[Zope-dev] Re: RFC: Reunite Zope 2 and Zope 3 in the source code repository

2005-11-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
What my point is here is that your attitude about Zope 2 is wrong: as a pure-play Zope 3 developer you *should* care about Zope 2. Some of us have been doing quite a bit of work of bringing Zope 3 to the Zope 2 world. I believe that at least partially as a result of this, Zope 3 is getting

[Zope-dev] Re: The Zope Software Certification Program and Common Repository Proposal

2006-02-20 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Mon, 20 Feb 2006 21:28:09 -, Stephan Richter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have spent the last two weeks working on a proposal that defines a Zope Software Certification Program (ZSCP) and a Common Repository that implements this process. The proposal is attached to this mail. I welcome

[Zope-dev] Re: Re: Re: Two visions

2006-03-02 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Thu, 02 Mar 2006 19:31:38 -, Stefane Fermigier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Strange how (most of) the Plone people seem to be so quick in willing to sacrifice the Zope brand :( I don't think that's true. I'm certainly not, and I've not heard anyone directly in favour of that either. What

Re: [Zope-dev] Two visions?

2006-03-02 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Thu, 02 Mar 2006 16:18:27 -, Jim Fulton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Zope is a agile flexible extensible app server with rich services. You forgot Enterprise. Martin -- (muted) ___ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev@zope.org

Re: [Zope-dev] What from zope.app are you using

2006-04-05 Thread Martin Aspeli
Lennart Regebro-2 wrote: Well, CMFonFive uses zope.app.publisher.browser, because that's where the menus hang. We would like to start using browser menus in Plone CPS uses zope.app.container for the container events and the IAdding interface all over the place. We may want to

Re: [Zope-dev] What from zope.app are you using

2006-04-06 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Thu, 06 Apr 2006 15:42:34 +0100, whit [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: to echo Martijn, I've learned much more about zope3 thumbing through the z3 bundled with Zope 2 than I have looking at actual zope3 source, because I don't have a job that pays me to do pure zope3. I would argue sending the

Re: [Zope-dev] I am starting to hate Zope/Plone development and its bl**dy lack of

2006-09-04 Thread Martin Aspeli
Max M wrote: Refresh no longer works, and the old debug, correct, restart cycle is back. Only this time a software stack the size a skyscrapers has to be loaded. Making it even slower than in the old Zope days. There are a few answers to this question - Get a better machine. :)

Re: [Zope-dev] Installer for Windows (quick question)

2006-11-09 Thread Martin Aspeli
Sidnei da Silva-2 wrote: Since I'm going to be building the installer for Windows I would like to quickly ask if anyone expects multiple Zope installs to live side-by-side. The existing installer atempted that but I don't believe it was very successful. I would like to know if anyone

[Zope-dev] Re: ploneout - Or how using zc.buildout for a common Zope2 project might look like

2007-01-16 Thread Martin Aspeli
Martijn Faassen wrote: Hey, I only caught this message earlier today, but this is really cool! It's really nice to see some zope 2 recipes and I hope they indeed will end up on svn.zope.org soon! Your workingenv recipe sounds very interesting and I should try this soon. Does it allow

[Zope-dev] Re: ploneout - Or how using zc.buildout for a common Zope2 project might look like

2007-01-16 Thread Martin Aspeli
Martijn Faassen wrote: Hey, I only caught this message earlier today, but this is really cool! It's really nice to see some zope 2 recipes and I hope they indeed will end up on svn.zope.org soon! Your workingenv recipe sounds very interesting and I should try this soon. Does it allow

Re: [Zope-dev] RFC: Eggifying Zope's extension mechanism (Products)

2007-01-25 Thread Martin Aspeli
Philipp von Weitershausen wrote: For their upcoming versions, Zope 2 consuming platforms such as Plone are creating standard Zope3-style Python packages while still having Zope 2 products around. This proposal aims at unifying the deployment of products and Python packages into a Zope 2

Re: [Zope-dev] RFC: Acquisition and __parent__ pointers

2007-01-25 Thread Martin Aspeli
Philipp von Weitershausen wrote: This proposal aims at bringing Zope 2 a bit closer to Zope 3 by making the widely used Acquisition API aware of Zope 3's __parent__ pointers. This will alleviate the need of using Acquisition base classes in Zope 2 for every security-sensitive object,

[Zope-dev] Re: ploneout - Or how using zc.buildout for a common Zope2 project might look like

2007-01-25 Thread Martin Aspeli
Philipp von Weitershausen wrote: The point is that buildout *already* handles eggs. There's really no point for having an extra layer on top of buildout. The zc.recipe.egg recipe can install any egg (as a development one or not) in an automated fashion, which is exactly what you'd want from a

[Zope-dev] Re: ploneout - Or how using zc.buildout for a common Zope2 project might look like

2007-01-25 Thread Martin Aspeli
Rob Miller wrote: honestly, it seems to me that buildout tries to do too much. it's trying to handle both repeatable deployment recipes AND providing a sandbox within which to run things. there may not be a point to having an extra layer on top of buildout, but buildout sure does seem to me

[Zope-dev] Re: ploneout - Or how using zc.buildout for a common Zope2 project might look like

2007-01-26 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: I don't think buildout's default locations would be called sensible by anybody except the folks who wrote it. I think a lot of this may have to do with sensible defaults; most (all?) of this is settable via options in buildout.cfg, which is reassuring at least. Here

[Zope-dev] Re: ploneout - Or how using zc.buildout for a common Zope2 project might look like

2007-01-26 Thread Martin Aspeli
I don't have a usecase for executing the scripts with any python interpeter other than the one which ran setuptools to generate them, and therefore don't care for the hard-wired path manipulation I would agree that having to mangle multiple scripts is annoying. On the other hand, I find the

[Zope-dev] Re: ploneout - Or how using zc.buildout for a common Zope2 project might look like

2007-01-28 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jim Fulton wrote: The first step to compatibility is deciding what it means. :) I'm all in favor of workingenv/buildout compatibility. I'd like to see some specifics of how people would like to use workingenv amd buildout together. I have some guesses, but I'd rather hear people say what they

[Zope-dev] Re: ploneout - Or how using zc.buildout for a common Zope2 project might look like

2007-01-28 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jim Fulton wrote: Martin Aspeli wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: The first step to compatibility is deciding what it means. :) I'm all in favor of workingenv/buildout compatibility. I'd like to see some specifics of how people would like to use workingenv amd buildout together. I have some guesses

[Zope-dev] Re: ploneout - Or how using zc.buildout for a common Zope2 project might look like

2007-01-28 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jim Fulton wrote: [foo] recipe=zc.recipe.egg eggs = egg1 egg2 ... interpreter = mypy extra-paths = path-to-your-instance/lib/python scripts = mypy This is great :) I used eggs = ${instance:eggs} to make sure it has the same eggs as our Zope instance, seems to

Re: [Zope-dev] RFC: Eggifying Zope's extension mechanism (Products)

2007-01-31 Thread Martin Aspeli
Daniel Nouri-3 wrote: BTW, compare the difference in size between that script[1] and ploneout[2]. I should mention that it does less than ploneout (it doesn't download Zope 2, but that'd be trivial to add) and it could be argued that it's less flexible for some definition of flexible.

[Zope-dev] Re: Interest in AdvancedQuery and/or ManagableIndex?

2007-02-02 Thread Martin Aspeli
Dieter Maurer wrote: I have no problems to donate AdvancedQuery and/or Managable Index to the Zope Foundation That's great, thank you! :) *BUT* I will not modify the code to bring it in line with the different style requirements usually applied to Zope components: e.g. * my code uses 2

[Zope-dev] Re: Interest in AdvancedQuery and/or ManagableIndex?

2007-02-03 Thread Martin Aspeli
yuppie wrote: - Should we add new products to the core? I thought we want to move away from products and use python packages instead. The AdvancedQuery code might become part of the ZCatalog package, ManagableIndex might be converted to a non-products package. There are hardly new, though,

[Zope-dev] Re: Interest in AdvancedQuery and/or ManagableIndex?

2007-02-03 Thread Martin Aspeli
Philipp von Weitershausen wrote: Dieter Maurer wrote: Whit (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) reported that AdvancedQuery is going to ship with Plone3 and that packaging would be easier for them if AdvancedQuery were part of the Zope 2 distribution. I fail to find an explanation *why* that is. I'm

[Zope-dev] Re: ploneenv - Or how using workingenv for a common Zope2 project might look like ;-)

2007-02-03 Thread Martin Aspeli
Ian Bicking wrote: One of the things that I think is pretty easy with workingenv, and a bit confusing with buildout, is moving one package into development. In workingenv you get the package you want (however you do that -- check out a branch, make your own local repository, unpack a

Re: [Zope-dev] difference between OOSet and OOTreeSet?

2007-03-01 Thread Martin Aspeli
Chris Withers wrote: Hi All, Wondering if someone could tell me the difference between an OOSet and an OOTreeSet? They seem to have different interfaces and yet seem to be used in similar circumstances in PluginIndexes/common/UnIndex.py... I'm looking for a set-like data

Re: [Zope-dev] difference between OOSet and OOTreeSet?

2007-03-01 Thread Martin Aspeli
Chris Withers wrote: Martin Aspeli wrote: I'll bet one is backed by a hashtable and the other is backed by an r/b tree, meaning the Set is O(1) lookups, possibly a bit less space efficient and non-ordered, Well, Set's are definitely ordered, same as normal python sets... From

Re: [Zope-dev] Proposal for optimized Blob handling

2007-03-07 Thread Martin Aspeli
Christian Theune-2 wrote: Am Mittwoch, den 07.03.2007, 14:01 -0300 schrieb Sidnei da Silva: What exactly do you mean by 'link'? As in 'soft links'? The uploaded file usually is a temporary file, so you are saying you would create a soft link on the 'blobs' directory to a file in the $TMP

[Zope-dev] Re: Killer App for ZClasses

2007-04-18 Thread Martin Aspeli
Christopher Lozinski wrote: I thought, hey, I bet a million people need such a simple web app. Let us make it really easy to implement craigslist or better. Let me go ahead and create a ZClass product, and go ahead and distribute it. Lots of people would use it. Or at least enough to

[Zope-dev] Re: Why are ZClasses Dead

2007-04-18 Thread Martin Aspeli
Christopher Lozinski wrote: 1. There is no demand for a through the web development environment that works. I just don't believe that. There is demand for TTW *customisation*, as we have in CMF/Plone with the portal_skins mechanism, for example. Developing entire systems through a web

[Zope-dev] Re: ZClassNG and ProductNG proposal

2007-04-21 Thread Martin Aspeli
Christopher Lozinski wrote: I think I have figured out how to do it. This looks like a ZMI based ZClass, you can define it through the ZMI, you can add instance variables, you can add instance methods, all through the ZMI, but you can change inheritance, because it is really a product

[Zope-dev] Re: ZClassNG proposal makes Archetypes Easy.

2007-04-22 Thread Martin Aspeli
Christopher Lozinski wrote: For those who have not been following this thread, here is the proposal. http://wiki.zope.org/zope2/ZClassesNG Can you please not start a new thread for every turn of this conversation? 8 of the last 9 threads are by you on this exact issue. Last night I

Re: [Zope-dev] Re: ZClassNG proposal makes Archetypes Easy.

2007-04-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Chris Withers wrote: Martin Aspeli wrote: Plone development with Archetypes is not painful. Hundreds of developers do it, so it can't be that bad. Urm, that's not true. Archetypes is the single most painful component to use from Plone... It's also the biggest source

Re: [Zope-dev] Re: ZClassNG proposal makes Archetypes Easy.

2007-04-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Andreas Jung-5 wrote: Okay. Let me rephrase. Most people don't find it painful, and a huge number of developers are being very productive with Archetypes. I know you hate it Chris, but you are in the minority. I have to second that. The latest versions of AT are pretty much stable and

Re: [Zope-dev] ZClassNG proposal makes Archetypes Easy.

2007-04-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: AT has the classic Z-shaped curve in spades: when it does what you want, it is great, but trying to get it to do something else is painful and frustrating. I don't agree all that often with Chris W, but I find Archetypes an extremely frustrating framework to work

[Zope-dev] Re: Killer App for ZClasses

2007-05-03 Thread Martin Aspeli
From people's comments, here and on the archetypes mailing list, I am pretty convinced that there is support for a through the web editing environment, even from Alexander Limi, expert on human interfaces and co-author of Plone. You have an incredibly annoying tendency to take the words of

[Zope-dev] Re: Zope2 and eggs

2007-06-10 Thread Martin Aspeli
Wichert Akkerman wrote: At the moment my options seem to be to not use buildout or modifying setup.py in zope.sendmail to remove all its declared dependencies. More like not to use setuptools, i.e. any egg-based solution would have the same problem (e.g. workingenv). You can probably check

[Zope-dev] Re: State of the philikon-aq-and-__parent__ branch

2007-06-18 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hanno Schlichting wrote: Hi, as some of you may have noticed I worked a bit more on philikon's branch which makes Acquisition and in return the Zope2 security machinery aware of __parent__ pointers. The branch can be found here:

[Zope-dev] Re: vulnerability in zope 2.10.4

2007-07-11 Thread Martin Aspeli
Andreas Zeidler wrote: hi, imho i've found a vulnerability in zope 2.10.4 or rather in the newer version of five (1.5.5) used by it. in `Five/browser/ pagetemplatefile.py` in line 27 `createTrustedZopeEngine` is used the instantiate the page template engine used by five templates, or at

[Zope-dev] Re: request.locale

2007-09-08 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hanno Schlichting wrote: Laurence Rowe wrote: Quite a lot of zope3 code (zc.datetimewidget for instance) expects to be able to access request.locale. ZPublisher does not provide this and to get around the limitation you must manually set request.locale in your view using

[Zope-dev] Re: Mixing recipes (zc.recipe.cmmi reuse)

2007-09-18 Thread Martin Aspeli
Sidnei da Silva wrote: Hi there, Not sure this is the right list, but let's give it a try. I would like to use the 'patches' functionality from zc.recipe.cmmi together with other recipes. I believe this is useful functionality and is interesting to all sorts of recipes, not only to cmmi-based

[Zope-dev] Re: How to publish Zope2 products on PyPI

2007-09-22 Thread Martin Aspeli
Dieter Maurer wrote: During our latest discussion to put my most important Zope2 products into a public repository, I have promissed to publish them on PyPI instead. Yesterday, I started work to fulfill this promiss and carefully read the PyPI related documentation -- to find out, that it is not

[Zope-dev] Re: How to publish Zope2 products on PyPI

2007-09-22 Thread Martin Aspeli
Andreas Jung wrote: I think there are currently several approaches doing products-as-eggs in the Zope 2 world - I also lost track a bit and have no idea how to do it the right way[tm]. To my knowledge, there are only two, complementary approaches: 1. Keep the Products.* namespace -

[Zope-dev] Re: How to publish Zope2 products on PyPI

2007-09-22 Thread Martin Aspeli
Andreas Jung wrote: --On 22. September 2007 12:40:04 +0100 Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Andreas Jung wrote: I think there are currently several approaches doing products-as-eggs in the Zope 2 world - I also lost track a bit and have no idea how to do it the right way[tm]. To my

[Zope-dev] Re: How to publish Zope2 products on PyPI

2007-09-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Dieter Maurer wrote: Martin Aspeli wrote at 2007-9-22 12:21 +0100: Dieter Maurer wrote: We extend the Zope2 configuration with an option additional-products which lists the products used by the instance that are not at a standard place -- such as those installed by setuptools I really

[Zope-dev] Re: Mixing recipes (zc.recipe.cmmi reuse)

2007-09-24 Thread Martin Aspeli
Sidnei da Silva wrote: My intent is: Given any recipe, no matter where data is coming from (be it an egg in PyPI, a Subversion checkout or a tarball), I would like to be able to perform an operation in the 'local copy' of the data, without depending on the person that wrote the recipe to have

[Zope-dev] Re: Zope.org, and thus Zope itself, is in trouble

2007-09-29 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi Greg, I think Zope is in serious trouble and the Zope.org web site is badly in need of attention. I started using zope in 2001 at Xerox PARC and the helpful and persuasive resources at zope.org were a major factor. Today, zope.org is full of dead links and it very hard to use unless

[Zope-dev] Re: [Zope3-dev] I'd lobe to merge the zope3-dev and zope-dev lists

2007-10-04 Thread Martin Aspeli
Stephan Richter wrote: On Thursday 04 October 2007 09:57, Jim Fulton wrote: This would basically involve retiring the zope3-dev list and moving zope3 developers to the zope-dev list. -1. I do not follow zope-dev at all and the traffic is pretty high there. But pretty low there, if you take

[Zope-dev] Re: zcml entry points

2007-10-17 Thread Martin Aspeli
Fred Drake wrote: On 10/17/07, Wichert Akkerman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A common issue we are seeing is that we have eggs depending on each other, but they still need to load the zcml from those dependencies somehow. As a temporary solution to play with the concept I added something simple to

[Zope-dev] Re: zcml entry points

2007-10-17 Thread Martin Aspeli
Fred Drake wrote: On 10/17/07, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The main win, IMHO, is to avoid the requirement for people to install slugs for third party products. Slugs suck - they are confusing to explain and people forget them all the time. Buildout makes it a bit easier, but it's

[Zope-dev] Re: zcml entry points

2007-10-18 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: I may not *want* the other package's ZCML to be loaded: some of its policies may not be appropriate for my application. I think that the library vs. pluggable application distinction is valid here: maybe you want to define an entry point in the egg which a given pluggable

[Zope-dev] Re: zcml entry points

2007-10-20 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Martijn Faassen wrote: Tres Seaver wrote: Wichert Akkerman wrote: [snip] So I turned things around: if I state in my egg information that I require another package that means I need to have that package available and

[Zope-dev] Re: Zope on Python 2.5?

2007-11-01 Thread Martin Aspeli
Alexander Limi wrote: On Wed, 31 Oct 2007 21:29:36 -0700, Andreas Jung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The recommendation is still System python is evil, evil, evil (quoting Jim). Sure, but if you ever want to be able to tell users to do: easy_install plone to get their Plone site, it's a

[Zope-dev] Re: AW: AW: Re: Grok 0.11 released!

2007-11-09 Thread Martin Aspeli
Stephan Richter wrote: On Friday 09 November 2007, Lennart Regebro wrote: On Nov 9, 2007 4:06 PM, Roger Ineichen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Create our own locked down index? I think so because, Surely there must be a way to say I want to use THAT KGS over there. Except for this module, that

[Zope-dev] Zope without Zope

2007-11-15 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi all, For fun, I just tried to make use of adapters and utilities, registered with ZCML, in a Pylons application. I installed Pylons in a virtualenv, and easy_installed zope.component and zope.interface using the KGS index for 3.4. I used zope.configuration (also installed) to load a

[Zope-dev] Re: Zope without Zope

2007-11-16 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi Chris, Then I tried to easy_install zope.security, but this pulled in most of Zope, including the ZODB, ZConfig and zdaemon. That's a real shame - no CA (at least not with ZCML) without having pretty much all of Zope there. :( Yup. Inappropriate dependency chain when you use the

Re: [Zope-dev] Zope without Zope

2007-11-16 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Nov 16, 2007 2:07 PM, Stephan Richter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thursday 15 November 2007, Martin Aspeli wrote: Then I tried to easy_install zope.security, but this pulled in most of Zope, including the ZODB, ZConfig and zdaemon. That's a real shame - no CA (at least not with ZCML

[Zope-dev] Re: Zope without Zope

2007-11-16 Thread Martin Aspeli
Rob Miller wrote: Lennart Regebro wrote: On Nov 16, 2007 11:41 AM, Lennart Regebro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Nov 16, 2007 3:38 AM, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Help appreciated! Well, I suggest you forget about ZCML and try to use the CA directly from Python. The Pylons people

[Zope-dev] Re: Zope without Zope

2007-11-17 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jim Fulton wrote: I understand the historical reasons behind these dependencies, but I genuinely think we should pick a few libraries that are useful to the outside world (zope.interface, zope.component, zope.configuration, zope.annotation, zope.event come to mind) and work to make these

[Zope-dev] Re: five.customerize

2007-12-20 Thread Martin Aspeli
Martijn Faassen wrote: Hi there, So, I am trying to look at five.customerize in the context of Silva. I look at the SVN, and see the trunk is significantly older than various Plone-related branches. Hm, odd. I thought, let's download the 0.2 sources from the cheeseshop. I download them.

[Zope-dev] Re: five.customerize

2007-12-21 Thread Martin Aspeli
Martijn Faassen wrote: Martin Aspeli wrote: Martijn Faassen wrote: [snip] So, what's the plan to clean up this mess? Can the Plone specific stuff be cleared up from the branches into a Plone-specific package and a new release be made that works for both Plone and the rest of the Zope world

[Zope-dev] Re: five.customerize

2007-12-21 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: That said, I suppose this should be either a conditional import or moved to a higher level altogether. - -1 to the conditional import; + 1 to moving the code. Agree. It seems to me it's also in the best interest of the Plone developers to have this cleaned up, right?

[Zope-dev] Re: [Zope3-Users] Re: Zope 3.4.0 candidate 1 Released

2008-02-01 Thread Martin Aspeli
Christophe Combelles wrote: Stephan Richter a écrit : Not responding to anyone in particular: I see there are plenty people with opinions. I would love not to do the Zope 3 releases anymore! I am tired of the endless discussions. Think I am frustrated? Absolutely! All the suggestions made

[Zope-dev] Re: [Zope3-Users] Re: Zope 3.4.0 candidate 1 Released

2008-02-02 Thread Martin Aspeli
Martijn Faassen wrote: Hey, On Feb 1, 2008 11:52 PM, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Stephan Richter wrote: On Friday 01 February 2008, Martijn Faassen wrote: http://www.openplans.org/projects/zorg-redux This project does not seem to be public. Right - thanks Martijn for spilling

[Zope-dev] Re: Reducing dependencies of zope.publisher

2008-03-21 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jim Fulton wrote: On Mar 21, 2008, at 12:55 PM, Jim Fulton wrote: On Mar 21, 2008, at 12:15 PM, Lennart Regebro wrote: On Fri, Mar 21, 2008 at 3:46 PM, Jim Fulton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thoughts? Objections? I've caught the repoze bug, and if this makes a Repoze.zope3 easier to

[Zope-dev] Re: Reducing dependencies of zope.publisher

2008-03-21 Thread Martin Aspeli
Andreas Jung wrote: --On 21. März 2008 19:20:46 + Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One thing that sucks right now for the repoze.zope2 story is that Zope 2 isn't officially packaged in an egg-friendly form so the Repoze guys have to repackage it. It'd be great to be able to get

[Zope-dev] Re: Reducing dependencies of zope.publisher

2008-03-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jim Fulton wrote: On Mar 21, 2008, at 6:54 PM, David Pratt wrote: Hi Jim. OK great. Many thanks for elaborating. This will be progressive. I had been considering an application use case without a zodb. Is this the scenario that the basic publisher would facilitate? No-more so than the

[Zope-dev] Re: Reducing dependencies of zope.publisher

2008-03-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jim Fulton wrote: On Mar 23, 2008, at 2:27 PM, Martin Aspeli wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: On Mar 21, 2008, at 6:54 PM, David Pratt wrote: Hi Jim. OK great. Many thanks for elaborating. This will be progressive. I had been considering an application use case without a zodb

[Zope-dev] Re: [Zope 2.12] Eggification of Zope 2 - pros and cons?

2008-03-24 Thread Martin Aspeli
Philipp von Weitershausen wrote: Andreas Jung wrote: during the latest 'zope.publisher' thread on zope-dev I came up with the proposal to eggify the Zope core for the Zope 2.12 release. I would like to start a discussion about the pros and cons, risks and advantages of any eggification

[Zope-dev] Re: [Zope 2.12] Eggification of Zope 2 - pros and cons?

2008-03-24 Thread Martin Aspeli
Wichert Akkerman wrote: Previously Martin Aspeli wrote: I'm not sure this is all that useful. For Plone 4, we're just going to have a number of plone.*, plone.app.* and Products.* (and a few others, like kss.*) eggs that we can put in a KGS or version pin in a single Plone egg. For Plone 4

[Zope-dev] Re: [Zope 2.12] Eggification of Zope 2 - pros and cons?

2008-03-25 Thread Martin Aspeli
Philipp von Weitershausen wrote: Wichert Akkerman wrote: Previously Martin Aspeli wrote: I'm not sure this is all that useful. For Plone 4, we're just going to have a number of plone.*, plone.app.* and Products.* (and a few others, like kss.*) eggs that we can put in a KGS or version pin

[Zope-dev] Let's fix the damned website

2008-04-05 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi all, The rumours are true. :) An effort has been going on for a while to improve the zope.org experience and thereby help make Zope more accessible to new users. I've helped co-ordinate it, but the project has been sanctioned by the Zope Foundation and driven by people like Martijn,

[Zope-dev] Re: Let's fix the damned website

2008-04-05 Thread Martin Aspeli
Paul Carduner wrote: I'm wondering where the Documentation section is? I'd like to volunteer for *that* section. By the way, the design looks pretty nice. There's one (called Learn) for each project, i.e. zope 2, zope 3, cmf, zodb. Which one would you like to contribute to? Martin --

[Zope-dev] Re: Let's fix the damned website

2008-04-05 Thread Martin Aspeli
Paul Carduner wrote: On Sat, Apr 5, 2008 at 10:54 AM, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Paul Carduner wrote: I'm wondering where the Documentation section is? I'd like to volunteer for *that* section. By the way, the design looks pretty nice. There's one (called Learn) for each

[Zope-dev] Re: Let's fix the damned website

2008-04-05 Thread Martin Aspeli
Paul Carduner wrote: On Apr 5, 2008, at 12:11 PM, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There's no content that isn't visible to anonymous on the site. Basically, we originally thought we would have one documentation/learn section for all Zope technologies. However, it seemed to make more

[Zope-dev] Re: Let's fix the damned website

2008-04-05 Thread Martin Aspeli
Martijn Faassen wrote: Kent Tenney wrote: Look at Sphinx for providing brilliant access to ReST doc. http://sphinx.pocoo.org/ I think looking at Sphinx is definitely a worthwhile effort. That said, I agree with Martin that we shouldn't let the new website effort be held up by (or distracted

[Zope-dev] Re: Let's fix the damned website

2008-04-06 Thread Martin Aspeli
Alexander Limi wrote: On Sat, 05 Apr 2008 08:52:07 -0700, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Now we need people to help contribute content, review the content that's already there and tie up a few loose ends. You can see current state of play here: http://zode01.lovelysystems.com

[Zope-dev] Re: Let's fix the damned website

2008-04-07 Thread Martin Aspeli
Chris Withers wrote: Martijn Faassen wrote: Yeah, I know this is really a me too post, but I think we should err on the side of conventional for our website. We can't go from out-of-date boring to cutting edge hip in one giant leap; it won't be believable. Let's stick with what people know

[Zope-dev] Re: Let's fix the damned website

2008-04-08 Thread Martin Aspeli
Chris Withers wrote: Martin Aspeli wrote: Yes. That's the point. It's vanilla Plone (well, one custom content type for the feature that fronts each section, but it's trivial) with a simple skin, not the FrankePlone that runs the old site. As a case in point, Wichert upgraded it from 3.0

[Zope-dev] Re: straighting out the SQLAlchemy integration mess

2008-04-09 Thread Martin Aspeli
Martijn Faassen wrote: Hi there, [I originally picked this up on a thread on zope3-users, but this deserves its own thread here] There are at least three approaches to SQLAlchemy integration with Zope: * z3c.zalchemy (Christian Theune) * z3c.sqlalchemy (Andreas Jung) * collective.lead

[Zope-dev] Re: straighting out the SQLAlchemy integration mess

2008-04-09 Thread Martin Aspeli
Laurence Rowe wrote: Should one phase commit be set as the default to make it easier to work with sqlite (and mssql)? Probably yes. Ideally we'd guess based on the URL scheme but allow it to be set explicitly, IMHO. Single phase would be the fallback, I guess. Should the default be for

[Zope-dev] Re: straighting out the SQLAlchemy integration mess

2008-04-09 Thread Martin Aspeli
Martijn Faassen wrote: Martijn Pieters wrote: On Tue, Apr 8, 2008 at 11:54 PM, Martijn Faassen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: All of these are in various states of brokenness. z3c.zalchemy doesn't work with SQLAlchemy trunk. collective.lead works with it, but only if you check out a particular

[Zope-dev] Re: straighting out the SQLAlchemy integration mess

2008-04-09 Thread Martin Aspeli
Andreas Jung wrote: --On 9. April 2008 14:15:38 +0100 Laurence Rowe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: @everyone: If we can all agree to use the same basic session and transaction management then we should probably push for it to be included as a sqlalchemy extension module. I would be happy with

[Zope-dev] Re: Five and browser-oriented components

2008-04-10 Thread Martin Aspeli
Martijn Faassen wrote: Technically, I think that this is going to be hard. You'd need to patch in the magic acquisition base class. Acquisition is the main reason that some of the code needed to be duplicated - without the existence of acquisition wrappers, security checks are not made for

[Zope-dev] Re: straighting out the SQLAlchemy integration mess

2008-04-11 Thread Martin Aspeli
Martijn Faassen wrote: Andreas Jung wrote: --On 10. April 2008 19:10:49 +0200 Brian Sutherland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just adding my few requirements: - Integration into the component architecture in such a way that I can specify the db connection parameters in ZCML and that

[Zope-dev] Re: straighting out the SQLAlchemy integration mess

2008-04-11 Thread Martin Aspeli
Andreas Jung lists at zopyx.com writes: The way I use collective.lead in my book is to have it look up the database settings in a local utility. That utility is editable via a control panel page in Plone. I suspect that it'd be quite easy to do something similar where the settings were

[Zope-dev] Re: Five and browser-oriented components

2008-04-14 Thread Martin Aspeli
Philipp von Weitershausen wrote: *IF* you'd like to be pragmatic, I'd suggest we clean up those failing Plone tests, merge the branch and be on our way. Yes, we *might* be plastering over a potential problem in the patch, but the other tests didn't seem to be affected and intensive alpha

[Zope-dev] Re: Proposal: Merge philikon-aq branch into Zope trunk

2008-04-17 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hanno Schlichting wrote: Philipp von Weitershausen wrote: Hanno Schlichting wrote: Merging it into Zope trunk will get it into the Zope 2.12 release which is at this point not scheduled yet, but is unlikely to get a release before early 2009. This should give us plenty of time to test. This

[Zope-dev] Re: Let's fix the damned website

2008-04-19 Thread Martin Aspeli
Maerteijn wrote: I'm thinking about volunteering for the zope2 section, but I already can say that I'm not an expert on all facets of zope2. However, helping out is the main concern now so something is better than nothing. Absolutely. I don't think you need to be an expert to do a good job. In

[Zope-dev] Re: paver: buildout is utterly doomed

2008-04-22 Thread Martin Aspeli
Martijn Faassen wrote: You Can Save Buildout! So, who is up to make a nice clean looking website and a few tutorials for buildout? It needs a website. Buildout has been around for a few years without a proper website already, Paver for 5 minutes and it's got one. I'm not going to do it, but

[Zope-dev] Re: paver: buildout is utterly doomed

2008-04-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Martijn Faassen wrote: Hi there, On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 12:58 PM, Christian Theune [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [buildout.org versus buildout.zope.org] Agreed, we shouldn't hide ourselves. I think *.python.org is a step too far. What I do think is that it's good to let projects that *do*

[Zope-dev] Re: paver: buildout is utterly doomed

2008-04-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Christian Theune wrote: Hi, On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 01:10:19PM +0200, Martijn Faassen wrote: I'm on the fence on this one. I think as long as the site *says* it's affiliated with the Zope project, the Zope community and the foundation, we're fine. You can argue both directions here: we might

[Zope-dev] Re: new zope.org, sphinx, and documentation management

2008-04-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi Paul, I guess I have officially volunteered to write content for the new zope.org site in the zope 3 section. Part of that involves describing what zope 3 is in a concise manner. I realize there are probably a lot of different opinions about what zope 3 is, so I would like to solicit the

[Zope-dev] Re: Let's fix the damned website

2008-04-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Lennart Regebro wrote: On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Christophe Combelles [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So let's just build a first nice zope.org with subfolders explaining the different projects because it's important to have just *something*. At least. Sure, that's fine. But that's just

[Zope-dev] Re: [Zope.org Redux] Re: Let's fix the damned website

2008-04-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Lennart Regebro wrote: Martins answer doens't seem to have arrived here, so sorry for the weird quoting: On 21 Apr 2008, at 11:53 , Martin Aspeli wrote: Does it really matter whether a microsite lives in zope.org/projects/zodb or zodb.zope.org? As mentioned, no.But it's important

[Zope-dev] buildout failures

2008-06-13 Thread Martin Aspeli
How many of these do we need? zope-dev is almost unreadable at the moment due to the number of buildout failure emails. Martin -- Author of `Professional Plone Development`, a book for developers who want to work with Plone. See http://martinaspeli.net/plone-book

[Zope-dev] Re: buildout failures

2008-06-14 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tim Cook wrote: On Sat, 2008-06-14 at 13:10 +0200, Christian Theune wrote: That's exactly the behaviour I was afraid of. I propose to keep it around for a few more days to see how it stabilizes. If it jerks again, I'll switch off notifications until I get a change done that avoids this

[Zope-dev] Re: SQLAlchemy integration experiment

2008-06-17 Thread Martin Aspeli
Brian Sutherland wrote: On Mon, Jun 16, 2008 at 08:40:24PM +0200, Martijn Faassen wrote: Hi there, In some earlier discussions a number of approaches to integrate SQLAlchemy into Zope were discussed. Following up on that, I've tried a particular approach that tries to use ScopedSessions with

[Zope-dev] Re: SQLAlchemy integration experiment

2008-06-17 Thread Martin Aspeli
Martijn Faassen wrote: Martin Aspeli wrote: Brian Sutherland wrote: [snip] For some reason this raises a warning bell in my head. I keep on thinking: this is zope, the session is a classic case for a utility, we should be getting it in views by an interface. FWIW, I had the same though. I

[Zope-dev] Re: SQLAlchemy integration experiment

2008-06-17 Thread Martin Aspeli
Laurence Rowe wrote: Martin Aspeli wrote: Martijn Faassen wrote: Martin Aspeli wrote: Brian Sutherland wrote: [snip] For some reason this raises a warning bell in my head. I keep on thinking: this is zope, the session is a classic case for a utility, we should be getting it in views

[Zope-dev] Re: buildout on Windows

2008-06-20 Thread Martin Aspeli
Chris Withers wrote: Hey All, I'm trying to run a plone-ish buildout on Windows for a customer, currently getting this: creating zope.proxy copying zope/proxy\proxy.h - zope.proxy error: Python was built with Visual Studio 2003; extensions must be built with a compiler than can generate

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