--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, wa6epd lme...@... wrote:
Wondering if anyone has found a source for the memory backup battery for the
Motorola R2600 Service Monitor?
Motorola says the part is obsolete and General Dynamics is doing some research,
but it doesn't sound good.
This one
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Matthew Kaufman matt...@... wrote:
Reducing the modulation index and simultaneously reducing the receiver
bandwidth from 5 to 2.5 kHz results in a situation which requires ~6 db more
signal level for the same demodulated quality (ex. 12db SINAD)
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, MCH m...@... wrote:
I would agree with the quality issues, but does that really equate to
unintelligibility on any significant scale?
-
Use of the term 'quality' is based on
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Andrew Seybold aseyb...@... wrote:
The new repeaters are exactly the same at the older ones, and the older ones
are capable of being converted to narrowband with programming, all Motorola and
the all are in simulcast mode, we have plotted the
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Matthew Kaufman matt...@... wrote:
Correct. Which is also why measuring DAQ equivalent this way is pretty much
useless for anyplace that has substantial terrain (hills and mountains) or
even reflective urban structures that aren't in the center of
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, petedcur...@... wrote:
If you chose to go digital, like P25 then you could also measure BER in your
coverage test? This maybe more meaningful. Although many public safety
customers will still ask for voice checks as well.
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, skipp025 skipp...@... wrote:
...
I've not heard this model U, C, Clip Nut ever called a Tinnerman ...
---
The ones Motorola uses carry the Tinnerman logo and the designation 14Z.
http://www.surplussales.com/Relays/rfcoaxialrelays/rfcoax_n.html
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Fred Seamans seaman...@... wrote:
To All: I am still trying to locate a Coaxial Relay with a 12 vdc coil and
either N or UHF connectors.
Please contact me off net if you have one
If you are attempting to verify a manufacturer's specification, the TIA-603
procedure should be used. If you are serious about that, you should probably
acquire TSB-88 in addition to TIA-603.
Here is a link to a presentation that discusses adjacent channel testing and
explains the roles of
.
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Tim tahr...@... wrote:
Hi Nj902,
Well, I'm not trying to be exacting in the measurement, I'm just trying to
track down a desense issue in the system. I figured I'd look at how
the receiver does with the adjacent
Tim,
It appears to me that your measurement procedure is correct - and that the
results you have gotten would normally be sufficient isolation to allow
desense-free duplex operation.
If you have some attenuators available - or better yet - a switchable [in 1 dB
increments] attenuator - there
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, David Jordan wa3...@... wrote:
... I think D-STAR will end up like Quadraphonic sound.just a matter of time.
..
Agreed. D-Star had the misfortune to roll out just ahead of the
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Chris Curtis demo...@... wrote:
... Easy with the laserdisk now ;)
I still have a nice collection here...
--
I also have a Lasterdisk collection! [and a working player] - and D-Star and
P25
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, wmhpowell w...@... wrote:
I'm looking for some Quantar engineering level help re: an interesting
simulcast issue.
...
Thanks,
Bill Powell
--
When you say this system was set up and installed
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Doug Hutchison specialq@...
wrote:
Their??? English therethey're ...get the right one!
--
Just remember:
The Smiths are going to Chicago on vacation.
They're going to drive there in their
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Mike Morris wa6i...@... wrote:
Did you look at the Test Equipment page at www.repeater-builder.com ?
Mike WA6ILQ
-
404 Not Found The requested URL
In fact there are defined tests for real world performance of the various
formats [with the exception of the amateur D-Star format]
The commercial land mobile industry has great interest in understanding the
operational characteristics of all of the current and emerging formats and
protocols,
The alignment procedure for this filter is part of the UHF Transmitter section
in the UHF Base and Repeater Station manual [e.g. 68P81061E55-C].
If you look at the schematic for the exciter [e.g. PEPS-37344-C covering
TLE5502A simplex / TLE5512B duplex] you will find within the bandpass filter
Answers to most of the Mototrbo questions can be found in the Mototrbo System
Planner.
Here is some information on color codes and groups copied from that document:
Color codes are defined by the Digital Mobile Radio (DMR) standard and can be
used to separate two or more MOTOTRBO digital radio
The current version of the Planner document discusses the Capacity Plus
[trunking] and IP Site Connect modes.
This document carries part number 6880309T12-H and is available at MOL where it
appears to have been posted 11 Feb 2010. There are several new Mototrbo
documents there - some posted
For the technically inclined reader:
http://www.dmrassociation.org/what-is-dmr.htm
It should also be noted that he is planning a system with voting receivers. It
is very possible that these receivers will improve the talk-in sufficiently
that the system will be talk-out limited even with 200 Watts.
-
---
There are at least a couple of easy ways you can do this.
First, you can program one wildcard output for RX PL DETECT and a second
wildcard output for RX CAR DET. Connect both of those to your external
controller and let it decide when or if both are necessary.
A second method would be to
We have a DB224 antenna that may need to be replaced. It is configured for an
offset pattern [all the loops point the same way] The replacement antenna
should be capable of the same pattern.
An engineer with a local communications company has told me that his experience
with recently
If those are recent imported ones - that's good to know. If they are older
ones - it is irrelevant.
--
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Rick wb9...@... wrote:
I AM USING A DB 264 and 224's NEVER HAD an issue with
Three Quantars and an MTR are likely to cost you something in the neighborhood
of $50,000.00.
You would normally purchase these items from a Motorola dealer. Ask your
account rep to get you the Motorola product planner documents. These will
explain the options and ordering configurations.
I
...Maybe there's a whole stash of ham-band Micors sitting in a government
warehouse somewhere. Maybe Area 51? --- Jeff WN3A
---
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Jim Brown w5...@... wrote:
Nah - we used GE.
73 - Jim W5ZIT
The VHF MTR2000 comes in three versions capable of transmit powers of 30, 40,
or 100 Watts.
The 30 and 40 Watt transmitters cover 132-174 as does the receiver in all
three, but the 100 Watt transmitter comes in two ranges: 132-154 MHz and
150-174 MHz.
The 100 Watt 150-174 transmitter can't be
As much good as the ARRL does in representing amateur radio and creating some
fine publications, they have certainly been a disappointment when it comes to
VHF/UHF FM, repeaters, and digital voice.
For example, the guys on the 900 list had some band plan questions and
contacted the ARRL World
Motorola's 900 MHz Hear-Clear product is different from other manufacturers'
audio improvement technologies because it combines companding with a patented
second feature known as Flutter-Fighter which rapidly varies IF gain in
response to flutter induced by Rayleigh fading.
For VHF and UHF
If you are referring to the 2.5 KHz steps - that's necessary so the radio can
be programmed on whatever frequency is necessary due to the variety of band
plans and channel spacings. That doesn't mean that in any one geography there
is any intent to have adjacent channel operations 2.5KHz
Numbers 1 or 4 are the more likely.
He has a Quantar which is designed to live in high RF environments at antenna
sites making #2 unlikely. Also, with respect to #3, the Quantar PA has a
built in circulator as standard equipment.
...Since there is NO two PL's the same, the problem went away...
The problem [intermod] did not go away - you just masked it so you don't hear
it. It is still causing degradation of the receiver's effective sensitivity.
There shouldn't be anything about running in P25 digital mode that would make a
Quantar any more prone to desense than it would be in analog.
Quantar is a high tier product with low TX sideband noise and an excellent
receiver. I have run Quantars at 600 KHz split on 2 meters with only a 4 can
It is best to keep those mice out of sight at your site or else pest control
might cite you.
---
The evil mice decided to waunder in to my repeater sight.
Not to discourage you from building, but an easy, low cost solution to MDC
decoding is to find a used Motorola B1666 or B1667 desktop signaling unit. In
addition to a built in display, these units have an RS232 port which can log
the MDC events to a printer or to an attached PC running a
Jeff,
What an excellent tutorial. This should be a permanent article on the
Repeater-buiilder site!
Adding some pictures of the various crimp tools and the crimping process would
make it complete.
BTW - for those looking to buy one of these tools - although the Daniels HX4
and Kings
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Jared ke4...@... wrote:
Anybody got a source for the large capacitors (65000 and 12 uf) in MSF
station power supplies?
-
For comparison, the Motorola parts are:
2382681N01, 64000uf, $42.84
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Robert Pease r...@... wrote:
What can people tell me about these
Any good on 2 meters. What's a good price for one?
The Quantar has been Motorola's top of the line infrastructure
The Quantar SAM FRU part number is TLN3364.
It probably won't come with documentation so you'll want 6881127E40.
The Quantar SAM RSS is RVN4110.
Getting the staion configured correctly with SAM and wildcard programming is
not something you want to attempt at the average tower site. You'll do
I'll post the numbers tomorrow.
-
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, rahwayflynn mafl...@... wrote:
1K is for the SAM option is less then half the cost of using a Zetron HEAR
decoder. Might you have part numbers so I
Unfortunately, a Quantar has no intrinsic ability to decode DTMF unless it is
equipped with a SAM option.
SAM = Station Access Module.
With the SAM option you can do exactly what you want with a combination of SAM
and wildcard programming.
The SAM option can be retrofitted in the field.
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, N9WYS n9...@... wrote:
I left Saturday afternoon, mainly because I'd spent my allocations of money -
but more so because I was staying at Motel Hell. ...
---
The Super Inn in Lewisburg? Ugh.
I would hope no one flames you for wanting to design your own digital repeater
- that's in the spirit of amateur radio and repeater-building.
I don't think the Motorola manuals will be much help since all the
'heavy-lifiting' is done in software inside of DSP chips. Some products from
other
R09.07 is the last distributed revision of release 9 of the Quantar RSS. As
such, it is OK to use it to program a station with any of the release 9
versions of firmware [or earlier].
Based on your production date, I suspect your station will have a newer release
firmware. If it does, you
First, to clarify, the Quantar has no built-in A-to-D capability [IMBE
VOCODER], hence it isn't possible to directly interface an analog device to a
Quantar and pass traffic to digital users.
This requires an additional device known as a DIU [Digital Interface Unit]
This device was availabe
You are correct - the programming is done through a serial connection to a
9-pin PC serial port - no RIB is required. This is normally done through the
port on the front of the station.
Earlier RSS versions run in DOS, so only a simple computer is required. Newer
versions of the software run
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Chuck Kelsey wb2...@... wrote:
... it might be interesting to see results of a sweep using some feedline
attached to the antenna. I have to wonder what impact it may (or may not) have.
...
---
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Bob M. msf5kg...@... wrote:
... The MSF5000 squelch is a single-level noise-based squelch system, much
like the MaxTrac and most mobile radios. The squelch-tail duration is fixed.
...
.
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Joe Serocki
joesero...@... wrote:
Anyone have a manual? ...
-
ebay
10 bucks
350158994897
Just search for R56 , that is Motorola's document titled: QUALITY
STANDARDS Fixed Network Equipment Installations
It is available from Motorola for about a hundred bucks in either
printed form or on a CD. [6881089E50 hard copy, 9880384V83 CD]
Pretty much the entire two-way industry, including
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, wd8chl wd8...@... wrote:
I absolutely do. There's a TON of non-narrowbandable equipment in
use, and we're not just talking about Micor/MastrII vintage
equipment. Maxtacs, MSF's, even early Quantars ...
Motorola had two factory options that would allow control of the
MSF5000 station, the DTMF decoder and the SAM [Station Access
Module].
The SAM card can respond to DTMF, MDC, and other signaling formats
and is the most versatile. It was also referred to as the Smart
Wildcard. Unfortunately,
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Bob M. msf5kg...@...
wrote:
I believe the Motorola DTMF decoder resides in an expansion
chassis. ... As you said, both are rare and none of the stations I
need to control have an expansion chassis.
... The other suggestions, while innovative, don't
The original factory design specification for the MSF5000 PL deviation
is 800 Hz. That is just slightly greater than the 750 Hz. mid point
in the acceptable range of 500 Hz to 1000 Hz as given in TIA-603.
One issue that can cause the PL level to be incorrect is failure to
properly perform the
The technical data for the UHF MSR2000 duplexers is contained in a
section of the UHF station manual, 68-81061E55, behind the OPTIONS
tab.
This section was not included in the original -O release of the
manual but is definitely in newer manuals such as the -C version.
The MSR2000 duplexer
The DB4003 is a three cavity bandpass duplexer with a specified
operating range of 148 to 174 MHz and a TX to RX separation of 5 MHz
or more.
With 30 dB of suppression in the one cavity branch and 50 dB of
suppression in the two cavity branch, even at five MHz of separation,
this unit would
Naahhh
In TIA-603-C paragraph 1.3.5.3 is in the Definitions section not
in the Standards section.
1.3.5.3 refers to the Definition of the standard test modulation.
The correct section for the actual Standard is under:
Standards for All Equipment
3.4.17, Transmitter Subaudible Deviation
There is a special RSS for the MSR2000 that will let you put it on any
frequency you want.
You don't even need to sign a license agreement. Just call
International Crystal. They can 'reprogram' the
MSR2000 'synthesizers' for you. ;)
For those who have a Unidapt kit, there is a product similar to the
FXR coupler available from RF Industries.
The RF Industries variable signal sampler is rated from 20-3000 MHz,
500 Watts power, 20-80 dB coupling. This device comes with type 'N'
connectors which can be changed using the RF
MSR2000 far superior to the Mastr II ?
Nah.
I'm a Motorola kind of guy and I sure wouldn't make that statement.
They are both capable of excellent performance so unless you need to
replace your Mastr II gear because of equipment failures / problems
you really wouldn't see any performance
Your data polarity might be inverted.
--
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, essexsaxo [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
... I have been trying to send some POCSAG Data through an Icom
F1010 ...
It isn't about the radios - it's about systems.
The Tyco rep was bashing Motorola because the EDACS platform supports
analog talkgroups and/or digital talkgroups as desired by the system
administrator whereas the latest Motorola systems - Smartzone 6.X and
7.X are P25 standards based and are
http://www.sigintdf.com/rfcat09.htm
John's contact information is on his web site.
--
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, kk2ed [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
... I should have picked up a few more of these ...
C75CXB7106AT is a 75 Watt secure capable repeater station. It
operates in the 800 band, 806-825 MHz receive, 851-870 MHz transmit.
If your application is 800 MHz commercial, you're good to go. If you
were looking for a station for a 900 ham project - keep looking.
A comparable 900 MSF model
There are several choices available at WW Grainger, some in the $20
range.
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/categories/electrical/relays/time-
delay-relays
-
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Thomas Oliver
[EMAIL
A few more observations.
A couple of years back I became interested in noise, noise figure,
etc. It all started with a noise problem [affecting a repeater of
course] I did some research, conducted tests, scratched my head, etc.
I even acquired an Agilent [HP] noise figure meter a couple of
The pictures are of a 'D' model. Within each 2001 series there were
various model numbers [e.g. R2014D] which indicated the options that
were installed.
As others have indicated, the 'D' models are the best of the 2001
series. There are actually three major variants of the 'D' series.
The
Andrew has a technical paper that compares Heliax to braid-foil cables
at:
http://www.andrew.com/search/BN_SP30-27.aspx
--
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Bryon Jeffers KØBSJ
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
...I just need a
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Eric Lemmon [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
I think you may have overlooked the fact that desense was observed
even when a dummy load was connected directly to the output of the
duplexer. That pretty much eliminates anything external to the
repeater itself,
This question has initiated an interesting exchange of ideas. Many
good suggestions have been provided.
The fact that the desensitization exists when operating duplex on
either of two antennas, or when using split antennas, combined with
the results of the other tests [minimal desensitization
This sort of behavior is far from normal for an MSF - thus it would
seem that you should look for a problem in your station such as off
frequency, skewed IF response, noisy RX VCO, etc.
If your tests have been conducted using a mobile or portable to
initiate the test transmissions, I suggest
It appears that your amplifier is doing what you should expect.
An amplifier's power handling capability, compression point, etc. are
rated based on amplification of a single sinusoid. When multiple
signals are present at the amplifier input, the total output power of
the amplifier does not
No - not the same VOCODER. IMBE is a VOCODER. VSELP is a VOCODER -
different from and incompatible with IMBE.
Early Motorola digital radios were sold with Motorola's Astro
proprietary digital voice format which uses the VSELP VOCODER. After
APCO released the P25 standard using the IMBE
I don't see why not.
Hams all over the country are experimenting with a variety of
digital voice formats including D-Star, P25, AOR, FDMDV, and
Mototrbo TDMA. If some of these are only available from one
manufacturer - so what?
See: http://www.hamradio-dv.org/
Since this list is not for
It's not so much that isolators cause intermod. They generate
harmonics. For this reason, an isolator is always followed by a
bandpass or low pass filter in commercial applications where good
engineering practice is followed.
See:
The major radio system suppliers such as Motorola and MaCom have been
building these systems successfully for a number of years. They have
the engineers, design tools, and products to deal with signal
distribution, site separation, multipath, phasing, inter-symbol
interference, carrier
The T-Pass UHF transmitter multicoupler [e.g. 73-67-25-2C-03] from TX-
RX systems uses cavity-ferrite technology and can combine two
transmitters at a separation of only 75 KHz. The loss ... is
comparable to that of a hybrid combiner, but T-Pass provides the
benefit of cavity selectivity for
Quantar 101:
Introduction to Wildcard programming.
If you are going to attempt to utilize Quantar wildcard functions you
must first arm yourself with the necessary manuals. A good starting
point is the Station Instruction Manual, 6881095E05. There are two
sections in this manual that are of
There is no such thing as a Quantar wildcard as a discrete board
the way there is a wildcard board for Micor, MSR2000, and MSF5000
stations.
The Quantar wildcard functions are software defined in the
station's programming. Inputs and outputs [hardware I/O] can be
part of what you create in
I will offer a couple of points for your consideration.
Think about your application a little.
How often will you use it?
Are you a test equipment nut or are you intimidated by lots of
bells
and whistles?
Will you take it into the field a lot?
Will you service the unit yourself?
How
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Jeff DePolo [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
I'm caught in a time warp in Philadelphia.
Time is still unstable there 64 years later?
Your callsign comes back as being in Ft Dodge, Iowa. If this is
accurate, you have an opportunity approaching. The ARRL Iowa State
Convention and 3900 Club Hamboree is in two weeks at Sioux City.
http://www.3900club.com
There should be a meeting there of the Iowa Repeater Council.
When you say TDR, if you are referring to an instrument such as a
Tektronix 1502, there probably isn't going to be a definitive
TDR image for you to compare to.
TDR's do an excellent job of determining the length of a transmission
line or the distance to an open or short. Because they do this
B.S.
There is no such thing as a SpectraTrac.
The name Consolette is often used to describe this product due to a
long history of previous Motorola Consolette products, however, the
actual name used by Motorola in their product literature, e.g. RC-13-
8(30A), and service manuals, e.g.
DARCOM stands for Distribution Automation Radio Communication System
It is a Motorola SCADA product circa late 1980's. It is
synthesized. The operating frequency information is contained in a
PROM [externally programmed]. The synthesizer manual section,
6802938G73 contains a complete
Motorola introduced the Station Access Module [SAM] as an option for
the CXB MSF5000 stations. Programming capability for that option was
incorporated into the MSF5000 RSS.
The SAM option was subsequently added to the Quantar station's
capability, however, the Quantar RSS cannot program the
Allied Electronic stock numbers 920-5010 (for red), and 920-5014 (for
black).
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Don [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I have a Motorola Bench Test power Supply Model R-1011 AA 40 Volt 40
Amp at
You can use a sweep generator and scope for swept alignment of
filters and duplexers. The manual for your sweeper should show the
setup procedure.
If you don't have the manual, try BAMA or other internet sites.
You will need an RF detector probe or preferably a detector such as
the HP 423A
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Nate Duehr [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
... Uhhh... just checking here, but didn't he say the one he took out
was melted?...
-
Uhhh ...Nate, what he said was: I removed a cap from a working
If you decide to expand your search for an instrument to include
established brands, there have been three companies in the handheld
spectrum analyzer market that build quality products: Anritsu,
Rohde Schwarz, and Wiltek.
Agilent has also just introduced a handheld unit, but it is
It is probably a Johanson piston trimmer capacitor like this ebay
item: 7626236572
They are available on the surplus market; try Bob at Surplussales of
Nebraska.
Measure the one you took out on a cap bridge to see what value you
need.
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, JOHN MACKEY [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
I'll bet they are VERY large and have POOR receiver sensitivity
(like .8 uV).
-
Sorry, but you've got your head stuck in the 60's. Those old
The Pulsar mobile phone is not a 1969 product, they were produced from
the late 1970's through the 1980's.
These drawer units make good raw materials for building repeaters.
They can be had for next to nothing or even for free, so you can build
a complete repeater for lunch money. Much of
If you look in the MSF service manual at the section for the battery
revert power supply, you will find that it has an output signal
called AC FAIL [active low] which is connected from the power supply
to the station control tray through the station's interconnect board.
This control signal is
You mentioned that the site's noise floor is pretty low.
Could you be more specific about that and how it was measured?
The usual method of determination of the site noise floor is to
measure the receiver's effective sensitivity using an RF coupler
such as the Microlab FXR or Bird devices that
There are only two pins on J812 that are necessary to make the
programming cable: GND [Pin 1] and IPCB [Pin 6]
Pin 6 is on the right as you view the station control tray from the
front.
You can verify that - measure the two pins with a high impedance
voltmeter. The IPCB pin will have voltage
The fact that most service monitors stop at 1 GHz or 500 MHz is
probably one obstacle to more use of the 1.2 GHz band. There are
some pieces of test equipment becoming available at moderate prices,
so that may change.
It sounds like your immediate interest is receiver testing. Some 2
GHz
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
...De-emphasized audio is, of course, flat audio. There is no tilt
in its response
--
Huh???
De-emphasized audio has a tilted frequency response BY DEFINITION!
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
... Our system takes flat audio in and delivers flat audio out...
You make my point. You say Our system You are a controller guy.
Your controller is your perspective. But that is actually a device
perspective.
Your device
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