Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
From: curtisdeltabl...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 2:50 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really. I guess you're right about that. I had left the TM movement before they started all the Maharishi Effect crap, so I didn't have a chance to buy into that, but I definitely spent money on astrologers once. I never really had any feeling for the existence of a God, either, but I played the game by using that terminology when it was called for in TM talks. But I definitely did and believed a bunch of things that qualified me as an idiot back in the day, so I should try to remember them when dealing with those who are still living in those mindstates. That would be more compassionate, after all. It's just that there is so little PAYOFF in dealing with people who still believe these things. They just go round in circles and then come back to the very things they started with. Their thinking seems to be as non-rigorous as it is circular.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
From: curtisdeltabl...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : Curtis, as jr. says, you guys say there is no God. Its not like it is ambiguous. M: But I don't say this. I say I see no reason to believe in one. There is a huge difference between these statements. I am amazed that I cannot communicate this difference effectively because it keeps coming back misstated. I keep trying to explain this to you, Curtis. You cannot convey this simple difference to Jim and John BECAUSE THEY'RE IDIOTS WITH BRAINS THE SIZE OF A PEA. :-) Here, let me demonstrate. I shall make a statement about what I actually believe. Then wait to see how long it takes one or both of these idiots to come back claiming that I said the exact opposite: I do not believe that there is any need to either hypothesize the need for a God, or to believe in the existence of one. I do NOT declare that There is no God, because that seems to be obvious. Even those who claim to believe in one can't produce him/her/it. Now, how long will it take before these two mental midgets transform what I said above into me declaring my absolute belief that there is no God and thus demonstrating that atheism is my religion? I admire Curtis his patience at dealing with these mental midgets, but I don't have that level of patience. I'd rather just point out how idiotic their beliefs are, ask them once again to PROVE their beliefs, and then sit back and watch. Unlike Curtis, who seems to think that he can actually communicate to these two numbnuts, I have no such illusions. Within a couple of days (probably less), they'll be back claiming the same things about what I supposedly believe that they always do, which is always 180 degrees opposite from what I actually believe. You really just CAN'T deal rationally with minds this weak. So I've given up trying...
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
turq, the compassion IS the payoff. This is in response to your sentence: That would be more compassionate, after all. It's just that there is so little PAYOFF... On Sunday, October 19, 2014 1:41 AM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: From: curtisdeltabl...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 2:50 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really. I guess you're right about that. I had left the TM movement before they started all the Maharishi Effect crap, so I didn't have a chance to buy into that, but I definitely spent money on astrologers once. I never really had any feeling for the existence of a God, either, but I played the game by using that terminology when it was called for in TM talks. But I definitely did and believed a bunch of things that qualified me as an idiot back in the day, so I should try to remember them when dealing with those who are still living in those mindstates. That would be more compassionate, after all. It's just that there is so little PAYOFF in dealing with people who still believe these things. They just go round in circles and then come back to the very things they started with. Their thinking seems to be as non-rigorous as it is circular.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Maybe just stick with movie and tv reviews Barry. I think you'll be happier. That may cut down on the 25 to 30 posts per week you make just telling everyone how stupid they are. And how long have you been willing to put up with that so little payoff? Give that some thought, Barry, if you get few minutes. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : That would be more compassionate, after all. It's just that there is so little PAYOFF in dealing with people who still believe these things. They just go round in circles and then come back to the very things they started with. Their thinking seems to be as non-rigorous as it is circular.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
http://freethoughtblogs.com/yemmynisting/files/2013/05/218863_1829061123648_1153920770_31704147_5306920_o.jpg http://freethoughtblogs.com/yemmynisting/files/2013/05/218863_1829061123648_1153920770_31704147_5306920_o.jpg --- sharelong60@... wrote : turq, the compassion IS the payoff. This is in response to your sentence: That would be more compassionate, after all. It's just that there is so little PAYOFF... From: curtisdeltablues@... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. --- turquoiseb@... wrote : As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really. I guess you're right about that. I had left the TM movement before they started all the Maharishi Effect crap, so I didn't have a chance to buy into that, but I definitely spent money on astrologers once. I never really had any feeling for the existence of a God, either, but I played the game by using that terminology when it was called for in TM talks. But I definitely did and believed a bunch of things that qualified me as an idiot back in the day, so I should try to remember them when dealing with those who are still living in those mindstates. That would be more compassionate, after all. It's just that there is so little PAYOFF in dealing with people who still believe these things. They just go round in circles and then come back to the very things they started with. Their thinking seems to be as non-rigorous as it is circular.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-kRLZxm3JXkw/VEO_nf_6CcI/A4o/yduhXKVm7A8/s710/epicurus_777.png https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-kRLZxm3JXkw/VEO_nf_6CcI/A4o/yduhXKVm7A8/s710/epicurus_777.png --- fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : Curtis, as jr. says, you guys say there is no God. Its not like it is ambiguous. From: curtisdeltablues@... M: But I don't say this. I say I see no reason to believe in one. There is a huge difference between these statements. I am amazed that I cannot communicate this difference effectively because it keeps coming back misstated. --- turquoiseb@... wrote : I keep trying to explain this to you, Curtis. You cannot convey this simple difference to Jim and John BECAUSE THEY'RE IDIOTS WITH BRAINS THE SIZE OF A PEA. :-) Here, let me demonstrate. I shall make a statement about what I actually believe. Then wait to see how long it takes one or both of these idiots to come back claiming that I said the exact opposite: I do not believe that there is any need to either hypothesize the need for a God, or to believe in the existence of one. I do NOT declare that There is no God, because that seems to be obvious. Even those who claim to believe in one can't produce him/her/it. Now, how long will it take before these two mental midgets transform what I said above into me declaring my absolute belief that there is no God and thus demonstrating that atheism is my religion? I admire Curtis his patience at dealing with these mental midgets, but I don't have that level of patience. I'd rather just point out how idiotic their beliefs are, ask them once again to PROVE their beliefs, and then sit back and watch. Unlike Curtis, who seems to think that he can actually communicate to these two numbnuts, I have no such illusions. Within a couple of days (probably less), they'll be back claiming the same things about what I supposedly believe that they always do, which is always 180 degrees opposite from what I actually believe. You really just CAN'T deal rationally with minds this weak. So I've given up trying...
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. On 10/18/2014 7:17 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) /Let's be logical: Just a few months ago Barry said he believed in levitation - suspension in midair with no visible means of support. If true, then Frederick Lenz is Lord Vishnu, God. Only a God could possibly levitate - by definition. Therefore, what Curtis says is true according to logic, but what Barry says is a contradiction, Barry being the True Believer. There seems to be a clear case of cognitive dissonance going on: mental stress or discomfort experienced by an individual who holds two or more contradictory beliefs at the same time. Go figure./
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
OK Jim, lets look at your claim to be in a higher state of consciousness with a special access to knowledge. This is your claim so I say, show me how I can distinguish your claim from that of a born again Christian who claims to have had the experience of being saved. You both are claiming subjective knowledge that cannot be evaluated from outside. But you have an advantage in enlightenment. That package comes with the added claim that you can know things that people like me cannot know. Can you express one single thing as evidence that you are functioning on a higher mental level rather than a state of self delusion? There must be some way that you can demonstrate that you actually have a special mental ability with your higher state isn't there? And if there is not, then your state of mind is indistinguishable from any other person whose opinion of their specialness exceeds what others see in them. One more thing. The God you know inside had better keep his trap shut. If he decides that you are the pure vehicle for one single message to us, anything: Lil Debbie cakes are superior to Hostess cupcakes, The Mets will win whatever it is that those teams want to win, Halloween candy corn will cure cancer but only if you eat each section starting with the tip separately, ANYTHING... you will go from enlightened guy to lunatic in the time it takes anyone here to read your message. (Nabbie excepted course) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : As long as you are on the path to know the creator of the universe, as you put it, I am OK with that. I understand that your previous experiences with religion and TM, may have created a confusing concept of God, that you have rejected. No problem, God is endlessly creative, and will no doubt eventually make him and herself known to you, in a way that is yours alone, personally tailored for you. Once God awakes within you, you will know what I am talking about. Otherwise, it is nonsense to the waking state consciousness. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : J: Er, Curtis, you are mistaking your failure, for certainty M: I have no certainty and don't buy yours. J: And being very arrogant about it. M: I am the on saying I do not KNOW the creator of the universe. You are saying you do. Perhaps you have redefined this word too. J: Without a sense of pure awareness, not the forced experiences from rounding, that you have mentioned, but the real deal, 24x7, you are basing your conclusions on fantasy, and have no clue about real enlightenment. M: So you know all about my awareness from inside too perhaps? J: Your choice, and so far, a very poor one, just like yer buddy, there, in front of the tube. M: Yeah, I don't buy your claims. Sorry that this frankness makes you feel hostile. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Sure. As I said, my enlightenment is not provable. I DO achieve everything that I desire. Enlightenment is the state of pure awareness, 24 x 7, universal synchronicity. It is a famous expression in the Gita, that an enlightened man sees darkness where the ignorant see light, and vice versa, so your comments are appropriate. Yes, I appear crazy to you, but you also appear out of touch with reality, to me. Other than that, I hope your day is going well! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : OK Jim, lets look at your claim to be in a higher state of consciousness with a special access to knowledge. This is your claim so I say, show me how I can distinguish your claim from that of a born again Christian who claims to have had the experience of being saved. You both are claiming subjective knowledge that cannot be evaluated from outside. But you have an advantage in enlightenment. That package comes with the added claim that you can know things that people like me cannot know. Can you express one single thing as evidence that you are functioning on a higher mental level rather than a state of self delusion? There must be some way that you can demonstrate that you actually have a special mental ability with your higher state isn't there? And if there is not, then your state of mind is indistinguishable from any other person whose opinion of their specialness exceeds what others see in them. One more thing. The God you know inside had better keep his trap shut. If he decides that you are the pure vehicle for one single message to us, anything: Lil Debbie cakes are superior to Hostess cupcakes, The Mets will win whatever it is that those teams want to win, Halloween candy corn will cure cancer but only if you eat each section starting with the tip separately, ANYTHING... you will go from enlightened guy to lunatic in the time it takes anyone here to read your message. (Nabbie excepted course) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : As long as you are on the path to know the creator of the universe, as you put it, I am OK with that. I understand that your previous experiences with religion and TM, may have created a confusing concept of God, that you have rejected. No problem, God is endlessly creative, and will no doubt eventually make him and herself known to you, in a way that is yours alone, personally tailored for you. Once God awakes within you, you will know what I am talking about. Otherwise, it is nonsense to the waking state consciousness. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : J: Er, Curtis, you are mistaking your failure, for certainty M: I have no certainty and don't buy yours. J: And being very arrogant about it. M: I am the on saying I do not KNOW the creator of the universe. You are saying you do. Perhaps you have redefined this word too. J: Without a sense of pure awareness, not the forced experiences from rounding, that you have mentioned, but the real deal, 24x7, you are basing your conclusions on fantasy, and have no clue about real enlightenment. M: So you know all about my awareness from inside too perhaps? J: Your choice, and so far, a very poor one, just like yer buddy, there, in front of the tube. M: Yeah, I don't buy your claims. Sorry that this frankness makes you feel hostile. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Turq-No one can *prove* the existence of God to you or anybody else! God can only be proven to yourself through your own *experience*. God is a subjective reality, and as MMY used to say, The proof is in the pudding, ie the taste!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
I must be prescient, having just said: I honestly think that a large part of the problem is that many of the players on the Believer side of this particular discussion have been indoctrinated by Maharishi not only with poor critical thinking skills, but with an actual false belief. That is, they believe that their subjective experience constitutes objective proof. It doesn't, and never will. :-) From: wgm4u no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 5:18 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Turq-No one can *prove* the existence of God to you or anybody else! God can only be proven to yourself through your own *experience*. God is a subjective reality, and as MMY used to say, The proof is in the pudding, ie the taste!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
uh...Barry...you being a former TM teacher and all, Maharishi wasn't talking about subjective experience, constituting objective proof, for anyone else, only for the subject, and only in a life of enlightenment. The meme for waking state is to always doubt experience, and it is an appropriate caution, for such a state of immature consciousness. But, as we grow up, and see waking state for what it is, a very incomplete picture of life, the subjective, and objective experience merges. So much easier that way, going about life, knowing what to do, to help others, and ourselves. Again, it is a personal thing, for each of us to personally evaluate, for ourselves, regarding our own experience. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : I must be prescient, having just said: I honestly think that a large part of the problem is that many of the players on the Believer side of this particular discussion have been indoctrinated by Maharishi not only with poor critical thinking skills, but with an actual false belief. That is, they believe that their subjective experience constitutes objective proof. It doesn't, and never will. :-) From: wgm4u no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 5:18 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Turq-No one can *prove* the existence of God to you or anybody else! God can only be proven to yourself through your own *experience*. God is a subjective reality, and as MMY used to say, The proof is in the pudding, ie the taste!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
and TM, may have created a confusing concept of God, that you have rejected. No problem, God is endlessly creative, and will no doubt eventually make him and herself known to you, in a way that is yours alone, personally tailored for you. Once God awakes within you, you will know what I am talking about. Otherwise, it is nonsense to the waking state consciousness. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : J: Er, Curtis, you are mistaking your failure, for certainty M: I have no certainty and don't buy yours. J: And being very arrogant about it. M: I am the on saying I do not KNOW the creator of the universe. You are saying you do. Perhaps you have redefined this word too. J: Without a sense of pure awareness, not the forced experiences from rounding, that you have mentioned, but the real deal, 24x7, you are basing your conclusions on fantasy, and have no clue about real enlightenment. M: So you know all about my awareness from inside too perhaps? J: Your choice, and so far, a very poor one, just like yer buddy, there, in front of the tube. M: Yeah, I don't buy your claims. Sorry that this frankness makes you feel hostile. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
thing. The God you know inside had better keep his trap shut. If he decides that you are the pure vehicle for one single message to us, anything: Lil Debbie cakes are superior to Hostess cupcakes, The Mets will win whatever it is that those teams want to win, Halloween candy corn will cure cancer but only if you eat each section starting with the tip separately, ANYTHING... you will go from enlightened guy to lunatic in the time it takes anyone here to read your message. (Nabbie excepted course) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : As long as you are on the path to know the creator of the universe, as you put it, I am OK with that. I understand that your previous experiences with religion and TM, may have created a confusing concept of God, that you have rejected. No problem, God is endlessly creative, and will no doubt eventually make him and herself known to you, in a way that is yours alone, personally tailored for you. Once God awakes within you, you will know what I am talking about. Otherwise, it is nonsense to the waking state consciousness. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : J: Er, Curtis, you are mistaking your failure, for certainty M: I have no certainty and don't buy yours. J: And being very arrogant about it. M: I am the on saying I do not KNOW the creator of the universe. You are saying you do. Perhaps you have redefined this word too. J: Without a sense of pure awareness, not the forced experiences from rounding, that you have mentioned, but the real deal, 24x7, you are basing your conclusions on fantasy, and have no clue about real enlightenment. M: So you know all about my awareness from inside too perhaps? J: Your choice, and so far, a very poor one, just like yer buddy, there, in front of the tube. M: Yeah, I don't buy your claims. Sorry that this frankness makes you feel hostile. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
know I am in the next state of enlightenment and am your guru trying to coax you along to my higher state. Subjective inflation can go both ways you know. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : OK Jim, lets look at your claim to be in a higher state of consciousness with a special access to knowledge. This is your claim so I say, show me how I can distinguish your claim from that of a born again Christian who claims to have had the experience of being saved. You both are claiming subjective knowledge that cannot be evaluated from outside. But you have an advantage in enlightenment. That package comes with the added claim that you can know things that people like me cannot know. Can you express one single thing as evidence that you are functioning on a higher mental level rather than a state of self delusion? There must be some way that you can demonstrate that you actually have a special mental ability with your higher state isn't there? And if there is not, then your state of mind is indistinguishable from any other person whose opinion of their specialness exceeds what others see in them. One more thing. The God you know inside had better keep his trap shut. If he decides that you are the pure vehicle for one single message to us, anything: Lil Debbie cakes are superior to Hostess cupcakes, The Mets will win whatever it is that those teams want to win, Halloween candy corn will cure cancer but only if you eat each section starting with the tip separately, ANYTHING... you will go from enlightened guy to lunatic in the time it takes anyone here to read your message. (Nabbie excepted course) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : As long as you are on the path to know the creator of the universe, as you put it, I am OK with that. I understand that your previous experiences with religion and TM, may have created a confusing concept of God, that you have rejected. No problem, God is endlessly creative, and will no doubt eventually make him and herself known to you, in a way that is yours alone, personally tailored for you. Once God awakes within you, you will know what I am talking about. Otherwise, it is nonsense to the waking state consciousness. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : J: Er, Curtis, you are mistaking your failure, for certainty M: I have no certainty and don't buy yours. J: And being very arrogant about it. M: I am the on saying I do not KNOW the creator of the universe. You are saying you do. Perhaps you have redefined this word too. J: Without a sense of pure awareness, not the forced experiences from rounding, that you have mentioned, but the real deal, 24x7, you are basing your conclusions on fantasy, and have no clue about real enlightenment. M: So you know all about my awareness from inside too perhaps? J: Your choice, and so far, a very poor one, just like yer buddy, there, in front of the tube. M: Yeah, I don't buy your claims. Sorry that this frankness makes you feel hostile. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
maybe if we say it enough, Barry will get. then again, maybe not. maybe there is a different agenda at work here, this so called testing memes aren't we lucky. why not call it what it is, a twenty year experiment of pushing other people's buttons to see what rise one can get. Okay, not an particularly endearing trait, but not criminal. But then, distorting what people believe so you can ridicule them? Again, not criminal, but a pretty sad way to communicate. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Turq-No one can *prove* the existence of God to you or anybody else! God can only be proven to yourself through your own *experience*. God is a subjective reality, and as MMY used to say, The proof is in the pudding, ie the taste!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
dang Barry, can you not read? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : I must be prescient, having just said: I honestly think that a large part of the problem is that many of the players on the Believer side of this particular discussion have been indoctrinated by Maharishi not only with poor critical thinking skills, but with an actual false belief. That is, they believe that their subjective experience constitutes objective proof. It doesn't, and never will. :-) From: wgm4u no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 5:18 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Turq-No one can *prove* the existence of God to you or anybody else! God can only be proven to yourself through your own *experience*. God is a subjective reality, and as MMY used to say, The proof is in the pudding, ie the taste!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Turq- Subjective experience only verifies subjective proof, INITIALLY, but eventually, what we find, if the theory bears out, is that the objective World is nothing BUT the subjective World as well. It's a dichotomy that only experience can sort outall is one. The relative World is nothing but Maya-Shakti, (the play of Mother Divine) you know that. The 5 physical senses will never be able to perceive that reality, only the subtler senses can discern that reality, which is SUBJECTIVE, I can't prove it to YOU because it's a subjective experience, FWIW. (Got me thinkin' anyway :-) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : I must be prescient, having just said: I honestly think that a large part of the problem is that many of the players on the Believer side of this particular discussion have been indoctrinated by Maharishi not only with poor critical thinking skills, but with an actual false belief. That is, they believe that their subjective experience constitutes objective proof. It doesn't, and never will. :-) From: wgm4u no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 5:18 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Turq-No one can *prove* the existence of God to you or anybody else! God can only be proven to yourself through your own *experience*. God is a subjective reality, and as MMY used to say, The proof is in the pudding, ie the taste!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Fleet is right. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : uh...Barry...you being a former TM teacher and all, Maharishi wasn't talking about subjective experience, constituting objective proof, for anyone else, only for the subject, and only in a life of enlightenment. The meme for waking state is to always doubt experience, and it is an appropriate caution, for such a state of immature consciousness. But, as we grow up, and see waking state for what it is, a very incomplete picture of life, the subjective, and objective experience merges. So much easier that way, going about life, knowing what to do, to help others, and ourselves. Again, it is a personal thing, for each of us to personally evaluate, for ourselves, regarding our own experience. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : I must be prescient, having just said: I honestly think that a large part of the problem is that many of the players on the Believer side of this particular discussion have been indoctrinated by Maharishi not only with poor critical thinking skills, but with an actual false belief. That is, they believe that their subjective experience constitutes objective proof. It doesn't, and never will. :-) From: wgm4u no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 5:18 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Turq-No one can *prove* the existence of God to you or anybody else! God can only be proven to yourself through your own *experience*. God is a subjective reality, and as MMY used to say, The proof is in the pudding, ie the taste!
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Ann, These are good quotes which adequately sum up the attitudes of atheists. LOL, adequately sums them up if you want your own narrow viewpoint bolstered you mean. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : Is this really the broad statement on which an atheist makes his case.? In which case, it really is a shame to see the arrogant and skewed attitude held by an atheist. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : “The man who prays is the one who thinks that god has arranged matters all wrong, but who also thinks that he can instruct god how to put them right.” Christopher Hitchens. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Yeah, maybe if they pray enough they'll start hopping. :-D On 10/16/2014 06:32 PM, jr_esq@... mailto:jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: As Sodom and Gomorrah. But he has a solution. http://m.cnsnews.com/mrctv-blog/michael-w-chapman/rev-billy-graham-america-just-wicked-sodom-and-gomorrah-ever-were http://m.cnsnews.com/mrctv-blog/michael-w-chapman/rev-billy-graham-america-just-wicked-sodom-and-gomorrah-ever-were
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Doncha love how people who believe in an invisible magic man in the sky like to portray those who don't as if *they* are the crazy ones. Sometimes the sheer feeble-mindedness of believers astounds me. Or, as someone once said so well: Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd. -- Voltaire I don't know about you, Salyavin, but it's difficult for me to imagine someone whose mind is so weak and whose fear of the unknown is so profound that they would exchange a belief in that which can never be proved to exist (because...duh...it doesn't) for the far more interesting and fulfilling sense of MYSTERY that is their birthright. From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2014 8:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Ann, These are good quotes which adequately sum up the attitudes of atheists. LOL, adequately sums them up if you want your own narrow viewpoint bolstered you mean.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Jesus, Barry, when did you set the bar so low for yourself? Is it really necessary to distort what someone says, just so you can attack the distortion. That also applies to your BFF, although, not so much. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : Doncha love how people who believe in an invisible magic man in the sky like to portray those who don't as if *they* are the crazy ones. Sometimes the sheer feeble-mindedness of believers astounds me. Or, as someone once said so well: Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd. -- Voltaire I don't know about you, Salyavin, but it's difficult for me to imagine someone whose mind is so weak and whose fear of the unknown is so profound that they would exchange a belief in that which can never be proved to exist (because...duh...it doesn't) for the far more interesting and fulfilling sense of MYSTERY that is their birthright. From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2014 8:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Ann, These are good quotes which adequately sum up the attitudes of atheists. LOL, adequately sums them up if you want your own narrow viewpoint bolstered you mean.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
As his true self, his Freddie addiction, and massive hypocrisy, are revealed, little Bawee has turned into the FFL troll. Poor bastard. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : Jesus, Barry, when did you set the bar so low for yourself? Is it really necessary to distort what someone says, just so you can attack the distortion. That also applies to your BFF, although, not so much. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : Doncha love how people who believe in an invisible magic man in the sky like to portray those who don't as if *they* are the crazy ones. Sometimes the sheer feeble-mindedness of believers astounds me. Or, as someone once said so well: Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd. -- Voltaire I don't know about you, Salyavin, but it's difficult for me to imagine someone whose mind is so weak and whose fear of the unknown is so profound that they would exchange a belief in that which can never be proved to exist (because...duh...it doesn't) for the far more interesting and fulfilling sense of MYSTERY that is their birthright. From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2014 8:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Ann, These are good quotes which adequately sum up the attitudes of atheists. LOL, adequately sums them up if you want your own narrow viewpoint bolstered you mean.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
On 10/18/2014 2:54 AM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Doncha love how people who believe in an invisible magic man in the sky like to portray those who don't as if *they* are the crazy ones. Sometimes the sheer feeble-mindedness of believers astounds me. Or, as someone once said so well: /You sound really confused, Barry, like Don Quixote tilting at windmills and attacking imaginary enemies. You sound like a True Believer where everything is either black or white with no shades of grey.// // //Traditionally Buddhists throughout the world consider that the universe contains more beings in it than are normally visible to humans. Buddhists have no objection to the existence of the Hindu gods. // // //Nevertheless, Buddhists can't take refuge in the gods because the gods are not Buddha. That is, they are not enlightened. All the Hindu gods, for all their power, are not the final truth of things. Power does not necessarily entail insight, and for Buddhists the gods do not have the liberating insight. But none of this entails that the gods do not exist or that the gods cannot exert a powerful influence over our lives. Thus, the Buddhist has no problem with the gods like you seem to have. / /Those over there are not giants but windmills.// //Those things that seem to be their arms are sails which, // //when they are whirled around by the wind, turn the millstone. // //- Miguel de Cervantes// / Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd. -- Voltaire
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : Doncha love how people who believe in an invisible magic man in the sky like to portray those who don't as if *they* are the crazy ones. Sometimes the sheer feeble-mindedness of believers astounds me. Or, as someone once said so well: Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd. -- Voltaire I don't know about you, Salyavin, but it's difficult for me to imagine someone whose mind is so weak and whose fear of the unknown is so profound that they would exchange a belief in that which can never be proved to exist (because...duh...it doesn't) for the far more interesting and fulfilling sense of MYSTERY that is their birthright. I'm just enjoying the responses it gets whenever you say anything contrary to the POV of the believer. Some of the weird fantasies that are getting projected on us are actually fascinating. If I could be bothered to read all of it I might start trying to classify it so we can use it to make predictions about what sort of abuse to expect per rational argument. There's got to be a use for FFL.. Leo Festinger would have been well into this place! From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2014 8:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Ann, These are good quotes which adequately sum up the attitudes of atheists. LOL, adequately sums them up if you want your own narrow viewpoint bolstered you mean.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : Doncha love how people who believe in an invisible magic man in the sky like to portray those who don't as if *they* are the crazy ones. Sometimes the sheer feeble-mindedness of believers astounds me. Or, as someone once said so well: Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd. -- Voltaire I don't know about you, Salyavin, but it's difficult for me to imagine someone whose mind is so weak and whose fear of the unknown is so profound that they would exchange a belief in that which can never be proved to exist (because...duh...it doesn't) for the far more interesting and fulfilling sense of MYSTERY that is their birthright. I'm just enjoying the responses it gets whenever you say anything contrary to the POV of the believer. Exactly. Thanks for noticing, and getting it. Inquisition actually is a pretty interesting documentary, BTW and deals with similar responses. Some of the weird fantasies that are getting projected on us are actually fascinating. If I could be bothered to read all of it I might start trying to classify it so we can use it to make predictions about what sort of abuse to expect per rational argument. There's got to be a use for FFL.. Careful, dude. That last sentence almost revealed belief that there might be a Plan behind all of this. :-) :-) :-) Leo Festinger would have been well into this place! Don't know him. Should I? From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2014 8:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Ann, These are good quotes which adequately sum up the attitudes of atheists. LOL, adequately sums them up if you want your own narrow viewpoint bolstered you mean.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
On 10/18/2014 2:54 AM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: I don't know about you, Salyavin, but it's difficult for me to imagine someone whose mind is so weak and whose fear of the unknown is so profound that they would exchange a belief in that which can never be proved to exist (because...duh...it doesn't) /This is a clear case of cognitive dissonance. Cognitive dissonance is the mental stress or discomfort experienced by an individual who holds two or more contradictory beliefs, ideas, or values at the same time, or information that conflicts with existing beliefs, ideas, or values. / for the far more interesting and fulfilling sense of MYSTERY that is their birthright. /The mystery is your spiritual path - that apparently has no spirits, and your online persona which doesn't seem to be very spiritual. In fact, most of your activities seem pretty mundane with just a few exceptions. As pointed out to you in a previous exchange, it just doesn't make any sense to claim para-normal powers like levitation, and then to deny in the next message a ///separate reality/ and quote Carlos Castaneda. You don't seem to be able to explain yourself very well. Do you even know what you believe or are you like everyone else figuring this life out on the fly? Carlos Castaneda on self-importance and petty tyrants: http://www.mail-archive.com/fairfieldlife%40yahoogroups.com/msg276165.html /
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : Doncha love how people who believe in an invisible magic man in the sky like to portray those who don't as if *they* are the crazy ones. Sometimes the sheer feeble-mindedness of believers astounds me. Or, as someone once said so well: Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd. -- Voltaire I don't know about you, Salyavin, but it's difficult for me to imagine someone whose mind is so weak and whose fear of the unknown is so profound that they would exchange a belief in that which can never be proved to exist (because...duh...it doesn't) for the far more interesting and fulfilling sense of MYSTERY that is their birthright. I'm just enjoying the responses it gets whenever you say anything contrary to the POV of the believer. Exactly. Thanks for noticing, and getting it. Inquisition actually is a pretty interesting documentary, BTW and deals with similar responses. I will look it up, sounds like my cup of Rosie. Some of the weird fantasies that are getting projected on us are actually fascinating. If I could be bothered to read all of it I might start trying to classify it so we can use it to make predictions about what sort of abuse to expect per rational argument. There's got to be a use for FFL.. Careful, dude. That last sentence almost revealed belief that there might be a Plan behind all of this. :-) :-) :-) Leo Festinger would have been well into this place! Don't know him. Should I? You might have done if I'd spelt it right ;-) When Prophecy Fails - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_Prophecy_Fails http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_Prophecy_Fails When Prophecy Fails - Wikipedia, the free encycl... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_Prophecy_Fails When Prophecy Fails: A Social and Psychological Study of a Modern Group That Predicted the Destruction of the World is a classic work of soci... View on en.wikipedia.org http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_Prophecy_Fails Preview by Yahoo From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2014 8:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Ann, These are good quotes which adequately sum up the attitudes of atheists. LOL, adequately sums them up if you want your own narrow viewpoint bolstered you mean.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Ann, These are good quotes which adequately sum up the attitudes of atheists. LOL, adequately sums them up if you want your own narrow viewpoint bolstered you mean. Everything is a mystery. What people think and why they think it is mysterious. How I can put one foot in front of the other is a mystery, even if someone thinks they can explain the mechanics of it there remain at least 50 mysteries within that act alone. The biggest mystery being what is motivating the desire to put one foot in front of the other. My life is nothing but mystery, I have enough mystery to keep me busy for 1000 lifetimes so don't start claiming that those who have opinions about something lack the capacity to embrace mystery because to do so is to fall into the very trap you are claiming others are already floundering in. I mean, you're the guy who requires the rigid scientific methods to strip down every mystery. You're the one who can't seem to abide something if it isn't clearly documented and disassembled right down to the boring nitty gritty. So don't talk to me about mystery.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : As his true self, his Freddie addiction, and massive hypocrisy, are revealed, little Bawee has turned into the FFL troll. Poor bastard. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : Jesus, Barry, when did you set the bar so low for yourself? Is it really necessary to distort what someone says, just so you can attack the distortion. That also applies to your BFF, although, not so much. Steve, this observation brilliant.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, punditster@... wrote : On 10/18/2014 2:54 AM, TurquoiseBee turquoiseb@... mailto:turquoiseb@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: Doncha love how people who believe in an invisible magic man in the sky like to portray those who don't as if *they* are the crazy ones. Sometimes the sheer feeble-mindedness of believers astounds me. Or, as someone once said so well: You sound really confused, Barry, like Don Quixote tilting at windmills and attacking imaginary enemies. You sound like a True Believer where everything is either black or white with no shades of grey. Traditionally Buddhists throughout the world consider that the universe contains more beings in it than are normally visible to humans. Buddhists have no objection to the existence of the Hindu gods. Nevertheless, Buddhists can't take refuge in the gods because the gods are not Buddha. That is, they are not enlightened. All the Hindu gods, for all their power, are not the final truth of things. Power does not necessarily entail insight, and for Buddhists the gods do not have the liberating insight. But none of this entails that the gods do not exist or that the gods cannot exert a powerful influence over our lives. Thus, the Buddhist has no problem with the gods like you seem to have. Really nice post Richard. Sometimes your learning and, dare I say it, wisdom really comes through.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
On 10/18/2014 6:45 AM, steve.sun...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Jesus, Barry, when did you set the bar so low for yourself? /Sometimes people get confused when they get old and they sometimes lash out at imagined enemies, Steve. The sad thing is that we have a real enemy on the war path in Iraq, but Barry thinks you are his enemy. It may be that he is just scared and afraid and feels vulnerable - unable to control his own thoughts or his environment. That's when the cognitive dissonance sets in. Cognitive dissonance is the mental stress or discomfort experienced by an individual who holds two or more contradictory beliefs, ideas, or values at the same time.For example, a belief in karma and at the same time, a denial of causation. It just doesn't make any sense. // // //Barry seems to want to be spiritual and he's been a seeker for most of his adult life, but obviously he hasn't found all the answers. That must be really frustrating - now he is seeking confirmation of some kind - or an appeal for help?/ Is it really necessary to distort what someone says, just so you can attack the distortion. That also applies to your BFF, although, not so much. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : Doncha love how people who believe in an invisible magic man in the sky like to portray those who don't as if *they* are the crazy ones. Sometimes the sheer feeble-mindedness of believers astounds me. Or, as someone once said so well: Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd. -- Voltaire I don't know about you, Salyavin, but it's difficult for me to imagine someone whose mind is so weak and whose fear of the unknown is so profound that they would exchange a belief in that which can never be proved to exist (because...duh...it doesn't) for the far more interesting and fulfilling sense of MYSTERY that is their birthright. *From:* salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com *To:* FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com *Sent:* Saturday, October 18, 2014 8:58 AM *Subject:* [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Ann, These are good quotes which adequately sum up the attitudes of atheists. LOL, adequately sums them up if you want your own narrow viewpoint bolstered you mean. Mystery creates wonder and wonder is the basis of man's desire to understand. - Neil Armstrong
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
On 10/18/2014 7:26 AM, fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: As his true self, his Freddie addiction, and massive hypocrisy, are revealed, little Bawee has turned into the FFL troll. Poor bastard. /Isn't ironic that Barry would wind up being labelled the FFL troll - a person who sends duplicitous messages to get angry responses.//Go figure./ Reason for trolling: * Seeks to dominate the thread by inciting anger or an angry response. * An indication of disturbing situations regarding family, relationships, substances, and schools. * Stating extreme positions to make his or her actual beliefs seem moderate. * A blatant violation of forum guidelines in order to see whether any action is taken by the forum administrator. * To some people, the thought of a 60-year-old Internet user sending a gross post is funny. * One of the greatest themes in trolling - one minute of your time spent causing 10 other people to waste ten or more minutes. * In some cases, the individuals do not think of themselves as trolls, but misunderstood writers, and/or political or religious commentators.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
I don't know about you, Salyavin, but it's difficult for me to imagine someone whose mind is so weak and whose fear of the unknown is so profound that they would exchange a belief in that which can never be proved to exist (because...duh...it doesn't) for the far more interesting and fulfilling sense of MYSTERY that is their birthright. On 10/18/2014 7:50 AM, salyavin808 wrote: I'm just enjoying the responses it gets whenever you say anything contrary to the POV of the believer. Some of the weird fantasies that are getting projected on us are actually fascinating. If I could be bothered to read all of it I might start trying to classify it so we can use it to make predictions about what sort of abuse to expect per rational argument. There's got to be a use for FFL.. /What else is their to say - you don't seem to want to talk about Rotherham. Sometimes it's what people don't say that is the most interesting part of their response. Go figure./ Leo Festinger would have been well into this place!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
How do you even stand to interact, even a little, with such uninformed, biased people here, salyavin? Isn't there some Mensa group you can associate with? I guess you just like slumming it here. Or maybe it just gets boring up in the tower. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : Doncha love how people who believe in an invisible magic man in the sky like to portray those who don't as if *they* are the crazy ones. Sometimes the sheer feeble-mindedness of believers astounds me. Or, as someone once said so well: Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd. -- Voltaire I don't know about you, Salyavin, but it's difficult for me to imagine someone whose mind is so weak and whose fear of the unknown is so profound that they would exchange a belief in that which can never be proved to exist (because...duh...it doesn't) for the far more interesting and fulfilling sense of MYSTERY that is their birthright. I'm just enjoying the responses it gets whenever you say anything contrary to the POV of the believer. Some of the weird fantasies that are getting projected on us are actually fascinating. If I could be bothered to read all of it I might start trying to classify it so we can use it to make predictions about what sort of abuse to expect per rational argument. There's got to be a use for FFL.. Leo Festinger would have been well into this place! From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2014 8:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Ann, These are good quotes which adequately sum up the attitudes of atheists. LOL, adequately sums them up if you want your own narrow viewpoint bolstered you mean.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
As it is with most of us Ann. Even when there is a scientific explanation behind it. And there is a sliding scale among everyone here of the belief in God. Barry, of course believes in most of the tenants of theism, but just doesn't use the word God He prefers the word Intelligence so he can get a card that states, I am a Atheist He treasures that card, because it goes along with his self proclaimed label as, rebel. But scratch beneath the surface, and he'd have some explaining to do. But don't expect him to be pressed by anyone in his clique. Oh, gawd, no. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : Everything is a mystery. What people think and why they think it is mysterious. How I can put one foot in front of the other is a mystery, even if someone thinks they can explain the mechanics of it there remain at least 50 mysteries within that act alone. The biggest mystery being what is motivating the desire to put one foot in front of the other. My life is nothing but mystery, I have enough mystery to keep me busy for 1000 lifetimes so don't start claiming that those who have opinions about something lack the capacity to embrace mystery because to do so is to fall into the very trap you are claiming others are already floundering in. I mean, you're the guy who requires the rigid scientific methods to strip down every mystery. You're the one who can't seem to abide something if it isn't clearly documented and disassembled right down to the boring nitty gritty. So don't talk to me about mystery.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
I guess now we are just waiting for the fat lady singing comment. for Barry that is to tout, how many replies he's gotten to his post. I think that's sort of his payoff, I guess. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, punditster@... wrote : On 10/18/2014 6:45 AM, steve.sundur@... mailto:steve.sundur@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: Jesus, Barry, when did you set the bar so low for yourself? Sometimes people get confused when they get old and they sometimes lash out at imagined enemies, Steve. The sad thing is that we have a real enemy on the war path in Iraq, but Barry thinks you are his enemy. It may be that he is just scared and afraid and feels vulnerable - unable to control his own thoughts or his environment. That's when the cognitive dissonance sets in. Cognitive dissonance is the mental stress or discomfort experienced by an individual who holds two or more contradictory beliefs, ideas, or values at the same time. For example, a belief in karma and at the same time, a denial of causation. It just doesn't make any sense. Barry seems to want to be spiritual and he's been a seeker for most of his adult life, but obviously he hasn't found all the answers. That must be really frustrating - now he is seeking confirmation of some kind - or an appeal for help? Is it really necessary to distort what someone says, just so you can attack the distortion. That also applies to your BFF, although, not so much. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... mailto:turquoiseb@... wrote : Doncha love how people who believe in an invisible magic man in the sky like to portray those who don't as if *they* are the crazy ones. Sometimes the sheer feeble-mindedness of believers astounds me. Or, as someone once said so well: Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd. -- Voltaire I don't know about you, Salyavin, but it's difficult for me to imagine someone whose mind is so weak and whose fear of the unknown is so profound that they would exchange a belief in that which can never be proved to exist (because...duh...it doesn't) for the far more interesting and fulfilling sense of MYSTERY that is their birthright. From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 18, 2014 8:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... mailto:jr_esq@... wrote : Ann, These are good quotes which adequately sum up the attitudes of atheists. LOL, adequately sums them up if you want your own narrow viewpoint bolstered you mean.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
I don't believe in the God, that the atheists don't believe in, either. Who the fuck would want to? Theirs is a cultural God, or philosophical God, or logical God. The atheists must define, that which they do not believe in, and I agree, I do not believe in any of the Gods or gods, that they do not believe in, too. The God I know, is unknown to them, they cannot define the God I know, and wouldn't have a clue where to begin. Now, THAT'S funny. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : As it is with most of us Ann. Even when there is a scientific explanation behind it. And there is a sliding scale among everyone here of the belief in God. Barry, of course believes in most of the tenants of theism, but just doesn't use the word God He prefers the word Intelligence so he can get a card that states, I am a Atheist He treasures that card, because it goes along with his self proclaimed label as, rebel. But scratch beneath the surface, and he'd have some explaining to do. But don't expect him to be pressed by anyone in his clique. Oh, gawd, no. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : Everything is a mystery. What people think and why they think it is mysterious. How I can put one foot in front of the other is a mystery, even if someone thinks they can explain the mechanics of it there remain at least 50 mysteries within that act alone. The biggest mystery being what is motivating the desire to put one foot in front of the other. My life is nothing but mystery, I have enough mystery to keep me busy for 1000 lifetimes so don't start claiming that those who have opinions about something lack the capacity to embrace mystery because to do so is to fall into the very trap you are claiming others are already floundering in. I mean, you're the guy who requires the rigid scientific methods to strip down every mystery. You're the one who can't seem to abide something if it isn't clearly documented and disassembled right down to the boring nitty gritty. So don't talk to me about mystery.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
--In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : I don't believe in the God, that the atheists don't believe in, either. Who the fuck would want to? Theirs is a cultural God, or philosophical God, or logical God. The atheists must define, that which they do not believe in, and I agree, I do not believe in any of the Gods or gods, that they do not believe in, too. The God I know, is unknown to them, they cannot define the God I know, and wouldn't have a clue where to begin. Now, THAT'S funny. M: That seems a bit assumptive. How could you know if the God you claim to experience is unknown to them. Perhaps they had similar experiences and have come to different conclusions about the meaning of them? You are perhaps giving your subjective experience undue epistemological weight, a condition that some cognitive psychologists would argue is one of our most glaring cognitive gaps. Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : As it is with most of us Ann. Even when there is a scientific explanation behind it. And there is a sliding scale among everyone here of the belief in God. Barry, of course believes in most of the tenants of theism, but just doesn't use the word God He prefers the word Intelligence so he can get a card that states, I am a Atheist He treasures that card, because it goes along with his self proclaimed label as, rebel. But scratch beneath the surface, and he'd have some explaining to do. But don't expect him to be pressed by anyone in his clique. Oh, gawd, no. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : Everything is a mystery. What people think and why they think it is mysterious. How I can put one foot in front of the other is a mystery, even if someone thinks they can explain the mechanics of it there remain at least 50 mysteries within that act alone. The biggest mystery being what is motivating the desire to put one foot in front of the other. My life is nothing but mystery, I have enough mystery to keep me busy for 1000 lifetimes so don't start claiming that those who have opinions about something lack the capacity to embrace mystery because to do so is to fall into the very trap you are claiming others are already floundering in. I mean, you're the guy who requires the rigid scientific methods to strip down every mystery. You're the one who can't seem to abide something if it isn't clearly documented and disassembled right down to the boring nitty gritty. So don't talk to me about mystery.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
From: curtisdeltabl...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-)
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... [1 Attachment]
Curtis, as jr. says, you guys say there is no God. Its not like it is ambiguous. I like what Edg had to say about it - God equals awareness. I'd go along with that definition, completely. So, can you say you have no awareness, or is this a big bluster, of being an atheist, against the bankrupt cultural God we all dismissed in 4th grade, or so, the old guy with the beard who sits in judgment - That guy. Forget about him - what do you say about Edg's simple association, that God is awareness? That is my God too, 24x7. As for assumptions, I don't make them about God - it is more like a reporting of instantaneous experience. The nervous system changes, as enlightenment progresses. There are no longer previous deep and unknown impressions, to fuel the subconscious, as it is known in waking state. Everything is as fresh as a daisy, rejuvenating itself, moment by moment. There is no need for undue doubt or speculation, or fantasy, or imagination, regarding God. Nothing to hold onto, at all - In fact what could be more absurd than trying to hold onto God?? I give prayers for thanks, when necessary, or seek comfort directly, or am struck with awe, at the wonder of God's creation, but, I don't think about God abstractly, much at all. It just doesn't come up. PS Here's a picture of God. Just caught her in the yard, as the sun was setting. :-) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : --In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : I don't believe in the God, that the atheists don't believe in, either. Who the fuck would want to? Theirs is a cultural God, or philosophical God, or logical God. The atheists must define, that which they do not believe in, and I agree, I do not believe in any of the Gods or gods, that they do not believe in, too. The God I know, is unknown to them, they cannot define the God I know, and wouldn't have a clue where to begin. Now, THAT'S funny. M: That seems a bit assumptive. How could you know if the God you claim to experience is unknown to them. Perhaps they had similar experiences and have come to different conclusions about the meaning of them? You are perhaps giving your subjective experience undue epistemological weight, a condition that some cognitive psychologists would argue is one of our most glaring cognitive gaps. Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : As it is with most of us Ann. Even when there is a scientific explanation behind it. And there is a sliding scale among everyone here of the belief in God. Barry, of course believes in most of the tenants of theism, but just doesn't use the word God He prefers the word Intelligence so he can get a card that states, I am a Atheist He treasures that card, because it goes along with his self proclaimed label as, rebel. But scratch beneath the surface, and he'd have some explaining to do. But don't expect him to be pressed by anyone in his clique. Oh, gawd, no. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : Everything is a mystery. What people think and why they think it is mysterious. How I can put one foot in front of the other is a mystery, even if someone thinks they can explain the mechanics of it there remain at least 50 mysteries within that act alone. The biggest mystery being what is motivating the desire to put one foot in front of the other. My life is nothing but mystery, I have enough mystery to keep me busy for 1000 lifetimes so don't start claiming that those who have opinions about something lack the capacity to embrace mystery because to do so is to fall into the very trap you are claiming others are already floundering in. I mean, you're the guy who requires the rigid scientific methods to strip down every mystery. You're the one who can't seem to abide something if it isn't clearly documented and disassembled right down to the boring nitty gritty. So don't talk to me about mystery.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Sure you can, Barry. ;-) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : Curtis, as jr. says, you guys say there is no God. Its not like it is ambiguous. M: But I don't say this. I say I see no reason to believe in one. There is a huge difference between these statements. I am amazed that I cannot communicate this difference effectively because it keeps coming back misstated. I see the God stories as mythology. Valuable as literature. I see the experiences of God as an interesting thing our brains can do without it meaning anything about the actual existence of God. I will keep trying. But I am not saying there is no God, how could I know such a thing if I am denying that you could know there is one? It would require the exact same thinking flaw IMO. F: I like what Edg had to say about it - God equals awareness. I'd go along with that definition, completely. So, can you say you have no awareness, or is this a big bluster, of being an atheist, against the bankrupt cultural God we all dismissed in 4th grade, or so, the old guy with the beard who sits in judgment - That guy. Forget about him - what do you say about Edg's simple association, that God is awareness? M:We can redefine God as a ham sandwich if we want, but that has nothing to do with the definitions within and without of mystical traditions. My awareness (yours also) did not create the world so it seems like a pretty big demotion of the concept. Redefining it as awareness and reducing it to that function simple does away with the essential concept that makes the word God separate from the term awareness. I don't find it helpful or descriptive. F: That is my God too, 24x7. As for assumptions, I don't make them about God - it is more like a reporting of instantaneous experience. The nervous system changes, as enlightenment progresses. There are no longer previous deep and unknown impressions, to fuel the subconscious, as it is known in waking state. M: You seem unaware of all the assumptive statements in those sentences. Certainly your right, but I would not see this as a case for extra awareness, I see it as you having less. And it falls far short of the superlatives that the term God has been associated with in mystical traditions including my own experiences in one. F: Everything is as fresh as a daisy, rejuvenating itself, moment by moment. There is no need for undue doubt or speculation, or fantasy, or imagination, regarding God. Nothing to hold onto, at all - In fact what could be more absurd than trying to hold onto God?? I give prayers for thanks, when necessary, or seek comfort directly, or am struck with awe, at the wonder of God's creation, but, I don't think about God abstractly, much at all. It just doesn't come up. M: I am not sure what you are saying here. Not being reflective about your subjective experience is not making a good case for having more awareness, it seems like less. If you are saying that you aren't able to question your own experience, or see no need to, then we are not on the same page about this at all. It sounds like unreflective intellectual over confidence. Not a virtue in my book. F: PS Here's a picture of God. Just caught her in the yard, as the sun was setting. :-) M: If you want to reduce the concept of God to nature then I think we already have a word for that and don't need another one with so much weird baggage. But I would like to end with an expression of appreciation for how you embrace life with or without the extra beliefs and interpretations of your experience that I don't buy Jim. As far as I can tell you are going for the gusto of interests in life in a way that I do respect. You seem to have inexhaustible curiosity about the world, and your interests in art and even cars. I don't reduce you to the areas where we don't see eye to eye. Whatever your beliefs are they seem to be working for you. I don't need to share them to appreciate many of your contributions here ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : --In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : I don't believe in the God, that the atheists don't believe in, either. Who the fuck would want to? Theirs is a cultural God, or philosophical God, or logical God. The atheists must define, that which they do not believe in, and I agree, I do not believe in any of the Gods or gods, that they do not believe in, too. The God I know, is unknown to them, they cannot define the God I know, and wouldn't have a clue where to begin. Now, THAT'S funny. M: That seems a bit assumptive. How could you know if the God you claim to experience is unknown to them. Perhaps they had similar experiences and have come to different conclusions about the meaning of them? You are perhaps giving your subjective experience undue epistemological weight, a condition that some cognitive psychologists would argue is one of our most glaring
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : As it is with most of us Ann. Even when there is a scientific explanation behind it. And there is a sliding scale among everyone here of the belief in God. Barry, of course believes in most of the tenants of theism, but just doesn't use the word God He prefers the word Intelligence so he can get a card that states, I am a Atheist He treasures that card, because it goes along with his self proclaimed label as, rebel. But scratch beneath the surface, and he'd have some explaining to do. But don't expect him to be pressed by anyone in his clique. Oh, gawd, no. Nicely articulated post there, Steve. You have made a deeper study of bawee than I have bothered to. I get just millimeters beneath the surface and that's about all I want to know. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : Everything is a mystery. What people think and why they think it is mysterious. How I can put one foot in front of the other is a mystery, even if someone thinks they can explain the mechanics of it there remain at least 50 mysteries within that act alone. The biggest mystery being what is motivating the desire to put one foot in front of the other. My life is nothing but mystery, I have enough mystery to keep me busy for 1000 lifetimes so don't start claiming that those who have opinions about something lack the capacity to embrace mystery because to do so is to fall into the very trap you are claiming others are already floundering in. I mean, you're the guy who requires the rigid scientific methods to strip down every mystery. You're the one who can't seem to abide something if it isn't clearly documented and disassembled right down to the boring nitty gritty. So don't talk to me about mystery.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Er, Curtis, you are mistaking your failure, for certainty. And being very arrogant about it. Without a sense of pure awareness, not the forced experiences from rounding, that you have mentioned, but the real deal, 24x7, you are basing your conclusions on fantasy, and have no clue about real enlightenment. Your choice, and so far, a very poor one, just like yer buddy, there, in front of the tube. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
n FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : J: Er, Curtis, you are mistaking your failure, for certainty M: I have no certainty and don't buy yours. J: And being very arrogant about it. M: I am the on saying I do not KNOW the creator of the universe. You are saying you do. Perhaps you have redefined this word too. J: Without a sense of pure awareness, not the forced experiences from rounding, that you have mentioned, but the real deal, 24x7, you are basing your conclusions on fantasy, and have no clue about real enlightenment. M: So you know all about my awareness from inside too perhaps? J: Your choice, and so far, a very poor one, just like yer buddy, there, in front of the tube. M: Yeah, I don't buy your claims. Sorry that this frankness makes you feel hostile. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Your awareness is a ham sammich? You are further gone, than I thought. I don't want to play games, Curtis, so I'll let your ham sammich continue thinking about whatever a ham sammich thinks about. we didn't create the world. Sure about that, old bean? In that case, please pass the mayo, so I can have you for lunch... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : Curtis, as jr. says, you guys say there is no God. Its not like it is ambiguous. M: But I don't say this. I say I see no reason to believe in one. There is a huge difference between these statements. I am amazed that I cannot communicate this difference effectively because it keeps coming back misstated. I see the God stories as mythology. Valuable as literature. I see the experiences of God as an interesting thing our brains can do without it meaning anything about the actual existence of God. I will keep trying. But I am not saying there is no God, how could I know such a thing if I am denying that you could know there is one? It would require the exact same thinking flaw IMO. F: I like what Edg had to say about it - God equals awareness. I'd go along with that definition, completely. So, can you say you have no awareness, or is this a big bluster, of being an atheist, against the bankrupt cultural God we all dismissed in 4th grade, or so, the old guy with the beard who sits in judgment - That guy. Forget about him - what do you say about Edg's simple association, that God is awareness? M:We can redefine God as a ham sandwich if we want, but that has nothing to do with the definitions within and without of mystical traditions. My awareness (yours also) did not create the world so it seems like a pretty big demotion of the concept. Redefining it as awareness and reducing it to that function simple does away with the essential concept that makes the word God separate from the term awareness. I don't find it helpful or descriptive. F: That is my God too, 24x7. As for assumptions, I don't make them about God - it is more like a reporting of instantaneous experience. The nervous system changes, as enlightenment progresses. There are no longer previous deep and unknown impressions, to fuel the subconscious, as it is known in waking state. M: You seem unaware of all the assumptive statements in those sentences. Certainly your right, but I would not see this as a case for extra awareness, I see it as you having less. And it falls far short of the superlatives that the term God has been associated with in mystical traditions including my own experiences in one. F: Everything is as fresh as a daisy, rejuvenating itself, moment by moment. There is no need for undue doubt or speculation, or fantasy, or imagination, regarding God. Nothing to hold onto, at all - In fact what could be more absurd than trying to hold onto God?? I give prayers for thanks, when necessary, or seek comfort directly, or am struck with awe, at the wonder of God's creation, but, I don't think about God abstractly, much at all. It just doesn't come up. M: I am not sure what you are saying here. Not being reflective about your subjective experience is not making a good case for having more awareness, it seems like less. If you are saying that you aren't able to question your own experience, or see no need to, then we are not on the same page about this at all. It sounds like unreflective intellectual over confidence. Not a virtue in my book. F: PS Here's a picture of God. Just caught her in the yard, as the sun was setting. :-) M: If you want to reduce the concept of God to nature then I think we already have a word for that and don't need another one with so much weird baggage. But I would like to end with an expression of appreciation for how you embrace life with or without the extra beliefs and interpretations of your experience that I don't buy Jim. As far as I can tell you are going for the gusto of interests in life in a way that I do respect. You seem to have inexhaustible curiosity about the world, and your interests in art and even cars. I don't reduce you to the areas where we don't see eye to eye. Whatever your beliefs are they seem to be working for you. I don't need to share them to appreciate many of your contributions here ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : --In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : I don't believe in the God, that the atheists don't believe in, either. Who the fuck would want to? Theirs is a cultural God, or philosophical God, or logical God. The atheists must define, that which they do not believe in, and I agree, I do not believe in any of the Gods or gods, that they do not believe in, too. The God I know, is unknown to them, they cannot define the God I know, and wouldn't have a clue where to begin. Now,
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
As long as you are on the path to know the creator of the universe, as you put it, I am OK with that. I understand that your previous experiences with religion and TM, may have created a confusing concept of God, that you have rejected. No problem, God is endlessly creative, and will no doubt eventually make him and herself known to you, in a way that is yours alone, personally tailored for you. Once God awakes within you, you will know what I am talking about. Otherwise, it is nonsense to the waking state consciousness. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : J: Er, Curtis, you are mistaking your failure, for certainty M: I have no certainty and don't buy yours. J: And being very arrogant about it. M: I am the on saying I do not KNOW the creator of the universe. You are saying you do. Perhaps you have redefined this word too. J: Without a sense of pure awareness, not the forced experiences from rounding, that you have mentioned, but the real deal, 24x7, you are basing your conclusions on fantasy, and have no clue about real enlightenment. M: So you know all about my awareness from inside too perhaps? J: Your choice, and so far, a very poor one, just like yer buddy, there, in front of the tube. M: Yeah, I don't buy your claims. Sorry that this frankness makes you feel hostile. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
-In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : As long as you are on the path to know the creator of the universe, as you put it, I am OK with that. I understand that your previous experiences with religion and TM, may have created a confusing concept of God, that you have rejected. No problem, God is endlessly creative, and will no doubt eventually make him and herself known to you, in a way that is yours alone, personally tailored for you. Once God awakes within you, you will know what I am talking about. Otherwise, it is nonsense to the waking state consciousness. M: Got it Jim, your mind is magic and mine isn't. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : J: Er, Curtis, you are mistaking your failure, for certainty M: I have no certainty and don't buy yours. J: And being very arrogant about it. M: I am the on saying I do not KNOW the creator of the universe. You are saying you do. Perhaps you have redefined this word too. J: Without a sense of pure awareness, not the forced experiences from rounding, that you have mentioned, but the real deal, 24x7, you are basing your conclusions on fantasy, and have no clue about real enlightenment. M: So you know all about my awareness from inside too perhaps? J: Your choice, and so far, a very poor one, just like yer buddy, there, in front of the tube. M: Yeah, I don't buy your claims. Sorry that this frankness makes you feel hostile. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Barry, you do realize that by your own admission you have been getting stuck on the idiot part for going on 35 years. Do you mind telling me what that means, cuz it has me bewildered? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-)
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
That sounds like personal growth. You may arrive at a different pov, than someone else, but there's something to be said for a civil exchange of ideas, even if it gets rather pointed at times. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
did Barry just get hoisted on his own petard? I think he did. (I think a long cry would do him a world of good) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : Sure you can, Barry. ;-) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-)
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) Er, bawee, I think you can. You are living proof.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Please keep looking for the creator! It is the only way to expand waking state, into 24x7 enlightenment, real life, vs. the 33 and 1/3 percent, you and TV watcher settle for... But, you know that... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : -In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : As long as you are on the path to know the creator of the universe, as you put it, I am OK with that. I understand that your previous experiences with religion and TM, may have created a confusing concept of God, that you have rejected. No problem, God is endlessly creative, and will no doubt eventually make him and herself known to you, in a way that is yours alone, personally tailored for you. Once God awakes within you, you will know what I am talking about. Otherwise, it is nonsense to the waking state consciousness. M: Got it Jim, your mind is magic and mine isn't. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : J: Er, Curtis, you are mistaking your failure, for certainty M: I have no certainty and don't buy yours. J: And being very arrogant about it. M: I am the on saying I do not KNOW the creator of the universe. You are saying you do. Perhaps you have redefined this word too. J: Without a sense of pure awareness, not the forced experiences from rounding, that you have mentioned, but the real deal, 24x7, you are basing your conclusions on fantasy, and have no clue about real enlightenment. M: So you know all about my awareness from inside too perhaps? J: Your choice, and so far, a very poor one, just like yer buddy, there, in front of the tube. M: Yeah, I don't buy your claims. Sorry that this frankness makes you feel hostile. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : From: curtisdeltablues@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 12:58 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... Atheists do not have to define what they do not believe in. They take the definitions from the believers and find them wanting. Yours included, to the degree that you have spelled out what it is. As usual, Curtis, I am in awe of your ability to interface with idiots as if they were actually worth the time. I keep getting stuck on the idiot part. To me, if a person believes in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect, that's kinda like the Trifecta of Idiocy. You can't actually become much more of a loser than that. :-) M: Well to be fair, there is nothing I have read hear (Nabbie included) that I didn't wholeheartedly embrace at one time in my life. I don't think of my past self as being an idiot, just a practicer of fallacious reasoning. I was just wrong about almost everything I believed. Simply and earnestly wrong. Kinda humbling really.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Share, MMY was saying that the path to unity consciousness is to act while in yoga, IMO. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Even in the SBAL Maharishi writes that our program is to meditate and act. So it's more like: meditate as if everything depends on Being; act as if everything depends on us. On Friday, October 17, 2014 6:51 AM, Michael Jackson mjackson74@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: “The man who prays is the one who thinks that god has arranged matters all wrong, but who also thinks that he can instruct god how to put them right.” - Christopher Hitchens. Oh that's rich! I love it! It also applies pretty well to the beliefs of the TM True Believers. From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 17, 2014 3:18 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : I was thinking that there's a similarity to the Maharishi Effect in what Pastor Graham is recommending. “The man who prays is the one who thinks that god has arranged matters all wrong, but who also thinks that he can instruct god how to put them right.” Christopher Hitchens. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Yeah, maybe if they pray enough they'll start hopping. :-D On 10/16/2014 06:32 PM, jr_esq@... mailto:jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: As Sodom and Gomorrah. But he has a solution. http://m.cnsnews.com/mrctv-blog/michael-w-chapman/rev-billy-graham-america-just-wicked-sodom-and-gomorrah-ever-were http://m.cnsnews.com/mrctv-blog/michael-w-chapman/rev-billy-graham-america-just-wicked-sodom-and-gomorrah-ever-were
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
John, I think you're right. And the path to CC is to dye the cloth or transcend, and then fade the cloth, that is, engage in activity. Actually in SBAL he writes that if we engage in activity we enjoy, the integration takes place more quickly. On Friday, October 17, 2014 4:03 PM, jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Share, MMY was saying that the path to unity consciousness is to act while in yoga, IMO. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Even in the SBAL Maharishi writes that our program is to meditate and act. So it's more like: meditate as if everything depends on Being; act as if everything depends on us. On Friday, October 17, 2014 6:51 AM, Michael Jackson mjackson74@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: “The man who prays is the one who thinks that god has arranged matters all wrong, but who also thinks that he can instruct god how to put them right.” - Christopher Hitchens. Oh that's rich! I love it! It also applies pretty well to the beliefs of the TM True Believers. From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 17, 2014 3:18 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : I was thinking that there's a similarity to the Maharishi Effect in what Pastor Graham is recommending. “The man who prays is the one who thinks that god has arranged matters all wrong, but who also thinks that he can instruct god how to put them right.” Christopher Hitchens. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Yeah, maybe if they pray enough they'll start hopping. :-D On 10/16/2014 06:32 PM, jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: As Sodom and Gomorrah. But he has a solution. http://m.cnsnews.com/mrctv-blog/michael-w-chapman/rev-billy-graham-america-just-wicked-sodom-and-gomorrah-ever-were
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Ann, These are good quotes which adequately sum up the attitudes of atheists. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : Is this really the broad statement on which an atheist makes his case.? In which case, it really is a shame to see the arrogant and skewed attitude held by an atheist. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : “The man who prays is the one who thinks that god has arranged matters all wrong, but who also thinks that he can instruct god how to put them right.” Christopher Hitchens. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Yeah, maybe if they pray enough they'll start hopping. :-D On 10/16/2014 06:32 PM, jr_esq@... mailto:jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: As Sodom and Gomorrah. But he has a solution. http://m.cnsnews.com/mrctv-blog/michael-w-chapman/rev-billy-graham-america-just-wicked-sodom-and-gomorrah-ever-were http://m.cnsnews.com/mrctv-blog/michael-w-chapman/rev-billy-graham-america-just-wicked-sodom-and-gomorrah-ever-were
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Richard, That's an interesting quote. I researched it and found the following explanation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There_are_no_atheists_in_foxholes http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There_are_no_atheists_in_foxholes
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Mike D, IMO, what you're saying is the same as attaining unity consciousness, although Pastor Graham would be expressing it in a more traditional--albeit archaic--way. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mdixon.6569@... wrote : John, it's not just prayer but repentance. Changing from those *wicked* ways.The God of Abraham, Isaac and Joseph prescribed a formula for His people to live by. If they strayed, they would lose His favor or protection. We see the same as a nation being in tune with dharma with support of nature or becoming adharmic and losing the support of nature. This doesn't occure over a period of a few years but over generations and we are currently becoming more and more adharmic. We no longer, as a nation, think of what we can do for our country, but what is our country going to do for *me*. Politicians exploit this *me first* mentality at the expense of the whole. Divide and conquer and the nation falls apart. On Thursday, October 16, 2014 9:32 PM, jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: I was thinking that there's a similarity to the Maharishi Effect in what Pastor Graham is recommending. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Yeah, maybe if they pray enough they'll start hopping. :-D On 10/16/2014 06:32 PM, jr_esq@... mailto:jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: As Sodom and Gomorrah. But he has a solution. http://m.cnsnews.com/mrctv-blog/michael-w-chapman/rev-billy-graham-america-just-wicked-sodom-and-gomorrah-ever-were http://m.cnsnews.com/mrctv-blog/michael-w-chapman/rev-billy-graham-america-just-wicked-sodom-and-gomorrah-ever-were
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
Fleetwood, Barry is saying that he's now a Buddhist, a non-theist, and apparently happy to be one. But for how long?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Ann, These are good quotes which adequately sum up the attitudes of atheists. Thanks, there's lots of them out there but these two sort of summed up a couple of salient points. I don't like to give myself labels because I feel kind of like some sort of hybrid. Or maybe I just don't quite know myself yet.
