Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Jeff Broadwick wrote: Hi Ryan, I realize this is somewhat tangential to your main point, but I wanted to point out that EIGRP/IGRP aren't standard protocols, nor will they work with any other router, necessarily. If you are shying away from proprietary equipment, Cisco's proprietary routing protocols are the last things you should be using. Regards, Jeff Ha! Jeff also has excellent reading comprehension skills! :) ryan -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Off the subject, but if you are a major operator then you are most certainly using cisco in your core, and eigrp is standard in cisco enviroments and makes sense if it's available to you. Like 802.1q and ISL - you could do 802.1q and interoperate, or just ISL and have the benefits of better across the board management and configuration flexibillity, at the cost of interoperabillity with non cisco gear. Personally I would go with cisco for everything if I could, but last time I checked, they don't have anything I can comfortablly install and run off solar power in low temprature enviroments Mike- Jeff Broadwick wrote: Hi Ryan, I realize this is somewhat tangential to your main point, but I wanted to point out that EIGRP/IGRP aren't standard protocols, nor will they work with any other router, necessarily. If you are shying away from proprietary equipment, Cisco's proprietary routing protocols are the last things you should be using. Regards, Jeff -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
NO, MY TOY. You can't have it. :o I am thinking of a summer Hotspot at our Marina and beach this year. You have a good day now,en mag jou more's ook so wees. Carl A Jeptha http://www.jeptha.com 905-349-2027 skype cajeptha Butch Evans wrote: On Fri, 29 Dec 2006, Carl A jeptha wrote: Backhaul CPE for some of our lighter microcells. My main Gateway is an MT, my Router board (with a valid License) is packed away waiting for me to decide something great to do with it. Come on Butch tell me something :-) Ummmyou can send it to me. :-) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Hi Mike, Off the subject, but if you are a major operator then you are most certainly using cisco in your core, You might be surprised. That might have been true at one point, but probably is not now. :-) and eigrp is standard in cisco enviroments and makes sense if it's available to you. Then it's not a standard, but a proprietary protocol. Actually, Cisco generally recommends BGP at this point and not EIGRP. Like 802.1q and ISL - you could do 802.1q and interoperate, or just ISL and have the benefits of better across the board management and configuration flexibillity, at the cost of interoperabillity with non cisco gear. Personally I would go with cisco for everything if I could, but last time I checked, they don't have anything I can comfortablly install and run off solar power in low temprature enviroments If you are seeking solutions for this sort of application, ImageStream can help: http://www.imagestream.com/Envoy.html -10C to =65C certification available http://www.imagestream.com/R1.html -20C to +70C 12/24 and 48 volt DC available. Regards, Jeff Mike- Jeff Broadwick wrote: Hi Ryan, I realize this is somewhat tangential to your main point, but I wanted to point out that EIGRP/IGRP aren't standard protocols, nor will they work with any other router, necessarily. If you are shying away from proprietary equipment, Cisco's proprietary routing protocols are the last things you should be using. Regards, Jeff -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Hi Jeff, Please don't get me started on imagestream... but anyways, the real stuff that really works - cisco - doesn't come in small form factor / extended temprature range and low power, is all I was saying. We use linux on Soekris with our own special blend (and 6mb) of linux for these jobs, so it's quagga and ospf and 802.1q (for actual routing) and no eigrp or isl for us. We don't try to do anything really fancy on any of the solar sites since power is at a premium and usually alls that's needed is little more than simple bridging at those locations while the heavy lifting is usually done from an AC powered site. Jeff Broadwick wrote: If you are seeking solutions for this sort of application, ImageStream can help: http://www.imagestream.com/Envoy.html -10C to =65C certification available http://www.imagestream.com/R1.html -20C to +70C 12/24 and 48 volt DC available. Regards, Jeff Mike- Jeff Broadwick wrote: Hi Ryan, I realize this is somewhat tangential to your main point, but I wanted to point out that EIGRP/IGRP aren't standard protocols, nor will they work with any other router, necessarily. If you are shying away from proprietary equipment, Cisco's proprietary routing protocols are the last things you should be using. Regards, Jeff -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Jeff, do you have a source for the statement that Cisco now recommends BGP (iBGP?) vs EIGRP? On 12/30/06, Jeff Broadwick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Then it's not a standard, but a proprietary protocol. Actually, Cisco generally recommends BGP at this point and not EIGRP. Best, -- Dylan Oliver Primaverity, LLC -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Hi Dylan, I should have said OSPF instead of BGP...sorry about that. That said, I don't know that I can find a document on Cisco's Web site saying Don't use EIGRP if that's what you want, since the comments came from Cisco engineers and not some Web document. Cisco, from a marketing standpoint, would love to have you use a proprietary protocol that locks you into their hardware, so you won't find Cisco publications suggesting the EIGRP is pointless. You could search for OSPF vs. EIGRP and look at some of the discussion as to why OSPF is preferable. Experts Exchange has a good discussion. From an interoperability standpoint, unless you plan to run a Cisco-only network, EIGRP doesn't make sense. OSPF also gives you options with OSPF areas that EIGRP doesn't have analogs for. One of our customers in N/W Indiana is a good example of why you'd use OSPF. He has a mix of D-Link switches, ImageStreams, and Mikrotik APs that need to share dynamic routing information. EIGRP isn't an option (even if he had Cisco equipment, which he doesn't). The bottom line is this: OSPF is standards based and widely supported. EIGRP is a proprietary protocol. Enough said. Regards, Jeff -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dylan Oliver Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2006 10:05 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Jeff, do you have a source for the statement that Cisco now recommends BGP (iBGP?) vs EIGRP? On 12/30/06, Jeff Broadwick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Then it's not a standard, but a proprietary protocol. Actually, Cisco generally recommends BGP at this point and not EIGRP. Best, -- Dylan Oliver Primaverity, LLC -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
That router, sitting about 12 inches from my monitor, is one of the most failure prone, troublesome, annoying and horribly underperforming piles of JUNK I have ever laid eyes upon. Yeah, my HOUSE is not on my own wireless network... And at the end of a day with that router locking up more than a half dozen times, simply going offline 1-5 times, and other inexplicable oddness (yes, I acct ually own 2 of these actiontec piles of junk and this is the BETTER one of the two), I can barely spit out the word Qwest without wanting to punch or strangle someone. To think that my CPE will often have uptimes in the months, with uptimes being interrupted purely by power outages, I can't exactly profess much faith in consumer routers, in comparison to the stuff I put on someone's roof. I recently ran across one of my cpe I logged into by mistake (typo on the ip) and found the uptime matched almost to the day I recall replacing it due to a lightning strike - just about 6 months. My gateway and backhaul often goes 4-6 months (and once got nearly 300 days) of uptime before a radio crash required a reboot. Build me a solution that works as reliably and solidly as these things I put together myself and you got something...really got something. +++ neofast.net - fast internet for North East Oregon and South East Washington email me at mark at neofast dot net 541-969-8200 Direct commercial inquiries to purchasing at neofast dot net - Original Message - From: George Rogato [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 11:24 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Butch Evans wrote: It is my contention (and yours, it seems) that a router at the CPE is necessary. BINGO. Qwest DSL has a router at every customer. Ever taken a look at what those Actiontec wireless dsl routers do... As we stated in an earlier thread, those pesky routers matter more than our cpes, to the customer. -- George Rogato Welcome to WISPA www.wispa.org http://signup.wispa.org/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Well I wish some Qwest customers would be as angry as you are and call me.. Ah, maybe not, I don't want angry customers! :) Mark Koskenmaki wrote: That router, sitting about 12 inches from my monitor, is one of the most failure prone, troublesome, annoying and horribly underperforming piles of JUNK I have ever laid eyes upon. Yeah, my HOUSE is not on my own wireless network... And at the end of a day with that router locking up more than a half dozen times, simply going offline 1-5 times, and other inexplicable oddness (yes, I acct ually own 2 of these actiontec piles of junk and this is the BETTER one of the two), I can barely spit out the word Qwest without wanting to punch or strangle someone. To think that my CPE will often have uptimes in the months, with uptimes being interrupted purely by power outages, I can't exactly profess much faith in consumer routers, in comparison to the stuff I put on someone's roof. I recently ran across one of my cpe I logged into by mistake (typo on the ip) and found the uptime matched almost to the day I recall replacing it due to a lightning strike - just about 6 months. My gateway and backhaul often goes 4-6 months (and once got nearly 300 days) of uptime before a radio crash required a reboot. Build me a solution that works as reliably and solidly as these things I put together myself and you got something...really got something. +++ neofast.net - fast internet for North East Oregon and South East Washington email me at mark at neofast dot net 541-969-8200 Direct commercial inquiries to purchasing at neofast dot net - Original Message - From: George Rogato [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 11:24 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Butch Evans wrote: It is my contention (and yours, it seems) that a router at the CPE is necessary. BINGO. Qwest DSL has a router at every customer. Ever taken a look at what those Actiontec wireless dsl routers do... As we stated in an earlier thread, those pesky routers matter more than our cpes, to the customer. -- George Rogato Welcome to WISPA www.wispa.org http://signup.wispa.org/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- George Rogato Welcome to WISPA www.wispa.org http://signup.wispa.org/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
- Original Message - From: Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 11:51 PM Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Right guys, I accept all that may be true but even in the DSL world, customers provide their own routers and that is certainly true of commercial customers. What planet do you live on? Every DSL service I have seen in a LONG time provides the dsl modem and router together as one device. In any event, VL does many of things for which you think make a router so critical. Even better, it does a lot of them at the RF level which makes the link and total network more efficient. Frankly though, I need one of my engineers in this type conversation; I'm just not technically competent enough on the networking side (and barely so in the nitty gritty of the RF side). You can't do routing, dhcp, firewalling, etc, at the RF level. At the same token, many here that are truly skilled remain under exposed on the RF side since most have not used truly sophisticated gear that allows for depths of tweaking beyond that which you have experienced. What I use may not be sophisticated by your standards. But if we look at the overall picture, attaching that high priced RF equipment to a linksys router is like transplanting a pinto engine and gas tank into a humvee... Frankly, I can't find that elusive somewhere between linksys and belkin and the other end where imagestream and cisco live - well, except for what I use... Which costs less and is dead reliable and excellent performing. I have never encountered an old hand who, once thoroughly exposed to our firmware in a scaled system, did not say something along the lines of, Wow, I did not know that sort of thing could be even be done! or You mean that's all we have to do to do that? That always took me hours before! Basically, I think many of you have trained and become good street racers, but you've not yet become real race car drivers because you are still driving souped up street cars not realizing a real race car actually IS different. Certainly most of us who deal with wifi-based gear are very much aware of the limitations of the rf side of this setup. It's no mystery, Patrick and I think you grossly underestimate what we understand in that regard. Perhaps alvarion c ould get into the business of providing a REAL mini-pci radio, certified with various antennas, and then we'd have the better of both worlds... Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of George Rogato Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 11:25 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Butch Evans wrote: It is my contention (and yours, it seems) that a router at the CPE is necessary. BINGO. Qwest DSL has a router at every customer. Ever taken a look at what those Actiontec wireless dsl routers do... As we stated in an earlier thread, those pesky routers matter more than our cpes, to the customer. -- George Rogato Welcome to WISPA www.wispa.org http://signup.wispa.org/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Ryan, YES YES! I personally run about 30 MikroTik APs (Proxim, Trango and a few Tranzeo's) and have been using Tranzeo CPE's exclusively for the last few years. It works great. I also know that Matt Larsen uses Tranzeo CPE exclusively (for years) and he is a 100% dyed in the wool StarOS man with StarOS AP's and Tranzeo CPE in at least 3 different States out west. Pick your flavor and deploy with confidence!! :-) Mac Dearman Maximum Access, LLC. Rayville, La. www.inetsouth.com www.radioresponse.org (Katrina relief) www.mac-tel.us (VoIP sales) 318.728.8600 318.728.9600 318.303.4182 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of D. Ryan Spott Sent: Friday, December 29, 2006 12:05 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Can anyone just answer the questions I had without fighting amongst yourselves? (I thought Xmas with the inlaws was bad!) Lonnie... If I were to buy a StarOS type product, would it be compatable with the CPQ series radios from Tranzeo? What sort of client load should I be able to support on a Star-OS based AP? ryan On Dec 28, 2006, at 10:01 PM, Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: Patrick, This is simply the LOWEST blow I have EVER seen you throw. You have always been an Evangelist and I have seen you come and go from several lists, while me and my people have survived legal blind sides and we have outlived several LARGER companies. Yep, pretty low. Plus it did not answer the question. I feel I cannot jump in since I am too close to the product and thus might be seen as self serving. What is your excuse? Lonnie On 12/28/06, Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I mean, besides simply being illegal, such a vendor has no quality controls, they can also just up and walk away from you and quit anytime, they have no accountability, and it throws away your investment from an equity standpoint. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Butch Evans Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Patrick Leary wrote: Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? Good idea, Patrick, but it doesn't answer the question that was asked. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ * *** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). * *** * *** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). * *** * *** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. * *** -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Patrick, what exactly is this illegal hardware you're referring to ? Can't be tranzeo -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Patrick Leary Sent: Friday, December 29, 2006 1:19 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Lonnie, Not sure why you are fired up. Your product is software that gets loaded into hardware so I'm not talking about you. I'm talking about illegal hardware and what is untrue about what I said about illegal hardware suppliers? Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lonnie Nunweiler Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 10:02 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Patrick, This is simply the LOWEST blow I have EVER seen you throw. You have always been an Evangelist and I have seen you come and go from several lists, while me and my people have survived legal blind sides and we have outlived several LARGER companies. Yep, pretty low. Plus it did not answer the question. I feel I cannot jump in since I am too close to the product and thus might be seen as self serving. What is your excuse? Lonnie On 12/28/06, Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I mean, besides simply being illegal, such a vendor has no quality controls, they can also just up and walk away from you and quit anytime, they have no accountability, and it throws away your investment from an equity standpoint. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Butch Evans Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Patrick Leary wrote: Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? Good idea, Patrick, but it doesn't answer the question that was asked. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Lonnie, Patrick has a valid point. Truthfully, its getting close to that time that there isn't a reason not to get certified. The 533 Gateworks boards, atheros chipset cards, are getting to be pretty standard products, with consistent availabilty, that meet just about any need. Thats much different than 2 years ago, when who knew what hardware would be used daily. Why not get them certified with the Rootenna product, and then use the new FCC relaxed equivellent antenna rules, to list additional equivellent antenna? I bet you could even get the cost covered by your buyers, if you took up a collection. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Lonnie Nunweiler [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Friday, December 29, 2006 1:01 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Patrick, This is simply the LOWEST blow I have EVER seen you throw. You have always been an Evangelist and I have seen you come and go from several lists, while me and my people have survived legal blind sides and we have outlived several LARGER companies. Yep, pretty low. Plus it did not answer the question. I feel I cannot jump in since I am too close to the product and thus might be seen as self serving. What is your excuse? Lonnie On 12/28/06, Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I mean, besides simply being illegal, such a vendor has no quality controls, they can also just up and walk away from you and quit anytime, they have no accountability, and it throws away your investment from an equity standpoint. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Butch Evans Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Patrick Leary wrote: Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? Good idea, Patrick, but it doesn't answer the question that was asked. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
I think Patrick needs to build Lonnie a box. Star OS software / Alvarion radio. Look out! :-) Scriv Patrick Leary wrote: Lonnie, you are just doing what I wish I were smart enough to do -- write code people are willing to pay for. Software is always better than hardware: you avoid FCC hassles, you have no hard shipping or packaging costs, you need no production facilities, you don't have to negotiate purchase of and stock components, you can live anywhere, it can be instantly deployed, etc., etc. I've nothing but respect for what you've done. For all the same reasons, I'd think you were insane if you went into hardware in this business. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lonnie Nunweiler Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 10:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Seemed kind close to my home is all. All the Best in 2007. Lonnie This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
their customers of the risks. And that'd all be an entirely fair and ethical approach. Rant off. Sigh. G'night. Be safe this New Years. ...and BE LEGAL! Patrick -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of George Rogato Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 11:36 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Then you must not be aware that Lonnie is now also selling the complete package. The newest product is Star V3, Atheros cm9 and a gateworks customized board to Lonnies specs. It's called the WAR board, or Wireless Advanced Router. They come in 2 flavors, a 4 port 533MHz proc or a 2 port 266MHz proc, both with 2 ethernets. Can do 5, 10, 20,,40MHz channel widths. I have better than 200 maybe 250 by now WAR boards in place with Pac Wireless Rootennas both 5 gig and 2 gig. Recently I built a new pop using a water tank. My transfer rate from the tank to my house gave me just under 30megs ftp across that link using a pair of 266's. Most of the links I put in are 5 gig and I use the 2nd port for a 2 gig wifi ap for the immediate area. I can honestly say that I can not remember having to reboot any of my war boards and 20 megs is not uncommon across my wireless man. This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
I worked for a manufacturer that certified product with the FCC. The legality issue for FCC type acceptance can be argued in certain circumstances. Truth is, we didn't re-apply for FCC type acceptance every time we changed a resistor value or made some board change or modified the software. It's arguable that the need for FCC type acceptance is only required when a change in the product alters the rf modulation. When it was clear to us that it did, we'd re-apply for FCC type acceptance. If someone puts an FCC type accepted radio card into box with a single board computer combined with some OS on the SBC, I'm not sure there's any legality issue as far as the FCC is concerned. I think the question is whether there's anything in the SBC external software that's changed the rf characteristics of the radio card that's already been FCC type accepted. If not ... why is it illegal? Rich - Original Message - From: Tom DeReggi To: WISPA General List Sent: Friday, December 29, 2006 9:44 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Lonnie, Patrick has a valid point. Truthfully, its getting close to that time that there isn't a reason not to get certified. The 533 Gateworks boards, atheros chipset cards, are getting to be pretty standard products, with consistent availabilty, that meet just about any need. Thats much different than 2 years ago, when who knew what hardware would be used daily. Why not get them certified with the Rootenna product, and then use the new FCC relaxed equivellent antenna rules, to list additional equivellent antenna? I bet you could even get the cost covered by your buyers, if you took up a collection. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Lonnie Nunweiler [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Friday, December 29, 2006 1:01 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Patrick, This is simply the LOWEST blow I have EVER seen you throw. You have always been an Evangelist and I have seen you come and go from several lists, while me and my people have survived legal blind sides and we have outlived several LARGER companies. Yep, pretty low. Plus it did not answer the question. I feel I cannot jump in since I am too close to the product and thus might be seen as self serving. What is your excuse? Lonnie On 12/28/06, Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I mean, besides simply being illegal, such a vendor has no quality controls, they can also just up and walk away from you and quit anytime, they have no accountability, and it throws away your investment from an equity standpoint. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Butch Evans Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Patrick Leary wrote: Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? Good idea, Patrick, but it doesn't answer the question that was asked. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
N White wrote, On 12/28/2006 11:30 PM: Nick. Is. A. God. (and has EXCELLENT reading comprehension!) Correction. It's late, I'm tired, and have had too much wine. I meant that the TRCPQ is Atheros based, not TRCPE. This is from a Tranzeo list: The CPE90 is Marvell. The 900, the CPQ, the 6000, the 49, and the 5a are all Atheros based. The CPE200, the 1000, 2000, 3000 and 4000 were Prism based. The CPE80 was Atmel. -Damian Wallace I was looking for that Damian Wallace post! Also, if you decide to go the StarOS/Mikrotik way, make sure you upgrade all of your Tranzeo gear to the latest firmwares. All of my TRCPQ are up to date.. I have a script that does it for me. :) (pointing and clicking on each CPE/Q gets REALLY tiresome after a while!) Thanks! ryan -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
OK, lets be clear on what the rules are today guys. (Why did I know that THIS thread was gonna turn out to be a ton of fun (said the pot to the kettle)) Here's how it works. If you have a AP out there it can have a MAX output of 4 watts. 36dB. That holds true for 900, 2.4 and 5.8 bands. I forget what the strange 5.7 unii band rules are but I think they are 4 watt also, at the ap. The 5.2 (some call it the 5.3) gig band has a 1 watt limit. As for antenna choices, you can use any antenna of the SAME type as long as it's of equal or lower gain AND the same type. If you are using an ap radio (doesn't matter if it's in a tranzeo box, war board or mt or whatever anymore) certified with a 15 dB vpol omni then you can use any vpol omni of similar in and out of band specs that's 15 dB or less. Want to run a 15 dB hpol omni? Nope, gotta go get it certified with that (I could be wrong on this one but I don't think so). Certainly if you want to put a sector on, so sorry, no can do. Unless that is, it's certified with *A* sector. Here's the really fun part. Under the NEW rules (from a year or two ago) if you want to run an amp it has to be a part of a COMPLETE system. AND the devices have to be keyed to each other. Meaning that the ap and the amp have to have unique connectors or be electronically keyed to each other. Thanks Michael Young formerly of YDI. On the cpe side things get even more fun. I'm only gonna talk about ISM rules as I keep forgetting exactly what the UNII rules are and few mix and match in the UNII band anyway. 900 mhz 4 watts max. You can use any antenna you want as long as it's of the same type (grid, yagi, panel) and similar specs as the LARGEST one certified with the radio. If they certified a 20 dB yagi, you can use almost any yagi that's 20dB or less. If they certified no yagis you can't use one. 2.4 ghz Starts at 4 watts. 30 dB of radio output and 6dB of antenna gain. For ever dB you reduce the radio output you can raise the antenna gain by 3dB. At 24 dB of radio output (250mw) you can put on a 24dB grid. This gives you a total of 60 watts of output. Same rules apply though. If the radio isn't certified with a grid antenna or with one that's less than 24 dB you can't do this. Make sure that your radio manufacturers are certifying everything with the LARGEST antenna of all common types! If they aren't certified with anything but a consumer grade rubber ducky, we can't legally use the radios. 5.8 ghz Starts with 4 watts. 30dB of radio output and 6 dB of antenna gain. Go as big as you want with the antennas, no need to drop the radio power. Same other rules about certification apply. Is my network perfect? Nope. Is it all within eirp limits? You bet. Well, I've got one sector that used to be an omni and I need to pull our the amp but I'll save that project for better weather. And it's only hurting me (does create a LOT of interference on one of my other systems in town). Do I go around bragging about, or complaining about compliance issues? Nope. That said, I'm working very hard to correct any compliance issues we have. It'll take another year or two, but I'll have everything certified. Things are growing too fast and getting too good to think that we can stay under the radar. Eventually there will have to be a crack down. Or another change in the rules. I'm not sure which will happen, I prefer at least an eirp crackdown. It's hard enough competing in this industry without a bunch of people that don't understand that more is not better most of the time screwing up the airways. (BTW, that's the bad thing about rec. thresholds. They tend to raise the overall noise floor which, in the end, is the same as running more amps out there.) If you hire a consultant that doesn't at least explain all of this to you, go hire a new consultant. The one you have either doesn't know the rules or he's only in it to take your money. And if he'll take your money without worrying about your long term legality, what else will he do to you? Let the Marlon bashing begin! Marlon (509) 982-2181 Equipment sales (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: George Rogato [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 11:36 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Then you must not be aware that Lonnie is now also selling the complete package. The newest product is Star V3, Atheros cm9 and a gateworks customized board to Lonnies specs. It's called the WAR board, or Wireless Advanced Router. They come in 2 flavors, a 4 port 533MHz proc or a 2 port 266MHz proc, both with 2 ethernets. Can do 5, 10
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Hire Jack Unger. He was patient enough to beat all the rules into my head eventually. C If you hire a consultant that doesn't at least explain all of this to you, go hire a new consultant. The one you have either doesn't know the rules or he's only in it to take your money. And if he'll take your money without worrying about your long term legality, what else will he do to you? -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Well said. You've covered issues in deploying your FCC certified radio product with various pre-approved antennas. Now, when it comes to selling a box with a computer and radio in it, the questions are a bit different. If it's a radio integrated onto a computer board, my belief it that it's got to be FCC accepted, certified, and bear the FCC ID, FCC certified label, and of course the This device complies with Part 15 of FCC Rules ... blah, blah, blah. If you're having a board manufactured with the 802.11a chips on it, I think you've got to get tested certified. On the other hand, if you're integrating an SBC with a radio card manufactured by another vendor who has already certified the card (it has the FCC ID, FCC certified logo, the Part 15 compliance) then I'm at a loss as to why this is not completely legal. You're not a manufacturer ... you're an integrator. I can't see why you'd need to re-test and certified a box with a radio that already bears the FCC certification. If you need to re-certify, then BestBuy'd need to certify to sell you a PC with the LAN card installed, CompUSA'd need to certify, etc. But if you integrate a certified radio, and reflash its code in a way that modifies its modulation behavior, then you've become a radio manufacturer ... and you need to actually go through a complete FCC type acceptance testing. However, in my opinion it's got to be modified at layer 1 (physical layer) to require this. Changing the Media Access Control (layer 2) or above is just not grounds to require re-certification IMHO. Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, nor have ever played a lawyer on TV. I am actually not qualified to comment on the topics I have just commented on! :-) They are just my ignorant opinions, and I'd greatly appreciate anyone who could kick some sense into me should I be all wet. Peace, Rich - Original Message - From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 To: WISPA General List Sent: Friday, December 29, 2006 12:03 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... OK, lets be clear on what the rules are today guys. (Why did I know that THIS thread was gonna turn out to be a ton of fun (said the pot to the kettle)) Here's how it works. If you have a AP out there it can have a MAX output of 4 watts. 36dB. That holds true for 900, 2.4 and 5.8 bands. I forget what the strange 5.7 unii band rules are but I think they are 4 watt also, at the ap. The 5.2 (some call it the 5.3) gig band has a 1 watt limit. As for antenna choices, you can use any antenna of the SAME type as long as it's of equal or lower gain AND the same type. If you are using an ap radio (doesn't matter if it's in a tranzeo box, war board or mt or whatever anymore) certified with a 15 dB vpol omni then you can use any vpol omni of similar in and out of band specs that's 15 dB or less. Want to run a 15 dB hpol omni? Nope, gotta go get it certified with that (I could be wrong on this one but I don't think so). Certainly if you want to put a sector on, so sorry, no can do. Unless that is, it's certified with *A* sector. Here's the really fun part. Under the NEW rules (from a year or two ago) if you want to run an amp it has to be a part of a COMPLETE system. AND the devices have to be keyed to each other. Meaning that the ap and the amp have to have unique connectors or be electronically keyed to each other. Thanks Michael Young formerly of YDI. On the cpe side things get even more fun. I'm only gonna talk about ISM rules as I keep forgetting exactly what the UNII rules are and few mix and match in the UNII band anyway. 900 mhz 4 watts max. You can use any antenna you want as long as it's of the same type (grid, yagi, panel) and similar specs as the LARGEST one certified with the radio. If they certified a 20 dB yagi, you can use almost any yagi that's 20dB or less. If they certified no yagis you can't use one. 2.4 ghz Starts at 4 watts. 30 dB of radio output and 6dB of antenna gain. For ever dB you reduce the radio output you can raise the antenna gain by 3dB. At 24 dB of radio output (250mw) you can put on a 24dB grid. This gives you a total of 60 watts of output. Same rules apply though. If the radio isn't certified with a grid antenna or with one that's less than 24 dB you can't do this. Make sure that your radio manufacturers are certifying everything with the LARGEST antenna of all common types! If they aren't certified with anything but a consumer grade rubber ducky, we can't legally use the radios. 5.8 ghz Starts with 4 watts. 30dB of radio output and 6 dB of antenna gain. Go as big as you want with the antennas, no need to drop the radio power. Same other rules about certification apply. Is my network perfect? Nope. Is it all within eirp limits? You bet. Well, I've got one sector that used
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Hi Ryan, My favorite AP setup for 2.4 is StarOS/Orinoco card/YDI amplifier/YDI 180deg sector antenna - however some of these parts are getting harder to find and/or don't work for a lot of situations. So here is the most common one that I am deploying as of late: StarOS/prism2511/tranzeo h-pol sector A WRAP with a 2511 will serve about 50 or 60 customers in 2.4. A loaded up PC with four Orinoco cards and four sectors will serve about 250-260 customers. Some have said that you can do more, but that is the most I've been able to do at one site. If you don't need radius authentication, or want to use hotspot-style authentication, I'm sure that a WRAP board with one of the new atheros chipset b/g cards would probably be the most compatible with a CPQ. FWIW, I have 1000+ subs on my staros access points, and the breakdown is probably 50% 200-15, 30% 80-15 and 20% CPQ radios. The CPQs are the best of them all for performance, reliability and ease of installation. Hope that helps. I'll take a shot at the other issues surfacing in this thread later. :^) Matt Larsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ryan Spott wrote: N White wrote, On 12/28/2006 11:30 PM: Nick. Is. A. God. (and has EXCELLENT reading comprehension!) Correction. It's late, I'm tired, and have had too much wine. I meant that the TRCPQ is Atheros based, not TRCPE. This is from a Tranzeo list: The CPE90 is Marvell. The 900, the CPQ, the 6000, the 49, and the 5a are all Atheros based. The CPE200, the 1000, 2000, 3000 and 4000 were Prism based. The CPE80 was Atmel. -Damian Wallace I was looking for that Damian Wallace post! Also, if you decide to go the StarOS/Mikrotik way, make sure you upgrade all of your Tranzeo gear to the latest firmwares. All of my TRCPQ are up to date.. I have a script that does it for me. :) (pointing and clicking on each CPE/Q gets REALLY tiresome after a while!) Thanks! ryan -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
In general what is considered a better combination, lower powered radio w/ higher gain antenna or higher powered radio w/ lower gain antenna? Mark -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 Sent: Friday, December 29, 2006 12:04 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... OK, lets be clear on what the rules are today guys. (Why did I know that THIS thread was gonna turn out to be a ton of fun (said the pot to the kettle)) Here's how it works. If you have a AP out there it can have a MAX output of 4 watts. 36dB. That holds true for 900, 2.4 and 5.8 bands. I forget what the strange 5.7 unii band rules are but I think they are 4 watt also, at the ap. The 5.2 (some call it the 5.3) gig band has a 1 watt limit. As for antenna choices, you can use any antenna of the SAME type as long as it's of equal or lower gain AND the same type. If you are using an ap radio (doesn't matter if it's in a tranzeo box, war board or mt or whatever anymore) certified with a 15 dB vpol omni then you can use any vpol omni of similar in and out of band specs that's 15 dB or less. Want to run a 15 dB hpol omni? Nope, gotta go get it certified with that (I could be wrong on this one but I don't think so). Certainly if you want to put a sector on, so sorry, no can do. Unless that is, it's certified with *A* sector. Here's the really fun part. Under the NEW rules (from a year or two ago) if you want to run an amp it has to be a part of a COMPLETE system. AND the devices have to be keyed to each other. Meaning that the ap and the amp have to have unique connectors or be electronically keyed to each other. Thanks Michael Young formerly of YDI. On the cpe side things get even more fun. I'm only gonna talk about ISM rules as I keep forgetting exactly what the UNII rules are and few mix and match in the UNII band anyway. 900 mhz 4 watts max. You can use any antenna you want as long as it's of the same type (grid, yagi, panel) and similar specs as the LARGEST one certified with the radio. If they certified a 20 dB yagi, you can use almost any yagi that's 20dB or less. If they certified no yagis you can't use one. 2.4 ghz Starts at 4 watts. 30 dB of radio output and 6dB of antenna gain. For ever dB you reduce the radio output you can raise the antenna gain by 3dB. At 24 dB of radio output (250mw) you can put on a 24dB grid. This gives you a total of 60 watts of output. Same rules apply though. If the radio isn't certified with a grid antenna or with one that's less than 24 dB you can't do this. Make sure that your radio manufacturers are certifying everything with the LARGEST antenna of all common types! If they aren't certified with anything but a consumer grade rubber ducky, we can't legally use the radios. 5.8 ghz Starts with 4 watts. 30dB of radio output and 6 dB of antenna gain. Go as big as you want with the antennas, no need to drop the radio power. Same other rules about certification apply. Is my network perfect? Nope. Is it all within eirp limits? You bet. Well, I've got one sector that used to be an omni and I need to pull our the amp but I'll save that project for better weather. And it's only hurting me (does create a LOT of interference on one of my other systems in town). Do I go around bragging about, or complaining about compliance issues? Nope. That said, I'm working very hard to correct any compliance issues we have. It'll take another year or two, but I'll have everything certified. Things are growing too fast and getting too good to think that we can stay under the radar. Eventually there will have to be a crack down. Or another change in the rules. I'm not sure which will happen, I prefer at least an eirp crackdown. It's hard enough competing in this industry without a bunch of people that don't understand that more is not better most of the time screwing up the airways. (BTW, that's the bad thing about rec. thresholds. They tend to raise the overall noise floor which, in the end, is the same as running more amps out there.) If you hire a consultant that doesn't at least explain all of this to you, go hire a new consultant. The one you have either doesn't know the rules or he's only in it to take your money. And if he'll take your money without worrying about your long term legality, what else will he do to you? Let the Marlon bashing begin! Marlon (509) 982-2181 Equipment sales (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: George Rogato [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 11:36 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Mark McElvy wrote: In general what is considered a better combination, lower powered radio w/ higher gain antenna or higher powered radio w/ lower gain antenna? Mark Rule of thumbs, keep the beamwidth to a minimum and use the lowest power needed to get the job done. These two rules will let lots of people play in the same sandbox and give you the best performance. George -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
I have used a tr5a against an MT AP and no problems. I also use Tranzeo 6000 for AP's and really don't see them slowing down. They also act as Backhaul AP's (at the same time) in PTMP mode for other microcell backhauls. Granted we don't have amount of clients that you have. We actually use the CPQ as a Backhaul CPE for some of our lighter microcells. My main Gateway is an MT, my Router board (with a valid License) is packed away waiting for me to decide something great to do with it. Come on Butch tell me something :-) This why I like to follow a standard, Tranzeo knows (in no uncertain terms) that I will replace them, just like I did the Smartbridges, CB3's and Demarc's, but I still have Hawking HWBA11's out their (Damn customers can't see anything wring with them). This is my company and I run it my way not their way. You have a good day now,en mag jou more's ook so wees. Carl A Jeptha http://www.jeptha.com 905-349-2027 skype cajeptha Ryan Spott wrote: N White wrote, On 12/28/2006 11:30 PM: Nick. Is. A. God. (and has EXCELLENT reading comprehension!) Correction. It's late, I'm tired, and have had too much wine. I meant that the TRCPQ is Atheros based, not TRCPE. This is from a Tranzeo list: The CPE90 is Marvell. The 900, the CPQ, the 6000, the 49, and the 5a are all Atheros based. The CPE200, the 1000, 2000, 3000 and 4000 were Prism based. The CPE80 was Atmel. -Damian Wallace I was looking for that Damian Wallace post! Also, if you decide to go the StarOS/Mikrotik way, make sure you upgrade all of your Tranzeo gear to the latest firmwares. All of my TRCPQ are up to date.. I have a script that does it for me. :) (pointing and clicking on each CPE/Q gets REALLY tiresome after a while!) Thanks! ryan -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Hi Ryan, I realize this is somewhat tangential to your main point, but I wanted to point out that EIGRP/IGRP aren't standard protocols, nor will they work with any other router, necessarily. If you are shying away from proprietary equipment, Cisco's proprietary routing protocols are the last things you should be using. Regards, Jeff -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of D. Ryan Spott Sent: Friday, December 29, 2006 12:15 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Dec 28, 2006, at 8:44 PM, Patrick Leary wrote: Ryan, Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC- certified) brands? Are you trying to troll? :) I am using all Tranzeo gear now. I am also looking for other options. I have 2 6500 series radios up at this site. They are currently sucking wind with 30 clients each. I ask about the Mikrotik/Star-OS stuff as it appears that there is nothing illegal about them. I find this analogous to my father in law building a kit Cobra in his barn. As long as all the parts fit together in a compatible and non- dangerous way then they are considered safe and licensable by the local DMV. There's no need to go the illegal route and that includes even price these days. Plus, with a legal product you'll get the benefit of support and a warranty. Even with support and a warranty I find myself hesitant to add additional clients to this setup. I see others on this list using these other products with decent support from the community and it seems, reasonable results. I like the Alvarion stuff, I really do. But I have seen entire countys/states get messed over by buying a proprietary system and then the system creator suddenly goes under or pulls a Motorola and forces a multi-million dollar upgrade. I tend to shy away from proprietary equipment unless it is able to use standardized protocols (like Cisco's EIGRP vs IGRP routing. You use the Enhanced if you use all Cisco, but plain non-enhanced compatible with any other router if you don't want the wiz-bang stuff.) Now. I ask again the last question: What works with the Tranzeo CPQ clients? Do you know? ! :) ryan Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of D. Ryan Spott Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 8:22 PM To: WISPA General List Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Sorry for the cross post. I am looking at replacing my array of TR6500s with something that can handle more than 30 concurrent users in a graceful manner. I have been looking at the Microtik line of products with an SR2 400mW Atheros radio in it. I know Matt Larsen uses StarOS with Lucent Cards Does anyone have any input as to what direction to go? What works with the Tranzeo CPQ clients? Thanks! ryan -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** ** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). ** ** ** ** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(42). ** ** ** ** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. ** ** -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
On Fri, 29 Dec 2006, Carl A jeptha wrote: Backhaul CPE for some of our lighter microcells. My main Gateway is an MT, my Router board (with a valid License) is packed away waiting for me to decide something great to do with it. Come on Butch tell me something :-) Ummmyou can send it to me. :-) -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Ryan, Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? There's no need to go the illegal route and that includes even price these days. Plus, with a legal product you'll get the benefit of support and a warranty. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of D. Ryan Spott Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 8:22 PM To: WISPA General List Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Sorry for the cross post. I am looking at replacing my array of TR6500s with something that can handle more than 30 concurrent users in a graceful manner. I have been looking at the Microtik line of products with an SR2 400mW Atheros radio in it. I know Matt Larsen uses StarOS with Lucent Cards Does anyone have any input as to what direction to go? What works with the Tranzeo CPQ clients? Thanks! ryan -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(42). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, D. Ryan Spott wrote: I have been looking at the Microtik line of products with an SR2 400mW Atheros radio in it. Does anyone have any input as to what direction to go? Really, this depends on what you want the AP to actually do (other than be a simple AP). I like the Mikrotik platform because it offers a LOT of flexibility beyond just a simple AP. What works with the Tranzeo CPQ clients? Many things work with this product, including Mikrotik and StarOS. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
On Dec 28, 2006, at 8:52 PM, Butch Evans wrote: On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, D. Ryan Spott wrote: I have been looking at the Microtik line of products with an SR2 400mW Atheros radio in it. Does anyone have any input as to what direction to go? Really, this depends on what you want the AP to actually do (other than be a simple AP). I like the Mikrotik platform because it offers a LOT of flexibility beyond just a simple AP. I agree. Other than some *cough*open source*cough*licensing issues*cough* I can see that there is lots that can be done with the Microtik. What works with the Tranzeo CPQ clients? Many things work with this product, including Mikrotik and StarOS. Specifically? What do you use? or what do you see your clients using? What works? Before I go and spend my money on a product, any product, I ask around to see what works and what does not. ryan -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Patrick Leary wrote: Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? Good idea, Patrick, but it doesn't answer the question that was asked. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
On Dec 28, 2006, at 8:44 PM, Patrick Leary wrote: Ryan, Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC- certified) brands? Are you trying to troll? :) I am using all Tranzeo gear now. I am also looking for other options. I have 2 6500 series radios up at this site. They are currently sucking wind with 30 clients each. I ask about the Mikrotik/Star-OS stuff as it appears that there is nothing illegal about them. I find this analogous to my father in law building a kit Cobra in his barn. As long as all the parts fit together in a compatible and non- dangerous way then they are considered safe and licensable by the local DMV. There's no need to go the illegal route and that includes even price these days. Plus, with a legal product you'll get the benefit of support and a warranty. Even with support and a warranty I find myself hesitant to add additional clients to this setup. I see others on this list using these other products with decent support from the community and it seems, reasonable results. I like the Alvarion stuff, I really do. But I have seen entire countys/states get messed over by buying a proprietary system and then the system creator suddenly goes under or pulls a Motorola and forces a multi-million dollar upgrade. I tend to shy away from proprietary equipment unless it is able to use standardized protocols (like Cisco's EIGRP vs IGRP routing. You use the Enhanced if you use all Cisco, but plain non-enhanced compatible with any other router if you don't want the wiz-bang stuff.) Now. I ask again the last question: What works with the Tranzeo CPQ clients? Do you know? ! :) ryan Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of D. Ryan Spott Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 8:22 PM To: WISPA General List Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Sorry for the cross post. I am looking at replacing my array of TR6500s with something that can handle more than 30 concurrent users in a graceful manner. I have been looking at the Microtik line of products with an SR2 400mW Atheros radio in it. I know Matt Larsen uses StarOS with Lucent Cards Does anyone have any input as to what direction to go? What works with the Tranzeo CPQ clients? Thanks! ryan -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** ** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). ** ** ** ** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(42). ** ** ** ** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. ** ** -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Butch, I wasn't trying to answer the question. I was asking one. I honestly do not understand the motivation these days for going the illegal route. I mean, besides simply being illegal, such a vendor has no quality controls, they can also just up and walk away from you and quit anytime, they have no accountability, and it throws away your investment from an equity standpoint. Legal options, ours or others, are far more attractive today for almost every reason -- legal, technical and economic. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Butch Evans Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Patrick Leary wrote: Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? Good idea, Patrick, but it doesn't answer the question that was asked. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
I've been around here for 8 years (well, WISP lists in general) so I can't be a troll in my own house! :) And this is not about Alvarion, it's about legal vs. illegal systems. As much as I like kit cars Ryan (I always thought it'd be cool to build one), your analogy is incorrect. The FCC certifies assembled systems. This is not a matter of opinion. Now will the FCC hunt you down for it? No, but they don't half to. It leaves you vulnerable to local competitors who could use your illegality to push their agenda in a civil court with a halfway smart telecom attorney (another Part 15 has no protections against other Part 15 users, but you'd not be a Part 15 user, you'd be an illegal user). For this reason alone it might make your investment worthless in the eyes of most who might otherwise want to buy you out. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of D. Ryan Spott Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:15 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Dec 28, 2006, at 8:44 PM, Patrick Leary wrote: Ryan, Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC- certified) brands? Are you trying to troll? :) I am using all Tranzeo gear now. I am also looking for other options. I have 2 6500 series radios up at this site. They are currently sucking wind with 30 clients each. I ask about the Mikrotik/Star-OS stuff as it appears that there is nothing illegal about them. I find this analogous to my father in law building a kit Cobra in his barn. As long as all the parts fit together in a compatible and non- dangerous way then they are considered safe and licensable by the local DMV. There's no need to go the illegal route and that includes even price these days. Plus, with a legal product you'll get the benefit of support and a warranty. Even with support and a warranty I find myself hesitant to add additional clients to this setup. I see others on this list using these other products with decent support from the community and it seems, reasonable results. I like the Alvarion stuff, I really do. But I have seen entire countys/states get messed over by buying a proprietary system and then the system creator suddenly goes under or pulls a Motorola and forces a multi-million dollar upgrade. I tend to shy away from proprietary equipment unless it is able to use standardized protocols (like Cisco's EIGRP vs IGRP routing. You use the Enhanced if you use all Cisco, but plain non-enhanced compatible with any other router if you don't want the wiz-bang stuff.) Now. I ask again the last question: What works with the Tranzeo CPQ clients? Do you know? ! :) ryan Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of D. Ryan Spott Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 8:22 PM To: WISPA General List Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Sorry for the cross post. I am looking at replacing my array of TR6500s with something that can handle more than 30 concurrent users in a graceful manner. I have been looking at the Microtik line of products with an SR2 400mW Atheros radio in it. I know Matt Larsen uses StarOS with Lucent Cards Does anyone have any input as to what direction to go? What works with the Tranzeo CPQ clients? Thanks! ryan -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ ** ** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). ** ** ** ** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(42). ** ** ** ** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. ** ** -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Patrick, This is simply the LOWEST blow I have EVER seen you throw. You have always been an Evangelist and I have seen you come and go from several lists, while me and my people have survived legal blind sides and we have outlived several LARGER companies. Yep, pretty low. Plus it did not answer the question. I feel I cannot jump in since I am too close to the product and thus might be seen as self serving. What is your excuse? Lonnie On 12/28/06, Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I mean, besides simply being illegal, such a vendor has no quality controls, they can also just up and walk away from you and quit anytime, they have no accountability, and it throws away your investment from an equity standpoint. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Butch Evans Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Patrick Leary wrote: Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? Good idea, Patrick, but it doesn't answer the question that was asked. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Can anyone just answer the questions I had without fighting amongst yourselves? (I thought Xmas with the inlaws was bad!) Lonnie... If I were to buy a StarOS type product, would it be compatable with the CPQ series radios from Tranzeo? What sort of client load should I be able to support on a Star-OS based AP? ryan On Dec 28, 2006, at 10:01 PM, Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: Patrick, This is simply the LOWEST blow I have EVER seen you throw. You have always been an Evangelist and I have seen you come and go from several lists, while me and my people have survived legal blind sides and we have outlived several LARGER companies. Yep, pretty low. Plus it did not answer the question. I feel I cannot jump in since I am too close to the product and thus might be seen as self serving. What is your excuse? Lonnie On 12/28/06, Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I mean, besides simply being illegal, such a vendor has no quality controls, they can also just up and walk away from you and quit anytime, they have no accountability, and it throws away your investment from an equity standpoint. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Butch Evans Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Patrick Leary wrote: Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? Good idea, Patrick, but it doesn't answer the question that was asked. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ * *** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). * *** * *** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). * *** * *** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. * *** -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, D. Ryan Spott wrote: I agree. Other than some *cough*open source*cough*licensing issues*cough* I can see that there is lots that can be done with the Microtik. Open source has nothing to do with it. Mikrotik does adhere to the open source licensing requirement. As for FCC certification, that is another story. I am not aware of anyone who has certified any system that includes a routerboard with a radio/antenna. BUT, the truth of the matter is that the FCC does not go after people who are not operating outside the legal EIRP limits. I am not going to argue the legality of using MT (or starOS) vs other certified systems. I am merely pointing out that Patrick's point regarding certified systems is valid. What works with the Tranzeo CPQ clients? Many things work with this product, including Mikrotik and StarOS. Specifically? What do you use? or what do you see your clients using? What works? Before I go and spend my money on a product, any product, I ask around to see what works and what does not. I am no longer an ISP. When I was, I used Mikrotik as an AP (several deployed), but I never used Tranzeo. I have several customers (some on this list) that use Mikrotik APs with Tranzeo CPE. I'd expect that you may hear from some of them in this thread as well. Either way, Mikrotik as an AP is a stable platform that offers a variety of options well beyond most of the competition, and it does work with Tranzeo products. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Lonnie, Not sure why you are fired up. Your product is software that gets loaded into hardware so I'm not talking about you. I'm talking about illegal hardware and what is untrue about what I said about illegal hardware suppliers? Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lonnie Nunweiler Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 10:02 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Patrick, This is simply the LOWEST blow I have EVER seen you throw. You have always been an Evangelist and I have seen you come and go from several lists, while me and my people have survived legal blind sides and we have outlived several LARGER companies. Yep, pretty low. Plus it did not answer the question. I feel I cannot jump in since I am too close to the product and thus might be seen as self serving. What is your excuse? Lonnie On 12/28/06, Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I mean, besides simply being illegal, such a vendor has no quality controls, they can also just up and walk away from you and quit anytime, they have no accountability, and it throws away your investment from an equity standpoint. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Butch Evans Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Patrick Leary wrote: Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? Good idea, Patrick, but it doesn't answer the question that was asked. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Ryan, I have no personal experience with the Tranzeo line so I cannot answer directly. Through helping people on our Support Forums I know some people have nothing but trouble while others have a really good experience with the CPQ series on our Access Points. I think it all depends on the firmware and hardware version. Sorry to not be able to be more positive for you. Lonnie On 12/28/06, D. Ryan Spott [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Can anyone just answer the questions I had without fighting amongst yourselves? (I thought Xmas with the inlaws was bad!) Lonnie... If I were to buy a StarOS type product, would it be compatable with the CPQ series radios from Tranzeo? What sort of client load should I be able to support on a Star-OS based AP? ryan On Dec 28, 2006, at 10:01 PM, Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: Patrick, This is simply the LOWEST blow I have EVER seen you throw. You have always been an Evangelist and I have seen you come and go from several lists, while me and my people have survived legal blind sides and we have outlived several LARGER companies. Yep, pretty low. Plus it did not answer the question. I feel I cannot jump in since I am too close to the product and thus might be seen as self serving. What is your excuse? Lonnie On 12/28/06, Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I mean, besides simply being illegal, such a vendor has no quality controls, they can also just up and walk away from you and quit anytime, they have no accountability, and it throws away your investment from an equity standpoint. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Butch Evans Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Patrick Leary wrote: Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? Good idea, Patrick, but it doesn't answer the question that was asked. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ * *** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). * *** * *** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). * *** * *** This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. * *** -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
I happen to use his software, and assemble hardware from various vendors, including him. I am scrupulously careful to be within the 2.4 and 5.8 eirp rules ( well under all limits) and don't deploy wild and crazy configs. I suppose I am illegal, but then recently I visited a consultant who had a cisco AP and 1 watt amp and 12 db omni on his roof. That was to overcome the WISP's linksys (I think) router and 1 watt amp and 15 db omni a couple blocks over on their roof...To be lumped into that kind of wild and idiotic (and very illegal) bunch is rather insulting, Patrick... IF someone built a product that would perform anywhere near as well and had anywhere NEAR the features, I might consider buying it.As much as I am intrigued by your VL product, every time I look at it, I remind myself that in order to be even workable, I have to buy and configure a router at the customer's end, because as best I can tell, the CPE is just a bridge as is the AP, which makes a REAL headache at the remote sites where space and power at an extreme premium and are powered by solar or wind or a combination.Another box that has to be maintained, another point of failure, yet another box to configure and install at the customer's end. And then there has to be a router at the AP end, complete with DHCP server, or we do like others, and start screwing around with vlans, etc, in order to overcome the essential features deficit built into things like VL and Trango. When you offer that $230 - $280 client that is certified and has at minimum the following features: Full routing. (both client and AP) Bandwidth control. QOS. Firewalling. DNS server for client's use. DHCP server (both client and AP) Multiple network interfaces (just plug in the rf module for 1 to 4 radios and already contains 1- 4 ethernet ports) bandwidth or data transfer tracking ping and other utilities bandwidth testing from any point to any other point on the network RIP, OSPF, OLSR, BGP capabilities Then you may make things like Mikrotik or Star-OS obsolete.. Until then, you're peddling a half solution to WISP's - or that's how it feels to those of us who have built our networks on them. BTW, you never did answer my questions about how all the neat RF features of VL overcome, help, or prevent various issues. You mentioned a lot of adjustments, but did not explain what the effect of these things are on the things we see that affect our similar networks - if you can muck with them, but they don't do what we think we need, or if we don't understand what they can accomplish... then reciting the list amounts to ball joints as an advanced feature of a Ferarri... +++ neofast.net - fast internet for North East Oregon and South East Washington email me at mark at neofast dot net 541-969-8200 Direct commercial inquiries to purchasing at neofast dot net - Original Message - From: Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 10:18 PM Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Lonnie, Not sure why you are fired up. Your product is software that gets loaded into hardware so I'm not talking about you. I'm talking about illegal hardware and what is untrue about what I said about illegal hardware suppliers? Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lonnie Nunweiler Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 10:02 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Patrick, This is simply the LOWEST blow I have EVER seen you throw. You have always been an Evangelist and I have seen you come and go from several lists, while me and my people have survived legal blind sides and we have outlived several LARGER companies. Yep, pretty low. Plus it did not answer the question. I feel I cannot jump in since I am too close to the product and thus might be seen as self serving. What is your excuse? Lonnie On 12/28/06, Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I mean, besides simply being illegal, such a vendor has no quality controls, they can also just up and walk away from you and quit anytime, they have no accountability, and it throws away your investment from an equity standpoint. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Butch Evans Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Patrick Leary wrote: Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? Good idea, Patrick
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Mark Koskenmaki wrote: IF someone built a product that would perform anywhere near as well and had anywhere NEAR the features, I might consider buying it. As much as I am intrigued by your VL product, every time I look at it, I remind myself that in order to be even workable, I have to buy and configure a router at the customer's end, because as best I can tell, the CPE is just a bridge as is Mark, You and I have been at odds on several topics, but this is, in my opinion, one of the most overlooked requirements of a good CPE installation. It is my contention (and yours, it seems) that a router at the CPE is necessary. I only wanted to say that, because I so rarely have a chance to agree with you. ;-) -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
We never used the TRCPQ, but we do have several hundred TRCPEs and TRCPE200s. We have 3 Access points with ~50 clients each- a combination of TRCPE, CPE200, and DemarcTech units. This handles well. If I remember correctly, the TRCPE is Atheros based(?) and I would think that it should work ever better than the TRCPE200 (Prism-based; which have sometimes been troublesome when one gets flaky) in combination with an Atheros based StarOS AP. All of our StarOS APs are Atheros based - either CM9, SR2, or WLM54G. Really no problems, and any that we've had we have overcome by tracking down some bad CPEs. We have a total of about 300 2.4Ghz clients, and about a dozen 5.8 clients. -Nick D. Ryan Spott wrote: Can anyone just answer the questions I had without fighting amongst yourselves? (I thought Xmas with the inlaws was bad!) Lonnie... If I were to buy a StarOS type product, would it be compatable with the CPQ series radios from Tranzeo? What sort of client load should I be able to support on a Star-OS based AP? ryan On Dec 28, 2006, at 10:01 PM, Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: Patrick, This is simply the LOWEST blow I have EVER seen you throw. You have always been an Evangelist and I have seen you come and go from several lists, while me and my people have survived legal blind sides and we have outlived several LARGER companies. Yep, pretty low. Plus it did not answer the question. I feel I cannot jump in since I am too close to the product and thus might be seen as self serving. What is your excuse? Lonnie On 12/28/06, Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I mean, besides simply being illegal, such a vendor has no quality controls, they can also just up and walk away from you and quit anytime, they have no accountability, and it throws away your investment from an equity standpoint. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Butch Evans Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Patrick Leary wrote: Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? Good idea, Patrick, but it doesn't answer the question that was asked. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ --WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- --- | Nick White | | Network Administrator | | Tele-NET Internet | | http://www.tele-net.net | | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | --- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Lonnie, you are just doing what I wish I were smart enough to do -- write code people are willing to pay for. Software is always better than hardware: you avoid FCC hassles, you have no hard shipping or packaging costs, you need no production facilities, you don't have to negotiate purchase of and stock components, you can live anywhere, it can be instantly deployed, etc., etc. I've nothing but respect for what you've done. For all the same reasons, I'd think you were insane if you went into hardware in this business. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lonnie Nunweiler Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 10:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Seemed kind close to my home is all. All the Best in 2007. Lonnie This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Butch Evans wrote: It is my contention (and yours, it seems) that a router at the CPE is necessary. BINGO. Qwest DSL has a router at every customer. Ever taken a look at what those Actiontec wireless dsl routers do... As we stated in an earlier thread, those pesky routers matter more than our cpes, to the customer. -- George Rogato Welcome to WISPA www.wispa.org http://signup.wispa.org/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Correction. It's late, I'm tired, and have had too much wine. I meant that the TRCPQ is Atheros based, not TRCPE. This is from a Tranzeo list: The CPE90 is Marvell. The 900, the CPQ, the 6000, the 49, and the 5a are all Atheros based. The CPE200, the 1000, 2000, 3000 and 4000 were Prism based. The CPE80 was Atmel. -Damian Wallace Also, if you decide to go the StarOS/Mikrotik way, make sure you upgrade all of your Tranzeo gear to the latest firmwares. -Nick N White wrote: We never used the TRCPQ, but we do have several hundred TRCPEs and TRCPE200s. We have 3 Access points with ~50 clients each- a combination of TRCPE, CPE200, and DemarcTech units. This handles well. If I remember correctly, the TRCPE is Atheros based(?) and I would think that it should work ever better than the TRCPE200 (Prism-based; which have sometimes been troublesome when one gets flaky) in combination with an Atheros based StarOS AP. All of our StarOS APs are Atheros based - either CM9, SR2, or WLM54G. Really no problems, and any that we've had we have overcome by tracking down some bad CPEs. We have a total of about 300 2.4Ghz clients, and about a dozen 5.8 clients. -Nick D. Ryan Spott wrote: Can anyone just answer the questions I had without fighting amongst yourselves? (I thought Xmas with the inlaws was bad!) Lonnie... If I were to buy a StarOS type product, would it be compatable with the CPQ series radios from Tranzeo? What sort of client load should I be able to support on a Star-OS based AP? ryan On Dec 28, 2006, at 10:01 PM, Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: Patrick, This is simply the LOWEST blow I have EVER seen you throw. You have always been an Evangelist and I have seen you come and go from several lists, while me and my people have survived legal blind sides and we have outlived several LARGER companies. Yep, pretty low. Plus it did not answer the question. I feel I cannot jump in since I am too close to the product and thus might be seen as self serving. What is your excuse? Lonnie On 12/28/06, Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I mean, besides simply being illegal, such a vendor has no quality controls, they can also just up and walk away from you and quit anytime, they have no accountability, and it throws away your investment from an equity standpoint. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Butch Evans Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 9:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... On Thu, 28 Dec 2006, Patrick Leary wrote: Why not stick with Tranzeo or one of the other legal (FCC-certified) brands? Good idea, Patrick, but it doesn't answer the question that was asked. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ Mikrotik Certified Consultant (http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html) -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ --WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- --- | Nick White | | Network Administrator | | Tele-NET Internet
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Then you must not be aware that Lonnie is now also selling the complete package. The newest product is Star V3, Atheros cm9 and a gateworks customized board to Lonnies specs. It's called the WAR board, or Wireless Advanced Router. They come in 2 flavors, a 4 port 533MHz proc or a 2 port 266MHz proc, both with 2 ethernets. Can do 5, 10, 20,,40MHz channel widths. I have better than 200 maybe 250 by now WAR boards in place with Pac Wireless Rootennas both 5 gig and 2 gig. Recently I built a new pop using a water tank. My transfer rate from the tank to my house gave me just under 30megs ftp across that link using a pair of 266's. Most of the links I put in are 5 gig and I use the 2nd port for a 2 gig wifi ap for the immediate area. I can honestly say that I can not remember having to reboot any of my war boards and 20 megs is not uncommon across my wireless man. George Patrick Leary wrote: Lonnie, you are just doing what I wish I were smart enough to do -- write code people are willing to pay for. Software is always better than hardware: you avoid FCC hassles, you have no hard shipping or packaging costs, you need no production facilities, you don't have to negotiate purchase of and stock components, you can live anywhere, it can be instantly deployed, etc., etc. I've nothing but respect for what you've done. For all the same reasons, I'd think you were insane if you went into hardware in this business. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lonnie Nunweiler Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 10:32 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Seemed kind close to my home is all. All the Best in 2007. Lonnie This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- George Rogato Welcome to WISPA www.wispa.org http://signup.wispa.org/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Right guys, I accept all that may be true but even in the DSL world, customers provide their own routers and that is certainly true of commercial customers. In any event, VL does many of things for which you think make a router so critical. Even better, it does a lot of them at the RF level which makes the link and total network more efficient. Frankly though, I need one of my engineers in this type conversation; I'm just not technically competent enough on the networking side (and barely so in the nitty gritty of the RF side). At the same token, many here that are truly skilled remain under exposed on the RF side since most have not used truly sophisticated gear that allows for depths of tweaking beyond that which you have experienced. I have never encountered an old hand who, once thoroughly exposed to our firmware in a scaled system, did not say something along the lines of, Wow, I did not know that sort of thing could be even be done! or You mean that's all we have to do to do that? That always took me hours before! Basically, I think many of you have trained and become good street racers, but you've not yet become real race car drivers because you are still driving souped up street cars not realizing a real race car actually IS different. Patrick Leary AVP WISP Markets Alvarion, Inc. o: 650.314.2628 c: 760.580.0080 Vonage: 650.641.1243 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of George Rogato Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 11:25 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients... Butch Evans wrote: It is my contention (and yours, it seems) that a router at the CPE is necessary. BINGO. Qwest DSL has a router at every customer. Ever taken a look at what those Actiontec wireless dsl routers do... As we stated in an earlier thread, those pesky routers matter more than our cpes, to the customer. -- George Rogato Welcome to WISPA www.wispa.org http://signup.wispa.org/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(190). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses(43). This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals computer viruses. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS or Microtik with TRCPQ clients...
Patrick Leary wrote: Right guys, I accept all that may be true but even in the DSL world, customers provide their own routers and that is certainly true of commercial customers. Not in the Qwest DSL world. at least the resi stuff they sell. Comes with an actiontec or 2wire wireless router with 4 ports and a built in dsl modem. Complete deal the Qwest technician can log into if they need to. All the customer has to do is plug in or wireless connect. Understood that commercial connections wouldn't want that type of a router. Point is, the trend is and rightly so, to get as close to the customer as possible to idiot proof their connectivity. Thus, the quality router. I bet even wisps who use your gear for resi have had issues and lost customers because of the confusion of where responsibility lies concerning the router. -- George Rogato Welcome to WISPA www.wispa.org http://signup.wispa.org/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
