[WISPA] computer service business
I know many of you are involved in computer repair/service in addition to your WISP efforts. Does anyone have any information they are willing to share regarding buying/selling a computer repair/service business. I'm looking at getting back into that business as well as doing the WISP thing. I'm looking for first hand information of people involved in buying/selling such companies regarding valuation methods, negotiated prices, etc... If you don't want to share on list, I'd be glad to correspond via my non-list email jp at midcoast dot net or I can call you if you write to my mentioned non-list address. I will be a very confidential listener and not share anything on the Internet. If you have useful first hand data to share within the next day, I'll provide a $50 amazon gift certificate to you for your assistance. -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Free Press Floods the FCC With Net Neutrality Petitions
On Thu, Dec 16, 2010 at 11:56:11AM -0800, Charles N Wyble wrote: Let's get some data around this. How many WISPS here have tried to peer? With whom? On what terms? I know Akamai has traffic commits. Do the other players? Let's start some open dialog and as an industry leverage our collective bargaining power to peer. Generic hand waving and saying big boys won't let us in the sandbox doesn't work for me as an operator. I like specifics. I've peered in the past with an ISP because we both were part of a statewide frame relay network and it was just the cost of a PVC to do it. The current impediments to small ISPs peering are: 1. BGP skills and hardware. It used to be the only reliable thing for BGP was a big cisco decked out with overpriced ram. Now anyone can do BGP private peering with a PC running MT/vyatta/linux or an MT routerboard, or their cisco or their juniper. Still, few have BGP experience to do this comfortably. You can get the talent in socal, but it's not nationwide. People could hire Butch or someone on guru.com to setup bgp, but they like to have the self sufficiency to DIY in many cases. I've probably met face to face all the people in my state who are proven BGP skillful and it's not a lot. 2. very high speed links between ISPs. Chances are ISPs with somewhat overlapping service areas don't have core network speeds all the way to each other's edge, and a peering connection would then be slower than just using your uplink. Getting these super high speed and reliable connections between WISPs is doable, but not cheap in all situations. If you were in the same city, yes, it could be very cost efficient. Arra middle-mile projects, friendly clecs, or cheap backhaul radios could change this. For example, Maine will have a 3-ring-binder fiber network where most of the ISPs or their upstream will connect to it. They will then be able to connect to each other with extreme speeds exceeding their uplinks. 3. decreasing uplink costs. Used to be you'd do anything to save a precious megabit and peering was one such thing. I had a satellite receiver system for receive usenet to offload the bandwidth back in 97ish. Now it's just outsourced. We used to cache a lot more web traffic too. Now it's helpful but not so important. If there were an occasional megabit of traffic going to another local ISP, I wouldn't really consider it worth the effort of peering. I would suspect most of the traffic between WISPs is email and a little random p2p, and perhaps some vpn activity between employees and businesses that use different service providers. The peers despite the extreme minimalist financial investment should be more reliable than the uplink to make good sense as well. That's something I'm hoping to do with socalwifi.net. I want to create a WISP friendly carrier. Peer with me over a private AS and I'll peer with all the other guys at various interconnection points. Or something like that. I'm working with some top tier networking talent here in the southland to build out the infrastructure. In short I'm building my own middle mile. Of course the socal area is full of carrier neutral interconnection points with wireless meet me rooms. Other areas of the country not so much. Dont misunderstand me, I do not mean to stereo type and I am not saying for sure that NetFlix or any content provider aren't willing to peer or talk about fair terms. I'm just saying, who's in control of whether it will occur? Simple. The eyeball network and the content provider. Not the feds. Not the FCC. A direct 1 to 1 relationship (or an open peering fabric). -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJNCm7bAAoJEMvvG/TyLEAtf7MP/R62xrf3a1v/G+mQMCzrA3xi HvbUg7OglDal1JvqFvSrEnIxvq6gmwlrII+XABVo/dlKIGkX9tx6OA8Ni0IOftrn hp6ba5tVdN3nSmkBCKhIK7BpaABHfYDmYlVnGLP7GCweBWClODGK6v0tSUmam//d oXFRtInH7XX+fNC0OQpFPWCJE5TLDRi54Py1Usui+2uYMvyNM1FvqzIgIgJwfgBb gTKRqI+cAzCWch3AlLbdxJhNcNEj4FLo+Fqi8IqNSOB7PbH28hF6Xt7MnuNnvFN8 LmEvHfilhVX2uH908zhvmk93UaJxI1b3SlOnGvstbN/FxBHOpTxjIJhzLyEoD1eO 3muxK9pI7n+XmetTbamBrNVPMGa3S55x8dDCpZiCe2raPukhbiYGEWPRYvslK3/D 1yc2KxZI7Oj7hG88qin9hIqjWOt1I/aoAAGezv0N1Rt/y0oRpP8jubNev+clMcB0 xQzoft8oibP1M+j3J8YvTcYG8fST889MpIrzNCDpKT2NDhpv9XKYDxL+uUvSwf+n Ar10XzASgyle4Ao+z+aIru4rUk44gdGeswbyWhGleAxz7GG+ZlE0NfqA5A6nKH5e JtE2lo+HiE9xDzzOmVVGWy68xHtLYjodQZOM8e0RfolIbtbNCBWUxWBc3PyRuCjv si2j+0ooCeAvT5ZIXe0o =TldW -END PGP SIGNATURE- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /*
Re: [WISPA] Email Accounts
We do our own email too with linux and just upgraded some stuff for the same and similar issues. Old box: amd64x2 or phenom9500 with postfix/amavisdnew/clamav/spamassassin spamd/spamc. New box: phenom 1075t, postfix/clamsmtp/clamav/spamassassin spamd/spamc/usermin. A new seagate enterprise hard drive seems a lot better performing than old 120-250gig consumer seagate drives. ddr3 memory and the new processor absolutely blows the old stuff out of the water. going from 4-8 or 8-16gb ram makes a huge improvement in simultaneous mail flow. I think the new faster parts and clamsmtp instead of amavis have made a big difference. We actually run things over a couple boxes with perdition to divide the load by first letter of the customer username. Then we can migrate customers to new servers one or more letters at a time and add capacity as needed. On Wed, Dec 15, 2010 at 09:38:01AM -0600, Matt wrote: Our current email server is getting a bit over loaded. Disk I/O is getting to be an issue on it. Hosting about 2000 accounts. Likely just going to move current solution to a bigger and newer RAID array. Before I do that thought I would ask what other solutions are out there? Prefer to keep it in house and keep costs down. Current solution actually works ok just such a pain whenever it needs upgraded. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT, file recovery software
A good reason for some people to still use film. Or at least such people should print the photos they want to keep. For most people's volume, they could realistically file away their memory cards after they are full without deleting photos for less money than film if they need the instant gratification of seeing it on the LCD. My grandmother now has a digital camera but no computer because she's not computer savvy. She puts the memory card into the self-service-machine at walmart, prints her photos, and gets her memory card back to use again. I haven't asks how she cleans/deletes pix from the card as I don't like to be the family tech support resource. On Fri, Dec 03, 2010 at 08:44:08AM -0800, Marlon K. Schafer wrote: Hi All, I have a customer that decided to reload windows. They now have no family pictures left. ug I've told them to leave the computer off till I can figure out how to get the files back. My plan is to get a USB hard drive adapter and use that to pull off any pics I can find. Anyone know of a good program that'll dig through the drive and look for jpgs and such? thanks marlon -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Question about beacon lights rules on a tower
In our area, there are a good number of used towers installed. This could be a used tower that came from an area where it needed painting and lighting. Obviously lights are a lot easier to remove than paint. Many municipal towers are hand-me-down used towers from war surplus, all installed before I was born, with civil defense earmarks. It might need paint to prevent corrosion and they painted it white when it was due for it or because that was a convenient time. On Fri, Dec 03, 2010 at 05:22:38PM -0800, Forbes Mercy wrote: I have a 100 foot guyed tower on top of a hill, it was previously an FM Radio station, they moved their site, sold us the site, but continue to use this site for STL's. Since then I've added the Fire Department and a low power radio station plus my own equipment. The tower was never lighted but was red and white paint. When the FM moved off it they painted it white. Can you tell me the purpose of why they painted it and how, especially being 10 miles from an approach why we don't have to light it? Thanks, Forbes -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] UBNT AUTO Channel
Perhaps this feature is there to be tested for future 5.4 use. They've got DFS, now they are testing the auto channel selection, fcc is willing to do 5.4 certs again now, things are looking up and I hope UBNT takes advantage of it. On Wed, Nov 10, 2010 at 11:04:17PM -0500, Tom DeReggi wrote: AUTO channel Hopping should be illegal. With that said, FCC law requires it for DFS support. That is hopping off radar channel. If Auto channel selection is an ehancement that will assist using DFS more reliably, well then I say good job in adding it, one more step towards progress of FCC certifiabilty.. One day it would be nice, if UBNT can be legal at 5.3 and 5.4. DFS enabled really does need abilty to define the channels that can be included or excluded from the hopping. -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Service contracts
All the other service providers such as DSL and cable are looking to lock people into 2 year contracts as well. add to that cellular, but I don't really consider that a competitor, customers understand the similarities that there is a common need to get into a term agreement to have service. The advantage is that customers aren't hopping around playing musical chairs with service providers for a buck savings when the service providers spend a lot of money on their install. The customers can safely ignore all the misleading flyers they get from the cable company or phone company talking about introductory prices or prices without the fees added, at least till their contract period is winding down. We keep our contract 1 page. I'm sure a lawyer would laugh at it, but the idea is that neither party wants it to end up in lawyer's hands. Referencing the TOS on your website would be a good thing in saving paper. We do 2 year contracts for one price and 1 year for a slightly higher setup price. We track who we give them to, who gave it to them and when. We need that to be able to follow up as sometimes customers don't follow through or expect the service but lose the paperwork. We can email the customer a pdf, the installers have them printed out in the van for customers. We track when we receive them back too; if we receive a contract back and there is a big delay in the install, that is a problem we have to investigate and address. If the customer needs a contract for reference we give them an extra blank one, or offer to mail them a photocopy of the one they signed. On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 12:39:02PM -0500, Jeremy Rodgers wrote: !DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC -//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN html head meta http-equiv=content-type content=text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 /head body text=#00 bgcolor=#ff For years now we have required new residential customers to sign a 2 year term agreement.nbsp; For competitive reasons we are evaluating this.nbsp; One barrier for us has been the length of time it takes from contract creation to customer returning it.nbsp; With our current situation striking while the iron is hot is not possible as it could take a couple of weeks for the agreement to be returned.nbsp; It is also intimidating at 6 pages long.br br So...a couple questionsbr br -How long is your customer contract (# of pages and term)br -What does your process look likebr -Do your installers get the paperwork signedbr -What advantages are there to a term agreementbr br Our thought is to possibly reduce it down to one page and reference the Terms of Service on our website.nbsp; When the new customer calls we can schedule them right on the spot and send the paperwork with the installer.nbsp; Anything you see as a disadvantage with this?br br Any input is appreciated!br div class=moz-signature-- br bfont face=Pristina size=5Jeremy J. Rodgers/font/b br Sales Manager br OnlyInternet Broadband and Wirelessbr O: 260.827.2234 br O: 800.363.0989 br F: 260.824.9624 br br #8230;But as for me and my household, we will serve the LORD. Joshua 24:15 /div /body /html WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Full BGP on RouterOS
We use MT BGP internally on our network; not full feeds. 1400 routes on one server. Works great for that; no reliability issues in every day operation. No problems with 12 month uptimes. I have seen some minor issues in 3.30 where if you remove a peer prior to disabling first, it can jam things up in terms of stale routes, but done in the right order it's fine. Once a month crash is not acceptable reliability for our uplink. Once in 6 months is OK if it's self-correcting. I've used Cisco for about ten years for my uplink with BGP, and it has been good as long as we didn't run out of memory or have a rare hardware problem. We kept a complete working spare system in place for parts and didn't have a Smartnet contract. I had a smartnet once for a smaller router, but it was so much trouble getting it and using it for just one router, I never renewed it. We have a Juniper j2350 with aftermarket ram now replacing a Cisco 7507. It's been as/more reliable than the Cisco and is 2u instead of dorm-fridge size, gigabit ports instead of 100mbps ports. Tech support was excellent. I'll be buying a spare or bigger one for backup. I have not tried Imagestream, but don't doubt the wide variety of other's praise. As networks get bigger and thus more complex, it's essential to avoid unreliable situations, no matter what the cost savings. Say you have 60 devices and each one has a once-a-month breakage. That's 2 outages a day, enough to drive staff and customers crazy. Reduce that to twice a year outage per device and that staffer can get something done again. On Tue, Nov 02, 2010 at 10:43:43AM -0400, Faisal Imtiaz wrote: This is exactly what I am concerned with. Things breaking once in a while is not an issue.. Things breaking once every month or few weeks is not going to be acceptable from our users.. Trying to determine if this is a 'feature' or a short term 'bug'. Cisco's and Junipers, get a premium even in the used market place, but the primary reason for it is stability... Any other that can chime in with their experiences ? Many thanks in advance. Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom On 11/2/2010 10:32 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote: Our MikroTik BGP router keeps crashing about once every month or so...sometimes sooner, sometimes later. We are using full BGP tables and 4.11 currently. Regards, Chuck On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 10:23 AM, Brad Beltonb...@belwave.com wrote: We've been running BGP with MikroTik for quite some time now. It hasn't been flawless by any stretch, but ever since late v2.8 or early v2.9 we haven't had much trouble with it. We running v3.30 on two routers with two full feeds each and a third running v4.11 with two full feeds. All of these routers have a handful of downstream BGP peers that we are also delivering full tables to. So far I think v4.11 might be the best, but we don't have as much time on that version as we do with v3.30. The only reason we moved one of our routers from v3.30 to v4.11 was because we had an unusual hang with that particular router. We weren't sure if it was hardware or OS related, however moving it to v4.11 seems to have resolved the problem. (knock on wood) Bottom line is given the price of a beefy MikroTik router vs. buying an Imagestream or Cisco that is equivalent we can have hot standby spares on hand and still be thousands if not tens of thousands of dollars ahead. That coupled with building a network that isn't solely dependent on any single point of failure further reduces the crisis when a core router fails. Things break...doesn't matter if MikroTik, ImageStream, Cisco or Juniper makes it. ALL things break eventually, so plan for it! Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Faisal Imtiaz Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2010 9:11 AM To: n...@brevardwireless.com; WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Full BGP on RouterOS Hi Nick, How stable has the Mikrotik been running full BGP with the two providers ? (I read about a memory leak issues, is that why you are using 5.0rc1 ?) We have been considering getting a Mikrotik for such use. Thanks. Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom On 11/2/2010 9:21 AM, Nick Olsen wrote: We have two full tables running on mikrotik, in two different locations. Running that command /ip route print count-only where bgp-as-path=1234 Replacing the AS with 33363 (local cable company). Doesn't work on either of our routers for some reason (MT 5.0rc1 or 4.4). Our router running a core 2 2.93ghz can take two full feeds gets all the routes in about 4 seconds, And cpu load is idle about 13 seconds later. However making changes with routing filters take anywhere from 10seconds to 2 minutes depending on what its doing. Nick Olsen Network Operations
Re: [WISPA] Grid dish material
We've got some that I think are some sort of magnesium/alloy material. I haven't tried making one burn yet. Other than scrap, you can use them as extra rebar in small concrete projects. On Mon, Oct 25, 2010 at 11:58:55AM -0500, Mike Hammett wrote: A magnet has it narrowed down to aluminum or stainless steel. Being as though the material is malformed with my bare hands, it isn't stainless steel. Is there any use for these old grids other than scrap? In a MIMO world, I have no use for them. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com On 10/25/2010 9:49 AM, Mathew Howard wrote: Depends what kind, I think they are either cast aluminum or galvanized steel. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Sunday, October 24, 2010 12:51 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Grid dish material What material are the old school 2.4 GHz grid dishes made of? WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] anyone know what this is about?
http://www.networkworld.com/columnists/2010/100610antonopoulos.html covers it with reasonable skill. Basically if this happens, illegal activity will be safely secure with illegal encryption (The cat is out of the bag with regard to quality encryption), and legal activity will be of unknown security because of the backdoors. Add software developers to the list of people who should be irate. That's where the back doors will be. I predict, if it is allowed to happen, all software industry will leave the USA (except perhaps those making stuff soley for the government) for greener pastures where they can make software that people can trust. On Tue, Oct 19, 2010 at 02:43:31PM -0430, Greg Ihnen wrote: I heard about this on the Tech News Today podcast. Folks are not happy about it. It sounds like the end of encryption without back doors, without the govt having the keys. Greg On Oct 19, 2010, at 2:25 PM, MDK wrote: LOL... Seriously, I've not seen any mention of this anywhere on any of the wireless sites, nor any other news site... So, my question... Does anyone know anything about this? I'm thinking that just about every telecom/internet/isp/voip/etc engaged entity should be on high alert to head this off at the pass, so to speak. ++ Neofast, Inc, Making internet easy 541-969-8200 509-386-4589 ++ From: RickG Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2010 8:39 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] anyone know what this is about? They'll call it the obama-air bill. On Tue, Oct 19, 2010 at 11:35 AM, MDK rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/19/us/19wiretap.html?_r=1 Quote: An Obama administration task force that includes officials from the Justice and Commerce Departments, the F.B.I.and other agencies recently began working on draft legislation to strengthen and expand the Communications Assistance to Law Enforcement Act, a 1994 law that says telephone and broadband companies must design their services so that they can begin conducting surveillance of a target immediately after being presented with a court order. There is not yet agreement over the details, according to officials familiar with the deliberations, but they said the administration intends to submit a package to Congress next year. Another quote: Another proposal would create an incentive for companies to show new systems to the F.B.I. before deployment. Under the plan, an agreement with the bureau certifying that the system is acceptable would be an alternative ?safe harbor,? ensuring the firm could not be fined. I am obviously not being... anything other that correct to say People, this is serious... You can't deploy anything new until the government approves of it, or face massive liability for fines and fees? ++ Neofast, Inc, Making internet easy 541-969-8200 509-386-4589 ++ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */
Re: [WISPA] Just Released: UNLICENSED OPERATION IN THE TV BROADCAST BANDS/ADDITIONAL SPECTRUM FOR UNLICENSED DEVICES BELOW 900 MHZ AND IN THE 3 GHZ BAND
On Thu, Sep 23, 2010 at 04:04:38PM -0400, Fred Goldstein wrote: At 9/23/2010 03:43 PM, you wrote: Hmm... looks like we need to keep up the good fight: I know this is out of line with the WISPA consensus, but it seems to me that if there are more than 10 white space channels in a given area, then letting Part 101 point-to-point operations share them could be in our best interests. Backhaul for WISPs is often very expensive, so a couple of channels (for FDD) of UHF backhaul could be just the ticket. Of course these should be available to any qualified Part 101 applicant, not just a CMRS licensee. Not knocking Fred's thoughtfullness, just adding some input. I could support some minor 101 use maybe 2-3 channels, but not 7 channels and guard channels, and all the other things asked for. I have a need to shoot 20 miles over water without ducting and multipath common to 5ghz, but ptmp tvws should serve that fine. As proposed the fiber tower plan is the most wasteful idea proposed yet to solve a theoretical problem that in reality could be solved with a pair of ubnt 5ghz radios and dish antennass. I seriously question the cell carrier motives for the ptp proposal. It might be part legitimate interest in having another choice for backhaul, but I think it's equally or more a red herring diversion being that it sounds a little fishy. As for the first part, the organization leading the ptp stands to gain income if it can provide some backhaul. The carriers are behind it because it might create additional competition (leverage to bargain with backwards telecom carriers) to remote cell towers (the areas of the country that have the least competition). That's the simple economic proposal everyone can understand and like. Their argument for this makes no technical sense whatsoever. It's the least useful use of spectrum ever. They claim they want this so they can use cheap antennass. Cell carriers don't use cheap antennas. It's like seeing a hip hop mogul doing a music video riding around in a Chrysler K-car; you notice it and it makes even less sense than before. They claim they need the low frequencies to carry long distances, I think citing a 75 mile link in one FCC comment. What cell carrier goes 75 miles between towers? They are trying to expand/enhance phone coverage, not replicate ATT LongLines. If you have to exceed 20 miles in rural wooded areas your service is going to be pretty spotty to put things nicely. They then rationalized several new towers and several expensive hops to get the 75 miles. I've never seen a cell phone site that is 75 miles away from it's coverage area. They need cells or patterns of coverage, not pin a tack on a map of the woods of maine/berkshires/kentucky/wherever and build coverage there. Coverage expansion tens to involve networks of sites, new retailers, not just a pair of $50 UHF antennas, some cheap radios, and a spool of rg6. That's something a wisp or ham would do. Furthermore, being that it's on a cell tower, it will have line of sight to somewhere. Cell tower zoning regulations usually require towers to support multiple carriers (to prevent unncesary blight from tower proliferation) and the towers will be higher than needed. Can't get much better choice for backhaul towers than a cell tower these days. Many inexpensive options exist on the market today for cheap LOS backhaul as WISPs know. I think they are trying to prevent a massive glut of spectrum being used on affordable and effective equipment from competing with their services on the spectrum they paid dearly for. It has the potential to work better for ptmp than what they have in rural areas and for building penetration. They want to temper the potential for a wifi revolution is in a band that somewhat more advantageous that what they use. If they can prevent a third of it from being used for ptmp, they could sit on it and use it for a few minor backhaul needs for a few years. One of them will buy fibertower cheap because it's backhauls were receiving skip and it's $50 antennas were falling apart. Another will buy the company that bought fibertower. They will lobby and contribute to politicians for a couple years. Then they will ask to convert this underused but vital ptp spectrum their almost forgotten subsidiary has into a more useful exclusively licensed ptmp network worth gazillions of dollars. People of both parties will be sympathetics to the usefulness and timeliness of the idea (because tvws internet will already be common) and some sort of promise for network services to public safety or people's welfare will seal the deal from political division. The wireless mic new rules are very generously fair to everyone involved. 2 channels won't take a huge chunk out of the unlicensed and it's all low power stuff. I'd have thought one channel would be enough; you can fit a lot of audio into 6mhz, but I suppose
Re: [WISPA] WISPA Classified Ads
Awesome; I thought it was just missing or broken before. On Fri, Sep 17, 2010 at 03:27:18PM -0400, Rick Harnish wrote: Thanks to Justin Wilson who helped format the WISPA Classified Ads page http://www.wispa.org/?page_id=2297 so that the content is now at the top. Respectfully, Rick Harnish Executive Director WISPA 260-307-4000 cell 866-317-2851 WISPA Office Skype: rick.harnish. rharn...@wispa.org WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Tower Climb video
Perhaps the guy is actually self employed. Still, I'd rather he used more safety. Apparently the video was pulled because he was afraid he'd get fewer future jobs from showing a lack of safety. On Fri, Sep 17, 2010 at 10:12:33AM -0400, Robert West wrote: So where in the OSHA regs does it say that free climbing is okay because it takes too much time to move safety lines every few feet? I'm looking.. Don't see it... From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Chuck Hogg Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:03 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Tower Climb video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQv-o5Kgbko Regards, Chuck On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 8:47 AM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.net wrote: If you Google for Stairway to heaven Tower you should be able to find it. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com On 9/15/2010 6:54 PM, Bob Moldashel wrote: Better yet... Notice how its been removed from Youtube due to copyright issues. Yeah right... Randy Cosby wrote: Notice how they blur the faces? Respect for the dead. RIP. Randy On 9/15/2010 9:37 AM, Jerry Richardson wrote: Makes my palms sweat just watching it WTF isn't he tied off? What an idiot - Jerry *From:* wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] *On Behalf Of *Justin Wilson *Sent:* Wednesday, September 15, 2010 8:28 AM *To:* WISPA General List *Subject:* [WISPA] Tower Climb video Mikrotik posted this on their Facebook post. I don't see the guy clipping off or a safety climb so don't do as he does (unless I missed the safety portion). _http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txdv_oNq81I _ -- Justin Wilsonj...@mtin.net http://www.mtin.net/blog - xISP News http://www.twitter.com/j2sw - Follow me on Twitter Wisp Consulting - Tower Climbing - Network Support WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Randy Cosby| InfoWest, Inc | www.infowest.com Vice President | 435-674-0165 x 2010 | facebook.com/infowest WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Looking for Layer 3 Switch with BGP?
On Wed, Sep 08, 2010 at 07:40:07PM -0400, Faisal Imtiaz wrote: Welcome to the Mid-range of traffic handling... There is nothing on the market place that is affordable that will do what you are looking for. Best thing you can do is deploy two devices.. a Gig Switch, pick your favorite vendor... and a Core Router for BGP Yep. I'd do either some sort of combination of multihop bgp or VLANs to the customers needing bgp routing. VLANs really are quite simple at least on procurve switches and mikrotiks and junipers. VLANs reduce broadcast traffic on bridged networks so long as the vlans don't extend to places they are not needed. We have every sited routed with mikrotiks using private ASNs and BGP, but we also have procurve switches on most sites' backhauls, so we do extend a vlan across multiple sites if we want for a particular purpose, and everything else at the sites is routed. We have stayed away from using switches for L3 because of routing limitations and for CALEA; I think it's easier to capture traffic on a router than off a switch port, because if your switch has traffic duplication you'd still need a router to route the traffic back to the collection point. For Core Router in the Cisco world you are looking at something with a G1 or G2 engine ... (7206vxr or small 7301) range $5k to 10K on the used market place. In Juniper Land... M10i or an M20 (if you like redundancy...) cost on the secondary markets about $8 to $10k We're using a Juniper J2350 with upgraded non-juniper RAM for 2 full BGP and presently 150+mbps of Internet. Comes with 4 1gbps ethernet ports. It was in the $2500 range iirc. There are switching features in it, but I haven't tried them. I bought it to do BGP. We can do a real nice MT for 1/3 that, but Mikrotik's BGP is not as well documented as Cisco/Juniper and we were willing to pay for software that was a little more mature/tested. We use MT BGP internally all the time, but that's a much smaller BGP network than the Internet of course. The j2350 will probably go to 300mbps perfectly fine and we'll upgrade again. There are a couple J series models that go higher performance than this and will be a lot cheaper than a M series chassis router. If you want up to date software and initial tech support, buying new is the way to go unfortunately. Unlike Cisco, you do get a reasonable period of tech support and software updates without buying a separate service contract. The BGP on this has been flawless. Juniper has a tool on their site to convert cisco configs to configs for their OS which was quite accurate. We upgraded from a Cisco 7507/rsp4 router which was running out of ram and steam and sucking too much power. You could use a Mikrotik Power Router.. cost $ 2500 to $5000 Only the Cisco 7301 and Mikrotik are small and consume little power... Everything else is big and consumes power. Most common, cost efficient network design would be to use GigE Switches in a ring or your favorite network topology, with one or two Routers located at DataCenters or NOC... If you find some other solution, that can do what you are looking for, please share it with us, cause we have been looking too... what I am sharing above with you is what we have found so far. Regards. Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom On 9/8/2010 7:16 PM, Jon Auer wrote: Needing full BGP routes takes you out of the realm of cheap Layer 3 switches... You need to worry about TCAM (hardware route memory) in addition to RAM on Layer 3 switches and apart from decked out Cisco 6500s or greater you aren't going to find that. The Juniper MX80 should work. It is 2U and can have 48 GigE ports. You should be able to get it for $30-50K. Alternatively you could try a multihop BGP setup like Cogent has been known to do. Setup one BGP session between the customer and your Layer 3 switch at the tower. This carriers a route for your border router/route reflector to the customer and vice versa. Then setup a BGP session between the customer and your border router/route reflector. Or you could drag MPLS into it but 2 simple BGP sessions seems like the most straightforward solution to me. On Wed, Sep 8, 2010 at 4:31 PM, Matt Jenkinsm...@smarterbroadband.net wrote: I am trying to find a Layer 3 switch that has 24 or 48 1000 base-T ports with enough RAM to handle Full BGP Internet Routes. Anyone have any suggestions? For those who wonder why I am upgrading all of my backhauls to support ~300mbps. In addition I need to be able to offer BGP connections to customers from this ring of backhauls. - Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
Re: [WISPA] Slightly OT - Mapping
You'd be surprised what Google Earth can do. There are lots of websites and utilities for converting user information into kmz files for googleearth. Anything that can save to an image file (Jpeg, tif, png, etc..) or a PDF can be printed out with someone's large printer, so the software doesn't have to support a particular printing system. On Wed, Sep 08, 2010 at 05:36:43PM -0400, Bob Moldashel wrote: Can anyone recommend a program or a resource that I can get high resolution maps from. I have multiple project going where I need to map out say a county or a town and have streets as well as specific information user added to the map. Then I need to output it to a plotter or Kinkos so we can make working material out of them. Does not need to be color but color would be nice. I have to be able to print 24 x 36 Tnx -B- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Bandwidth Providers
On Thu, Sep 02, 2010 at 10:52:38AM -0400, Justin Wilson wrote: Most telcos figure 8 months or so is the time to start re-negotiating so I am surprised they did not want to start talking to you. We always start making inquiries around that time to see if we can get better pricing. This is because it can take 6 months to put in facilities, so 8 months is reasonable planning. You should keep this schedule in mind too when shopping for a potential replacement. If you think you are going to be switching, you could have ATT and perhaps Comcast or someone while doing the ARIN/BGP setup, then drop ATT after setting up BGP. It would satisfy the application requirements and the renumbering would make it easier for you to drop ATT. Talk to your sales guy toward the end of the month when he's probably trying to get some extra business. The obviously don't want to trade a current connection for something cheaper, but perhaps if you mentioned you want more bandwidth for the same money, or triple the bandwidth for a little bit more money, the idea of them getting the same or more money is appealing. With ATT there is also likely a period for you to cancel the contract. Like they need 60-90 days notice or it self renews or other stupid things. Be aware of that. Comcast fiber is not that bad to work with. They will do BGP feeds and the like. Have you contacted Zayo to see if they are doing anything in your area? They have some stimulus money and have some projects on the books in Indiana. Another thing to consider is where your ATT circuit is homed out of. If it is at a carrier hotel you could simply use them for transport until you can get another physical connection. This would allow you to become multi-homed and get your AS# and work toward IP space. I am sure this would keep you busy re-numbering. Maybe in the meantime a circuit opportunity would open up. Justin -- Justin Wilson j...@mtin.net http://www.mtin.net/blog xISP News http://www.twitter.com/j2sw Follow me on Twitter Wisp Consulting Tower Climbing Network Support From: Eric Rogers ecrog...@precisionds.com Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 1 Sep 2010 15:41:50 -0400 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Bandwidth Providers I am looking for multiple connections to the internet. We currently have ATT Fiber and IPs. We want to look at redundancy in terms of becoming a BGP peer, and purchasing our own IP addresses. The ONLY other provider in our area is Comcast. Has anyone worked with them to do any BGP peering? What really rocked my boat was that I am seeing new ISPs signing up with ATT Opt-E-Man with 100 MB circuits for $2600/mo. That is less than what I am paying for my 50 MB circuit. I called my sales rep and they stated that I could get a 100 MB circuit for $4200/mo and because I am under contract for another year, there is nothing they can do for price...so pretty much they are saying to me that they want new customers, and anyone under contract they can gouge as long as I am under contract... When can we get rid of these monopolies?!?!? Eric Rogers Precision Data Solutions, LLC (317) 831-3000 x200 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Ethernet to Fiber Adapters
Get a 24-12 or 24-5 volt dc-dc converter on ebay for it. http://stores.ebay.com/fiberopticforallwarehouse also has chassis' that work on 24v, though the individual converters probably use 12v. On Fri, Aug 20, 2010 at 12:27:00PM -0400, Scott Reed wrote: I have a tower that it looks like the only option is to run fiber to the RB433 as there is an FM repeater station just below us. All my RBs are running at 24VDC. What Ethernet to Fiber adapters are folks using that run on 24VDC? -- Scott Reed Sr. Systems Engineer GAB Midwest 1-800-363-1544 x2241 1-260-827-2241 Cell: 260-273-7239 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Single radio or multiple radios in the same box?
That UBTik looks pretty cool. Mikrotik rocks for a lot of things, but I don't trust their .N yet. For N I'll stick with Ubnt till I'm overwhelmed with reports of Mikrotik N greatness. On Wed, Aug 18, 2010 at 09:47:22AM -0400, Eric Rogers wrote: Why not use N radios? If you don't like UBNT Rockets, then look at Mikrotik 411s with Baltic Networks' Ubitik device. You can buy the UBNT dual-polarity dishes, but use Mikrotiks on them. Eric Rogers Precision Data Solutions, LLC (317) 831-3000 x200 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jeremie Chism Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 7:48 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Single radio or multiple radios in the same box? There was a discussion here not to long ago about interference with using two radios in one rb. As I recall there is interference but someone had a solution. I am sure someone will chime in or you could check the archive. Sent from my iPhone On Aug 18, 2010, at 6:42 AM, Paolo Di Francesco paolo.difrance...@teleinform.com wrote: Hi all, in our point-to-point links, we have always used one single radio per routerboard and that worked nicely. Obviously using 2 radios in the same RB (e.g. RB433) is not a bad idea, the cost is lower, but I was wondering if this can lead to some interference considering that the radios could be working on adjacent channels. that's why I would appreciate any suggestion about multiple radios on the same routerboard. Thank you in advance -- Ing. Paolo Di Francesco Teleinform s.r.l. Sede Legale: Via Francesco Paolo Di Blasi 1, 90144 Palermo Unita' Operativa: Via Regione Siciliana 49, 90046 Monreale (Palermo) Tel: +39-091-6408576, +39-091-6404501 Fax: +39-091-6406200 http://www.wikitel.it http://www.teleinform.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Electrical Question.......
I put 3 phase into my datacenter because I have a three phase generator and I knew eventually my load would be too big for a 1-phase generator and potentially too big for a 1-phase service. I know of no reason why it would handle lightning any differently. It has a neutral/ground just like single phase. If you lose one phase and have nothing to detect that, bad things can happen. Same with single phase; we had a storm knock out the neutral wire at one of sites a few weeks ago. Water tower pumps on the same line made our voltage go between 70 and 250v at the 120v outlet. At our datacenter, the generator autotransfer swtich will switch to generator if we lose one of the three phases. You can get a whole-building lighting/surge supressor to go in your main panel too. If you have a tower, connect it's ground system to your service grounding system too. We're using about 15kw average/peak right now. It's pretty steady and only changes with the AC compressors going on/off. Learn your utility rules for demand and pricing. I just hooked up some hair dryers and ran them for 40 minutes to get us into the 20+kw peak category (medium business); higher monthly minimum but much cheaper per kwh rate. As for your retail, you can use a single phase panel on a three phase service, just realize you can't get 240v out of it. Your 120v circuits will be 120 degrees out of phase with each other instead of 180 degrees out of phase like on single phase. On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 11:31:41PM -0400, Robert West wrote: Putting together a new NOC. The new NOC is in an older warehouse and we ripped out ALL the crazy wiring and the multiple electrical panels. Total gut job. Installed a single phase electrical panel for the retail and service area in the front but we have three phase coming into the building. Electrician uncle Dude, 80+ years, tells me that three phase protects against power surges since it adds another transformer. My question is, would installing a three phase panel for the NOC be a proactive thing? Advantageous against the great lightning and idiotic power company Godz? (GODZ Rock And Roll Machine) Old location was all three phase and we never had one lick of trouble Not one. Would this be the reason or would it be just a stroke of luck, one that didn't involve the lottery.. Figures. Bob- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Content Filtering
Set setup a linux box with squid and dansguardian on it. Customers can use it at no cost by changing their proxy settings. Very reliable, almost no support required compared to installable software. Just another reason for some customers to keep service with us. On Wed, Aug 11, 2010 at 01:07:44PM +0200, Luis Abenza Sánchez wrote: Hi all, We want to add content filtering service to our WISP, especially for kids control. We are thinking about CensorNet Pro. Are you selling this service? Which software/hardware are you using? Thanks, Luis WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] POE / Ethernet extenders
If your fiber does not have a metal armor/messenger in it, you can run it with the 120v. You might consult an electrician, but I'd probably run the single mode fiber and 3 conductors of thwn electrical wire into a bundle, terminate the fiber for the top end, hoist it up, chop the bottom of the bundle, and slide plastic conduit up the tower with the wire in place, 100' at a time. Fasten the conduit to the tower at appropriate intervals. Have an electrical box every 100' with something to take the strain off the wire. Tried it once with 300' of wire/fiber/liquitight all at once, and it was more weight than we were prepared to handle. The wire slipped irretrievably back into the liquitight, we dropped some of the liquitight and it damaged itself from the stretching. We ended up with a big scrap pile of the stuff for small jobs. Now, we just use POE, but that wasn't an option ten or more years ago. We don't use any towers so high we can't do POE. The concept of 120v on a tower isn't unusual. Most of the lighting systems are probably 120/240. On Sat, Aug 07, 2010 at 11:23:01PM -0400, RickG wrote: Nice! I ran fiber up the commercial tower I was on in Florida but it had 120 volts at the 330' mark where my equipment was. Too bad there isnt POE for fiber. LOL, I guess you could run low voltage wire along the fiber and power the converters radios the old fashioned way? On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 10:50 PM, Philip Dorr wirel...@judgementgaming.comwrote: The fiber on one tower is Chromatic technologies, Inc. Optical Fiber Cable 700 series shielded cable, but usually it is just normal fiber that is inside conduit. The media converters are whatever we can buy and still cheap (TP-Link,TRENDnet,etc). We put our own ends on the cable to fit whatever modules we buy (used to be SC, but now mainly ST). We use a Lightcrimp Pluss kit to put the ends on the fiber. On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 9:34 PM, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com wrote: What type of fiber and media converters are you using? On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 4:55 PM, Philip Dorr wirel...@judgementgaming.com wrote: We would use fiber+120VAC On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 3:32 PM, Jason Hensley ja...@jaggartech.com wrote: Anyone used one on a tower to go beyond 100meters? I need to get higher than that on a tower and looking for solid recommendations. Thanks! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List:
Re: [WISPA] DOS attack
If you use squirrelmail, add the restric_senders plugin. Stops the spammers quick by setting normal reasonable limits to the numbers of recipients per time period. They'll go elsewhere. On Mon, Aug 02, 2010 at 10:56:39PM -0700, Gary Garrett wrote: Lately I have had some Pfishers get passwords to users E-mail and start sending out from their Webmail accounts. I have taken to blocking the entire /8 . about 16 million addresses each. Really cuts down on the incoming spam also. No complaints yet. Well, I believe in this case it was all Asia IP space, Mostly from the same hand full of subnets. So they dropped the associated /24's WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] emerg. switch to NS2,5 for AP?
Replace the Nanos with rocket/airmax sectors ASAP, or put mikrotiks back. You lose MASSIVE signal by using pigtails with the NS gear, thus the invention of the Bullets. I have used high quality 23dbi flatpanels with a NS5 once and it only got 1db better than the internal antenna; all due to the pigtail path through the nanostation. On Tue, Aug 03, 2010 at 07:44:39AM -0700, rabbtux rabbtux wrote: hi all, one of our largest service points took a hit saturday night. I had to come up with a bunch of replacement equipment fast. The solution involved adding more cables up the tower, and running the mikrotik router from the ground. Each of the 3 primary antenna are now driven by nanostation 2 or 5 using a short pigtail. This was a busy site with 2 - 2.4 Ghz sectors(25+ each) and a busy 5.8Ghz sector(15+. I realize there are tradeoffs using Airos on an AP radio. All cpes are not yet working. I have a few questions. Is there a limit for how many associations a nanostation will accept?? Any suggestions or advice is greatly appreciated in this situation! Thanks, Marshall rabbitmeadows.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] tree heights
Wonder if this is potentially useful/accurate enough for our industry: http://www.cnn.com/2010/TECH/innovation/07/21/nasa.tree.map/index.html -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Generators
If you go propane/NG upsize quite a bit to have smooth power. Diesel's torque makes for smoother power output undering changing loads. Diesel can run full rated load of datacenter load. I went diesel (Cummins/Onan) for my datacenter. I put the generator inside to prevent winter fuel gelling, rodents, rust, etc... It's on a 275 gallon heating oil tank. Looks almost like new still after 10 years. There's a whole set of design requirements for having a generator inside, in terms of fire safety, fresh air flow for combusition and cooling, etc..., that's why most are outside. I was building from scratch, so I put it where I wanted it. Had a boatbuilder put a custom stainless steel exhaust on it coming out the side of the building. Get something that matches the voltage and phase your utility provides. Don't get a 1 phase for your 3phase service. Get an appropriate high quality auto transfter switch that can switch your whole datacenter over, not just select circuits. The transfer switch should also be able to exercize the generator on a schedule. Check the hour meter and fluids once in a while so you know it's exercizing properly and ready for use. On Thu, Jul 29, 2010 at 03:02:28PM -0400, Chuck Hogg wrote: Ok, so I am in the market for a Generator. Looking for probably 30-45kW. I've heard people say I need a PMG Exciter?? Anyone with experience in doing this? It's to support our datacenter, a few racks, a few 2200 UPS's and PDU's, and Cooling. I find all kinds of different ones on eBay and elsewhere, and am hoping someone already did the legwork and figured out everything they needed and can share? Regards, Chuck Hogg Shelby Broadband 502-722-9292 ch...@shelbybb.com mailto:ch...@shelbybb.com http://www.shelbybb.com http://www.shelbybb.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Overheating UPS?
I've had the 2u rackmount APCs eventually get hot and overcharge the battery. They'd be quite warm with little or no load, and the batteries would bulge. This is in 72f datacenter. They last much shorter in 95 degree heat in my opinion. When it happens, we pull them out of service and use a tripplite APS. For small cheap UPSs we get a APC backups or tripplite or whatever is onsale at staples. On Wed, Jul 28, 2010 at 12:29:26AM -0600, Matt Larsen - Lists wrote: It is getting ready to fail.I have had two APCs that got hot and failed soon after.One made for an awful stink in the NOC when it finally went. I thought the building was on fire. Matt Larsen vistabeam.com On 7/27/2010 7:39 PM, Forbes Mercy wrote: One of my UPS's at a house/tower was chirping, I sent a technician to pull the unit in for testing. It was so hot that they had to wrap it in towels to move it, it wasn't chirping when he got there. It has a minimum load of about 3-4 amps for a couple Mikrotik and Motorola radios on it with a switch and remote reboot unit. The UPS was in an attic of the house and it is averaging about 95 degrees (we don't have humidity here) outside so I figure over 100 in the attic. I'll let it cool down overnight in the office but my guess is the chirping was a high temp warning, any ideas? SmartAPC Model SUA 750 - about a year old. Forbes WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Lightening protection
Make sure the tower is grounded to the electrical system ground as well. Sort of like every house is grounded with a lightning rod, but uses the electrical system ground also. On Tue, Jul 27, 2010 at 09:18:04AM -0600, Mark Dueck wrote: I've been wanting to ask this question for a few days. We got hit on one of our NOCs with about 6 radios on the tower. Every single radio was fried. Our problem I think is that it's a limestone (caliche or white marl) hill. How well can you ground in a situation like that? Or does it not matter? We had all our POE's properly grounded, but did not run separate ground from the radios as they were all Tranzeo with metal back plate, metal mount, mounted directly on the legs of the tower. The tower has a grounding rod at the bottom, but it goes directly into the limestone. Any suggestions? On 07/27/2010 08:29 AM, Kurt Fankhauser wrote: I had a problem customer than was always getting CPE Ethernet knocked out. Switched to shielded CAT5 with a pac wireless POE adapter that grounds the jacket through the 3rd prong ground of the house plug and problem went away. Also it helps if the pole the the CPE is mounted to is grounded as well. If its on a roof you may have to run a ground wire to the pole to dissipate static. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jeremie Chism Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 9:54 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Lightening protection I had two cpe's get struck by lightening yesterday that took out the cpe, the router behind it and the voip adapter behind that. Along with a few Ethernet cards also. What are you using on the customers end to try to stop this. The cpe is powered by poe. Sent from my iPhone WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Pole-mounted base stations
I would check with the electric utility to see if they will do poles and for how much, sometimes it's reasonable. Local electricians will know who the inexpensive pole subcontractors are, as electricians often need poles installed in the course of installing their part of new electrical services. You might even want the electricians to handle the pole installs, any conduit runs (for power to the poles if power is nearby). I would not assume there are electrical outlets everywhere you want them and it's not all low voltage wiring, so some relationship with an electrician may be necessary. I had one experience with a windmill and it wasn't good. It was an older air-x 400. I'm sure newer ones are better, but mine vibrated the tower quite bit, and seized up after a couple months. Solar can work very well if you don't skimp on panel and battery. Most of them attempts you read about are people trying it out, skimping on both battery and panel capacity and they are setting them self up for early trouble. On the other hand, big companies speccing out solar systems will massively overbuild to protect their reputation and sell more stuff. New gear like UBNT and mikrotik uses very little electrical power, making solar more practical than ever. For the wisp stuff, you'll want to either find a qualified local WISP company with long term maintenance in mind. Ocassionally, surges and power issues will break things or cause things to need a power cycle. Lacking that, a computer service shop that is good at networking might be able to maintain it, but I wouldn't suggest a computer service shop for the setup. On Mon, Jul 19, 2010 at 06:08:35PM -0400, Fred Goldstein wrote: At 7/19/2010 05:53 PM, you wrote: Fred: I have some poles on my network. They are hard to climb and service would be the only caveats I'd share. Consider windmills. The ones they sell to keep ponds aerated are aesthetically pleasing and not too expensive. You're right; we'll probably need a bucket truck to do poles, both to install and service. Are you talking about using wind for power too? There are few or no local windmills otherwise. Some of the best relay sites may be off the grid so a wind charger could be practical. Solar might work but lake-effect snow could be a problem. Lake-effect wind, on the other hand, would be helpful. Friendly Regards, Mike Mike Gilchrist Disruptive Technologist Advanced Wireless Express P.O. Box 255 Toledo, IA 52342 239.770.6203 m...@aweiowa.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Fred R. Goldstein Sent: Monday, July 19, 2010 3:24 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Pole-mounted base stations A design I'm working on is in a hilly wooded rural/resort area, not farmland. It will need a fair number (perhaps a few dozen) sites to cover the planned turf. Each node will need both backhaul (mesh, in the loose sense) and access antennas. The obvious place to put these is atop utility poles. I think the local electric cooperative will cooperate and let us rent pole space. We may however need to put additional poles in some places. They seem cheaper than metal towers and are less likely to raise the locals' eyebrows. Does anyone out there have experience with this sort of arrangement? We're in the budgeting stage now. I have an idea what the radios cost but the installation might be the bigger deal. The big engineering firms are more used to fancy cellular and fiber installs, not WISP-style radios. So we may also want to bring in someone with this kind of WISP experience to do some consulting or setup with us too. Thanks. -- Fred Goldsteink1io fgoldstein at ionary.com ionary Consulting http://www.ionary.com/ +1 617 795 2701 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Fred Goldsteink1io fgoldstein at ionary.com ionary Consulting http://www.ionary.com/ +1 617 795 2701 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/
[WISPA] interference from ships
We've got a 700' drilling ship moored about a mile off our coast for a few days for repairs. http://www.stena-drilling.com/sub.asp?m=drillingp=stenaforth Since it came in, 900mhz within a couple miles of it has stopped working. We went out with the spectrum analyser after the Alvarion software spectrum analyzer went off the charts. The HP spectrum analyzer with a 9dbi yagi was picking up big fat gaussian shaped signals at -20 to -25dbm about 10-15mhz wide in the middle. I sent my guys to a second location with the spectrum analyzer just to make sure they weren't seeing local interfernce and they saw the same thing. A legal amount of power output would cause it to come in at about -50. Anyone else seen such strange stuff coming from this type of ship? I've never seen any trouble from any ship ever, though this is the first drilling ship to visit our area. -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] How the FCC Proposes the Regulate Broadband
On Fri, May 28, 2010 at 01:39:06PM -0600, Matt Larsen - Lists wrote: Tom, Thank you for asking your questions - I have some awesome answers for you. 1) Alaska. Alaska does indeed have an infrastructure problem. Alaska also receives an enormous amount of federal support already along with substantial revenues from their natural resources, mainly oil and gas. These Americans would not be left out in the cold - communication wise - if they took some of their massive piles of money and built out their infrastructure. Right now, the Alaska Permanent Fund - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_Permanent_Fund - has 28 Billion dollars in it, and is primarily used to pay an annual dividend to Alaska residents. I'm pretty sure that money would go to better use if Alaska used that to pay for their communications infrastructure needs instead of expecting the residents of the lower-48 to pay for it. More simply, if they can run a massive oil pipeline (alyeska) the length of the state in 2 years across all sorts of weather environments, they can certainly run a fiber cable everywhere 30+ years later. If they can't do it by land due to frost, copy the poor african countries and tropical islands that link their towns by fiber in the sea. 2) Rural Telco Failure. I have a really hard time believing that a rural telco could fail, but I guess it could happen. In that scenario, I would suggest that the government set up some kind of a trustee operation that maintained the operation of the telco until a buyer could be found. I live in a very rural area, and the majority of the rural ILECs here are swimming in money from USF, and have very successful unregulated subsidiaries that operate outside of the normal regulatory environment. With all of the recent advances in voice switching and remote broadband deployment, the residents of a community with a failling telco would be better off in the long run if the telco was allowed to fail and someone else was able to come in and rebuild with more modern equipment. This is a little tricky, but could be addressed in a more efficient manner than what we are seeing now. Theoretically, regulators who are supposed to be looking out for the citizens are supposed to be watching the telcos so failure can be warded off and things can work flawlessly because of their regulatory oversight. I have just argued that they are all based around expensive local switches which is how they get the USF. If they are not profitable, it's either because they are growing (such as investing in dsl to enhance their monopoly), or they are limiting profits in order to avoid taxation or rate regulation changes. (Look how long they've managed to milk reciprocal compensation in the LD business) In Maine, we had fairpoint (indy ILEC) buy out the assets of Verizon (Bell). Fairpoint's indy operations remained a separate business with separate rates. The what's the bell company named this week organzation went bankrupt. Surely the independents operations were kept separate because they knew that was a better business than buying the bell company. Incidently, the bankrupted company continues to provider service, so there is precedent that a bankrupted telco doesn't have to be a service risk to the customers. 3) Mobile Phone Coverage. There is a really simple answer to this one. There are buildout requirements in cellular licenses that the federal government grants to mobile carriers. They have been effectively lobbbying to get USF money to build out and meet those requirements. Even so, rural cellular coverage is awful. USF has been the carrot to incentivize rural wireless buildouts - now it is time to try the stick. Rural carriers that don't build out, or only build out the areas with with Interstates and highways (for roaming traffic) without building out to the sparsely populated rural locations lose their licenses. This will lower the value of the licenses in rural areas to the point where smaller competitors could feasibly buy licenses and compete. It would also substantially reduce the amount of spectrum warehousing that goes on in rural areas. No need to throw money at this problem, just enforce the existing laws and modify the requirements so that there is less redlining of the more profitable portions of their license area. I'm in a rural area where there are legitimate needs for more cellular coverage. Some funding with time limits could be useful. Timelimits would prevent it from being a wastefully used as they'd know it would have to self sustaining at some point. It would be an uphill battle against better cell coverage. The public safety implications of poor cell coverage are huge and heartwrenching propoganda if needed. Some disadvantged pregnant lady gets run off a less traveled road by a drunk driver and doesn't have the cell reception to call
Re: [WISPA] How the FCC Proposes the Regulate Broadband
On Fri, May 28, 2010 at 11:15:08AM -0400, Tom DeReggi wrote: I've always been pro-tax credit, based on my personal agenda. I think it incourages investment, not only helps reduce an ISP's tax burden. However, from my experience debating ARRA, I learned there can be some disadvantages of Tax Credits. The BIG disadvantage for WISPs is that it helps Large Telcos and Cable Cos and large scale VC backed companies the most. They have tons of income they'd love to have tax relief from. They also have tons of money to invest, WISPs may have less comparatively. Probaly the best way to get FIOS built out to your community, to put the local WISP out of business, is to give Verizon a healthy Tax credit to Invest there. Those companies you fear have always had more money than our ISPs. It's about customer service and adopting technology, that we survive, not by financial superiority. If the goal is to help more American get faster broadband sooner, Tax Credits is a great idea. But if the goal is to help make sure WISPs becomes a larger part of that solution, I'm not so sure it helps us. Strategically, it would benefit WISPs if we could discourage investment from large carriers. That first goal is one that would be supported and we should be able to say our goal is not contrary to that. The other thing is that Tax Credits equally rewards all spending whether it is efficent or wasteful spending. Dont we want policy that focuses rewards to those that spent more efficiently? WISP's advantage is that they have more affordable cost of deployment. One of the things I challenge today is where there is any place left on teh planet in rural America that is not cost effective to serve with wireless? With the exception of Tower costs. If line of sight can be acheived, and twoers are needed, the cost to deploy an area can skyrocket. But otherwise, even rural areas of 1 home per square mile can be afforded with Fixed Wireless. HAving a low dnsity is actually preferred. When a 2.4Ghz AP can extend 20 miles, and can only support about 20-50 homes per AP, its a perfect match for low density rural terrain. That's a lot of assumptions. http://www.f64.nu/photo/tmp/jeffersonsouth/ Here's an IR panorama from a tower we just put up last year in one of the best locations in our service area. You can see a few houses around the tower/hill site, but otherwise as far as you can see it's trees and 90%+ of customers require NLOS solutions due to trees. This was not cost effective to serve without a state grant. Not only did we need 900 instead of 2.4, we needed multiple APs and sectors with downtilt, as 900mhz interference comes in from afar when you have a tower atop a nice hill. I also have no patience for thoise that say a small rurla town can survive without being a monopoly. I live in a farm town with 300 homes, 25 acre zoning minimum, most have much more land per farm.. And here are 4 WISPs in this town, and there is enough revenue for each of us, for each of us to justify keeping up operations. What it means is that we dont put all our eggs in one town. Having 25% of the market in 4 towns, is equivellent to 100% of the market to serve one. I only need 5 customers in a town for it to be profitable to serve. (again, there are exceptions to that based on tower requirements). But the answer is just to spread out farther, so one towns infrastructure can subsidize the next's. Sometimes it means diversity, where a provider might need to offer otehr services like Compueter repir or traininf along side their Broadband opperations. But that has often been the way it is in small towns, where businesses serve more than one function for its community, than its core competency. What people really mean is that Fiber is more cost effective to deploy as a monopoly. Isn't what we really need is continued awareness building that Wireless delivers what people need, and what is needed is investment in Wireless. Like the Rolling Stones said, You cant always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you can get what you need. The other thing is that a tax credit will decrease the fed government revenue earned from larger telcos (our competitirs), which is a huge sum of money. Wouldn't it be better if that revenue was kept, and reused for broadband programs that would help smaller providers and competitive providers? Killing off USF and giving tax credits in combined would benefit wealthy urban/suburban RBOCs and Cable Cos the most. One price advantage that WISPs have today, is that we dont have to impose that 6% USF tax today on our subscribers. Its one of the hidden charges on teh telco bill, that helps reduce how much RBOCS out price us. How many WISPs advertise, no hidden charges? Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: MDK
Re: [WISPA] Becoming a Wisp
On Thu, May 27, 2010 at 08:56:53AM -0700, finkle dinkle wrote: So, I've got space in a building in So. Cal with a lot of neighbors with crappy connections. In the beginning, I wanted to bring in a gig PTP from the datacenter 12 miles away... I'm not a salesman, I think with the bandwidth I have available at the DC + the of the PTP, I could've made everyone in the building happy, at least 20 tenants if I could convince them.. doubt I could. Anyway, I have potential access to the roof, I'd have to ask. Are there any laws if I want to sell service ? Yes. You have to file a bunch of stuff to be Calea compliant. You also need to file a 477 with the FCC on a regular interval. In order to professionally install the radios we all use outdoors, you should be familar with the FCC part15 rules especially with regard to power output, interference, etc... If you get into VOIP, there are CPNI filings which are very serious not to skip. For working on a roof top, if there is a risk of falling, you may be required to have appropriately increased insurance and provide such proof to the building management. Even if you are self employed, there may be expectations on part of the building owner for you to obey OSHA safety guidelines working up there. Local codes may also require wiring and grounding to be done according to NEC, which means you should study that and/or hire an electrician for inspection/guidance. In an urban area, there is no simple answer for what works for NLOS. Depends on interference, construction materials, physics, etc... If you can't make more money than what you are doing, it's a negative effect on your present business activities. I have no idea what you can or should charge. If I want to provide service to lets just say 50 clients (not in the building but through wireless), are there devices that dont have to rely on LOS ? I'm just trying to understand if this all went along well, how many devices would I need to mount up on the roof to support 20-50 clients externally with the devices and which devices.. I'm looking to sell the bandwidth for a relatively low price, undercut wimax and not strictly looking for profit but looking to be the point guy for other tech operations for these potential clients.. Also, to the people who have good access to bandwidth or even not.. how much are you looking at from all your cost to what you actually charge (not including administrative) but lets assume your bandwidth costs are 8k/month with the point to point to the datacenter + 1000mbit commit. I know I could do better but what are we looking at here, if the total cost to get the bandwidth, less the equipment to my office building at 8 bux a meg, how much should I be selling it ? any recommendations ? I do not want to be a company like towerstream where I sell 8 megs for 800/MRC, i'm looking to charge more like 25 bux per meg... Is my model right or wrong ? WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] How the FCC Proposes the Regulate Broadband
On Thu, May 27, 2010 at 02:55:21AM -0700, MDK wrote: As long as there is money on the table - as long as any administration or agency or even Congress has the means to buy off resistance - there is no reliable massive block of resistance. As was pointed out in other emails, an alliance with small and rural CLEC's and others is going to be shaky, because if the regulators put money on the table for them, they abandon the common defense and we're on our own. Yes, I expect USF money to be used as bait in how this plays out. Next, we need to address fundamental questions - Ideas must be sellable to Congress, they must obtain at least a modicum of support, and they should be equitable to all - putting free market principles to work.It must not institute permanent subsidy, which discourages the establishment of business models which are fundamentally sound WITHOUT public money. I see no reason to have permanent USF subsidy. It is money down the toilet over the long run and a tax that seriously hinders people's ability to afford communications services. A big part of current USF money goes to switching which I see as an antiquated hierarchy where small rural towns have their own switch, with all it's maintenance and support. With the advent of cheap high capacity fiber created by ARRA projects and private upgrades, smaller digital switches, wholesale access to switch partitions, and VOIP, there is no technical reason to permanently subsidize modern distributed switching. If permanent support for switching were tapered off, the rural phone companies could find cheaper ways to do voice switching. The cellcos almost all have some sort of architecture where all their sites in the state go back to single state-wide switches. When not used for switching, permanent USF pays for monopoly infrastructure that discourages rural competition by irrationally priced services. 4. No ILEC is ever eligible for any subsidy within the boundaries of it's incumbency, whether it is expanding broadband to unserved portions of its incumbency or not.Whether or not CLEC status should be included should be a subject of debate. CLECs tend to be doing stuff that meets a need the ILECs aren't filling. I'm fine with non-permanent support to that. 5. That any financial incentive consist solely as a refundable tax rebate per consumer serviced per month, with the consumers being defined as those who reside in an area currently without broadband, or in an area where infrastructure does not currently exist to serve at least 95% of all residences within that area.Area definition should be tied to local trade areas.Consumers would be defined as customers of the ISP, be it residential, business, or organization - like schools, businesses, or even other ISP's. 6. Rebate eligibility expires upon: 2 years after a 3rd provider or 2nd different technology covers at least 95% of all consumers within the defined areas.( example, DSL access is limited to a smallish rural area, so the 1st and 2nd WISP can both claim rebates per consumer, but the DSL provider cannot unless it expands to reach 95% of the people. WISP's cannot qualify EITHER, unless or until they can cover 95%. Even if 2 WISP's fully cover, rebates continue until a third joins - then the trigger allows that WISP subsidy for 2 years,, or the telco rolls out universal DSL, at which the telco and WISP's continue for 2 years and then expires. Even if one/any/all go out of business after this threshold is crossed, the expiration is permanent,) A tax rebate would be highly preferable to USF, as it would be a reduction in taxation rather than an increase in taxation. Either way, non-permanent support is the only thing I can advocate. I like the idea of non-permanent support for unserved/underserved areas. My state's ConnectME fund is looking at a one-time ISP payment (per customer) to support high-cost installations to unserved locations. The details of how much and under what conditions are undecided, but it would address the high CPE/installation costs that plague broadband expansion and would not cause long term dependence on government. This would be an alternative to the present system of government funded infrastructure projects. This would be less apt to stir a hornets nest of capitalism versus government funded project overbuilding, which is more and more apt to happen. 10. That ALL infrastructure investment be fully expensable -as in 100% write-off in year one, as it concerns taxes.Basically, that puts every ISP in the position of being able to write off and not be taxed on growing or expansion.This should be permanent tax policy for EVERYONE, everywhere. This has some precedent. Something like the §179 which lets the self employed fully deduct big SUVs and work trucks. This was meant to help small businesses and the auto
Re: [WISPA] Bandwidth
There is no such thing as collisions now on ethernet/fiber as we use switches instead of hubs. Each link is full duplex and capable of handing 100% capacity. However if you basing utilization on 5 minute averages like MRTG, keep in mind that's a 5 minute average and you could be going from frequent 100% utilization to 50% utilization within that 5 minute interval, so 75% utilization could be considered full under those circumstances if you want to avoid dropped packets. On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 11:08:50AM -0400, Scott Reed wrote: Old rule of thumb for Ethernet, because it is based on collision detection, is 70-75% is the max you want. Above this and collisions often become an issue. I assume the same is true for the faster links as well. Jeremie Chism wrote: At what percentage of your backbone usage do you look at adding more capacity. At peak times I run at 65-70 percent of capacity. Just looking for suggestions. Sent from my iPhone WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Scott Reed Sr. Systems Engineer GAB Midwest 1-800-363-1544 x2241 1-260-827-2241 Cell: 260-273-7239 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] WISPA classifieds?
On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 09:44:38AM -0400, Tom DeReggi wrote: However, I argue there are few items that are not atleast worth their weitht in shipping. Many Liquidators would accept donated equipment. And EBAY has proven, that just about anything can be sold for a profit. One mans's trash is another man's product in short supply. I've got stuff you can't find on Ebay. Last time I checked it hadn't sold for enough to be worth my while to photograph and list it. (Old dialup equipment) As far as classifieds, my input is to have something like the craigslist system, but also have a list we can subscribe to so that by email we can receive a summary of new posts each day. I really don't mind the occassional post to the list of used items for sale, as it's often useful. However, I can see the value in having something made for the purpose. If anyone has any type of gear operating in 5.x or 900, that they feel is best destined for the landfills, they can just ship it to me instead, I'll accept it at no charge, and then they can save on Dump Fees and gas, and contribute to saving the environment at the same time :-) Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brian Webster bwebs...@wirelessmapping.com To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 11:50 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] WISPA classifieds? What about sending the equipment to these relief projects like in Haiti? While this stuff may not be worth a production WISP environment, in a place like that it would be worth its weight in gold. Thank You, Brian Webster -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 11:27 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] WISPA classifieds? This brings up another point. What do you do with old gear that just plain isn't worth keeping? Its taking up valuable space and you can't even give it away so the landfill is looking like its final resting place. I have been thinking lately of using my old TR-CPE-200's as clay pigeons but then I would have to go clean up the mess.. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Kevin Sullivan Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 7:53 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] WISPA classifieds? Hello, I've asked before, but I still haven't got an answer. Does WISPA have any online classifieds for used WISP equipment? I'm looking for a licensed link, and I have mountains of Trango 5800(-d), Trango 900, Tranzeo, and a few Trango ATLAS backhaul units I'd like liquidate. (I've also got a HUGE pile of Raylink, alvarion 900, and SmartBridges, but I'll probably have to just haul those to the dump). I'm thinking of throwing up a classifieds page for WISPs, but I really don't want to duplicate, if someone else already has one. Thanks, Kevin WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for
Re: [WISPA] Looking for iput on 900MHz H-Pol Sector Choices. Not healthcare, taxes or government related.........
MTI is the shizz for this. MTI will give much better coverage than a superpass, more than enough coverage to be worth the extra money. The MTI's radiating/listening pattern is pretty neat too, whereas the Superpass will be kinda like a lopsided omni. The pac-wireless hoz 900 sectors are actually good too in terms of operation. Their fiberglassing isn't quite as good as MTI's covering though. Superpass is a step up over a $100 omni, but it's not functionally competitive for sectors. On Thu, Apr 29, 2010 at 09:02:10PM -0400, Robert West wrote: I'm in need of a 120 or a couple of 90 degree 900MHz H-POL sector antenna(s). Not looking forward to buying worthless CRAP just because I've never had to buy these before so I'm asking who uses what and if it works great. I've done the Omni path, okay but noisy, but this new install needs some decent signal for 2 to 4 miles. Mostly clear path but, ofcourse , into the trees to the CPEs. I've looked at the Super Pass solution and as we all know, I'm a cheap SOB so it fits my budget but I'd gladly pay bigger $$$ for top quality if it's deserved. Thanks. Bob- The cheap SOB WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Alvarion VL Users
We've been using VL since it came out. I would also recommend the 5.5.26 firmware for vl 5.8ghz. We routinely install it on overlapping or adjacent channels on the same tower. (I.e. 5830 for a backhaul, 5820 for a sector 40 feet away). If you have revA gear, change it to rev C or better and sell or reuse the revA gear for a rural low volume backhaul. In revB and newer hardware, it has some things 5ghz wifi stuff doesn't. Packet aggregation of up to 4000+ byte radio packets is possible with rev c or newer. This lets you do very high PPS rates for small packets that regular wifi gear won't do. The modulation adaption algorithm is completely adjustable. The retries, etc.. are all fully adjustable. Spectrum analyzer is very nice. You have adjustable noise floor for use in high interference areas. You also have ATPC which I think all gear should have. It's got something called drap for prioritizing voice calls, but I can't explain it. Every feature is highly tweakable. It's completely programmable with SNMP. We have a script to program customer radios before they go out the door with installers. After it's installed, everything is monitorable with SNMP, unlike MT, ubnt, etc.. It has a nice 500+ page pdf manual for the software and everything is well explained, unlike MT/UBNT. The software is reliable; I have links with uptimes over a year. It's available in US certified 5.4. They have quality integrated MTI antennas. The major downfall of VL is the CPE are speed limited, requiring an upgrade key purchase to get full speed. For this reason, we are upgrading some sectors to UBNT-M5 for more customer speed. We'll reuse the VL radios elsewhere as we are spoiled by them. A minor downfall is their support ticketing system only uses IE, but we don't deal with their support very much. On Sun, Apr 25, 2010 at 10:15:44AM -0400, can...@believewireless.net wrote: VL has been a love/hate for us. When it works, it works great. However, it has several serious flaws. It has the same associate/dis-associate issue seen with other WDS implementations. If a weak client continues to associate/dis-associate, packet loss to all radios on the sector happens and can even shut down the AP for long periods of time. No easy way to see on the AP the number of times this happens either. SNR is completely worthless for determining anything. Some of our worst channels are ones where clients show fantastic SNR. And, as said before, noise is a killer. It's very difficult to co-locate APs on the same tower even with 20 MHz of separation. Now that Canopy 430 is out, we'll be ditching Alvarion and moving to Canopy. Canopy has been the best product we have used and the software continues to mature and while bug fixes are slow to be released, they typically are addresses. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Solar
Two 75w panels would be about right for just the MT411. And you'd need a bigger charge controller. 150w/12v= 10A. On Wed, Apr 21, 2010 at 03:57:01PM +, Akinlolu Ajayi-Obe wrote: I have a repeater with one microtik 411, two motorolla canopy and one 1amp 12v switch. I want to run it strictly on solar. I'm wondering if a 75watts solar panel with a 10amp charge controller will do. Thanks Akin Sent from my BlackBerry® smartphone WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Bizarre *Cold* front coming from the west
Antenna icing mostly happens when things are real close to freezing. Like a wet cloud depositing moisture on cold antennas. When things are well below freezing, like most mountain the northeast for the whole winter, there is not much icing. We do get a little at the beginning and ending of the winter. On Wed, Apr 21, 2010 at 05:16:20PM -0400, Jerry Richardson wrote: Heads up to the East. Just had a NNW facing AP ice up on Mt Diablo - can't believe it.. There was enough ice buildup to drop over half the subs so it had to pile on quickly. Temperature is rising and the customers are coming back but that's some bizarre stuff for this area. [cid:image001.gif@01CAE15C.ED6524B0] Broadband for Business Public and Private WiFi Jerry Richardson VP Operations 925-260-4119 x2 Websitehttp://www.aircloud.com/ Bloghttp://weblog.aircloud.com/ Twitterhttp://www.twitter.com/aircloudbband LinkedInhttp://www.linkedin.com/pub/jerry-richardson/6/372/354 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Seagate 7200.11 Hard Drives
Long time ago, I got burned bad buying IBM deathstar drives. IBM is a good conservative choice right? Seagate has long been the troublefree conservative choice. I still prefer seagate and consider them a somewhat safe bet, despite the race to zero quality in that industry. However, some of their newer drives are less reliable based on other people's experience with them. I have tried samsung twice over the past couple years. Disaster. 1 DOA, 1 died in no time. I gave away the first replacement drive. Didn't bother to RMA the second. Recently bought some western digital 1tb 'green' drives. 1 was DOA. 1 is working in a server. I relegated the replacement drive to a techdesk desktop machine. I've got a cart full of old hard drives (must be at least 80 of them). About half IBMs, half seagate and others. If I take a 40-80gb drive out of a machine, it's not worth my while to securely wipe out the data and sell it, so they just pile up. Someday I'll play dominoes with them or make something one of a kind with a tig welder. On Tue, Apr 20, 2010 at 10:07:38AM -0400, RickG wrote: Friends dont let friends use Seagates :) On Tue, Apr 20, 2010 at 9:15 AM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com wrote: FYI. If anyone is using Seagate 7200.11 SATA hard drives (500gb to the terabyte) and have been experiencing random blue screens or lockups, they have been having firmware problems for awhile on these drives and you should backup your data and send them back to Seagate via RMA. The 7200.11 can be usually found on the top left hand corner. I've found that even in a raid, they can fail pretty much at the same time and thus thwarting the protection of the raid. I've talked to one other WISPA member who had this problem (As well as my own experience with them - 5 sent back already on my own) and thought others may want to look to see what's in their servers. They were flashed with the wrong firmware and experience a countdown of sorts then eventually fail. Again, if in a raid, they will essentially fail at the same time if installed at the same time. I have went as far as RMAing one that showed no issues and they replaced that one as well with no questions. Robert West Just Micro Digital Services Inc. 740-335-7020 Logo5 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Internet for festival: Laptop/PDA signal strength?
I would suggest checking with the organizers to see if they want basic/free/cheap or really nice with cost. They may have big dreams and will seek a way to make it happen in conjuction with you for reasonable money. I don't do free festivals or events. I give away enough every month to regular nonprofits and other trade arrangements, I don't need to get distracted by big events for free when I should be taking care of local paying customers. While you might be doing them a great favor to provide something for free, Internet might be a very very important thing to them and the sponsors/vendors and they might want to make it a priority for the sake of commerce and community development. National sponsors wouldn't bat an eyelash at an elaborate broadband improvement for the festival. If they go for the latter, you might get paid to install year round infrastructure throughout the area, and gain year round customers. And they wouldn't have to rethink/upgrade Internet again the next year and the next. You might also make nicer relationships with repeater site owners if the impetus is to prepare for the festival more so than strictly business profit. On Sun, Apr 18, 2010 at 10:02:00AM -0400, Charles Hooper wrote: Oh yeah, I'm doing this for free. I don't really have any hardware other than a Bullet with an omni that a friend gave me. I planned on buying some equipment and I don't mind, provided I can use it for other projects after this one, but I'd like to keep the budget under $300 (if that's laughable, do let me know!) My thoughts were to use NS5Ls for the backhaul and up to three well-placed 2.4 Bullets w/ omnis, but the fewer the better. Josh Luthman wrote: Nanos would be cheaper then MT wouldn't it? On 4/17/10, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote: Marlon's idea is good. Put a high 5.8 omni at the crossroads. Put some 5.8 cpe at a few different places with 2.4 low power radios connected to them. A P2P to the crossroads system from your demark would complete the system. You could do it with Deliberant radios, or Mikrotik quite easily. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2010 7:08 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Internet for festival: Laptop/PDA signal strength? I use a 24dB grid for a project like this. We can get to a laptop (in open air) about a mile away this way ;-). It's pretty cool. You'd never be able to handle the volume that way though. I'd probably try to go with REALLY low powered omni or sectors with a LOT of them. 5 gig 802.11 a and b/g. I'd also run a 5 gig system over the top of it for backhaul. Unless you are doing this for free. Then put in what you've got that's cheap and go from there. marlon - Original Message - From: Charles Hooper choo...@plumata.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2010 11:27 AM Subject: [WISPA] Internet for festival: Laptop/PDA signal strength? Hi, Every year in July we have a fairly large, 3-day festival in town with over 100 vendors and over 300,000 visitors. I'm teaming up with a local non-profit that I'm involved with to try to provide Internet access to those vendors, as well as any of those 300,000 people with smartphones/PDAs who feel the need to get online. Essentially, the area I want to cover is in green on this map (plus the pier): http://sailfest.org/images/page/sailfest2009_event_guide.gif For a sense of scale, those green sections are only about 400 feet long and are (mostly) flat and the buildings around them are made of brick. There will be tents and stands all along the street. This is one of the areas: http://sailfest.org/images/page/vendorarea_03.jpg If I put a Ubiquiti bullet in that intersection of the green area with an omnidirectional antenna, I have very little doubt that its signal will get wherever it needs to go, but will people's laptops and PDAs have a problem with connections at that range? Or should I put a repeater halfway down those streets, or even for this use case use a Mesh network design? Thanks in advance, Charles WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/
Re: [WISPA] Switch recommendations
procurve 2650 is exactly what you are asking for. On Sun, Apr 18, 2010 at 05:41:18PM -0500, Mike Hammett wrote: I had a Dell PowerConnect 3048 die on me today... I owned it for probably 6 years and only paid $150 for it. Recommendations for a reasonably priced managed 48 port switch? Doesn't have to be new. Recommendations to stay away from? The more gigabit ports the better, but no more than 2 required. The switch works via console, but doesn't respond to pings anymore, even after resetting to factory defaults. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Friday Funnies
I remember some of the old macs (open transport?) had an arrow that went up or down to indicate the status of the PPP connection. On Fri, Apr 16, 2010 at 12:50:45PM -0700, Forbes Mercy wrote: The 80 year old dial up customer calls, he's running Windows 3.1 and regularly complains about speed, he's the kind of guy who would bring in his record player and ask why the CD won't play. He says he got a notice that his PPP/Winsock wouldn't work, he yells I can't get my PPP up! On 4/16/2010 11:02 AM, Steven Barnes wrote: Guys and Gals it's been a long week and I need a good laugh. Anyone got a Friday funny worth its weight? Steve WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Experiences with State Broadband Mapping Agencies
Maine has asked for it. I'll try to get some details privately emailed to you. On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 08:28:46AM -0400, Brian Webster wrote: To All; My contact at the NTIA has asked me to provide a list of the states who have been asking WISP's to provide a list of the customer addresses. I know a few of you have mentioned this but I wasn't keeping track. Could you post or send me your experiences and I will forward that directly to the NTIA. We now have a person I can contact directly to express our concerns with this process as necessary. The NTIA has weekly conference calls with the states so there are opportunities to help this process along. Thank You, Brian Webster WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] monitoring product (was Re: Ubiquiti Beta 5.2.4 Released)
I dont' graph temp/humidity at my towers. I do graph it for my detatched garage and datacenter though. (The most important locations) I have a little atom PC running centos, 1-wire temp/humidity sensor from www.hobby-boards.com, owfs, mrtg, apache. It also has rsync and a 2tb drive for offsite backup of my photos. It is connected with fiber to my home for the offsite backup access. http://www.f64.nu/garage/temp_2.html http://www.f64.nu/garage/temp_3.html On Sun, Apr 11, 2010 at 12:50:45PM -0700, Ryan Spott wrote: Must be nice to be so close to a NOAA weather station.. and to have consistant weather from one mile-post to the next. I can tell you that out here, 200' elevation 4500' elevation 4 miles away. :) And I do graph all of that. :) ryan On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 9:08 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com wrote: We do this now. From NOAA weather stations. All our backhaul links are polled every 60 seconds for just about everything they spit out (i.e. bits in/out, signals, errors, temperature, etc.) as well as NOAA weather info (temp, humidity, pressure, etc.) for the nearest station. It's all available on a graph to us through extranet. Works very well. On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 8:07 AM, Matt Liotta mlio...@r337.com wrote: This makes me think about a cool product someone needs to produce. Some sort of device that could be deployed at a wireless colocation site that would simply listen on a variety of bands and collect weather information. The device would make all this data available via some reasonable API; possibly SNMP. Then a monitoring system to collect this data and graph it historically. This would allow the operator to have a much better view of the environment for which their network is operating in. -Matt On Apr 9, 2010, at 10:00 AM, John Scrivner wrote: I am not a huge UBNT fan but I might be persuaded to buy one of these for each tower to setup as a remote Spectrum Analyzer for each tower location. How much do these radios run and who sells them on here? Scriv WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] connected nation mapping data
On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 11:51:34AM -0600, Matt Larsen - Lists wrote: I was on a conference call with the State of Nebraska broadband mapping contractors and the Public Service Commission this morning and came away with a bad feeling. Based on the Form477 data, and the PSC's broadband provider registration information, there are 283 broadband providers in the state of Nebraska. But they only have complete information for about 25, and signed NDAs from only 160. I offered to them that they would have better luck getting data if they weren't asking for so much information.The data template that they ask for includes: 1) All subscriber addresses, and the type of broadband deployed at that location 2) GPS coordinates for all of our tower locations, the types of antennas provided and the frequencies in use at that location 3) Key anchor institutions that are receiving service from our system The people doing mapping for Maine have asked for these things as well. I have provided #2 as a google earth file, and a subset of #1. I have ignored #3 for a couple reasons. Anchor institutions was fairly undefined first of all. After further explanation, I knew mostly what they meant. The government doesn't know what the anchor institutions are and how they are served. That's their problem for not knowing what the libraries, PDs, FDs, (all government related organizations) etc.. have for Internet. If you ask the town, county, whatever governemnt org the anchor institution is part of, it's public FOI knowledge. If you ask my business, it's customer information. Those institutions are customers to me. They want the names of those customers, and I'm not giving out customer names. Soapbox opinion: I think someone up high is thinking we should be proud and boasting about the anchor institutions we serve and gladly share them. I'm sure they want the list of anchor institutions so someone in government with a few billion to spend can take those customers away with some pork project. I'm not talking a government funded ARRA project. I'm talking a 100% government run pork project, cutting out small business and costing 10x as much to operate, solving a problem that doesn't really exist. Done under the guise of homeland security or education, it would be unstoppable. I should shut up before someone gets a good idea. I have had a couple of phone calls and several emails back and forth with the mapping subcontractors, and they (and the PSC) are still adamant about the data collection requirements. I thought that we had negotiated to the point that they would accept a shape file and a summary of the number of subscribers per census block, but the phone call this morning confirmed that incomplete data submissions (ones that do not include the tower verification information and subscriber information in the format that they requested) will not be included in the summary data, or the state broadband availability map that will be released to the public. The contractors and the attorney for the PSC gave the indication that the NTIA is mandating this level of data collection, and that their NDA should be enough protection to ensure the safety of our proprietary information. My position, and the position of the majority of WISP operators that I have visited with, is that I am not going to turn over the information that they are asking for. Full disclosure of all my tower sites and the addresses of my customers is an onerous request and fundamentally unnecessary to determine where broadband coverage exists within the state. I would prefer to run the risk of being overbuilt by a government funded program in the future than to turn over information to entities (NTIA in particular) that could be legally obligated to turn over that information through a FOIA request. I don't know whether it is too late to push back at the NTIA to reduce the data that they are requesting. I can sympathise to a certain degree with the PSC and the contractors, as they are just trying to collect the data that NTIA has mandated them to collect. But they are simply asking for too much information. In the end, it will be another inaccurate representation of broadband coverage and that information will be used to develop policy and programs that will make the competitive environment for WISPs and other independent ISPs even more difficult to succeed in. That sucks. Matt Larsen vistabeam.com On 4/12/2010 10:29 AM, Tom DeReggi wrote: BTOP Mapping grants given to States are Federal initiatives. The states have to answer and report to the Feds on their progress. Basically they will report to the Feds, who they contacted, and who provided info and who didn't. The State mappers have little authority to do anything about whether you give them information or not. But the Feds potentially could. Remember it is
Re: [WISPA] email issues
Many customers have shared their passwords with webmail phishers. (who want to use their webmail accounts). We have squirrelmail webmail for our users. We had a bunch of with people from nigeria entering into our customers' webmail accounts. We installed the restrict sender plugin from the squirrelmail homepage, set it to limit the number of messages per day per sender to something reasonable our customers are not normally apt to hit. Just like magic, the spammers went elsewhere real quick. On Thu, Apr 08, 2010 at 09:01:21AM -0400, Kurt Fankhauser wrote: I had problems with hi-jacked email accounts for months until I finally traced it to the webmail interface. Turned off webmail and have not had a problem since. Apparently you do not have to have the correct password to spam from the webmail so I just turned it off. Plus that took care of another problem were customers were not downloading their mail from the server and just using webmail exclusively. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of RickG Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2010 10:17 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] email issues I've got a client whose email (mkfa...@kywifi.com) appears to have been hijacked for spamming purposes. I'm not sure what to do about it. Sample email below. Any ideas? Thanks in advance! -RickG *** From: mailer-dae...@yahoo.co.jp To: mkfa...@kywifi.com Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2010 8:50 PM Subject: Delivery failure Message from yahoo.co.jp. Unable to deliver message to the following address(es). danjiri_girl_san...@yahoo.co.jp: Sorry your message to danjiri_girl_san...@yahoo.co.jp cannot be delivered. This account has been disabled or discontinued [#102]. ytktmm9...@yahoo.co.jp: Sorry your message to ytktmm9...@yahoo.co.jp cannot be delivered. This account has been disabled or discontinued [#102]. yuffieg...@yahoo.co.jp: Sorry your message to yuffieg...@yahoo.co.jp cannot be delivered. This account has been disabled or discontinued [#102]. y...@yahoo.co.jp: This user doesn't have a yahoo.co.jp account (y...@yahoo.co.jp) [-5] yukideschene7...@yahoo.co.jp: This user doesn't have a yahoo.co.jp account (yukideschene7...@yahoo.co.jp) [-101] yukiko_no...@yahoo.co.jp: Sorry your message to yukiko_no...@yahoo.co.jp cannot be delivered. This account has been disabled or discontinued [#102]. yukimatsuok...@yahoo.co.jp: Sorry your message to yukimatsuok...@yahoo.co.jp cannot be delivered. This account has been disabled or discontinued [#102]. yukko_pudd...@yahoo.co.jp: Sorry your message to yukko_pudd...@yahoo.co.jp cannot be delivered. This account has been disabled or discontinued [#102]. yumis...@yahoo.co.jp: Sorry your message to yumis...@yahoo.co.jp cannot be delivered. This account has been disabled or discontinued [#102]. yuri...@yahoo.co.jp: Sorry your message to yuri...@yahoo.co.jp cannot be delivered. This account has been disabled or discontinued [#102]. --- Original message follows. X-YahooFilteredBulk: 190.253.243.200 X-Originating-IP: [190.253.243.200] Return-Path: mkfa...@kywifi.com Received-SPF: none ([190.253.243.200]: domain of mkfa...@kywifi.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) Authentication-Results: mta307.mail.ogk.yahoo.co.jp from=kywifi.com; domainkeys=neutral (no sig) Received: from 190.253.243.200 (EHLO 190.253.243.200) (190.253.243.200) by mta307.mail.ogk.yahoo.co.jp with SMTP; Thu, 08 Apr 2010 09:43:27 +0900 Received: from [221.6.75.79] (helo=wxtzlmdpwyl.macfszutaxwyb.org) by with esmtpa (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MMHK8-2919sz-YH for yukimatsuok...@yahoo.co.jp; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 19:43:25 -0500 From: Major Madrid mkfa...@kywifi.com To: yukimatsuok...@yahoo.co.jp, yukideschene7...@yahoo.co.jp, yunon...@yahoo.co.jp, yuffieg...@yahoo.co.jp, y...@yahoo.co.jp, yukko_pudd...@yahoo.co.jp, ytktmm9...@yahoo.co.jp, yukiko_no...@yahoo.co.jp, ysan...@yahoo.co.jp, yuri...@yahoo.co.jp, danjiri_girl_san...@yahoo.co.jp, yukiedgecom...@yahoo.co.jp, yumis...@yahoo.co.jp Subject: Re: Please, conflrm you receipt Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2010 19:43:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary==_aywkmxl_77_88_20 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: iiparxz_54 Message-ID: 3391449688.0ero8bwt613...@graizgzokcruk.pumhvbedkrrtuh.info --=_aywkmxl_77_88_20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Express Chemist PharmacyBuy non-prescription treatmentsonline. Discreet. = UK US registered. --=_aywkmxl_77_88_20 Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable !DOCTYPE HTML
Re: [WISPA] Building Heights?
Use the profiler on here: http://www.heywhatsthat.com/ The website author made it usable for wireless for us. He'll do custom sites that show only your tower locations too if you want. On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 04:42:27PM -0700, Forbes Mercy wrote: Wouldn't it be cool if when using Google Earth you could draw a straight line between two points and it would calculate the altitude of each origin point then mark in red any place where altitude is higher than the beginning and end points along the line? For long legs in mixed altitude areas that would really be nice. Forbes On 3/29/2010 1:12 PM, Jim Patient wrote: Well, it prolly isn't good every place but I just selected 3d buildings on google earth and drug my mouse from the street to top of Met Square in St Louis. It shows the elevation at street level and the top of the building. The difference is the elevation of the building height in this case. Jim On 3/29/2010 2:03 PM, Cameron Crum wrote: Not for free. This info is usually pretty expensive for good high res data. That being said, one interesting flaw in the SRTM data is that is contains building canopy within the data. The radar they used bounced off man made structures and make them appear to be part of the terrain. So, in big cities, or even small ones in core areas, if you are running propagation plots, you would not want to add additional building heights. If you want the most accurate results, I suggest 10m DEM's (where available) with a good set of building elevation data (the expensive stuff). If you are just looking to run propagation plots for your unlicensed network, The SRTM data is probably good enough. Cameron On 3/29/2010 12:07 PM, Charles Hooper wrote: Hello, Does anyone know a reliable source/method of getting building heights? Something like a topographical map that included buildings would be excellent, but I haven't been able to find anything like this. Thanks! Charles WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Building Heights?
Tax assessing data 45 degree square and a tape measure on flat ground. 45 degree square, laser rangefinder, scientific calculator. On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 02:07:36PM -0400, Charles Hooper wrote: Hello, Does anyone know a reliable source/method of getting building heights? Something like a topographical map that included buildings would be excellent, but I haven't been able to find anything like this. Thanks! Charles WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] FCC Enforcements
The moto problem in San Juan was gear that was probably tampered with to operate outside it's intended band. That's what got them in trouble. If it were the right equipment for the job, the operator could have fixed it to play nicer. On Fri, Mar 12, 2010 at 03:25:45AM -0500, Blair Davis wrote: A thing to note... All these enforcement actions were taken because of interference with licensed users Lessons I get from them... 1) Stay off the 5.4GHz band 2) Keep your EIRP down 3) Check your installations for out of band emissions. Leon D. Zetekoff wrote: Was going through recent enforcement actions and came across these: http://www.fcc.gov/eb/FieldNotices/2003/DOC-296094A1.html http://www.fcc.gov/eb/FieldNotices/2003/DOC-290776A1.html http://www.fcc.gov/eb/FieldNotices/2003/DOC-290775A1.html Make sure you are legal. You never know when a surprise can happen. Leon WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] State Education Networks?
We don't, but were involved in the most recent in Maine. Back quite a while ago, when the network was first built, the BELL LEC (I don't rember what name they went by that year), was fined $20 million for overcharging rate payers. Instead of paying the fine, they suggested the state should have an educational network to link the schools together with Internet and so forth. Wonder of wonders, they received the whole project when it went to bid and built that instead of paying the fine. This allowed the LEC to build a Frame Relay and ATM network all over the state; sort of dead tech from the beginning. After the ongoing costs had exhausted the value of the fine some years later, we got a new charge on our phone bills to cover ongoing operations of the network. The schools have been using 56k leased lines, T1s, bonded T1s, and if they pay a bunch extra, ATM links. ISPs could provide the services, but would only get about $50/mo per location to serve a school/library, far less than the wholesale cost of what was installed by the LEC. Lots of people grumbled about this for a long time. Fast forward to present. They put out a new RFP for a new network based on ethernet speeds and IP: http://www.maine.edu/strategic/upcoming_bids-list.php?id=10 Incumbents, CLECs, Cable, and various ISPs participated in the process. The variety of parties at the required RFP meeting and email discussion was a who's who meeting of the minds which I'm sure sharpened the proposals a bit. The cable company won the bid for the uplink. The links to the schools and libraries were awarded to combination of a major Maine CLEC, the Bell LEC, and the cable company. We made a proposal for a portion, but didn't get picked for our parts of the project. Our participation and submission of a proposal keeps us on the list as a potential vendor if the chosen vendor is unable to do everything on their list of sites, or if a school or library needs a legitimate upgrade that the chosen vendor can not provide in a timely and affordable means. As a business I was a little dissapointed not to be among the chosen because of the hard work involved in preparing a proposal. As a business and individual tax payer, I was very pleased this costly and important project is now going to be operated in a more competitive manner. It will cost less than the old network and be a whole lost faster and more useful because of actual competition between broadband technologies and facilities owners. It should be more reliable too. There were times in the past when most of the network went down because of a central LEC problem. The new network I suspect will be more resilient like the Internet operates. On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 08:17:05PM -0800, Kevin Owen wrote: The State I provide service in (Idaho) is in the process of building a Statewide Educational Network. I am interested in hearing from any of you are providing service in a State that has built a State Educational Network and if so, are local providers used to provide any of the last miles services to the schools? Idaho started by saying they would work with the local providers, however, now they have changed their tune and local providers are not given the opportunity to even bid on the service. Qwest is charging at least 3 - 5 times what any of the other local ISP's could or would charge for the same or more bandwidth. We are simply told we are not able to provide the service due to technical reasons, however, the State thus far has not defined what those technical reasons are. The difference in cost per year is in the millions. Our State IT group is also saying this is how it is done in other states to provide a quality and cost effective network. So does anybody provide any last mile services to any Statewide educational network? Thanks, Kevin First Step Internet, LLC WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] here it come$
On Fri, Mar 12, 2010 at 02:38:44PM -0500, Larry Yunker wrote: RANT Gee, now this (ESPN Live 360) won't make the Cable-Op internet providers have an unfair advantage over traditional ISPs! You have to imagine that the cable-op's are negotiating this internet service into their network programming agreements with EPSN, whereas if you are a non-cable-op you will have to pay outright and separate for the service and then pass along that fee to all of your subscribers or more likely... eat the cost. My understanding is that ESPN is the 800 pound gorilla here. You can't sell non-basic cable if you don't have ESPN. ESPN is reported to get $4/customer/month from the cable companies for providing the television programming it does. Things like this: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/29/business/media/29cable.html happen all the time where the broadcasters and operators can't agree over money and threaten to shut off your favorite channels. A cable company might be persuaded to get espn360 to hedge their position incase they were afraid of hardball negotiations over their cable channel costs. It wounldn't be all or nothing with ESPN if they offered espn360. If they can't provide something, the customers will go straight to dish or directv. I'm not sticking up for the cable companies here. Those participating might also see the Internet as simply a conduit for proprietary and costly entertainment, which is a travesty in it's own right. That is something to rant about. This is another case where a utility is able to abuse its monopoly power to the disadvantage of a non-utility ISP. The regulated and non-regulated portions of a company that engages in internet service need to be forced to conduct business as arms-length transactions. For instance... if MegaCableCompany operates as a Cable TV provider and operates as an internet provider, the Cable TV provider business unit is regulated and enjoys an advantage as a utility, whereas the Internet Provider Business Unit is unregulated and operates in an open market. The Cable TV unit is free to negotiate terms for TV programming from the various networks. The Internet Unit is free to negotiate terms of service for internet related valued-added-services. Whereas, the Cable TV unit should not be permitted to negotiate terms for unrelated internet services. (i.e. ESPN Live 360). The CableTV unit as a utility providing TV service should have no interest in internet valued added services. However, in the alternative... if the Cable TV unit were permitted to negotiate terms for unrelated internet services, it should be prepared to offer those services to the open market at the same rate that it charges its own Internet Service Business Unit!! Of course.. this argument may sound familiar to some of you... I've made this same argument time and time again for the unbundling of network elements within the TelCo monopolies. If you sell phone service as a utility, your associated unregulated ISP business unit should not enjoy preferential pricing with regards to internet transport or internet termination. /RANT Larry Yunker -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of RickG Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 1:57 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] here it come$ The television content providers are going to bill ISP's? Try using ESPN Live 360 and see what it tells you. -RickG WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] DC Powered sites
On Wed, Mar 10, 2010 at 11:26:17AM -0600, Scott Piehn wrote: We a looking to setup a couple of our sites to run directly from DC power. AC comes in, convert to DC At this point, plan is to have a 24v setup of deep cycle batteries. Use a packetflux to monitor the battery voltage level Use a digital logger DIN relay for remote reboot. Use the PacWireless DC POE injectors for 12 - 48 volt output What I am totally not sure on is the charging/power piece. The initial site is going to have Canopy CMM micro with 1 powered port 8 Mikotik routerboards, switch ?should I run things directly from the battery, or how should it be powered ?what kind of charger should I get Scott Piehn The Mikrotiks handle up to 24v, but the charging float voltage is higher than they like, so you'll need a DC-DC converter for them. They are cheap and plentiful for a 24v-12v dc-dc converter. You can get a 24vdc switching power supply (or two) from Jameco, Ebay, etc.. and adjust the voltage set screw to the recommended float voltage for your batteries (probably in the 27-28v range). Too low, and you won't fully charge them, too high and you'll boil them away over time. The power supplies should provide power for the load and excess power for charging. Thus you'll have to figure out your load before you get a power supply (or just go for something grossly in excess of your needs) So if you have 240w load, you'll need 10A for the load and extra for charging and expansion, so a 20A (~~ 500w) power supply might be good. Use heavy duty wiring between the batteries and charger, etc.. for minimal voltage drop. A fuse panel like used in boats or traditional autos would be fine for the charging and loads fuses. For larger fuse needs, there are lots of excellent car audio system fuses and fuse blocks available. -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Fw: [WISPA Approved Ad] Special offer from Propel Software for WISPAmembers
You mean like Proxyconn? We used to use that, but stopped because they haven't made any new software for a long time as well. http://ziproxy.sourceforge.net/ is what we replaced it with. Basically ziproxy being the customer facing side of a squid server. Even speeds up 1mbps sort of connections, though not as dramatically as dialup. And of course since it's just a proxy setting, it works with all operating systems and browsers. I have no idea how it compares with propel. On Mon, Mar 08, 2010 at 01:56:22PM -0600, David E. Smith wrote: On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 13:45, Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.comwrote: OK, this looks interesting. It would be nice to drop the amount of data across especially busy parts of the network! Anyone else used this or something similar? This looks a lot like the dialup accelerator software packages that were all the rage several years ago. I'd just about bet Propel's service requires software to be installed on the customer's PC. Assuming that's the case, you won't be able to install it on a Netflix box or a PS3 or basically anything that's not a standard desktop computer. Thus, depending on your customer base, you may not see all that much traffic reduction. We have something similar, from another vendor. It works well enough, though we were marketing it primarily towards dialup users; at the time (several years ago) the effects on a 1Mbps connection were negligible. This probably has changed over time, but our vendor wanted a crazy amount of money to sell us an update that would be compatible with Windows Vista, so we haven't really tested it in quite a while. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] 477 data uses/sharing
Some more insight into allowed uses and sharing for 477 data. -Jason - Forwarded message from Lindley, Phil phil.lind...@maine.gov - X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.0-rc1 (2009-12-22) on saucer.midcoast.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.0 required=5.8 tests=AWL,HTML_MESSAGE, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE,T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD shortcircuit=no autolearn=disabled version=3.3.0-rc1 X-Original-To: j...@saucer.midcoast.com Delivered-To: j...@saucer.midcoast.com X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Subject: FCC Form 477 Filing Waiver Request Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2010 15:01:51 -0500 X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: FCC Form 477 Filing Waiver Request Thread-Index: Acq0EVxjNqk+zn0wQWWv+WQYFnVdfQAmOGUQAGCdo0A= From: Lindley, Phil phil.lind...@maine.gov To: ME, Connect connect...@maine.gov X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Feb 2010 20:01:52.0538 (UTC) FILETIME=[5F924FA0:01CAB655] Maine Communications Service Providers: Section 3 of the ConnectME Authority rule requires that all communications service providers file copies of the FCC Form 477 with the Authority. The ConnectME Authority rule says that the Authority can waive any of the rule requirements upon a request of any person subject to the rule or on its own motion. Below is a waiver request from FairPoint Communications to waive the Form 477 filing requirement. Currently, the ConnectME Authority gets copies of the Form 477 data from providers as required by our statute, but due to changes the FCC made to allow online electronic filings, what we now get from most providers is scanned page prints of the online submissions. A somewhat unusable format. To alleviate that problem, I am checking into getting secure, confidential access from the FCC to state specific electronic 477 data, as the Maine PUC now has. From the FCC website, Separately, the Commission is resolving terms of access to Form 477 data by entities - including state commissions - that are eligible for mapping grants under the Broadband Data Improvement Act (BDIA) As the Authority is the designated entity eligible for the grants, and has actually been awarded a grant, I believe direct access by the Authority is much more efficient and less burdensome on the providers. The Authority will deliberate the waiver request at its next meeting, March 16, 2010, 1 PM. Any comments or questions should be sent to me before that date. Thanks, Phil Phillip Lindley Executive Director ConnectME Authority 78 State House Station Augusta, ME 04333-0078 E: phil.lind...@maine.gov mailto:phil.lind...@maine.gov P: (207) 624-9970 C: (207) 441-0498 W: www.maine.gov/connectme/ http://www.maine.gov/connectme/ From: Tulk, RoJean [South Portland, ME.] [mailto:rojean.t...@fairpoint.com] Sent: Monday, February 22, 2010 5:50 PM To: Lindley, Phil Subject: Form 477 waiver request... Phil: Pursuant to Chapter 101 §8 of the ConnectME Authority's rules, FairPoint Communications would like to request a waiver of §3 which requires communications providers to file their FCC Form 477s with the Authority. We make this request on behalf of FairPoint's NNE Group and its Telecom Group (Classic properties). There are two reasons why FairPoint is making this request. First, it has been noted that the 477 data has not been particularly helpful in determining broadband availability in Maine. However, getting the data from the federal website and prepared in a format appropriate for filing with the Authority is time-consuming and burdensome. Second, the ConnectME Authority has currently undertaken a broadband mapping project that will show broadband availability throughout the state in granular detail. Therefore, the purpose for collecting the 477 data is no longer germane. For these reasons, FairPoint respectfully requests the ConnectME Authority consider waiving this requirement for the current reporting period and subsequent reporting periods. Additionally, we would also request an extension of the March 1 filing deadline to April 1 while the Authority is considering our waiver request. Please let me know if you need additional information. Thanks very much... R. RoJean Tulk - Director of Legislative Relations, Maine FairPoint Communications | 155 Gannett Drive, South Portland, ME 04106 | rt...@fairpoint.com 207.642.7351 office | 207.233.9375 cell | 207.642.7411 fax Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ This e-mail message and its attachments are for the sole use of the intended recipients. They may contain confidential information, legally privileged information or other information subject to legal restrictions. If you are not the intended recipient of this message, please do not read, copy, use or disclose this message or its attachments, notify the sender by replying to this message and
Re: [WISPA] tower contracts
On Tue, Mar 02, 2010 at 04:28:02PM -0800, Ryan Spott wrote: Well, the lawyer is not gonna like my advice.. How else does he get paid? :) I also like binding arbitration, of course, the one that files suit pays for the arbitration fees. Again, this forces people to 'figure it out' before they start rattling sabers! Further more, many towns and cities have an attorney on the payroll, so there is no additional expense to them in them rattling sabres, though it could be costly to you. Keep that in mind, depending on the town you deal with. ryan On Tue, Mar 2, 2010 at 4:19 PM, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com wrote: Great tip! So, otherwise you would sign it? I'm runnig it past a lawyer friend but wanted to hammer out any details before he gets involved. Thanks! -RickG On Tue, Mar 2, 2010 at 7:08 PM, Ryan Spott rsp...@cspott.com wrote: unless caused by Grantor's negligent or willful conduct or Grantor's failure to fulfill its maintenance obligations as set forth in Paragraph 6 above. is your out. This looks pretty good. One of the things we have added to our contracts is legal fees arising from litigation are the responsibility of the litigant. This causes governments etc to think twice before filing a $20,000 legal battle over a $20 item. ryan On Tue, Mar 2, 2010 at 4:05 PM, Cliff w...@eccentrixtechnologies.com wrote: My understanding is, even without that clause written, being a government they have that clause. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of RickG Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2010 6:04 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] tower contracts One of our favorite topics :) So, I've had fairly good luck with the tower agreements that I've posted until lately. It seems people are getting real particular these days, which is fine. After two years of discusions, I've finally made some progress of getting on a nearby towns water tank. My issue is that they have scrapped my contract and come up with an easement contract of their own. Its not too bad but I'm concerned about the indemification section. Basically, it reads as follows: INDEMNIFICATION: The Grantee does hereby agree to defend, hold harmless, and indemnify Grantor, its successors and assigns, from any claim of liability or any other claim involving the access, utilities, or arising out of the Grantee's use of the easement described above, unless caused by Grantor's negligent or willful conduct or Grantor's failure to fulfill its maintenance obligations as set forth in Paragraph 6 above. As a government. the Grantor reserves all rights afford under its Sovereign Immunity. Basically, it protects them but not me. LOL, normally my contract does the reverse! Thoughts? -RickG WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] small generator with ATS
We just ordered a GE 7KW from homedepot. #100661779 It comes with automatic transfer for $2239. No idea if it auto exercises; I'll find out soon enough. What's your actual load? For most of my tower sites, deep cycle batteries and tripplite APS are my solution. On Tue, Mar 02, 2010 at 09:27:46AM -0600, Marco Coelho wrote: I'm looking for small, 3-6 KW, propane fed generators with automatic transfer / exercise switches. This would be an ideal size for small tower sites. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] small generator with ATS
On Tue, Mar 02, 2010 at 10:25:37AM -0600, Mike wrote: The deep cycle batteries and an inverter are a good idea. I like the APC units much better than the Tripplites; they have better power supplies. I've had APCs run great for 10 years, others have gotten hot and bulged batteries to the extent that the units had to be fully dissasembled to get the batteries out. We still get them for small ($100) UPSs, but use Tripplite APS for the bigger stuff. We've got sites that will run 20+ hours on a 100AH 12v battery without us intervening. Compared to a portable generator, that saves three visits if power is restored in time. 1 to bring in and start a generator, one refuel, one visit to hook back up to utility power. I have replaced a dead internal gel cell with an external deep cycle battery. The only down side is the trickle circuitry is sized for a 7 ah or so battery and NOT a 60 ah. So get a $20 general purpose trickle charger from walmart or harborfreight if you want to go this route. I have actually been contemplating running both a solar panel and a wind generator combination to power the equipment at the noc. Wing looks nice, but it's a pain unless you do grid-tied. You need large batteries to absorb the power generated and some of the wind generators aren't particularly reliable either. I think it has a strong future as a component of international energy needs, but it's sort of frustrating in an isolated setup. The marketing mileage I would get out of that, in this day of green awareness would be tremendous. The marketing would be that the entire network is powered with green energy, and you could tout that in advertising and your literature. Mike -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of jp Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2010 10:01 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] small generator with ATS We just ordered a GE 7KW from homedepot. #100661779 It comes with automatic transfer for $2239. No idea if it auto exercises; I'll find out soon enough. What's your actual load? For most of my tower sites, deep cycle batteries and tripplite APS are my solution. On Tue, Mar 02, 2010 at 09:27:46AM -0600, Marco Coelho wrote: I'm looking for small, 3-6 KW, propane fed generators with automatic transfer / exercise switches. This would be an ideal size for small tower sites. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Data Site Consortium Threats?
On Tue, Mar 02, 2010 at 10:46:58AM -0700, Jason Wallace wrote: Does anyone know anything about a company named Data Site Consortium? Someone named Debra Dupée is calling and asking for information about my company that has to do with the Federal Broadband Mapping Program I'm not aware of such a company. I have seen lists of companies with regard to 477, but not the actual data. So if she got contact info, that's probably publicly available information. She said she got my information from FCC Form 477! And is working with all ISPs in Arizona. 1. Doesn't this mean that the FCC broke it's word about the non-disclosure part of 477, since Data Site Consortium is a privately owned company? 2. Do I have to reply to their demands? Worst of all, I got a message on my cell yesterday that said (and I quote): We will escalate this up to the State Level and then to the Federal level if we don't hear from you. The email addresses she provides aren't even branded: azbroadb...@gmail.com ddu...@cox.net Is she legit? Anyone? Shouldn't they have to provide proof of who they are or a warrant or something before I have to provide info? Jason WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Private fiber deployments
On Tue, Mar 02, 2010 at 10:27:45AM -0800, MDK wrote: I have a situation where a rural housing development (very rural, up in the mountains, far far from town, heavily wooded) is wanting broadband, and it seems to me that the best way would be to wire these guys up. I have 900 gear onsite, but the fact that the area is steep, rugged, and heavily timbered, means I can't get even 900 to work well in it. When the original owner/developer started this thing, he put in underground power and phones to some of it, and some of it's in the air. The roads are not county property, they are owned by the HOA that runs the development.Anyone familiar with what legal entanglements and requirements are involved in stringing fiber? I would need to run about 1-2 miles, at absolute most, and it would pass 30 to 40 homes / yet undeveloped lots. Sounds like you're all set. Get HOA permission and do it. This is really the simplest type of deployment as far as permissions go. If the pole are owned by a utility, you probably can't use them. You can run the fiber over the ground, on privately owned poles, or trenched. I've run it over the ground in an association. Just don't run it too close to the road where it might get damaged by a plow or bushhog. Make sure you use outdoor fiber, leave some slack for future splices, etc... I'd do active ethernet rather than gepon. Where do I look for best practices for build out, who's done this kind of stuff? Any input or experiences with this appreciated. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] That black magic
Columbus and Armstrong were busy using federal $, not running a business. On Tue, Feb 23, 2010 at 09:43:47AM -0600, Mike wrote: Josh said I agree with Jason, too. Just because you can does not mean you should. Columbus, or Neil Armstrong, or Edmund Hillary never said that! :-) WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] That black magic
On Tue, Feb 23, 2010 at 08:55:31AM -0600, Mike wrote: I need to do a reality check with those of you familiar with knife edge diffraction as a propagation medium. First, I should paint the scene: I have a corporate farmer almost 16 miles away who is motivated. His options are satellite, dialup he currently uses, or us. Business reality for me is not to do it if tech support and tinkering costs more than it's worth, and that's a known possibility ahead of time. I'd suggest an intermediate repeater location that will work for him (and others to make it worthwhile). If the guy is motivated, perhaps he can find a spot for you to put a pole or tower or work with a neighbor on your behalf. -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] FBI wants records kept of Web sites visited | Politics and Law - CNET News
More burden (potentially unconstitutional) for us, and no lasting effect on crime. a VPN or p2p by the criminals would undermine the whole thing. Is the government trying to catch only the stupid criminals? They can hang out on craigslist for that, and won't need any new laws. It's amazing how little they think ahead when suggesting these ideas. Monitoring hasn't stopped internet crime in China for example. On Mon, Feb 08, 2010 at 08:07:21PM -0600, Mark McElvy wrote: http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-10448060-38.html?tag=nl.e404 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] am tower proximity
I am considering constructing a small tower site (for microwave ptp uses mostly) next to an AM radio tower. Like about 300' away. I know not to be on the tower itself. Am I likely to run into any issues with that sort of closeness to AM radio? It's a 1KW station based on current public information. TIA, Jason -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Bandwidth Promo
On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 09:42:09AM -0600, Mike Hammett wrote: As Matt Larsen has been talking about, he built out 125 miles of backhaul to connect his network back to civilization. Others have even further to go. - Mike Hammett Looks like we'd have to go across three states to get to a Cogent facility. Five states to get to Hurricane Electric. Colocation at their datacenter would be a pittance compared to the backhaul costs. -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Side Mount to Wooden Utility Pole?
I'd first check for the stuff electricians mount buried entrance conduits to the pole with like used for the plastic conduit in this photo. http://www.f64.nu/gallery2007/view_photo.php?full=1set_albumName=album182id=DSC7495 We mounted a couple antennas to a pole using a pole-pipe mounting kit from tessco. You can't see the actual hardware in the photo, but this is how it ended up. http://www.f64.nu/gallery2007/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album182id=DSC7498 On Mon, Jan 25, 2010 at 10:49:45AM -0700, AJ wrote: Anyone have any detailed photos or ideas for side mounting to a wooden utility pole? We have a site that will only allow side mounting at about 35' AGL on a wooden utility pole. I considered building a stand off bracket out of Unistrut and mounting it directly through the hole with galvanized hardware but it seems a bit overkill for a single omni. Thanks! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] telco cabinet in unserved area
Roadside SLC/wiring cabinet. http://www.f64.nu/gallery2007/view_photo.php?full=1set_albumName=album182id=DSC7491 We're looking to do some wireless in the neighborhood here. Looks like the phone company has a tough time just keeping dialtone working here. Judging by the ducttape marks on the right, it looks like it's been this way for a while. -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Spectrum Analyzer Recommendation?
We've got an older HP (now agilent) spectrum analyzer that does up to 22ghz. Most people don't know how to use it. I had plenty of experience with O-scopes, and obtained a manual for it, so I'm comfortable with it. The average 25 year old geek would be lost after turning it on. We occasionally drag it out and use a directional antenna to locate a source of interference. Sees the cell phone, 900 paging, and some 900 unlicensed stuff real good. 5ghz is harder as the antennas are much more directional. For monitoring over a time period, Trango 900 SUs and Alvarion 900VL SUs are great at spectrum analysis too via the CLI, as is the Alvarion FH 900 with the spectrum analysis firmware and windows utility. For 5ghz, I'd recommend an Alvarion VL SU for the band you are testing. On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 11:34:45PM -0500, Steven G McGehee wrote: Hi all, Was wondering if any of you have owned or used a spectrum analyzer for common WISP frequencies like 3.3-3.8Ghz, 5Ghz, as well as 11, 18, 23, and 24Ghz. I'm primarily interested in 3.3-3.8Ghz and the complete 5Ghz range. Something that could analyze as low as 900Mhz and as high as the 60-80Ghz would be nice too, but not as important. I've tinkered with a Bumblebee device before in 5Ghz, but wondered what analyzers you folks would recommend. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks! -Steven WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Spectrum Analyzer Recommendation?
During high school and college, I had a nice summer job repairing and final testing some expensive government electronics. It used skills I already had, rather than anything from college. The people involved in building what I tested and fixed didn't have any electronics education. They knew their resistor colors, knew diodes only went one way, and could read the labels on chips. They were holdovers from the declining minicomputer businesses, and they were one step away from being replaced by a wave soldering machine if the production volume were a little higher. When I was in college 93-95 at a reputable engineering school, I had an EE roommate and many friends in the department. They went from math to breadboards to FPGAs, imaginary logic circuits, and VLSI. Nothing as simple as actually building or repairing things; that's for hobby or lower end jobs. It doesn't make for star researchers or big business inventors. I studied computer science. You could graduate without actually opening a computer or assembling a network cable. You'd have to be able to program the computer with a variety of languages and a variety of methods and algorithms. You'd probably get a nice job managing a team of programmers or a serious software project after graduation. I dropped out and started an Internet business like many did during that era. On Fri, Jan 22, 2010 at 01:28:24PM -0600, Blake Bowers wrote: No offense, but as also a BSEE, I offer that many people with a degree still have no clue about test equipment or simple things like soldering irons. I recall all too clearly a young lady who had her BSEE doing an internship with the FBI, who had no idea how those components were actually connected together on a board. Don't take your organs to heaven, heaven knows we need them down here! Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today. - Original Message - To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 9:37 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Spectrum Analyzer Recommendation? I am an EE... I know my way around a spec-an. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] stolen solar site
On Mon, Jan 18, 2010 at 08:50:47AM -0800, Marlon K. Schafer wrote: Deep sigh. I put up my first solar site 3 weeks ago. Today it's gone. $3,000 in hardware, poof. What do you guys do to secure them? Two of mine are on islands. You'd have to have a real nice boat to get to them. That rules out most lower tier criminals. The solar repeaters are on the property of lobstermen on the islands too. Lobstermen have limits of how much they will mess with each other, as extra-legal retribution is reality and they have to get along together on the same pieces of ocean. I hope the jerks fell of the cliff's and got hurt! It's not like the whole world even know the gear was out there. Pretty remote location, not at all publicized. Merry Christmas and a Happy New year eh? ug marlon WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Send MONEY Now!
Done, and I'm not an easy pushover for donations. Haiti is our neighbor and to say they need help is an understatement. These helpful firsthand recommendations for aid wouldn't be possible without the Internet. Getting the money routed and people organized wouldn't be efficient without the Internet. On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 10:56:24AM -0500, chris cooper wrote: This is completely off topic, but stick with me a few minutes. There is a WISP tie in here. As you all know, Haiti has been hit by a devastating earthquake. Haiti is the most impoverished country in the western hemisphere - these people were already struggling to live on a daily basis. The situation there now is horribly nightmarish. Tom Fritz, the director of Connect Ohio, is treasurer of Lifeline Christian Ministries. Tom has been very supportive of the WISP industry here in Ohio. You can learn more about Lifeline's work here: http://www.lifeline.org. Lifeline has been working in Haiti for decades. They feed the hungry, provide medical care, operate schools and provide shelter for orphaned children. I spoke with Tom this morning. He said that they have been able to communicate with their staff on the ground in Haiti and things there are getting worse by the hour. He said that many of their structures are leveled. One of their orphanages is gone and they believe scores of children housed there are dead. He said that they are out of medical supplies and have been reduced to treating amputated limbs with duct tape. Bodies are piling up. They expect thousands more to die simply because they don't have medical care, food or even water. I think it's sometimes difficult for those of us here in the US to know how to help during a crisis like this. I also know that the WISP community mobilized to help those in need after Katrina. It's time for our community to do something now. I'm asking you to give $100 today to help the people of Haiti. $100. That's less than the cost of a CPE. You can afford it. Tom assured me that 100% of your donation will pass directly to their efforts in Haiti. If you have more questions you can contact Tom directly at tfr...@connectohio.org. To give your $100 now you can go here: http://www.lifeline.org/2003/html/currentList.htm If you for some reason would rather not give to Lifeline you can go here to give your $100: www.doctorswithoutborders.org www.redcross.org http://www.oxfam.org/en/emergencies Don't look away from this horrible crisis. It's only $100. Give now. Thanks, Chris Cooper Intelliwave LLC WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Network Gigabit Switch Recommendations
I'd go for HP procurve. Lifetime warranty to prove the cisco like quality. Excellent documentation. Free software upgrades for life. New/Used doesn't really matter. On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 09:24:06PM -0800, Scott Vander Dussen wrote: Need to upgrade several 10/100 switches to 10/100/100; I'm looking for recommendations on good reliable equipment. Will need 24 and 48 port units, Rx/Tx port mirroring is a must! Thanks in advance, Scott WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT - Glad I Didn't Buy an iPhone
I can make change by either math or the count to 100 method, but I'll stick up for the guy a little bit. After taking 5 calculus classes, differential equations, discrete mathematics, and algorithms, my ability to do simple addition and subtraction was permanently impaired. I studied CS instead of math, but math was an important part of the program. On Thu, Jan 07, 2010 at 03:44:43PM -0500, RickG wrote: We must live parallel lives! I stopped at an Arbys for lunch a while back in a college town. The register was out. My total was $5.15. I gave the kid a $10 and a quarter. He handed me 4 ones and a dime. I asked him to rethink the change. He scratched his head and finally the manager came over and corrected the situation. I asked the kid if he was going to college there. He said yes. I asked what his major was and he replied I'm a math major. -RickG On Thu, Jan 7, 2010 at 2:42 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote: Trust me. I've seen it and I've lived it. I used to have to teach these kids to make change. I'd say, Can you count from one to a hundred? *YUP!* Then you can make change. Many still didn't get it.. sigh.. A customer owes 30 bucks and they give you 2 twenties.. How much do you owe them back? I'd say.I dunno.. would be the answer. You can't count from 30 to 40? I don't really fault the schools, a lot of it has to do with experience. If you never needed it, you don't have it. Brain cells that is. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 2:19 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT - Glad I Didn't Buy an iPhone Obviously you've never seen a cash register worker count change when the machine is broken. Longest 10 minutes of my life. I just tipped them the $2 and change. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources. --- Albert Einstein On Thu, Jan 7, 2010 at 2:03 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote: That reminds me of a trip I took to Italy a few years ago. I ride the city busses when I travel and the busses were running really, really late. A bus pulled up and the sign on the front, where a street name would be, was a Dump Error and inside the bus the routes and schedules were normally on video screens but they kept blue screening. Windows XP. The entire bus system was on XP (In ENGLISH even!) and the main server crashed causing all the busses to be lost. I was just flabbergasted, whatever that means. I kept saying, Just drive the damn bus! I still haven't a clue how a server crash can stop a guy from driving a bus from here to there Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 1:53 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT - Glad I Didn't Buy an iPhone I'd like to just not have to reboot my phone every time I want to check my visual voicemail or get online Kevin, is your phone running Windows? LOL, couldn't resist. Scottie -- Original Message -- From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2010 00:49:33 -0500 Kevin - that's your phones fault, not ATT. As much as I hate admitting that. VVM works on the latest update of the Bold. On 1/7/10, Kevin Neal ke...@safelink.net wrote: I'd like to just not have to reboot my phone every time I want to check my visual voicemail or get online.ATT sucks around here, so far. Voice is ok, datamuch to be desired. -Kevin On Wed, Jan 6, 2010 at 7:37 PM, Jeremie Chism jchi...@gmail.com wrote: I think droid is definitely going to be the way to go considering apple has to approve everything before it is allowed. But at the time when the iPhone first came out it was a big leap forward. Especially being able to telnet into our routers and make changes or remotely reboot cpe units. Also logmein on iPhone is a great help. It has gotten to where I don't think I could be without. I start experiencing withdrawal after about an hour. Sent from my iPhone Begin forwarded message: From: Jack Unger jun...@ask-wi.com Date: January 6, 2010 4:11:34 PM CST To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] OT - Glad I Didn't Buy an iPhone Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Thank God I'm not addicted to rushing out and buying the latest consumer gadget. If I HAD rushed
Re: [WISPA] StarOS Operator gets Stimulus Funding
I think it's probably a case of the ISP wanting to get it feet wet and prove itself. The'll do it right, get some press, and apply for a bigger project in another round. On Thu, Jan 07, 2010 at 11:12:33PM -0500, Tom DeReggi wrote: Yes, that is a very good point. BUT... He can use the profit from the deployed network to pay those auditing fees. I'd be more concerned about the statement that service was for a community of 600 and he might need to build to serve everyone. $106k is a bit tight to cover 600 people. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Charles Wu c...@cticonnect.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 7:33 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS Operator gets Stimulus Funding A precondition to accepting stimulus money is to submit to an annual 3rd party CPA audit (which generally costs $10-15k / year) -- he's probably going to lose money on the deal... Oops... -Charles -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 8:36 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS Operator gets Stimulus Funding Hi, I have to say I'm not impressed... $106,000 loan could have been gotten with a leasing company, without all the government ties and restrictions. Travis Microserv Matt Larsen - Lists wrote: Aloha Broadband, a WISP in Hawaii that runs 100% StarOS, was one of the first 18 companies to receive broadband stimulus money. Looks like the total scope of the project was also a lot more reasonable than some of the other ones. http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jgqG0W8KNsbeVueTYPRDKYHqy8twD9CLQMJ02 Matt Larsen vistabeam.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.560 / Virus Database: 270.12.26/2116 - Release Date: 5/15/2009 6:16 AM WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] TrangoLink45 Link Problem
There was one firmware version where the adaptive modulation didn't adapt back up properly. I'd also add making sure the firmware is up to date. On Fri, Jan 08, 2010 at 12:35:40PM -0500, Tom DeReggi wrote: Scott, You are doing the right thing targetting a -60 rssi. We design most of our TLINKs to operate there, because they can distort after -58 and maximum RSSI is beneficial for top modulation. I see two relevent topics to address. 1) Why its dropping on one end, and 2) How well does Adaptive modulation work. WE ALWAYS LEAVE ADAPTIVE MODULATION OFF AND HARD SET BEST MODULATION for Tlinks. My personal feeling is that Tlink's adaptive modulation does not work well. We have found that it will stay on channels that are bad for to long. For example, if 54mod had 80% loss, and 36mod had 20% loss, and 24mod had zero loss, its not uncommon for the link to set it self to 36 mod and operate as a compromised link. We found that reducing packet loss is more important for TCP Throughout, that LAyer2 speed. Trango considers layer2 for picking best modulation and does not consider effect to TCP congestion control algorithyms. We just dont trust the Adaptive Modulation. Dont misunderstand me, we LOVE TLink-45s, they are our favorite radio under 30mbps, and work great when we hard set modulation. We rely on Linktest to establish what modulation is best to set each radio on. Meaning which modulation has least packet loss. As you know, each side can work at a different modulation. So it can take some playing to find the best modulation for each side. Sure it is possible that you have a bad radio on one end, and if you cant solve, would be worth swapping the radio. But I'd consider that as a last resort. Its very common to have noise floors that are different on one side of a link than the other. And it can be very common to have noise over a large number of channels. Remember Wifi channelsare 10Mhzspace off that of Trango, and some full duplex radio space their channels far apart. So one competitor's radio can sometimes chew up a lot of free channels. Have you tried both polarities? Or just channels. You have a perfect case for showing the high value of Trango. They give you the tool to solve this. You need to rely on Trango's embedded Spectrum scanning feature. You need to know the noise floor on BOTH sides to progress in troubleshooting this. On each side, run the spectrum scan on every channel, and copy to note pad, and compare noise floor picked up. Peak noise is most relevent.. Remember it takes 30db of SNR to reliably work at 54mb. And about 20-25db to operate at 36mb. But it only takes about 12db SNR to operate at 12mbps. Lastly, you should not judge whether your hardware is working well by what modulation is detected. Instead rely on Linktest to view packet loss at each modulation. That will give you clues. For example, if you have a bad radio, maybe its likely you might get packet loss on all your modulations of similar percentages. If packet loss drops proportionally to modulation (ex, 54mb 90%, 48 80%, 36mb 60%, 24mb 40%), you can be certain packet loss is proportional to the SNR, and therefore most likely truely a noise source interfering with you. If the RU is the one going to tx at 12mb, at a first glance it would be probable that the noise is at the MU side. But do not rely on that assumption. We have found otherwise many times. I'm assuming you are using integrated panels at 2 miles. If not, and using pigtails, make sure both side have the pigtails going to the correct polarities. We've had cases where tech's made a mistake and reverse the radio pigtail on one side, but because the radio is so close, and autoTXpower was on, it still worked and had similar RSSI on each end. So it was important to verify that TX power is hard set to the same value on BOTH sides. We decoverd our mistake, simply by swapping the polarity just on the near radio, and watching the packet loss go away, then verified with site visit. But if TX powers hard set equally, and equal RSSI, polarity is probably correct. Also remember that alignment is not symetrical to the other side. Or I should say Multi-path is not always symetrical. In theory, a reflective path is symetical if each side's Transmitted signal hits the same shape object that reflects the signal. But in many environments in the real world that are not the condition of reflective opject. For example an object shaped like 1\ . If getting multi-path on one side, its feasible that the RSSI could still be equal. Again, this is not a likely the cause, when you have a short LOS link, and can see everything in the path. But I can give you one example, where we had a panel mount loosen, and the panel fell pointed down to the roof, but because close and autopowerleveing, the link stayed up, but the link was established through
Re: [WISPA] Wimax gear
On Mon, Jan 04, 2010 at 05:28:49PM -0600, Wallace Walcher wrote: Having built my WISP from scratch with my own resources and currently being debt free in my operations, I often wonder who the people are who so quickly classify Mikrotik and Ubiquity gear as trash. I am making a very good living deploying such trash. I'm not ashamed of calling their bluff when they say something is carrier class, and it's not even released yet and then has firmware their either sets the timing wrong to the point of destroying the link or doesn't do vlans, and the firmware isn't pulled offline because it's the best stuff available. I've got a couple UBNT M links up and like them, and believe it has a future. I just can't put my whole business on the line while they refine a product. It is wise and irrestible to try the stuff though. I've got a downtown network of UBNT 802.11 gear, and the nanos and bullets just can't handle the interference as I'd like. It was intended to be an upgrade from the breezecom FH gear which was slow but reliable. The UBNT is faster, but less reliable in the presence of local interference. Now, if someone has an interference problem, we immediately swap them over to Alvarion 5.4 gear. It is more expensive, but we know we'll never have a service call after it's put in unless it gets hit by lightning or the customer wants to upgrade. We would have been wise to upgrade straight from the old stuff to 5.4. I'd still recommend the UBNT CPE for truly rural use. Then MT is always making something wonky. A couple years ago, you could crash the MT with a SNMP query. Now, if you put an N card in and upgrade the firmware in your 433ah to 4.4, you might lose the ethernet ports. I stay 1-4 months behind on their firmware because it's a mystery what you might get. Changelogs show less than half of what they change. I do like them for basic routing and also use their gear for a few links. I think it's a step up from UBNT for ptp 802.11 based links. I also like MT because it's pretty low power use, which has practical value for solar sites or sites needing long battery backup. We don't have the time to tinker to use it for everything. We tried 900 with SR9 then XR9 and the reliability wasn't there compared to what we were accustomed to with Trango and Alvarion. Once you get to say 1000+ customers, things like having the staff for service calls and time to repair for customers are often more important than the brand of radio or the original cost of the radio. We do spend more on payroll than radios, despite deploying lots of expensive gear. Keeping CPE prices down is appreciated and important, but less tangible ongoing management, troubleshooting, and repair costs must also be considered. The reduction in support costs isn't an expection, it's a reality and requirement in many situations. A minor glitch that affects a few customers outside of town is not a big deal, but if the glitch requires half a day on the road or requires aircraft, boats, snowcats, or sleds, it could cost hundreds of dollars and mess up a lot of customers. I'd fear for my welfare if everything was built on UBNT and MT though. We use Alvarion 900, 2.4 (not going forward), 5.4, 5.8, Trango (lots of 900 installed, but not going forward), MT, UBNT, and now Solectek and Radwin. My WISP is pretty low debt 100% privately owned and financed, and we often choose higher end equipment. You do get what you pay for, but of course there are diminshing returns the higher end you go. My perception is they are either people who are not spending their own money - they are working for the investor, or possibly borrowing or leasing the equipment, or they are a vendor promoting their own high margin goods. Those that are WISPs seem to have the perception that it is better to install higher cost equipment, no matter what the cost, if it will provide them an expected reduction in support costs. What I have found in my area is that people who deploy such equipment have a very hard go of it, mainly because the replacement costs during the storm season eat their lunch. My operational plan is different than some - I focus on residential customers on the outskirts of town that do not have access to Cable and DSL. Those focusing on business accounts in cities would understandably have a different perspective. But I feel very fortunate to have a sub $200 total CPE cost (sometimes sub $100) with the Mikrotik-type solution. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL
Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti ready for prime time?
We've been using the pacw wideband dual pole 2' and 3' solid dishes. On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 01:13:26AM -0500, Scott Carullo wrote: What antenna of choice are you using for rockets jp? Scott Carullo Brevard Wireless 321-205-1100 x102 From: jp j...@saucer.midcoast.com Sent: Monday, December 21, 2009 2:44 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti ready for prime time? I would suggest trying it on a small project or two first. I've not been satisfied with the normal nanostation gear for urban/suburban use. The rocketm's have been great for ptp backhaul so far, despite some manual tweeking to override their software's distance ack shortcoming. On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 08:35:00AM -0600, Mike wrote: I was almost ready to pull the trigger on some Ubiquiti equipment for a new project. The scent of low price is alluring. Then I start reading about connectors pulling out, connectors not soldered on properly, and the wrong boot code on boards. Is it too early? Should I wait a bit before I dive in? Has the haste to get product into the distribution stream compromised quality control? Is the low price just too good to be true? I'd be interested in some constructive thoughts and analysis. Thanks mg -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Wireless backhauls for Cell Carriers
On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 09:24:34PM -0500, Matt Liotta wrote: That doesn't seem inline with any of the RFPs. Generally speaking, the carriers that want TDM only want it for voice and generally don't require more than 5 T1s for voice. Almost all of the carriers now seek Ethernet for for data. Almost always, the request is between 10Mbps and 100Mbps per tower. That doesn't seem too difficult. Look, if we can't get 10-100mbps to a tower, we're doomed in a short time. Our towers are often close to cell towers, and a high margin microwave link to our tower, paid for by the cell folks recurring payment would really improve our sites, then we'd run fiber over to the cell phone company shelter. We'd win with the upgrade and revenue, and they wouldn't have to build fiber or pay more rent for a microwave backhaul. Not to say that it is easy. CDMA-based carriers for example have stringent clocking requirements for their TDM that doesn't appear solvable with TDD radios. Further, the carriers that want Ethernet want straight layer2 between their tower and MSO. This generally means that the aggregate amount of backhaul exceeds radio capability the further away from the MSO you get. Unless you have a fiber partner or have fiber yourself then forget it. -Matt On Dec 23, 2009, at 6:06 PM, 3-dB Networks wrote: Don, Unless your backhaul can support TDM natively and can deliver over 500Mbps just to them (which from what I understand the carriers are really believing they will need), I don't think the average carrier would be interested in collocating if that is what you were thinking of. The more immediate concern to WISP's should be carriers like Clearwire/Sprint gobbling up licensed spectrum for their backhauls in my opinion. It's a very real concern in markets where Clearwire has deployed... and is only going to become more of a concern going forward. 60GHz and 80GHz are going to get a big boost though. Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com dan...@3-db.net -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Robert West Sent: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 3:57 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wireless backhauls for Cell Carriers Some of us have discussed doing that but it takes more than just a few of us. If enough were on board it would be a win/win for those involved. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Don Renner Sent: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 5:37 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: [WISPA] Wireless backhauls for Cell Carriers A coordinated effort by WISPA to provide some of the necessary backhauls, seems like a good idea. http://www.rcrwireless.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20091223/INFRASTRUCTUR E/912219995/ Don Renner NetsurfUSA, Inc. 8550 W. Main St. French Lick, IN 47432 812-936-4514 Office 812-936-2006 Fax 812-521-1876 Cell dren...@netsurfusa.net mailto:dren...@helixtec.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and
Re: [WISPA] Testing radios
Your plan sounds good. We have a guy take the radios and a laptop up to the third floor of our building where we have LOS to multiple APs of ours of multiple technologies. He'll make them associate, evaluate signal levels, run some traffic over it, and if it's good, set it back to defaults. Part of sending a guy away from his desk to test them is to eliminate the constant interruptions that have prevented the person from getting to that big stack of questionable gear. Many radios are broken due to bad pigtails/jumpers, bad power supplies, etc.. If it's an Alvarion radio, we look into the log files as well for clues. On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 01:43:56PM -0800, Kristian Hoffmann wrote: Hi, We tend to get radios back from techs with notes that say something like bad radio or low signal. Things that aren't obviously broken tend to sit around and collect dust. Does anyone have a efficient way to test 802.11a/b/g radios? Most of our equipment is MikroTik, so my plan was to do a conductive test between a known good radio and the radio in question with 80 dB or so of attenuator stacked between them, check the rx signal on both ends, and run a bw test for a set amount of time. Is there anything else that I should take into consideration, or perhaps a completely different approach? I was looking at these attenuators... http://www.minicircuits.com/pdfs/UNAT-30+.pdf I don't think precision is really an issue as long as they're consistent from one test to another. Thanks, -- Kristian Hoffmann System Administrator kh...@fire2wire.com http://www.fire2wire.com Office - 209-543-1800 | Fax - 209-545-1469 | Toll Free - 800-905-FIRE WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti ready for prime time?
I would suggest trying it on a small project or two first. I've not been satisfied with the normal nanostation gear for urban/suburban use. The rocketm's have been great for ptp backhaul so far, despite some manual tweeking to override their software's distance ack shortcoming. On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 08:35:00AM -0600, Mike wrote: I was almost ready to pull the trigger on some Ubiquiti equipment for a new project. The scent of low price is alluring. Then I start reading about connectors pulling out, connectors not soldered on properly, and the wrong boot code on boards. Is it too early? Should I wait a bit before I dive in? Has the haste to get product into the distribution stream compromised quality control? Is the low price just too good to be true? I'd be interested in some constructive thoughts and analysis. Thanks mg -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] stimulus announcements thus far
Working with GWI beats working with Fairpoint. They are a skilled and fair project leader. Any participant will have the same advantages provided by the project and could tap in at any splice point on the rings. I counter that it's not a monopoly if no provider can have more than 25% of it. You suggest it might be bad for small providers? It should lower barriers of entry for small providers to kick it up a notch to the next level of service. I'm going to figure out how to exploit three ring binder everywhere it makes business sense. Places where it doesn't, we've got other technologies like wireless. Wireless last mile is one of the intended uses of the project and that has been publicized. Places where it's too far to easily travel, we'll leave it up to a variety of other providers. Getting off Fairpoint is indeed a brilliant goal many ISPs share; I only have a few pots lines from them now. On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 12:11:57PM -0500, Curtis Maurand wrote: You'd have to ask him. I know that he's in the DSL business and is interested in being Maine's phone company. This project not only provides relief for the desparate middle mile in maine, but if you look at the map on the project website (http://www.threeringmaine.com/map.html ) you'll see that it talks about GWI (Great Works Internet) central offices. That puts GWI in control and if your an independent ISP in Maine, I'd be working that there is oversight and that there is no huge advantage for GWI in the deal. After all, he gets to build the network and he doesn't have to foot the bill for it. Yes it means jobs for Maine, but only a handful. As I said, he's been interested in overbuilding (Fairpoint/Verizon) for years, ever since I installed his first 8 modems back in the 90's. He's built quite a business. He's no shrinking violet, He's brilliant, shrewd and patient. Cheers, Curtis On 12/18/2009 11:29 AM, Aaron D. Osgood wrote: Curt - wouldn't Mr. Kittredge be open to discussing using wireless to extend the last mile? Aaron D. Osgood Streamline Solutions L.L.C P.O. Box 6115 Falmouth, ME 04105 TEL: 207-781-5561 FAX: 615-704-8067 MOBILE: 207-831-5829 aosg...@streamline-solutions.net http://www.streamline-solutions.net Introducing Efficiency to Business since 1986. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Curtis Maurand Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 10:44 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] stimulus announcements thus far I'm from Maine. Its good for Mainers. Its better for GWI and Fletcher Kittredge who's been looking to overbuild Fairpoint for a very long time. Now he gets his chance. Its going to be bad for the small provider. You're still not going to get a break on connectivity. It will follow GWI's usual pricing model which is very expensive. He's going to get a more advantageous deal for GWI retail and federal money to do the deal. He doesn't even have to put up much of his own money to get it done. Talk about an inside game. Trading one monopoly for another is not good. It does inject a third player into the game, though and that's good. On 12/17/2009 2:17 PM, Josh Cheney wrote: Speaking as someone from Maine, and who knows a bit about what that plan entails, it is an excellent project. On 12/17/09 2:10 PM, Robert West wrote: On the outside, that all sounds like reasonable choices and towards the actual goal. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 1:41 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] stimulus announcements thus far A $33.5 million grant to the North Georgia Network Cooperative for a fiber-optic ring that will bring high-speed Internet connections to the northern Georgia foothills of the Appalachian Mountains. The project will serve an eight-county area with a population of 334,000. A $25.4 million grant to the Biddleford Internet Corp., a partnership between the University of Maine and service providers, to build three fiber-optic rings across rural Maine. The network will pass through more than 100 communities with 110,000 households and will connect 10 University of Maine campuses. A combined grant/loan of $2.4 million to the Consolidated Electric Cooperative in north central Ohio to build a 166-mile fiber network that will be used, among other things, to connect 16 electrical substations to support a smart grid project. A 4G wireless network to be built by an Alaska Native Corporation in southwestern Alaska, a fiber-to-the-home project in a remote corner of New Hampshire and computer centers for 84 libraries in Arizona. -Matt
Re: [WISPA] stimulus announcements thus far
It's a mix of miracles, talent, and deparation. Usually when the state government gets involved, Fairpoint (or whoever owns the phone company this week) manages to use their role in government to screw things up good. It's a miracle that didn't happen succesfully. The backers AND planners are talented folks. Biddeford is the oldest Internet provider in the state (about a year older than us), and has worked with all the Internet providers (including us and competitors) and the university for planning/designing it properly from the ground up. The planners here are the talent. We all firmly believe the economics and expansion of Internet will be better with this than without. As far as I know this project has been planned exclusively by small clecs, ISPs, and the university. Maine (and NH and VT) has a bankrupt phone company that has been shafting everyone for more than a decade. Prior to that, we were just a backwoods place where hand-me-down telco gear was installed when it wasn't good enough for Boston. It's the Internet supercowpath. The major ubiquitous fiber owners in Maine are the cable companies (which were recently bankrupt) and they don't have to share their fiber because of Brand-X, and they can't run fiber places they dont have franchise agreements for, since they'd have to cover the whole town. And then there is Fairpoint. Verizon skipped town with a 2+ billion dollars sellout and we got a debt ridden replacement with the same people, same plant, and different name. Fairpoint has fought at every level of government as a Bell to not have to provide wholesale access of anything whenever possible. Fairpoint has also been in big lawsuits preventing other companies from deploying fiber (see fairpoint/verizon versus oxford networks.) Thus, the only wide spread fiber is stuff bought with the blood of lawyers before wholesale agreements were nullified. Without wholesale access, prices are really such Fairpoint doesn't want to sell it, like thousands a month for just a local loop. Many people either want redundancy from fairpoint (a fair business need), or are looking to drop fairpoint like a lead balloon. There are also many places where fairpoint does not go, regardless of the price. Consumers can have a choice by porting to a cell phone or voip, but ISPs and large institutions haven't had any options for redundancy or a future when it comes to a better Internet middle mile. For the first time ever, people are starting to realize a duopoly isn't sufficient or ideal, especially when the Bell doesn't have the money to deploy end user DSL on schedule. On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 02:24:08PM -0500, Robert West wrote: So how did it get through? :) -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Cheney Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 2:17 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] stimulus announcements thus far Speaking as someone from Maine, and who knows a bit about what that plan entails, it is an excellent project. On 12/17/09 2:10 PM, Robert West wrote: On the outside, that all sounds like reasonable choices and towards the actual goal. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 1:41 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] stimulus announcements thus far A $33.5 million grant to the North Georgia Network Cooperative for a fiber-optic ring that will bring high-speed Internet connections to the northern Georgia foothills of the Appalachian Mountains. The project will serve an eight-county area with a population of 334,000. A $25.4 million grant to the Biddleford Internet Corp., a partnership between the University of Maine and service providers, to build three fiber-optic rings across rural Maine. The network will pass through more than 100 communities with 110,000 households and will connect 10 University of Maine campuses. A combined grant/loan of $2.4 million to the Consolidated Electric Cooperative in north central Ohio to build a 166-mile fiber network that will be used, among other things, to connect 16 electrical substations to support a smart grid project. A 4G wireless network to be built by an Alaska Native Corporation in southwestern Alaska, a fiber-to-the-home project in a remote corner of New Hampshire and computer centers for 84 libraries in Arizona. -Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] stimulus announcements thus far
On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 03:04:28PM -0600, Chadd Thompson wrote: Just curious but how will this work out for you guys in the end? Is it going to just give you guys access to middle mile facilities or is it going to give you access to wholesale fiber to the home? Primarily middle-mile/2nd mile facilities. It will help us keep up with bandwidth demand to the last mile like we all supplied comment for a few weeks ago with the WISPA survey in support of additional spectrum. It's not a replacement for spectrum, as it doesn't go everywhere. It will partially enable ISPs to build spurs off the ring to do small FTTH projects that are not doable now due to no middle mile. It will also let us (and other ISPs) offer higher end services to big business customers that can afford it. The way I see it is in our area if the rural areas ever get FTH most of us out here are done because there just is no way to compete with fiber in the wireless world. Join the fiber rush instead of fight it. It's not that hard technically and it is very future proof and low maintenance. It's just more money up front per customer. We do wireless, DSL, dialup, and now some fiber, and consider ourselves technology agnostic. We like wireless alot and are well known for that, but we're also pragmatic. We expect to continue to grow in mostly wireless and fiber. We may even grow in DSL if we can get our wholesale DSL provider into more COs as a result of the middle mile project. You can also use fiber to bring bandwidth to your towers when you outgrow your backhauls. As data uses increase, you have to weight the cost of dark fiber versus expensive backhaul upgrades every couple of years. The fiber access could also make the wireless sites more attractive to lucrative cell carrier leasees. I wouldn't see anything good coming out of a government funded FTH project in IL for the small ISP's. Now if it was just middle mile facilities that the ISP's could hook into then yeah it would provide a future for us. Chadd -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of jp Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] stimulus announcements thus far It's a mix of miracles, talent, and deparation. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Anyone have nanostation m5 in stock?
We just got some rocket5m stock. We needed 2, but ordered 6 because we never know where/when more might be in stock. It's guys like us that cause inventory to fluctuate on the demand side. I do hope they improve in their supply. Until then, the gear is cheap enough that we'll continue to order more than we have immediate need for. I'm pretty much done buying their regular nanostations, the pattern is just not defined enough and the pick up lots of interference in all but the most rural of applications. I think MT behaves better for 802.11 in interference situations. I think the rocket 5m stuff is super nice though. We've only used it with dishes, and it rocks at that as long as you tweek the distance setting, have the right firmware, etc... On Fri, Dec 11, 2009 at 12:19:22PM -0500, Robert West wrote: I'm with ya. With MT, a 411 is around 50, the card 30 or so, then a mimo antenna ?? and shipping and you're way past the hundred. I talked to StreakWave this morning, salesman told me UBNT is making a push to always be in stock after the first of the year and if that's true, lots of my stress will be gone. We're in business to add and keep customers but it's hard to add when we can't put in a CPE and with all the substitutions I've put in it gets to be a hassle. People won't wait for an install. It's now or they go elsewhere. You know how it is, hate leaving money on the table. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of os10ru...@gmail.com Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 11:52 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Anyone have nanostation m5 in stock? Yeah, I'm doing Bullets to tide me over too. But with the bullets there's no mimo unfortunately. Sure wish there was an MT offering that had router board and radio (or RB and integrated radio) with enclosure antenna all for $100 or less. Oh yeah, and it be in stock more often then out of stock. Greg On Dec 11, 2009, at 11:46 AM, Robert West wrote: I was looking all over yesterday and the day before. Only found them in Europe so I gave up. Some UBNT stuff being delivered, from what I hear, first part of next week, dunno what though. So I'm back ordered on what I needed and installing bullets and grids till I get it. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of os10ru...@gmail.com Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 11:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Anyone have nanostation m5 in stock? Just need two. Greg WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Insurance....
I run a Maine WISP, and we use the state government choice health insurance. We feel providing health insurance is an important benefit to attracting and retaining quality workers of all ages, especially young ones with families. I idealogically disfavor our states plan, but it saved us money over the other choices, and we like our business to stay in the black a little bit, our decision to use it is a strict financial choice. First, Maine has lots of older folks who come here to retire (and eventually die), and the young people tend to move out after high school or college because housing costs have grown and opportunity hasn't as much. Thus, we have a disproportionate of expensive to keep healthy citizens. Our state also has large areas that are economically disadvantaged, where recreational pharmaceuticals, marijuana, and Allen's coffee brandy are major economic players. We also have a state goverment that bounces back and forth between independent centrist and leftist. Our state government is highly impressionable by lobbyists based on my broadband/telecom interactions with state government. Folks get elected because they are nice community oriented people, not because of political idealogy when it comes to local politics. State regulation of insurance has meant that there are typically 2-3 choices of insurance/hmo companies on the market, none of which are great deals. I don't understand all of it, but something in their regulations prevents more companies from providing insurance in Maine. This is not only for health insurance, but for automotive insurance as well. So the state created this idealist governemnt health care option called dirigo, which is the state motto. It was going to do great things and save us lots of money and create more choices. But the regulations remained, and dirigo just has been a commerical insurnace company being the low bid operator, and the government provided some discounts and entitlements to go along with it, along with rebranding it as their own. Our insurance cards have both digiro and the underlying providers' name on it. After about the first year of the plan, they were losing big money on it, so it was closed to most new applicants to prevent more money loss. Sort of a lose money on every customer, but make up for it with bulk like the dialup ISPs did in their heyday. That's why it doesn't have as many users as originally planned. It continues to operate rebadging private health insurance, adding discounts, entitlements, etc.. and is paid for by a tax on private insurance. Something tells me this deters competition more than anything. It's only marginally cheaper, meaning it's costs are a year or two behind the market. I would not call it a success. It's a government business failure that's kept alive by taxes. Nothing was innovative about it. Some credit is deserved for trying, but the implementation is what naysayers expected. On Tue, Dec 08, 2009 at 11:08:09AM -0500, Jeff Broadwick wrote: The Massachusetts and Maine programs have blown through their budgets...I don't think Maine even signed up as many people as they expected. Regards, Jeff Jeff Broadwick ImageStream 800-813-5123 x106 (US/Can) +1 574-935-8484 x106 (Int'l) -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Tuesday, December 08, 2009 10:49 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Insurance I support a system for people that truly cannot afford it themselves. Just pulling a number out of thin air, but I'd imagine that's only 5% of the population. My parents crested $40k in annual income not long ago, yet we (family of 5) always had everything we needed to live and grow, including healthcare. I believe Illinois recently expanded their income requirements for the low income government health program to $75k for a family of 4. Excuse me? In going a little bit off topic (Hey, this conversation is relevant to any business, regardless of it going anywhere or not.) Why can't this and most federal programs be done on a state level? I believe Massachusetts has had government healthcare for a couple years. Let them have it and let Texas not! Let Massachusetts have government social security, welfare, etc. and Texas not! (No, I don't live in Texas, but it's a largely populated conservative state.) - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: David E. Smith d...@mvn.net Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 10:30 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Insurance On Mon, Dec 7, 2009 at 22:06, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com wrote: Um, thats what happens now. I pay mine and you pay yours. So, wheres the problem? Oh ya, there are those that cant or choose not to. So now we want to force
Re: [WISPA] 5.8 Grids
We've noticed 5.8 grids are far more affected by icing than 2.4 or 900. Ice buildup isn't different, just attenuation is. We stick to solid dishes or flat panels for 5.8. On Tue, Dec 08, 2009 at 11:05:01AM -0500, Michael Baird wrote: I've been testing a few 5.8 grids for some p2p applications we are developing. I had some Pac Wireless 26db's from old stock, I brought in some Poynting 31's for testing, the Poynting's actually do worse then then Pac Wireless which was rated 5 db less. I'm looking for other Grids I should be looking at (reasonably priced)? From our experiences with 2.4 the Grid vendor seems to make a difference. Regards Michael Baird WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] One long @#$% day!
I don't think an rb14 can handle the power need of multiple XR cards. I'd suggest unless you have a good reason besides saving $100, either use routerboards or stick to manufactured radio systems from a reputable and reliable manufacturer. You pay more money or give up a little flexibility, but it gives YOU more time to gain customers, sleep, etc... I love tinkering as much as the next guy, and I have a a variety of MT links, but I stick to familiar and trusted components despite the alluring variety of parts out there. Far Far outnumbering MT radios on my network are brand name radios from folks like Alvarion, Trango, and others. If I built all my radios and APs, I'd be out of business in a hurry as I'd be working full time tinkering instead of running an ISP, or hiring staff to build radio equipment instead of installing and taking care of customers. On Mon, Dec 07, 2009 at 03:49:59AM -0800, MDK wrote: It's 2:30 AM... I just drove up to the house, and walked VERY fast inside. After all, weather.com says that it's 12 degrees and an 8 MPH wind. In their head, maybe.Outside of the little valley I live in, the wind's more like 25 mph. There's no snow on the ground. I don't make a habit of staying up late, but last night, I was doing one of those let's just have some fun looking around sessions on EBAY. Next thing I knew, it was nearly 3AM. Without shutting anything down, I just crawled into bed. At 8:45 my cell phone rang... I didn't answer it, but I did get up. Looked at my computer and Peer Monitor says... nothing is connected.Now, I have had some issues with one of the dist points a few miles outside of town.It had randomly locked up 3 times last week. Each time, I thought I had found the problem and not worried about it. The first time for instance, it was extremely dense fog, and I found the ventilation fan running in the box. Thinking I had sucked in too much damp, I just shut it off and rebooted. The locked up system is a mini-itx board and RB 14 adapter card W/4 radios... Obviously, I was wrong. Something was wrong. It had run since Friday, but now it's Sun AM and PM says I've been off for 3 hours. It's died 2 other times since the fog incident, so... Houston, we have a problem... I quick yanked on some clothes and drove up the mountain to the site, used the step ladder to get to the box lid and looked in. Restarted and everything went off just fine. But, it's now done this several times. And that's not good or right. I look in the van. Spare mini-ITX board, licensed. Spare RB14, 2 spare radios, including an XR5, just like what's up there.Anyway, morning zips by, and I have an appointment in the afternoon to switch a family friend's computer out for her. So, I go to do that and she's not home. That's odd. I could have sworn she said she'd be there at 2... I wanted to be home, nice and warm and setting up the new board so I could change in in daylight tomorrow. So, I go to the workshop and do some stuff I've been putting off and ... fall asleep, waiting for an OS install to finish. When I wake up, it's after 5. Must have slept at least 15 min... Sheesh. So, I get up, drive over to house, start the project. 30 min later, my phone beeps. Text message... Site's down.ARRRGGH. 25 minute drive to the site and I reboot it.Go home, pull out the parts and start to assemble the whole thing. It goes down again . Drive back up, restart. This time, nothing will coax it into running. Finally, I pull everything out, and take it home. Now the phone's going nuts. I just put 60 customers down. I take it home, cause it's COLD out there on the hillside... and everything runs flawlessly. Just to be judicious, I grab a config backup off of it, 'cause it's changed lately and my last backup is a few weeks old. I haul it up the mountain, put it back in place... No run. So, I go home, grab the spare mini-itx, use the backup config and haul it up the mountain. Won't boot. Doesn't even beep.Power comes on, but no beep. Haul it down the mountain, back home (this is .7 miles of rocky pasture I drive through at idle in 1st gear, then 5 miles of paved road. Takes 20 min round trip) with all the parts. Runs flawlessly. Haul it back up the mountain, plug it in, boots, but locks 5 to 60 seconds after booting. Inspect EVERYTHING (it's dark, so had to do it all by flashlight) again. I see nothing. So, I grab the spare RB14, switch the radios over and plug it in. Boots. Lights flash. Fire up the laptop and no. It's not working. log in through ethernet port... NO RADIOS DETECTED. Put old RB14 back in, change one radio. Boots up. Logs in. all radios detect, data flowing to customers. Drive home. Try to thaw out. The wind up there is 25 mph and it cuts like a knife through you.
Re: [WISPA] health insurance
Another option would be to split into two companies to keep them the right size. A installation subcontracting company that loses you money might be good for your taxes. On Sat, Dec 05, 2009 at 05:50:02PM -0700, Travis Johnson wrote: Hi, What are everyone else's plans if this new health insurance plan gets passed in Congress? We fall in the 25-100 employee category, so they are estimating our health insurance costs would go up $412 per employee for us (we already cover 100% of the costs for our employees). So, basically this would force us to go to a subcontractor type work-force (at least for 5-10 of our current employees) to get us under the 25 employee limit and offer less benefits for everyone in the company. Once again, it seems our government is stepping in where it doesn't belong. Either take over the health care system 100% (including funding it), or leave it alone. Travis Microserv WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Alvarion VL Access Control
We use this for setting up VL radios, including speed. If you want to automate it, just use $1, $2 as command line variables instead of reading in answers from questions. Then you could include it in a loop that cycles through a database generated list. I wish more manufacturers actually knew something about SNMP so we could program all radios this way. Saves a lot of human error. #!/bin/bash echo -e |--| echo -e | pinging radio to check if it is there and is set to factory defaults | echo -e | hit control-C if pinging fails | echo -e |--| ping -n -c 2 10.0.0.1 echo -e |--| echo -e | what will the radio be named? | read UNITNAME echo -e | what IP address will this radio have? | read IP echo -e | This radio will have $IP echo -e | what ESSID will this radio have? | read ESSID echo -e | Speed choice: Type 1 for gold (2 down 1 up), 2 for platinum connectme (3 down 1.5 up), 3 platinum (3 down, 2 up) read SPEED echo -e | Enter the antenna gain read ANTENNA echo -e |--| CM=changeme SP=/usr/bin/snmpset -v1 -r2 -On -c SG=/usr/bin/snmpget -v1 -r2 -On -c GW=`echo $IP|cut -d. -f1-3`.1 echo -e |--| echo -e | Setting up MIR/CIR | echo -e |--| case $SPEED in 1) $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.2.0 i 2000 $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.3.0 i 1000 ;; 2) $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.2.0 i 3000 $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.3.0 i 1500 ;; 3) $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.2.0 i 3000 $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.3.0 i 2000 ;; esac $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.4.0 i 128 $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.5.0 i 128 $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.6.0 i 1000 echo -e Now setup as: echo -e MirAUtoSU `$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.2.0` echo -e MirSUtoAU `$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.3.0` echo -e CirAUtoSU `$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.4.0` echo -e CirSUtoAU `$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.5.0` echo -e MaxDelay `$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.7.6.0` echo -e CIR/MIR all setup echo -e |--| echo -e | Setting wireless menu items | echo -e |--| $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.6.1.1.0 s $ESSID $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.6.11.1.0 i 2 $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.6.13.1.0 i 2 $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.6.17.0 s $ANTENNA echo -e ESSID `$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.6.1.1.0` echo -e Best AU `$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.6.11.1.0` echo -e ATPC `$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.6.13.1.0` echo -e AntennaGain `$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.6.17.0` echo -e Done setting wireless items echo -e |--| echo -e | Setting up management items | echo -e |--| $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.2.3.0 s $UNITNAME $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.2.8.2.0 s alsochangeme $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.2.8.3.0 s changeme $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.4.1.0 a $IP $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.4.2.0 a 255.255.255.0 $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.4.3.0 a $GW echo -e Name`$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.2.3.0` echo -e Inst PW`$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.2.8.2.0` echo -e Admin PW`$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.2.8.3.0` echo -e IP address `$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.4.1.0` echo -e Netmask `$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.4.2.0` echo -e Gateway `$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.4.3.0` echo -e Done setting up manamgent items echo -e |--| echo -e | Setting up filter and network management | echo -e |--| $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.8.1.0 i 1
Re: [WISPA] RadWin 2000 5.8
I haven't tried MT 4.x yet, but the other 3.x frequency scan only showed 802.11 stuff with the same channel size too. For a half way useful scan, you'd have to scan on 5,10,20,40 mhz channel sizes and compile the results yourself. They've traditionally been weak on spectrum analysis and noise floor measurement, but I'd be glad to see that change. On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 11:31:39PM -0500, Josh Luthman wrote: Correct me if I am wrong but a spectrum analyzer would have to see only it's type of transmission or everything. Mikrotik (at least before Mike's post..) could only hear 802.11 stuff. Nothing else. Trango, Canopy, Redline, etc can all see everything in the band. I couldn't imagine Radwin's stuff hearing only Radwin. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources. --- Albert Einstein On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 11:24 PM, 3-dB Networks wi...@3-db.net wrote: I have not had a chance to personally test it... but it should detect noise regardless of the transmitting device (i.e. like Canopy, Trango, Orthogon, et. al.) Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Tom DeReggi Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2009 8:46 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] RadWin 2000 5.8 Latest firmware has a spectrum analyzer built in... A real one, sorta link Trango's and Canopy's? Or just one that sees 802.11n/a devices? Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: 3-dB Networks wi...@3-db.net To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2009 10:06 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] RadWin 2000 5.8 Latest firmware has a spectrum analyzer built in... Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2009 8:18 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] RadWin 2000 5.8 Also keep in mind someone said they bricked it while using Vista. I expect 7 to work as well if not better then Vista. I never did try WINE, but an XP VM guest works. My remark was more suggesting I do not like the menu system or layout. I found that some commands needed issued multiple times and it seemed awfully confusing when trying to set up. I would like to see a spectrum analyzer and some basic values on link quality. On 11/24/09, Patrick Shoemaker shoemak...@vectordatasystems.com wrote: Yes. Most importantly, in a pinch when you've just run over your Windows laptop with the truck on the way to the tower site, or need to make changes through a telnet session from a router, or have only your blackberry/iphone with you, etc., command line / HTTP configuration is a lifesaver. Patrick Shoemaker Vector Data Systems LLC shoemak...@vectordatasystems.com office: (301) 358-1690 x36 http://www.vectordatasystems.com Kevin Neal wrote: I would rather see a web or command line instead of anything you have to install. OS independent then, as long as they don't write it specifically for IE :( -Kevin On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 6:00 AM, os10ru...@gmail.com wrote: As a Mac OS X/Windows/Linux user (OS X natively and Windows, Linux under Fusion) I'd like to see the configuration apps be universal (Java?) or something cross platform. But I realize you can't fight city hall. So I'll always have Fusion for a small handful of apps (Mapwel, Dude, WinBox). Greg On Nov 24, 2009, at 7:54 AM, Steve Barnes wrote: Josh, you are correct we are not the same person. I live in a world that windows is operated on 90% on all business computers. I don't live in a world of nirvana that I can use just linux and life is good. Besides if I was programming an app that I wanted to reach the majority of computers why would I program for just linux. I would program for the standard. More to the point, my review was not to hack the OS of the computer the software needed to be installed on it, it was for the equipment. I don't feel your comments help anyone and put a shadow over a good product. The RadWin 2000 product is easy to configure but as Josh has pointed out you must use a windows computer to configure it. Steve Barnes RC-WiFi Wireless Internet Service -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Monday, November 23, 2009 5:27 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] RadWin 2000 5.8 Software
Re: [WISPA] Cat3 instead of Cat5
http://www.versatek.com/products/vxveb160r2.htm On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 12:06:37PM -0500, RickG wrote: Those old phone line units could only do 1Mbps. My question was: Can anyone show me reliable equipment that will do 100Mbps+ on cat 3? Not according to this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category_3_cable or my experience. If such an animal exists, I could use it, which is why I asked. We may be in game of semantics here. Can you get 100Mbps? I suppose a short cable on the bench might do it but not in the field reliably. In my experience, in order to get a reliable connection over cat 3, I had to lock down the switch ports to 10Mbps. I would never claim to know it all but I've been around the block a time or two. The windings are to cancel out EMF which can cause errors that affect speed due to transmission retries. The speed capability of a cable is due to the quality of its wire rating - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category_5_cable and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category_6_cable Obviously, by utilizing more that 2 pair, you can do some interesting things. -RickG On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 12:58 AM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote: Phone line is twisted pair and normally 2 pair. Transmit and receive. Can easily do 100mbps. You could even get it to do gigabit with not much effort. No PoE though, no pair for that. HOWEVER, the problems come from the nasty connections everyone including the phone company has made. Most phone line isn't clean like a network cable you would run. Who knows where the hell the splices and rodent chewed ends are at and if they stick with a common wiring scheme throughout the structure. If it was the best option, you could at least test and give up quickly if it fell on its face. There used to be some home networking nics that used the phone lines in the home and you could also use the phones with the things connected. That was in the late 1990's, early 2000. Some Gateway desktops came with them. I never saw them used though. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of RickG Sent: Wednesday, November 18, 2009 12:02 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cat3 instead of Cat5 That would be great! But, I cant find anything on the net except references to the standard being 10Mbps: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category_3_cable Any examples? On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 9:38 PM, Kevin Neal ke...@safelink.net wrote: With the right equipment I've heard of gigabit over rusted old barbwire! -Kevin On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 7:32 PM, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com wrote: 100Mbps on cat 3? Really? On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 4:12 PM, Forbes Mercy forbes.me...@wabroadband.comwrote: We currently run a Cat5 into the wall then put a jack into the house. My question is since you can get 100MB through a Cat3 which is the same as a phone line why can't we run the connection into their phone line? Most of our customers have cell phone only and their internal wiring is virtually unused. Thanks, Forbes WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] X86 low power board w/3 or more ethernet
I've bought these to run routerOS very successfully: http://rackmountmart.stores.yahoo.net/newrmexshor1.html looks like they have a newer faster version too. I haven't tried this yet. http://rackmountmart.stores.yahoo.net/nermexsh1ura.html As you can see they are fanless and have a laptop style DC power supply in the case. I'm sure it could be removed so you could supply your own DC power. There are many DC-DC converters for these sort applications as people use mini-itx computers in boats, cars, etc... On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 02:33:26PM -0800, MDK wrote: Looking for an x86 compatible board of some kind with at least 3 or (better) more ethernet ports. Anyone have suggestions? Needs to have enough cpu power to route full 100m ethernet speed.gigE would be even better. I've not found such a beast... but I need one where there's no ac power, no climate control... WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Cat3 instead of Cat5
Cat3 == phone line phone line != Cat3 Phone wiring doesn't even have to make the scale of categories. A lot of the phone wiring is put in daisy chained with wire nuts, by electricians, homeowners, etc... On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 01:12:10PM -0800, Forbes Mercy wrote: We currently run a Cat5 into the wall then put a jack into the house. My question is since you can get 100MB through a Cat3 which is the same as a phone line why can't we run the connection into their phone line? Most of our customers have cell phone only and their internal wiring is virtually unused. Thanks, Forbes WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] example of needing middle mile
http://pressherald.mainetoday.com/story.php?id=295654ac=PHnws Bankrupt Fairpoint backbilling and threatening an ISP/CLEC because Fairpoint doesn't want to continue an interconnection agreement. It's a bit sensationalized (according to my conversation with the ISP in the story), but shows how the big telcos care more about protecting their monopoly than promoting business, broadband, or innovation. This is why Maine needs a middle mile ARRA network such as has been applied for. Some states probably do not, but we do in Maine. Fairpoint is hopeless in every respect. -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] About Hulu and Netflix and youtube... increased data delivery is here to stay.
On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 09:17:58AM -0800, MDK wrote: I guess you could call me lucky in that I have access to darn good rates. I'm currently at $60/mbit and working to see if my provider will give me a break for doubling my commit. Continued business with you should be important. If you offer to pay the same and get more bandwidth, that should work for everyone. We're also looking at deploying either Ubnt's M based equipment or someone else's if anyone ever comes up with something workable and affordable, as an addition to our already deployed network. I've found the rocket5m to work pretty good with 2' dishes for ptp links. The speed is real and it runs well. It does needs a minor work around in that the automatic distance setting does not work, you need to manually set it, plus 15%. I can get 100mbit no problem with 20mhz spectrum. This is serious praise, as I generally prefer midrange or higher end stuff like Alvarion, Trango, and I generally have serious reservations about the cheap stuff for honest calculated reasons. We initially had a bandwidth cost of of about $6/customer, it reached a low of about $3.3 a year or two after starting, and now it's back up to a little less than $5 / customer. We've raised our rates 50 cents, cut our administrative costs by $.70 for most customers by changing to EFT payments, and now we're trying to figure out how to keep up with our expected 3X use of data transfer and still keep our bandwidth costs within our planned maximum of $8 over the next 3 years. I've never raised rates in 15 years and use that as a differentiator between us and the standard practices of the duopoly cable/telephone competition. (We keep rates a little higher to begin with) We have some strategies to help with this, one of them is to offer a premium service to residences that has higher than cable or dsl speeds for around $225-250 / mo, and it appears we can deliver this to over 90% of our service area at a moderate investment. Also, we're liscensing up big time for deploying 3.65 in a PtMP scheme over a sizeable area, as well. About a year ago, my biggest competitor began deploying stuff that looks identical to mine, though I know that it's Mikrotik inside instead of Star-OS. It's time to make that big step up and be ahead again for a while. -- From: Butch Evans but...@butchevans.com Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2009 8:44 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] About Hulu and Netflix and youtube... increased data delivery is here to stay. At 03:09 PM 11/12/2009, you wrote: I've been watching the thread about it with great interest.Partly because I was wondering if anyone was going to try my solution, which is, to attempt to be able to deliver the bandwidth to the people who want to use these, and have them work fine. Please understand, I'm not talking about a prioritizing scheme, which puts video ahead of surfing, etc. This is a good point. The fact is, that a GOOD bandwidth manager will allow traffic to flow as fast as possible. One thing to bear in mind, with regard to my QOS system, is that I don't speed limit ANYTHING. I simply prioritize traffic so that the time sensitive stuff gets out first. There is no reason to limit even P2P if there is available bandwidth. Every class that I give that covers QOS, I restate this one maxim: QOS is not simply LIMITING bandwidth. Rather, QOS is about MANAGING the available bandwidth resources. There is an important distinction there that your comments don't take into account. We're thinking about how we're going to meet the demands of the near future... not managing a shortage of bandwidth delivery. Even with sufficient bandwidth available, there are links and network infrastructure where a good QOS mechanism will benefit the network. I'm thinking of planning on a future delivery of 4 to 6 meg per customer, oversubscribed to around 4 to 6 to one. For many, 4:1 would mean out of business. Even at 10:1, many would not survive. There are places in this country where bandwidth is still quite expensive ($200/Meg would sound GOOD to some people). Even at that price, a 4:1 ratio is $50/customer before you add in ANY costs. Even 10:1 is to high. It would be NICE if the price for wholesale BW came down, but too many folks do not have the benefit of reasonable bandwidth. -- * Butch Evans * Professional Network Consultation* * http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering * * http://www.wispa.org/ * Wired or Wireless Networks * * http://blog.butchevans.com/ * ImageStream, Mikrotik and MORE! *
Re: [WISPA] About Hulu and Netflix and youtube... increaseddata delivery is here to stay.
On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 10:15:41AM -0800, MDK wrote: In some places, we do 900 gear, and that's still a $300+ install cost. Or, we eat most of it if the customer will pay a year in advance. 900 is reserved to the absolutely nothing else will work locations, as it's such a finicky and persnickety beast.Channel changes due to weather or temperature or humidity changes, and all sorts of other grief, as well, including a lot of SR9 failures. (use xr9's now) You're taking the finicky and persnickety approach to 900. We don't have that grief with Alvarion/Trango, and Canopy people probably don't have the same grief. We still reserve 900 as a last option, as it's slower and more expensive than line-of-sight options. -- From: jp j...@saucer.midcoast.com Sent: Friday, November 13, 2009 9:32 AM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] About Hulu and Netflix and youtube... increaseddatadeliveryis here to stay. On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 09:17:58AM -0800, MDK wrote: I guess you could call me lucky in that I have access to darn good rates. I'm currently at $60/mbit and working to see if my provider will give me a break for doubling my commit. Continued business with you should be important. If you offer to pay the same and get more bandwidth, that should work for everyone. We're also looking at deploying either Ubnt's M based equipment or someone else's if anyone ever comes up with something workable and affordable, as an addition to our already deployed network. I've found the rocket5m to work pretty good with 2' dishes for ptp links. The speed is real and it runs well. It does needs a minor work around in that the automatic distance setting does not work, you need to manually set it, plus 15%. I can get 100mbit no problem with 20mhz spectrum. This is serious praise, as I generally prefer midrange or higher end stuff like Alvarion, Trango, and I generally have serious reservations about the cheap stuff for honest calculated reasons. We initially had a bandwidth cost of of about $6/customer, it reached a low of about $3.3 a year or two after starting, and now it's back up to a little less than $5 / customer. We've raised our rates 50 cents, cut our administrative costs by $.70 for most customers by changing to EFT payments, and now we're trying to figure out how to keep up with our expected 3X use of data transfer and still keep our bandwidth costs within our planned maximum of $8 over the next 3 years. I've never raised rates in 15 years and use that as a differentiator between us and the standard practices of the duopoly cable/telephone competition. (We keep rates a little higher to begin with) We have some strategies to help with this, one of them is to offer a premium service to residences that has higher than cable or dsl speeds for around $225-250 / mo, and it appears we can deliver this to over 90% of our service area at a moderate investment. Also, we're liscensing up big time for deploying 3.65 in a PtMP scheme over a sizeable area, as well. About a year ago, my biggest competitor began deploying stuff that looks identical to mine, though I know that it's Mikrotik inside instead of Star-OS. It's time to make that big step up and be ahead again for a while. -- From: Butch Evans but...@butchevans.com Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2009 8:44 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] About Hulu and Netflix and youtube... increased data delivery is here to stay. At 03:09 PM 11/12/2009, you wrote: I've been watching the thread about it with great interest.Partly because I was wondering if anyone was going to try my solution, which is, to attempt to be able to deliver the bandwidth to the people who want to use these, and have them work fine. Please understand, I'm not talking about a prioritizing scheme, which puts video ahead of surfing, etc. This is a good point. The fact is, that a GOOD bandwidth manager will allow traffic to flow as fast as possible. One thing to bear in mind, with regard to my QOS system, is that I don't speed limit ANYTHING. I simply prioritize traffic so that the time sensitive stuff gets out first. There is no reason to limit even P2P if there is available bandwidth. Every class that I give that covers QOS, I restate this one maxim: QOS is not simply LIMITING bandwidth. Rather, QOS is about MANAGING the available bandwidth resources. There is an important distinction there that your comments don't take into account. We're thinking about how we're going to meet the demands of the near future... not managing a shortage of bandwidth delivery. Even with sufficient bandwidth
Re: [WISPA] About Hulu and Netflix and youtube... increased data delivery is here to stay.
I think it's something about 2x2 rocketM that is better. The only bullets I really like are Wolf Match Target in .22LR; they are almost as hard find in stock in any quantity. This is a 13 mile link using dual polarity dishes, a 2' on one end, 3' on the other, going over water. One end has multiple Alvarion 5.8 links and a trango 5.8 link on the same tower. The other ends has 2 Alvarion 5.8 sectors, and a Trango tlink45 link. The dual polarities / diversity do help reduce tidal fluctuation over water in comparison to other 5.8 non-N systems, based on my rssi graphs. Haven't tried it yet where we actually overlap frequencies with other backhauls. I do that at a couple of sites with other non-N gear. On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 12:43:40PM -0600, Matt wrote: I've found the rocket5m to work pretty good with 2' dishes for ptp links. The speed is real and it runs well. It does needs a minor work around in that the automatic distance setting does not work, you need to manually set it, plus 15%. I can get 100mbit no problem with 20mhz spectrum. I am just amazed you are getting 100mbit in 20mhz even if using both polarities. I tried the Bullet5m's and had mostly bad results on a 12 mile link with 2 foot dishes. Tried many tweaks on modems with no results. I am in the pressence of alot of other 5.8ghz gear though. Am looking at a PTP500 to replace it for alot more money. They are supposed to be much more tolerent of interference I hear. Matt WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Small Managed Switches
Some of their better managed switches do these things. Perhaps it's an incentive for people to who value those features to go upmarket a little. I do love their switches. I mostly buy used ones. I think the 26xx series can allow you to label ports. All the telnet/snmp manageable ones allow naming VLANs. All the telnet/snmp ones allow enabling/disabling ports. As far as port and vlan labeling, a database could be built to keep track of that stuff. So you just pull up the switch in your php/mysql custom display and it will show you all the ports their the labeling and vlan names. On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 07:53:10PM -0500, Nick Olsen wrote: This is my main complaint with the 1800-8G and the 1800-24G I've asked procurve to add these 3 features and got a standard we'll think about it answer. 1. Ability to label ports 2. Ability to label vlans 3. Ability to disable a port All very simple requests that can't take much in terms of memory/firmware size to implement. In terms of speed, stability, function other then the above, its a awesome switch. Nick Olsen Brevard Wireless (321) 205-1100 x106 From: Tom DeReggi wirelessn...@rapiddsl.net Sent: Wednesday, November 11, 2009 7:42 PM To: n...@brevardwireless.com n...@brevardwireless.com, WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Small Managed Switches There are several classes of VLAN switches. I'll use SMC as an example... 1) They have the higher end models that are Full VLAN support that are very intuitive and fully flexible. For example, they'll allow you to label each port in web interface. They fully refer to each ports specifying their Egress and Ingress VLAn support, etc. They allow every thing to be done. But because they are intuitive, in the web interface itself, its easy to configure them without accidentally misconfiguring another clients. They make great switches that will act as both Trunk backbone switches and end location switches. 2) then they have lower end model. They let one do almost everything with VLAN. But they are way less intuitive. And they dont work as well for dual purpose, and tend to work better as a backbone or end location switch. They lack abilty to label ports.They have confusing terminology to enable or disable like VLAN Aware that may not be specific on what VLAN functionality is enabled by making it aware. It usually takes a quick read of the manual before making a config, because the logic is not straight forward. Many Web Switches are like this. SMC and Intellinet have affordable 8 port VLAN switches that are functional, but with the firmware that is equivellent to low end VLAN switches as described in #2 above. But I beleive both have text, SNMP, serial, and Web interfaces, which give them a step up over other basic web switch products. Both models sell under $200, and have atleast 2 Gigabit ports, possibly SPF ports. I just wish someone made a 8 port VLAN switch for the low dollar cost, that had the HIGH END INTUITIVE VLAN firmware, that allowed each port to be labled in software. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Nick Olsen n...@brevardwireless.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, November 11, 2009 3:07 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Small Managed Switches Well, there is the Procurve 1800-8G that is 8 ports gigabit, Management is a little light, but it will do the simple stuff. like vlans and such. They are fanless and we have them on towers, bullet proof all day long. Nick Olsen Brevard Wireless (321) 205-1100 x106 From: Marco Coelho coelh...@gmail.com Sent: Wednesday, November 11, 2009 2:53 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Small Managed Switches I'm looking for suggestions for small (8+ ports) Managed switches. They would be installed in NEMA 4 un-cooled enclosures in the Texas heat. -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
Re: [WISPA] vlan tagging/trunking
Yes. http://cdn.procurve.com/training/Manuals/2520-ATG-Nov09-S_14_03.pdf is a pretty good overview of vlan implementation. We use vlans to keep data separate on the same switch and reduce broadcasts, scope of mistakes, etc... A MT router might use VLANs to create separate interfaces (all over the same ethernet to the switch) where different sites and their links have their own MT interfaces. We can then label a VLAN interface monhegan for instance on the MT. It will go tagged into the switch, and then untagged to the bridged radio link from our aggregating site to the monhegan site. Thus one router at an aggregating tower site, with a VLAN switch, can provide separate IP networks to each of the smaller pops served by the aggregating site. We also have separate VLAN networks for each type of ptmp gear at the tower site. I.E. One for VL gear, another for trango gear, etc... Just to keep traffic separate for management and broadcast purposes. In theory, using radio bridges that support vlan passthrough, you could have one router at the core and many many sites over many hops, using vlans the whole way to keep the traffic seperate. But we like to have routers at each of our aggregating tower sites for a variety of unrelated reasons such as internal BGP, calea, and backup link flexibility. We mostly use MT RBs connected to Procurve managed switches. For cold weather use the 1u fixed configuration switches, we have found the modular chassis/blade style switches to not handle 0f that well. (They work great indoors at normal temps though) On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 06:59:26AM -0700, Phil Curnutt wrote: Anybody out there using Vlan tagging to segment their network? Right now we are running unrouted level 1 with fixed IP's and starting to see a lot of bandwidth being eaten up with broadcast packets. Vlan tagging and trunking seems to be an easy way to segment, but we can't seem to wrap our heads around how to impliment. The easiest way seems to be tagging at the edge and then assigning switch ports along the way to direct traffic to and from the gateway router, but then someone says no you need to trunk from the router to the switchs. Any thoughts? Phil WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] CPE - who buys it?
We own the CPE radio in 95% of our installs and the router in probably 80%. Nobody wants finger pointing when things stop working. If we think it's the CPE causing an outage, we just replace it no questions asked, no fussing over who's fault it or coordinating amongst the customer and their hired techs. Our customers can replace our routers with their own or specify they don't need a router, but we can only provide the settings they need and it limits the extent of the tech support we can provide if we can't ping their router, etc... For instance if a customer has voip with us and uses our provided router, we can log into the router remotely, setup a port forward, login into their ATA if needed. We have a few seasonal customers that chose to own their own radio so they wouldn't have an off-season fee to pay. They bought them from us, we configured and installed them just like any other customer's radio. If the radio dies, they can either pony up for a new one, or sign a new contract with us where we own the radio, and we typically try to upgrade them to a newer technology if one is available. If they upgrade or leave, we let them know their purchased radio is useless unless they bring it for a factory reset or let us reset it remotely before they take it down. If someone wants WIFI AP in their house, we encourage them to do it without us. We did it for a while, and tech support is a nightmare with all the laptop drivers and different wifi products, coverage problems, OS problems, etc... Customers can not differentiate between less than ideal internal wifi and their wireless broadband fixed service. On Sun, Nov 08, 2009 at 03:24:27PM -0500, RickG wrote: I've always provided the CPE to the end user and retained ownership as part of the service. That was mostly due to the high cost of CPE in the past. With the advent of lower CPE cost, I'm considering changing that to where the customer buys their own CPE. I'd like to hear the pros and cons to this strategy. -RickG WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
