of a 
>> publisher disappears
>
> https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11637251 
> <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11637251>
>
> In all seriousness, what would stop the WMF from attempting to setup journals?
>

The Directory of Open Access Journals currently lists 11,649
journals[1]. While some of those are junk[2] the world is currently in
no way short of open access journals.

The only way a wikimedia backed open access journal would make sense
is if either we aimed for a really high quality journal (probably by
throwing money at the problem) or a journal that targets areas that
wikipedians have identified as being hard to find citations (and this
month's edition of citation needed features a number of papers on the
initial sales price of games consoles and vessels used in local ferry
services)

[1]https://doaj.org/
[2]https://doaj.org/article/ebed893bfc3748d58695b2851c8270e9


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Fwd: Wikimedia Foundation ED search steering group created

2016-04-19 Thread geni
On 20 April 2016 at 00:05, Pine W <wiki.p...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Ironholds, I think that you're taking a negative interpretation. It seems
> to me that any ED candidate is going to want to know what they're getting
> into before agreeing to take the job, and if forks are on the horizon

They aren't. Its an incredibly bad idea to the point where people of
significance aren't even going to bother engaging with it.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikipedia Zero mass effect on Wikimedia projects

2016-04-15 Thread geni
On 27 March 2016 at 23:00, David Emrany <david.emr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> You are imposing "modern" 1st world standards on these poor people.
> Many I remind you to remember how many 1st world Commons bureaucrats
> and admins were doing something similar / identical [1] only a few
> years ago at Commons.Do we collectively recall how many years.it took
> to ban them and delete their files ?
>


Actually illegal stuff is vaporised as soon as it is found. Images
adult depicting nudity are not per se illegal are where they are
freely licensed and withing project scope they have not been deleted
and remain to this day. By the same token films under a free license
such as Tears of Steel are also not going to be removed from commons.

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Tears_of_Steel_in_4k_-_Official_Blender_Foundation_release.webm

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikipedia.org portal page update!

2016-03-11 Thread geni
On 11 March 2016 at 18:18, Deborah Tankersley <dtankers...@wikimedia.org> wrote:
> We're interested in hearing your feedback or if you have any questions! (Note
> 2: My apologies for not getting this email out yesterday, but I had had
> issues with size limitations of my screenshots.)
>
> On behalf of the very happy Wikipedia.org Portal Team,
>
> Deb


The image thumbnail thing fails to filter our fair use images along
with the usual lack of author and licensing information.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] “Reliable”, “Notable”, and “Encyclopaedic” Sources for Automated Solvers for FreeCell

2016-03-10 Thread geni
On 10 March 2016 at 12:22, Shlomi Fish <shlo...@shlomifish.org> wrote:
> Hello Peter,
>
> On Tue, 8 Mar 2016 17:36:02 +0200
> "Peter Southwood" <peter.southw...@telkomsa.net> wrote:
>
>> If you get it published off Wikipedia then it becomes a reference and someone
>> else can mention it on Wikipedia
>
> Published where , how, why, what, and when? What forms of publishing are
> acceptable for using as a Wikipedia reference?
>
> Regards,
>
> Shlomi Fish
>

Anything that meets the requirements of:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Identifying_reliable_sources

In your case you would be looking at peer reviewed journals, retro
game magazines or perhaps someone publishing a book through a
reputable publisher on microsoft's games.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia Announcements] Executive transition planning

2016-03-05 Thread geni
On 5 March 2016 at 03:21, Brion Vibber <bvib...@wikimedia.org> wrote:
> There's less weakness in admitting a failure honestly, retreating and
> regrouping, than in powering through when knowing oneself unprepared.


Fallacy of the excluded middle.

In any case that doesn't change the fundamental problem. The only
formal mechanism the wider community of editors has to control the
activities of the foundation is via the nominal community seats on the
board. Things in that respect are pretty bad. We've lost our
apparently most effective member and the replacement is currently
doing pet rock impressions.

In more recent times the only practical level of control the board has
exercised is appointing the ED. If they are given that up the wider
community no longer has any formal mechanisms of control left.

While that may not be the intent of the WMF employees it is where we are.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimedia Armenia candidate for the board

2016-03-02 Thread geni
On 2 March 2016 at 19:58, Andreas Kolbe  wrote:
> Western countries don't really have a tradition of state-published
> encyclopedias,

Wales is not a western country?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Encyclopaedia_of_Wales


> If we had the US Secretary of Defense
> writing Wikipedia articles about the US Army,

Who exactly do you think writes our articles about US military subjects?

> or had employees of the
> German government running Wikimedia Deutschland,


Both of User:Juergen.friedrich's employers are public universities.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Post mortems (second attempt)

2016-02-21 Thread geni
On 22 February 2016 at 01:06, Pete Forsyth <petefors...@gmail.com> wrote:

> The discussion about post-mortems arose rather organically, not as a result
> of a decision to use a certain medium. The participants were: Jonathan
> Cardy, Erik Möller, Dariusz Jemielniak, myself, Ben Creasy, Asaf Bartov,
> Jon Beasley-Murray, Bence Damakos, Luis Villa, Eddie Erhart, Liam Wyatt,
> and Tisza Gergő. I think it is fair to say that we had a general consensus
> that:
>
> When something does not go well (for instance, various software releases),
> it would be highly valuable for the Wikimedia Foundation's senior
> leadership to prioritize creating a thoughtful and official post-mortem
> document and discussion.
>

So they want there to be even more incentives for the foundation never to
admit failure?


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] US Copyright Law Forces Wikimedia to remove Public Domain Anne Frank Diary

2016-02-16 Thread geni
On 16 February 2016 at 14:43, Michael Maggs <mich...@maggs.name> wrote:

> It's worth noting, if only to increase awareness of the excessive length
> (95 years) of some US copyright terms.
>


Thats hardly a US only thing though. The Leni Riefenstahl (yes that one)
film The Blue Light will have a 141 year copyright term.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Elsevier?

2016-02-15 Thread geni
On 15 February 2016 at 16:07, Pete Forsyth <petefors...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Teemu,
> These "partnerships" (which I think is an unfortunate word for them) are
> about giving volunteers access to closed sources.
>
> Apart from brand affiliation, what do you see as a potential benefit from
> partnering with PLoS?
> Pete
> [[User:Peteforsyth]]


Probably none. DOAJ on the other hand. I'm less convinced of DOAJ's
financial soundness and its loss would be unfortunate. I've lost track of
the current PR line over whatever we are currently calling the knowledge
engine but if they are still going for the searching for reliable
information line DOAJ would be an obvious place to deploy it (well mostly.
This got into their database some how
https://doaj.org/article/ebed893bfc3748d58695b2851c8270e9 ).



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Message from Arnnon Geshuri to the Wikimedia Community

2016-01-27 Thread geni
On 26 January 2016 at 19:07, Arnnon Geshuri <agesh...@wikimedia.org> wrote:

> Regarding the concerns that have been raised, I have listened closely.
> That said, in my opinion, there are some misconceptions and there are
> mitigating considerations.  As a general matter, I will say that,
> throughout my career, I have been charged with enforcing company policies
> as part of my role as a people manager. I have tried to do so thoughtfully
> and consistently.  I have done so realizing company policies and practices
> evolve over time as circumstances change.
>
>
>
> As part of the current narrative, members of the community generated a
> running theme within the online conversations related to trust.  Comments
> were expressed questioning their trust in the Wikimedia Foundation Board
> and asking if the community could accept me as a new Board Member.  Wanting
> to understand the challenges ahead, I have spent the last few weeks
> speaking with current and former Board members and reaching out to folks in
> the community.  I have more conversations in the coming days and appreciate
> those who have been generous with their time.  Given the story line that
> has been shaped over the last couple weeks and based on the feedback from
> my conversations, I know I have a longer journey than most new Board
> members to prove to the community and WMF alumni that they can put their
> trust in me.


Nice polished PR spiel. A bit too polished in my view since it reduces the
chance of people empathizing with you but hey I understand that you have to
keep the lawyers happy. Of course that's part of the reason why its
unreasonable to expect wikipedians to deal with you let alone trust you.



>   I joined to make a positive difference and be a part of the
> important effort to grow the WMF for the next generation of editors,
> contributors, and users.
>

Hmm? The WMF appears to have already hit its fundraising limit. At this
point further growth isn't really on the list of things we want.





> As the community gets to know me, folks will see the way I work is with
> thoughtfulness, transparency, diversity, and a focus on doing what is
> right.


You've already said that the way you work is doing what your bosses tell
you and we know that wasn't right:

"I have been charged with enforcing company policies
as part of my role as a people manager. I have tried to do so thoughtfully
and consistently."



>   I have key experiences in both my professional and non-profit
> careers which lend a distinctive perspective to the honorable work of a
> Trustee – especially the learnings gained over the last decade.


Decade? You weren't caught until 2010. That isn't a decade ago.


>  And as we all become closer and transition to debating the
> issues and not the people, the community will see I consistently speak from
> the heart,


People who speak from the heart doesn't speak in highly polished legally
cleared PR statements. They speak like RMS or Jason Scott which is one of
the things that make them annoying.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Endowment Update

2016-01-14 Thread geni
On 14 January 2016 at 18:41, Lisa Gruwell <lgruw...@wikimedia.org> wrote:

>
>
>The Wikimedia Endowment has been established as a Collective Action Fund
>at Tides Foundation <https://www.tides.org/> as a permanent,
>income-generating fund to support the Wikimedia projects. Tides has
> over 40
>years of experience administering funds for nonprofits and helping to
>launch such efforts.  They often serve as fiscal sponsors for
> organizations
>when they are first starting out and will be providing administrative
>support to the Wikimedia Endowment.  The endowment will be independent
> from
>WMF but an Advisory Board, nominated by the WMF and appointed by Tides,
>will make recommendations to Tides related to the endowment.  We have
> the
>option in the future to transfer the endowment out of Tides to the WMF
> or
>to a new charitable entity. The endowment will continue to be a
> permanent,
>income-generating fund to support the Wikimedia projects under any
> entity.
>For now, we feel Tides is a great, cost effective place to start and we
>will look at other options when the endowment reaches critical mass.
>
>


Heh I remember those guys. Their fees were one of the costs that caused
Citizendium so much trouble (not that Citizendium didn't have a bunch of
other issues). Ah 2007. Fun times.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Fwd: Introducing Jaime Villagomez as our Chief Financial Officer

2016-01-12 Thread geni
On 11 January 2016 at 20:28, Lila Tretikov <l...@wikimedia.org> wrote:

>
> Most recently, Jaime served as CFO at two startups: AnyCOMM, a smart cities
> startup,


Looks like literal DRMed light-bulbs.


> and Karum Group, which focused on extending credit services to
> underserved, unbanked communities in Mexico.



Hmm apart from the court filings they have maintained an impressively low
profile. Best I can tell they are software house with a focus on the
Mexican retail sector.



> Before then he was Vice
> President of Finance at Advent Software,


Financial services software. Harmless.



> QRS,



Probably QRS Corporation. Harmless.


> and Northpoint Communications
>
Dot com bust. Messy bankruptcy but well a lot of them were.



> Jaime is a first generation San Franciscan. He speaks fluent Spanish, and
> has strong connections to his extended family in Latin America. Jaime holds
> a deep appreciation for diversity, the importance of learning environments,
> and the urgency of advancing the lives of those in need. He is committed to
> bringing his experience to these issues through support for local community
> organizations and non-profits, including the Salvation Army,


Diversity or the Salvation Army. Pick one.


Seems a reasonable choice but we shall see.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] WMF trustee Arnnon Geshuri and part in anticompetitive agreements in Google

2016-01-09 Thread geni
On 8 January 2016 at 22:41, Lodewijk <lodew...@effeietsanders.org> wrote:

> Maybe here the best is to wait a bit for the WMF to come with a response,
> before piling on - unless you actually have information to contribute.
> Pile-on threads seem to lead these days to the original questions being
> ignored/forgotten about.
>
>
They've had over 24 hours. How long do you think they need?



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Announcement about changes to the Board

2016-01-09 Thread geni
On 9 January 2016 at 02:07, Milos Rancic <mill...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
> On top of that, unlike Sue, Lila is a geek. And geeks have troubles in
> understanding the social impact of their actions, especially inside of
> the extraordinary complex environment of Wikimedia movement.
>

You aren't seriously trying that argument are you? in any case it doesn't
really help since people skills are a job requirement for WMF ED.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Announcement about changes to the Board

2016-01-02 Thread geni
On 2 January 2016 at 09:24, George Herbert <george.herb...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> So far the best description I can think of is that we have a bunch of
> people who were there struggling to describe the situation without
> breaching duty to the organization or resorting to attacks, the information
> release results of which so far are unsatisfying to concerned external
> parties such as most of us.
>
>
Eh I'd argue at this point we have a fairly good idea of what went on.

We know from the high employee turnover in some areas and the odd slip
(well that and pretty direct complaints
https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=WMF_Transparency_Gap=15199687=15199605
) that, oh lets call it moral, isn't exactly rock solid at the WMF. The
long term failure to fill the chief technology officer position probably
doesn't help but there are reasons to suspect there are other issues.

For whatever reason James ended being ground zero for complaints by WMF
employees. Not clear why they would go for one of the community elected
people although perhaps it has something to do with only them being the
only post Lila Tretikov board members. (BTW either
https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Board_of_Trustees needs updating or
we've just lost another two board members).

James handled these complaints in a way that the WMF management felt was
undermining their authority/ability to lead and complained to the board.
The board sided with management and removed James.

The community can't actually do much about this other than perhaps
recommending board level representation for WMF employees with the counter
that we revive that old proposal of them not voting in the elections for
the community representatives.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Announcement about changes to the Board

2016-01-01 Thread geni
On 31 December 2015 at 13:02, Patricio Lorente <patricio.lore...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> We are working with the 2015 Elections Committee to fill this vacancy with
> a member of the Wikimedia community. This is a top priority. More
> information will be available once the Board has had a chance to confer
> with the 2015 Elections Committee.
>
>

So can I see these conferings?

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Unreliable sources? Pay-to-publish science journals and too-trusting popular news outlets

2015-12-27 Thread geni
On 28 December 2015 at 02:44, Pine W <wiki.p...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Food for thought for those interested in the quality and reliability of
> references:
>
> http://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2015/05/28/410313446/why-a-journalist-scammed-the-media-into-spreading-bad-chocolate-science
>
> Pine
>


Eh running a search of Beall’s List:

http://scholarlyoa.com/publishers/

against the wikipedia database is probably something that should be done
but beyond that the problems aren't really limited to any specific type of
journal.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Quality issues

2015-12-22 Thread geni
On 21 December 2015 at 15:25, Andreas Kolbe <jayen...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> Re-users are very, very unlikely indeed to spend "way too much of their
> time worrying" about, say, having to add the words "Source: Wikidata.
> (Disclaimer.)" to their websites -- hyperlinked to wikidata.org and the
> Wikidata disclaimer.
>
> It's a one-minute job.
>
>

You've broken say a CC-BY-SA license in at least two ways there.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Quality issues

2015-12-22 Thread geni
On 22 December 2015 at 12:27, Andreas Kolbe <jayen...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> I was unaware that you were in favour of CC BY-SA for Wikidata now.
>
>
I'm not but you failed to specify a license and CC-BY-SA is one you might
be vaguely familiar with




> It's surely not beyond human skill to devise a licence for Wikidata that
> requires re-users to include the three words above on their website, while
> placing no other duties or restrictions on them.



You appear to be suggesting a homebrew license so we are already above the
one minute mark. Worse still by talking about websites you are suffering
from the classic problem of failing to consider all use cases. For example
books, calendars or indeed any form of data transmission that isn't the web.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Quality issues

2015-12-20 Thread geni
On 20 December 2015 at 13:18, Andreas Kolbe <jayen...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Lydia,
>
> I can only relate my impressions to you. The first two items I looked at
> (Jerusalem and Obama) happened to be protected, so on my first visit I was
> completely non-plussed as to how to edit anything on Wikidata.
>

Both are semied on en. I think this mostly shows your ignorance of
protection patterns. The first things you think of will pretty much always
be protected since they are the ones that attract a lot of vandalism. You
either use special:random or something closer to your personal interests.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Quality issues

2015-12-13 Thread geni
On 13 December 2015 at 15:57, Andreas Kolbe <jayen...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Jane,
>
> The issue is that you can't cite one Wikipedia article as a source in
> another.
>


However you can within the same article per [[WP:LEAD]].

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

2015-12-03 Thread geni
On 3 December 2015 at 19:29, Lisa Gruwell <lgruw...@wikimedia.org> wrote:

> We agree with you that WMF fundraising should not use stock photography.
> This was a mistake by a designer.
>

They made a mistake with a Getty image?

>We pulled that banner yesterday
>and asked our designers for a new custom image that we can freely license.

To clarify these are different designers? Messing with Getty is not
something you want to be doing.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

2015-12-03 Thread geni
On 3 December 2015 at 23:30, Rob <gamali...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> It was a photo of a cup of coffee.  It was a mistake that was quickly
> acknowledged and corrected.  Let's keep things in perspective, please.
>

It was a Getty image on one of the most high profile sites on the web.
Legal doesn't need the extra workload.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

2015-12-03 Thread geni
On 3 December 2015 at 23:29, Gnangarra <gnanga...@gmail.com> wrote:

> hold it, back up the truck for a moment
>
> If the WMF has a fundraising team and a PR/media team why is it paying a
> third party to provide the banners surely someone should be able to design
> them in house, what about someone from the design teams working on other
> projects.   If no one has the skills to layout a banner why not ask the
> community for some options there are many skilled volunteers that would
> gladly do it for free, the WMF could even offer a scholarship to Wikimania
> as an incentive to get it done within a short time frame.
>
>
Graphic design is really one of those things better left to professionals.
Equally for a handful of banners going externally rather than employing
someone full time makes sense. Admittedly the WMF hasn't had the best of
luck with its external contractors (wikipedia forever, this) but in
principle it is a valid approach.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Quality issues

2015-11-29 Thread geni
On 28 November 2015 at 19:17, Ed Erhart <the.e...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On the very specific point of knowledge and how it's not always possible to
> boil it down to a single quantifiable value, I couldn't agree more. Thank
> you, Andreas, for the detailed anecdote displaying that problem, and I'll
> be happy to provide more if needed.
>
> Does Wikidata have a way of marking data entries as estimates, or at least
> dates as circa (not just unknown)?
>
>
Yes https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Property:P1317 however a quick comparison
between the English Wikipedia and wikidata suggests it isn't used very much.

Of course there are a bunch of other issues. It gives dates for Egyptian
Pharaohs without saying what chronology it is using. It keeps claiming
dates are Gregorian without showing any conversion has actually taken place
(wikipedians tend to be pretty poor when it comes to such conversions since
they require a fair bit of background knowledge. For example depending on
the year and writer the year in England can start on the 1st of January,
25th March or the first day of advent).

Wikidata doesn't do very well on carbon dating either. If we look at Ötzi
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q171291

We again get dates with no indication of the calibration used. Really this
would be better handled using the uncalibrated C14 numbers (4550 ± 27BP
http://digitalcommons.library.arizona.edu/objectviewer?o=http%3A%2F%2Fradiocarbon.library.arizona.edu%2FVolume36%2FNumber2%2Fazu_radiocarbon_v36_n2_247_250_v.pdf
) and then adding enough information for the correct calibration curve to
be selected (Northern hemisphere land based which at the moment probably
means INTCAL13)

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Quality issues

2015-11-27 Thread geni
On 27 November 2015 at 15:16, Andreas Kolbe  wrote:

>
>
> How does the presence of that information in Wikidata help if the Google
> user just gets the info in the Knowledge Graph without any indication that
> it comes from Wikidata? Because CC0 specifically waives the right to
> attribution that Wikipedia retains.[1][2] No re-user of Wikidata content is
> required to say where the data came from, and they typically don't.


The problem is that there aren't really any alturnatives to CC0 that do any
better (since wikidata isn't really copyrightable in conventional terms).
Open Data Commons Open Database License would be closest but only applies
in the EU and leads to messy arguments over what counts as a substantial
part
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [GLAM] Video: "Wikipedia, an introduction - Erasmus Prize 2015"

2015-11-27 Thread geni
On 26 November 2015 at 19:23, Jens Best  wrote:

> Well, then this is a cheap success for the propaganda for a project started
> by the Foundation which has nothing to do with the community which is
> creating and editing the Wikipedia.
>
> - WP0 is a clear violation of net neutrality and therefore undermines the
> ground on which an open croudsourcing project is based.


Open street maps comes from the UK a country which does not have net
neutrality.
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Quality issues

2015-11-27 Thread geni
On 27 November 2015 at 15:27, Andreas Kolbe <jayen...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, Nov 27, 2015 at 1:47 PM, Gnangarra <gnanga...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Would it not make more sense to import (and verify!) the reliable source
> cited in the relevant Wikipedia version, along with the statement?
>
>
You hit issues with non machine readable data, paywalls and deadtree walls.
And even then it varies by field (for example in chemistry if you can get
around those problems you wouldn't bother with wikidata and instead go
straight for the Beilstein clone).

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Geohack

2015-07-22 Thread geni
On 19 July 2015 at 17:57, Dan Garry dga...@wikimedia.org wrote:


 Hopefully this answers your query. Let me know if you have any further
 questions.



Which non earth bodies will the Wikimedia Maps Tile Server support? Geohack
supports lunar coordinates well enough:

https://tools.wmflabs.org/geohack/geohack.php?pagename=Tycho_%28crater%29params=43.31_S_11.36_W_globe:Moon_type:landmark

But Phobos needs work.

https://tools.wmflabs.org/geohack/geohack.php?pagename=Stickney_%28crater%29params=1_N_49_W_type:landmark_globe:phobos_dim:9000

By September the number of things named on Pluto and Ceres is going to
become an issue

Do you have any long term plans with regards to wikisky?

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Future of Wikipedia

2015-07-14 Thread geni
On 14 July 2015 at 21:22, Renata St renataw...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi.

 So I saw this YouTube video yesterday about kids reacting to printed
 encyclopedia: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7aJ3xaDMuMnoredirect=1

 It made me sad. And very fearful of the future of Wikipedia.

 These kids do not appreciate knowledge and information because they grew up
 with its abundance. When I was growing up (and I am only 30), printed
 encyclopedia was the only research tool.



You would have been 8 years old when Encarta was launched.



 Those kids never deprived of knowledge and information will never know how
 precious it is.


Eh you always hit walls sooner or later. A lot of information is still
buried in libraries (the best soruce I'm aware of for theThe jewelry of
roman Britain is a book written in 1996). Other stuff is behind paywalls or
is commercially sensitive. Or simply doesn't exist (there doesn't seem to
be a solid history of calshot castle anywhere).



 They will not have the same love that is required to edit
 Wikipedia and write quality articles. And it makes me sad.


I think there will be other motivations.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia Announcements] Securing access to Wikimedia sites with HTTPS

2015-06-14 Thread geni
On 14 June 2015 at 05:21, Comet styles cometsty...@gmail.com wrote:

 China and Iran blocks https (and WMF thinks https is more secure than
 http when it can be EASILY blocked lol)

China is currently blocking HTTP and has done so quite frequently. The
ability to block is largely unrelated to security.



 so people in these countries
 used wikipedia on http, so some here think that these countries are
 spying on them by forcing them to use http, but that https block in
 this countries was NOT to target wikipedia, it was to target social
 networking sites and  american based email sites like yahoo and gmail
 etc..but now by moving to HTTPS, we have now become a target for those
 countries..well done..


That doesn't make sense. HTTPs doesn't hide the domain. The country can
still tell that someone is visiting wikipedia rather than say facebook.
What becomes more difficult is telling what a person is viewing on
wikipedia.



 and to add to that, people who used
 wikipedia in those countries to find the truth about whats happening
 in their country and other regions can no longer do so since its
 blocked..Well Done again WMF..


Well actually no they couldn't if they had a government with active
blocking measures. With HTTP traffic governments and ISPs can (and did)
block individual pages that they don't like.




 Someone has to be fired for this.


That would seem to be something of an over reaction even if you disagree
with the decision.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia Announcements] Securing access to Wikimedia sites with HTTPS

2015-06-13 Thread geni
On 12 June 2015 at 22:08, David Gerard dger...@gmail.com wrote:

 Excellent news!

 So how are we dealing with the Iran and China issue?


Well the introduction appears to have been timed for one of those periods
where we are completely blocked in china anyway.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Voting system (was: Results of 2015 WMF Board elections)

2015-06-06 Thread geni
On 6 June 2015 at 19:58, Pine W wiki.p...@gmail.com wrote:

 I'm happy with S/N/O and with the election winners, but concerned about the
 diversity of the Board. I wonder if rethinking the entire board structure
 is in order, for example we could have:

 1. One seat per continent, elected by the whole voting community


Continents have widely varying populations. Europe has a population of
about 0.75 billion while Asia is over 2 billion



 2. Two affiliate seats chosen by all affiliates including user groups.


The problem is that this tends to favor pure political players. I'm not
saying its a bad thing to have excellent networkers on the board but there
are other factors that should matter.





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Re: [Wikimedia-l] My article on Wikipedia Zero and Net Neutrality, just out today at Reason.com

2015-04-09 Thread geni
On 9 April 2015 at 00:51, Mike Godwin mnemo...@gmail.com wrote:

 http://reason.com/archives/2015/04/08/nothing-but-net


 --Mike



I'm not convinced you are helping your case with your choice of venue.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Announcing: The Wikipedia Prize!

2015-03-30 Thread geni
On 31 March 2015 at 03:15, Richard Farmbrough rich...@farmbrough.co.uk
wrote:

 Moreover this may well be a breach of policy, TOS and even law.


Eh probably not. Go through a bunch of wikipedia bios of not very notable
people. Find the edits obviously made by the subject of the article. Note
IPs. I don't see any legal issues. Just rather boring thats all.



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Adding your own works as sources possible conflict of interests

2015-03-21 Thread geni
On 21 March 2015 at 15:22, Rui Correia correia@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi Peter

 Thanks for your reply.

 I was not aware that there might be that much difference from one Wp
 to another, but, yes, I am referring to the English WP.



The English Wikipedia has an adequate selection of noticeboards where you
can ask such a question or alternatively it has its own mailing list:

https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Questions about GLAM projects

2015-03-16 Thread geni
On 16 March 2015 at 21:20, Ilario Valdelli valde...@gmail.com wrote:

 First question: can someone say me if there was a GLAM project managing
 more than 4 languages?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:GLAM/JoburgpediA



 Second question: do you know a GLAM project managing material in Latin
 language?



The original British museum project produced some Latin material.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Announcement: WMF to file suit against the NSA

2015-03-11 Thread geni
On 11 March 2015 at 08:37, Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijs...@gmail.com
wrote:

 Hoi,
 The fact that law suits like this actually happen is a wonderful
 improvement in and of itself.

 Our aim is to freely share in the sum of all knowledge. Free has many
 meaning, one of them is free to share without consequences.It is not only
 about free of cost.In the past we implemented https for the very reason
 that we did not want eavesdropping on the content from our Wikis.


Partially implemented https



 I think
 nobody ever suggested that we should not do this because of the cost.


So for what reason wasn't it done?



 The least it does
 is make it obvious that the NSA is not behaving in a way that is conducive
 to propagating democracy and its associated values in our world. It shames
 the current practices and the donkey may sing.


Being spied on by AIVD on the other hand is just fine.

Seriously people if you aren't American pick your words with care. Your
domestic agencies are either worse or activity incompetent.
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Become a Digital object identifier (DOI) registarnt

2015-01-21 Thread geni
On 21 January 2015 at 00:01, Federico Leva (Nemo) nemow...@gmail.com
wrote:

 The two articles combined make me wonder: if I cite a Wikimedia projects
 page in a long-term document, should I link something like perma.cc or to
 the oldid? I prefer the oldid, because I think it's every website's
 responsibility to offer really permanent links.


Mediaviewer does not in fact offer a permanent link. See:

https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension_talk:Media_Viewer/About#Non_predominance_of_links



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] WMF has lost its path

2015-01-20 Thread geni
On 20 January 2015 at 18:23, Trillium Corsage trillium2...@yandex.com
wrote:


 Thank you for informing me my opinion is wrong, but I'd appreciate
 specific refutation next time. The answer dig through the logs and
 archives will find no doubt many criticisms of Russavia including from
 many rabid and shifty accusers and drama mongers, but won't tell one why
 the WMF acted. Do some homework and figure it out yourself is no answer
 for an 100 million dollar organization with scores of employees to say.


I'm not a 100 million dollar organisation but in any case we have further
established that your interest is not in fact openness.



 You seem to have misread what I said. In such a case, the WMF could advise
 the editor of all that privately,


No. Your problem is that you are assuming internal WMF communications are
privileged (note this term has a very precise legal meaning and that is the
way I'm using it).

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] WMF has lost its path

2015-01-20 Thread geni
On 20 January 2015 at 17:19, Trillium Corsage trillium2...@yandex.com
wrote:

 I guess I don't object much to specific ban reasons not disclosed to the
 *public* if it at least is publicly said reasons of privacy prohibit us
 from commenting specifically, however I would object if specific ban
 reasons were not disclosed to the *banned individual*. It's simple fairness
 and common decency to tell somebody why he or she has been banned.

 Consider a user like Russavia who has done a great deal of positive
 editing, contributed great value, to the WMF projects. He shouldn't just be
 banned without telling *him* specifically why. Personally I feel he was
 pushed around at English Wikipedia a lot, that one of his maligned and
 deleted focus projects Poland Ball was for years worthy of its own
 article, and that had to be vindicated by its articles in like a dozen of
 the non-English Wikipedias before, after years, the English Wikipedia
 administrative bullies finally backed down (
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polandball, now #3 in Google results).


However regardless of your opinion (which is wrong but that's a secondary
issue) of it the reasons for blocking were publicly discussed on the
English wikipedia and can be found through enough digging through the
relevant logs and archives. Given that this does not satisfy you there
would appear to be little point in paying attention to any demands you make
for openness.




 Of course if the WMF indeed tells the individual the particulars, he or
 she could himself or herself choose to make that public. Maybe that's what
 the WMF really doesn't want. If it were done that way, there'd be no you
 compromised my privacy complaint basis for the individual.


Sigh. Okey consider the following (which I wish to make clear is entirely
hypothetical). The WMF is 99% sure that an editor is using Wikipedia as a
CC network for a bot net (yes in theory this could be done). Now it has
two options. It can either ban the editor without giving a reason or it can
give its reasoning and face a 1% risk of significant libel damages and
legal costs (falsely accusing someone of running a botnet is libel). Which
one do you think it is going to do?



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] WMF has lost its path

2015-01-20 Thread geni
On 20 January 2015 at 17:47, Yaroslav M. Blanter pute...@mccme.ru wrote:

 The problem is that WMF already produced a lot of damage, and foremost,
 damage to their reputation. Russavia at the point he was banned was still a
 Commons administrator, and he recently survived a desysop discussion. This
 means he really was trusted by active part of the community (though there
 was vocal opposition as well). At some point, WMF will need to get
 volunteer support for some of its actions, and it will be extremely
 difficult to achieve on Commons.


The reality is that its recent actions have made no difference in that
respect other than reducing the number of anti WMF people in senior
positions on commons by one. Realistically there was no course of action
that the WMF people could take that would bring that anti WMF commons
people onside. Partly because they are pretty set on their current position
and partly because in most cases it is an extension of being anti-english
wikipedia and that is frankly even less fixable.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] WMF has lost its path

2015-01-20 Thread geni
On 20 January 2015 at 19:05, Yaroslav M. Blanter pute...@mccme.ru wrote:


 My point is that reducing the number of anti WMF people in senior
 positions on commons by one they might have converted some pro WMF people
 in senior positions on commons to anti WMF people,


Doubtful. Judging by events on commons however this appears not to be the
case.




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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Introducing WikiProject X

2015-01-15 Thread geni
On 15 January 2015 at 21:29, Andy Mabbett a...@pigsonthewing.org.uk wrote:

 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q8564001 was created on 28 March 2013‎
 and is found in the left-hand navigation on
 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florin_%28English_coin%29 as a link
 called Wikdata item.


So we're back to the English Wikipedia being the only functional method of
navigating wikidata. Of course whats really going to mess things up is that
the florin isn't a single coin but in fact a whole series of them. While it
makes sense for the english wikipedia to bash them all together it makes
less sense for wikidata to do so.


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Introducing WikiProject X

2015-01-14 Thread geni
On 14 January 2015 at 12:33, Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijs...@gmail.com
wrote:

 Hoi,
 How is Wikidata not here yet ?
 Thanks,
  GerardM


Well at the london meetup we tried poking at it with regards to coins. It
tends not to be aware when things are currency units (pounds crown florin)
hasn't heard of the likes of long cross pennies let alone individual coin
mintings (the exception presumably being ones notable enough to have
Wikipedia articles).

It does of course know a fair bit about bitcoin.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Why WMF should reconsider the 3-month gender gap project-related decision

2015-01-08 Thread geni
On 8 January 2015 at 07:07, mcc99 mc...@hotmail.com wrote:

 If you ask any RN the names of the greatest contributors to the nursing
 profession, you'll get a stream of women's names.  To suggest that nursing
 needs more men or else it won't be able to achieve its greatest potential
 would be a crass and inaccurate insult to the many thousands of women who
 have made modern nursing what it is.  Of course there have been and will be
 male nurses who stand out as contributors, but only a very small
 percentage, probably in keeping with the ratio of men to women in nursing.
 And yet, despite the high salaries RNs command, are there any
 gov't-sponsored initiatives to get men into nursing?


In fact nurses get paid less than the male national average wage. This is
clearly some definition of high salaries I wasn't previously familiar with



 If so, it'd be news to me and many others.  But I ask, if men by and
 large, for whatever reasons, aren't interested in becoming nurses, why make
 a big deal about it?


Reducing the recruitment pool is less than ideal. However the number of men
training to be nurses has been increasing so it is probably felt the
problem will solve itself.


 Are there gov't-sponsored campaigns to get more women into the relatively
 lucrative job of refuse collection?


Ah you can tell the piece you are recycling from is dated. Post
privatisation refuse collection has ceased to be a particularly lucrative
job.


Or, the likewise lucrative jobs of plumber,


http://www.walesonline.co.uk/business/business-news/call-more-women-construction-3m-6942911

Although again due to eastern European labour plumbing isn't as lucrative
as it used to be.



 ordnance disposal engineer,



I understand there have been various attempts to recruit women into the
military



 nuclear materials technician, etc.?  No.  But other fields that are a lot
 less dirty and/or dangerous, yes.



Were you under the impression that nuclear materials technician was dirty
and/or dangerous? For very obvious reasons it isn't. However the nuclear
industry has been downsizing of late so I don't think there are significant
programs to recruit anyone.



  (Think professional STEM fields.)


I'm a chemist you insensitive clod. Depending on what you are doing it can
be dirty or dangerous.







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