[Zope-CMF] Re: ToolInit deprecation warnings

2005-07-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Note that Plone does this all over the place, and we probably won't change it for 2.1. 2.1.1 maybe... Martin Hi Jens. It clearly says 'parameter' as you have pointed out. Must be tired, sorry. I'll look for these products and make the changes. Many thanks. Regards, David On

[Zope-CMF] Re: [Plone-developers] Re: How many copies of plone are in memory?

2005-07-28 Thread Martin Aspeli
Trying-not-to-sound-patronizing-ly, Stefan Liar. :) Martin -- (muted) ___ Zope-CMF maillist - Zope-CMF@lists.zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-cmf See http://collector.zope.org/CMF for bug reports and feature requests

[Zope-CMF] Re: Re: Plone participation in the CMF list

2005-08-02 Thread Martin Aspeli
The general mindset of most Plone developers, as I perceive it from the CMF side, seems to be one of I'm in Plone code, and I know what to do here, and I don't need to look beyond my world. Very few developers have a broader view and even think of pushing generic functionality or even

[Zope-CMF] Retaining ease of customisation

2005-11-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi all, First of all, a couple of apologies: for the cross-post, but I think this concerns all these groups; for my ignorance: I'm only starting to scratch the surface of Z3, via Five, coming from Plone; and for dragging this out again. However, I think this is important.; and maybe for

[Zope-CMF] Re: Meld2, was Re: Proposal for hooking rendering

2005-11-30 Thread Martin Aspeli
It's a lot looser than knowing the whole DOM. You just need to know the IDs. And in some cases, only when an id is used in multiple places, you will need to know the id of its parent. That's the only mental model you need. You don't need to have any idea what the tags are or how the page

[Zope-CMF] Re: CMF 1.6 change broke Plone compatibility

2005-12-20 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi, The following checkin on the 1.6 branch, which looks like a pure cleanup item, completely breaks Plone 2.1 and up on CMF 1.6. I assume that was not the intention. http://svn.zope.org/CMF/branches/1.6/CMFCore/TypesTool.py? rev=40364r1=40360r2=40364 Do you know how it breaks Plone,

[Zope-CMF] Re: Re: CMF 1.6 change broke Plone compatibility

2005-12-20 Thread Martin Aspeli
That CMFDynamicViewFTI doohickey (no idea what that is, really, but Plone needs it for some reason) tries to import typeClasses from CMFCore.TypesTool and add information about itself to it. See fti.py module. Ah. :) CMFDVFTI (say that ten times fast, would'ya) is what powers the

[Zope-CMF] Re: CMF 1.6 change broke Plone compatibility

2005-12-20 Thread Martin Aspeli
Unless someone fixes that CMFDynamicsomethingFTI thing (or the CMF 1.6 branch) people cannot even attempt to run Plone 2.1 or 2.2 against CMF 1.6. This is like a stalemate. Can you suggest how to add a new kind of factory information class similar to appending it to that typeClasses

[Zope-CMF] Re: CMF 1.6 change broke Plone compatibility

2005-12-22 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: I think this brings up the need for a slightly more formalized planning and release process. Given the requisite backing by at least the main developers (meaning their agreement that they would actually use such a thing) I'd like to set up a release plan page on

[Zope-CMF] Re: The components of Archetypes

2006-01-09 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Mon, 09 Jan 2006 14:29:06 -, Rocky Burt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi all, Sorry about the cross post, but I thought this topic concerned CMF, Plone, and Archetypes equally. I had a discussion with Alec Mitchell recently where we talked about the components that made up Archetypes and

[Zope-CMF] Re: CMF 2.0 Release Status

2006-01-12 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Wed, 11 Jan 2006 18:42:08 -, Tres Seaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 First, many thanks to all who have contributed toe the CMF 2.0 effort! I'd like to review the current status of a number of the CMF 2.0 roadmap items, and ask for feedback

[Zope-CMF] Re: [Plone-developers] Re: Re: The components of Archetypes

2006-01-13 Thread Martin Aspeli
So let's play with the idea of using plone_schemas instead of Archetypes for a moment. How does it compare? Off the top of my head, how does it support: ... I really don't know why Opera has taken to posting my messages thre times (at least it shows up three times here), but there you

[Zope-CMF] Re: [Plone-developers] Re: Re: The components of Archetypes

2006-01-13 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Fri, 13 Jan 2006 20:56:21 -, Rocky Burt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - Ability to make custom views easily Customizing views happens with overrides.zcml today. No plone_schemas required. This should work for widget customizations as well. Obviously as we've all discussed this needs a

[Zope-CMF] Re: Re: [Plone-developers] Re: Re: The components of Archetypes

2006-01-14 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi Alec, I see that plone_schemas covers most of what I was asking about, which is great :) I took a look at plone_schemas' example type. I can't get it to install (Zope won't start, some conflict of versions, I'm sure), but looking at the code, I notice that you - Derive from

[Zope-CMF] Re: CMF 2.0 Release Status

2006-01-15 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi, On Wed, 11 Jan 2006 18:42:08 -, Tres Seaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'd like to review the current status of a number of the CMF 2.0 roadmap items, and ask for feedback from the community on how they fit into a near-term release of a beta for CMF 2.0. In fact, I would like to

[Zope-CMF] Re: Re: RFC: backporting including python-package-product support to support Zope 2.8

2006-01-17 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Mon, 16 Jan 2006 11:41:23 -, Martijn Faassen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How urgent is it that all of this works with Zope 2.8? I guess it's urgent if you want to sell it to the Plone community, which will only switch to Zope 2.9 or beyond by next year or so, I expect. How much more

[Zope-CMF] Re: RFC: backporting including python-package-product support to support Zope 2.8

2006-01-17 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Mon, 16 Jan 2006 15:50:44 -, whit [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In actuality, the number of products that anyone depends on will not be using this in 2.8, but making it available to 2.8 will give people an opportunity to use this and familiarize themselves. for example, Plone will be on

[Zope-CMF] Re: RFC: backporting including python-package-product support to support Zope 2.8

2006-01-17 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Mon, 16 Jan 2006 14:37:41 -, Rocky Burt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think there are two reasons Plone 2.5 is targetting CMF 1.6 (instead of just going to CMF 2.0) 1) the risk that CMF 2.0 wouldn't be ready when plone -- and I'm pretty sure the 6 month release rule has already been

[Zope-CMF] Forcing a workflow state

2006-01-24 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi guys, I'm writing some migration code that needs to force a workflow state. That is, a given content item has a workflow with states A, B and C, and depending on some external state, I need to force it to be in state B, including having B's security settings. I've had a look at the

[Zope-CMF] Re: Forcing a workflow state

2006-01-24 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi Jens, On Tue, 24 Jan 2006 19:58:14 -, Jens Vagelpohl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You'll probably have to construct the dictionary that describes the state/comment/transition time etcyourself and then append it at the end of the workflow history. At least that's what we've been doing

[Zope-CMF] What's the story for using Z3 content types as first-class citizens in CMF?

2006-02-10 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi, Just trying to get an overview - are there any plans or code (CMF 2?) to make it possible to use Z3 content types as first-class citizens in CMF? That is, make them available in add menus, make actions/tabs appear on them, let them use method aliases, make them catalog aware and so on,

[Zope-CMF] Re: What's the story for using Z3 content types as first-class citizens in CMF?

2006-02-13 Thread Martin Aspeli
Chris Withers [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Martin Aspeli wrote: Alec Mitchell's plone_schemas product lets you use such types in Plone, though he derives from CMF's PortalContent (as I recall) and manually constructs an FTI. FWIW, I think this is an exceptionally bad idea. I'd much

[Zope-CMF] Re: What's the story for using Z3 content types as first-class citizens in CMF?

2006-02-13 Thread Martin Aspeli
yuppie [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The underlying question is whether we want to drop support for TTW development. I don't want that. So I prefer to keep portal types and Actions until we have a suitable Z3 replacement. In my own opinion, there are three levels of TTW development: 1. TTW

[Zope-CMF] Re: Re: CMF roadmap

2006-02-15 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Wed, 15 Feb 2006 14:16:26 -, Jens Vagelpohl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 15 Feb 2006, at 14:12, Florent Guillaume wrote: Jens Vagelpohl wrote: There's one specific item that I couldn't find enough information on to make a comment, which is events support. Florent, what is the

[Zope-CMF] Re: How to customize forms and pages in the CMF for a CMS

2006-02-28 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Tue, 28 Feb 2006 23:37:24 -, Bradly Bernier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So there isnt a way of doing this just with the CMF? I have looked at plone and it doesn't seem to offer the exact requirments. All I want to make is a site where my clients can edit the body of 1 or 2 pages and

[Zope-CMF] Re: How to customize forms and pages in the CMF for a CMS

2006-03-01 Thread Martin Aspeli
Bradly Bernier [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yah Plone seemed to be just as difficult as the CMF when I looked at it. Plone has way to many options that it scares me which I know would never work for my very computer illiterate clients. Well, Plone is built on top of the CMF so it has exactly all

[Zope-CMF] Re: Some first steps with CMF2

2006-03-01 Thread Martin Aspeli
yuppie [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: If someone figures out what's necessary to use CPSSkins V3 with CMFDefault we might be able to add the necessary hooks in CMF. I have no idea how hard this would be, but I think it would be a very nice thing to have integrated at the CMF level. There was some

[Zope-CMF] Re: CMF 2.0.0 released

2006-04-16 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi Jens, Congratulations! :-) - pluggable TypeInformation objects - new-style Actions Where would I look to find more details on how these work? They sound like the may be useful for Plone going forward. :) Martin -- (muted) ___

[Zope-CMF] Re: CMF roadmap update

2006-04-16 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi Jens, CMF 2.0.0 is now out the door and I have made some updates to the roadmap document. Please take a look and give me some feedback on the dates (well, the only dates we have set are the dates for CMF 2.1) and the description of 2.1:

[Zope-CMF] Re: Re: CMF roadmap update

2006-04-25 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 16:33:01 +0100, David Pratt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Jens. Z3 has it own uid facilities. I guess folks could pick this up through five could they not? Its all moving in that direction in any case. Plone doesn't have UID, but Archetypes does. This is used primarily

[Zope-CMF] Re: Re: CMF roadmap update

2006-04-26 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 20:21:09 +0100, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 16:33:01 +0100, David Pratt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Jens. Z3 has it own uid facilities. I guess folks could pick this up through five could they not? Its all moving in that direction in any

[Zope-CMF] Re: GenericSetup now incompatible with Zope 2.8?

2006-06-03 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Sat, 03 Jun 2006 12:16:06 +0100, Jens Vagelpohl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 This checkin seems to have broken Zope 2.8-compatibility: http://svn.zope.org/GenericSetup/trunk/tests/common.py? rev=68391r1=41338r2=68391 Specifically, the line

[Zope-CMF] Re: CMF 1.6.1 beta cycle this coming week

2006-06-03 Thread Martin Aspeli
On Sat, 03 Jun 2006 12:34:53 +0100, Jens Vagelpohl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: BTW: Next week I plan to land ZCML support and non-Products package support for registering profiles. Don't know if new features like that should be shipped with CMF 1.6 or if we need a maintenance branch for

[Zope-CMF] Re: [dev] RFC: rethinking GenericSetup extension profiles

2006-07-25 Thread Martin Aspeli
yuppie wrote: Since CMF 1.5.1 CMFSetup/GenericSetup supports extension profiles. They are quite useful, but their current format has some fundamental issues: I posted something in a similar vein to this on plone-developers last night, about using GenericSetup profiles for product

Re: [Zope-CMF] Re: [dev] RFC: rethinking GenericSetup extension profiles

2006-07-25 Thread Martin Aspeli
yuppie-2 wrote: GenericSetup uses a completely different approach than CMFQuickInstaller. It is focused on states, not on changes. Indeed. From having used it recently, it just seems to be an easier way of working, so I'm trying to find out how we can meet the use cases that CMFQI meets

Re: [Zope-CMF] [dev] RFC: rethinking GenericSetup extension profiles

2006-07-25 Thread Martin Aspeli
yuppie-2 wrote: GenericSetup uses a completely different approach than CMFQuickInstaller. It is focused on states, not on changes. Indeed. From having used it recently, it just seems to be an easier way of working, so I'm trying to find out how we can meet the use cases that CMFQI meets

Re: [Zope-CMF] [dev] RFC: rethinking GenericSetup extension profiles

2006-07-25 Thread Martin Aspeli
The concept of import steps is confusing because it was invented before extension profile support was added. Originally an import step represented a piece of the profile. The handler property just provided the information which handler to use for this piece of the profile. That did no

[Zope-CMF] Abusing GenericSetup during traditional installs

2006-07-28 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi, I realise this isn't entirely kosher (and that yuppie has much better long-term ideas), but I am wondering if it's possible to invoke some GenericSetup handler code during a more traditional Extensions/Install.py install. This is purely for convenience - but if I need a more traditional

[Zope-CMF] Re: Abusing GenericSetup during traditional installs

2006-07-30 Thread Martin Aspeli
Rob Miller wrote: maybe i'm missing something, but is there a reason why you wouldn't want to simply make your profile active and then import specific steps programmatically from within your install method, rather than invoking the import adapters manually? Because in this case I wouldn't

Re: [Zope-CMF] Abusing GenericSetup during traditional installs

2006-07-31 Thread Martin Aspeli
yuppie-2 wrote: def install(self): wftool = getToolByName(self, 'portal_workflow') # create empty workflow obj_id = 'myWorkflow' wftool._setObject(obj_id, DCWorkflowDefinition(obj_id)) obj = getattr(wftool, obj_id) # create import context environ

Re: [Zope-CMF] Abusing GenericSetup during traditional installs

2006-07-31 Thread Martin Aspeli
yuppie-2 wrote: If you write a new XML body to adapted.body the settings of the workflow are changed. The body is not stored as a string, it is stored as object tree. (So yes, the workflow is 'initialized' with the settings defined in the XML file.) If you modify the object tree TTW

[Zope-CMF] Re: Abusing GenericSetup during traditional installs

2006-08-06 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi guys, yuppie wrote: Ok. Wrote a prototype for you. And it worked great! :) I've used this here now: http://svn.plone.org/svn/collective/borg/trunk/examples/charity/ See especially http://svn.plone.org/svn/collective/borg/trunk/examples/charity/Extensions/Install.py and

[Zope-CMF] Tools as local utilities

2006-09-09 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi guys, philiKON pointed out something interesting to me the other day - we could actually register the existing tools as local utilities as of Zope 2.10. That way, you could do this: actions = getUtility(IActionsTool) as another spelling for actions = getToolByName(context,

[Zope-CMF] Re: Tools as local utilities

2006-09-10 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 10 Sep 2006, at 14:53, Rocky Burt wrote: This sounds fine, but we'd probably want to wait until we have a CMF version that does require 2.10, right? HEAD says Zope = 2.9. Unless we want to work with indirections that know

Re: [Zope-CMF] Re: Tools as local utilities

2006-11-13 Thread Martin Aspeli
I am experimenting with that right now, but my z3/Five-Fu ran low again ;) My problem: calls to zope.component.getUtility (interface_class) never return anything. Here's the top part (the bottom is just the old way) of my CMFCore.utils.getToolByName: Yay! def

[Zope-CMF] Re: Zope 3 events from workflow

2006-12-27 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Am I right in thinking that DCWorkflow does not send any Zope 3 events? I'm not terribly familiar with that code, but some grepping suggests so. Do you agree this would be useful? (I've got a pretty strong need for it for

[Zope-CMF] Re: Zope 3 events from workflow

2006-12-27 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: You need to provide full patches and find someone who has the time - I'm afraid I don't. The best solution would be for you to get in touch with Jim and get a contributor agreement going. That's not rocket science. This turned out to be easier than I feared. I've put a

[Zope-CMF] Re: Zope 3 events from workflow

2006-12-27 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 27 Dec 2006, at 16:16, Tres Seaver wrote: Rocky Burt wrote: On Wed, 2006-27-12 at 11:46 +0100, Jens Vagelpohl wrote: P.S.: I _hate hate hate_ doctests ;) Why? I won't speak for Jens, but I find they have two serious

[Zope-CMF] Re: Zope 3 events from workflow

2006-12-27 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: Looks farily good overall. I think one useful extension would be useful to provide access to the same information currently exposed via Products.DCWorkflow.Expression.StaTeChangeInfo (these are what the guard expressions use): - The workflow object itself. - The

[Zope-CMF] Re: Zope 3 events from workflow

2006-12-27 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: Looks farily good overall. I think one useful extension would be useful to provide access to the same information currently exposed via Products.DCWorkflow.Expression.StaTeChangeInfo (these are what the guard expressions use): - The workflow object itself. - The

[Zope-CMF] Re: Zope 3 events from workflow

2006-12-27 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: The testbrowser tests tend to be the worst when it comes to failures early on and then spewing out never-ending messages because the browser ist messed up at that point. Yes, this is true - they can be pita when you have complex pages (like Plone). Martin

[Zope-CMF] Re: Zope 3 events from workflow

2006-12-27 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi Tres, Looks farily good overall. I think one useful extension would be useful to provide access to the same information currently exposed via Products.DCWorkflow.Expression.StaTeChangeInfo (these are what the guard expressions use): - The workflow object itself. - The transition

[Zope-CMF] Re: Zope 3 events from workflow

2006-12-27 Thread Martin Aspeli
Sidnei da Silva wrote: Something that strikes me, by looking at this code is that we also want events that map to 'notifySuccess' and 'notifyException' too (ie, ITransitionSuccessEvent and ITransitionFailureEvent), not only 'before'/'after'. (see _invokeWithNotifications). Those could be fired

[Zope-CMF] Re: Zope 3 events from workflow

2006-12-27 Thread Martin Aspeli
Sidnei da Silva wrote: On 12/27/06, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't think I fully understand the use case or usage of notifySuccess() and notifyException(). They are called by portal_workflow, on the workflow definition. They don't seem to be used in the current code at least

[Zope-CMF] Re: Zope 3 events from workflow

2006-12-27 Thread Martin Aspeli
Sidnei da Silva wrote: On 12/27/06, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree that maybe this refactoring is lower priority, I'm just making sure it's not forgotten just because the main workflow used is DCWorkflow, and maybe clarifying some not-so-clear use cases beyond DCWorkflow's

[Zope-CMF] Re: Zope 3 events from workflow

2006-12-27 Thread Martin Aspeli
Sidnei da Silva wrote: On 12/27/06, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Right - that was the question I was asking. *Is* this an event that's useful outside the framework? I believe so. For example, a subscriber that wants to know if an action has succeeded, no matter where/when, so it can

[Zope-CMF] Re: [CMF 2.1] FSPageTemplate Unicode

2007-01-06 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hanno Schlichting wrote: Yep, you are wrong ;) Fair enough. Out of curiosity, does the object have a __parent__? In any case, I think your original suggestion is a good one. Let's take this opportunity to diagnose the problem and not the symptom: True tools should be singletons and act

[Zope-CMF] Re: [CMF 2.1] FSPageTemplate Unicode

2007-01-06 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hanno Schlichting wrote: PhiliKON some time ago suggested that Five should wrap the utilities eventually but nobody followed up on that idea. Philipp also has some ideas (not too far off completion, I believe) that may remove some of the acquisition intermingling. I'm not sure they'd apply

[Zope-CMF] Re: [CMF 2.1] FSPageTemplate Unicode

2007-01-06 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hanno Schlichting wrote: The idea is to use a specialized persistent component registry, that does the needed AQ-wrapping. This will however only give us AQ-wrapped local utilities, whereas those registered with the global component registry wouldn't be wrapped. I think this might be an

[Zope-CMF] Re: [CMF 2.1] FSPageTemplate Unicode

2007-01-06 Thread Martin Aspeli
Okay, spoke to Philipp on IRC and he asked me to relay his opinions on some of this: - CMF tools ought not to depend on acquiring things from 'self' if at all possible. - TTW code will need aq contexts for security. However, it makes sense for getToolBy(Interface)Name() to handle this.

[Zope-CMF] Re: [CMF 2.1] FSPageTemplate Unicode

2007-01-07 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 6 Jan 2007, at 23:03, Martin Aspeli wrote: In light of what we're seeing here, and because there is *so* much third party code using getToolByName(), perhaps a DeprecationWarning (and worse, speedy deprecation) is a bit

[Zope-CMF] Re: [CMF 2.1] FSPageTemplate Unicode

2007-01-07 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi Jens, A warning is a warning is a warning, there's no lower level, and people won't see anything if it isn't in their faces. The usage of something like a debug error message is unprecedented, counterintuitive and will not compel anyone to fix their product. We finally have a

[Zope-CMF] Re: [CMF 2.1] FSPageTemplate Unicode

2007-01-07 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hanno Schlichting wrote: Maybe a compromise would be to only return those utilities back acquisition wrapped that where registered as tools? That sounds sensible to me; most new local utilities wouldn't really behave the same way, I'm guessing. Jens added a new function to CMFCore.utils

[Zope-CMF] Re: [CMF 2.1] FSPageTemplate Unicode

2007-01-09 Thread Martin Aspeli
Dieter Maurer wrote: - It's an explicit declaration of support As is the definition of __of__. Well, not in a formal sense. I could have some non-Zope python object that I wanted to register as a local utility (to override a global one, say) that could have __of__() for some other

[Zope-CMF] Re: [CMF 2.1] FSPageTemplate Unicode

2007-01-09 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: Or, to paraphrase the Beatles: All you need is __of__ ... DAH dah, dadda dum... __of__ is all you need. LOL! :) Knock yourselves out, I don't feel as strongly about this as I like a good argument. ;) Martin ___ Zope-CMF

[Zope-CMF] Re: Tools as local utilities

2007-02-06 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 7 Feb 2007, at 00:36, Martin Aspeli wrote: Eggs make your life easier, especially if you want to use tools like workingenv.py or zc.buildout. Well, for simple work with the CMF like setting up a quick instance

[Zope-CMF] Re: Tools as local utilities

2007-02-06 Thread Martin Aspeli
Charlie Clark wrote: Am 07.02.2007 um 00:36 schrieb Martin Aspeli: Why? Is it the ability to specify sensible version restrictions? Have multiple versions of the same package as different dependencies for different dependents? Automatic downloading of dependencies where possible/desired

Re: [Zope-CMF] Re: Tools as local utilities

2007-02-07 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: I won't grace the uncalled-for sarcasm with an answer. You misunderstand my point. I simply don't want the existing dead-simple way of creating quick sandboxes be replaced by some mechanism where I need to start writing configuration files or learn some

[Zope-CMF] Re: Tools as local utilities

2007-02-08 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: Let's get this discussion back from generic pie-in-the-sky to the simple situation where we just need this one package integrated into CMF 2.1, and quickly. +1 Wichert wants a Plone 3 beta very very soon, there is no time to switch the CMF to any other

[Zope-CMF] Re: Tools as local utilities

2007-02-08 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: I'm not convinced that anything which is this tightly coupled to Zope needs to be a package, rather than a product. I don't think the package zealots get the fact that purity is not a win if we have to distort the rest of the application to satisfy it. Amen to that. I

Re: [Zope-CMF] Five's local sitemanager, CMF, etc

2007-02-22 Thread Martin Aspeli
yuppie-3 wrote: Jens Vagelpohl wrote: On 22 Feb 2007, at 09:03, Wichert Akkerman wrote: Hey Rocky, any progress? Haven't heard and loud yelling from Wichert yet, but I think he's getting close to the Plone 3.0 beta by now... I'm hoping for upcoming monday.. Merging the branch into

[Zope-CMF] Re: Five's local sitemanager, CMF, etc

2007-02-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 23 Feb 2007, at 00:39, Rocky wrote: So... what's next? Figuring out how to deal with existing sites that need to be modified on the fly somehow so they don't break completely. Does CMF core not have any kind of

Re: [Zope-CMF] Re: Five's local sitemanager, CMF, etc

2007-02-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: After reading Phillip's book I really like Zope 3 generations, but I have no idea if that mechanism could be used at all. I had a look at it and started thinking about a CMFish version. The main challenge is that generates just get the app root as a handle, so you

[Zope-CMF] Re: Five's local sitemanager, CMF, etc

2007-02-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
yuppie wrote: Hi Rocky! Rocky wrote: Done. five.localsitemanager is now included with CMFCore on the jens branch. There aren't any CMF specific tests in place for any of this, but the CMFCore tests all run fine with sys.path stuff setup (they failed when I misconfigured things). So...

Re: [Zope-CMF] Five's local sitemanager, CMF, etc

2007-02-26 Thread Martin Aspeli
Philipp von Weitershausen wrote: Rocky wrote: On Feb 23, 3:50 pm, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: yuppie wrote: Maybe I'm missing something. But wasn't a major goal of five.localsitemanager to return acquisition wrapped tools? That was my understanding, too. I thought this would

[Zope-CMF] Re: Five's local sitemanager, CMF, etc

2007-03-04 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 26 Feb 2007, at 17:03, Martin Aspeli wrote: To get to the portal root / CMF site, I suggest a pattern that is sometimes used in Zope3: We register the CMF site object as a utility providing ICMFSite (or whatever

[Zope-CMF] Re: Delete trouble

2007-03-26 Thread Martin Aspeli
Philipp von Weitershausen wrote: Martin Aspeli wrote: Philipp von Weitershausen wrote: *sigh* Chapter XYZ in my book explains the process :). Whenever you traverse over a site, its site manager becomes the active component registry. So if you haven't traversed over that site yet

[Zope-CMF] Re: getToolByName depreciation, getUtility, and five.lsm

2007-03-28 Thread Martin Aspeli
Kapil Thangavelu wrote: A few of us (Alec Mitchell, Godefroid Chapelle, Balazs Ree, Rocky Burt, Daniel Nouri, Rob Miller, Vincenzo Di Somma, and myself) have been discussing this in depth at the Sorrento Sprint. We've reached consensus on how we hope to resolve the issues arising from the

Re: [Zope-CMF] getToolByName depreciation, getUtility, and five.lsm

2007-03-29 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Philipp von Weitershausen wrote: Hanno Schlichting wrote: I would say that all of Acquisition is dark implicit magic and something I expect when developing in Zope 2. When using Zope 3 concepts in Zope 2 I also expect

[Zope-CMF] Re: [dev] unresolved site manager related issues

2007-04-15 Thread Martin Aspeli
Balazs Ree wrote: Acquisition is raping Zope3, it seems. That must surely be quotation of the month. :) Martin ___ Zope-CMF maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-cmf See http://collector.zope.org/CMF for bug

[Zope-CMF] Re: [dev] unresolved site manager related issues

2007-04-15 Thread Martin Aspeli
Dieter Maurer wrote: Alec Mitchell wrote at 2007-4-12 06:59 -0700: ... ... deprecation of getToolByName ... which is that there's no practical reason other than aesthetics to deprecate getToolByName at this point. A very good point: let's deprecate deprecations done just for aethetical

[Zope-CMF] Re: [dev] unresolved site manager related issues

2007-04-15 Thread Martin Aspeli
Rob Miller wrote: i'll add yet another me too to this chorus. removing getToolByName has become considerably more trouble than it's worth. currently, i see basically two options being suggested: - adding (and then living with) yet more code in Five, which changes the behaviour of clean,

[Zope-CMF] Re: [dev] unresolved site manager related issues

2007-04-15 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Martin Aspeli wrote: Kapil Thangavelu wrote: On Thu, 12 Apr 2007 06:16:23 -0400, yuppie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi! Philipp von Weitershausen wrote: yuppie wrote: Kapil's also right when he says that utilities

[Zope-CMF] Re: [dev] unresolved site manager related issues

2007-04-15 Thread Martin Aspeli
Alec Mitchell wrote: On 4/15/07, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dieter Maurer wrote: Alec Mitchell wrote at 2007-4-12 06:59 -0700: ... ... deprecation of getToolByName ... which is that there's no practical reason other than aesthetics to deprecate getToolByName at this point. A very

[Zope-CMF] Re: tools, utilities, and getToolByName

2007-04-22 Thread Martin Aspeli
Rocky wrote: On Apr 19, 12:52 pm, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -1 to relying on five.localsitemanager, especially if it means other site managers somewhere inside the CMF site will need to be five.lsm aware. Not sure what relying on five.lsm means... because if we don't use

Re: [Zope-CMF] Making TypesTool faster

2007-05-02 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: Before we look at optimizing the use of the product dispatch mechanism, I'd like to propose deprecating it in favor of the factory-utility mechanism: leaving the 'product' field blank in an FTI, and having the 'factory' field be the name of a utility registered for

[Zope-CMF] Re: Making TypesTool faster

2007-05-03 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Alexander Limi wrote: On Wed, 02 May 2007 10:03:39 -0700, Martin Aspeli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: +1, but I don't think the two need to be mutually exclusive. Amen. At present, Archetypes-based content types cannot be used

Re: [Zope-CMF] Re: Making TypesTool faster

2007-05-04 Thread Martin Aspeli
Charlie Clark-3 wrote: Am 03.05.2007 um 00:50 schrieb Alexander Limi: At present, Archetypes-based content types cannot be used with a factory (I tried hard, but there are some acquisition-related/factory related reasons); I'd like to refactor this, but we can't for Plone 3.0

[Zope-CMF] Re: [dev] five.localsitemanager: proposal

2007-06-23 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi Yuppie, This proposal is now implemented on CMF and five.localsitemanager trunk. Everything *seems* to work, but maybe I'm missing something. This might be a good time to review and test the changes - any feedback is welcome. Well done - great work! :) Done: - There are 10 tools in

[Zope-CMF] Re: [dev] tools-as-utilities roadmap

2007-07-06 Thread Martin Aspeli
yuppie wrote: Well. The 2.1 changes are based one the assumption that we switch quickly and completely to utilities, making all tools work as utilities. The roadmap proposed by Tres means it will take several years and we'll have to work with tools and utilities side by side for a long time.

[Zope-CMF] GenericSetup extension profile import step mis-feature

2007-07-30 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hi guys, After a lot of is-this-a-bug type discussions with Rob and Wichert, I've come to feel pretty strongly about the following: When you load an extension profile for the first time in GS, it looks to see if it has any import steps (in import_steps.xml) that are not already known. If

[Zope-CMF] Re: GenericSetup extension profile import step mis-feature

2007-07-31 Thread Martin Aspeli
Hanno Schlichting wrote: One example where the current behavior makes sense is when you write an add-on product which wants to install itself into a standard Plone site and change the settings of the Archetypes tool. The import handler for the Archetypes tool is only specified in the extension

Re: [Zope-CMF] Re: GenericSetup extension profile import step mis-feature

2007-07-31 Thread Martin Aspeli
yuppie-3 wrote: Hi! The proposed solution doesn't work: The ImportStepRegistry is not only used for imports - it is also used for creating new 'import_steps.xml' files for exports. Exported profiles are always base profiles, they have to specify *all* import handlers used for

Re: [Zope-CMF] Re: GenericSetup extension profile import step mis-feature

2007-07-31 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: I think it's wrong :) The export functionality suffers from the same problen as the import functionality: the export steps defined in extension profiles are only used if they have been selected once. In other words: it is just as unpredictable. What is

Re: [Zope-CMF] Re: GenericSetup extension profile import step mis-feature

2007-07-31 Thread Martin Aspeli
yuppie-3 wrote: For an import operation, you run: - All steps that came from the current base profile - All steps that came from explicit, transitive dependencies of the current base profile (provided we get support for declaring profile dependencies) ??? Base profiles have

Re: [Zope-CMF] Re: GenericSetup extension profile import step mis-feature

2007-07-31 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: 'importVarious' is a brutal hack: better to focus efforts on making it disappear. The entire point of the tool is to externalize configuration as declarative data in the profile; accomodating imperative configuration is not something I care to support. I think

[Zope-CMF] Re: CMF collector on Launchpad?

2007-08-13 Thread Martin Aspeli
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Andreas Jung is in the process of getting the regular Zope 2 issue collector moved onto Launchpad. He said the Launchpad guys could move other collectors like the CMF collector at the same time. The question is, do we

[Zope-CMF] Re: eggification status?

2007-11-06 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 yuppie wrote: Hi! Right now there are two versions of CMFCore and GenericSetup: Products.GenericSetup and GenericSetup Products.CMFCore and CMFCore wichert is currently working on GenericSetup/trunk, tseaver stitched today

[Zope-CMF] Re: [dev] GenericSetup: using global steps

2007-12-22 Thread Martin Aspeli
Tres Seaver wrote: Worse, an import is potentially destructive. I am now of the opinion that content import / export should be treated as a separate application, not built into the profile. From a design perspective, I'd tend to agree. I've always felt that the 'structure' import step sat a

[Zope-CMF] Re: What is the status of GS wiping catalog indexes on catalog.xml import?

2008-02-29 Thread Martin Aspeli
Andreas Jung wrote: --On 28. Februar 2008 20:35:09 +0100 Dieter Maurer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Andreas Jung wrote at 2008-2-28 07:13 +0100: --On 27. Februar 2008 21:59:58 + Maurits van Rees [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: greenman, on 2008-02-27: So, for the catalog.xml importer, why

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