[RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Lungimsam]

That pic was from when it was new

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Re: [RBW] Thinking of a Riv

[Will]

Consider a Shutter Precision dynamo. Riv sells a wheelset using it. 

Consider a Tubus Logo Evo for the rear rack. Very good rack, fits Ortlieb 
panniers, carries weight lower, and is set up for the best rear dyno 
powered light: B Topline. 

Consider Pitlocks for the wheels and seat post. 


On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 8:44:09 PM UTC-5, Tim Butterfield wrote:
>
> Well, my component choices just got a bit more complicated.  Isn't that 
> what always happens?  It might not be quite as roadish as initially 
> anticipated.
>
> The problem was I got to thinking of future uses as has been mentioned 
> before.  That thinking can often cause these problems.  I expect my AHH to 
> arrive sometime in August.  Just a few months further down the calendar, 
> winter will be starting.  Here in Anacortes, that means it is getting dark 
> earlier.  If I want to do any riding after work, I'm going to need 
> lighting.  With the whole ride being in the dark, I don't want to have to 
> keep recharging batteries.  See what's happening here?  It's like the thin 
> edge of a wedge.  :)
>
> If I'm not using battery lights, that means a dyno hub.  Now, I'm into 
> custom wheels also.  Might as well do the rear, too.  This little detour 
> has added these to my tentative build list:
>
> Busch IQ-X headlight (black)
> SONdelux Wide Body Dyno Hub 36h
> Phil “Rivy” Rear Hub 36h
>
> The winters are wet here, so I might as well add these:
> SKS/ESGE LongBoard Silver Fenders
>
> Well, I'm almost there anyway.  What about racks?  This isn't full 
> touring, though.  So, let's keep it light with these:
> Nitto Mark's Rack M1 - 20108
> Nitto R-14 Top Rack
>
> Less than six months after getting the AHH, it's role has already 
> progressed beyond my initial guess.  It's not quite as roady as first 
> thought, but probably more usable.
>
> These are just my initial guesses at my options.  Feel free to convince me 
> otherwise.  I can always use an education and reasoning on options will 
> help reaffirm choices.
>
> Thanks again for all of the assistance.
>
> Tim
>
>  
>
> On Wed, May 25, 2016 at 7:14 PM, Tim Butterfield  > wrote:
>
>> I've been thinking of getting a Rivendell bicycle for a long time.  I 
>> first joined this group to lurk back in 2010 and have been a member and 
>> sometimes lurker since then.  But, I had not made the commitment and 
>> purchased a Riv.  The closest I came was getting a Velo-Orange Rando.  That 
>> was sort of rivish.  
>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/timbutterfield/sets/72157624827193423
>>
>> Being in the suburbs of Chicago near O'Hare airport limited my comfort 
>> using it the way it should have been.  That bike was sold before I left 
>> Chicago to live full-time in an RV.  Once we decided to settle in 
>> Anacortes, WA (still in the RV), I purchased a Specialized AWOL Comp, 
>> definitely not rivish.  
>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/timbutterfield/sets/72157644371355428
>>
>> It's a nice bike, but I now want something more rivish, this time, the 
>> real thing.  I'm thinking of getting either the Roadeo or the A Homer 
>> Hilsen.  I like the idea of the liveliness and sportiness of the Roadeo, 
>> but like the bit of extra versatility of the AHH also.  With my weight at 
>> 200+ (PBH 33" or 83.8cm, age 51), I'm leaning towards the AHH instead of 
>> the Roadeo.  I can start more roadish with the AHH and, as I build my 
>> abilities further, expand the bike to fit new and/or different tasks 
>> without having to change frames.
>>
>> So, I'm fairly settled on getting my first Riv, one of the two 
>> mentioned.  My pondering now is mostly on how to appoint it.  My Rando was 
>> more modern with the 105 setup.  The AWOL was definitely modern with discs 
>> and SRAM setup.  But, I'm not tied to that.  Though I haven't used it much, 
>> I like the looks of a quill stem, drop bars, and downtube shifters.  It 
>> looks clean and simple.  I'm just not sure what it's like to live with.  I 
>> expect that, like many things, it is a matter of adapting to it.  But, 
>> using DT shifters or bar ends does set a direction as neither would work 
>> with an 11-speed I could have instead.  I'm trying to consider the pros and 
>> cons of each.
>>
>> With my AWOL, I leave it locked to the cabana just outside my RV.  Some 
>> RVs have sufficient inside storage for a bike.  Mine doesn't.
>>
>> My questions to the group are these:  As I am not yet doing longer 
>> distances, are there still benefits to the more traditional setups?  If I 
>> pick either one, what might I later miss the other may have provided?  Are 
>> there likely to be any weather related or other wear issues leaving a Riv 
>> locked to the RV park cabana like I do my AWOL?  I'm doubtful of that, but 
>> don't want to mistreat it either.  Any thing else I should consider?
>>
>> Thanks for any advice you have.
>>
>> Tim
>>
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Re: [RBW] Thinking of a Riv

[Tim Butterfield]

Hi, John.
Thanks for getting in touch.  It would make for a long day, but if you have
an AHH to compare to, I would love to take a look.  I'll follow up with you
off list.

Thanks.

Tim

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 1:30 PM, John at Rivelo 
wrote:

> Dear Tim,
>
> We're down in Portland, and have Joe Appaloosas (and more Clems on the
> way), as well as some other demo bikes to try.
>
> Come on down if you have time/interest.
>
> John @ Rivelo
>
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[RBW] Thinking of a Riv

[John at Rivelo]

Dear Tim,

We're down in Portland, and have Joe Appaloosas (and more Clems on the way), as 
well as some other demo bikes to try.

Come on down if you have time/interest.

John @ Rivelo

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[RBW] Re: Frame bag recommendations

[John Philip]

Thanks, yes it is the Nitto lugged post.  Works well for me.

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 10:32:46 PM UTC-4, Andrew Patteson wrote:
>
> On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 8:16:39 PM UTC-6, John Philip wrote:
>>
>> Here's one on my 64 Bomba. 
>>
>
> Wow, beautiful bike.  Sorry to derail, but may I ask, is that a Nitto 
> lugged seatpost?  Lots of setback can be helpful! 
>
> Andrew in SLC
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Remember Islabikes?

[Scott Henry]

And that's the point that is confusing, islabike is still making the type
of bike that you are referring to. All they are doing is offering
consumers a choice.

Intolerance and single-sightedness don't seem to be those Riv qualities
that some of you preach on about.

So it's a great company if they make only the type of bike that you want?
But it's a bad company if they make the bike you want AND the type of bike
that someone else may want?

Wow.  It's no wonder the reputation garnered here.
On May 27, 2016 5:26 PM, "'Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch" <
rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> You guys are conflating the things I've written.This is not about snobbery
> or proselytizing,  not about anti this or that, not about who should or
> should not be on the list. I did not question anyone's qualifications for
> being on RBW.  If you have actually read what I wrote and the reason for
> my, let's face it, in the context of life, mild dismay at Islabikes is not
> clear, I cheerfully give up! Wait, one last time:
>
> There is a kid's bicycle company. It appeared that they had some Riv-like
> qualities and a similar approach to bicycles as RBW. I purchased a bike
> from them based in some good measure on this approach. They are now
> offering a line of kid's bikes that in many ways goes against this approach
> toward making and selling bicycles. I am disappointed. You don't have to
> be. Not in the slightest.
>
> On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 4:30:26 PM UTC-4, Daniel D. wrote:
>>
>> Because I like steel, I like pretty paint jobs, I like wool, I like
>> swedish axes, I like leather saddles, I like lugs, I like racks, I like
>> nice bags, I like the best bike shop experience ever,
>>
>>  But what I enjoy and am willing to spend is not the end all be all .
>> Don't get the snobbery and need for it to be a "cause".
>>
>> On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 11:56:27 AM UTC-7, Mark in Beacon wrote:
>>>
>>> And by the way, this idea that they are "filling a market" and "giving
>>> customers what they want" is also a bit suspect. One reason RBW is such a
>>> niche company is that the majority of people shopping for bicycles are at
>>> the mercy of the industry, which has a vested interest in pushing certain
>>> types of bicycles. And if you don't get that, I am truly puzzled why you
>>> are on this list. (Note that none of this means I think people should only
>>> ride Rivendells, or that carbon sucks, or that people cannot have fun on
>>> pro style racing bicycles. It's not about that per se.)
>>>
>>>
>>> On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 11:40:55 AM UTC-4, RJM wrote:

 There is a lot of negativity towards this company here which made me
 check the link so I can understand why, and after I still don't get it.

 I've never heard of this company before but I understand why they are
 making this pro line...not a lot of companies cater to the young racer and
 offer equipment for that. They are filling a market. If you don't believe
 that kids that young are racing then you aren't attending many races. Just
 this past weekend I worked a local mountain bike race day and there was a
 kid class, and they were competitive and having fun at the same time riding
 a smaller portion of the same trail that the adults rode on. Very capable
 kids.

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[RBW] Re: Frame bag recommendations

[Andrew Patteson]

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 8:16:39 PM UTC-6, John Philip wrote:
>
> Here's one on my 64 Bomba. 
>

Wow, beautiful bike.  Sorry to derail, but may I ask, is that a Nitto 
lugged seatpost?  Lots of setback can be helpful! 

Andrew in SLC

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[RBW] Re: Frame bag recommendations

[John Philip]

Here's one on my 64 Bomba. Scott Felter of Porcelain Rocket does first 
class work. Highly recommended.   
 https://www.flickr.com/photos/cnyriv/14051388838/in/dateposted-public/ 
  There's a shallower compartment on the other side as well. I find the bag 
very useful.  Today it carried a Sven saw and large bushcraft knife as I 
was harvesting a bit of wood for a project.  It works great for pack rods 
tent poles and all manner of small stuff.  Here's one Scott made for my 
son's Hunq.   
  https://www.flickr.com/photos/cnyriv/14343996523/in/dateposted-public/

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 4:20:30 PM UTC-4, Jared Volpe wrote:
>
> Hi all. Searched the list and didn't come up with anything conclusive. I'm 
> looking for a frame bag for my 64 cm Bomba. There is about 4" of space 
> between the top bars. Thanks!
>

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[RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[dougP]

In the photo there is visible wear on the middle & outer but nowhere near 
the point of replacement.  Have you checked that the new chain is correct? 
 I actually used a 9 speed chain on an 8 speed drivetrain without noticing 
but I may have been lucky.  Weird stuff can happen that way.  If you're 
having shift problems after changing chains, it could be the chain.  

dougP

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 9:35:07 AM UTC-7, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> I ride in Maryland in rain and winter weather (dry, but salty), humid 
> summers...maybe I do have more miles. I just guestamated. But nowhere near 
> 20k. Maybe 4k, tops.
>
> I am surprised they are shark toothing already, too.
>
> Based on online search, the only Sugino rings I can find that looks like 
> mine is the Supershift Pro Triple Chainring Set 26/36/46T 74/110mm 5-Bolt: 
> Silver, you can see at Ben's and Harris for 125$ for a set of all three 
> rings. I cannot find them sold separately. They are a QBP product, and may 
> be likely my LBS used them on the xd600 crankset on the bike. I think my 
> LBS uses Merry Sales.
>
> But I kind of don't want to get same because of the quick wear. Maybe 
> better to get something that lasts longer. I don't know what my current 
> rings are made of. Those Rivvy rings at RBW are the longest wear aluminum. 
> Maybe they will be better. Comparable price for a full set (25,35,45).
>
> I don't know, for those prices maybe I oughtta upgrade to a better 
> crank/chainset. One that allows changing rings without taking off crankarms 
> would be great. Herse does that but way more than I would want to pay right 
> now. 500$
>
> Pic of crankset when new below.
>
>
>  
>

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Re: [RBW] Sugino chainring swap as easy as this Rivideo makes it look?

[dougP]

Yes.  I've done it.  Easier to remove the cranks.  PITA on the bike.

dougP

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 2:15:59 PM UTC-7, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> Is it possiblt to finagle the middel and big rings off without having to 
> pop the crank?

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[RBW] Re: FS: Willow Chainring Sale

[Joe Bernard]

Ah yes, the strange and mysterious Exage LT group. It was painted a kind of 
cement color, and lasted exactly one year. The former may explain the latter. 

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Re: [RBW] Thinking of a Riv

[Tim Butterfield]

Well, my component choices just got a bit more complicated.  Isn't that
what always happens?  It might not be quite as roadish as initially
anticipated.

The problem was I got to thinking of future uses as has been mentioned
before.  That thinking can often cause these problems.  I expect my AHH to
arrive sometime in August.  Just a few months further down the calendar,
winter will be starting.  Here in Anacortes, that means it is getting dark
earlier.  If I want to do any riding after work, I'm going to need
lighting.  With the whole ride being in the dark, I don't want to have to
keep recharging batteries.  See what's happening here?  It's like the thin
edge of a wedge.  :)

If I'm not using battery lights, that means a dyno hub.  Now, I'm into
custom wheels also.  Might as well do the rear, too.  This little detour
has added these to my tentative build list:

Busch IQ-X headlight (black)
SONdelux Wide Body Dyno Hub 36h
Phil “Rivy” Rear Hub 36h

The winters are wet here, so I might as well add these:
SKS/ESGE LongBoard Silver Fenders

Well, I'm almost there anyway.  What about racks?  This isn't full touring,
though.  So, let's keep it light with these:
Nitto Mark's Rack M1 - 20108
Nitto R-14 Top Rack

Less than six months after getting the AHH, it's role has already
progressed beyond my initial guess.  It's not quite as roady as first
thought, but probably more usable.

These are just my initial guesses at my options.  Feel free to convince me
otherwise.  I can always use an education and reasoning on options will
help reaffirm choices.

Thanks again for all of the assistance.

Tim



On Wed, May 25, 2016 at 7:14 PM, Tim Butterfield 
wrote:

> I've been thinking of getting a Rivendell bicycle for a long time.  I
> first joined this group to lurk back in 2010 and have been a member and
> sometimes lurker since then.  But, I had not made the commitment and
> purchased a Riv.  The closest I came was getting a Velo-Orange Rando.  That
> was sort of rivish.
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/timbutterfield/sets/72157624827193423
>
> Being in the suburbs of Chicago near O'Hare airport limited my comfort
> using it the way it should have been.  That bike was sold before I left
> Chicago to live full-time in an RV.  Once we decided to settle in
> Anacortes, WA (still in the RV), I purchased a Specialized AWOL Comp,
> definitely not rivish.
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/timbutterfield/sets/72157644371355428
>
> It's a nice bike, but I now want something more rivish, this time, the
> real thing.  I'm thinking of getting either the Roadeo or the A Homer
> Hilsen.  I like the idea of the liveliness and sportiness of the Roadeo,
> but like the bit of extra versatility of the AHH also.  With my weight at
> 200+ (PBH 33" or 83.8cm, age 51), I'm leaning towards the AHH instead of
> the Roadeo.  I can start more roadish with the AHH and, as I build my
> abilities further, expand the bike to fit new and/or different tasks
> without having to change frames.
>
> So, I'm fairly settled on getting my first Riv, one of the two mentioned.
> My pondering now is mostly on how to appoint it.  My Rando was more modern
> with the 105 setup.  The AWOL was definitely modern with discs and SRAM
> setup.  But, I'm not tied to that.  Though I haven't used it much, I like
> the looks of a quill stem, drop bars, and downtube shifters.  It looks
> clean and simple.  I'm just not sure what it's like to live with.  I expect
> that, like many things, it is a matter of adapting to it.  But, using DT
> shifters or bar ends does set a direction as neither would work with an
> 11-speed I could have instead.  I'm trying to consider the pros and cons of
> each.
>
> With my AWOL, I leave it locked to the cabana just outside my RV.  Some
> RVs have sufficient inside storage for a bike.  Mine doesn't.
>
> My questions to the group are these:  As I am not yet doing longer
> distances, are there still benefits to the more traditional setups?  If I
> pick either one, what might I later miss the other may have provided?  Are
> there likely to be any weather related or other wear issues leaving a Riv
> locked to the RV park cabana like I do my AWOL?  I'm doubtful of that, but
> don't want to mistreat it either.  Any thing else I should consider?
>
> Thanks for any advice you have.
>
> Tim
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Thinking of a Riv

[Tim Butterfield]

Thanks, Avery.  I'm looking forward to riding my Homer.

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 5:46 PM, Avery Wilson  wrote:

> I don't know if I've ever heard of anyone getting an A. Homer Hilsen and
> regretting it. Hands down, it's just a fantastic road bike. It's certainly
> the best I've ever ridden.  My dad, a dedicated carbon-riding roadie has
> ridden it and conceded that it has a "magical" ride quality about it.
>
> See below for relevant stats if interested:
>
> I am 5'10" with an 88.5pbh. I ride a 2010 black and cream Waterford-built
> 61cm Homer that I've had canti bosses brazed onto the back, and swapped the
> fork for an old stock cantilever Hillborne fork. Since I'm long of leg and
> short of torso, I use a 6cm technomic fork with 46cm Noodles. I'm running
> Soma Supple Vitesse 42mm tires with sks P50 fenders and it's just perfect.
>
> You will love the Homer.
>
> Avery Wilson
> Indianapolis, IN
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Thinking of a Riv

[Avery Wilson]

I don't know if I've ever heard of anyone getting an A. Homer Hilsen and 
regretting it. Hands down, it's just a fantastic road bike. It's certainly the 
best I've ever ridden.  My dad, a dedicated carbon-riding roadie has ridden it 
and conceded that it has a "magical" ride quality about it. 

See below for relevant stats if interested: 

I am 5'10" with an 88.5pbh. I ride a 2010 black and cream Waterford-built 61cm 
Homer that I've had canti bosses brazed onto the back, and swapped the fork for 
an old stock cantilever Hillborne fork. Since I'm long of leg and short of 
torso, I use a 6cm technomic fork with 46cm Noodles. I'm running Soma Supple 
Vitesse 42mm tires with sks P50 fenders and it's just perfect.

You will love the Homer. 

Avery Wilson 
Indianapolis, IN 

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[RBW] Re: FS: Willow Chainring Sale

[David Banzer]

I must've deleted them on the site. Listed on eBay: 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/172186480246?var==STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649
Price would be $30 plus the shipping per order cost.
Thanks,
David
Chicago

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 6:21:18 PM UTC-5, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> What cranks do you have? I don't see pics on the site. 

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Re: [RBW] Sugino chainring swap as easy as this Rivideo makes it look?

[Deacon Patrick]

Glimpses betwixt the ears are always scary.

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 5:20:20 PM UTC-6, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> It all makes sense now! Sort of! 

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[RBW] Re: FS: Willow Chainring Sale

[Joe Bernard]

What cranks do you have? I don't see pics on the site. 

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Re: [RBW] Sugino chainring swap as easy as this Rivideo makes it look?

[Joe Bernard]

It all makes sense now! Sort of! 

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Re: [RBW] Sugino chainring swap as easy as this Rivideo makes it look?

[Deacon Patrick]

Rocks on the trail take great pleasure in scratching my cranks. If I do it 
for them, I'd get complaints from their rock union. But if you haffa splain 
it, it warnt worf it in the fus place! Sardonic grin.

With abandon (of a sense of humor recognized by an outside agency)
Patrick

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 4:31:14 PM UTC-6, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> I don't know what that means, Patrick, but I like it!

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[RBW] Re: FS: Willow Chainring Sale

[David Banzer]

Everything I have is listed, and it's mostly odd sizes, not too unlike what 
Riv is offering with their chainrings. So, 46t 110 middle position I have, 
technically not an outer ring, but I've used them mounted as an outer with 
no issues. 37t closest for middle ring. 

While this is out there to the group, I'll offer a Memorial Day weekend 
special, same as what I offered earlier this spring. Prices good through 
Monday - let's say just send me an email before I wake up Tuesday morning 
(6am CST). That'll be the cutoff.

The remaining sizes I have are listed at 
http://treetop.bigcartel.com/category/willow-chainrings-c
To get the sale prices - please contact me directly and I'll send an 
invoice through Paypal.
Sale prices are:
110 bcd - 46t & larger - $15
110 bcd - 39t & smaller - $12
74 bcd - $10
130 bcd - $15
135 bcd - $15
Triplizer Rings w/ Hardware - $20

Also have a few Shimano triple cranks (who knows why I stocked up on 
these!) that I don't need that are NOS - $30

Shipping is a flat $6 per order and will ship via USPS priority mail.
Again, contact me offlist to get the sale prices.
Thanks,
David Banzer
Chicago
treetop.bigcartel.com


On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 5:13:09 PM UTC-5, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> You have any:
> 110x36 middle silver
> 110x46 outer silver?
>
> Need for my triple crank.
>

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Re: [RBW] Sugino chainring swap as easy as this Rivideo makes it look?

[Patrick Moore]

Joe -- my short term memory is shot, so I don't know what it means either!
But I'm sure it's right, and I'm sure I like it too.

Patrick "context, why don't they include context?" Moore

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 4:31 PM, Joe Bernard  wrote:

> I don't know what that means, Patrick, but I like it!
>
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Re: [RBW] Sugino chainring swap as easy as this Rivideo makes it look?

[Joe Bernard]

I don't know what that means, Patrick, but I like it!

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Re: [RBW] Re: Thinking of a Riv

[Joe Bernard]

I agree about brifters and triples. They...what's the word I'm looking for 
here...SUCK.

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Re: [RBW] Re: S3X wheel: first impressions and home-hacked Cambio Corsa-type shifter

[Patrick Moore]

Questions that are probably more idle and curious than practical, but:

1. Has anyone put 2 cogs on the S3X driver? There is room.

2. If so, what sizes, and why these?

3. I could install a 13 in addition to the 15 that is the default; this
would give me:

76-57-48 and 88-66-55

Or: 76-66-57/55-48, which just theoretically might be nice.

4. The problem with this is, that with this frame, these dropouts, and
these cogs, I'll have to remove a half link to use the 13. (I've tried it
otherwise, every which way; using the 13 and the 15 requires shortening the
chain for the 13).

So (and this is the question): Is there any reason why I might not want to
use 2 pairs of (SRAM 9 speed) Powerlinks on either side of an internal
half-link? I daresay that, if one Powerlink pair works fine, then 2 of them
will work fine, too, if not twice as fine. Right?

At any rate, removing a half link to shift will be so annoying that one
would do this only for the longest rides. But academic and theoretical
curiosity has its rights, too.

Anyone?

Aside: link to a great Northern NM video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PnP9WvtCPY

Riv content: roads.

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[RBW] FS: Willow Chainring Sale

[Lungimsam]

You have any:
110x36 middle silver
110x46 outer silver?

Need for my triple crank.

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Re: [RBW] Thinking of a Riv

[Tim Butterfield]

René,

Thanks for the thoughts.  I'm not too worried about messing with my cockpit
for a while.  Until I live with it for a while, I have not way of knowing
whether any potential change is a real need for that change or just a lack
of adaptation on what is already there.  Because of that, at least to begin
with, I would like to get everything fixed in such a way that it is easier
to leave it as it is and adapt to it than to change it just because it is
easy.  I need to ensure any reason for change is real and not just imagined.

Thanks for the Compass bar mention, too.  I like it and have put the
Compass Randonneur 440mm on my tentative build list.

Tim


On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 10:07 AM, René Sterental 
wrote:

> I went from brifters on my pre-Riv road bikes to barends when I got my
> Homer, my first Rivendell and pretty quickly to downtube shifters as I was
> messing up with the cockpit a lot on all my subsequent Rivendell bikes. I
> like them so much in not even planning to try anything different in my
> upcoming 650b custom. Downtube shifters on all of them!
>
> Even on the Betty I placed them on the stem, so I'd be free to play with
> the cockpit.
>
> The best Rando handlebar is the Compass one. Best geometry and super
> comfortable. I tried the Nittos before. Might still have one for sale. The
> long ramps are probably not too ideal for brifters unless you want the long
> reach.
>
> I just upgraded to 2x10 on my Bike Friday which uses barends and it's
> wonderful.
>
> All the best, you can't really go wrong!
>
> René
>
>
> On Friday, May 27, 2016, Patrick Moore  wrote:
>
>> I run my Silver bar end shifter cables under the tape so that they exit
>> near the bar clamp. I shift 9 speeds, non-serial cogs (ie, home made
>> cassette) with no problems. VO copies of the Maes Parallel -- long ramps.
>>
>> On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 12:25 AM, Tim Butterfield <
>> timbutterfi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, May 25, 2016 at 10:45 PM, Tim Butterfield <
>>> timbutterfi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
 One thing I have noticed from the bike pictures that included bar end
 shifters is there seems to be more cable looped in front of the bars.  If I
 decide to add a front rack and bag later, would that extra cable have any
 interference from that?  Just wondering if there are any gotchas to be
 aware of.

>>>
>>> Just to be clear on this, I don't know what I may add in future,
>>> rack/bag, handlebar bag, etc.  My preference is for neat and tidy cable
>>> routing.  If barcon cables can be mostly tucked under the bar tape instead
>>> of big and loopy, they may still work for me.  But, I don't know how neat
>>> and tidy routing may affect cable life.
>>>
>>> Tim
>>>
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>>
>>
>>
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>> *
>> ***
>> *The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a
>> circumference on the contours of which all conditions, distinctions, and
>> individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu
>>
>> *Stat crux dum volvitur orbis.* *(The cross stands motionless while the
>> world revolves.) *Carthusian motto
>>
>> *It is *we *who change; *He* remains the same.* Eckhart
>>
>> *Kinei hos eromenon.* (*It moves [all things] as the beloved.) *Aristotle
>>
>>
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Re: [RBW] Thinking of a Riv

[Tim Butterfield]

Good to know.  Thanks.

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 9:37 AM, Patrick Moore  wrote:

> I run my Silver bar end shifter cables under the tape so that they exit
> near the bar clamp. I shift 9 speeds, non-serial cogs (ie, home made
> cassette) with no problems. VO copies of the Maes Parallel -- long ramps.
>
> On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 12:25 AM, Tim Butterfield <
> timbutterfi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, May 25, 2016 at 10:45 PM, Tim Butterfield <
>> timbutterfi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> One thing I have noticed from the bike pictures that included bar end
>>> shifters is there seems to be more cable looped in front of the bars.  If I
>>> decide to add a front rack and bag later, would that extra cable have any
>>> interference from that?  Just wondering if there are any gotchas to be
>>> aware of.
>>>
>>
>> Just to be clear on this, I don't know what I may add in future,
>> rack/bag, handlebar bag, etc.  My preference is for neat and tidy cable
>> routing.  If barcon cables can be mostly tucked under the bar tape instead
>> of big and loopy, they may still work for me.  But, I don't know how neat
>> and tidy routing may affect cable life.
>>
>> Tim
>>
>> --
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>
>
>
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> **
> **
> *The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a
> circumference on the contours of which all conditions, distinctions, and
> individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu
>
> *Stat crux dum volvitur orbis.* *(The cross stands motionless while the
> world revolves.) *Carthusian motto
>
> *It is *we *who change; *He* remains the same.* Eckhart
>
> *Kinei hos eromenon.* (*It moves [all things] as the beloved.) *Aristotle
>
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Thinking of a Riv

[Tim Butterfield]

Chris,
It's more of a drive than you think.  From Anacortes, WA, getting Walnut
Creek, CA is less than half the distance to Indy.  Thanks for the offer,
though.

Tim

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 8:47 AM, Christopher Wiggins 
wrote:

> Tim,  I'll be honest I didn't read all the responses,so I don't know where
> you are on this.  I have Sams, Appas and I own a AHH that you could ride.
> It's a bit of a drive, but it may clear things up a bit.
>
> Chris Wiggins
> Owner
> A1 Cyclery
> Indianapolis IN
>
> On Wednesday, May 25, 2016 at 10:38:33 PM UTC-4, Tim Butterfield wrote:
>
>> I've been thinking of getting a Rivendell bicycle for a long time.  I
>> first joined this group to lurk back in 2010 and have been a member and
>> sometimes lurker since then.  But, I had not made the commitment and
>> purchased a Riv.  The closest I came was getting a Velo-Orange Rando.  That
>> was sort of rivish.
>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/timbutterfield/sets/72157624827193423
>>
>> Being in the suburbs of Chicago near O'Hare airport limited my comfort
>> using it the way it should have been.  That bike was sold before I left
>> Chicago to live full-time in an RV.  Once we decided to settle in
>> Anacortes, WA (still in the RV), I purchased a Specialized AWOL Comp,
>> definitely not rivish.
>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/timbutterfield/sets/72157644371355428
>>
>> It's a nice bike, but I now want something more rivish, this time, the
>> real thing.  I'm thinking of getting either the Roadeo or the A Homer
>> Hilsen.  I like the idea of the liveliness and sportiness of the Roadeo,
>> but like the bit of extra versatility of the AHH also.  With my weight at
>> 200+ (PBH 33" or 83.8cm, age 51), I'm leaning towards the AHH instead of
>> the Roadeo.  I can start more roadish with the AHH and, as I build my
>> abilities further, expand the bike to fit new and/or different tasks
>> without having to change frames.
>>
>> So, I'm fairly settled on getting my first Riv, one of the two
>> mentioned.  My pondering now is mostly on how to appoint it.  My Rando was
>> more modern with the 105 setup.  The AWOL was definitely modern with discs
>> and SRAM setup.  But, I'm not tied to that.  Though I haven't used it much,
>> I like the looks of a quill stem, drop bars, and downtube shifters.  It
>> looks clean and simple.  I'm just not sure what it's like to live with.  I
>> expect that, like many things, it is a matter of adapting to it.  But,
>> using DT shifters or bar ends does set a direction as neither would work
>> with an 11-speed I could have instead.  I'm trying to consider the pros and
>> cons of each.
>>
>> With my AWOL, I leave it locked to the cabana just outside my RV.  Some
>> RVs have sufficient inside storage for a bike.  Mine doesn't.
>>
>> My questions to the group are these:  As I am not yet doing longer
>> distances, are there still benefits to the more traditional setups?  If I
>> pick either one, what might I later miss the other may have provided?  Are
>> there likely to be any weather related or other wear issues leaving a Riv
>> locked to the RV park cabana like I do my AWOL?  I'm doubtful of that, but
>> don't want to mistreat it either.  Any thing else I should consider?
>>
>> Thanks for any advice you have.
>>
>> Tim
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Thinking of a Riv

[Tim Butterfield]

Justin,
When I spoke with Dave earlier today, he mentioned Pauls now come in a
bolt-on.  Is there enough of a performance difference to get the Pauls
insted of the Tektro R559?  I like the mention of the Compass EL tires,
especially the Barlow EL mentioned by Surlyprof.

Thanks.

Tim



On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 6:56 AM, Justin August 
wrote:

> If I were ordering a new AHH I would ask for the following customization:
> - Paul Racer Braze-ons
> You won't regret having these brakes! I would also choose a custom color
> and use Compass EL tires.
>
> -Justin
>
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Re: [RBW] Sugino chainring swap as easy as this Rivideo makes it look?

[Deacon Patrick]

Plus then the decomposed granite rock union claims I took work from the 
rocks. Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 3:46:16 PM UTC-6, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> I'm not a big fan of this process 'cause it's easy to scratch the cranks
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Thinking of a Riv

[Tim Butterfield]

Tim,
That's an interesting take on 2x for brifters and 3x for bar-ends.  I'll
need to think on that for a while.  I think right now that's what I'm the
most undecided about.

For wheels, I want good and serviceable, but don't want bling I have to
keep polished to look okay.  So, the mid-range Shimano will probably work
well for that.

I was originally thinking B135 for the Nitto Randonneur, but the comment by
René has me leaning towards a 44 Compass now.

Thanks.

Tim

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 6:49 AM, Tim Gavin 
wrote:

>
> On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 10:47 PM, Tim Butterfield <
> timbutterfi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Tim,
>> Lots of great info.  Thanks.  If I go with bar ends, I was thinking of
>> running the cable along the bar, existing the tape vertically through a
>> notch in the inside of the brake hoods.  That may keep the cable loop from
>> going too far forward and interfering with a bag I may mount in the front
>> later.  This might avoid the friction of following the bar further along
>> while still keeping the cable tucked in a bit.
>>
>> > I changed the right bar-end out for a 10-speed indexed Shimano BS79
>> shifter
>>
>> I took a look at that shifter and one thing let to another until I was
>> looking at the Shimano SL-BSR1.  I hadn’t thought I could get an 11-speed
>> group with bar ends.  That’s tempting, though I would be giving up the
>> friction option.  Like you say, it’s only a twist of the adjustment barrel
>> every so often to tweak it.  But, then again, after reading the comments
>> after yours, I wonder whether I would be better off with the standard 3x9
>> from Riv.  I do like the gearing on that.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Tim
>>
>>
> Tim-
>
> Cable routing:
> Your routing plan sounds OK.  But I didn't mean to suggest that there is
> noticeable friction when the cables are routed all the way to the stem.
> Theoretically?  Yes.  In observation?  No, not if you use care to keep the
> bends as gradual as possible.
>
> I routed my shift cables along the bars to the stem, where the loops cross
> over to the opposite side of the downtube, and then cross over again
> between the downtube cable stops and the bottom bracket cable guide.  This
> makes the loops from the bars to the downtube more gradual, and it keeps
> the cable housing from rubbing on the head tube.  aka Sheldon Brown
> "criss-cross" 
>
>
> Drivetrain:
> 3 x 8 or 9 is excellent.  You can use a medium-range cassette (11-28 or
> 30) with a Riv/touring triple and still get good gear spacing but a wide
> gear range.  Also, 8 or 9 speed gear is more durable (wider chain spacing)
> and cheaper.
>
> 2 x 10 or 11 is also excellent.  But you have to use a wider-range
> cassette to get the same gear range as a triple, and the gear spacing will
> be wider.
>
> If I'm dead set on using brifters, I prefer a double crank.  If I'm dead
> set on a triple crank, I prefer bar-end shifters.
> In my experience, brifter triple shifting is picky.  It works best with
> the standard Shimano road triple (50/39/30) and doesn't like to work well
> with other ring combinations (especially rings without ramps & pins).
> Whereas, shifting a triple with a Silver bar-end is super easy.  And
> shifting a double with brifters seems to work pretty well.
>
> I use a Silver left shifter and indexed Shimano right shifter on both of
> my bikes with triple cranks.  I use brifters on both of my bikes with
> double cranks.
>
>
> On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 11:09 PM, Tim Butterfield <
> timbutterfi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> For some of the other components I'm narrowing down choices on...
>>
>> Bars - Nitto Randonneur - I want a drop bar and like the flare out of the
>> drop on these.  Earlier, Tim removed my worry about possibly using brifters
>> on it.  I had the FSA Wing Pro on my VO Rando and it was nice.  I think the
>> Randonneur flare may be a little better for me, though that's just a guess
>> right now.
>>
>> Wheels - Since I am not likely to need much lighting, battery power
>> should be sufficient for lighting instead of getting a dyno.  If I ever do
>> any touring later, I can get a dyno hub for the second wheel set.  I like
>> the idea of Phil hubs, but am leaning towards the standard Riv wheels.  I
>> don't know enough about Phils to know if extra cost difference would be
>> worth it for my application.
>>
>>
>>
>>
> Wheels:
> Riv/Rich recommend mid-range Shimano hubs, which are quite good.  They're
> less expensive than boutique hubs, and any shop (or you) can service them
> easily.
> Pauls are nice (I have a set of 90s vintage freewheel Pauls), but I'm not
> convinced that they're worth the huge premium.
> I bought a Velo Orange Grand Cru Touring hub for my latest wheel build;
> it's about the same price as Ultegra hubs but it has cartridge bearings and
> is field-serviceable without tools.
>
> Bars:
> I love the Nitto Randonneur bars, but be warned that they come in a couple
> 

Re: [RBW] Sugino chainring swap as easy as this Rivideo makes it look?

[Joe Bernard]

Yep. It's fiddly, but you can twist them away from the bolt mounts, then 
carefully slide them past the crankarm and pedal. It's best to hold the middle 
ring in place with one backing nut still installed while you get the big one 
off first. 

I'm not a big fan of this process 'cause it's easy to scratch the cranks, but 
I've done it a bunch of times. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Thinking of a Riv

[Tim Butterfield]

Thanks, Phillip.
I know Grant designed the San Marcos, but it's a Soma and, to me, not a
real Riv that is currently sold at rivbike.com.  For that requirement, I
think the AHH is as good as I can get.

Tim

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 6:36 AM, Philip Kim  wrote:

> I've owned a Hillborne and Cheviot, before settling on the San Marcos.
> This I'm building up for my gf, and then waiting for a Hunq, which should
> be ready in a couple of weeks
>
> Once you own one, you want to own them all. They all ride great, but due
> to limitations in space and money, I settles on the Hunq and San Marcos.
> The San Marcos is a bit zippier than a Hillborne.
>
> From reaching out to people who've ridden both the San Marcos and the AHH,
> it seems the San Marcos is a bit zippier than the AHH. Maybe it could be a
> nice middle ground between the AHH and Rodeo? Also a bit cheaper. Not as
> nice paint, but Riv geo and lugs.
>
> On Wednesday, May 25, 2016 at 10:38:33 PM UTC-4, Tim Butterfield wrote:
>
>> I've been thinking of getting a Rivendell bicycle for a long time.  I
>> first joined this group to lurk back in 2010 and have been a member and
>> sometimes lurker since then.  But, I had not made the commitment and
>> purchased a Riv.  The closest I came was getting a Velo-Orange Rando.  That
>> was sort of rivish.
>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/timbutterfield/sets/72157624827193423
>>
>> Being in the suburbs of Chicago near O'Hare airport limited my comfort
>> using it the way it should have been.  That bike was sold before I left
>> Chicago to live full-time in an RV.  Once we decided to settle in
>> Anacortes, WA (still in the RV), I purchased a Specialized AWOL Comp,
>> definitely not rivish.
>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/timbutterfield/sets/72157644371355428
>>
>> It's a nice bike, but I now want something more rivish, this time, the
>> real thing.  I'm thinking of getting either the Roadeo or the A Homer
>> Hilsen.  I like the idea of the liveliness and sportiness of the Roadeo,
>> but like the bit of extra versatility of the AHH also.  With my weight at
>> 200+ (PBH 33" or 83.8cm, age 51), I'm leaning towards the AHH instead of
>> the Roadeo.  I can start more roadish with the AHH and, as I build my
>> abilities further, expand the bike to fit new and/or different tasks
>> without having to change frames.
>>
>> So, I'm fairly settled on getting my first Riv, one of the two
>> mentioned.  My pondering now is mostly on how to appoint it.  My Rando was
>> more modern with the 105 setup.  The AWOL was definitely modern with discs
>> and SRAM setup.  But, I'm not tied to that.  Though I haven't used it much,
>> I like the looks of a quill stem, drop bars, and downtube shifters.  It
>> looks clean and simple.  I'm just not sure what it's like to live with.  I
>> expect that, like many things, it is a matter of adapting to it.  But,
>> using DT shifters or bar ends does set a direction as neither would work
>> with an 11-speed I could have instead.  I'm trying to consider the pros and
>> cons of each.
>>
>> With my AWOL, I leave it locked to the cabana just outside my RV.  Some
>> RVs have sufficient inside storage for a bike.  Mine doesn't.
>>
>> My questions to the group are these:  As I am not yet doing longer
>> distances, are there still benefits to the more traditional setups?  If I
>> pick either one, what might I later miss the other may have provided?  Are
>> there likely to be any weather related or other wear issues leaving a Riv
>> locked to the RV park cabana like I do my AWOL?  I'm doubtful of that, but
>> don't want to mistreat it either.  Any thing else I should consider?
>>
>> Thanks for any advice you have.
>>
>> Tim
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Lungimsam]

I am guessing my Sam and Bleriot have similar mileages but the Sam's xd2 rings 
look better than the xd600 rings on the Bleriot.

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[RBW] Re: Frame bag recommendations

[Bill Lindsay]

I recommend having Ruthworks make one for you.  Ely does great work. 
 Google Ruthworks and you'll find his site, and contact info.

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 1:20:30 PM UTC-7, Jared Volpe wrote:
>
> Hi all. Searched the list and didn't come up with anything conclusive. I'm 
> looking for a frame bag for my 64 cm Bomba. There is about 4" of space 
> between the top bars. Thanks!
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Remember Islabikes?

['Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch]

You guys are conflating the things I've written.This is not about snobbery 
or proselytizing,  not about anti this or that, not about who should or 
should not be on the list. I did not question anyone's qualifications for 
being on RBW.  If you have actually read what I wrote and the reason for 
my, let's face it, in the context of life, mild dismay at Islabikes is not 
clear, I cheerfully give up! Wait, one last time: 

There is a kid's bicycle company. It appeared that they had some Riv-like 
qualities and a similar approach to bicycles as RBW. I purchased a bike 
from them based in some good measure on this approach. They are now 
offering a line of kid's bikes that in many ways goes against this approach 
toward making and selling bicycles. I am disappointed. You don't have to 
be. Not in the slightest. 

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 4:30:26 PM UTC-4, Daniel D. wrote:
>
> Because I like steel, I like pretty paint jobs, I like wool, I like 
> swedish axes, I like leather saddles, I like lugs, I like racks, I like 
> nice bags, I like the best bike shop experience ever, 
>
>  But what I enjoy and am willing to spend is not the end all be all . 
>  Don't get the snobbery and need for it to be a "cause".   
>
> On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 11:56:27 AM UTC-7, Mark in Beacon wrote:
>>
>> And by the way, this idea that they are "filling a market" and "giving 
>> customers what they want" is also a bit suspect. One reason RBW is such a 
>> niche company is that the majority of people shopping for bicycles are at 
>> the mercy of the industry, which has a vested interest in pushing certain 
>> types of bicycles. And if you don't get that, I am truly puzzled why you 
>> are on this list. (Note that none of this means I think people should only 
>> ride Rivendells, or that carbon sucks, or that people cannot have fun on 
>> pro style racing bicycles. It's not about that per se.)
>>
>>
>> On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 11:40:55 AM UTC-4, RJM wrote:
>>>
>>> There is a lot of negativity towards this company here which made me 
>>> check the link so I can understand why, and after I still don't get it. 
>>>
>>> I've never heard of this company before but I understand why they are 
>>> making this pro line...not a lot of companies cater to the young racer and 
>>> offer equipment for that. They are filling a market. If you don't believe 
>>> that kids that young are racing then you aren't attending many races. Just 
>>> this past weekend I worked a local mountain bike race day and there was a 
>>> kid class, and they were competitive and having fun at the same time riding 
>>> a smaller portion of the same trail that the adults rode on. Very capable 
>>> kids. 
>>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] Tire wear question. When to replace?

[Brewster Fong]

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 1:57:27 PM UTC-7, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
> Or, you could do as Saint Sheldon recommended, and put the new tire on 
> the front and rotate the front tire to the back.  


Don't forget the rest of it, take the rear tire and throw it out when it is 
worn!  
 

> It's important to have 
> a good tire on the front.  This insures the best one's on the front, and 
> -- as with other versions of rotation schemes -- prolongs the life of 
> the tire. 
>

I agree that the best tire should always be in front. That is why - new 
front, old front to rear and throw out the rear when it is worn.

Good Luck! 

>
> On 05/27/2016 04:23 PM, ian m wrote: 
> > Rotate your tires, you should get less wear on the front than the rear 
> and can possibly prolong the life of the tire. Good to do this semi 
> regularly so you don't end up with one tire much more worn than the other 
> > 
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Sugino chainring swap as easy as this Rivideo makes it look?

[Lungimsam]

Is it possiblt to finagle the middel and big rings off without having to pop 
the crank?

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Re: [RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Patrick Moore]

Similar to what? 3 people gave 3 different numbers.

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 2:49 PM, Lungimsam  wrote:

> Similar mileage
>
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Re: [RBW] Tire wear question. When to replace?

[Lungimsam]

Im thinking put the new one on the back. The front still has file tread on it. 
Not worn off yet. And I can see it better to monitor. So with the new one on 
the back maybe they will wear down at the same time and can get a new set at 
once.

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Re: [RBW] Tire wear question. When to replace?

[Steve Palincsar]

Or, you could do as Saint Sheldon recommended, and put the new tire on 
the front and rotate the front tire to the back.  It's important to have 
a good tire on the front.  This insures the best one's on the front, and 
-- as with other versions of rotation schemes -- prolongs the life of 
the tire.


On 05/27/2016 04:23 PM, ian m wrote:

Rotate your tires, you should get less wear on the front than the rear and can 
possibly prolong the life of the tire. Good to do this semi regularly so you 
don't end up with one tire much more worn than the other



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Re: [RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Lungimsam]

Ill have to go back and check some of my old ride tecords and mileages. My mind 
may have just stopped tracking miles after I hit 3k on the bikes. I havent had 
a computer on either bike since early 2016 either.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Lungimsam]

Similar mileage

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[RBW] Re: Now (nearly) fully stocked

[Ron Mc]

Fair enough

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[RBW] Re: Tire wear question. When to replace?

[Deacon Patrick]

I just replace each tire as needed. No muss, no fuss.

With abandon,
Patrick

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 2:23:50 PM UTC-6, ian m wrote:
>
> Rotate your tires, you should get less wear on the front than the rear and 
> can possibly prolong the life of the tire. Good to do this semi regularly 
> so you don't end up with one tire much more worn than the other 

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[RBW] Re: Now (nearly) fully stocked

[Christopher Wiggins]

Ron, If there were more bike racks we couldn't ride circles in the store. 
 A guys gotta have some fun at work!


On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 11:42:49 AM UTC-4, Ron Mc wrote:
>
> I think you need more bike racks - there' plenty of walking space
>
> On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 10:40:42 AM UTC-5, Christopher Wiggins wrote:
>>
>> Sams have arrived and are ready to roll.  Mid sized Appas still in stock. 
>>  One big Clem left until late summer.  It's a great time to visit Indy and 
>> ride a Riv.  If you decide to buy you can even ride around the Speedway and 
>> see some of the craziness of the 100th running of the 500!  
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Remember Islabikes?

[Daniel D.]

Because I like steel, I like pretty paint jobs, I like wool, I like swedish 
axes, I like leather saddles, I like lugs, I like racks, I like nice bags, 
I like the best bike shop experience ever, 

 But what I enjoy and am willing to spend is not the end all be all . 
 Don't get the snobbery and need for it to be a "cause".   

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 11:56:27 AM UTC-7, Mark in Beacon wrote:
>
> And by the way, this idea that they are "filling a market" and "giving 
> customers what they want" is also a bit suspect. One reason RBW is such a 
> niche company is that the majority of people shopping for bicycles are at 
> the mercy of the industry, which has a vested interest in pushing certain 
> types of bicycles. And if you don't get that, I am truly puzzled why you 
> are on this list. (Note that none of this means I think people should only 
> ride Rivendells, or that carbon sucks, or that people cannot have fun on 
> pro style racing bicycles. It's not about that per se.)
>
>
> On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 11:40:55 AM UTC-4, RJM wrote:
>>
>> There is a lot of negativity towards this company here which made me 
>> check the link so I can understand why, and after I still don't get it. 
>>
>> I've never heard of this company before but I understand why they are 
>> making this pro line...not a lot of companies cater to the young racer and 
>> offer equipment for that. They are filling a market. If you don't believe 
>> that kids that young are racing then you aren't attending many races. Just 
>> this past weekend I worked a local mountain bike race day and there was a 
>> kid class, and they were competitive and having fun at the same time riding 
>> a smaller portion of the same trail that the adults rode on. Very capable 
>> kids. 
>>
>>

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[RBW] Tire wear question. When to replace?

[ian m]

Rotate your tires, you should get less wear on the front than the rear and can 
possibly prolong the life of the tire. Good to do this semi regularly so you 
don't end up with one tire much more worn than the other 

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[RBW] Frame bag recommendations

[Jared Volpe]

Hi all. Searched the list and didn't come up with anything conclusive. I'm 
looking for a frame bag for my 64 cm Bomba. There is about 4" of space 
between the top bars. Thanks!

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Re: [RBW] Re: Massively upgraded Appaloosa

[Bill Lindsay]

Speaking of which, I do have the matching XTR greyish rear derailer on my 
Atlantis.  Perhaps I should switch that over...

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 11:18:12 AM UTC-7, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> I think a mustard Appa slathered with greyish black XTR bits would look 
> fabulous. Would it work appreciably better than the stock build? That's not 
> the point!

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Re: [RBW] Re: Remember Islabikes?

[RJM]

Maybe Grant needs to make some kids bikes then.

 But, it seems that Islaybikes are also making the bikes you seek along 
with a line of bikes more performance oriented for those seeking such. 
Choices are good and in today's bike marketplace, there are a ton of them. 
I just fail to see how offering both is that big of a deal. 



As to questioning why I'm on this list... I've owned 4 rivs and still have 
two; even bought and sold stuff to list members. I've even purchased 
a Gransfors Bruks hatchet and two copies of "Just Ride" and even gave one 
away so it isn't like I don't know what Rivendell is about. 

But...

I also started racing and appreciate nice race bikes and understand why 
people do it and actually enjoy doing it. Liking these two aspects of 
riding don't have to be mutually exclusive and I certainly see room for 
both. I also don't agree with Riv on carbon forks or carbon bikes, nor on 
lycra or disc brakes...but I don't have to agree with everything Rivendell 
stands for to enjoy the bikes nor the list. I don't have to choose just one 
"philosophy" when I can enjoy all of it. 




On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 1:56:27 PM UTC-5, Mark in Beacon wrote:

> From my first post in this thread:
>
>
>> *I understand there are arguments for the existence of these things--hey, 
>> if you have the money and you want the "best" why not? Hey, life is 
>> competition, give the kid an edge. Hey, why not emulate your "heroes. ...*
>
>  
>
>> *It goes without saying that this is strictly my point of view. *
>>
>
> But since you never heard of the company until today I am going to assume 
> you are also not familiar with its original approach to kid's bikes, that 
> may be why you don't understand why at least a couple of us who bought 
> bicycles from them recently might feel betrayed or disappointed by this 
> latest direction of "pro" bicycles for 4-year-olds. From Why Islabikes:
>
> *It’s easy to be tempted by the latest technology on adult bikes and the 
>> ideas that often unnecessarily trickle down to kids’ bikes. Isla focuses on 
>> the sort of advantages that make riding easier and more pleasurable*
>>
>> *The reputation of an Islabike helps maintain high resale value. A bike 
>> designed with an emphasis on making the whole ride experience easier and 
>> safer will never have the cheapest price tag, however, the ideal fit, 
>> durability, ease of maintenance, and desirability of an Islabike ensure 
>> retention of value. *
>>
>
> Sound at all like the ethos embodied by another bicycle company you've 
> heard of? (Note that the "retention of value" to this point does not yet 
> include the new pro line, which is still in the pre-order phase.) Sound at 
> all like they will need to change this little blurb with the advent of the 
> "Pro Series"?
>
>  As I also said earlier, if I had known this was Islabikes take on things, 
> I had several other choices in terms of companies that sell decent kids 
> bikes to choose from and might well have gone another way. So you see, it's 
> partly the context here, which should be clear enough. And by that I mean 
> both the scenario outlined above and the fact that this is a forum that, at 
> least loosely, is based on the idea of celebrating a philosophy of "just 
> ride," of practical bicycles not limited by the parameters of modern day 
> pro level machines. No doubt there are many places on the Internet to 
> celebrate carbon fiber racing bicycles designed for kids 4-12 years old.
>
> And by the way, this idea that they are "filling a market" and "giving 
> customers what they want" is also a bit suspect. One reason RBW is such a 
> niche company is that the majority of people shopping for bicycles are at 
> the mercy of the industry, which has a vested interest in pushing certain 
> types of bicycles. And if you don't get that, I am truly puzzled why you 
> are on this list. (Note that none of this means I think people should only 
> ride Rivendells, or that carbon sucks, or that people cannot have fun on 
> pro style racing bicycles. It's not about that per se.)
>
>
> On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 11:40:55 AM UTC-4, RJM wrote:
>>
>> There is a lot of negativity towards this company here which made me 
>> check the link so I can understand why, and after I still don't get it. 
>>
>> I've never heard of this company before but I understand why they are 
>> making this pro line...not a lot of companies cater to the young racer and 
>> offer equipment for that. They are filling a market. If you don't believe 
>> that kids that young are racing then you aren't attending many races. Just 
>> this past weekend I worked a local mountain bike race day and there was a 
>> kid class, and they were competitive and having fun at the same time riding 
>> a smaller portion of the same trail that the adults rode on. Very capable 
>> kids. 
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Patrick Moore]

Same as what?

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 12:17 PM, Lungimsam  wrote:

> My XD2 on the Sam has about the same and still looks good, too.
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Remember Islabikes?

[Scott Henry]

I'm on this list because I like bicycles.All of them, not just bikes
that Grant markets.   He does contract out some pretty ones, but I like all
bikes.   My stable starts with a 1958 Schwinn and goes straight thru to a
2015 Haanjo cross.   There are bikes of steel, aluminum and carbon, I've
sold a ti.They all ride different, but they are all fine bikes designed
for different tasks.   I have a quickbeam, its pretty and it does what it
is designed to do.

Sometimes I wonder how many on this list in particular have ever ridden a
carbon bike.  They really aren't that bad and they certainly aren't that
dangerous.I can't see how it will hurt their 'retention of value' in
the least.
Ideal fit, durability and ease of maintenance is really just marketing
verbiage.   Its a bicycle: fit comes from offering sizes, bikes are durable
by design and ease of maintenance - there are 12 year olds building these
things in asia, they aren't that complicated.



On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 2:56 PM, 'Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch <
rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> From my first post in this thread:
>
>
>> *I understand there are arguments for the existence of these things--hey,
>> if you have the money and you want the "best" why not? Hey, life is
>> competition, give the kid an edge. Hey, why not emulate your "heroes. ...*
>
>
>
>> *It goes without saying that this is strictly my point of view. *
>>
>
> But since you never heard of the company until today I am going to assume
> you are also not familiar with its original approach to kid's bikes, that
> may be why you don't understand why at least a couple of us who bought
> bicycles from them recently might feel betrayed or disappointed by this
> latest direction of "pro" bicycles for 4-year-olds. From Why Islabikes:
>
> *It’s easy to be tempted by the latest technology on adult bikes and the
>> ideas that often unnecessarily trickle down to kids’ bikes. Isla focuses on
>> the sort of advantages that make riding easier and more pleasurable*
>>
>> *The reputation of an Islabike helps maintain high resale value. A bike
>> designed with an emphasis on making the whole ride experience easier and
>> safer will never have the cheapest price tag, however, the ideal fit,
>> durability, ease of maintenance, and desirability of an Islabike ensure
>> retention of value. *
>>
>
> Sound at all like the ethos embodied by another bicycle company you've
> heard of? (Note that the "retention of value" to this point does not yet
> include the new pro line, which is still in the pre-order phase.) Sound at
> all like they will need to change this little blurb with the advent of the
> "Pro Series"?
>
>  As I also said earlier, if I had known this was Islabikes take on things,
> I had several other choices in terms of companies that sell decent kids
> bikes to choose from and might well have gone another way. So you see, it's
> partly the context here, which should be clear enough. And by that I mean
> both the scenario outlined above and the fact that this is a forum that, at
> least loosely, is based on the idea of celebrating a philosophy of "just
> ride," of practical bicycles not limited by the parameters of modern day
> pro level machines. No doubt there are many places on the Internet to
> celebrate carbon fiber racing bicycles designed for kids 4-12 years old.
>
> And by the way, this idea that they are "filling a market" and "giving
> customers what they want" is also a bit suspect. One reason RBW is such a
> niche company is that the majority of people shopping for bicycles are at
> the mercy of the industry, which has a vested interest in pushing certain
> types of bicycles. And if you don't get that, I am truly puzzled why you
> are on this list. (Note that none of this means I think people should only
> ride Rivendells, or that carbon sucks, or that people cannot have fun on
> pro style racing bicycles. It's not about that per se.)
>
>
> On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 11:40:55 AM UTC-4, RJM wrote:
>>
>> There is a lot of negativity towards this company here which made me
>> check the link so I can understand why, and after I still don't get it.
>>
>> I've never heard of this company before but I understand why they are
>> making this pro line...not a lot of companies cater to the young racer and
>> offer equipment for that. They are filling a market. If you don't believe
>> that kids that young are racing then you aren't attending many races. Just
>> this past weekend I worked a local mountain bike race day and there was a
>> kid class, and they were competitive and having fun at the same time riding
>> a smaller portion of the same trail that the adults rode on. Very capable
>> kids.
>>
>> --
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Re: [RBW] Re: Tire wear question. When to replace?

[Steve Palincsar]

Or, in my case, with the tire removed from the wheel, inspired by having 
to fix a flat tire.  When the difference in the center reaches a "Holy 
%$#@!" state I definitely replace the tire.


On 05/27/2016 11:18 AM, Peter White wrote:
This is done with no air in the tube. Just roll the tire tread back 
and forth between your thumb and a finger. As the tire wears, the 
center becomes thinner, and the difference in thickness becomes more 
obvious.


PJW

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 8:51 AM, Steve Palincsar > wrote:



And yes, I agree, excessive thinness of tread is my major reason
for replacing tires.  I gauge it by pinch-testing the tire.



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[RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[ascpgh]

Those TA rings are the finest. My Zephyr crankset introduced me to them and 
I am now ruined to others. Fit, finish and durability. I wasn't a chainring 
elitist until trying these.

A choice not wasted if you dare.

Andy Cheatham
Pittsburgh 

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 8:58:29 AM UTC-4, Ron Mc wrote:
>
> might want to hunt in UK for TA chainrings
>
> On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 3:48:16 AM UTC-5, Lungimsam wrote:
>>
>> But I think I only have 3k miles on them.
>> If they go bad that fast, what better options are there to put on the 
>> xd600 cranks that will last longer?
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Remember Islabikes?

['Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch]

>From my first post in this thread:


> *I understand there are arguments for the existence of these things--hey, 
> if you have the money and you want the "best" why not? Hey, life is 
> competition, give the kid an edge. Hey, why not emulate your "heroes. ...*

 

> *It goes without saying that this is strictly my point of view. *
>

But since you never heard of the company until today I am going to assume 
you are also not familiar with its original approach to kid's bikes, that 
may be why you don't understand why at least a couple of us who bought 
bicycles from them recently might feel betrayed or disappointed by this 
latest direction of "pro" bicycles for 4-year-olds. From Why Islabikes:

*It’s easy to be tempted by the latest technology on adult bikes and the 
> ideas that often unnecessarily trickle down to kids’ bikes. Isla focuses on 
> the sort of advantages that make riding easier and more pleasurable*
>
> *The reputation of an Islabike helps maintain high resale value. A bike 
> designed with an emphasis on making the whole ride experience easier and 
> safer will never have the cheapest price tag, however, the ideal fit, 
> durability, ease of maintenance, and desirability of an Islabike ensure 
> retention of value. *
>

Sound at all like the ethos embodied by another bicycle company you've 
heard of? (Note that the "retention of value" to this point does not yet 
include the new pro line, which is still in the pre-order phase.) Sound at 
all like they will need to change this little blurb with the advent of the 
"Pro Series"?

 As I also said earlier, if I had known this was Islabikes take on things, 
I had several other choices in terms of companies that sell decent kids 
bikes to choose from and might well have gone another way. So you see, it's 
partly the context here, which should be clear enough. And by that I mean 
both the scenario outlined above and the fact that this is a forum that, at 
least loosely, is based on the idea of celebrating a philosophy of "just 
ride," of practical bicycles not limited by the parameters of modern day 
pro level machines. No doubt there are many places on the Internet to 
celebrate carbon fiber racing bicycles designed for kids 4-12 years old.

And by the way, this idea that they are "filling a market" and "giving 
customers what they want" is also a bit suspect. One reason RBW is such a 
niche company is that the majority of people shopping for bicycles are at 
the mercy of the industry, which has a vested interest in pushing certain 
types of bicycles. And if you don't get that, I am truly puzzled why you 
are on this list. (Note that none of this means I think people should only 
ride Rivendells, or that carbon sucks, or that people cannot have fun on 
pro style racing bicycles. It's not about that per se.)


On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 11:40:55 AM UTC-4, RJM wrote:
>
> There is a lot of negativity towards this company here which made me check 
> the link so I can understand why, and after I still don't get it. 
>
> I've never heard of this company before but I understand why they are 
> making this pro line...not a lot of companies cater to the young racer and 
> offer equipment for that. They are filling a market. If you don't believe 
> that kids that young are racing then you aren't attending many races. Just 
> this past weekend I worked a local mountain bike race day and there was a 
> kid class, and they were competitive and having fun at the same time riding 
> a smaller portion of the same trail that the adults rode on. Very capable 
> kids. 
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Brewster Fong]

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 9:42:53 AM UTC-7, Ron Mc wrote:
>
> http://www.wiggle.com/ta-110-pcd-zephyr-middle-road-chainring-34-39t-1/
>

Interesting, when you call the ring "inner" ring instead of "middle" ring, 
you get the 33t included, but no 39t:

 http://www.wiggle.com/ta-110-pcd-zephyr-inner-road-chainring/

Good Luck!

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Re: [RBW] Re: Massively upgraded Appaloosa

[Joe Bernard]

I think a mustard Appa slathered with greyish black XTR bits would look 
fabulous. Would it work appreciably better than the stock build? That's not the 
point!

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[RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Lungimsam]

My XD2 on the Sam has about the same and still looks good, too.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Massively upgraded Appaloosa

[Keith Muller]

Like a good friend likes to say.  If it's worth doing, then it's worth over 
doing.  Is it necessary? Never!  Is it fun to do?  Hells yes!  Kind of like my 
Hunqapillar equipped with an XTR 11-speed one-by drivetrain.  Completely 
unnecessary in a sense, but it's lots of fun and it sure looks pretty!

Keith

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Re: [RBW] Re: Massively upgraded Appaloosa

[Patrick Kelly]

For myself, I believe replacing the brake cable housing was necessary.
The brakes worked before. The bike stopped when needed. I never felt
they were failing. But I wasn't happy with the feel of the brakes.
Let's just say they did not feel satisfactory to me.

My fix can't be classified as scientific, because I swapped out levers
and pads as well, but I believe the biggest improvement in my braking
was when I changed the cable housing.

Let me also point out that I live on top of a 700 ft hill that
descends in 2 miles. Whenever I go anywhere I my bike, I start with a
downhill ride where I easily hit 35 MPH, and I'm among cars going that
fast or faster. Tip top brake performance is very important to me. If
I lived and rode in Davis (eg) it would not be quite as critical. :)


On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 6:58 AM, Bill Lindsay  wrote:
> Zach
>
> I don't know that it would be fair for me to call you "wrong".  If that's
> how you wanted to understand what I did, then I wouldn't try to talk you out
> of it.
>
> From my perspective, it was the equivalent of seeing a hat that I liked, and
> buying it on impulse, because I liked it.  Did I need a hat?  Probably not.
> Did I need  to run Shimano XTR brakes on my Appaloosa?  No.  Did I need to
> change brake cable housing on my Appaloosa?  No.
>
> I did, however, decide to upgrade the brakes on my Appaloosa, and that
> decision has led to several improvements to my bicycle.  Two of those
> several improvements were:
>
> 1.  New cable housing made the brakes less squishy
> 2.  New cable housing is reflective, further increasing my conspicuity
>
> There are other improvements, but I wouldn't encourage people to desperately
> start searching for NOS XTR brakes.  I bought them used and on impulse for a
> price that I felt was too low to pass up.  I shared the story for the
> entertainment of the group.  If a fellow Appaloosa owner goes and swaps
> brake cable housing and finds a big improvement, while leaving the stock
> brakes in place, I will be similarly entertained to hear about it.
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
>
> On Thursday, May 26, 2016 at 6:51:16 PM UTC-7, Zach Kahl wrote:
>>
>> Am I wrong to understand that you bought new brakes when all you needed to
>> do in the first place was replace your housing?
>>
>> Thanks for the updates with your journey of the Appaloosa, it's been a fun
>> one to watch.
>
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[RBW] Re: Massively upgraded Appaloosa

[Ron Mc]

I think it looks great and was entertained. 

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Re: [RBW] Thinking of a Riv

[René Sterental]

I went from brifters on my pre-Riv road bikes to barends when I got my
Homer, my first Rivendell and pretty quickly to downtube shifters as I was
messing up with the cockpit a lot on all my subsequent Rivendell bikes. I
like them so much in not even planning to try anything different in my
upcoming 650b custom. Downtube shifters on all of them!

Even on the Betty I placed them on the stem, so I'd be free to play with
the cockpit.

The best Rando handlebar is the Compass one. Best geometry and super
comfortable. I tried the Nittos before. Might still have one for sale. The
long ramps are probably not too ideal for brifters unless you want the long
reach.

I just upgraded to 2x10 on my Bike Friday which uses barends and it's
wonderful.

All the best, you can't really go wrong!

René

On Friday, May 27, 2016, Patrick Moore  wrote:

> I run my Silver bar end shifter cables under the tape so that they exit
> near the bar clamp. I shift 9 speeds, non-serial cogs (ie, home made
> cassette) with no problems. VO copies of the Maes Parallel -- long ramps.
>
> On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 12:25 AM, Tim Butterfield <
> timbutterfi...@gmail.com
> > wrote:
>
>> On Wed, May 25, 2016 at 10:45 PM, Tim Butterfield <
>> timbutterfi...@gmail.com
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> One thing I have noticed from the bike pictures that included bar end
>>> shifters is there seems to be more cable looped in front of the bars.  If I
>>> decide to add a front rack and bag later, would that extra cable have any
>>> interference from that?  Just wondering if there are any gotchas to be
>>> aware of.
>>>
>>
>> Just to be clear on this, I don't know what I may add in future,
>> rack/bag, handlebar bag, etc.  My preference is for neat and tidy cable
>> routing.  If barcon cables can be mostly tucked under the bar tape instead
>> of big and loopy, they may still work for me.  But, I don't know how neat
>> and tidy routing may affect cable life.
>>
>> Tim
>>
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>
>
>
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>
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> world revolves.) *Carthusian motto
>
> *It is *we *who change; *He* remains the same.* Eckhart
>
> *Kinei hos eromenon.* (*It moves [all things] as the beloved.) *Aristotle
>
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: S3X wheel: first impressions and home-hacked Cambio Corsa-type shifter

[Patrick Moore]

Philip: never mind; looking more closely, I see that you use your
right-side seatstay rack boss. Must add one of those myself, one day.

Aside: My intention for this hub, lash and all, is a cheap but OCD-plagued
man's way of getting gears for, say, an Eroica, that is, on the cheap and
without permanent or complex alterations to what was designed as a stripped
down gofast. So far, I think it will do fine. Worst case, I can always use
a freewheel and rig a rear brake.

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 10:57 AM, Patrick Moore  wrote:

> I might try one of these, mounted to the seat tube with the cable running
> directly to the pull chain -- ie, without roller or housing or housing
> stop. That might make the shifter a bit more accessible. It looks as if one
> can even remove the unused boss.
>
> But the seatstay shifter works alright.
>
> Philip: Will you please post a photo of your seatstay shifter mount?
>
> http://www.jensonusa.com/Problem-Solvers-Downtube-Shifter-Mount
>



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[RBW] Re: Massively upgraded Appaloosa

[Bill Lindsay]

Zach

I don't know that it would be fair for me to call you "wrong".  If that's 
how you wanted to understand what I did, then I wouldn't try to talk you 
out of it.  

>From my perspective, it was the equivalent of seeing a hat that I liked, 
and buying it on impulse, because I liked it.  Did I *need* a hat? 
 Probably not.  Did I *need * to run Shimano XTR brakes on my Appaloosa? 
 No.  Did I *need* to change brake cable housing on my Appaloosa?  No.  

I did, however, decide to upgrade the brakes on my Appaloosa, and that 
decision has led to several improvements to my bicycle.  Two of those 
several improvements were: 

1.  New cable housing made the brakes less squishy
2.  New cable housing is reflective, further increasing my conspicuity

There are other improvements, but I wouldn't encourage people to 
desperately start searching for NOS XTR brakes.  I bought them used and on 
impulse for a price that I felt was too low to pass up.  I shared the story 
for the entertainment of the group.  If a fellow Appaloosa owner goes and 
swaps brake cable housing and finds a big improvement, while leaving the 
stock brakes in place, I will be similarly entertained to hear about it.  

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

On Thursday, May 26, 2016 at 6:51:16 PM UTC-7, Zach Kahl wrote:
>
> Am I wrong to understand that you bought new brakes when all you needed to 
> do in the first place was replace your housing?
>
> Thanks for the updates with your journey of the Appaloosa, it's been a fun 
> one to watch.
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: S3X wheel: first impressions and home-hacked Cambio Corsa-type shifter

[Patrick Moore]

I might try one of these, mounted to the seat tube with the cable running
directly to the pull chain -- ie, without roller or housing or housing
stop. That might make the shifter a bit more accessible. It looks as if one
can even remove the unused boss.

But the seatstay shifter works alright.

Philip: Will you please post a photo of your seatstay shifter mount?

http://www.jensonusa.com/Problem-Solvers-Downtube-Shifter-Mount

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[RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Shoji Takahashi]

Maybe try the Willow Chainrings (available for 110, 74 BCD)? David Banzer 
on this group has 'em for sale:
http://treetop.bigcartel.com/category/willow-chainrings-c

Do you need a new granny?

Agreed that 3,000 miles on chain rings sounds low. I've got at least double 
that on Sugino XD2 w/o signs of needing replacement. (Riding 4 seasons in 
Boston area.)

Good luck
shoji
 

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 12:35:07 PM UTC-4, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> I ride in Maryland in rain and winter weather (dry, but salty), humid 
> summers...maybe I do have more miles. I just guestamated. But nowhere near 
> 20k. Maybe 4k, tops.
>
> I am surprised they are shark toothing already, too.
>
> Based on online search, the only Sugino rings I can find that looks like 
> mine is the Supershift Pro Triple Chainring Set 26/36/46T 74/110mm 5-Bolt: 
> Silver, you can see at Ben's and Harris for 125$ for a set of all three 
> rings. I cannot find them sold separately. They are a QBP product, and may 
> be likely my LBS used them on the xd600 crankset on the bike. I think my 
> LBS uses Merry Sales.
>
> But I kind of don't want to get same because of the quick wear. Maybe 
> better to get something that lasts longer. I don't know what my current 
> rings are made of. Those Rivvy rings at RBW are the longest wear aluminum. 
> Maybe they will be better. Comparable price for a full set (25,35,45).
>
> I don't know, for those prices maybe I oughtta upgrade to a better 
> crank/chainset. One that allows changing rings without taking off crankarms 
> would be great. Herse does that but way more than I would want to pay right 
> now. 500$
>
> Pic of crankset when new below.
>
>
>  
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Ron Mc]

http://www.wiggle.com/ta-110-pcd-zephyr-middle-road-chainring-34-39t-1/


>>

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Re: [RBW] Thinking of a Riv

[Patrick Moore]

I run my Silver bar end shifter cables under the tape so that they exit
near the bar clamp. I shift 9 speeds, non-serial cogs (ie, home made
cassette) with no problems. VO copies of the Maes Parallel -- long ramps.

On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 12:25 AM, Tim Butterfield 
wrote:

> On Wed, May 25, 2016 at 10:45 PM, Tim Butterfield <
> timbutterfi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> One thing I have noticed from the bike pictures that included bar end
>> shifters is there seems to be more cable looped in front of the bars.  If I
>> decide to add a front rack and bag later, would that extra cable have any
>> interference from that?  Just wondering if there are any gotchas to be
>> aware of.
>>
>
> Just to be clear on this, I don't know what I may add in future, rack/bag,
> handlebar bag, etc.  My preference is for neat and tidy cable routing.  If
> barcon cables can be mostly tucked under the bar tape instead of big and
> loopy, they may still work for me.  But, I don't know how neat and tidy
> routing may affect cable life.
>
> Tim
>
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**
*The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a
circumference on the contours of which all conditions, distinctions, and
individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu

*Stat crux dum volvitur orbis.* *(The cross stands motionless while the
world revolves.) *Carthusian motto

*It is *we *who change; *He* remains the same.* Eckhart

*Kinei hos eromenon.* (*It moves [all things] as the beloved.) *Aristotle

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Re: [RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Patrick Moore]

I've got almost 13K miles on a 46 t Pro 5 Vis chainring with no wear
visible to the naked eye, this under my mashing pedaling style (it's a 76"
fixed gear). 3K miles means that something is wrong. I do change the chain
every 2K miles or so.

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 7:20 AM, Scott Henry  wrote:

> 3000 on some chainrings seems really low.   I'm taking it that you are a
> low cadence / masher?
> How about the chain, how many times have you changed it so far?
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[dougP]

"But I think I only have 3k miles on them."

Are you sure?  Miles can add up quickly.  That's incredibly low.  I get 
around 20,000 miles on a middle & outer, & use whatever's on sale for 
rings.  The granny is steel & is the original one Riv put on in '03 when I 
bought the bike.  I'm in a dry climate & don't bother replacing rings until 
seriously worn (but not troublesome), so my mileage may be at the upper end 
of common.  Perhaps someone from a more aggressive climate could comment 
but IMHO rings ought to last at least 10,000 miles.

dougP

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 1:48:16 AM UTC-7, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> But I think I only have 3k miles on them.
> If they go bad that fast, what better options are there to put on the 
> xd600 cranks that will last longer?

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[RBW] Re: Thinking of a Riv

[Christopher Wiggins]

Tim,  I'll be honest I didn't read all the responses,so I don't know where 
you are on this.  I have Sams, Appas and I own a AHH that you could ride. 
 It's a bit of a drive, but it may clear things up a bit.

Chris Wiggins
Owner
A1 Cyclery
Indianapolis IN

On Wednesday, May 25, 2016 at 10:38:33 PM UTC-4, Tim Butterfield wrote:
>
> I've been thinking of getting a Rivendell bicycle for a long time.  I 
> first joined this group to lurk back in 2010 and have been a member and 
> sometimes lurker since then.  But, I had not made the commitment and 
> purchased a Riv.  The closest I came was getting a Velo-Orange Rando.  That 
> was sort of rivish.  
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/timbutterfield/sets/72157624827193423
>
> Being in the suburbs of Chicago near O'Hare airport limited my comfort 
> using it the way it should have been.  That bike was sold before I left 
> Chicago to live full-time in an RV.  Once we decided to settle in 
> Anacortes, WA (still in the RV), I purchased a Specialized AWOL Comp, 
> definitely not rivish.  
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/timbutterfield/sets/72157644371355428
>
> It's a nice bike, but I now want something more rivish, this time, the 
> real thing.  I'm thinking of getting either the Roadeo or the A Homer 
> Hilsen.  I like the idea of the liveliness and sportiness of the Roadeo, 
> but like the bit of extra versatility of the AHH also.  With my weight at 
> 200+ (PBH 33" or 83.8cm, age 51), I'm leaning towards the AHH instead of 
> the Roadeo.  I can start more roadish with the AHH and, as I build my 
> abilities further, expand the bike to fit new and/or different tasks 
> without having to change frames.
>
> So, I'm fairly settled on getting my first Riv, one of the two mentioned. 
>  My pondering now is mostly on how to appoint it.  My Rando was more modern 
> with the 105 setup.  The AWOL was definitely modern with discs and SRAM 
> setup.  But, I'm not tied to that.  Though I haven't used it much, I like 
> the looks of a quill stem, drop bars, and downtube shifters.  It looks 
> clean and simple.  I'm just not sure what it's like to live with.  I expect 
> that, like many things, it is a matter of adapting to it.  But, using DT 
> shifters or bar ends does set a direction as neither would work with an 
> 11-speed I could have instead.  I'm trying to consider the pros and cons of 
> each.
>
> With my AWOL, I leave it locked to the cabana just outside my RV.  Some 
> RVs have sufficient inside storage for a bike.  Mine doesn't.
>
> My questions to the group are these:  As I am not yet doing longer 
> distances, are there still benefits to the more traditional setups?  If I 
> pick either one, what might I later miss the other may have provided?  Are 
> there likely to be any weather related or other wear issues leaving a Riv 
> locked to the RV park cabana like I do my AWOL?  I'm doubtful of that, but 
> don't want to mistreat it either.  Any thing else I should consider?
>
> Thanks for any advice you have.
>
> Tim
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Tire wear question. When to replace?

[Ron Mc]

different tires also feel differently - some you can feel the flat spot 
from wear even aired up (Open Paves), but again, I always ride them until 
wear affects their reliability, and I have the new tire with me.  
Others have called that excessive kit, but for me, it's handy, mindless, 
and doesn't get in the way of riding.  


  

the roadside bag gets opened on the road side, only when I need it


On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 10:18:40 AM UTC-5, Peter White wrote:
>
> This is done with no air in the tube. Just roll the tire tread back and 
> forth between your thumb and a finger. As the tire wears, the center 
> becomes thinner, and the difference in thickness becomes more obvious.
>
> PJW 
>
> On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 8:51 AM, Steve Palincsar  > wrote:
>>
>>
>> And yes, I agree, excessive thinness of tread is my major reason for 
>> replacing tires.  I gauge it by pinch-testing the tire. 
>>
>
>
> -- 
> Peter White
>

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[RBW] Re: Now (nearly) fully stocked

[Ron Mc]

I think you need more bike racks - there' plenty of walking space

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 10:40:42 AM UTC-5, Christopher Wiggins wrote:
>
> Sams have arrived and are ready to roll.  Mid sized Appas still in stock. 
>  One big Clem left until late summer.  It's a great time to visit Indy and 
> ride a Riv.  If you decide to buy you can even ride around the Speedway and 
> see some of the craziness of the 100th running of the 500!  
>
>
>
>
>
> 
>
>

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[RBW] Now (nearly) fully stocked

[Christopher Wiggins]

Sams have arrived and are ready to roll.  Mid sized Appas still in stock. 
 One big Clem left until late summer.  It's a great time to visit Indy and 
ride a Riv.  If you decide to buy you can even ride around the Speedway and 
see some of the craziness of the 100th running of the 500!  






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Re: [RBW] Re: Remember Islabikes?

[RJM]

There is a lot of negativity towards this company here which made me check 
the link so I can understand why, and after I still don't get it. 

I've never heard of this company before but I understand why they are 
making this pro line...not a lot of companies cater to the young racer and 
offer equipment for that. They are filling a market. If you don't believe 
that kids that young are racing then you aren't attending many races. Just 
this past weekend I worked a local mountain bike race day and there was a 
kid class, and they were competitive and having fun at the same time riding 
a smaller portion of the same trail that the adults rode on. Very capable 
kids. 

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 9:04:20 AM UTC-5, Mark in Beacon wrote:

> Wow. Can't quite wrap your mind around it? Let me try to help.
>
> You are on a list called Rivendelll Bicycle Works Owners Bunch. 
>
> Conveniently, serendipitously even, the owner and founder of RBW  wrote a 
> post a couple of days ago that expounds on some of the motivations behind 
> his business. Some of those reasons include not selling stuff he doesn't 
> think his customers need, or that he believes could be capable of harming 
> them.
>
> The OP, having gotten recommendations about another company, Islabikes, 
> that sounded like they might share some of this approach toward doing 
> business, was dismayed to see evidence recently appear that seems to 
> contradict this, yes, assumption. 
>
> In the world I live in, thankfully, there are still a few businesses that 
> exist for reasons in addition to making a profit, and will not, in fact, 
> sell the consumer whatever they want. Sadly, it does appear that Islabike, 
> until recently a contender, does not fall into this category. Hence the 
> thread discussion. Hope this helps dissipate some of the confusion.
>
> On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 8:12:38 AM UTC-4, Skenry wrote:
>>
>> Wow is right.   I have no idea what world some of you all live in.  
>> Islabike only has one philosophy, to make money.   They will sell the 
>> consumer whatever they want to buy.That's how this works. 
>>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Tire wear question. When to replace?

[Peter White]

This is done with no air in the tube. Just roll the tire tread back and
forth between your thumb and a finger. As the tire wears, the center
becomes thinner, and the difference in thickness becomes more obvious.

PJW

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 8:51 AM, Steve Palincsar  wrote:
>
>
> And yes, I agree, excessive thinness of tread is my major reason for
> replacing tires.  I gauge it by pinch-testing the tire.
>


-- 
Peter White

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Re: [RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Lungimsam]

Third chain on last week.

Im pribably about 80-90 cadence. No foot retention. I live in rolling terrain. 
170lbs.

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[RBW] Re: FS: Ibex and Wooly Warm, New and used (lightly)

[Deacon Patrick]

Wash on hot with extra agitation soap and lanolin. Hey! Presto! Boiled wool 
in your size! Grin.
(note, hardly an exact science, shrinkage will vary, and I post this with a 
wink and a nod.)

With abandon,
Patrick

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 7:32:40 AM UTC-6, Belopsky wrote:
>
> Ah too bad. if medium i'd grab a couple
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Remember Islabikes?

['Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Wow. Can't quite wrap your mind around it? Let me try to help.

You are on a list called Rivendelll Bicycle Works Owners Bunch. 

Conveniently, serendipitously even, the owner and founder of RBW  wrote a 
post a couple of days ago that expounds on some of the motivations behind 
his business. Some of those reasons include not selling stuff he doesn't 
think his customers need, or that he believes could be capable of harming 
them.

The OP, having gotten recommendations about another company, Islabikes, 
that sounded like they might share some of this approach toward doing 
business, was dismayed to see evidence recently appear that seems to 
contradict this, yes, assumption. 

In the world I live in, thankfully, there are still a few businesses that 
exist for reasons in addition to making a profit, and will not, in fact, 
sell the consumer whatever they want. Sadly, it does appear that Islabike, 
until recently a contender, does not fall into this category. Hence the 
thread discussion. Hope this helps dissipate some of the confusion.

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 8:12:38 AM UTC-4, Skenry wrote:
>
> Wow is right.   I have no idea what world some of you all live in.  
> Islabike only has one philosophy, to make money.   They will sell the 
> consumer whatever they want to buy.That's how this works. 
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Thinking of a Riv

[Justin August]

If I were ordering a new AHH I would ask for the following customization:
- Paul Racer Braze-ons
You won't regret having these brakes! I would also choose a custom color and 
use Compass EL tires. 

-Justin

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Re: [RBW] Re: Thinking of a Riv

[Tim Gavin]

On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 10:47 PM, Tim Butterfield 
 wrote:

> Tim,
> Lots of great info.  Thanks.  If I go with bar ends, I was thinking of
> running the cable along the bar, existing the tape vertically through a
> notch in the inside of the brake hoods.  That may keep the cable loop from
> going too far forward and interfering with a bag I may mount in the front
> later.  This might avoid the friction of following the bar further along
> while still keeping the cable tucked in a bit.
>
> > I changed the right bar-end out for a 10-speed indexed Shimano BS79
> shifter
>
> I took a look at that shifter and one thing let to another until I was
> looking at the Shimano SL-BSR1.  I hadn’t thought I could get an 11-speed
> group with bar ends.  That’s tempting, though I would be giving up the
> friction option.  Like you say, it’s only a twist of the adjustment barrel
> every so often to tweak it.  But, then again, after reading the comments
> after yours, I wonder whether I would be better off with the standard 3x9
> from Riv.  I do like the gearing on that.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Tim
>
>
Tim-

Cable routing:
Your routing plan sounds OK.  But I didn't mean to suggest that there is
noticeable friction when the cables are routed all the way to the stem.
Theoretically?  Yes.  In observation?  No, not if you use care to keep the
bends as gradual as possible.

I routed my shift cables along the bars to the stem, where the loops cross
over to the opposite side of the downtube, and then cross over again
between the downtube cable stops and the bottom bracket cable guide.  This
makes the loops from the bars to the downtube more gradual, and it keeps
the cable housing from rubbing on the head tube.  aka Sheldon Brown
"criss-cross" 


Drivetrain:
3 x 8 or 9 is excellent.  You can use a medium-range cassette (11-28 or 30)
with a Riv/touring triple and still get good gear spacing but a wide gear
range.  Also, 8 or 9 speed gear is more durable (wider chain spacing) and
cheaper.

2 x 10 or 11 is also excellent.  But you have to use a wider-range cassette
to get the same gear range as a triple, and the gear spacing will be wider.

If I'm dead set on using brifters, I prefer a double crank.  If I'm dead
set on a triple crank, I prefer bar-end shifters.
In my experience, brifter triple shifting is picky.  It works best with the
standard Shimano road triple (50/39/30) and doesn't like to work well with
other ring combinations (especially rings without ramps & pins).
Whereas, shifting a triple with a Silver bar-end is super easy.  And
shifting a double with brifters seems to work pretty well.

I use a Silver left shifter and indexed Shimano right shifter on both of my
bikes with triple cranks.  I use brifters on both of my bikes with double
cranks.


On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 11:09 PM, Tim Butterfield 
wrote:

> For some of the other components I'm narrowing down choices on...
>
> Bars - Nitto Randonneur - I want a drop bar and like the flare out of the
> drop on these.  Earlier, Tim removed my worry about possibly using brifters
> on it.  I had the FSA Wing Pro on my VO Rando and it was nice.  I think the
> Randonneur flare may be a little better for me, though that's just a guess
> right now.
>
> Wheels - Since I am not likely to need much lighting, battery power should
> be sufficient for lighting instead of getting a dyno.  If I ever do any
> touring later, I can get a dyno hub for the second wheel set.  I like the
> idea of Phil hubs, but am leaning towards the standard Riv wheels.  I don't
> know enough about Phils to know if extra cost difference would be worth it
> for my application.
>
>
>
>
Wheels:
Riv/Rich recommend mid-range Shimano hubs, which are quite good.  They're
less expensive than boutique hubs, and any shop (or you) can service them
easily.
Pauls are nice (I have a set of 90s vintage freewheel Pauls), but I'm not
convinced that they're worth the huge premium.
I bought a Velo Orange Grand Cru Touring hub for my latest wheel build;
it's about the same price as Ultegra hubs but it has cartridge bearings and
is field-serviceable without tools.

Bars:
I love the Nitto Randonneur bars, but be warned that they come in a couple
variants, the B132 and B135.  I use the B135 because they have shorter
reach (tops).  This works better with brifters and/or TRP RRL brake levers,
which have somewhat long ramps (I use B135s with TRP RRL levers on my two
triple-crank-equipped bikes).  I feel that the B132's longer reach would
put the brake levers too far away for comfort; that bar would work better
with vintage brake levers with shorter ramps.

However, the B132 only comes in one width, 42 at the tops / 45 cm at the
bottom.  It's a bit narrow for me (I'm 6'1") but I really like the feel.
The B135 comes in two widths, 42 or 44 at the tops.
The Noodle, in comparison, comes in a ton of widths.


B135 45cm



B132 44cm



Just for fun, 

[RBW] Re: Thinking of a Riv

[Philip Kim]

I've owned a Hillborne and Cheviot, before settling on the San Marcos. This 
I'm building up for my gf, and then waiting for a Hunq, which should be 
ready in a couple of weeks

Once you own one, you want to own them all. They all ride great, but due to 
limitations in space and money, I settles on the Hunq and San Marcos. The 
San Marcos is a bit zippier than a Hillborne. 

>From reaching out to people who've ridden both the San Marcos and the AHH, 
it seems the San Marcos is a bit zippier than the AHH. Maybe it could be a 
nice middle ground between the AHH and Rodeo? Also a bit cheaper. Not as 
nice paint, but Riv geo and lugs.

On Wednesday, May 25, 2016 at 10:38:33 PM UTC-4, Tim Butterfield wrote:
>
> I've been thinking of getting a Rivendell bicycle for a long time.  I 
> first joined this group to lurk back in 2010 and have been a member and 
> sometimes lurker since then.  But, I had not made the commitment and 
> purchased a Riv.  The closest I came was getting a Velo-Orange Rando.  That 
> was sort of rivish.  
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/timbutterfield/sets/72157624827193423
>
> Being in the suburbs of Chicago near O'Hare airport limited my comfort 
> using it the way it should have been.  That bike was sold before I left 
> Chicago to live full-time in an RV.  Once we decided to settle in 
> Anacortes, WA (still in the RV), I purchased a Specialized AWOL Comp, 
> definitely not rivish.  
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/timbutterfield/sets/72157644371355428
>
> It's a nice bike, but I now want something more rivish, this time, the 
> real thing.  I'm thinking of getting either the Roadeo or the A Homer 
> Hilsen.  I like the idea of the liveliness and sportiness of the Roadeo, 
> but like the bit of extra versatility of the AHH also.  With my weight at 
> 200+ (PBH 33" or 83.8cm, age 51), I'm leaning towards the AHH instead of 
> the Roadeo.  I can start more roadish with the AHH and, as I build my 
> abilities further, expand the bike to fit new and/or different tasks 
> without having to change frames.
>
> So, I'm fairly settled on getting my first Riv, one of the two mentioned. 
>  My pondering now is mostly on how to appoint it.  My Rando was more modern 
> with the 105 setup.  The AWOL was definitely modern with discs and SRAM 
> setup.  But, I'm not tied to that.  Though I haven't used it much, I like 
> the looks of a quill stem, drop bars, and downtube shifters.  It looks 
> clean and simple.  I'm just not sure what it's like to live with.  I expect 
> that, like many things, it is a matter of adapting to it.  But, using DT 
> shifters or bar ends does set a direction as neither would work with an 
> 11-speed I could have instead.  I'm trying to consider the pros and cons of 
> each.
>
> With my AWOL, I leave it locked to the cabana just outside my RV.  Some 
> RVs have sufficient inside storage for a bike.  Mine doesn't.
>
> My questions to the group are these:  As I am not yet doing longer 
> distances, are there still benefits to the more traditional setups?  If I 
> pick either one, what might I later miss the other may have provided?  Are 
> there likely to be any weather related or other wear issues leaving a Riv 
> locked to the RV park cabana like I do my AWOL?  I'm doubtful of that, but 
> don't want to mistreat it either.  Any thing else I should consider?
>
> Thanks for any advice you have.
>
> Tim
>

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Re: [RBW] Price drop on El Fito at Ibex

[Chris Birkenmaier]

I got mine yesterday. Got 2 pairs each of the 3/4 and the El FIto.  They were 
heavier in weight than I expected. But that's ok. I'm in PA and it gets cold 
here

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[RBW] Re: FS: Ibex and Wooly Warm, New and used (lightly)

[Belopsky]

Ah too bad. if medium i'd grab a couple

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Re: [RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Scott Henry]

3000 on some chainrings seems really low.   I'm taking it that you are a
low cadence / masher?
How about the chain, how many times have you changed it so far?



On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 8:58 AM, Ron Mc  wrote:

> might want to hunt in UK for TA chainrings
>
>
> On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 3:48:16 AM UTC-5, Lungimsam wrote:
>>
>> But I think I only have 3k miles on them.
>> If they go bad that fast, what better options are there to put on the
>> xd600 cranks that will last longer?
>
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[RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Ron Mc]

might want to hunt in UK for TA chainrings

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 3:48:16 AM UTC-5, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> But I think I only have 3k miles on them.
> If they go bad that fast, what better options are there to put on the 
> xd600 cranks that will last longer?

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Re: [RBW] Re: Tire wear question. When to replace?

[Steve Palincsar]

On 05/27/2016 08:20 AM, Ron Mc wrote:
when it flats is a criterion Steve.  Tires flat because they're 
getting thin.  Why is in your nature to call people out?


I didn't "call you out," I simply pointed out that you had not addressed 
the very question the original poster had asked.  Why is it in your 
nature to turn everything into a personal attack?


And yes, I agree, excessive thinness of tread is my major reason for 
replacing tires.  I gauge it by pinch-testing the tire.  When the center 
feels no thicker than the sidewalls and is dramatically thinner in the 
center of the tread area than around the shoulders of the tread area, I 
replace the tires.   Excessive flats is another reason, but you have to 
make sure the reason for excessive flats isn't an embedded sharp you 
missed.  I find extra powerful reading glasses (2.5 vs the normal 1.5s I 
use for reading) coupled with the use of a very bright flashlight helps 
find those tiny glass shards and wires that are hiding inside the tire 
causing "repeat flats."







On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 7:02:28 AM UTC-5, Steve Palincsar wrote:


On 05/27/2016 07:39 AM, Ron Mc wrote:
> I carry a fold up on every bike.  When it flats I inspect it,
and if
> it needs replacing, that's when I do it.
>

I think the OP's question here is at what point, by what criteria, do
you decide that it needs replacing.  I'm pretty sure most of us would
agree, "when the cords are showing through" is beyond that point.



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Re: [RBW] Re: Tire wear question. When to replace?

[Ron Mc]

quite simply, when a tire becomes an annoyance, I replace it - that's 
exactly how much attention I give the issue.  

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Re: [RBW] Re: Tire wear question. When to replace?

[Ron Mc]

when it flats is a criterion Steve.  Tires flat because they're getting 
thin.  Why is in your nature to call people out?  

On Friday, May 27, 2016 at 7:02:28 AM UTC-5, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
>
> On 05/27/2016 07:39 AM, Ron Mc wrote: 
> > I carry a fold up on every bike.  When it flats I inspect it, and if 
> > it needs replacing, that's when I do it. 
> > 
>
> I think the OP's question here is at what point, by what criteria, do 
> you decide that it needs replacing.  I'm pretty sure most of us would 
> agree, "when the cords are showing through" is beyond that point. 
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Remember Islabikes?

[Scott Henry]

Wow is right.   I have no idea what world some of you all live in.
Islabike only has one philosophy, to make money.   They will sell the
consumer whatever they want to buy.That's how this works.

On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 8:34 PM, 'Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch <
rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:

>
> 
> I agree 100% with Leah. Disappointing.
>
> I bought an Islabike for  my 6 year old in March. He loves the bike. I
> will say that if they were offering the "pro" series at that time, I would
> have seriously considered going in another direction.
>
> For me the issue is not necessarily the safety of carbon--I will assume
> that is really no more of an issue these days than any other material. (but
> carbon steerer? Really?)
>
> For me the issue is the blatant attempt to make kids want the "pro stuff."
> Now, companies have long used pro names to sell merch, from baseball gloves
> to sneakers to bicycles (Sears had a "Ted Williams" bicycle.) But the
> ever-increasing specialization and technization of professional racing
> bicycles makes it kind of absurd to create a kid's bike in this image. Here
> is the bike for the Age 4 set (the only one without disc brakes, by the
> way):
> Cnoc 16 Pro Series
>
> Age 4+ / $1199.99
>
>  *The first bike we all dreamed of and the most important bike you’ll
> ever buy.*
>
> *The Cnoc 16 Pro Series is a superb introduction to riding for the young
> cyclist in your life. Stunning specifications and features will give them
> an unforgettable experience at one of the most important stages of their
> cycling development.*
>
>
> Riggght. The main takeaway a young cyclist will get during this "most
> important stage of their cycling development" is that, to really succeed,
> you need to buy the bling, baby. But hey, we need to create good little
> consumers, and what better time in life to sink your brand in?
>
>
> In the How We've Used Carbon Fiber section, there's this:
>>
>> This decision to adopt the use of carbon fiber has lead to us designing
>> and developing our own range of perfectly proportioned, ultra-light forks,
>> specifically tailored to work perfectly with our Pro Series frames.
>>
>> The Pro Series forks are constructed of Toray T700s standard modulus
>> unidirectional carbon fiber. ..blah blah technomumbojumbo blah blah...
>>
>>
>> *Through manipulation of the fork shape we have been able to achieve the
>> ride qualities we were looking for.* (My emphasis) Our exclusive
>> monocoque design features gently curved fork legs which reduce in size
>> towards the center allowing the fork to flex evenly along its entire length
>> for ride comfort, while flattened profiles retain steering sharpness
>>
>>
>> By using multiple unidirectional carbon fiber layers in varying degrees
>> throughout the fork we can also adjust the fork characteristicsblah
>> blah multidirectional blah blah layup...blah blah
>>
>> For the ultimate in lightweight, the forks feature full carbon
>> construction of the legs, crown and steerer. Because they are designed for
>> lighter riders we have been able to build them significantly lighter than
>> equivalent adults models whilst still being strong enough to withstand
>> rigorous loads — over and above testing...
>>
>>
>> We’ve incorporated a neat internal routing for the brake hose on our disc
>> brake models, keeping the cable out of harms way and removing the need for
>> a screw-on clamp.
>>
>
> Seriously? How would you know that you've achieved "the ride qualities
> 'you' were looking for?" By tooling around the test track on a 16" wheeled
> bicycle? Come on. Keeping the cable out of harm's way? What about the
> revolving discs that the pros recently decided to ban? Sheesh.
>
> I had to think long and hard before laying out in the neighborhood of $600
> for a bike my 6-year-old will outgrown in 2 years max. I did it because he
> has shown a real interest and enjoyment in bicycling, and it is something
> we do together, and the bike's features had a true cost for benefit logic.
> Plus I figured a chunk of that would be recouped at resale, or his younger
> cousin would ride it. $1200 for a 4-year-old's bicycle is, honestly, nuts.
> And not just because it is out of my price range. My son's mother wanted to
> buy him the same bicycle to have when he is with her! I said please, no,
> let's just get the bike back and forth. What kind of values would we be
> teaching by getting him two of the same bicycle? Or a "pro" bike that looks
> just as menacing and depressing as today's "real race bicycle" and goes
> well above and beyond what any kid needs (or really, should have) at that
> age? The "regular" Islabikes come in bright, fun kid colors. The "pro"
> bikes come in stealth matte black with blood red highlighting.
>
> I understand there are arguments for the existence of these things--hey,

Re: [RBW] Re: Tire wear question. When to replace?

[Steve Palincsar]

On 05/27/2016 07:39 AM, Ron Mc wrote:
I carry a fold up on every bike.  When it flats I inspect it, and if 
it needs replacing, that's when I do it.




I think the OP's question here is at what point, by what criteria, do 
you decide that it needs replacing.  I'm pretty sure most of us would 
agree, "when the cords are showing through" is beyond that point.



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Re: [RBW] Indian food run and Goose face-off!

[Scott Henry]

Who else wants to make an "Indians don't eat geese" joke?

On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 5:00 PM, Tim Gavin 
wrote:

> We have a big goose over-population problem in my town (Cedar Rapids, IA),
> especially on the bike paths near the river.  Go figure!  But it's become
> serious enough that the city is planning on hunting or trapping many of the
> geese (in rural land on the edge of the city) and donating them to food
> pantries.
> 
>
> The path near Cedar Lake is completely infested with geese and goslings,
> and the path is totally covered in "goose grease".  It's almost the same
> color and almost as slippery as Park/Paul grease.  A couple people have
> wiped out on the "goose grease" and hurt themselves.
>
> The geese parents are very defensive when they have goslings (they're
> pretty passive the rest of the year).  They get all the food they want from
> the greenery on the edge of the path (I call them "flying cows" for their
> size and grazing habits).
>
> I have good luck diverting them off the path by dinging my bell and
> "honking" at them with my voice.  They'll still hiss at me as I pass, but
> at least they're doing it from the grassy verge instead of the middle of
> the path.
>
> Best of luck,
> Tim
>
> On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 3:41 PM, Lungimsam  wrote:
>
>> One of my favorite things to do is meet my wife at out favorite Indian
>> restaurants for lunch buffet.
>>
>> I ride my bike there and back, and she drives there and back. Suburban
>> roads and MUP. She encourages me to ride all the time so it is nice having
>> a wife that is understanding and encouraging about bike riding.
>>
>> Today, I took a pic of the bike locked up in place, and then, on the ride
>> home, pics of some geese and their gooselets on the path and the adults
>> hissed at me and wouldn't let me pass. The babies and parents walked
>> towards me. I was wondering if they wanted food or if they were just
>> standing their ground. I figured the parents were going to be aggressive
>> because the gooselets were with them and I didn't want to get bit, or upset
>> them any more so I turned around and went around the other side of the lake.
>>
>> Enjoy the pics...
>>
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[RBW] Re: Squeaky bb needs to change?

[Ron Mc]

the last one I replaced was because grease from the sealed bearings was 
seeping out and the failed seals were dragging enough on the spindle to 
back out the Italian threads.  

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[RBW] Re: Tire wear question. When to replace?

[Ron Mc]

I carry a fold up on every bike.  When it flats I inspect it, and if it 
needs replacing, that's when I do it.  

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[RBW] Re: Tire wear question. When to replace?

[Michael Hechmer]

Buy one new tire and put it on the front.

"Buy a bike; you'll never regret it, if you live."  Mark Twain

Buy a tire; you'll never regret it, and your chances of living will 
improve.  Michael Hechmer

On Thursday, May 26, 2016 at 5:51:49 PM UTC-4, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> Rear tire on Bleriot. Tread bald down center for a while now. Front tire 
> still has plenty of tread.
>
> I inspect the tire every few rides.
>
> *Is it safe to ride down 'til the tread just barely starts showing? To the 
> first peek of tan color? Or is the tire gonna rip open at that point and 
> better to swap out now?*
>
> Manufacturer/distributor/retailer told me I have about 1k left on it about 
> 1k ago.
>
> Waiting until casing starts to show or get next flat to replace it with 
> new tire. I want to get my money's worth out of the tire (really expensive) 
> and I am not a penny pinching person at all, and usually swap out tires 
> faster, but I... just...can't bring myself to replace the tire until 
> these conditions are met because the tire was so expensive.
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Chainrings...when to replace?

[Lungimsam]

But I think I only have 3k miles on them.
If they go bad that fast, what better options are there to put on the xd600 
cranks that will last longer?

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[RBW] Squeaky bb needs to change?

[Lungimsam]

Upon rotating my crank arms by hand slowly and gently backwards I hear a 
squeak sound like the low squak sound of rubbing a balloon until I increase 
the speed, then it goes away.

They spin fine, no crunchy sounds. no play.


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Re: [RBW] Thinking of a Riv

[Tim Butterfield]

> You'll be able to easily fine tune your cockpit without messing with your
drivetrain every time. When you settle on the cockpit, you'll know if you
want to keep the downtube shifters or switch to brifters it barends.

I like your reasoning, but then I had to go research it a bit and happened
to reread Sheldon on shifters.  Regarding down tube shifters, he said,
"Once you get used to having the shift controls on the handlebars, you're
unlikely to ever want to go back."  About bar ends, he said, "Bar-end
shifters are the most versatile of handlebar-mounted shift options for use
with drop handlebars."  Strangely, I also recalled briefly owning a 1982
Bianchi Limited that I switched from bar ends to down tubes.
Unfortunately, I didn't keep it long before I upgraded to the VO Rando and
thus do not remember much about the experience.  It's certainly more to
consider, though.

> And since you won't be doing heavy touring, the Homer is the best you can
get.

I now think so also.

Thanks.

Tim



On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 10:56 PM, René Sterental 
wrote:

> So much great advice!
>
> Go for the Homer, set it with 9 or 10 speed, double or triple, downtube
> shifters (indexed) and ride it.
>
> You'll be able to easily fine tune your cockpit without messing with your
> drivetrain every time. When you settle on the cockpit, you'll know if you
> want to keep the downtube shifters or switch to brifters it barends.
>
> That's what I did and now I'm using then in all my bikes. It's seldom that
> I need to shift both at the same time. If you get a double front, it's
> easier than ever. I love the indexing and won't go to friction.
>
> An 11/36 in the back with a 24/40 or 26/40 or higher combos will give you
> everything you need in a super simple and reliable setup.
>
> And since you won't be doing heavy touring, the Homer is the best you can
> get.
>
> Enjoy the journey!!!
>
> René
>
>
> On Thursday, May 26, 2016, Tim Butterfield 
> wrote:
>
>> Joe,
>> You're not much older than I.  I'm 51.  On the idea of planning ahead as
>> mentioned earlier, I'm not sure I want to learn to use friction at this
>> point either.  Who knows how long my hearing may last.  So, some type of
>> indexing would be preferred, whether indexed bar ends or brifters.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Tim
>>
>> On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 8:53 AM, Joe Bernard  wrote:
>>
>>> Bianchi uses Dia-Compe (same internals as Silver) friction shifters with
>>> a 10-speed cassette on their L'Eroica bike. Or you can use 10-speed indexed
>>> bar-ends, which would be my preference (front is still friction). I've
>>> pretty much walked away from rear friction at this point; at 54-years-old
>>> I've lost the fine hearing necessary to hear what's going on with the
>>> chain/cassette back there, and can't tell if I'm properly in gear anymore.
>>> I'm old!
>>>
>>>

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