[Emc-developers] a couple of make errors

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gentlemen,
 I see this error while make is running

../docs/html/hal/rtcomps.html:1001: parser error : Entity 'pi' not defined
  Change to 60 for RPM, to 360 for degrees per second, 6.283185 (= 2*)
for r

I am not sure if this is a bug or not - just wanted to report it.



Immediately after the above reported error I see this on the screen

Error: 500 Access to 'file' URIs has been disabled

This repeats for several pages until I see

###
### language: English
### all links are good!
###

This ends the make function.



Again, since this is the first time I compiled the documentation I don't
know if this is even an error.

This is my configure command./configure --with-realtime=uspace
--enable-build-documentation --disable-build-documentation-translation
--enable-non-distributable=yes

may make command is  - make

I am running Debian 12 in virtualbox on a Windows 7 host.
I installed a live LinuxCNC iso and then git cloned linuxcnc into
linuxcnc-dev.
I had to clear a bunch of dependency errors.
Linuxcnc is running fine out of my linuxcnc-dev/scripts directory.



thanks
Stuart

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[Emc-developers] distutils - sysconfig

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gentlemen,
 Configuring linuxcnc gives me a deprecation warning about distutils and
tells me to use sysconfig instead.
 I see disutils should still work as the warning states distutils will be
removed in Python 3.12 and the current Python is 3.11.
 I found some 'replacement instructions' (such as they are claimed) that
give me NDI (no d@mn idea) how to proceed. :)
 Is there a better explanation or will this just be fixed for 3.12?

thanks
Stuart


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Re: [Emc-developers] vismach example movies

[Stuart Stevenson]

https:/l/videobin.org/+87f/b08.html
https://videobin.org/+87g/b09.html
https://videobin.org/+87i/b0b.html
https://videobin.org/+87j/b0c.html
https://videobin.org/+87k/b0d.html

These are all the links on the wiki page.

heh - I copied them all but i suspect if one works then all will work

thanks
Stuart




On Thu, May 23, 2024 at 11:20 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Wed, 22 May 2024 at 20:14, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> > Gentlemen,
> >   The wikiQuick links to vismach movies
> > links do not work.
>
>
> Which link?
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
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[Emc-developers] vismach example movies

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gentlemen,
  The wikiQuick links to vismach movies
links do not work.

Is there another place to look?

thanks
Stuart


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Re: [Emc-developers] The Wiki Certificate might have expired

[Stuart Stevenson]

My iPhone opened the page.

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On Fri, May 17, 2024 at 5:29 PM andy pugh  wrote:

> My Mac is really unwilling to visit wiki.linuxcnc.org
>
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] make "errors"(?)

[Stuart Stevenson]

very good
thanks

On Mon, Mar 25, 2024 at 7:44 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Sat, 23 Mar 2024 at 22:02, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> >
> > Are any of the reports important or serious?
>
>
> No, that's all normal and as expected.
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
> ___
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Re: [Emc-developers] possible documentation error

[Stuart Stevenson]

Andy,
I thought about trying to fix it myself. Would that have been possible for
me to do at my level of participation?
thanks
Stuart


On Sun, Mar 24, 2024 at 1:31 PM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Sat, 23 Mar 2024 at 21:45, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> > Should the word disktop be desktop?
>
>
> Fixed
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
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[Emc-developers] make "errors"(?)

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gentlemen,

I used the "Quick Start" instructions.
the 'runtests' gave me this result.

Runtest: 270 tests run, 270 successful, 0 failed + 0 expected, 4 skipped

This is the list of lines showing abnormal(?) results.

1: Skipping disabled test:
/home/stustev/linuxcnc-dev/tests/classicladder/estop
2: ***
/home/stustev/linuxcnc-dev/tests/interp/m98m99/12-M99-endless-main-program:
XPASS: Passed, but was expected to fail
3: Skipping disabled test: /home/stustev/linuxcnc-dev/tests/linuxcncrsh
4: loadrt found the test component, and it failed to load
5: line 6213: accel phase over
6: Skipping disabled test: /home/stustev/linuxcnc-dev/tests/raster
7: Skipping disabled test: /home/stustev/linuxcnc-dev/tests/save.1

Are any of the reports important or serious?

regards
Stuart

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[Emc-developers] possible documentation error

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gentlemen,
  In the "Building LinuxCNC" (building-linuxcnc.html) document, section 6
Building on Gentoo the second sentence says "Be sure you are running a
disktop profile." Should the word disktop be desktop?
thanks
Stuart




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Re: [Emc-developers] Status of LinuxCNC in Debian

[Stuart Stevenson]

Yup,
loading ascii-docs fixed that error
loading another Xmu file fixed the last error to stop "make'

I am now running on the screen. many thanks guys

I download the zip file and extracted the files
running autogen was good from the start
configure coughed on a few files. finding the corresponding files in
synaptic cleared the coughing.
make also needed a few files from synaptic to make it happy.
now with 8  or 10 files out of synaptic it runs seemingly just fine. very
few problems
I have not run any tests yet

many thanks guys
Stuart



On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 5:53 PM Rod Webster  wrote:

> Probably a missing dependency Stuart.
> Get the source with git clone per the docs.
> I did a video a while ago https://youtu.be/Oe4Hfq3G2_A?si=B6_IhIcShkuF77Hk
> Sometimes a dependency will not get caught when checking build
> dependencies.
>
> Rod Webster
> *1300 896 832*
> +61 435 765 611
> Vehicle Modifications Network
> www.vehiclemods.net.au
>
>
> On Sat, 23 Mar 2024 at 00:32, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> > Make will not go past a requirement for A2X. Looks like this is a python
> > file.
> > I must leave for a while.
> > Is there an easy fix?
> > thanks
> > Stuart
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 8:44 AM Stuart Stevenson 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Andy,
> > > thank you
> > > for now I will download the zip file
> > > I will bookmark the contributing link for later
> > >
> > > Sincerely
> > > Stuart
> > >
> > > On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 8:08 AM andy pugh  wrote:
> > >
> > >> On Fri, 22 Mar 2024 at 12:56, Stuart Stevenson 
> > wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > I want to download the source from git. Is there a script of
> > >> instructions
> > >> > to get me there?
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> If you only want the code, and don't want to make pull requests etc,
> > then
> > >> just download this zip file:
> > >> https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/archive/refs/heads/master.zip
> > >>
> > >> Otherwise, see:
> > >>
> > https://linuxcnc.org/docs/stable/html/code/contributing-to-linuxcnc.html
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> atp
> > >> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed
> > >> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> > >> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> > >>
> > >> ___
> > >> Emc-developers mailing list
> > >> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Addressee is the intended audience.
> > > If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to
> read
> > > this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without
> saving
> > or
> > > reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
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> > > Thank you for honoring my wish.
> > >
> > >
> >
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Re: [Emc-developers] Building from source. Was:Re Status of LinuxCNC in Debian

[Stuart Stevenson]

will do

On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 10:17 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Fri, 22 Mar 2024 at 15:07, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> > I have found/installed all the configure dependencies.
> > A2X stops the make process. There is no A2X in synaptic unless it is in a
> > python package and not obvious.
>
>
> It's part of asccidoc, I think.
>
> Try
>
> ./autogen.sh
> ./configure --enable-build-documentation=none
> make
>
> That should bypass all the docs building dependencies.
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] Building from source. Was:Re Status of LinuxCNC in Debian

[Stuart Stevenson]

I have found/installed all the configure dependencies.
A2X stops the make process. There is no A2X in synaptic unless it is in a
python package and not obvious.
I will try the build-dep this evening.
thanks
Stuart


On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 9:49 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Fri, 22 Mar 2024 at 14:35, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> > Make will not go past a requirement for A2X. Looks like this is a python
> > file.
>
>
> There are lots of build-time dependencies.
>
> You _might_ be able to (from the source root, ie below /src/
>
> ./debian/configure
> sudo apt-get build-dep
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] Status of LinuxCNC in Debian

[Stuart Stevenson]

Make will not go past a requirement for A2X. Looks like this is a python
file.
I must leave for a while.
Is there an easy fix?
thanks
Stuart


On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 8:44 AM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> Andy,
> thank you
> for now I will download the zip file
> I will bookmark the contributing link for later
>
> Sincerely
> Stuart
>
> On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 8:08 AM andy pugh  wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 22 Mar 2024 at 12:56, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>>
>> > I want to download the source from git. Is there a script of
>> instructions
>> > to get me there?
>>
>>
>> If you only want the code, and don't want to make pull requests etc, then
>> just download this zip file:
>> https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/archive/refs/heads/master.zip
>>
>> Otherwise, see:
>> https://linuxcnc.org/docs/stable/html/code/contributing-to-linuxcnc.html
>>
>> --
>> atp
>> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
>> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
>> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-developers mailing list
>> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>>
>
>
> --
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>
>

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Re: [Emc-developers] Status of LinuxCNC in Debian

[Stuart Stevenson]

Andy,
thank you
for now I will download the zip file
I will bookmark the contributing link for later

Sincerely
Stuart

On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 8:08 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Fri, 22 Mar 2024 at 12:56, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> > I want to download the source from git. Is there a script of instructions
> > to get me there?
>
>
> If you only want the code, and don't want to make pull requests etc, then
> just download this zip file:
> https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/archive/refs/heads/master.zip
>
> Otherwise, see:
> https://linuxcnc.org/docs/stable/html/code/contributing-to-linuxcnc.html
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
> ___
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Re: [Emc-developers] Status of LinuxCNC in Debian

[Stuart Stevenson]

I want to download the source from git. Is there a script of instructions
to get me there?


On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 5:46 AM Rod Webster  wrote:

> Its my understanding that the version of linuxcnc in Bookworm is dated
> around February 2023 and is well out of date.
> I get frustrated when I see people recommending installing linuxCNC from
> the repos when Andy has a script documented in the 2.9 getting linuxcnc
> docs that gets a current version.
> It would be nice to get it into testing again.
>
> Rod Webster
> *1300 896 832*
> +61 435 765 611
> Vehicle Modifications Network
> www.vehiclemods.net.au
>
>
> On Fri, 22 Mar 2024 at 20:31, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> > Andy,
> > I sent you a reply then received a message it needs moderator approval
> > because it is too long.
> > It must be because I included a screen shot to show you the response in
> > synaptic.
> >
> > Synaptic shows linuxcnc is a choice to install.
> >
> > thanks
> > Stuart
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 5:27 AM Stuart Stevenson 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Yes
> > > Here is my uname -a response for a fresh install last week.
> > > Linux Debian12-Optiplex 6.1.0-18-rt-amd64 #1 SMP PREEMPT_RT Debian
> > > 6.1.76-1 (2024-02-01) x86_64 GNU/Linux
> > >
> > > Here is what I see in Synaptic
> > >
> > > regards
> > > Stuart
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 5:15 AM andy pugh  wrote:
> > >
> > >> Is LinuxCNC currently in Debian? I know that we were due for removal
> > from
> > >> Testing, and since then I have heard no further updates from Debian
> > about
> > >> anything at all.
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> atp
> > >> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed
> > >> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> > >> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> > >>
> > >> ___
> > >> Emc-developers mailing list
> > >> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > > --
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> > > If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to
> read
> > > this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without
> saving
> > or
> > > reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
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> > > Thank you for honoring my wish.
> > >
> > >
> >
> > --
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> > reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
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> >
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Re: [Emc-developers] Status of LinuxCNC in Debian

[Stuart Stevenson]

Andy,
I sent you a reply then received a message it needs moderator approval
because it is too long.
It must be because I included a screen shot to show you the response in
synaptic.

Synaptic shows linuxcnc is a choice to install.

thanks
Stuart


On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 5:27 AM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> Yes
> Here is my uname -a response for a fresh install last week.
> Linux Debian12-Optiplex 6.1.0-18-rt-amd64 #1 SMP PREEMPT_RT Debian
> 6.1.76-1 (2024-02-01) x86_64 GNU/Linux
>
> Here is what I see in Synaptic
>
> regards
> Stuart
>
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 5:15 AM andy pugh  wrote:
>
>> Is LinuxCNC currently in Debian? I know that we were due for removal from
>> Testing, and since then I have heard no further updates from Debian about
>> anything at all.
>>
>> --
>> atp
>> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
>> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
>> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-developers mailing list
>> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>>
>
>
> --
> Addressee is the intended audience.
> If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to read
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> reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
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>
>

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Re: [Emc-developers] LinuxCNC-aware chat bot

[Stuart Stevenson]

I agree with Andy. The explanation is largely complete and accurate. It is
very impressive.

I look forward to the result of it learning the source code.


On Fri, Feb 2, 2024 at 6:47 PM Jacob Rush  wrote:

> I wonder what would happen if you added the source code.
> 
> From: andy pugh 
> Sent: Friday, February 2, 2024 6:06:52 PM
> To: EMC developers 
> Subject: Re: [Emc-developers] LinuxCNC-aware chat bot
>
> On Fri, 2 Feb 2024 at 23:43, Steffen Möller via Emc-developers
>  wrote:
>
> > GPT 4 after receiving all our documentation:
> > In HAL (Hardware Abstraction Layer) configuration for LinuxCNC,
> traditional programming constructs like loops (for, while) are not directly
> supported in the HAL configuration language itself.
> ...
> > In summary, while HAL itself does not support loops in the way a
> conventional programming language does, you can achieve similar outcomes
> through the methods mentioned above. This design choice keeps HAL
> configurations straightforward and focused on hardware-software
> interfacing, with more complex logic handled by custom components or
> external scripts.
>
> That's really quite impressive.
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
> ___
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Re: [Emc-developers] 5-axis video at Tormach meet up

[Stuart Stevenson]

Heh - They told me the Venturecom was an entire operating system that ran
the Windows system for the GUI as an application.
My thought was Windows on top of Windows - what could possibly go wrong?
Later we had a couple small Cinci horizontals with Cinci's windows based
control. Very difficult to keep running although I was not sure where the
problem was - control, implementation or cheap hardware. Very difficult to
troubleshoot with very limited access (closed source). You could bring
techs in but that got expensive very fast.

What moved EMC from Windows to Linux?
thanks
Stuart



On Tue, May 2, 2023 at 7:51 AM  wrote:

> On 2023-05-02 06:59, Stuart Stevenson wrote:
>
> > We put MDSI's OpenCNC control on it. We
> > installed OpenCNC on 3 hydrotels. OpenCNC ran on QNX then. MDSI changed
> > to
> > offer OpenCNC on Venturecom's Windows operating system only. I searched
> > for
> > a control running on something other than Windows and found EMC. During
> > my
> > 'education' installing EMC I discovered EMC2. What a breath of fresh
> > air -
> > made the switch and never looked back.
>
> The first version of EMC ran on the Venturecom real time extension for
> Windows NT 3.51. The GUI was done in Visual Basic.
>
> Thanks,
> Matt
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] 5-axis video at Tormach meet up

[Stuart Stevenson]

Hi,
 The blue Cinci was built in the 50's as a 40 inch X 120 inch hydrotel. In
the early 80's Cincinnati began purchasing the castings from the used
market. They installed ball screws and the gimbal head to create the 5 axis
machine. Circa 1997 we bought the machine from a local Wichita shop. It had
the Big Blue Cinci control (IIRC called the Acramatic 800/850). It ran fine
with that control. The control was old and was showing signs of age and
parts were hard to come by. We put MDSI's OpenCNC control on it. We
installed OpenCNC on 3 hydrotels. OpenCNC ran on QNX then. MDSI changed to
offer OpenCNC on Venturecom's Windows operating system only. I searched for
a control running on something other than Windows and found EMC. During my
'education' installing EMC I discovered EMC2. What a breath of fresh air -
made the switch and never looked back.
Last I knew the blue cinci was making parts in a shop in Tulsa and one of
the 28 inch X 120 hydrotel retrofits with OpenCNC was still making parts in
a shop in Kansas City. I left the company in 2013 and lost track of the
machines shortly thereafter. I supplied manuals and config details when the
machines were sold but haven't heard much lately.
regards
Stuart


On Tue, May 2, 2023 at 6:07 AM Leonardo Marsaglia 
wrote:

> What a nice machine, I remember there were videos of it on the LCNC site a
> while ago.
>
> I'm curious about the manufacture year of this machine and also if this
> came with hydraulic servo actuators and if so are they still being used
> with LCNC?
>
> I remember a guy who retrofitted an internal grinding machine and he used
> the original hydraulic cylinder the machine had on the Z axis but installed
> a Moog type valve and a linear scale to control it with LCNC. It worked
> perfectly.
>
> El mar., 2 de mayo de 2023 02:43, Thomas J Powderly 
> escribió:
>
> > Thanks for the links
> >
> > and for FFox, it can ask
> >
> > save
> >
> > or
> >
> > open with
> >
> > (some  app to view the .wmv)
> >
> > So I just  open with VLC
> >
> > likely MPV and Parole can view wmv also
> >
> > tomp
> >
> > thx Jogn Jon and Stuart
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
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> > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> >
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] 5-axis video at Tormach meet up

[Stuart Stevenson]

I sent Jon copies. He can give them to anyone he wishes. I will give them
to anyone that asks.
regards
Stuart

On Wed, Apr 26, 2023 at 2:53 PM Bari  wrote:

> Looks like it might be Jon Elson's PC showing a 5-axis machine video by
> Stuart Stevenson.
>
> I believe that Stuart took his "youtubes" down. Maybe someone has copies
> to share.
>
> On 4/26/23 13:57, John Allwine wrote:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Thanks for the great weekend! It was nice to be able to put faces to all
> > the names I see in the commits and forums.
> >
> > I forget who was showing it, but I was hoping to get the video of the big
> > 5-axis machine that was rigged up with dial indicators.  I snapped a
> > picture of it (see here,
> > https://demos.pentamachine.com/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-5-axis.jpg). Does
> anyone
> > have that?
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> > -John
> >
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>
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Re: [Emc-developers] spindle speed output not working?

[Stuart Stevenson]

My answer is 'ditto Gene's answer'


On Sun, Mar 5, 2023 at 10:26 PM gene heskett  wrote:

> On 3/5/23 18:44, Jon Elson wrote:
> > On 1/15/23 11:50, Jon Elson wrote:
> >> Hello, all,
> >>
> >> I have a user who can't get spindle speed to work.  He says he is
> >> using 2.7.0 and my USC/UPC boards with the 8-bit spindle DAC board.
> >
> > The user sent his computer to me, and I have discovered what looks like
> > it could be considered a bug.  He had a parameter in the loadrt line
> > like this:
> >
> > loadrt hal_ppmc extradac = 0x00
> >
> > this caused a parameter extradac not found error from hal.
> >
> > The correct syntax that works is :
> >
> > loadrt hal_ppmc extradac=0x00  (note - no spaces between extradac and
> > the 0x00).  Is this a known issue in loadrt parameters, and would it be
> > easy to fix?
> >
> > I am not sure this behavior can be tested without Pico Systems hardware,
> > but it seems to be something intrinsic to the hal command interpreter,
> > so it is likely to affect most loadrt commands.
> >
> > Anybody else run into this one?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Jon
> >
> I have now faint memories of something very like that quite a while
> back, but I fixed it by removing the spaces and have since 99% forgot
> about it. Yonks ago.
>
> 2.7.x is quite elderly now, no idea if master still does that. I just
> checked 2 of my machines, no spaces anyplace in a names= or count= of a
> loadrt line. Is that a specific hal_ppmc option? No man page for it.
> >
> >
> > ___
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> > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>   soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>   - Louis D. Brandeis
> Genes Web page 
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] Unknown g code used

[Stuart Stevenson]

maybe a better error feedback would be "Gunknown is not a defined command"

On Fri, Dec 23, 2022 at 7:08 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Fri, 23 Dec 2022 at 11:39,  wrote:
> >
> > I get the Message "Unknown g code used".
> > How to debug this?
>
> It means exactly what it says.
> Which G-code is it complaining about?
>
> (note that the line number might be a few lines out)
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] NURBS in XY, XZ(lathe) and YZ plane

[Stuart Stevenson]

On the Fanuc 15MB control G68/G69 allowed the rotation of the XY/YZ/ZX
planes. G68 would rotate one plane. Another G68 line would then rotate a
second plane combining the two rotations. Tool motion would then be
coordinated to the new plane locations. On the bridge mill with the BC head
you would be able to work to print dimensions at any chosen orientation.
A little tricky as the point of rotation was supremely important as well as
the sequence of rotations. Confusion was a very possible result. I only
ever used it a couple times.
G69 was your friend as it cancelled all rotations.

On Wed, Dec 21, 2022, 8:52 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Tue, 20 Dec 2022 at 09:47, Joachim Franek  wrote:
> > BTW:
> > http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?NURBS
> > Here is a link to a pdf from Leto: but I do only
> > get a pdf with 0 file length.
>
> I got the original papers from Ernesto Lo Valvo and have uploaded them
> to that page.
> In the email that he sent me with them he mentioned a significant
> performance improvement in the G6.2 algorithm that is supposedly
> outlined in the second paper, but has not been submitted to LinuxCNC.
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] NURBS in XY, XZ(lathe) and YZ plane

[Stuart Stevenson]

A point and a vector fully describe a plane in 3D space.

On Wed, Dec 21, 2022 at 2:40 AM Nicklas SB Karlsson  wrote:

> ons 2022-12-21 klockan 00:47 + skrev andy pugh:
> > On Tue, 20 Dec 2022 at 21:27, Nicklas SB Karlsson  wrote:
> >
> > > Three points with three in the (x,y,z) space will define an arc in
> > > three dimensions. Then there is three degrees of freedom for the
> > > tool
> > > direction at each point or two for a rotating/"round" tool if I
> > > think
> > > correct.
> >
> > We have been discussing this on the forum (At least, I think it was
> > there) and someone had the idea of defining both an end point and a
> > point part-way along the arc. This gives an unambiguous arc in three
> > dimensions. If you define the centre point (in three dimensions) then
> > with a start and an end you get two options. And you can't easily
> > define a clockwise and anticlockwise for an arbitrary plane...
> Maybe. Give three points then centre point need to be calculated by
> Linuxcnc but if this does not have accuracy problem for the path I
> guess it is  a good option.
>
>
> > But this isn't what I was rambling about, I was discussing making
> > arcs
> > in XY and UV _simultaneously_ where the arcs have different radii and
> > centre points.
> > The issue is not one of maths, but of G-code letters to use for the
> > parameters.
> > An option might be a G2.1 and G3.1 to "queue up" an arc, to be run
> > concurrently with the next feed move.
> Give all four coordinates (X,Y,U,V) at start point, middle point and
> end point?
>
> Then arc for path could be calculated from (X,Y) coordinates and arc
> for cutting direction by (U,V) with same mathematics will do the trick?
> Or thinking wrong a four dimensional arc need to be calculated?
>
>
> Nicklas Karlsson
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] Arc Bug, help needed.

[Stuart Stevenson]

I think I would pay attention to G90/G91.

On Wed, Dec 7, 2022 at 7:48 PM Greg C  wrote:

> FWIW the preview works here on a Virtual Machine, homed in place with g2 as
> the first move, G20 or G21.
>
> 12th Gen Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-12700KF
>
> -Greg
>
> On Wed, Dec 7, 2022 at 6:43 PM Peter C. Wallace  wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 7 Dec 2022, andy pugh wrote:
> >
> > > Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2022 21:54:41 +
> > > From: andy pugh 
> > > Reply-To: EMC developers 
> > > To: EMC developers 
> > > Subject: Re: [Emc-developers] Arc Bug, help needed.
> > >
> > >> On Wed, 7 Dec 2022 at 20:36, John Thornton  wrote:
> > >>
> > >> I can confirm the bug is in the 2.9 branch that is currently in
> Debian,
> > >> I'm unable to build a RIP on 2.9 to see if it's still there as I get
> >
> >
> > >metric or imperial config?
> > >Did you run the test command in G20 or G21?
> > >NO_FORCE_HOMING?
> > >
> > >What CPU are you running? (It is getting to the point that I am
> wondering
> > >if that matters)
> >
> >
> > I have no issue with G20 or G21 with current master
> >
> > (with g2 x0 y0 j5 z-2 f1000 as the first linuxCNC motion at startup)
> >
> > of course X,Y must be 0 at the start
> >
> > Peter Wallace
> >
> >
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> >
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] [Hosted Weblate] New comment in LinuxCNC/LinuxCNC Documentation

[Stuart Stevenson]

PAUSE/CONTINUE with II/> as the symbols. My 22 month old grandson
understands this on my phone and on the tv screen.

Returning to earlier NC/CNC commands is "rewind" to start at the beginning
of the program.

A strip visual cues on the screen showing the major start points such as
tool changes.


On Thu, Jul 28, 2022 at 5:36 AM Hans Unzner  wrote:

> Maybe
> will restart the program at the following line. --> will continue executing
> the program at the following line.
> ?
>
> Am Do., 28. Juli 2022 um 11:55 Uhr schrieb Steffen Möller via
> Emc-developers :
>
> >
> >
> > #  Comment added
> >
> > [ smoe](https://hosted.weblate.org/user/smoe/ "Steffen Möller"): [Hosted
> > Weblate](https://hosted.weblate.org) /
> > [LinuxCNC](https://hosted.weblate.org/projects/linuxcnc/) / [LinuxCNC
> > Documentation](
> https://hosted.weblate.org/projects/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-docs/)
> > /
> > [English](https://hosted.weblate.org/projects/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-docs/en/
> )
> >
> > ## Source string
> >
> > 'M0' - pause a running program temporarily. LinuxCNC remains in the Auto
> > Mode
> > so MDI and other manual actions are not enabled. Pressing the resume
> button
> > will restart the program at the following line.
> >
> > ## Source string description
> >
> > type: Plain text
> >
> > ## Comment
> >
> > I am unhappy with the term "restart". That would imply that something
> > would be
> > "re"-executed, which is not the case, and variables are not affected,
> > either.
> > I would prefer "the execution of that program continues in the following
> > line."
> >
> > [Edit this string](
> https://hosted.weblate.org/translate/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-
> > docs/en/?checksum=acfba46ddc59075d#comments
> > <
> https://hosted.weblate.org/translate/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-docs/en/?checksum=acfba46ddc59075d#comments
> >
> > )
> >
> > ## Source string location
> >
> > [src/gcode/m-code.adoc:47](
> >
> https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/docs/src/gcode/m-code.adoc?plain=1#L47
> > )
> >
> > ##  Translation Info
> >
> > All strings|  [
> > 29,515
> > ](https://hosted.weblate.org/translate/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-docs/en/) |
> >
> >
> >
> ---|---|
> > Translated strings |  [
> > 29,515
> > ](https://hosted.weblate.org/translate/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-
> > docs/en/?q=state:>=translated) |  [
> > 100%
> > ](https://hosted.weblate.org/translate/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-
> > docs/en/?q=state:>=translated)
> > Untranslated strings   |  [ 0
> >
> > ](https://hosted.weblate.org/translate/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-
> > docs/en/?q=state:empty)|  [
> > 0%
> > ](https://hosted.weblate.org/translate/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-
> > docs/en/?q=state:empty)
> > Unfinished strings |  [ 0
> >
> > ](https://hosted.weblate.org/translate/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-
> > docs/en/?q=state: > 0%
> > ](https://hosted.weblate.org/translate/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-
> > docs/en/?q=state: > Strings marked for edit|  [ 0
> >
> > ](https://hosted.weblate.org/translate/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-
> > docs/en/?q=state:needs-editing)|  [
> > 0%
> > ](https://hosted.weblate.org/translate/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-
> > docs/en/?q=state:needs-editing)
> >
> >
> > [View](https://hosted.weblate.org/projects/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-docs/en/)
> >
> >
> > [Weblate, the libre continuous localization system.](
> https://weblate.org/)
> >
> > Generated on July 28, 2022, 11:53 a.m..
> >
> > ___
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> > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> >
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] linuxcnc is marked for autoremoval from testing

[Stuart Stevenson]

What does 'autoremoval from testing' mean? Is it good or bad?

On Thu, Jun 23, 2022 at 11:34 AM gene heskett  wrote:

> On 6/23/22 10:31, Debian testing autoremoval watch wrote:
> > linuxcnc 2.9.0~pre0+git20220402.2500863908-4 is marked for autoremoval
> from testing on 2022-07-13
> >
> > It is affected by these RC bugs:
> > 1012789: linuxcnc-uspace: Linux CNC will not start
> >   https://bugs.debian.org/1012789
> I beg to differ, this mornings install from the buildbot for both wintel
> and armhf machines
> is working fine. And has done so for every install here. sometimes at
> less than daily intervals
> for an updated install since the last time the buildbot was restarted.
> Pix of two machines running it are at:
>
> 
>
> This is all on uptodate buster.  The last time I tried to build on
> bullseye was on the rpi4 (armhf)
> and it failed on both a wintel and on an armhf because the python was
> too new.
>
>
> >
> >
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> >
> > Autoremoval data is generated by:
> >
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> > .
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Re: [Emc-developers] tool database in python

[Stuart Stevenson]

In the 1988/1989 timeframe I ran a Mori Seiki (SL25?) with a Fanuc control.
I built a tool holder to hold 3 tools on one tool station on the turret. I
had a spot drill, drill and small boring bar mounted. The tools could be
varied as I used small round shank collet holders.
Ex.
T0101 would be tool station 1 offset 1
This would spot drill and move back (Z positive to a clearance point)

T0111 would be tool station 1 offset 11
This would (without the turret rotating) drill the hole and move back (Z
positive to a clearance point)

T0121 would be tool station 1 offset 21
This would (without the turret rotating) bore the hole and move back (Z
positive to a clearance point)

\Ex.

One lathe I ran (I wish I could remember what the control was) would allow
me to change the value of the offset while the control was running. The
offset change would be applied (interpolated) during the running of the
next block of code. The control would read the offset value at the
beginning of every line of code and interpolate to the end point while
applying the offset value. I thought this a very useful feature. Never saw
it again.

Most of the controls I ran have had wear offsets available. I never used
them. I thought they were confusing and just one more opportunity for human
error and forgetfulness (maybe this is just my way of self
protection/compensation). I probably would not use wear offsets today. I
don't see the point.

Just my 2 cents contribution
Stuart


On Thu, Jun 23, 2022 at 8:57 PM Feral Engineer 
wrote:

> Siemens controls use tool edges to control offsets for each tool. Every
> tool starts with edge 1
>
> T1 D1 is tool 1 data 1
> T="end mill" D1
> T3 D1
> Etc
>
> You can have like 10 offsets per tool
>
> On a lathe there are two ways you can have your offsets. T0101 as an
> example could either be station 1 / offset 1, wear 1 or T0101 could be
> station 1, offset 1 / wear 1
>
> Another example would be T0210
>
> Station 2
> Offset 10
> Wear 10
>
> Or
>
> Station 2
> Offset 2
> Wear 10
>
> Depends on parameter setting. On a Mitsubishi, i think it's 1098. I forget
> what it is on fanuc. I'd have to look.
>
> Phil T.
> The Feral Engineer
>
> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
> www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
>
> Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
> www.patreon.com/theferalengineer
>
> Order one of the coolest label makers on the market at
> http://labelworks.epson.com, use coupon code "theferalengineer" and
> receive
> 20% off of your order 
>
> On Thu, Jun 23, 2022, 9:46 PM Chris Morley 
> wrote:
>
> > Different edges of the same tool is done by having different offsets, not
> > tool number.
> > t11 = tool pocket 1 offset 1
> > t12 = tool pocket 1 offset 2
> >
> > There is also
> >  T111 = tool 1 offset 1 wear offsets 1
> >
> > To pick a particular tool for a pocket in Gcode is not standard on a
> lathe.
> > I'm quoting Okuma, I believe Fanuc is similar but I'm sure there are
> > exceptions of course.
> >
> > Anyways the problem of the GUI knowing what offset/wear offset is
> > currently set is still the same.
> >
> > Chris
> > 
> > From: andy pugh 
> > Sent: June 23, 2022 7:29 PM
> > To: EMC developers 
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-developers] tool database in python
> >
> > On Thu, 23 Jun 2022 at 06:42, Chris Morley 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > for instance, you can use multiple tool offsets (one at a time) on a
> > single tool position.
> >
> > Indeed, which is why a database needs to allow several tools to be
> > simultaneously in the same pocket.
> > (To store different edges of the same tool as different T-numbers
> > using different offsets)
> >
> > --
> > atp
> > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> > designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> > lunatics."
> > — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> >
> >
> > ___
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> >
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Re: [Emc-developers] tool database in python

[Stuart Stevenson]

Simple Tool Changer on mill,

The pocket number IS the tool number loaded into the spindle.
An M06/M6 command then puts the spindle tool in the correct pot and the
machine waits for the next tool pot number to be positioned to allow the
spindle to be loaded.
Machines with a tool change rack or a carousel will position the spindle
above the tool change magazine and move the proper tool pot into position.
This is simple and effective but very time consuming and not very flexible.
This also allows a tool large enough to interfere with an adjoining tool to
be used as the adjoining pockets are left empty and the control knows
nothing about the empty pockets.

Simple Random Tool Changer on a mill,

The tool number is the tool. This causes consternation when a new operator
places tool number 1 into pot number 1 and so on for all the tools. After
running the program the operator sees pot number 1 no longer holds the tool
he placed into pot number 1. This happens because the tool changer placed
tool number 2 into postion for the tool change and the tool changer pulled
tool number 1 from the spindle to allow tool number 2 to be placed into the
spindle. At the same time tool number one was placed into pot number 2. The
control must keep track of which tool number is in which pot so the next
time tool number 1 is called for use - pot number 2 can be positioned to
allow tool number 1 to be loaded into the spindle. This allows the next
tool to be positioned for a tool change while the machine is still running
the tool in the spindle. Tool changes are much quicker and are simple and
effective.


Somewhat Complex Random Tool Changer on a mill,

The same as the simple random tool changer with added capabilities such as
a secondary tool number 1 (for example). The primary tool number 1 dulls or
times out. The secondary tool number 1 in whatever pot it is in is called
by the control choosing to replace the primary tool number 1. The pot the
secondary number 1 now is included in all the tool changes and the pot with
the primary tool number 1 is ignored.

The BEST Tool Change Protocol,

The best tool change protocol is the tool number and pot number stay the
same. They may not match but the tool is pulled from and placed into the
same pot for the duration of the tools use. The complexity is in the tool
change mechanism. When tool 1 is in the spindle and tool 2 is called as the
next tool then tool tool 2 is place into the tool change position. The tool
changer picks the tool out of the pot and position itself for a tool
change. The tool change happens and tool 2 happily starts cutting while the
tool change arm waits for the pot for tool 1 to be placed into position so
the arm can place tool 1 into the same pot it pulled to one from just prior
to the tool change. The next tool is called in the program and the tool is
place into the tool change position and picked up by the tool change arm
waiting to be put into the spindle. This allow the tool change time to be
reduced like a random tool changer but allow tool management like the
simple tool changer. This also allows for much simpler large tool
management and spare tool management.
It woul also allow automated tool installation into the local machine
magazine from a tool hive. This would require another tool change arm and
is beyond what would be required for a single machine installation.

About 3 months ago I talked with a man that said he had installed LinuxCNC
on a machine but (talking with an authoritative condescending voice)
changed it to Centroid as it would allow him to put an encoder in the
spindle and do rigid tapping. I quietly mentioned LinuxCNC has had rigid
tapping for only about 15 years. His stumbling answer was almost
incoherent. Our conversation ended shortly thereafter and I left. I sent
him a few video links and then after about two weeks I stopped by to ask
him if he had seen them. He had not had time as he is too busy. I then sent
him a video link of peck tapping but have not talked to him again. :)
At least he didn't ask if LinuxCNC had cutter radius compensation and/or
tool length compensation.



On Tue, Jun 21, 2022 at 5:32 PM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Tue, 21 Jun 2022 at 20:57, Jérémie Tarot  wrote:
>
> > > So, the tool _number_ as associated with the G-code T-command is very
> > > deliberately _not_ a key but a "property."
>
> > I think that number is really a pocket_id in a tool_magazine to which is
> > associated a tool_id, which in turn has a tool_number... Properly indeed!
>
> The T-number can be the pocket number if you want to run your query
> that way. But it's a very bad choice for a random toolchanger.
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] curious about the ethernet protocol

[Stuart Stevenson]

The Fanuc drives on the mill used Fanus feedback but the drive had quad
output so I connected that to LinuxCNC
easy peasy simple

On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 5:59 PM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> use the encoder feedback on both the motor drive and LinuxCNC
>
> On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 5:38 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
>
>> Linuxcnc doesn't care where you close the feedback loop (linuxcnc always
>> closes the feedback loop).   Simple step/direction closes the loop between
>> the step-gen and linuxcnc.
>>
>>
>>
>> sam
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 3:57 PM Torsten Curdt via Emc-developers <
>> emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net> wrote:
>>
>> > > > That said - that's a dual loop with two different encoders.
>> > > > That's not really the same dual loop when you have LinuxCNC and a
>> > Closed
>> > > > Loop Stepper/Servo Driver.
>> > >
>> > > If you only have one feedback source, how can you have a dual feedback
>> > > loop? With the feedback closed on the driver, your joint will be
>> treated
>> > as
>> > > if its open loop by linuxcnc.
>> > > Yes, Linuxcnc will use a pid but its generally not aware of the
>> drive's
>> > > encoder. Its just dealing with step and direction pulses.
>> > >
>> >
>> > That is exactly the point I was trying to make.
>> > I guess the closed loop on the driver will do a decent job.
>> > But such a system does not really seem to be in the full spirit of
>> LinuxCNC
>> > being in control.
>> >
>> > ___
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>> >
>>
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Re: [Emc-developers] curious about the ethernet protocol

[Stuart Stevenson]

use the encoder feedback on both the motor drive and LinuxCNC

On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 5:38 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> Linuxcnc doesn't care where you close the feedback loop (linuxcnc always
> closes the feedback loop).   Simple step/direction closes the loop between
> the step-gen and linuxcnc.
>
>
>
> sam
>
> On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 3:57 PM Torsten Curdt via Emc-developers <
> emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net> wrote:
>
> > > > That said - that's a dual loop with two different encoders.
> > > > That's not really the same dual loop when you have LinuxCNC and a
> > Closed
> > > > Loop Stepper/Servo Driver.
> > >
> > > If you only have one feedback source, how can you have a dual feedback
> > > loop? With the feedback closed on the driver, your joint will be
> treated
> > as
> > > if its open loop by linuxcnc.
> > > Yes, Linuxcnc will use a pid but its generally not aware of the drive's
> > > encoder. Its just dealing with step and direction pulses.
> > >
> >
> > That is exactly the point I was trying to make.
> > I guess the closed loop on the driver will do a decent job.
> > But such a system does not really seem to be in the full spirit of
> LinuxCNC
> > being in control.
> >
> > ___
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Re: [Emc-developers] curious about the ethernet protocol

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gentlemen,
  Of the 5 machines I have put LinuxCNC on every one was closed loop servo
with LinuxCNC tuning the already tuned closed loop. The machines all ran
just fine. One of them was configured using the 'encoder' feedback
connected to the P and D and a linear scale connected to I. This machine
ran and moved just fine tuning using P and D and final position using I.
I have always wondered what it would be like to tune using a dumb amp and
only LinuxCNC in the loop. Probably not much better than I had.
The only stepper experience was a six axis robot. Chris Radek configured
three axes, we clamped a sharpie to the end effector and drew the LinuxCNC
example program with me holding a piece of cardboard up to the sharpie. I
drew the tool path on the cardboard.
thanks
Stuart

On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 3:28 PM Torsten Curdt via Emc-developers <
emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net> wrote:

> > > Could you do e.g. rigid tapping when there is a LinuxCNC and another
> PID
> > > loop on the motor driver?
> >
> > Granite devices has a good description of dual feedback loops (and a
> > mention for linuxcnc). The inner velocity feedback loop is normally
> closed
> > on the drive and the outer position loop by Linuxcnc
> > https://granitedevices.com/wiki/Dual-loop_feedback_position_control
>
>
> Wow! That's great. Very interesting. Thanks for the link.
>
> That said - that's a dual loop with two different encoders.
> That's not really the same dual loop when you have LinuxCNC and a Closed
> Loop Stepper/Servo Driver.
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] When is an arc small?

[Stuart Stevenson]

Andy,
 I haven't calculated how far the midpoint of the arc is from the midpoint
of a straight line from point to point using the values in your example but
I know it would not be much.
I do know APT uses 2500 inches as the cutoff point for radius calculation.
I don't know the exact reason for choosing this radius value as the cutoff
point but it gives rise to an interesting programming scenario.
Apt is very conducive to 'family of parts' programming. A bearing pillow
block is one example since the shape contour is basically the same for
every size. The 2500 inch as a cutoff value allows you to program the
entire contour using circular (G02/G03) commands. You would choose 2500 as
the radius of any straight lines and the desired radius of any needed
radius. G02/G03 X Y... R*>*2500 is treated as a straight line. G02/G03
X... Y... R<2500. Deviation from the 'standard' contour can be addressed
using this protocol and the same APT code can be used to generate a Gcode
file.
Just my thoughts this fine morning. I have never used this except to prove
it to myself with an example. I still wonder the exact reason this was
done.
HTH
Stuart


On Fri, Feb 4, 2022 at 3:30 PM andy pugh  wrote:

> LinuxCNC G-code assumes that the programmer wanted a full circle if
> the coordinates of the start and end points in the plane are "the
> same".
>
> Currently both the preview interpreter and motion use the angle
> between the start and end points of an arc to decide if the start and
> end coordinates are “identical” and if so it is assumed that a full
> turn was wanted.
>
>
> https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/src/libnml/posemath/_posemath.c#L1824
>
> https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/src/emc/rs274ngc/gcodemodule.cc#L1002
>
> They calculate the angle in different ways and get slightly different
> results. (ie, if you carefully tweak the code, you can have the
> preview and actual motion give different results.
>
> This probably doesn't matter very often.
>
> A problem arises if a _very_ large radius is computed to generate a
> nearly-straight line.
> (In the example in issue 1528 one of the problem arcs is 5mm long, but
> has a 7km radius. The coordinates are very different, but the included
> angle is very, very small)
>
> Given that arcs are programmed in terms of XY coordinates, I think it
> makes no sense to judge the smallness of an arc by internal angle. I
> propose doing it purely on the basis of hypotenuse distance in the
> plane.
>
> (Incidentally, part of the reason that the preview and motion differ
> is because motion is  in metric and preview is in imperial! At least
> with a metric config and metric G-code. I will need to test the 4
> combinations)
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] linuxcnc_2.9.0~pre0+git20211108.cf14c89a9-1_amd64.changes REJECTED

[Stuart Stevenson]

Sebastian,
  This is all above my pay grade but if there is anything I can do to help
with this workload let me know. Retirement can give you opportunities
previously unavailable. :) I can contribute a few hours a day to a project.
You will need to educate me on how this needs to be done. Give me a small
project, tell me how/what to do. Evaluate whether I can save you time or
energy by "helping".

thanks
Stuart


On Mon, Nov 15, 2021 at 5:01 AM Thorsten Alteholz <
ftpmas...@ftp-master.debian.org> wrote:

>
> Hi Sebastian,
>
> unfortunately I have to reject your package.
>
> Please mention all files licensed under a BSD license (e.g.
> linuxcnc/lib/python/qtvcp/widgets/nurbs_editor.py and some other python
> files) in your debian/coypright.
>
> Please also mention all files under GPL-3+ in your debian/copyright.
>
> There are more files available under GPL-2 as you wrote in your
> debian/copyright (e.g. linuxcnc/src/hal/components/*). Please mention all
> of them in your debian/copyright.
>
> Please also mention all files under the Boost Software License in your
> debian/copyright.
>
> Please also mention all files under a CC-3 license in your
> debian/copyright.
>
> Please remove all files licensed under CC-2.5 license from your source
> tarball, as this license is not compatible with DFSG.
>
> As the file headers contain information about the different copyright
> holder, please mention them in your debian/copyright. Stating only "the
> LinuxCNC developers" is not enough.
>
> Thanks!
>  Thorsten
>
>
>
> ===
>
> Please feel free to respond to this email if you don't understand why
> your files were rejected, or if you upload new files which address our
> concerns.
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] 4th axis pivot point question

[Stuart Stevenson]

notice the command "setp" in the kinematics file

that is a default value

while LinuxCNc is running you can issue a "setp" with a command line to
help you determine what the value should be

happy the information is helpful
Stuart


On Sun, May 9, 2021 at 8:45 AM Juergen Gnoss  wrote:

> Sorry Stuart for not responding earlier.
> Yes, I already downloaded it. Thanks for that, it helped a lot.
>
> It took me some time, but It's much clearer now.
> I'm a type of guy like JT, I've to fully understand the stuff behind the
> scenes before I start to cook. Copy, trial and error is not my thing.
> So I took the cincikins_good_24JUN2009.c kinematics file from your .tgz
> and started to tweak it in order to fit my 3 axis gantry + B axis.
>
> Not there yet, but as I said, I learn as I go, at the moment I'm exploring
> how that parameter back and forth (the implementation of it)
> between linuxcnc and a component works.
> Later today I'll go into the kinematics stuff. That part will be straight
> forward, I think, because I already understand that part of the code in
> cincikins_good_24JUN2009.c.
>
> so again, thanks a lot Stuart
> I keep you updated on the progress.
>
> Ju
>
>
> 
> From: emc-developers-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net <
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> Sent: Sunday, May 9, 2021 8:27 AM
> To: emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net <
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> Subject: Emc-developers Digest, Vol 181, Issue 9
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> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 8 May 2021 16:45:33 -0500
> From: Stuart Stevenson 
> To: EMC developers 
> Subject: Re: [Emc-developers] 4th axis pivot point question
> Message-ID:
> <
> cahf93hr07jh-cqlfmxgim3tg-zinnl8vqupjy7zuxpqgkqr...@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> the link expires 5/16/2021
>
> On Sat, May 8, 2021 at 4:43 PM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> > Juergen,
> >
> > This link will give you the EMC2 files used to run the 5 axis cinci with
> > TLO and Pivot Length offsets. The machine has an A axis carried by the B
> > axis and both ride on the Z axis. I hope this will help you.
> >
> > https://www.dropbox.com/s/n3qnegnk52ke1gj/emc2-stuart.tgz?dl=0
> >
> > thanks
> > Stuart
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sat, May 8, 2021 at 8:56 AM Juergen Gnoss  wrote:
> >
> >> Thanks Stuart,
> >>
> >> right now, that sounds like villages in the desert to me, but I'll go
> >> into it.
> >>
> >> me ... going to dive into lcnc documentation
> >>
> >> thanks Ju
> >>
> >>
> >> 
> >> From: emc-developers-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net <
> >> emc-developers-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net>
> >> Sent: Saturday, May 8, 2021 8:19 AM
> >> To: emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net <
> >> emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net>
> >> Subject: Emc-developers Digest, Vol 181, Issue 7
> >>
> >> Send Emc-developers mailing list submissions to
> >> emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> >>
> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> >> emc-developers-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net
> >>
> >> You can reach the person managing the list at
> >> emc-developers-ow...@lists.sourceforge.net
> >>
> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> >> than "Re: Contents of Emc-developers digest..."
> >>
> >>
> >> Today's Topics:
> >>
> >>1. Re: 4th axis pivot point question (Stuart Stevenson)
> &g

Re: [Emc-developers] 4th axis pivot point question

[Stuart Stevenson]

the link expires 5/16/2021

On Sat, May 8, 2021 at 4:43 PM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> Juergen,
>
> This link will give you the EMC2 files used to run the 5 axis cinci with
> TLO and Pivot Length offsets. The machine has an A axis carried by the B
> axis and both ride on the Z axis. I hope this will help you.
>
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/n3qnegnk52ke1gj/emc2-stuart.tgz?dl=0
>
> thanks
> Stuart
>
>
>
> On Sat, May 8, 2021 at 8:56 AM Juergen Gnoss  wrote:
>
>> Thanks Stuart,
>>
>> right now, that sounds like villages in the desert to me, but I'll go
>> into it.
>>
>> me ... going to dive into lcnc documentation
>>
>> thanks Ju
>>
>>
>> 
>> From: emc-developers-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net <
>> emc-developers-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net>
>> Sent: Saturday, May 8, 2021 8:19 AM
>> To: emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net <
>> emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net>
>> Subject: Emc-developers Digest, Vol 181, Issue 7
>>
>> Send Emc-developers mailing list submissions to
>> emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
>>
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>> emc-developers-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net
>>
>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>> emc-developers-ow...@lists.sourceforge.net
>>
>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than "Re: Contents of Emc-developers digest..."
>>
>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>>1. Re: 4th axis pivot point question (Stuart Stevenson)
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Fri, 7 May 2021 21:52:42 -0500
>> From: Stuart Stevenson 
>> To: EMC developers 
>> Subject: Re: [Emc-developers] 4th axis pivot point question
>> Message-ID:
>> <
>> cahf93hrpamdpb19judkm6-17mfvverxpgfw9cvpcg07wp8e...@mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>>
>> Juergen,
>> Are you talking about the display on the AXIS preview or are you talking
>> about machine motion?
>>
>> If you are talking about the display on the screen I don't have much
>> experience with that.
>>
>> If you are talking about machine motion then -
>> You can modify your kinematics file to include a pivot length distance on
>> the y axis/joint position to adjust for the pivot length you determine.
>> sin
>> B axis value times pivot length and cos B axis value times pivot length
>> also
>> You can modify your kinematics file to include a tool length from the tool
>> table to adjust the y axis/joint position for the tool length. sin B axis
>> value times tool length and cos B axis value times tool length
>> also
>> You can modify the kinematics and hal files to create a variable to be
>> read
>> from a hal file to allow you to adjust the pivot length value.
>> You will also need to pass the tool length value into the kinematics file.
>>
>> You will then have 4 axis pivot and tool length compensation.
>>
>> Ideally, the program would position the XYZ tool tip and have a B axis
>> value. The pivot length value and the tool length MUST add up to the
>> distance from the tool tip to the pivot point. You can arbitrarily choose
>> where the pivot point is measured from along the spindle/tool axis. Your
>> tool length will have to be measured from the same point along the spindle
>> tool axis.
>>
>> thanks
>> Stuart
>>
>> On Fri, May 7, 2021 at 5:38 PM andy pugh  wrote:
>>
>> > On Fri, 7 May 2021 at 16:43, Juergen Gnoss  wrote:
>> >
>> > Pivot point of the B axis is about 100mm above spindle collet.
>> > >
>> > > Do I need to tell LCNC something about that in configuration or hal,
>> or
>> > is
>> > > that handled by tool offset in Z ?
>> > >
>> >
>> > It's not really handled at all.
>> >
>> > The machine will do what the machine does, that is fixed by the
>> mechanics.
>> >
>> > The graphical preview will assume that the B axis is along Y = 0.
>> (because
>> > it has no way to know any better)
>> >
>> > --
>> > atp
>> > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium a

Re: [Emc-developers] 4th axis pivot point question

[Stuart Stevenson]

Juergen,

This link will give you the EMC2 files used to run the 5 axis cinci with
TLO and Pivot Length offsets. The machine has an A axis carried by the B
axis and both ride on the Z axis. I hope this will help you.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/n3qnegnk52ke1gj/emc2-stuart.tgz?dl=0

thanks
Stuart



On Sat, May 8, 2021 at 8:56 AM Juergen Gnoss  wrote:

> Thanks Stuart,
>
> right now, that sounds like villages in the desert to me, but I'll go into
> it.
>
> me ... going to dive into lcnc documentation
>
> thanks Ju
>
>
> 
> From: emc-developers-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net <
> emc-developers-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net>
> Sent: Saturday, May 8, 2021 8:19 AM
> To: emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net <
> emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net>
> Subject: Emc-developers Digest, Vol 181, Issue 7
>
> Send Emc-developers mailing list submissions to
> emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> emc-developers-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> emc-developers-ow...@lists.sourceforge.net
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Emc-developers digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>1. Re: 4th axis pivot point question (Stuart Stevenson)
>
>
> --
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 7 May 2021 21:52:42 -0500
> From: Stuart Stevenson 
> To: EMC developers 
> Subject: Re: [Emc-developers] 4th axis pivot point question
> Message-ID:
> <
> cahf93hrpamdpb19judkm6-17mfvverxpgfw9cvpcg07wp8e...@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> Juergen,
> Are you talking about the display on the AXIS preview or are you talking
> about machine motion?
>
> If you are talking about the display on the screen I don't have much
> experience with that.
>
> If you are talking about machine motion then -
> You can modify your kinematics file to include a pivot length distance on
> the y axis/joint position to adjust for the pivot length you determine. sin
> B axis value times pivot length and cos B axis value times pivot length
> also
> You can modify your kinematics file to include a tool length from the tool
> table to adjust the y axis/joint position for the tool length. sin B axis
> value times tool length and cos B axis value times tool length
> also
> You can modify the kinematics and hal files to create a variable to be read
> from a hal file to allow you to adjust the pivot length value.
> You will also need to pass the tool length value into the kinematics file.
>
> You will then have 4 axis pivot and tool length compensation.
>
> Ideally, the program would position the XYZ tool tip and have a B axis
> value. The pivot length value and the tool length MUST add up to the
> distance from the tool tip to the pivot point. You can arbitrarily choose
> where the pivot point is measured from along the spindle/tool axis. Your
> tool length will have to be measured from the same point along the spindle
> tool axis.
>
> thanks
> Stuart
>
> On Fri, May 7, 2021 at 5:38 PM andy pugh  wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 7 May 2021 at 16:43, Juergen Gnoss  wrote:
> >
> > Pivot point of the B axis is about 100mm above spindle collet.
> > >
> > > Do I need to tell LCNC something about that in configuration or hal, or
> > is
> > > that handled by tool offset in Z ?
> > >
> >
> > It's not really handled at all.
> >
> > The machine will do what the machine does, that is fixed by the
> mechanics.
> >
> > The graphical preview will assume that the B axis is along Y = 0.
> (because
> > it has no way to know any better)
> >
> > --
> > atp
> > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
> > for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> > ? George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-developers mailing list
> > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> >
>
>
> --
> Addressee is the intended audience.
> If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to read
> this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without sav

Re: [Emc-developers] 4th axis pivot point question

[Stuart Stevenson]

Juergen,
Are you talking about the display on the AXIS preview or are you talking
about machine motion?

If you are talking about the display on the screen I don't have much
experience with that.

If you are talking about machine motion then -
You can modify your kinematics file to include a pivot length distance on
the y axis/joint position to adjust for the pivot length you determine. sin
B axis value times pivot length and cos B axis value times pivot length
also
You can modify your kinematics file to include a tool length from the tool
table to adjust the y axis/joint position for the tool length. sin B axis
value times tool length and cos B axis value times tool length
also
You can modify the kinematics and hal files to create a variable to be read
from a hal file to allow you to adjust the pivot length value.
You will also need to pass the tool length value into the kinematics file.

You will then have 4 axis pivot and tool length compensation.

Ideally, the program would position the XYZ tool tip and have a B axis
value. The pivot length value and the tool length MUST add up to the
distance from the tool tip to the pivot point. You can arbitrarily choose
where the pivot point is measured from along the spindle/tool axis. Your
tool length will have to be measured from the same point along the spindle
tool axis.

thanks
Stuart

On Fri, May 7, 2021 at 5:38 PM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Fri, 7 May 2021 at 16:43, Juergen Gnoss  wrote:
>
> Pivot point of the B axis is about 100mm above spindle collet.
> >
> > Do I need to tell LCNC something about that in configuration or hal, or
> is
> > that handled by tool offset in Z ?
> >
>
> It's not really handled at all.
>
> The machine will do what the machine does, that is fixed by the mechanics.
>
> The graphical preview will assume that the B axis is along Y = 0. (because
> it has no way to know any better)
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
> ___
> Emc-developers mailing list
> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>


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Re: [Emc-developers] some glitch with a fresh 2.8 install

[Stuart Stevenson]

Juergen,

I love it when someone creates a problem for themselves, fixes it and
reports the fix.

When I encounter a seemingly ethereal problem - the report of the fix
reminds me to go over my system again with the idea of - I might have
missed something.

thank you very much for the lesson

Stuart

On Fri, May 7, 2021 at 12:12 AM Juergen Gnoss  wrote:

> one problem less.
>
> The hick-up on the x axis in negative direction with no indication was a
> hardware problem.
> I forgot to enable the break out power on the 6i25.
>
> The direction problem I worked around by giving negative scale values.
>
> ju
>
> ___
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> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>


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Re: [Emc-developers] chart of arrays

[Stuart Stevenson]

Hello TJP,

I certainly could exercise it but at my level of expertise I would not be
able to determine how much (or not) help it could be.
It seems to me an experienced C/C++ programmer would be able to wield the
tool in a far more effective manner if it is determined to be the "magic".

I also asked a local C++ guy what tools are available. He works in the
non-free side of coding but he may have something to use. I have not heard
from him.

I would gladly throw USD100.00 into the pot if it is determined to be a
useful tool.

I can hardly wait until AI (the real magic) lets us speak in our native
tongue and have AI generate error free code in real time.
It should be very soon now.

Although, currently the need is more acute in the self-driving vehicle
arena. I would think one of the more pressing issues would be a clench
sensor in the seats. :)

thanks
Stuart


On Thu, Apr 29, 2021 at 12:08 AM Thomas J Powderly  wrote:

> Hello Stuart
>
> Crystal Flow and Crystal Revs do look good.
>
> There's a free trial, could you exercise it?
>
>
> How could it be used by the Linuxcnc Programmers as a group?
>
> I'd gladly put a 100$ in the pot if it make a tool that demystified the
> hairball of emc.
>
> Tho, I cant see what would be purchased, given the pages of variants.
>
>
> Hello devs, please discuss if you want this.
>
>
> Maybe
>
> if it is wanted
>
> then someone who understands these legalities and needs
>
> might contact SVGSARC and ask
>
> how can an open source non-commercial group could use it?
>
> ( a cloud based graph server?)
>
>
> also please look at
>
> egypthttp://www.gson.org/egypt/
>
> SourceTrail https://github.com/CoatiSoftware/Sourcetrail/releases
>
> codeviz https://github.com/petersenna/codeviz
>
>
> the yearning for a c/c++ visualization reminds me of the hal attempts
> (geda eagle rockhopper  ;-)
>
>
> tomp
>
>
>
> On 4/29/21 9:20 AM, Stuart Stevenson wrote:
> > This looks like what I (think) I want. It is not free but not terribly
> > expensive if it is usable on this project.
> >
> > https://www.sgvsarc.com/demo.htm
> >
> > thanks
> > Stuart
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 3:39 PM Matt Shaver  wrote:
> >
> >> On Wed, 28 Apr 2021 10:19:21 -0500
> >> Jon Elson  wrote:
> >>
> >>> This would be a great tool, maybe somebody has written such
> >>> a tool.
> >>   I haven't looked in a long time, but before 'egypt' was about the
> >>   closest thing I ever saw. But a long time has passed...
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Matt
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Emc-developers mailing list
> >> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> >>
> >
>
>
> ___
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> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>


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Re: [Emc-developers] chart of arrays

[Stuart Stevenson]

Andy,
thanks for the code notes link
Stuart


On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 9:20 PM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> This looks like what I (think) I want. It is not free but not terribly
> expensive if it is usable on this project.
>
> https://www.sgvsarc.com/demo.htm
>
> thanks
> Stuart
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 3:39 PM Matt Shaver  wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 28 Apr 2021 10:19:21 -0500
>> Jon Elson  wrote:
>>
>> > This would be a great tool, maybe somebody has written such
>> > a tool.
>>
>>  I haven't looked in a long time, but before 'egypt' was about the
>>  closest thing I ever saw. But a long time has passed...
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Matt
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-developers mailing list
>> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>>
>
>
> --
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> reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
> correspondence.
> Thank you for honoring my wish.
>
>

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Re: [Emc-developers] chart of arrays

[Stuart Stevenson]

This looks like what I (think) I want. It is not free but not terribly
expensive if it is usable on this project.

https://www.sgvsarc.com/demo.htm

thanks
Stuart


On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 3:39 PM Matt Shaver  wrote:

> On Wed, 28 Apr 2021 10:19:21 -0500
> Jon Elson  wrote:
>
> > This would be a great tool, maybe somebody has written such
> > a tool.
>
>  I haven't looked in a long time, but before 'egypt' was about the
>  closest thing I ever saw. But a long time has passed...
>
> Thanks,
> Matt
>
>
> ___
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> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>


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Re: [Emc-developers] chart of arrays

[Stuart Stevenson]

Then a db search by subject to minimize the size of the chart (answer).
Sometimes I debug an NCL macro by introducing an error(check). Running it
against the database and finding the error line.

Thanks
Stuart


On Wed, Apr 28, 2021, 10:28 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Wed, 28 Apr 2021 at 12:33, Matt Shaver  wrote:
> >
> > I think what Stuart wants is a diagram of the data structures in
> > Linuxcnc that visually represents their scope and that shows what code
> > accesses them.
>
> Yes, that would be great. I wish that I had it too. I still get
> somewhat lost between interp and HAL.
> When I did the multispindle changes I worked out what code accessed
> the spindle data by the crude approach of simply renaming the spindle
> struct and seeing what failed to compile
>
> Have you found this (simplistic, out of date, stuff?)
>
> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.8/html/code/code-notes.html
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
> ___
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> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
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Re: [Emc-developers] chart of arrays

[Stuart Stevenson]

How to ask the question is very important!

Maybe it hasn't been done (or published) as it becomes more confusing as
the arrows get drawn. Maybe a picture like Matt's example but with arrows
restricted to a 'current' project so the flow is specific.

In areas of work/life I am familiar with I can picture the flow in my head.
Maybe I am asking for the picture to be built without years of
experience/study?

It is difficult when you don't know enough to even ask relevant/logical
questions.

thanks
Stuart

On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 6:33 AM Matt Shaver  wrote:

> I think what Stuart wants is a diagram of the data structures in
> Linuxcnc that visually represents their scope and that shows what code
> accesses them. He would probably also like some sort of "call map" that
> illustrates program execution paths. I have always wanted something
> like this too! I've never been really comfortable with "what does
> what"...
>
> Perhaps this could be generated by some analysis tool like this:
> https://www.gson.org/egypt/
>
> I think I tried this some years ago without much luck, but I think this
> is the sort of stuff Stuart is looking for if I read him right!
>
> Thanks,
> Matt
>
> On Wed, 28 Apr 2021 05:30:09 -0500
> Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> > Isn't a block of memory locations for a pointer to use just an array?
> > I would like to have something to hang on the wall to help me
> > visualize the information structure.
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 5:20 AM andy pugh  wrote:
> >
> > > On Wed, 28 Apr 2021 at 05:09, Stuart Stevenson 
> > > wrote:
> > > >   Has anyone developed or printed a chart of arrays to use for
> > > > visualization during LinuxCNC development?
> > >
> > > I don't even know what a chart of arrays is.
> > >
> > > --
> > > atp
> > > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> > > designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> > > lunatics."
> > > — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> > >
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-developers mailing list
> > > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> ___
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> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>


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Re: [Emc-developers] chart of arrays

[Stuart Stevenson]

Isn't a block of memory locations for a pointer to use just an array?
I would like to have something to hang on the wall to help me visualize the
information structure.

On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 5:20 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Wed, 28 Apr 2021 at 05:09, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> >   Has anyone developed or printed a chart of arrays to use for
> > visualization during LinuxCNC development?
>
> I don't even know what a chart of arrays is.
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
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[Emc-developers] chart of arrays

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gentlemen,
  Has anyone developed or printed a chart of arrays to use for
visualization during LinuxCNC development?

thanks
Stuart

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Re: [Emc-developers] newest iso install, sshfs can't connect

[Stuart Stevenson]

NFS works great if you manually set it up. Populate the hosts and fstab
files and NFS is rock solid.

MPM used NFS at the beginning. Rock Solid. No maintenance.
As we grew we "progressed" to Novell. Worked well if you rebooted 2 times a
week. We had around 25 computers and users.
Then we "progressed" to Active Directory. Worked well as long as IT did
daily maintenance.

SMB is working a lot better now that Windows is working on a Linux kernel
to run Windows on top of. Imagine that.

Maybe we will return to rock solid networking like NFS (on more than a very
few computers).

Heh
Stuart



On Sun, Apr 18, 2021 at 9:41 AM Thomas J Powderly  wrote:

> Hi Gene
>
> On 4/18/21 7:51 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > On Sunday 18 April 2021 06:13:38 you wrote:
> >
> > I put this on the dev list too, just in case someone knows the reason.
> > This is the second time it bit me
> >> Hi Gene
> >>
> >> it worked here as user tomp connecting to user pi on raspberry pi 4
> >>
> >> i have kdoren's 5.10 kernel
> >>
> > Where can I get that? My 4.19-rt yadda kernel I built a year ago, stopped
> > supporting screens greater than 1366x768 about 90 days back, no clues
> > anyplace in the logs. As far as Xorg.0.log is concerned its running a
> > 1920x1080 screen but thats not what I'm getting. Looks fuggly.
>
> goto
>
> https://github.com/kdoren/linux/releases
>
> near nottom of page is a link
> "linux-image-5.10.25-rt35-v7l+_5.10.25-1_armhf.deb
> <
> https://github.com/kdoren/linux/releases/download/5.10.25-rt35/linux-image-5.10.25-rt35-v7l+_5.10.25-1_armhf.deb
> >"
>
> rt clk, save as, then ...
>
> scroll to "To install from deb packages, as root:"
>
> and follow instructions
>
> >> i never used sshfs before
> > Beats any version of NSF like a white mouthed mule, TomP.  When it works,
> > it always works, where NSF, CIFS, etc always seem to flip a coin to see
> > if they are going to work today.
>
> yes its very nice, like a file server w/o all the mess
>
> but i have to remember to mount ny archive 4T on the system that i sshfs
> 'to'
>
> >> and failed 1st time whenb i used 'sudo sshfs pi@192.168.1.5'
> yeh, better
>
> sshfs pi@192.168.1.5: nameofmountpoint
>
> > Thats an incomplete command line in several ways.
> >
> > My script that mounts those that work:
> > #!/bin/bash
> > # usr and path to mount /mount/point
> > sshfs gene@sixty40://sshnet/sixty40
> > sshfs gene@lathe:/  /sshnet/lathe
> > sshfs gene@GO704:/  /sshnet/GO704
> > sshfs pi@rpi4:/ /sshnet/rpi4
> > sshfs gene@TLM://sshnet/TLM
> > #sshfs gene@3dprint://sshnet/3dprint
> > sshfs gene@dddprint:/ /sshnet/dddprint
> >
> > But I think I recall why, just haven't had enough coffee to go fix it
> > yet.
> >
> > I recall I wasn't able to make sixty40 work when it was named 6040.
> > Something apparently doesn't like hostnames starting with a nummber.
> > I'll rename it dddprint. Thats 3d's isn't it? ;o)
> >
> > I went to it, changed its hostname in tghat file and address in the e/n/i
> > file & fixed the /etc/hosts file on both ends of the cable. rebooted it.
> >
> > Came back to this machine and fixed the script by adding the last line
> > and creating that mountpoint. Works as requested.  It works as dddprint,
> > but doesn't as 3dprint.  I think I'll ask debian if there is a valid
> > reason.  Anyway, problem solved!
> >
> > Point to remember, do NOT start a hostname with a number.
> >
> > Thanks TomP. Take care and stay well now.
> >
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett
> tomp
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] 5 axis cutter compensation

[Stuart Stevenson]

Regarding running from Windows - OpenCN began supporting only Venturecom's
Windows realtime system for OpenCNC's version 3.0. They dropped QNX usage
at that time. I only used their version running on QNX. I had purchased
their API so I could add functionality. I was on Version 2.1. Version 3.0
was the next release. I stopped any further upgrades of OpenCNC as I would
not have Windows running a machine. That was in 1998. MPM had a machine
running OpenCNC 2.1 until they sold the machine in 2015. It went to a
company in Kansas City. It may still be running OpenCNC.

Stuart

On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 3:47 PM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> Bari,
>   My focus is to modify an already generated tool path.
>
> I have watched (with interest) the StepNC project. It seems to me if the
> part is designed with StepNC in mind the result from StepNC is more usable.
> Unfortunately, a lot of parts cannot meet the criteria of StepNC favorable.
> Since about 1980 I have heard comments in the NC programming field
> programmers will be out of a job in a few years as the computer will have
> surpassed the ability of a human to generate tool paths. Decades ago
> computers surpassed humans in the ability to generate tool paths. Computers
> still cannot determine which paths to generate to complete the job in an
> efficient manner. StepNC's focus was trying to determine path planning. I
> haven't paid much attention for a few years now. The last I knew StepNC had
> not completed the task.
>
> I will help in any way I can. I have a lot of experience (40+ years)
> making parts.
>
> regards
> Stuart
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 1:00 PM Bari  wrote:
>
>> Stuart,
>>
>> One of the methods for generating tool paths is described by this paper
>> and expired patent:
>>
>>
>> https://dspace.mit.edu/bitstream/handle/1721.1/29225/50140264-MIT.pdf
>>
>> https://patents.google.com/patent/US6311100B1/en
>>
>> Since I plan to use a physics engine to avoid collisions while
>> generating paths I figured that this can also be used for verification
>> on a given machine and piece of stock.
>>
>>
>> On 4/15/21 6:59 AM, Stuart Stevenson wrote:
>> > sounds to me like you are wanting to develop an open verification
>> > application. That would be a very nice addition to the open source tool
>> kit.
>>
>>
>> ___
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>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>>
>
>
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>
>

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Re: [Emc-developers] 5 axis cutter compensation

[Stuart Stevenson]

Bari,
  A person working with the controls and software is usually easy to
convince of the power of Linux. The guy with the funding sitting behind the
Windows computer running the management software probably doesn't realize
the management software server is running Linux. The golden rule is as
follows - He who has the gold RULES. Windows is his interface to the world.
TPC (Tool Point Control) is one of the current buzzwords known in the sales
world.

Stuart


On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 3:46 PM Bari  wrote:

> I wouldn't worry about someone thinking that Linux means something 2nd
> or 3rd rate. Hell I'd run screaming from anything that says Wind0ws and
> CNC or real time. This is just someone with funding that doesn't know
> much about operating systems or how to really judge CNC controllers. I
> work with all sorts of software with names I would not of picked with 20
> ft poles. If I went by the name only I would not have much to work with.
>
> On 4/15/21 3:30 PM, Stuart Stevenson wrote:
> > Which EMC Corp sent the letter demanding the group stopped using EMC2?
> > There are at least three now.
> >
> > https://www.emcins.com/ EMC Insurance selling insurance products
> >
> > https://utility.org A utility services corporation
> >
> > https://www.dellemc.com/ A wing of Dell
> >
> > I don't see how they could complain if we went back to using EMC2.
> > Especially if we tagged it like - "EMC2 - A Linux based Industrial
> > Control". Or some such moniker.
> >
> > The same name - three distinct industries. I didn't search deep and found
> > three major companies. A fourth would not cause any waves.
> >
> > regards
> > Stuart
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 1:09 PM Jon Elson 
> wrote:
> >
> >> On 04/15/2021 12:36 PM, John Thornton wrote:
> >>> Well it could be shortened to
> >>>
> >>> NEMC
> >>>
> >> Nope, the dastardly EMC2 corporation would be all over us if
> >> we did that.
> >> That's why we had to change the name about a decade ago.
> >>
> >> Jon
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Emc-developers mailing list
> >> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> >>
> >
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] 5 axis cutter compensation

[Stuart Stevenson]

Bari,
  My focus is to modify an already generated tool path.

I have watched (with interest) the StepNC project. It seems to me if the
part is designed with StepNC in mind the result from StepNC is more usable.
Unfortunately, a lot of parts cannot meet the criteria of StepNC favorable.
Since about 1980 I have heard comments in the NC programming field
programmers will be out of a job in a few years as the computer will have
surpassed the ability of a human to generate tool paths. Decades ago
computers surpassed humans in the ability to generate tool paths. Computers
still cannot determine which paths to generate to complete the job in an
efficient manner. StepNC's focus was trying to determine path planning. I
haven't paid much attention for a few years now. The last I knew StepNC had
not completed the task.

I will help in any way I can. I have a lot of experience (40+ years) making
parts.

regards
Stuart


On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 1:00 PM Bari  wrote:

> Stuart,
>
> One of the methods for generating tool paths is described by this paper
> and expired patent:
>
>
> https://dspace.mit.edu/bitstream/handle/1721.1/29225/50140264-MIT.pdf
>
> https://patents.google.com/patent/US6311100B1/en
>
> Since I plan to use a physics engine to avoid collisions while
> generating paths I figured that this can also be used for verification
> on a given machine and piece of stock.
>
>
> On 4/15/21 6:59 AM, Stuart Stevenson wrote:
> > sounds to me like you are wanting to develop an open verification
> > application. That would be a very nice addition to the open source tool
> kit.
>
>
> ___
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> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>


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Re: [Emc-developers] 5 axis cutter compensation

[Stuart Stevenson]

Which EMC Corp sent the letter demanding the group stopped using EMC2?
There are at least three now.

https://www.emcins.com/ EMC Insurance selling insurance products

https://utility.org A utility services corporation

https://www.dellemc.com/ A wing of Dell

I don't see how they could complain if we went back to using EMC2.
Especially if we tagged it like - "EMC2 - A Linux based Industrial
Control". Or some such moniker.

The same name - three distinct industries. I didn't search deep and found
three major companies. A fourth would not cause any waves.

regards
Stuart


On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 1:09 PM Jon Elson  wrote:

> On 04/15/2021 12:36 PM, John Thornton wrote:
> > Well it could be shortened to
> >
> > NEMC
> >
> Nope, the dastardly EMC2 corporation would be all over us if
> we did that.
> That's why we had to change the name about a decade ago.
>
> Jon
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] 5 axis cutter compensation

[Stuart Stevenson]

Have the developed their own real time kernel?

On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 11:11 AM Feral Engineer 
wrote:

> Here's another tidbit for ya - Siemens and Heidenhain controls run on top
> of a Linux kernel.
>
> Phil T.
> The Feral Engineer
>
> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
> www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
>
> On Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 11:25 AM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> > Feral,
> > I love it!
> >
> > Just think how LinuxCNC would be accepted if Android was called
> > LinuxAndroid!
> > Or we had LinuxWeb as the main term for the internet.
> >
> > How many people have heard of QNX? Not many. My first retrofit was
> > installing OpenCNC on a 5 axis Cinci. QNX was the underlying realtime
> > system. I showed a Fanuc service guy how to boot it up. His face had a
> > shocked look on it when the boot up was finished. He said the boot up
> > screens looked just like the fanuc control when booted up. We don't see
> the
> > boot up screens of the fanuc control when we start it. The service guys
> > sometimes see them.
> >
> > QNX is everywhere and has been for a long time. I don't know if Fanuc
> runs
> > on top of QNX but it wouldn't surprise me.
> >
> > Heh - we don't claim to be marketers but some of us can make parts and
> some
> > of us can write amazing code. Either group is a very small subset of
> > society. I am proud to be associated with members of both groups. I
> always
> > like to associate with people much smarter than me.
> >
> > Heh
> > Stuart
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 10:11 AM Feral Engineer <
> > theferalengin...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Call it LegitCNC to really get the point across.
> > >
> > > If anyone ever questions Linux, tell them to get off the internet and
> put
> > > down their Android phones.
> > >
> > > That's what gets me about masso. It's touted as this great plug and
> play
> > > system and doesn't even support g41/g42... It's crap if you ask me.
> > >
> > > Phil T.
> > > The Feral Engineer
> > >
> > > Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
> > > www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
> > >
> > > On Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 10:49 AM andy pugh  wrote:
> > >
> > > > On Thu, 15 Apr 2021 at 14:23, Stuart Stevenson 
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > The shop owner's hesitancy was caused by the name LinuxCNC. The use
> > of
> > > > the
> > > > > term Linux gave him the idea of a less than capable control.
> > > >
> > > > We used to have "Enhanced" in that position. Perhaps we should have
> > kept
> > > > it.
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > atp
> > > > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> > > > designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> > > > lunatics."
> > > > — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ___
> > > > Emc-developers mailing list
> > > > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> > > >
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-developers mailing list
> > > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
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> or
> > reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
> > correspondence.
> > Thank you for honoring my wish.
> >
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>
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Re: [Emc-developers] 5 axis cutter compensation

[Stuart Stevenson]

now there is a mouthful


On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 11:43 AM John Thornton  wrote:

> I think the project should be named
>
> NIST Enhanced Machine Controller Second Generation
>
> JT
>
> On 4/15/2021 10:24 AM, Stuart Stevenson wrote:
> > Feral,
> > I love it!
> >
> > Just think how LinuxCNC would be accepted if Android was called
> > LinuxAndroid!
> > Or we had LinuxWeb as the main term for the internet.
> >
> > How many people have heard of QNX? Not many. My first retrofit was
> > installing OpenCNC on a 5 axis Cinci. QNX was the underlying realtime
> > system. I showed a Fanuc service guy how to boot it up. His face had a
> > shocked look on it when the boot up was finished. He said the boot up
> > screens looked just like the fanuc control when booted up. We don't see
> the
> > boot up screens of the fanuc control when we start it. The service guys
> > sometimes see them.
> >
> > QNX is everywhere and has been for a long time. I don't know if Fanuc
> runs
> > on top of QNX but it wouldn't surprise me.
> >
> > Heh - we don't claim to be marketers but some of us can make parts and
> some
> > of us can write amazing code. Either group is a very small subset of
> > society. I am proud to be associated with members of both groups. I
> always
> > like to associate with people much smarter than me.
> >
> > Heh
> > Stuart
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 10:11 AM Feral Engineer <
> theferalengin...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Call it LegitCNC to really get the point across.
> >>
> >> If anyone ever questions Linux, tell them to get off the internet and
> put
> >> down their Android phones.
> >>
> >> That's what gets me about masso. It's touted as this great plug and play
> >> system and doesn't even support g41/g42... It's crap if you ask me.
> >>
> >> Phil T.
> >> The Feral Engineer
> >>
> >> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
> >> www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
> >>
> >> On Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 10:49 AM andy pugh  wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Thu, 15 Apr 2021 at 14:23, Stuart Stevenson 
> >> wrote:
> >>>> The shop owner's hesitancy was caused by the name LinuxCNC. The use of
> >>> the
> >>>> term Linux gave him the idea of a less than capable control.
> >>> We used to have "Enhanced" in that position. Perhaps we should have
> kept
> >>> it.
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> atp
> >>> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> >>> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> >>> lunatics."
> >>> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ___
> >>> Emc-developers mailing list
> >>> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> >>>
> >> ___
> >> Emc-developers mailing list
> >> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> >>
> >
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] 5 axis cutter compensation

[Stuart Stevenson]

Feral,
I love it!

Just think how LinuxCNC would be accepted if Android was called
LinuxAndroid!
Or we had LinuxWeb as the main term for the internet.

How many people have heard of QNX? Not many. My first retrofit was
installing OpenCNC on a 5 axis Cinci. QNX was the underlying realtime
system. I showed a Fanuc service guy how to boot it up. His face had a
shocked look on it when the boot up was finished. He said the boot up
screens looked just like the fanuc control when booted up. We don't see the
boot up screens of the fanuc control when we start it. The service guys
sometimes see them.

QNX is everywhere and has been for a long time. I don't know if Fanuc runs
on top of QNX but it wouldn't surprise me.

Heh - we don't claim to be marketers but some of us can make parts and some
of us can write amazing code. Either group is a very small subset of
society. I am proud to be associated with members of both groups. I always
like to associate with people much smarter than me.

Heh
Stuart


On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 10:11 AM Feral Engineer 
wrote:

> Call it LegitCNC to really get the point across.
>
> If anyone ever questions Linux, tell them to get off the internet and put
> down their Android phones.
>
> That's what gets me about masso. It's touted as this great plug and play
> system and doesn't even support g41/g42... It's crap if you ask me.
>
> Phil T.
> The Feral Engineer
>
> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
> www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
>
> On Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 10:49 AM andy pugh  wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 15 Apr 2021 at 14:23, Stuart Stevenson 
> wrote:
> >
> > > The shop owner's hesitancy was caused by the name LinuxCNC. The use of
> > the
> > > term Linux gave him the idea of a less than capable control.
> >
> > We used to have "Enhanced" in that position. Perhaps we should have kept
> > it.
> >
> > --
> > atp
> > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> > designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> > lunatics."
> > — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> >
> >
> > ___
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> >
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] 5 axis cutter compensation

[Stuart Stevenson]

I am not arguing for that result just making a comment on observed
behavior. If the project had another name and the same amount of exposure
he would have explored it. He didn't explore it because if Linux is part of
it - it cannot be worthy of even a look. I would hate to see Linux removed
from the title. If I would propose anything I would propose a dual name.I
have no idea what to call it. :)



On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 9:49 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Thu, 15 Apr 2021 at 14:23, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> > The shop owner's hesitancy was caused by the name LinuxCNC. The use of
> the
> > term Linux gave him the idea of a less than capable control.
>
> We used to have "Enhanced" in that position. Perhaps we should have kept
> it.
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] 5 axis cutter compensation

[Stuart Stevenson]

My comments are interspersed in the body.

On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 6:03 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Thu, 15 Apr 2021 at 05:49, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>
> >   My current attention to the project is driven by my desire to have 5
> axis
> > cutter diameter compensation in LinuxCNC.
>
> I think that there is an argument that this is better done in the CAM
> as it has a much better idea where the material is, and can handle
> non-cylindrical cutters.
> Not that I am against the idea of it being doable in the controller, I
> just think that it won't see much use.
>

Use a barrel cutter as an example. If you resharpen a barrel cutter and
take .02 off the diameter you have now created a completely different
cutter than what was used in the CAM system to generate the program. That
would necessitate generating a new program if you wanted to create a
correct part.

I tend to agree with your use comment. This capability may not generate a
lot of use but the 5 axis world has grown a LOT in the last 10 years. If
you want a place at the 5 axis table you need 5 axis capability.
Prospective users still question whether LinuxCNC has 2D CDC. :)

Recently, I was talking to a shop owner about LinuxCNC. He only wanted to
talk about Tool Point Control. When I told him LinuxCNC could to that was
when he allowed me to show him the LinuxCNC website. He would not have
considered LinuxCNC before as it is JUST a 2D bit player. He had researched
almost all other controls but had not looked at LinuxCNC. He now wants
LinuxCNC on his 5 axis machines. The (Covid) slowdown has put his desire on
hold.

I would like to have 5 axis CDC implemented before he wants the retrofit
done.

The shop owner's hesitancy was caused by the name LinuxCNC. The use of the
term Linux gave him the idea of a less than capable control.


> >   Circular interpolation is also an area to be simplified. G17, G18 and
> G19
> > can be eliminated. They would have to stay so legacy programs would still
> > function. I would implement G02/G03 as follows:
> > G02/G03 X Y Z I J K F would circle the tool around a vector perpendicular
> > to a plane described by the IJ values combined with the XY start point
>
> It might be simpler to just define the centre point with IJK and
> eliminate the explicit plane entirely. I think that start, centre and
> end defines a circular  arc in 3D space completely?)
>

Start, Center and End points do describe the circular arc unless you are
talking about a full circle or half circle.
Using the third value of I J K allows you to use a full circle or half
circle or even an arbitrary plane to describe the circle. The arbitrary
circle would not necessarily be perpendicular to the tool axis.


> The interpreter could learn to use the new-style arc whenever it sees
> all three of IJK. Or, alternatively, we could use the currently unused
> G16 code to mean "arbitrary planes"
> (G16 means "Polar coordinates" in Fanuc, but LinuxCNC uses @ and ^ for
> that. If clashing with Fanuc is a problem then G19.9 could be used.)
> I think that I prefer an INI entry in [TRAJ] that turns accepting all
> of IJK in an M2 / M3 on and off.
>
> I don't think clashing with Fanuc is a problem at all.


> Note that there is already an old branch that attempted arbittrary arcs
> https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/tree/arbitrary-arc
> You can see the chages here:
>
> https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/commit/0fc41d50c1bce2bdecc8a90e6e5057af5153d66f
> This used a "magic comment" to define the curve, but it can be seen
> that it is pretty much the same input data as suggested above.
>
> I like to have a magic button on the bottom of my keyboard. The button is
called the IFM button. It's F'n Magic. :)
It has the same function as the Staple's red 'EASY' button.

thanks
Stuart


> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] 5 axis cutter compensation

[Stuart Stevenson]

3D cutter comp is a totally different animal.

Tool Point Control is a better term for what I am proposing.

Stuart

On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 7:18 AM Feral Engineer 
wrote:

> As a follow to Andy's comment, I've been on 5 axis mills for 17 years and
> honestly have never once used 3d cutter comp. It has a place, but it's a
> very small place. Only one customer has ever asked about it.
>
> Phil T.
> The Feral Engineer
>
> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
> www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
>
> On Thu, Apr 15, 2021, 7:03 AM andy pugh  wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 15 Apr 2021 at 05:49, Stuart Stevenson 
> wrote:
> >
> > >   My current attention to the project is driven by my desire to have 5
> > axis
> > > cutter diameter compensation in LinuxCNC.
> >
> > I think that there is an argument that this is better done in the CAM
> > as it has a much better idea where the material is, and can handle
> > non-cylindrical cutters.
> > Not that I am against the idea of it being doable in the controller, I
> > just think that it won't see much use.
> >
> > >   Circular interpolation is also an area to be simplified. G17, G18 and
> > G19
> > > can be eliminated. They would have to stay so legacy programs would
> still
> > > function. I would implement G02/G03 as follows:
> > > G02/G03 X Y Z I J K F would circle the tool around a vector
> perpendicular
> > > to a plane described by the IJ values combined with the XY start point
> >
> > It might be simpler to just define the centre point with IJK and
> > eliminate the explicit plane entirely. I think that start, centre and
> > end defines a circular  arc in 3D space completely?)
> >
> > The interpreter could learn to use the new-style arc whenever it sees
> > all three of IJK. Or, alternatively, we could use the currently unused
> > G16 code to mean "arbitrary planes"
> > (G16 means "Polar coordinates" in Fanuc, but LinuxCNC uses @ and ^ for
> > that. If clashing with Fanuc is a problem then G19.9 could be used.)
> > I think that I prefer an INI entry in [TRAJ] that turns accepting all
> > of IJK in an M2 / M3 on and off.
> >
> > Note that there is already an old branch that attempted arbittrary arcs
> > https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/tree/arbitrary-arc
> > You can see the chages here:
> >
> >
> https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/commit/0fc41d50c1bce2bdecc8a90e6e5057af5153d66f
> > This used a "magic comment" to define the curve, but it can be seen
> > that it is pretty much the same input data as suggested above.
> >
> > --
> > atp
> > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> > designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> > lunatics."
> > — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-developers mailing list
> > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> >
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] 5 axis cutter compensation

[Stuart Stevenson]

Bari,
The 5 axis tool path for the machine I describe is point to point motion.
CAM generates XYZAB and a feedrate (G93) for every line of motion.

5 axis CDC uses the A and B command to create a target vector. In essence I
use the AB values to recreate the tool axis vector the CAM system used to
create the AB values.

The XYZ point and the tool axis vector describe a plane where the
programmed target tool position is.
I use the plane to calculate the corrected target XYZ point. The values of
A and B don't change. The only thing changed are the XYZ values needed to
move the edge of the tool to the desired location.

This in conjunction with 5 axis tool length correction allows the 5 axis
tool path to be (from the operator stand point) no different from a 2D
path. Change the tool, reset the TLO, reset the diameter(or radius) value
and you are off and making chips again. You need to account for cutting
pressure or tool wear to tweak a workpiece dimension? TLO or CDC to the
rescue as in 2D work.

In the 80s (1980s) Cincinnati Machine Works engineers claimed we would
never see 5 axis TLO as it was impossible to calculate from the values in
the program. A thought provoking IMTS booth conversation with Willie (the
programmer in a wheel chair at MPM and my shop) enabled Cincinnati to
announce (about 6 months later) a NEW USD10,000.00 software/hardware
upgrade to the control allowing 5 axis TLO. Processor speed development had
allowed the calculation in real time.

I used NCL (a CAM package I use) to help me verify the calculations of
plane and correction values. When I was able to calculate the same values
NCL output I knew I was correct. After I had developed my algorithm I saw a
Fanuc manual describing how they calculate 5 axis CDC. They use EXACTLY the
same process. This is what I want to have available in LinuxCNC.

Something else to add to my desire for 5 axis TLO and CDC is the
application of the changes during the running of the program. If you change
the value of either I would like it to be applied to the next line of code
in the program. The control would finish the current commanded positioning
and then use the new values to calculate the next line position correction.

Bari - I sounds to me like you are wanting to develop an open verification
application. That would be a very nice addition to the open source tool kit.

thanks
Stuart




On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 12:24 AM Bari  wrote:

> On 4/14/21 11:49 PM, Stuart Stevenson wrote:
>
> > Gentlemen,
> >My current attention to the project is driven by my desire to have 5
> axis
> > cutter diameter compensation in LinuxCNC.
> >
>
> On a more serious note I'd like to see what you have thought up. I am
> starting to work on an open 5-axis CAM application for FreeCAD Paths.
> I'm going to use a physics engine to prevent collisions between the
> tools and the parts. I thought of how this might even be used within
> LCNC to preflight programs.
>
>
> -Bari
>
>
>
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[Emc-developers] 5 axis cutter compensation

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gentlemen,
  My current attention to the project is driven by my desire to have 5 axis
cutter diameter compensation in LinuxCNC.
  I am now 67 (soon to be 68) years old and have retired. I sold out of MPM
in 2013. I had a shop for 5 years. I closed the shop in November of 2019,
sold most everything at an auction in January of 2020. The 5 year lease on
the shop expired in February of 2020. I did nothing for a few months. This
quickly turned into a very boring existence. I have been working on a
couple of CAD projects and went to work (contract) for a shop in town to
help put together a 100 inch vertical Summit lathe. Since the middle of
October 2020 I have been watching one of  my grandsons. He was six weeks
old then and is now 7 months old. I have him 4 days a week. He is just now
at the age where he is beginning to not require my constant attention every
minute he is with me so I have some time to think about this cutter
diameter project.
  In my perusal of the project to see where I need to change/insert things
to have 5 axis cutter diameter compensation I have seen a number of (I
think) needed changes. If the changes look small and easy I may try to do
them for the experience.
  I did one project like that. I saw the reference to G17, G18 and G19 are
respective XY, XZ and YZ in LinuxCNC. In most other controls the reference
is XY, ZX and YZ. In my system now the reference matches most other
controls. I chose this because the function of these changes is so minimal
I don't believe I could have broken anything. I changed a few variable
names (CANON_PLANE_XZ to CANON_PLANE_ZX, etc) and successfully compiled so
I think I have my system clean. I don't plan to ask for these changes to be
incorporated into LinuxCNC as this is such a minor issue. I just wanted to
do this to see if I could get my grep skills working enough to be able to
complete this small project.
  I have the algorithm for 5 axis cutter diameter compensation in the style
of a machine like the Blue Cincinnati at MPM working in NCL. That machine
has an A and B head on the Z axis. I believe this can be incorporated in a
general way so as to be applicable to any 5 axis machine and maybe even
used for 2 axis lathes and 3 (and 4) axis mills.
  One thing I have seen is I believe cutter diameter compensation can be
implemented in such a way as to greatly simplify the handling through
LinuxCNC. Handling legacy programs would be no problem so current
functionality would not be affected. On going CDC would be handled in all
orientation with no problem and very easily. I have the logic figured out.
My problem is expressing my project in C/C++ so others can follow it
easily. The Cinci at MPM (now in Tulsa) has 5 axis tool length compensation
and full 5 axis geometry compensation. I showed my project to Jeff and
Chris. Their reaction was amazing (surprise). They had no desire to spend
the time necessary to understand how I had accomplished it. I had about 70
lines of variables and math. Jeff's comment was "inscrutable". I have to
agree. At that time I was very familiar with it. Now when I look at it
inscrutable is very appropriate.

  Circular interpolation is also an area to be simplified. G17, G18 and G19
can be eliminated. They would have to stay so legacy programs would still
function. I would implement G02/G03 as follows:
G02/G03 X Y Z I J K F would circle the tool around a vector perpendicular
to a plane described by the IJ values combined with the XY start point
values to establish the circle center. The perpendicular vector (the circle
interpolation vector) would be established by the K value in relation to
the center point. This would not need to be aligned with the tool axis
vector but could be.
Also, G02/G03 Y Z X J K I F and G02/G03 Z X Y K I J F would be usable. (I
think)
I haven't worked on this at all. I just saw that when looking at the
current code.

Also, I would like to see polar interpolation.

Also, I would like to see spiral interpolation.

Also, I would like G68/G69 (coordinate system rotation). The Fanuc 15MB
allowed you to use two consecutive G68 commands to rotate the working plane
to any orientation. All programming commands then functioned at that angle
as if the part had been rotated to the XY plane. This was on the 5 axis
XYZBC Viper bridge mill at MPM. B and C are a two axis head on the end of
the Z axis ram. A little tricky and seldom used but sometimes useful.

Whew - what a word salad.

thanks
Stuart





















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Re: [Emc-developers] primitive code question from a C/C++ newbie

[Stuart Stevenson]

thanks for the responses gentlemen

The information helps me to understand the flow of information through the
project.
It may turn out to have been dangerous information as I see a LOT of
things/items that need to be addressed.
I will talk about the items in future emails. :)

again - thanks for your responses and attention - I truly appreciate it!
Stuart

On Tue, Apr 13, 2021 at 6:22 PM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> Hi,
> src/emc/rs274ngc/interp_convert.cc line 1897 has the term 'primitive code'
>
> What is the definition of primitive code in this context?
> Let me know if this is something I can search the internet to learn.
>
> thanks
> Stuart
>
> --
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> correspondence.
> Thank you for honoring my wish.
>
>

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[Emc-developers] primitive code question from a C/C++ newbie

[Stuart Stevenson]

Hi,
src/emc/rs274ngc/interp_convert.cc line 1897 has the term 'primitive code'

What is the definition of primitive code in this context?
Let me know if this is something I can search the internet to learn.

thanks
Stuart

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Re: [Emc-developers] primitive code question from a C/C++ newbie

[Stuart Stevenson]

This is really a question about 'primitive level'


On Tue, Apr 13, 2021 at 6:22 PM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> Hi,
> src/emc/rs274ngc/interp_convert.cc line 1897 has the term 'primitive code'
>
> What is the definition of primitive code in this context?
> Let me know if this is something I can search the internet to learn.
>
> thanks
> Stuart
>
> --
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> reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
> correspondence.
> Thank you for honoring my wish.
>
>

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Re: [Emc-developers] possible error in documentation

[Stuart Stevenson]

John,
The documentation looks awesome.
thanks
Stuart


On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 8:09 AM John  wrote:

> Thanks for finding that, I can fix that ASAP
>
> JT
>
> On 4/11/21 11:33 PM, Stuart Stevenson wrote:
> > Hi,
> > I was reading the LinuxCNC gcode list. I noticed the G52 section example
> is
> > G53. This may not be the intended G value. I would attempt to change it
> (if
> > it is possible for me to do so) if I was sure the change needed to be
> made.
> >
> > http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode/g-code.html#gcode:g52
> > I think the value should be G52 in that section. 
> >
> > I also made some changes to my files here. This is a nit picking change
> but
> > it was fun and didn't take very long. I changed all the G18 references to
> > ZX instead of XZ. This now matches the Fanuc (and almost et al) control
> > usage.
> > I did the same for all the UW axis designations. They are all now WU to
> > follow the same pattern as the ZX designation.
> > thanks
> > Stuart
> >
> >
>
>
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[Emc-developers] possible error in documentation

[Stuart Stevenson]

Hi,
I was reading the LinuxCNC gcode list. I noticed the G52 section example is
G53. This may not be the intended G value. I would attempt to change it (if
it is possible for me to do so) if I was sure the change needed to be made.

http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode/g-code.html#gcode:g52
I think the value should be G52 in that section. 

I also made some changes to my files here. This is a nit picking change but
it was fun and didn't take very long. I changed all the G18 references to
ZX instead of XZ. This now matches the Fanuc (and almost et al) control
usage.
I did the same for all the UW axis designations. They are all now WU to
follow the same pattern as the ZX designation.
thanks
Stuart


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Re: [Emc-developers] 2.8 release update.

[Stuart Stevenson]

I installed and compiled LinuxCNC.2.9.0-pre0 in virtualbox.
After satisfying all the dependencies, configure choked on pango. I
installed python-glade2 to resolve it. Configure and make and make install
worked just fine. Runtests finished with no errors. LinuxCNC/Axis starts
and runs.
I created an appliance. The size is 4.5gb.
If anyone would like to install the appliance on their computer let me
know. I will place it somewhere to allow download.

On Wed, Aug 5, 2020 at 7:41 AM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> I see the entire configure message that scrolls across the screen as the
> configure runs. I just have to scroll it down until I see the top. That is
> where I saw libgnomeprint and optreset messages. I don't remember seeing
> the optreset message before. I have resolved the libgnomeprint before. I
> could probably resolve it this time but the concept of diminishing returns
> raises it's ugly head. Murphy may be lurking in the weeds. 樂 We will see.
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 4, 2020 at 1:29 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:
>
>> On Tuesday 04 August 2020 14:07:19 Jon Elson wrote:
>>
>> > On 08/04/2020 10:10 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
>> > > On Tuesday 04 August 2020 08:10:48 Stuart Stevenson wrote:
>> > >> I saw no problems in config.log other than the configure report in
>> > >> the terminal.
>> > >> libgnomeprint-2.2 and optreset
>> > >> both are 'OLD' - I believe I can safely ignore both
>> > >
>> > > But I was talking about what goes flying by on screen while
>> > > ./configure is running.  Much more verbose than the log. You might
>> > > have to set scrollback thru history to 50,000 or more to see the
>> > > whole thing. But yes, libgnomeprint-2.2 is OLD. optreset I don't
>> > > recall seeing so is new to me.
>> >
>> > You can do this :
>> >
>> > ./configure 2>&1 | tee configure.log
>> >
>> > This redirects both std output and error output to one pipe,
>> > and tees it so you see the output on the screen and it also
>> > writes to the file.
>> >
>> > Jon
>>
>> did you copy that Stuart?
>> >
>> > ___
>> > Emc-developers mailing list
>> > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>>
>>
>> Cheers, Gene Heskett
>> --
>> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
>> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
>> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>>  - Louis D. Brandeis
>> Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
>>
>>
>> ___
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>> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>>
>
>
> --
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> If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to read
> this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without saving or
> reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
> correspondence.
> Thank you for honoring my wish.
>
>

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Re: [Emc-developers] 2.8 release update.

[Stuart Stevenson]

I see the entire configure message that scrolls across the screen as the
configure runs. I just have to scroll it down until I see the top. That is
where I saw libgnomeprint and optreset messages. I don't remember seeing
the optreset message before. I have resolved the libgnomeprint before. I
could probably resolve it this time but the concept of diminishing returns
raises it's ugly head. Murphy may be lurking in the weeds. 樂 We will see.


On Tue, Aug 4, 2020 at 1:29 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Tuesday 04 August 2020 14:07:19 Jon Elson wrote:
>
> > On 08/04/2020 10:10 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > > On Tuesday 04 August 2020 08:10:48 Stuart Stevenson wrote:
> > >> I saw no problems in config.log other than the configure report in
> > >> the terminal.
> > >> libgnomeprint-2.2 and optreset
> > >> both are 'OLD' - I believe I can safely ignore both
> > >
> > > But I was talking about what goes flying by on screen while
> > > ./configure is running.  Much more verbose than the log. You might
> > > have to set scrollback thru history to 50,000 or more to see the
> > > whole thing. But yes, libgnomeprint-2.2 is OLD. optreset I don't
> > > recall seeing so is new to me.
> >
> > You can do this :
> >
> > ./configure 2>&1 | tee configure.log
> >
> > This redirects both std output and error output to one pipe,
> > and tees it so you see the output on the screen and it also
> > writes to the file.
> >
> > Jon
>
> did you copy that Stuart?
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-developers mailing list
> > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>  - Louis D. Brandeis
> Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
>
>
> ___
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> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>


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Re: [Emc-developers] 2.8 release update.

[Stuart Stevenson]

I saw no problems in config.log other than the configure report in the
terminal.
libgnomeprint-2.2 and optreset
both are 'OLD' - I believe I can safely ignore both

The font size issue seems to be a job for 'virtualbox'. I will install
Buster in virtualbox and see what happens.

thanks
Stuart



On Tue, Aug 4, 2020 at 12:33 AM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Tuesday 04 August 2020 00:56:57 Stuart Stevenson wrote:
>
> > Started LinuxCNC.
> > The first screen tells me to pick a machine from the list on the left.
> > The font of the list on the left is large enough to be written on top
> > of one another to the extent I cannot read any of the words - let
> > alone choose any.
> > The directory headers with the pull down icons are clear and readable.
> > Pull down function properly. The machine names are what are not
> > readable. I am running a 43 inch 4k screen. Is there an easy way to
> > modify the size of the font or is this something I will need to deal
> > with on my monitor? thanks
> > Stuart
> >
> I've been building that on my rpi4, sometimes 2-3x a day as commits are
> made. All those machine sym names and such are in a normal font. All
> others are up to date from the buildbot, running master-rt. Just checked
> my other 3 machines. No font problems anywhere. But the pi is the inly
> buster. Its running raspbian buster 10.4, uptodate except the stuff a
> non-preempt kernel install would change.
>
> dpkg-checkbuilddeps is NOT foolproof, so dbl-check the config logs for
> stuff .configure is complaining about. Best advice I've got, Stuart.
>
> > On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 11:49 PM Stuart Stevenson 
> wrote:
> > > forgot to mention the OS is Buster - a recent install
> > >
> > > just finished the runtests
> > > I saw a number of skipped test and the rtai not loaded fail but the
> > > report says 234 run, 234 successful, 0 failed, 0 expected
> > >
> > > thanks
> > > Stuart
> > >
> > > On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 11:20 PM Stuart Stevenson 
> > >
> > > wrote:
> > >> Gentlemen,
> > >> I just git got () linuxcnc-dev. After clearing all the
> > >> dependencies I notice libgnomeprintui-2-2 is not loaded. Seems to
> > >> have been removed from the repositories decades(maybe not that
> > >> long) ago. This gives me no cause for concern and this is not a
> > >> request for any action or attention. Just an FYI as the configure
> > >> message says printing from classic ladder will not be possible.
> > >> I could find the package as an rpm but I didn't try to install it
> > >> as I don't "think" I will need to print from classic ladder. You
> > >> know how that goes though - for some reason I will want/need to
> > >> print from classic ladder.
> > >>
> > >> thanks
> > >> Stuart
> > >>
> > >> On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 12:23 PM Chris Morley
> > >> 
> > >>
> > >> wrote:
> > >>> One ugly work around is to embed gremlin into a qt screen.
> > >>> I just added a sample screen under
> > >>> qtvcp_screen/qtvcp_experimental/gremlin.ini
> > >>> It is Qtaxis with both qt's graphics and gremlin.
> > >>> I have reports gremlin works on the Pi.
> > >>> It has some warts that could be worked on.
> > >>>
> > >>> opencv should only be required if you use the camview widget.
> > >>> It probably prevents one from using designer to modify screens -
> > >>> I'll look into that.
> > >>>
> > >>> Chris
> > >>>
> > >>> 
> > >>> From: Phill Carter 
> > >>> Sent: August 3, 2020 9:16 AM
> > >>> To: linuxcnc-developers 
> > >>> Subject: Re: [Emc-developers] 2.8 release update.
> > >>>
> > >>> I couldn't get the Qtvcp screens working on my Pi either.
> > >>>
> > >>> The raspbian python-opengl module has been built for OpenGL ES, I
> > >>> tried several times to build it for OpenGL but was unsuccessful.
> > >>>
> > >>> Cheers, Phill
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>> ___
> > >>> Emc-developers mailing list
> > >>> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> > >>
> > >> --
> 

Re: [Emc-developers] 2.8 release update.

[Stuart Stevenson]

Started LinuxCNC.
The first screen tells me to pick a machine from the list on the left.
The font of the list on the left is large enough to be written on top of
one another to the extent I cannot read any of the words - let alone choose
any.
The directory headers with the pull down icons are clear and readable. Pull
down function properly. The machine names are what are not readable.
I am running a 43 inch 4k screen. Is there an easy way to modify the size
of the font or is this something I will need to deal with on my monitor?
thanks
Stuart


On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 11:49 PM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> forgot to mention the OS is Buster - a recent install
>
> just finished the runtests
> I saw a number of skipped test and the rtai not loaded fail but the report
> says 234 run, 234 successful, 0 failed, 0 expected
>
> thanks
> Stuart
>
> On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 11:20 PM Stuart Stevenson 
> wrote:
>
>> Gentlemen,
>> I just git got () linuxcnc-dev. After clearing all the dependencies I
>> notice libgnomeprintui-2-2 is not loaded. Seems to have been removed from
>> the repositories decades(maybe not that long) ago. This gives me no cause
>> for concern and this is not a request for any action or attention. Just an
>> FYI as the configure message says printing from classic ladder will not be
>> possible.
>> I could find the package as an rpm but I didn't try to install it as I
>> don't "think" I will need to print from classic ladder. You know how that
>> goes though - for some reason I will want/need to print from classic ladder.
>>
>> thanks
>> Stuart
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 12:23 PM Chris Morley 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> One ugly work around is to embed gremlin into a qt screen.
>>> I just added a sample screen under
>>> qtvcp_screen/qtvcp_experimental/gremlin.ini
>>> It is Qtaxis with both qt's graphics and gremlin.
>>> I have reports gremlin works on the Pi.
>>> It has some warts that could be worked on.
>>>
>>> opencv should only be required if you use the camview widget.
>>> It probably prevents one from using designer to modify screens - I'll
>>> look into that.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>> 
>>> From: Phill Carter 
>>> Sent: August 3, 2020 9:16 AM
>>> To: linuxcnc-developers 
>>> Subject: Re: [Emc-developers] 2.8 release update.
>>>
>>> I couldn't get the Qtvcp screens working on my Pi either.
>>>
>>> The raspbian python-opengl module has been built for OpenGL ES, I tried
>>> several times to build it for OpenGL but was unsuccessful.
>>>
>>> Cheers, Phill
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ___
>>> Emc-developers mailing list
>>> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Addressee is the intended audience.
>> If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to read
>> this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without saving or
>> reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
>> correspondence.
>> Thank you for honoring my wish.
>>
>>
>
> --
> Addressee is the intended audience.
> If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to read
> this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without saving or
> reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
> correspondence.
> Thank you for honoring my wish.
>
>

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Re: [Emc-developers] 2.8 release update.

[Stuart Stevenson]

forgot to mention the OS is Buster - a recent install

just finished the runtests
I saw a number of skipped test and the rtai not loaded fail but the report
says 234 run, 234 successful, 0 failed, 0 expected

thanks
Stuart

On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 11:20 PM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> Gentlemen,
> I just git got () linuxcnc-dev. After clearing all the dependencies I
> notice libgnomeprintui-2-2 is not loaded. Seems to have been removed from
> the repositories decades(maybe not that long) ago. This gives me no cause
> for concern and this is not a request for any action or attention. Just an
> FYI as the configure message says printing from classic ladder will not be
> possible.
> I could find the package as an rpm but I didn't try to install it as I
> don't "think" I will need to print from classic ladder. You know how that
> goes though - for some reason I will want/need to print from classic ladder.
>
> thanks
> Stuart
>
> On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 12:23 PM Chris Morley 
> wrote:
>
>> One ugly work around is to embed gremlin into a qt screen.
>> I just added a sample screen under
>> qtvcp_screen/qtvcp_experimental/gremlin.ini
>> It is Qtaxis with both qt's graphics and gremlin.
>> I have reports gremlin works on the Pi.
>> It has some warts that could be worked on.
>>
>> opencv should only be required if you use the camview widget.
>> It probably prevents one from using designer to modify screens - I'll
>> look into that.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>> 
>> From: Phill Carter 
>> Sent: August 3, 2020 9:16 AM
>> To: linuxcnc-developers 
>> Subject: Re: [Emc-developers] 2.8 release update.
>>
>> I couldn't get the Qtvcp screens working on my Pi either.
>>
>> The raspbian python-opengl module has been built for OpenGL ES, I tried
>> several times to build it for OpenGL but was unsuccessful.
>>
>> Cheers, Phill
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-developers mailing list
>> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>>
>
>
> --
> Addressee is the intended audience.
> If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to read
> this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without saving or
> reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
> correspondence.
> Thank you for honoring my wish.
>
>

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Re: [Emc-developers] 2.8 release update.

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gentlemen,
I just git got () linuxcnc-dev. After clearing all the dependencies I
notice libgnomeprintui-2-2 is not loaded. Seems to have been removed from
the repositories decades(maybe not that long) ago. This gives me no cause
for concern and this is not a request for any action or attention. Just an
FYI as the configure message says printing from classic ladder will not be
possible.
I could find the package as an rpm but I didn't try to install it as I
don't "think" I will need to print from classic ladder. You know how that
goes though - for some reason I will want/need to print from classic ladder.

thanks
Stuart

On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 12:23 PM Chris Morley 
wrote:

> One ugly work around is to embed gremlin into a qt screen.
> I just added a sample screen under
> qtvcp_screen/qtvcp_experimental/gremlin.ini
> It is Qtaxis with both qt's graphics and gremlin.
> I have reports gremlin works on the Pi.
> It has some warts that could be worked on.
>
> opencv should only be required if you use the camview widget.
> It probably prevents one from using designer to modify screens - I'll look
> into that.
>
> Chris
>
> 
> From: Phill Carter 
> Sent: August 3, 2020 9:16 AM
> To: linuxcnc-developers 
> Subject: Re: [Emc-developers] 2.8 release update.
>
> I couldn't get the Qtvcp screens working on my Pi either.
>
> The raspbian python-opengl module has been built for OpenGL ES, I tried
> several times to build it for OpenGL but was unsuccessful.
>
> Cheers, Phill
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-developers mailing list
> Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
>


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Re: [Emc-developers] 2.8 Situation

[Stuart Stevenson]

Alec,

I truly appreciate your contributions BUT have to chuckle at one comment.

you can ignore the following comments as they are just in fun

On 6/10/20 2:56 AM, Alec Ari via Emc-developers wrote:

> > I want what I want because I'm five and I want it now. I spent 6 years
> working my ass off on RTAI and none of you could give a fuck less.
> >
>

If you take the above comment out of context it sounds like the Derek Jeter
commercial with the little girl.

He says how long have you had this dream?
She says 10 years.
He says wow you are 6 and have had this dream for 10 years.



Hope you can smile at this comment.

regards
Stuart


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Re: [Emc-developers] strange interpreter results - was [iocontrol.0.tool-prepare]

[Stuart Stevenson]

The stop spindle command on line 20 seems correct to me as stopping and
starting the spindle should be part of the total tool change routine and
come between the start change and end change commands.

As for the 21 and 5 commands I can only guess. It is possible the 21 and 5
are pocket numbers to handle a random tool change sequence.

Shrugs shoulders
Stuart

On Tue, May 19, 2020, 8:54 AM Reinhard 
wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I digged a bit deeper to understand what happens, but result is, the
> deeper I
> dig, the less I understand.
>
> I added N-words to each line to be able to link (in my mind) interpreter
> output to each gcode-line.
>
> Sample is now like this (obvious motion lines ommited):
> N005 G17 G21 G64
> ( Tasche1 )
> ( T4 : 12.0 HPC )
> N010 G40 G80
> N015 T4
> N020 M6
> N025 G0 G90 G54 X50 Y70 S4750 M3 T23
> N030 G43 H4 Z2 M8
> N035 G1 Z-9 F300
> ...
> N090 G1 X38.523 Y55.077
> N095 G1 X50 Y70
> N100 G0 Z150 M5
> N105 M9
> N110 M6
>
> corresponding tool.tbl is this:
> T4   P4 Z56.4 D12 ;12,0mm hpc 4-schneider
> T23 P7 Z50D10 ;10,00mm 4 schneiden fräser
> T24 P8 Z50D12 ;12,00mm 4 schneiden fräser
>
> ... there exists no tool entry with number 5 !
>
> ... and here's the output from interpreter, started standalone with
> gcode-file
> as commandline-parameter. First executed option 3 - read tool file, then
> start
> interpreting.
>
>10 N005   SELECT_PLANE(CANON_PLANE_XY)
>11 N005   USE_LENGTH_UNITS(CANON_UNITS_MM)
>12 N005   SET_MOTION_CONTROL_MODE(CANON_CONTINUOUS, 0.00)
>13 N005   SET_NAIVECAM_TOLERANCE(0.)
>14 N. COMMENT("Tasche1 ")
>15 N. COMMENT("T4 : 12.0 HPC ")
>16 N010   COMMENT("interpreter: cutter radius compensation off")
>17 N010   COMMENT("interpreter: motion mode set to none")
>18 N015   SELECT_TOOL(4)
>19 N020   START_CHANGE()
>20 N020   STOP_SPINDLE_TURNING(0)
>21 N020   CHANGE_TOOL(21)
>22 N025   SET_SPINDLE_SPEED(0, 4750.)
>23 N025   SELECT_TOOL(23)
>24 N025   START_SPINDLE_CLOCKWISE(0)
>25 N025   COMMENT("interpreter: continuing to use same coordinate
> system")
>26 N025   STRAIGHT_TRAVERSE(50., 70., 0., 0., 0.,
> 0.)
>27 N030   FLOOD_ON()
>28 N030   USE_TOOL_LENGTH_OFFSET(0. 0. 1432.5600, 0. 0.
> 0., 0. 0. 0.)
>29 N030   STRAIGHT_TRAVERSE(50., 70., 2., 0., 0.,
> 0.)
>30 N035   SET_FEED_RATE(300.)
>44 N095   STRAIGHT_FEED(50., 70., -9., 0., 0.,
> 0.)
>45 N100   STOP_SPINDLE_TURNING(0)
>46 N100   STRAIGHT_TRAVERSE(50., 70., 150., 0., 0.,
> 0.)
>47 N105   MIST_OFF()
>48 N105   FLOOD_OFF()
>49 N110   START_CHANGE()
>50 N110   STOP_SPINDLE_TURNING(0)
>51 N110   CHANGE_TOOL(5)
>
> I guess, that the first number of each line is the sequence of command
> execution.
> Line 18 is as expected, but line 20 should go before line 19 ...
> Don't know, but from my point of view the spindle should stop, before
> initiating any tool-change process.
>
> Line 21 looks strange to me. Where does the 21 come from?
> In the whole file no tool #21 is mentioned.
>
> Line 23 shows, that the tool selection has been recognized. But is not
> sent to
> atc-pin (yes, I broke the cut-loop).
>
> Line 25 shows the tip is at Z0.
> Line 28 applies the tool length offset - but not the offset from tool.tbl
> - no
> idea, where that numbers come from. In my understanding, G43 H4 means,
> that
> the tool-length from tool #4 should be taken. That length is 56.4 (with
> dot,
> not with comma). So if the tip was at Z0, it should be at ±56.4 - as G21
> has
> been commanded.
>
> Then at line 51 a tool #5 will be changed. I don't have a tool #5 in
> tool.tbl
> and no T5 in the whole gcode file.
>
> Please gimme a hand to understand the whole story.
>
> cheers Reinhard
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] git

[Stuart Stevenson]

Maybe the license is still free. You just need to ask for one. This seems
to be a precursor to a license purchase sometime in the future but it may
be free for now.

On Tue, May 12, 2020, 8:05 AM Kurt Jacobson  wrote:

> Hello Reinhard,
>
> That's very disappointing. I thought GitKraken was still completely free to
> use.
> I have used it since 2017 and have never had it ask for a licence file.
> Maybe I am grandfathered in some how.
>
>
> On Tue, May 12, 2020 at 12:53 AM Reinhard 
> wrote:
>
> > On Montag, 11. Mai 2020, 23:18:32 CEST Kurt Jacobson wrote:
> > > GitKraken is unsurpassed for quickly viewing git commit history and
> file
> > > diffs.
> > > Unfortunately its not open source, but it is free to use.
> >
> > Tried to install standalone version, as I wanted the functionality for my
> > local repos. But on startup it requires a license file.
> > Exit is the only alternative - does not run as freeware.
> >
> > For public repositories I don't need such tools, as the github-browser
> > offers
> > all I need.
> >
> >
> > Reinhard
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
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> >
>
>
> --
> *Kurt Jacobson*
> 505-303-1933
> kurtcjacob...@gmail.com
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] [Rtai] Fw: Kernel 4.19 series now added to RTAI for LinuxCNC

[Stuart Stevenson]

Andy

The odd bit of code looks like a private debug label. I don't know much
about the programming but if I wanted to know what happened on a certain
line I would do something like that.
Stuart

On Fri, Apr 17, 2020, 3:45 PM Alec Ari via Emc-developers <
emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net> wrote:

> The fix works here!
>
> Alec
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] Toolchange and tlo behaviour change in 2.8

[Stuart Stevenson]

Jared,

A milled pocket will have a fillet in the corners at least equal to the
radius of the cutter used but that does not make it a requirement to
describe a fillet to be able to cut it. I like to use G41/G42 during even
the roughing of a pocket. When I rough a pocket using cutter comp in
LinuxCNC I must describe a fillet for EVERY change of cutter direction.
This is not necessary for efficient roughing and is a pita.

Regards
Stuart

On Wed, Apr 15, 2020, 11:24 AM Jared McLaughlin <
jared.p.mclaugh...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I know I'm jumping in the middle of the conversation, but I can't see
> what other behavior would be desired.
>
> On Wed, Apr 15, 2020 at 11:30 AM Stuart Stevenson 
> wrote:
> >
> > I have tried, without success, to convince a developer to add a switch to
> > the config file to enable/disable the "feature". I don't like this
> > behavior. I would always run with the feature disabled.
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 15, 2020, 8:26 AM Reinhard 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Greetings,
> > >
> > > On Mittwoch, 15. April 2020, 15:00:38 CEST Stuart Stevenson wrote:
> > > > It sounds to me like you will run into a problem with G41/G42 ...
> > > > When using G41/G42, if the tool radius (plus any diameter/radius
> > > > modification for roughing) is not smaller than the programmed radius
> of
> > > the
> > > > corner LinuxCNC will give you an error code and will not run.
> > >
> > > Well, that is correct and expected behaviour.
> > >
> > > Of cause, if faking tool properties, linuxcnc should use the resulting
> > > properties to (re-)calculate the new toolpath. If that would not be the
> > > case,
> > > the support for faking tool properties would be useless.
> > >
> > > But tests with G43.1 gimme the hope, that linuxcnc already takes the
> fake
> > > values for path calculations.
> > > I will test that, when I have a new dev-box up and running.
> > >
> > > Reinhard
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
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> > >
> >
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>
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Re: [Emc-developers] Toolchange and tlo behaviour change in 2.8

[Stuart Stevenson]

I have tried, without success, to convince a developer to add a switch to
the config file to enable/disable the "feature". I don't like this
behavior. I would always run with the feature disabled.

On Wed, Apr 15, 2020, 8:26 AM Reinhard 
wrote:

> Greetings,
>
> On Mittwoch, 15. April 2020, 15:00:38 CEST Stuart Stevenson wrote:
> > It sounds to me like you will run into a problem with G41/G42 ...
> > When using G41/G42, if the tool radius (plus any diameter/radius
> > modification for roughing) is not smaller than the programmed radius of
> the
> > corner LinuxCNC will give you an error code and will not run.
>
> Well, that is correct and expected behaviour.
>
> Of cause, if faking tool properties, linuxcnc should use the resulting
> properties to (re-)calculate the new toolpath. If that would not be the
> case,
> the support for faking tool properties would be useless.
>
> But tests with G43.1 gimme the hope, that linuxcnc already takes the fake
> values for path calculations.
> I will test that, when I have a new dev-box up and running.
>
> Reinhard
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] Toolchange and tlo behaviour change in 2.8

[Stuart Stevenson]

Hi,

It sounds to me like you will run into a problem with G41/G42 when you get
the roughing radius offset working like you want.
When using G41/G42, if the tool radius (plus any diameter/radius
modification for roughing) is not smaller than the programmed radius of the
corner LinuxCNC will give you an error code and will not run. Maybe
G41.1/G42.1 or G41.2/G42.2 will handle this but I have never used either so
I don't know.
regards
Stuart

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Re: [Emc-developers] ask for help

[Stuart Stevenson]

Way back when (79,80) I ran machine with a GE Mark Century 100 control. The
control was built in 1958. No tool length offets, the zero position was
adjusted with thumb wheel dials and no memory only a tape reader. Block
delete was useful then because there was no program changes at the machine.
If the programmer would put a manreadable section at the beginning of each
tool the you could position the tape in the reader to start in the middle
of the program.
The control box was about 6 feet square and about 5 feet tall.


On Fri, Mar 27, 2020, 1:21 PM Reinhard 
wrote:

> Hi,
>
> > Block delete is not used for comment lines.
>
> I know. I was suggesting, that in case block delete is not supported,
> using
> brackets (character for multiline comment) could offer same functionality
> and
> you need less characters to disable multiple lines.
>
> > I haven't used block delete for over 20 years.
>
> I never have used block delete so far.
> In case I want to use only part of existing program, I use "run from line"
> together with M0
>
>
> cheers Reinhard
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] ask for help

[Stuart Stevenson]

Block delete is not used for comment lines. Block delete causes the control
to ignore the line with the block delete symbol during control operation. I
have seen controls with multiple levels of block delete.
I have found very limited use for one level of block delete and have never
used a second level block delete.
The only block delete symbol I have seen has been the / symbol. Any symbol
would work.
/   - one level
// - two levels
/// - three levels.
I don't know if a two or more level block delete will honor levels with
lower numbers of symbols or only ignore the lines with the same level of
block delete symbols.
I have seen controls with block delete and block delete 2 and block delete
3 buttons.
I have always assumed block delete level two would ignore level 1 and level
2 block delete lines.
I haven't used block delete for over 20 years.

Regards
Stuart



On Fri, Mar 27, 2020, 9:30 AM Reinhard 
wrote:

> Hi Chris,
>
> > Oh and I would like to fix block delete to work in program
>
> Well, I don't really understand the benefit of that feature.
>
> Why not use brackets for multiline comment?
> That is "standard" for many cnc-controllers and it is easy to use.
>
> Block delete could be implemented as a filter function of the gcode
> lister.
> GCode-interpreter should support that tag too - and as it is documented, I
> suppose, the gcode-interpreter already supports that feature?
>
> If not, it could be implemented like line comments.
>
> cheers Reinhard
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] COMP files

[Stuart Stevenson]

I have used bidirectional compensation on several machines. The latest on a
cinci just like the blue one at MPM. It has a Cin950 control. I collected
data using a CMM connected to the X table. I put the data in the file,
restarted the machine and the machine had twice the error as when I
started. I reversed the data in the compensation table and voila the
machine looked pretty good. Repeated for Y and Z.
Collecting data for 3 dimensional correction may be problematic in some
cases.

thanks
Stuart

On Sun, Nov 24, 2019 at 7:26 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Sunday 24 November 2019 19:47:33 Stuart Stevenson wrote:
>
> > A two (or three) dimension comp file could work wonders to straighten
> > the motion. To be able to correct Y and Z motion per X motion at the
> > same discreet points chosen for the bidirectional compensation would
> > be a very good thing. Correcting X and Z for Y motion and correcting X
> > and Y for Z motion would complete the package.
> > The interpolation for the correction values would make a machine
> > motion much straighter.
> >
> > This would not perfect the machine as lead screw lost motion and
> > gib/linear (guide ways) slop would still be present until mechanically
> > corrected.
> >
> > A slight warp in the bed of a lathe would be easily corrected.
> >
> Ok, but lets pull this magic rabbit back out of the weeds.  Where might I
> find a good tut on actually putting it to work?
>
> Thanks Stuart, Gene.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>  - Louis D. Brandeis
> Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of LinuxCNC --> Precalculations

[Stuart Stevenson]

Raoul,

Paragraph (1)
I think it would be necessary to empirically collect the dynamic behavior
of each machine component on each machine tool.
A productivity improvement by a factor of five seems to be a very large
improvement. You can push a tool speed and feed only so much no matter how
smooth it moves.
What were you measuring to determine a five factor improvement?

Paragraph (2)
I think the reason all the commercial controls guard their software so
close is they are all doing it the same way and don't want to fight
proprietary battles. Math is math and there is only 1 best way to calculate
something. They may have a few diversionary side tracks inserted to confuse
the issue.

I did geometric compensation on the 5 axis mill in the video. The kinematic
file took a large number of variables and compensated all five axes for
geometric inaccuracies such as the center line of the spindle did not pass
EXACTLY through the center line of the A axis. Same for the B axis.
The A and B axes were not perfect to one another. I collected data with a
laser tracker and modified the variables until I saw the motion as shown by
the three travel indicators. I am sure I could have tweaked the variables=
to minimize needle movement but I believe I was at the all important point
of diminishing returns.  I reached my goal of the tool tip accurate to
within +/-.005 during full travel of all axes. If someone puts a part on
that machine requiring closer positioning the part is on the wrong machine.

--

I like that you are working to improve the capability of LinuxCNC (by
association and sharing).

I have the algorithms done to implement 5 axis tool diameter compensation.
I have not done it as figuring out how to do it in LinuxCNC seems way past
my coding skill. After I completed the algorithms I found a paper by Fanuc.
It showed their 5 axis cutter diameter compensation concept. It was exactly
the same as what I had done. Their paper was produced far earlier than
anything I did. It was a published paper and I didn't see any reference to
a patent or copyright. It must not be their original work. Probably
something so old and obvious I reinvented the wheel. UGH!

What are some of the missing features you have identified?

thanks
Stuart


On Sun, Nov 24, 2019 at 11:47 AM Herzog Raoul 
wrote:

> dear Stuart,
>
> there were several motivations for starting the OpenCN project :
>
> 1) We observed that productivity can often be increased compared to
> commercial CNC, while maintaining the same geometrical tolerances and
> surface quality of the machined piece. In order to do so, you need to model
> the dynamical behaviour of the machine (vibrational behaviour).
> We did this in a project, and we could achieve a gain of a factor 5 in
> productivity compared to a Heidenhain CNC, while maintaining the same
> quality of the machined piece. This is the ultimate goal (not yet realized
> in OpenCN).
>
> 2) We observed that commercial CNC (Fanuc, Siemens, Heidenhain, ) are
> black boxes, and the trajectory planning algorithms are closed, completely
> impossible for a user to change.
> LinuxCNC is open, but the trajectory planning lacks jerk control, and the
> C code of this part of LinuxCNC is really poorly documented.
>
> This was the motivation for starting OpenCN.
>
> Note that OpenCN is yet in an experimental stage with many features
> missing.
> We'll continue on academic side, and maybe some of our ideas could be used
> to improve LinuxCNC in the future.
>
> best regards,
>
> Raoul
>
>
> -Message d'origine-
> De : Stuart Stevenson 
> Envoyé : dimanche 24 novembre 2019 05:36
> À : EMC developers 
> Objet : Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of LinuxCNC
> --> Precalculations
>
> Raoul,
> What did you compare? Why did you start this project? Lead me through your
> thought process.
> I have the most interest in feedrate modification but if the part quality
> can be improved and increase the feed then we have two of the three.
> Faster - check
> Better - check
> Cheaper - ?
> Thanks in advance for the education.
> Stuart
>
> On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 10:09 AM Herzog Raoul 
> wrote:
>
> > dear Stuart,
> >
> > comparative examples between OpenCN and what, LinuxCNC, commercial CNC's
> ?
> > And comparing what, machining time, surface quality ?
> >
> > Not so easy, but one thing is clear : the jerk control is absolutely
> > necessary for a CNC, otherwise for a given quality of the machined
> > part you need to lower really a lot feedrate.
> >
> > best regards,
> >
> > Raoul
> >
> > -Message d'origine-
> > De : Stuart Stevenson  Envoyé : samedi 23 novembre
> > 2019 16:51 À : EMC developers 
> > Objet : Re: [Emc-developers] announceme

Re: [Emc-developers] COMP files

[Stuart Stevenson]

A two (or three) dimension comp file could work wonders to straighten the
motion. To be able to correct Y and Z motion per X motion at the same
discreet points chosen for the bidirectional compensation would be a very
good thing. Correcting X and Z for Y motion and correcting X and Y for Z
motion would complete the package.
The interpolation for the correction values would make a machine motion
much straighter.

This would not perfect the machine as lead screw lost motion and gib/linear
(guide ways) slop would still be present until mechanically corrected.

A slight warp in the bed of a lathe would be easily corrected.

thanks
Stuart


On Sun, Nov 24, 2019 at 4:08 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> Greetings all;
>
> I see in Documentation.pdf at about page 375 its mentioned that if a comp
> file is used. then backlash is ignored. That seems a bit odd, until one
> realizes that COMP in this case is being used to correct for possible
> non-linearities in THAT screw. That detail could be clarified, but I've
> no suggestions how.
>
> What I am doing in the Sheldon, is compensating X based on Z position, so
> that it turns relatively straight in spite of a few thou of bed wear.
> IOW a different critter entirely. It also took several days to measure
> with a rifle bore sighting laser since it turned out to be temperature
> sensitive. For final readings I loosened the foot ball joint and left it
> loose for several days before snugging it back up. That seemed to have
> helped stabilize the measured error.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>  - Louis D. Brandeis
> Genes Web page 
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of LinuxCNC --> Precalculations

[Stuart Stevenson]

Couple of links

This is me and my machine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35tHYaDUmZQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nn1bJ3YAQdI

thanks
Stuart



On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 10:35 PM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> Raoul,
> What did you compare? Why did you start this project? Lead me through your
> thought process.
> I have the most interest in feedrate modification but if the part quality
> can be improved and increase the feed then we have two of the three.
> Faster - check
> Better - check
> Cheaper - ?
> Thanks in advance for the education.
> Stuart
>
> On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 10:09 AM Herzog Raoul 
> wrote:
>
>> dear Stuart,
>>
>> comparative examples between OpenCN and what, LinuxCNC, commercial CNC's ?
>> And comparing what, machining time, surface quality ?
>>
>> Not so easy, but one thing is clear : the jerk control is absolutely
>> necessary for a CNC, otherwise for a given quality of the machined part you
>> need to lower really a lot feedrate.
>>
>> best regards,
>>
>> Raoul
>>
>> -Message d'origine-
>> De : Stuart Stevenson 
>> Envoyé : samedi 23 novembre 2019 16:51
>> À : EMC developers 
>> Objet : Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of LinuxCNC
>> --> Precalculations
>>
>> Would it be possible to post some comparative example pictures/videos so
>> I can better understand what you are fixing?
>> Thanks
>> Stuart
>>
>> On Sat, Nov 23, 2019, 5:43 AM Herzog Raoul 
>> wrote:
>>
>> > dear Andrew,
>> >
>> > The RS274 interpreter is still the original, important concepts like
>> > HAL, pins etc, are still there.
>> >
>> > Even with high end drives, you cannot simply stream position data, the
>> > reference signals for each drive *must* respect the physical
>> > constraints regarding max jerk, max acceleration and max speed !
>> >
>> > Important for understanding : there is NOT ANY trajectory planning
>> > INSIDE the drive, only feedback loops and feedforward.
>> >
>> > best regards,
>> >
>> > Raoul
>> >
>> > -Message d'origine-
>> > De : Andrew 
>> > Envoyé : samedi 23 novembre 2019 12:24 À : EMC developers
>> > 
>> > Objet : Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of
>> > LinuxCNC
>> > --> Precalculations
>> >
>> > Just wondering what's left from LinuxCNC there ) With such intelligent
>> > servo drives you just have to stream the position data (you made the
>> > new TP for that!).
>> > Do you use Ethercat I/O too?
>> >
>> > сб, 23 лист. 2019 о 12:17 Herzog Raoul  пише:
>> >
>> > > dear Nicklas,
>> > >
>> > > there is no feedback control loop in OpenCN.
>> > > Feedback and Feedforward is only inside the drives.
>> > >
>> > > We use TSD80E drives from the manufacturer Triamec (
>> > > https://www.triamec.com/de/triamec-servo-drives.html).
>> > > The sampling frequency for the PWM, current control loop and
>> > > position control loop is 100 kHz !
>> > > The setpoint values coming from EtherCat at a rate of 10 kHz are
>> > > fine interpolated in the drive and upsampled to 100 kHz.
>> > >
>> > > One remark regarding our feedrate planning.
>> > > At any time, at least one of the constraints is "active", meaning
>> > > that either the max jerk is delivered, or the max acceleration, or
>> > > the max
>> > speed.
>> > > Sometimes this is called "Bangbang", maybe a misleading term since
>> > > there are no jumps in acceleration.
>> > > Time optimality automatically leads to this "Bangbang" property.
>> > >
>> > > best regards,
>> > >
>> > > Raoul
>> > >
>> > > -Message d'origine-
>> > > De : N  Envoyé : samedi 23 novembre
>> > > 2019 10:51 À : EMC developers 
>> > > Objet : Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of
>> > > LinuxCNC
>> > > --> Precalculations
>> > >
>> > > > dear Nicklas,
>> > > >
>> > > > of course, feedforwards are utilized (and well parametrized) in
>> > > > the
>> > > *drives*, otherwise excessive tracking errors appear.
>> > > >
>> > > > But this is done in the *drive*, *not* in OpenCN.
>> > > > OpenCN calculates

Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of LinuxCNC --> Precalculations

[Stuart Stevenson]

Raoul,
What did you compare? Why did you start this project? Lead me through your
thought process.
I have the most interest in feedrate modification but if the part quality
can be improved and increase the feed then we have two of the three.
Faster - check
Better - check
Cheaper - ?
Thanks in advance for the education.
Stuart

On Sat, Nov 23, 2019 at 10:09 AM Herzog Raoul 
wrote:

> dear Stuart,
>
> comparative examples between OpenCN and what, LinuxCNC, commercial CNC's ?
> And comparing what, machining time, surface quality ?
>
> Not so easy, but one thing is clear : the jerk control is absolutely
> necessary for a CNC, otherwise for a given quality of the machined part you
> need to lower really a lot feedrate.
>
> best regards,
>
> Raoul
>
> -Message d'origine-
> De : Stuart Stevenson 
> Envoyé : samedi 23 novembre 2019 16:51
> À : EMC developers 
> Objet : Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of LinuxCNC
> --> Precalculations
>
> Would it be possible to post some comparative example pictures/videos so I
> can better understand what you are fixing?
> Thanks
> Stuart
>
> On Sat, Nov 23, 2019, 5:43 AM Herzog Raoul 
> wrote:
>
> > dear Andrew,
> >
> > The RS274 interpreter is still the original, important concepts like
> > HAL, pins etc, are still there.
> >
> > Even with high end drives, you cannot simply stream position data, the
> > reference signals for each drive *must* respect the physical
> > constraints regarding max jerk, max acceleration and max speed !
> >
> > Important for understanding : there is NOT ANY trajectory planning
> > INSIDE the drive, only feedback loops and feedforward.
> >
> > best regards,
> >
> > Raoul
> >
> > -Message d'origine-
> > De : Andrew 
> > Envoyé : samedi 23 novembre 2019 12:24 À : EMC developers
> > 
> > Objet : Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of
> > LinuxCNC
> > --> Precalculations
> >
> > Just wondering what's left from LinuxCNC there ) With such intelligent
> > servo drives you just have to stream the position data (you made the
> > new TP for that!).
> > Do you use Ethercat I/O too?
> >
> > сб, 23 лист. 2019 о 12:17 Herzog Raoul  пише:
> >
> > > dear Nicklas,
> > >
> > > there is no feedback control loop in OpenCN.
> > > Feedback and Feedforward is only inside the drives.
> > >
> > > We use TSD80E drives from the manufacturer Triamec (
> > > https://www.triamec.com/de/triamec-servo-drives.html).
> > > The sampling frequency for the PWM, current control loop and
> > > position control loop is 100 kHz !
> > > The setpoint values coming from EtherCat at a rate of 10 kHz are
> > > fine interpolated in the drive and upsampled to 100 kHz.
> > >
> > > One remark regarding our feedrate planning.
> > > At any time, at least one of the constraints is "active", meaning
> > > that either the max jerk is delivered, or the max acceleration, or
> > > the max
> > speed.
> > > Sometimes this is called "Bangbang", maybe a misleading term since
> > > there are no jumps in acceleration.
> > > Time optimality automatically leads to this "Bangbang" property.
> > >
> > > best regards,
> > >
> > > Raoul
> > >
> > > -Message d'origine-
> > > De : N  Envoyé : samedi 23 novembre
> > > 2019 10:51 À : EMC developers 
> > > Objet : Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of
> > > LinuxCNC
> > > --> Precalculations
> > >
> > > > dear Nicklas,
> > > >
> > > > of course, feedforwards are utilized (and well parametrized) in
> > > > the
> > > *drives*, otherwise excessive tracking errors appear.
> > > >
> > > > But this is done in the *drive*, *not* in OpenCN.
> > > > OpenCN calculates physically realizable setpoint values (according
> > > > to
> > > "optimal control theory").
> > >
> > > Sounds really good. Physical realisable will be movement calculated
> > > with feedforward of maximum and minimum voltage with a perfect
> > > model, sounds simple but to calculate then it is time to slow down
> > > to exactly hit a point running at the limits is suprisingly hard to
> > > get correct for
> > all cases.
> > >
> > > Then there must be some room for the control law. You have gone
> > > further and included unperfect model and dynam

Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of LinuxCNC --> Precalculations

[Stuart Stevenson]

Would it be possible to post some comparative example pictures/videos so I
can better understand what you are fixing?
Thanks
Stuart

On Sat, Nov 23, 2019, 5:43 AM Herzog Raoul  wrote:

> dear Andrew,
>
> The RS274 interpreter is still the original, important concepts like HAL,
> pins etc, are still there.
>
> Even with high end drives, you cannot simply stream position data, the
> reference signals for each drive *must* respect the physical constraints
> regarding max jerk, max acceleration and max speed !
>
> Important for understanding : there is NOT ANY trajectory planning INSIDE
> the drive, only feedback loops and feedforward.
>
> best regards,
>
> Raoul
>
> -Message d'origine-
> De : Andrew 
> Envoyé : samedi 23 novembre 2019 12:24
> À : EMC developers 
> Objet : Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of LinuxCNC
> --> Precalculations
>
> Just wondering what's left from LinuxCNC there ) With such intelligent
> servo drives you just have to stream the position data (you made the new TP
> for that!).
> Do you use Ethercat I/O too?
>
> сб, 23 лист. 2019 о 12:17 Herzog Raoul  пише:
>
> > dear Nicklas,
> >
> > there is no feedback control loop in OpenCN.
> > Feedback and Feedforward is only inside the drives.
> >
> > We use TSD80E drives from the manufacturer Triamec (
> > https://www.triamec.com/de/triamec-servo-drives.html).
> > The sampling frequency for the PWM, current control loop and position
> > control loop is 100 kHz !
> > The setpoint values coming from EtherCat at a rate of 10 kHz are fine
> > interpolated in the drive and upsampled to 100 kHz.
> >
> > One remark regarding our feedrate planning.
> > At any time, at least one of the constraints is "active", meaning that
> > either the max jerk is delivered, or the max acceleration, or the max
> speed.
> > Sometimes this is called "Bangbang", maybe a misleading term since
> > there are no jumps in acceleration.
> > Time optimality automatically leads to this "Bangbang" property.
> >
> > best regards,
> >
> > Raoul
> >
> > -Message d'origine-
> > De : N 
> > Envoyé : samedi 23 novembre 2019 10:51 À : EMC developers
> > 
> > Objet : Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of
> > LinuxCNC
> > --> Precalculations
> >
> > > dear Nicklas,
> > >
> > > of course, feedforwards are utilized (and well parametrized) in the
> > *drives*, otherwise excessive tracking errors appear.
> > >
> > > But this is done in the *drive*, *not* in OpenCN.
> > > OpenCN calculates physically realizable setpoint values (according
> > > to
> > "optimal control theory").
> >
> > Sounds really good. Physical realisable will be movement calculated
> > with feedforward of maximum and minimum voltage with a perfect model,
> > sounds simple but to calculate then it is time to slow down to exactly
> > hit a point running at the limits is suprisingly hard to get correct for
> all cases.
> >
> > Then there must be some room for the control law. You have gone
> > further and included unperfect model and dynamics from the feedback in
> > some way or other?
> >
> >
> > Regards Nicklas Karlsson
> >
> >
> > ___
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> > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> >
> >
> > ___
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> > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> >
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of LinuxCNC

[Stuart Stevenson]

Just for my education would you tell me where LinuxCNC is so far behind
today's commercial CNC controls?

On Fri, Nov 22, 2019, 4:01 PM Herzog Raoul  wrote:

> dear Andrew,
>
> thanks for your positive feedback.
>
> There were many reasons for us to develop OpenCN :
>
> 1) of course scientific curiosity  ...  I'm working for ~8 years in this
> field
>
> 2) but, more important, I had and have customers having problems with
> surface quality as feedrate increases.
> I'm living in the "watchmaking" western part of Switzerland  :-)
> We found out that the cause of the bad surface quality problem stems from
> the vibrational behaviour of the machine.
> And we started to develop special trajectory planning algorithms coded in
> Matlab for *precalculating* the setpoint values.
> It turned out, that the machining time with our algorithms was ~5 times
> lower compared to a high end CNC, while keeping the same surface quality.
> But then ...  very difficult to get a commercial CNC manufacturer
> interested in  ... an industrialization seemed difficult.
> We decided to make the important step from "offline precalculation" of
> setpoint values to online calculation as any CNC does.
> LinuxCNC and the IgH EtherCat Master were our starting points, but we
> realized that LinuxCNC today is more a "hobbyist" solution, far from the
> performance commercial CNC's can deliver today.
> And for academic people, LinuxCNC, as it is today, is a code labyrinth,
> especially in the trajectory planning part.
> This motivated our development.
>
> 3) yes, we have immediate use : we are doing many machining tests on our
> micro milling machine "m3" you can see in the video.
> And next year we will have the "micro5" here (
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hITTmdsiihY), and we'll move OpenCN to 5
> axis !
>
> best regards,
>
> Raoul
>
>
> -Message d'origine-
> De : Andrew 
> Envoyé : vendredi 22 novembre 2019 22:15
> À : EMC developers 
> Objet : Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of LinuxCNC
>
> Dear Raoul,
>
> I truly admire your and your team's efforts.
> Let me ask you about the purpose of OpenCN. Why did you decide to create
> it?
> Was it mostly for science or you have immediate use for it?
>
> Sincerely,
> Andrew
>
>
> пт, 22 лист. 2019 о 09:48 Herzog Raoul  пише:
>
> > dear Linux developers,
> >
> > I'm pleased to announce a new fork of LinuxCNC, called "OpenCN* :
> >
> > OpenCN is an open source numerical control (CNC) for high end
> > machining applications (high dynamics, high precision).
> >
> > OpenCN is originally based on LinuxCNC, but with strong enhancements :
> >
> > -) completely reworked trajectory planning (TP) including jerk control
> > based on embedded optimization
> > -) Xenomai asymmetric multiprocessing (AMP) for hard real time, low
> > latency
> > -) up to date Linux kernel
> > -) EtherCat with 10 kHz frame rate and distributed clock (DC), mode B
> > -) new Qt based GUI superseding "axis"
> >
> > The HW platforms are x86 (available) and ARM (in preparation).
> >
> > Software : gitlab.com/mecatronyx/opencnc/opencn<
> > https://gitlab.com/mecatronyx/opencnc/opencn>
> > Doc : mecatronyx.gitlab.io/opencnc/doc/<
> > https://mecatronyx.gitlab.io/opencnc/doc/>
> > Youtube : www.youtube.com/channel/UC8FQCu_fKYfK7QRDN0j_dBw<
> > https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8FQCu_fKYfK7QRDN0j_dBw>
> >
> >
> > best regards,
> >
> > Raoul
> >
> >
> >
> > [http://correspondance.heig-vd.ch/assets/heig.png]
> >
> > Raoul Herzog
> > Dr.
> >
> > Professeur
> > Institut d'Automatisation Industrielle (iAi) Groupe mecatronYx Prof. :
> >
> > +41 24 557 61 93
> >
> > Site web :
> >
> > http://www.iai.heig-vd.ch
> >
> >
> > raoul.her...@heig-vd.ch
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
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> > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> >
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of LinuxCNC

[Stuart Stevenson]

No need to explain in detail. Just the general areas would be fine.

On Fri, Nov 22, 2019, 4:01 PM Herzog Raoul  wrote:

> dear Andrew,
>
> thanks for your positive feedback.
>
> There were many reasons for us to develop OpenCN :
>
> 1) of course scientific curiosity  ...  I'm working for ~8 years in this
> field
>
> 2) but, more important, I had and have customers having problems with
> surface quality as feedrate increases.
> I'm living in the "watchmaking" western part of Switzerland  :-)
> We found out that the cause of the bad surface quality problem stems from
> the vibrational behaviour of the machine.
> And we started to develop special trajectory planning algorithms coded in
> Matlab for *precalculating* the setpoint values.
> It turned out, that the machining time with our algorithms was ~5 times
> lower compared to a high end CNC, while keeping the same surface quality.
> But then ...  very difficult to get a commercial CNC manufacturer
> interested in  ... an industrialization seemed difficult.
> We decided to make the important step from "offline precalculation" of
> setpoint values to online calculation as any CNC does.
> LinuxCNC and the IgH EtherCat Master were our starting points, but we
> realized that LinuxCNC today is more a "hobbyist" solution, far from the
> performance commercial CNC's can deliver today.
> And for academic people, LinuxCNC, as it is today, is a code labyrinth,
> especially in the trajectory planning part.
> This motivated our development.
>
> 3) yes, we have immediate use : we are doing many machining tests on our
> micro milling machine "m3" you can see in the video.
> And next year we will have the "micro5" here (
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hITTmdsiihY), and we'll move OpenCN to 5
> axis !
>
> best regards,
>
> Raoul
>
>
> -Message d'origine-
> De : Andrew 
> Envoyé : vendredi 22 novembre 2019 22:15
> À : EMC developers 
> Objet : Re: [Emc-developers] announcement OpenCN, a new fork of LinuxCNC
>
> Dear Raoul,
>
> I truly admire your and your team's efforts.
> Let me ask you about the purpose of OpenCN. Why did you decide to create
> it?
> Was it mostly for science or you have immediate use for it?
>
> Sincerely,
> Andrew
>
>
> пт, 22 лист. 2019 о 09:48 Herzog Raoul  пише:
>
> > dear Linux developers,
> >
> > I'm pleased to announce a new fork of LinuxCNC, called "OpenCN* :
> >
> > OpenCN is an open source numerical control (CNC) for high end
> > machining applications (high dynamics, high precision).
> >
> > OpenCN is originally based on LinuxCNC, but with strong enhancements :
> >
> > -) completely reworked trajectory planning (TP) including jerk control
> > based on embedded optimization
> > -) Xenomai asymmetric multiprocessing (AMP) for hard real time, low
> > latency
> > -) up to date Linux kernel
> > -) EtherCat with 10 kHz frame rate and distributed clock (DC), mode B
> > -) new Qt based GUI superseding "axis"
> >
> > The HW platforms are x86 (available) and ARM (in preparation).
> >
> > Software : gitlab.com/mecatronyx/opencnc/opencn<
> > https://gitlab.com/mecatronyx/opencnc/opencn>
> > Doc : mecatronyx.gitlab.io/opencnc/doc/<
> > https://mecatronyx.gitlab.io/opencnc/doc/>
> > Youtube : www.youtube.com/channel/UC8FQCu_fKYfK7QRDN0j_dBw<
> > https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8FQCu_fKYfK7QRDN0j_dBw>
> >
> >
> > best regards,
> >
> > Raoul
> >
> >
> >
> > [http://correspondance.heig-vd.ch/assets/heig.png]
> >
> > Raoul Herzog
> > Dr.
> >
> > Professeur
> > Institut d'Automatisation Industrielle (iAi) Groupe mecatronYx Prof. :
> >
> > +41 24 557 61 93
> >
> > Site web :
> >
> > http://www.iai.heig-vd.ch
> >
> >
> > raoul.her...@heig-vd.ch
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-developers mailing list
> > Emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-developers
> >
>
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[Emc-developers] Cylindrical Square - off topic

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gentlemen,
  I found this on the floor in my office this morning. It was sitting in
the corner on a shelf behind a toaster and a coffee pot. Both the toaster
and the coffee pot - and one half of this was on the floor. One half was
still on the counter.

https://ibb.co/jVMynzX
https://ibb.co/bHtkdxm

The links are two pictures of this item. I have never seen anything like
this before. I have had this for approximately 15 years and used it a lot.
How in the world would it split in half like this now?

thanks
Stuart

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Re: [Emc-developers] removal of gedit as default editor

[Stuart Stevenson]

I kept two hawk eyes on it for a couple years.
Now I just use one eye but I still don't trust it completely.
:)

On Wed, Mar 20, 2019 at 3:12 PM Moses McKnight  wrote:

>
>
> On 3/20/19 3:00 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > On Wednesday 20 March 2019 15:29:10 Peter C. Wallace wrote:
> >
> >> On Wed, 20 Mar 2019, Moses McKnight wrote:
> >>> Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2019 13:45:42 -0500
> >>> From: Moses McKnight 
> >>> Reply-To: EMC developers 
> >>> To: emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net
> >>> Subject: Re: [Emc-developers] removal of gedit as default editor
> >>>
> >>> On 3/20/19 1:01 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
>  Now we know of two victims. Stuart and I. :(
> >>>
> >>> Well, that would explain why it didn't get removed from
> >>> distributions!  2 glitches out of 2 million installs (<-random
> >>> number), and it is the official text editor for Gnome.
> >>>
> >>> I suspect a third person probably had a glitch, and he fixed it -
> >>> which is why no one else has ever had a glitch with it. ;-)
> >>>
> >>> I've used it for many years myself and use it pretty much daily
> >>> still and have never had it corrupt anything.
> >>>
> >>> Moses
> >>
> >> I use gedit frequently, and at one time (maybe 2 years ago) I had it
> >> corrupt a file (multiple pastes scattered throughout the file), but
> >> since then I have not had a re-occurance, I do suspect that this bug
> >> (which might be WM dependent) has been fixed
> >>
> > That makes 3, and thats much more recent than my last session which was
> > at least 4, maybe 5 years back. Your description, Peter, fits it to a T.
> >
>
> Now y'all are making me nervous!  Now what did I do with my backup tapes...
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] removal of gedit as default editor

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gedit scrambled a few files for me a few years ago. The next update seemed
to have fixed it and I have had no problems for a while. I did start
working on a copy only. That kept Murphy at bay.


On Wed, Mar 20, 2019, 8:52 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Wed, 20 Mar 2019 at 13:00, Gene Heskett  wrote:
>
> How gedit ever made it into LinuxCNC as the default editor is
> > immaterial, but when it was found to be a file scrambler it should not
> > have taken several years to remove it.
>
>
> I think it only ever scrambled files for one user.
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] removal of gedit as default editor

[Stuart Stevenson]

The second vid was so funny. I have seen/heard conversations like this. I
am still laughing. 

Most likely, anyone understanding the joke will have NO problem with which
editor to use. The choice of notepad or wordpad is a big decision in some
universes.

The choice of which screen 'Axis, Touchy etc' is also difficult if you have
very little experience with CNC controls. Virtually any one of the
control screens can get the job done but which one is BETTER? Depends

Now 'depends' is another late life choice to be made. It is just a blink of
the eyes between diapers and depends. Time passes SO fast.
Which is better Depends or Tranquility or Egosan? Choices Choices Choices -
LIFE IS SSSO HARD!!

but then HARD is a relative term also for us older gents. Which hardness
aid is the best?

HTH
heh

regards
Stuart



On Wed, Mar 20, 2019 at 1:47 AM Alec Ari via Emc-developers <
emc-developers@lists.sourceforge.net> wrote:

> Hey everyone,
>
>
> I skimmed through this discussion a bit, I use Pluma most of the time. In
> the Linux world, the never ending war has been between Vim vs. Emacs. I
> don't use either, ever. If I don't have a graphical environment going, I
> use nano, an editor that absolutely everyone makes fun of. What is it with
> text editors and all the bickering that goes on? If you use Pluma or Kate,
> what does that make you, and why is everyone so incredibly opinionated over
> which editor _YOU_ use?
>
> This whole debate has been made fun of in movies and TV as well:
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpdngXQOkBI
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsoOG6ZeyUI
>
> Alec
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] removal of gedit as default editor

[Stuart Stevenson]

Or maybe upon first use in LinuxCNC a box would pop up to allow the choice
of available editors.

On Sun, Mar 17, 2019, 11:18 AM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Sunday 17 March 2019 11:39:05 Jon Elson wrote:
>
> > On 03/17/2019 09:15 AM, andy pugh wrote:
> > > On Sun, 17 Mar 2019 at 13:51, Nicklas Karlsson
> > >
> > >  wrote:
> > >> Do not know if I like emacs but it seems to stick forever.
> >
> > Emacs is a "heavyweight" editor.  It pulls in so many
> > language support libraries that it takes a long time to
> > load.  It used to take a whole minute on my CNC computer a
> > long time ago.  That one was very short on memory, but was
> > good enough for the old EMC2. Much better now, but still a
> > few seconds delay to start.
> >
> > > Doesn't appear on the LiveCD as far as I can see. vi is there...
> > >
> > > This isn't about editors. This is about changes we can make in the
> > > LinuxCNC sample configs _only_ to make the user experience a bit
> > > better.
>
> I think it IS about editors, making sure the experience of using it
> impresses the user that this IS a professional cnc even if its free.
> > >
> > > And clicking "Edit G-code" and having nothing happen is not good.
>
> Agree 100%.
>
> > Hmm, maybe during install the script could look for what
> > editors are actually installed and select one of them to be
> > used by the Edit button.
> >
> > Jon
>
> Thats a great idea, Jon.
>
> And making the script smart enough to know the difference between a good
> editor and a potential disaster is an exercise for the script author.
> Probably better to give it a list of known good editors, best to safely
> usable, with nano at the bottom of the list, not because its dangerous
> but because of its ugly face, its otherwise a good editor. Heck, you can
> even train it to scroll a line at a time.  That half a screen jump
> bothers my concentration.
>
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> Genes Web page 
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] got math problem I can't check in backplot

[Stuart Stevenson]

I think I would dial in a hole or a boss with a test indicator. Write down
the xy coordinates. Run a probe routine to determine where the probe says
the hole/boss is. Calculate the error. Write the error on a sticky pad.
Stick the sticky pad on the control face and use those values to set xy
when you probe a feature on a part. You would only needing orient the probe
the same way each time. Then the error between the probe tip and the
spindle center line would not be important.
Maybe I haven't followed your discussion accurately but if you would have a
problem with the wires using Ken's procedure how would you handle spinning
the spindle at 100 rpm or more?
Thanks
Stuart

On Fri, Mar 1, 2019, 11:09 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Friday 01 March 2019 21:10:35 Jon Elson wrote:
>
> > On 03/01/2019 05:03 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > > I just hooked mine up, pretty bad, and so eccentric, around .125" of
> > > wobble at the ball
> >
> > Doesn't it have some screws to center it?  Mine has 4 radial
> > setscrews that center the probe body on the arbor.  I
> > tweaked them until I got a consistent reading when turning
> > the probe in 90 degree steps.
> >
> > Jon
>
> Not that I've found, Jon. its made of pretty clear plastic castings and
> has 3 posts sticking out of the bottom of the plastic body, with
> adjusting nuts so the 3 armed plastic web holding the probe itself can
> be tilted, and in tilting it one could center the ball for very low
> runout. Kenneths idea of an arm so it could be rotated 180 degrees and
> an average runout be determined sounds like a good idea, but I'd like to
> see how Kenneth arranged his stops, which I think should be  magnetic so
> the wires couldn't drag it off whichever stop it was stuck to.
>
> >
> >
> > ___
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>
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> Genes Web page 
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] got math problem I can't check in backplot

[Stuart Stevenson]

Clamp a dowel pin to the table and probe the od.

On Thu, Feb 28, 2019, 10:25 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Thursday 28 February 2019 21:03:49 Jon Elson wrote:
>
> > On 02/28/2019 05:04 PM, Frank Tkalcevic wrote:
> > > I have a cheap ebay $100 probe.  I had doubts about the accuracy, so
> > > I perfomed a test probing a precision disc from all orientations.
> > > (The disc came from a 1"-2" micrometer - it is used to "zero" the
> > > micrometer).
> > >
> > > The results were pretty poor, with the error ranging from 0.3mm to
> > > 0.75mm.
> > >
> > > http://www.franksworkshop.com.au/wordpress/2019/03/01/touch-probe-ac
> > >curacy/# results
> > >
> > >> I have no way to measure how good MY probe is.
> >
> > Yes, what I need is a standard for an inside mike.  That
> > would make it pretty easy to test several directions without
> > moving anything. I did set it up by creating a program to
> > measure two sides of a gauge block, and dialing in the
> > "fudge factor" in the program to compensate for the apparent
> > probe ball diameter.  Since the Blum probe needs the ball
> > deflected a fair bit to register, the computed diameter of
> > the ball is quite different from the actual measured size of
> > the ball.  But, it seems to work pretty well.
> >
> > Jon
>
> Jon, have you considered setting a digital caliper to say .2500" and
> locking it, then clamping it down well enough it won't slip while you
> probe its gap. Maybe even mounting it on an upward faceing belt drive
> rotory table so all angles of the probe could be explored?  Its not
> required that it be exactly .2500 inches, only that it was well zero'd
> before you started, and that you can read whatever it is once opened and
> locked.  That would be the standard you are comparing the probe to. That
> ought to make us some smarter about probes. Backlash comp would need to
> be done first of course.
> >
> >
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>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
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>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
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>
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Re: [Emc-developers] got math problem I can't check in backplot

[Stuart Stevenson]

Every Renishaw probe I have used has had to have the spindle oriented when
probing. Otherwise I could not trust the results. Try the probe. It will
measure much better than .005.
Hth
Stuart

On Wed, Feb 27, 2019, 12:58 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Wednesday 27 February 2019 12:16:17 Jon Elson wrote:
>
> > On 02/27/2019 07:50 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > >   But repeated measurements require I add about
> > > 2 counts to the scale value for every repeated measurement done that
> > > way, and I've added around 20 counts trying to catch up. In a 16750
> > > count, 20 is not that much.
> >
> > This is not a MATH problem.  I'm assuming open loop steppers
> > here, hope that is what you have.
>
> yes.
>
> > If you get a fairly consistent accumulating error every back
> > and forth movement, it is likely something to do with timing
> > of the step pulses relative to the direction pin.  Make sure
> > the space between step pulses is in the right sense, so that
> > the direction never changes when the step pulse is "true".
> > That is the one that will surely foul up many step drivers,
> > especially if they are microstepping.
>
> These are, by 8 I believe.
>
> > Also, check all
> > details of the step timing, pause between step pulses, etc.
> > If you don't have detailed specs for your drives, then try
> > doubling the step pulse, step space and setup time on the
> > direction and see if that helps the problem.
>
> Ok.
>
> > Jon
> >
> I haven't checked with a scope to see if the pulses are right side up,
> meaning the opto's are only driven for step time, with a large off time
> in between pulses but will. With the 7i76, thats very easily reversible
> as it has both polarities of drive available.
>
> The hole patterns its cutting are round and it takes 12 passes thru the
> loop to cut one hole, stopping and digging 8 thou deeper per pass around
> the circle. I'd thought of that, which is why I checked them for round
> although the pattern in the spoil board might be questionable, its
> cherry ATM & tends toward leaving a little fuzz. It doesn't cut as clean
> as mahogany.
>
> But I'll double check with a scope yet this afternoon. The drivers are
> the original 2M542's, step and space are 1750ns, setup and holds at
> 4000ns. Thats some longer in each case than what I've found for that
> driver.  All 4 are running with that timing. Getting a solid 5 volts on
> the + and the -signal for on time from the 7i76 on its - terminal.
>
> Its crowded up there though as the garage door motor impinges on the
> space on the overhead shelf where everything but the coolant tank
> resides.
>
> I should also comment that a g0x0.00 always ends up at 0.000xx when I
> do that, then grab the moving caliper and slide it back against the side
> of the tool, with the xx often less than 10.
>
> Far more accurately than this renishaw clone can do. I find in the spec
> sheet its a .005" device.  Thats so discouraging I haven't even mounted
> it. I'd assume one measures the ball, and figures in half the ball
> diameter plus a fudge of 2 to 4 as its true trip point. Piece of junk
> IOW. Not at all concentric as it recommends locking the spindle to use
> it. Moronic waste of money on my part.
>
> Thanks Jon. I'll go fix the missus some lunch and get to it.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> Genes Web page 
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-developers] Breakout of HAL/ machinekits's HAL

[Stuart Stevenson]

What is wrong with NML? If it doesn't have some needed process is it not
able to be extended?

On Wed, Sep 12, 2018, 2:52 PM Sebastian Kuzminsky 
wrote:

> On Sat, Sep 8, 2018 at 6:28 PM Chris Morley 
> wrote:
>
> >
> > I'm not sure where they are at with replacing NML, but that is not what I
> > was talking of.
> >
>
> Machinekit has not gotten rid of NML, it's still how you get commands from
> the UIs into Task.
>
> My understanding from a cursory reading of their code is: They have added a
> new program called machinetalk that you can think of as a "network UI", in
> the same sense that our "halui" is a "HAL UI".  Machinetalk takes 0mq
> messages from the network and turns them into NML messages, then sends
> those NML messages to Task just like a "native NML" UI does.
>
> It adds the capability of talking to the motion controller via 0mq, but at
> the cost of an additional IPC hop.
>
> That's how it looks to me but of course I'm no expert, I'd welcome
> corrections from anyone who knows the MK code.
>
> In my opinion it is a mistake to add another layer of communication on
> top.  Far better to clean up the internals to replace NML with 0mq (or
> whatever the correct transport is, I don't know the answer to that
> question).
>
>
> --
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[Emc-developers] Fwd: Inconsistent documentation?

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gentlemen,

Using the search "linuxcnc gcode" in a browser I see the Quick Code
Reference.

The G81 reference shows a possible P symbol.
When you click the G81 link the information there is no shown P symbol.
The latest 2.7 release doesn't allow a P symbol on the G81 line.

The G82 Quick Code Reference shows the P symbol also.
The G82 link shows the P symbol also.
The latest 2.7 release allows the use of the P symbol.

The G85 has the same inconsistency as the G81 and the same result on the
control.

The G86 works like the G82.

thanks
Stuart

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Re: [Emc-developers] git

[Stuart Stevenson]

Thanks for the replies. I had already blown it away and cloned it again. I
am back where I was before trying to fix it with git. :)

I will try to 'fix' it again in the next couple days.

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[Emc-developers] git

[Stuart Stevenson]

I get this message when running 'git pull' in my 2.7 directory.

this doesn't make sense to me so what is it saying?

enshu@enshu:~/linuxcnc2.7-dev/src$ git status
# On branch 2.7-ilowpass-fix
# Your branch is ahead of 'origin/2.7-ilowpass-fix' by 7 commits.
#
# Untracked files:
#   (use "git add ..." to include in what will be committed)
#
#../configs/by_machine/enshu_touchy/
#../debian/linuxcnc-uspace-rtai.files
#../debian/linuxcnc-uspace-xenomai.files
#../docs/man/man1/thermistor.1
#../lib/python/pyui/
#../scripts/halcmd_twopass
#config.h.in~
#emc/usr_intf/touchy/touchy_new.py
#emc/usr_intf/touchy/touchy_orig.py
#hal/components/enshutoolchange.comp
#hal/components/estop_latch2.comp
#hal/components/gear2.comp
nothing added to commit but untracked files present (use "git add" to track)




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Re: [Emc-developers] jog wheel problem

[Stuart Stevenson]

Gentlemen,
 Having the problem on 4 mpg's (three single and on diff) I am relatively
sure the problem isn't hardware.

Halshow (watch) shows the encoder counts accurate and ilowpass counts are
incorrect I suspect ilowpass.
ilowpass is so simple it is almost impossible to see how it could be
incorrect also it has run correctly on the same machine for years without
problems.

I blame the change that was made and that is the new operating system and
the new LinuxCNC version.

The hal file shows everything running on the servo thread. It is the same
hal file as before.

I moved the ilowpass down the list to right in front of the write statement.

I have the same result.

The initial direction loses a count.

ppmc encoder count moves 4 each detent.
ilowpass moves 3 for the first move and 4 thereafter
motion reversal resyncs the counts until zero is reached
reversing again loses a count again as long as zero has not been passed

results as follows

start machine
  encoder count = 0
  ilowpass in = 0
  ilowpass out = 0

move positive one click
  encoder count = 4
  ilowpass in = 4
  ilowpass out = 3

this relationship is maintained while moving in the same direction for as
far as I moved

upon motion reversal encoder count, ilowpass in, and ilowpass out are the
same until I pass 0

  the next click past 0 the count then becomes
  encoder count = -4
  ilowpass in = -4
  ilowpass out = -3

and it maintains this relationship until motion reversal
  upon motion reversal the counts are the same again until I go past
zero.

The same but opposite behavior depending on counts being positive or
negative.

all comments/suggestions welcome

thanks
Stuart

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