Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Hi Andrew. When I was living on DC I used to go to a gas station new Mt Airy Maryland and buy B100 at the pump. I would fill up my tank and then another four five gallon yellow diesel fuel containers in my trunk. This would last me about three months. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 16, 2011, at 4:40 PM, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: I have pretty much ruled out becoming a home distiller after reading all these excellent posts. The better choice would appear to be installing a system in the car to burn filtered WVO. On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 1:21 PM, ernest breakfield erne...@backyardengineering.org wrote: Andrew, will find much information and disinformation on the topic of BioD here and elsewhere. (for example, the horror stories you hear about BioD eating fuel lines; i've got over 70,000 miles on almost exclusively straight BioD on the same fuel lines that were in my '85 300D when i started using BioD over 7 years ago, and there still hasn't been any evidence of any need to change them. all you need to do if you're using quality fuel is watch them like you'd watch any other fuel lines from a previous decade, and change them out when they show signs of needing it.) as for availability of source oil, it's unlikely that anyone outside of your area will be able to tell you what the actual availability is in your area, and even then it'll vary from restaurant to restaurant. (generally, cleaner/less used WVO is better; sushi joints usually have cleaner and less overused oil than burger joints.) bottom line, if it's only cost effectiveness you're looking for you have to figure out if it's even worth it to you to go through the hassles of making BioD. even if the source oil is free and your time is worth nothing, how much would you need to use before the savings would pay for the equipment and the energy to run it? if you're only using ~10G/wk, it'd be over a year before you even paid for the equipment, and we're still not counting the cost of any of the chemicals. (i'm not even going to get into the byproduct waste disposal issue or the concerns about having some of those chemicals around, or the mess,... and am ignoring the fear-mongering about jackbooted thugs hired by renderers or our guvernment coming through your doors due to perceived tax and various regulatory issues. but if you check into it, you might find we can't even legally haul WVO without a renderers license and liability coverage!) if you're trying to use BioD for other reasons (like reducing petroleum dependency, environmental concerns, or just the joy of experimental hobbying,) your calculations of whether it's worth the fuss might be different. in that case, i'd probably encourage searching our your local B99 vendor and buying commercially produced stuff, and let someone else deal with all the issues. cheers! e On 15/Jul/11 10:59, andrew strasfogel wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.**html http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
I'm not opposed to WVO conversions per-say, I'm opposed to poor WVO conversions. Unfortunately it seems like the bulk of them are poor conversions. A boat gas tank in the trunk is a poor conversion, its the hallmark of a poor conversion as a matter of fact. A good conversion pre-heats the oil with engine coolant and then final heats electrically at the injection lines so the oil is hot hot when it goes into the injectors which ensures proper atomization, anything else is junk. Poor atomization is the real problem, IP killing is a secondary issue. Honestly Andrew, you don't drive enough to even consider it. I use ~ 15 gallons a week in a car that gets half again better mileage (190D 2.2l) so we can safely assume I drive more than twice as much as you. (around 30k a year) With WVO you won't be able to run on WVO all that much because you won't be getting the oil hot with your pre-heat plus you need a purge cycle before shutdown... I've been down this same road spec-ing out the idea, if I had a really easy source of lots of oil I'd consider WVO but I'd plan on $1000 at LEAST for my conversion. Then theres still that sticky paying road tax thing... -Curt Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2011 22:50:27 -0400 From: andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: CAC35L=s4znX5nf-B3ntZ5OF=X6tN03-_6sNV7di=07fdbty...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I have seen a 1983 300D converted to a dual system run without any problems on WVO and regular diesel. If I did a conversion it would be to my other car, the 1983 300TD with 325K miles. But don't hold your breath... On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 10:32 PM, Walt Zarnoch zarnoch...@gmail.com wrote: In my neck of the woods, the only way to buy a 617 is to wait for 3 years till one comes into a yard, buy a craigslist crackvertised car to strip then crush, or have one shipped in and pay big $$$. I guess that skews my perspective, but the viscosity difference is a real issue. The difference in HP needed to turn the pump can cause the injection advance mechanism on the intermediate shaft (behind vac pump) to not advance at it's set rate as well. It will run, you can drive, but I cringe whenever I see it done. It's up to the person doing it to evaluate what the time filtering, processing, etc is worth to them. I personally will pay the cash for the pre-made Bio or petro, since my time is worth more to me than the money going into the tank. You can always make more money. You can never make more time. Walt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
here in the SF Bay area, running WVO was so popular for a while that there's an abundance of 616s and 617s in the local yards. AAMOF, you can't give away a non-running 617 now to some local junkyards unless you tow it to their front door and sign it over; that's how many of them were killed by people running WVO in them (with and without conversions). i'm of the opinion that all the heating customizations that Curt mentions are absolutely necessary, and that's not necessarily enough. $1000 for a conversion is probably toward the minimum, and that might not be enough. even still, i've seen vehicles that had the most proper conversions and still had problems, and they all seem to have the same thing in common; they were used for short commutes. those short commutes were too short to get everything hot enough, and they didn't get the engine oil hot enough for long enough to evaporate all the crud that would get into the engine oil. bottom line; if you don't have a good long commute and want to keep your car for a while, WVO conversions probably aren't for you. buy BioD instead. cheers! e On 17/Jul/11 14:49, Curt Raymond wrote: I'm not opposed to WVO conversions per-say, I'm opposed to poor WVO conversions. Unfortunately it seems like the bulk of them are poor conversions. A boat gas tank in the trunk is a poor conversion, its the hallmark of a poor conversion as a matter of fact. A good conversion pre-heats the oil with engine coolant and then final heats electrically at the injection lines so the oil is hot hot when it goes into the injectors which ensures proper atomization, anything else is junk. Poor atomization is the real problem, IP killing is a secondary issue. Honestly Andrew, you don't drive enough to even consider it. I use ~ 15 gallons a week in a car that gets half again better mileage (190D 2.2l) so we can safely assume I drive more than twice as much as you. (around 30k a year) With WVO you won't be able to run on WVO all that much because you won't be getting the oil hot with your pre-heat plus you need a purge cycle before shutdown... I've been down this same road spec-ing out the idea, if I had a really easy source of lots of oil I'd consider WVO but I'd plan on $1000 at LEAST for my conversion. Then theres still that sticky paying road tax thing... -Curt Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2011 22:50:27 -0400 From: andrew strasfogelastrasfo...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion Listmercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: CAC35L=s4znX5nf-B3ntZ5OF=X6tN03-_6sNV7di=07fdbty...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I have seen a 1983 300D converted to a dual system run without any problems on WVO and regular diesel. If I did a conversion it would be to my other car, the 1983 300TD with 325K miles. But don't hold your breath... On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 10:32 PM, Walt Zarnochzarnoch...@gmail.com wrote: In my neck of the woods, the only way to buy a 617 is to wait for 3 years till one comes into a yard, buy a craigslist crackvertised car to strip then crush, or have one shipped in and pay big $$$. I guess that skews my perspective, but the viscosity difference is a real issue. The difference in HP needed to turn the pump can cause the injection advance mechanism on the intermediate shaft (behind vac pump) to not advance at it's set rate as well. It will run, you can drive, but I cringe whenever I see it done. It's up to the person doing it to evaluate what the time filtering, processing, etc is worth to them. I personally will pay the cash for the pre-made Bio or petro, since my time is worth more to me than the money going into the tank. You can always make more money. You can never make more time. Walt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Ok, maybe I should have used lurk vice post. Max -- Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: Hey I have NEVER knowingly posted on Banned. I can barely survive the polite list. On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 7:08 PM, Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.netwrote: Banned is a great place for such, and today I learned that Andrew also posts there... Max -- Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: Let me suggest that you folks stick to talking about MB's and leave politics alone. --R On 7/15/11 3:48 PM, Dieselhead wrote: Andrew's friends at the EPA are making cities clamp down on grease disposal. The city is making every food prep operation, not just restaurants, but prison, schools and hospitals, nursing homes etc. Even the neighborhood daycare, if they prepare meals... install a grease separator system to replace the relatively simple grease traps. These grease separators are thousands of dollars and there is essentially no benefit in the end, other than the grease load at the muni WWT plant is presumably lighter. The owner no longer can clean the thing themselves, but HAVE TO (all hail marx, lenin and stalin) hire an approved collection company (generally owned by guys who hire guys with dark glasses to break bones) to pick up the grease and empty these grease separators. The only way you will get used fry oil is if someone fried a turkey in the backyard, or if your community has not yet implemented these draconian measures. This has been implemented by the bummer administration to make sure that nobody can make homebrew BioD to compete with the oil companies. On the open market, Yellow grease (Used fry oil) is trading at 45 cents per pound in the east coast region.. (today's Jacobsen report) That is $3.38 per gallon for feedstock. Add $.75 per gallon for processing costs. Andrew, since you are a card carrying liberal, we know you would not dream of not paying the appropriate fuel taxes so add whatever the DC tax is, plus the federal tax. This is in the neighborhood of $.50 per gallon. Now your costs, not counting time, are $4.63 per gallon. How much are you saving? Then you need to buy a pickup to gather oil, etc, etc. And the EPA will come around and declare your backyard a hazardous waste area, and charge you with illegal disposal of hazardous waste. Add those fines and lawyer costs to your per gallon price. BTW, in small lots, you can't buy yellow grease for .45 a lb. that is for semi loads or rail car lots. STOP! (Since you asked) The chemicals are easy, before you do anything stockpile 100 gallons (2x 55 gallon drums) of the oil to prove that there are lots of sources and to prove to yourself that its something you want to go through on a consistent basis. I think you'll find your sources of fat are MUCH more limited than you previously though. Unlike what the bio-digester folks usually tell you restaurants don't usually have to pay to get rid of their fryer oil... -Curt Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 13:59:34 -0400 From: andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: CAC35L=tQbUeALWYynj-68aYvP1rDoswzk27t+xUohyFbADrf=q...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Andrew, will find much information and disinformation on the topic of BioD here and elsewhere. (for example, the horror stories you hear about BioD eating fuel lines; i've got over 70,000 miles on almost exclusively straight BioD on the same fuel lines that were in my '85 300D when i started using BioD over 7 years ago, and there still hasn't been any evidence of any need to change them. all you need to do if you're using quality fuel is watch them like you'd watch any other fuel lines from a previous decade, and change them out when they show signs of needing it.) as for availability of source oil, it's unlikely that anyone outside of your area will be able to tell you what the actual availability is in your area, and even then it'll vary from restaurant to restaurant. (generally, cleaner/less used WVO is better; sushi joints usually have cleaner and less overused oil than burger joints.) bottom line, if it's only cost effectiveness you're looking for you have to figure out if it's even worth it to you to go through the hassles of making BioD. even if the source oil is free and your time is worth nothing, how much would you need to use before the savings would pay for the equipment and the energy to run it? if you're only using ~10G/wk, it'd be over a year before you even paid for the equipment, and we're still not counting the cost of any of the chemicals. (i'm not even going to get into the byproduct waste disposal issue or the concerns about having some of those chemicals around, or the mess,... and am ignoring the fear-mongering about jackbooted thugs hired by renderers or our guvernment coming through your doors due to perceived tax and various regulatory issues. but if you check into it, you might find we can't even legally haul WVO without a renderers license and liability coverage!) if you're trying to use BioD for other reasons (like reducing petroleum dependency, environmental concerns, or just the joy of experimental hobbying,) your calculations of whether it's worth the fuss might be different. in that case, i'd probably encourage searching our your local B99 vendor and buying commercially produced stuff, and let someone else deal with all the issues. cheers! e On 15/Jul/11 10:59, andrew strasfogel wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
I have pretty much ruled out becoming a home distiller after reading all these excellent posts. The better choice would appear to be installing a system in the car to burn filtered WVO. On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 1:21 PM, ernest breakfield erne...@backyardengineering.org wrote: Andrew, will find much information and disinformation on the topic of BioD here and elsewhere. (for example, the horror stories you hear about BioD eating fuel lines; i've got over 70,000 miles on almost exclusively straight BioD on the same fuel lines that were in my '85 300D when i started using BioD over 7 years ago, and there still hasn't been any evidence of any need to change them. all you need to do if you're using quality fuel is watch them like you'd watch any other fuel lines from a previous decade, and change them out when they show signs of needing it.) as for availability of source oil, it's unlikely that anyone outside of your area will be able to tell you what the actual availability is in your area, and even then it'll vary from restaurant to restaurant. (generally, cleaner/less used WVO is better; sushi joints usually have cleaner and less overused oil than burger joints.) bottom line, if it's only cost effectiveness you're looking for you have to figure out if it's even worth it to you to go through the hassles of making BioD. even if the source oil is free and your time is worth nothing, how much would you need to use before the savings would pay for the equipment and the energy to run it? if you're only using ~10G/wk, it'd be over a year before you even paid for the equipment, and we're still not counting the cost of any of the chemicals. (i'm not even going to get into the byproduct waste disposal issue or the concerns about having some of those chemicals around, or the mess,... and am ignoring the fear-mongering about jackbooted thugs hired by renderers or our guvernment coming through your doors due to perceived tax and various regulatory issues. but if you check into it, you might find we can't even legally haul WVO without a renderers license and liability coverage!) if you're trying to use BioD for other reasons (like reducing petroleum dependency, environmental concerns, or just the joy of experimental hobbying,) your calculations of whether it's worth the fuss might be different. in that case, i'd probably encourage searching our your local B99 vendor and buying commercially produced stuff, and let someone else deal with all the issues. cheers! e On 15/Jul/11 10:59, andrew strasfogel wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.**html http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
So after months of effort and untold hundreds of dollars, you finally restore your car to original condition, and now you will butcher it to be able to burn waste oil? This modification and use (some would say abuse) will decrease the value of the car. I also get the feeling that your pay is so high that if you worked just one hour of overtime every two weeks you pay for all the fuel you use in a month, so you are economically penalizing yourself to spend any amount of time collecting and filtering waste oil. Max -- Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: I have pretty much ruled out becoming a home distiller after reading all these excellent posts. The better choice would appear to be installing a system in the car to burn filtered WVO. On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 1:21 PM, ernest breakfield erne...@backyardengineering.org wrote: Andrew, will find much information and disinformation on the topic of BioD here and elsewhere. (for example, the horror stories you hear about BioD eating fuel lines; i've got over 70,000 miles on almost exclusively straight BioD on the same fuel lines that were in my '85 300D when i started using BioD over 7 years ago, and there still hasn't been any evidence of any need to change them. all you need to do if you're using quality fuel is watch them like you'd watch any other fuel lines from a previous decade, and change them out when they show signs of needing it.) as for availability of source oil, it's unlikely that anyone outside of your area will be able to tell you what the actual availability is in your area, and even then it'll vary from restaurant to restaurant. (generally, cleaner/less used WVO is better; sushi joints usually have cleaner and less overused oil than burger joints.) bottom line, if it's only cost effectiveness you're looking for you have to figure out if it's even worth it to you to go through the hassles of making BioD. even if the source oil is free and your time is worth nothing, how much would you need to use before the savings would pay for the equipment and the energy to run it? if you're only using ~10G/wk, it'd be over a year before you even paid for the equipment, and we're still not counting the cost of any of the chemicals. (i'm not even going to get into the byproduct waste disposal issue or the concerns about having some of those chemicals around, or the mess,... and am ignoring the fear-mongering about jackbooted thugs hired by renderers or our guvernment coming through your doors due to perceived tax and various regulatory issues. but if you check into it, you might find we can't even legally haul WVO without a renderers license and liability coverage!) if you're trying to use BioD for other reasons (like reducing petroleum dependency, environmental concerns, or just the joy of experimental hobbying,) your calculations of whether it's worth the fuss might be different. in that case, i'd probably encourage searching our your local B99 vendor and buying commercially produced stuff, and let someone else deal with all the issues. cheers! e On 15/Jul/11 10:59, andrew strasfogel wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.**html http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html; _ **_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/; To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com; _ **_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/; To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com; _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Interesting analogy. How much can you buy a used OM617 injection pump for? I see running parts cars for $500-$1500. I paid $1100 for my 83 300d(you should see it.Mann filters, Conti belts, MBZ fluids always, clean as a whistle under the hood...). At the current $4.15 per gallon if I run nothing but wvo it will take a bit over 200 gallons to pay for the car in full. 200 gallons @ 25mpg or so = 5000 miles. That doesn't take long. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 6:17 PM, Walt Zarnoch zarnoch...@gmail.com wrote: Fuel viscosity is different, pump takes more HP to do it's job, more mechanical stress... WVO is good if you get the viscosity under control, filter it, dry it, biocide it, etc. It works, but in the same way that using 1's for TP works... Walt On Jul 15, 2011 5:58 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: Look at it this way.screw up once filtering oil and replace filters. Screw up once making BD and die or risk pump failure. Your choice. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 5:50 PM, Dimitri Seretakis dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote: Too much modification will devalue the car. BD is easier. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2011, at 5:43 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: To heck with making biodiesel! Convert your car to run wvo, filter it very well and make sure it has no suspended water. Anyone that tells you it won't work right is full of it. Been doing it for years and have yet to have a veggie oil related failure. Clean, clean, clean oil is the secret to success. Gravity is your friend, let the oil settle and only filter from the top. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 2:00 PM, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
In my neck of the woods, the only way to buy a 617 is to wait for 3 years till one comes into a yard, buy a craigslist crackvertised car to strip then crush, or have one shipped in and pay big $$$. I guess that skews my perspective, but the viscosity difference is a real issue. The difference in HP needed to turn the pump can cause the injection advance mechanism on the intermediate shaft (behind vac pump) to not advance at it's set rate as well. It will run, you can drive, but I cringe whenever I see it done. It's up to the person doing it to evaluate what the time filtering, processing, etc is worth to them. I personally will pay the cash for the pre-made Bio or petro, since my time is worth more to me than the money going into the tank. You can always make more money. You can never make more time. Walt On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 9:20 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting analogy. How much can you buy a used OM617 injection pump for? I see running parts cars for $500-$1500. I paid $1100 for my 83 300d(you should see it.Mann filters, Conti belts, MBZ fluids always, clean as a whistle under the hood...). At the current $4.15 per gallon if I run nothing but wvo it will take a bit over 200 gallons to pay for the car in full. 200 gallons @ 25mpg or so = 5000 miles. That doesn't take long. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 6:17 PM, Walt Zarnoch zarnoch...@gmail.com wrote: Fuel viscosity is different, pump takes more HP to do it's job, more mechanical stress... WVO is good if you get the viscosity under control, filter it, dry it, biocide it, etc. It works, but in the same way that using 1's for TP works... Walt On Jul 15, 2011 5:58 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: Look at it this way.screw up once filtering oil and replace filters. Screw up once making BD and die or risk pump failure. Your choice. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 5:50 PM, Dimitri Seretakis dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote: Too much modification will devalue the car. BD is easier. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2011, at 5:43 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: To heck with making biodiesel! Convert your car to run wvo, filter it very well and make sure it has no suspended water. Anyone that tells you it won't work right is full of it. Been doing it for years and have yet to have a veggie oil related failure. Clean, clean, clean oil is the secret to success. Gravity is your friend, let the oil settle and only filter from the top. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 2:00 PM, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
I have seen a 1983 300D converted to a dual system run without any problems on WVO and regular diesel. If I did a conversion it would be to my other car, the 1983 300TD with 325K miles. But don't hold your breath... On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 10:32 PM, Walt Zarnoch zarnoch...@gmail.com wrote: In my neck of the woods, the only way to buy a 617 is to wait for 3 years till one comes into a yard, buy a craigslist crackvertised car to strip then crush, or have one shipped in and pay big $$$. I guess that skews my perspective, but the viscosity difference is a real issue. The difference in HP needed to turn the pump can cause the injection advance mechanism on the intermediate shaft (behind vac pump) to not advance at it's set rate as well. It will run, you can drive, but I cringe whenever I see it done. It's up to the person doing it to evaluate what the time filtering, processing, etc is worth to them. I personally will pay the cash for the pre-made Bio or petro, since my time is worth more to me than the money going into the tank. You can always make more money. You can never make more time. Walt On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 9:20 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting analogy. How much can you buy a used OM617 injection pump for? I see running parts cars for $500-$1500. I paid $1100 for my 83 300d(you should see it.Mann filters, Conti belts, MBZ fluids always, clean as a whistle under the hood...). At the current $4.15 per gallon if I run nothing but wvo it will take a bit over 200 gallons to pay for the car in full. 200 gallons @ 25mpg or so = 5000 miles. That doesn't take long. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 6:17 PM, Walt Zarnoch zarnoch...@gmail.com wrote: Fuel viscosity is different, pump takes more HP to do it's job, more mechanical stress... WVO is good if you get the viscosity under control, filter it, dry it, biocide it, etc. It works, but in the same way that using 1's for TP works... Walt On Jul 15, 2011 5:58 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: Look at it this way.screw up once filtering oil and replace filters. Screw up once making BD and die or risk pump failure. Your choice. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 5:50 PM, Dimitri Seretakis dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote: Too much modification will devalue the car. BD is easier. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2011, at 5:43 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: To heck with making biodiesel! Convert your car to run wvo, filter it very well and make sure it has no suspended water. Anyone that tells you it won't work right is full of it. Been doing it for years and have yet to have a veggie oil related failure. Clean, clean, clean oil is the secret to success. Gravity is your friend, let the oil settle and only filter from the top. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 2:00 PM, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To
[MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Don't buy it! Processing BioD needs to happen in a pressure sealed environment at around 135-140F. HDPE will break down when exposed to NaOH/KOH and Methanol/Ethanol under heat and pressure. Pressure is generated during the mixture of Lye/Methanol AND when that is mixed with the heated oil. A metal tank is a much better way to process BioD. Bring this question over to the BioD list and I'll help more if you'd like to make your own home BioD for $300-400 or less. Luther KB5QHUOak Park, IL '87 300SDL (312,xxx mi) '91 Dodge Ram 150 (290,xxx mi) On 7/15/2011 12:59 PM, andrew strasfogel wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Check with the restaurants first. They may be required to deal with licensed 'hazardous waste' companies only. And a few years ago it looked like biofuels would make fry oil a commodity item to sell rather than a waste item to pay for disposal of. Funny how we don't hear as much about biodiesel as we did a few years ago, maybe fry oil is still trash. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
I found one on ebay that looks and sounds very cool: http://cgi.ebay.com/Biodiesel-Processor-65g-batch-size-Full-draining-tanks-/260711009292?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0hash=item3cb3964c0c On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 2:47 PM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote: Check with the restaurants first. They may be required to deal with licensed 'hazardous waste' companies only. And a few years ago it looked like biofuels would make fry oil a commodity item to sell rather than a waste item to pay for disposal of. Funny how we don't hear as much about biodiesel as we did a few years ago, maybe fry oil is still trash. Mitch. __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
What's the link to the biodiesel list, Luther? On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 2:06 PM, Benz Hogs benz-n-h...@gulseth.net wrote: Don't buy it! Processing BioD needs to happen in a pressure sealed environment at around 135-140F. HDPE will break down when exposed to NaOH/KOH and Methanol/Ethanol under heat and pressure. Pressure is generated during the mixture of Lye/Methanol AND when that is mixed with the heated oil. A metal tank is a much better way to process BioD. Bring this question over to the BioD list and I'll help more if you'd like to make your own home BioD for $300-400 or less. Luther KB5QHUOak Park, IL '87 300SDL (312,xxx mi) '91 Dodge Ram 150 (290,xxx mi) On 7/15/2011 12:59 PM, andrew strasfogel wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.**html http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
andrew strasfogel wrote: What's the link to the biodiesel list, Luther? http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/biodiesel_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
I am already a member but haven't received anything in eons. On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 3:00 PM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote: andrew strasfogel wrote: What's the link to the biodiesel list, Luther? http://okiebenz.com/mailman/**listinfo/biodiesel_okiebenz.**comhttp://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/biodiesel_okiebenz.com __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Restaurants are getting paid for their oil now I think, so you will have to get in line. Plus, you have to figure out what to do with all the glycerin and nasty leftover chemicals. And being in DC BTW the boy is moving to DC in a coupla weeks to go to Gtown Med, I get to go move him in Aug 1 and hang around a coupla days for the opening ceremony. Maybe I'll buy you a beer and you can tell me how wonderful Obama is, if you still have a job then. --R On 7/15/11 2:56 PM, andrew strasfogel wrote: I found one on ebay that looks and sounds very cool: http://cgi.ebay.com/Biodiesel-Processor-65g-batch-size-Full-draining-tanks-/260711009292?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0hash=item3cb3964c0c On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 2:47 PM, Mitch Haleym...@voyager.net wrote: Check with the restaurants first. They may be required to deal with licensed 'hazardous waste' companies only. And a few years ago it looked like biofuels would make fry oil a commodity item to sell rather than a waste item to pay for disposal of. Funny how we don't hear as much about biodiesel as we did a few years ago, maybe fry oil is still trash. Mitch. __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
If you use KOH (Potassium hydroxide) instead of NaOH, the lefover glycerin (after you boil any extra Methanol off) is compostable and biodegradable, unlike NaOh-glycerin, which has a large component of salt Luther KB5QHUOak Park, IL '87 300SDL (312,xxx mi) '91 Dodge Ram 150 (290,xxx mi) On 7/15/2011 2:08 PM, Rich Thomas wrote: Restaurants are getting paid for their oil now I think, so you will have to get in line. Plus, you have to figure out what to do with all the glycerin and nasty leftover chemicals. And being in DC BTW the boy is moving to DC in a coupla weeks to go to Gtown Med, I get to go move him in Aug 1 and hang around a coupla days for the opening ceremony. Maybe I'll buy you a beer and you can tell me how wonderful Obama is, if you still have a job then. --R On 7/15/11 2:56 PM, andrew strasfogel wrote: I found one on ebay that looks and sounds very cool: http://cgi.ebay.com/Biodiesel-Processor-65g-batch-size-Full-draining-tanks-/260711009292?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0hash=item3cb3964c0c On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 2:47 PM, Mitch Haleym...@voyager.net wrote: Check with the restaurants first. They may be required to deal with licensed 'hazardous waste' companies only. And a few years ago it looked like biofuels would make fry oil a commodity item to sell rather than a waste item to pay for disposal of. Funny how we don't hear as much about biodiesel as we did a few years ago, maybe fry oil is still trash. Mitch. __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Same problems with the Biobuddy...he's using a HDPE tank which will break down and have a leak eventually. Not a question of if it will leak but it will leak, just when? Luther KB5QHUOak Park, IL '87 300SDL (312,xxx mi) '91 Dodge Ram 150 (290,xxx mi) On 7/15/2011 1:56 PM, andrew strasfogel wrote: I found one on ebay that looks and sounds very cool: http://cgi.ebay.com/Biodiesel-Processor-65g-batch-size-Full-draining-tanks-/260711009292?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0hash=item3cb3964c0c On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 2:47 PM, Mitch Haleym...@voyager.net wrote: Check with the restaurants first. They may be required to deal with licensed 'hazardous waste' companies only. And a few years ago it looked like biofuels would make fry oil a commodity item to sell rather than a waste item to pay for disposal of. Funny how we don't hear as much about biodiesel as we did a few years ago, maybe fry oil is still trash. Mitch. __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
The chemicals are easy, before you do anything stockpile 100 gallons (2x 55 gallon drums) of the oil to prove that there are lots of sources and to prove to yourself that its something you want to go through on a consistent basis. I think you'll find your sources of fat are MUCH more limited than you previously though. Unlike what the bio-digester folks usually tell you restaurants don't usually have to pay to get rid of their fryer oil... -Curt Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 13:59:34 -0400 From: andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: CAC35L=tQbUeALWYynj-68aYvP1rDoswzk27t+xUohyFbADrf=q...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Thanks for the great input. The local Z Burger chain has a guy pick it up every Wednesday but they haven't seen him in awhile. I wonder if more frequent (2 or 3x weekly) pickups would be more appealing, although since my consumption.is probably on the order of 10 gallons/week I would probably not be able to keep up with their supplies. On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 3:19 PM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: The chemicals are easy, before you do anything stockpile 100 gallons (2x 55 gallon drums) of the oil to prove that there are lots of sources and to prove to yourself that its something you want to go through on a consistent basis. I think you'll find your sources of fat are MUCH more limited than you previously though. Unlike what the bio-digester folks usually tell you restaurants don't usually have to pay to get rid of their fryer oil... -Curt Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 13:59:34 -0400 From: andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: CAC35L=tQbUeALWYynj-68aYvP1rDoswzk27t+xUohyFbADrf=q...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Sure - let me know. What sort of story would you like to hear in exchange for a second beer? On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 3:08 PM, Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: Restaurants are getting paid for their oil now I think, so you will have to get in line. Plus, you have to figure out what to do with all the glycerin and nasty leftover chemicals. And being in DC BTW the boy is moving to DC in a coupla weeks to go to Gtown Med, I get to go move him in Aug 1 and hang around a coupla days for the opening ceremony. Maybe I'll buy you a beer and you can tell me how wonderful Obama is, if you still have a job then. --R On 7/15/11 2:56 PM, andrew strasfogel wrote: I found one on ebay that looks and sounds very cool: http://cgi.ebay.com/Biodiesel-**Processor-65g-batch-size-Full-** draining-tanks-/260711009292?**pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0hash=** item3cb3964c0chttp://cgi.ebay.com/Biodiesel-Processor-65g-batch-size-Full-draining-tanks-/260711009292?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0hash=item3cb3964c0c On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 2:47 PM, Mitch Haleym...@voyager.net wrote: Check with the restaurants first. They may be required to deal with licensed 'hazardous waste' companies only. And a few years ago it looked like biofuels would make fry oil a commodity item to sell rather than a waste item to pay for disposal of. Funny how we don't hear as much about biodiesel as we did a few years ago, maybe fry oil is still trash. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/ http://www.okiebenz.**com/archive/ http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com http://mail.**okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/**mercedes_okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Find others that would like to make BioD and form a Co-op to share reasources. Buying 5-10 lbs a at a time of KOH/NaOH is MUCH more expensive than a 1 time purchase of 50lbs or more. Start looking at http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/Biodiesel/ and http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/biodieselbasics/ for information and people close to you that might have a handle on your local environment for homeBioD. Luther KB5QHUOak Park, IL '87 300SDL (312,xxx mi) '91 Dodge Ram 150 (290,xxx mi) On 7/15/2011 2:28 PM, andrew strasfogel wrote: Thanks for the great input. The local Z Burger chain has a guy pick it up every Wednesday but they haven't seen him in awhile. I wonder if more frequent (2 or 3x weekly) pickups would be more appealing, although since my consumption.is probably on the order of 10 gallons/week I would probably not be able to keep up with their supplies. On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 3:19 PM, Curt Raymondcurtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: The chemicals are easy, before you do anything stockpile 100 gallons (2x 55 gallon drums) of the oil to prove that there are lots of sources and to prove to yourself that its something you want to go through on a consistent basis. I think you'll find your sources of fat are MUCH more limited than you previously though. Unlike what the bio-digester folks usually tell you restaurants don't usually have to pay to get rid of their fryer oil... -Curt Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 13:59:34 -0400 From: andrew strasfogelastrasfo...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion Listmercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: CAC35L=tQbUeALWYynj-68aYvP1rDoswzk27t+xUohyFbADrf=q...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Yeah, if you are talking about a restaurant that produces a lot of waste oil (such as McDonald's) they already have contracts with rendering companies to buy their used oil; if you try to siphon it out of the dumpster in back of the store you'll be charged with theft. If you know an independent restaurant owner you might be able to get oil, or not. All in all it's going to be harder than the WO proponents make it sounds, most restaurants are not sitting on tanker loads of oil begging someone to take it. Allan On Fri, 15 Jul 2011 14:47 -0400, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote: Check with the restaurants first. They may be required to deal with licensed 'hazardous waste' companies only. And a few years ago it looked like biofuels would make fry oil a commodity item to sell rather than a waste item to pay for disposal of. Funny how we don't hear as much about biodiesel as we did a few years ago, maybe fry oil is still trash. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
On 15/07/2011 2:32 PM, andrew strasfogel wrote: Sure - let me know. What sort of story would you like to hear in exchange for a second beer? On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 3:08 PM, Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: Restaurants are getting paid for their oil now I think, so you will have to get in line. Plus, you have to figure out what to do with all the glycerin and nasty leftover chemicals. And being in DC BTW the boy is moving to DC in a coupla weeks to go to Gtown Med, I get to go move him in Aug 1 and hang around a coupla days for the opening ceremony. Maybe I'll buy you a beer and you can tell me how wonderful Obama is, if you still have a job then. --R Let me suggest that you folks stick to talking about MB's and leave politics alone. Randy ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Don't forget to account for the increased expenses in injector and pump rebuilds. On Fri, 15 Jul 2011 13:59 -0400, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
That's horse crap if the BioD is properly washed and NOT rancid. Fuel system problems are mostly cause by the solvent nature of BioD washing out the crap that years of PetroD usage left behind. Other issues are due to soy oils being the quickest to go rancid, on the order of 6mo or so. Other oils (peanut, canola/rapeseed, corn) have a much longer shelf life and will not cause pitting of your fuel system. When the BioD is properly washed to rid it of excess methanol and lye, then dried to remove water, the ONLY downside is that it has less energy per molecule than diesel and your fuel economy will be less. Countering that, is that BioD has about 20% MORE oxygen than PetroD and burns much more completely. Luther KB5QHUOak Park, IL '87 300SDL (312,xxx mi) '91 Dodge Ram 150 (290,xxx mi) On 7/15/2011 2:41 PM, Allan Streib wrote: Don't forget to account for the increased expenses in injector and pump rebuilds. On Fri, 15 Jul 2011 13:59 -0400, andrew strasfogelastrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch. There's not one good answer to this. The worse the waste oil, and by worse I mean how degraded it has become with repeated use, the more acidic the oil becomes and the more lye is required to treat it. Lee ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Be prepared to dispose of the chunks of fries, chicken, etc that come in the bottom of the oil bin. They could be carefully burned for heat to warm oil Luther KB5QHUOak Park, IL '87 300SDL (312,xxx mi) '91 Dodge Ram 150 (290,xxx mi) On 7/15/2011 2:28 PM, andrew strasfogel wrote: Thanks for the great input. The local Z Burger chain has a guy pick it up every Wednesday but they haven't seen him in awhile. I wonder if more frequent (2 or 3x weekly) pickups would be more appealing, although since my consumption.is probably on the order of 10 gallons/week I would probably not be able to keep up with their supplies. On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 3:19 PM, Curt Raymondcurtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: The chemicals are easy, before you do anything stockpile 100 gallons (2x 55 gallon drums) of the oil to prove that there are lots of sources and to prove to yourself that its something you want to go through on a consistent basis. I think you'll find your sources of fat are MUCH more limited than you previously though. Unlike what the bio-digester folks usually tell you restaurants don't usually have to pay to get rid of their fryer oil... -Curt Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 13:59:34 -0400 From: andrew strasfogelastrasfo...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion Listmercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: CAC35L=tQbUeALWYynj-68aYvP1rDoswzk27t+xUohyFbADrf=q...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 12:50 PM, Benz Hogs benz-n-h...@gulseth.net wrote: Be prepared to dispose of the chunks of fries, chicken, etc that come in the bottom of the oil bin. They could be carefully burned for heat to warm oil Or Andrew could put them in his compost pile along with the cat poop. ;) Alex ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Andrew's friends at the EPA are making cities clamp down on grease disposal. The city is making every food prep operation, not just restaurants, but prison, schools and hospitals, nursing homes etc. Even the neighborhood daycare, if they prepare meals... install a grease separator system to replace the relatively simple grease traps. These grease separators are thousands of dollars and there is essentially no benefit in the end, other than the grease load at the muni WWT plant is presumably lighter. The owner no longer can clean the thing themselves, but HAVE TO (all hail marx, lenin and stalin) hire an approved collection company (generally owned by guys who hire guys with dark glasses to break bones) to pick up the grease and empty these grease separators. The only way you will get used fry oil is if someone fried a turkey in the backyard, or if your community has not yet implemented these draconian measures. This has been implemented by the bummer administration to make sure that nobody can make homebrew BioD to compete with the oil companies. On the open market, Yellow grease (Used fry oil) is trading at 45 cents per pound in the east coast region.. (today's Jacobsen report) That is $3.38 per gallon for feedstock. Add $.75 per gallon for processing costs. Andrew, since you are a card carrying liberal, we know you would not dream of not paying the appropriate fuel taxes so add whatever the DC tax is, plus the federal tax. This is in the neighborhood of $.50 per gallon.Now your costs, not counting time, are $4.63 per gallon. How much are you saving? Then you need to buy a pickup to gather oil, etc, etc. And the EPA will come around and declare your backyard a hazardous waste area, and charge you with illegal disposal of hazardous waste. Add those fines and lawyer costs to your per gallon price. BTW, in small lots, you can't buy yellow grease for .45 a lb. that is for semi loads or rail car lots. STOP! (Since you asked) The chemicals are easy, before you do anything stockpile 100 gallons (2x 55 gallon drums) of the oil to prove that there are lots of sources and to prove to yourself that its something you want to go through on a consistent basis. I think you'll find your sources of fat are MUCH more limited than you previously though. Unlike what the bio-digester folks usually tell you restaurants don't usually have to pay to get rid of their fryer oil... -Curt Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 13:59:34 -0400 From: andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: CAC35L=tQbUeALWYynj-68aYvP1rDoswzk27t+xUohyFbADrf=q...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
On 15/07/2011 2:53 PM, Alex Chamberlain wrote: On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 12:50 PM, Benz Hogsbenz-n-h...@gulseth.net wrote: Be prepared to dispose of the chunks of fries, chicken, etc that come in the bottom of the oil bin. They could be carefully burned for heat to warm oil Or Andrew could put them in his compost pile along with the cat poop. ;) Alex OR, feed that stuff to the cats. Nice glossy fur with all the oil! Randy ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
On 15/07/2011 2:48 PM, Dieselhead wrote: Andrew, since you are a card carrying liberal, we know you would not dream of not paying the appropriate fuel taxes so add whatever the DC tax is, plus the federal tax. This is in the neighborhood of $.50 per gallon.Now your costs, not counting time, are $4.63 per gallon. How much are you saving? Then you need to buy a pickup to gather oil, etc, etc. NO, NO, Andrew will need to get a nice battery operated Prius to haul oil for his veggie Benz! Randy ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
I don't know anything about stringent rules for WVO. The manager at the local burger joint that I called seemed to have no qualms in giving away their fryer oil. Obviously, unless the oil were free I wouldn't be interested. The whole point is to turn a waste product into something useful while reducing (in a small way) dependence on petroleum products. On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 4:01 PM, Randy Bennell rbenn...@bennell.ca wrote: On 15/07/2011 2:48 PM, Dieselhead wrote: Andrew, since you are a card carrying liberal, we know you would not dream of not paying the appropriate fuel taxes so add whatever the DC tax is, plus the federal tax. This is in the neighborhood of $.50 per gallon.Now your costs, not counting time, are $4.63 per gallon. How much are you saving? Then you need to buy a pickup to gather oil, etc, etc. NO, NO, Andrew will need to get a nice battery operated Prius to haul oil for his veggie Benz! Randy __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Allan Streib wrote: Don't forget to account for the increased expenses in injector and pump rebuilds. I thought the wonderful thing about biodiesel was that it had more lubricity than dinodiesel, which helped the fuel system live a long and happy life. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Yellow grease does not biodiesel make folks. Been there done that. Yellow grease will not support a transesterfication chemical reaction that is dependable or repeatable. By definition yellow grease is chemical combination of any fatty acid source available to the collection company. In 2007 I was the design engineer for a large commercial bio diesel plant with production capacity of 20,000,000 gallons per month, design through certification. We took a hard look at using Yellow Grease because of the trading volumes available on the market. Bottom line, NO. Use clean oil. Remove all water, Remove all solids, Do titrate each batch to learn what you have and adjust the chemistry for each batch as necessary. The EPA will become your New Friend the instant it is discovered you are making anything with chemicals followed by Homeland Security, BATF, and about a dozen alphabet soup government shops you never heard of till then... All of them have the motto: We are from the Government and we're not happy until you're not happy Time and cost to pass all the government regs and controls, 2 yrs.8 months, $6.4 million in legal fees and added compliance costs. Time and cost to build out plant to production, 126 days. $2.9 million And we won? On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 1:01 PM, Randy Bennell rbenn...@bennell.ca wrote: On 15/07/2011 2:48 PM, Dieselhead wrote: Andrew, since you are a card carrying liberal, we know you would not dream of not paying the appropriate fuel taxes so add whatever the DC tax is, plus the federal tax. This is in the neighborhood of $.50 per gallon.Now your costs, not counting time, are $4.63 per gallon. How much are you saving? Then you need to buy a pickup to gather oil, etc, etc. NO, NO, Andrew will need to get a nice battery operated Prius to haul oil for his veggie Benz! Randy __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Can't haul 10-20 5 gal jugs or 2-6 55 gal drums in a pious On 15/07/2011 2:48 PM, Dieselhead wrote: Andrew, since you are a card carrying liberal, we know you would not dream of not paying the appropriate fuel taxes so add whatever the DC tax is, plus the federal tax. This is in the neighborhood of $.50 per gallon.Now your costs, not counting time, are $4.63 per gallon. How much are you saving? Then you need to buy a pickup to gather oil, etc, etc. NO, NO, Andrew will need to get a nice battery operated Prius to haul oil for his veggie Benz! Randy ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
You are right! I was trying to point out the gummit friends that will come calling on Andrew in a much lighter tone. Used fry oil is traded as yellow grease. Yes, it is highly variable. Most of the grease collection tanks are left open to collect rainwater too... Water and used fry oil are not good company for those who want to make BioD. Even at 20 million gallons per YEAR, yellow grease is not a good feedstock because of its variability. It can be handled in small batch plants, but most homebrew BioD plants do not have adequate facilities to make good BioD, and dry out the water and glycerine/soap. It is not something I could recommend for a small lot in DC. Yellow grease does not biodiesel make folks. Been there done that. Yellow grease will not support a transesterfication chemical reaction that is dependable or repeatable. By definition yellow grease is chemical combination of any fatty acid source available to the collection company. In 2007 I was the design engineer for a large commercial bio diesel plant with production capacity of 20,000,000 gallons per month, design through certification. We took a hard look at using Yellow Grease because of the trading volumes available on the market. Bottom line, NO. Use clean oil. Remove all water, Remove all solids, Do titrate each batch to learn what you have and adjust the chemistry for each batch as necessary. The EPA will become your New Friend the instant it is discovered you are making anything with chemicals followed by Homeland Security, BATF, and about a dozen alphabet soup government shops you never heard of till then... All of them have the motto: We are from the Government and we're not happy until you're not happy Time and cost to pass all the government regs and controls, 2 yrs.8 months, $6.4 million in legal fees and added compliance costs. Time and cost to build out plant to production, 126 days. $2.9 million And we won? On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 1:01 PM, Randy Bennell rbenn...@bennell.ca wrote: On 15/07/2011 2:48 PM, Dieselhead wrote: Andrew, since you are a card carrying liberal, we know you would not dream of not paying the appropriate fuel taxes so add whatever the DC tax is, plus the federal tax. This is in the neighborhood of $.50 per gallon.Now your costs, not counting time, are $4.63 per gallon. How much are you saving? Then you need to buy a pickup to gather oil, etc, etc. NO, NO, Andrew will need to get a nice battery operated Prius to haul oil for his veggie Benz! Randy __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
It is if it meets the BQ standard. Meeting the standard is not likely with homebrew. Testing a sample runs roughly $1000 cash. Allan Streib wrote: Don't forget to account for the increased expenses in injector and pump rebuilds. I thought the wonderful thing about biodiesel was that it had more lubricity than dinodiesel, which helped the fuel system live a long and happy life. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
They usually have a contract with disposal companies so the waste oil is really their property Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2011, at 2:19 PM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: The chemicals are easy, before you do anything stockpile 100 gallons (2x 55 gallon drums) of the oil to prove that there are lots of sources and to prove to yourself that its something you want to go through on a consistent basis. I think you'll find your sources of fat are MUCH more limited than you previously though. Unlike what the bio-digester folks usually tell you restaurants don't usually have to pay to get rid of their fryer oil... -Curt Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 13:59:34 -0400 From: andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: CAC35L=tQbUeALWYynj-68aYvP1rDoswzk27t+xUohyFbADrf=q...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Thank you for the suggestion. Biofuel is however an intrinsic political topic, amongst chemistry, logistics, etc. My point was a friendly jibe to Andrew, who has been a friendly foil for various light-hearted political exchanges. He and I will have fun, and maybe some beers and tomatoes. The second story I would like to hear is how I need to pay more taxes (and then we can discuss how Andrew will pay the road tax on his biobuddy fuel, and how he will keep the gummint happy with his home brewing activities in our nation's capital/ol). --R On 7/15/11 3:41 PM, Randy Bennell wrote: On 15/07/2011 2:32 PM, andrew strasfogel wrote: Sure - let me know. What sort of story would you like to hear in exchange for a second beer? On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 3:08 PM, Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: Restaurants are getting paid for their oil now I think, so you will have to get in line. Plus, you have to figure out what to do with all the glycerin and nasty leftover chemicals. And being in DC BTW the boy is moving to DC in a coupla weeks to go to Gtown Med, I get to go move him in Aug 1 and hang around a coupla days for the opening ceremony. Maybe I'll buy you a beer and you can tell me how wonderful Obama is, if you still have a job then. --R Let me suggest that you folks stick to talking about MB's and leave politics alone. Randy ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Let me suggest that you folks stick to talking about MB's and leave politics alone. --R On 7/15/11 3:48 PM, Dieselhead wrote: Andrew's friends at the EPA are making cities clamp down on grease disposal. The city is making every food prep operation, not just restaurants, but prison, schools and hospitals, nursing homes etc. Even the neighborhood daycare, if they prepare meals... install a grease separator system to replace the relatively simple grease traps. These grease separators are thousands of dollars and there is essentially no benefit in the end, other than the grease load at the muni WWT plant is presumably lighter. The owner no longer can clean the thing themselves, but HAVE TO (all hail marx, lenin and stalin) hire an approved collection company (generally owned by guys who hire guys with dark glasses to break bones) to pick up the grease and empty these grease separators. The only way you will get used fry oil is if someone fried a turkey in the backyard, or if your community has not yet implemented these draconian measures. This has been implemented by the bummer administration to make sure that nobody can make homebrew BioD to compete with the oil companies. On the open market, Yellow grease (Used fry oil) is trading at 45 cents per pound in the east coast region.. (today's Jacobsen report) That is $3.38 per gallon for feedstock. Add $.75 per gallon for processing costs. Andrew, since you are a card carrying liberal, we know you would not dream of not paying the appropriate fuel taxes so add whatever the DC tax is, plus the federal tax. This is in the neighborhood of $.50 per gallon.Now your costs, not counting time, are $4.63 per gallon. How much are you saving? Then you need to buy a pickup to gather oil, etc, etc. And the EPA will come around and declare your backyard a hazardous waste area, and charge you with illegal disposal of hazardous waste. Add those fines and lawyer costs to your per gallon price. BTW, in small lots, you can't buy yellow grease for .45 a lb. that is for semi loads or rail car lots. STOP! (Since you asked) The chemicals are easy, before you do anything stockpile 100 gallons (2x 55 gallon drums) of the oil to prove that there are lots of sources and to prove to yourself that its something you want to go through on a consistent basis. I think you'll find your sources of fat are MUCH more limited than you previously though. Unlike what the bio-digester folks usually tell you restaurants don't usually have to pay to get rid of their fryer oil... -Curt Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 13:59:34 -0400 From: andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: CAC35L=tQbUeALWYynj-68aYvP1rDoswzk27t+xUohyFbADrf=q...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
My intent was to be somewhat funny as well. Maybe it came accross too serious. I could just see the two of you getting into a fight in a bar. There is some silly only country song about political leanings of the members of a band who end up beating on each other. the one on the right was on the left and the one in the middle was on the right or something along those lines. Randy who gets bored with politics pretty quickly On 15/07/2011 4:04 PM, Rich Thomas wrote: Thank you for the suggestion. Biofuel is however an intrinsic political topic, amongst chemistry, logistics, etc. My point was a friendly jibe to Andrew, who has been a friendly foil for various light-hearted political exchanges. He and I will have fun, and maybe some beers and tomatoes. The second story I would like to hear is how I need to pay more taxes (and then we can discuss how Andrew will pay the road tax on his biobuddy fuel, and how he will keep the gummint happy with his home brewing activities in our nation's capital/ol). --R On 7/15/11 3:41 PM, Randy Bennell wrote: On 15/07/2011 2:32 PM, andrew strasfogel wrote: Sure - let me know. What sort of story would you like to hear in exchange for a second beer? On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 3:08 PM, Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: Restaurants are getting paid for their oil now I think, so you will have to get in line. Plus, you have to figure out what to do with all the glycerin and nasty leftover chemicals. And being in DC BTW the boy is moving to DC in a coupla weeks to go to Gtown Med, I get to go move him in Aug 1 and hang around a coupla days for the opening ceremony. Maybe I'll buy you a beer and you can tell me how wonderful Obama is, if you still have a job then. --R Let me suggest that you folks stick to talking about MB's and leave politics alone. Randy ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
AFAIK commercially available stuff should prolong your engine's life as long as it's diluted in dinodiesel. I think B20 is best. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2011, at 4:38 PM, Dieselhead 126die...@gmail.com wrote: It is if it meets the BQ standard. Meeting the standard is not likely with homebrew. Testing a sample runs roughly $1000 cash. Allan Streib wrote: Don't forget to account for the increased expenses in injector and pump rebuilds. I thought the wonderful thing about biodiesel was that it had more lubricity than dinodiesel, which helped the fuel system live a long and happy life. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
To heck with making biodiesel! Convert your car to run wvo, filter it very well and make sure it has no suspended water. Anyone that tells you it won't work right is full of it. Been doing it for years and have yet to have a veggie oil related failure. Clean, clean, clean oil is the secret to success. Gravity is your friend, let the oil settle and only filter from the top. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 2:00 PM, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Too much modification will devalue the car. BD is easier. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2011, at 5:43 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: To heck with making biodiesel! Convert your car to run wvo, filter it very well and make sure it has no suspended water. Anyone that tells you it won't work right is full of it. Been doing it for years and have yet to have a veggie oil related failure. Clean, clean, clean oil is the secret to success. Gravity is your friend, let the oil settle and only filter from the top. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 2:00 PM, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Who cares about devaluing the car? If you save $5000 in fuel then you can afford to lose a few bucks if you decide to resell. Doesn't take long to make one of our old beaters into a free car at over 4 dollars a gallon for diesel. And NO biodiesel is not easier by any means. There is much more work involved. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 5:50 PM, Dimitri Seretakis dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote: Too much modification will devalue the car. BD is easier. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2011, at 5:43 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: To heck with making biodiesel! Convert your car to run wvo, filter it very well and make sure it has no suspended water. Anyone that tells you it won't work right is full of it. Been doing it for years and have yet to have a veggie oil related failure. Clean, clean, clean oil is the secret to success. Gravity is your friend, let the oil settle and only filter from the top. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 2:00 PM, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Look at it this way.screw up once filtering oil and replace filters. Screw up once making BD and die or risk pump failure. Your choice. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 5:50 PM, Dimitri Seretakis dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote: Too much modification will devalue the car. BD is easier. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2011, at 5:43 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: To heck with making biodiesel! Convert your car to run wvo, filter it very well and make sure it has no suspended water. Anyone that tells you it won't work right is full of it. Been doing it for years and have yet to have a veggie oil related failure. Clean, clean, clean oil is the secret to success. Gravity is your friend, let the oil settle and only filter from the top. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 2:00 PM, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
I'm not suggesting making BD. I'm suggesting buying the good commercially available stuff. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2011, at 5:58 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: Look at it this way.screw up once filtering oil and replace filters. Screw up once making BD and die or risk pump failure. Your choice. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 5:50 PM, Dimitri Seretakis dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote: Too much modification will devalue the car. BD is easier. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2011, at 5:43 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: To heck with making biodiesel! Convert your car to run wvo, filter it very well and make sure it has no suspended water. Anyone that tells you it won't work right is full of it. Been doing it for years and have yet to have a veggie oil related failure. Clean, clean, clean oil is the secret to success. Gravity is your friend, let the oil settle and only filter from the top. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 2:00 PM, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Fuel viscosity is different, pump takes more HP to do it's job, more mechanical stress... WVO is good if you get the viscosity under control, filter it, dry it, biocide it, etc. It works, but in the same way that using 1's for TP works... Walt On Jul 15, 2011 5:58 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: Look at it this way.screw up once filtering oil and replace filters. Screw up once making BD and die or risk pump failure. Your choice. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 5:50 PM, Dimitri Seretakis dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote: Too much modification will devalue the car. BD is easier. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2011, at 5:43 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: To heck with making biodiesel! Convert your car to run wvo, filter it very well and make sure it has no suspended water. Anyone that tells you it won't work right is full of it. Been doing it for years and have yet to have a veggie oil related failure. Clean, clean, clean oil is the secret to success. Gravity is your friend, let the oil settle and only filter from the top. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 2:00 PM, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Dimitri Seretakis dsereta...@yahoo.com writes: I'm not suggesting making BD. I'm suggesting buying the good commercially available stuff. That is the only way I'd do it. Too much trouble to be worth it making it yourself. Allan -- 1983 300D ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
That's certainly one way to look at it. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2011, at 5:56 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: Who cares about devaluing the car? If you save $5000 in fuel then you can afford to lose a few bucks if you decide to resell. Doesn't take long to make one of our old beaters into a free car at over 4 dollars a gallon for diesel. And NO biodiesel is not easier by any means. There is much more work involved. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 5:50 PM, Dimitri Seretakis dsereta...@yahoo.com wrote: Too much modification will devalue the car. BD is easier. Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2011, at 5:43 PM, Michael Canfield slozuk...@gmail.com wrote: To heck with making biodiesel! Convert your car to run wvo, filter it very well and make sure it has no suspended water. Anyone that tells you it won't work right is full of it. Been doing it for years and have yet to have a veggie oil related failure. Clean, clean, clean oil is the secret to success. Gravity is your friend, let the oil settle and only filter from the top. Mike On Jul 15, 2011 2:00 PM, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Banned is a great place for such, and today I learned that Andrew also posts there... Max -- Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: Let me suggest that you folks stick to talking about MB's and leave politics alone. --R On 7/15/11 3:48 PM, Dieselhead wrote: Andrew's friends at the EPA are making cities clamp down on grease disposal. The city is making every food prep operation, not just restaurants, but prison, schools and hospitals, nursing homes etc. Even the neighborhood daycare, if they prepare meals... install a grease separator system to replace the relatively simple grease traps. These grease separators are thousands of dollars and there is essentially no benefit in the end, other than the grease load at the muni WWT plant is presumably lighter. The owner no longer can clean the thing themselves, but HAVE TO (all hail marx, lenin and stalin) hire an approved collection company (generally owned by guys who hire guys with dark glasses to break bones) to pick up the grease and empty these grease separators. The only way you will get used fry oil is if someone fried a turkey in the backyard, or if your community has not yet implemented these draconian measures. This has been implemented by the bummer administration to make sure that nobody can make homebrew BioD to compete with the oil companies. On the open market, Yellow grease (Used fry oil) is trading at 45 cents per pound in the east coast region.. (today's Jacobsen report) That is $3.38 per gallon for feedstock. Add $.75 per gallon for processing costs. Andrew, since you are a card carrying liberal, we know you would not dream of not paying the appropriate fuel taxes so add whatever the DC tax is, plus the federal tax. This is in the neighborhood of $.50 per gallon. Now your costs, not counting time, are $4.63 per gallon. How much are you saving? Then you need to buy a pickup to gather oil, etc, etc. And the EPA will come around and declare your backyard a hazardous waste area, and charge you with illegal disposal of hazardous waste. Add those fines and lawyer costs to your per gallon price. BTW, in small lots, you can't buy yellow grease for .45 a lb. that is for semi loads or rail car lots. STOP! (Since you asked) The chemicals are easy, before you do anything stockpile 100 gallons (2x 55 gallon drums) of the oil to prove that there are lots of sources and to prove to yourself that its something you want to go through on a consistent basis. I think you'll find your sources of fat are MUCH more limited than you previously though. Unlike what the bio-digester folks usually tell you restaurants don't usually have to pay to get rid of their fryer oil... -Curt Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 13:59:34 -0400 From: andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: CAC35L=tQbUeALWYynj-68aYvP1rDoswzk27t+xUohyFbADrf=q...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Any dieseling pals in the area you could share with to offset the cost of your production? Maybe get them to do the picking up for your effort in converting it into bio-D? -Curt Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 15:28:48 -0400 From: andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: CAC35L=vqjrYWdcQa9Gybsx1n=78svsfnhf3yrfzbkrqoa8k...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Thanks for the great input. The local Z Burger chain has a guy pick it up every Wednesday but they haven't seen him in awhile. I wonder if more frequent (2 or 3x weekly) pickups would be more appealing, although since my consumption.is probably on the order of 10 gallons/week I would probably not be able to keep up with their supplies. On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 3:19 PM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: The chemicals are easy, before you do anything stockpile 100 gallons (2x 55 gallon drums) of the oil to prove that there are lots of sources and to prove to yourself that its something you want to go through on a consistent basis. I think you'll find your sources of fat are MUCH more limited than you previously though. Unlike what the bio-digester folks usually tell you restaurants don't usually have to pay to get rid of their fryer oil... -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Don't confuse veggie oil with bio-diesel... -Curt Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 15:41:39 -0400 From: Allan Streib str...@cs.indiana.edu To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: 1310758899.25266.2152244...@webmail.messagingengine.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Don't forget to account for the increased expenses in injector and pump rebuilds. On Fri, 15 Jul 2011 13:59 -0400, andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com wrote: We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., http://biobuddy.us.com/faq.html ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy
Hey I have NEVER knowingly posted on Banned. I can barely survive the polite list. On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 7:08 PM, Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.netwrote: Banned is a great place for such, and today I learned that Andrew also posts there... Max -- Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. Rich Thomas richthomas79td...@constructivity.net wrote: Let me suggest that you folks stick to talking about MB's and leave politics alone. --R On 7/15/11 3:48 PM, Dieselhead wrote: Andrew's friends at the EPA are making cities clamp down on grease disposal. The city is making every food prep operation, not just restaurants, but prison, schools and hospitals, nursing homes etc. Even the neighborhood daycare, if they prepare meals... install a grease separator system to replace the relatively simple grease traps. These grease separators are thousands of dollars and there is essentially no benefit in the end, other than the grease load at the muni WWT plant is presumably lighter. The owner no longer can clean the thing themselves, but HAVE TO (all hail marx, lenin and stalin) hire an approved collection company (generally owned by guys who hire guys with dark glasses to break bones) to pick up the grease and empty these grease separators. The only way you will get used fry oil is if someone fried a turkey in the backyard, or if your community has not yet implemented these draconian measures. This has been implemented by the bummer administration to make sure that nobody can make homebrew BioD to compete with the oil companies. On the open market, Yellow grease (Used fry oil) is trading at 45 cents per pound in the east coast region.. (today's Jacobsen report) That is $3.38 per gallon for feedstock. Add $.75 per gallon for processing costs. Andrew, since you are a card carrying liberal, we know you would not dream of not paying the appropriate fuel taxes so add whatever the DC tax is, plus the federal tax. This is in the neighborhood of $.50 per gallon. Now your costs, not counting time, are $4.63 per gallon. How much are you saving? Then you need to buy a pickup to gather oil, etc, etc. And the EPA will come around and declare your backyard a hazardous waste area, and charge you with illegal disposal of hazardous waste. Add those fines and lawyer costs to your per gallon price. BTW, in small lots, you can't buy yellow grease for .45 a lb. that is for semi loads or rail car lots. STOP! (Since you asked) The chemicals are easy, before you do anything stockpile 100 gallons (2x 55 gallon drums) of the oil to prove that there are lots of sources and to prove to yourself that its something you want to go through on a consistent basis. I think you'll find your sources of fat are MUCH more limited than you previously though. Unlike what the bio-digester folks usually tell you restaurants don't usually have to pay to get rid of their fryer oil... -Curt Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 13:59:34 -0400 From: andrew strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: [MBZ] Stop me before I buy a Biobuddy Message-ID: CAC35L=tQbUeALWYynj-68aYvP1rDoswzk27t+xUohyFbADrf=q...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 We own three W123 turbodiesels so this is very tempting. Cost is about $1700 + $450 more for the dry washing feature. We have lots of restaurants that probably would be happy to get rid of their fryer grease; the main snag might be the cost and ease of obtaining NAOH (caustic soda). I also wonder how much lye and water is consumed per batch, and what the brew would do to our fuel lines., _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
