Re: [FairfieldLife] Painful internal dynamics (was Re: CC is Baby Awakening)
Also, this "internal crap, can be there as you say, and still hold the awareness part of you, the part that witnesses. In reality, that part that witnesses is the experience of "soul energy" and that soul energy, when maintained along with the "crap" will heal the "crap", or dissolve it. It's also worthy to note that when there is a lot of "crap" going on, or releasing, it's good to "open the crown chakra, that is imagine that the "the light of the soul is coming down as if you are looking up through the top of your head, and the light is coming down through you into the earth. It is the light of pure consciousness, or the light of the soul, whatever you like to call it, that more effectively heals the crap, when maintained; and witnessed...Jeff Fischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't know if there is supposed to be any intention with respect to internal crap. It's been my experience that with this increasing awareness of that part of me that is not involved, there is less of me that gets overwhelmed. The crap is still there, but my relationship to it has changed. For the time being, I've given up trying to fix things. Instead, I simply remain present to however I show up at any given moment. AlexCool. Ultimately, I believe you need to handle the internal "crap" and get rid of it.JeffTo subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[FairfieldLife] A Very Compelling Broadcast Tonight (also repeats immediately afterwards)
Really great show on Coast to Coast tonight, they're having a roundtable about evidence in the 9/11 matter, how we've been lied to about the incident and such http://38.116.132.19:80/kfi This will be one of the most compelling shows they've done. I would have mentioned this sooner though didn't check the schedule until now. It's a 4 hour show, starting at 10pm PT, 2am ET, and on the link above, it will repeat the first 3 hours from 2am PT 5am ET, to 5am PT to 8am ET. If you know anyone who's really Disneyly Dizzy about physics and coo coo for coco puffs about the infallability of government, then have them tune in, they may mature to adulthood right on the spot! Your local stations for North America, Pacific Realms, XM and Syndicates outside of North America may be found here: http://www.coasttocoastam.com/affiliates/aa.html The show's home site is http://www.coasttocoastam.com/ and tonight's show's details are here: http://www.coasttocoastam.com/shows/2005/06/16.html Even Bush Bunnies, Ronnie Rollovers and Elmer Fudds are bewildered when they witness the facts these honorable folks will present tonight. Remember, you can catch 3 hours of repeat once the show is over, other stations around the continent will have repeats as well, especially in the West, and Coast To Coast also has an archive service, with podcasting, for subscribers. In Love and Truth, Dharma Mitra DharmaMitra2 AT gmail.com Helping you Say It With Panache! Because, how you say it can be, and often is, as important as what you want to convey, and what you have to say is very important to you. http://PROUT-Ananlysis-Synthesis.latest-info.com - Copywriting - Editing - Publishing - Publicity - To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: No more I Discussions
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter Sutphen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (.) That's pity. I really expected some sincere discussion on the questions I made to you. Irmeli To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (re: these petty disputes where everyone has to have the last word.) I don't tend to get involved in them any more. Any ideas I have about enlightenment are just that. And personally, I'm working on my last words being, as I surf into the Bardo, Shit, that was fun! :-) Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: Santa Cruz TM forest retreat
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip John Konhaus likes to sail. Is John Konhaus the mysterious Guy Banner? humm. If so, I submit his use of language as an argument against long-term celibacy. :-) Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: No more I Discussions-AMEN
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter Sutphen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (.) I say amen to that brother. I would've used seven dots. :-) Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] A Very Compelling Broadcast Tonight (also repeats immediately afterwards)
So then knowing what you have learned what will you do with it? - Original Message - From: Dharma Mitra To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; Shriidhara ; Shriidhara ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 1:43 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] A Very Compelling Broadcast Tonight (also repeats immediately afterwards) Really great show on Coast to Coast tonight, they're having aroundtable about evidence in the 9/11 matter, how we've been lied toabout the incident and such http://38.116.132.19:80/kfi This will beone of the most compelling shows they've done.I would have mentioned this sooner though didn't check the scheduleuntil now. It's a 4 hour show, starting at 10pm PT, 2am ET, and onthe link above, it will repeat the first 3 hours from 2am PT 5am ET,to 5am PT to 8am ET. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[FairfieldLife] Painful internal dynamics (was Re: CC is Baby Awakening)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't know if there is supposed to be any intention with respect to internal crap. It's been my experience that with this increasing awareness of that part of me that is not involved, there is less of me that gets overwhelmed. The crap is still there, but my relationship to it has changed. For the time being, I've given up trying to fix things. Instead, I simply remain present to however I show up at any given moment. Cool. Ultimately, I believe you need to handle the internal crap and get rid of it. As hopefully a rare intellectualism from me, and not to argue but to present another POV, I once heard an interesting talk from a Tibetan teacher on this idea of working through stuff. His view was that the crap has no existence; to focus on it in an attempt to work through it tends to give it existence, and activate something that is otherwise inactive. In his very traditional view, the crap is related to states of attention. A certain level of internal crap is just how one sees things *from* a certain state of attention. His view was that it's impossible to work through the crap of that state of attention because there is an infinite amount of it. Focusing on the crap is like turning on a faucet that is fed by an infinite lake of that particular brand of crap. No matter how much of it you work through as it flows through the faucet, there is always more. In other words, you could convince yourself that you've worked through all the anger that you've got inside you, and be free from it for some time. But the minute you allow your mind to shift back into state of attention in which anger is an attribute, bing! there is anger again. So his approach was very Tibetan traditional. Become more aware of your ever-fluctuating states of attention, and use your free will and intention to not dwell in the ones that have lower attributes (like anger or jealousy), prefering the states of attention that have higher attributes (like love and compassion). Sounds a little like mood-making, but I can assure you that with the proper training in identifying one's fluctuating relative states of attention and then shifting from one to another easily, it isn't the same thing at all. It's more like, Oh, there's that anger sucker again. I know how I feel whenever I indulge in it, and don't particularly want to feel that way again. Therefore I will shift my state of attention to one that is shinier and more productive. I'm not saying that this approach is better, I'm just presenting it as another POV on the subject. This approach, when you analyze it, is a lot like When you become aware that you are not thinking the dharma, easily think the dharma. :-) Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Question for Jeff
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I heard today on Howard Stern that Katie Holmes had achieved a level four operating theton. The attributes associated with that accomplishment seemed to be near onmiscience. What is a level 4 operating theton?, how is it determined if one has reached this point?, and would not such a person be entitled to great reverence within the organization? lurk P.S. I just happened to tune in to the program. They weren't trashing the organnization, although they did poke a little fun at it. A related question might be (and it isn't as negative as it might sounds, merely curiosity), do you find that rich and famous people are rated higher on the Scientology scale than everyday people? We know that in the TMO one's spiritual worth tends to be associated with how much money or publicity the person can bring to the plate, and you also find this phenomenon in other spiritual organizations. I'm really just curious whether you find that this happens in Scientology as well, Jeff. I'm more a student of comparative spirituality than a proponent of any of them. Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Question for Jeff
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It wasn't that Katie had achieved a level four operating theton...they were discussing that Tom Cruise had hired a MINDER to accompany Katie everywhere and that the minder was a level four...Katie is a newbie and, therefore, one would assume, not at that level yet... Ah, that may answer the question I posed to Jeff. Never mind. Thanks, Shemp. Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: African Children 'Sacrificed' In UK
What I think is that MMY's interpretations concerning the UK have been off beam for some time. The scandal of sacrificed children uncovered in Britain concerns black magic cults from another continent - nothing to do with Britain as such. Of Blair's electoral victory I've made my position clear in previous posts. MMY's view of the Labour Party as a bunch of ignorant labourers who should go back to digging is another of his clangers. So I would not be surprised if the sacrificed children story ends up in Hagelin's news reviews sometime.. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, uns_tressor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, claudiouk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thursday June 16, 03:07 PM African Children 'Sacrificed' In UK I can see MMY interpreting this as confirmation that his fatwah has showed up even more the despicable depravity of Britain... ...Certainly, that would be consistent with his Britisher scorpions speech of 5/11. But what do YOU think? Uns. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Painful internal dynamics (was Re: CC is Baby Awakening)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As hopefully a rare intellectualism from me, and not to argue but to present another POV, I once heard an interesting talk from a Tibetan teacher on this idea of working through stuff. His view was that the crap has no existence; to focus on it in an attempt to work through it tends to give it existence, and activate something that is otherwise inactive. In his very traditional view, the crap is related to states of attention. A certain level of internal crap is just how one sees things *from* a certain state of attention. His view was that it's impossible to work through the crap of that state of attention because there is an infinite amount of it. Focusing on the crap is like turning on a faucet that is fed by an infinite lake of that particular brand of crap. No matter how much of it you work through as it flows through the faucet, there is always more. In other words, you could convince yourself that you've worked through all the anger that you've got inside you, and be free from it for some time. But the minute you allow your mind to shift back into state of attention in which anger is an attribute, bing! there is anger again. So his approach was very Tibetan traditional. Become more aware of your ever-fluctuating states of attention, and use your free will and intention to not dwell in the ones that have lower attributes (like anger or jealousy), prefering the states of attention that have higher attributes (like love and compassion). Sounds a little like mood-making, but I can assure you that with the proper training in identifying one's fluctuating relative states of attention and then shifting from one to another easily, it isn't the same thing at all. It's more like, Oh, there's that anger sucker again. I know how I feel whenever I indulge in it, and don't particularly want to feel that way again. Therefore I will shift my state of attention to one that is shinier and more productive. I'm not saying that this approach is better, I'm just presenting it as another POV on the subject. This approach, when you analyze it, is a lot like When you become aware that you are not thinking the dharma, easily think the dharma. :-) Unc I see this to be a dualistic understanding. And it is very typical to the eastern traditions. This is also the weak spot of many of those traditions. Certain emotions like fear and anger are labelled as negative. There are ideals that in an awakened state you don't anymore have those emotions. Ingenious techniques have been developed to disconnect oneself from those emotions. Those emotions are thrown out of perception somewhere into the collective energy soup for some other, maybe somewhat weaker people to carry and handle the best they can. And this is called creating peace!!! Fear and anger (fury) are very important emotions for life to sustain itself. You cannot live without them, you can only disconnect your conscious mind from those emotions and push them to your subconsciousness or to the collective consciousness to be expressed by others, often not too constructively. Fear warns of danger, anger helps us to put legitimate limits, so that others cannot use us. These are important functions. We must just learn to use them constructively. When the person, or organizing I evolves emotionally, it can learn better and better process these emotions. A cornerstone in this evolution I understand to be something I call emotional enlightenment. By this concept I mean a stage of emotional development, where the I don't anymore identify with the emotions. When this is accomplished you can start really to work with and transform the heavy and difficult emotions more easily. E.g. I can perceive fear, usually it is felt somewhere in the body, but the I is just calmly observing the emotion, and can decide how to work with it. At best this transformative work with fear can be quite enjoyable. Anger I cannot manage that skilfully yet. But one thing I know for sure through my own experience: this kind of work is very healing. Before this stage of non-identification is fully gained, working with those emotions is very hard and tumultuous work. It is probably true that in the collective energy or emotion pool there is no end to those emotions. But that is not a problem, because learning better and better to working with the emotions and transforming them is rewarding. Irmeli To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Painful internal dynamics (was Re: CC is Baby Awakening)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Irmeli Mattsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: . . . In his very traditional view, the crap is related to states of attention. A certain level of internal crap is just how one sees things *from* a certain state of attention. His view was that it's impossible to work through the crap of that state of attention because there is an infinite amount of it. Focusing on the crap is like turning on a faucet that is fed by an infinite lake of that particular brand of crap. No matter how much of it you work through as it flows through the faucet, there is always more. In other words, you could convince yourself that you've worked through all the anger that you've got inside you, and be free from it for some time. But the minute you allow your mind to shift back into state of attention in which anger is an attribute, bing! there is anger again. . . . I see this to be a dualistic understanding. And it is very typical to the eastern traditions. This is also the weak spot of many of those traditions. Certain emotions like fear and anger are labelled as negative. Having gotten to know this gentleman, I can assure you that this is not the case at all. Fear was labeled as no more inherently negative than bliss was labeled positive. It's not on that level at all, since neither of these emotions/states of mind really exist. The judgment is purely about the karmic effect of indulging in these emotions. Indulging in anger and fear brings the perceiver down and creates negative karma, that which lengthens the process of realization. Indulging in compas- sion and love uplifts, and shortens the process of real- ization. Purely pragmatic, with no moral judgment involved at all. There are ideals that in an awakened state you don't anymore have those emotions. Not in this particular tradition. One *continues* to exper- ience these emotions. One simply has developed the control not to have to indulge in them. Ingenious techniques have been developed to disconnect oneself from those emotions. Those emotions are thrown out of perception somewhere into the collective energy soup for some other, maybe somewhat weaker people to carry and handle the best they can. And this is called creating peace!!! Yours is a perfectly valid POV, but I can assure you that it is not the POV of the teacher I mention. ALL possible emotions are present at ALL times; which one or ones you choose to indulge in is up to you. This tradition would very much disagree with Maharishi's unstressing theory, that when an emotion becomes predominant, it is a result of something being worked through or being released, and one has no control over it; thata one is basically a victim to the emotional state until it passes. The Tibetan view is very different. There is NO state of attention that one is victim to. One ALWAYS has a choice. That is what free will is ABOUT. Preferring one state of attention to another doesn't add to the collective energy soup. It can't. All of these emotions are always there at all times, in infinite amounts. So are all the positive emotions, in equally infinite amounts. All one is doing is making a choice as to which to focus on and give expression to and allow to generate karma. Fear and anger (fury) are very important emotions for life to sustain itself. You cannot live without them, you can only disconnect your conscious mind from those emotions and push them to your subconsciousness or to the collective consciousness to be expressed by others, often not too constructively. That is a very Western POV, and possibly valid. I am presenting a different POV. I'm not trying to sell it, merely to present it. Fear warns of danger, anger helps us to put legitimate limits, so that others cannot use us. And both produce karma. The Tibetan view is that we, as perceivers and actors, are in charge of what karma we wish to produce. We are not slaves to which emotion is predominant at any given time, and have a clear choice as to the state of attention we bring to any situation, and thus a choice as to the karma our thoughts and actions produce in that situation. These are important functions. We must just learn to use them constructively. That's one way of seeing things. I am merely presenting another. Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Painful internal dynamics (was Re: CC is Baby Awakening)
On Jun 16, 2005, at 9:45 PM, Patrick Gillam wrote: Related to this topic and the short but recent Hitler thread, I just finished reading Chapter 3 of Robert Perry's _Path of Light_, which describes the levels of the mind according to the Course in Miracles. It describes in brutal terms how the ego protects its turf. It's not pretty. In the tradition I practice in, when one feels the need to work through ego issues one works with a practice called 'the Chod', which means 'the cutting'. It's a way to directly cut the ego at its root developed by the great yogini Machig Labdron. While different yogic methods might have descriptions such as 'the unification of bliss and emptiness' or 'the unity of luminosity and the ground', directly working with the grasping of ego could best be described as working with 'sheer terror and emptiness'. When I first began this practice some of the visions were just so utterly terrifying as this repressed material came forward, I would have to do walking meditation for several hours just regain some sense of normal awareness. But from that a sense of utter spaciousness and freedom and fearlessness arose. The ability to do things or go places you would never let your mind touch upon comes about. For example I found it gratifying and easy being around people who were dying or in extreme agony. Other purification practices might even bring about healing or removal of diseases. I've been watching a friend who is undertaking Vajrasattva purification go through some radical changes. She had developed a number of siddhis from her practices which had created a number of internal obstacles. The removal of those obstacles have been a horrible sometimes even medically challenging situation for her. So this happens on a number of different levels but it is important to go through some deep purification. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: No more I Discussions-AMEN
--- TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter Sutphen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (.) I say amen to that brother. I would've used seven dots. :-) Unc We don't speak to the 7 dot people. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: No more I Discussions-AMEN
(.) I say amen to that brother. I would've used seven dots. :-) We don't speak to the 7 dot people. Can we compromise on 6? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: No more I Discussions-AMEN
x-tad-bigger 0/x-tad-bigger
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: Santa Cruz TM forest retreat
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: on 6/16/05 11:45 PM, lurkernomore20002000 at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip John Konhaus likes to sail. Is John Konhaus the mysterious Guy Banner? humm. Don't think so. Guy Banner said he had to build a Peace Palace. Konhaus is Raja of the whole West Coast and French Polynesia. Including Nauru? Well, FWIW, hereabouts nauru = laughter... To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Karunamayi
on 6/17/05 12:14 AM, Rick Archer at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: on 6/17/05 12:11 AM, lurkernomore20002000 at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip That would be a very subjective judgment. Objectively speaking, in terms of sheer entertainment value, K is a garage band and A is The Beatles. Quite a show. But it's really too crass to compare on that level. Different strokes for different folks. I hope you can make it up here July 6 7 to see Amma. You won't regret it. Yes, I think I will come up. Check out http://ammaiowa.org/ for information. And if you can, plan to stay up all night on the 7th. It won't end until the sun is up on the 8th. There's a grand finale that's not to be missed. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Question for Jeff
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I heard today on Howard Stern that Katie Holmes had achieved a level four operating theton. The attributes associated with that accomplishment seemed to be near onmiscience. What is a level 4 operating theton?, how is it determined if one has reached this point?, and would not such a person be entitled to great reverence within the organization? lurk Lurk, I didn't know (think) Katie was even a Scientologist. OT (Operating Thetan spirit) IV is one of 8 OT levels currently available. On our Grade Chart it shows up to OT XV. Omniscience - I don't think so. The Grade Chart is a gradient, step by step approach to greater awareness. The Grades below the OT levels deal with memory, communication, problems, transgressions, upsets, and fixed conditions. For me it's identifiable progress. Those on the OT Levels are respected but (at least for me and my observation) not revered. We want higher states of awareness to be available for everyone. Each of these steps has a verifiable result. Interestingly, one current goal of Scientology is to get 10,000 people auditing on OT VII. I've heard no direct mention of a Maharishi effect but as I recall, the Movement was trying to get a group of 10,000 flyers together. Is this still the case? P.S. I just happened to tune in to the program. They weren't trashing the organnization, although they did poke a little fun at it. lurk Howard not trashing it? He must be getting soft in his old age. Or scared of the Scientology lawyers. :-) Thanks for the question. Jeff To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Yoga sutras
Title: Yoga sutras Sent by a friend: In the Yoga Sutras of Maharshi Patanjali is a clear instruction to the aspirant on how to handle negative situations and negativity in general, both inside and out while on the path to enlightenment. The instruction was given to me by my Guru a over 2 decades ago and I have passed it along to some of you occasionally during readings when you are going through challenging cycles and transits. It is deceptively simple but like all things subtle, it is remarkably effective. It takes a bit of practice to get the hang of it because it is a bit more than just the power of positive thinking. What is developed as a result of doing it, is the ability to discriminate more finely between what is real and what is not real and it therefore becomes actually not only a tool for making lifes road easier but at the same time and technique for gaining further enlightenment. The reason it does this is because in order for it to work you have to think the exact opposite thought, not just a positive thought. The sloka is vitarkabadhane pratipaksabhavanam When a mind is disturbed by negative thoughts, constantly ponder over the opposite -yoga Sutras Maharshi Patanjali To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[FairfieldLife] Tom pops the question in my 'hood
Ran into them both last night, went for drinks, and while Katie was on her way to the loo Tom asks me, Dude, whaddya think...should I marry her? I took one look at her cute little butt and gave him the thumbs-up. That's my story and I'm stickin' to it... :-) Tom Cruise Proposes to Katie Holmes By SOPHIE NICHOLSON, AP PARIS (June 17) - Actor Tom Cruise said he and girlfriend Katie Holmes are engaged, after he popped the question early Friday morning atop the Eiffel Tower. Cruise, speaking at a Paris news conference with Holmes, said: ''Yes, I proposed to her.'' The couple often shared smiles and blushes as Cruise turned to look at her, with a massive diamond ring on her finger. ''It was early this morning at the Eiffel Tower, so I haven't slept at all,'' he said. ''Today is a magnificent day for me, I'm engaged to a magnificent woman.'' Asked why he chose the famed Paris landmark, he said: ''I've never been to the Eiffel Tower. It's Paris, it's a beautiful city, it's very romantic.'' To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Transformative work versus indulging with emotions(was painfulinternal dynamics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Irmeli:I see this to be a dualistic understanding. And it is very typical to the eastern traditions. This is also the weak spot of many of those traditions. Certain emotions like fear and anger are labelled as negative. Unc:Having gotten to know this gentleman, I can assure you that this is not the case at all. Fear was labeled as no more inherently negative than bliss was labeled positive. It's not on that level at all, since neither of these emotions/states of mind really exist. Irmeli: Ok that is already one important step ahead. I agree fully with this. Unc:The judgment is purely about the karmic effect of indulging in these emotions. Indulging in anger and fear brings the perceiver down and creates negative karma, that which lengthens the process of realization. Indulging in compas- sion and love uplifts, and shortens the process of real- ization. Purely pragmatic, with no moral judgment involved at all. I was not proposing to indulging with those emotions, rather the opposite, containing, confronting, containing and transforming them instead of suppressing them. Suppression is an automatic process which very easily happens, when you have decided to put your attention away from those emotions. In that case those emotions don't get transformed, and in some subtle way somebody else can receive them. And that creates karma. Indulging in compassion can also lead on a subtle level to mood making. I appreciate the Tibetans and they have a great wisdom tradition. But why does that nation live in such a deep poverty and misery. Isn't there karmic effect working there. Irmeli: There are ideals that in an awakened state you don't anymore have those emotions. Unc: Not in this particular tradition. One *continues* to exper- ience these emotions. One simply has developed the control not to have to indulge in them. Irmeli: That is very good and in that case the person talks about precisely the same thing as I am. There is however possibly a problem embedded in the control of not idulging. The emotions won't necessarily get really transformed that way. However it is an important step to learn to do. When you contain and confront an emotion, it changes its character rather fast. There is no indulging present, but no avoidance of it either. Irmeli: Ingenious techniques have been developed to disconnect oneself from those emotions. Those emotions are thrown out of perception somewhere into the collective energy soup for some other, maybe somewhat weaker people to carry and handle the best they can. And this is called creating peace!!! Unc: Yours is a perfectly valid POV, but I can assure you that it is not the POV of the teacher I mention. ALL possible emotions are present at ALL times; which one or ones you choose to indulge in is up to you. This tradition would very much disagree with Maharishi's unstressing theory, that when an emotion becomes predominant, it is a result of something being worked through or being released, and one has no control over it; that one is basically a victim to the emotional state until it passes. Irmeli: What does POV mean? My dictionary does not know the word. My way is not to indulge in any emotion. But my approach is closer to MMY's: I just allow the emotion naturally appear. When it can be clearly seen, I start to transform it. This is a very important distinction: We all have many subtle emotional states embedded in ourselves we are not aware of. The emotional state has to be allowed to come into awareness in order to be able to transform it. You cannot work with something you are not aware of. Regrettably I have observed some subtle level mood making of positive emotions like compassion in the Tibetan Buddhist I have met. Unc:The Tibetan view is very different. There is NO state of attention that one is victim to. One ALWAYS has a choice. That is what free will is ABOUT. Preferring one state of attention to another doesn't add to the collective energy soup. It can't. All of these emotions are always there at all times, in infinite amounts. So are all the positive emotions, in equally infinite amounts. All one is doing is making a choice as to which to focus on and give expression to and allow to generate karma. Irmeli: What does There is NO state of attention that one is victim to mean.? If you feel you are victim of something, you transform that emotion or energetic structure and the victim hood dissolves. The collective energy field is a very tricky thing. Different nations have partly their own collective energy field. I have had all my adult life a certain kind of understanding of how wars are formed. And I have not yet seen any need to make changes to it. The theory is this: A nation is drawn to a war or wars, when in its collective consciousness there is a lot of suppressed anger and fury and fear. When people cannot confront and transform these emotions internally, they start
[FairfieldLife] Re: Yoga sutras
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: vitarkabadhane pratipaksabhavanam When a mind is disturbed by negative thoughts, constantly ponder over the opposite -yoga Sutras Maharshi Patanjali I think this works if you simultaneously pay attention to the emotional states that get activated. I have done it a lot. Irmeli To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Karunamayi
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote snip And if you can, plan to stay up all night on the 7th. It won't end until the sun is up on the 8th. There's a grand finale that's not to be missed. I'm calling this the Rick Archer Closer. How can one resist? lurk To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Question for Jeff
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip Howard not trashing it? He must be getting soft in his old age. Or scared of the Scientology lawyers. :-) Thanks for the question. Jeff Thanks for the comeback. lurk To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Karunamayi
on 6/17/05 9:53 AM, lurkernomore20002000 at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote snip And if you can, plan to stay up all night on the 7th. It won't end until the sun is up on the 8th. There's a grand finale that's not to be missed. I'm calling this the Rick Archer Closer. How can one resist? Resistance is futile. Send money. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Tom pops the question in my 'hood
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ran into them both last night, went for drinks, and while Katie was on her way to the loo Tom asks me, Dude, whaddya think...should I marry her? I took one look at her cute little butt and gave him the thumbs-up. That's my story and I'm stickin' to it... :-) Oh, it feels good to laugh! lurk To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Purity of the teaching (was Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mentally challenged ? No, as far as I know he's never had anything to do with Benjamin Creme. :-) Care to clarify ? No, other than to suspect that my rebellious, mentally-challenged, ice-cream eating friend, were he to become a bigot and decide to put down the world's sixth largest religion, would at least know how to spell it. :-) Unc, still under the influence of the Guna Guys... Just the kind of response one would expect from you. Whatever way you want to spell it, Buddhist, Bhudist or Budhist or whatever, it is a nice little religion as far and away from its source as Christianity. I'm not posting http://www.shareintl.org now here for you since I doubt that you are interested, but for other less predjudiced souls who could be interested in finding out who Maitreya really is. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Question for Jeff
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A related question might be (and it isn't as negative as it might sounds, merely curiosity), do you find that rich and famous people are rated higher on the Scientology scale than everyday people? Unc As far as their spiritual development, no. We know that in the TMO one's spiritual worth tends to be associated with how much money or publicity the person can bring to the plate, and you also find this phenomenon in other spiritual organizations. I'm really just curious whether you find that this happens in Scientology as well, Jeff. I'm more a student of comparative spirituality than a proponent of any of them. I believe the guys at the top are definitely wanting the celebs to have a positive impact. In LA we have a facility called Celebrity Center which is specifically designed to give them superior service. As far as I know, Cruise has donated the most $ of any of them, but I don't know how that is handled. I have seen and believe Scientology helps people. Cruise does too, but he's in a much better position to get the word out as a lot of people are interested in celebs and he has the opportunity to rub shoulders with some top guys in society. When you promote something the way he has with Scientology, you're going to get hit. But, he believes the world needs help that Scientology can provide, so he promotes. My goal (and I believe his) is not to make everyone become a Scientologist, but to provide access to the tools Scientology has and let someone try them and see if it doesn't improve some conditon for them. Jeff To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Transformative work versus indulging with emotions(was painfulinternal dynamics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Irmeli Mattsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Unc:The judgment is purely about the karmic effect of indulging in these emotions. Indulging in anger and fear brings the perceiver down and creates negative karma, that which lengthens the process of realization. Indulging in compas- sion and love uplifts, and shortens the process of real- ization. Purely pragmatic, with no moral judgment involved at all. I was not proposing to indulging with those emotions, rather the opposite, containing, confronting, containing and transforming them instead of suppressing them. Suppression is an automatic process which very easily happens, when you have decided to put your attention away from those emotions. Continuing the discussion (and I really see it as a discussion, not an argument or an attempt to convince anyone of anything), IS suppression the same as simply shifting one's attention? Think TM. When you become aware that you are on other thoughts and effortlessly come back to the mantra, are you suppressing those thoughts? In that case those emotions don't get transformed, and in some subtle way somebody else can receive them. We must agree to disagree on this. I've already stated my view, that there is an infinite supply of ALL emotions available to ALL people at ALL times. Nothing either adds to or subtracts from the supply of available emotions. And that creates karma. Indulging in compassion can also lead on a subtle level to mood making. I appreciate the Tibetans and they have a great wisdom tradition. But why does that nation live in such a deep poverty and misery. By whose standards? Poverty, yes, but that says absolutely nothing about happiness. The Tibetans I have met have always struck me as the happiest people I have ever met. And this is even more surprising given the circumstances they're dealing with. Isn't there karmic effect working there. Maybe, in terms of the Chinese conquest of Tibet. I don't really have privy to the inner workings of long-term karma, so I can't say. :-) Irmeli: There are ideals that in an awakened state you don't anymore have those emotions. Unc: Not in this particular tradition. One *continues* to exper- ience these emotions. One simply has developed the control not to have to indulge in them. Irmeli: That is very good and in that case the person talks about precisely the same thing as I am. There is however possibly a problem embedded in the control of not idulging. The emotions won't necessarily get really transformed that way. The people I am talking about have no interest in transforming emotions. They simply focus on those emotions that are most productive, for themselves and the world. I doubt they'd believe that emotions CAN be transformed. Again, thinking of it in terms of TM. You are lost in thoughts of icky things. You realize this and effortlessly come back to the mantra. Thirty seconds later you're in bliss. Did you transform the icky thoughts into something else? I don't think so. However it is an important step to learn to do. When you contain and confront an emotion, it changes its character rather fast. There is no indulging present, but no avoidance of it either. I'm really not talking about avoidance; that's your interpretation of what I'm saying. I'm talking about being *comfortable* with whatever emotions one experiences, not beating oneself up for having them, but at the same time not dwelling on them, even to theoretically confront them, for very long. If your purpose in life is to spend as much of your time doing nice things for others as you can, you don't spend a lot of that time processing your own emotions; you just get back to work. Irmeli: What does POV mean? My dictionary does not know the word. Point of view. My way is not to indulge in any emotion. But my approach is closer to MMY's: I just allow the emotion naturally appear. When it can be clearly seen, I start to transform it. This is a very important distinction: We all have many subtle emotional states embedded in ourselves we are not aware of. The emotional state has to be allowed to come into awareness in order to be able to transform it. You cannot work with something you are not aware of. If it works for you, cool. I personally don't believe that emotions can be transformed. You merely gain some perspec- tive on them and then allow them to go their way, and get back to living in the moment, in different emotions. No transformation took place, merely a shift of state of attention. Regrettably I have observed some subtle level mood making of positive emotions like compassion in the Tibetan Buddhist I have met. Cool. I have experience primarily real compassion. Unc:The Tibetan view is very different. There is NO state of attention that one is victim to. One ALWAYS has a
[FairfieldLife] Re: Question for Jeff
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have seen and believe Scientology helps people. Cruise does too, but he's in a much better position to get the word out as a lot of people are interested in celebs and he has the opportunity to rub shoulders with some top guys in society. When you promote something the way he has with Scientology, you're going to get hit. But, he believes the world needs help that Scientology can provide, so he promotes. My goal (and I believe his) is not to make everyone become a Scientologist, but to provide access to the tools Scientology has and let someone try them and see if it doesn't improve some conditon for them. My impression as well. I was always impressed by an interview he gave in, I think, Esquire or Vanity Fair some years back, in which the interviewer tried to get him to talk about Scientology. He didn't. But he managed to get a full-page photo of his face in the article, with the following words written on it: If you want to know more about Scientology, read a book. I considered that brilliant. Do you know how much a full-page AD would've cost in that magazine? He got one for free, while not coming across as a prosyletute. Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Tom pops the question in my 'hood
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ran into them both last night, went for drinks, and while Katie was on her way to the loo Tom asks me, Dude, whaddya think...should I marry her? I took one look at her cute little butt and gave him the thumbs-up. That's my story and I'm stickin' to it... :-) Oh, it feels good to laugh! lurk Unc, when I saw Paris, I knew you had to have something to do w/ it :-) To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: A Very Compelling Broadcast Tonight (also repeats immediately afterwards)
---I hear what you're saying, like it's all past history, so what's the point. I just have a compulsion to know the truth about stuff... In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So then knowing what you have learned what will you do with it? - Original Message - From: Dharma Mitra To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; Whole- [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; Shriidhara ; Shriidhara ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; evolutionary- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 1:43 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] A Very Compelling Broadcast Tonight (also repeats immediately afterwards) Really great show on Coast to Coast tonight, they're having a roundtable about evidence in the 9/11 matter, how we've been lied to about the incident and such http://38.116.132.19:80/kfi This will be one of the most compelling shows they've done. I would have mentioned this sooner though didn't check the schedule until now. It's a 4 hour show, starting at 10pm PT, 2am ET, and on the link above, it will repeat the first 3 hours from 2am PT 5am ET, to 5am PT to 8am ET. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Purity of the teaching (was Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics)
--- lupidus108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm not posting http://www.shareintl.org now here for you since I doubt that you are interested, but for other less predjudiced souls who could be interested in finding out who Maitreya really is. A sattvic figment of Mr. Creme's over active imagination? A benign astral being playing a prank on the silly humans as an initiation into an astral fraternity? The second coming of Christ? Who knows? I resist the validity of a spiritual teaching though if it has a spokesperson and uses crosses of light appearing on windows and buildings and blurry photographs as means of validation. A little strange for me. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Transformative work versus indulging with emotions(was painfulinternal dynamics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Irmeli Mattsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Unc:The judgment is purely about the karmic effect of indulging in these emotions. Indulging in anger and fear brings the perceiver down and creates negative karma, that which lengthens the process of realization. Indulging in compas- sion and love uplifts, and shortens the process of real- ization. Purely pragmatic, with no moral judgment involved at all. I was not proposing to indulging with those emotions, rather the opposite, containing, confronting, containing and transforming them instead of suppressing them. Suppression is an automatic process which very easily happens, when you have decided to put your attention away from those emotions. Continuing the discussion (and I really see it as a discussion, not an argument or an attempt to convince anyone of anything), IS suppression the same as simply shifting one's attention? Think TM. When you become aware that you are on other thoughts and effortlessly come back to the mantra, are you suppressing those thoughts? In that case those emotions don't get transformed, and in some subtle way somebody else can receive them. We must agree to disagree on this. I've already stated my view, that there is an infinite supply of ALL emotions available to ALL people at ALL times. Nothing either adds to or subtracts from the supply of available emotions. And that creates karma. Indulging in compassion can also lead on a subtle level to mood making. I appreciate the Tibetans and they have a great wisdom tradition. But why does that nation live in such a deep poverty and misery. By whose standards? Poverty, yes, but that says absolutely nothing about happiness. The Tibetans I have met have always struck me as the happiest people I have ever met. And this is even more surprising given the circumstances they're dealing with. Isn't there karmic effect working there. Maybe, in terms of the Chinese conquest of Tibet. I don't really have privy to the inner workings of long-term karma, so I can't say. :-) Irmeli: There are ideals that in an awakened state you don't anymore have those emotions. Unc: Not in this particular tradition. One *continues* to exper- ience these emotions. One simply has developed the control not to have to indulge in them. Irmeli: That is very good and in that case the person talks about precisely the same thing as I am. There is however possibly a problem embedded in the control of not idulging. The emotions won't necessarily get really transformed that way. The people I am talking about have no interest in transforming emotions. They simply focus on those emotions that are most productive, for themselves and the world. I doubt they'd believe that emotions CAN be transformed. Again, thinking of it in terms of TM. You are lost in thoughts of icky things. You realize this and effortlessly come back to the mantra. Thirty seconds later you're in bliss. Did you transform the icky thoughts into something else? I don't think so. However it is an important step to learn to do. When you contain and confront an emotion, it changes its character rather fast. There is no indulging present, but no avoidance of it either. I'm really not talking about avoidance; that's your interpretation of what I'm saying. I'm talking about being *comfortable* with whatever emotions one experiences, not beating oneself up for having them, but at the same time not dwelling on them, even to theoretically confront them, for very long. If your purpose in life is to spend as much of your time doing nice things for others as you can, you don't spend a lot of that time processing your own emotions; you just get back to work. Irmeli: What does POV mean? My dictionary does not know the word. Point of view. My way is not to indulge in any emotion. But my approach is closer to MMY's: I just allow the emotion naturally appear. When it can be clearly seen, I start to transform it. This is a very important distinction: We all have many subtle emotional states embedded in ourselves we are not aware of. The emotional state has to be allowed to come into awareness in order to be able to transform it. You cannot work with something you are not aware of. If it works for you, cool. I personally don't believe that emotions can be transformed. You merely gain some perspec- tive on them and then allow them to go their way, and get back to living in the moment, in different emotions. No transformation took place, merely a shift of state of attention. Regrettably I have observed some subtle level mood making of positive emotions like compassion in the Tibetan
[FairfieldLife] Re: Transformative work versus indulging with emotions(was painfulinternal dynamics)
One last comment on this topic. The person who gave the talk that my comments are based upon was a monk. His entire *life* was dedicated to spending as much of his time as possible working for the welfare of others. This entailed spending as little of it as possible thinking about himself and his problems with a few fleeting emotions. In general, Westerners are self-obsessed. They get into all these trips that process their emotions, that talk about them or deal with them or confront them. This implies either a great deal of spare time, or a certain level of self-obsession. Having the luxury to sit around and ponder or work on one's fleeting emotions implies that this process is some- how more important than other things, that the enlight- enment of the person doing all this stuff is more important than anything else. One of the things that I find most refreshing about many of the Tibetan monks I have met is that they spend almost NO time working on themselves. Their own enlightenment is SECONDARY to helping others. Given a choice between pursuing some technique or process that would get them, personally, enlightened a little faster and just getting back to work helping others, there is simply no question which path they would choose. It's a matter of personal preference, I admit, but I found it refreshing after decades of seekers who would blow off ANY responsibility to others to pursue something that they thought would get them to enlightenment faster. In a way, it's related to a comment I heard from some programmers I worked with who used to live in Cambodia, during the Pol Pot period. We were read- ing some newspaper article about America and how many people suffered from neuroses. They started laughing. I asked why. They said, Neurosis is a rich person's disease. You have to have a lot of time on your hands to care about neuroses. When your entire day is being spent just trying to survive, you don't have time for this kind of indulgence. Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Painful internal dynamics (was Re: CC is Baby Awakening)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Also, this internal crap, can be there as you say, and still hold the awareness part of you, the part that witnesses. In reality, that part that witnesses is the experience of soul energy and that soul energy, when maintained along with the crap will heal the crap, or dissolve it. It's also worthy to note that when there is a lot of crap going on, or releasing, it's good to open the crown chakra, that is imagine that the the light of the soul is coming down as if you are looking up through the top of your head, and the light is coming down through you into the earth. It is the light of pure consciousness, or the light of the soul, whatever you like to call it, that more effectively heals the crap, when maintained; and witnessed... good description, though I always experience the opening of my crown chakra as expanding up and outwards, a powerful current of bliss energy blasting forth from the top of my head. Feels great, though I don't sense any 'light of the soul coming down' as you describe. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Transformative work versus indulging with emotions(was painfulinternal dynamics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: They're both just theories that we're spouting. Probably NEITHER is correct. Like I said, I'm not trying to sell mine. I'm just putting it out there for others to bounce off of. Unc OK. I'll bounce this ball. Let's say somone has lost a loved one. They experience grief. Sometimes it gets pretty overwhelming. Observing, one would say they are the victim of that emotion. Yet, for them, everything reminds them of the person they lost, so it triggers the grief. One possible remedy : Tell me something that doesn't remind you of . Continue until the person feels better. A way to unstick the attention. Two days ago I met a guy who had just buried his 13 year old daughter (hit by a car when on her bike). He asked me what he should do with her stuff. I said Give them to a charity your daughter would have supported. Otherwise, every time he sees her stuff it will tend to trigger the grief. I did Dianetics with a guy who had lost his wife to cancer. He was still very much in it. We ran the incident of the last night in the hospital. Huge amounts of pain and grief came off. It took two nights but he finally felt better. Told me after that he was able to look at pictures of her without feeling sad and could smile and enjoy them. The difference here, IMO, is that if someone continues to go over (put directed attention on) an incident, it will eventually dissolve. If you just put your attention on it without fully confronting it, it does grow stronger and have a negative effect. Per Dianetics, previous painful incidents (including past lives) are the source of negative emotions: handle the incident and the reactive condition of the emotion is gone. I agree that one has all emotions available to one at any moment. However, when one is impinged upon heavily by a past incident, it's not so easy to think about something else. Neither am I saying this is the only thing that works I've just seen it work so many times that I do it and support it. Jeff To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And personally, I'm working on my last words being, as I surf into the Bardo, Shit, that was fun! :-) Unc Unc, I would've thought yours would be more like, Man, that was f*cked UP, waaay UP! To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Transformative work versus indulging with emotions(was painfulinternal dynamics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: They said, Neurosis is a rich person's disease. You have to have a lot of time on your hands to care about neuroses. When your entire day is being spent just trying to survive, you don't have time for this kind of indulgence. Unc Agree. During the period when London was being constantly bombed, Hubbard said there were no people going crazy They were too engaged in the daily survival. Interesting. Jeff To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Painful internal dynamics (was Re: CC is Baby Awakening)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I once heard an interesting talk from a Tibetan teacher on this idea of working through stuff. His view was that the crap has no existence; to focus on it in an attempt to work through it tends to give it existence, and activate something that is otherwise inactive. In his very traditional view, the crap is related to states of attention. A certain level of internal crap is just how one sees things *from* a certain state of attention. His view was that it's impossible to work through the crap of that state of attention because there is an infinite amount of it. Focusing on the crap is like turning on a faucet that is fed by an infinite lake of that particular brand of crap. No matter how much of it you work through as it flows through the faucet, there is always more. In other words, you could convince yourself that you've worked through all the anger that you've got inside you, and be free from it for some time. But the minute you allow your mind to shift back into state of attention in which anger is an attribute, bing! there is anger again. So his approach was very Tibetan traditional. Become more aware of your ever-fluctuating states of attention, and use your free will and intention to not dwell in the ones that have lower attributes (like anger or jealousy), prefering the states of attention that have higher attributes (like love and compassion). Sounds a little like mood-making, but I can assure you that with the proper training in identifying one's fluctuating relative states of attention and then shifting from one to another easily, it isn't the same thing at all. It's more like, Oh, there's that anger sucker again. I know how I feel whenever I indulge in it, and don't particularly want to feel that way again. Therefore I will shift my state of attention to one that is shinier and more productive. I'm not saying that this approach is better, I'm just presenting it as another POV on the subject. This approach, when you analyze it, is a lot like When you become aware that you are not thinking the dharma, easily think the dharma. :-) Unc good description. The key seems to be the difference between denying 'that anger sucker', and accepting it. Paradoxically, the less we are attached to it, the easier it is to accept it, and then to be able to easily put the attention somewhere else. To deny anger, i.e. mood making, is just creating a fantasy and really isn't very helpful to growth except to eventually wake up to the impotence of the fantasy. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Transformative work versus indulging with emotions(was painfulinternal dynamics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: They're both just theories that we're spouting. Probably NEITHER is correct. Like I said, I'm not trying to sell mine. I'm just putting it out there for others to bounce off of. OK. I'll bounce this ball. Let's say somone has lost a loved one. They experience grief. Sometimes it gets pretty overwhelming. Observing, one would say they are the victim of that emotion. Yet, for them, everything reminds them of the person they lost, so it triggers the grief. One possible remedy : Tell me something that doesn't remind you of . Continue until the person feels better. A way to unstick the attention. In theory, yes. Two days ago I met a guy who had just buried his 13 year old daughter (hit by a car when on her bike). He asked me what he should do with her stuff. I said Give them to a charity your daughter would have supported. Otherwise, every time he sees her stuff it will tend to trigger the grief. Sounds like good advice to me. I did Dianetics with a guy who had lost his wife to cancer. He was still very much in it. We ran the incident of the last night in the hospital. Huge amounts of pain and grief came off. It took two nights but he finally felt better. Told me after that he was able to look at pictures of her without feeling sad and could smile and enjoy them. Cool. The difference here, IMO, is that if someone continues to go over (put directed attention on) an incident, it will eventually dissolve. If you just put your attention on it without fully confronting it, it does grow stronger and have a negative effect. Quite possible. I am more familiar, unfortunately, with the latter path. Santa Fe was full of what we used to call walking wounded, people who just kept replaying the tragedies of their lives over and over and over, and never getting past them. You'd meet them and they'd talk about how horrible X, Y, and Z were and then you'd meet them six years later and they were still talking about how horrible X, Y, and Z were. For me, it's a matter of whatever works for you. In some cases, the process I described of shifting one's state of attention to a more productive one works for me. Sometimes if an emotion seems particularly power- ful I'll confront it and try to understand it for a while. But never for very long, because to be honest I have a lot of people who depend on me for things, and it's more important for me to get back to helping them than it is to ponder my own issues. And what I find is, almost every time, when I get back to selfless service, after a very short while the issues just aren't there any more. The only reason they were there in the first place was because I was feeling important. Forget the self, and the self's troubles often go away. That's my theory. Today. Tomorrow I may have another one. :-) Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Benj. Creme finds Jesus
http://www.piratejesus.com/001.html To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And personally, I'm working on my last words being, as I surf into the Bardo, Shit, that was fun! :-) Unc, I would've thought yours would be more like, Man, that was f*cked UP, waaay UP! I had in mind my whole life when I wrote the above. And there is simply no WAY that it was f*cked up. It's been pretty much a gas all the way through. I consider myself one of the luckiest guys on the planet. Wouldn't change a thing. I'm just hoping that this trend holds up until the last moment... Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Yoga sutras
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sent by a friend: in order for it to work you have to think the exact opposite thought, not just a positive thought. sounds a lot like a distillation of Byron Katie's technique. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Purity of the teaching (was Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lupidus108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: who could be interested in finding out who Maitreya really is. just curious, have you been in the physical presence of one of Maitreya's incarnations? If so, what was it like? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Transformative work versus indulging with emotions(was painfulinternal dynamics)
Jeff wrote: The difference here, IMO, is that if someone continues to go over (put directed attention on) an incident, it will eventually dissolve. If you just put your attention on it without fully confronting it, it does grow stronger and have a negative effect. Turquoise wrote: Quite possible. I am more familiar, unfortunately, with the latter path. Santa Fe was full of what we used to call walking wounded, people who just kept replaying the tragedies of their lives over and over and over, and never getting past them. You'd meet them and they'd talk about how horrible X, Y, and Z were and then you'd meet them six years later and they were still talking about how horrible X, Y, and Z were. All too familiar. If you don't fully confront it you are a victim, ad nauseum. Try this if someone constantly complains about what somebody else has done to them: Have you done something similar yourself? For me, it's a matter of whatever works for you. In some cases, the process I described of shifting one's state of attention to a more productive one works for me. Sometimes if an emotion seems particularly power- ful I'll confront it and try to understand it for a while. But never for very long, because to be honest I have a lot of people who depend on me for things, and it's more important for me to get back to helping them than it is to ponder my own issues. And what I find is, almost every time, when I get back to selfless service, after a very short while the issues just aren't there any more. The only reason they were there in the first place was because I was feeling important. Forget the self, and the self's troubles often go away. Agree and have employed this myself quite often. Ultimately I think we can all be saved by focusing on helping each other. That's my theory. Today. Tomorrow I may have another one. :-) Unc Cool, man, cool. BTW what did you think of that TurQy handle or is it old hat? Jeff To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Transformative work versus indulging with emotions(was painfulinternal dynamics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's my theory. Today. Tomorrow I may have another one. :-) Cool, man, cool. BTW what did you think of that TurQy handle or is it old hat? Had never heard it before. Gobbled it right up. With gravy. :-) Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Unc, I would've thought yours would be more like, Man, that was f*cked UP, waaay UP! I had in mind my whole life when I wrote the above. And there is simply no WAY that it was f*cked up. It's been pretty much a gas all the way through. I consider myself one of the luckiest guys on the planet. Wouldn't change a thing. I'm just hoping that this trend holds up until the last moment... Unc words can be too fun a puzzle for me sometimes...I meant it this way when I said it: f*cked referring to your enjoyable sexual experiences that you have touched upon on FFL, and UP meaning you have merged your energies upward, in the direction of Enlightenment, possibly beginning with the enjoyable feelings associated with sex and bridging into bliss. I tend to automatically parse any phrase or sentence for its complete series of meanings, flip words and sentences forwards and backwards too, and move emphasis around, read each word and its association with the words next to it apart from conventional meaning. Keeps the language fresh and universal for me. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: words can be too fun a puzzle for me sometimes...I meant it this way when I said it: f*cked referring to your enjoyable sexual experiences that you have touched upon on FFL, and UP meaning you have merged your energies upward, in the direction of Enlightenment, possibly beginning with the enjoyable feelings associated with sex and bridging into bliss. The little death as metaphor for the big one? :-) I tend to automatically parse any phrase or sentence for its complete series of meanings, flip words and sentences forwards and backwards too, and move emphasis around, read each word and its association with the words next to it apart from conventional meaning. Keeps the language fresh and universal for me. You should read Finnegan's Wake. That'd keep you busy for a while. :-) Playing with words in several lang- uages, and with the sounds they make, relating them to the sound of Dublin English. About the only quote I can remember gives you a taste: In the name of the former, and of the latter, and of their holocaust, all men. :-) Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
You should read Finnegan's Wake. That'd keep you busy for a while. :-) Playing with words in several lang- uages, and with the sounds they make, relating them to the sound of Dublin English. About the only quote I can remember gives you a taste: In the name of the former, and of the latter, and of their holocaust, all men. I've tried reading him and Shakespeare and they tend to fry my circuits, so I praise them from a distance. :-) I can't claim to have finished Finnegan's Wake, either. Supposedly, when asked once how long the average reader should take to fully appreciate Finnegan's Wake, Joyce said, Well, it took me fourteen years to write...I think that's about right. :-) Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
Reply to Akasha appears below: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [SNIP] That Awareness is expressed in the lifes of all in infinite ways is of little surprise. However, what I was seeking to confirm (or refute if there is no confirmation -- same process) is that there is some commonality to the so called experience of so called awakening. As a rough analogy, while all humans are unique and different, there are are core features of commonality that allow them to be classified as homo-sapiens. [SNIP TO END] *** I like to think that there is one underlying reality that all forms and expressions of enlightenment take part in. That may be asking too much, but I'd like to take it as a starting point. Why not similataneously hold that there maybe is commonality and also mayber there is NOT commonality to all human expressions or experience of spritual unfoldment. It seems if you take ONE possiblity as true as the strating point, you may be chasing your tail. REPLY TO AKASHA: I feel very disappointed that you dismissed this discussion so easily. It is as if you didn't bother reading past my first paragraph and formed an opinion on that basis alone. Somehow, I think you misunderstood me. To better explain the point of view I was expressing, I'll use an analogy that you recently used: physicists acknowledge that some phenomena are best described by Newtonian physics, while others are better describe by Quantum Mechanics. However, an underlying assumption is that these two methods of describing and explaining phenomena are in fact describing the same universe. So that was my starting point. I chose to assume that there is one universe within which different people get enlightened. This says nothing about the description of that universe, or the character of the enlightenment of anyone in particular. For example, this same universe may support an enlightenment in which God or Personal God plays an important role, an enlightenment in which there is no God, an enlightenment in which the ultimate truth can well be described using words like Self, or an enlightenment in which there is No Self. These various forms of enlightenment may be on some sequential path, or they may be mutually exclusive end states. All of that is up for grabs, as far as I'm concerned. And yes, maybe there are forms of enlightenment that have no commonality whatsoever with other forms. What if everyone exists in his/her own universe with its own rules? What does that mean, really? Does it mean that the person's experience alone defines his/her universe? or that everyone else's universe doesn't really exist as far as I'm concerned? Well, we could go that way. But I don't find it very fruitful. I've included my original post below. I was hoping to get a more thoughtful reply from you. But, if you don't want to, well, ok, it was fun, I guess... a ORIGINAL POST REPEATED: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [SNIP] That Awareness is expressed in the lifes of all in infinite ways is of little surprise. However, what I was seeking to confirm (or refute if there is no confirmation -- same process) is that there is some commonality to the so called experience of so called awakening. As a rough analogy, while all humans are unique and different, there are are core features of commonality that allow them to be classified as homo-sapiens. [SNIP TO END] *** I like to think that there is one underlying reality that all forms and expressions of enlightenment take part in. That may be asking too much, but I'd like to take it as a starting point. Then, the question arises, within that reality, how much room is there for variation of experience that could meaningfully be called awakened or enlightened? Some differences may be accounted for by people being at various stages. Thus, for example, you could have some speak of the world of change as unreal. While this sounds like a fairly advanced perception, it may be a reflection of the Self/Non-Self duality that M. associates with CC. Others might speak of the world of change as utterly real, and seamlessly connected to the unchanging, which sounds more like a UC perception. One confounding factor brought out in various autobiographical accounts is that awakened states may be experienced at first as ultimate because they all have some quality of unboundedness, infinity, immortality about them; whereas, it is only in retrospect that they may be recognized as transitional states moving on to more awakenings. But all of this presupposes that there is one more or less general outcome (with many minor variations) for everyone who is destined to awaken. That could be a false
[FairfieldLife] Re: Transformative work versus indulging with emotions(was painfulinternal dynam
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Unc:Continuing the discussion (and I really see it as adiscussion, not an argument or an attempt to convinceanyone of anything), IS suppression the same as simplyshifting one's attention?Think TM. When you become aware that you are on otherthoughts and effortlessly come back to the mantra, areyou suppressing those thoughts? Irmeli:I didn't claim suppression is happening that situation. I was discussing the situation were you indulge in the positive emotions compassion and love. That can pretty easily lead to suppression of other emotions. I interpret that kind of approach being dualistic. That is not my path. It is has not even been possible for me after the powerful awakening experience I had at the age 16. Unc:We must agree to disagree on this. I've already statedmy view, that there is an infinite supply of ALL emotionsavailable to ALL people at ALL times. Nothing either addsto or subtracts from the supply of available emotions. Irmeli:I'm here talking about emotional states, we all have, and many of which we are not aware of. They are suppressed. An emotional state has too sides to it like a coin. One is mental and the other is physical. Suppressed emotions often create in the long run not only mental but also physical illnesses. And these emotional states can gradually be exposed and transformed or healed. I do it by focusing my attention on where the emotion is located physically in body. I hold the physical and mental parts together and infuse this package by bliss. Many interesting things can happen then. The most important being the gradual improvement of health. If I work with fear, I shift my attention away from the thoughts, what I might be afraid of, and pay attention on the physical counterpart of the emotion. And here I really know, what I'm talking about, because I have done this kind of work a lot. And I have had good reasons for why I've been doing it.I grew up in a dysfunctional family. My mother is mentally ill, and was physically very violent towards me. As an adolescent I had many problems: I was withdrawn, suffered from anxiety, was stuttering, my bearing was poor, I had mild scoliosis. Starting from early childhood I suffered pains during the nights in my hands and feet. When I grew older, the pain got worse. At age 20 I was diagnosed with a progressive muscular disease. I had mild pathological changes in my muscles. Later that disease was found to be genetically inherited. These reasons have drawn me to work intensely with my energies = suppressed emotions. This work included meditation in a way where a lot of attention was paid on the physical sensations simply because their were many uncomfortable sensations in my body. I have not used pain killers. Later I also started to use a powerful breathing technique to better to connect to the emotions. I have also gone through eight years of psychoanalytical psychotherapy. And how am I nowadays? I'm 54 years old. I'm not withdrawn, no anxiety, outgoing, and have many hobbies. My energy flows. The scoliosis has gone, my bearing is good. I'm stuttering much less. The muscular disease is not completely healed. But I'm capable of doing 3 times a week 1,5 ?2 hours rather heavy astanga yoga exercise. In addition to that I swim, and cycle. I experience very little pain or discomfort in my body. The energy just flows. To get to this I have done a lot of transformative work with the emotions, especially with fear, but also with fury, anger and sorrow. When I do this work I can clearly feel how the energy (emotion) transforms itself, and I enjoy that process very much. It is a slow work though. To transform even partly a certain fear structure inside the body is needed usually hours of work in deep meditative blissful state. But transformation is a fact. Irmeli To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: Santa Cruz TM forest retreat
I lived for five years just a few minutes from this location. It is very, very lovely. It has a natural soft and silent feeling. My meditations were always deep and clear there. Groups programs or WPA's would probably be fantastic. I think the angels are already there. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: DEAR CREATORS OF WORLD PEACE AND ENLIGHTENMENT FOR ALL We are very pleased to announce the ceremonial groundbreaking for our beautiful 172 acre forest retreat in Santa Cruz, Friday June 17 starting at 11:30 am. You are all invited to attend this moving of Heaven and Earth, which will not only clear the path of all obstacles and create angel falls here in Santa Cruz, but throughout our entire domain. Our stirring of the Absolute on the mountain will radiate to all the lands in California, Oregon, Washington, Hawaii and French Polynesia, and help to open all of our cities to the arrival of our Peace Palaces. Please arrive on time. The ceremonies will begin at noon. A catered lunch will be served after the ceremony. Please RSVP to Penny Eklof, [EMAIL PROTECTED], 831 426 1287 by Tuesday 6/14. Dress for varied weather- it can be quite warm or cool. For directions from your area, please go to mapquest and do a search for 13575 Empire Grade, Santa Cruz CA 95060. This is the only address nearby, and it is .4 miles [four tenths of a mile] to the east from the road/driveway onto the land, which is on the left. There will be Global Country of World Peace flags at the entrance. Parking is somewhat limited, so please carpool if possible. Jai Guru Dev Tom Eklof To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: Santa Cruz TM forest retreat
Great- I hope it happens, so that us 'valley dwellers' can receive the benefit too! I've spent a lot of time in the Santa Cruz mountains- I agree, really good energy! --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, martyboi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I lived for five years just a few minutes from this location. It is very, very lovely. It has a natural soft and silent feeling. My meditations were always deep and clear there. Groups programs or WPA's would probably be fantastic. I think the angels are already there. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Transformative work versus indulging with emotions(was painfulinternal dynam
All of this sounds good, and sounds productive. As I said to you, we were speaking different languages. I assumed you were talking about transforming emotions by pondering them intellectually; you were talking about feeling the body. And as I said to Dr. Pete, I think that can be beneficial. I guess that the reason I like the Tibetan guy's approach to dealing with emotions is that it assumes that they're not our emotions. They are merely the way the world looks from a particular state of attention that flows through us briefly. In this paradigm, the world looks the same to ALL people who are experiencing that state of attention; ALL of them experience the same set of emotions. This strikes me as possibly a more accurate model than the Western idea that our emotions are somehow ours. That's all. Unc --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Irmeli Mattsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Unc:Continuing the discussion (and I really see it as adiscussion, not an argument or an attempt to convinceanyone of anything), IS suppression the same as simplyshifting one's attention?Think TM. When you become aware that you are on otherthoughts and effortlessly come back to the mantra, areyou suppressing those thoughts? Irmeli:I didn't claim suppression is happening that situation. I was discussing the situation were you indulge in the positive emotions compassion and love. That can pretty easily lead to suppression of other emotions. I interpret that kind of approach being dualistic. That is not my path. It is has not even been possible for me after the powerful awakening experience I had at the age 16. Unc:We must agree to disagree on this. I've already statedmy view, that there is an infinite supply of ALL emotionsavailable to ALL people at ALL times. Nothing either addsto or subtracts from the supply of available emotions. Irmeli:I'm here talking about emotional states, we all have, and many of which we are not aware of. They are suppressed. An emotional state has too sides to it like a coin. One is mental and the other is physical. Suppressed emotions often create in the long run not only mental but also physical illnesses. And these emotional states can gradually be exposed and transformed or healed. I do it by focusing my attention on where the emotion is located physically in body. I hold the physical and mental parts together and infuse this package by bliss. Many interesting things can happen then. The most important being the gradual improvement of health. If I work with fear, I shift my attention away from the thoughts, what I might be afraid of, and pay attention on the physical counterpart of the emotion. And here I really know, what I'm talking about, because I have done this kind of work a lot. And I have had good reasons for why I've been doing it.I grew up in a dysfunctional family. My mother is mentally ill, and was physically very violent towards me. As an adolescent I had many problems: I was withdrawn, suffered from anxiety, was stuttering, my bearing was poor, I had mild scoliosis. Starting from early childhood I suffered pains during the nights in my hands and feet. When I grew older, the pain got worse. At age 20 I was diagnosed with a progressive muscular disease. I had mild pathological changes in my muscles. Later that disease was found to be genetically inherited. These reasons have drawn me to work intensely with my energies = suppressed emotions. This work included meditation in a way where a lot of attention was paid on the physical sensations simply because their were many uncomfortable sensations in my body. I have not used pain killers. Later I also started to use a powerful breathing technique to better to connect to the emotions. I have also gone through eight years of psychoanalytical psychotherapy. And how am I nowadays? I'm 54 years old. I'm not withdrawn, no anxiety, outgoing, and have many hobbies. My energy flows. The scoliosis has gone, my bearing is good. I'm stuttering much less. The muscular disease is not completely healed. But I'm capable of doing 3 times a week 1,5 ?2 hours rather heavy astanga yoga exercise. In addition to that I swim, and cycle. I experience very little pain or discomfort in my body. The energy just flows. To get to this I have done a lot of transformative work with the emotions, especially with fear, but also with fury, anger and sorrow. When I do this work I can clearly feel how the energy (emotion) transforms itself, and I enjoy that process very much. It is a slow work though. To transform even partly a certain fear structure inside the body is needed usually hours of work in deep meditative blissful state. But transformation is a fact. Irmeli To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This
[FairfieldLife] Re: Transformative work versus indulging with emotions(was painfulinternal dynamics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One of the things that I find most refreshing about many of the Tibetan monks I have met is that they spend almost NO time working on themselves. Their own enlightenment is SECONDARY to helping others. Given a choice between pursuing some technique or process that would get them, personally, enlightened a little faster and just getting back to work helping others, there is simply no question which path they would choose. Unc I agree. We once had some Buddhist monks visit our Scientology Church. They were interested in the e meter. Put one of them on it: one of the cleanest needles I've ever seen. They were interested in helping others and my impression is they were helping themselves in the bargain. They were very cool. Jeff To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] A Very Compelling Broadcast Tonight (also repeats immediately afterwards)
I'll vouch for the Streamlink subscription. The Bay Area station KSFO is only 5KW and even locally does not come in well at night (and during the day is the hang out of right-wing wack jobs). So the subscription and downloading the shows I want (also available as Podcasts) well worth it. I'll often plop the files on to my MP3 player and listen to them while walking. Coast To Coast is great entertainment for the less mundane. Dharma Mitra wrote: Really great show on Coast to Coast tonight, they're having a roundtable about evidence in the 9/11 matter, how we've been lied to about the incident and such http://38.116.132.19:80/kfi This will be one of the most compelling shows they've done. I would have mentioned this sooner though didn't check the schedule until now. It's a 4 hour show, starting at 10pm PT, 2am ET, and on the link above, it will repeat the first 3 hours from 2am PT 5am ET, to 5am PT to 8am ET. If you know anyone who's really Disneyly Dizzy about physics and coo coo for coco puffs about the infallability of government, then have them tune in, they may mature to adulthood right on the spot! Your local stations for North America, Pacific Realms, XM and Syndicates outside of North America may be found here: http://www.coasttocoastam.com/affiliates/aa.html The show's home site is http://www.coasttocoastam.com/ and tonight's show's details are here: http://www.coasttocoastam.com/shows/2005/06/16.html Even Bush Bunnies, Ronnie Rollovers and Elmer Fudds are bewildered when they witness the facts these honorable folks will present tonight. Remember, you can catch 3 hours of repeat once the show is over, other stations around the continent will have repeats as well, especially in the West, and Coast To Coast also has an archive service, with podcasting, for subscribers. In Love and Truth, Dharma Mitra DharmaMitra2 AT gmail.com Helping you Say It With Panache! Because, how you say it can be, and often is, as important as what you want to convey, and what you have to say is very important to you. http://PROUT-Ananlysis-Synthesis.latest-info.com - Copywriting - Editing - Publishing - Publicity - To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
Sorry for lurking, but I think this is a very interesting discussion: I like the way that Eckhart Tolle talks about words in relationship to enlightenment. He says that all word are just pointers, because the experience is beyond words, beyond thought. He explains that words like: Self, being, no-self, presence, void, all point to the same experience of perfectly awake silence, but are inadequate to describe it. However, when talking from that place, the silence is as if carried out like a signal on a carrier waves. I feel that this explains why the use of different languages by various teachers does not hinder you from getting there. Also explains why being in the presence of an enlightened person can have the quality of darshan - regardless if they speak or not or what words they do use. Enlightenment is primarily and experience that is beyond the mind, and any discussions about it only point to it. Of course, some individuals verbal skill probably point to it better than others do. Thinking about enlightenment, describing it, and analyzing it is just an interesting hobby that keeps you from getting bored until you are there. Of course, all work and no play, make you a dull boy... --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Reply to Akasha appears below: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [SNIP] That Awareness is expressed in the lifes of all in infinite ways is of little surprise. However, what I was seeking to confirm (or refute if there is no confirmation -- same process) is that there is some commonality to the so called experience of so called awakening. As a rough analogy, while all humans are unique and different, there are are core features of commonality that allow them to be classified as homo-sapiens. [SNIP TO END] *** I like to think that there is one underlying reality that all forms and expressions of enlightenment take part in. That may be asking too much, but I'd like to take it as a starting point. Why not similataneously hold that there maybe is commonality and also mayber there is NOT commonality to all human expressions or experience of spritual unfoldment. It seems if you take ONE possiblity as true as the strating point, you may be chasing your tail. REPLY TO AKASHA: I feel very disappointed that you dismissed this discussion so easily. It is as if you didn't bother reading past my first paragraph and formed an opinion on that basis alone. Somehow, I think you misunderstood me. To better explain the point of view I was expressing, I'll use an analogy that you recently used: physicists acknowledge that some phenomena are best described by Newtonian physics, while others are better describe by Quantum Mechanics. However, an underlying assumption is that these two methods of describing and explaining phenomena are in fact describing the same universe. So that was my starting point. I chose to assume that there is one universe within which different people get enlightened. This says nothing about the description of that universe, or the character of the enlightenment of anyone in particular. For example, this same universe may support an enlightenment in which God or Personal God plays an important role, an enlightenment in which there is no God, an enlightenment in which the ultimate truth can well be described using words like Self, or an enlightenment in which there is No Self. These various forms of enlightenment may be on some sequential path, or they may be mutually exclusive end states. All of that is up for grabs, as far as I'm concerned. And yes, maybe there are forms of enlightenment that have no commonality whatsoever with other forms. What if everyone exists in his/her own universe with its own rules? What does that mean, really? Does it mean that the person's experience alone defines his/her universe? or that everyone else's universe doesn't really exist as far as I'm concerned? Well, we could go that way. But I don't find it very fruitful. I've included my original post below. I was hoping to get a more thoughtful reply from you. But, if you don't want to, well, ok, it was fun, I guess... a ORIGINAL POST REPEATED: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [SNIP] That Awareness is expressed in the lifes of all in infinite ways is of little surprise. However, what I was seeking to confirm (or refute if there is no confirmation -- same process) is that there is some commonality to the so called experience of so called awakening. As a rough analogy, while all humans are unique and different, there are are
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Transformative work versus indulging with emotions(was painfulinternal dynamics)
--- TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter Sutphen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There are all different forms of experiential or cathartic work. They are effective if the attention is primarily on the bodily experience and not in the mind. The mind tends to obsess and replay an event over and over and it never comes to a resolution because it is seeking a cognitive resolution and there is none. The resolution is just letting the experience occur in the body and relaxing into it. I can see that. That's very much in line with the Zen approach to emotions. Be neither attracted or repulsed, just be with whatever is happening. On a physical level, that is. Feel the body. Unc But on the other hand, you can't dismiss the role of cognition either. There is a balance and a movement back and forth between the already-formed, culturally-bound explicit (words, symbols, movement, etc.) and the lived, preverbal, implicit (the body). Each carries forward the other to completion. Eugene Gendlin is a philosophical genius and clinical master in explaining and working with people this way. See: www.focusing.org To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Destructive Emotions
The study of destructive emotions is a popular field of research in cutting edge meditation research. http://www.snowlionpub.com/pages/N51_4.php DESTRUCTIVE EMOTIONS: The Mind and Life Conference 2000 By Ven. Thubten Chodron Beginning in the mid-1980s, the Mind and Life Institute has brought together scientists from various fields of expertise with HH the Dalai Lama in a series of conferences. A theme is picked for each, and five to seven scientists in that field are selected to make presentations to HH. These presentations are given in the morning session each day, and lively discussions among these key participants, who are seated in a circle, occupy the afternoon session. In addition to the scientists, two Tibetan-English translators are present. A group of observerstwenty to forty in numbersit around the periphery. The atmosphere is informal and intimate. The topics of previous conferences have ranged from physics and astronomy to sleeping and dreaming to the relationship between the mind and the brain. The eighth Mind and Life Conference, held in Dharamsala March 20-24, 2000, explored the topic of destructive emotions. While it is impossible to summarize the complex proceedings in a way pleasing to all, I will mention a few highlights as well as discuss some of the points I found most interesting. Dr. Owen Flanagan, Professor of Philosophy at Duke University, spoke about the role of emotion and virtue in making a good life. The West has several approaches to this topic. Religious moral philosophy speaks of the destructive nature of some emotions and the improvement of human qualities through religious practice, while secular moral philosophy discusses the topic in terms of democracy and reason. Science sees emotions as having a physiological basis, and this raises further questions as to human nature and the possibility of pacifying destructive emotions. In the West, emotions are important for determining what is moral, and morality is essential for the functioning of society. Thus working with emotions is seen as important for social interaction, not for having a good soul or being a good person. This leads the West to focus on self-esteem and self-accomplishment as positive emotions, not on having a harmonious inner emotional life. We find three main answers in response to the question, What are we really like deep down inside? The rational egoists say that we look out for our own good, and know that only by being nice to others will we get what we want. The second is that we first are selfish and take care of ourselves and then are compassionate sharing any extra resources with others. The third is that we are basically compassionate, but if theres scarcity in resources we become selfish. HH believes human beings are by nature gentle and compassionate, and due to self-centeredness and ignorance, people feel and act in the opposite way. Still, we cannot say that ordinary human nature is one of cherishing others. Western culture considers love and compassion to be other-oriented. His Holiness clarified that in Buddhism, they are felt towards oneself as well. Wanting ourselves to be happy and free of suffering is not necessarily selfish. Having those feelings in healthy ways is essential to practice the path, and they are included in the love and compassion we develop on the path. Ven. Mattieu Ricard, a scientist and a Buddhist monk, gave an excellent summary of the Buddhist approach to the mind, speaking about the pure luminous nature of mind, the distortions of the destructive emotions, and the potential to eliminate them. HH mentioned two types of emotions. The first, impulsive, destructive emotions, are based on misconceptions and therefore cannot be cultivated limitlessly. The second, realistic ones, such as compassion and disillusionment with samsara, can be enhanced limitless. The first are based on illogical reasons that can be disproved, whereas the second are grounded in valid observation and reasoning. We must use valid reasoning to develop mental states opposed to the destructive emotions. For example, love, as an antidote to anger, must be cultivated through reasoning. It will not arise simply by praying to the Buddha. He also suggested that scientists perform neurological studies to determine if these two types of emotions are linked with specific brain activities. Dr. Paul Ekman, Professor of Psychology at UCSF Medical School, spoke about the evolution of human emotion. Previously it was thought that emotions, like language and values, differed from one culture to another. However, Darwin saw them as common to all people and existing in animals as well. Ekmans research showed that across cultures, people all identified certain facial expressions as indicating the same emotions. Also, the same physiological changes occurred in people from all cultures when they feel specific emotions. For example, when fearful or angry, everyones heart rate increases. Emotions occur quickly.
[FairfieldLife] 'Blitzkrieg/ShockAwe/Military Glorification/What's Next I Wonder?...'
General Tommy Franks indicated that a plan for martial law is well in place, if there is another major attack. You know we could be very close to a military dictatorship; the way things are going. R. Gimbel Seattle, WA. Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: A Very Compelling Broadcast Tonight (also repeats immediately afterwards)
Nah, what I'm saying is that if you really believed that our own government was killing us on purpose you would run out into the streets screaming, unless you were scared of them, or of losing your place in society. Like all people, it's easier to believe the lie than get run over by the truth. - Original Message - From: Robert Gimbel To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 10:42 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A Very Compelling Broadcast Tonight (also repeats immediately afterwards) ---I hear what you're saying, like it's all past history, so what's the point. I just have a compulsion to know the truth about stuff...In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Llundrub" [EMAIL PROTECTED]... wrote: So then knowing what you have learned what will you do with it? - Original Message - From: Dharma Mitra To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; Whole-[EMAIL PROTECTED] ; Shriidhara ; Shriidhara ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; evolutionary-[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 1:43 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] A Very Compelling Broadcast Tonight (also repeats immediately afterwards) Really great show on Coast to Coast tonight, they're having a roundtable about evidence in the 9/11 matter, how we've been lied to about the incident and such http://38.116.132.19:80/kfi This will be one of the most compelling shows they've done. I would have mentioned this sooner though didn't check the schedule until now. It's a 4 hour show, starting at 10pm PT, 2am ET, and on the link above, it will repeat the first 3 hours from 2am PT 5am ET, to 5am PT to 8am ET.To subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!' To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Purity of the teaching (was Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics)
When Creme ranks Antoine Nader up with Jesus I'll take notice. - Original Message - From: Peter Sutphen To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 10:42 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] "Purity of the teaching" (was Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics) --- lupidus108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm not posting http://www.shareintl.org now here for you since I doubt that you are interested, but for other less predjudiced souls who could be interested in finding out who Maitreya really is.A sattvic figment of Mr. Creme's over activeimagination? A benign astral being playing a prank onthe silly humans as an initiation into an astralfraternity? The second coming of Christ? Who knows? Iresist the validity of a spiritual teaching though ifit has a "spokesperson" and uses crosses of lightappearing on windows and buildings and blurryphotographs as means of validation. A little strangefor me. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links [EMAIL PROTECTED] __Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com To subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!' To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Benj. Creme finds Jesus
On Jun 17, 2005, at 3:16 PM, Llundrub wrote: Worth every second. Arrrgh!
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter Sutphen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Some responses below: akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter Sutphen wrote: CC is baby awakening. Cessation of identification of consciousness with mind. End of I and me. No more localization of consciousness. The localization produces the I. There are still some pretty pernicious mental habits that the mind engages in (ala Suzanne Segal). ... There's plenty of I remaining. Moreso than before. We don't know anything at all! A state of wonder when the mind stops and doesn't know. First there is a mind then t here is no mind. Peter, make up your mind! To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] 'Blitzkrieg/ShockAwe/Military Glorification/What's Next I Wonder?...'
If the military isn't all killed first. It gettin to be safer in the hood. Charles Manson had some predictions on this topic. - Original Message - From: Robert Gimbel To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 1:55 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] 'Blitzkrieg/ShockAwe/Military Glorification/What's Next I Wonder?...' General Tommy Franks indicated that a plan for martial law is well in place, if there is another major attack. You know we could be very close to a military dictatorship; the way things are going. R. Gimbel Seattle, WA. Yahoo! SportsRekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football To subscribe, send a message to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/and click 'Join This Group!' To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[FairfieldLife] Re: TMO sells Chicago hotel
I take it then, that you HAVE complained to the IRS, and you were ignored, which is why you're bitching and moaning about things on this group rather than cooperating with an ongoing investigation of what you describe below? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How much did they pay for it originally and who staked the money for it? Yes, *Tennessee-based Maharishi Global Development Fund* but which donors actually staked the money for the idea? Do they still think their money is going for 'peace-making projects'? Do you have reason to think it is not? Contact the IRS. They would LOVE to be able to get their hands on part of the millions that the Global Development Fund has accumulated over the years. Haw! Blackstone Hotel? Were those the years of Old Zimmerman money? or sturart Z. or Chroman money? Foster and Rubin type of nuevo-money? ITG days? Gratzen or Telegroup? Do they still think their money is being used for *peace-making projects*? Chicago? Blackstone? Ponneman ITG money? Yes, non=profit tax exempt charitable educational organization. Except for the fact that in pattern the money seems to go to Europe and disappear in India in Indian *Foundations*. Sounds more like a ...*RICO*. Spelled: Racketeering? Read the archive here even in FFL and read the federal example case against securities fraud: 'To be in a position to have known or should have known '. What of the good people in the TMO developement office? Doing the bidding of the *TMO* like Jane or some lowling like Wooster, or a Todt? *Known or should have known*? People who fundraise now like Hagelin or Morris or Wallace or someone spokesman even like, a Lipman? Spokepeople? Shills? In a position *to have known or should have known*. Methodically selling for *peace-making projects* that seem to not materilize. Non-profit enterprize that seem to be money diversionary projects primarily, called philantrophy fraud. Not uncommon generally, turns out even our Iowa US IA Senator Grassley in the Finance Committe is having hearings about this very subject of *Philantrophy Frand* and the enormous loss of capital and income that it generates. What better example than a home town RICO? The Ia. Attorney General even has its own laws just on this type of fraud. Jeez. The 4th of July is only just a few days away. Damn demeocracy? Of course is you are and aquisitive MMY and No, bless the Decl of Independ. and also the US constitution of us and our bills of rights that allows us to live together against just such methodical fraud as we are seeing even before us! Re-cerification? Haw! Bring on our Attorneys Generals to defend us with Truth and re-concilliation. Yea, '20,000' US teachers of TM/ govenors and only a few hundred re-certifying? Says a lot about the credibililty of the TMO even amoungst those who know. MMY and the TMO are not even close to Truth and Reconcilliation with us generally. They have not touched *transparency* with anything close to a ten- foot pole. In fact they are down to a few hundreds of true-believers and then a whole movement of now de-certified teachers and governors. And meditatiors? They do not even know what they have obviously spawned. What does this say about the great teacher? It is pretty evident: bring on democracy and enlightenment. It is also called transparency. JGD =D To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jyouells2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] [...] You can always organize a study of newly awakened former TMers and compare their physiology to the ongoing participants in the program. Have you ever seen the signs (eeg studies etc...) of any other people besides TMers. Did you even take a look at Ken_Stops_His_Brainwaves.wmv that Vaj posted? Pretty impressive. Is it? Why don't youpost the URL of that video to a moderated neuroscience newsgroup and ask for comments? Next time I can presuade the NIH to float me a million or so I'll gather up a few of the 'newly awakened' for a study. You can perform quite a study with a million or so, and yes, NIH DOES fund studies of various kinds on things like this. MUM has been getting money for years to study the effects of meditation on hypertension in black americans. I the mean time, it seems that some people have made significant progress after leaving TMO or they made significant progress and they decided to leave and present their knowlege outside the context of TM. Whatever. There is a substantial group of the 'newly awakened' here writing on FFL, willing to stick their necks out. How many of them are still closely associated with the TMO? I've seen few signs of newly awakened on this group. In fact, quite the opposite, unless one assumes that the habitual responses of the newly awakened include knee-jerk criticism of an organization they no longer care to be affiliated with. JohnY To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ingegerd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: No, it is not a response to Chopra. How do you know? The purpose of an organisation - is to organize on all levels. Ingegerd Um, OK, but how do you know that the, obvious to me at least, testing of the rajas by giving them silly titles and making them wear silly outfits is NOT a response to the self-importance of Deepak Chopra? It's a response to Chopra, I think. Chopra would never have stood for such a thing. Abu-Nader is quite competent, as far as I can tell, but he will never be able to set up a splinter organization based on his own personal popularity outside the TM organization the way CHopra could. But my creativity is blossoming outside the TMO.I am more fullfilled outside than inside the TMO. What is the purpose of the TMO? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: account of MUM dining hall murder
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Obviously, the Powers that Be thought this was simple unstressing and didn't act on the warning signs. Well, duh. That's the whole purpose of the term 'unstressing.' It's a term invented so that you can dismiss something bad or unpleasant happening as something good happening. It's a mechanism for never examining the possibility that the unpleasant experience per se might not be either necessary or productive. No, unstressing refers to part of the process of meditation and its immediate aftereffects, NOT to extreme counter-reactions to therapeutic drug withdrawal. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you ever seen the signs (eeg studies etc...) of any other people besides TMers. Did you even take a look at Ken_Stops_His_Brainwaves.wmv that Vaj posted? Pretty impressive. I'm afraid that was a cheat! I don't know about a cheat, but I don't know that it meant anything specifically. A 4-channel EEG [expensive] toy isn't exactly the most sophisticated scientific instrument, especially when the guy conducting the measurement is the one being measured. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Actually, MMY has characterized CC as merely normal, and as glorified ignorance. All that CC is is when there is 24/7 presence of Self. The claim that I and me goes away is either a mis-identification of CC with extreme unstressing resulting in pathological derealization, or a misinterpretation of what MMY is describing. Is this based on personal experience? I will never tell. Typical True Believer evasion of a simple question, and one that should be asked of *everyone* who makes an assertion about what enlightenment is or is not. Many here have no problem with that simple question, whether the answer is Yes or No. Why do you? Why do they? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I take that as a no. And am left with the impression that your view is based on your interpretation of any number of advanced lecture tapes you heard and assimilated over the years. Bingo. And it's understandable. There is a mindset within the TMO (and, to be fair, within many traditions) that knowledge and wisdom are synonymous with being able to parrot back ideas that have been taught to you. Your standing or value to the organization is based upon how WELL you can parrot. Not only is no credit given to someone who comes up with their own words to describe phenomena or concepts, you are often considered off the program for doing so. It's the academic approach to didactic learning, super- imposed on a study that should be about individual experience and expression, because it has to do with individual awakening. Standardization of dogma has to do only with standardization of dogma, not with knowledge. What knowledge are we discussing? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Mind
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Right NOW... First there is an I -- then there is no I -- then there is. Second there is a mind--then there is no mind--then there is. Third there is a mountain--then there is no mountain--then there is. Right NOW... or NOT! Just so, just so, just so... To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jyouells2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There is a substantial group of the 'newly awakened' here writing on FFL, willing to stick their necks out. How many of them are still closely associated with the TMO? And there is a good reason for this. If they had started having good experiences and tried to talk about them within the TMO, what would have happened to them? Among the teachers, even the teachers of so-called advanced techniques, there is no one who has been trained to deal with such experiences. In the general milieu, the We don't speak about our experiences dogma has been interpreted as Anyone who does is delusional and should be put down and shunned. In the contextof the TMO, anyone who discusses enlightenment is off the program... It's actually very sad. And in answer to some of the people who have asked me why, since I walked away from the TMO 25 years ago, I hang out at this place, it's because Rick has provided a forum in which it is OK to talk about such things. When it all comes down, there is nothing meaningful we can say about enlight- enment itself. *By definition* it cannot be described. But we can talk about our particular path, and the adventures we have had along that path, and share with others our own subjective experiences, in an ongoing attempt to understand them, or even to come to grips with them. For me, that's a rare and unique opportunity, not just within the environment of the TMO, but within any spiritual group. I think it's a neat thing. Others are threatened by it. Go figure. Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Irmeli Mattsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: on 6/15/05 2:23 PM, sparaig at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If it jeopardizes the company, you bet it gets dealt with somehow. If it doesn't, the company goes down. Which personal behavior of MMY's has jeapordized the TMO? If I enumerated them you'd dismiss them as unfounded rumors and we'd be going in circles, so let's drop it. Uh-huh. Something other than the sex? Sounds to me like you've got a certain obsession, which you've been unable to drop. LoL... I like to see MMY as a CEO of an international company or organization. If his policies are evaluated through that lens, he would have scored extremely low already for a long time, in the 60's and early 70's clearly better. In the mid 70's the CEO of TMO should have been changed to a more competent one. Had the CEO been changed, as normally happens, when the organizations course points steadily downhill, TMO's position in the world would be quite different now. Except that the TMO is privately held and in that case, the goals of the company are the goals of the founder of the company, which may not be what you think they are. And no-one has addressed the question of Which personal behavior of MMY's has jeapordized the TMO? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Irmeli Mattsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Since purity of the teaching is and always has been MMY's most important focus, he's been willing to tolerate less-than- creative individuals because they're the ones most likely to follow the purity of the teaching requirement, regardless. The fundamentalists usually give `the purity of the teaching' as an excuse, when they give reasons for there course of action. That pattern is so typical to fundies, that I already for a long time have immediately labelled anyone who appeals to that phrase as a fundamentalist. So far nothing has emerged that would hint those persons having got to a wrong category. And yet, you haven't actually addressed what I said: MMY is most concerned with purity of the teaching, and he's willing to tolerate non-creative types who maintain said purity over more creative types who don't. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
Thanks for the comments martyboi. You have made the assumption that all languages for describing enlightenment are describing the same thing, even though the descriptions sound different. This may not be the case. This becomes more than just an interesting hobby when having to make choices about what teachers to listen to, and correspondingly, which practices to engage in. For example, take the ongoing discussion between Irmeli and TurquoiseB on the subject of emotions. The viewpoints that each is expressing give rise to very different ways of focusing one's attention, and different outcomes. Each viewpoint has an explanation for why the approach of the other will do harm in some way. It's your choice to listen to one of these approaches or not. But the outcome has real consequences. a --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, martyboi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry for lurking, but I think this is a very interesting discussion: I like the way that Eckhart Tolle talks about words in relationship to enlightenment. He says that all word are just pointers, because the experience is beyond words, beyond thought. He explains that words like: Self, being, no-self, presence, void, all point to the same experience of perfectly awake silence, but are inadequate to describe it. However, when talking from that place, the silence is as if carried out like a signal on a carrier waves. I feel that this explains why the use of different languages by various teachers does not hinder you from getting there. Also explains why being in the presence of an enlightened person can have the quality of darshan - regardless if they speak or not or what words they do use. Enlightenment is primarily and experience that is beyond the mind, and any discussions about it only point to it. Of course, some individuals verbal skill probably point to it better than others do. Thinking about enlightenment, describing it, and analyzing it is just an interesting hobby that keeps you from getting bored until you are there. Of course, all work and no play, make you a dull boy... --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Reply to Akasha appears below: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [SNIP] That Awareness is expressed in the lifes of all in infinite ways is of little surprise. However, what I was seeking to confirm (or refute if there is no confirmation -- same process) is that there is some commonality to the so called experience of so called awakening. As a rough analogy, while all humans are unique and different, there are are core features of commonality that allow them to be classified as homo-sapiens. [SNIP TO END] *** I like to think that there is one underlying reality that all forms and expressions of enlightenment take part in. That may be asking too much, but I'd like to take it as a starting point. Why not similataneously hold that there maybe is commonality and also mayber there is NOT commonality to all human expressions or experience of spritual unfoldment. It seems if you take ONE possiblity as true as the strating point, you may be chasing your tail. REPLY TO AKASHA: I feel very disappointed that you dismissed this discussion so easily. It is as if you didn't bother reading past my first paragraph and formed an opinion on that basis alone. Somehow, I think you misunderstood me. To better explain the point of view I was expressing, I'll use an analogy that you recently used: physicists acknowledge that some phenomena are best described by Newtonian physics, while others are better describe by Quantum Mechanics. However, an underlying assumption is that these two methods of describing and explaining phenomena are in fact describing the same universe. So that was my starting point. I chose to assume that there is one universe within which different people get enlightened. This says nothing about the description of that universe, or the character of the enlightenment of anyone in particular. For example, this same universe may support an enlightenment in which God or Personal God plays an important role, an enlightenment in which there is no God, an enlightenment in which the ultimate truth can well be described using words like Self, or an enlightenment in which there is No Self. These various forms of enlightenment may be on some sequential path, or they may be mutually exclusive end states. All of that is up for grabs, as far as I'm concerned. And yes, maybe there are forms of enlightenment that have no commonality
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter Sutphen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: CC is well described as glorified ignorance, especially the early stages of it. But, Sparaig, you need to read your 'Gita a little more carefully regarding I and enlightenment. I suspect your understanding of enlightenment is based on intellect alone rather than on intellect and experience. The I never gets enlightened. How can it? You talk about presence of Self. What is Self? An object? A subject? For that matter, what is ignorance? No buzz words please. Derealization is a mental phenomena only, it has nothing to do with CC. Perhaps, but to claim that CC means there is no I or me... Well, I fill in the blanks in my own way. sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:snip Actually, MMY has characterized CC as merely normal, and as glorified ignorance. All that CC is is when there is 24/7 presence of Self. The claim that I and me goes away is either a mis-identification of CC with extreme unstressing resulting in pathological derealization, or a misinterpretation of what MMY is describing. But with Sat Yuga and all, maybe things are mellower. You yourself are even making what you previous called huge epistimological mistakes! and laughing it away. On a more serious note, do you singularly define CC as Cessation of identification of consciousness with mind. End of 'I' and 'me'? Do you feel No I is both nexcessary and sufficient to label the experience CC? Without relying on dogmatic kneejerks, it does seems there are additional attributes along with or beyond the experience of No I. Though as you know I am no fan or labeling any experience or person with such labels, it seems that if one does enjoy that exercise, they may be jumping the gun a bit to ring the bell of Eureka of CC simple when experience no I. But as people often remind me that I know nothing, I tend to agree. Though as Tom has claimed there are 58 million flavors of awakening at the Awakening /IceCream store. I just wonder if plain vanilla is really the same as triple jamaca almond machadamion nut ghee-fudge blueberry mocha mintchip chavanaprash cherry saffron swirl with gold leaf topping? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Purity of the teaching (was Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] [...] Obviously, this is not a purity of the teaching issue per se, but it IS an example of the fascist mindset that can develop in those who espouse it as an excuse for just being fascists. There's always that danger, of course. But that goes back to the issue of purity of teaching vs creativity (or tolerance). I'd like to point out that by 1985, on the sidhis course, the thought police were far more circumspect than they were before. They had the course participants elect a course leader from their own ranks who acted as the go-between between the Sidhis Administrators and the students. If there was a minor problem of off the programness, it was this course leader's job to discuss it with the students, not the Administrator's. Ours would approach us with you're not going to believe this but I've been asked to talk to you guys about cooling it with flirting with them women [or whatever]... The dynamics were definitely different than what you describe. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter Sutphen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Who's Peter? That's what I've been trying to figure out. ? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Akasha, great to see you back. Hope you are well. On Jun 15, 2005, at 9:29 PM, akasha_108 wrote: Ut oh Peter, now you have done it! You called CC baby awakening. Tom is going to go totally ballistic! I quoted you sometime back as CC being baby steps and Tom lambsted me up and down for 3-4 posts as to why there was nothing baby about it. But with Sat Yuga and all, maybe things are mellower. You yourself are even making what you previous called huge epistimological mistakes! and laughing it away. It's funny when you see these parrotings of TMO doctrine. What's so funny is that most aren't even aware that to a Samkhya practitioner turiyatita (CC) *IS* the big E! Really all that can be said is that this is the POV of Mahesh Yogi (this CC opinion)--because it certainly does not represent any lineal transmission. Most hilarious is the whole idea that there is a transition from CC to GC to UC. GC or Bhagavata-chetana is the style of enlightenment described by the Bhagavatins. The Bhagavatins were Vaishnavite Bhaktis--devotional practitioners from the cult of Vishnu! This is why when you study and practice from the perspective of the Shankaracharya trad. you will NOT find GC as part of any continuum of enlightenment. What these represent are different POV's--different darshanas. Advaita does show a path beyond turiyatita to videha-mukti (UC) but it ain't anything like M. claims. The idea of 7 states of consciousness is a fabrication of M.'s opinions. Seven may have been a more marketable concept than six, but the idea that these 7 states represent a continuum is a novelty of Mahesh. On a more serious note, do you singularly define CC as Cessation of identification of consciousness with mind. End of 'I' and 'me'? Do you feel No I is both nexcessary and sufficient to label the experience CC? Without relying on dogmatic kneejerks, it does seems there are additional attributes along with or beyond the experience of No I. Actually turiyatita or CC is said to occur with the complete DISSOLUTION of mind. Merely ceasing to identify with the mind would give a glimpse of CC perhaps, not the end result. The methods to perform this dissolution are not taught in the TMO so therefore it is crucial, if we are to maintain the illusion that the TM/TMSP actually can lead to enlightenment, that other false or novel ideas be presented. -Vaj So which Shankaracharya of Jyotirmath has endorsed YOU as a preferred candidate to become his sucessor? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Destructive Emotions
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The study of destructive emotions is a popular field of research in cutting edge meditation research. http://www.snowlionpub.com/pages/N51_4.php Nice article, Vaj. Thanks for posting it. Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Reacting to' vs. 'bouncing off of'
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One of them has to be RIGHT, and the other WRONG. And therefore the only proper response to a contrary view is to challenge it and draw the other person into an argument, during which the goal is to prove one person WRONG and the other RIGHT. The further down somebody is, the stronger the compulsion to be RIGHT: Constant assertion of rightness because one's own sanity depends on being right. IMO the more one asserts rightness in the face of huge evidence to the contrary, the further down the scale they are. What evidence of what righness or wrongness are we talking about? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Benj. Creme finds Jesus
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jun 17, 2005, at 3:16 PM, Llundrub wrote: Worth every second. Arrrgh! Can we get Johnny Depp to play Jesus in the movie? :-) To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter Sutphen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It does seem rather ironic that a spiritual movement who's primary goal is enlightenment does not encourage its members to talk about their experiences regarding this goal. I've always seen this as a political decision. I believe Bevan et al wanted to hold on to the interpretive power or the sanctioned narrative of enlightenment. This then assured them of the purity of the teaching and sole control over the meaning of enlightenment. Yup. And sole control over validating reported exper- iences of enlightenment and advising people on how to regard them and what to do with them. I don't know about the rest of you, but Bevan's right out for me as someone to trust the advice of. What advice does Bevan give about enlightenment? And even IF (a big IF) I considered Maharishi an expert on higher states of consciousness, if I look at how things have turned out for him and what he's become, it's not as if I'm gonna be lookin' for advice from him, either. What advice does MMY give? God forbid there could be people out there in the TMO in higher states of consciousness who disagreed with MMY or the TMO. This is probably the real reason why no one has been certified enlightened. Can't take the chance that, once they have been, they'll continue to follow the party line. There have been many people reporting episodes of CC lasting a year or more who have been studied quite extensively. And King TOny's state of consciousness has been examined quite carefully by MMY. These people had to be marginalized. And they were by not allowing personal talk of enlightenment. Enlightenment was only discussed as an inspiration to continue with some program or to adhere to some organizational rule. The carrot on the stick tied to the horse, never to be munched, only drooled over. The Road Runner eternally pursued by Wile E. Coyote, never to be caught, only to be pursued. A myth. And, of course, a myth that increases sales. The better the myth is of how good Road Runner tastes when you catch one, the more products the Acme company is able to sell to hungry coyotes. Perhaps, or perhaps a genuine sincerity of belief that the carrot exists, and that following the advice of the organization will help others attain that carrot. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am simply saying I don't necessarily experience a natural progression of TC - CC - GC - UC...and really either does the tradition. That's reassuring for me. I know some paths introduce unity right away--you grab what you can and let it burn through to the base (of reality). Anything less is a prop of some sort. *** I don't think MMY would exclude this possibility of going for unity directly. What you are doing is ridiculing his official public position only. What follows is a quote from a post that I made recently on this topic (post #57280): I have a personal opinion (not a strongly held belief), based on years of listening to MMY comment on people's experiences (years ago), that the CC/GC/UC model that he has laid out is, for him, an oversimplified model for the purpose of teaching to and inspiring large numbers of people. His comments on experiences make me believe that his own understanding is much more flexible, and takes into account a surprising number of characteristics and individual differences that are not included in the CC/GG/UC model. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/message/57280 This post was directed to you, Vaj. I'm surprised that you didn't respond. :-) To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] 'St.Germain: Greed Root of Evil...'june 16, 2005'
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2005 9:38 AM Subject: [NESARA CANADA] St Germain: Greed is the Root of all Evil, 16th June 2005 St. Germain: Greed is the Root of all Evil 16th June, 2005 There is a sudden upsurge of interest in the various petitions being presented to the authorities. People are becoming more aware that something big is happening, and now their curiosity gets the better of them. Consequently, some whose eyes and ears have been closed are awakening to what has been happening. The movements that will bring in the changes are becoming stronger, and an energy abounds that was not there previously. This is all about people power and the rising mass consciousness that will eventually engulf the dark. This has been slowly building for quite some time and it is about to determine how future events come about. Without the necessity of physical force you have called a halt to the attempts to take away your last bastions of freedom. Even those who supported your leaders are beginning to realize that they are not representative of the people, but only themselves. Except for those who directly benefit from the actions of the government, support is dwindling very fast and people look for new champions to lead them forward. You will know them by the work they do, and they are emerging into the public eye for all to see. People's beliefs are very hard to shift once they have nailed their colors to the mast. However, there is now a weight of evidence against those who lead this great nation that shows they have fully let the people down. What you will see happening now is a massive turning point that will lead you into the direction which will enable you to reclaim your freedom, sovereignty and justice. There is a saying, that what happens today in America ? happens in the rest of the world tomorrow. It is certain that current events will soon have world wide repercussions. The greatest prize will be the declaration of peace and the end of hostilities all over the world. The people have spoken on this issue, and if need be the end of all wars will be enforced. The old ways will then be seen to be truly committed to the graveyard of experience. Peace should be welcomed, but many people are in positions that have greatly profited by the continuation of war. These ill gotten gains will eventually be reclaimed and used for the benefit of the people. War and all that it represents has had a good run and touched so many people with its tentacles. All of you have had experiences of it in one life or another. War has brutalized many souls and is it no wonder that it leads to mental problems. It is time to turn over a new leaf and bring peace to each one of you. Time to release the burden of sorrow that the affect of war causes, and return the hopes of people that wish to live side by side in happiness and Oneness. There is a great will to achieve such goals, and it will be helped by the release of abundance and a fair sharing of the resources and wealth of the world. You are achieving so much by peaceful demonstrations, and a shining example to those who would not hesitate to use force against you to stop your protests. You are proof that much can be achieved by peaceful means, and you are the bedrock of the new movement towards peace. Eat, sleep and drink peace because the impetus must not now be lost. The demands have to continue so that they are not pushed out of sight, and nothing less than complete success will suffice. It has been a long hard road to get this far and it will bring success, and it is so written. Dear Ones, it is so wonderful to see the support you have given to those brave ones who have shown that they are equal to the task of restoring peace on Earth. It may take time to be fully established, but even those who wear their uniforms will be relieved and happy to turn their hand to peaceful pursuits. Many have proudly gone into battle with a great feeling of satisfaction at being able to serve and protect their country. Souls who have been prepared to lay down their bodies if necessary, and are the true patriots. I do not condone any aspect of war, but it has to be acknowledged that it is your intention that is uppermost. Some souls enjoy the killing fields and for them many lessons are yet to be learnt. It takes all kinds, so you say, and indeed the world is a vast cauldron of different cultures, religions and beliefs that makes it such a wonderful place to gain experience. Remember, that in the ultimate that is exactly what it is about and you are no less than anyone else by having experienced the dark. Your growth would not occur at the same speed without it, and it enables you to balance the Light and the dark. Many have already reached that point where the cycle of duality has taught them all they need to know, and wait for the quickening vibrations that will lead them to Ascension. I hear some saying that
[FairfieldLife] Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jyouells2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There is a substantial group of the 'newly awakened' here writing on FFL, willing to stick their necks out. How many of them are still closely associated with the TMO? And there is a good reason for this. If they had started having good experiences and tried to talk about them within the TMO, what would have happened to them? Among the teachers, even the teachers of so-called advanced techniques, there is no one who has been trained to deal with such experiences. In the general milieu, the We don't speak about our experiences dogma has been interpreted as Anyone who does is delusional and should be put down and shunned. In the contextof the TMO, anyone who discusses enlightenment is off the program... You need to be a little more precise. The above statement is clearly not true. It's fine to discuss enlightenment as a concept, and to trot out the TM dogma for what it is supposed to be. But discuss your *own* experiences with enlightenment and you do run the risk of being declared off the program. Now the real question: do you see that as Ok? Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Purity of the teaching (was Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And then it hits him, in a blinding flash of realization, that he's sitting there quivering in his seat, about to be judged by his betters for the dastardly crime of Eating Ice Cream. He starts to laugh. They call him into the room. He can't stop laughing. He answers none of their questions, because he just can't stop laughing. He finally gets up and leaves the room, and the Inquisitors are so dumbfounded by some- one not being afraid of them that they don't do *anything* about it. He hears not another word about it. He goes back home at the end of his ATR course, and naturally the next time he applies for another course he is barred from attending it. But by this time he really doesn't care, because he's still laughing. Not the same thing but I applied at a new restaurant yesterday for the chef position. I decided to use the Maharishi rule of thumb that if they're not buying at cheap then let them not buy at expensive. Sure enough these guys decide that they are going to pay their chef, get this, $35,000 a year salary for an expected 60 hour work week. So that was way under what I wanted considering my skills. So I was talking wiith them telling them how at this venue the food is the star and will make them or break them, they get what they pay for, and all that. And then I said, for a business that will bring in a potential 3-5 million dollars you're not very much willing to part with much of it for top quality cooking. I said, the owners and managers are important because you all have made the bed, but the chef is the one that will be bringing people off the streets and turning the tricks for you. And then I thought, jeez what a dumbass I am. Where did that come from. The guy looked at me, and said, well, thanks for your unique viewpoint. End of interview. It's always good to check out the market before you speak: http://www.restaurant.org/rusa/magArticle.cfm?ArticleID=358 [...] Salary and bonus levels tend to be highest for chef and executive- chef positions. Executive chefs took home a median base salary of $32,500 in an organization with annual sales of less than $1 million and $55,000 in a business with annual sales of $10 million or more. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Reacting to' vs. 'bouncing off of'
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Fischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One of them has to be RIGHT, and the other WRONG. And therefore the only proper response to a contrary view is to challenge it and draw the other person into an argument, during which the goal is to prove one person WRONG and the other RIGHT. The further down somebody is, the stronger the compulsion to be RIGHT: Constant assertion of rightness because one's own sanity depends on being right. IMO the more one aserts rightness in the face of huge evidence to the contrary, the further down the scale they are. I'm not sure I'd say that consistently insisting that one is RIGHT indicates that they're low down on some scale. More like terrified to move UP the scale, wherever on it they might be. Being RIGHT all the time disallows learning anything new, which may be the whole point. Unless, of course, you ARE right. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter Sutphen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That response was quite funny, Vaj! Said Peter when Vaj pushed his button... Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jun 15, 2005, at 11:17 PM, sparaig wrote: All that CC is is when there is 24/7 presence of Self. The claim that I and me goes away is either a mis-identification of CC with extreme unstressing resulting in pathological derealization, or a misinterpretation of what MMY is describing. Said the robot Lawson when the remote was pushed. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links - Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM more. Check it out! To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks for the comments martyboi. You have made the assumption that all languages for describing enlightenment are describing the same thing, even though the descriptions sound different. This may not be the case. This becomes more than just an interesting hobby when having to make choices about what teachers to listen to, and correspondingly, which practices to engage in. For example, take the ongoing discussion between Irmeli and TurquoiseB on the subject of emotions. The viewpoints that each is expressing give rise to very different ways of focusing one's attention, and different outcomes. Each viewpoint has an explanation for why the approach of the other will do harm in some way. It's your choice to listen to one of these approaches or not. But the outcome has real consequences. Or, both work equally well, for people of the right temperament or predilection. And they might not work as well for people with other predilections. The game seems to be about determining what works best for you. Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Purity of the teaching (was Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics)
Why did you CARE? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jyouells2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Your friend has great experience and is pushed out of the TMO. Maybe there is some truth to the old rumor that the powers that be are reincarnated members of the order of the protectors of the faith (inquisitors) ;-) LOL Anything is possible. One thing is certain, in my exper- ience, *whatever* their incarnational pedigree, such petty tyrants are incapable of handling being laughed at or being embarrassed in public. As you can probably tell from my posts here, I was not the most on the program and tactful guy when I was in the TM movement. I didn't actually make that many waves, but the wave I'm most proud of also occurred at an ATR course in Switzerland. For a change, I'd gotten assigned a decent room. It was on the fourth floor, sunny, had its own bathroom. What is not to like? So it's about two weeks into the course and we get a new German course leader. He shows up, is assigned *his* room and, one can presume, doesn't like it much. The way I find *out* that he doesn't like his room much is that I go back to my *own* room after lunch and see my suitcases outside the door, with a note on them. In it, he informs me that he has moved into my room. I have been reassigned to the room that wasn't worthy of him, and he has taken the liberty of packing all of my things for me. He had the nerve to sign the note with Jai Guru Dev. What he has forgotten is that I still have my key. I use it, open the door, and walk in. He's not there, but all of his stuff is. I gather it all up and throw it out the fourth-floor window. I don't bother to pack it, I just gather up heaps of clothes and books and toilet articles and just toss them out the window onto the lawn below. And then I move back into my room. Know what happened? Nothing. Nada. Rien. Nichevo. Bupkus. I never heard a WORD about it, either from the course leader himself or anyone else. Not a word. Petty tyrants are able to be tyrants only because people allow them to do so. Stand up to them, especially in a way that makes them look ridiculous or causes others to laugh at them, and they turn back into what they always were, timid little mice given power before they were mature enough to handle it. Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So which Shankaracharya of Jyotirmath has endorsed YOU as a preferred candidate to become his sucessor? It's just a meaningless statement, Lawson. It's like someone saying, My choice for US President is Nelson Mandela. Not gonna happen; can't ever happen until they change the laws for Ahnuld. So it's easy to say. Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Purity of the teaching (was Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Stand up to them, especially in a way that makes them look ridiculous or causes others to laugh at them, and they turn back into what they always were, timid little mice given power before they were mature enough to handle it. Unc --Or they take power. And kill you... To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Purity of the teaching (was Re: Lenz -- Sex and Business Practices / Ethics)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Llundrub [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Stand up to them, especially in a way that makes them look ridiculous or causes others to laugh at them, and they turn back into what they always were, timid little mice given power before they were mature enough to handle it. --Or they take power. I think I got away with it because it was just a TM movement weasel, and thus confrontation-averse. I mean the guy left a NOTE, ferchrissakes...how spineless is that? If it had been Dick Cheney I'd still be in Guantanamo with electrodes attached to some of my favorite places. :-) He may have been ustressing and and when ranted about what YOU had done, someone pointed out that what HE had done was out-of-line... To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: CC is Baby Awakening
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter Sutphen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: CC is baby awakening. Cessation of identification of consciousness with mind. End of I and me. Cessation of identification of consciousness with the mind but still an awareness that is confined to the body in that seeing is done through a particular set of eyes, hearing through a particular set of ears etc.. Still bound to the body but no longer identifying as the personallity. There seems to still be individuality though. Rick Carlstrom We automatically call our self the most permanent set of things present in our mental landscape. For most, these include personality, beliefs, habits, emotions, etc. When somone has 24/7 witnessing, the most permanent aspect of their existance is that 24/7 witnessing, so by definition, that is their self. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
