subject:"positive"

Hi Shelley. Thanks for clarifying. I really didn’t know that prednisolone could 
have negative effects on the heart. However, I have had the experience of a cat 
with a heart murmur. Eventually, after we had looked after her for a while, the 
heart murmur disappeared.

However, if your cat pants after playing for a while, you are right that one of 
the reasons may well be heart issues.

You obviously have a terrific heart to take in a feral like that and keep him 
when you found he was positive. What a nice person.

Thanks for the info. Unfortunately, though, again, I kinda feel that in some 
circumstances like FeLV, whether there are potential side-effects from some of 
the meds, there are few choices and I would probably take the risk if my cat 
was doing poorly (as mine was). Thank you though for that information, which I 
definitely did not know. I will have to keep it in mind.

Amani

From: Felvtalk  On Behalf Of Shelley Theye
Sent: October 18, 2018 6:27 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

Hi Amani,

I was speaking about corticosteroids- Prednisone or Prednisolone.  Sorry for 
any confusion.
I have a cat, Jack, with heart disease who also has IBD so he cannot have 
steroids.
I believe there is one, which is called Budesonide?  that might act more 
locally in the intestines so
it could be a bit safer if a cat has heart disease.

My FeLV positive cat Leo, who became sick quickly back in 2014, was diagnosed 
with both Lymphoma and
leukemia, his WBC count was through the roof, in the 150,000’s??  I would have 
to go back and look at the notes.
He was @ 5 years old. I trapped him in a neighbor’s yard to TNR, but
he tested positive so I kept him. Anyway, after the vet visit, for mainly 
inappetence, he went downhill
very quickly and I thought the stress of the visit, x-rays, fluids, and pred. 
might have sent him into heart failure too.
That was a guess on my part.  He was an adult feral that I tamed once he tested 
positive for FeLV, and he was so afraid
out of his environment that I never took him to get an echo.  I only suspected 
it as a possibility because he
had a murmur when he was neutered, though not later, and would pant when 
playing too much with feather toy.
Something I will never know and it has always eaten away at me.

I am not in this group much anymore, but read the messages, and just wanted to 
mention to Katy, just in case.
Hopefully not that.

Shelley








On Oct 18, 2018, at 4:59 PM, Amani Oakley 
mailto:aoak...@oakleylegal.com>> wrote:

Sorry Shelley – my email below should have read IT ISN”T prednisolone. . .

Amani

From: Felvtalk 
mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org>>
 On Behalf Of Amani Oakley
Sent: October 18, 2018 4:57 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org<mailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org>
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

Hi Shelley. Are you speaking about anabolic steroids or corticosteroids? And 
what type in particular? I think that there may be a particular steroid which 
has been linked with heart issues sometimes but it is prednisolone (which is a 
corticosteroid) and it isn’t Winstrol (which is an anabolic steroid).

Amani

From: Felvtalk 
mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org>>
 On Behalf Of Shelley Theye
Sent: October 18, 2018 4:29 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org<mailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org>
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

Hi Katy,

So sorry that Batman is going through this!

Did they look at Batman’s heart while he was at the vet hospital?  Specifically 
did they do an echocardiogram?  I am guessing that they had no reason to with 
his initial symptoms so they probably didn’t?

Maybe he has heart disease that the steroids have exacerbated... Young cats can 
have it and not have any outward symptoms.  Steroids are contraindicated with 
heart problems.  I think there is one type that can be used, but it is not 
usually given first.

Just throwing this out there just in case.  Steroids could hurt his heart if he 
has undiagnosed heart problem and maybe cause him to act like.
Not to scare you, just to get him treated for it if it is that.

Shelley



On Oct 18, 2018, at 3:27 PM, Katy Brown 
mailto:ktbrow...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Amani,
That is very insightful. I’m not convinced he has lymphoma because his decline 
was so rapid. Within hours he went from walking to having completely rigid 
legs. And today he is starting to decline. I’m wondering if there is something 
else I can give him besides the 5 mg of Prednisolone and the Clindamycin.
The vet said he he keeps declining we could do another form of Chemo which is 
very aggressive and has other side affects and would be a Hail Mary to buy him 
another few days?
I’m just not convinced he has cancer. Even though he is FeLV positive he is 
young to develop a cancer?
Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 18, 2018, at 12

Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

2018-10-18 Thread Shelley Theye

Hi Amani,

I was speaking about corticosteroids- Prednisone or Prednisolone.  Sorry for 
any confusion.
I have a cat, Jack, with heart disease who also has IBD so he cannot have 
steroids.
I believe there is one, which is called Budesonide?  that might act more 
locally in the intestines so 
it could be a bit safer if a cat has heart disease.  

My FeLV positive cat Leo, who became sick quickly back in 2014, was diagnosed 
with both Lymphoma and 
leukemia, his WBC count was through the roof, in the 150,000’s??  I would have 
to go back and look at the notes.
He was @ 5 years old. I trapped him in a neighbor’s yard to TNR, but 
he tested positive so I kept him. Anyway, after the vet visit, for mainly 
inappetence, he went downhill
very quickly and I thought the stress of the visit, x-rays, fluids, and pred. 
might have sent him into heart failure too.
That was a guess on my part.  He was an adult feral that I tamed once he tested 
positive for FeLV, and he was so afraid 
out of his environment that I never took him to get an echo.  I only suspected 
it as a possibility because he 
had a murmur when he was neutered, though not later, and would pant when 
playing too much with feather toy.
Something I will never know and it has always eaten away at me.

I am not in this group much anymore, but read the messages, and just wanted to 
mention to Katy, just in case.
Hopefully not that.

Shelley 








> On Oct 18, 2018, at 4:59 PM, Amani Oakley  wrote:
> 
> Sorry Shelley – my email below should have read IT ISN”T prednisolone. . . 
>  
> Amani
>  
> From: Felvtalk  <mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org>> On Behalf Of Amani Oakley
> Sent: October 18, 2018 4:57 PM
> To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org <mailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org>
> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.
>  
> Hi Shelley. Are you speaking about anabolic steroids or corticosteroids? And 
> what type in particular? I think that there may be a particular steroid which 
> has been linked with heart issues sometimes but it is prednisolone (which is 
> a corticosteroid) and it isn’t Winstrol (which is an anabolic steroid).
>  
> Amani
>  
> From: Felvtalk  <mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org>> On Behalf Of Shelley Theye
> Sent: October 18, 2018 4:29 PM
> To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org <mailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org>
> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.
>  
> Hi Katy,
>  
> So sorry that Batman is going through this!
>  
> Did they look at Batman’s heart while he was at the vet hospital?  
> Specifically did they do an echocardiogram?  I am guessing that they had no 
> reason to with his initial symptoms so they probably didn’t?
>  
> Maybe he has heart disease that the steroids have exacerbated... Young cats 
> can have it and not have any outward symptoms.  Steroids are contraindicated 
> with heart problems.  I think there is one type that can be used, but it is 
> not usually given first.  
>  
> Just throwing this out there just in case.  Steroids could hurt his heart if 
> he has undiagnosed heart problem and maybe cause him to act like.
> Not to scare you, just to get him treated for it if it is that.
>  
> Shelley   
>  
>  
>  
> 
> On Oct 18, 2018, at 3:27 PM, Katy Brown  <mailto:ktbrow...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>  
> Amani,
> That is very insightful. I’m not convinced he has lymphoma because his 
> decline was so rapid. Within hours he went from walking to having completely 
> rigid legs. And today he is starting to decline. I’m wondering if there is 
> something else I can give him besides the 5 mg of Prednisolone and the 
> Clindamycin.
> The vet said he he keeps declining we could do another form of Chemo which is 
> very aggressive and has other side affects and would be a Hail Mary to buy 
> him another few days? 
> I’m just not convinced he has cancer. Even though he is FeLV positive he is 
> young to develop a cancer? 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Oct 18, 2018, at 12:54 PM, Amani Oakley  <mailto:aoakley@oakleylegalcom>> wrote:
> 
> I actually had a few similar experiences. Once it involved two very young 
> kittens. Once it involved a cat about a year old. In my opinion, the two 
> different experiences had two different causative agents, and at the risk of 
> boring you silly, I will try to explain both. Neither, by the way, was well 
> understood by the vets, leading me again to the inevitable conclusion that 
> cat health is very poorly studied (no where near dog health) and because cats 
> respond different to disease and medication, (whereas dogs respond very much 
> like people), then science and medicine is way behind in understanding cats.
>  
> With respect to the kittens,

Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

Sorry Shelley – my email below should have read IT ISN”T prednisolone. . .

Amani

From: Felvtalk  On Behalf Of Amani Oakley
Sent: October 18, 2018 4:57 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

Hi Shelley. Are you speaking about anabolic steroids or corticosteroids? And 
what type in particular? I think that there may be a particular steroid which 
has been linked with heart issues sometimes but it is prednisolone (which is a 
corticosteroid) and it isn’t Winstrol (which is an anabolic steroid).

Amani

From: Felvtalk 
mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org>>
 On Behalf Of Shelley Theye
Sent: October 18, 2018 4:29 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org<mailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org>
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

Hi Katy,

So sorry that Batman is going through this!

Did they look at Batman’s heart while he was at the vet hospital?  Specifically 
did they do an echocardiogram?  I am guessing that they had no reason to with 
his initial symptoms so they probably didn’t?

Maybe he has heart disease that the steroids have exacerbated... Young cats can 
have it and not have any outward symptoms.  Steroids are contraindicated with 
heart problems.  I think there is one type that can be used, but it is not 
usually given first.

Just throwing this out there just in case.  Steroids could hurt his heart if he 
has undiagnosed heart problem and maybe cause him to act like.
Not to scare you, just to get him treated for it if it is that.

Shelley

On Oct 18, 2018, at 3:27 PM, Katy Brown 
mailto:ktbrow...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Amani,
That is very insightful. I’m not convinced he has lymphoma because his decline 
was so rapid. Within hours he went from walking to having completely rigid 
legs. And today he is starting to decline. I’m wondering if there is something 
else I can give him besides the 5 mg of Prednisolone and the Clindamycin.
The vet said he he keeps declining we could do another form of Chemo which is 
very aggressive and has other side affects and would be a Hail Mary to buy him 
another few days?
I’m just not convinced he has cancer. Even though he is FeLV positive he is 
young to develop a cancer?
Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 18, 2018, at 12:54 PM, Amani Oakley 
mailto:aoakley@oakleylegalcom>> wrote:
I actually had a few similar experiences. Once it involved two very young 
kittens. Once it involved a cat about a year old. In my opinion, the two 
different experiences had two different causative agents, and at the risk of 
boring you silly, I will try to explain both. Neither, by the way, was well 
understood by the vets, leading me again to the inevitable conclusion that cat 
health is very poorly studied (no where near dog health) and because cats 
respond different to disease and medication, (whereas dogs respond very much 
like people), then science and medicine is way behind in understanding cats.

With respect to the kittens, it was my view that they actually had (and one of 
them still has) Lyme disease. The area I picked them up was one very well-known 
to be endemic for Lyme disease. They had an alternating lameness – once picking 
up one paw which seemed very swollen and sore – and then next day, picking up 
the other paw. I looked this up and saw that this alternating lameness was 
described in dogs with Lyme disease. However, my vet believed that it might be 
calici virus. I didn’t agree with her, but let her treat for calici virus 
(including vaccination). The acute phase of the response seemed to be limited 
in time, and both kittens seemed to get better on their own. However, their 
brother lapsed into a coma – was literally unresponsive for hours while I sat 
up with him. I didn’t know what to do, and my view was that either there was 
inflammation of the meninges (sac surrounding the brain) or an inflammation of 
the brain itself, causing increased intracranial pressure which might also 
result in loss of consciousness. I superdosed him with transdermal prednisone, 
took him to bed with me and kept checking him for hours. Then, suddenly, at 
about 4 in the morning, he just bounded awake, and began playing and 
galavanting all over the bed. Meanwhile, though, one of his two sisters has 
never been the same. She lost HUGE amounts of weight, and even now, as a 2+ 
year old cat, she weighs less than many kittens and she is all bones. I have 
been treating her with a combination of Winstrol, Doxycycline, high prednisone 
doses and magnesium (her muscles don’t work right – like they are constantly 
spastic, and she walks in a funny tip toe way, and has poor coordination 
jumping on things and going up stairs, etc.) Anyhow, she is starting to get 
better, starting to put on weight and starting to walk better. I am convinced 
this was and is Lyme disease, though scientists and vets say that cats don’t 
get it. I don’t know how they know this, becau

Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

Hi Shelley. Are you speaking about anabolic steroids or corticosteroids? And 
what type in particular? I think that there may be a particular steroid which 
has been linked with heart issues sometimes but it is prednisolone (which is a 
corticosteroid) and it isn’t Winstrol (which is an anabolic steroid).

Amani

From: Felvtalk  On Behalf Of Shelley Theye
Sent: October 18, 2018 4:29 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

Hi Katy,

So sorry that Batman is going through this!

Did they look at Batman’s heart while he was at the vet hospital?  Specifically 
did they do an echocardiogram?  I am guessing that they had no reason to with 
his initial symptoms so they probably didn’t?

Maybe he has heart disease that the steroids have exacerbated... Young cats can 
have it and not have any outward symptoms.  Steroids are contraindicated with 
heart problems.  I think there is one type that can be used, but it is not 
usually given first.

Just throwing this out there just in case.  Steroids could hurt his heart if he 
has undiagnosed heart problem and maybe cause him to act like.
Not to scare you, just to get him treated for it if it is that.

Shelley

On Oct 18, 2018, at 3:27 PM, Katy Brown 
mailto:ktbrow...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Amani,
That is very insightful. I’m not convinced he has lymphoma because his decline 
was so rapid. Within hours he went from walking to having completely rigid 
legs. And today he is starting to decline. I’m wondering if there is something 
else I can give him besides the 5 mg of Prednisolone and the Clindamycin.
The vet said he he keeps declining we could do another form of Chemo which is 
very aggressive and has other side affects and would be a Hail Mary to buy him 
another few days?
I’m just not convinced he has cancer. Even though he is FeLV positive he is 
young to develop a cancer?
Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 18, 2018, at 12:54 PM, Amani Oakley 
mailto:aoakley@oakleylegalcom>> wrote:
I actually had a few similar experiences. Once it involved two very young 
kittens. Once it involved a cat about a year old. In my opinion, the two 
different experiences had two different causative agents, and at the risk of 
boring you silly, I will try to explain both. Neither, by the way, was well 
understood by the vets, leading me again to the inevitable conclusion that cat 
health is very poorly studied (no where near dog health) and because cats 
respond different to disease and medication, (whereas dogs respond very much 
like people), then science and medicine is way behind in understanding cats.

With respect to the kittens, it was my view that they actually had (and one of 
them still has) Lyme disease. The area I picked them up was one very well-known 
to be endemic for Lyme disease. They had an alternating lameness – once picking 
up one paw which seemed very swollen and sore – and then next day, picking up 
the other paw. I looked this up and saw that this alternating lameness was 
described in dogs with Lyme disease. However, my vet believed that it might be 
calici virus. I didn’t agree with her, but let her treat for calici virus 
(including vaccination). The acute phase of the response seemed to be limited 
in time, and both kittens seemed to get better on their own. However, their 
brother lapsed into a coma – was literally unresponsive for hours while I sat 
up with him. I didn’t know what to do, and my view was that either there was 
inflammation of the meninges (sac surrounding the brain) or an inflammation of 
the brain itself, causing increased intracranial pressure which might also 
result in loss of consciousness. I superdosed him with transdermal prednisone, 
took him to bed with me and kept checking him for hours. Then, suddenly, at 
about 4 in the morning, he just bounded awake, and began playing and 
galavanting all over the bed. Meanwhile, though, one of his two sisters has 
never been the same. She lost HUGE amounts of weight, and even now, as a 2+ 
year old cat, she weighs less than many kittens and she is all bones. I have 
been treating her with a combination of Winstrol, Doxycycline, high prednisone 
doses and magnesium (her muscles don’t work right – like they are constantly 
spastic, and she walks in a funny tip toe way, and has poor coordination 
jumping on things and going up stairs, etc.) Anyhow, she is starting to get 
better, starting to put on weight and starting to walk better. I am convinced 
this was and is Lyme disease, though scientists and vets say that cats don’t 
get it. I don’t know how they know this, because they DO NOT TEST cats for it.

Story number two involves a kitten I got who was described as a “wobbly” kitten 
and it was assumed that his mom had suffered a viral infection when he was in 
utero, which can result in this type of neurological damage (and it can be much 
worse). However, when he was very little, he suddenly and without warning, 
decided to s

Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

2018-10-18 Thread Shelley Theye

Hi Katy,

So sorry that Batman is going through this!

Did they look at Batman’s heart while he was at the vet hospital?  Specifically 
did they do an echocardiogram?  I am guessing that they had no reason to with 
his initial symptoms so they probably didn’t?

Maybe he has heart disease that the steroids have exacerbated... Young cats can 
have it and not have any outward symptoms.  Steroids are contraindicated with 
heart problems.  I think there is one type that can be used, but it is not 
usually given first.  

Just throwing this out there just in case.  Steroids could hurt his heart if he 
has undiagnosed heart problem and maybe cause him to act like.
Not to scare you, just to get him treated for it if it is that.

Shelley   



> On Oct 18, 2018, at 3:27 PM, Katy Brown  wrote:
> 
> Amani,
> That is very insightful. I’m not convinced he has lymphoma because his 
> decline was so rapid. Within hours he went from walking to having completely 
> rigid legs. And today he is starting to decline. I’m wondering if there is 
> something else I can give him besides the 5 mg of Prednisolone and the 
> Clindamycin.
> The vet said he he keeps declining we could do another form of Chemo which is 
> very aggressive and has other side affects and would be a Hail Mary to buy 
> him another few days? 
> I’m just not convinced he has cancer. Even though he is FeLV positive he is 
> young to develop a cancer? 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Oct 18, 2018, at 12:54 PM, Amani Oakley  <mailto:aoakley@oakleylegalcom>> wrote:
> 
>> I actually had a few similar experiences. Once it involved two very young 
>> kittens. Once it involved a cat about a year old. In my opinion, the two 
>> different experiences had two different causative agents, and at the risk of 
>> boring you silly, I will try to explain both. Neither, by the way, was well 
>> understood by the vets, leading me again to the inevitable conclusion that 
>> cat health is very poorly studied (no where near dog health) and because 
>> cats respond different to disease and medication, (whereas dogs respond very 
>> much like people), then science and medicine is way behind in understanding 
>> cats.
>>  
>> With respect to the kittens, it was my view that they actually had (and one 
>> of them still has) Lyme disease. The area I picked them up was one very 
>> well-known to be endemic for Lyme disease. They had an alternating lameness 
>> – once picking up one paw which seemed very swollen and sore – and then next 
>> day, picking up the other paw. I looked this up and saw that this 
>> alternating lameness was described in dogs with Lyme disease. However, my 
>> vet believed that it might be calici virus. I didn’t agree with her, but let 
>> her treat for calici virus (including vaccination). The acute phase of the 
>> response seemed to be limited in time, and both kittens seemed to get better 
>> on their own. However, their brother lapsed into a coma – was literally 
>> unresponsive for hours while I sat up with him. I didn’t know what to do, 
>> and my view was that either there was inflammation of the meninges (sac 
>> surrounding the brain) or an inflammation of the brain itself, causing 
>> increased intracranial pressure which might also result in loss of 
>> consciousness. I superdosed him with transdermal prednisone, took him to bed 
>> with me and kept checking him for hours. Then, suddenly, at about 4 in the 
>> morning, he just bounded awake, and began playing and galavanting all over 
>> the bed. Meanwhile, though, one of his two sisters has never been the same. 
>> She lost HUGE amounts of weight, and even now, as a 2+ year old cat, she 
>> weighs less than many kittens and she is all bones. I have been treating her 
>> with a combination of Winstrol, Doxycycline, high prednisone doses and 
>> magnesium (her muscles don’t work right – like they are constantly spastic, 
>> and she walks in a funny tip toe way, and has poor coordination jumping on 
>> things and going up stairs, etc.) Anyhow, she is starting to get better, 
>> starting to put on weight and starting to walk better. I am convinced this 
>> was and is Lyme disease, though scientists and vets say that cats don’t get 
>> it. I don’t know how they know this, because they DO NOT TEST cats for it.
>>  
>> Story number two involves a kitten I got who was described as a “wobbly” 
>> kitten and it was assumed that his mom had suffered a viral infection when 
>> he was in utero, which can result in this type of neurological damage (and 
>> it can be much worse). However, when he was very little, he suddenly and 
>> without warning, decided to squat and pee right in the middle of o

Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

I think you’re right that the decline is way too fast to be accounted for, by 
cancer. If it were me, I would give him a high dose of prednisone – 20 mg for 
maybe two days, and then drop back to 5 mg. I would also try him on the 
Winstrol, but in the very short-term, I think it may be the prednisolone which 
might do the best good. However, of course, you’re shooting in the dark because 
it is not clear what your target is. Try the high dose prednisone for a few 
days and see if he responds.

I don’t think that the chemo makes sense if the vet hasn’t identified a tumour 
and of course, the side effects are likely to worsen your cat’s condition. The 
good thing about what I am suggesting is that it may or may not work, but it is 
unlikely to leave him in a worse state, which cannot be said for the chemo. I 
would therefore try the prednisolone and Winstrol before I agreed to more chemo 
if it were my cat.

Amani

From: Felvtalk  On Behalf Of Katy Brown
Sent: October 18, 2018 3:28 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

Amani,
That is very insightful. I’m not convinced he has lymphoma because his decline 
was so rapid. Within hours he went from walking to having completely rigid 
legs. And today he is starting to decline. I’m wondering if there is something 
else I can give him besides the 5 mg of Prednisolone and the Clindamycin.
The vet said he he keeps declining we could do another form of Chemo which is 
very aggressive and has other side affects and would be a Hail Mary to buy him 
another few days?
I’m just not convinced he has cancer. Even though he is FeLV positive he is 
young to develop a cancer?
Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 18, 2018, at 12:54 PM, Amani Oakley 
mailto:aoak...@oakleylegal.com>> wrote:
I actually had a few similar experiences. Once it involved two very young 
kittens. Once it involved a cat about a year old. In my opinion, the two 
different experiences had two different causative agents, and at the risk of 
boring you silly, I will try to explain both. Neither, by the way, was well 
understood by the vets, leading me again to the inevitable conclusion that cat 
health is very poorly studied (no where near dog health) and because cats 
respond different to disease and medication, (whereas dogs respond very much 
like people), then science and medicine is way behind in understanding cats.

With respect to the kittens, it was my view that they actually had (and one of 
them still has) Lyme disease. The area I picked them up was one very well-known 
to be endemic for Lyme disease. They had an alternating lameness – once picking 
up one paw which seemed very swollen and sore – and then next day, picking up 
the other paw. I looked this up and saw that this alternating lameness was 
described in dogs with Lyme disease. However, my vet believed that it might be 
calici virus. I didn’t agree with her, but let her treat for calici virus 
(including vaccination). The acute phase of the response seemed to be limited 
in time, and both kittens seemed to get better on their own. However, their 
brother lapsed into a coma – was literally unresponsive for hours while I sat 
up with him. I didn’t know what to do, and my view was that either there was 
inflammation of the meninges (sac surrounding the brain) or an inflammation of 
the brain itself, causing increased intracranial pressure which might also 
result in loss of consciousness. I superdosed him with transdermal prednisone, 
took him to bed with me and kept checking him for hours. Then, suddenly, at 
about 4 in the morning, he just bounded awake, and began playing and 
galavanting all over the bed. Meanwhile, though, one of his two sisters has 
never been the same. She lost HUGE amounts of weight, and even now, as a 2+ 
year old cat, she weighs less than many kittens and she is all bones. I have 
been treating her with a combination of Winstrol, Doxycycline, high prednisone 
doses and magnesium (her muscles don’t work right – like they are constantly 
spastic, and she walks in a funny tip toe way, and has poor coordination 
jumping on things and going up stairs, etc.) Anyhow, she is starting to get 
better, starting to put on weight and starting to walk better. I am convinced 
this was and is Lyme disease, though scientists and vets say that cats don’t 
get it. I don’t know how they know this, because they DO NOT TEST cats for it.

Story number two involves a kitten I got who was described as a “wobbly” kitten 
and it was assumed that his mom had suffered a viral infection when he was in 
utero, which can result in this type of neurological damage (and it can be much 
worse). However, when he was very little, he suddenly and without warning, 
decided to squat and pee right in the middle of our bed, and he had never done 
this before. He was looking straight at me and I felt that he didn’t know why 
he was doing what he was doing. Not too long after (a few weeks or

Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

2018-10-18 Thread Katy Brown

Amani,
That is very insightful. I’m not convinced he has lymphoma because his decline 
was so rapid. Within hours he went from walking to having completely rigid 
legs. And today he is starting to decline. I’m wondering if there is something 
else I can give him besides the 5 mg of Prednisolone and the Clindamycin.
The vet said he he keeps declining we could do another form of Chemo which is 
very aggressive and has other side affects and would be a Hail Mary to buy him 
another few days? 
I’m just not convinced he has cancer. Even though he is FeLV positive he is 
young to develop a cancer? 
Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 18, 2018, at 12:54 PM, Amani Oakley  wrote:
> 
> I actually had a few similar experiences. Once it involved two very young 
> kittens. Once it involved a cat about a year old. In my opinion, the two 
> different experiences had two different causative agents, and at the risk of 
> boring you silly, I will try to explain both. Neither, by the way, was well 
> understood by the vets, leading me again to the inevitable conclusion that 
> cat health is very poorly studied (no where near dog health) and because cats 
> respond different to disease and medication, (whereas dogs respond very much 
> like people), then science and medicine is way behind in understanding cats.
>  
> With respect to the kittens, it was my view that they actually had (and one 
> of them still has) Lyme disease. The area I picked them up was one very 
> well-known to be endemic for Lyme disease. They had an alternating lameness – 
> once picking up one paw which seemed very swollen and sore – and then next 
> day, picking up the other paw. I looked this up and saw that this alternating 
> lameness was described in dogs with Lyme disease. However, my vet believed 
> that it might be calici virus. I didn’t agree with her, but let her treat for 
> calici virus (including vaccination). The acute phase of the response seemed 
> to be limited in time, and both kittens seemed to get better on their own. 
> However, their brother lapsed into a coma – was literally unresponsive for 
> hours while I sat up with him. I didn’t know what to do, and my view was that 
> either there was inflammation of the meninges (sac surrounding the brain) or 
> an inflammation of the brain itself, causing increased intracranial pressure 
> which might also result in loss of consciousness. I superdosed him with 
> transdermal prednisone, took him to bed with me and kept checking him for 
> hours. Then, suddenly, at about 4 in the morning, he just bounded awake, and 
> began playing and galavanting all over the bed. Meanwhile, though, one of his 
> two sisters has never been the same. She lost HUGE amounts of weight, and 
> even now, as a 2+ year old cat, she weighs less than many kittens and she is 
> all bones. I have been treating her with a combination of Winstrol, 
> Doxycycline, high prednisone doses and magnesium (her muscles don’t work 
> right – like they are constantly spastic, and she walks in a funny tip toe 
> way, and has poor coordination jumping on things and going up stairs, etc.) 
> Anyhow, she is starting to get better, starting to put on weight and starting 
> to walk better. I am convinced this was and is Lyme disease, though 
> scientists and vets say that cats don’t get it. I don’t know how they know 
> this, because they DO NOT TEST cats for it.
>  
> Story number two involves a kitten I got who was described as a “wobbly” 
> kitten and it was assumed that his mom had suffered a viral infection when he 
> was in utero, which can result in this type of neurological damage (and it 
> can be much worse). However, when he was very little, he suddenly and without 
> warning, decided to squat and pee right in the middle of our bed, and he had 
> never done this before. He was looking straight at me and I felt that he 
> didn’t know why he was doing what he was  doing. Not too long after (a few 
> weeks or maybe a month), he started showing some very alarming neurological 
> symptoms, including a loss of muscle control in the back end. His rectum 
> seemed not tight but loose and stool just “fell out” rather than being pushed 
> out. His back legs in particular also became very very weak, and he developed 
> a “tripod stance” – both back legs together – his back end would sway and he 
> would fall down. My knowledge with humans is that this occurs when there is 
> damage to nerves in the spinal column, or pressure on them from a herniated 
> disc, or something like that (cauda equina syndrome). I took him to the 
> emergency clinic, but I had already started him on Winstrol and Prednisolone, 
> assuming that the Prednisolone would help with reduction of swelling in the 
> spinal canal and thus take pressure off the affected nerves, and the Winstrol 
> mig

Re: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

I actually had a few similar experiences. Once it involved two very young 
kittens. Once it involved a cat about a year old. In my opinion, the two 
different experiences had two different causative agents, and at the risk of 
boring you silly, I will try to explain both. Neither, by the way, was well 
understood by the vets, leading me again to the inevitable conclusion that cat 
health is very poorly studied (no where near dog health) and because cats 
respond different to disease and medication, (whereas dogs respond very much 
like people), then science and medicine is way behind in understanding cats.

With respect to the kittens, it was my view that they actually had (and one of 
them still has) Lyme disease. The area I picked them up was one very well-known 
to be endemic for Lyme disease. They had an alternating lameness – once picking 
up one paw which seemed very swollen and sore – and then next day, picking up 
the other paw. I looked this up and saw that this alternating lameness was 
described in dogs with Lyme disease. However, my vet believed that it might be 
calici virus. I didn’t agree with her, but let her treat for calici virus 
(including vaccination). The acute phase of the response seemed to be limited 
in time, and both kittens seemed to get better on their own. However, their 
brother lapsed into a coma – was literally unresponsive for hours while I sat 
up with him. I didn’t know what to do, and my view was that either there was 
inflammation of the meninges (sac surrounding the brain) or an inflammation of 
the brain itself, causing increased intracranial pressure which might also 
result in loss of consciousness. I superdosed him with transdermal prednisone, 
took him to bed with me and kept checking him for hours. Then, suddenly, at 
about 4 in the morning, he just bounded awake, and began playing and 
galavanting all over the bed. Meanwhile, though, one of his two sisters has 
never been the same. She lost HUGE amounts of weight, and even now, as a 2+ 
year old cat, she weighs less than many kittens and she is all bones. I have 
been treating her with a combination of Winstrol, Doxycycline, high prednisone 
doses and magnesium (her muscles don’t work right – like they are constantly 
spastic, and she walks in a funny tip toe way, and has poor coordination 
jumping on things and going up stairs, etc.) Anyhow, she is starting to get 
better, starting to put on weight and starting to walk better. I am convinced 
this was and is Lyme disease, though scientists and vets say that cats don’t 
get it. I don’t know how they know this, because they DO NOT TEST cats for it.

Story number two involves a kitten I got who was described as a “wobbly” kitten 
and it was assumed that his mom had suffered a viral infection when he was in 
utero, which can result in this type of neurological damage (and it can be much 
worse). However, when he was very little, he suddenly and without warning, 
decided to squat and pee right in the middle of our bed, and he had never done 
this before. He was looking straight at me and I felt that he didn’t know why 
he was doing what he was doing. Not too long after (a few weeks or maybe a 
month), he started showing some very alarming neurological symptoms, including 
a loss of muscle control in the back end. His rectum seemed not tight but loose 
and stool just “fell out” rather than being pushed out. His back legs in 
particular also became very very weak, and he developed a “tripod stance” – 
both back legs together – his back end would sway and he would fall down. My 
knowledge with humans is that this occurs when there is damage to nerves in the 
spinal column, or pressure on them from a herniated disc, or something like 
that (cauda equina syndrome). I took him to the emergency clinic, but I had 
already started him on Winstrol and Prednisolone, assuming that the 
Prednisolone would help with reduction of swelling in the spinal canal and thus 
take pressure off the affected nerves, and the Winstrol might help in healing 
whatever injury there was in the spinal column. By the time they could do an 
MRI on him, he was regaining all function and his gait had become normal. The 
MRI was inconclusive, with the vets thinking that they could possible see the 
remains of a lesion, right in the area where one would expect it to be to 
affect rectal control and muscle function of the back legs, but the lesion 
appeared to be healed over so they couldn’t tell if that was the cause or if 
the lesion was old or new.

It sounds to me like the prednisone you used in your case, has a similar 
effect. There was swelling somewhere, likely in the spinal column as you 
surmise, and the prednisone helped bring down the swelling.

Amani

From: Felvtalk  On Behalf Of katy brown
Sent: October 18, 2018 12:21 PM
To: Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: [Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

Hello,
I have an amazing cat named Batman who a year ago as a kitten

[Felvtalk] Batman Felv Positive Having Neurological issues.

2018-10-18 Thread katy brown

Hello,
I have an amazing cat named Batman who a year ago as a kitten tested
positive for FelV. His brother also texted positive, after 2 other tests
later on after the antibodies from the mother had cleared, Batman still
tested positive while his brother was negative.

Fast forward a year and both of them were doing great. I was away on
vacation and left them with a full time cat sitter, who notice about a week
ago that Batman was not going up stairs as much, but we figured this could
be to him just adjusting to a new person in his home. When I arrived back
home I immediately noticed he was not moving well and as the day progressed
he was losing more mobility in his front paws. I took him to the emergency
room where they thought he had experienced a trauma, and discharged him
with 2 types of pain meds. The pain meds were a disaster, and he lost
further mobility. From there we took him to Pennsylvania Vet. Hospital,
which is supposed to be one of the best in the country, they realized he
was having neurological issues, did a bunch of testing, his vitals and
blood work were all good. An x-ray revealed no masses in his chest or
spine. At this point they felt it was a cancer in his column, most likely
lymphoma. The Vet thought that he was quite young even given his FeLV
positive status to have lymphoma, but given how fast he was becoming
completely paralyzed, there were not many other diagnosis that fit the
bill. The vet started him on Prednisolone and Clindamycin, and within hours
he regained movement in his legs and was walking again. Yesterday he was
jumping and scratching on his post again, and eating and drinking. Last
night his behavior changed and he kept trying to hide which is very unlike
him, however I thought that maybe he was just tired, he had gone from
completely paralyzed to jumping in 3 days. But this morning it was apparent
that he was not ok, he did eat after much encouragement, but has moved very
very little. I have called the Vet and am waiting to hear back but I'm not
optimistic. Has anyone had this experience? I don't want to put him down if
there is a chance he could come back but he is hardly moving and seems like
him trying to hide was him trying to find a place to pass away
quietly. Batman is so young and he is the sweetest cat I have ever owned,
and his brother can't get along with out him.  I will try anything to keep
him alive but I want him to have a good quality life. Any suggestions would
be appreciated.

Also I apologize if I did not use this forum correctly. I wasn't sure if I
emailed the group or how it works so I hope this does work.
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Re: [Felvtalk] Felv positive support urgent

2018-10-18 Thread Gloria

Amani-I thought that the meds you talked about might be beneficial for both 
since both are viruses-thanks!

note: keeping the previous emails attached for context-hope this is okay
Gloria
-g 
Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 17, 2018, at 8:04 PM, Amani Oakley  wrote:
> 
> I was confused about that because the "re" line said FeLV.
> 
> It doesn’t matter though. I have used the medication combo on a cat from a 
> feral colony where FIV ran rampant and killed most of the cats. When I took 
> mine in, she was very very sick as well. She pulled through on the med 
> combination.
> 
> Amani
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of 
> Gloria
> Sent: October-17-18 10:49 PM
> To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Felv positive support urgent
> 
> Amani-
> FYI
> Sandy said FIV, not FeLV-not sure if it makes any difference, tho’.❤️
> Gloria
> 
> 
> -g 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Oct 17, 2018, at 4:10 PM, Amani Oakley  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Sandy
>> 
>> I will step in here, and repeat what I have told so many others on this 
>> chatline.
>> 
>> I am cutting and pasting from one of my first ever posts on this forum:
>> 
>> I would like to share what I think is very important information with others 
>> who have cats diagnosed with Feline Leukemia.
>> 
>> 
>> "I am new to this forum so I don't know if my post (below) can be seen by 
>> other members of the discussion forum. If so, I apologize for reposting it a 
>> few times today in response to a few of the posts.
>> 
>> I had a cat with leukemia as a kitten, and he lived to the age of 7 and died 
>> from something else that I don't believe was related to the leukemia. When 
>> the vets told me that they could do nothing for him as a kitten dying with 
>> leukemia (and he WAS dying - his red cells were dropping down to nothing and 
>> I had given him TWO blood transfusions that weren't holding up his numbers 
>> to any great degree) then as a last ditch effort, I tried some Winstrol I 
>> had in the cupboard that a previous vet had given to me for another cat. 
>> 
>> This medication turned him completely around. To monitor his condition, we 
>> were performing weekly blood tests on him - CBC, liver function, etc. After 
>> being put on the Winstrol, his red cells and white cell counts began to 
>> climb very quickly and steadily. It was totally amazing and the vets 
>> couldn't believe the lab results either. My beautiful little boy was out of 
>> the woods in about six months. We were obsessively checking the pinkness of 
>> his ears,


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Re: [Felvtalk] Felv positive support urgent

2018-10-17 Thread Amani Oakley

I was confused about that because the "re" line said FeLV.

It doesn’t matter though. I have used the medication combo on a cat from a 
feral colony where FIV ran rampant and killed most of the cats. When I took 
mine in, she was very very sick as well. She pulled through on the med 
combination.

Amani

-Original Message-
From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Gloria
Sent: October-17-18 10:49 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Felv positive support urgent

Amani-
FYI
Sandy said FIV, not FeLV-not sure if it makes any difference, tho’.❤️
Gloria


-g 
Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 17, 2018, at 4:10 PM, Amani Oakley  wrote:
> 
> Hi Sandy
> 
> I will step in here, and repeat what I have told so many others on this 
> chatline.
> 
> I am cutting and pasting from one of my first ever posts on this forum:
> 
> I would like to share what I think is very important information with others 
> who have cats diagnosed with Feline Leukemia.
> 
> 
> "I am new to this forum so I don't know if my post (below) can be seen by 
> other members of the discussion forum. If so, I apologize for reposting it a 
> few times today in response to a few of the posts.
> 
> I had a cat with leukemia as a kitten, and he lived to the age of 7 and died 
> from something else that I don't believe was related to the leukemia. When 
> the vets told me that they could do nothing for him as a kitten dying with 
> leukemia (and he WAS dying - his red cells were dropping down to nothing and 
> I had given him TWO blood transfusions that weren't holding up his numbers to 
> any great degree) then as a last ditch effort, I tried some Winstrol I had in 
> the cupboard that a previous vet had given to me for another cat. 
> 
> This medication turned him completely around. To monitor his condition, we 
> were performing weekly blood tests on him - CBC, liver function, etc. After 
> being put on the Winstrol, his red cells and white cell counts began to climb 
> very quickly and steadily. It was totally amazing and the vets couldn't 
> believe the lab results either. My beautiful little boy was out of the woods 
> in about six months. We were obsessively checking the pinkness of his ears, 
> gums and pads to check the status of his profound anemia, and to our 
> unbelievable joy, he began to get pink and his lab results just kept getting 
> better after only a few days on the medication. After about a year, I called 
> back the internal medicine veterinarian we had seen, and who had told us 
> there was no hope, and told him of our beautiful cat's recovery. To my 
> surprise - and a little bit of anger - he said that I had gone "old school" 
> and that Winstrol used to be used but then there were rumours of possible 
> liver damage associated wit
> h it, and vets stopped prescribing it. This REALLY annoyed me. My cat was 
> dying and no one thought that maybe, just maybe, some treatment - even with a 
> potential side effect - was better than no treatment??? In our experience, on 
> a few occasions the liver enzymes would indeed rise, but would drop back down 
> to normal fairly quickly after a short break from the Winstrol. We monitored 
> our beautiful Zander very closely during and after his initial crisis, and if 
> I thought that maybe he was looking pale again, or if the CBC came back with 
> a significantly dropping red cell count, we would put him back on the 
> Winstrol for a 4 to 6 week period, and it would fix him right up.
> 
> The Winstrol also really helped to increase his appetite so I could get him 
> to eat when he was so very sick.
> 
> I used it at a level of 1 mg two times a day when he was really sick, and 
> when he started to recover, I cut it back to 1 mg a day, or even 1/2 mg a day 
> for a maintenance dose. I would pair it with prednisone (5 mg) and 
> Doxycycline (50 mg) as well.
> 
> I have looked after a very large number of strays over the years and I have a 
> science and medicine background in science and microbiology and laboratory 
> medicine, so I tested and analyzed the lab results we were getting, using 
> this knowledge. I have since used Winstrol in my cats in a number of other 
> situations where vets have told me there is no hope, and I have to say that 
> it has come through more often than not.
> 
> I therefore could not understand the reluctance of the veterinary - and 
> medical community for that matter - to consider Winstrol, especially in 
> circumstances where vets are telling pet owners that there are no other 
> options and their kitten or cat will die.
> 
> I have had to do a fair amount of internet research and spoken to a number of 
> veterinarians about this. I have personally concluded that

Re: [Felvtalk] Felv positive support urgent

2018-10-17 Thread Gloria

Amani-
FYI
Sandy said FIV, not FeLV-not sure if it makes any difference, tho’.❤️
Gloria


-g 
Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 17, 2018, at 4:10 PM, Amani Oakley  wrote:
> 
> Hi Sandy
> 
> I will step in here, and repeat what I have told so many others on this 
> chatline.
> 
> I am cutting and pasting from one of my first ever posts on this forum:
> 
> I would like to share what I think is very important information with others 
> who have cats diagnosed with Feline Leukemia.
> 
> 
> "I am new to this forum so I don't know if my post (below) can be seen by 
> other members of the discussion forum. If so, I apologize for reposting it a 
> few times today in response to a few of the posts.
> 
> I had a cat with leukemia as a kitten, and he lived to the age of 7 and died 
> from something else that I don't believe was related to the leukemia. When 
> the vets told me that they could do nothing for him as a kitten dying with 
> leukemia (and he WAS dying - his red cells were dropping down to nothing and 
> I had given him TWO blood transfusions that weren't holding up his numbers to 
> any great degree) then as a last ditch effort, I tried some Winstrol I had in 
> the cupboard that a previous vet had given to me for another cat. 
> 
> This medication turned him completely around. To monitor his condition, we 
> were performing weekly blood tests on him - CBC, liver function, etc. After 
> being put on the Winstrol, his red cells and white cell counts began to climb 
> very quickly and steadily. It was totally amazing and the vets couldn't 
> believe the lab results either. My beautiful little boy was out of the woods 
> in about six months. We were obsessively checking the pinkness of his ears, 
> gums and pads to check the status of his profound anemia, and to our 
> unbelievable joy, he began to get pink and his lab results just kept getting 
> better after only a few days on the medication. After about a year, I called 
> back the internal medicine veterinarian we had seen, and who had told us 
> there was no hope, and told him of our beautiful cat's recovery. To my 
> surprise - and a little bit of anger - he said that I had gone "old school" 
> and that Winstrol used to be used but then there were rumours of possible 
> liver damage associated wit
> h it, and vets stopped prescribing it. This REALLY annoyed me. My cat was 
> dying and no one thought that maybe, just maybe, some treatment - even with a 
> potential side effect - was better than no treatment??? In our experience, on 
> a few occasions the liver enzymes would indeed rise, but would drop back down 
> to normal fairly quickly after a short break from the Winstrol. We monitored 
> our beautiful Zander very closely during and after his initial crisis, and if 
> I thought that maybe he was looking pale again, or if the CBC came back with 
> a significantly dropping red cell count, we would put him back on the 
> Winstrol for a 4 to 6 week period, and it would fix him right up.
> 
> The Winstrol also really helped to increase his appetite so I could get him 
> to eat when he was so very sick.
> 
> I used it at a level of 1 mg two times a day when he was really sick, and 
> when he started to recover, I cut it back to 1 mg a day, or even 1/2 mg a day 
> for a maintenance dose. I would pair it with prednisone (5 mg) and 
> Doxycycline (50 mg) as well.
> 
> I have looked after a very large number of strays over the years and I have a 
> science and medicine background in science and microbiology and laboratory 
> medicine, so I tested and analyzed the lab results we were getting, using 
> this knowledge. I have since used Winstrol in my cats in a number of other 
> situations where vets have told me there is no hope, and I have to say that 
> it has come through more often than not.
> 
> I therefore could not understand the reluctance of the veterinary - and 
> medical community for that matter - to consider Winstrol, especially in 
> circumstances where vets are telling pet owners that there are no other 
> options and their kitten or cat will die.
> 
> I have had to do a fair amount of internet research and spoken to a number of 
> veterinarians about this. I have personally concluded that due to the 
> association of Winstrol with athletic doping scandals, the scientific 
> community as a whole has decided to abandon what might indeed be a promising 
> drug. This saddens me but I simply can see no other explanation. I mean 
> really - does it make sense to hear from vets that the drug MAY cause liver 
> disease, when your animal is dying Wouldn't you give that option in those 
> circumstances, and let the pet owner understand the risks??? Personally, I 
> think that the risk of permanent liver damage is not a significant risk. The 
> information I have been able to find - buried so very deeply as to be almost 
> unable to be found on the Internet - points to any change in the liver 
> enzymes as being transitory and not representing any

Re: [Felvtalk] Felv positive support urgent

2018-10-17 Thread Amani Oakley

arting to go up from basically a zero level). He 
was eating and looking better, so I grit my teeth and proceeded with the 
Winstrol. I suspect that many vets might have abandoned ship at that point, and 
pulled the Winstrol before it had had an opportunity to really have the desired 
effect, but my vet was at least good enough to recognize that if this treatment 
didn't work, my cat was out of luck, and she allowed me to continue on with the 
Winstrol since Zander was doing better in so many other ways.

This was also our experience when I used Winstrol in another very elderly cat 
who had a large and aggressive sarcoma in her sinus cavity, and again who was 
not expected to live very long. She lived another 3 years after the diagnosis 
(she was around 19 when she passed away), and I believe that the Winstrol 
helped immensely in getting her to keep eating, and to keep the swelling under 
control. With her, we definitely found that her liver enzymes spiked 
dramatically with the use of the Winstrol, but settled down immediately with a 
brief discontinuance of the drug.

Zander died at age 7 from cardiomyopathy - nothing to do with his liver. I 
tortured myself with thoughts that maybe the Winstrol had caused the 
cardiomyopathy, and for all I know, it did. However, again, I did a fair amount 
of research and initially, I found references to a link between Winstrol and 
cardiac damage, but the link was pretty tenuous at best, and seemed to be 
suspected in athletes who had taken Winstrol at 100 X the recommended dosages 
for years and years. My guilt has never gone away because of course, you never 
know, but what I do know is that I would have lost him when he was only a year 
old. If the Winstrol managed to give me 6 more very good years with my cat, who 
played and was exceptionally affectionate and showed an extreme happiness with 
his life, then I would have to say I have no hesitation in doing it again.
 
What I find truly bizarre is that given the death sentence that this disease 
represents to cats, it should be very simple indeed to (a) have vets try the 
Winstrol and see what their experience is with it (with the proviso that they 
shouldn't pull a cat off the Winstrol just because the liver enzymes start to 
go up) and (b) why haven't there been some decent clinical trials with this 
stuff? The cats are zero given probability of surviving this disease. Even if 
Winstrol only works sometimes, that is better than the odds we are given for 
these cats at the moment."



Sandy - let me also point out that with further experience, I am now very 
firmly of the view that it was the combination of Doxycycline, Winstrol 
(stanozalol) and prednisone that was effective. Doxycycline is an antibiotic 
which has interesting and effective properties against other viruses and 
parasites as well. It is my hypothesis that the Doxycycline prevents the FeLV 
virus from properly replicating (as it has been scientifically established to 
interfere with cell wall synthesis in some other viruses), and simultaneously, 
the WInstrol works on the bone marrow to get it to turn back on and start 
producing the progenitor cells (immatures) of the red cell, white cell and 
platelet lines. Winstrol is used in humans for severe and intractable 
hereditary anemia, and of course, athletes use it to build up muscle and heal 
injured tissues.

You will need the compounding pharmacy to get the Winstrol, and you will need a 
vet who is onside. Some people on this forum have had good success with this 
combination of medication.

Amani

-Original Message-
From: Felvtalk  On Behalf Of Sandy Millard
Sent: October 17, 2018 2:18 AM
To: Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Cc: gcm...@comcast.net
Subject: [Felvtalk] Felv positive support urgent

I adopted 2 male cats with fiv. Can anyone give me info to help minimize the 
symptoms of upper respiratory infections?

I am using homeopathic nasal, cough, and immune support in their food and 
water.  Is there a product that will boost what i am already using? 
Sandy
gcm...@comcast.net


Sent from Xfinity Connect Application

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Re: [Felvtalk] Felv positive support urgent

2018-10-17 Thread Gloria

Compounding pharmacy link-don’t have to join website to read info: 
https://www.pharmacist.com/frequently-asked-questions-about-pharmaceutical-compounding

A compound pharmacy will prepare prescription in the dose that your vet 
(or doctor) prescribes —- whereas a regular pharmacy only gives you meds that 
are already prepared by a pharmaceutical company


-g 
Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 17, 2018, at 4:05 AM, Sandy Millard  wrote:
> 
> Thank you. What do you mean "a compound pharmacy"?
> After reading as much as possible, all I can do is keep Sonny comfortable and 
> make sure he eats good food.
> I dread what is to come. 
> 
> 
> Sent from Xfinity Connect Application
> 
> -Original Message-
> 
> From: gloriajh...@verizon.net
> To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
> Cc: gcm...@comcast.net
> Sent: 2018-10-17 3:37:54 AM 
> Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Felv positive support urgent
> 
> I would get an antibiotic to help their compromised immune system and suggest 
> a compound pharmacy to provide a liquid form- I’m no vet, and do not have 
> medical training , so, take this as a layman talking-I currently have 15 cats 
> in our home-strictly inside only-so take this as only a layperson 
> sharing—imho- you need a stronger solution as you evaluate the risks.
> So sorry you’re struggling with this, it’s hard, I know!❤️❤️
> Gloria
> 
> -g 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Oct 16, 2018, at 11:17 PM, Sandy Millard  wrote:
>> 
>> I adopted 2 male cats with fiv. Can anyone give me info to help minimize the 
>> symptoms of upper respiratory infections?
>> 
>> I am using homeopathic nasal, cough, and immune support in their food and 
>> water.  Is there a product that will boost what i am already using? 
>> Sandy
>> gcm...@comcast.net
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from Xfinity Connect Application
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Re: [Felvtalk] Felv positive support urgent

2018-10-17 Thread Sandy Millard

Thank you. What do you mean "a compound pharmacy"?
After reading as much as possible, all I can do is keep Sonny comfortable and 
make sure he eats good food.
I dread what is to come. 

Sent from Xfinity Connect Application

-Original Message-

From: gloriajh...@verizon.net
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Cc: gcm...@comcast.net
Sent: 2018-10-17 3:37:54 AM 
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Felv positive support urgent

I would get an antibiotic to help their compromised immune system and suggest a 
compound pharmacy to provide a liquid form- I’m no vet, and do not have medical 
training , so, take this as a layman talking-I currently have 15 cats in our 
home-strictly inside only-so take this as only a layperson sharing—imho- you 
need a stronger solution as you evaluate the risks.
 So sorry you’re struggling with this, it’s hard, I know!❤️❤️
Gloria

-g 
Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 16, 2018, at 11:17 PM, Sandy Millard  wrote:
> 
> I adopted 2 male cats with fiv. Can anyone give me info to help minimize the 
> symptoms of upper respiratory infections?
> 
> I am using homeopathic nasal, cough, and immune support in their food and 
> water.  Is there a product that will boost what i am already using? 
> Sandy
> gcm...@comcast.net
> 
> 
> Sent from Xfinity Connect Application
> ___
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Re: [Felvtalk] Felv positive support urgent

2018-10-17 Thread Gloria

I would get an antibiotic to help their compromised immune system and suggest a 
compound pharmacy to provide a liquid form- I’m no vet, and do not have medical 
training , so, take this as a layman talking-I currently have 15 cats in our 
home-strictly inside only-so take this as only a layperson sharing—imho- you 
need a stronger solution as you evaluate the risks.
 So sorry you’re struggling with this, it’s hard, I know!❤️❤️
Gloria

-g 
Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 16, 2018, at 11:17 PM, Sandy Millard  wrote:
> 
> I adopted 2 male cats with fiv. Can anyone give me info to help minimize the 
> symptoms of upper respiratory infections?
> 
> I am using homeopathic nasal, cough, and immune support in their food and 
> water.  Is there a product that will boost what i am already using? 
> Sandy
> gcm...@comcast.net
> 
> 
> Sent from Xfinity Connect Application
> ___
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> Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
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[Felvtalk] Felv positive support urgent

2018-10-17 Thread Sandy Millard

I adopted 2 male cats with fiv. Can anyone give me info to help minimize the 
symptoms of upper respiratory infections?

I am using homeopathic nasal, cough, and immune support in their food and 
water.  Is there a product that will boost what i am already using? 
Sandy
gcm...@comcast.net


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Re: [Felvtalk] FeLv Positive cat

2017-02-25 Thread Margo


I went thru the lymph node thing with one cat three years ago. All external 
nodes were the size of a golfball. His were so bad internally that they 
obstructed his bowel. He was in a household with FeLV+s, so we assumed 
lymphosarcoma. I took him in, and it was my first contact with a new Vet. I 
told her I had no desire to put a dying cat thru very much, if she could just 
relieve the constipation, and try to shrink the nodes, I'd just take him home 
and make him comfortable. She (surprisingly, to me) didn't quibble, gave him an 
enema, prescribed an antibiotic (I chose Zenequin), and a course of 
prednisolone. He recovered completely, and there's never been a recurrence. 

I don't know if he's FeLV+. None of us expected him to live, so no bloodwork 
was done. 

Just my experience.

Margo


-Original Message- 
>From: dlg...@windstream.net
>Sent: Feb 25, 2017 9:15 AM
>To: Molly Mou <mollymou...@yahoo.com>, felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
>Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FeLv Positive cat
>
>I haave had no problems with this, all I can offer is prayer.
>
> Molly Mou <mollymou...@yahoo.com> wrote: 
>>  I am new to the list. Three weeks ago my 5-year old Miakitty was diagnosed 
>> with FeLv. The ELISA test showed slightly + for FeLv. Itook her to the vet’s 
>> initially because her lymph nodes were raging – all ofthem premandibular, 
>> prescapular, inguinal all the way to the popliteals wereenlarged. A needle 
>> aspirate of the lymph nodes result was hyperplasia,no lymphosarcoma. White 
>> blood cell count was normal, but she was anemic, butnot to the point of 
>> needing a transfusion.I was devastated and stunned at this diagnosis because 
>> she(the whole litter) was tested as kittens for FIV and FeLv and were 
>> negative. Myvet said the disease can stay in the bone marrow. I have her 
>> brother who isasymptomatic – confusing. I haven’t had him tested yet for 
>> FeLv yet.My vet recommended treatment with Immunoregulin. Theprotocol per 
>> Plumb’s is an IV injection twice weekly for two weeks, then 1injection once 
>> weekly for 21 weeks. She is now in her 4th week oftreatment. For the first 
>> two weeks, her lymph nodes decreased and becamesofter. But after the 2nd 
>> week her lymph nodes are raging againdespite the treatments. She is eating 
>> well, but not very active. Has anyone had experience with this treatment or 
>> any othertreatment(s) or advice to help my little girl? Thanks in advance,  
>> Pat Peterson
>
>
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Re: [Felvtalk] FeLv Positive cat

2017-02-25 Thread Amani Oakley

Hi Molly

I tried Immunoregulin for a long time with my FeLV little boy, but it was 
completely ineffective. You need to be doing regular (weekly or every other 
week) blood testing, to monitor whether the Immunoregulin is helping or not.

If not, then don’t run through the full 21 weeks. There would be no point and 
you will waste valuable time while she worsens.

I had good luck using a combination of Doxycycline (1/2 100 mg twice a day) 
plus Winstrol (1 mg x2 day) plus prednisone/prednisolone (1/2 5 mg tablet x2 a 
day). Even on this protocol, I recommend close weekly or bi-weekly monitoring 
so you can see if you start getting a rise in the red cell indices, etc. Don’t 
let your vet talk you out of one or another of these medications. You can’t 
substitute another antibiotic for the Doxycycline, for example. Doxycycline has 
anti-RNA properties (which allows it to interfere with the replication of 
viruses when other antibiotics don’t do this.)

Some people in this group have also reported excellent results with “Zander’s 
Protocol” while others have not. I am hypothesizing that this may be due to the 
fact that it appears there may be as many as five different strains of the 
virus, so perhaps the different strains respond or don’t respond to certain 
things. The other thing that may affect outcome is timing. The virus shuts down 
the bone marrow by killing or taking over the cells in the bone marrow. At some 
point, there will be little in the bone marrow to turn back on (which it 
appears the Winstrol can do in some instances).

Amani

P.S. – For those of you keeping score, I have corrected my previous description 
of Zander’s Protocol because I found an old pill bottle and realized I had been 
giving him ½ a 100 mg Doxy tablet twice a day, not a ¼ tablet as I had 
previously reported. Sorry for any confusion.

From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Molly 
Mou
Sent: February-24-17 9:57 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: [Felvtalk] FeLv Positive cat

I am new to the list. Three weeks ago my 5-year old Mia kitty was diagnosed 
with FeLv. The ELISA test showed slightly + for FeLv. I took her to the vet’s 
initially because her lymph nodes were raging – all of them premandibular, 
prescapular, inguinal all the way to the popliteals were enlarged.
A needle aspirate of the lymph nodes result was hyperplasia, no lymphosarcoma. 
White blood cell count was normal, but she was anemic, but not to the point of 
needing a transfusion.
I was devastated and stunned at this diagnosis because she (the whole litter) 
was tested as kittens for FIV and FeLv and were negative. My vet said the 
disease can stay in the bone marrow. I have her brother who is asymptomatic – 
confusing. I haven’t had him tested yet for FeLv yet.
My vet recommended treatment with Immunoregulin. The protocol per Plumb’s is an 
IV injection twice weekly for two weeks, then 1 injection once weekly for 21 
weeks. She is now in her 4th week of treatment.
For the first two weeks, her lymph nodes decreased and became softer. But after 
the 2nd week her lymph nodes are raging again despite the treatments. She is 
eating well, but not very active.
Has anyone had experience with this treatment or any other treatment(s) or 
advice to help my little girl?

Thanks in advance,

Pat Peterson
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Re: [Felvtalk] FeLv Positive cat

2017-02-25 Thread Katherine K.

count, and was used as a
> treatment for facial swelling or angioedema.
>
> When the manufacture of Winstrol was finally discontinued, Ovation
> Pharmaceuticals bought the rights to manufacture it, in 2003. However,
> Ovation Pharmaceuticals have ceased their operations now, so the Winstrol
> products available today in the American markets are only generic and not
> pharmaceutical grade. Outside the USA, however, several large brands still
> manufacture and sell Winstrol.
>
> Genuine Stanozolol can be distinguished in water suspensions because it
> separates from the liquid into micrometer particles. These particles will
> fall to the bottom if the container is not disturbed for a few hours. The
> crystals have a milky white color.
>
> Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses as
> well. Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in order to
> promote red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate appetite, and
> enhance muscle growth. It has also reportedly been used to dope horses in
> US horse races.
>
> If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from a
> compounding pharmacy.
>
>
>
> The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in poor
> shape and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times a day for a
> week or so, and then drop down to the lower dose.
>
>
>
> Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver damage.
>
>
>
> The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably result
> in the premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is directly
> effective to fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may not assist but
> such a treatment is again a side treatment where you are hoping to boost
> your cat’s immune system, rather than a direct attack on the virus. It is
> also quite indirect in that IF the interferon helps, it will be more long
> term, and only if it manages to boost the immune system enough to permit
> your cat’s system to try and fight the virus, and when/if the virus is
> inhibited enough, then MAYBE (if the virus hasn’t already destroyed all the
> progenitor cells in the bone marrow) will red cell production begin to
> climb again. Winstrol is the only medication that I know of, (and believe
> me, I have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on those progenitor
> cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it also works to
> enhance the production of bone cells (effective against osteoporosis).
>
>
>
> The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only
> information about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly
> designed research study where the cats in the study were given doses found
> effective on HUSKY SLED DOGS for lord’s sake! The cats were given a LOADING
> DOSE via intravenous injection, of 25 mg – more than 10 times the
> recommended daily dose for cats. That’s the only study which has found this
> supposed link between Winstrol and liver damage. And even in that study,
> with those remarkably ridiculous doses, the cats in that study only had
> elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) and the liver enzymes dropped
> back to normal levels when the Winstrol was discontinued. This is
> consistent with my experience as well. I refused to stop the Winstrol for
> my cat, when the enzymes went up, because he was going to die with the low
> red cell count he had. I kept him on Winstrol for around 10 months, before
> the red cells were in a normal range. During that ten month period, I would
> wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells would immediately drop
> again, so it was more than clear that it was the Winstrol making the
> numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol pretty much for the duration
> of 10 months and his liver enzymes went right back to normal again, once I
> discontinued the Winstrol – NO lasting damage. This was also my experience
> with a second cat with a nasal sarcoma, and where I used the Winstrol to
> keep her appetite up and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The enzymes went
> quite high at the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to normal
> when I weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took her
> off the Winstrol.
>
>
>
> Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the prednisone
> (which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the Winstrol is used)
> and Doxycycline.
>
>
>
> Amani
>
>
>
> *From:* Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] *On Behalf
> Of *Liz McCarty
> *Sent:* September-15-16 1:40 PM
> *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
> *Subject:* [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV
>
>  Hi everyone,
>

Re: [Felvtalk] FeLv Positive cat

2017-02-25 Thread Sandy

ve a milky white color. 

Winstrol can not only be used for humans, but it has veterinary uses as well. 
Weakened or injured animals can be treated with Winstrol in order to promote 
red blood cell count, strengthen bones, stimulate appetite, and enhance muscle 
growth. It has also reportedly been used to dope horses in US horse races. 

If your vet is willing to try this, he/she will need to order it from a 
compounding pharmacy. 



The dose should be 1 mg 2 times a day for a cat. If your cat is in poor shape 
and needs an immediate boost, start him on 2 mg x 2 times a day for a week or 
so, and then drop down to the lower dose. 



Your vet will undoubtedly say that Winstrol is known to cause liver damage. 



The first answer to this is, so what? FeLV will almost invariably result in the 
premature death of cats. The vets have nothing which is directly effective to 
fight FeLV. Things like Interferon may or may not assist but such a treatment 
is again a side treatment where you are hoping to boost your cat’s immune 
system, rather than a direct attack on the virus. It is also quite indirect in 
that IF the interferon helps, it will be more long term, and only if it manages 
to boost the immune system enough to permit your cat’s system to try and fight 
the virus, and when/if the virus is inhibited enough, then MAYBE (if the virus 
hasn’t already destroyed all the progenitor cells in the bone marrow) will red 
cell production begin to climb again. Winstrol is the only medication that I 
know of, (and believe me, I have looked!) that seems to work by turning back on 
those progenitor cells or possibly promoting the growth of new ones since it 
also works to enhance the production of bone cells (effective against 
osteoporosis). 



The second answer, regarding the liver damage, is that the only information 
about this is quite suspect, coming out of a very poorly designed research 
study where the cats in the study were given doses found effective on HUSKY 
SLED DOGS for lord’s sake! The cats were given a LOADING DOSE via intravenous 
injection, of 25 mg – more than 10 times the recommended daily dose for cats. 
That’s the only study which has found this supposed link between Winstrol and 
liver damage. And even in that study, with those remarkably ridiculous doses, 
the cats in that study only had elevated liver enzymes (no tumours, etc.) and 
the liver enzymes dropped back to normal levels when the Winstrol was 
discontinued. This is consistent with my experience as well. I refused to stop 
the Winstrol for my cat, when the enzymes went up, because he was going to die 
with the low red cell count he had. I kept him on Winstrol for around 10 
months, before the red cells were in a normal range. During that ten month 
period, I would wean him down a few times, but ALWAYS the red cells would 
immediately drop again, so it was more than clear that it was the Winstrol 
making the numbers rise. So, in the end, he had Winstrol pretty much for the 
duration of 10 months and his liver enzymes went right back to normal again, 
once I discontinued the Winstrol – NO lasting damage. This was also my 
experience with a second cat with a nasal sarcoma, and where I used the 
Winstrol to keep her appetite up and reduce the swelling (she was 16). The 
enzymes went quite high at the outset of my use of Winstrol, but went back to 
normal when I weaned her off for a bit and then again when I ultimately took 
her off the Winstrol. 



Get the Winstrol if you can, and use it in combination with the prednisone 
(which I am told also helps to protect the liver when the Winstrol is used) and 
Doxycycline. 



Amani 



From: Felvtalk [ mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org ] On Behalf Of Liz 
McCarty 
Sent: September-15-16 1:40 PM 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Subject: [Felvtalk] My baby recently diagnosed with FeLV 

Hi everyone, 

Looking for support, suggestions, and information. I've never had a cat with 
FeLV. We took our 1 year old, Hodor, to the vet because he seemed lethargic and 
in his stool there was a piece of floss that was red. At the vet things 
escalated and they told us he was severely anemic and would need a transfusion 
that day. I took off work and rushed him to a specialist. The vet there told us 
she would run an FeLV test before doing anything in case we wanted to avoid the 
extra tests and procedures. She told us he was FeLV positive and persistently 
talked to me and my fiance about euthanizing him which was out of the question 
for us. I took him to the vet thinking it was going to be minor and then she's 
talking to me about killing him! We went forward with the blood transfusion. 
It's been almost 3 weeks now. They had him on doxycycline in case there was a 
bacterial cause, and prednisone. Last week he started interferon... Does anyone 
have experience with that and know if it was effective? I also started him on 
Pet Tinic. Any other suggestions? Any insight into whether you think he wil

Re: [Felvtalk] FeLv Positive cat

2017-02-25 Thread dlgegg

I haave had no problems with this, all I can offer is prayer.

 Molly Mou  wrote: 
>  I am new to the list. Three weeks ago my 5-year old Miakitty was diagnosed 
> with FeLv. The ELISA test showed slightly + for FeLv. Itook her to the vet’s 
> initially because her lymph nodes were raging – all ofthem premandibular, 
> prescapular, inguinal all the way to the popliteals wereenlarged. A needle 
> aspirate of the lymph nodes result was hyperplasia,no lymphosarcoma. White 
> blood cell count was normal, but she was anemic, butnot to the point of 
> needing a transfusion.I was devastated and stunned at this diagnosis because 
> she(the whole litter) was tested as kittens for FIV and FeLv and were 
> negative. Myvet said the disease can stay in the bone marrow. I have her 
> brother who isasymptomatic – confusing. I haven’t had him tested yet for FeLv 
> yet.My vet recommended treatment with Immunoregulin. Theprotocol per Plumb’s 
> is an IV injection twice weekly for two weeks, then 1injection once weekly 
> for 21 weeks. She is now in her 4th week oftreatment. For the first two 
> weeks, her lymph nodes decreased and becamesofter. But after the 2nd week her 
> lymph nodes are raging againdespite the treatments. She is eating well, but 
> not very active. Has anyone had experience with this treatment or any 
> othertreatment(s) or advice to help my little girl? Thanks in advance,  Pat 
> Peterson


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[Felvtalk] FeLv Positive cat

2017-02-24 Thread Molly Mou

 I am new to the list. Three weeks ago my 5-year old Miakitty was diagnosed 
with FeLv. The ELISA test showed slightly + for FeLv. Itook her to the vet’s 
initially because her lymph nodes were raging – all ofthem premandibular, 
prescapular, inguinal all the way to the popliteals wereenlarged. A needle 
aspirate of the lymph nodes result was hyperplasia,no lymphosarcoma. White 
blood cell count was normal, but she was anemic, butnot to the point of needing 
a transfusion.I was devastated and stunned at this diagnosis because she(the 
whole litter) was tested as kittens for FIV and FeLv and were negative. Myvet 
said the disease can stay in the bone marrow. I have her brother who 
isasymptomatic – confusing. I haven’t had him tested yet for FeLv yet.My vet 
recommended treatment with Immunoregulin. Theprotocol per Plumb’s is an IV 
injection twice weekly for two weeks, then 1injection once weekly for 21 weeks. 
She is now in her 4th week oftreatment. For the first two weeks, her lymph 
nodes decreased and becamesofter. But after the 2nd week her lymph nodes are 
raging againdespite the treatments. She is eating well, but not very active. 
Has anyone had experience with this treatment or any othertreatment(s) or 
advice to help my little girl? Thanks in advance,  Pat Peterson___
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Re: [Felvtalk] both of my cats are FELV positive. What to do now?

2016-06-07 Thread Rachel Dagner

Hi Realissa,



I am sorry to hear about your babies, the diagnosis is a real heartbreaker,
I know. If you are interested in a holistic approach to keep them healthy
there is a really good book called The Nature of Animal Healing by Dr.
Marin Goldstein. He is known as one of the best integrative vets in the
world, integrative meaning he uses conventional and holistic remedies for
his patients. He has cured animals that owners were told were not curable
or that conventional medicine alone did not work for. Which I think is the
best kind of vet. His clinic is  based out of New York, if I lived there
and had known about him that is where I would have gone for my baby right
from the get go, no doubt. He has a section in his book on what he has done
for FELV kitties to keep them healthy and from developing the bad things
that can come along for FELV cats. I think the biggest thing I have learned
about FELV is that we should probably not vaccinate them, especially if
they are indoor cats. Vaccinations do a number on even a healthy animals
immune system. He does have suggestions on how to keep them strong if they
must endure vaccinations due to state laws, and suggests that if you do
vaccines that you should not do them all at once or in combo doses as this
is too much for the immune system to handle at one time. There is a very
real reason they have now* finally* started doing 3 year vaccinations
instead of yearly, even though Veterinarians have been pushing for it since
the 90s.  The side effects, the sick animals, the cancer that they have
caused… it is all very scary and with a FELV or immune compromised cats and
dogs even more so.  I hope you can push past the fear, come up with a solid
game plan to do the best you can for them and then just enjoy them and put
Felv on the back burner and go on as normal. This is what you have to do,
and you will, and you will come to terms with the situation and move
forward. I will pray that your babies stay healthy and happy for many, many
years to come.



Rachel







*From:* Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] *On Behalf Of
*Realissa Dekraunti
*Sent:* Sunday, June 05, 2016 8:51 PM
*To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
*Subject:* [Felvtalk] both of my cats are FELV positive. What to do now?



Hi everybody. Thank you for accepting me in this group.  I am just too
devastated to think straight. I rescued two cats in October and I found out
two days ago that they are both Felv positive. We did an Elisa test on
Thursday, and it came back positive, and an IFA that confirmed the positive
results. I live in LA and I don't know what to do, where to go, if there is
alternative medicine. I love these two cats more than I could ever imagine
and it is breaking my heart. Any input, help, direction you could give me,
would be incredibly appreciated. They are FIV negative but FELV positive. I
have heard there is a medicine called LTCI but that it is very expensive. I
am also heard of Virbagen Omega, L Lysin, Interfone. There is so much info
that I am overwhelmed.



to add some information.



 Date of birth: May 7, 2015
ELISA "snap" test at Animal Wellness Center: June 25, 2015 (age: 7 weeks).
Results: weak positive for FeLV
IFA confirming test at Animal Wellness Center: June 30, 2015 (age: 7 weeks,
5 days). Results: negative
ELISA "snap" test at Animal Wellness Center: August 1, 2015 (age: 12 weeks,
2 days). Results: weak positive for FeLV
ELISA in-lab test at Animal Wellness Center (sent to IDEXX): August 13,
2015 (age: 14 weeks). Results: negative



June 1, 2016 ELISA test both came positive



June 2, 2016 IFA both came Felv positive FIV negative



Thanks a lot
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Re: [Felvtalk] both of my cats are FELV positive. What to do now?

2016-06-05 Thread Amani Oakley

 x2 days or 
even down to 1 mg a day

Be forewarned that your vet, if he has heard of Winstrol, will tell you that it 
causes liver damage. In my experience, the liver enzymes often do rise, but 
will fall back into the normal range once the Winstrol is discontinued. As far 
as I am able to tell, there is no lasting damage, and despite the fact that I 
have spent literally hundreds of hours on the internet researching this drug 
(for both humans and animals) I am unable to find any true, 
scientifically-established link to any actual liver damage. (Website after 
website recites that it is known to cause or may cause liver damage, but none 
of them have any scientific references or even case studies to back up this 
claim.) For your cats, if they are not exhibiting any symptoms, this may be 
more of an issue for you to consider. Most of us in this group, have had cats 
in desperate situations when we looked for something like Winstrol, so 
obviously, a risk of liver issues was a completely acceptable risk. However, I 
am pretty confident that the risk of liver problems is an extremely inflated 
and unsubstantiated threat.

If you do decide to go this route, your vet needs to get the Winstrol from a 
compounding pharmacy, but unlike the other options out there like Interferon 
and LTCI, (which are pretty expensive) Winstrol is not – maybe a $1 a pill or 
something like that – I can’t remember for sure.

However, this is just my opinion and experience. Zander lived 6 years after his 
“crash” and after the vets told me there was nothing to do for him but put him 
down. From reading the emails of others in this group, there are some who have 
had good experiences with Interferon and LTCI. I recently learned that there 
are four subgroups of the virus that causes FeLV and thus, this may explain why 
different people have different experiences with these medications. However, in 
my book, if I had the opportunity to do things again, I would have started 
Zander on Winstrol as soon as he was diagnosed with FeLV and when he had the 
first minor problem show itself. Winstrol, as an anabolic steroid, strengthens 
body (muscle and promotes bone growth, etc), enhances appetite and a sense of 
energy and well-being, so I think it is a good support for the system stressed 
by the FeLV virus in any event.

Amani



From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of 
Realissa Dekraunti
Sent: June-05-16 8:51 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org<mailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org>
Subject: [Felvtalk] both of my cats are FELV positive. What to do now?

Hi everybody. Thank you for accepting me in this group.  I am just too 
devastated to think straight. I rescued two cats in October and I found out two 
days ago that they are both Felv positive. We did an Elisa test on Thursday, 
and it came back positive, and an IFA that confirmed the positive results. I 
live in LA and I don't know what to do, where to go, if there is alternative 
medicine. I love these two cats more than I could ever imagine and it is 
breaking my heart. Any input, help, direction you could give me, would be 
incredibly appreciated. They are FIV negative but FELV positive. I have heard 
there is a medicine called LTCI but that it is very expensive. I am also heard 
of Virbagen Omega, L Lysin, Interfone. There is so much info that I am 
overwhelmed.

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Re: [Felvtalk] both of my cats are FELV positive. What to do now?

2016-06-05 Thread Marsha

Hi, welcome to the group!  First off, don't panic.  If they appear to be 
otherwise healthy, the most important things are a low stress 
environment and a high quality diet.  My Harley & Milkdud each lived 4.5 
years after I adopted them, in generally good health until the virus 
changed to its active form.  Brock only lived a year and a half (but he 
was probably close to 5 when he died).  All were doing great until 10 
days to 3 months before they died.  Harley did have a severe upper 
respiratory infection (10 days in the hospital) 2 months before he got 
cancer, but those 2 months between, he was a happy boy, his usual 
rambunctious self, causing all kinds of mischief.  All 3 got cancer in 
the end - 2 lymphoma, and Harley's was an inoperable tumor that started 
in the middle ear and spread down to his jaw.


Brock had a heart condition and was on 5 prescription meds plus 2 
supplements for that.  I gave lysine when Harley got his upper 
respiratory infection, but I'm not sure it did much.  I think I gave it 
to Brock also.  He lived with Harley, but never got the infection.  I 
will always wonder if Brock might have been the source.  But it was 2-3 
months between the time I adopted Brock and Harley got the URI.  Mice 
would get in sometimes, and a week or two before Harley got sick, he 
caught a chipmunk in the garage.


Some lucky FeLV+ cats live 10-12 years.  I have had 2 vets say they see 
an average survival of 2.5 years, with a range from 6 months to 10+ years.


Marsha


On 6/5/2016 7:51 PM, Realissa Dekraunti wrote:
Hi everybody. Thank you for accepting me in this group.  I am just too 
devastated to think straight. I rescued two cats in October and I 
found out two days ago that they are both Felv positive. We did an 
Elisa test on Thursday, and it came back positive, and an IFA that 
confirmed the positive results. I live in LA and I don't know what to 
do, where to go, if there is alternative medicine. I love these two 
cats more than I could ever imagine and it is breaking my heart. Any 
input, help, direction you could give me, would be incredibly 
appreciated. They are FIV negative but FELV positive. I have heard 
there is a medicine called LTCI but that it is very expensive. I am 
also heard of Virbagen Omega, L Lysin, Interfone. There is so much 
info that I am overwhelmed.


to add some information.

 Date of birth: May 7, 2015
ELISA "snap" test at Animal Wellness Center: June 25, 2015 (age: 7 
weeks). Results: weak positive for FeLV
IFA confirming test at Animal Wellness Center: June 30, 2015 (age: 7 
weeks, 5 days). Results: negative
ELISA "snap" test at Animal Wellness Center: August 1, 2015 (age: 12 
weeks, 2 days). Results: weak positive for FeLV
ELISA in-lab test at Animal Wellness Center (sent to IDEXX): August 
13, 2015 (age: 14 weeks). Results: negative


June 1, 2016 ELISA test both came positive

June 2, 2016 IFA both came Felv positive FIV negative

Thanks a lot


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[Felvtalk] both of my cats are FELV positive. What to do now?

2016-06-05 Thread Realissa Dekraunti

Hi everybody. Thank you for accepting me in this group.  I am just too
devastated to think straight. I rescued two cats in October and I found out
two days ago that they are both Felv positive. We did an Elisa test on
Thursday, and it came back positive, and an IFA that confirmed the positive
results. I live in LA and I don't know what to do, where to go, if there is
alternative medicine. I love these two cats more than I could ever imagine
and it is breaking my heart. Any input, help, direction you could give me,
would be incredibly appreciated. They are FIV negative but FELV positive. I
have heard there is a medicine called LTCI but that it is very expensive. I
am also heard of Virbagen Omega, L Lysin, Interfone. There is so much info
that I am overwhelmed.

to add some information.

 Date of birth: May 7, 2015
ELISA "snap" test at Animal Wellness Center: June 25, 2015 (age: 7 weeks).
Results: weak positive for FeLV
IFA confirming test at Animal Wellness Center: June 30, 2015 (age: 7 weeks,
5 days). Results: negative
ELISA "snap" test at Animal Wellness Center: August 1, 2015 (age: 12 weeks,
2 days). Results: weak positive for FeLV
ELISA in-lab test at Animal Wellness Center (sent to IDEXX): August 13,
2015 (age: 14 weeks). Results: negative

June 1, 2016 ELISA test both came positive

June 2, 2016 IFA both came Felv positive FIV negative

Thanks a lot
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Re: [Felvtalk] FelV positive or negative

2015-10-05 Thread Lorrie

How right you are... It really is a crap shoot. I test all
newcomers to our sanctuary, but this does not mean the cat will be
Felv negative forever.  There is the re-emergence of the virus, the
test being done wrong, and the window area where a cat has  just
acquired the virus but it does not show up in the blood test yet.
-
Lorrie



> I have many cats. They live in groups, and occasionally one crosses
> from one group to another, or at least they did. All cats in my
> house have been FeLV tested at least twice (a minimum of 45 days
> apart), and all tested negative by Elisa. Two years ago in March,
> after blocking and subsequently going precipitously downhill, my
> Gribble tested positive for FeLV. After a major struggle, we got
> him back, at least for now. I now only test with routine bloodwork,
> or when someone is sick. One other cat has come up positive. He
> previously tested negative 3 times.
> 
> My point in all this is that I no longer believe negative means
> negative. I feel that the virus can become dormant in the bone
> marrow, and re-emerge to cause active infection. So I figure all I
> can do is now keep the groups separate, and vaccinate any incomers.
> Two cats have come in with special needs, and both live with the
> positives, because they also need monitoring. They are vaccinated.
> 
> It's a crap shoot :(
> 
> Margo
> 

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Re: [Felvtalk] Positive cats

2015-05-29 Thread dlgegg

You hit it on the head, STRESS is the culprit. Annie never showed signs of
FELV until a the age of 4, her owner was diagnosed with liver cancer and
quickly went to hospice. Then she was locked up in a single trailer for 3
weeks with only contact was someone feeding and changing the box. After that
she was boxed up, brought to the vet and then to my house. Too much change too
fast. She still has emotional problems.

Margo toomanykitti...@earthlink.net wrote:

Hi Lorrie,

What approximate age were they when tested? Just a single snap
(Elisa) test? No confirmation? I have come to the conclusion that a negative
subsequent to a positive result is pretty unreliable, because thru personal
experience I have had cats that tested negative multiple times, and no
possibility of exposure after that break positive. I'm going with the 2008
information on the subject from DVM (
http://veterinarycalendar.dvm360.com/testing-kittens-felv-and-fiv-proceedings?id=sk=date=%0A%09%09%09pageID=2
);

Ideas on possible outcomes of infection with FeLV are currently undergoing
re-evaluation. In the past, it was believed that about 1/3 of cats became
persistently viremic and about 2/3 would clear infection. New research using
PCR technologies suggests that most cats remain infected for life following
exposure to FeLV. However, they may revert to a non-viremic state that is
termed regressive infection. In regressive infections, there is no antigen
present in the blood and virus cannot be cultured from blood. But FeLV
proviral DNA can be detected in blood using PCR (Pepin, Tandon et al. 2007).
The significance of PCR-positive but antigen-negative regressive infections
is not yet clear. These cats are unlikely to shed infectious virus in saliva,
but may transmit proviral DNA via blood transfusion if used as a blood donor.
Prior to the advent of PCR technology, the term latency was used for
antigen-negative cats where virus could not be cultured from blood, but could
be cult
ur
ed from bone marrow or other tissues. It now appears that latency is a
phase through which cats pass during regressive infection.

But, if they were not confirmed as kittens, there is a
possibility that the results were false.

And I'm with you. I don't re-test unless/until there's a reason
to do so. Stress is the enemy...

HTH,

Margo

-Original Message-
From: Lorrie felineres...@frontier.com
Sent: May 28, 2015 5:05 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: [Felvtalk] Positive cats

Has anyone in the group had a cat or cats who tested positive on a
snap test 7 years ago (as kittens) and are still in apparent good
health? I have two ferals who tested positive and both are still
doing fine. I have not had them retested due to their being feral
as I'm afraid the stress of a vet visit will affect their immune
systems.

Lorrie

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[Felvtalk] Positive cats

2015-05-28 Thread Lorrie

Has anyone in the group had a cat or cats who tested positive on a
snap test 7 years ago (as kittens) and are still in apparent good
health?  I have two ferals who tested positive and both are still
doing fine. I have not had them retested due to their being feral 
as I'm afraid the stress of a vet visit will affect their immune
systems.  

Lorrie



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Re: [Felvtalk] Positive cats

2015-05-28 Thread dlgegg

mINE IS NOT FERAL, BUT TESTED POSITIVE WHEN I ADOPTED HER OVER 4 YEARS AGO.  
SHE CME FROM A VERY STRESSFUL SITUATION AND I THINK THAT IS WHAT MADE HER TEST 
POSITIVE.  OTHER THAN BEING UN SOCIAL (IN 1 PERSON, 1 CAT HOME), SHE IS IN 
PERFECT HEALTH AND LIVES WITH MY OTHER CATS.  STARTED WITH 8 AND THEN SOME DIED 
DUE TO OLD AGE (19).  I AM NOW DOWN TO 4 CATS, 1 EX FERAL AGE 8, ANNIE AND DUE 
CHILDREN HARLEY AND DEE WHO DRIVE THE OLDER ONES CRAZY .

 Lorrie felineres...@frontier.com wrote: 
 Has anyone in the group had a cat or cats who tested positive on a
 snap test 7 years ago (as kittens) and are still in apparent good
 health?  I have two ferals who tested positive and both are still
 doing fine. I have not had them retested due to their being feral 
 as I'm afraid the stress of a vet visit will affect their immune
 systems.  
 
 Lorrie
 
 
 
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Re: [Felvtalk] Positive cats

2015-05-28 Thread Margo


Hi Lorrie,

  What approximate age were they when tested? Just a single snap 
(Elisa) test? No confirmation? I have come to the conclusion that a negative 
subsequent to a positive result is pretty unreliable, because thru personal 
experience I have had cats that tested negative multiple times, and no 
possibility of exposure after that break positive. I'm going with the 2008 
information on the subject from DVM ( 
http://veterinarycalendar.dvm360.com/testing-kittens-felv-and-fiv-proceedings?id=sk=date=%0A%09%09%09pageID=2
 );

Ideas on possible outcomes of infection with FeLV are currently undergoing 
re-evaluation. In the past, it was believed that about 1/3 of cats became 
persistently viremic and about 2/3 would clear infection. New research using 
PCR technologies suggests that most cats remain infected for life following 
exposure to FeLV. However, they may revert to a non-viremic state that is 
termed regressive infection. In regressive infections, there is no antigen 
present in the blood and virus cannot be cultured from blood. But FeLV proviral 
DNA can be detected in blood using PCR (Pepin, Tandon et al. 2007). The 
significance of PCR-positive but antigen-negative regressive infections is not 
yet clear. These cats are unlikely to shed infectious virus in saliva, but may 
transmit proviral DNA via blood transfusion if used as a blood donor. Prior to 
the advent of PCR technology, the term latency was used for antigen-negative 
cats where virus could not be cultured from blood, but could be cultur
 ed from bone marrow or other tissues. It now appears that latency is a phase 
through which cats pass during regressive infection.

But, if they were not confirmed as kittens, there is a possibility 
that the results were false.


And I'm with you. I don't re-test unless/until there's a reason to 
do so. Stress is the enemy...

HTH,

Margo

  
-Original Message-
From: Lorrie felineres...@frontier.com
Sent: May 28, 2015 5:05 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: [Felvtalk] Positive cats

Has anyone in the group had a cat or cats who tested positive on a
snap test 7 years ago (as kittens) and are still in apparent good
health?  I have two ferals who tested positive and both are still
doing fine. I have not had them retested due to their being feral 
as I'm afraid the stress of a vet visit will affect their immune
systems.  

Lorrie



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Re: [Felvtalk] Positive cats

2015-05-28 Thread Linda Titus

I'm on the Owners of FELV +/FIV+ Cats on Facebook and it sounds like a lot
of people there have older cats. You should join that group.
On May 28, 2015 3:05 PM, Lorrie felineres...@frontier.com wrote:

 Has anyone in the group had a cat or cats who tested positive on a
 snap test 7 years ago (as kittens) and are still in apparent good
 health?  I have two ferals who tested positive and both are still
 doing fine. I have not had them retested due to their being feral
 as I'm afraid the stress of a vet visit will affect their immune
 systems.

 Lorrie



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[Felvtalk] Donatello - Leuk positive cat in PA

2015-01-19 Thread Amy

The rescue where I volunteer recently took in a stray that tested positive for 
leukemia.  We are looking for a loving home for him.  I have pictures if 
anybody is interested and his information is on Facebook and on our website.  
He is one handsome fella!
https://www.facebook.com/AnimalServiceLeague

http://www.animalserviceleagueny.org/

Donatello was found as a stray. He is a large, male, black and white spotted 
cat. Upon testing, he was found to be positive for feline leukemia. This test 
has been confirmed by further blood work. He is estimated to be about four 
years old and is a big, truly friendly, and affectionate cat. He is VERY sweet 
and full of personality! He is in need of a loving, permanent indoor home with 
other leukemia positive cats or in a home with properly leukemia vaccinated 
cats. Although he has been accustomed to outdoor life, he is currently in 
indoor isolation away from other cats and would be very happy to have more 
freedom and friends. He just cannot be outside anymore where he could expose or 
infect other cats. His eyes are bright and he appears healthy and is active. We 
have neutered him and completed his vaccinations. If you are interested in a 
special needs cat, please consider Donatello. We will do whatever we have to do 
to find him a safe place! 
Thanks!Amy
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Re: [Felvtalk] pregnant positive cat

2015-01-16 Thread Margo



Hi Kat,

   Guess we're all on the same page. When I saw you mention abort I 
wanted to be clear on my thoughts. I'm curious about the kitty dnc, could you 
explain? 

Thanks!

Margo



-Original Message-
From: Korruptakitty korruptaki...@gmail.com
Sent: Jan 15, 2015 9:26 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] pregnant positive cat

Well, yes, of course spayed.  I was just saying terminated because after a 
certain point, sometimes a kitty dnc of sorts, is necessary.  I didn't mean 
to imply I thought she should be left intact, by any means. 

Sealed with a purr..  =^.,^=

~Kat~


***I'm Kat Parker;  I park  cats***

 On Jan 15, 2015, at 5:48 PM, felvtalk-requ...@felineleukemia.org wrote:
 
 Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to
felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 
 To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
 
 or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
felvtalk-requ...@felineleukemia.org
 
 You can reach the person managing the list at
felvtalk-ow...@felineleukemia.org
 
 When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
 than Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest...
 
 
 Today's Topics:
 
   1. Re: pregnant FeLV cat (judith cook)
   2. Re: pregnant FeLV cat (judith cook)
 
 
 --
 
 Message: 1
 Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2015 01:48:06 + (UTC)
 From: judith cook jmasse...@yahoo.com
 To: Margo toomanykitti...@earthlink.net,
felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org,
felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] pregnant FeLV cat
 Message-ID:

 389200175.1965350.1421372886293.javamail.ya...@jws106147.mail.bf1.yahoo.com

 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
 
 AllYes, I AM planning to do a spay, if that's what we think is best. ?I have 
 heard about cats in heat - really devious little devils, and pains in the 
 neck. ?Really want to get this resolved, and hoping that it works out best 
 for my kitty. ?Her name is Spice, and she is (no surprise) a tortoiseshell 
 with white chest, belly, and paws. ?She really looks a lot like another 
 tortie I once had - a little jewel also. ?Thanks so much for your advice and 
 interest. ?Will let you know ASAP.Judy 
 
 On Thursday, January 15, 2015 3:57 AM, Margo 
 toomanykitti...@earthlink.net wrote:
 
 
 #yiv6002453355 body{font-family:Geneva, Arial, Helvetica, 
 sans-serif;font-size:9pt;background-color:#ff;color:black;} ?Hi 
 Kat??? You're still timely, there will be a meeting with the Vet 
 Friday, I believe. I just want to be clear on what I stated, so there is no 
 misunderstanding :). I think Kitty should be spayed, not aborted. Leaving 
 her intact would be an invitation to a repeat pregnancy, and the stress of 
 heat cycles. No matter how careful we are, cats get out, and?a cat in heat 
 is VERY resourceful! At least with a spay, it's all over with.All the 
 best,Margo
 
 
 -Original Message- 
 From: Kat Parker 
 Sent: Jan 14, 2015 1:25 PM 
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] pregnant FeLV cat 
 
 PLEASE have the abort the kittens. We have our vets here for the
 ? FCC terminate cats pregnancies up until the time of birth, sometimes. And
 if you have watched many kittens die of FeLV, like I have,you wouldnt wish
 that on them. Not Only born to die,but a terrible death that is
 unnecessary. I realize I am not replying in a timely manner, and I hope
 it is not too late, but please, do the right thing by these kittens.Also,
 in terms of Momma's Stress, no doubt about it, kitten birth, nursing, the
 stress involved,and watching her own kittens die one by one. Please
 terminate this pregnancy.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 *Love and Katnip, ~Kat~ =^,,^= **I'm Kat
 Parker. I park cats.*
 * Spay  neuter your neighbors... maybe THAT will fix the problem.*
 *Keep your kitties INSIDE, 24/7, 'cause an inside cat is a SAFE  HAPPY
 cat!*
 
 *http://www.facebook.com/kat.theCRITTERprotector
 *
 
 On Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 10:00 AM, 
 wrote:
 
 Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to
 felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 
 To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
 
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
 
 or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
 felvtalk-requ...@felineleukemia.org
 
 You can reach the person managing the list at
 felvtalk-ow...@felineleukemia.org
 
 When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
 than Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest...
 
 
 Today's Topics:
 
 1. Re: Pregnant FeLV cat (judith cook)
 
 
 --
 
 Message: 1
 Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2015 03:31:36 + (UTC)
 From: judith cook 
 To: Margo ,
 felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Pregnant

Re: [Felvtalk] pregnant positive cat

2015-01-16 Thread Marsha

I am getting more confused.  A standard spay of a female cat involves 
removal of both ovaries and both uterine horns.  The uterus is not left 
behind, so there would be no D  C as is done with humans after a 
miscarriage.  The ovaries, uterus, AND kittens inside it would come out 
during a spay, thus terminating (or aborting) the pregnancy by default. 
Spaying is not just tying tubes.  If she was confirmed positive by IFA 
test, I personally would schedule this asap, but would ask the vet about 
what happens at whatever stage of pregnancy she's at, and how would they 
ensure the kittens would pass peacefully.  It's awful to think about, 
but bringing a litter (how many? 3, 4, 5 or more?) of FeLV+ kittens into 
the world isn't so great to think about either.  How would you place 
them, would you keep them all? It would be very hard emotionally and 
financially, I think.


Marsha
(best wishes, whatever you decide)

On 1/15/2015 8:26 PM, Korruptakitty wrote:

Well, yes, of course spayed.  I was just saying terminated because after a certain 
point, sometimes a kitty dnc of sorts, is necessary.  I didn't mean to imply I thought 
she should be left intact, by any means.

Sealed with a purr..  =^.,^=

~Kat~




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Re: [Felvtalk] pregnant positive cat

2015-01-16 Thread Katherine K.

That's a tough issue and I can see both sides. The kittens would take a lot
of her nutrients during nursing, but I don't know how much that would
compromise her immune system. The idea of eliminating a pregnancy during
spay appeals to no one, but raising a litter of positive kittens has it's
own share of heartbreaks. I'm sure you and your vet will make the right
call for sweet Spice. She's lucky to have you caring for her.

On Fri, Jan 16, 2015 at 12:02 PM, Marsha mar...@lynxe.com wrote:

 I am getting more confused.  A standard spay of a female cat involves
 removal of both ovaries and both uterine horns.  The uterus is not left
 behind, so there would be no D  C as is done with humans after a
 miscarriage.  The ovaries, uterus, AND kittens inside it would come out
 during a spay, thus terminating (or aborting) the pregnancy by default.
 Spaying is not just tying tubes.  If she was confirmed positive by IFA
 test, I personally would schedule this asap, but would ask the vet about
 what happens at whatever stage of pregnancy she's at, and how would they
 ensure the kittens would pass peacefully.  It's awful to think about, but
 bringing a litter (how many? 3, 4, 5 or more?) of FeLV+ kittens into the
 world isn't so great to think about either.  How would you place them,
 would you keep them all? It would be very hard emotionally and financially,
 I think.

 Marsha
 (best wishes, whatever you decide)

 On 1/15/2015 8:26 PM, Korruptakitty wrote:

 Well, yes, of course spayed.  I was just saying terminated because
 after a certain point, sometimes a kitty dnc of sorts, is necessary.  I
 didn't mean to imply I thought she should be left intact, by any means.

 Sealed with a purr..  =^.,^=

 ~Kat~



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Re: [Felvtalk] pregnant positive cat

2015-01-15 Thread Korruptakitty

Well, yes, of course spayed.  I was just saying terminated because after a 
certain point, sometimes a kitty dnc of sorts, is necessary.  I didn't mean 
to imply I thought she should be left intact, by any means. 

Sealed with a purr..  =^.,^=

~Kat~


***I'm Kat Parker;  I park  cats***

 On Jan 15, 2015, at 5:48 PM, felvtalk-requ...@felineleukemia.org wrote:
 
 Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to
felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 
 To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
 
 or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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 When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
 than Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest...
 
 
 Today's Topics:
 
   1. Re: pregnant FeLV cat (judith cook)
   2. Re: pregnant FeLV cat (judith cook)
 
 
 --
 
 Message: 1
 Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2015 01:48:06 + (UTC)
 From: judith cook jmasse...@yahoo.com
 To: Margo toomanykitti...@earthlink.net,
felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org,
felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] pregnant FeLV cat
 Message-ID:

 389200175.1965350.1421372886293.javamail.ya...@jws106147.mail.bf1.yahoo.com

 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
 
 AllYes, I AM planning to do a spay, if that's what we think is best. ?I have 
 heard about cats in heat - really devious little devils, and pains in the 
 neck. ?Really want to get this resolved, and hoping that it works out best 
 for my kitty. ?Her name is Spice, and she is (no surprise) a tortoiseshell 
 with white chest, belly, and paws. ?She really looks a lot like another 
 tortie I once had - a little jewel also. ?Thanks so much for your advice and 
 interest. ?Will let you know ASAP.Judy 
 
 On Thursday, January 15, 2015 3:57 AM, Margo 
 toomanykitti...@earthlink.net wrote:
 
 
 #yiv6002453355 body{font-family:Geneva, Arial, Helvetica, 
 sans-serif;font-size:9pt;background-color:#ff;color:black;} ?Hi 
 Kat??? You're still timely, there will be a meeting with the Vet 
 Friday, I believe. I just want to be clear on what I stated, so there is no 
 misunderstanding :). I think Kitty should be spayed, not aborted. Leaving her 
 intact would be an invitation to a repeat pregnancy, and the stress of heat 
 cycles. No matter how careful we are, cats get out, and?a cat in heat is VERY 
 resourceful! At least with a spay, it's all over with.All the best,Margo
 
 
 -Original Message- 
 From: Kat Parker 
 Sent: Jan 14, 2015 1:25 PM 
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] pregnant FeLV cat 
 
 PLEASE have the abort the kittens. We have our vets here for the
 ? FCC terminate cats pregnancies up until the time of birth, sometimes. And
 if you have watched many kittens die of FeLV, like I have,you wouldnt wish
 that on them. Not Only born to die,but a terrible death that is
 unnecessary. I realize I am not replying in a timely manner, and I hope
 it is not too late, but please, do the right thing by these kittens.Also,
 in terms of Momma's Stress, no doubt about it, kitten birth, nursing, the
 stress involved,and watching her own kittens die one by one. Please
 terminate this pregnancy.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 *Love and Katnip, ~Kat~ =^,,^= **I'm Kat
 Parker. I park cats.*
 * Spay  neuter your neighbors... maybe THAT will fix the problem.*
 *Keep your kitties INSIDE, 24/7, 'cause an inside cat is a SAFE  HAPPY
 cat!*
 
 *http://www.facebook.com/kat.theCRITTERprotector
 *
 
 On Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 10:00 AM, 
 wrote:
 
 Send Felvtalk mailing list submissions to
 felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 
 To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
 
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
 
 or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
 felvtalk-requ...@felineleukemia.org
 
 You can reach the person managing the list at
 felvtalk-ow...@felineleukemia.org
 
 When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
 than Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest...
 
 
 Today's Topics:
 
 1. Re: Pregnant FeLV cat (judith cook)
 
 
 --
 
 Message: 1
 Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2015 03:31:36 + (UTC)
 From: judith cook 
 To: Margo ,
 felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Pregnant FeLV cat
 Message-ID:
 
 560642934.154540.1421206296031.javamail.ya...@jws10613.mail.bf1.yahoo.com
 
 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
 
 
 I don't know how far along. ?Just got this kitty right after Christmas.
 ?The vet can feel her kittens, though, so I guess it's not just the
 beginning. ?The vet is trying to get some information also - she is
 concerned about this cat, even though the

Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

2014-11-15 Thread Katherine K.

Sorry Amy, I do agree with all of the points you made. I wish things were
easier for you and these little ones. I too have found this list to be very
supportive and helpful many times. I hope you'll keep us updated on their
status.
On Nov 14, 2014 7:10 PM, Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Hi all,

 I'm sorry that people on this board disagree about the adoption fee and
 I'm disappointed that some people are making judgmental comments.  This
 board has been a great source of support to my family over the years and I
 am not feeling that at all at the moment.  I have adopted 12 positive cats
 of my own and have been on this board since I took my first mom and 3
 kittens over 10 years ago.  I have never owned a non-leuk positive cat
 until this year.  It sounds to me like people think I'm trying to make
 money off these cats or that I'm asking people to do something
 unreasonable.  Do you know what I spent in the past two months trying to
 save one leuk positive?  Over $5000.  That is one of them.  Did I not treat
 her because she is leuk positive?  No I treated her like I would any other
 cat and gave her every opportunity to live, despite her status.  I do the
 same with all my positives even though I know the end result is usually
 them losing the battle with this horrible disease.  I'm not saying that
 whoever adopts these cats should go to those lengths to save them but I
 know the veterinary care that is involved with leuk positives.  If somebody
 is worried about paying a $100 adoption fee because the cat might die, are
 they going to say the same thing about vet care?  I don't want to spend
 the money because it might die.  And what about senior cats/dogs or
 special needs cat/dogs? Rescues charge adoption fees for them as well and
 they can die in a year or two.  Why are leuks any different?  I paid an
 adoption fee at a shelter in CT for 2 of my leuk positives.  I do
 understand there is a controversy about free adoptions vs. fees.  We are
 not a rescue that cares about numbers.  We are a no-kill and we commit to
 an animal for life.  We do the best we can for that animal and are
 committed to finding it the best home possible.  We don't do free adoptions
 or try to move cats as quickly as we can.  It just isn't  how we operate.
 We have a very selective adoption process and we try to make sure all our
 cats are going to loving forever homes.  I am trying to do the same for
 these cats, even though I am well aware of how awful this disease is.

 The woman that contacted us about these kittens has placed lots of
 kittens, no vetting, no applications, no follow up.  That is not helping
 the situation to give kittens away to people that aren't going to take care
 of them or be responsible about this disease.  Asking for an adoption fee
 simply helps show that the adopters are committed and that they understand
 the expense involved in owning an animal.  It in no means makes a dent in
 the money that we spend to help them, nor is it meant to.  We are vetting
 these cats and we are trying to teach this woman about helping in a
 responsible way.  She was going to adopt these cats to anybody and just
 spread the disease or release them outside.  As it is, we are trying to get
 a hold of the stray mom who is probably outside and leuk positive.  I'm
 trying to help educate her and teach her about leukemia and everybody makes
 it sound like I'm doing something wrong.  I have placed numerous cats on
 this board over the years as people constantly call me to help the
 positives.  This woman called me and we are trying to do the right thing.
 Money is not the issue.  It costs us about $500 to vet a kitten
 completely.  There are 5 of them which means about $2500.  I am not trying
 to get that money back.  We already paid to combo test all of them and to
 treat the one for a URI without any commitment to these cats or any thought
 of an adoption fee.  She could have euthanized them all and we would have
 been out that money.  We were just trying to help her out.

 Anyway, I'm probably not going to convince any of you about the adoption
 fee but I would like to say that I never said anything about not placing
 these cats in homes with other FeLV positive cats.  I said I would do an
 IFA first because both Cornell and the SPCA suggest that.  I have
 researched this disease for the past 10 years of my life and talked to vets
 all over the country about it.  I've talked to sanctuaries as well and many
 will not take a leuk positive cat without a positive IFA.  If the cat is
 going to convert and you send it to a home with leukemia when it is IFA
 negative, you could be giving that kitten a death sentence when it could
 have a happy full life leukemia free.  Right now we are giving them 30 days
 to start converting and then we will retest.  But if somebody wanted  one
 and they had cats with leukemia, I just would want to make sure the kitten
 is truly positive.  As I mentioned, we recently had 5 positives at our

Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

2014-11-15 Thread Kelley S

Hi Amy,

I am so sorry if I came off like that.  I hesitated to say anything because
I specifically did not want to come off wrongly or like I was trying to
scold you.  What you are talking about with the lady giving away the cats -
that is not free adoptions IMHO - that is giving away cats.  I go to a lot
of adoption seminars and they stress that when you do free or reduced price
adoptions you keep your same screening.  If you aren't willing to do that
it is perfectly ok, you just have to accept that they have a reduced chance
of ever finding a home.  You might try the facebook group I linked.  They
have had some success in placing FELV+ cats.  I would not hesitate to give
any other cat I had to the adopter that adopted our double positive girl.
She gave her a great life and great medical care.

On Sat, Nov 15, 2014 at 9:22 AM, Katherine K. kaths...@gmail.com wrote:

 Sorry Amy, I do agree with all of the points you made. I wish things were
 easier for you and these little ones. I too have found this list to be very
 supportive and helpful many times. I hope you'll keep us updated on their
 status.
 On Nov 14, 2014 7:10 PM, Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Hi all,

 I'm sorry that people on this board disagree about the adoption fee and
 I'm disappointed that some people are making judgmental comments.  This
 board has been a great source of support to my family over the years and I
 am not feeling that at all at the moment.  I have adopted 12 positive cats
 of my own and have been on this board since I took my first mom and 3
 kittens over 10 years ago.  I have never owned a non-leuk positive cat
 until this year.  It sounds to me like people think I'm trying to make
 money off these cats or that I'm asking people to do something
 unreasonable.  Do you know what I spent in the past two months trying to
 save one leuk positive?  Over $5000.  That is one of them.  Did I not treat
 her because she is leuk positive?  No I treated her like I would any other
 cat and gave her every opportunity to live, despite her status.  I do the
 same with all my positives even though I know the end result is usually
 them losing the battle with this horrible disease.  I'm not saying that
 whoever adopts these cats should go to those lengths to save them but I
 know the veterinary care that is involved with leuk positives.  If somebody
 is worried about paying a $100 adoption fee because the cat might die, are
 they going to say the same thing about vet care?  I don't want to spend
 the money because it might die.  And what about senior cats/dogs or
 special needs cat/dogs? Rescues charge adoption fees for them as well and
 they can die in a year or two.  Why are leuks any different?  I paid an
 adoption fee at a shelter in CT for 2 of my leuk positives.  I do
 understand there is a controversy about free adoptions vs. fees.  We are
 not a rescue that cares about numbers.  We are a no-kill and we commit to
 an animal for life.  We do the best we can for that animal and are
 committed to finding it the best home possible.  We don't do free adoptions
 or try to move cats as quickly as we can.  It just isn't  how we operate.
 We have a very selective adoption process and we try to make sure all our
 cats are going to loving forever homes.  I am trying to do the same for
 these cats, even though I am well aware of how awful this disease is.

 The woman that contacted us about these kittens has placed lots of
 kittens, no vetting, no applications, no follow up.  That is not helping
 the situation to give kittens away to people that aren't going to take care
 of them or be responsible about this disease.  Asking for an adoption fee
 simply helps show that the adopters are committed and that they understand
 the expense involved in owning an animal.  It in no means makes a dent in
 the money that we spend to help them, nor is it meant to.  We are vetting
 these cats and we are trying to teach this woman about helping in a
 responsible way.  She was going to adopt these cats to anybody and just
 spread the disease or release them outside.  As it is, we are trying to get
 a hold of the stray mom who is probably outside and leuk positive.  I'm
 trying to help educate her and teach her about leukemia and everybody makes
 it sound like I'm doing something wrong.  I have placed numerous cats on
 this board over the years as people constantly call me to help the
 positives.  This woman called me and we are trying to do the right thing.
 Money is not the issue.  It costs us about $500 to vet a kitten
 completely.  There are 5 of them which means about $2500.  I am not trying
 to get that money back.  We already paid to combo test all of them and to
 treat the one for a URI without any commitment to these cats or any thought
 of an adoption fee.  She could have euthanized them all and we would have
 been out that money.  We were just trying to help her out.

 Anyway, I'm probably not going to convince any of you about the adoption
 fee

Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

2014-11-15 Thread Marsha


Re:  adoption fees

A lot might depend on the specific area where adoptions are being done:  
income levels of potential adopters in the area, attitudes of the 
community, the availability of generous donors in the area that might 
support a substantial amount of the vetting, overall cat population vs. 
potential adopter population.  Each situation is going to be different.  
Time and experience will eventually lead to the screenings and fees that 
work best.


Marsha

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[Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

I volunteer for a rescue in Rochester, NY and have also owned leukemia positive 
cats (rescues) for years.  We were recently contacted by somebody that adopted 
out a kitten from a litter of 5 that she found outdoors.  She got a call from 
the adopters that the kitten tested positive and that the people needed to 
bring him back.  She wanted help so we paid to have all 5 kittens tested this 
week.  All five are positive.  The foster is willing to hold them for 30 days 
so we can retest them but she does not want to euthanize (nor would we suggest 
that) and she can't keep them.  She has five cats of her own and can't take 
another 5.  She would like us to try to find adoptive homes for them.

We have agreed to find homes for them if she will let us screen the homes and 
do the adoptions through our rescue, Animal Service League.  We would love to 
find homes for them with people that know this disease.  We have a black, a 
blue cream, a gray and white, a calico and a tortie.  Pictures are available if 
you email me.  We will determine sex and give them names soon.  We will also 
retest them at 30 days or possibly do an IFA to make sure they are positive if 
somebody wants them sooner and has other leuk positives.  We wouldn't want to 
send them to a home with leukemia if there is any chance they are going to 
fight it off but will all five positive, we suspect some or all of them will 
remain positive.

These kittens will not be free.  We will do all the vetting on them - 
spays/neuters, microchipping, rabies, distemper, flea and parasite treatment, 
etc., and will charge a $115 adoption fee.  We are a rescue and will not adopt 
out animals that are not fully vetted and we don't do free adoptions.  We are 
aware that they may not live past a year or two but they still deserve a 
loving, responsible home and proper veterinary care.  

If anybody is interested in helping one of these little beauties, please let us 
know.

Amy Weygandt___
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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

2014-11-14 Thread dlgegg

MAY NOT LIVE OVER A YEAR, BUT THEN YOU NEVER KNOW.  MY ANNIE IS NOW 8 YEARS OLD 
.

 Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com wrote: 
 I volunteer for a rescue in Rochester, NY and have also owned leukemia 
 positive cats (rescues) for years.  We were recently contacted by somebody 
 that adopted out a kitten from a litter of 5 that she found outdoors.  She 
 got a call from the adopters that the kitten tested positive and that the 
 people needed to bring him back.  She wanted help so we paid to have all 5 
 kittens tested this week.  All five are positive.  The foster is willing to 
 hold them for 30 days so we can retest them but she does not want to 
 euthanize (nor would we suggest that) and she can't keep them.  She has five 
 cats of her own and can't take another 5.  She would like us to try to find 
 adoptive homes for them.
 
 We have agreed to find homes for them if she will let us screen the homes and 
 do the adoptions through our rescue, Animal Service League.  We would love to 
 find homes for them with people that know this disease.  We have a black, a 
 blue cream, a gray and white, a calico and a tortie.  Pictures are available 
 if you email me.  We will determine sex and give them names soon.  We will 
 also retest them at 30 days or possibly do an IFA to make sure they are 
 positive if somebody wants them sooner and has other leuk positives.  We 
 wouldn't want to send them to a home with leukemia if there is any chance 
 they are going to fight it off but will all five positive, we suspect some or 
 all of them will remain positive.
 
 These kittens will not be free.  We will do all the vetting on them - 
 spays/neuters, microchipping, rabies, distemper, flea and parasite treatment, 
 etc., and will charge a $115 adoption fee.  We are a rescue and will not 
 adopt out animals that are not fully vetted and we don't do free adoptions.  
 We are aware that they may not live past a year or two but they still deserve 
 a loving, responsible home and proper veterinary care.  
 
 If anybody is interested in helping one of these little beauties, please let 
 us know.
 
 Amy Weygandt


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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

Did she get leukemia as a kitten?  I have a 12 year old leuk positive but I 
didn't get him til he was three so not sure if he had it as a kitten or an 
adult.  I also just lost one of my leuk positives that was 12, also got her 
around 4 so not sure when she got leukemia.  Anybody that I had with leukemia 
as a kitten hasn't made it past 2 :(  I know any of them can defy the odds and 
I always tell people that but I will warn people that there may be heartbreak 
ahead.  I think it is only fair.  Never stopped me from helping these little 
ones though.  They are all so special.

We just had an entire litter convert at our rescue (which the vets and the 
specialists have told me is really unusual) so I'm hoping for the best for 
these little cuties.  So happy your Annie is doing well!!!



 From: dlg...@windstream.net dlg...@windstream.net
To: Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com; felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 9:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens
 

MAY NOT LIVE OVER A YEAR, BUT THEN YOU NEVER KNOW.  MY ANNIE IS NOW 8 YEARS OLD 
.




 Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com wrote: 
 I volunteer for a rescue in Rochester, NY and have also owned leukemia 
 positive cats (rescues) for years.  We were recently contacted by somebody 
 that adopted out a kitten from a litter of 5 that she found outdoors.  She 
 got a call from the adopters that the kitten tested positive and that the 
 people needed to bring him back.  She wanted help so we paid to have all 5 
 kittens tested this week.  All five are positive.  The foster is willing to 
 hold them for 30 days so we can retest them but she does not want to 
 euthanize (nor would we suggest that) and she can't keep them.  She has five 
 cats of her own and can't take another 5.  She would like us to try to find 
 adoptive homes for them.
 
 We have agreed to find homes for them if she will let us screen the homes and 
 do the adoptions through our rescue, Animal Service League.  We would love to 
 find homes for them with people that know this disease.  We have a black, a 
 blue cream, a gray and white, a calico and a tortie.  Pictures are available 
 if you email me.  We will determine sex and give them names soon.  We will 
 also retest them at 30 days or possibly do an IFA to make sure they are 
 positive if somebody wants them sooner and has other leuk positives.  We 
 wouldn't want to send them to a home with leukemia if there is any chance 
 they are going to fight it off but will all five positive, we suspect some or 
 all of them will remain positive.
 
 These kittens will not be free.  We will do all the vetting on them - 
 spays/neuters, microchipping, rabies, distemper, flea and parasite treatment, 
 etc., and will charge a $115 adoption fee.  We are a rescue and will not 
 adopt out animals that are not fully vetted and we don't do free adoptions.  
 We are aware that they may not live past a year or two but they still deserve 
 a loving, responsible home and proper veterinary care.  
 
 If anybody is interested in helping one of these little beauties, please let 
 us know.
 
 Amy Weygandt


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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

2014-11-14 Thread dlgegg

I GOT ANNIE AS AN ADULT OF 4 YRS, BUT THE VET THINKS SHE WAS ALWAYS POSITIVE.  
SHE HAD NEVER BEEN OUTSIDE THE LADY'S HOUSE AND WAS SPOILED ROTTEN.  I HAVE HAD 
NO PROBLEMS WITH MY OTHER CATS WHO WERE ANYWHERE FROM 1 YEAR TO 10 YEARS.  MOST 
DIE OF OLD AGE AT 18 OR SO.  YOU DO HAVE TO BE VERY OBSERVANT AND CATCH ANY 
PROBLEM BEFORE IT CAN GET STARTED.  
I AGREE, YOU HAVE TO TELL PEOPLE, BUT IF THEY REALLY LOVE CATS, THEY WILL TAKE 
THE CHANCE AND LOVE THEM UNTIL THEY ARE GONE.  WHAT YOU GET FROM THEM IN THAT 
SHORT TIME IS WORTH IT.

 Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com wrote: 
 Did she get leukemia as a kitten?  I have a 12 year old leuk positive but I 
 didn't get him til he was three so not sure if he had it as a kitten or an 
 adult.  I also just lost one of my leuk positives that was 12, also got her 
 around 4 so not sure when she got leukemia.  Anybody that I had with leukemia 
 as a kitten hasn't made it past 2 :(  I know any of them can defy the odds 
 and I always tell people that but I will warn people that there may be 
 heartbreak ahead.  I think it is only fair.  Never stopped me from helping 
 these little ones though.  They are all so special.
 
 We just had an entire litter convert at our rescue (which the vets and the 
 specialists have told me is really unusual) so I'm hoping for the best for 
 these little cuties.  So happy your Annie is doing well!!!
 
 
 
  From: dlg...@windstream.net dlg...@windstream.net
 To: Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com; felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 9:28 AM
 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens
  
 
 MAY NOT LIVE OVER A YEAR, BUT THEN YOU NEVER KNOW.  MY ANNIE IS NOW 8 YEARS 
 OLD .
 
 
 
 
  Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com wrote: 
  I volunteer for a rescue in Rochester, NY and have also owned leukemia 
  positive cats (rescues) for years.  We were recently contacted by somebody 
  that adopted out a kitten from a litter of 5 that she found outdoors.  She 
  got a call from the adopters that the kitten tested positive and that the 
  people needed to bring him back.  She wanted help so we paid to have all 5 
  kittens tested this week.  All five are positive.  The foster is willing to 
  hold them for 30 days so we can retest them but she does not want to 
  euthanize (nor would we suggest that) and she can't keep them.  She has 
  five cats of her own and can't take another 5.  She would like us to try to 
  find adoptive homes for them.
  
  We have agreed to find homes for them if she will let us screen the homes 
  and do the adoptions through our rescue, Animal Service League.  We would 
  love to find homes for them with people that know this disease.  We have a 
  black, a blue cream, a gray and white, a calico and a tortie.  Pictures are 
  available if you email me.  We will determine sex and give them names soon. 
   We will also retest them at 30 days or possibly do an IFA to make sure 
  they are positive if somebody wants them sooner and has other leuk 
  positives.  We wouldn't want to send them to a home with leukemia if there 
  is any chance they are going to fight it off but will all five positive, we 
  suspect some or all of them will remain positive.
  
  These kittens will not be free.  We will do all the vetting on them - 
  spays/neuters, microchipping, rabies, distemper, flea and parasite 
  treatment, etc., and will charge a $115 adoption fee.  We are a rescue and 
  will not adopt out animals that are not fully vetted and we don't do free 
  adoptions.  We are aware that they may not live past a year or two but they 
  still deserve a loving, responsible home and proper veterinary care.  
  
  If anybody is interested in helping one of these little beauties, please 
  let us know.
  
  Amy Weygandt
 
 
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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

I must not be getting all the posts.  FELV+ kittens are very hard to
place,and the adoption fee you are charging doesn't make it easier.  I too
do rescue.   We adopted out a double positive cat to a person on this list.
We altered her, vaccinated her, tested and retested her.  We charged $25
and today I doubt we'd charge that. She went to an excellent home, we got
pictures and updates.  She recently was euthanized due to severe
cardiomyopathy and lived 7.5 years.  I wish you the best of luck testing
your 5.  Maybe someone here has room for a new kitty:)

On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 8:53 AM, dlg...@windstream.net wrote:

 I GOT ANNIE AS AN ADULT OF 4 YRS, BUT THE VET THINKS SHE WAS ALWAYS
 POSITIVE.  SHE HAD NEVER BEEN OUTSIDE THE LADY'S HOUSE AND WAS SPOILED
 ROTTEN.  I HAVE HAD NO PROBLEMS WITH MY OTHER CATS WHO WERE ANYWHERE FROM 1
 YEAR TO 10 YEARS.  MOST DIE OF OLD AGE AT 18 OR SO.  YOU DO HAVE TO BE VERY
 OBSERVANT AND CATCH ANY PROBLEM BEFORE IT CAN GET STARTED.
 I AGREE, YOU HAVE TO TELL PEOPLE, BUT IF THEY REALLY LOVE CATS, THEY WILL
 TAKE THE CHANCE AND LOVE THEM UNTIL THEY ARE GONE.  WHAT YOU GET FROM THEM
 IN THAT SHORT TIME IS WORTH IT.

  Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com wrote:
  Did she get leukemia as a kitten?  I have a 12 year old leuk positive
 but I didn't get him til he was three so not sure if he had it as a kitten
 or an adult.  I also just lost one of my leuk positives that was 12, also
 got her around 4 so not sure when she got leukemia.  Anybody that I had
 with leukemia as a kitten hasn't made it past 2 :(  I know any of them can
 defy the odds and I always tell people that but I will warn people that
 there may be heartbreak ahead.  I think it is only fair.  Never stopped me
 from helping these little ones though.  They are all so special.
 
  We just had an entire litter convert at our rescue (which the vets and
 the specialists have told me is really unusual) so I'm hoping for the best
 for these little cuties.  So happy your Annie is doing well!!!
 
 
  
   From: dlg...@windstream.net dlg...@windstream.net
  To: Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com; felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
  Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 9:28 AM
  Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens
 
 
  MAY NOT LIVE OVER A YEAR, BUT THEN YOU NEVER KNOW.  MY ANNIE IS NOW 8
 YEARS OLD .
 
 
 
 
   Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com wrote:
   I volunteer for a rescue in Rochester, NY and have also owned leukemia
 positive cats (rescues) for years.  We were recently contacted by somebody
 that adopted out a kitten from a litter of 5 that she found outdoors.  She
 got a call from the adopters that the kitten tested positive and that the
 people needed to bring him back.  She wanted help so we paid to have all 5
 kittens tested this week.  All five are positive.  The foster is willing to
 hold them for 30 days so we can retest them but she does not want to
 euthanize (nor would we suggest that) and she can't keep them.  She has
 five cats of her own and can't take another 5.  She would like us to try to
 find adoptive homes for them.
  
   We have agreed to find homes for them if she will let us screen the
 homes and do the adoptions through our rescue, Animal Service League.  We
 would love to find homes for them with people that know this disease.  We
 have a black, a blue cream, a gray and white, a calico and a tortie.
 Pictures are available if you email me.  We will determine sex and give
 them names soon.  We will also retest them at 30 days or possibly do an IFA
 to make sure they are positive if somebody wants them sooner and has other
 leuk positives.  We wouldn't want to send them to a home with leukemia if
 there is any chance they are going to fight it off but will all five
 positive, we suspect some or all of them will remain positive.
  
   These kittens will not be free.  We will do all the vetting on them -
 spays/neuters, microchipping, rabies, distemper, flea and parasite
 treatment, etc., and will charge a $115 adoption fee.  We are a rescue and
 will not adopt out animals that are not fully vetted and we don't do free
 adoptions.  We are aware that they may not live past a year or two but they
 still deserve a loving, responsible home and proper veterinary care.
  
   If anybody is interested in helping one of these little beauties,
 please let us know.
  
   Amy Weygandt
 
 
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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

2014-11-14 Thread Katherine K.

Amy,
I wish you the best of luck in placing these kittens. I had a litter of 4
positive kittens and tried very hard to find good homes for them, with no
luck, so they lived with me until they passed away, most before they were 1
year old. It was a very busy year, but they were a lovely little group and
it was nice seeing them stay together as a family for the time they had.
I have to agree with Kelley that a $115 adoption fee in reality is not
likely to help you get them placed in homes. In my experience, people just
don't want to adopt and get attached to, much less pay a fee for, a kitty
who will probably not live long. I was lucky enough to be working with a
larger rescue organization who covered their shots, spay/neuters and
testing expenses. I just provided the home, food, love and tears :)
I suggest making flyers with the best photos you can get, and make them
sound very friendly and loving. Play the sympathy card for all it's worth!
:)
Good luck,
Katherine

On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 11:44 AM, Kelley S moonv...@gmail.com wrote:

 I must not be getting all the posts.  FELV+ kittens are very hard to
 place,and the adoption fee you are charging doesn't make it easier.  I too
 do rescue.   We adopted out a double positive cat to a person on this list.
 We altered her, vaccinated her, tested and retested her.  We charged $25
 and today I doubt we'd charge that. She went to an excellent home, we got
 pictures and updates.  She recently was euthanized due to severe
 cardiomyopathy and lived 7.5 years.  I wish you the best of luck testing
 your 5.  Maybe someone here has room for a new kitty:)

 On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 8:53 AM, dlg...@windstream.net wrote:

 I GOT ANNIE AS AN ADULT OF 4 YRS, BUT THE VET THINKS SHE WAS ALWAYS
 POSITIVE.  SHE HAD NEVER BEEN OUTSIDE THE LADY'S HOUSE AND WAS SPOILED
 ROTTEN.  I HAVE HAD NO PROBLEMS WITH MY OTHER CATS WHO WERE ANYWHERE FROM 1
 YEAR TO 10 YEARS.  MOST DIE OF OLD AGE AT 18 OR SO.  YOU DO HAVE TO BE VERY
 OBSERVANT AND CATCH ANY PROBLEM BEFORE IT CAN GET STARTED.
 I AGREE, YOU HAVE TO TELL PEOPLE, BUT IF THEY REALLY LOVE CATS, THEY WILL
 TAKE THE CHANCE AND LOVE THEM UNTIL THEY ARE GONE.  WHAT YOU GET FROM THEM
 IN THAT SHORT TIME IS WORTH IT.

  Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com wrote:
  Did she get leukemia as a kitten?  I have a 12 year old leuk positive
 but I didn't get him til he was three so not sure if he had it as a kitten
 or an adult.  I also just lost one of my leuk positives that was 12, also
 got her around 4 so not sure when she got leukemia.  Anybody that I had
 with leukemia as a kitten hasn't made it past 2 :(  I know any of them can
 defy the odds and I always tell people that but I will warn people that
 there may be heartbreak ahead.  I think it is only fair.  Never stopped me
 from helping these little ones though.  They are all so special.
 
  We just had an entire litter convert at our rescue (which the vets and
 the specialists have told me is really unusual) so I'm hoping for the best
 for these little cuties.  So happy your Annie is doing well!!!
 
 
  
   From: dlg...@windstream.net dlg...@windstream.net
  To: Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com; felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
  Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 9:28 AM
  Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens
 
 
  MAY NOT LIVE OVER A YEAR, BUT THEN YOU NEVER KNOW.  MY ANNIE IS NOW 8
 YEARS OLD .
 
 
 
 
   Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com wrote:
   I volunteer for a rescue in Rochester, NY and have also owned
 leukemia positive cats (rescues) for years.  We were recently contacted by
 somebody that adopted out a kitten from a litter of 5 that she found
 outdoors.  She got a call from the adopters that the kitten tested positive
 and that the people needed to bring him back.  She wanted help so we paid
 to have all 5 kittens tested this week.  All five are positive.  The foster
 is willing to hold them for 30 days so we can retest them but she does not
 want to euthanize (nor would we suggest that) and she can't keep them.  She
 has five cats of her own and can't take another 5.  She would like us to
 try to find adoptive homes for them.
  
   We have agreed to find homes for them if she will let us screen the
 homes and do the adoptions through our rescue, Animal Service League.  We
 would love to find homes for them with people that know this disease.  We
 have a black, a blue cream, a gray and white, a calico and a tortie.
 Pictures are available if you email me.  We will determine sex and give
 them names soon.  We will also retest them at 30 days or possibly do an IFA
 to make sure they are positive if somebody wants them sooner and has other
 leuk positives.  We wouldn't want to send them to a home with leukemia if
 there is any chance they are going to fight it off but will all five
 positive, we suspect some or all of them will remain positive.
  
   These kittens will not be free.  We will do all the vetting on them -
 spays/neuters, microchipping, rabies

Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

2014-11-14 Thread Jennifer Lewis

I agree with Katherine. My rescue group was just happy that I was able to take 
and keep 2 + kitties that otherwise would have gone to a sanctuary after their 
long term fosters failed and bailed on them. 
As desperate as all rescue groups are for funds, they never even suggested a 
fee for either kitty. My baby Smoosh lasted for 14 months as she inherited the 
FeLV from her mother. Brynn came to me as an adult and is still here with us. 
We often think of getting her a companion, but our living situation is tenuous 
right now and we're in a holding pattern.
On Nov 14, 2014, at 9:05 AM, Katherine K. wrote:

 Amy,
 I wish you the best of luck in placing these kittens. I had a litter of 4 
 positive kittens and tried very hard to find good homes for them, with no 
 luck, so they lived with me until they passed away, most before they were 1 
 year old. It was a very busy year, but they were a lovely little group and it 
 was nice seeing them stay together as a family for the time they had. 
 I have to agree with Kelley that a $115 adoption fee in reality is not likely 
 to help you get them placed in homes. In my experience, people just don't 
 want to adopt and get attached to, much less pay a fee for, a kitty who will 
 probably not live long. I was lucky enough to be working with a larger rescue 
 organization who covered their shots, spay/neuters and testing expenses. I 
 just provided the home, food, love and tears :) 
 I suggest making flyers with the best photos you can get, and make them sound 
 very friendly and loving. Play the sympathy card for all it's worth! :)
 Good luck,
 Katherine
 
 On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 11:44 AM, Kelley S moonv...@gmail.com wrote:
 I must not be getting all the posts.  FELV+ kittens are very hard to 
 place,and the adoption fee you are charging doesn't make it easier.  I too do 
 rescue.   We adopted out a double positive cat to a person on this list. We 
 altered her, vaccinated her, tested and retested her.  We charged $25 and 
 today I doubt we'd charge that. She went to an excellent home, we got 
 pictures and updates.  She recently was euthanized due to severe 
 cardiomyopathy and lived 7.5 years.  I wish you the best of luck testing your 
 5.  Maybe someone here has room for a new kitty:)
 
 On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 8:53 AM, dlg...@windstream.net wrote:
 I GOT ANNIE AS AN ADULT OF 4 YRS, BUT THE VET THINKS SHE WAS ALWAYS POSITIVE. 
  SHE HAD NEVER BEEN OUTSIDE THE LADY'S HOUSE AND WAS SPOILED ROTTEN.  I HAVE 
 HAD NO PROBLEMS WITH MY OTHER CATS WHO WERE ANYWHERE FROM 1 YEAR TO 10 YEARS. 
  MOST DIE OF OLD AGE AT 18 OR SO.  YOU DO HAVE TO BE VERY OBSERVANT AND CATCH 
 ANY PROBLEM BEFORE IT CAN GET STARTED.
 I AGREE, YOU HAVE TO TELL PEOPLE, BUT IF THEY REALLY LOVE CATS, THEY WILL 
 TAKE THE CHANCE AND LOVE THEM UNTIL THEY ARE GONE.  WHAT YOU GET FROM THEM IN 
 THAT SHORT TIME IS WORTH IT.
 
  Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com wrote:
  Did she get leukemia as a kitten?  I have a 12 year old leuk positive but I 
  didn't get him til he was three so not sure if he had it as a kitten or an 
  adult.  I also just lost one of my leuk positives that was 12, also got her 
  around 4 so not sure when she got leukemia.  Anybody that I had with 
  leukemia as a kitten hasn't made it past 2 :(  I know any of them can defy 
  the odds and I always tell people that but I will warn people that there 
  may be heartbreak ahead.  I think it is only fair.  Never stopped me from 
  helping these little ones though.  They are all so special.
 
  We just had an entire litter convert at our rescue (which the vets and the 
  specialists have told me is really unusual) so I'm hoping for the best for 
  these little cuties.  So happy your Annie is doing well!!!
 
 
  
   From: dlg...@windstream.net dlg...@windstream.net
  To: Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com; felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
  Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 9:28 AM
  Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens
 
 
  MAY NOT LIVE OVER A YEAR, BUT THEN YOU NEVER KNOW.  MY ANNIE IS NOW 8 YEARS 
  OLD .
 
 
 
 
   Amy awilkin...@yahoo.com wrote:
   I volunteer for a rescue in Rochester, NY and have also owned leukemia 
   positive cats (rescues) for years.  We were recently contacted by 
   somebody that adopted out a kitten from a litter of 5 that she found 
   outdoors.  She got a call from the adopters that the kitten tested 
   positive and that the people needed to bring him back.  She wanted help 
   so we paid to have all 5 kittens tested this week.  All five are 
   positive.  The foster is willing to hold them for 30 days so we can 
   retest them but she does not want to euthanize (nor would we suggest 
   that) and she can't keep them.  She has five cats of her own and can't 
   take another 5.  She would like us to try to find adoptive homes for them.
  
   We have agreed to find homes for them if she will let us screen the homes 
   and do the adoptions through our rescue, Animal Service

Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

Some adopters may make a donation to the organization they adopt a 
zero-fee cat from.  I did.  You might make a cat low or no fee, but say, 
donations gratefully accepted.  If you list on PetFinder, consider 
adding FeLV+ to the heading, besides just listing them as special 
needs.  Some people are looking specifically for a FeLV+ cat as a 
companion for one they already have, and not putting that in the heading 
forces those people to sift through every special needs listing to find 
the FeLV+ kitty.  I turned to PetFinder after having no luck locally 
finding a companion for Harley, and did a search by zip code.  I 
specified up to 100 miles, and that's how I found Brock.  Actually, 
113 miles away, but the search goes by zip code.


There are also some listings here (up for adoption or looking to adopt 
FeLV, FIV, FIP +): 
http://www.bemikitties.com/felv/cgi-bin/suite/classifieds/classifieds.cgi

You can also get to that by the felineleukemia.org website.

One other place to list is the PurringPixie yahoo group.

Marsha
(with Harley  Brock)

On 11/14/2014 11:05 AM, Katherine K. wrote:

Amy,
I wish you the best of luck in placing these kittens. I had a litter 
of 4 positive kittens and tried very hard to find good homes for them, 
with no luck, so they lived with me until they passed away, most 
before they were 1 year old. It was a very busy year, but they were a 
lovely little group and it was nice seeing them stay together as a 
family for the time they had.
I have to agree with Kelley that a $115 adoption fee in reality is not 
likely to help you get them placed in homes. In my experience, people 
just don't want to adopt and get attached to, much less pay a fee for, 
a kitty who will probably not live long. I was lucky enough to be 
working with a larger rescue organization who covered their shots, 
spay/neuters and testing expenses. I just provided the home, food, 
love and tears :)
I suggest making flyers with the best photos you can get, and make 
them sound very friendly and loving. Play the sympathy card for all 
it's worth! :)





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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

There are some other places to list on Facebook, if you would like the
links.  One thing that struck me when I read your post was confusion on my
part as to what exactly you wanted.  It seemed to me reading it, and I may
be reading things into this, that you did not want the kittens to go to a
home with FELV+ cats in there already.   That, in addition to the adoption
fee, is going to make it *almost* impossible to ever find these kittens a
home (nothing is 100% impossible of course).  Also, once you adopt the
kitten out, you don't have control over what the adopters do later.  They
may bring in FELV+ cats later.  My heart kitty died of heart disease
brought on by a congenital defect.  I spent a lot of time holding her and
crying because she was going to die.  They are all going to die, we hope
after many years in a happy home.  I spent more time mourning her death
than I did celebrating her life.  This was  a grave mistake on my part.

On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Marsha mar...@lynxe.com wrote:

 Some adopters may make a donation to the organization they adopt a
 zero-fee cat from.  I did.  You might make a cat low or no fee, but say,
 donations gratefully accepted.  If you list on PetFinder, consider adding
 FeLV+ to the heading, besides just listing them as special needs.  Some
 people are looking specifically for a FeLV+ cat as a companion for one they
 already have, and not putting that in the heading forces those people to
 sift through every special needs listing to find the FeLV+ kitty.  I turned
 to PetFinder after having no luck locally finding a companion for Harley,
 and did a search by zip code.  I specified up to 100 miles, and that's
 how I found Brock.  Actually, 113 miles away, but the search goes by zip
 code.

 There are also some listings here (up for adoption or looking to adopt
 FeLV, FIV, FIP +): http://www.bemikitties.com/felv/cgi-bin/suite/
 classifieds/classifieds.cgi
 You can also get to that by the felineleukemia.org website.

 One other place to list is the PurringPixie yahoo group.

 Marsha
 (with Harley  Brock)

 On 11/14/2014 11:05 AM, Katherine K. wrote:

 Amy,
 I wish you the best of luck in placing these kittens. I had a litter of 4
 positive kittens and tried very hard to find good homes for them, with no
 luck, so they lived with me until they passed away, most before they were 1
 year old. It was a very busy year, but they were a lovely little group and
 it was nice seeing them stay together as a family for the time they had.
 I have to agree with Kelley that a $115 adoption fee in reality is not
 likely to help you get them placed in homes. In my experience, people just
 don't want to adopt and get attached to, much less pay a fee for, a kitty
 who will probably not live long. I was lucky enough to be working with a
 larger rescue organization who covered their shots, spay/neuters and
 testing expenses. I just provided the home, food, love and tears :)
 I suggest making flyers with the best photos you can get, and make them
 sound very friendly and loving. Play the sympathy card for all it's worth!
 :)



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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

Kelly, now *I'm* confused.  I don't want anything.  I was just sharing 
my personal experiences and putting some suggestions out there.  Some of 
the resources you or others may already know about, but others might be 
new to some people.  Feel free to list your Facebook resources so people 
here are aware of those too.   Or maybe you were really replying to the 
same person I was replying to?


Idea for everyone:  make up a flyer with some basic info about FeLV, 
with a picture of one or more or your FeLV+ cats looking happy and 
living the good life.  Maybe put a link on the flyer to 
felineleukemia.org or other resource(s).  Distribute the flyer to local 
vet offices for when the vet gets a client with a cat that tests 
positive.  The vet could show the flyer to the owner so that the owner 
can see that there is support available, and that FeLV+ cats can live a 
happy life for a variable number of years.


Marsha

On 11/14/2014 1:00 PM, Kelley S wrote:
There are some other places to list on Facebook, if you would like the 
links.  One thing that struck me when I read your post was confusion 
on my part as to what exactly you wanted.  It seemed to me reading it, 
and I may be reading things into this, that you did not want the 
kittens to go to a home with FELV+ cats in there already.   That, in 
addition to the adoption fee, is going to make it *almost* impossible 
to ever find these kittens a home (nothing is 100% impossible of 
course).  Also, once you adopt the kitten out, you don't have control 
over what the adopters do later.  They may bring in FELV+ cats later.  
My heart kitty died of heart disease brought on by a congenital 
defect.  I spent a lot of time holding her and crying because she was 
going to die.  They are all going to die, we hope after many years in 
a happy home.  I spent more time mourning her death than I did 
celebrating her life.  This was  a grave mistake on my part.


On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Marsha mar...@lynxe.com 
mailto:mar...@lynxe.com wrote:


Some adopters may make a donation to the organization they adopt a
zero-fee cat from.  I did.  You might make a cat low or no fee,
but say, donations gratefully accepted.  If you list on
PetFinder, consider adding FeLV+ to the heading, besides just
listing them as special needs.  Some people are looking
specifically for a FeLV+ cat as a companion for one they already
have, and not putting that in the heading forces those people to
sift through every special needs listing to find the FeLV+ kitty. 
I turned to PetFinder after having no luck locally finding a

companion for Harley, and did a search by zip code.  I specified
up to 100 miles, and that's how I found Brock.  Actually, 113
miles away, but the search goes by zip code.

There are also some listings here (up for adoption or looking to
adopt FeLV, FIV, FIP +):
http://www.bemikitties.com/felv/cgi-bin/suite/classifieds/classifieds.cgi
You can also get to that by the felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org website.

One other place to list is the PurringPixie yahoo group.



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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

2014-11-14 Thread Maya D'Alessio

My cat Yang who I lost this summer made it to 3 with feline leukemia. She
had to have gotten it as a kitten, I adopted her at five months and she
hadn't been exposed since entering my care. We didn't know she had it until
she had to be put down. It was a terrible shock, but she lived an excellent
life up until two days before we put her down.
On Nov 14, 2014 2:39 PM, Marsha mar...@lynxe.com wrote:

  Kelly, now *I'm* confused.  I don't want anything.  I was just sharing
 my personal experiences and putting some suggestions out there.  Some of
 the resources you or others may already know about, but others might be new
 to some people.  Feel free to list your Facebook resources so people here
 are aware of those too.   Or maybe you were really replying to the same
 person I was replying to?

 Idea for everyone:  make up a flyer with some basic info about FeLV, with
 a picture of one or more or your FeLV+ cats looking happy and living the
 good life.  Maybe put a link on the flyer to felineleukemia.org or other
 resource(s).  Distribute the flyer to local vet offices for when the vet
 gets a client with a cat that tests positive.  The vet could show the flyer
 to the owner so that the owner can see that there is support available, and
 that FeLV+ cats can live a happy life for a variable number of years.

 Marsha

 On 11/14/2014 1:00 PM, Kelley S wrote:

 There are some other places to list on Facebook, if you would like the
 links.  One thing that struck me when I read your post was confusion on my
 part as to what exactly you wanted.  It seemed to me reading it, and I may
 be reading things into this, that you did not want the kittens to go to a
 home with FELV+ cats in there already.   That, in addition to the adoption
 fee, is going to make it *almost* impossible to ever find these kittens a
 home (nothing is 100% impossible of course).  Also, once you adopt the
 kitten out, you don't have control over what the adopters do later.  They
 may bring in FELV+ cats later.  My heart kitty died of heart disease
 brought on by a congenital defect.  I spent a lot of time holding her and
 crying because she was going to die.  They are all going to die, we hope
 after many years in a happy home.  I spent more time mourning her death
 than I did celebrating her life.  This was  a grave mistake on my part.

 On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Marsha mar...@lynxe.com wrote:

 Some adopters may make a donation to the organization they adopt a
 zero-fee cat from.  I did.  You might make a cat low or no fee, but say,
 donations gratefully accepted.  If you list on PetFinder, consider adding
 FeLV+ to the heading, besides just listing them as special needs.  Some
 people are looking specifically for a FeLV+ cat as a companion for one they
 already have, and not putting that in the heading forces those people to
 sift through every special needs listing to find the FeLV+ kitty.  I turned
 to PetFinder after having no luck locally finding a companion for Harley,
 and did a search by zip code.  I specified up to 100 miles, and that's
 how I found Brock.  Actually, 113 miles away, but the search goes by zip
 code.

 There are also some listings here (up for adoption or looking to adopt
 FeLV, FIV, FIP +):
 http://www.bemikitties.com/felv/cgi-bin/suite/classifieds/classifieds.cgi
 You can also get to that by the felineleukemia.org website.

 One other place to list is the PurringPixie yahoo group.



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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

Marsha..sorry..when I said I don't know what you want I was referring to
the OP, who if I recall correctly said something along the lines of we
don't want these cats in with other FELV+ cats if they could possibly be
negative.  So the way I read her post was:  we want people with no cats
who are willing to take the very probable heartbreak of a FELV+ kitten and
promise to not expose it to other FELV+ cats and who will pay us over a
hundred dollars for doing so.  This is possible, but not very likely
IMHO.   Even in our rescue, after a certain point they would eat up over
$100 worth of food and we would be losing money even if we did get $100
plus for them.  More importantly, everyone is limited in space, and an
animal in a foster home means another animal your rescue cannot help.
The facebook group is interesting, and I encourage those on Facebook to
join, not that I want to take traffic away from here, but most are very
very very very stridently against mixing.I tried to get them to come
here, but haven't had any luck that I know of.  There is a very strange
situation going on there that I'd like to get some input on.  There is a
kitten who has tested (snap and IFA) pos for FELV.  This kitten came from a
breeder who tests all her cats regularly and none has ever tested
positive.  The kitten's owner took the kitten to the vet as per contract
within 10 days of buying the cat and got a positive test.  Rechecked with
IFA, still positive.  ALL THE OTHER CATS were retested by the breeder and
are still negative.  All the other kittens in the litter have tested
negative.  HOW did this kitten contract FELV?

Anyway here is the link:  https://www.facebook.com/groups/26073442228/


On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 1:39 PM, Marsha mar...@lynxe.com wrote:

  Kelly, now *I'm* confused.  I don't want anything.  I was just sharing
 my personal experiences and putting some suggestions out there.  Some of
 the resources you or others may already know about, but others might be new
 to some people.  Feel free to list your Facebook resources so people here
 are aware of those too.   Or maybe you were really replying to the same
 person I was replying to?

 Idea for everyone:  make up a flyer with some basic info about FeLV, with
 a picture of one or more or your FeLV+ cats looking happy and living the
 good life.  Maybe put a link on the flyer to felineleukemia.org or other
 resource(s).  Distribute the flyer to local vet offices for when the vet
 gets a client with a cat that tests positive.  The vet could show the flyer
 to the owner so that the owner can see that there is support available, and
 that FeLV+ cats can live a happy life for a variable number of years.

 Marsha

 On 11/14/2014 1:00 PM, Kelley S wrote:

 There are some other places to list on Facebook, if you would like the
 links.  One thing that struck me when I read your post was confusion on my
 part as to what exactly you wanted.  It seemed to me reading it, and I may
 be reading things into this, that you did not want the kittens to go to a
 home with FELV+ cats in there already.   That, in addition to the adoption
 fee, is going to make it *almost* impossible to ever find these kittens a
 home (nothing is 100% impossible of course).  Also, once you adopt the
 kitten out, you don't have control over what the adopters do later.  They
 may bring in FELV+ cats later.  My heart kitty died of heart disease
 brought on by a congenital defect.  I spent a lot of time holding her and
 crying because she was going to die.  They are all going to die, we hope
 after many years in a happy home.  I spent more time mourning her death
 than I did celebrating her life.  This was  a grave mistake on my part.

 On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Marsha mar...@lynxe.com wrote:

 Some adopters may make a donation to the organization they adopt a
 zero-fee cat from.  I did.  You might make a cat low or no fee, but say,
 donations gratefully accepted.  If you list on PetFinder, consider adding
 FeLV+ to the heading, besides just listing them as special needs.  Some
 people are looking specifically for a FeLV+ cat as a companion for one they
 already have, and not putting that in the heading forces those people to
 sift through every special needs listing to find the FeLV+ kitty.  I turned
 to PetFinder after having no luck locally finding a companion for Harley,
 and did a search by zip code.  I specified up to 100 miles, and that's
 how I found Brock.  Actually, 113 miles away, but the search goes by zip
 code.

 There are also some listings here (up for adoption or looking to adopt
 FeLV, FIV, FIP +):
 http://www.bemikitties.com/felv/cgi-bin/suite/classifieds/classifieds.cgi
 You can also get to that by the felineleukemia.org website.

 One other place to list is the PurringPixie yahoo group.



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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

Kelly, I think she wants to wait until they are confirmed positive with 
an IFA before adopting them out to a home with other FeLV+ cats.  She 
did mention the hope to find homes that are familiar with FeLV.


 I kept Brock quarantined from Harley until I got a positive IFA test 
on Brock.  Brock had ony ever had a single Snap test at the shelter to 
say he was FeLV+.  Looking back, I would have requested (and paid for) a 
vet local to the shelter to do an IFA.  That would have made it  easier 
for the shelter to adopt out a negative cat, while I continued to search 
for a positive companion for Harley.  But I had already brought Brock 
home, so if he had by chance tested negative on my vet's IFA, then I 
would have kept him separate from my negatives until he got a 2nd 
negative, then be put with them instead, and I would then have searched 
for another possible companion for Harley.  Someday I may consider 
mixing negatives  positives, especially if treatments are developed 
like there are for HIV, where it's not cured, but knocks the 
transmissible virus load to near zero.  But for now I keep them 
separate, because I don't want to deal with the guilt I would have if 
just ONE negative cat got infected.


As for the lone FeLV+ kitten, that's pretty bizarre.  I don't think 
there's any way for anyone not directly involved to know what happened.  
Most likely either the breeder or the buyer knows or suspects, but isn't 
telling.  The only other possibility I can think of is that the virus 
somehow was passed genetically, and the exact right circumstances 
allowed it to manifest in one kitten. Kind of like FIP, in that the 
virus infects a large percentage of cats, but only a few have the 
genetic susceptibility, and the right circumstances for it to manifest 
into FIP disease.  But that doesn't seem so likely.


Marsha

On 11/14/2014 2:05 PM, Kelley S wrote:
Marsha..sorry..when I said I don't know what you want I was 
referring to the OP, who if I recall correctly said something along 
the lines of we don't want these cats in with other FELV+ cats if 
they could possibly be negative. So the way I read her post was:  we 
want people with no cats who are willing to take the very probable 
heartbreak of a FELV+ kitten and promise to not expose it to other 
FELV+ cats and who will pay us over a hundred dollars for doing so.  
This is possible, but not very likely IMHO.   Even in our rescue, 
after a certain point they would eat up over $100 worth of food and we 
would be losing money even if we did get $100 plus for them.  More 
importantly, everyone is limited in space, and an animal in a foster 
home means another animal your rescue cannot help.
The facebook group is interesting, and I encourage those on Facebook 
to join, not that I want to take traffic away from here, but most are 
very very very very stridently against mixing.I tried to get them 
to come here, but haven't had any luck that I know of.  There is a 
very strange situation going on there that I'd like to get some input 
on.  There is a kitten who has tested (snap and IFA) pos for FELV.  
This kitten came from a breeder who tests all her cats regularly and 
none has ever tested positive.  The kitten's owner took the kitten to 
the vet as per contract within 10 days of buying the cat and got a 
positive test.  Rechecked with IFA, still positive.  ALL THE OTHER 
CATS were retested by the breeder and are still negative.  All the 
other kittens in the litter have tested negative.  HOW did this kitten 
contract FELV?


Anyway here is the link: https://www.facebook.com/groups/26073442228/



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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

I thought it would be interesting to get yall involved in the discussion
there. It is CRAZY.  There is also some really hopeful anecdotal evidence
about treating non-regenerative anemia with aquapuncture.  Again, not
trying to drive traffic from this list, and I've tried to get them to come
here, but if you are interested go on over.

On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 2:59 PM, Marsha mar...@lynxe.com wrote:

 Kelly, I think she wants to wait until they are confirmed positive with an
 IFA before adopting them out to a home with other FeLV+ cats.  She did
 mention the hope to find homes that are familiar with FeLV.

  I kept Brock quarantined from Harley until I got a positive IFA test on
 Brock.  Brock had ony ever had a single Snap test at the shelter to say he
 was FeLV+.  Looking back, I would have requested (and paid for) a vet local
 to the shelter to do an IFA.  That would have made it  easier for the
 shelter to adopt out a negative cat, while I continued to search for a
 positive companion for Harley.  But I had already brought Brock home, so if
 he had by chance tested negative on my vet's IFA, then I would have kept
 him separate from my negatives until he got a 2nd negative, then be put
 with them instead, and I would then have searched for another possible
 companion for Harley.  Someday I may consider mixing negatives  positives,
 especially if treatments are developed like there are for HIV, where it's
 not cured, but knocks the transmissible virus load to near zero.  But for
 now I keep them separate, because I don't want to deal with the guilt I
 would have if just ONE negative cat got infected.

 As for the lone FeLV+ kitten, that's pretty bizarre.  I don't think
 there's any way for anyone not directly involved to know what happened.
 Most likely either the breeder or the buyer knows or suspects, but isn't
 telling.  The only other possibility I can think of is that the virus
 somehow was passed genetically, and the exact right circumstances allowed
 it to manifest in one kitten. Kind of like FIP, in that the virus infects a
 large percentage of cats, but only a few have the genetic susceptibility,
 and the right circumstances for it to manifest into FIP disease.  But that
 doesn't seem so likely.

 Marsha

 On 11/14/2014 2:05 PM, Kelley S wrote:

 Marsha..sorry..when I said I don't know what you want I was referring
 to the OP, who if I recall correctly said something along the lines of we
 don't want these cats in with other FELV+ cats if they could possibly be
 negative. So the way I read her post was:  we want people with no cats who
 are willing to take the very probable heartbreak of a FELV+ kitten and
 promise to not expose it to other FELV+ cats and who will pay us over a
 hundred dollars for doing so.  This is possible, but not very likely IMHO.
  Even in our rescue, after a certain point they would eat up over $100
 worth of food and we would be losing money even if we did get $100 plus for
 them.  More importantly, everyone is limited in space, and an animal in a
 foster home means another animal your rescue cannot help.
 The facebook group is interesting, and I encourage those on Facebook to
 join, not that I want to take traffic away from here, but most are very
 very very very stridently against mixing.I tried to get them to come
 here, but haven't had any luck that I know of.  There is a very strange
 situation going on there that I'd like to get some input on.  There is a
 kitten who has tested (snap and IFA) pos for FELV.  This kitten came from a
 breeder who tests all her cats regularly and none has ever tested
 positive.  The kitten's owner took the kitten to the vet as per contract
 within 10 days of buying the cat and got a positive test.  Rechecked with
 IFA, still positive.  ALL THE OTHER CATS were retested by the breeder and
 are still negative.  All the other kittens in the litter have tested
 negative.  HOW did this kitten contract FELV?

 Anyway here is the link: https://www.facebook.com/groups/26073442228/



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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

OK, I submitted my request to join (like I need another group to join, 
LOL).  But can't get sucked into reading right now - it's time to hang 
out with Harley and Brock!


Marsha

On 11/14/2014 3:09 PM, Kelley S wrote:
I thought it would be interesting to get yall involved in the 
discussion there. It is CRAZY.  There is also some really hopeful 
anecdotal evidence about treating non-regenerative anemia with 
aquapuncture.  Again, not trying to drive traffic from this list, and 
I've tried to get them to come here, but if you are interested go on over.





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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

2014-11-14 Thread Margo

Hi Amy
Well, I can bet right now you have at least three females :).
I could never feel justified asking for fees when adopting out many special needs kittens or cats. Fortunately, I was not subject to oversight, which makes a difference. And yes, I usually had lots of money invested in those, but knowing I was asking for "above and beyond", I figured thattaking on the kind of burden I waspresenting, we were even. I have the added self-imposedconcern that I no longer believe "conversion" to negative is truly a negative. I now feel once positive, always positive, at some level.
But maybe you will have better luck. I do hope you are successful.
Margo
-Original Message- From: Amy <awilkin...@yahoo.com>Sent: Nov 14, 2014 8:48 AM To: FeLV Talk <felvtalk@felineleukemia.org>Subject: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens I volunteer for a rescue in Rochester, NY and have also owned leukemia positive cats (rescues) for years. We were recently contacted by somebody that adopted out a kitten from a litter of 5 that she found outdoors. She got a call from the adopters that the kitten tested positive and that the people needed to bring him back. She wanted help so we paid to have all 5 kittens tested this week. All five are positive. The foster is willing to hold them for 30 days so we can retest them but she does not want to euthanize (nor would we suggest that) and she can't keep them. She has five cats of her own and can't take another 5. She would like us to try to find adoptive homes for them.We have agreed to find homes for them if she will let us screen the homes and do the adoptions through our rescue, Animal Service League. We would love to find homes for them with people that know this disease. We have a black, a blue cream, a gray and white, a calico and a tortie. Pictures are available if you email me. We will determine sex and give them names soon. We will also retest them at 30 days or possibly do an IFA to make sure they are positive if somebody wants them sooner and has other leuk positives. We wouldn't want to send them to a home with leukemia if there is any chance they are going to fight it off but will all five positive, we suspect some or all of them will remain positive.These kittens will not be free. We will do all the vetting on them - spays/neuters, microchipping, rabies, distemper, flea and parasite treatment, etc., and will charge a $115 adoption fee. We are a rescue and will not adopt out animals that are not fully vetted and we don't do free adoptions. We are aware that they may not live past a year or two but they still deserve a loving, responsible home and proper veterinary care. If anybody is interested in helping one of these little beauties, please let us know.Amy Weygandt

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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

Hi all,

I'm sorry that people on this board disagree about the adoption fee and I'm 
disappointed that some people are making judgmental comments.  This board has 
been a great source of support to my family over the years and I am not feeling 
that at all at the moment.  I have adopted 12 positive cats of my own and have 
been on this board since I took my first mom and 3 kittens over 10 years ago.  
I have never owned a non-leuk positive cat until this year.  It sounds to me 
like people think I'm trying to make money off these cats or that I'm asking 
people to do something unreasonable.  Do you know what I spent in the past two 
months trying to save one leuk positive?  Over $5000.  That is one of them.  
Did I not treat her because she is leuk positive?  No I treated her like I 
would any other cat and gave her every opportunity to live, despite her status. 
 I do the same with all my positives even though I know the end result is 
usually them losing the battle with
 this horrible disease.  I'm not saying that whoever adopts these cats should 
go to those lengths to save them but I know the veterinary care that is 
involved with leuk positives.  If somebody is worried about paying a $100 
adoption fee because the cat might die, are they going to say the same thing 
about vet care?  I don't want to spend the money because it might die.  And 
what about senior cats/dogs or special needs cat/dogs? Rescues charge adoption 
fees for them as well and they can die in a year or two.  Why are leuks any 
different?  I paid an adoption fee at a shelter in CT for 2 of my leuk 
positives.  I do understand there is a controversy about free adoptions vs. 
fees.  We are not a rescue that cares about numbers.  We are a no-kill and we 
commit to an animal for life.  We do the best we can for that animal and are 
committed to finding it the best home possible.  We don't do free adoptions or 
try to move cats as quickly as we can.  It just isn't
  how we operate.  We have a very selective adoption process and we try to make 
sure all our cats are going to loving forever homes.  I am trying to do the 
same for these cats, even though I am well aware of how awful this disease is.

The woman that contacted us about these kittens has placed lots of kittens, no 
vetting, no applications, no follow up.  That is not helping the situation to 
give kittens away to people that aren't going to take care of them or be 
responsible about this disease.  Asking for an adoption fee simply helps show 
that the adopters are committed and that they understand the expense involved 
in owning an animal.  It in no means makes a dent in the money that we spend to 
help them, nor is it meant to.  We are vetting these cats and we are trying to 
teach this woman about helping in a responsible way.  She was going to adopt 
these cats to anybody and just spread the disease or release them outside.  As 
it is, we are trying to get a hold of the stray mom who is probably outside and 
leuk positive.  I'm trying to help educate her and teach her about leukemia and 
everybody makes it sound like I'm doing something wrong.  I have placed 
numerous cats on this board over
 the years as people constantly call me to help the positives.  This woman 
called me and we are trying to do the right thing.  Money is not the issue.  It 
costs us about $500 to vet a kitten completely.  There are 5 of them which 
means about $2500.  I am not trying to get that money back.  We already paid to 
combo test all of them and to treat the one for a URI without any commitment to 
these cats or any thought of an adoption fee.  She could have euthanized them 
all and we would have been out that money.  We were just trying to help her out.

Anyway, I'm probably not going to convince any of you about the adoption fee 
but I would like to say that I never said anything about not placing these cats 
in homes with other FeLV positive cats.  I said I would do an IFA first because 
both Cornell and the SPCA suggest that.  I have researched this disease for the 
past 10 years of my life and talked to vets all over the country about it.  
I've talked to sanctuaries as well and many will not take a leuk positive cat 
without a positive IFA.  If the cat is going to convert and you send it to a 
home with leukemia when it is IFA negative, you could be giving that kitten a 
death sentence when it could have a happy full life leukemia free.  Right now 
we are giving them 30 days to start converting and then we will retest.  But if 
somebody wanted  one and they had cats with leukemia, I just would want to make 
sure the kitten is truly positive.  As I mentioned, we recently had 5 positives 
at our rescue and I
 posted it about it a while back.  They are now all leuk free on both the Elisa 
and IFA.  We separated them from the positive mom and we gave them 90 days to 
convert before retesting.  They have been tested 3 times as negative and 
Cornell, the SPCA and numerous vets said

Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens

Marsha,

I would like to thank you for your suggestions, help and support.  Even though 
you may not agree with everything I'm saying, you have been very respectful and 
helpful.  It is most appreciated.

Amy



 From: Marsha mar...@lynxe.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Friday, November 14, 2014 1:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens
 

Some adopters may make a donation to the organization they adopt a 
zero-fee cat from.  I did.  You might make a cat low or no fee, but say, 
donations gratefully accepted.  If you list on PetFinder, consider 
adding FeLV+ to the heading, besides just listing them as special 
needs.  Some people are looking specifically for a FeLV+ cat as a 
companion for one they already have, and not putting that in the heading 
forces those people to sift through every special needs listing to find 
the FeLV+ kitty.  I turned to PetFinder after having no luck locally 
finding a companion for Harley, and did a search by zip code.  I 
specified up to 100 miles, and that's how I found Brock.  Actually, 
113 miles away, but the search goes by zip code.

There are also some listings here (up for adoption or looking to adopt 
FeLV, FIV, FIP +): 
http://www.bemikitties.com/felv/cgi-bin/suite/classifieds/classifieds.cgi
You can also get to that by the felineleukemia.org website.

One other place to list is the PurringPixie yahoo group.

Marsha
(with Harley  Brock)




On 11/14/2014 11:05 AM, Katherine K. wrote:
 Amy,
 I wish you the best of luck in placing these kittens. I had a litter 
 of 4 positive kittens and tried very hard to find good homes for them, 
 with no luck, so they lived with me until they passed away, most 
 before they were 1 year old. It was a very busy year, but they were a 
 lovely little group and it was nice seeing them stay together as a 
 family for the time they had.
 I have to agree with Kelley that a $115 adoption fee in reality is not 
 likely to help you get them placed in homes. In my experience, people 
 just don't want to adopt and get attached to, much less pay a fee for, 
 a kitty who will probably not live long. I was lucky enough to be 
 working with a larger rescue organization who covered their shots, 
 spay/neuters and testing expenses. I just provided the home, food, 
 love and tears :)
 I suggest making flyers with the best photos you can get, and make 
 them sound very friendly and loving. Play the sympathy card for all 
 it's worth! :)



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Re: [Felvtalk] 5 leukemia positive kittens