new to list - question on kittens and comment re Georgie
Hi, Hope I'm doing this correctly, I'm not very good at these lists. I'm with a small rescue group and we've trapped fourteen 10 - 12 week old kittens (three moms) from one yard. They are being socialized in 3 or 4 foster homes. It's a lot of work and time and the kittens are already at a disadvantage because by the time they are socialized, they're not 8 - 12 weeks anymore. Started trapping the adults to TNR and the original mom cat, who didn't look so hot, tested - IFA - Leukemia positive. I'm OK with FIV and have had plenty of experience with it, but I've found different vets have different and sometimes radical opinions, so I am assuming it's the same with leukemia. I'm looking for some practical advice - when to test, ELISA or IFA...I'm trying to get as much current and correct information as possible, but am getting a little mixed up. Fourteen feral kittens aare a lot for us even under the best circumstances. What should we do next? As far as Georgie, there's a website called www.catsinthebag.org - it is excellent for helping to find lost cats. Thanks, Janine --
kitten with swollen glands and positive feral mom cat
Hello everyone, A while back I joined this list after trapping 5 kittens who tested positive. Luckily, all 5 have been placed. One little guy named Emmet went to a home as a companion to another positive cat. The adoptive mom's vet said Emmet's glands are swollen and doesn't give this kitten long. Is this necessarily so? Their positive mother, who is quite feral,is still crated weeks after her spay because there is some conflict as to what to do with her. She was sick at the time we trapped her, and very thin, but now she is eating so well it's hard to look at her like she's sick. Her orginal caretaker doesn't want her returned to her yard, more out of fear that the cat will get sick again, go off somewhere and die. The cat was not a piece of cake to trap in the first place, and is the most secretive of the adults in the yard, so I can see where she's coming from. She doesn't want her living in a cage either...any thoughts on this? Thank you, Janine
Re: kitten with swollen glands and positive feral mom cat
Yes, she tested positive with the IFA test. We are primarily a small TNR group and don't always test, but she was so thin and run down, we had her tested. The other adults looked OK. Many of the 14 kittens, positive and negative, had health issues, which we're getting through. We are based in Stamford, CT, which is south towards NY City. Janine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So the mom is FELV+? Where are you located. One possibility is to find a rescue that will take (feral) FELV cats. Gloria At 09:31 AM 8/28/2005, you wrote: Hello everyone, A while back I joined this list after trapping 5 kittens who tested positive. Luckily, all 5 have been placed. One little guy named Emmet went to a home as a companion to another positive cat. The adoptive mom's vet said Emmet's glands are swollen and doesn't give this kitten long. Is this necessarily so? Their positive mother, who is quite feral,is still crated weeks after her spay because there is some conflict as to what to do with her. She was sick at the time we trapped her, and very thin, but now she is eating so well it's hard to look at her like she's sick. Her orginal caretaker doesn't want her returned to her yard, more out of fear that the cat will get sick again, go off somewhere and die. The cat was not a piece of cake to trap in the first place, and is the most secretive of the adults in the yard, so I can see where she's coming from. She doesn't want her living in a cage either...any thoughts on this? Thank you, Janine
Re: kitten with swollen glands and positive feral mom cat
Our website is www.adoptapet.org - we have a ways to go with the site, but if you take a look, Emmet, the positive kitten with the swollen glands, is on our home page. Even tho he's been placed, the picture is so cute we thought it might help people realize positive cats need homes too. Janine --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So the mom is FELV+? Where are you located. One possibility is to find a rescue that will take (feral) FELV cats. Gloria At 09:31 AM 8/28/2005, you wrote: Hello everyone, A while back I joined this list after trapping 5 kittens who tested positive. Luckily, all 5 have been placed. One little guy named Emmet went to a home as a companion to another positive cat. The adoptive mom's vet said Emmet's glands are swollen and doesn't give this kitten long. Is this necessarily so? Their positive mother, who is quite feral,is still crated weeks after her spay because there is some conflict as to what to do with her. She was sick at the time we trapped her, and very thin, but now she is eating so well it's hard to look at her like she's sick. Her orginal caretaker doesn't want her returned to her yard, more out of fear that the cat will get sick again, go off somewhere and die. The cat was not a piece of cake to trap in the first place, and is the most secretive of the adults in the yard, so I can see where she's coming from. She doesn't want her living in a cage either...any thoughts on this? Thank you, Janine
Re: kitten with swollen glands and positive feral mom cat
Gloria, Thanks for that 2c. I got the feeling the vet was leaning towards euth'sia and I didn't want to argue the point when I don't really know what I'm talking about. Janine --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Regarding Emmet, My guess would be that's not necessarily so (that he's dying). Could be fighting it off. They can do that. Could be fighting something else off, like a uri. Or on the other hand would be developing lymphoma. WOuld require a vet check. Might start giving him interferon Alpha, or some other immune system boosters. Just my 2c. Gloria in Arkansas At 09:31 AM 8/28/2005, you wrote: Hello everyone, ... The adoptive mom's vet said Emmet's glands are swollen and doesn't give this kitten long. Is this necessarily so? Their positive mother, who is quite feral,is still crated weeks after her spay because there is some conflict as to what to do with her. She was sick at the time we trapped her, and very thin, but now she is eating so well it's hard to look at her like she's sick. Her orginal caretaker doesn't want her returned to her yard, more out of fear that the cat will get sick again, go off somewhere and die. The cat was not a piece of cake to trap in the first place, and is the most secretive of the adults in the yard, so I can see where she's coming from. She doesn't want her living in a cage either...any thoughts on this? Thank you, Janine
Re: Jen----Nutrical
I have a cat who is negative, but he doesn't want to eat either. My homeopathic vet recommends a supplement called Amino B-Plex. It has amino acids, B vitamins to stimulate the appetite, potassium, iron, a few other things that aren't familiar to me. It's a liquid, and they seem to like it. You just squirt it in their mouth. It doesn't have sodium benzoate, which is a preservative that isn't OK for cats (even tho a lot of cat products use it) I don't know how high calorie it is, but I am wondering how many calories are in a tablespoon of nutrical and what that actually translates to for a cat? The website listed on the bottle is www.naturaldvm.com if anyone is interested. Janine --- Elizabeth Paz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've never heard of Nutrical, is it a food supplement? This sounds very good and quite easy to give, at this point I am willing to try anything. Thank you so much, I will be picking up a tube tomorrow. BLOCKQUOTE style='PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #A0C6E5 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px'font style='FONT-SIZE:11px;FONT-FAMILY:tahoma,sans-serif'hr color=#A0C6E5 size=1 From: i[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ibrReply-To: ifelvtalk@felineleukemia.org/ibrTo: ifelvtalk@felineleukemia.org/ibrSubject: iRe: RE: Lisa--Nutrical/ibrDate: iWed, 31 Aug 2005 12:16:34 -0500/ibrgt;This is a good way to administer Nutrical, if it hasn't been suggestedbrgt;already! It's a high-calorie gel that comes in a tube (can also bebrgt;found at Petsmart, etc.)...just put some on your finger and scrapebrgt;against the roof of kitty's mouth...I've also put some on paws so thatbrgt;they're forced to lick it off...but you can't put too much as cat's havebrgt;a tendency to want to shake it off before they lick it off...I've gotbrgt;splatterings of Nutrical all over the kitchen!brgt;brgt;brgt;brgt;quot;But if you tame me, then we shall need each other. To me, you will bebrgt;unique in all the world. To you, I shall be unique in all the world; Youbrgt;become responsible, forever, for what you have tamed...quot; --Antoine debrgt;Saint-Exupérybrgt;brgt;quot;If you talk to the animals they will talk with you and you will knowbrgt;each other. If you do not talk to them you will not know them, and whatbrgt;you do not know you will fear. What one fears one destroys.quot; --Chief Danbrgt;Georgebrgt;brgt;- Original Message -brgt;From: Hideyo Yamamoto lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt;brgt;Date: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 11:13 ambrgt;Subject: RE: Lisabrgt;brgt; gt; Hi, Lisa, are you using syringe? I have one cat, Leo who justbrgt; gt; hated tobrgt; gt; be fed with syringe and everthing could come out from his mouth ---brgt; gt;brgt; gt; My vet also told me a different way of feeding with your finger - youbrgt; gt; take a pallatble food like baby food or cannned food, and put some onbrgt; gt; the tip of your pointing finger . you put the food side up (thebrgt; gt; oppositeside of where your nail is), and put it into his mouth --brgt; gt; rub againstbrgt; gt; the top of his palate -brgt; gt;brgt; gt; How is he doing today?brgt; gt; -Original Message-brgt; gt; From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]brgt; gt; [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Elizabethbrgt; gt; PazSent: Tuesday, August 30, 2005 10:11 PMbrgt; gt; To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgbrgt; gt; Subject: Hideyobrgt; gt;brgt; gt;brgt; gt; Thank you for your kind words, I will keep trying. It just that hebrgt; gt; struggles so much that I worry about getting him all stressed out. Hebrgt; gt; doesbrgt; gt; put up one heck of a struggle. His head is so strong and it movesbrgt; gt; sobrgt; gt; quickly.brgt; gt;brgt; gt; But I will keep trying. He was so ill in 03 that we did not think hebrgt; gt; wouldbrgt; gt; make it but we worked so hard on getting him so healthy and chubby.brgt; gt; butthisbrgt; gt; is so different with the food. I can easily give him his pills, butbrgt; gt; thisbrgt; gt; food stuff, what can I say, this is just tearing my heart up.brgt; gt;brgt; gt; Thank You for support.brgt; gt; Lisabrgt; gt;brgt; gt;brgt; gt;brgt; gt;brgt; gt; lt;BLOCKQUOTE style='PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT:brgt; gt; #A0C6E5brgt; gt; 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px'gt;lt;fontbrgt; gt; style='FONT-SIZE:11px;FONT-FAMILY:tahoma,sans-serif'gt;lt;hrbrgt; gt; color=#A0C6E5brgt; gt; size=1gt;brgt; gt; From: lt;igt;amp;quot;Hideyo Yamamotoamp;quot;brgt; gt; lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]amp;gt;lt;/igt;lt;brgt;Reply-To:brgt; gt; lt;igt;felvtalk@felineleukemia.orglt;/igt;lt;brgt;To:brgt; gt; lt;igt;lt;felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgamp;gt;lt;/igt;lt;brgt;Subject: lt;igt;RE: Won'tbrgt; gt; EatPlease Helplt;/igt;lt;brgt;Date: lt;igt;Tue, 30 Aug 2005 17:20:06brgt; gt; -0600lt;/igt;lt;brgt;amp;gt;Lisa, I can
Re: laser toy
Hi Kerry, Most of my cats love the laser. No matter how quietly I try to take it out of it's hiding spot, some of them will actually wake up immediately and come running. I find it amazing that they know the difference between the noise the chain on the laser makes and dozens of others similar noises. I used to worry about it teasing them also, until one cat, whenever I took my finger off the switch, came over and smacked my arm, looking straight into my eyes, until I turned it back on - then she was back to pretending it was really something to chase. And another will just stop and look over his shoulder at me as if to say Aw, come one, turn it back on! (and this one I don't consider to be the brightest of the bunch g) So, I decided then they must know, they're just such great pretenders. Janine --- MacKenzie, Kerry N. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Glad someone mentioned the laser toy--I do use it occasionally because it's the one thing that never fails to get my 2 quarantined cats moving. But the reason I only use it occasionally is that I worry about the frustration element-they think there's something to catch but they can never succeed. Ditto those cat videos showing birds etc, with all the sound effects. I used to play them, but worried about the cats becoming depressed. I'd love to hear other opinions. Is there any reliable info out there on how chasing intangible objects affects cats? If I thought they were really ok, I'd use them more often. Kerry -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Barb Moermond Sent: Monday, September 05, 2005 2:51 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: Bandy and supplements I would be cautious in using laser pointers as toys - I know they love it and I bring mine out a couple times a year, but it can make some kitties go a little nuts. One of the clinic cats where I take my boys lost it after having played with the laser toy and kept looking for the red dot to the point she was attacking other kitties. No more lasers and she was on meds for a while but is OK now. Just something to keep in mind! --- maimaipg [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My alternative vet recommends transfer factor and MacroForce for boosting the immune system. The active ingredient in Macro Force is available in other brands. This just happens to be the easiest to get in my area of the country. She also uses laser (as has me use a regular laser pointer) on various points on the cat's body. It acts sort of like acupuncture. You would have to get someone to show you the points or try to figure it out from the internet. Keep the light out of the eyes. But enjoy running the light in circles around the cat. Mine love to chase the little red dot they can't catch. For $20 it is a wonderful toy even if you can't figure the alternative med stuff out. It stimulates their interest and gives them exercise that has to help their morale. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, September 05, 2005 10:11 AM Subject: Re: Bandy and supplements I do not think that any supplements will help with the anemia directly unless it is iron anemia, which is very rare in cats and probably is not the case with him. I would put him on 500 mg per day of Lysine, split into two doses, and a multi-vitamin supplement (like Pet Tinic, which does have iron) and maybe switch on and off between echinacea and astragalus every week. I would mix them into baby food twice per day in small doses and let him eat them. People also rave about Transfer Factor, which I have not tried yet, so maybe that as well. I would start with one at a time so if he does not want to eat the baby food you will know which supplement he does not like. Michelle Barb+Smoky the House Puma+El Bandito Malito My cat the clown: paying no mind to whom he should impress. Merely living his life, doing what pleases him, and making me smile. - Anonymous __ Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. http://store.yahoo.com/redcross-donate3/ hr IRS CIRCULAR 230 NOTICE. Any advice expressed above as to tax matters was neither written nor intended by the sender or Mayer, Brown, Rowe Maw LLP to be used and cannot be used by any taxpayer for the purpose of avoiding tax penalties that may be imposed under U.S. tax law. If any person uses or refers to any such tax advice in promoting, marketing or recommending a partnership or other entity, investment plan or arrangement to any taxpayer, then (i) the advice was written to support the promotion or marketing (by a person other than Mayer, Brown, Rowe Maw LLP) of that transaction or matter, and (ii) such taxpayer should
Re: Question about Euthanasia and my Grace
Hi all, I'm going through this same thing and am so grateful for all the experience and calmness on this subject. And Nina, I don't feel so crazy since reading how you are feeling the same way. My cat MacKenzie is not positive, but he is dying. His breathing is mostly quieter now, but very shallow. He's not hiding at all but has picked a spot on our bedroom floor under a window. He's stopped eating, and stopped drinking too I think.He can't really walk more than one or two steps. My husband and I had this strong feeling that at least for now he wants to be here but it's a little tough to sit with. MacKenzie has been a homeopathic patient for the 3 yrs he's been with us, so that's how were handling it for now too. Janine Nina [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My Beloved Group, First of all, I'm sorry I haven't been able to participate fully in the group this last couple of weeks. I love you all, but for the last couple of days, I haven't even been able bring myself to read the posts. I'm physically and emotionally exhausted by Grace and my last efforts to bring her back to health. Yesterday, I finally resigned myself to thinking of our time together as 'death bed vigil'. Those of you that know me, know that I pray all your babies are safe and healthy, and those that are losing, or have lost the battle; my love is with you. I don't know what I would have done without the love and support of this group. You have been a Godsend to me and my sweet fur angels. Yesterday morning Gracie told me she does not want to stay. Among other signs, I was syringe feeding her and she refused to swallow. I'm trying my best to make peace with her decision. I know you understand. She hasn't eaten on her own for a long time now and she's skin and bones. She spent a nice peaceful day, and I did my best to just be with her. During the afternoon she made it clear that she didn't want to be sung to, or touched. It's so hard on me to watch her pull away. At one point, she seemed a bit agitated so I ground up a tiny bit of Valium and gave it to her in water. She was so relaxed she even did a stretch-semi roll out on the patio in the sun. She did something that startled me, and got my hopes up again. (I just can't stop believing in miracles). I was giving the dogs treats and she was laying on the couch. Well, we have this thing Grace and I. Whenever the dogs get treats she'd come bounding over the barrier and expect one too. When she saw me giving the dogs treats this afternoon, she jumped off the couch. I started to cry, because I thought, there's no way she's going to take a treat. I put one in front of her anyway and you could have knocked me over with a sigh. It took her a minute to decide to eat it, but she not only ate that one, but 3 more. Then she ate 3 or 4 pieces of kibble! My hopes were short lived though. I've been up with her most of the night. She still doesn't want my attention. She doesn't even want me to look at her, it's breaking my heart to say goodbye, and I guess it may be making it harder for her to go, although that is not my intention. It's not like I don't want her to leave her body, I do. I want her suffering to be over. Yesterday, when I knew it was time, I called my Internist's office to see if Dr. Ortega would be willing to help her cross. Grace has always liked Dr. Ortega, and I thought she would be calmest with her. Well, my Internist isn't going to be in the office until Friday. It doesn't seem possible that Grace will still be here by then. My stance has always been, that when I know it's the end, when I know that the chance of a recovery after treatment isn't possible, then it's time to help them cross. Even though Grace is peaceful, (she just lays on her side and breathes shallow, but relaxed breaths), I have a hard time letting nature take it's course. It's arrogant of me, but I can't stand seeing her like this. I'm also so worried about her being in pain, when I look in her eyes, she doesn't seem in pain, but she doesn't seem like herself either. I wouldn't mind vacant, but it's almost like she's... not quite angry, more like annoyed to still be here. Just to let you know... Over the past week or so, I think I may have mentioned it, we've been following an extensive homeopathic regime with the help of a practitioner named Darla Palmer. While it didn't save Grace, it did bring her back into her body, and for brief glorious moments, back to me. It was such a joy to see the Grace I know and love shining out of her eyes again. Anyway, here's my question: Can anyone tell me how difficult it is to put an animal to sleep in an emaciated condition? Of course, I don't want to make things harder on her, I want to ease her suffering. What if they can't find a vein, because
Re: OT: Help ! ringworm in kittens
Yes, please don't use Tea Tree Oil on or around cats. And if it's a small amount in a product (like Halo makes an earwash that has T.T. listed in it) I won't use it either because I wonder what effect it has on their liver. Janine --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: DO NOT USE TEA TREE OIL ON CATS
Re: cat question
Hi Janet, That simple act of rescue can certainly become complicated. I joined this list months ago after trapping a litter of feral positive kittens. I was looking for sound advice, which I got, and I should really sign off the list now since I can't keep up with the volume of emails but I hang on because this is the most sensitive, caring, THINKING list of people who love cats, so you couldn't have landed in a better place. That said, having seen too many hard-luck moms actually look grateful to have someone take over the care of yet another litter, I spay pregnant females in precarious positions for the mother's sake and the fact that there are already so many healthy, homeless kittens (and cats) out there already. Not a perfect answer, but one that makes sense to me, for now. Janine --- wendy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Janet, I have to agree with everything that Nina said. Having the cat spayed would probably be the humane thing to do. My cat Cricket was born with Feline Leukemia; his mother had it. I would like to urge you to consider keeping this cat if you are at all attached to it, and caring for it yourself. FELV+ positive is not necessarily a death sentence; many cats throw off the virus after they've been exposed, expecially those with good health care and a lot of love. FELV+ cats are hard to place, and many times, are euthanised because a lot of vets recommend it. But we do not agree with this policy. These kitties deserve a happy life being loved just as much as a cat that isn't FELV+. Cricket lived 4 and a half years, and probably would have lived longer had he not been stressed out by a house full of Hurricane Rita evacuees for a week, when the virus kicked in and he became anemic. Because he was born FELV+, his life expectancy was a lot less than he actually lived. Many kittens die by 6 months because their immune systems are so weak, and even more by two years old. No one can make this decision for you, but learn a little more before you make the decision and I wish you luck. Let us know what you decide. I'll keep you in my prayers. :) Wendy --- Nina [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Janet, As Terri and Tonya have already mentioned, many of us mix adult negs that have been vaccinated with pos. It's a judgement call and of course no matter what our success rate in doing this is, there's no safer protection for your elderly cat than to not mix them together. That's what most vets will tell you. Being that your current kitty is older, I might not mix them together either. That said, if I were in this situation, I'd figure God sent her to me for a reason and I'd personally dive in with both feet and do whatever I could to save her and her kittens. I am all too familiar with the heartache involved with pos kittens. My experience with felv came when my husband and I found a box of kittens that were just 2.5 weeks old. Because they were so young, I assume the mother succumbed to felv from the stress of having them and the people who abandoned them didn't know how to care for them. Why else would they take them from their mother at that age? We lost 2 of our babies when they were about 6 mos old and two more before their 2nd birthday. The other two are doing fine and are reaching 2.5 yrs. Their lives were filled with love and concern and I'm not a bit sorry that I made the commitment to try and save them. Janet, you have some tough decisions ahead of you. You don't know me, so you might think I'm a monster for even bringing this up, but given what you've said in your post... It's going to be hard enough to place the mother, if she's healthy. I can't say what I would do in your place. I'm not you and I have no idea what you have to contend with. If someone steps up very quickly to adopt her, knowing she's pregnant, well that's a different story altogether. If you just found out she's pregnant, I'm supposing she's not too far along. Under the circumstances you describe, if you have her spayed, the kittens would be aborted at the same time and praying that she remains asymptomatic after the stress of the operation, you might have a chance of placing her. I couldn't bear to think about what might be in store for those babies if they lose their mother, and don't have a human willing to step in and care for them. My 2 cents on the harshness of reality. Now, what I'm praying for is that you've fallen in love with this little stray and you'll want to adopt her yourself. If so, there are many wonderful, knowledgeable people on this list who will support you no matter where that decision takes you. I'm also praying that someone, if not you, will hear this little girl's story, take her in and give her the kind of life every
Re: advice needed re half-adopted cat
Kerry, I agree with Gloria - would be surprised if the cat was chipped, at least by the half-adopters. Can you lure the cat away from the building and out of site of the cameras (for instance - KFC thigh meat, esp warmed so the smell carries might make her walk right into a carrier set behind your car)Janine[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey Kerry-Chances are the kitty has *not* been microchipped by an owner who won't even let her inside when needed - and even if so I doubt if the vet would check it unless you asked him/her to. And if you take her to your vet as your cat, well...I also doubt if talking to the owner again would be useful - might even be counter productive.Sure she can help this kitty -Good luck -GloriaAt 12:37 PM 12/20/2005, you wrote:Hi guysThe same good friend who told me about the kitty with litterbox problems that was under threat of pts (apparently happily resolved, for now at any rate) updated me on another situation.Background:Misha is a stray that was sort of taken in by the people who work in a studio at the same business complex where my friend works. I say sort of because although two of the workers took her to the vet after she was badly attacked, and although they feed her, they don't take her home at the weekend: ie no one is actually making Misha their responsibility. In the summer and fall Misha would be found outside after they had all locked up and gone home for the weekend. When my friend, distressed by Misha's situation, offered to try to find Misha a home, the studio owner (who my friend says seems to be a reasonable, decent guy) rejected the proposal, saying that they had "adopted" her. Recently -- and it is really cold now--- my friend found Misha miaowing in vain at the studio door to be let in. My friend knocked on the door, and one of the other workers (not the owner) opened it. When she explained the cat needed to come in, the response to her was "Haven't you got anything better to do?"Q--where do we go from here?If my friend just takes Misha, there's a chance a surveillance camera will record the action as it's a business location. Also, even if she did that, when she takes her to the vet, what happens if she's been microchipped by those people? Is the vet legally/ethically prevented from removing the chip and replacing it? Obligated to contact the people? My friend would not be keeping Misha as she's allergic to cats; she'd want my help in placing her in the shelter where I have a good contact. Not ideal but she would at least be cared for there. However, I'd need to know how to resolve the chip situation first.My friend's proposal was to talk to the owner again and try to make him understand that someone needs to take proper responsibility for the cat. My feeling was that if she fails, then she will be the first person he suspects if and when she kidnaps Misha. And the scene could turn ugly.Even if I were to find and "rescue" the cat when I "happen to be passing by" at the weekend the microchip Q still arises. (We don't know if she's microchipped -- is there a way for a layperson to scan her without vet involvement?)All input/info welcome on how Misha gets the care she deserves---I've no experience in this field---yet. But I know some of you heroes do.Kerry
Re: Fostering Fiv Cat
Ah, only a cat would have to put up with a choice between amputation and being homeless. www.catsinternational.org has excellent information on how to train a cat. They've toned down their article on declawing for some reason, but still make some good points in it. Feline Future also has a good article on declawing, without sounding hysterical. Janine --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 1/2/06 1:14:29 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I know a lot of cats get tossed out on the street because people don't like the scratching But Sherry, why don't you try to educate this vet about all the declawed cats that end up dumped in kill shelters for litter box problems??? Or those cats that are just brought into vets to be routinely euthanized for inappropriate urination?? My 2 Maine Coon boys each were brought in, on 2 separate occasions, 2 different owners, within one month of each other to be euthanized Peeing outside of box. Year+ later, they are both doing fine Too damn big to be declawed...Each over 25 lbs.!! Whatever were these people thinking?? Anyway, since you're volunteering there, maybe you can talk to this vet about how inhumane declawing is. You know, it is illegal in Europe, and even California is talking about outlawing it. It should be illegal. It's just cruelty, plain simple. And, Sherry, I know you are against it, I'm just having one of my rants Patti
Re: Patches and Bupenephrine (sp?)
Excuse me for coming into this in the middle, so I hope I'm not repreating anything but if interstitial cystitis is the one that recurrs, sometimes has blood in the urine, no bacteria and cyrstals or stone, I use slippery elm. Natures Way is one compnay that makes it and it comes in capsules. Here's what I do - About 1/4 cup hot water, mix in about 1/3 capsule slippery elm. Add about 1 Tablespoon of the SE/water mixture to canned food am and pm for a couple of days,a then I back off to once a day for a couple more days. Slippery Elm is a classic treatment for soothing inflammed mucous membranes. It breaks that cycle of inflammation, irritation, distress which leads to inflammation, irritation, distress. I have a can of Waltham's SO that I never used. One of my cats was returned for peeing outside the box and he then blocked, so he DID have crystals, which is obviously very serious, and slippery elm may have helped, but not completely cured.His vet wanted me to put him on the SO, since it's neutral, but I didn't like the ingredients. I put the cat (who'd been adopted for a year and on Science Diet dry food) on a raw diet. It's been 2 years, and he's fine. The canned SO ingredients, besides the mystery by-products, has water as its first ingredient. That's good as cats have evolved to get most of their moisture from their prey, in other words, in their food. No grain in the ingredients either - that's interesting to me because cats are obligate carnivores and do not have any use for, or any way to assimilate, grains - I'm thinking that this company knows that the use of grains in cat food throws their PH off, but hey, grain is cheap, so it's OK in everything else. Canned SO is preserved with BHA/BHT which is toxic to cats and all other living things. And the last ingredient, dl-METHIONINE, is an amino acid that is naturally ocurring in raw meat, which is nature's neutral cat food. But I've had 5 or 6 cats with that cystitis that comes from anxiety, and that's what I use the slippery elm for. Winn Feline Foundation talks about that kind of cystitis. And catnutrition.org explains the dry food/grain thing very well, has a great recipe for raw food, lists decent canned food and very helpful links and references. My cats were on a raw diet for 7 or 8 yrs, but I have too many now and don't have the energy to do it anymore. They're on Wellness canned (not dry!) now and my cat who blocked is still fine. Not that I think Wellness is perfect, but better than a lot. I get hot about this subject, but I feel so sorry for some of these cats who go through all that stuff because of IMO big business and marketing. Janine --- Barb Moermond [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've had Smoky on the s/o food that normalizes urine pH since his first episode a year ago. The 2nd bout was the week of Thanksgiving, the 3rd, with struvite and bacteria, was Dec 8th and the 4th was on the 22nd while he was still on treatment for the crystals and bacteria from the previous bout. With this last one, the crystals were gone and there was no bacteria at all, yet all the same damn symptoms. I feel so bad for him during these flare-ups because he's utterly miserable. The s/d food cleared up the crystals very quickly and we're back to the s/o food. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: the raw diet is supposed to help with cystitis and struvite crystals. I am about to try it with Lucy for chronic loose stools, and am thinking of trying it with Patches after her surgery (knock on wood) for her urinary tract problems. Michelle In a message dated 1/7/2006 3:45:55 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Italways amazes me that more vets don't provide good pain control forcats. The only narcotic that I know of close to that name is buprenex, but it's delivered orally and is good for 8 ish hours. Since the week ofThanksgiving, Smoky has had 3 flare-ups of cystitis, only one of which showedstruvite and bacteria, the other two, interstitial. hmph. Anyway,one of the standard things we do for him is to give him a fentanyl patch tohelp with the pain as well as keeping him dosed with the anti-spasmoticacepromazine. The advantage of the patch is that it provides 24/7 pain control and does not wear off, which the oral meds do. Barb+Smoky the House Puma+El Bandito Malito My cat the clown: paying no mind to whom he should impress. Merely living his life, doing what pleases him, and making me smile. - Anonymous __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: Patches and Bupenephrine (sp?)
MIchelle, I honestly don't know if the SE effects the PH, but I'm pretty sure grain does. When Benjamin blocked, I got really scared about what to feed him. I really didn't like the vet-recommended food but I needed someone I respected to tell me it was OK to take the jump and feed him raw, so I sent Michelle at www.blakkatz.com an email. She's so smart about why to feed a raw diet, and she replied, and I took the jump. And sure enough, all of it makes perfect (common) sense. Benjamin is a tough cat to handle, (biker in a previous life) and horrible at the vet. They sedated him, put in the catheter, IV's, E - collar and next morning, he had removed EVERYTHING, and was really, really mad - they were relieved when I took him home - bad candidate to make a mistake on! But, it's the idiopathic cystitis I'm more confident using SE on, not the high Ph kind. The high Ph and crystals is what I'd feed the raw diet for tho. And once they start eating it, it's a big hit. We used to make a huge bowl of it, plop it out to all the dishes, it was gone in 5 minutes. The big bonus when you have a lot of cats to feed, is the litter boxes are so much easier to clean, so much less smell!!! and much less waste cuz they are actually using what they are eating. And they don't drink as much water either, because they don't need to, which, as desert animals, is how they are supposed to be. I used to use Feline Future and I think it's fine. I eventually followed the whole chicken leg diet, bone and all through the grinder from catnutrition.org. I'd also retest his urine at home with those little pellets in a plastic jar. I understand nerves can make the Ph higher too and vets = nerves. I thought I heard something about Ph strips once but don't remember where. I would think at-home Ph watch would be a good idea, for peace of mind if nothing else. I don't know why the SE wouldn't soothe irritated membranes even if it was high Ph and crystals and I think if I go through that again, I would try it. It just doesn't make any sense that all these cats would have so many UTI, diabetes, middle age kidney failure, thyroid, -and-everything-else- problems and they've been on the planet for thousands years. Why would nature make an animal like that? I think it's how we feed them. And maybe over vaccinating too? As far as Evo, the dry food without grain, well, it's still dry and I still don't like it. If you pour a little water over Evo, won't the Evo suck the water up? So what happens in a cat's (desert-evolved) body? Sorry so long, just bugs me! Janine --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Janine, one question: I use slippery elm often for stomach and intestinal upsets, but have never used it for urinary tract upsets. It doesn't make the ph of the urine more basic? Patches has really high ph-- 8.5, much too basic. Thanks, Michelle
Re: Patches and Bupenephrine (sp?)
I don't have any FeLV cats here now, but I did have a FeLv kitten for 6 months here, and I started him on raw immediately. He came in pretty sick too. He eventually went into a foster home with a positive room, and he was so much happier with company, but when here, he ate that raw like there was no tomorrow, and he had a very excellent coat. Never had a problem with t he raw with him at all. I also had an FIV cat who was symptomatic when I trapped him - 8 yrs old, horrible gingivitis/stomatitis - starving but screamed when he ate. I fed him raw, sometimes off my fingers, and treated him with homeopathy before he finally succumbed to cancer 2 yrs later. But those 2 yrs were so perfect, and for the most part, he was very comfortable and very active. Before all that, I had an old girl I fostered. Little thing, bad temperment, in CRF. I took away her dry food, and fed her a premium, HIGH PROTEIN canned food and she died years later from cancer, not CRF. I didn't think she could take raw food at the time, but I would not hesitate to feed raw to a cat like her now. When I fed raw, I was careful. I bought the freshest meat I could find and usually free-range, followed a diet whether Feline Future, blakkatz, or catnutrition. My cats had maybe 1/2 hr to eat it, then all bowls were picked up, which wasn't a problem because they all ate it immediately. No dry food in-between, just breakfast and dinner. And hugs between meals. No one was fat, everyone had a beautiful coat and good breath. Also have one cat with what I think is IBD, but she never once vomited on raw. No kitten diarreah either from all those just-trapped kittens, and those kittens attacking the raw was something to be seen! Other than that, I'm a long time vegetarian! But cats are not. Janine --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks for all the info. If that is true about stress making the ph higher, then that could be an explanation with Patches. Her teeth are hurting her terribly (so much she is on narcotic shots twice a day until her dental surgery on Wednesday). I thought it was just a bad coincidence that she developed the urinary tract problem at the same time as her teeth getting really painful, but maybe the pain from her teeth stressed her so much it caused her urine ph to go up. Anyway, we are off on our raw adventure. I hope we have good luck with it. I was nervous about feeding raw because they are FeLV+ and some people who feed raw say not to feed it to cats who are immune-compromised. But a holistic vet answered someone else's question about this on the Best Friends website and said it is ok and probably immune enhancing, so I am trying it. Is Benjamin FeLV+? If not, do you feed raw to your FeLV+ cat/s? Michelle In a message dated 1/8/2006 9:08:28 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I understand nerves can make the Ph higher too and vets = nerves.I
Re: Sweet Angel Sam/Add to CLS
I can't imagine what this is like for you either. Peace to you and LIghtening Bug. I hope all the love we have for these cats gets wrapped around them and makes that journey easier. . --- catatonya [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Del, I found your message about Sam. Again, I'm so sorry. Yes, it is hard to lose them so close together. I've never lost 2 so close together so can only imagine your pain. :( tonya Del H. Daniels [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My sweet boy passed away early this morning while I talked to him and held his hand. His last 24+ hours was bad, I didn't expect him to last as long as he did. His first clot was mid-November with back end paralysis but he regained some limb function. He threw another saddle clot Sunday night but rallied, then Wednesday night threw another and it was downhill from there. He was not going to survive when he continued to throw these clots frequently while on the meds and his heart was inconsistent. Ten minutes before he died Lightning Bug, his sister, lay in front of his crate for five minutes his head was right next to hers, like they were sharing unspoken thoughts before he moved on. He and Effie used to look at each other in admiration through the screen door, now they are finally playing together. It's hard losing two in a week. Del
Re: Bad news about Starman - OT (long)
I always thought those big FIV cats are just the sweetest - just never heard anyone come out and say that! Lucky person who gets found by one of those cats - my big, scary looking guy was the best cat I've ever lived with. My husband went from calling him a monster - this was fear I think for the other cats, and his bloody mouth - to crying like a baby when the cat passed. My vet at that time had 4 FIV's and 4 negs for years living together and she tested them every year, since she could do that on her own, and nothing ever changed. Congratulations and give him a big head butt for me - I really miss that! Janine --- catatonya [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nina, As soon as you said 'big intact male' I KNEW he was going to be fiv positive. Since you asked for opinions I'm going to give you mine. I hope you don't take offense. We had a stray cat living around our lake house that we visit on weekends only. He looked horrible. His ears were all bloody and bent down. He was grungy. He would walk around and cry when we were there, but would never let us catch him. His eyes were crusty and he drooled constantly. He was in really, really bad shape. The first weekend I saw him I found out he had been hanging around and people were trying to run him off. You can imagine how well that went over with me. So I spent all weekend trying to catch him, but didn't have a carrier, trap, anything with me. At that time I was not into rescue. I had 3 cats at home. (My first 3 I'd ever had.) He was HUGE, and I was afraid of him. Well I couldn't catch him and everyone was saying someone should shoot him and put him out of his misery. I told my grandfather if he did such a thing I would NEVER speak to him again, and he believed me. We had a huge argument about how I had too many cats. (3- lol) I had to work during the week, but the next week I went back with a carrier, tuna, and sardines. I didn't even know there was such a thing as a 'cat trap'! After hours and hours I tricked him into the carrier sometime Friday night. He went beserk, foaming at the mouth, his ears all bloody, sneezing, etc The next morning I found a local vet and took the cat in squawling to have him put to sleep. Well, the vet said the cat was fine and there was no reason to put him to sleep! He had scratched his ears raw due to earmites. He had buckshot in his ears that the doctor removed. grrr! He had an upper resp. infection and some bad teeth. I didn't know what to do. I couldn't take this sick cat that I was scared to death of home! The vet said Why don't you just take him home and let him be an outdoor cat? So I thought that was a better choice than pts so I said yes. He kept him until the next weekend for me and neutered him etc During that week I put up a fence for a few thousand dollars so dogs wouldn't bother my 'new outdoor cat'. I brought him home the next week. The vet said he was fine, but I was still afraid of him. I decided to keep him in a cage until his antibiotics were finished. His ears were so gross I didn't even want to touch him. Everyone who saw him had a fit asking why I brought this horrible looking bloody cat home. After a few more days I decided to just let him out on my screened porch because I was afraid if I put him outside right away he would run away. This cat would come up to me and try to head butt me with his bloody head. He would follow me around like a dog. He weighed nearly 20 pounds, looked like a mongrel, and I was STILL afraid of him. I kept waiting for him to cry to go outside or bolt toward the door when I opened it, but that never happened. Over the days of course I petted him some, but was still afraid. Finally I let him in the house with everyone else. The first night he snuggled right up with me on the bed. He was the biggest loverboy I've ever known. Soon his ears healed, but they were always scarred. He looked like a scottish fold with lots of scars. I had named him Brutus because he was such a big Brute. Anyone who's been on the list for years like me has heard me talk about my Brutus. He was THE most loving cat I've ever had. EVERYONE fell in love with him. Every time I had company they wanted to take him home. He was almost like a person. When I would talk about who would take my cats if something happened to me everyone always said they'd take Brutus! He was s cool. He is the one that I wrote about that would eat so much he would throw up most of the time. I guess he had been starved for so long. I had to feed him small amounts at a time or NEVER let the dishes go empty or he would overeat and get sick. It's too late to make such a long story short, but after about 7 years I noticed he was losing weight. By that time I had TONS of cats (20 or more at a time) that
Re: OT: Best canned food (poll for everyone)
Here is a good list http://www.catinfo.org/commercialcannedfoods.htm Most importantly, the catinfo.org website explains WHY it's a good list. Dr. Pierson did such a good job putting all of this together and when I asked her for permission to post to our website she said Yes, whatever you can do that helps cats - she really cares. Please read about why not dry food, and why not grain - it makes so much sense! Site also has a recipe for raw, how to read labels (like don't let the protein content fool you!), how to switch dry food junkies over to canned or raw - really well done. I fed raw for years, but can't do it right now because I have more cats than I care to count but for now I'm feeding Wellness because I can get it here. It's not a perfect answer but way better than most other commercial foods. Site also has listed references to look up or link to. Janine --- wendy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks for the info. Michelle. Here is a link to the website I was looking at with Felidae on it: http://www.thecatconnection.com/page/TCC/CTGY/FOD-WET --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Of those, I have only tried Felidae (chicken and rice flavor), Wellness (all kinds), and Innova. The cats would only eat Innova every once in a while, so even though I liked the ingredients best they do not get it very often (Ginger is the only one on normal food right now anyway, and she is currently obsessed with ProPlan Chicken and Rice and Salmon and Rice and will not eat anything else!). They have been obsessed, on and off, with the Felidae chicken and rice and the Wellness chicken and herring. They seem to do fine on them, except that when Patches was eating the Wellness chicken and herring too much she got struvite crystals, but Ginger did not. I would get Felidae if I could find it-- I got in MA all the time, but in NJ no one seems to carry it. Michelle __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: FeLV + test results
But is IS true with the FIV vaccine. Janine --- Terri Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with Chris. That's not so with the FeLV vaccine. My Siggie was always vaccinated and has always tested negative. =^..^= Terri, Siggie the Tomato Vampire, Guinevere, Sammi, Travis, Dori and 6 furangels: RuthieGirl, Samantha, Arielle, Gareth, Alec Salome' =^..^= Furkid Photos! http://mysite.verizon.net/vze7sgqa/http://mysite.verizon.net/vze7sgqa/ My Personal Page: http://www.geocities.com/ruthiegirl1/terrispage.html?1083970447350http://www.geocities.com/ruthiegirl1/terrispage.html?1083970447350 - Original Message - From: Chrismailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgmailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 4:42 PM Subject: RE: FeLV + test results I think that this is only for FIV vaccine, not FELV... but I may be wrong on that Chris [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Karolyn Lount Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2006 6:29 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]; felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgmailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]; lynne Subject: FeLV + test results I learned something the other day I did not know. If a cat is vaccinated against getting FeLV all its life it will test positive. So it could very well be that a rescue cat that tests positive is not. This is what my new vet told me. I feel this all the more reason not to put down those that test positive.
Re: Need help and prayers for my sister's lost cat
Try www.catsinthebag.org --- Nina [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Everyone, My sister's (Connie), inside-only tuxedo cat went missing sometime last night. His name is Tux and he's short haired, and about 2yrs, with the sweetest little kitten face. They think he may have snuck out when a visitor left the screen door ajar, (the visitor left around 9pm). They didn't miss him until this morning because my nephew thought he was sleeping with my sister and my sister thought he was with my nephew. They are sick with worry. Not only has he never been outside before, but he's very skittish and they live in coyote territory. Being out at night is a death sentence for any small pets in their neighborhood. To make matters worse, he has short little legs and he can't even jump on a counter, let alone scale a wall. I've set a trap in her front yard and they've confined their other cat to the bedroom so they can leave the front door open. She's already put up fliers and tomorrow we'll be canvassing the neighborhood door to door with his picture and info. Please, please, please take a moment to send out positive thoughts to help him find his way home safely. This is doubly hard on Connie because her 17 year old dog just crossed about a month ago. I called several professional ACs today, but no one has called me back yet. If anyone on the AC group can help contact him we'd be so appreciative. I can only imagine how scared he is and how disoriented. I've posted a couple of pictures under Come home Tux, (I hope I did it right!). Thank you so much, Nina
Re: OT: New journey-laying tile!!!
No experience here but much interest in the responses! My wood floors and carpeted upstairs are trashed! I can't see my husband and I laying tile ourselves but maybe some people from the organization will help us. Janine -- wendy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey guys, My husband and I have decided to go with the tile in replacing our carpet in the living room, hallway and one bedroom, plus we figure we might as well replace the kitchen and master bath linoleum while we're at it as it needs replacing too. We're going to move on this in the next two weeks, since I'm having foot surgery on the 25th of April and would like it completed by then. There is some beautiful tile out there. What stinks is that the labor costs twice as much as the tile. So if you have a 10x10 room, and the tile is 2$ per square foot (on average), it's going to cost you $200 for just the tile. But the labor is another $3.25 (HD) or $3.50 (Lowe's) per square foot, so what we could do for $200 will end up costing us $525-550. That's a lot! And when you're talking about 800 square feet, it gets expensive. Plus, sealing the tile is extra (we will for sure do that ourselves), and tearing up the carpet is extra (we'll do that too), and floor prep is extra (probably do that too!!!). LOL. So we might possibly lay the tile ourselves with help from a few friends who have already done it. My husband is scared to do it-he doesn't want to mess our house up. I am more the do-it-yourself type, so I'm all for it. Anyone out there ever lay tile? Any thoughts or advice? :) Wendy __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
l-lysine for kittens
Anyone know the dose of lysine to give to kittens? They are 4 months, a little thin. Thanks, Janine
Re: FIV resources
I think FIV cats seem to be the sweetest too - trapped one the other day and the poor boy peed in the trap, he was so frightened. That's the first time that's ever happened to me. There are a whole bunch of rescue people a little north of where I am who instead of saying the cat tested FIV+, say the cat has AIDS. It bugs me! Maybe coincidently, maybe not, the vets they use tend to think they should be put down too. Kills me! Janine --- Susan Hoffman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: No big deal -- those were the exact words of one of my vets when Scooter tested FIV+ And my current vet (part of an AAHA certified veterinary hospital) is also similarly enlightened, including on the question of FIV+ and FIV- cats mixing. I know how lucky I am. I know this is not the standard across the US [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lucky you, with a vet like that! No, I remember MC (tenhousecats) saying that at their large rescue up in Michigan, the FIV's were sweet and laid back - and all mine six are (and healthy too, no problelms). Gloria At 08:56 AM 6/2/2006, you wrote: We've got an FIV guy here...the sweetest, most laid back little dude I've ever met! I didn't know much about FIV other than it was pretty hard to spread it and that cats can live relatively normal lives with the virus. But what really set me straight was the attitude of my vet who basically said, No big deal, I've got one at my house who mingles with all of my other cats! As much as I knew in my heart it was no big deal, it really gave me a peace of mind hearing it from an expert, so-to-speak! :) Education is probably the key, and having more vets out there to dispel the myths would certainly come in handy (and this goes for FeLV, too)! As an aside, is it true that FIV cats seem to be some of the coolest cats around, or is it just me? ;) But if you tame me, then we shall need each other. To me, you will be unique in all the world. To you, I shall be unique in all the world; You become responsible, forever, for what you have tamed... --Antoine de Saint-Exupéry If you talk to the animals they will talk with you and you will know each other. If you do not talk to them you will not know them, and what you do not know you will fear. What one fears one destroys. --Chief Dan George The flame that burns twice as bright burns half as long... --Blade Runner - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, June 2, 2006 8:37 am Subject: Re: FIV resources To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org It's discouraging. I have never placed an FIV+ cat. I have 5 or 6, and they're wonderful. Something to work on, I guess. Gloria At 01:29 AM 6/2/2006, you wrote: I have a couple of FIV+ cats of my own and a beautiful little Siamese mix foster who is FIV+ They take longer to place. We have to try harder. We have to work at educating people. But we have to get the message out that FIV cats can live long happy lives and are not furry little lepers. Consider how language reflects mindset and affects actions. Does it really take longer to place an FIV cat than a senior or a special needs cat? Or an all black cat? Some take longer than others. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have one up for adoption too... they are hard to place. Phaewryn (was Jenn, changed name) http://ucat.us http://ucat.us/domesticcatlinks.html Adopt a cat from Little Cheetah (UCAT) Cat Rescue: http://ucat.us/adopt.html PLEASE DONATE TO THE TANGLE FUND: Tangle is a cat in Greece that was severely injured when someone wrapped wire around his neck to strangle him, Little Cheetah Cat Rescue is raising funds to bring Tangle to Vermont to find him a good home! http://ucat.us/tangle-fund.html DONATE: We could really use a power saw (for construction), a digital camera (for pictures), and more towels! No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.1/354 - Release Date: 6/1/2006
2 littermates - one pos/one neg
Hi all, Two brothers, 7 weeks today tested one positive, one negative for leukemia. The mom is feral, and has not been tested yet, but her sister tested positive. The mom had been trapped by someone trying to do the right thing, but the kittens were born beforre she could get her to the vet. All have been living together crated in this person's home. As an organization, we had a pair of littermates testing the same as these 2, and we let them stay together. The positive cat died at around 3 yrs, the negative cat is still negative (and has recently been adopted!) so it's not entirely new to me but what's the best thing to do? Try to adopt them out as a pair? Separate them now? Or it doesn't matter at this point, even if the negative kitten is so young? The test was Elysa and we are re-running both. Thanks! Janine
Re: 2 littermates - one pos/one neg
Thank you all! I would prefer they stay together also and will try to talk the woman who trapped the mom into that. Our vet thinks we should separate the kittens from the mom now, but I am wondering if the negative kitten is immune anyway. How much more prolonged contact can you get than birth and motherhood in a crate??? BTW, the mom had 5 kittens - one stillborn, 2 died within a week. I suppose that could be leukemia but could have been the tremendous amount of stress that mom must have been under. --- Nina [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Janine, I agree with Belinda and Rachel. I would keep them together, for both their sakes. Poor little lambs have been through so much already. Have you been reading the posts lately? We just had a kitten on the list apparently turn out to be a false pos. I know it's less likely in your case, given that other members of the colony are testing pos too, but your little boy is only 7 weeks and may very well be testing pos because of his mother's antibodies still. Whatever you decide, I know that you have their best interest at heart. Still, I'm praying that they can be kept together and adopted out to someone that cares as much as we do for their quality of life. Thanks for all you do, Nina janine paton wrote: Hi all, Two brothers, 7 weeks today tested one positive, one negative for leukemia. The mom is feral, and has not been tested yet, but her sister tested positive. The mom had been trapped by someone trying to do the right thing, but the kittens were born beforre she could get her to the vet. All have been living together crated in this person's home. As an organization, we had a pair of littermates testing the same as these 2, and we let them stay together. The positive cat died at around 3 yrs, the negative cat is still negative (and has recently been adopted!) so it's not entirely new to me but what's the best thing to do? Try to adopt them out as a pair? Separate them now? Or it doesn't matter at this point, even if the negative kitten is so young? The test was Elysa and we are re-running both. Thanks! Janine
Ridgefield, Connecticut - 2 leukemia pos girls
Guy called today. Going through divorce, wife does not want the cats. He's moving back in with his parents, who have a cat, but are thankfully away for a week. When he called, he was driving around with his cats in his car. I asked him to bring the cats to his parents' house and put them in a confined area and give me a chance to place them. Leukemia positive, both 3 yrs old, one all grey, one calico, both affectionate sweet cats. He's pretty sure his parents will not let the cats stay there. I am depressingly overloaded. Does anyone know of a safe place for these girls? Thanks, Janine
Re: vet in Ct
This is a vet on our org's board. Her name is Elaine Parliman and her email is [EMAIL PROTECTED] She's based in Norwalk, CT, and makes house calls. Janine --- kelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 10:59 AM 10/22/2006, you wrote: I will pass this on to her. Sadly she lost Binky .. KELLY Hi- sorry...I just read post requesting referral for vet in Ct. New England Cat Care in Amity(right of Merritt Parkway) is wonderful. 203-387-6369. They only care for felines. It is a husband-wife team. He is also a registered pharmacist for many years before going to vet school. I found them when I was in Ct and used them for all my special needs kitties when my regular vet had given up or just wasn't well enough versed in special care/needs. They are wonderful and so very,very caring. Now that I am in northern Vt- I really,really miss them. There have been several times when I thought of taking certain kitties back down to them 4 1/2 hourshope this helps. Roxanne http://www.incredimail.com/index.asp?id=409lang=9 [] No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.9/490 - Release Date: 10/20/2006
2 very different positives Ross and Prince
Hello, I'm with a rescue group and have questions about 2 different cats who have tsted positive. Ross - A family we connected with rescued a front declawed, orange 2 yr old male from an abandoned building 2 yrs ago. He test leukemia positive. Family did not give up on him and he has lived in child's bedroom since. He's 4 now, they recently retested him and he is still positive. The family would keep him but would rather he have a more normal life because he's a really nice cat and maybe a little lonely. Someone is interested in adopting the cat and we know her - she's a good mom and recently lost her orange female to cancer. Here's my first question - 4 yr old very healthy and happy male - am I correct in thinking he has a good shot at a long life since he's past that 2 yr mark and has never been sick? 2nd cat Prince - trapped him a few weeks ago. Looks like a 3 month old kitten but is getting his adult teeth so in reality closer to 5 months.Was extremely dehydrated and constipated, and very skinny under his very matted fur. Absolutely beautiful kitten, but something is off about him. Should I get my hopes up about Prince retesting negative in a month? Opinions/best guesses please? Janine
RE: OT: Pregnant Feral Kitty....Questions
I would spay her also, I'm sorry to say. I don't like it, neither do the vets, but I don't like the reality of over population either. We just took a little one from a mom who could not or would not feed her babies - the other 2 siblings died. Next night, young tame mother brought to animal control in distress and bleeding - 3 dead kittens inside of her. I trapped a feral cat once, who looked so pregnant to me - just HUGE - but with runny eyes, horrible neighborhood, outside in freezing sleet - I could not bring myself to spay her. Thought for sure she'd have her kittens the next day. THREE WEEKS LATER she gave birth - joke was on me! 2 great kittens, 2 not so great - 5 yrs later still have one of those kittens who strikes me as border-line autistic. I love him dearly, but who else will? But if you decide to NOT spay her, please ask a good vet if she should be de-wormed or vaccinated. I can never remember these things, but if she needs to wait until after her litter is born, no big deal. --- Melissa Lind [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Terrie, I agree with Nina. I just made this difficult decision last week and had Nonie (a rescue) spay/abort. However, this is such a personal choice; you have to do what you feel is right. I took in 3 rescues/foster cats last week, and I don't run a shelter. Since I couldn't afford it if Nonie had babies, I decided to do this. Also, I know that where I live, trying to find a home for these three fosters will be next to impossible let alone a litter. But, I know it's a delicate and controversial issue-one that I grappled with quite a bit. Good luck with Little Girl-poor baby! Best Wishes, Melissa _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Nina Sent: Saturday, April 14, 2007 2:33 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: OT: Pregnant Feral KittyQuestions I see you haven't removed the invisible sign welcoming wayward ones from your front lawn :-) . I Googled your question about worming pregnant cats and got conflicting answers. If it where me, esp given her age and circumstance, I'd have her spayed and the kittens aborted. It may sound harsh, but I've come to that conclusion from harsh realities. I completely understand and respect your decision to let her have her kittens, esp if she is in good health and you are able to take on the responsibility. I love the babies and even with my harsh opening disclaimer would be thrilled to hear the pitter patter of little kitten paws about the place. If you are going to take this on, I would bring her to the vet and have her checked. At the very least, get a stool sample and have it checked for worms. I know there are certain worms that can be dangerous for the kittens. From the behavior you describe, I'm betting Little Girl will tame up in no time. She sounds like she is reaching out to you and has had at least some good experiences with humans. What a smart girl to have found her way to you! Congratulations. Please keep us informed, Nina [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi all, It looks as we have a Feral pregnant Mom that has found her way to us. I'm going to trap her and put her on my back porch so she can tame down. Also have her babies safely. She is just a tiger strip kitty and very small. I have named her Little Girl My question is Can she be wormed? Do you recommend she be vaccinated before or after the birth of the kittens? I use Heska...it is intra nasal vaccination on my cats. I've never had any problems with it. I can tell she wants to be friendly with me. I can get about 2 feet from her and drop some food down. I back off and she eats it up. I have been feeding her with my other Feral kitties. I normally wouldn't ask these questions but never had a pregnant kitty either that lived outside that is feral. I can tell she is a baby herself she is under a year old at the most maybe 7-9 months old. I will get her spayed for free after the babies are born. So as you can see I'm clueless on this! Thanks for your help in this matter. Hugs to all Terrie Mohr-Forker
Re: Survey on IFA's turning negative
I was wondering this exact question tonight. Our group has a pos kitten, about 6 mos, who IFA tested pos 2 months ago. Any chance at all he will retest IFA negative? The poor kitten is in a kitty condo. It has a hammock and he can look out a window but he so lonely, he wimpers when he sees another cat. Not one of us has a room without cats in it. And he's not tame enough yet for most people. Beautiful, long haired kitten, too - it's heartbreaking. Janine --- wendy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey guys, Survey question: Have any of you ever had a cat that tested positive on the IFA eventually test negative at a later date? I called and spoke with Joanie at Best Friends, the woman who is normally at Casa de Calmar. I asked her about testing procedures, because I was considering having Toshie retested to see if she was still positive so I could possibly adopt her. Joanie told me that they have had cats that have arrived at Best Friends that subsequently sero-converted (what we refer to as 'throwing the virus'). She said that if a cat tests positive on Elisa but negative on IFA, that they do have a chance to sero-convert. They do not place these cats in Casa de Calmar, the FeLV unit, nor do they mix them with any other cats, as they can possibly infect others or their own sero-conversion can be affected by further exposure to FeLV. As long as they keep testing positive on Elisa but negative on IFA, they are tested every six weeks until they get a negative or positive IFA. If negative, they are mixed with the general population and put up for adoption. If positive, the virus is already in their bone marrow, which means to the veterinary community that they can never sero-convert, and they are then placed in Casa de Calmar. Thus, my question above. I am wondering if these testing guidelines hold true 100% of the time. Thanks, :) Wendy Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has! ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~ __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: question on test result
Oh good lord, you poor thing. Poor mom cat! I'm not an expert on these things which is why I joined this list, but we've had positive and negative in the same litter, and positive kittens revert to negative, and had some negatives stay that way. Lots of love, good food, supplements, maybe some transfer factor and no one knows how those babies will test down the road. Good idea, find a different vet. Good for you! Janine --- Deana K. Wagoner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Here is the next bit of info on my situation - My husband went by the vet office to pay the bill for the service provided on the stray mama that died from the dog inflicted injuries. The vet was not at all happy that we were not bringing the kittens to her to be put to sleep - since she is confident they are all positve and will die. (she has never seen them) The vet now says the first test on the dying mother was slightly postive so she ran it again and it was More positive. Is there such thing as slightly positive or is it just yes or no? I will never know if the mama cat was beyond treatment for sure, but I do know that the test was done about 4 hours after I left her there and no treatment or exam was done before that. The most important item on the list was this test. We are looking for another vet. Deana
article on releasing /not testing for felk in feral cats
http://www.neighborhoodcats.org/info/releasing.htm From Neighborhood Cats. It's well written and helped one of our hard headed vets understand why we don't always want them to test. She actually got it, and said thanks after she read it. Janine
article on releasing /not testing for felk in feral cats
http://www.neighborhoodcats.org/info/releasing.htm From Neighborhood Cats. It's well written and helped one of our hard headed vets understand why we don't always want them to test. She actually got it, and said thanks after she read it. Janine
Re: Anyone feed a raw diet to their FeLV+ cats?
I fed my little Baby a raw diet until he went into a home with leukemia cats. He came in as a tiny little thing with horrible URI's and sucked that stuff up like no tomorrow. Used Blakkatz.com or catinfo.org - pretty much the same. Whole chicken thighs ground up in grinder, plus supplements, for 6 months. He did really, really well, and he absolutely loved it. Janine --- C J [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What sort of raw meat did you use? I started off with ground turkey/chicken from the supermarket, but didn't feel comfortable with that, so I bought a meat grinder. Now I grind up turkey/chicken thighs after washing them off. I can't find organic meat in my area, so I have little choice other than to buy meat at the supermarket. Cassandra - Original Message - From: Belinda [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, May 21, 2007 4:30 PM Subject: Re: Anyone feed a raw diet to their FeLV+ cats? PS. I used to feed raw and my positive did very well on it, he became a little chubbster. I did lose him a year ago to pancreatic cancer unfortunately. -- Belinda happiness is being owned by cats ... Be-Mi-Kitties http://bemikitties.com Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens http://adopt.bemikitties.com FeLV Candlelight Service http://bemikitties.com/cls HostDesign4U.com [affordable hosting web design] http://HostDesign4U.com BMK Designs [non-profit animals websites] http://bmk.bemikitties.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.7.6/813 - Release Date: 5/20/2007 7:54 AM
Re: Something is killing my cats, please help me/environment
I'm loosing a few too many right now also but for the most part, they have been diagnosed with something not terribly surprising, given their circumstances. But similar, vague symptoms, I think, is another story. One of our larger foster homes had a fire. For a few years after, cats would suddenly come down with the same symptoms, with no explainations - weight loss, dehydration, great blood work. There are a lot of toxins in an older house on fire. Another story - a friend's cat, lethargic, anorexic, suddenly eating weird things. Big time hospital in NYC, couldn't come up with anything. Moved cat out of house when mold was found from leak in wall or basement. Cat immediately got better. It is worth checking out your environment, I'm sorry to say. Good luck, big hugs, take a deep breath. Janine --- MaryChristine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: yep. lost gypsy in april, crosby two and a half weeks ago, and lexie on sunday. all three have been ill for quite awhile, and it was just their time. would i have scheduled it quite like that? of course not. right now, for the first time in a very long time, i have no sick cats i do, however, have one FeLV+ kitten, two FIV+ adults, and a number who are 13 and older. MC On 6/28/07, Susan Hoffman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I lost 3 in January but all were obvious candidates -- one FIV+ cat with cancer, another who was FIV+ and had badly damaged kidneys from having been starved a long time, and my own senior cat who was more than 18 years old. So 4 isn't really that many when you do rescue and have a house full of cats who came from rough circumstances. *MaryChristine [EMAIL PROTECTED]* wrote: it actually isn't, unless it continues. anyone who works with large numbers of cats know that sometimes it goes in cycles--you can go months without losing any but the obvious candidates, then suddenly seem to hit a patch of whatever, and suddenly lose a number. it's how it balances out that matters. plus, with rescue animals, coming through a public shelter, in a part of the country that has extremes in temperature, amounts of moisture, and no real seasons to kill off parasites, etc., until cats start coming into these shelters with a full copy of both their genetic profiles and their medical histories, it's impossible to know what predispositions they are bringing with them, and what hidden conditions. yeah, just my opinion, but based upon working with a population of 600+ cats. MC On 6/28/07, Susan Dubose [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As far as shelter rescue work, 4 cats in such a short timeframe is not a normal rate of death. It is exceesively high. Susan J. DuBose ^..^ www.PetGirlsPetsitting.com http://www.petgirlspetsitting.com/ www.Tx.SiameseRescue.org http://www.tx.siameserescue.org/ www.shadowcats.net As Cleopatra lay in state, Faithful Bast at her side did wait, Purring welcomes of soft applause, Ever guarding with sharpened claws. Trajan Tennent - Original Message - From: wendy [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 10:45 AM Subject: Re: Something is killing my cats, please help me Hi Kelley, I'm sorry to hear this. I honestly don't know what to tell you. I have no idea what could be causing the deaths. Are you sure the deaths are related? I am wondering since you do shelter work if four cats out of ? (how many) is a normal rate of loss, given the circumstances (ie. shelter cats are more likely to be found when rescued with already compromised immune systems). I don't know much about shelter work, so others with experience will hopefully help you. Please keep us posted. :) Wendy --- Kelley Saveika [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is the toll so far from this year, not including kittens. Joey - 10 - died in late April. Being treated for AIHA. Lucky Lady - 12 - got sick, was adopted by my vet, apparently recovered but is now dying, they think cancer. Caroline - ran up a bill in excess of $1,000. No one knows what was or is wrong. Possible FIP (but she's getting better), brain cancer, toxo. Suzie - I don't even want to see the bill and don't know how I am going to pay it. Possible FIP, toxo. They are all 5 and up. All presented with massive dehydration (skin tenting), anorexia, massiive weight loss. Some w/neuro symptoms..bloodwork varying... All tested neg/neg for FELV. Tehy are down to looking in my house for asbestos and leadsomeone please help me...I
Re: FIRE!!!!!
Hi Susan, We went through this 4 yrs ago with our largest foster home. It's really a nightmare. Looking back I can see we did a few things wrong. Beating the bushes and calling their names was the wrong thing to do, esp with the more feral cats. Setting traps is really a better idea. You might pick up tips from catsinthebag.org too. The leftover smell of the fire and smoke might discourage them from coming too close to the house - talk about a bad memory! - so maybe setting traps in neighbor's yards might be helpful. A very few neighbors put food and water out on back porches or near bushes where a frightened cat could sneak in and eat and the neighbor would let us know if that happened so we would then set a trap right there. If your neighbors are helpful, that's half the battle. Those 2 things were important to recognize, in hindsight - the home that now smelled like a nightmare and the calm, calculated drawing in of the cats in the surrounding area. Thinking of you and your cats, Janine --- Susan Hoffman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Two of the missing cats -- Buddy and Lil Mister -- are my personal cats, two former feral brothers. (I have their sister YoYo with me right now.) Buddy has been seen inside since the fire but he is really freaked, reverted to feral. Lil Mister has not. Sugar is in the house, also a former feral, and she's pretty smug about not going into those traps we've set. Gustine (also known as Yard Fodder) is a VERY feral lynxpoint siamese girl, a foster, and she has been seen after the fire inside the house. Tuffy is a sweet fearful former feral foster girl, a little tabby. Have not seen her. Widget is a very shy all black kitten, maybe 4 months old. Have not seen her. (She's the only one of the kittens still missing.) There are still 3 outside feral cats, all of whom have been seen. We have traps set inside and out. Going back with a drop trap in a few days to get the outside cats. Planning on camping out there overnight soon to try to get the remaining inside cats. The general consensus is that they are hiding inside the house and, after trapping Rooster overnight and Tanner yesterday, and finding Ember hiding in the burned out basement, I suspect they are all still inside. If I keep going back and keep baiting those traps, eventually I should be able to get them all. No one has been found dead so I have to assume they are alive and in there somewhere. wendy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Susan, I have crossposted to the hyperT group. I can also send to my cousin in L.A. who knows people, but she's out of town until the middle of this month. I am so, so sorry this has happened to you, but so, so happy that none of your kitties were killed in the fire. I have a dumb question: are the five lost cats just lost/hiding in the house in the rubble or are they outside somewhere? Also, are all your personal cats accounted for or are some of them part of the missing five? Sending good vibes your way to find those lost kitties and that you find a place soon to rent until you're able to get settled again. :) Wendy Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has! ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~ - Original Message From: Susan Hoffman [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Tuesday, August 7, 2007 11:03:14 AM Subject: Re: FIRE! Just set up a photobucket account with photos of (a) fire damage, (b) missing cats and (c) adoptables in foster care. PLEASE CROSSPOST WIDELY. The link is http://s207.photobucket.com/albums/bb3/susan4233/ I will gather more photos as I can but I want to start circulating what I have. Need adoption assistance with cats in foster care. Need good trapping vibes for the ones who are still missing. Kelly L [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So far there are now only 5 cats she has not found as yet,,Susan's really big need is for fosters who can assist with adoptions and anyone knowing of animal friendly rentals between Vallejo and San Francisco,,she said she could go up to 1500 per month,, If you can't reach her you can contact me also p.m. and I will reach her, thanks Kelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.
Re: OT:declawing your cat is illegal...Crash Landing
Ah, but only a cat would have to choose between amputaion or death. I see no difference with this logic and killing cats who test positive. Catsinternational.org (also based in the midwest) has thankfully updated their page on declawing. They are calling for people to name declawing what it is - amputation. They guarantee 100% they can help you teach your cat not to scratch inappropriately. It's called education. I have to say when I went to that petfinder link, I felt like I was on another planet. Only a cat would have to choose between amputation and death. Only in America. Janine --- Kelley Saveika [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm not really sure I buy the theory that declawed cats are more likely to have behavioral problems. I've seen a lot of cats, both clawed and declawed, and behavioral problems seem to be about the same in both groups. We currently have a 12.5 year old declawed cat who is probably the sweetest cat ever. Similarly we have fully clawed cats who have had terrible behavioral problems. It just seems to be pretty random to me. Nationally, about 25% of cats are declawed. I'd be interested to see the studies that purport that they are turned in to shelters in disproportionate numbers. If this is the case, it doesn't seem to be the case locally. Also if they are turned in to shelters in disproportionate numbers, I'd like to know if the clawed cats are just turned loose somewhere, as opposed to being turned in to a shelter. I did speak to my vet about it and he says there is no hard evidence of any correlation between behavior and status of claws. Lots of people I really like have declawed cats, including my vet's receptionist. I continue to believe that cats are better off declawed than dead, and if you have to make the correlation YES I would rather have the tips of my fingers chopped off than be killed. -- Rescuties - Saving the world, one cat at a time. http://www.rescuties.org Vist the Rescuties store and save a kitty life! http://astore.amazon.com/rescuties-20 Please help George! http://rescuties.chipin.com/george I GoodSearch for Rescuties. Raise money for your favorite charity or school just by searching the Internet with GoodSearch - www.goodsearch.com - powered by Yahoo!
RE: PARTIAL SUCCESS! Advice on trapping...night v day trapping
Good source of information is yahoo groups - Feral_cats. For hard-to-trap cats, I bungee cord the trap open to get them used to the concept. It's just a little patience and most importantly, calmness. Act as if the bungeed-open trap is nothing more than a big dish to put food in. I didn't read all of the emails, but don't leave a set trap unattended. Get the cat on a schedule, feed her in a trap not really set, and when she relaxes and goes all the way in, make the app't and set the trap for real, staying around the corner with eyes and ears open so she can be covered up completely with a sheet and either brought straight to a vet, or brought inside somewhere safe, again covered up, until the next morning. --- Christiane Biagi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had to come back to NY today but my father is continuing to try to trap. She does come when he calls and follows him around-BUT she still won't go in the trap. We rigged the trap so it won't spring put some inside near the entrance-she did eat some of that. He wants to try that for a couple of days before setting the trap again. keep fingers crossed.. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of laurieskatz Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 12:10 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: PARTIAL SUCCESS! Advice on trapping...night v day trapping Chris, I am assuming no luck? - Original Message - From: Chris mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2008 10:18 AM Subject: PARTIAL SUCCESS! Advice on trapping...night v day trapping Last night mom and kitty were waiting and followed my dad to our door to get food. I know they were hungry! I managed to trap the little Munchkin who turns out is a girl. I got her to an e-vet at 10 PM and they tested her and put her in the big dog kennel for me. She's now sitting there sort of looking at all of us. Of course she's lying in the litter box. I think she ate a little of the food but basically she's just scared. I put her up high as she knows my father and he can't crawl around on the floor to talk to her. I should be bringing her to shelter later today. I reset the trap for mom-oh how I hope she isn't too spooked to go in there. I put in some heated dark tuna and smeared a little on the newspaper I lined the bottom of the trap with. I know she's hungry. She's been known to catch birds but she's not really good at it. So now I wait. Munchkin the little one, tested neg for FELV/FIV so I'm hoping that's a good sign for mom. I hate it so that shelter required this-its just sooo unnecessary! Many thanks for all the helpful advice. It really gave me some courage to keep trying. I just felt so over my head on this.I will keep you posted. Christiane Biagi 914-632-4672 Cell: 914-720-6888 [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of laurieskatz Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2008 9:14 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: Advice on trapping...night v day trapping Trap with water and canned food in the trap. They will be fine overnight. Cover with a towel and place the trap in a quiet, dark, safe INSIDE place until you can get to vet. Most important thing is to keep them safe until they can get to vet. Trying to transfer is not safe. I always took the trapped cat directly to the vet in the trap (covered and placed in plastic in my vehicle). I always trapped in the AM so I could get them right to the vet. That's better, if you can do that, depending on your schedule and theirs. I set 2 traps at once and that sped things up. Good luck, L - Original Message - From: Chris mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2008 6:43 PM Subject: RE: Advice on trapping... Is there any 'trick' to transferring from trap to large dog kennel? If for example, I trapped one tonight, I'd have to keep her overnight before I could go anywhere and I don't want to leave the cat in the trap all night with no food, water or litter box.. Christiane Biagi 914-632-4672 Cell: 914-720-6888 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Katrina Animal Reunion Team (KART) www.findkpets.org Join Us Help Reunite Katrina-displaced Families with their Animals From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2008 7:37 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: Advice on trapping... This is some good trapping advice. http://tinyurl.com/32zpor Also try Alley Cat Allies. On Jan 8, 2008 6:13 PM, Kelley Saveika [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would leave the kitty in the trap. Try mackerel..the cats around here can't resist it. Although I wouldn't say these are untrappable,
RE: PARTIAL SUCCESS! Advice on trapping...night v day trapping
That's fine! If she gets trapped, she can be brought inside until the morning. If covered completely with a sheet, and put somewhere quiet without people looking at her, she will be fine until morning. My concern is leaving a trap set and not attended overnight. 2 reasons why not to do this - another animal, cat or otherwise, may walk into the trap. Not only is this animal traumitized for no reason, but what if your cat is watching? She's not too likely to want to step into that trap after watching and hearing a panicked animal. 2nd reason is if you get the cat you want, she may react very badly to being in a trap all night, outside, where she knows she is very vulnerable. I used to hate trapping at night and holding til the morning, but when it's all over, they are so much better off, and an overnight stay in a covred trap is just a blip in a hopefully long, healty, happy life. --- Chris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well the problem is that primary feeding time is early evening just as it gets dark. If she gets trapped after dark, I know my parents won't be able to drive her to e-vet until the morning. She is in a safe place where the trap is set but he could also bring her inside to the bathroom if need be. It's a difficult situation for them and I wish there was someone available to take her to vet at night but couldn't find anyone Christiane Biagi 914-632-4672 Cell: 914-720-6888 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Katrina Animal Reunion Team (KART) www.findkpets.org Join Us Help Reunite Katrina-displaced Families with their Animals -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of janine paton Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 6:21 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: RE: PARTIAL SUCCESS! Advice on trapping...night v day trapping Good source of information is yahoo groups - Feral_cats. For hard-to-trap cats, I bungee cord the trap open to get them used to the concept. It's just a little patience and most importantly, calmness. Act as if the bungeed-open trap is nothing more than a big dish to put food in. I didn't read all of the emails, but don't leave a set trap unattended. Get the cat on a schedule, feed her in a trap not really set, and when she relaxes and goes all the way in, make the app't and set the trap for real, staying around the corner with eyes and ears open so she can be covered up completely with a sheet and either brought straight to a vet, or brought inside somewhere safe, again covered up, until the next morning. --- Christiane Biagi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had to come back to NY today but my father is continuing to try to trap. She does come when he calls and follows him around-BUT she still won't go in the trap. We rigged the trap so it won't spring put some inside near the entrance-she did eat some of that. He wants to try that for a couple of days before setting the trap again. keep fingers crossed.. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of laurieskatz Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 12:10 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: PARTIAL SUCCESS! Advice on trapping...night v day trapping Chris, I am assuming no luck? - Original Message - From: Chris mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2008 10:18 AM Subject: PARTIAL SUCCESS! Advice on trapping...night v day trapping Last night mom and kitty were waiting and followed my dad to our door to get food. I know they were hungry! I managed to trap the little Munchkin who turns out is a girl. I got her to an e-vet at 10 PM and they tested her and put her in the big dog kennel for me. She's now sitting there sort of looking at all of us. Of course she's lying in the litter box. I think she ate a little of the food but basically she's just scared. I put her up high as she knows my father and he can't crawl around on the floor to talk to her. I should be bringing her to shelter later today. I reset the trap for mom-oh how I hope she isn't too spooked to go in there. I put in some heated dark tuna and smeared a little on the newspaper I lined the bottom of the trap with. I know she's hungry. She's been known to catch birds but she's not really good at it. So now I wait. Munchkin the little one, tested neg for FELV/FIV so I'm hoping that's a good sign for mom. I hate it so that shelter required this-its just sooo unnecessary! Many thanks for all the helpful advice. It really gave me some courage to keep trying. I just felt so over my head on this.I will keep you posted. Christiane Biagi 914-632-4672 Cell: 914-720-6888 [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto
Re: CLS- Possum
Caroline, I love possums and I love that name! Please
don't feel guilty. Whatever time Possum had here, the
two of you made it better for each other.And
you've given me the inspiration I've needed to keep
focused on rescue, (burnt out!) so you and Possum have
had a ripple effect that will help a few more sweet
and gentle souls.
Oddly enough, I have been after a grey and white male
with a hurt foot and sore mouth, and just took in a
grey and white youngster who flung himself into
traffic trying to get away from a cord wrapped around
his neck. I think Possum is a great name and if you
don't mind, I might borrow it.
--- Sherry DeHaan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Caroline,I am sorry to hear of your sweet Possee
leaving you.He was lucky to have you.Hugs to you.
Sherry
Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
.hmmessage P { margin:0px; padding:0px }
body.hmmessage { FONT-SIZE: 10pt;
FONT-FAMILY:Tahoma }Can you add my foster
kitten Possum (aka Possee) to the CLS? He was not
an FELV cat, but possibly FIP.
He was a struggling, failing to thrive white w/ grey
kitten (who indeed looked like a Possum), who had a
rough start in life and I took him in to give him
TLC and see what I could do for him. Unfortunately,
I was unable to get him the vet care he
needed/deserved due to approval problems with the
adoption group he belonged to/I volunteered for and
I will forever regret that and feel guilty. But I
know I gave him a wonderful few months that he
wouldn't have had if I hadn't taken him in: he was
kept warm, freed from the pet store condos, got the
royalest treatment of all my fosters b/c I never
made him stay in the condo-he had free reign of my
two bedrooms, he slept on the bed with me curled in
my arms or on my chest or shoulder every night and
we had love-fest sessions every morning, with him
purring away, he got the highest quality food and
supplements, holistic vet treatments, and a little
kitty heating pad that became his all time favorite
thing. Sadly though, for
whatever reason, whether it be FIP, a congenital
heart defect, or both, his little body couldn't keep
up with his mind and desire to live and he crashed
without warning (besides a swollen belly) on me in
the early morning hours of Sunday and I rushed him
to the emergency vet clinic to end his suffering.
He was a wonderfully sweet little boy and although
he was more an old-man cat then the 7 mo kitten he
was supposed to be, I loved him for who and what he
was and I will miss him dearly, especially because
he became my sleeper-bud and I haven't had one since
Monkee left me in July.
He was my first cat/foster kitten to die since
Monkee and that makes it even more heartbreaking for
me b/c the Monkee loss is still so fresh. I also
wonder why they keep crashing on me on Sundays?!
Thank you,
Caroline K.
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Re: re spaying my kitten
Hopefully I'm not repeating something here, but we've had 2 young females (both approx 8 mos) in 2 different feral colonies recently with pyometra. One was obviously ill and close to death. The other was just dumb luck - trapped her expecting a routine spay and was very surprised to find out. Both cats survived. But that's another reason to tip the spay or not scale. Janine --- Sharyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think Tonya meant to say that spaying decreases the risk of cancer. I'm about to have my 2 FeLV+ females spayed per the vets recommendation. One has already gone into heat. Her appetite was affected and she seemed pretty stressed out. There is a risk to any surgery. You just have to make the best decision you can with your vet's help. Sharyl Sissy and Rocket catatonya [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would spay. I think your vet would tell you if there were any problem and would persuade you not to spay. Spaying dramatically increases your cat's risk of cancer. The stress of going into heat is also bad for a positive cat. I have had both my positive cats spayed. tonya Lynne [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Kathy, personally, unless she has had bloodwork showing she is the healthiest positive cat on the planet, I would not do it. I was told that the stress of wanting to breed is harder on a cat than the stress of undergoing neutering but if I had to do it again, I would never have had my positive male neutered. Although he was pretty far advanced leukemia wise, I truly believe his neutering caused him many additional problems that hastened his death. As we know, spaying is a much bigger procedure than neutering. If she is going to be an indoor cat only and you are willing to go through heats I would not do it. Just my take on things. I now have a 3 year old female who has Feline Herpes Virus, inactive at the moment, and I've only had her for a week. I am not even going to think about spaying for at least a month. I want her to be in excellent health, stress free etc before I'll even consider it. Lynne - Original Message - From: Kathy Dillard To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2008 10:18 AM Subject: re spaying my kitten My female kitten Foxy is about 8 1/2 months old. She has tested positive for feline leukemia and is currently on a daily dose of interferon. My vet has recommended having her spayed . Please advise and discuss pros and cons. I feel very anxious and scared about having this procedure done but want to do the right thing for Foxy. kathy - Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. - You rock. That's why Blockbuster's offering you one month of Blockbuster Total Access, No Cost.
Re: [Felvtalk] I think my girl kitty is pregnant...will the kittens be FeLV+??
Hi, I am not so active on this list because I am primarily doing rescue with only occassional positives. But, I have to say I would spay this cat so fast, pregnant or not. There are way too many kittens being born outside this year - back to back pregnancies it seems. And you don't need your girl to have problems giving birth either. Janine, from CT, overwhelmed with kittens! --- Laura B [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Jennifer, Even if FeLV were not a factor in this possible pregnancy I would suggest a spay-abort. The kitten season has been particulary bad this summer in Jersey (and probably elsewhere) so if you can't keep them they would have a VERY bleak future. I live in central Jersey and if you're not too far from Toms River (don't know how far south you are) you can take her to a clinic there that does low cost S/N. We take all the ferals we can TNR there, and they have no problem doing spay-aborts. You actually have to go through ABC (Animal Birth Control) which is a group based in Bayville (I believe) NJ, they will give you a voucher or number that will entitle you to a low cost S/N. If you would like I can get the information for you, my neighbor has it since she does TNR daily this time of year. I help out financially when I can since I work during the day (she doesn't work, cept for sterilizing cat colonies for people). Laura --- On Mon, 8/11/08, Jennifer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Jennifer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Felvtalk] I think my girl kitty is pregnant...will the kittens be FeLV+?? To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Date: Monday, August 11, 2008, 8:47 PM and the only possible father is my FeLV+ kitty, Ash. Isobel is showing signs of pregnancy (hard and protruding tummy as well as pointy nipples). She's going this Thursday to get tested for FeLV. My question is, if she tests negative (which my guess is she won't being that her and Ash mated), will the kittens be FeLV+ because their father is FeLV+? Also, if Isobel is pregnant and she is FeLV+, does that automatically mean the kittens will be too? I feel so horrible about not getting her fixed sooner, but my money is tight and I have to save up just to take them to the vet. If she is pregnant, I can't keep the kittens as we already have three and my boyfriend is allergic and says no way to any more cats in the house, which I understand. If I take them to a shelter and they're positive, won't they put them to sleep right away? I don't want that to happen. I live in Southern New Jersey...anyone want more kittens?? When I take her to the vet this week, I'll have them confirm her pregnancy. Jennifer - PROUD VEGETARIAN LOCAL SPCA VOLUNTEER. Be their voice. ~ loving mama to ~ Morrison (born Oct. 10, 2000) Isobel aka Fat Girl (born Feb. 7, 2007) Ash (born July 11, 2007, diagnosed FeLV+ July 28, 2008) ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Kitten chronic loose stool
That's an EXCELLENT website. Nothing straightens out cats and kittens like the recipe from catinfo.org. CRF, LK, cancer, symptomatic FIV, healthy cats, you name it, we've had cats on this diet with tremendous success and never once a bad result. You just have to treat the raw meat with respect.And nothing beats the entertainment of watching a kitten eat it. The growling, the sheer delight - very funny! --- On Sat, 11/1/08, Laurieskatz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Laurieskatz [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Kitten chronic loose stool To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Date: Saturday, November 1, 2008, 10:02 PM Tracey thanks for this post. I bought everything, using the recipe and resources on catinfo.org, during the food scare. I never got the courage to make the foodmaybe I will at some point. Soon, I hope. Laurie -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tracey Sent: Saturday, November 01, 2008 8:25 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Kitten chronic loose stool A few months ago I found a kitten (Abbey) who was near death who tested +. She had uncontrollable diarrhea, I mean it was everywhere and I have 3 other cats, all -'s and I have fed them a homemade raw chicken and bones diet for the last 9 months. I started feeding her the raw diet. It was amazing! Within a week it was solid as can be, and she is really the picture of health. I took me a long time to make the decision to make my own food and it also took a while to get them switched over to this new diet, but it was well worth the effort! They are so healthy! Their coats are extremely shiny and softer, their temperaments are better, they are much more active (playing more than they ever did), and my 16 lb 'fat cat' has lost a little weight. I just couldn't believe it. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
[Felvtalk] question on adopting neg kitten to family with positive cat
Hello everyone, I joined this list some years ago because as a rescuer, I wanted information on how best to deal with leukemia colonies we were running into. My organization also does adoptions. We have a family interested in one of our kittens as a companion to a 5 yr old positive cat. Their cat tested positive for leukemia as a kitten and their vet recommended euthanizing - they declined and the cat is now a healthy adult, and still testing positive. The kitten they are interested in is under 3 mos and was the runt of the litter. One concern I have is the number of vaccines plus neutering a cat that age has to go through already in a relatively short period of time - then add in the leukemia vaccine on top of that. And is the vaccine good enough protection for a kitten, should a kitten even get that vaccine? Any thoughts on this, or if you do adoptions, how would you handle it? I'm hesitating suggesting they look for another positive youngster only because the family has young children. We have plenty of kittens of all ages, and young adults - does this matter? Thanks for any thoughts - it's a very nice family with a great reference from their vet. Janine ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] advice on kitty's loose tooth
Had this recently with one of mine. Her canine tooth was sticking straight out also, it looked horrible, but took her to vet, person who does dentals there easily removed the tooth. Came right out in one second, by had, no big deal! From: Laurieskatz lauriesk...@mchsi.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Thu, November 19, 2009 5:47:06 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] advice on kitty's loose tooth I would get her to a vet as soon as possible to make sure there isn't an infection Abscessed teeth can be a serious issue. L -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Tracey Shrout Sent: Thursday, November 19, 2009 4:44 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] advice on kitty's loose tooth Hi all, I have a positive who has a loose lower canine tooth. I have never had this problem in a cat. She is very clumsy (one bad eye) and I think she has possibly just ran into something. Anyway, her tooth is now sticking straight out. I worry that it may be getting infected, or that it may become infected when it falls out. This is the fifth day, and it still hasn't fallen out. She's acting normal and eats fine as well. Is this something I should be terribly concerned about or has anyone had this happen to your kitty??? Thanks for any advice, Tracey ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] I Hate PETA
Is it just me, or does anyone else think maybe PETA killed these cats regardless of their test results. In other words, is it possible the cats didn't test positive for anything but feral, so was an excuse to kill them? Sharyl, I am so very sorry. Janine From: Diane Rosenfeldt drosenfe...@wi.rr.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Thu, December 3, 2009 7:51:46 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] I Hate PETA Oh, Sharyl! This is just so sad and pointless. But a really hard learning experience, I guess, about PETA's practices. I know Butterball and Smoky Jo know you were trying to help them. Gentle Bridge vibes to both of them, and solace to you. I'm grieving with you. Diane R. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] OT:help w/post traumatic stress in cat?
Jeepers. I'm so sorry for this cat! I have a FIV+ named Whitey who'd been hit by a car a few winters ago. Disappeared for a week, feeders thought he was dead. Long story short, he now lives in my bedroom (only because he doesn't play nice with others) but oh boy, does he love us. Broken jaw and paralysis on one side of his face. Can not open his mouth more than a quarter of an inch. He is physically a little akward, too. For two years at least, he startled awake out of a sound sleep when hearing a loud car or truck. NOT jumping as high as your kitty, and he doesn't have beebees in him, but now he is starting to relax more, and sleep through loud motor noises. There's a drug called cyproheptadine (maybe used for allergies?) we use sometimes to relax just a little, maybe at night would be a good time. Also increases appetite, sort of useful for cancer patients. Also, Bach flower rememdies come in more than rescue rememdy, although rescue rememdy might do it.If you go to a health food store, or online, you can pick out a few to use in his water that may fit his issues. Janine From: Susan Hoffman susan_hoff...@yahoo.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org; Mari meko...@mycomhouston.com; tlstick...@yahoo.com Sent: Mon, December 7, 2009 11:50:58 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] OT:help w/post traumatic stress in cat? If the pheremones don't work then talk to your vet about antianxiety meds, either prozac or elavil, at least for awhile till he begins to get over whatever is in his past. (I had one cat on prozac for years. It made all the difference in the world.) --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Barb Moermond mr_mok...@yahoo.com wrote: From: Barb Moermond mr_mok...@yahoo.com Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] OT:help w/post traumatic stress in cat? To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org, Mari meko...@mycomhouston.com, tlstick...@yahoo.com Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 8:42 AM Tamara, I'm forwarding this individually to Mari as I know she has experience with this. She's on the list, but I think on digest and I want to make sure she sees this. Barb+Smoky the House Puma+El Bandito Malito My cat the clown: paying no mind to whom he should impress. Merely living his life, doing what pleases him, and making me smile. - Anonymous From: tamara stickler tlstick...@yahoo.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Mon, December 7, 2009 10:37:33 AM Subject: [Felvtalk] OT:help w/post traumatic stress in cat? Hello all, This is off-topic, and for that I apologize, but I figured with all the cat care-giving/rescuing experience of the people on this list, perhaps someone would have an answer for me. I took in stray tabby about 3 years ago. Had him neutered and vetted. He had/has many issues including being prone to kidney crystals and infections -which I think we have under control at the moment w/ cranberry powder additive to his food. He used to be very aggressive towards other cats (something for which my other cat still hasn't completely forgiven him for) and he truly believes himself to be a dog. He has no fear at ALL of people, cats or canines, -fetches toys, heels, comes when called and will go into his crate if you just mention it...(something even my DOG REFUSES to do!). But..there is one major obstacle to completely incorporating him into the household: he has night terrors. Because of his past aggression, he's separated in his own room whenever I'm not home at night, but I have been trying to get to the point where he can be allowed to sleep with us. Unfortunately, he has incredible nightmares where he BOLTS INTO THE AIR (we're talking sometimes 2-3 feet HIGH) from a dead sleep and FLEES until he hits something - usually a wall or piece of furniture- hard enough to wake him up. Then he sits all hunched up and blinking for a few minutes. If I go to him he immediately starts to purr and rolls over for a belly rub - only after head-butting me a few dozen times. I've had him to the vet thinking he was having painful spasms or something. All she could find were old injuries that looked like a car accident may have hit him in the hip area (all healed - he moves fine) and what appear to be 3 bebes still lodged in the back of his neck and shoulder area. She doesn't think they would be the cause of pain now...but both injuries tell something of the first year or two of his life. I've tried feline pheromones ...he still has the episodes. As much as I hate putting him in a room by himself at night, while the cat and dog and I share a bedwhen he freaks out at night- it sets off a chain reaction of the other cat going all hissy-spazzy and the dog barking and chasing one or both around the condo until he fully wakes up and calms down (I'm surprised my neighbors haven't complained yet!). (Not to mentionI've gotten kicked in the eye
Re: [Felvtalk] stomatitis
Took in an FIV cat with very bad stomatitis. I'd never seen a huge, emaciated cat try to eat but run backwards growling and screaming and pawing at his face, and boy, was I afraid of him! Vet pulled teeth, was reluctant at first to use steroid because of FIV status but after a month, very bad flare-up so vet wanted to try steroid. I found an excellent homeopath instead and Kohl did very well for 2 years with this (rather intensive treatment) and a raw diet. He was actually physically and mentally excellent until we noticed a swelling that was dx as an oral cancer, but even his ending was helped with the homeopathy and he did well until the few days before we opted to have him eithanized. Janine From: Gloria B. Lane gbl...@aristotle.net To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sun, December 13, 2009 5:22:23 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] stomatitis I'll have to think - for Stomatitis/gingivitis, I've used 1) pulling the teeth (seems to work well) 2) Oral dexamethasone (some folks have good luck with that - made my kitty cough a little but helped somewhat) 3) Monthly Demo (steroid) shot - nice but if it gets too frequent, kitty comes down with other things 4) Convenia antibiotic shot, followed by oral Axithromycin as needed (worked pretty well) There's another oral med that I've tried but can't remember the name right now, have to look it up. It was pretty good. I'm sure there are some other options. As I understand, Stomatitis can be called by several different things... Best of luck, Gloria On Dec 13, 2009, at 3:54 PM, lernermiche...@aol.com wrote: Hi. I'm fostering an FIV+ cat right now who has pretty bad stomatitis. We had his teeth cleaned and 6 of them removed, and after a few weeks of antibiotics post-dental surgery he was doing much much better-- eating a lot more, gained 3 pounds in 3 weeks, not seeming to have any mouth pain and the redness was all gone. We stopped the antibiotics (which had been clindamycin then switched to clavamox) and he remained ok for a few days. He then went to a potential adoptive home with another FIV+ cat. A week later she called for us to get him back, largely because his mouth got really bad again. He is back on Clavamox, and has been for a few days, but is growling when he eats and can only eat wet food that we break up into very small pieces. His gums are very inflamed again. I had 6 FeLV+ cats, but was lucky that none had stomatitis like this. For those of you whose cats have it or had it, what do you recommend? thanks, Michelle ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Bridget is dead
Hey Laura, Your subject line really caught me - I've recently lost a cat named Bridget and she was the best, smartest cat. Bridget is a wonderful name and thank god she had one. I don't know what LTCI is and am hoping someone explains it. I relocated a feral cat named Molly to my yard and for years, she did really well, never leaving. She loved to hang out with us on our deck. Then she found a friend, followed him, got hit by car. Her beautiful face was smashed and there was no doubt she died instantly, but still, I had to have a vet listen for her heart hours later, to be sure, even tho it was so obvious she was gone. Looking back, I think my asking for vet to listen for heart beat was shock and disbelief on my part We all blame ourselves at first when something so unexpected happens, it must be human nature. It's terribly stressful for these cats to go into heat over and over (I think more than twice a year) and the possibility of an infected uterus or mammary cancer is very real, I know, I've seen enough of it. I hope you realize sooner than later you were doing what was right for Bridget, and keep on helping others. The very best to you, Janine From: Sharyl cline...@yahoo.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Wed, March 17, 2010 9:41:44 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Bridget is dead Laura, I am so sorry to read about Bridget. We do the best we can with the knowledge we have. Normally it is best to have any kitty spayed/neutered. Unfortunately there is always a risk with anesthesia. My heart goes out to you. Sharyl --- On Wed, 3/17/10, LauraM hingebacktorto...@yahoo.com wrote: From: LauraM hingebacktorto...@yahoo.com Subject: [Felvtalk] Bridget is dead To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Date: Wednesday, March 17, 2010, 4:45 PM Bridget is dead. I had her spayed today and apparently she died very quickly under anesthesia. She was my baby. I would have done anything for her and now she's dead. It has been a miserable few weeks with Frosty Paws and then Baby Girl but this has broken my heart. She was doing so well. Could it have been the LTCI? I have to know whether I'm responsible for killing her. Please, if anyone knows whether the LTCI could have had something to do with it, maybe made her more sensitive to being put under, please let me know, I have to know whether I killed my cat. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] I killed my kitten last night...
Kim, it's a horrifying experience to go through. You are right, Laura, so many of us do have the same story and it just happened here - a mild URI, a sudden difficulty in breathing, emergency vet visit, then gone a few hrs later, but unlike your kitty, by himself with his brother as a witness.At 4 months, this was NOT normal. Kim, you were fighting something you couldn't see. But try to look at this in a different way - you loved her and you gave her your best because you loved her. I'm not sure sub-q'ing fluids when a kitten is struggling to breathe is the safest thing to do anyway, so maybe it was just time for her to pass. So Kim, she is lucky she left while you were holding her, no matter what position. You didn't kill her, whatever was ailing her killed her - you were trying to help her. Janine From: LauraM hingebacktorto...@yahoo.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sat, November 6, 2010 6:43:25 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] I killed my kitten last night... Oh, Kim, I have been through this so many times and so many times I've said I killed my cat/tortoise/lizard/snake/whatever. You did not kill her. You did the best you could at the time with the information you had, and I am so sorry that you feel this way. It's normal to blame oneself but hindsight is 20/20; a cliche, I know, but so true. On St Patrick's Day my FeLV+ cat, Bridget, died at the vet. She was there to be spayed but never made it to the table - they put her under and she died. Horrible. But what was even more horrible was that I had a premonition that she would die during surgery, for weeks. A voice literally screamed in my head. DON'T DO IT, SHE WILL DIE. And yet I did it, and got that awful phone call from the vet. That night I posted on this forum - it's my fault, I killed her. I was so grateful for the assurances from other members that no, I didn't kill her.I tried my best and something happened. I am sure that many other folks will have a similar story. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Insight Please
Definitely pos mom gave birth in trap to 5 kittens. 2 survived, one pos, one neg tested over and over. Adopted, both retested negative down the road. No explanation either but it must be possible. What I don't understand is a kitten testing neg while the virus is latent, then breaking with it years later - is this something that really happens and there is need to worry about? Thanks, Janine - Original Message From: Natalie at...@optonline.net To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sat, December 11, 2010 9:05:33 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Insight Please That's what happened to a rescuer friend - I was in Mexico at the time and couldn't post to the group myself - another member kindly posted for me. However, my friend heard back from only one person. Mother cat with 6 kittens; mother and 2 kittens negative, 4 kittens borderline positive. The veterinarians are vexed; I thought that since many of you had experienced or heard of quite a few false positives with certain tests lately, there might have been an answer. My assumption would be that the were exposed to another FeLV cat. Natalie -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Marnie Sent: Saturday, December 11, 2010 12:53 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] Insight Please My shelter just took in a litter of 5 kittens. They are about 8 weeks old. The 3 females tested possible for feline leukemia with the Idexx snap test and the 2 males were negative. We retested from another batch of tests and the same thing. How is this possible if they are all from the same mother? Can anyone shed some light on this please? Marnie Sent from my iPhone ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Neutering males
Last year we had a brother/sister feral pair just in, crated together and when spayed 2 wks later at 5 1/2 mos, the female was pregnant already with one kitten. We can't afford to spay.neuter every single litter we take on right away, but follow up like crazy with adoptions and our rule is spay/neuter at 5 mos. They do heal faster at a younger age. See Winn Feline Foundation website for more information about this - it might dispel the myths of early spay/neuter, esp with boys. Human children seem to be more prone to early sexuality, why not cats? Janine - Original Message From: Peggy Verdonck jetalitosunnys...@gmail.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Mon, December 27, 2010 6:00:35 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Neutering males Wow, I went outside for a little bit to ride one of our horses.bunches of new replies :-) All our other cats were around 9 months old when spayed or neutered. I'm from the Netherlands and there are not many vets that will do it earlier then that. I've been reading and listening to the pros and cons to early/late neutering and spaying, but there are just as many pros as cons in either of them. I even lean towards early, because a kitten bounces back a lot quicker then an older cat. I've personally made up my mind that it is better to neuter young, but not at like 3 weeks old or so. I don't think much can go wrong with a male. If a vet messes that up, he needs to go back to school. With females I would wait till older. It is a lot harder on them because they actually get opened up and have all their female organs removed.. With my first question I was just wondering at what age most people have their male kittens neutered. Didn't even think about the weight of the kitten...makes a lot more sense! Thanks for the all the replies! 2010/12/27 Susan Hoffman susan_hoff...@yahoo.com Unfortunately that has been the experience of too many people. Even with a contract and a spay/neuter deposit it does not happen. Or it doesn't happen until after that little surprise litter from a 7 month old cat. Early age spay/neuter goes a long way towards reducing pet overpopulation. The areas that do very young spay/neuter amd have active feral cat programs have fewer kittens in shelters and higher adult cat adoptions. So if you're going to adopt them out, fix them first. --- On Mon, 12/27/10, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: From: Natalie at...@optonline.net Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Neutering males To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Date: Monday, December 27, 2010, 1:14 PM I am a rescue group - but we don't have any laws in CT to alter them before adoptions. Probably a great idea! I keep in personal contact with adopters and make absolutely sure that they spay/neuter at the appropriate times. But they found that even though people pay for the spay/neuter at the time of adoption, a huge percentage never come back to do it...Whether they do it on their own or not, isn't known. More likely, they don't, and that's why such a problem continues. -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Susan Hoffman Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 3:45 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Neutering males It's different if you are a rescue who places animals for adoption. In California it is illegal for a 501(c)(3) non-profit to adopt out an unaltered animal. Also, we have so many vets in Northern California who are very experienced at early age spay/neuter. It's the standard here and the kittens always seem to bounce back so quickly from their surgery. --- On Mon, 12/27/10, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: From: Natalie at...@optonline.net Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Neutering males To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Date: Monday, December 27, 2010, 10:49 AM I personally do NOT neuter/spay until much later and have never had a sprayer.my vet doesn't like doing it that early, and believes that neutering males so early has some possible future risks that are not yet known. -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 12:53 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Neutering males We do ours at 6 months; our vet will not do them before that, and from what I've read about the bad possible side effects of early s/n in dogs I can't blame him. On Mon, Dec 27, 2010 at 10:41 AM, Edna Taylor taylore...@msn.com wrote: My vet prefers for them to weigh 3-4 pounds before surgery (usually 16 weeks) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2010 11:33:58 -0500 From: athenapities...@gmail.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re:
Re: [Felvtalk] Singing to Cats
Same here, I sing to my feral kittens and they seem to love it. Trapped one in a snowstorm who was very ill and kept moving away, but fell asleep when I sang to him. When I got close, he'd wake and I'd stop, look away, start singing again when he relaxed and stoped looking at me. Finally got close enough to sing, let him nod off, scruff, drop in trap. I don't have a very good voice and could only remember Christmas songs at the time because I was so nervous for him, but it sure worked. Janine - Original Message From: Diane Rosenfeldt drosenfe...@wi.rr.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Thu, December 30, 2010 6:54:10 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Singing to Cats The listmom of my feral-cats list (she is Wiccan) feels strongly that cats love to be sung to, and to have their own special song. So y'all are on the right track! She also says that cats love to be told their own story -- where they came from, how you met them, whatever. She feels that there is a special kind of communication and they sort of understand on a cellular level that the song or story is about them. I'm not as radical as that, but I do occasionally try to tell one cat or another its story. Can't hurt! Oh, and she tells people to explain things to cats and ask their permission, forgiveness or whatever. This might be useful for those of us going through hard times with our kitties -- assisted feeding, pilling etc. Diane R. -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Bonnie Hogue Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2010 1:57 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Singing to Cats So I'm not the only one who makes up little songs for the cats! Each cat has its own song (some have several) -- a kind of theme song. For some reason, I do this for every cat. I wonder why we do this? The songs are quite nice...or so the cat thinks! ha! ~B. - Original Message - From: Lorrie felineres...@kvinet.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 4:58 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Singing to Cats On 12-26, Katy Doyle wrote: This might sound silly, but I sing to my cats. Like when I'm taming and socializing feral kittens... It seems to work and I have fun :-) It's good to know I'm not the only one who makes up silly little songs to sing to my cats :-) Lorrie ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Deciding-when-a-pet-has-suffered-enough
Hello, I joined this list years ago, and have now needed to rejoin. Trying to find testing protocol for FeLV and an explanation for it. I am with a rescue grp and we have just started trapping in a colony that had 30 kittens last year and none of them tested pos. We just took 9 kittens within a few days, and are close to having all of the adults neutered. There were a few newcomers - mostly toms. All kittens tested neg until Bella, who tested a weak pos with Elysa sent out to lab. Moms were all mixed up in this colony, everyone taking care of each other's kittens. A 2nd vet did IFA test a few days after Bella's pos results, which I understand is too soon, but having a hard time trying to explain this! My concern is that even if all the kittens tested neg except Bella, that doesn't mean in a few weeks the same kittens would not retest pos. My thinking is that more than one may have been exposed recently enough that the test might not be positive last wk, but may be tomorrow? Another vet thinks I am over thinking/reacting and we should just adopt out the ones that have tested neg right around the same time Bella tested positive. Looking for guidance - Thank you, Janine - Original Message From: dlg...@windstream.net dlg...@windstream.net To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Mon, October 1, 2012 6:15:00 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Deciding-when-a-pet-has-suffered-enough Bow hunting has started in my area and I keep my cats close to hoome. Only Harley goes down the road, so HE stays inside. I keep hearing they are only animals as the excuse. Well, since we are suspossed to be descended from monkeys, we are animals so why can't I shoot them. They are only animals arn't they? Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: I am so sorry to hear about the poor cat that was shot with an arrow - this is so typical this time of year when bowhunting begins for deer; dogs and cats are shot all the time.on purpose, because how could one think that a cat is a deer? Could also be some stupid neighborhood kid practicing on small animals! Ted Nugent, the creepy rock star macho moron bowhunter, started his 3-yr old kid practicing bowhunting on small barn animals on his farm.. Even when caught, these creeps get a mere slap on the wrist, if at all! I believe in karma, but it's not soon enough for me - I hope they rot in hell ASPA! Natalie From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lisa Conner Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2012 10:36 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Deciding-when-a-pet-has-suffered-enough Friends, We can only do our best everyday to help the victims without voices, either humans or animals. Kevorkian was arrested because it is against the law to end lives. Thanks goodness we can do what we can do, to end the suffering of a companion that is truly suffering (pet). I am a Christian and believe in heaven and hell and Karma. So, until we all die, that person who puts their pet down to travel the world or whatever, is a selfish person to begin with and I am sure it is not the first time that they were disrespectful to life. They will have to be judged and only the Lord will have that talk with them at the end of their life. I live in Florida and just heard about a cat in Riverview that was found (alive) with an arrow in its back! They are trying to find the person who did it. Trust me, I am sure if it was a little child or adult, the FBI would be involved. But because it was a cat, they are doing their best. At the end of every day, everything we do a group has a major impact on saving our furry friends. We can also voice our opinion to the government to change laws. God Bless America. Let's be positive here, we are in America and have the opportunity to change anything in our power as a group. Look in the Middle East, killing everyday! Thank you to all you Vet techs that try to intervene and help out where you can. however, you are right.. it is up to the VET to stand up for the healthy animals that they put to sleep. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Asking for advice again/back to Leukemia list
I am surprised this list got so off topic. A few years ago, this wouldn't be allowed to happen. I have very strong political opinions, and very strong opinions about hunting, but what I rejoined this list for was only to understand how to deal with 9 kittens from a few different litters in same colony, where one tested positive and I think I got one, maybe two answers. I guess it's OK to talk about other things, if a newcomer feels like he or she has been listened to, but I did not. For me, 9 kittens are a lot of kittens to worry about even with past LK experience. So I don't really see how a total newcomer would have been helped by this list over the last week or two whatsoever. Leukemia is scary, and this list should be an opportunity to educate. I don't feel comfortable sending people to this list if they are ignored. Would rather stick to common sense, out of the box, how to help and what to expect.It's shame to loose this resource. My 2 cents. Janine From: Natalie at...@optonline.net To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sat, October 6, 2012 7:30:29 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Asking for advice again That’s what my vet gives me – Cyproheptadine (Periactin) – ¼ pill does a good job. From:Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lee Evans Sent: Friday, October 05, 2012 9:16 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Asking for advice again Another brain cell woke up and reminded me that there's also an antihistamine called Ciproheptadine. I'm thinking that this is the one they use as an appetite stimulant. I just Googled it and sure enough, this is the one. If you want more information on getting your cat to eat go to the following Website: Tanya's Comprehensive Guide to Feline Chronic Kidney Disease. The URL is: www.crf.org/persuading_cat_to_eat.htm There are some other hints on getting an anorexic cat to chow down also. Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors too! From:Edna Taylor taylore...@msn.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Friday, October 5, 2012 5:23 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Asking for advice again I have been trying that, she eats just a smidge and then turns away :( Thank you :) Poor thing is just wasting away and I feel so helpless :( Date: Fri, 5 Oct 2012 17:58:20 -0400 From: ti...@mindspring.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Asking for advice again You can try gerber stage2 baby food...the meat kind (ham, beef, turkey, etc). Not all thw nutrition a cat needs but it gets them something. Christiane Biagi Sent from my Samsung Epic™ 4G ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
[Felvtalk] 9 kittens, one testing pos
Can anyone explain to me why if from point of exposure to actually testing pos is 28 days, if this is correct, why we can't just retest in one month using Elisa? And if all excepting the one testing weak pos, stjill test neg, is this good enough? All 8 kittens and some of their moms tested neg, just the one a weak pos. I am asking because I am trying to make this make sense to me and keep everyone safe. And foster homes understanding. Thanks, Janine From: Natalie at...@optonline.net To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Fri, October 5, 2012 8:52:00 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] (no subject) I agree, they have been very civil! Natalie From:Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Diane Rosenfeldt Sent: Friday, October 05, 2012 8:23 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] (no subject) Thanks, Lee, I was about to say that I have never seen anyone not get responded to on this list in their time of need and emotional turmoil. Going offtopic is almost inevitable when you’re on a specialized list like this. I think the OT discussion has been amazingly civil and respectful. As it happens, I will be voting Democrat because I feel they are in touch with, and care about, the people that the Republicans have referred to as the 47% they’re not interested in reaching. My reasons have to do with the way the most vulnerable among us would be treated under each party. I feel people like most of us, who are sort of getting by or not quite getting by or getting by only because we get a pension or disability or whatever, need people in government who are interested in reaching us. Diane R. From:Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lee Evans Sent: Friday, October 05, 2012 2:54 PM To: felvtalk Subject: [Felvtalk] (no subject) In the middle of our chit-chat about politics and hunters and vegetarian diets, if someone had come in with the subject line: Cat Bitten by Cobra, we would have been off the chatty stuff in an instant and onto Google to look up what could be done for the cat while the caregiver was taking him to the vet emergency clinic. So if we wander around the hospital isles occasionally when everyone is asleep and babble a bit, don't worry. We can switch in a moment. I actually did switch when I saw how agonized you were and posted about vets treating FeLv cats differently from non-FeLv cats to get us back on topic. But occasionally on every specialized list I have been on there is a subject with OT listed and then it's either a funny article copied from a magazine or other online source or some cute pictures of cats doing silly things, or even a heated political discussion about who will be President and how it would effect our ability to financially keep our heads above water and still feed our rescues and take our cats to the vet when needed. It really does tie into the FeLv+ cat group because we are very money intensive in trying to keep our rescued special needs cats as healthy as can be for as long as can be. If I lose my Social Security and Medicare benefits or they are reduced, I would have to cut down on food for myself and air conditioning in the summer and heat in the winter to pay my mortgage on this house that I bought to keep my cats safe from being seized by Animal Control in a city where there are cat limits. Even though I still work and have an online job, I would be in dire straits. So it is very important to my cats who I vote for. And since I live in a rural area, hunting becomes a problem for me also. If the NRA controls the government, then my 3 outside cats and my peacock are in danger. I actually hear gunshots sometimes in the daytime on weekends and it makes me tremble. Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors too!___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] 9 kittens, one testing pos
Hi Natalie, We are not certain which is this kitten's mom, because the whole colony is mixed up. One mom drops 2 kittens off, another picks them up. They are all sharing. From: Natalie at...@optonline.net To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Mon, October 8, 2012 11:06:33 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] 9 kittens, one testing pos Janine, you wrote that some of their moms tested negative. How about the positive kitten’s mom - was she pos or neg? I would retest with the ELISA. I find it strange that a kitten would show a weak positive if the mother was positive because their kittens are positive, or should be. If the kitten’s mom is not positive, could this kittens have been exposed to a positive cat and therefore be a weak positive? What was the vet’s explanation? I don’t have much experience with FeLV – I have quite a few FIV. I had a FeLV+ kitten years ago, and he died within 2 months. Last year, I had 2 FeLV+ adult cats (already in the bone marrow), one died of CRF and the other one was adopted by a veterinarian and still doing really well. Those two FeLV+ cats were living with a large group of healthy cats for about 6 months…I have retested, starting with the youngest and oldest, and then everyone in the middle – not a single cat contracted FeLV! I consider myself quite lucky! But there are many on this list who have FeLV+ cats living with healthy ones, some vaccinate the healthy ones, and some do not. Natalie From:Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of janine paton Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 8:21 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] 9 kittens, one testing pos Can anyone explain to me why if from point of exposure to actually testing pos is 28 days, if this is correct, why we can't just retest in one month using Elisa? And if all excepting the one testing weak pos, stjill test neg, is this good enough? All 8 kittens and some of their moms tested neg, just the one a weak pos. I am asking because I am trying to make this make sense to me and keep everyone safe. And foster homes understanding. Thanks, Janine From:Natalie at...@optonline.net To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Fri, October 5, 2012 8:52:00 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] (no subject) I agree, they have been very civil! Natalie From:Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Diane Rosenfeldt Sent: Friday, October 05, 2012 8:23 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] (no subject) Thanks, Lee, I was about to say that I have never seen anyone not get responded to on this list in their time of need and emotional turmoil. Going offtopic is almost inevitable when you’re on a specialized list like this. I think the OT discussion has been amazingly civil and respectful. As it happens, I will be voting Democrat because I feel they are in touch with, and care about, the people that the Republicans have referred to as the 47% they’re not interested in reaching. My reasons have to do with the way the most vulnerable among us would be treated under each party. I feel people like most of us, who are sort of getting by or not quite getting by or getting by only because we get a pension or disability or whatever, need people in government who are interested in reaching us. Diane R. From:Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lee Evans Sent: Friday, October 05, 2012 2:54 PM To: felvtalk Subject: [Felvtalk] (no subject) In the middle of our chit-chat about politics and hunters and vegetarian diets, if someone had come in with the subject line: Cat Bitten by Cobra, we would have been off the chatty stuff in an instant and onto Google to look up what could be done for the cat while the caregiver was taking him to the vet emergency clinic. So if we wander around the hospital isles occasionally when everyone is asleep and babble a bit, don't worry. We can switch in a moment. I actually did switch when I saw how agonized you were and posted about vets treating FeLv cats differently from non-FeLv cats to get us back on topic. But occasionally on every specialized list I have been on there is a subject with OT listed and then it's either a funny article copied from a magazine or other online source or some cute pictures of cats doing silly things, or even a heated political discussion about who will be President and how it would effect our ability to financially keep our heads above water and still feed our rescues and take our cats to the vet when needed. It really does tie into the FeLv+ cat group because we are very money intensive in trying to keep our rescued special needs cats as healthy as can be for as long as can be. If I lose my Social Security and Medicare benefits or they are reduced, I would have to cut down on food for myself and air conditioning in the summer and heat
Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
Alev, I am so sorry this has happened to you and River. River is a beautiful name, btw, and one I gave to a rescue cat we took in recently. I don't know what else to say other than I am hoping you someday find peace with what has happened knowing your intentions were only the best, and you only wanted to help her. Some of these types of shelters have come a long way, but still have a long way to go. They can be ignorant and misinformed and how could you have known this? Best to you, Janine From: Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Tue, October 16, 2012 1:12:13 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat Hi Christiane, Thank you so much...I am so sorry to find out about all these a little too late...Yes, they show kittens, young cats, but very few seniors on their website for adoption...They are a kill shelter and people do not know this. People are happily donating money thinking they are helping the animals, but they are helping them to be killed too. What can I do to change this? I want to send them an email, what should I say? I want to say the right things and not sound like a crazy woman... Thank you so much for your kind words, maybe River will be the reason that this shelter does something about their policy. You (and the animals in that area) are very lucky. Take care, Alev From: Christiane Biagi ti...@mindspring.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:49 PM Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat The caveat to the “no kill” (as defined in the Asilomar Accords) is that all it means is they will not kill adoptable animals. Unfortunately, its up to the individual shelter/rescue to define what they consider “adoptable”. All too often, facilities that advertise themselves as “no kill” really mean that they will kill all ill, senior, problem behavior, etc. animals but never kill a healthy easily adoptable animals. These kinds of facilities never ever publish their euthanasia matrix” which is where they define their policy on who they will kill. True no kills (as we think it means as defined by Nathan Winograd) are tough to find. I volunteer for one such shelter in New Orleans (ARNO) the handful of animals they’ve put down have been terminally ill animals who were either comatose or in intractable pain. They never put down for fiv or felv! The shelter you cited clearly is a kill shelter why they wouldn’t have alerted you to the cat’s test results given you some time demonstrates an attitude that is unfortunately all too common. I’m so sorry this happened to you but please know that River had love from you—something she likely hadn’t had in a very long time. From:Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Alev Durmus Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Spaying advice
The stress of an unspayed female is great, I think much greater than the spaying itself. And it may be true that pyometria is more common in dogs, but boy have we seen plenty in outside cats, even young ones. One couldn't have been more than a year old and we had no idea her slightly swollen belly was pyometria. And have h ad a few with mammary cancer also. Not worth it. Use a decent vet and get your cat spayed! From: Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Tue, November 20, 2012 8:57:09 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Spaying advice Amen to that sister. My cat Cookie, long ago, was borderline diabetic. The vet didn't want to subject her to anesthesia because he said she was an older cat and might develop full blown diabetes since she was on the edge. So I didn't have her spayed. She went into her heat cycle several more times, then gave it up as a bad idea. She lived an additional 5 years with me as a house feral. One day I noticed blood on her chair towel (I use towels to cover the plastic chairs in my house. Everything here has to be washable). I also noticed that Cookie was acting very lethargic. I finally got her into a carrier. At the clinic they flipped her over and I was horrified. All her nipples were black, some were enlarged, two were bleeding. She had severe mammary cancer. The vet said she was probably in pain. There was nothing I could do. He gave her a pain injection. She became drowsy and I allowed him to euthanize her. I will NEVER NOT SPAY a cat. Male cats can get prostate cancer. There is no proven reason why cats and dogs can't be spayed and neutered. Humans have the operation all the time for ovarian cancer and prostate cancer. If physicians didn't do hysterectomies on women with cancer or with precancerous lesions the cancers would metastasize and more people would die. In addition, try and get an intact spraying male cat or howling female cat adopted. It will just not work. Or, as an alternative, get the female's tubes tied and give the male a vasectomy and you still have all the mating behavior in addition to the operations costing almost a thousand dollars as opposed to spay/neuter that can be had for a cost as low as $15 including rabies shot. I want to add that my mother, a registered nurse at the time, forbade me to have any of our yard cats neutered or spayed citing the ridiculous argument that animals and people have to be left natural. Consequently I allowed two intact cats to remain that way, filling my yard with 7 kittens who, although I didn't know it, were FeLv positive and active for the disease. They all died. Had I spayed and neutered mom and dad cat, I would have saved 7 kittens from being born and dying in illness and discomfort and possibly saved mom and dad cats from wandering away to spread the disease all over the neighborhood. Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors too! From: Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2012 11:15 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Spaying advice I'm not going to start an argument over one study. Being in heat was very stressful on the one of the 1st FeLV cats I had. The spay was easy she recovered quickly. My cats have all been spayed. We've had cats live well into their 20's - all spayed. Cats who still have their ovaries, which are responsible for heat cycles, are much more likely to develop mammary cancer. Cats ( dogs) can also develop an infection in their uterus (pyometra) from not being spayed.. There is just not enough evidence out there to make me even think about not getting my cats, FeLV or not, spayed. Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] raw food FeLV pos cats
Amen to that and great point about all the salmonella from commercial food! My house has been a great experiment in raw vs commercial. While feeding a raw food diet (same one as on catnutrition.org) my cats rarely had a hairball, never had crystals or any type of cystitis, had sleek coats and great muscle tone. And they were members of the clean plate club every single meal. While NOT feeding a raw diet, it's been hairballs the size of small mice, excessive shedding, dental disease, IBD, one poor guy with crystals, fussier eaters and too many cats with intestinal lymphoma. And more than one cat eating paper... Janine From: Tracey Shrout dtshr...@gmail.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sat, March 16, 2013 11:59:30 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] raw food FeLV pos cats KG, very well said...I wholeheartedly agree! On Sat, Mar 16, 2013 at 11:51 AM, KG BarnCats kgbarnc...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, For several years I have primarily fed home made raw to my horde of cats (FELV + separated) and dogs, and have never had any food related problem whatsoever. They are in wonderful condition. I do mix in some fish as a treat every week or so, but it is canned tuna, mackerel, or sardines (all in water, not oil). I carefully follow a balanced recipe with no grains, starches, veggies. I make a point of being very well read on the publicized risks but I think they are very overstated - after all, raw is what cats evolved to eat over millions of years. Their digestive systems are short and acidic. Most vets are poorly trained on nutrition and much of that training comes via the pet food industry, which makes a bundle selling biologically inappropriate grain laden, carb heavy, overproccessed, overpriced crap. Of course they fear-monger about raw food, even for cats with perfectly healthy immune systems. As if dry food hasn't been proven to have frequent contamination with salmonella etc. No human has ever been shown to catch disease from raw food, but there are loads of cases of people getting it from commercial pet food. And that doesn't even begin to address the factors of salivary enzymes as the cat gnaws chunks of meat/bone, or the enzymes and nutrients destroyed by the disgusting rendering process, or the plastic and filth cooked in with the often rancid ingredients. Or the risk of tainted ingredients. Or the fact that cats are far less healthy overall than they were 50 years ago... just research the huge jump in diabetes, obesity, kidney disease, cancer, etc. Why do most cats now routinely die in their early teens at best, when they used to live so much longer? Why? If one believes that fresh, natural food is better for people than processed food, then why treat animals any different? I believe sick or immunocompromised animals need more nutrition, not less. They need the best quality food possible, and I think that is the food they evolved to eat. I wish I could feed whole prey, but it's unaffordable. On the other hand, homemade raw is made with far better ingredients yet costs so much less than commercial food - about 35 cents a day. Which do you trust more? Millions of years of mother nature's success, or the money-motivated pet food industry? Ok, getting off soapbox now. :) Kg On Saturday, March 16, 2013, Maryam Ulomi ava...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Carrie, I am so sorry to hear about your kitties. And I am praying they get better very soon. I had put a post up asking the group about raw food for FeLV cats but no one responded or commented about using that for their cats. I have read that for FeLV cats it might be a hazard because their systems cannot withstand any challenges from parasites. Also I have read that seafood is not recommended for FeLV cats so I do not feed any seafood to mine. I am trying to find a holistic vet to start my FeLV cat on a special diet but it's always best to be in contact with a vet when starting the home cook diet or a raw diet. If the cats are sick l would take them to vet so they can be treated right away, with FeLV early prevention is the best policy. Hope this helps, please send an update soon. Sent from my iPad On Mar 15, 2013, at 23:45, Carrie Rosenblatt oecb11...@yahoo.com wrote: hi. I saw this online - and wondered what you found out about raw food for FeLV cats. I had one at my apt for a night, and gave him homemade food, which was made with raw meat, but no pieces of meat was in what I gave him, just the grains and tuna and supplements, but I was wondering if the juice or residue from the raw meat could have hurt him, as he is very sick and getting worse. cr ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] metacam and prednisone
I am so not a fan of metacam either, other than one or two days. More than one day is off label and for good reason. Agree with Susan, use torbulgesic or buprenex, which addresses cancer pain much better. I don't get why vets continue to use metacam. Maybe they will stop when they have a cat go into kidney failure, which is why my vet stopped using it. I would say talk to another vet about this, not the ones recommending the metacam. Janine From: Susan Hoffman susan_hoff...@yahoo.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sun, May 19, 2013 9:31:03 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] metacam and prednisone I'm a fan of metacam. I've never used it in an FeLV cat and you cannot use it if a cat has kidney issues, but for mild pains, like aches and sprains and arthritis, it helps. But it's given in a tiny amount, weight-based, and only every two or three days. Don't overdo it. Also, it is an antinflammatory so I would not give it with pred. I'vr never had it prescribed with pred. For a tumor however you may need a stronger pain med, like torbulgesic or buprenex, so talk to your vet about this. From: Lance lini...@fastmail.fm To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2013 5:58 PM Subject: [Felvtalk] metacam and prednisone Hi all, I posted recently about my FeLV+ girl, Ember. Since she most likely has (at least) a lung tumor, I'm going to get her on pain meds soon, despite the fact that most of the differences in her behavior are minor. Our second opinion vet prescribed metacam, and an oncologist who consulted with Ember's primary vet also recommended metacam. These are smart, experienced folks with lots of education. But, I'm seeing so much outcry over metacam online that I'm very reluctant to give it to Ember. I'd love to ease any discomfort she might be having, and metacam would be easy to give. What are your thoughts on metacam? I'm also wondering if prednisone might be helpful in reducing any inflammation that Ember is dealing with. I know people on the list have used it, but I'm concerned about its ability to create low wbc. Ember already has that issue, due to being FeLV+. Would folks who have pred experience in FeLV+ cats mind posting your experiences? Thanks, Lance ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] OT-diatomaceous earth - warning
I am sorry, I haven't been following this thread but caught the diatomaceous warning. Hoping they still make this, but 1-800-flea busters out of FL. is my favorite product to use. It's a little work, but I think I was over zealous the first year. Third yr I used it, I was not so diligent, but it worked just fine. It is safe, and it lasts a year and that's the real bonus. Takes a few weeks to work, but it really does. Janine From: Lorrie felineres...@frontier.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, July 1, 2013 5:07 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] OT-diatomaceous earth - warning Very scary Beth, Thanks for the warning. On 07-01, Beth wrote: I don't want to start a barrage of OT emails with this post. Just a quick warnng to be careful I tried the food grade diatomaceous earth this weekend to try to stop the fleas. I have all hardwood floors - really old ones, with lots of crevices for the flea eggs to hide in. I wore a good sanding mask which blocks small particles. I opened the windows (as many as I could without danger of the cats getting out). I sprinkled it in the product on the floors using a sieve. I gently swept it into the cracks in the floor in my bedroom hallway. If did not create any visible dust clouds, etc. I went outside, took the mask off sat for a bit. When I went back inside I could not breath. My mouth immediately became parched my throat started closing. I grabbed some water went back outside. I spent the rest of the day with the mask back on washing the floors trying to get rid of the stuff. Please be careful. I am a very active, relatively young person. I don't have breathing issues. This was quite scary. In addition to the breathing issues, some of it got on my skin it just burned. Again, yes, this was the food grade kind. I know people on this list use it have no problems. That's great. But if you have not tried it, please be careful if you do. Try it in a very small area, first. I guess I will go back to vacuuming flea combing. I may use the rest in the yard since most of the problem seems to be my dog bringing them in from outside. Beth ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
