Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Dear Marc, this is exactly the problem: focusing only on toddlers and on on-site solutions. when what parent need is focusing on the general problem of childcare wether on the site of wikimania or not. -Natacha > Le 11 nov. 2016 à 15:56, Marc-Andre a écrit : > > FWIW,

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Hoi, Right. I agree. It is vital for us to have a safe space where we have our conference. When we assess a place we should indeed do a risk assessment. This risk assessment is for all of us. It means that we have to be safe to do our thing at the conference, we have to be safe at our digs, we

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Greetings, I wanted to take off my Wikimedia Foundation hat for a moment and offer some thoughts as a fellow volunteer. Without feeling physically/emotionally/mentally safe and free from prosecutorial persecution, it is nearly impossible to actively engage. Therefore, no goals can be achieved if

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

"Foreigners" are at an increased risk regardless of where they travel thats the reality of international travel, additionally each persons individual circumstances will affect those risks. What we shouldnt be doing is engaging in a contest as to whos circumstances gives them the greater risk and

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

It is correct I have yet to attend a Wikimania conference, but was planning to after my positive experience presenting at WikiConference North America. Please note the "Muslim" and "LGBT" are not mutually exclusive. Same with any other marginalized groups you might name. FYI my preferred

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

om: Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijs...@gmail.com> Sender: "Wikimedia-l" <wikimedia-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org>Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2016 09:00:13 To: Wikimedia Mailing List<wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org> Reply-To: Wikimedia Mailing List <wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Hoi, Exactly. It is the whole community that meets and it is regularly in a different country because in this way we have been in all continents but Australia and it has been wonderful to see the different outlook from the local Wikipedians. When Wikimania is not about outreach we could have it

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

I see the primary point of Wikimania as an opportunity for the community to meet in person once a year. Many important initiatives for our movement have grown out of Wikimania including but not limited to: Wikivoyage, the copyright detection bot, our collaboration with the World Health

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Hoi, In that case what is the point of Wikimania. Thanks, GerardM On 10 November 2016 at 14:25, Andrew Lih wrote: > On Thu, Nov 10, 2016 at 3:00 AM, Gerard Meijssen < > gerard.meijs...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > Hoi, > > You do not get it. Wikimania is first and

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

On Thu, Nov 10, 2016 at 3:00 AM, Gerard Meijssen wrote: > Hoi, > You do not get it. Wikimania is first and foremost about spreading the word > about what we do and who we are. > {{citationneeded}} The reality is Wikimania is largely a community event first, with the

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

+1 On 10 November 2016 at 09:00, Gerard Meijssen wrote: > Hoi, > You do not get it. Wikimania is first and foremost about spreading the word > about what we do and who we are. > > I have read Pax's original post. He did not go to Wikimania. He asks for > consideration

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Hoi, You do not get it. Wikimania is first and foremost about spreading the word about what we do and who we are. I have read Pax's original post. He did not go to Wikimania. He asks for consideration that any Wikimania will be in a place where he feels safe. It is OK for him to ask this but it

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Gerard, Yes you are being offensive. You are deliberately painting a picture that somehow Pax, myself and others are attempting to make out that safety of LGBT+ Wikimedians is more important than safety of Women Wikimedians or the safety of Muslim Wikimedians. The only person doing that is you.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Hoi, The notion of offence is one where you take it where there is none certainly no offence is intended. When you consider Wikimanias past, we have been to places where there is a "risk". Arguably there has been a risk in going to other countries in the past. When you consider the events

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 5:08 AM, Gerard Meijssen wrote: > Hoi, > Not going to North Corolina is absolutely fine with me. We do not gain > anything by going there arguably not to any state in the United States. > What Wikimania is, is a platform for propaganda for what

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Gerard, You have posted several emails on the subject which read as disrespectful, can cause offence and discourage LGBT+ contributors to this list who may have otherwise openly expressed views. The line of argument that LGBT+ Wikimedians must expect to be at personal risk just to attend a

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Hoi, What is the point. When not even the USA is "safe", we have to be realistic. Wikimania is about propaganda for what we do. We have to travel and selecting a place is not about you, it is about them. It is about the people we aim to serve. I made my point before, it did not get any attention

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Gerard, as a queer black trans person who feels unsafe even in San Francisco (and has felt that way for years), I would really appreciate you not pushing last night's election results in my face to make a point. - Pax On 11/9/16 8:24 AM, Gerard Meijssen wrote: Hoi, Do you blame me for not

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Hoi, Do you blame me for not feeling safe going to the USA? Thanks, GerardM On 8 November 2016 at 11:08, Gerard Meijssen wrote: > Hoi, > Not going to North Corolina is absolutely fine with me. We do not gain > anything by going there arguably not to any state in

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Hoi, Not going to North Corolina is absolutely fine with me. We do not gain anything by going there arguably not to any state in the United States. What Wikimania is, is a platform for propaganda for what we have, what we do, who we are and how we do what we do. In many countries Wikipedia is not

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

With all due respect Pax... whilst I am fully in agreement with the concept of selecting a country with the safety of ALL participants in mind, I totally disagree with the concept of selecting a country based on "high human records" generally. We are not serving the part of humanity that has

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

We can share knowledge without meetings, we cannot share knowledge without our community. If some of our community cannot be safe well...who cares of meetings then? Vito 2016-10-18 15:26 GMT+02:00 Gerard Meijssen : > Hoi, > For me safety is to a large extend secondary

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Gerard, this isn't about "holiday destinations", it's about human rights and dignity. That's why I emphasized in my original post that I'm concerned not only about the safety of conference attendees, but also about those living in the host country. The choice of a venue in a location with a

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Hoi, For me safety is to a large extend secondary to what we aim to achieve. Our primary goal is to improve on our primary goal and it is "sharing in the sum of all knowledge". It is not for going to the perfect holiday destination. Thanks, GerardM On 18 October 2016 at 13:56, Fæ

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Gerard, could you provide some tangible examples of how other safety aspects of Wikimania would be compromised if there is any specific attention paid to the safety of LGBT+ Wikimedians? I cannot imagine how such a thing could be true. Based on my reading, nobody in this thread has asked for the

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

IMHO we should divide criteria into two categories, reflecting two different kind of issue: *someone *cannot* partecipate because of a certain issue -> the proposal is rejected *someone may not feel comfortable in partecipating -> the proposal is somehow penalized In other words, if LGBT people

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Hoi, I do care that everybody can come to places where they are safe. All the specific LGBT attention to safety is however on many levels problematic when we prioritise this over other safety aspects. The big picture for me is that we need to go to places where bringing Wikipedia and what it

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Ellie, thanks for the response. Could the criteria you mention be published on-wiki? Holding an open and transparent process for selecting host locations for Wikimania should be a requirement on the selection committee, so there ought to be nothing stopping this from happening. If the applied

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Thanks Ellie. On the topic of event safety, I am wondering if there is a standard checklist that WMF uses when narrowing potential sites for Wikimanias and if you could make that checklist public. Perhaps it is public already but I don't know where to find it. Regarding Wikimania goals and

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Yes we are doing a review and I can vouch that issues like this will always be a part of the criteria when selecting a venue. In most of the recent Wikimanias the selection committee and WMF have included the security of our LGBT community as one of the criteria when considering bids. Another

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

There are two aspects in this situation. We have the law and we have the enforcement. We know that most of ME countries have laws against LGBT people and actively enforce it but for example in India even though there is a law but it's not being enforced. On the other hand in North Carolina (and

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Agreed, that link is just a broad overview. There are many other pages that drill down to specific laws and policies of regions and cities that affect the safety of LGBT+ people. From Amir Ladsgroup's reply it does sound like the Wikimania committee is aware of these issues and taking them

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Hi, I suppose that it should be a group of people to give relevant reasons and to be more proactive when selecting a bid mainly if connected with a poor respect of rights or with the safety of some specific diversities. The link you give is more related to the rights than to the safety of

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Hi Pax, My understanding is that WMF is doing a strategic review of Wikimania. If that is correct, considerations like the ones you raise about location could be included in the scope of that review. I'm pinging Ellie with the hope that she can provide information about the status of WMF's

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Thanks Anna. I forgot to include this relevant link (which I also posted in the Facebook discussion): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_by_country_or_territory - Pax On 10/16/16 10:14 AM, Anna Stillwell wrote: These are lovely suggestions / requests. Thank you for raising them. I'm

Re: [Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

These are lovely suggestions / requests. Thank you for raising them. I'm happy to hear of your positive experience at WikiConference. +1 /a On Sun, Oct 16, 2016 at 8:10 AM, Pax Ahimsa Gethen < list-wikime...@funcrunch.org> wrote: > Hello all. I had a positive experience at WikiConference North

[Wikimedia-l] LGBT+ safety considerations for conference venues

Hello all. I had a positive experience at WikiConference North America last weekend, where I gave a talk on transgender issues and Wikipedia.[1] I'm posting because there's an active discussion in Wikipedia Weekly on Facebook about choosing a host country for Wikimania 2018.[2] I am concerned