We are on the verge of changing to a metered or tiered billing structure
with Caps that once they exceed the cap; it doesn't shut off, but they
get charged the overage. Netflix is getting out of control and I don't
want to punish the customers that only use it occasionally. I think
they are very
Eric,
What type of appliance are you using to meter this usage? I have the same
problem here.
Joe
- Original Message
From: Eric Rogers ecrog...@precisionds.com
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Sat, November 7, 2009 6:56:03 AM
Subject: [WISPA] Metered Billing
We are
I use multiple MS IAS radius servers logging to a SQL server with accounting
on. I have already built a customer portal to display billing info for
customers, and I just added a section that shows their current usage. Each
time a customer views a page, it will also search the database and
Portability is one thing to consider. He wants to use it as a client from
his truck to open networks. I tried using the NS2 for the same reason but
it was a pain in the butt due to the size and the plastic pipe mount stand
offs on the rear of the NS2. I suppose if you could make up a magnetic
Marlon does this and smiles every time he signs a Bandwidth Hog!
-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Eric Rogers
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2009 4:56 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] Metered Billing
We are on
I didn't know that very cool indeed
-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf
Of Robert West
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2009 7:39 AM
To: n...@brevardwireless.com; 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Nanostation Loco2
I
Few devices document that - I guess it's just assumed all 802.11 devices do
this? Engenius had it noted on their web config at one point but that has
since disappeared. I can't imagine the capability has been lost, though.
Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
10% of your customers will use 90% of your resources. Direct that 10%
customer base to cable or DSL and stop worrying about adding complexity
to your network.
Travis
Microserv
Chuck Profito wrote:
Marlon does this and smiles every time he signs a Bandwidth Hog!
-Original Message-
With the proper setup the network complexity does not change. Why would
I want to give up additional revenue?
Travis Johnson wrote:
10% of your customers will use 90% of your resources. Direct that 10%
customer base to cable or DSL and stop worrying about adding complexity
to your network.
I do agree with you and that works if there are other options. One
customer who was downloading 160G, came from DSL and moved into this
neighborhood and now wants high speed where we are the only option. It
is only a matter of time before others are using Netflix and others.
They come in all
That is true, but depending on your business model, bandwidth based pricing
will need to be implemented eventually. Why turn away the money if they are
willing to pay? If they are not, they will go elsewhere. -RickG
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 12:22 PM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net wrote:
10% of your
Many of you know this is not that hard. Back in 1997 I had an Allot box that
gave me the numbers. All I did was pull the report and bill accordingly. The
hard part would be integrating it with a billing system so it does it
automatically. -RickG
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 7:56 AM, Eric Rogers
Hi,
You are talking about having to add additional resources (radius, etc.)
to track it. Then you have to bill it. Then you get to deal with the
phone calls from users that say "My computer wasn't even turned on
during those times. Remove the charge or I will go elsewhere." So,
even that one
And deal with the extra phone calls each month from customers that
claim they didn't use that much. :(
Travis
Microserv
RickG wrote:
Many of you know this is not that hard. Back in 1997 I had an Allot box that
gave me the numbers. All I did was pull the report and bill accordingly. The
So have you tried it or are you doing it now that you are saying it is a
pain in the rear?
Eric
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Travis Johnson
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2009 2:19 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Metered
I was curious Bob did she say you were right or was that you talking
out loud. :-P
Robert West wrote:
Portability is one thing to consider. He wants to use it as a client from
his truck to open networks. I tried using the NS2 for the same reason but
it was a pain in the butt due to the size
You sound like the cell phone company.
I am convinced the big failure in my business model is I charge by the
month while the cellular guys charge by the minute.
Travis Johnson wrote:
Hi,
You are talking about having to add additional resources (radius, etc.)
to track it. Then you have to
LOL, even if she said it, you would never agree :)
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 2:26 PM, Frank Crawford mogoo...@gmx.com wrote:
I was curious Bob did she say you were right or was that you talking
out loud. :-P
Robert West wrote:
Portability is one thing to consider. He wants to use it as a
Travis, I was operating on the premise that you said to send them to DSL or
cable.
Even with that, I did not have that experience. We sent the invoices out
with a copy of their usage report and it was rarely, if ever questioned.
-RickG
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 2:18 PM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net
Rick, I don't think its up to Netflix to pay us. They in turn would have to
raise their prices which would further complicate things.
We need to make sure we get a fair price from our customers that reflects
our costs and hopefully profits.
So the customer pays Netflix and us for the movie they
I'm with Travis.
If 90% of your customers cost $1 a month and 10% of your customers cost $1 a
month it only makes sense to trim the fat.
Every single month Vonage contacts the top 3% heaviest users and tells them
they're a) raising their bill or b) gone (I was told it's the customer's
choice).
Rick, did you have a self-serve portal where your customers could check
ongoing usage?
We are implementing IPtrack, same as Marlon. Brandon will build a
self-service portal for us.
We are also going to implement something called 'Moonlighting', where we
don't count bandwidth from Midnight to 6am
In PPPOE you should be able to just kill the connection and the client
should reestablish a moment afterward. I know it works this way with MT
PPPOE server/client.
Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373
The secret to creativity is knowing
In addition, their costs are limited by speed availability. To explain,
you may not be able to use their service everywhere and when you can the
usage is limited to just a handful of apps and the speed of their
connection. In our case, the customer has multiple computers and devices on
our
I mostly agree, it was really just a thought. But, to support my argument
for I point to the telco agreements where they exchange fees for each others
networks. At any rate, it will probably never happen. With that said, the
end user always pays, its just a matter of how. I'm just searching for a
She said I was right. I became concerned and talked her into seeing the
doctor and he put her on some medication to make sure it doesn't happen
again.
I know, it was just a little thing but next thing you know I'd be able to be
out late working, eat whatever food I wanted, watch what I want on
That's interesting. So in theory we could just script a 'flicker' at the APs
at Midnight, and another 'flicker' at 6am to get the settings to change at
the client...
Good idea! Thanks Josh.
George
-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
Yup. I used to work for Bell Mobility in Toronto in the business systems
side. We had a standing joke that a telco is a billing system surrounded by
a few phone lines.
A good few years ago some telcos, Cinci Bell springs to mind, actually
generated more profits from renting out their billing
That would work. The only thing you'd need to test is the clients you're
using. It would be up to the client to sense being disconnected and attempt
a (re?)connection.
You can charge them for that but then you have to worry about customers
getting itchy F-U fingers. The DSL/Cable/alternative
I've felt this way many times but I always go back to my business model
which says We are in business to provide internet access for profit
according to our posted rates under the terms spelled out in our AUP and the
contract between (us) the company and the subscriber. Furthermore, my
business
I'm totally for metered billing however the customers have all been spoiled
with one price access for years now. To not alienate the customer, would it
be possible to have the current one price for a particular speed tier with
unlimited MB at that speed, set the high use sites down in the list of
I think the better question is Are we in business to sell Internet access
or sell Internet access while making money?
As far as I know, there is no comparable service to Internet in terms of
progression where minimal bandwidth capabilities soon become enormous
capabilities and services exceeding
George,
Considering the resources back then, we were lucky to have the concept work.
I left that company in 2000 so I dont know what became of the system. The
next ISP we implemented online billing which included usage but it was part
of a larger system that I had little technical input to. I
Very good point Josh, it would be unfortunately to have a pro-consumer
initiative backfire because of a flaky implementation.
I need to think on this some more. It may be enough to start with just to
ignore bandwidth used during the Moonlighting window.
George
-Original Message-
From:
When I worked at ATT Wireless, we had the same jokel There is where I agree
with Travis on this subject. If your not careful, you will generate phone
calls and the cure will be worse then the illness. RickG
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 3:04 PM, George Morris ghmor...@candlelight.cawrote:
Yup. I used
It always goes back to marketing. You can only sell what the market will
bear. If you competition doesnt do it, you better tread lightly.
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 3:05 PM, Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:
That would work. The only thing you'd need to test is the clients you're
I believe this is another part of bandwidth based billing that needs to
happen - premium bits versus non-premium. Those apps such as video which
require priority and higher demand should cost more than the non-priority
such as email. Eventually there will have to be a convergence of priority
and
As they say YMMV. Really its all dependent on your local market. Back in
'97, there was no DSL or cable. So, I had a monopoly and the only
alternative was to get a T1 at $3500/month. It was an easy sell.
There are a lot of great thinkers on this list. They'll help keep you clean
:)
-RickG
On
Right. It has to be implemented to look as an improvement not a detraction.
An added service to add to their Multimedia Internet Experience sort of
B.S..
I'm a fan of George Orwell's Animal Farm. Make your changes slowly but deny
that you ever changed a thing!
If my bandwidth prices remain
Problem with this initiative is that I have nothing to really compare it
with except what the unholy duopoly is doing today.
We've been doing the traditional WISP thing for about eight years now, but
Urban Gorilla is aimed at the throats of the cablecos/telcos in small/medium
towns here. They
The cellular guys don't charge by the minute... I have an unlimited
plan on my cell phone. I can also get unlimited text and internet
access for $9.95/mo extra.
People don't want to guess what their internet bills are going to be
from month to month. Would you want that at your own home?
That's why I think it should be done in a simple manner as standard and
premium add-ons. People can understand that better and it makes the billing
much easier to understand.
I'd also like to have a Turbo Button that the customer can click on their
account page, get charged 5 bucks and it
Ya know, we've looked at this many times over the past couple years, and
even tested it for a bit.
Fact is, people like unlimited, and not having to guess. I, myself, being a
fairly lite user of the Internet, would still always opt for an unlimited
plan--even if I knew my bill may be lower on a
Hi,
You posted a while ago about delivering 12Mbps to all your customers. I
tried before to go to your homepage to check it out, but it didn't
resolve or open. I just tried again, and same thing. Do you have a
different website than your email account domain that is used on this
list?
I'm
Hi,
My flight plans just changed for the cruise trip, so I will need a hotel
for tomorrow (Sunday) night in Miami. Any suggestions?
Travis
Microserv
WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/
A vacation? Whats that...
Scott Carullo
Brevard Wireless
321-205-1100 x102
From: Travis Johnson t...@ida.net
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2009 6:36 PM
To: WISPA members memb...@wispa.org, WISPA General List
wireless@wispa.org
Subject: [WISPA] Miami
Put radius attribute 27 (Session Timeout) to 2 days and it will
automatically disconnect them every 48 hrs. I set the businesses to 5
days.
Eric
-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of George Morris
Sent: Saturday, November
I'll be here Sunday night.
Residence Inn Miami Airport West/Doral Area1212
Nw 82Nd Avenue
Miami, FL 33126
305-591-2211
Rick Harnish
-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Travis Johnson
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2009
It's called work... ;)
http://www.doubleradius.com/wirelesswithoutlimits/index.html
Travis
Microserv
Scott Carullo wrote:
A vacation? Whats that...
Scott Carullo
Brevard Wireless
321-205-1100 x102
From: Travis Johnson t...@ida.net
Sent:
Sheraton South Beach. Nice grounds and excellent food. Beautiful people.
At 05:36 PM 11/7/2009, you wrote:
Hi,
My flight plans just changed for the cruise trip, so I will need a hotel
for tomorrow (Sunday) night in Miami. Any suggestions?
Travis
Microserv
For $100 a month per phone and the internet access is relatively slow. Not
really an apples to apples comparison.
In my home, I want unlimited electicity, natural gas, and water too!
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 4:24 PM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net wrote:
The cellular guys don't charge by the
Thats one way to utilize bandwidth shaping but how do you guaranteed
minimum of 1.5Mbps, 4Mbps and
6Mbps at those low rates to every use and make money? Maybe I'm wrong but
the problem I see is that you will end up having unhappy subscribers when
their expectations are not met. Thats where the
Jump on Hotels.com and take your pick. Plenty of great places all over the
town, in all ranges of prices and amenities. To suit your taste..
Faisal Imtiaz
Computer Office Solutions Inc. /SnappyDSL.net
Ph: (305) 663-5518 x 232
-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org
I'm also stuck in Miami this weekend. We were headed to Mexico until
Ida changed those plans. Anyone up for a group dinner Sunday night?
On 11/7/09, Faisal Imtiaz fai...@snappydsl.net wrote:
Jump on Hotels.com and take your pick. Plenty of great places all over the
town, in all ranges of prices
I have unlimited water in my home. $40 per month.
Travis
RickG wrote:
For $100 a month per phone and the internet access is relatively slow. Not
really an "apples to apples" comparison.
In my home, I want unlimited electicity, natural gas, and water too!
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 4:24 PM,
Travis, Thats great for you but that's not the norm for most people and
doesnt rebuff my point. I suppose youre getting unlimited bandwidth from
your upstream too?
-RickG
On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 11:53 PM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net wrote:
I have unlimited water in my home. $40 per month.
I have unlimited water; 380 foot well. Unlimited heat; lots of dead
trees. Working on the unlimited electricity thing. There is
unlimited natural gas on this list.
Mike
At 10:53 PM 11/7/2009, you wrote:
I have unlimited water in my home. $40 per month.
Travis
RickG wrote:
For $100 a
That won't last for long.. I used to be the water system guy in a
previous life. We put in meters and usage dropped 40%.
I followed water running along the road once and found a hose running in
the horse trough while the guy was on vacation. He took a cruise and
didn't want the horses
http://www.odessaoffice.com/services.html
We've done this for years. Brandon Checkalets built the software that we
use.
We bill on usage. Lowish base price, but relatively high overage fees. We
bill out about $1k per month in overages.
Our average customer does about 4 gigs per month.
We
Nope... we pay per MB on our upstream connections... but once you reach
a certain mass, your upstream is no longer a concern. Our three
upstream connections account for 7% of our total expenses. Time is the
most valueable asset you have. If you are having to take even a few
"extra" calls per
Yes they should. HOWEVER, there is only so much capacity available on the
equipment we use. That 5% can (and often does) kill service for the other
95%. I'll gladly give up a netflixer in order to save the 9 grandma's that
slow, crappy service would have run off.
Or my service would slow to
It's been that way for 20+ years in this community (100+ homes). I
don't see it changing any time soon.
And just like internet, there are "heavy" water users (neighbors I see
with their sprinklers running almost 24 hours per day) and normal users
(like me) and light users (the yellow dead
It doesn't work that way. We've got HUNDREDS of subs now. Some on fiber.
We do get those calls from time to time but it's almost always an open router
or virus/spyware issue. Our customers LIKE that we track this and can actually
help protect them better because of it. It's been a great
Marlon,
With thousands of wireless users, I think our "unlimited eat all you
want" is working quite well. And I can say we have 5 or 6 competitors
(DSL, wireless, cable, licensed Wimax, etc.) so there is no monopoly.
You are brining in $1k extra per month... but it would be interesting
to see
We have NO speed tiers. All customers go as fast as I can make them go.
Our fiber customers can hi 20 megs, some wireless folks get over 10 megs. I
try to get everyone else 2 usually 4 megs.
The only limit is how much they want to pay for the actual data flow they
consume.
marlon
-
Unlimited cell phone? I don't buy it There's a limit, there always is.
Also, is your unlimited cell phone program only $40 or $50 per month?
If I could get the same $100 to $300 per month for internet that people often
pay the cell companies I'd be able to sell them a LOT more service for
LOL
Lets be honest here. At 380 foot well isn't free. The electricity to pump
the water isn't free either.
Lots of dead trees means a chain saw, splitter, WORK etc. Also not free.
The natural gas isn't free either. You had to pay for the chili!
grin
marlon
- Original Message -
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