EV digest 7099
EV Digest 7099 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Could higher pack voltage be stepped down for Curtis input? by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Lee, you alright? by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) NEDRA 10th Anniversary Nationals Press Release by Roy LeMeur [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) More Info on the NEDRA 10th Anniversary National EVent by Roy LeMeur [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: [ElectricMotorcycles] Inspection Woes by Dave Davidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- this doesn't like much more than a series of switches, and not all that expensive. A reed switch on one cable, and a heat sensor switch on the controller. What else did you have in mind that drives up the cost to new controller range? From: Peter VanDerWal Hmm well, a pair of highpower contactors (S1 and S2), a high power diode, and of course the cost of any extra low voltage controllers you happen to fry trying to get everything right. The nice thing about this circuit is that the contactors and/or diode are fairly inexpensive and low-rated parts. At most, the current should be less than the controller's current limit. At most, the voltage across them won't exceed the 36v pack voltage. So, you can use low-voltage parts typically found in golf carts. The hard part of this circuit is the control system. If you just throw it together with *no* control circuit, and depend on the operator to only open or close those contactors at the right times, then sooner or later he will mess up, and murder his controller. -- Excellence does not require perfection. -- Henry James -- Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart-at-earthlink.net ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- From: Dave Cover Just heard about the bridge collapse, hope you were home at the time. Our thoughts are with those who were involved. Yes, we're all fine here. Thanks for your concern! I just heard about it myself. That bridge is about 70 miles away from here. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Subject: Electric Drag Racing - NEDRA 10th Anniversary National Event in Portland, OR - 8/17/07 and 8/18/07 FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE: NEDRA 10th Anniversary National Event 8/17/07 and 8/18/07 at Portland International Raceway - 6PM till Midnight. CONTACT: Roy LeMeur NEDRA Northwest Regional Director [EMAIL PROTECTED] 360.528.0468 The National Electric Drag Racing Association www.nedra.com EVENT: NEDRA 10th Anniversary National Event 8/17/07 and 8/18/07 at Portland International Raceway - 6PM till Midnight. As our 10th anniversary event approaches, NEDRA is experiencing unprecedented interest in electric drag racing. We will have the largest group of battery-powered drag racing vehicles ever in one place competing against each other and against gasoline-powered cars, trucks, and bikes on the dragstrip. There will also be a large group of electric vehicle enthusiasts with their daily-driven vehicles on display at the track. This short list of recent media coverage of NEDRA speaks for itself and provides much more information- Front page Wall Street Journal article 8/1/07- http://online.wsj.com/article/SB118593442187584293.html?mod=hpp_us_pageone AP article from 7/30/07 featured in USA Today- http://www.usatoday.com/tech/products/gear/2007-07-29-electric-dragsters_N.htm Four-page article from May 2007 Car and Driver Magazine- http://www.caranddriver.com/features/12750/batteries-included.html Two great videos from the AP at NEDRA's most recent event- http://video.ap.org/v/default.aspx?g=e1908c3c-e3b5-4719-9148-ed622858ce70 http://video.ap.org/v/default.aspx?g=f0556229-afc6-44d7-b10c-bf0890bcb1c7 Here are a couple of examples of NEDRA's battery-powered competitors- The KillaCycle, the world's quickest electric vehicle. 8.168 seconds @ 155.74 mph in the quarter-mile. Vehicle Owner- Bill Dube' www.killacycle.com The White Zombie, the world's quickest street-legal electric vehicle. 11.466 seconds @ 114.08 mph in the quarter-mile. Vehicle Owner- John Wayland www.plasmaboyracing.com Come and see electric vehicles beat gas cars at their own game on the dragstrip. NEDRA racers spend pennies recharging their vehicles between rounds and our vehicles run quicker and faster as the batteries warm up during the charging and discharging process. There will be a good variety of race vehicles, conversion EVs on display, electric bikes and scooters. Portland International Raceway website- www.portlandraceway.com For additional information on this event please contact Roy LeMeur or visit www.nedra.com. See electric drag racing videos at www.plasmaboyracing.com ABOUT NEDRA - The National Electric Drag Racing Association (NEDRA) exists to increase public awareness of electric vehicle (EV) performance and to encourage
EV digest 7093
/evalbum/1135 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- --- Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm not sure exactly what yours is like, but it should have four terminals on it, not just two like a typical series motor. My big GE sepex motor has four -- two for the field and two for the armature. Hey Zeke Number of terminals has nothing to do with how many terminals it has. Two terminaled motors are designed to run in just one direction while four terminals allows you to reverse the motor. Series, sep-ex, and shunt wound reffer to how the fields are wound. In fact there are several forklift motors with the same armatures, brushes, housings, pole shoes, etc but is available in either series or sep-ex field coils. Anyway I ran across this thread and wanted to offer some thoughts. Hope this helps Cya Jim Husted Hi-Torque Electric Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel. http://travel.yahoo.com/ ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I forgot where this thread started. But when my Ford Escort EV was totaled GEICO would only give me $1200 for it. It's an '86 so obviously a small dent would be worth more damage then the value of the car. I told the claims adjuster the car was worth more then $1200 with all the EV parts. So he asked me to send for sale information on similar conversions. I went to Mike Chancey's site and found a few electric Ford Escorts for sale. All of them were selling for over $5000 so I sent them that info and GEICO changed the claim and sent me a check for $2500. I thought that was a fair compromise. And with the money I bought a clean door from the junkyard and had a body shop repair the dent in the rear quarter panel and repaint the whole car. The rocker panel was fine so the frame wasn't damaged. It was pretty much the passenger door and rear quarter panel that was damaged. So I'm pretty satisfied with GEICO with handling the EV. Chip On Jul 31, 2007, at 10:21 PM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote: From: damon henry [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: July 31, 2007 7:34:05 PM EDT To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Insurance From: Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Insurance Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2007 16:30:28 -0600 With my EV, I have a advantage. I had it re title and name it Electro. The sister car, another EV I have is call Transformer I and even has a different VIN number which was a re manufacture GM B body. These were selling for $52,000.00 back in 1977, but I got my for a reduce cost because it was one of the proto types that road tested for about 1/2 a year before I received it. Ohhh, that car salesman layed a doosy on you Roland. You find me the people that spent $52K in 1977 for those other electric cars :-) I hate to be the one to give you the bad news, but the silver tounged salesman only made it seem like a bargain... damon ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Ah, a common negative for the field and armature. Is the common negative also grounded to the case? I think it make sense that it didn't have much torque when both the field and the armature were hooked to the chopper controller -- essentially you were telling the it to rotate slowly via the armature, and to rotate fast, via the field -- sort of like the electrical equivalent of trying to drive in slowly in 4th gear by not giving it any gas -- which would stall an ICE engine, but instead of stalling the motor, it just tried drawing very high current, which tripped the overcurrent on the controller. Z On 7/31/07, Michael Barkley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Oops, I meant in this sentence: (The other terminal of the field wiring was terminated at the field's negative terminal.) To be: The other terminal of the field wiring was terminated at the armature's negative terminal. Sorry about that. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- --- Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well I'd certainly listen to Jim before me but I don't see a problem with a good dunking. The reality of driving an EV in the winter in the north west can't be much better g. I actually wash my Prestolite motor out every couple of years. I use clean soapy water and pour it over the brush area while I run the motor in neutral. Then I run it while I spray the garden hose inside (the pot box is within reach.) The fan effectively removes a large percentage of the water (I look like I tried to take a bath with my clothes on.) After that I take it for a drive in 3rd gear to warm up the motor. I've done this 4 times over the last 8 years to keep the motor pretty to look at :-) Of course its entirely possible that Jim is gonna spank me now LMAO Paul Gooch Hey Paul and all 8^) Many of my forklift accounts mechanics have done this for decades. Of course
EV digest 7095
EV Digest 7095 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: CVT results update by Jack Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: CVT results update by Jack Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Inspection Woes by Mark Eidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: NEDRA board help on 3 wheeled vehicles by Bill Dube [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires - tire width vs RR by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) RE: Inspection Woes by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Could higher pack voltage be stepped down for Curtis input? by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Other ways to do brush timing by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: John Wayland in Wall Street Journal by (-Phil-) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Electric Emblem by Bruce Williford [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Inspection Woes by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Inspection Woes by Mark Eidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) RE: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires - tire width vs RR by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: [ElectricMotorcycles] Inspection Woes by damon henry [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Mailman Always Rings Twice by David Roden (Akron OH USA) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Hydrogen and Fuel Cells on the EVDL by David Roden (Akron OH USA) [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Hi, thanks. The motor is a ADC 8, I posted the pic earlier that shows the setup with the planetary, http://www.nimblemotorsports.com/NiMHybridCVT.jpg, and the rear axle converted to a driven wheel, http://nimblemotorsports.com/drivenwheel.jpg (this was with the 5:1 chain drive, which worked, but was REALLY LOUD) Jack Frank John wrote: Jack - that is outstanding work. Way to go. What drive setup are you using i.e. how much power? There's lots of lightweight vehicles that might benefit from this type of setup. - Original Message From: Jack Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Wednesday, August 1, 2007 12:43:34 AM Subject: CVT results update As I reported earlier, I put a CVT belt drive on my Aspire, a Comet 94C, http://www.hoffcocomet.com/comet/aftermarket-torque-converters.asp#94c It has a variable gearing from 3.49:1 to .78:1. When I connected it directly to the rear wheel in the aspire, it didn't have enough torque to get the car moving from a stop, the belt just slipped. No surprise really, it would have been nice if it worked, so I gave it a try. To fix it, I built a 3.27:1 planetary gear setup for the driven pulley, http://www.nimblemotorsports.com/planetary.jpg This weighs only 32lbs. So now the car starts off with a 12.9:1 gear and a seamless transition to a 2.55:1 gearing. I took it for a test drive today, and it works great, no problem at all from a start. If my calculations are correct, the motor at 5000 rpm could transition from 27mph to 140mph through the gear ratio. I don't have a tach on the motor yet, but the calcs show at 25mph the motor at 2500rpm with the belt drive at mid-point, and that is about what it looked like today. A remaining issue is running the car with ICE power. The electric motor does still spin, the belt mostly slipping, however a couple times it would get engaged in the motor and spin up to speed, in which case, it would create momentum to keep the car moving when lifting the ICE throttle. Not sure if that is a bug or a feature, but it didn't happen every time. More testing to do, but I'm quite pleased with the results so far. Jack Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games. http://get.games.yahoo.com/proddesc?gamekey=monopolyherenow ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I would guess the CVT itself is 10-15lbs. The Aspire weighs about 2000-lbs from the factory, my car still has its complete ICE drivetrain, its a parallel hybrid prototype. I don't know what it weighs now, at least 300-500lbs more than stock. Jack Greg Owen wrote: Jack Murray wrote: As I reported earlier, I put a CVT belt drive on my Aspire, a Comet 94C, http://www.hoffcocomet.com/comet/aftermarket-torque-converters.asp#94c It has a variable gearing from 3.49:1 to .78:1. Do you recall how much this puppy weighs offhand? And around how much your Aspire weighs? ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- So I take my bike http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/preview.php?vid=1231 down to the local ADOT Level II inspection station to get a VIN number and titlethe first guy looked really concerned and asked how many cc's. I explained that it was a 13 HP electric motor. He said that that was not enough for highway use. I explained that it would go over 65 MPH. He said I don't think we can do this and went to get his sargent, who came
EV digest 7098
peak HP is enough to push you to quite a bit higher if your gearing lets the motor develop the needed power at the needed RPM. My gut feel is that you're geared to spin the motor too fast and at 72V it is going to go to sleep on you before you get to top speed. Looking at the cold peformance curves for the L91-4003 at 75V on EV Parts, at 5000RPM the motor is drawing only 80A and develops about 8HP; 13HP is available at about 4000RPM, and this is right near peak efficiency for the motor (at this voltage). But 4000RPM with your present gearing is about 52MPH. Since 13HP is a fair bit greater than the 7.5HP predicted to maintain 50MPH, you'll probably accelerate OK up to this speed but struggle to get much faster, even on flat ground in still air, and will not reach 60mph with the present gearing. Once you've got it on the road you'll have a better idea how it performs, but my guess is that you'll want to re-gear for perhaps 4500RPM @70mph if you want to be able to reach 60mph. The present gearing has your motor pretty near peak efficiency at the max speed of your typical commute (45mph), but the efficiency drops off much faster if you spin the motor faster than if you load it down and spin it a bit slower. Cheers, Roger. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I like the header advertisement on the Marketplace (B) section of the paper: AC/DC - For those about to Rock. Too bad its not on the same page as the Wayland article ;-) ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I have 4 of the TS-LFP40aha on cycle life testing. So far very good results. I am trying to hold them to the %70 DOD spec that yields a 3000 cycle life curve. I have Mk3Lion Regs on each cell. I have the top set to 4.01 volts and the floor I ran 20 cycles with a floor of 2.5 volts. The yielded about %98 DOD on all 20 cycles. Damn!! Those cells sure make cheap lead acid look like junk!! I am now runnig with a floor of 2.80 volts per cell. I hope to restrict the Ahrs to aproximateley 32. This is the %80 DOD point, When these cycles are run, Then I am upping the voltage floor to 3.00 volts and hoping the results will be 28 amp hours, Then I am going to run them for ever! I expect that by the time I get to cycle 2000 the added shop heat will be a welcome addition to the heating budget at the Power shop. Right now .. it's a crime to be making any heat in hot shop in August. Doing PFC40 liquid coole chargers.. on a 80 Deg day, Well that wasted heat is not doing anybody any good. The set up is 4 cells in series, for a 12 volt..aka 16 volt pack, I have 4 modified MK3 Digi regs doing data collection, and Reg/charger feed back for the high and low Gard voltage feature. The Cycles.. is a 50 amp class charger set up as a Windloader, and a PFC30 Hanger Queen doing 30 amps of charge powerCute pile of equipment, finally earning it's keep. The Regs do dissapate and equalize the cells when they Reg at 4.01 volts, This keep the pack equalized on every charge off state. The cycler is programmed to hold peak volts of 16.00 until the amps taper to 5 amps on the charge side. And.. the regs hold any one cell in line as well as the charger. On discharge I cancell the draw down at the set floor voltage of 2.81 and when the current drops below 10 amps. So we do get a charge taper and a discharge taper. Works for Me. Any Questions? Rich Rudman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Manzanita Micro 360-297-7383, Cell 360-620-6266 Production shop 360-297-1660 FAX at Metal shop 1-360-297-3311 - Original Message - From: Sam Maynard [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Sunday, July 29, 2007 6:29 PM Subject: RE: A123 chemistry The ideal charge profile for the TS LiFePO4 chemistry is constant current of .3C to 80% SOC, then constant 4.2V to full, according to TS. I took delivery (Well, it wasn't exactly delivery, the air shipping agents were a PITA - reverse engineer the acronym) of some 40Ah and 90Ah LFP cells, and was impressed that the relaxed voltage was 3.31V for each of 45 cells on arrival, no deviation to the 2nd decimal place. I was looking to manifest a parallel float level maintainer (to buy storage time until BMS) when I measured each cell again 10 days later. Still 3.31V for each one after 10 days, although TS says self discharge is about 5% per month (or is that .5% ?). Although that is a relief, I know I have to come up with a safe parallel storage charger soon, and better yet, BMS/charge so they can be put on some 2-wheelers. Anyone who has already blazed this trail, advice appreciated (thanks Jukka-I'm sure you have your hands full too). Otherwise, I'll see what I can come up with and let you know how it works. -S Original Message --- Subject: RE: A123 chemistryrool From: Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri, July 27, 2007 8:38 pm To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu I had talked with them early, when they would talk to us normal people. and Since
EV digest 7088
EV Digest 7088 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Acid Coloring ? for Lead Acid Batteries by Michael Barkley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: DIY Electric Car Forums by Roger Daisley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision description by Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) RE: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires - tire width vs RR by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Acid Coloring ? for Lead Acid Batteries by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Honeywell DCP 700 Programmer Controller 120V by Michael Mohlere [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by Roderick Wilde [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Planning for the next conversion- Batteries and controllers by Don Buckshot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Planning for the next conversion- Batteries and controllers by Michael Mohlere [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by David Wilker [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Curtis controller voltage questions [was Re: Re: Could higher pack voltage be stepped down for Curtis input?] by Markus Lorch [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) RE: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Albright Contactor Failure Modes by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: [OT] Satellite Internet (was: DIY Electric Car Forums) by (-Phil-) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Low resistance wheels by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Belleville (or other) washers by Frank John [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Acid Coloring ? for Lead Acid Batteries by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Additional Motor Inductance/better acceleration by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) RE: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by Steven Ciciora [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Prestolite Timing, low frequency Curtis Start by Mark Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Is there an additive that can change the color of the battery acid, so that it can be seen in the battery a little easier? It would help me out quite alot when checking the acid level. What would really be cool, is if it would change color with regards to the specific gravity of the acid. Any chemists out there? ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Clearwire (WIMax) offers VOIP service in certain areas. ~~ BLOG: http://rdaisley.blogspot.com [New messages/photos daily] -Original Message- From: Zeke Yewdall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, July 30, 2007 2:51 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: DIY Electric Car Forums Nope -- VOIP cannot be used on any of the satellite internet services that I've checked out -- to high a latency due to going up to geosynchronous orbit and back. Plus, I think they are concerned about bandwidth -- because if you try to use VOIP, they will shut down your service. I have wildblue, and it is great -- I can work from home several days a week instead of commuting. I still have to have a landline for phone (cell phones don't work at my house) BUT we are getting WAY off topic here. On 7/30/07, Brian Jackson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I wonder if any of these satellite tv and internet companies offer phone service too. Or does satellite technology make cell phones viable for people who live in the country already? Anyway, this is where cable modems really shine and hopefully a satellite modem could do the same thing. When our house had dial-up, the only reason we had a land line at all was for the computer. We were already using cell phones. When we switched to cable, we disconnected the land line and saved ourselves that $25 per month. We also got rid of AOL, so we did not have to worry about that $25 a month anymore. We did have to upgrade our cell phone service, so there was some additional cost involved, but between the AOL charges and the Qwest charges, our COX cable bill was basically covered. Is a scenario like this possible with Satellite Internet? Brian Tim Humphrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: = I have a dial-up connection that normally connects as a fast 28.8 speed. This is the best that I can get since I live out in the country where cable and DSL is not available. I don't want to be a spammer but, Those of you caught in this situation may wish to consider www.wildblue.com Stay Charged! Hump I-5, Blossvale NY ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- On Jul 28, 2007, at 11:17 PM, Victor Tikhonov wrote: This is an option, so if you want it, you just get version with sensor, I don't see what is the worry. OHOH, few people said - EVision does too many things for their likes - they would be happy with $25 Ah raw counter, nothing more. I guess you get as many opinions as many people you ask. Oh - I think that was
EV digest 7089
EV Digest 7089 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Ni-MH cells and Chevron by Dmitri [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: Could higher pack voltage be stepped down for Curtis input? by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Remote State of Charge Display? by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: What happened to my post to John Wayland by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Tweety went swimming!! by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) RE: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by George Swartz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) re:few clarifications about LI ion technolgy by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Belleville (or other) washers by George Swartz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Timing, Inductance Bypass, oh my by Mark Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Belleville (or other) washers by Mark Grasser [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Belleville (or other) washers by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: EV Drag Video on Associate Press website by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) RE: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by Dale Ulan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) RE: Is GM Playing Games with the Volt? by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Timing, Inductance Bypass, oh my by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) RE: EV Drag Video on Associate Press website by Tim Humphrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Is GM Playing Games with the Volt? by Timothy Balcer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: EV Drag Video on Associate Press website by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) RE: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Ni-MH cells and Chevron by Larry Cronk [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- While the DeWalt packs are not a bad idea, he's gonna need a lot of packs to get to 40Ah, 17-18. That's a lot of them to charge individually with a DeWalt charger. - Original Message - From: Alan Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Monday, July 30, 2007 4:31 PM Subject: RE: Ni-MH cells and Chevron Hello James Drysdale, Jeff Shanab has a great point here. Think about getting some of the DeWalt 36 volt lithium battery packs on E-bay. And a charger. However, before you take them apart for the ten cells inside, consider using the pack as a whole. When you charge the pack with the DeWalt charger, I think you get each individual cell to the correct state of charge. The DeWalt pack has a small lead to each individual cell for monitoring the charge or discharge, I am not sure. By charging the packs correctly, they will perform and last well. I have seen pictures where the DeWalt flashlight tool was disassembled and used to mount a battery to a bicycle frame. Once several batteries are charged, they are close in voltage, and others have run two, three or four in parallel on a bicycle. If you go to 72 volts, you will be able to use more of your pack in series, and less in parallel. The DeWalt 36 volt charger completes the charge in just under one hour. You can stop for lunch and be charged if you can carry enough chargers. Contact me off list and I can send you the contact I have who uses the DeWalt batteries. He is helpful. I also received a wiring diagram on how to connect to the battery. Where are you from? Be careful purchasing on E-bay. I have found many good sellers, and one that ships slowly, who sells to the US and Australia. Check feedback on E-bay. Alan Brinkman -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Shanab Sent: Sunday, July 29, 2007 8:13 AM To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List Subject: RE: Ni-MH cells and Chevron 40ah for a bicycle? even at only 36V, that seems like an awfully large pack. I would think that the closest to lead acid in chargeing and balancing is actually the lifepo4 cells. The cost is, of course, the issue. As a test. 4-36V dewalt packs from ebay may be a good way. Take them apart to get at the main power as the built in controller is probably too low of amps That would only be only 9ah by 36V but the reduced weight helps range and they don't have problem with the amps. In this application it might be interesting to see if the built in controllers could work in parallel to provide an all in one soulution. You could even have two sets of packs and have one set on charge while the other is in use. 40AH * 36Volts of lead-acid is not really 40ah maybe 30 at low amps. 2hour instead of 20hour rate? 30ah * 36V in LiFePo4 (26650's) would be 11*13 =143 cells, and is 22lbs raw cell weight. (Inserted James Drysdale's question here) G'day all. First up, if you don't know me here, its because I don't yet have
EV digest 7090
EV Digest 7090 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: AGM battery emissions by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by Bukosky, Allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) RE: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters - AC motors by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) RE: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) RE: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires - tire width vs RR by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Tweety went swimming! by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: NEDRA board help on 3 wheeled vehicles by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Could higher pack voltage be stepped down for Curtis input? by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Curtis controller voltage questions [was Re: Re: Could higher pack voltage be stepped down for Curtis input?] by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Tweety went swimming!! by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) RE: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires - tire width vs RR by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: EV Drag Video on Associate Press website by ROBERT GOUDREAU [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) RE: Could higher pack voltage be stepped down for Curtis input? by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) AC forklift motor info by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: NEDRA board help on 3 wheeled vehicles by Timothy Balcer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Electric car vies for speed record (500 kph) by Colin Frame [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Electric car vies for speed record (500 kph) by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Truncated messages (Primer and distillation by an observer) by Timothy Balcer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Electric car vies for speed record (500 kph) by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Electric car vies for speed record (500 kph) by Timothy Balcer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) RE: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires - tire width vs RR by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Mark Freidberg wrote: Was it more of a tangy or rotten egg smell? A bit of both, I suppose, but definitely a distinct sulfur (rotten egg) smell. You have the chargers mounted where you can verify that each and every one has finished sucessfully before you drive away? Have you verified the outputs to confirm that each one is bringing its battery to the required voltage? Yes to both of these, and a Paktrakr has been onboard since May so the individual battery voltages are viewable in real-time. Great. (Perhaps you can tell us more about life with the PakTrakr in a different thread? I've just got a couple in to play with and will be evaluating it against my HP3497A data acquisition unit to see just how accurate the PakTrakr is from channel to channel.) When I was installing one of the newer replacements, I noticed it was stinky just handling it. That was prior to any charge, discharge, or connection to the pack. This makes me think that the so-called sealing valves in these batteries are really nothing of the sort. They are simply leaky. Brings new meaning to the expression 'to have gotten a few stinkers'! ;^ I doubt this has to do with sealing of the valves. I've received 100Ah AGMs from a customer for testing, and several were damaged in shipping such that the posts were just about broken right off and the post seals damaged. I cycled a pair of these damaged batteries while awaiting replacements and there was no noticable odour during charge or discharge despite the fact that they were venting noticably around the posts where the seals were compromised. With subsequent trips, other old batts have become the weak ones. When they've tumbled below 9.5 volts after too few miles on a trip, they've been replaced. 9.5V is kind of low; ordinarily 10.5V under load is considered 100%DOD. If less than 9.5V after too few miles is grounds for replacement, what are the good batteries holding under the same conditions? Plus, 1 Deka Dominator 8G31 gel was installed late last week. Simply to see if it would be less stinky. So far it seems the gel might be less stinky (or not stinky at all) then the AGMs. I've got some experience with the 8G31's and can say with some confidence that they should not smell at all; not when new, not when driving, and not when charging. So that makes for a total of 12 batts. Six are upright, six on their sides. Have you noticed any trend either with the stinkers or weaklings tending to be more likely to occur in the upright or laid down sets? Of the ones on their sides, have you noticed any dampness/droplets anywhere near the terminals or vents, or generally anywhere near the top of the battery case, or the seam where the case top is joined
EV digest 7091
\___/ | - | _| series |/_||_| |_ motor S2 | B+|_|_ |_| || D1 /_\ |_| field __|__ +| |___|_| ___ 144 | |_| |M- | -| -||_ Q1 | || | | | ||_| | Controller B-|_| Close either S1 or S2 to be using 14-cell mode or 17-cell mode, respectively. Start off in 14-cell mode, then switch to 17-cell mode when up to speed. Controller never sees more the 144V across it. Charge the two battery strings separately. Bill Dennis ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- It seems the information is copied from the A123 data :) LMAO !!! With few years with TS LFP cells and always charging to 4,3 V has very little effect on the lifetime. Thou... I will post here some data by the end of this week about the cycle test on LFP-30 cell. I have several vehicles with LFPs on the roads. The cells do not give out the name plate capacity unless you take it to the 4,3 V. Charging is stopped when the current is less than few amps. The voltage drops quite fast down to 3-3,2 V in driving. But stays there until about 20% SOC. then it drops nicely to 2,7 V. Stays there for a while.. and then drops like a rock to 2V. This is how LFP-350 cells behave. They give 100% DOD cycles out (from 2V to 4,3V) over 1000. In my case I can expect at least 700 000 km (430 000 miles) on the Bus batteries (before less than 60% 0f original capacity). :) I rarely drive more than 100 km a day with the bus green moster ( http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1009 ). TS cells are MUCH different from A123s. Tolerances and purities are WAY different. A123 guys, try to make your cells with purufied tab water. :) If you'd know how cheap they are to make you would S#!@ your pants ! Thou A123s can out perform the TS in power, cyclic life and capacity. TS beats with the price. Thou.. I STILL like more LiCo cells... I need energy dense batteries... -Jukka Marcin Ciosek kirjoitti: The information available on Thundersky and Everspring's website kept me wonder why they are giving such wide voltage range for charging. First I though that TS product is a bit different in cathode/anode chemistry but MSDS gives straight information about what's inside. So I asked a company that ordered BMSes for TS project to send me a piece or two for investigation. Meanwhile I tried to contact Everspring representative and get some information. I was answered by Keith Lau: I am not too sure about your question. Anyway, the norminal voltage of TS-LFP series is about 3.2V.2v to 3.6v is basically a limit of safety operation of the battery; in other words, you cannot charge over 3.6 v and you cannot allow the battery discharge below 2.0v. In normal circumstance, you may just want to charge upto 3.45v and discharge to 2.6v which will account for over 95% of the battery capacity. MC I know LiFP batteries are safe for overcharge but doing it constatnly MC leads to shorten battery life. you are correct. Overcharging is the major problem leads to the shorten battery life or even battery damaged. And in the meantime lab tests gave me results that charging TS with 3.6 V limit gives full charge withing 10% longer period of time than under overvoltage. That's all I know. Generally TS business is a bit strange, their websites are full of inconsistent information that can lead even to cell destruction. Marcin ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hydrogen is not a fuel. It IS an energy carrier, or storage medium much as a battery or capacitor.. If the electrons from the storage medium power an electric motor, then technically it IS an EV. Maybe we could rename our group the BEVDL, or Battery Electric Vehicle Discussion List and limit our arguments to what batteries get the best performance, or how to maintain them better. It seems you are now the one with the closed mind, and blindly following the mantra of if its not batteries its not electric, yada yada yada. I'm not one to favour the hydrogen hype because it is such an inefficient form of energy storage. However to stay technically correct, but not argue for that side, I would say the Fuel Cell powered vehicle are EV's if they power electric motors. - Original Message - From: Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 11:39 am Subject: Re: Electric car vies for speed record (500 kph) To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G wrote: Why do you say it is NOT an electric vehicle? I don't see a gas engine of any type on there. A fuel cell generates ELECTRICITY and the primary drive mechanism is an ELECTRIC Motor. Just because the fuel is hydrogen doesn't mean it is not electric. They are just making it aboard instead of charging it externally
EV digest 7092
EV Digest 7092 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Define EV ! Was:Re: Electric car vies for speed record (500 kph) by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: A123 chemistry by Dmitri [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Battery question by Freddie Hartsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: E-dragsters go for gas-powered records by Chip Gribben [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Insurance by damon henry [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Define EV ! Was:Re: Electric car vies for speed record (500 kph) by MIKE WILLMON [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: E-dragsters go for gas-powered records by MIKE WILLMON [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Jukkas toy bus .. was:Re: A123 chemistry by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Tweety went swimming!! by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Insurance by David Wilker [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Define EV ! Was:Re: Electric car vies for speed record (500 kph) by Andrew Kane [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Insurance by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Insurance by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Metric splined shaft coupler for Siemens motor by Tehben Dean [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Jukkas toy bus .. was:Re: A123 chemistry by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Trying again by Phelps [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Tweety went swimming!! by Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Tweety went swimming!! by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Which type by Phelps [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Trying again by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Trying again by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- There's a place for a survey again :) I have defined a vehicle as EV when they use 100% electric drivetrain and can be charged with electricity from most outlets out there. It has to eat electrons. Fool cells can be done to do that but I have no record if such vehicles exist and have been sold. Such type of vehicle would be EV for me. Hydrogen is a energy media. As are Lions and SLAs. I think the EV has been defined already in mid 19th century. Fool cells were not there by then (I think). Fool cells are fool cells.. that's it. Required efficiency is not there. And will never be... (WKTEC = Mechanical rabbit..) -Jukka Zeke Yewdall kirjoitti: Well, the way I classify it, the whole purpose of an electric vehicle is to be able to refuel it on site without importing power (I have a PV array, so I do not have to import electricity) Hybrid electrics, I cannot fill up with electricity -- so though they may technically be electric, but don't meet my criteria for WHY to have an electric. If you make a plug in hybrid, then yes it is (as long as I can run it without putting gas in it almost all the time). If I can generate hydrogen on site with my electricity, and use it as the energy carrier, instead of batteries, then I'm fine with that (the only problem is that the round trip efficiency of this is pretty bad compared to batteries). If I have to buy hydrogen that is made from reformed natural gas that defeats the purpose. For racing purposes, I'd say whether it is an electric vehicle could be a bit broader -- because yes, people do charge them from an ICE generate before the race sometimes. But there I'm more concerned with drivetrain details than fuel per se, I guess. Indecisive... Z On 7/31/07, MIKE WILLMON [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hydrogen is not a fuel. It IS an energy carrier, or storage medium much as a battery or capacitor.. If the electrons from the storage medium power an electric motor, then technically it IS an EV. Maybe we could rename our group the BEVDL, or Battery Electric Vehicle Discussion List and limit our arguments to what batteries get the best performance, or how to maintain them better. It seems you are now the one with the closed mind, and blindly following the mantra of if its not batteries its not electric, yada yada yada. I'm not one to favour the hydrogen hype because it is such an inefficient form of energy storage. However to stay technically correct, but not argue for that side, I would say the Fuel Cell powered vehicle are EV's if they power electric motors. - Original Message - From: Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 11:39 am Subject: Re: Electric car vies for speed record (500 kph) To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G wrote: Why do you say it is NOT an electric vehicle? I don't see a gas engine of any type on there. A fuel cell generates ELECTRICITY and the primary drive mechanism is an ELECTRIC Motor. Just because the fuel is hydrogen doesn't mean it is not electric. They are just making it aboard instead of charging it externally
EV digest 7082
. Sometimes two pots and an idle switch. The triple pot gives the most redundancy as a single failure can be isolated and a trusted value generated. GM has done that for some time. The EV1 used a triple pot as well. I have not used one in an EV but I intend on it. I've written ICE engine control software to use them, and at work we use them on CNG vehicles all of the time (my day job). -Dale ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hey John and Roderick and all! Aaron Clark from AP called while I was on vacation last week to follow up with questions concerning the article. He had asked where I thought EV racing was heading and was interested in the amount of cars that show up and the amount of sanctioned races we have each year. I gave a pretty positive response but in hindsight should have re-emphasized the tremendous leaps EVs have made these past 10 years. But I didn't think it warranted much emphasis since he was there to see it for himself at your race! It's right there on YouTube. You beat a hot Mustang for crying out loud. But I don't think the point should be to beat the fastest ICE car, at least not right now. Especially, if Aaron and the NHRA compare the Zombie to the fastest ICE cars which are Top Fueler Funny Cars and Dragsters which don't even use gas. They use alcohol or something exotic formulated specifically for racing, with just enough fuel to make the run. And they have big corporate sponsors behind them. The Army being the one sponsoring the fastest dragster (from what I remember) Plus you need a special NHRA license to drive under 10 or 9 seconds in the NHRA. If Aaron and the NHRA is comparing the Zombie to those types of vehicles, it's not even a fair comparison by a long shot. Those are completely different vehicles altogether. The step above that is the Sportsman series racers and they are running full cages and are completely tubbed out. The Zombie isn't even in the NEDRA Extreme Class which besides the Dragster classes are the closest classes we have to those vehicles. The NHRA should know better then to make that comparison with Zombie. They themselves should have give Zombie credit for the competition it's giving cars in it's respective ICE classes. That's where the Zombie is knocking off the competition. That NHRA official didn't even acknowledge the 60 foot times or is he even paying attention? I think the NHRA was wa out of line here with that remark, but not surprising. OK, true we aren't there yet. But at least make a fairer comparison between the respective ICE and EV classes when spouting off assumptions. The Zombie with two motors on a skewer handily beat out a 400 ci Pontiac muscle car for crying out loud. I'm surprised the NHRA hasn't considered the ramifications of those little electric motors beating out the big blocks that have dominated the drag strips for all these years. That's where the story should be. I think we will be there very soon and will have that NHRA character eating his own words. Chip Gribben NEDRA http://www.nedra.com On Jul 29, 2007, at 9:46 PM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote: From: John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: July 29, 2007 9:21:02 PM EDT To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: EVs are slower than ICEs...for now Hello to All, Bill Dube wrote: I have to agree with Jim on this one. The article gave a very balanced account of the present state of EV drag racing in the context of ICE drag racing. And I have to disagree, big time. Comparing a street legal sedan to an all-out funny car is not by any stretch of the imagination, balanced! That's exactly what Mr. Clark did when he cited White Zombie's 11.4 ET and then in the same line, said it was 6.4 seconds off the best top fuel record...you call that balanced? We aren't _the_ very fastest yet. I nor anyone in our crew, nor any other team of EV racers have ever made a claim like that. It is a fact that the fastest EVs are not as fast as the fastest ICEs on the drag strip at this time. Who has ever said this? What we do say and what we do, is compare our EV's performance to similar gas cars' performance...and this is important...in the same racing class. I compare my street legal EV that is driven to the track to other street legal gas cars driven to the track, and I never, ever say we are faster than any gas car...ever. I do point out when we are the quickest car at the track on a given night. I also, to help non-car nut folks appreciate what our EV's performance is like, often compare our car to factory available street cars. This is valid and fun, as it raises quite a few eyebrows to learn that a backyard converted electric car can waste a Porsche, Vette, or Ferrari in the 1/4 mile drag! To argue against this is foolish. To argue that our EV is quicker than 'any' other gas car is for sure, foolish, because there will always be somebody quicker
EV digest 7083
EV Digest 7083 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Is GM Playing Games with the Volt? by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Is GM Playing Games with the Volt? by Brian Jackson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Ni-MH cells and Chevron (Re: EV digest 7078) by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Is GM Playing Games with the Volt? by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) RE: Is GM Playing Games with the Volt? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Is GM Playing Games with the Volt? by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) RE: Is GM Playing Games with the Volt? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Modifying a zilla speed sensor by Eric Poulsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: New Lion Electric Vehicles. Starting under 30k. by Peter Eckhoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: AGNS takes NEDRA record # 6 by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Battery for a Bicycle? by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Planning for the next conversion- Batteries and controllers by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Ni-MH cells and Chevron (Re: EV digest 7078) by Jack Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by Mark Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) NEDRA board help on 3 wheeled vehicles by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Additional Motor Inductance/better acceleration by Mark Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Planning for the next conversion- Batteries and controllers by Don Buckshot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Planning for the next conversion- Batteries and controllers by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) CNN Money: Have you driven a Fjord lately? by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: what does Ah or ampere hour signify by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: solid state relays by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) E-Dragsters Go for Gas-Powered Records by Ralph Merwin [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: FW: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor by Tim Humphrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: NEDRA board help on 3 wheeled vehicles by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Jims EV Raffle was RE:NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor by Tim Humphrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: Neutral Timing is Better for Commuters by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Tim Humphrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 28) Re: NEDRA board help on 3 wheeled vehicles by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 29) photos of OJ and AGNS by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- nothing much about the volt in the article someone should track down the prototype and see if they are actually working on it. some industrial espionage if you will I'm guessing they are still not committed to it. We have to keep the pressure on them Dan Marc Geller wrote: Is GM Playing Games with the Volt? http://www.plugsandcars.blogspot.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- God! for GM to put the Volt on the back burner right now would be a huge mistake for the company. General Motors NEEDS a car like this. The company has an image deficit compared to Toyota and Honda. I sure hope they get the Volt into production before Toyota gets their plug-in Prius to market. Brian Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: = nothing much about the volt in the article someone should track down the prototype and see if they are actually working on it. some industrial espionage if you will I'm guessing they are still not committed to it. We have to keep the pressure on them Dan Marc Geller wrote: Is GM Playing Games with the Volt? http://www.plugsandcars.blogspot.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- In my experience, the only nickel batteries with decent power output are in Sub-C size, since they're targeted at the industrial market. Decent brands will usually claim 10C continuous discharge rates. The downside is they only go up to about 3000mAh. Other sizes (AA/C/D) are aimed at consumer devices - torches, radios, that sort of thing - so aren't designed to put out much juice. I actually played with a handful of those Tenergy AA cells as well and was fairly disappointed, I could only pull ~2C out of them. -Ian On 30/07/2007, at 9:08 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Unfortunately, I have tried that Tenergy D cell, and it is crap. I bought a bunch of Tenergy AA cells to make a NiMh battery for a friend's mobility scooter. The 2600mAh cells tested at about 1900. It will be interesting to see how they hold up. I emailed the factory and their online store and got no response. Bill ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I hope they do too but satanists are known for their poor grasp on right and wrong. It's not like they were unware of the benefits of the EV1 when they killed that.. When they smashed them in the desert.. I would be quite surprised if they did the right
EV digest 7087
EV Digest 7087 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: CNN Money: Have you driven a Fjord lately? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Brian Jackson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Another NHRA anomaly by David (Battery Boy) Hawkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Think/Stirling/Big Brother/Public Utilities by Tom Gocze [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) RE: Is GM Playing Games with the Volt? by Michaela Merz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: With barely a sound, electric dragsters aim for gas-powered records by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: With barely a sound, electric dragsters aim for gas-powered records by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: With barely a sound, electric dragsters aim for gas-powered records by MIKE WILLMON [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Could higher pack voltage be stepped down for Curtis input? by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: With barely a sound, electric dragsters aim for gas-powered records by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Is GM Playing Games with the Volt? by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: What happened to my post to John Wayland by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Is GM Playing Games with the Volt? by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: With barely a sound, electric dragsters aim for gas-powered records by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires - tire width vs RR by Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: What happened to my post to John Wayland by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: What happened to my post to John Wayland by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) What exactly happened? (Battricide) by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: NEDRA board help on 3 wheeled vehicles by Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: What happened to my post to John Wayland by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: NEDRA board help on 3 wheeled vehicles by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: What exactly happened? (Battricide) by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) RE: AGM battery emissions by Mark Freidberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- David One minor but interesting point I noticed - Think seems to have David lost its bang (!). It used to be Th!nk. Has anybody seen it? David ;-) It's still on their website: http://www.think.no/ Skip ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I wonder if any of these satellite tv and internet companies offer phone service too. Or does satellite technology make cell phones viable for people who live in the country already? Anyway, this is where cable modems really shine and hopefully a satellite modem could do the same thing. When our house had dial-up, the only reason we had a land line at all was for the computer. We were already using cell phones. When we switched to cable, we disconnected the land line and saved ourselves that $25 per month. We also got rid of AOL, so we did not have to worry about that $25 a month anymore. We did have to upgrade our cell phone service, so there was some additional cost involved, but between the AOL charges and the Qwest charges, our COX cable bill was basically covered. Is a scenario like this possible with Satellite Internet? Brian Tim Humphrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: = I have a dial-up connection that normally connects as a fast 28.8 speed. This is the best that I can get since I live out in the country where cable and DSL is not available. I don't want to be a spammer but, Those of you caught in this situation may wish to consider www.wildblue.com Stay Charged! Hump I-5, Blossvale NY ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Nope -- VOIP cannot be used on any of the satellite internet services that I've checked out -- to high a latency due to going up to geosynchronous orbit and back. Plus, I think they are concerned about bandwidth -- because if you try to use VOIP, they will shut down your service. I have wildblue, and it is great -- I can work from home several days a week instead of commuting. I still have to have a landline for phone (cell phones don't work at my house) BUT we are getting WAY off topic here. On 7/30/07, Brian Jackson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I wonder if any of these satellite tv and internet companies offer phone service too. Or does satellite technology make cell phones viable for people who live in the country already? Anyway, this is where cable modems really shine and hopefully a satellite modem could do the same thing. When our house had dial-up, the only reason we had a land line at all was for the computer. We were already using cell phones. When we switched to cable, we disconnected the land line and saved
EV digest 7081
provided the voltages are somewhere close (for efficiency), and you have enough current capacity in whatever you use to hold up the bus. If you have enough battery strings and converters to support the full motor current, then you only need caps on the bus, otherwise, it's a hybrid pack with maybe some AGM's or that sort of thing on the bus, as you mentioned. Possibly with smart phasing of each converter on the bus, you can limit the ripple currents on the caps? -Dale ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- The ideal charge profile for the TS LiFePO4 chemistry is constant current of .3C to 80% SOC, then constant 4.2V to full, according to TS. I took delivery (Well, it wasn't exactly delivery, the air shipping agents were a PITA - reverse engineer the acronym) of some 40Ah and 90Ah LFP cells, and was impressed that the relaxed voltage was 3.31V for each of 45 cells on arrival, no deviation to the 2nd decimal place. I was looking to manifest a parallel float level maintainer (to buy storage time until BMS) when I measured each cell again 10 days later. Still 3.31V for each one after 10 days, although TS says self discharge is about 5% per month (or is that .5% ?). Although that is a relief, I know I have to come up with a safe parallel storage charger soon, and better yet, BMS/charge so they can be put on some 2-wheelers. Anyone who has already blazed this trail, advice appreciated (thanks Jukka-I'm sure you have your hands full too). Otherwise, I'll see what I can come up with and let you know how it works. -S Original Message --- Subject: RE: A123 chemistryrool From: Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri, July 27, 2007 8:38 pm To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu I had talked with them early, when they would talk to us normal people. and Since then,via email, to the factory in china that claims to make the cells for them until they get their own plant going and in boththis conversations they have said Lithium-Iron-Phosphate. But it is easier than this to check. Get out your voltmeter. Lithium cobalt 3.6Vnominal 4.25Max charge Lithium Iron Phosphate 3.2-3.4 3.7 max charge (Easy to tell) Lithium-magenese 3.7-3.8 Nominal 4.2Max charge (ok, hard to tell compared to cobalt) http://www.batteryuniversity.com/partone-5A.htm ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Look at the ALLTRAX 7245, that is what I'm running in my 94' Eclipse. The voltage range actually has a 90vdc limit in it's programming, so I bumped my main battery bank voltage up to 78vdc. I also power the field of my aircraft generator with a separate 24volt battery pack (12 volts didn't have enough torque, 36volts kept ripping the rubber motor mounts out and ruined a CV joint, 24volts seems to give me enough torque at inclines, and can keep the car running highway speeds) , therefore leaving all the main pack juice for the armature. Look at it at: www.texomaev.com --- Eduardo Kaftanski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sun, Jul 29, 2007 at 06:45:35PM -0400, Phelps wrote: Ok.. It is time for me to look at buying a controller.. Like I have stated before I have a Motor that takes 30 volts at 300 amps,, However I am planing on using 36 volts and I guess at times that would bring the current up to 360 amps . It is a air craft starter engine. My car will weight no more than 1500 pounds when done and that's with the batteries and all.. What are my choices for controllers that would do a good job for this?? I am also assuming that 36 volts will be ok when I use a controller? I am more or less in the same bandwagon and plan to buy a 72volts Alltrax. -- Eduardo K.| Darwin pone las reglas. http://www.carfun.cl | Murphy, la oportunidad. http://ev.nn.cl | | Yo. ---End Message---
EV digest 7073
EV Digest 7073 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Zilla Radiator- Fan/ no Fan by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision replaces all gauges in White Zombie by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: was DIY Electric now forums redux by Tehben Dean [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision replaces all gauges in White Zombie by Tehben Dean [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) battery management and power distribution system design by gulabrao ingle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) RE: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Insurance by Bart Grabman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) My Appologies Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision description by Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision description by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) RE: DIY Electric Car Forums by Freddie Hartsell [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: A123 chemistry by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: My Appologies Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by =?windows-1252?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Insurance by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- I just had some problems with an undersized pump and a no fan radiator.(tranny cooler) It had lasted a year but I noticed that when it was warm, the zilla was fine untill I get to a light, then pulling away from the light it would go into thermal protect(just about snapped my neck) BTW, Isn't that pump from ev source awsome! I went to that pump and switched to the smaller radiator like he had on his site and added a 120mm 12V fan. on the lowest speed on the hotter days, after finding all the red lights on the way home. It overheated once. I turned the fan up to speed two and all is well now. Doesn't even get warm to the touch. Remember this if running adds 10W/min of heat and accelerating adds 100W/min of heat if you are adding 150W/5min and are pulling out 30W/min you will not overheat, but if you are only pulling out 29W/min that extra watt/min will acumulate. The next stoplight the temperature difference in the zilla heat exchanger is less so more flow will be required to take out the watts of heat and the watts of heat from the last cycle. It can get out of hand pretty quick. The fan lets the system catch up the pulses of heat from the accelerations at the stoplights when you aren't moving air past the radiator. You need it. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- You should put a video of the EVision on youtube! On 7/27/07, Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'll be releasing them for general sale in about 4 weeks. John got to give me a feedback first... Victor Hey Victor If it can survive Wayland you're golden 8^) I'm guessing you or Tim put it in or he'd have broke it already ;^) Congrats on developing what looks like an awesome unit, I wish you much success with it and it's a total win, win, for both you and EVeryone with an EV. Anyway I just got this picture of you as you pondered... who can I get to try and break it, LMAO! Just one answer, hehe. Cya Jim Husted Hi-Torque Electric Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story. Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games. http://sims.yahoo.com/ ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Umm, that is only an advantage if you are crazy enough to use Digest mode. Most people I know just get each email as it comes in, which is real-time posting. Except email takes random amount of time to arrive at list... in my experience. -- Tehben '90 Toyota 4x4 Pickup 'hElix EV' evalbum: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1225 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- What is the diameter of the face of evision? Any more info on power steering control? On 7/27/07, Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You should put a video of the EVision on youtube! On 7/27/07, Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'll be releasing them for general sale in about 4 weeks. John got to give me a feedback first... Victor Hey Victor If it can survive Wayland you're golden 8^) I'm guessing you or Tim put it in or he'd have broke it already ;^) Congrats on developing what looks like an awesome unit, I wish you much success with it and it's a total win, win, for both you and EVeryone with an
EV digest 7074
EV Digest 7074 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: battery management and power distribution system design by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: AGNS and OJ make record runs in Memphis, TN by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision description by Bill Dennis [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Insurance by Jerry Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Battery for a Bicycle? by vehiculeselectriques.free.fr [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Fwd: battery management and power distribution system design by gulabrao ingle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) RE: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Fwd: battery management and power distribution system design 2 (message got truncated) by gulabrao ingle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: A123 chemistry by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Insurance by Kip C. Anderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Insurance by joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: parallel batteries by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Potenza RE92/LRR tires by Jerry McIntire [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: AGNS and OJ make record runs in Memphis, TN by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: AGNS and OJ make record runs in Memphis, TN by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) checking claims for couregges exe and tesla roadster by gulabrao ingle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Zilla Radiator- Fan/ no Fan by Mark Dutko [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: forums redux by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: forums redux by Keith Richtman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) RE: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision description by Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: forums redux by Tehben Dean [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) With barely a sound, electric dragsters aim for gas-powered records by ROBERT GOUDREAU [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Hello Gulabrao, Using pb-acid for 120 mile range with a maximum discharge to 50% DOD, which is the preferred max discharge for long life and very little balancing, the total vehicle weight will never catch up to the battery and net vehicle weight. If you can hold your maximum discharge to about 25% DOD, or 75% State of Charge, then you will not need any battery management system. For the last 32 years, the maximum discharge rate is to 25% DOD for about 99% of the time. The other 1% was testing once to 50% DOD. This means I carry four times the AH battery I need for my range for a 25% DOD, no BMS, and replacements average of 12 years. For my vehicle of 7000 lbs, (use to weigh 8000 lbs with 300 AH batteries), with 2400 lbs of batteries my range is limited to 50 miles at 50% DOD maximum, but I recharge at 25% DOD. To increase this range to 150 miles at 50 mph and only discharge the Pb-acid to 50% for a 7000 lb EV, but the batteries would be 9600 lbs for a 1040 AH cell plus the total weight of the vehicle would be about 14,000 lbs. Even if reduce the net weight of the EV to 3500 lbs, it still takes 4320 lbs of PB-acid which the vehicle total weight will now be about 7620 lbs using 520 AH battery. My first pack which was 90 cells 18 inches high, weigh 4500 lbs which was place in a 3200 lb vehicle had a range of 50 miles at 50% DOD so it does make your 120 miles at 50 mph at 50% and these were proto type cobalt cells which some of the li-ion cells are using now. This EV before I received it, was test ran for 24 hours, running at a average of 44 mph and fast charge every 60 minutes for 15 to 20 minutes at charge amperes up to 200 amps. The EV ran 1056 miles in 24 hours with maximum discharge rates of 30% to 50% DOD. So the more batteries you carry, the weight go's up, the more power it takes to move, the range barely increases. Roland - Original Message - From: gulabrao ingle [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Saturday, July 28, 2007 12:16 AM Subject: battery management and power distribution system design Hello All, I want to know what kind of battery management system or power distribution system has be constructed in order to meet the following criteria, also what cost will be incurred in it and can it be made at home, 1. instead of all batteries discharging equally together can there be a system in which small sets of 2-3 batteries discharge more than the rest of the pack without the overall pack voltage becoming down. 2. these small sets once discharged are disconnected and then are charged by an external means like an alternator or solar panels 3. once fully charged they are again connected to the main pack and another small set which has become discharged takes their place at the charging port 4.
EV digest 7075
you have on your vehicle? What company do you use? How much do you pay? ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I'm in. -- Manny http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1117 http://EVorBust.blogspot.com On 7/28/07, Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Between the different NEDRA EVent's it's close to being a quarterly raffle thing already 8^P As a small shop it'd be nice to eventually start building at least a few for sale 8^o Jim, You put a lot of time and effort into these motors and are one of the critical players in making all of the new EV records! Here's another idea, you put together a nice 8 or 9 motor and raffle it out on YOUR paypal account! These type of raffles seam to raise considerable money for charities (raffling a car for example). I may be a cheapskate and acquire many many of my parts free like you mentioned earlier, but I would be willing to risk $20 to win one of your motors. Heck, with only 200 people playing your raffle you would have enough money to by a Zilla for YOUR own EV (and the chances of winning would be pretty good :-). I think everybody on the list would like to see 'the motor guy' get his own EV. So, what do you think? a raffle for Jim Husted to help him get his own EV on the road! Perhaps if you hit a goal of x dollars you could include the cost of shipping and handling using part of the raffle money. Rod ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- HI, Jeff Are you saying that narrower tires have lower or higher RR? Or neither? I'm not sure I follow your train of thought. From: Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2007 20:17:54 -0700 Tire rolling resistance relative to width. Because the narrower tire ends up with more weight per square inch and an therefore a larger flatspot and higher force to multiply by the friction coeffient it tends to balance out with the narrower but longer patch. But a large change either direction from optimal is noticable. I disagree. with the first statement here. The only thing that really affects the weight per square inch of the tire on the road (contact patch pressure) is the tire pressure.The exception is for a tire with VERY low air pressure, where the sidewalls support more of the weight. This is from how stuff works For your 2-ton (4,000 lb) car, you will find that the area of the contact patch is about equal to the weight of the car divided by the tire pressure. In this case 4,000 pounds divided by 30 pounds per square inch equals 133 square inches. That may seem like a lot, but your car's tires are probably about 7 inches wide. That means that the contact patch for each tire will be about 4.75 inches long. And as far as rolling resistance, friction with the road is not the major factor. The energy loss is mostly due to hysteresis ( damping, or loss) in the tire itself. This is from page 96 of TIRES AND PASSENGER VEHICLE FUEL ECONOMYTRANSPORTATION RESEARCH BOARDSPECIAL REPORT 286 The main source of rolling resistance is hysteresis, which is caused by the viscoelastic response of the rubber compounds in the tire as it rotates under load. The repeated tire deformation and recovery causes mechan- ical energy to be converted to heat; hence additional mechanical energy must be supplied to drive the axle. The design characteristics of a tire that affect this energy loss are its construction; geometric dimensions; and materials types, formulations, and volume. The tread, in particular, has a major role in hysteresis because it contains large amounts of viscoelastic rubber material. As tread wears, a tireÂ’s rolling resistance declines, primar- ily because of the reduction in the amount of viscoelastic material. The report goes on to say that there is no conclusive correlation between tire width and rolling resistance. They do have a couple of interesting things to say, though. They state that RR is reduced as tire temperature rises, so that the RR is higher when the car starts out. That might be one factor in reduced winter range of EV's - the higher tire RR in cold weather. They also say the RR drops as the tread wears - an average of about 20%, because most of the loss is in the tread. Phil The key to a low rolling resistance tire is not as simple as people assume. Mainly a more flexible rubber that doesn't just rub off by adding silica, the ability to be kept rounder with more air pressure without being made stiffer by using a higher thread count of more flexible threads in the casing and a diagonal ply arrangement on the side-walls to allow them to flex without absorbing too much energy. As the tire goes around the side walls are forced to flex and unflex and the road pushing against the rolling tire forming a teardrop distortion that adds drag. The addition of silica
EV digest 7072
EV Digest 7072 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Air-cooled VW to 8 Motor adaptor plate Question by Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: parallel batteries by Jack Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision replaces all gauges in White Zombie by Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: was DIY Electric now forums redux by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires by MIKE WILLMON [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Air-cooled VW to 8 Motor adaptor plate Question by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Lester SCR Battery Charger by Tom Gocze [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Controller precharge resistor drain? by Roger Daisley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision replaces all gauges in White Zombie by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) RE: Air-cooled VW to 8 Motor adaptor plate Question by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor by Michael Barkley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) AMC project motor, DIY potbox kit thoughts by James Massey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor by Tim Brehm [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Air-cooled VW to 8 Motor adaptor plate Question by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor by Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Controller precharge resistor drain? by James Massey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) RE: A123 chemistry by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: NEDRA Nationals Raffle motor by Dave Cover [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- I see this is lacking responses. I don't have one apart at this time but I have in the past... On Jul 24, 2007, at 11:59 PM, Mike Willmon wrote: The stock flywheel seems to have to set down about ~3/8 into the housing with about an RCH clearance. I mean its pretty tight. The flywheel doesn't seem to be perfectly true or else the alignment holes are not prefectly true on center because it rubs the housing. We wound up trying 3 different flywheels as well as rotating them 90 degrees until just about the last one fit and didn't rub the side of the adaptor housing. So has anyone done a Bug that can tell us if the flywheel is supposed to sit down inside that housing, or are we mounting it in too far? If it is supposed to fit inside somewhat, is there any problem turning off the ring gear as well as .125 off the OD. The Beetle flywheel sits just *slightly* inside the stock engine case. The amount is not very much, I don't think any part of the flywheel is outside the face of the transaxle (in other words, its inside by less than the thickness of the centering ring on the back of the engine.) The ring gear should be completely inside the transaxle. You mentioned that one flywheel fit. You should make sure its not a 180mm clutch flywheel. That's no fair and no good (they have enough trouble with later stock VW engines, that's why VW went to a 200mm clutch.) While we got one iteration of our different fitments to work without rubbing I'm concerned that the weight of the motor hanging unsupported off the transaxle might set down on the flywheel causing it to rub again. Would .125 off the O.D. be sufficient clearance? Things here better not be moving! The Beetle had no problem hanging a 247 lb. engine off the back of the transaxle. Shake, rattle, and roll, it was never a problem (unless someone didn't tighten the bolts!) When grinding out a 40HP tranny to fit a 200mm clutch flywheel its not uncommon to stop grinding with only 0.01 inch of clearance for the larger ring gear. HTH, Paul neon Gooch ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- NiMH parallel no problem to discharge. They can't be charged in parallel because their voltage drops once fully charged, but they still accept current, so the other strings will continue to overcharged the weakest one to death. The solution is to use a switch or diode so a string can't be charged by another one, and charge each string independently. You need a BMS to handle it, its not difficult, just adds expense, but adds a lot of other value as well, like balancing and monitoring. Jack Dale Ulan wrote: As I understand it, lead acid batteries work okay being in parallel and NiMH don't work well in parallel. Question for those who have more knowledge on this point... NiMH don't parallel well, but what about having several strings that are either higher or lower in voltage than the motor+controller need, and a buck/boost bidirectional converter for each string,
EV digest 7066
in quantities of about 10 or so at a time, and if I am reading the specs correctly I should be able to configure one I/O to monitor each cell voltage. I think I would still have another completely seperate channels left over which I could configure to take a reading of the discharge current off a shunt. I've never worked with a device like this however, so I'm not sure I am reading everything correctly. Does my plan look feasible? thanks Damon _ http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-usocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_2G_0507 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I do this kind of work for a living. I would only attempt this if the owner of this list contacted me directly. Otherwise I would not think that such an endeavor would be worthwhile. Yes the DIY forums are probably going to get some hits. Yes I signed up for it when I saw the original post. Yes I prefer the look of a web based forum. Yes I prefer to the speed of a mailing list. Yes I could make it to where you received an email for every new post. No you would not need to log into the web to reply to a post. Yes you could post a new topic without having to log into. Yes it would be easier to search than the current mailing list(thanks Google). Yes you would be able to unsubscribe to a particular thread if you started to think that it was getting off topic. No it would probably not be quite as fast as the current system (That's an awful big loop algorithm to detect who's is subscribed to a particular topic and who is not.) Once again if the current administrator of this mailing list was to contact me I would develop the software for this for free but probably not otherwise. Out of respect for the current administrator of this mailing list this will be my last reply to the group on this particular topic. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lee Hart Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2007 12:49 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: DIY Electric Car Forums From: Lee Hart It seems to me that what is needed is a 'bridge' from the EVDL to a more modern, attractive, glamourous web-based viewer... But here's the problem. Nobody wants to do the work. They want to automate the above process, with some software package (that they didn't write, either). The software isn't smart enough to do any of the above things right, so it winds up doing a half-assed job of it, creating more problems than it solves. It looks prettier, but works worse. damon henry wrote: Ouch Lee, I was reading through your list and immediately my mind started thinking of how to automate all the things you were listing off, and then you totally shot me down... You're probably right though, it would be very difficult to come up with an intelligent enough system to put it all together and certainly no one would take on the task of doing all that work manually. To my credit however, I was not thinking of using someone else's software to do the job :-) Ah, now if you could write your own software to do this (or at least to automate most of it and make the rest simpler for the moderator), then I think you could pull it off! -- Ring the bells that still can ring Forget the perfect offering There is a crack in everything That's how the light gets in--Leonard Cohen -- Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Thanks, Lawrence. The vectrix seems like a very well-finished piece. I'd like to see some competition for it (as that's good for everyone), especially the more sporting model they've hinted at. Lon Hull, Portland, OR - Original Message - From: Lawrence Rhodes [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu; SFEVA [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; ETList [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2007 10:44 AM Subject: Vectrix, a first ride. I showed up at British Motor Cars in San Francisco meet Tansy Brook for a quick demo of the Vectrix its controls. It has reverse which is also a very controlable regen function. To start you turn the key, put up the kickstand, hold the left brake and tap the right brake. It then says GO. The main speedometer is in KPH with MPH in smaller lettering below. The bike feels light. I took it out on the street up a hill and it had plenty of power. I cruised up Eddy or Ellis(can't remember which) went down Gough I got tremendous regen but halfway down the hill it cut out. I'm assuming that regen on a full charge isn't reliable. I grabbed the brakes and bounced down the hill. I weigh 242. The bike never felt out of control. I'm sure the wheelie poppers will like this soft but controlable suspension. On the rest of my ride I hardly used the hand brakes at all. I'm 6'2' with a 30
EV digest 7067
EV Digest 7067 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge by Timothy Balcer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Toyota Plug in Prius Video by Ian Page-Echols [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge by Marc Geller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge by Jack Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge by Joe Plumer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: What is the typical amperage draw of the field for a sepex motor? by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: What is the typical amperage draw of the field for a sepex motor? by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge by Timothy Balcer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Dave Davidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: What is the typical amperage draw of the field for a sepex motor? by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Fun with trees and Re: Sebring EV info needed by jerryd [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: What is the typical amperage draw of the field for a sepex motor? by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Mike [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Porsche to make hybrids by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Indicator lamps for contactor operation by Eric Poulsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Lawrence Rhodes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Upgrading NEV as alternative to ICE conversion by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: [EV] Re: FourthGen ''PB6' Pot Box by Eduardo Kaftanski [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Lawrence Rhodes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision replaces all gauges in White Zombie by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge by Rich Rudman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Let My People Convert! - The A123 Challenge by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: Hanging with Victor...EVision replaces all gauges in White Zombie by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Thanks Dan. You've properly crystallized my whole position on this thing. :) --T On 7/26/07, Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Marc, I don't think it must be tantalizing to the automakers since iirc they are free of the ZEV mandate so they have nothing to live up to. Further, if Les Goldman wanted some action he could start selling their cells to EV converters at the same price they sell them for to DeWalt instead of punishing us by a factor 2 or 3. he might even offer those packs we saw Wayland use if that's a semi stock product. put up a webshop with their products instead of hiding behind retarded old b2b practices and let the grass roots people and the speed freaks spread fear into the coal black hearts of big auto. Dan ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Anyone have a guestimate based on their use of either the current Prius, or their battery enhanced Prii to guess what the gas mileage might change to with even this tiny bump in battery? Ian On 7/25/07, Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If I remember correctly, they're just using two strings of the 6.5Ah Panasonic prismatic NiMH batteries - more or less two of the existing Prius battery packs in parallel. (So not violating any Cobasys patent licensing.) The stated 13km range is pretty puny though, I don't think plugin hybrids will gain traction (unintentional pun) until the electric range is more like 50kms. Which pretty much means lithium batteries. (It might be possible with lead, but with all the ICE weight in there as well it'd get way too heavy.) -Ian On 26/07/2007, at 12:40 PM, Joseph T. wrote: I can't read your post, but I saw the video. If you look closely you'll see an E-Com! But I have to admit, is Toyota trying to have people the Prius's design. I mean, the way it already is, it doesn't look so great. Did they really need to add the frilly flowers and birds? Toyot says that they're not using lithium batteries but just a bigger NiMH pack, Maybe the whole patent issue with Cosaby and Panasonic is over or the patent has expired? On 7/25/07, Tom Gocze [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ---REMAINDER OF MESSAGE TRUNCATED---* * This post contains a forbidden message format * * (such as an attached file, a v-card, HTML formatting) * * Lists at sjsu.edu only accept PLAIN TEXT * * If your postings display this message your mail program * * is not set to
EV digest 7065
EV Digest 7065 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Electric Toyota prius by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Brian Jackson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Porsche making Hybrid by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Porsche to make hybrids by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: chevy transmissions... by Brian Jackson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Simple Controller by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Really needed ??? Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by =?UTF-8?B?SnVra2EgSsOkcnZpbmVu?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Really needed ??? Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Porsche to make hybrids by Brian Jackson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Electric Toyota Prius by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Indicator lamps for contactor operation by Frank John [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) E-F guage for Ni-Cads by Mark Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Bumping up the Speed on NEV,s by Mark Hanson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Porsche to make hybrids by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: chevy transmissions... by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Kip C. Anderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: chevy transmissions... by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Upgrading NEV by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Wh/Mile Formula ? by Jeff Mccabe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Hanging with Victor...EVision replaces all gauges in White Zombie by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- http://money.cnn.com/2007/07/25/news/international/bc.toyota.plugins.reut/index.htm?postversion=2007072506 seems toyota is dragging its feet. only 13km range and nimh based and 'unfit for commercialization' blaming battery tech video report from reuters http://www.reuters.com/news/video?videoId=61683videoChannel=1 Dan ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Here here. php forums are the standard these days. I was actually looking for a forum when I stumbled across this. The archives are a bit of a pain to search. I actually used my Google tool bar to search them and it worked well, but many people would not go to that trouble. This is just how things go. php replaced mailing lists. Email lists replaced paper mailing lists. paper mailing lists replaced chisel and stone :) Brian Kip C. Anderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: = Scam? Like what? The facts are: - Most people on this list would like to see EVs go mainstream. - Allot of people on this list have no idea how to search the archive or where to go to do it, nor do they wish to take the time to figure it out when a web forum offers the convenience right in front of their faces on every single page. Mailing lists of this size are unwieldy and antiquated - and not readily embraced by the AOL/MySpace generation of internet users. I used to run a fairly large mailing list and am familiar with many aspects of operating them, but I hate the snot out of the format now. Instead of just browsing through threads adressing subjects of immediate interest or being able to easily and conveniently search, I end up having to press the delete key endlessly on stuff that I am not the least bit interested in. Mailing lists are best for immediate polling of the knowledge base of it's users or for sending alerts, but when it comes to the basics, we need something better. I'm not complaining about the quality of the discussion here, but merely the shotgun disorganized nature of the format. Until something better catches on, it will do. But I really hope something better catches on! If we wanted to make EV conversion easier and more mainstream, doesn't it make sense to make the access to the information meet the same criteria? Someday, I will be a seasoned EV'er, and I probably won't be talking about it much here except to redirect people to a more convenient format. I have registered on the new forum and hope to see many others do so as well. Continuing to stick to this list as the sole means of technical support is a Luddistic insistance on not progressing the cause. -- Kip - Original Message - From: Michael Barkley [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 7:32 PM Subject: Re: DIY Electric Car Forums I hope this forum that just popped up, isn't some sort of scam, it might relieve you seasoned EV'rs from the postings of us newbies, that don't search the archives quite as well as needed (Yes I'm guilty). I'd hate to see some of you guys leave the EVDL list, due
EV digest 7064
EV Digest 7064 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Two EV vans on e-bay by Steve Powers [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Michael Barkley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) NEON Indicator lamps for contactor operation by Roger Daisley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: The questions on the EV-1C by James Massey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) New to List by Brian Jackson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Upgrading NEV as alternative to ICE conversion by Brian Jackson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Brian Jackson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Indicator lamps for contactor operation by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Indicator lamps for contactor operation - LED? by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) RE: DIY Electric Car Forums by Dave Davidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: NEON Indicator lamps for contactor operation by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) helixev update - website announcement by Tehben Dean [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Tehben Dean [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) chevy transmissions... by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Kip C. Anderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Looking for zilla speed sensor mount design/picutres for double shaft by Adrian DeLeon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Toyota Plug in Prius Video by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Toyota Plug in Prius Video by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: single speed vs xmission by dale henderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Upgrading NEV as alternative to ICE conversion by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: single speed vs xmission by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by BrownGassyTurd [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Wh/Mile Formula ? by Jeremy Rutman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) RE: helixev update - website announcement by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) RE: helixev update - website announcement by Brian Jackson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: Indicator lamps for contactor operation by Eric Poulsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 28) Re: Upgrading NEV as alternative to ICE conversion by Brian Jackson [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- 1989 GMC : 3500 Vandura Item number: 320138527359 I noticed these 2 vans are still relatively cheap - $1500 / ea. One is NiCD. One is NiMH. Lots of views, few bids. Anyone know the history on these? Supposedly (according to the auction) the NiCDs are still good and hold a charge. Still, the vans are listed as not running. Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links. http://mobile.yahoo.com/mobileweb/onesearch?refer=1ONXIC ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I hope this forum that just popped up, isn't some sort of scam, it might relieve you seasoned EV'rs from the postings of us newbies, that don't search the archives quite as well as needed (Yes I'm guilty). I'd hate to see some of you guys leave the EVDL list, due to all the new postings from us newbies. Please keep in mind most of us are all working towards the same goal, to be driving a EV rather than an ICE and for me, getting the word out to more and more people about EV conversions can only be a good thing. --- joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I haven't seen it before you posted, but I have a very good spam filter, and it may have caught it. Joseph H. Strubhar Web: www.gremcoinc.com E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 3:56 PM Subject: DIY Electric Car Forums How many people with an EV on the EValbum got this message, just curious, Hello, My name is Robert Green. I just saw your EV on austinev albums and thought I'd invite you to a new EV conversion community I'm starting up. The point of the community is to organize conversion information, help facilitate communication between DIYers like yourself and others and bring in parts vendors and fabricators all to a single location to help everyone's projects out. The end goal is to have guides and kits available for most makes and models of standard cars and community support for those attempting their EV conversions. You have very valuable experience and information that I think could seriously benefit others and I think you will find more information valuable to you in the very near future. What I'd really like is for you to introduce yourself or post a little info about your past or existing projects to help me jumpstart this database. Several admins will be checking the site, sorting and grouping the posts and data to
EV digest 7061
EV Digest 7061 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: What is the typical amperage draw of the field for a sepex motor? by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: What EV to see in LA by Will Beckett \(becketts\) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Series/Parallel switching (was Re: Karmann Ghia Design - System voltage) by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: I love my job a.k.a. I brought home so much by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) An experiment by Obrien, Haskell W. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Wh/Mile Formula ? by Jeff Mccabe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: An experiment by BrownGassyTurd [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Battery for a Bicycle? by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Series/Parallel switching (was Re: Karmann Ghia Design - System voltage) by Steven Ciciora [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: An experiment by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) RE: individual chargers by Mark Freidberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: What EV to see in LA by Bob Siebert [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Battery for a Bicycle? by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: What EV to see in LA by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: To Feed or Not To Feed (the troll) [was: RE: by Roderick Wilde [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) RE: An experiment by Michael Wendell [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Upgrading NEV as alternative to ICE conversion by Kevin Lura [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) by Marc Geller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Cooling a Netgain Motor... by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) RE: An experiment by Obrien, Haskell W. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Upgrading NEV as alternative to ICE conversion by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Upgrading NEV as alternative to ICE conversion by Michael Barkley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) RE: Upgrading NEV as alternative to ICE conversion by David S [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Karmann Ghia Design - System voltage by Deb Hollenback [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: An experiment - a scam?? by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: Upgrading NEV as alternative to ICE conversion by Kevin Lura [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Yes, it is blower cooled. On 7/25/07, Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Zeke, 6.8 Ohms is pretty low for a true shunt motor. Lee's got a pretty good take on it. But I think your nameplate said this was blower cooled, so field watts could be even lower, maybe 200 to 300. Good news is that you'll be able to over excite for accel torque. If you can come up with a variable power supply for the field, 100 V, 15A, or at least 50 V, 8A, you could run some bench tests to figure out how to control the field. If you can drive the armature of the beast at a constant RPM, you can take a no load magnetization curve. That would be helpful when you design your control and give you a real good idea of safe field current. Jeff --- Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks Lee. Yup, 220A is the total continuous rating, which is 21.2kW at 96 volts. Man, I can't wait to get my donor vehicle here so I get start testing everything in the car, instead of just sitting on the workbench (it's in my friend's shop 400 miles away). Zeke On 7/24/07, Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Zeke Yewdall wrote: It's got two separate terminals for the field. And, I measured the resistance between them -- 6.8ohms. Which I guess would translate to only 14 amps at rated voltage (96 volts) That sounds about right for a sepex motor. Field power is on the order of 2% of armature power. I think you said this was a 96v 22 horsepower motor? That means armature power is around 22kw. 2% of 22kw is 440 watts for the field. With a 6.8 ohm field, 440 watts is 57 volts at 7.67 amps. This is an educated guess as to what the field could stand for (say) one hour. The full 96v into a 6.8 ohm field would be over 1350 watts, which would burn it out in 5-10 minutes. So, it's unlikely to be a shunt motor, which would have had a field wound to withstand full armature voltage for an hour or more. -- Ring the bells that still can ring Forget the perfect offering There is a crack in everything That's how the light gets in--Leonard Cohen -- Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us. http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- The largest, electric vehicle only show on the west coast is the Silicon Valley Rally on August 25th in Palo Alto, CA http://www.eaasv.org/rally.html -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
EV digest 7063
EV Digest 7063 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Sebring EV info needed by G DONALDSON LUCAS [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: DIY Electric Car Forums by Alan Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) RE: DIY Electric Car Forums by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Nimh packs and battery chargers at batteryspace.com by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) RE: DIY Electric Car Forums - and Jim Husted time :-) by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Looking for zilla speed sensor mount design/picutres for double shaft ADC motor by David Brandt [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) The questions on the EV-1C by Steve Powers [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) RE: DIY Electric Car Forums by Ted Sanders [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Upgrading NEV as alternative to ICE conversion by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Indicator lamps for contactor operation - LED? by Danny Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Upgrading NEV as alternative to ICE conversion by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Jerry Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Greg Catanzarita [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires- how about B381's ? by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by damon henry [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by David Brandt [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Nimh packs and battery chargers at batteryspace.com by Dmitri [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Upgrading NEV as alternative to ICE conversion by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Simple Controller by Rich Rudman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Indicator lamps for contactor operation by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires- how about B381's ? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: parallel batteries by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Toyota Plug in Prius Video by Tom Gocze [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: Battery for a Bicycle? by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: Indicator lamps for contactor operation by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: DIY Electric Car Forums by joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Jerry, If you haven't found the Citicar info you need let me know. I have some of the manuals and could look for the pages you want. Nu-Kar has an excellent manual which includes all of the C-Car models, costs about $40, might be worth getting if you will be doing a lot of work on these vehicles. Gail P.S. When you become a C-Car expert please consider opening a branch office in Las Vegas. My last great maintenance guru had too much else to do and I think got sick of trying to keep the C-Cars functional. - Original Message - From: jerryd [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 3:33 AM Subject: Sebring EV info needed and don't feed the troll Hi All, I need a diagram of a Sebring-Citi-car, especialy the reverse wring from a later Sebring EV I'm working on. It's been modified with a Curtis controller and presently using a battery tap for the 12vdc curcuits so much work needs to be done. Also I couldn't find the Citicar list. Anyone can give me a hand would be greatly appreciated. Please stop playing Dan's the troll, game as it waste the list, listee's time, resources. Could he be Troy? Thanks, Jerry Dycus ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Rod, 1. Rod H 2. Alan B 3. 4. . Alan Brinkman -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rod Hower Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2007 3:56 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: DIY Electric Car Forums How many people with an EV on the EValbum got this message, just curious, Hello, My name is Robert Green. I just saw your EV on austinev albums and thought I'd invite you to a new EV conversion community I'm starting up. snip ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I got one also. Haven't had time to look yet. I feel I don't have time enough for the EVDL but I'll check it out when I get a free minute. Cya Jim Husted Hi-Torque Electric --- Alan Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How many people with an EV on the EValbum got this message, just curious, Hello, My name is Robert Green. I just saw your EV on austinev albums and thought I'd invite you to a new EV conversion community I'm starting up. snip Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games. http://get.games.yahoo.com/proddesc?gamekey=monopolyherenow
EV digest 7053
EV Digest 7053 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Karmann Ghia Design - System voltage by Bruce Williford [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Battery second string range implications ? by Rush [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Karmann Ghia Design - System voltage by Bruce Williford [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: EV1 Leasing Requirements ??? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Battery second string range implications ? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: EV1 Leasing Requirements ??? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) To Feed or Not To Feed (the troll) [was: RE: Tree House Controller] by Myles Twete [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Peter Buys An Electric Car- LA Times, June 2003 by Chelsea Sexton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires by Ricky Suiter [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2007 23:39:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Ricky Suiter [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Bridgestone Ecopia EP-03 Tires To: EV List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ok so hoping this might help someone out there looking for a purpose built LRR tire. The Honda EV Plus used this tire in a 195/65R14 size, they still list it on Bridgestone's web site. Although they list oem fittment as a Honda Civic EV. So I first called up my trusted local Discount Tire store, they had nothing in the computer about them and recommend the Insignia tire in that size. Of course I decline because I want *this* tire. I call the local Firestone corporate store, they have nothing as well. Hmm, ok I print out the information sheet and take it to that store. There is an article number 060-070, they search it in their system and sure enough it comes up, but shows no stock at any of the local stores. They get on the phone and call the main warehouse who searches the article number and it comes up national back order with no ETA. Frustrated I shoot and email to Bridgestone corporate to see if I can get these tires or not. I know the Ecopia EP-02, which is a truck and SUV size tire is available on tirerack.com and was used on the RAV4 EV. I didn't know if I'd be able to get the smaller size Ecopia EP-03. I emailed tirerack even and they said they weren't available. Sure enough I get a prompt reply from Bridgestone saying they are indeed available, but they will have to be special ordered from Japan and it will be mid September by the time they arrive. They actually had to enter the tire in to their system so it would show it could be ordered, they even called the store I went to and gave them the procedure to order them. Back to the store, they ordered them! Price per tire is about $100, which is a bit more than usual but the things are coming 8000 miles (that's a guess) from Japan. I get a call 2 days later, they found a set hidden somewhere in California so now I'm supposed to have them within a couple of days. So I'll know how they do in a couple days or a couple weeks depending on where they're coming from. The amazing part is when I talked to the Bridgestone sales rep who got them in the system for me I only said Electric Vehicle, he actually threw the term low rolling resistance out there in our conversation! I was so impressed. So what are they going on? I acquired a decent condition running 2002 Ford Th!nk neighborhood with a 8 month old set of Deka batteries and the updated DelatQ charger! It needs paint and a little other reconditioning, but I'm planning on putting the aftermarket motor in it, reprogramming and getting the thing to keep up with regular traffic. By some mix up I was issued a full registration with it, not a NEV registration so I am feeling justified. The other factor in this decision is the stock turf tires (which don't roll all that well) are no longer made. Ford still has them available, but they want $150 a copy! So that made my decision easier because for a few more bucks I could put really good looking wheels on it, have a LRR tire and get a few more mph out of the deal. I have experience putting LRR tires on GEM's and they seem to have lost no range that way while gaining more speed. So if anyone wants a tire made for an EV they are available no matter what anyone tells you. Later, Rick 92 Saturn SC conversion AZ Alt Fuel Plates ZEROGAS Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. http://farechase.yahoo.com/ ---End Message---
EV digest 7050
on a 216 volt nominal system. I have nice dc to dc converters for 120 vdc input and more for 300 vdc input but need the range in between with a 14 vdc output at 50 or more amps. Any suggestions? Thanks, Bill Brinsmead ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- You might try Belktronix, I've seen their name mentioned a few times on the list with positive comments. They are at http://www.belktronix.com/isodcdc.html respectfully, John - Original Message - From: billb [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2007 8:13 PM Subject: Dc to Dc ?s Hi Guys , I am looking for a dc to dc in a hard to find input range, about 170 to 250 vdc.to run on a 216 volt nominal system. I have nice dc to dc converters for 120 vdc input and more for 300 vdc input but need the range in between with a 14 vdc output at 50 or more amps. Any suggestions? Thanks, Bill Brinsmead ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Back when you could actually lease one, I'd heard the same thing. You had to have a 6 figure income and had to take a personality test to make sure you had the right kind of personality to lease one. Maybe that's why out of the 5,000 people on the waiting list only 50 people were willing to sign the paperwork. On 7/23/07, Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Back when you could actually lease one, I'd heard the same thing. You had to have a 6 figure income and had to take a personality test to make sure you had the right kind of personality to lease one. I just figured it was GMs way of limiting the number of acceptable applicants. I think they figured that way they could be justified when they claimed that nobody wanted them. Kind of backfired when, even with the restrictions, they had many times as many acceptable applicants as there were EV1s available. Of course that doesn't stop them from claiming that nobody wanted them and using the excuse that they could only lease 600 of them, convienently failing to mention that they only made 600 available (or 650, whichever it was). I'd heard of one dealer that stopped taking names for their waiting list because they already had over 600 qualified applicants and no more EV1s were being made. Well...? Any EV1 leasees to comment...? On 7/22/07, Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mel Gibson in Who Killed the Electric Car describes a greuling interview, a resume required and locations of bodily tatoos :-O Sounds like they did the full background investigation and maybe EVen the endoscopy, doh :-O Joseph T. wrote: snip a bit And your income had to be at least 100k to lease the car? And then you had to pass a test? I've never heard of these either. Anyone with soem real EV1 leasing experience? -- If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has 4 lines of legalistic junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long legalistic signature is void. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Field resistance of a Cor van de Water Systems Architect Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Private: http://www.cvandewater.com Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +1 408 542 5225VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925 Fax: +1 408 731 3675eFAX: +31-87-784-1130 Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zeke Yewdall Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2007 9:51 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: What is the typical amperage draw of the field for a sepex motor? Thanks for the info. Exactly my plan (finding the resistance of the field winding). I'm trying to get an idea of how many amps the field controller and field wiring has to handle, and the specs only give total motor amps, not field current separately. For now, I'm just trying it with a 12 volt battery. I spun the whole motor up at 12 volts, with jumper cables from my ICE car, and it handled it fine, so I imagined that at that low voltage, the field current should be low enough to measure without blowing up the DMM. I could actually use a big 6 volt L-16 to test it with too. Z On 7/23/07, Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are you just looking to get an idea of the resistance of the field winding or...? At any rate, if you only use a 12V battery, I'm pretty sure the field winding will draw less than 20 Amps. If you have a 6V battery, you could start there. The current draw of the field winding is pretty much linear with voltage and is generally not effected much by the RPM of the motor. So you could measure it at 6V and multiply by 16 to get a good idea of what it would be at 96V, or measure it at 12V and multiply by 8. Just wondering if I can measure field current with the 20A range on my DMM
EV digest 7052
EV Digest 7052 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: amps during normal driving by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: amps during normal driving - Zilla and other overspeed protection by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) RE: Message truncated problem by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Tree House Controller by torich1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Battery second string range implications ? by Steve Hawkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Karmann Ghia Design - System voltage by Deb Hollenback [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Battery second string range implications ? by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Karmann Ghia Design - System voltage by Bruce Williford [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: What is the typical amperage draw of the field for a sepex motor? by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: 1st street ev smile/frown by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: What is the typical amperage draw of the field for a sepex motor? by David Dymaxion [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Tree House Controller by torich1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Karmann Ghia Design - System voltage by Deb Hollenback [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Karmann Ghia Design - System voltage by Deb Hollenback [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Karmann Ghia Design - System voltage by Rich Long [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Tree House Controller by R. Matt Milliron [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Fwd: [evco]: The Environmental Impacts of E-bikes in Chinese Cities by Lock Hughes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Fwd: [evco]: The Transition To Electric Bikes In China by Lock Hughes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: oversized motor? by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: EV1 Leasing Requirements ??? by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: EV1 Leasing Requirements ??? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Battery second string range implications ? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Zilla inside picture (Hot, Cold and Broken) by Eric Poulsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Battery second string range implications ? by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) RE: oversized motor? by Dale Ulan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: Karmann Ghia Design - System voltage by Bruce Williford [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: EV1 Leasing Requirements ??? by Chelsea Sexton [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Hello Dan, The motor volts and motor amps are about the same at 150 amps. I have small analog meters on these, not digital. Roland - Original Message - From: Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Monday, July 23, 2007 9:39 AM Subject: Re: amps during normal driving hi and thank you. very detailed account. but 6860 lbs! that's a heavy vehicle :) do you have a motor volt reading on for instance the 6000rpm, 45mph, 2nd gear, 150amp position? for your warp 9 hugely heavy vehicle : ) Dan Roland Wiench wrote: Hello Dan, I'am at the time driving with a Warp 9 that has a 192 volt rating at 199 amps continuous, in my 6860 lb EV with a 19.595:1 1st gear overall ratio and a 13.5:1 2nd gear ratio and final gear ratio of 5.57:1, a Zilla controller and 180 volt 260 AH battery pack. I always start out in 1st gear in acceleration. During normal acceleration, the motor ampere goes to about 200 amps while the battery amperes is at 50 amps. If I press the accelerator to the floor, the motor ampere will peak at 300 amps at 6000 rpm which is 25 mph which will do this in less than 10 seconds. The Zilla has the rpm limited to 6000 rpm, so even if I hdld the acceleration at 6000 rpm, the motor ampere starts to drop to about 150 amps and when I let back a bit on the accelerator, I can get it to drop to about 100 amps, battery ampere is about 30 amps. When I shift to 2nd gear at 25 mph, the motor amps may go to 500 amps and battery amps go to 125 amps. At 6000 rpm which is 45 mphs in 2nd gear, the motor ampere starts to drop back to about 150 amps. Shifting into 3rd at 6000 rpm at 45 mph, the ampere goes to about 600 amps and starts to drop back at 50 mph at 4000 rpm to 250 motor amperes and 180 battery amperes. Now with a GE 11 high torque motor, that has double the torque at a given rpm of a Warp 9, the the motor ampere at 70 mph is 180 amperes as well as the battery amps. Parking or backing up with a GE 11, the battery ampere reads only 3 to 5 amps!!! Roland - Original Message - From: Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Monday, July 23, 2007 7:00 AM Subject: amps during normal driving anyone have some data on a normal sedan conversion with for instance an ADC 8 motor. where the amps are at during casual acceleration. (following traffic) what gearing is used (if you
EV digest 7048
Effect Pedal input. Basically fly by wire for your accelerator. Many newer cars use them. They are just an alternative for the 5 k-ohm potentiometer box thats hooks to your existing accelerator pedal, linkage and spring. Mike, Anchorage, Ak. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Christopher Robison Sent: Saturday, July 21, 2007 8:21 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: ZILLA HEPI SIGNAL GROUND On Sat, July 21, 2007 8:17 pm, Mark Dutko wrote: Which terminal on the Hairball does the HEPI SIGNAL ground got to, it is not clear if it should go to the same signal ground as the speed sensor or someplace else. The remaining grounds on the HEPI go to chassis ground. I wondered about this for a bit as well, in putting together a test setup for my HEPI-equipped Zilla. Turns out, it goes to the pin labeled Signal GND on the hairball -- I hooked it up this way and it works. Full disclosure: I don't have a speed sensor set up yet but I'm guessing they'll just share that ground connection. -- Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://ohmbre.org -- 1999 Isuzu Hombre + Z2K + Warp13! ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Yeah, Dennis. You can't use the hood popped up on me and is broke excuse. The same thing happened to me a couple months ago. I was driving Jake to his tennis lesson in Wattson, our electric Ford Escort, and the hood flew up just as I was hitting 45 mph. Dumb me forgot to latch it closed after checking the batteries. I was able to barely close it back but the cowling in front of the windshield was bent up, the back of the hood was bent out of whack and the hinges were completely bent out of shape. The hood closed like an inch and half forward then it did originally. I couldn't find hinges at the Ford dealer. Only like 5 new hinges left in the whole US for an 86 Ford Escort so I had to order them from a junk yard. Actually, from two junk yards. But in one week I had the new hinges in, bent the hood back the best I could so it could at least open and close and was on my way. I'm sure you can find parts for an S-10. I realize you probably have some special bodywork done on it but you should be able to make it work by the Nationals. Its not even August yet. Body work is easy. I think building motors is hard :-) Chip On Jul 22, 2007, at 1:07 AM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote: From: John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: July 21, 2007 4:11:22 PM EDT To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: 1st street ev smile/frown Hello to All, Yeah, both Dennis and Rudman called me to tell me the tale of the fly-up hood thing :-( [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Bummer about the hood. Bet that was exciting though! STOP Your making me drool all over my keyboard! OK everyone, here's the dealDennis is 'supposed' to bring his new machine to the NEDRA Nationals next month here in Portland (as if we haven't already had a good time playing with fast EVs), but now he's whining and telling me there's no way to get the bodywork fixed in time. I say he's just chicken to put it on the track next to White Zombie :-) We need everyone to start posting, telling Dennis to 'make it happen'...get the truck fixed as an urgent situation, convince his bodyman that instead of letting the truck sit for weeks, it needs to be repaired in a few days. It would be a shame to not have his truck up here next month, all because (according to Dennis) that there's no way he can twist his bodyman's arm to get the truck done in time. The other thing we need to do, is get Dennis (and others) to stop sending whatever format he/they send emails in, and make it so guys like me can read the posts, instead of getting the following message when I try to read email posts: Message truncated. Ken, how is it that you could read his post, an I could not? If you had not pasted Dennis' message into your post here, I would not have known what he wrote. What change in the EVDL happened a few months ago to make me start seeing maybe 20% of the emails from the EVDL turned into this gibberish 'truncated' message crap? I know it's something to do with html and not plain text, but why can Ken see the posts and I cannot? Is there some way I can change my mail program's parameters so I can read these omitted posts? Better yet, what was changed a few months ago with the EVDL, why was it changed, and why can't it just go back the way it was? See Ya.John Wayland ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hi I am at the point of machining an adaptor plate for my ac42 [solectria] thats intended to inhabit a suzuki alto. (Electro automotive dont have a plate and I wont be shipping a transmission transatlantic). My question - have I gone and bought a motor way too big for the job? The ac42 is 60kg, 100 horsepower max and 28horses continuous. My car-mechanic friend took one look
EV digest 7049
EV Digest 7049 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Plug In Prius by Tom Gocze [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: 6v or 12v by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) RE: Condensation? @ Heater core ? OT maybe by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) html email by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Message truncated problem by David Roden (Akron OH USA) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Ideal conversion candidate? Aussies are Lucky. by Brian Hay [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) RE: Condensation? @ Heater core ? OT maybe by Michael Barkley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Ideal conversion candidate? Aussies are Lucky. by Ev Performance (Robert Chew) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: 1st street ev smile/frown by ROBERT RICE [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Ideal conversion candidate? Aussies are Lucky. by (-Phil-) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Plug In Prius by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Zilla inside picture (Hot, Cold and Broken) by (-Phil-) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: EV1 Leasing Requirements ??? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Tell Me Which DC to DC Converter I Should Use by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Driving in reverse, spastic moves by Deanne Mott [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) RE: Message truncated problem by David S [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Speed Indication Issue - Toyota Yaris Conversion by Mark Dutko [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Driving in reverse, spastic moves by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) What is the typical amperage draw of the field for a sepex motor? by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Driving in reverse, spastic moves by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Driving in reverse, spastic moves by (-Phil-) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Speed Indication Issue - Toyota Yaris Conversion by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: What is the typical amperage draw of the field for a sepex motor? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Driving in reverse, spastic moves by Chris Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) RE: Driving in reverse, spastic moves by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Dc to Dc ?s by billb [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: What is the typical amperage draw of the field for a sepex motor? by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 28) Re: Dc to Dc ?s by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 29) Re: EV1 Leasing Requirements ??? by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- I dunno if someone already posted this, but Toyota has applied for on road testing in Japan of their next gen, which is a plug in Prius with Lion batteries. Wonder how much that'll be? Tom in Maine ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I defer to the expert. I was looking at that from the math perspective L is mostly fixed, di/dt is steady state, the voltage is determined. I liked this explination http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_1/chpt_16/3.html ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I was gonna try a different approach Use those little curvy diet coke bottles(so the air can get past) with just the right amount of water in them and an icechest with a 120mm 12V fan. Since I drive to work in the morning and the hot part is driving home, I plan on carrying the ice chest into work and recharging the bottles in the freezer :-) It just hasn't gotten hot enough to bother yet. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Although the email being sent in html is the source of the problem, The mechanism is in place to view the text. The List Proc is not handleing this the way it was designed! It is stripping the html but leaving the header. I don't know what they are using but a tad of administrating might allow it to print the text only mime type of the multipart/mime that is being sent. of course, my client could too, but then we still have the html sucking bandwidth. After a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ---REMAINDER OF MESSAGE TRUNCATED---* * This post contains a forbidden message format * * (such as an attached file, a v-card, HTML formatting) * * Lists at sjsu.edu only accept PLAIN TEXT * * If your postings display this message your mail program * * is not set to send PLAIN TEXT ONLY and needs adjusting * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- On 22 Jul 2007 at 13:49, GWMobile wrote: Html is not email. Html is internet website language. If we wanted to see that we would surf the web. If msn hotmail is that way it is time to get a real email. I would suggest earthlink. Whether you send html or not really isn't related to your ISP; rather, it's a function of your mail client and its configuration. The client may be on your own computer or
EV digest 7045
EV Digest 7045 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: batteries: another increasing range question by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: 6v or 12v by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Tesla Roadster Drifting! by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Tree House Controller by storm connors [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: [EV] Re: Tree House Controller by Eduardo Kaftanski [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) MetricMind in the news by JS [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Drawbacks re Zap Xebra motor?... by Bruce Weisenberger [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) RE: Drawbacks re Zap Xebra motor?... by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) individual chargers by Tim Gamber [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) RE: Drawbacks re Zap Xebra motor?... by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) new motor concept, brushless by Fizzy Electricity [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: individual chargers by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Simple Controller by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Tree House Controller by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Zilla inside picture (Hot, Cold and Broken) by Cor van de Water [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Zilla inside picture (Hot, Cold and Broken) by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Unrealistic expectations (was Re: 'Tree House' Controller by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Zilla inside picture (Hot, Cold and Broken) by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Tree House Controller by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Number of E-mails by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) ICS-200 (not 2000) Charger by Steve Gibbs [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) ICS-2000 Charger by Steve Gibbs [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) RE: Tree House Controller by Dale Ulan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Tree House Controller by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: 6v or 12v by Dmitri [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) RE: individual chargers by David Sherritze [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: new motor concept, brushless by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 28) Motor volts, was Re: 6v or 12v by James Massey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 29) RE: Tree House Controller by Dale Ulan [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- John G. Lussmyer wrote: Aren't those different part numbers? Yep, but the case colour is a nice sanity check no matter what model/part number you are told you are getting. I think the deep cycle models suitable for EV use all start with a D (e.g. D34 = deep cycle group 34, D31=deep cycle group 31), and the M suffix identifies the battery as a marine, or Blue Top (BT) version rather than a Yellow Top. Cheers, Roger. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hey Guys These motors will get into the danger flashover zone at around 160 volts to the motor, give or a take a few volts depending on individual motors. Make sure the motor brushes are advanced for your direction. Hope this helps Jim Husted Hi-Torque Electric --- Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is 240v too much? I don't really know, but from looking at different EV conversions, I think that 240 volts might be too much for an 8'' motor. On 7/20/07, Jack Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'll be moving my Optima batteries to my sailboat, so I'm going to get some new batteries for the Fiero. I'm leaning towards getting the Trojan 24TM 12v batteries, and go with 10-20 of them. It seems to me the higher voltage is going to reduce current draw and be better for range via pukert. How many volts can an ADC 8 motor be OK with? Is 240v too much? Jack Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. http://farechase.yahoo.com/ ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I found some videos on youtube of the Tesla Roadster racing a Ferrari, McLaren Mercedes, Corvette, and some motorcycle on youtube. http://youtube.com/watch?v=h-AWy2nBT-s (there's five of them) There was no info. however about why or where the Tesla roadster was racing on the Tesla Motors Website or by the person who posted the video on youtube. So I informed AutoBlogGreen.com of these videos and asked them to ask if anyone knows about this video. Sam Abuelsamid, who apparently is the Moderator of AutoBlogGreen.com or something, contacted Darryl Siry, who works for Tesla Motors. Well, this is what the article says: According to Darryl, The upcoming Project Gotham Racing 4 from Microsoft will be featuring the Roadster. The video was shot during filming for a commercial from Microsoft that should begin airing in Mid-August. Apparently they closed off some streets and used professional drivers and the Tesla proved to be quite an accomplished drifter thanks to its Lotus-developed chassis. PGR4 is coming out in September if you've got an XBox 360. I
EV digest 7046
that be limited as well with a faraday shield surrounding, or perhaps at least shielding in the right directions, the engine compartment? Sure; you can shield it as tightly as desired, to the point where the noise is undetectable without delicate instruments. However, that costs money. People are of course reluctant to spend money on things unless they are sure it's necessary. I don't know about you Lee, but I like my music ;) Hmm. Now I'll have to go and price out copper foil! Hmm... and maybe use copper water pipe for runs ;-) --T ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- On 7/19/07, John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 08:38 AM 7/19/2007, Lee Hart wrote: I think I mentioned this before to John, but for the benefit of the rest of the list... You can replace the special resistor on the Rudman regulators with a standard 10w or 20w ceramic tube resistor. This type consists of a hollow ceramic tube, with the resistance wire wound on it, a terminal on each end, and a ceramic glase over it for insulation. Note that this is only for the OLD style regulators. Not the current version. (I have MKIIC regs) Route a copper tube through the center of each one. Pump water (or oil or something) through them all. This carries away the heat neatly, with no need for fans or heatsinks. Frankly, I find that mounting a little CPU fan, and plugging it into the connector on the reg is a LOT easier than routing a cooling line all over the place, adding pump, radiator, etc... True.. but not as effective :) Hm... well, you could use a Peltier cooler if you just wanted to slab the entire back of the board with cooling. Or some other arrangement. It's not as if you are lacking power in an EV ;) --T ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ---REMAINDER OF MESSAGE TRUNCATED---* * This post contains a forbidden message format * * (such as an attached file, a v-card, HTML formatting) * * Lists at sjsu.edu only accept PLAIN TEXT * * If your postings display this message your mail program * * is not set to send PLAIN TEXT ONLY and needs adjusting * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- It is just a glorified 208 or 240 vac outlet. The ISC 200 or any other type of charger just passes ac power to the vehicle in a form that satisfies all the requirements for national electric code. You can get the inlet from Avcon, www.avconev.com, the email is dead, but if you call the number it's for the Meltrix (I think it was them if I remember right) company, just ask for the Avcon person. They have to inlets, the Honda and the Ford, get the Ford one it has a longer cable and has the pilot emulator built in so you won't have to muck with having to try to tell the charger to send power. The only thing is you'll need an actual charger on the vehicle side that will accept a 208 or 240 volt input. If the connector on the end doesn't look like the Avcon connector then you might have one of the weird Yazaki ones too Toyota used before they went inductive. Later, Rick 92 Saturn SC conversion AZ Alt Fuel Plates ZEROGAS From: Steve Gibbs [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List' ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: ICS-200 (not 2000) Charger Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 22:21:23 -0500 I have acquired a couple ICS 200 (not 2000, as I mistyped the first time) chargers, and am looking for more information related to them. Does anyone there have any technical information regarding this charger? I have the User's Guide and Installation Manual. Has anyone documented interfacing this device to a 1998 S10 EV? I'd like to check out the feasibility of using this charger rather than the Magnecharger if possible. Thanks! Steve Get the Yahoo! toolbar and be alerted to new email wherever you're surfing. http://new.toolbar.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/index.php ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I have a hard-copy of the ICS-200B Service Manual (dated 1/19/99). I found soft-copies (PDFs) here: http://www.bowzerbird.com/eviweb/download.html Regards --- Steve Gibbs [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have acquired a couple ICS 200 (not 2000, as I mistyped the first time) chargers, and am looking for more information related to them. Does anyone there have any technical information regarding this charger? I have the User's Guide and Installation Manual. Has anyone documented interfacing this device to a 1998 S10 EV? I'd like to check out the feasibility of using this charger rather than the Magnecharger if possible. Thanks! Steve Get the Yahoo! toolbar and be alerted to new email wherever you're surfing
EV digest 7043
current is 200 amps, and I think this is probably correct because the IGBT is only rated 300 amps. There is more than enough acceleration. Vehicle weighs 2 tonnes. The motor is a sepex, is that why Citroen can get away with this low amperage and still have acceleration at low speed? Perhaps this a way forward for budget controllers, 100 amp continuous + sepex motor? Rich Rudman wrote: 300 amps and 300 volts... Not even Curtis amps Hoo ho ho... Good one there... -- If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has 4 lines of legalistic junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long legalistic signature is void. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Rod's right. There is a slew of Chinese controllers out there, but only for the scooter market. Mostly 24 volts. Above 48 volts, I haven't seen any. For example, check this site out and scroll to the bottom half of the page. http://www.scootercontroller.com You'll see rows and rows of 24 volt scooter controllers. At the most they can handle 30 to 40 amps. Easy and cheap to make. Above 60 amps with motors in the 1000 to 2000 watt range your getting into more complex circuits that the full size 48 volt scooters use and that's where you start to see the Alltrax and Curtis type controllers. If the Chinese saw a market for larger ones then 48 volt 60 amp controllers they would be doing it. And thank goodness they don't. I have boxes of melted and burnt out 24 volt Chinese controllers. I keep them to salvage the wires and connectors. Chip Gribben www.electroscooterworks.com On Jul 19, 2007, at 11:06 PM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote: From: Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: July 19, 2007 9:43:12 PM EDT To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Simple Controller the trick is to connect it right and watch for high current. but with the right knowledge it should be a simple circuit and the parts relatively cheap. Yep, it must be pretty simple and cheap, that's why we see a flood of EV controls coming from China (since it's so easy they should be cranking them out by now!). Two problems, it's not cheap and easy and there is not a big enough market to create these controls. If there's money to be made I'm sure the Chinese would be cranking these out in high volume. That's the problem, there is not a big market for these controls to bring down the price in volume. When you produce controls in lower volume you have to spread out the engineering and manufacturing cost to cover your expenses. Knowing what it takes to produce a control, I realize that people like Rich Rudman and Otmar aren't making big bucks, just producing a product in low volume to serve the EV market. When you actually design and manufacture a control like this you'll know what I mean concerning low volume cost. A good comparison would be the PC. You can buy a nice high performance desktop for $300 to $400 bucks new. Imagine what it would cost if you were producing 1000 PC's, contracting out all of the individual circuit boards and also hand building many of the parts manually (not automated assembly, which you CANT do with a Zilla control). I guess I'm just rambling, but I know the time involved in producing low volume controls (I have put together many low volume prototypes of my 2HP BLDC control for the transportation market which is just starting to order higher volumes of controls, the first 100 were very expensive and the next 1000 will still be very costly do to the low volume manufacturing). Once they get up to the 10k to 20k volume they will be quite a bit cheaper, but will still cost quite a bit because they are not being produced in the 1 million quantity (probably 1/3 the cost!!). So, my advice is to put in the sweat equity and see what it actually costs to produce something at the cost you envision. Good luck! Rod --- Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hehe that's rich. I know what an IGBT is. I plan to use them. you didn't. and from what I understand they can be used rather simply. a pwm, an IGBT driver and the IGBTs (caps etc). and they are not terribly expensive either. Otmar said the IGBTs in the zilla 1K cost him 165$ and 1000amps is way too much for a normal car. As I understand it, higher than the typical 100-150v is more important than amps so the car can do freeway speeds too instead of just initial strong acceleration. the trick is to connect it right and watch for high current. but with the right knowledge it should be a simple circuit and the parts relatively cheap. others have succesfully built controllers themselves. a shame that noone has yet made a good simple robust design that everyone can make but perhaps that will happen. something like a 300V 300A spec would be nice I believe. but hey, what do I know :) Dan ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- what system voltage? I'm guessing low. starts quick
EV digest 7044
EV Digest 7044 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Is THIS the PHEV announcement ? by Timothy Balcer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Number of E-mails by Timothy Balcer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) RE: batteries: another increasing range question by [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Fwd: best way to transport a newly purchased EV by BrownGassyTurd [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Not a 'Heavy metal garden tractor' by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Simple Controller by Thomas Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Understanding SOC by Jeff Mccabe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) RE: batteries: another increasing range question by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) RE: Understanding SOC by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) RE: Not a 'Heavy metal garden tractor' by damon henry [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) RE: batteries: another increasing range question by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) RE: Tell Me Which DC to DC Converter I Should Use by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) RE: batteries: another increasing range question by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) RE: Understanding SOC by Jeff Mccabe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) RE: batteries: another increasing range question by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) RE: Understanding SOC by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) RE: batteries: another increasing range question by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Tree House Controller by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Drawbacks re Zap Xebra motor?... by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) RE: Understanding SOC by Jeff Mccabe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) RE: batteries: another increasing range question by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) RE: Understanding SOC by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) RE: best way to transport a newly purchased EV by Michael Mohlere [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Curtis Battery Book by JS [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: Tell Me Which DC to DC Converter I Should Use by John [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) RE: Understanding SOC by Jeff Mccabe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: 6v or 12v by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 28) RE: batteries: another increasing range question by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 29) RE: Understanding SOC by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Hm. Interesting, although the lease program to only government entities sounds fishy. Also no mention is made of any specs. Also, the article is not terribly positive on EVs. Besides.. they aren't doing it in the US, where you would think they would give it a first go considering their third party competition for the technology. So.Hm. :-) On 7/20/07, Steven Lough [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is THIS the PHEV announcement Every One has been Waiting For ? Dateline TOYOTA Japan 20 - July Off the Google - Alert - Electric Car News Feed... ( http://www.asahi.com/english/Herald-asahi/TKY200707200126.html ) -- Steven S. Lough, Pres. Seattle EV Association 6021 32nd Ave. N.E. Seattle, WA 98115-7230 Day: 206 850-8535 Eve: 206 524-1351 e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] web: http://www.seattleeva.org -- If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen. -Samuel Adams ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- snip People post when something catches their interest. Threads feed on themselves. Sometimes the flames actually die down, giving us a good opportunity to toast some marshmallows. ;-) Ha! :-) Yeah.. summer it would come down because folks are workiing on their EVs a lot and not jawing so much :) Bet money it goes back up in the third week of august! --T ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I appreciate all the suggestions. If they I get AGMs, and drove the route I quoted before, at most 3 times a week, would they last 4 months? After that, they would mostly get a 4 mile round trip drive, occasionally, as I ride in a vanpool to work. So the question is, if I only need the range for 90 days, not consecutive, would that work? With a pack that of 144V, 70 - 80 Ah batteries, at the C/20 rate? Thanks again, Brian On Wed Jul 18 11:29 , Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] sent: Joe wrote: Optima YT's would give you 75 Ah, so would double your range; would do it in the summer, or spring/fall, but maybe not in winter, unless you use G31's, which are around 90 Ah. You gotta tell the rest of us where you buy your Optimas! ;^ The Optima D34 (YT) and D34M (BT) (Group 34) batteries I can buy are rated 55Ah C/20, and are good for about 35-40Ah in the real world. The D31M (Group
EV digest 7042
EV Digest 7042 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Simple Controller by John A. Evans - N0HJ [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Fast Charging by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Number of E-mails by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Zivan (NG2?) by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: LionEV battery packs and vehicles by John A. Evans - N0HJ [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Simple Controller by Danny Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) RE: LionEV battery packs and vehicles by David S [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Simple Controller by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: EV's need sleep mode by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: LionEV battery packs and vehicles by John A. Evans - N0HJ [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Number of E-mails by David Roden (Akron OH USA) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) RE: LED headlights- new development! by Michael Mohlere [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Simple Controller by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Simple Controller by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Simple Controller by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Tell Me Which DC to DC Converter I Should Use by Joseph Lado [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) AGNS back to the track, FINALLY!!! by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Simple Controller by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Tell Me Which DC to DC Converter I Should Use by Timothy Balcer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Simple Controller by Rich Rudman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: 4002 vs. ADC 8 by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: LionEV battery packs and vehicles by Timothy Balcer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Simple Controller by Rich Rudman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: Tell Me Which DC to DC Converter I Should Use by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- SCR - Silicon Controlled Rectifier - use wikipedia and see if you can find more details, if interested. john Dan Frederiksen wrote: what's an SCR? ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- At 08:38 AM 7/19/2007, Lee Hart wrote: I think I mentioned this before to John, but for the benefit of the rest of the list... You can replace the special resistor on the Rudman regulators with a standard 10w or 20w ceramic tube resistor. This type consists of a hollow ceramic tube, with the resistance wire wound on it, a terminal on each end, and a ceramic glase over it for insulation. Note that this is only for the OLD style regulators. Not the current version. (I have MKIIC regs) Route a copper tube through the center of each one. Pump water (or oil or something) through them all. This carries away the heat neatly, with no need for fans or heatsinks. Frankly, I find that mounting a little CPU fan, and plugging it into the connector on the reg is a LOT easier than routing a cooling line all over the place, adding pump, radiator, etc... -- John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream http://www.CasaDelGato.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I've been getting less e-mails; is this a problem with the server or are there just less e-mails? ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Thank you Lee for all your different charge control methods. :) On 7/19/07, storm connors [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lee, That is the most succinct description of charge control I've seen! An amplification of one of your points, having a timer on the charger can be a butt saver. If all else fails or the monitor gets distracted, at least the cooking time is limited. On 7/18/07, Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Joseph T. wrote: So what chargers are appropriate for AGM batteries? It's not so much of an appropriate charger -- it's a matter of setting up whatever charger you have to produce the right charging algorithm. Even a really crude, simple, stupid charger can do a good job if carefully set up and monitored. Conversely, a very expensive sophisticated charger can still screw up and fry the batteries if programmed wrong. Here's the bottom line: You need to know how many amphours you took out of the batteries. Put back that amount, plus about 5% more. batteries will be full charged, with just a bit more overcharging for equalization and balancing. Now, how do you find this point? 1. Amphour counting: Put back 105% of what was taken out. 2. Voltage level detect: Charge until voltage rises to about 2.45v/cell. (Assumes the charger's current drops off as it approaches full charge.) 3. DV/DT: Charge until voltage stops rising. (Assumes the charger regulates current at the end of a charge cycle.) 4. Current level detect: Charge until current falls below about 2% of the battery's amphour capacity. (Assumes the charger limits voltage at the end of a charge cycle). 5. DI/DT: Charge until the
EV digest 7039
EV Digest 7039 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: Ideal conversion candidate? Aussies are Lucky. by Mark Fowler [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: Amost Live from PIR, 1st Update by Mark Fowler [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Motor Configuration by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Motor Configuration by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) LED headlights- new development! by Danny Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: What will it take to get White Zombie into the 10's? by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: What will it take to get White Zombie into the 10's? by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: What will it take to get White Zombie into the 10's? by Bill Dube [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: What will it take to get White Zombie into the 10's? by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: EV digest 7038 by Ricky Suiter [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Th!nk - Can it PASS the Crash TEST ?? by Ricky Suiter [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: LED headlights- new development! by Dave Cover [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) RE: Mark Fowler's take on the Wayland Invitational - and Otmars AC control by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Mark Fowler's take on the Wayland Invitational - and Otmars AC control by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: 4002 vs. ADC 8 by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Information needed please. by Aaron Choate [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: What will it take to get White Zombie into the 10's? by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Henney Kilowatt controller, was: Information needed please. by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Land of the Midnight Run by joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: batteries: another increasing range question by joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- But if you fill the tray of your ute with batteries, where do you put your dog? http://doginaute.corrigin.wa.gov.au/ Mark -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Shaun Williams Sent: Friday, 13 July 2007 5:10 AM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Ideal conversion candidate? Aussies are Lucky. Ah yes, the quintessential Aussie automotive icon, the ute. The Work Hard, Play Hard boys toy. They're pretty heavy at around 1600+kg (3500lb) but could carry the 1/3 lead required. I'm not sure I've heard of one been converted though. I think some might consider the very idea sacrilegious! Mmm, food for thought though. http://www.holden.com.au/www-holden/action/vehicleentry?vehicleid=15 http://www.ford.com.au/servlet/ContentServer?cid=1137384216525pagename= Pagec=DFYPage If you ever come back this way Peter and happen to be passing though BrizVegas I'd be very keen to give you the electric-echo experience! :-) ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Here's my youtube vids... http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=wayland+invitational Mark -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jukka Järvinen Sent: Saturday, 14 July 2007 12:59 AM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Amost Live from PIR, 1st Update AWESOME NEWS ! I wish I could be there... -*sob*- pls.. upload videos to Youtube as soon as possible.. -Jukka ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I couldn't think of a better word than configuration to sum up the topic of this question. Anyway, is it harmful to have a motor (it's a DC motor from Currie) arranged upside down or at its side? ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hey J Nope it doesn't. Cya Jim Husted --- Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I couldn't think of a better word than configuration to sum up the topic of this question. Anyway, is it harmful to have a motor (it's a DC motor from Currie) arranged upside down or at its side? Building a website is a piece of cake. Yahoo! Small Business gives you all the tools to get online. http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/webhosting ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Oh check this out! A couple of weeks ago I was mentioning that the Luxeon Rebels have achieved power levels that make it practical to make LED headlights. Well Luxeon just pulled a fast one. Their 0070 part suddenly became obsolete as their line achieved 0100. So with zero increase in electrical power, it's now making 180 lumens instead of 130 lumens @2.38W. That's a simultaneous leap in both efficiency and output per device. I have dealt with them and the thermal issues are not particularly bad and achieving the full rating in a real-world application should not be all that difficult. So Wikipedia says the first halogens headlights (still around) are 700 lumens on low beam. This would have required 6 devices per side, now we're down to 4 per side. As a reminder, this may not be legal
EV digest 7035
EV Digest 7035 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: Anyone seen a 1600A fuse before? by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Information needed please. by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) seeking comments on EV motor sizing by Michael Mohlere [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) RE: necessity of other gauges (12V and vacuum) by Dave Cover [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) prestolite 4001 vs 4002 vs ADC 8 by Michael Mohlere [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) batteries: another increasing range question by [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: prestolite 4001 vs 4002 vs ADC 8 by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) RE: A few pics of Mike Willmons motors by Matt Graham [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) RE: better battery option for AC Geo Metro? by Dale Ulan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: batteries: another increasing range question by joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: batteries: another increasing range question by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: seeking comments on EV motor sizing by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: necessity of other gauges (12V and vacuum) by storm connors [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: seeking comments on EV motor sizing by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: necessity of other gauges (12V and vacuum) by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Dead EV batteries, OK for solar or other uses? by Deanne Mott [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: seeking comments on EV motor sizing by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) RE: Tropica Reducer by Bukosky, Allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) 4002 vs. ADC 8 by Michael Mohlere [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Information needed please. by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) RE: A few pics of Mike Willmons motors by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: 4002 vs. ADC 8 by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- I'm running a 400A fuse with my Z1K. If your pack voltage is significantly higher than the motor's limit of around 170 VDC, then the motor current will limit out first and the battery current will never stay (or even get to) its 1000A max. With my 192V pack I would hit close to 1000 from the batteries only for a couple seconds during a hard acceleration. I never blew the fuse and even the 250A breakers only popped once after 4 or 5 hard back-to-back acceleration runs for 0-60 mph times. The fuse still held. I would suspect the 600A fuse that was shown would be plenty for daily driving and may well hold a couple thousand amps for few couple seconds. Mike, Anchorage, Ak. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of RobAmy Smith Sent: Monday, July 16, 2007 10:44 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Anyone seen a 1600A fuse before? This does bring up a good question. Whats a good rule of thumb for fuse sizing? My understanding was these types of fuses are pretty slow to blow, and need to be undersized relative to peak amps (but well over cruising amps) to reliably go in the event of a problem. I seem to recall some folks running 400A fuses in their pack with a Z1k. Does that sound right, or did I misunderstand? Rob ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Transistors were still pretty new in 1960. I don't think the first SCR DC motor controller was developed until the late 60's. However, I don't know for sure when the first SCR DC motor controller was developed. I found a pattent for a patent for a low power SCR controller for AC devices, the patent was from 1965. It's the earliest SCR bsed controller I could find. I don't think transistors were developed enough in the early '60s for a transistor based controller. The motor controller is a strictly electromechanical affair Really? Wikipedia claims that the Henney Kilowatt is transistor-regulated) On 7/17/07, Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, July 16, 2007 10:40 pm, Joseph T. wrote: Cool, the first electric car to have modern electronics. Actually, there are no modern electronic components in the Kilowatt that I know of, besides perhaps the charger (not sure, haven't opened one up). The motor controller is a strictly electromechanical affair, with a bank of contactors located behind the back seat cushion, which are actuated by a clever little cam surrounded by switches. As the throttle cable is pulled by the pedal, it rotates the cam which then actuates the switches as necessary. The switches control the contactors and the battery pack is thus placed in 4 different voltage configurations (lowest voltage includes a resistor) depending on the position of the throttle. A classic contactor controller design. It's somewhat entertaining to drive a Kilowatt at night with the cushion removed and the contactors exposed. The flashes can get pretty bright. :-) -- Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED]
EV digest 7036
EV Digest 7036 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: A few pics of Mike Willmons motors by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: 4002 vs. ADC 8 by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: necessity of other gauges (12V and vacuum) by Eric Poulsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Test by BrownGassyTurd [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Test by Dmitri [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Conflicting Pattents ? by Steven Lough [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Th!nk - Can it PASS the Crash TEST ?? by Steven Lough [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel? by Bukosky, Allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Information needed please. by Aaron Choate [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Information needed please. henney kilowatt by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Audio interference in EV by Brian Pikkula [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Test by kevin conley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Conflicting Pattents ? by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Test by BrownGassyTurd [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: necessity of other gauges (12V and vacuum) by storm connors [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Battery Problems by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) LPI paddle charger parts - #2 by Steve Hawkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: necessity of other gauges (12V and vacuum) by Deanne Mott [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) RE: A few pics of Mike Willmons motors by MIKE WILLMON [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Anyone seen a 1600A fuse before? by Ricky Suiter [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Conflicting Pattents ? by lyle sloan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Land of the Midnight Run by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Test by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Anyone seen a 1600A fuse before? by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: EV's need sleep mode by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: batteries: another increasing range question by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Hey all One other thing here, Mike likes to flip me a lot of greif here on the list, so I built him a motor that he'll have to install without touching, just to get EVen, LMAO! Cya Jim Husted Hi-Torque Electric Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. http://farechase.yahoo.com/ ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Well Michael, Depends. I know the MTC well. Not much about the ADC 8. The MTC-4001 replaced a 9 Baldor in the Jet Ind ElectraVan and put the 9 to shame. But the Baldor 9 was an easy target. The MTC-4002 is the same winding as MTC-4001 with some mechanical difference. MTC defines the elctromagnetics of the Prestolite motor. Which I know was very good for the MTC. That 33 slot lamination was exceptional. Great efficiency. Like I said, I don't know the ADC motor. But I suspect that it has a different winding with more slots, making it higher torque/slower speed for a given current. So, for equivalent vehicle performance between the two motors, you'd have to gear differently. And, depending on brush advance, chances are the ADC would commutate better at higher voltage. At a given power output, I'd bet MTC to have higher efficiency. But, a few percent can get lost in the mix. You really have to get the motor curves and hack it out for your application. Barring all that work, get the one most available and least costly, and work your vehicle system around it. Jeff --- Michael Mohlere [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Maybe I should pare down the question: I was hoping a seasoned EV veteran could give me an opinion as to the difference between a Prestolite MTC-4002 and an ADC 8 would the difference be negligible? Would an EV w/ a Prestolite 4002 be preferable to one w/ an ADC 8 or vice versa - I realize the ADC is the more modern version, so the Prestolite would be older, but in terms of performance.. Sorry about beating this horse to death!!! While I'm at it, anyone installed aftermarket a/c in an EV before...looking for comments. Thanks, Mike From: Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: seeking comments on EV motor sizing Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 07:06:03 -0700 (PDT) Hey Jeff, all Great write up Jeff 8^) Now lets add to this mess with whether two smaller motors are better than one larger. The larger motor will generally be more eff, but when using two motors you get the benifit of a series / parallel shift as well as generally higher rpm ability as you state. I've posted several times that a motors mass is an easy (although rough) way for folks to judge a motors abilities. Winding a slot car motor for 240 volts wont get ya an EV motor 8^P
EV digest 7037
EV Digest 7037 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Dead EV batteries, OK for solar or other uses? by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: 4002 vs. ADC 8 by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Battery Problems by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Battery Problems by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: necessity of other gauges (12V and vacuum) by (-Phil-) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) What happened at the races by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: EV's need sleep mode by (-Phil-) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Battery Problems by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) unsubscribe ev by FRED JEANETTE MERTENS [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) RE: necessity of other gauges (12V and vacuum) by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: batteries: another increasing range question by [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Land of the Midnight Run by MIKE WILLMON [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) RE: Audio interference in EV by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Motor control operation including regen by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Interesting NEV on eBay by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Audio interference in EV by Paul Compton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) RE: Dead EV batteries, OK for solar or other uses? by Mick Abraham [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) RE: batteries: another increasing range question by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: batteries: another increasing range question by David Roden (Akron OH USA) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: The final comparison by David (Battery Boy) Hawkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: EV's need sleep mode by Lawrence Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) RE: batteries: another increasing range question by Dale Ulan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Th!nk - Can it PASS the Crash TEST ?? by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: 4002 vs. ADC 8 by Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Deanne Mott wrote: I am wondering if a set of floodies (or other batteries) too dead for an EV will still be good for other uses. It depends on what's wrong with them. They might be too dead for an EV because they have low amphour capacity, or too high an internal resistance, or a high self-discharge rate, or excess water usage, or other problems (dead cells, damaged terminals, cracked or leaking cases, etc.) In particular, I want to set up an off-grid PV solar system for a friend's hunting cabin out in the sticks. I think the most load he'll have is for a water pump. He says he wants 40A (I will double check his requirements) but seems like some day when I kill my set of T-125's they should still have enough life in them to do that... The best situation would be that your EV batteries work fine, but don't have enough amphour capacity any more -- say, you need 40 miles range, but they only deliver 30 miles so you need to replace them. Another possibility (mainly with gels or AGMs) is that overcharging has caused water loss and grid corrosion -- they now have high internal resistance and can't deliver high currents; but they have good amphour capacity with low current loads. If flooded batteries are old or have a lot of cycles on them, they may still work adequately (more than half their amphour capacity remains), but have excessively high end-of charge current and gas a lot. They might work OK in a solar application, but will waste most of your precious solar energy and need frequent watering. Obviously, batteries with bad cells, leaks, or seriously low amphour capacity would be more trouble than they're worth. Recycle them, and get some decent used ones for your friend's PV application. When you take in your old PbA batteries to trade for new ones do you get any money back for them? Yes, you should. Some dealers (crooks) will *charge* you to return the old batteries. But the scrap value of lead is pretty high; an honest dealer or metals recycling place will pay *you* $2 to $5 per battery. -- Ring the bells that still can ring Forget the perfect offering There is a crack in everything That's how the light gets in--Leonard Cohen -- Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Michael Mohlere wrote: I was hoping a seasoned EV veteran could give me an opinion as to the difference between a Prestolite MTC-4002 and an ADC 8... would the difference be negligible? Would an EV w/ a Prestolite 4002 be preferable to one w/ an ADC 8 or vice versa - I realize the ADC is the more modern version, so the Prestolite would be older, but in terms of performance... In my opinion, the Prestolites are well-made, reliable motors -- probably a bit higher quality than ADC motors. Performance-wise, I don't think you'll be able to tell the difference between a Prestolite and ADC motor of the same
EV digest 7038
EV Digest 7038 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: batteries: another increasing range question by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Th!nk - Can it PASS the Crash TEST ?? by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: necessity of other gauges (12V and vacuum) by Mark Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) RE: necessity of other gauges (12V and vacuum) by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) RE: Battery Problems by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) RE: 4002 vs. ADC 8 by Michael Mohlere [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) RE: 4002 vs. ADC 8 by Michael Mohlere [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: 4002 vs. ADC 8 by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) RE: 4002 vs. ADC 8 by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Information needed please. by Steven Trovato [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) RE: Battery Problems by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Zivan (NG2?) by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) What will it take to get White Zombie into the 10's? by Ryan Stotts [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Adaptor and Battery Box 4 Sale... by Bart Grabman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: NiMh poor self discharge rate by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) RE: Battery Problems by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: What will it take to get White Zombie into the 10's? by Dave Cover [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) RE: Zivan (NG2?) by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: What will it take to get White Zombie into the 10's? by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Zivan (NG2?) by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Zivan (NG2?) and AOL... by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: What will it take to get White Zombie into the 10's? by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: The final comparison by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: What happened at the races by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: Battery Problems by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: 4002 vs. ADC 8 by R. Matt Milliron [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: Land of the Midnight Run by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 28) Re: Dead EV batteries, OK for solar or other uses? by Richard Krog [EMAIL PROTECTED] 29) Re: Dead EV batteries, OK for solar or other uses? by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 30) RE: Mark Fowler's take on the Wayland Invitational by Mark Fowler [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Dale Ulan wrote: The rear suspension arrangement on the old Beetles doesn't help. Weight changes will change the rear alignment dramatically on those. I believe this one was said to be a '74, so it ought to have the IRS transaxle and not suffer from this. It likely has problems at the opposite end, as it probably has the SuperBeetle MacPherson strut front suspension instead of the torsion bar front end. I believe Neon mentioned his buggy was running the swingaxle transaxle, and I believe while the alignment might vary more with suspension travel, this transaxle is likely considerably more efficient. (They have a single inboard fulcrum plate joint per axle instead of 2 CV joints, and both the inboard joint and outboard wheel bearings are lubed by tranny oil inside the axle housings while the CV joints and wheel bearings on the IRS drivetrain are lubed with grease. Everything has its tradeoffs! ;^) Cheers, Roger. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- When ford sold these they were freeway legal and one would assume that they had passed the crash test then butt you know about ass u me --- Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are you referring to the Th!nk City, or the Th!nk Neighbor? Z On 7/17/07, Steven Lough [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The Th1nk EV seems to be gaining some traction, with new investors jumping in, according to several sources and news briefs. Does any one know whether the car itself will ever pass muster with the US crash-worthy standards ?? Or will it just be another 25 mph NEV ?? -- Steven S. Lough, Pres. Seattle EV Association 6021 32nd Ave. N.E. Seattle, WA 98115-7230 Day: 206 850-8535 Eve: 206 524-1351 e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] web: http://www.seattleeva.org Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top picks on Yahoo! TV. http://tv.yahoo.com/ ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Well Roger, here you go. http://bp3.blogger.com/_xouyKpqe9U4/RnP8CH8WfII/ADM/48c3-MJf0As/s320/vacuum.jpg My car also monitors transmission fluid temperature, 12v side voltage and total current, as well as inside and outside air temperature. Not really all necessary, but nice features in my opinion. :-) Mark Ward World's first New Generation Saab EV www.saabrina.blogspot.com - Original Message - From: Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Tuesday,
EV digest 7033
. There are back up switches just in case a switch or circuit goes out. Can fix the circuits on the fly without stopping. Then there is a whole roll of switches that I can with one sweep which I can turn any one off to kill all the power in the EV. Like I say, it depends what you want to know about your EV system. Roland - Original Message - From: Brian Pikkula [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Monday, July 16, 2007 8:36 AM Subject: necessity of other gauges (12V and vacuum) I was thinking of installing a 12V gauge to monitor my aux battery (and DC/DC converter by proxy) and a vacuum gauge to make sure all is well with my brakes. Before i buy them, I was wondering if others have such gauges or are they unnecessary? Thanks -- Brian in TX http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/960 http://www.evdub.blogspot.com/ It may seem like I am doing nothing, but on a cellular level I'm really quite busy. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hi, I tried an EV-1 NiMh in my boat as a starting battery and a smaller one about the size of a tractor battery as an auxiliary batter in my EV. Both die within a week of being fully charged. The fast self discharge rate is horrible. I switched back to lead batteries in both cases. I havn't had that problem with Ni-Cads even thoughg they are a nickel chemistry. Is that an inherent problem with MiMH batteries? Best Regards, Mark _ http://liveearth.msn.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I need expert opinion. The end cap of the motor I bought from Jim was cracked by the nice guys in customs. I dissassembled the motor, cleaned up the crack, separated the pieces, and reassembled with a cold weld epoxy mix that includes a small jar of aluminum powder you add. End result looks very good, and I managed to restore alignment (I reassembled the cap without the brushed and let it dry in place). Did I fix it? it looks ok to me... pictures: http://www.nn.cl/Autos/EV/Motor/EndCapFix/ -- Eduardo K.| Darwin pone las reglas. http://www.carfun.cl | Murphy, la oportunidad. http://ev.nn.cl | | Yo. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I have an electric bus that has it's 2 air cond., 5 hp power steering, hydraulic brakes, defrost heaters, cooling fans and an 120 psi air compressor all running off of two GE/Fuji AF300e$ 10 hp vfd drives powered from the 350 volt traction pack. I am currently investigating using another one of these VFDs in a different EV. In this inverter application the normal 3 phase inputs are bussed together and powered with dc and the frequency is set at 60 hz. It appears that it will run with as low as 180 volt dc input but wants about 230 up to 400 vdc to initially fire up. It has a 3 phase output that is adjustable from 120 to over 240 vac. These VFD drives may be one solution for getting ac power on a EV. Bill Brinsmead ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Roger, I have an '87 Cabriolet with a Zilla 1K, no emeter. To avoid EMI issues I did the following: 1) Twisted the 2/0 cables that connect the front and rear battery groups. 2) Twisted +12V and Gnd wires together when wiring pumps, fans, etc. 3) Placed my controller opposite the antenna side of the car. 4) Tried to run high and low voltage wiring in separate areas (not always possible). I have an Alpine 9857 head unit mounted in the factory radio spot. An iPod adapter plugs into the rear, with the iPod sitting in the small area in front of the shifter. I made a separate on/off switch for the radio from a spare rear window defrost switch. The Cabriolet has no accessory key position, and I'm sometimes in the car and want to listen to the radio without the motor blower and cooling pump running :) My speaker wires are unshielded, both front and rear. Rear speakers are Kenwood 6x9's mounted on the removeable wooden rear deck. The results: 1) iPod operation is perfect 2) CD operation is perfect 3) FM radio is OK. I get a little static on some stations with slight foot pressure on the accelerator. 4) AM radio works until I press on the accelerator. Then there's horrible static/squeal that originates from the controller. The noise goes away when I let off the pedal. My radio reception might improve if I actually grounded the Zilla's case to the car chassis. Eventually I'll get around to it and post the results. -Adrian . ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- You got lucky, many of the VFDs I've looked at use a doubler circuit. Capacitor doublers will not work on DC. -Phil - Original Message - From: billb [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Monday, July 16, 2007 10:58 AM Subject: Re: How to run appliances off your EV pack I have an electric bus that has it's 2 air cond., 5 hp power steering, hydraulic brakes, defrost heaters, cooling
EV digest 7024
EV Digest 7024 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Amost Live from PIR, 1st Update by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Amost Live from PIR, 1st Update by MIKE WILLMON [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) EV parts by Michael Mohlere [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Electric Evette by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Amost Live from PIR, 1st Update by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: One question of many by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: One question of many by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) FuelVapor Technologies - fuel efficient vehicle automobile high mileage ale' by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: 80 % discharge voltage by Rush [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Optimum Brush Advance for Acceleration top end by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Home Power Zeke by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Optimum Brush Advance for Acceleration top end by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Tropica Reducer by Bill Dennis [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Tropica Reducer by Bill Dennis [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Amost Live from PIR, 1st Update by james s [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Electric Evette by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: 80 % discharge voltage by Jerry Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Electric Evette by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Another, fairer comparison by Timothy Balcer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Amost Live from PIR, 1st Update by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Another, fairer comparison by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: FuelVapor Technologies - fuel efficient vehicle automobile high mileage ale' by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Short and Cheap :was Short range bat. pack by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Tesla, 3-year-cycle? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- AWESOME NEWS ! I wish I could be there... -*sob*- pls.. upload videos to Youtube as soon as possible.. -Jukka Roderick Wilde kirjoitti: I just talked to John at the PIR track. They were having a minor heating issue with the batteries. They also left their 12 volt auxiliary battery on while they were charging and when they made their third run of the night the voltage was not enough to hold in their contactor. It dropped out three times on the run. There is so much press there it is like Hollywood Paparazzi. Even with power dropping off three times during the run they were able to pull off an 11.974 run at 105.68 mph and totally wasted the hot Mustang in the other lane that had done an awesome fear invoking burnoff. Alas the White Zombie just waltzed away under partial power. Killacycle's second run wowed the crowd with a blistering 8.7 second 152 mph run. Spectators and the press are finally starting to envision the true power and the future of EVs. It is definitely a special night for electric vehicles! Roderick Wilde Suck Amps EV Racing www.suckamps.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- DUDE!! I WAS THERE. Not to rub it it, but it was an awsome spectacle. Being this was my first EVer drag race EVent I must say EVen the fast gassers barely turned my head away from all the dedicated Amp heads loitering around. Kiilcycle, awesome!!! Thats all I can say. I couldn't get a pic of the launch because the 500ms delay on my camera was killing me. I tried leading Scotty more and more each time and after 4 tries I still failed to get him in the frame; not EVen the back tire :-( White Zombie with the Lithium pack, was Awesome!!! On the last run Tim pulled an 11.5 something (I'll let John fill in the details in his part 2 ( and now Part 3) of the White Zombie commentary) But holy sh%$, the crowd goes wild, there's a fire on the Zombie, EVeryone's chattering The Zombie is on fire. Looking down the track wondering what the track officials are doing to help out at the end of the track. John's on his cell phone, hands up in the air saying Awe its alright, Tim just pulled the Oh Sh%$ handle. Apparently the mechanical linkage on the accelerator pedal got stuck down and jamming on the the brakes and locking up the front tires only slowed the RPM's down from 6600 to 6000. Front tires sliding and no slowing down the OH SH%$ bar comes out and a large flash and smoke resembling a motor zorching gets the crowds attention. Tim drives it back to the pits however like nothing is wrong. Except that about half an inch of rubber from one side of each of the front tires is missing with a nice flat spot about twice the size of my hand is readily noticable. 550 feet of dragging the front brakes at 1000 battery amps might tend to do that to front tires :-O The track guys said they've never seen a skid mark that long :-O I'd concur with the obsceneties Wildman alluded to that most likely were relayed
EV digest 7017
EV Digest 7017 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) questions by Michael Mohlere [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: todd pc25lv dc-dc converter specs by Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) RE: Passive (Parallel/Serial) Balancing by Mick Abraham [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) RE: conversion question by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) RE: conversion question by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Ideal EV configuration for my situation? by Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Efficiency of lead acid batteries by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: conversion question by joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: questions by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) PM Motor Short Blown Controller? by Mark Hastings [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Another, fairer comparison by Peter Gabrielsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Bringing a TEVan back to life by Steve Powers [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Battery Boxes and Heating by Tehben Dean [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Another, fairer comparison by Bill Dennis [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Bringing a TEVan back to life by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Another, fairer comparison by Bill Dennis [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Another, fairer comparison by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Another, fairer comparison by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) RE: Another, fairer comparison by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Balancing NiCad batteries? by Joe Smalley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Efficiency of lead acid batteries by Joe Smalley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: AGM vs Gel by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Efficiency of lead acid batteries by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Ideal EV configuration for my situation? by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: Passive (Parallel/Serial) Balancing by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) RE: conversion question by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: Ideal EV configuration for my situation? by Matthew Chan [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Sorry about the last message - seems windows live hotmail doesn't support plain text emails (nice)... Does anyone know if a todd pc25lv dc-dc converter can be used up to 144 volts, or is 120 the limit? Also, does running an electric motor (prestolite, ADC, etc.) used in EVs at a higher pack voltage make it more powerful as well as extend the range? CAN you run a prestolite (the 4002) at 144 volts? Will that kill or shorten the life of the motor? Do they still make Prestolite motors? Can they be rebuilt (new brushes, i assume)? Thx, Mike _ http://liveearth.msn.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- On Jul 11, 2007, at 3:36 AM, Michael Mohlere wrote: Anyone know if a todd pc25lv can be used on a 144 volt pack? thx, mike There are not many of those out there. Later units where turned down into PC20LV models. What pisses them off the most is a low input voltage. There is one in the Rabbit Pickup I built (Don's still I believe.) The absolute maximum voltage one of these should ever see is 200 volts DC. It would be better if you can keep it under 190 volts. You should be fine with a 144 volt pack provided the charging voltage does not exceed that. (or if it ever even might the Todd has been disconnected first) Paul neon Gooch ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Jim Davis wrote: I have a string of 24 (12v, gel Size 31, 100ahC/20) which is massively out-of-balance (with individual OCV measurements ranging from 11.0 to 12.8). Individual charging with my single ~10a 12v charger is a slow process. I don't want to put the string on my 10kw 330v charger until my string is balanced. I am in no hurry (I have other things to work on), so I was wondering...Can I balance this string passively, over time?Can I leave the series connectors in place, disconnect the pack, and add parallel connectors to make one huge 12v amp-bucket? Would this pack then naturally balance itself over time? Mick says: Alan Brinkman's reply is correct. You would first need to disconnect all of the series cables then connect the batteries all in parallel--otherwise you'll see sparks and other pyrotechnics. Once connected in parallel, the voltage for each monobloc would converge with that of the others. Voltage convergence occurs faster than state of charge convergence, however, so you'd want to take some readings of the amperage transfer that's going on (I suggest using a clamp around DC ammeter for this) and leave the monoblocs in parallel until the amperage transfer goes very small. Mick says: Once those batteries are disconnected from parallel and placed back in series, however, the underachievers would in short order begin slumping in voltage relative to the overachievers. If one
EV digest 7015
EV Digest 7015 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Another, fairer comparison by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: Bradley GT Electric by Tim Humphrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: LED headlights by David Roden (Akron OH USA) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Remainder of Message Truncated ( Was Re: todd pc25lv dc-dc ...) by David Roden (Akron OH USA) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Bradley GT Electric by Don Davidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Passive (Parallel/Serial) Balancing by Andre' Blanchard [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) EV Workshops by Electro Automotive [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Passive (Parallel/Serial) Balancing by Ralph Merwin [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: limiting wire by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Short Range Battery Pack by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Zivan ICS 200 Avcon charging problem by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: fusing charger DC/DC by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Ideal EV configuration for my situation? by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: a little thought problem for the list by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Speed Reducers in the Nose by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Battery Boxes and Heating by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Ping! by ROBERT RICE [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Speed Reducers in the Nose by [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Speed Reducers in the Nose by [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) using a 12v volt meter to monitor traction voltage by Brian Pikkula [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Ampabout, Long Distance WAS: Ping! by ROBERT RICE [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) RE: Speed Reducers in the Nose by Tim Humphrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Speed Reducers in the Nose by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) RE: Another, fairer comparison by [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) how to modify signal to my stock tachometer by Brian Pikkula [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: Ideal EV configuration for my situation? by David Dymaxion [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Hi Phil, Thanks for correcting me. I knew I wasn't getting it completely right. Regarding 11.715 kwh vs. kw, I drove 55 miles at 55 mph so I drove for an hour didn't I? I get what you're saying though. I worded it badly. At any rate, let's make a fairer comparison like you said. I saw a commercial last night that says the Prius So a Prius at 60 mpg, consumes .01666 gallons per mile. That's 13000 X .01666= 2,166,666 Joules consumed per mile. 2,166,666 joules/mile= 2,166,666 watt-seconds/mile X 1 hr/3600 s=601.85 watt-hr per mile. So: 1974 EV VW Beetle conversion: 213 wh/mile 2007 Toyota Prius: 602 wh/mile (Not including line losses, charger heat waste, etc) Much more competitive. Did I get it right? Rich A. _ http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-usocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_2G_0507 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Don; For some reason your hyperlinks got doubled up. I took the liberty of correcting them for you. -- Stay Charged! Hump I-5, Blossvale NY -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Don Davidson Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 11:51 AM To: EV_Discussion_Group Subject: Bradley GT Electric If anyone owns or is restoring a Bradley GT Electric, I've created a website with photos, video many pages of pdf documents that may assist with your project. Go to: http://public.orb.com/BradleyGT2 I still maintain other websites that have many links to EV sites: www.dbd3.spaces.live.com and www.elecars.spaces.live.com Hope these sites help Don B. Davidson III [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- That's pretty good. Around 57 lumens per Watt (probably less once the devices are mounted, though) is finally starting to encroach on compact fluorescent territory. They still have some way to go to achieve the same efficacy as the best linear fluorescents (80-100 l/W). This is the sort of device that might see prototype application in such EVs as the original Solectria Sunrise (probably not Lee Hart's revision) or Horlacher Carbon (80 Wh/mi!), if they were being designed today. These EVs were tweaked for the ultimate in efficiency. For conversion EVs, the improvement in efficiency probably still wouldn't be worth the substantial effort and expense. But I can see some folks here applying them for the coolness factor. LEDs are popularly perceived as efficient, even though in several common applications they aren't that advantageous. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- On 11 Jul 2007 at 1:43, patrick DonEgan wrote: Why do I get this message SO much??? * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
EV digest 7008
the Subaru seats for light, polymer racing seats as well as all fenders, trunk and deck lids for fiberglass replacements. The body panels alone will save me almost 200 lbs. Maybe that'll help a little. Rich A. _ http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-usocid=TXT_TAGHM_migratio n_HM_mini_2G_0507 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hi Mark, Luckily you don't like new toys ;-) I think your regular email was forwarded to your blackberry account, because I tried to email you privately and again got the failure from the blackberry account, so I could not reach you to tell you about the issue - catch 22. UPDATE!!! I am still getting delivery status notification (Failed) The contents of the message are: -- Your message: To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: My power consumption Sent Date: Mon Jul 09 21:33:26 2007 has not been delivered to the recipient's BlackBerry Handheld. The returned error status is DB_USER_SUSPENDED_MODE -- Cor van de Water Systems Architect Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Private: http://www.cvandewater.com Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +1 408 542 5225VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925 Fax: +1 408 731 3675eFAX: +31-87-784-1130 Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark Dutko Sent: Monday, July 09, 2007 4:48 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Delivery status notification FIXED!! Dan- I got an I phone and ATT messed up my old blackberry account- I just had them delete it so it it happens again in the next day please let me know- I was not aware of this till today. Sorry Mark electricyaris.com On Jul 9, 2007, at 3:41 PM, Dan Frederiksen wrote: do you guys also constantly get an email about delivery failure to a [EMAIL PROTECTED] ? what's up with that Dan ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Should be fixed now- they did not delete the account as stated... On Jul 9, 2007, at 9:38 PM, Cor van de Water wrote: Hi Mark, Luckily you don't like new toys ;-) I think your regular email was forwarded to your blackberry account, because I tried to email you privately and again got the failure from the blackberry account, so I could not reach you to tell you about the issue - catch 22. UPDATE!!! I am still getting delivery status notification (Failed) The contents of the message are: -- Your message: To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: My power consumption Sent Date: Mon Jul 09 21:33:26 2007 has not been delivered to the recipient's BlackBerry Handheld. The returned error status is DB_USER_SUSPENDED_MODE -- Cor van de Water Systems Architect Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Private: http://www.cvandewater.com Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +1 408 542 5225VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925 Fax: +1 408 731 3675eFAX: +31-87-784-1130 Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark Dutko Sent: Monday, July 09, 2007 4:48 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Delivery status notification FIXED!! Dan- I got an I phone and ATT messed up my old blackberry account- I just had them delete it so it it happens again in the next day please let me know- I was not aware of this till today. Sorry Mark electricyaris.com On Jul 9, 2007, at 3:41 PM, Dan Frederiksen wrote: do you guys also constantly get an email about delivery failure to a [EMAIL PROTECTED] ? what's up with that Dan ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- One from Steven Lough (posted 2 months ago): S T O PB U R N I N G S T A R T E A R N I N G Cor van de Water Systems Architect Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Private: http://www.cvandewater.com Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +1 408 542 5225VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925 Fax: +1 408 731 3675eFAX: +31-87-784-1130 Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lawrence Rhodes Sent: Monday, July 09, 2007 2:50 PM To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List Subject: Catch phrase for the EVDL We have already made the mistakes so you don't have to. What do you think? Lawrence Rhodes... ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Intelligent Vehicle Discussion List ;-) or Shade Tree Car Innovations or Tomorrows Car, you can build it yourself and drive it Today. Cor van de Water
EV digest 7009
if this was clear enough in my last message. The NEDRA Race Form is only necessary if you are racing on your own. The form is not necessary if you are racing at a NEDRA sanctioned event like the Wayland Invitational, the Nationals or the Power of DC because a NEDRA Board Member(s) is present at all NEDRA sanctioned events to record all that information. The NEDRA Race Form provides the record keeper, who is NEDRA President Brian Hall, with all the necessary information about the vehicle, the track, the Class/Voltage Division and to ensure the vehicle passes safety inspection (inspector signature required) so he can accurately record it on the website. http://www.nedra.com/NEDRAraceform.html Chip Gribben NEDRA http://www.nedra.com On Jul 10, 2007, at 6:11 AM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote: From: Chip Gribben [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: July 9, 2007 9:23:26 PM EDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: EV Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Important NEDRA Record Rules Updates Hello, To accommodate our members who are racing at their local tracks and to expedite the process to get records up on the website we have made some updates to the process. First news is that NEDRA members can now race at their local IHRA tracks in addition to NHRA tracks if they are going for a record. Secondly, members who are going for a NEDRA Record and racing outside a NEDRA sanctioned event will need to fill out a NEDRA Race Form to be checked off and signed by the track inspection official before racing. This form can be conveniently downloaded from the NEDRA Home Page under Info for Racers. It is also available from the Class Rules Page or the Records Page. So briefly, these are the requirements for NEDRA Members gunning for a record at their local tracks. 1) Track must be an IHRA or NHRA track 2) Vehicle owner and driver must be a NEDRA Member 3) NEDRA Race Form must be completed and signed off by the Inspection Official at the track 4) Make a copy of two time slips (the times must be within 1% of each other) from runs made on the same day. 5) Email a copy of the completed NEDRA Race Form and the time slips to Brian Hall at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or snail mail to: NEDRA Record Holders 3200 Dutton Ave #220 Santa Rosa, Ca 95407 Chip Gribben NEDRA http://www.nedra.com ---End Message---
EV digest 7004
EV Digest 7004 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: At last! My conversion to LiIon is complete! by Dmitri [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Electricity Book by Dave Wilker [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Electricity Book by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Dead Batteries by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) One way to promote EV's by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Battery Balancer/Regulator??? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Nimble Motorsports NiMHybrid Update by Jack Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) RE: Nimble Motorsports NiMHybrid Update by David S [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: At last! My conversion to LiIon is complete! by Nikki Bloomfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Adding electric assist to a surrey bike by Darren David [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) RE: One way to promote EV's by Cor van de Water [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) RE: Adding electric assist to a surrey bike by Cor van de Water [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Adding electric assist to a surrey bike by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) RE: One way to promote EV's by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: [ EV ] Adding electric assist to a surrey bike by Darren David [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Nimble Motorsports NiMHybrid Update by Jack Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Electricity Book by lyle sloan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: [ EV ] Adding electric assist to a surrey bike by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Ideal EV configuration for my situation? by Matthew Chan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Nimble Motorsports NiMHybrid Update by lyle sloan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Tony Hwang [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Which exact battery model did you use? - Original Message - From: Nikki Bloomfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2007 4:41 PM Subject: At last! My conversion to LiIon is complete! Hi folks! I finally got that wonderful smile today which comes from knowing you've done some good quality work on your EV. I started to convert my 98 City El to lithium Ion batteries last ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Thank you! I just bought one for my class. David C. Wilker Jr. USAF (RET) - Original Message - From: GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2007 2:03 PM Subject: Re: Electricity Book Here is a $7 dvd containing public domain films on electricity. http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-Electrical-Elctricity-Films-DVD_W0QQitemZ180137678363QQihZ008QQcategoryZ617QQcmdZViewItem On Sun, 8 Jul 2007 9:31 am, (-Phil-) wrote: The best book I know of is Getting Started in Electronics by Forrest Mims, simple, fun, and you retain it. I've taught many people electronics using this awesome book! http://www.forrestmims.com/ -Phil - Original Message - From: Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2007 2:53 PM Subject: Electricity Book I am wondering if anyone here knows of any good books about electricity that cover from the real basics to electronic components? www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming and the melting poles. www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Actually I believe you want http://www.gutenberg.org www.projectgutenberg.org is one of those search page traps designed to catch people that misspell URLs Search the archives at www.projectgutenberg.org Everything is free and over 100,000 books for download. Also archive.org has free video. Search there too. On Sun, 8 Jul 2007 9:31 am, Peter VanDerWal wrote: My all time favorite is the ARRL Handbook, you can buy it on Amazon.com or check it out from your local library (I've yet to find a library that doesn't have it). It starts out simple and works it's way up. It's geared for radio communications, but the basics are the same for all electronics. You can skip the section on Tubes and, if you're not interested in transmitters/receivers, pretty much everything after it covers basic amplifiers amplifiers. They publish an updated version every year, so if you buy one it's pretty much guaranteed to be up to date. I am wondering if anyone here knows of any good books about electricity that cover from the real basics to electronic components? -- If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has 4 lines of legalistic junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I wish with the message. By posting the message you
EV digest 7005
EV Digest 7005 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Shaun Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) My power consumption by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Jay Leno reviews the Tesla Roadster by Claudio Natoli [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: My power consumption by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Ideal EV configuration for my situation? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Bill Dube [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) conversion question by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: conversion question by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) RE: Adding electric assist to a surrey bike by Michael Wendell [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) limiting wire by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) RE: Another EV smile by Jeff Mccabe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: limiting wire by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Another EV smile by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Ideal EV configuration for my situation? by Matthew Chan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: Ideal EV configuration for my situation? by George Swartz [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Do we have any prices on bulk A123 cells? has anyone ever been able to buy some? Jukka Järvinen wrote: Bill.. Do you have any info on A123s how they die after overchareged repeatedly ? How many cycles are needed with overcharging to reduce the cell capacity and/or increase the internal resistance to unusable levels? ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- A was kindly given a quote by the A123 Systems folk a couple of months ago for 1500 cells but in the spirit of a good conspiracy theory, on which some appear to thrive, I can't possibly tell you their price... :-) However, a quick search for DeWalt 36V prices at eBay will give you the correct answer (with the bonus of a 10 module battery balancer thrown in!). Shaun www.electric-echo.com On 7/9/07, Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Do we have any prices on bulk A123 cells? has anyone ever been able to buy some? ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Ok, I have some more numbers to add to my power consumption curve for a '74 bug with 16, 8v batteries @69 lbs. each: Last night, when I went to Annapolis, I averaged 33 mph @ 65 amps * 135 volts= 8.8kW (rounded up) 1st gear. This morning's commute on the highway I averaged 55 mph @ 90 amps *130 volts= 11.7kW. 2nd gear. Like I said, without an E-meter it's kind of hard to be perfectly accurate due to all the low-grade hills around here. My inbound commute is definitely an overall uphill pull but I used a pretty level stretch to get the 11.7kW number. I have good, new tires and the alignment is straight. I'd like to regrease my bearings and replace the gearbox oil. I also intend to swap out the Subaru seats for light, polymer racing seats as well as all fenders, trunk and deck lids for fiberglass replacements. The body panels alone will save me almost 200 lbs. Maybe that'll help a little. Rich A. _ http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-usocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_2G_0507 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I'm not sure I follow that reasoning but please tell me the price Shaun Williams wrote: A was kindly given a quote by the A123 Systems folk a couple of months ago for 1500 cells but in the spirit of a good conspiracy theory, on which some appear to thrive, I can't possibly tell you their price... :-) However, a quick search for DeWalt 36V prices at
EV digest 7006
at 3.6 nominal voltage. So3.6 volts times 6,831 cells obviously doesn't equal 375 volts!!! What's going on here? ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- My problem: I have a Zivan NG3 switching charger in my EV. It has a power factor of 0.68. It has an internal fuse of 20 Amps. I have an AVCON adapter box. I can charge on some public chargers, but some of the ICS-200 units shut down after 1 minute. I am planing a simple low-pass L filter to see if this eliminates the problem. I have two 0.005 Henry inductors, 22.5 Ampere rated, and 0.03 Ohm. I have a large number of 10 and 50 microFarad capacitors, oil filled, rated at 600 Volts. With the two inductors (in series) placed in series with 300 microFarads I calculate a resonate frequency of 91 Hz. I calculated the inductive reactance at 60 Hz at 3.77 Ohms, and the capacitive reactance as 4.4 Ohms. 1. Can I connect the series combination across my 240 Volt 60Hz lines (without the Zivan) for a test? 2. What will the current be through the Capacitor? 3. Is it okay to connect the Zivan (across the capacitor). 4. Would additional capacitance to lower the resonant frequency help? 5. Would placing additional capacitance at the junction of the two inductors have any advantage? 6. This experiment would cost me nothing, but does it make any sense? John in Sylmar, CA PV EV ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- George, Thanks for replying so quickly. Unfortunately, I can't obtain the 240D. The 260e and 300e are only available to me by sheer coincidence. My family has had these cars for years and they're starting to die off now. I'm hoping to use them instead of sending them to the junk yard. The diesel hybrid does sound interesting, and the increased range is definitely tempting. Is 80-100km range too much? We can always use other cars for the longer hauls. I think it's a bit generous of an estimate. I believe realistically, the car wouldn't have to travel farther than 60km on the longest trips. I'm just worried that I'd have to tow the car back one day. Matt On 7/9/07, Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu wrote: EV Digest 7005 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Shaun Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) My power consumption by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Jay Leno reviews the Tesla Roadster by Claudio Natoli [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: My power consumption by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Ideal EV configuration for my situation? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Bill Dube [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) conversion question by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: conversion question by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) RE: Adding electric assist to a surrey bike by Michael Wendell [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) limiting wire by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) RE: Another EV smile by Jeff Mccabe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: limiting wire by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Another EV smile by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Ideal EV configuration for my situation? by Matthew Chan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: Ideal EV configuration for my situation? by George Swartz [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Matthew Chan VP Fundraising Engineers Without Borders Carleton C: (613) 262-3768 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Marcin, let us know how the cells are after 500 cycles (paralled ones). That will be very interesting for all of us. -Jukka Marcin Ciosek
EV digest 7007
EV Digest 7007 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Tesla motors ABC news report by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: limiting wire by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Jay Leno reviews the Tesla Roadster by Andrew Kane [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: conversion question by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Electric Bike by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Electric Bike by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Shaun Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Shaun Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Zivan ICS 200 Avcon charging problem by Paul Compton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Electric Bike by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Electric Bike by mike young [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Catch phrase for the EVDL by Lawrence Rhodes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Catch phrase for the EVDL by Dave Cover [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Catch phrase for the EVDL by Mike Chancey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Catch phrase for the EVDL by JS [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Catch phrase for the EVDL by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Dead Batteries by Tom Carpenter [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Converted super cars by Matthew Drobnak [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Catch phrase for the EVDL by David Wilker [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Delivery status notification (failure) by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: Delivery status notification FIXED!! by Mark Dutko [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s by Matthew Drobnak [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: Delivery status notification FIXED!! by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 28) Re: conversion question by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 29) Re: Catch phrase for the EVDL by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 30) Re: Catch phrase for the EVDL by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 31) Re: Electric Bike by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 32) Re: Catch phrase for the EVDL by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 33) Re: Delivery status notification (failure) by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 34) Re: Delivery status notification (failure) by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 35) Re: Ideal EV configuration for my situation? by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- sorry if this has been on here before nothing major but might contain a few new bits of info http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRd7ER7u-KU Dan ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- also, what do you do when you forget to put the heat shrink on a few of the cables? do you split the 2/0 heat shrink, and then put overtop of it the size heat shrink that will slide over the clamp? This happened to me when I was connecting some small wires. Unfortunately cutting a heatshrink in two, and then putting the two heatshrink pieces in such a way that together they wrap around the wire doesn't work. When you heat it, the heatshrink shrink, but not around the wire.The two pieces split and just squish up into a little piece of plastic. That's what happened small scale at least. On 7/9/07, keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I just made up some cables and painted them with tool dip as an insulator...don't know if it will take heat or not but terminals shouldn't get hot if well made/connected just an idea i'll see how it holds up --- Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The question is, If I have one or two 1/0 cables or one lug end connector., does that make the whole loop as if it were 1/0 or the I^2/R equation means I only loose a little of voltage whereas with all 1/0 cabling I loose ALOT of VOLTAGE? Exactly; the shorter the total length of 1/0 in the loop, the lower the total voltage drop will be. Ideally you want all cables to be 2/0, but every 1/0 cable you replace will decrease the voltage drop. also, what do you do when you forget to put the heat shrink on a few of the cables? do you split the 2/0 heat shrink, and then put overtop of it the size heat shrink that will slide over the clamp? Just get heatshrink large enough to go slide on over the clamp
EV digest 7002
EV Digest 7002 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Got Amps by Joe Smalley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: weight savings by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Got Amps by Andrew Kane [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Honda Civic Crankshaft? by Andrew Kane [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) RE: melted battery post by Ted Sanders [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Honda Civic Crankshaft - clarity of terms by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Got Amps by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Plexiglas enclosures. by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Digest 7000 by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Discover Channel to cover Wayland Invitational, July 14th by Bill Dube [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Honda Civic Crankshaft? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: White Zombie 11s in 07 by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) RE: Converted super cars by Dean Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Digest 7000 by David Roden (Akron OH USA) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: White Zombie 11s in 07 by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Discover Channel to cover Wayland Invitational, July 14th by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Electricity Book by Bruce Weisenberger [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) RE: Another EV smile by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Honda Civic Crankshaft? by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) RE: Converted super cars by Jerry Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Electricity Book by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: White Zombie 11s in 07 by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: White Zombie 11s in 07 by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: White Zombie 11s in 07 by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- You need to subtract the sag of the battery pack before you multiply by the current. Joe Smalley Rural Kitsap County WA Former owner of 48 Volt Fiesta NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Andrew Kane [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2007 4:54 PM Subject: Re: Got Amps I checked out his evalbum entry at http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/371.html. It says the car has a 128V pack (I'm assuming it's the same car! ;) 128V * 25A= 3.2KW @35mph, or 6.4KW at 50A. I *think* this yields between 90 and 180 Wh/mile, but I am not at all sure that I've done the calculation correctly. If so, those seem to be pretty impressive efficiency numbers. On 7/7/07, Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rich- 25 -50 amps at 35 mph sounds very good. What is your pack voltage? I would be interested to know how many watts you use at that speed, also. Phil From: Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Got Amps Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2007 14:52:21 -0400 My new ammeter arrived this week and I installed it this morning. Now I'll be able to record my consumption at various speeds, try different driving styles and generally have an indicator of how hard I'm pounding my batteries, controller and motor. It was a trick to hook up though. Lol..you gotta love a used EV where you puzzle out the PO's wiring scheme. Turns out that the ammeter wires run from the shunt, through a 12v relay to the meter. I finally found the relay, wires, and a keyswitch 12v source to hook everything up. I haven't had a reason to get out on the highway yet, but I have learned that I only draw 25-50 amps cruising at 35 mph in my E-Beetle. Soon I'll have stats on cruising to work at 55, and 65 mph, as well as the return trip. I suspect my rates of consumption are different due to an overall uphill trend on the way to work. Then I'll be able to figure out my KW's and all that. Thanks to EA for getting it to me! Rich A. _ http://newlivehotmail.com _ http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-usocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_pcmag_0507 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I don't know. My system would be more expensive, but I think would weigh less and provide significant performance (range and cycle life) over Optima 31s or parallel strings of YT. I don't see how. Even with the lower discharge rates, the flooded 12V batts won't last as long as well maintained AGMs. The A123s have a much higher cycle life, except you are cycling them multiple times on each trip, so that pretty much cancels out. They might las twice as long as AGMs, but then they cost 8X as much per WH (not counting the required balancing circuitry). The small gain in capacity you get for the 12V Lead-Acid is used up in the charge efficiency of the A123s. I don't know
EV digest 7003
EV Digest 7003 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Electricity Book by (-Phil-) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: White Zombie 11s in 07 by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) voltage sag by dale henderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: White Zombie 11s in 07 by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Prius Electronics by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Honda Civic Crankshaft? by Mike Chancey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: voltage sag by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Electricity Book by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Honda Civic Crankshaft? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Dead Batteries by Tom Carpenter [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) re:Digest 7000 by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) The prius A/C controller by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: voltage sag by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: weight savings by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Has anyone tried using several starter motors modified for cooling and hence continuos use as primary motors fo an ev? by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Electricity Book by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Electricity Book by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Electricity Book by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) At last! My conversion to LiIon is complete! by Nikki Bloomfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Has anyone tried using several starter motors modified for [snip] by Roy LeMeur [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Conversion Classes in The Bay? by Larry Cronk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Datsun conversion progress by Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Honda Civic Crankshaft? by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Bill Dube [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: Got Amps by Joe Smalley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: weight savings by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- The best book I know of is Getting Started in Electronics by Forrest Mims, simple, fun, and you retain it. I've taught many people electronics using this awesome book! http://www.forrestmims.com/ -Phil - Original Message - From: Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2007 2:53 PM Subject: Electricity Book I am wondering if anyone here knows of any good books about electricity that cover from the real basics to electronic components? ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- please. sounds like you are in charge of cleaning his ears for wax too so it's not exactly a stretch to think you might know the price. certainly not a stretch to think that you could find out within a 10 second quarter mile Jim Husted wrote: I'm the motor guy, you're barking up the wrong tree, again! LMAO!! Jim Husted Hi-Torque Electric Shape Yahoo! in your own image. Join our Network Research Panel today! http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- forgive my novicedom, but thinking about the issue of voltage sag; could a controller be built such that it could draw from a extra battery to off set the voltage sag? for example if you had a 100v pack but it sagged to 88v under full load could the controller then tap an extra battery to bring the voltage back up to 100v? or would this be to hard, unnecessary or not worth it to have that extra battery [which could be smaller than the pack batteries]? Albuquerque, NM http://geocities.com/hendersonmotorcycles/blog.html http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1000 http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1179 http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1221 http://geocities.com/solarcookingman Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from someone who knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out. http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=listsid=396545433 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- --- Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I just love being right :) what will they cost and where does he get them? and please no secrecy bullshit I'm the motor guy, you're barking up the wrong tree, again! LMAO!! He doesn't have much choice. He's managed to insult/piss off just about everyone else on the list so there aren't many people, besides you, left that even read his posts let alone respond. I'm sure it's just a matter of time before he insults those few of you left and then nobody will read his crap anymore. In the mean time, can I suggest that if you feel a need to respond to him, that you do it privately? That way the rest of us won't be getting his shit second-hand? I can filter out him, but when you respond to him on the list it gets by
EV digest 7000
EV Digest 7000 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: Conversion Classes in The Bay? by Cor van de Water [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Stoern Energy by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: the eVette by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Dessicant by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Setting a Battery on Concrete Myth Answered by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Thanks EVDL by Andrew Kane [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Thanks EVDL by Andrew Kane [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) RE: Another EV smile by Alan Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: EV world map by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) RE: Danaher Motion (Used to be Kollmorgen) Motors by Mick Abraham [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Hypothetical use of A123 cells by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) The hypothetical A123 pack again (clarification) by Steve Powers [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Thanks EVDL by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: temp sensor location by Philippe Borges [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) article: US$15,000 Carbon Fibre Enertia electric motorcycle to hit stores in early 2008 by Paul Wujek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Honda Civic Crankshaft? by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Another EV smile by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Voltage sag in CivicWithACord solved by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: The hypothetical A123 pack again (clarification) by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Thanks EVDL by Andrew Kane [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Plexiglas enclosures. by JOHN P SWEENEY [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Hi JM, In the past years there was a free 1-day EV conversion class by Mike Brown and Shari Prange from Electroauto on the day after the Palo Alto EV show and rally, usually in September/October so you may want to check out the website of the Silicon Valley chapter of the EAA: http://www.eaaev.org/ http://eaasv.org/ I see that the rally is now planned for end August. It is usually held in the parking lot of the Palo Alto Highschool, along El Camino Real, corner Embarcadero. This is across from Stanford Stadium and Town and Country Village shopping mall. The EV class has been given in a HP building in Cupertino, though I do not know the plans for this year. On the EAA site you will find the email address of the chairman of the SV EAA chapter, Jerry Pohorsky. He will be able to tell you more about the program and whether Electroauto has time to give another class this year. Regards, Cor van de Water Systems Architect Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Private: http://www.cvandewater.com Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +1 408 542 5225VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925 Fax: +1 408 731 3675eFAX: +31-87-784-1130 Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of jmmistrot Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 4:53 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Conversion Classes in The Bay? Folks, Thought it might be wise to take a class before starting my own project... Anyone know of some good resources in the by area? Thanks, jm ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- ROTFLMAO I was going to post that they'd probably experience a wheel bearing failure after only 17 miles. The old folks on the list would have got the joke. I decided not to waste the bandwidth, now I wish I had. Obviously these guys are following the Tilly Scam playbook page for page. They speculated that the hot lighting destroyed one of the bearings. http://www.newsfactor.com/story.xhtml?story_id=0110CMWK Apparently it has some quantum/Heinseberg problem. The presence of an observer changes the process and it stops working. Anyhow, I'm only responding to give you some things to say to the guys who tell you you need to look into making a Steon powered car. The topic's dead. Danny Dan Frederiksen wrote: it's Steorn. and they crashed hard at the demo. no show. saga continues who knows. what a world Rob Hogenmiller wrote: Anyone seen the news on the Stoern project? (thoughts on it) Free Energy. -- If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has 4 lines of legalistic junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long legalistic signature is void. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- First of all, there is nothing inherently unsafe about three wheelers per se. There are unsafe three wheeled designs, just like there are unsafe four wheeled designs. But that is because of poor design choices, not because three wheelers are inherently unsafe A properly designed three wheeler, either Delta or Tadpole, will slide before it tips.
EV digest 7001
EV Digest 7001 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Plexiglas enclosures. by Lawrence Rhodes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) melted battery post by Ted Sanders [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Trojan T105 measurements. by JS [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: melted battery post by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) RE: Voltage sag in CivicWithACord solved by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: WZ cool advertising was: Zombie Rips into the 11s by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) July Meeting Place by [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: WZ cool advertising was: Zombie Rips into the 11s by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) RE: Voltage sag in CivicWithACord solved by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: article: US$15,000 Carbon Fibre Enertia electric motorcycle to hit stores in early 2008 by lyle sloan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Got Amps by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) RE: Got Amps by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Required Fire sticker for WA State by Joe Smalley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Electricity Book by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Electricity Book by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Electricity Book by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Electricity Book by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Convert 1995 Civic to Parallel Hybrid by Larry Licata [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Got Amps by Andrew Kane [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Converted super cars by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Electricity Book by patrick DonEgan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Converted super cars by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Honda Civic Crankshaft? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Electricity Book by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: melted battery post by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: Honda Civic Crankshaft? by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: Electricity Book by Mike Sandman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 28) Re: melted battery post by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 29) Re: melted battery post by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 30) Re: Electricity Book by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED] 31) RE: Another EV smile by Jeff Mccabe [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Could have been a loose connection under the plexiglass. That is something to think about. However PFC's tend not to get hot wires. Lawrence Rhodes - Original Message - From: JOHN P SWEENEY [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: EV LIST EV@listproc.sjsu.edu; EVBMS [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2007 7:32 AM Subject: Plexiglas enclosures. Guys girls, I have made a rather startling discovery about using Plexiglas as an enclosure for power electronics. Plexiglas burns really well!! I had the brilliant (well sort of) idea to make the enclosure for my rather unique PFC capacitive coupled charger so people could see the inner workings of the beast and at the same time provide electrical isolation, I.E. keeping curious fingers away from 300 VDC. ( hey it was a good idea at the time) I have been using the charger on a daily basis for the past couple years without incident. A couple days ago something failed in the charger and ignited the Plexiglas. OOH HAH by the time I noticed the failure the charger was a flaming blob of plastic. I doubt I'll ever know what failed other than it was not the rectifiers, everything else is covered in melted plastic and dry chemical fire extinguisher powder. The only things that were hurt were the charger and my pride however if it had been an unattended late night recharge my shop would have burnt to the ground. So a word to the wise don't use Plexiglas for your enclosure when parts can fail and ignite it, and always have a fire extinguisher handy. Pat ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2007 22:08:53 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeff Mccabe [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: Another EV smile To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] You might be Alan, I definitely worked through allot of electrical issues. The best thing I did was remove the entire stock fuse and relay panel and used a 12 circuit hot rod unit. The stock unit had 34 fuzzed circuits and 22 relays ! Thanks, Jeff McCabe --- Alan Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jeff, After looking at your EV Album listing, your parts used, and modified, and the great result you have come up with, I would not say you are an electronic novice. Maybe at the start, but after 16 months, I think you could teach the class now. Great car, I hope you enjoy it a lot! Alan Brinkman -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Mccabe Sent: Friday,
EV digest 6996
until I set the throttle back to neutral. It was designed specifically for personal mobility scooter use. So you can put as many safeguards into the system as you want. Since that scooter was for an elderly man, as a precaution I also adjusted the sensitivity of the potentiometer so he could select what the top speed could be. Basically a pot in series with the pot. So coming from the robot/personal mobility scooter angle I can see how Tom's vehicle is set up. Would I drive it? Not sure yet. Need to see it in person first. I'm sure Tom would probably say I'm totally wrong but it's great to drive. Chip ElectroScooterWorks.com On Jul 5, 2007, at 6:52 PM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote: From: Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: July 5, 2007 5:43:29 PM EDT To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: the eVette Hi John, Thanks for the input, however First off all a standard three wheeler is inherently unsafe, the front wheel in tring to steer the bike is what turns it over. I guess you couldn`t see the chuck hole our car went over in that turn, I thought the springs worked pretty good on that turn. Florida doesn`t have many hills so thats so thats not a problem here. By the did I tell you we`ve been experimenting with driving the car autonomously by computer. Tom Sines ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- If you do bury batteries underground, they should remain at a constant 57F. This would keep the batteries from overheating, but you wouldn't get the full capacity achievable at 70-80F. My 2 Wh, Brandon Kruger http://bmk789.dyndns.org/ev/ http://cafepress.com/altfuel On 7/5/07, patrick DonEgan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 7/5/07, Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'll start off with a grid-tie system but evenually I want an interrupt breaker that will divert PV output from the static inverter to a battery bunker I'm going to bury in the backyard. That way, if the grid goes down, I'll have batteries to run things for a little while. If you bury the batteries, will the earth soak up a percentage of your energy? -- ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Right now I'm loosening all the stuff in preparation for removing the motor and transmission from my old Datsun. I hope to pull them this weekend. There is a large nut around the speedo cable (3/4 inch head in my case) that will turn. There is also a small bolt in the transmission right next to where the speedo cable enters. Looking at my service manual I'm having a hard time figuring out if that is a bolt I am NOT supposed to remove (a reverse gear locking bolt) or if that bolt allows me to pull the whole assembly out of the transmission. The factory service manual for the does not make it clear. I know most Datsun conversions are based on newer models than mine. However, my tranny is the first of the newer type full syncro units. My factory service manual devotes a couple of pages to the newer full syncro tranny and most of the section to the older transmissions with syncros in all but 1st gear. There are a number of Datsuns in the EV album. Someone with one please share a bit of their experience. I can't afford to just cut the cable and figure it out later, '66 Datsun parts are hard to get (and tend to be expensive when you find them.) Thanx, Paul neon G. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Well, what about the capacitance of the Earth (aka dirt)??? I know when you bury electrical cables, you lose power. On 7/5/07, Brandon Kruger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you do bury batteries underground, they should remain at a constant 57F. This would keep the batteries from overheating, but you wouldn't get the full capacity achievable at 70-80F. My 2 Wh, Brandon Kruger http://bmk789.dyndns.org/ev/ http://cafepress.com/altfuel On 7/5/07, patrick DonEgan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 7/5/07, Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'll start off with a grid-tie system but evenually I want an interrupt breaker that will divert PV output from the static inverter to a battery bunker I'm going to bury in the backyard. That way, if the grid goes down, I'll have batteries to run things for a little while. If you bury the batteries, will the earth soak up a percentage of your energy? -- ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I'm looking for a graph of Amp hr capacity vs time for Optima D34's. I went to the Optima site but only found the 20 hour and 100 hour values. I'm basically looking for the 1 hour value but I do have need of an actual graph. I contacted Optima customer service and they sent me a open circuit voltage vs state of charge graph. Do any of you have a URL to a graph of Amp Hr capacity vs time? Am I asking for this correctly? Peter ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- If you had discharge curves (voltage vs time) at different currents, you could pick a cutoff voltage, then figure out the time, and backcalculate the AH
EV digest 6997
EV Digest 6997 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: ev1 scr drrives by dbd [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) White Zombie 11s in 07 by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: how much dc to get about 450 v ac by owen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) 11s in '07...Timing is Everything! (pt 1) by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Steel by Phelps [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Dessicant by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Steel, Back to the old Grind! by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: 11s in '07...Timing is Everything! (pt 1) by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: how much dc to get about 450 v ac by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: bury batts was: Re: Free Energy by joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Thanks EVDL by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: bury batts was: Re: Free Energy by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: bury batts was: Re: Free Energy by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Setting a Battery on Concrete Myth Answered by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Steel by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Steel by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Steel by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Got any photos? Contact me at my private email address and I'll try to help as I'm restoring my own Bradley GT E Don B. Davidson III [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: FRED JEANETTE MERTENS [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 9:07 PM Subject: ev1 scr drrives I have an original equipment bradley ev1 drive + ge motor but I don't have any info that tells me where to hook up the speed control pot and also need to know where the wires go to on the vechicle that are terminated on the top of the motor controller , on the scar control that has 2 rows of 10 screws on row marked l the other marked r ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hello to All, I'm forwarding Tim's post to the EVDL, because for some reason, it didn't make it when he sent it directly: Hello everyone, After many hours of work on the car to get ready for racing, Friday finally came. It had been raining off and on all day with downpours in the afternoon. It was starting to look like the anti-EV vortex was back. I arrived at Wayland's around 4:00 pm to find the shop full of cameras and crew interviewing Wayland. Between the weather and the distractions it wasn't looking good for racing. Marco Mongillo had arrived in his electric Fiat. We waited out in the rain for the cameras to stop rolling so we could load all the racing gear in the service truck. When the cameras stopped, we debated going to the track. With the occasional sun breaks and the dark clouds moving to the north though, we headed to the track. We arrived at the track at around 6:00, the rain had completely stopped, but the sky looked like it could open up at anytime. John drove the service truck directly to our charging area to connect the giant power cable to the PIR transformer for charging while I drove the Zombie to tech inspection. After the inspector's quick look at the car, I was off to the charging area. With a full charge, I pulled up to the water box for the first burnout since the brush timing change. I wasn't sure what to expect, and I was worried about arcing or loss of some torque from the 5 more degree advancement of the motor. I eased into the go pedal, the tires immediately spun up and turned into rolling balls of white smoke. I thought to myself Wow, the car feels like it has more torque, the launch should be interesting. I pulled up to the line next to a new bright yellow Corvette. Yellow, yellow, yellow,I hope this thing goes straight when I hit this pedal green, GO! I stomped the pedal and the car launched perfectly, the front end came up just enough to get good weight distribution, but not far enough to loose any time or waste too much torque. The tires stuck to the track and catapulted the car in a perfectly straight line. I thought oh, here comes the 1/8th mile mark, time for the motor to quit pulling so hard, but it never stopped pulling. This was a whole new car, the batteries were still cold and the brushes were barely broken in. I saw the Corvette coming up in the mirror, but it was too late I had already crossed the finish line nearly a full second in front of him. I pulled up to the shack to grab my time slip, oh, 12.4 @ 101 not bad for the first run. With another cycle on the mighty Enersys/Hawker batteries, I was ready for a second run against the Corvette (this time with his traction control on). A second effortless tire boiling burnout and up to the line again. I smashed the pedal, again a very controllable almost gentle launch (very gentle compared to how the car use to launch). The Corvette was getting smaller and smaller, it was another nearly perfect run, no tire spin, no aggressive
EV digest 6998
here, I have no attachements or different font that should be causing problems - it says 'plain text')it sounds like their model will switch between fuel cell and some sort of multi-vitamin blender generator to supply power to it's 40 miles range worth of Lithium batteries? SO, I guess they are relying on adequate fuel cell developments in order for this vehicle to become reality, as well? So, when they say stuff like '2010' or something, that's likely for the initial Honda FCX-like 2 car, million dollar car fleet, then maybe a few years after that, they'll get their next generation 1/2 million dollar version ,etc. etc. ? (or perhaps they can leverage Honda's experience and start out at just the $500,000 version!). So, their statements about 'we have 500 engineers working on making it into a production model' and 'we're testing batteries until June 2008' are sort of hyperbole since they know full well that 'Lord Fauntleroy is in the Fuel Cell' (my own version of 'the devil's in the details') and, even if they find an acceptable Lithium battery for 40 miles range, which makes it into a $40,000 ish plug-in series hybrid, they will still have that little $500,000 fuel cell component to work out? (plus their Ronco multi-fuel slicer-dicer gizmo). It seems one problem with those Lithium 40 miles range (or more) battery packs are that, even if you can fork out the extra $10,000+ to start out with, you still havethe issue of having to fork out the same amount 5-10 years later, though maybe people can be persuaded to save their extra pump savings into a giant nationalized energy savings account which will pay for their next battery? There's one for Hillary to work on ... I'm still banking on firefly to be the 'game changer' for ev's (not buying into EEStor stuff), an affordable and somewhat light weight-ish 100+ mile range ev ... They presumably have some group 31 batteries coming out this fall, I'd like to see the specs and see if they can fit in something ... Seth - Original Message - From: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 12:18 PM Subject: EV digest 6997 EV Digest 6997 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: ev1 scr drrives by dbd [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) White Zombie 11s in 07 by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: how much dc to get about 450 v ac by owen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) 11s in '07...Timing is Everything! (pt 1) by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Steel by Phelps [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Dessicant by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Steel, Back to the old Grind! by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: 11s in '07...Timing is Everything! (pt 1) by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: how much dc to get about 450 v ac by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: bury batts was: Re: Free Energy by joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Thanks EVDL by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: bury batts was: Re: Free Energy by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: bury batts was: Re: Free Energy by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Setting a Battery on Concrete Myth Answered by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Steel by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Steel by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Steel by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Just to be clear here, I set Paul up with a webmail account on my personal server. I'd originally suggested that he open a Yahoo, Lycos, or Gmail account, but the major webmail providers are blocked for him. I've never done this before for an EVDL member and probably won't very often. I don't have unlimited server space! However, since Paul only needs an account until he gets back to school in the fall, I made an exception. This was a quick fix that got him up and running right away. In general, if Yahoo, Lycos, or Gmail won't work for you, there are literally thousands of other ad-supported webmail providers out there, often co-branded, that probably will. Just type free email into your favorite search engine. Whatever service you choose, don't forget to set it for plain text. Here's one example of a free (ad-supported) email service that defaults to plain text. This may be of interest to some (not all) EVDL members. http://passport.care2.net/signup.html It's on the pokey side (probably close to hopeless on a dialup) and the user interface is a tad convoluted, but glory be, it sends plain text. After you log in, the link for email is the word email in tiny, tiny text at the top right. ;-) As I say, this service won't be for everyone; it definitely has a progressive slant (see the website for more information). I had a little trouble finding free email that might meet with more favor from conservatives, but here are a couple of sources that may be of interest : http://keepandbeararms.com/ http://www.worthyemail.com/ None of the above links is intended as a partisan comment
EV digest 6999
--- ---BeginMessage--- Actually, you probably don't want to leave a battery on a concrete floor, not for the batteries sake but for the floors sake. I left an old flooded battery in one spot on my garage floor for a couple months and the acid stained and tore up the concrete. It must have had a leak or something on the bottom. Chip On Jul 6, 2007, at 5:21 PM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote: From: Michael Barkley [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: July 6, 2007 2:08:12 PM EDT To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Setting a Battery on Concrete Myth Answered I found this article on the internet regarding a couple of battery myths: http://www.inct.net/~autotips/battmyth.htm Battery Myth #2 Storing a battery on a concrete floor will discharge the battery. There is not currently a strong reason for avoiding contact of a battery with a concrete floor. The battery's contact with the concrete should not create a problem with the material in today' s batteries. If the battery is not clean, but has a surface layer of acid or grime which is conductive, the battery can be expected to self-discharge more rapidly than if it was clean and dry. Many years ago, the batteries were constructed with a wooden case around a glass jar with the battery in it. Any moisture on the floor could cause the wood to swell and possibly fracture the glass, causing it to leak. Shortly after the introduction of Hard Rubber containers, which were somewhat porous and of a less than ideal design, there was a chance of current to be conducted through the container of a high carbon content if the moist concrete floor permitted the current to find an electrical ground. These are two of the older reasons for not storing batteries on a concrete floor. There is no reference to avoiding storage on concrete floors in the Battery Service Manual published by the BCI. Their suggestion is appropriate for the current state of the art batteries built by reputable battery manufacturers. For more information on storage, see the AutoTips Battery Storage Tips page. ( Thanks to Interstate Batteries for review and contributions to this article! Check out their Battery Care page for more information.) ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Paul wrote: pull speedo cable (must drain tranny first!) remove hood You only have to drain the tranny if you pull the whole speedo drive assembly. I don't remember having to pull the speedo drive to pull a Datsun tranny in the past and read Larry's message as simply confirming that the purpose of the small bolt is to retain the speedo drive, not that you must pull the drive to disconnect the cable. You're probably going to treat the tranny to a drink of fresh synthetic fluid anyway, so perhaps draining it isn't a biggie, but I'd still just disconnect the speedo cable from the drive and leave the drive place on the tranny if it were mine. Cheers, Roger. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ---REMAINDER OF MESSAGE TRUNCATED---* * This post contains a forbidden message format * * (such as an attached file, a v-card, HTML formatting) * * Lists at sjsu.edu only accept PLAIN TEXT * * If your postings display this message your mail program * * is not set to send PLAIN TEXT ONLY and needs adjusting * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- hmm maybe 'we' could make an online map showing the EVs in the world that site with all the car projects might be a good host maybe EV enthusiast yet without a car could also be plottet and EV recharge friendly locations make something GM could vent their anger at :) Dan ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- How does one search pasts posts,(those that were made before I subscribed)? God bless ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Anyone seen the news on the Stoern project? (thoughts on it) Free Energy. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- David Dymaxion wrote: I'm not disagreeing, but looking at things from a different point of view. The Evette might be able to hold more batteries as a percentage of vehicle weight, which is the important number for city range. I think your comparison between a bicycle, unicycle, and 3 and 4-wheelers is invalid, at least in this instance. It assumes that the fewer wheels a vehicle has, the less framework/structure it has as well; it kind of falls apart if the 'unicycle' is a bicycle with the front wheel removed, which is more like what Tom has done (except he also replaced the bicyle's remaining wheel with one from a motorcycle, so the wheel may not be the limiting factor anymore but the 'unicycle' now weighs as much or more than the original bicycle ;^). So if it is properly designed, a vehicle like the Evette could have a higher battery to vehicle weight ratio than a four wheel vehicle, giving it greater range. Finding strong enough bearings and axles is doable
EV digest 6992
send email to me, or the EVDL, that has 4 lines of legalistic junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long legalistic signature is void. Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2007 16:54:07 -0700 From: Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Highlighting EV's To Others Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I think you left out the biggest categories for us. conversions and conversion for hire, and race. Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2007 17:10:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Joseph Lado [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: A Welder as a Power Supply To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ascii Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] I was just thinking. Has anyone tried to use a welder to change the AC power of a generator to the DC power needed to run a DC EV? I have been thinking of creating a range extending generator power supply for my EV, but I haven't figured out how to get the AC to DC in high enough DC voltage and amps to keep my car going. I can cruse at 50 plus miles an hour at about 50 amps. My battery pack is a 108 volt pack. I have found welders that have a 110 volt output with different amp outputs some vary from 20 amps to 300 amps. Could I rig up a combination that would give me the volts and amps I need to keep going without, well welding everything in my car together? joE ladO Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2007 18:18:57 -0600 From: John A. Evans - N0HJ [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Highlighting EV's To Others Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Race shouldn't be an issue here ;) john Jeff Shanab wrote: I think you left out the biggest categories for us. conversions and conversion for hire, and race. From: R. Matt Milliron [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: EV fire Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2007 19:28:28 -0500 Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Wed, 4 Jul 2007 12:41:33 -0700, you wrote: I witnessed an EV fire where the battery cables shorted to sheet metal where they came thru the body steel. It is insufficient to use a simple rubber grommet to protect a 2/0 cable because of high stresses from the cable combined with sharp edges of the steel. What is needed is a strong insulating feed thru panel made from a material such as glastic or phenolic, combined with an insulating clamp or strain relief. It also helps to have a fuse in the middle of the battery pack. Another safety strategy is to have an Anderson plug to completely disconnect the battery from the car propulsion when Ev is being charged or stored. I used 1.25 inch and 3/4 inch watertight electrical connectors from Lowes. They have a rubber seal that fits tight to the cable. Cable does not touch metal. Screw down the cap and it tightens around your cable. You will need a knockout set to pull out the holes. R. M. Milliron 1981 Jet Electrica http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/702 This machine has been garaged for 17 years. I am trying to get it running. Tabitha, my daughter, named it, Pikachu. It's yellow and black, electric and contains Japanese parts, so I went with it. Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2007 19:31:01 -0500 To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu From: Mike Chancey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Solar Powered NEV Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed HI folks, I just stumbled on this and I thought I should pass it along. http://www.aboutmyplanet.com/alternative-energy/solar/solar-diy-car-kit also at: http://www.sunnev.com/proto.htm I have always been been pretty dismissive of NEVs and of solar panels on EVs, but in this case there is some logic in it all. Thanks, Mike Chancey, '88 Civic EV Kansas City, Missouri EV Photo Album at: http://evalbum.com My Electric Car at: http://www.geocities.com/electric_honda Mid-America EAA chapter at: http://maeaa.org Join the EV List at: http://www.madkatz.com/ev/evlist.html In medio stat virtus - Virtue is in the moderate, not the extreme position. (Horace) Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2007 17:41:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Bruce Weisenberger [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Solar Powered NEV -Why? To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] When you can have a Solar Charge EV that can drive down the road? See link: www.xlr8sun.com Found this link after last years Battery Beach Burnout Photos were posted. Solar Charged Cycle down by Jerry's neck of the Woods in Florida. --- Mike Chancey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: HI folks, I just stumbled on this and I thought
EV digest 6993
] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 1:09 PM Subject: Re: Zilla emergency shutdown Just google interia switch and you'll find some stuff. The only problem is that the interia switches have a g rating. I am assuming it is the range of g's that make the switch cut off. Does anyone know the g's you ecounter in an accident? On 7/3/07, Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think you could get one from any ford car. They are in the back by the fuel tank. If you hit the car hard enough they shut the fuel pump off. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chip Gribben Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 14:40 To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Zilla emergency shutdown How about an inertia switch? Ford has these on their cars, I think. You hit something it turns the car off. I think the Tour de Sol cars had to have these but can't recall and anyone get easily get one. I opened one up years ago. I think it had a ball bearing or something inside that would release upon impact and strike a relay. It was mounted under the dash on the firewall. It's all a 12 volt affair so it would be just like any other relay in series with the key switch. I think it's on the Electric Ford Ranger, but I'm sure you can get them somewhere. These folks are going overboard on the safety issue as far as an emergency kill switch. Are they going to require the same thing on OEMs. Granted we do at NEDRA but even the gassers have to have an emergency cut off switch on the back. Chip Gribben NEDRA http://www.nedra.com On Jul 3, 2007, at 1:31 PM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote: From: Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: July 3, 2007 1:23:12 PM EDT To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Zilla emergency shutdown Hi Dave; Didn't the State want a Kill button OUTSIDE the damn car, like a Big Red Button in the BACK, OUTSIDE like the Nedra rules? That's wgat I thought that paper sez. The state is as clueless about EV's as I am with nuclear Fissin'! I sorta set my BIG fuseholder up in a positition in my Jetta trunk , planning a steel Cam Over setup you could pull outside the car, right above where it sez; :Led Sled which would pop the 200 amp fuze out. If forced onto the issue? Not crazt about an obviously marked thing like that in public.CDOT didn't have that on any of their Forces from Solectria. CT DID have an intreaging program, in the DOT with a few EV's. Thats wHY the Electric tag is taken. I asked, was willing to actually PAY Corrupticut for ann Electric Tag.Maybe Lectrik or something like that? I'm too cheap to PAY for a specuial tag, it doesn't give me any better range? Does it? I like your plans to Kill the car. If UI were the inspecter??OK by me.Isn't there inertional type switch thingies in some gas rigs that kill THEM if hit?Or what turns on the Airbags? Of course the firepeople will probably want to hack up as many cables they can find, in a wreck? They LOVE to do that! So try to stay consious, after the wreck, to protect yur investmentG They CLIMBED all over Tony's Rabbit in Worchester during HIS fire. Christ! They coulda pushed the car to safer ground, unharmed! Punched out a window in his Isuzu pickup! Why? Because they COULD, to quote Tony. What do ya do? Tow the car over to DOT in Weathersfield?This must be an ongoing thing? I can't wait for the emmissions folks to hit me up for a testg! I hope that goes as smoothly as before with the Rabbit?? They never LOOKED at the car, took my word for it that it was electric. Do I have a trusting voice??As a dedicated CT Taxpayer? No hassle, guy was very nice, we chatted close to an hour! Changed my VIN to electric powered, as they SHOULD for yur Porsche. VIN is how they go, if car was Born with a Diseasel or Gas engine THAT'S what it is in CT's archives, until ya hit the right guy! Good Luck Bob - Original Message - From: Dave Cover [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 8:08 AM Subject: Zilla emergency shutdown I have to provide a means to shut down my car in an emergency. The state wants me to provide a way for emergency personel to shut 'er down if I run into a tree. The emergency people want to be sure that the pack is positively disconnected, which means the contactors are open. My preference is to interrupt the power at the 12 volt level so the controller will shut itself down. I have my eye on one of those big red buttons you mash to kill things. I'd place it in a very prominent location under the hood to give them the warm and fuzzies. They can also just turn off the key in the ignition. Parameters: 1 - protect the Zilla 2 - sacrifice the contactors
EV digest 6994
EV Digest 6994 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: conversions by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: BB 600's by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Sailboat Conversion by Bill Dube [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) RE: the eVette by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) ADC Sep Ex or Perm-132 ? by Corry Peterson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) RE: the eVette by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: conversions by Chip Gribben [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) RE: the eVette by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: BB 600's by damon henry [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack by Peter Gabrielsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: conversions by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: the eVette by John Fisher [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) RE: White Zombie and Friday Night Drags by Matt Graham [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Tony Hwang [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) RE: the eVette by Mike Chancey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: the eVette by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Hi Greyfoot, We live in Okeechobee Forida, if you would like a ride, call frist and let us know when you would like to come. Tom Sines -Original Message- From: TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Jul 5, 2007 8:34 AM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: conversions Tom, If I'm ever down Florida-way we'll have to run yours and mine through a slalom. I'm unconvinced that my normal 4-wheeler is less maneuverable than your 3 wheeler. Trot, the certain, fox... On 7/5/07, Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Rodger, Yes it is a motorcycle, that means no insurance in Florida. The advantages are,it holds more batteries so it will go farther on a charge.It will out maneuver any 4wheel car any time, and its fun to drive.It also has 2 motors twice the power. Tom Sines -- | /\_/\ TrotFox \ Always remember, | ( o o ) AKA Landon Solomon \ There is a | \_/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] \ third alternative. PeoplePC Online A better way to Internet http://www.peoplepc.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- BOB, I think I will come to PIR for the wayland invitational and bring a scooter that I have set up for 36v if you have room for that many bb 600 maybe we can adapt them to it, probably have to build some sort of different battery box. what would the dimensions of a 36v pack be? See you in portland...(I if you are staying at the same hotel maybe we can share the expense) --- Steven Ciciora [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey Bob, How many, and how much? I can get them back to Colorado in Bill Dube's rig, so shipping won't cost anything... - Steven Ciciora --- Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi EVerybody; Micro Sloth is up to it's old stuff! My note an BB600's bounced, said I wasn't subscribed to the List? Like hell! Have been for YEARS, but I'll use one of my notes that DID get through.Wipe it clean and forward. Point here, Oh, I'm GETTING to it! Anybody want/need some BB600's, like for a bike, scooter? A reasonable load for a Prius, as I would deliver on my Portland Pilgrimage in a few daze.Would help defray the expences, too. Seeya at PDX Bob Building a website is a piece of cake. Yahoo! Small Business gives you all the tools to get online. http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/webhosting Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links. http://mobile.yahoo.com/mobileweb/onesearch?refer=1ONXIC ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Speaking of battery packs.. It seems ThunderSky's prices have gone up about 25% in the last 2 months, which means they've lost most of their cost advantage over PHET (and others), and with all this talk of dodgy business practices, it's given me reason for pause. So once again I'm entertaining the idea of building a pack from 18650s (yes, what a lot of work..!) I believe the Tesla pack has modules of 99 cells in series, with 23 of these modules connected in parallel. So no single cells are explicitly paralleled, and if capacities don't match exactly well it's averaged out over the 99. Great way to do it. But this requires BMS monitoring of each cell individually, which is just too much work for me!
EV digest 6995
EV Digest 6995 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: the eVette by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Vicor DC-DC by [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: easy (back on topic) by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) V-Infinity DC-DCs (was Re: Vicor DC-DC) by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) World's Quickest Electric Vehicles in Portland, OR - 7/13/07 and 7/14/07 by Roy LeMeur [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Building LiFePO4 packs from many, many 18650s (was Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack) by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: battery carrying straps wtb?? by mike golub [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Knoxville Area happenings? by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: the eVette by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Motors by storm connors [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: the eVette by John Fisher [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: the eVette by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Sailboat Conversion by storm connors [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: ADC Sep Ex or Perm-132 ? by dale henderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Knoxville Area happenings? by storm connors [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: ADC Sep Ex or Perm-132 ? by Dmitri [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) RE: ADC Sep Ex or Perm-132 ? by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) bury batts was: Re: Free Energy by patrick DonEgan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) [Fwd: Re: Fiero conversions..?] by Ken Lange [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Simple, Peter has it right: 375 v / 3.6 volt per cell = about 104 cells or little less that are in series or about 99 cells. Then: 6831 cells /99 cells = about 69 strings in parallel The 99 by 69 combination is the only number that will come out even or you would have to cut a battery into sections. The 375 volts is the normal pack voltage where the actual voltage will be a little higher than that. Roland - Original Message - From: Peter Gabrielsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 10:31 AM Subject: Re: Tesla Roadster Battery Pack 69 in parallel 99 in series. On 7/5/07, Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 11 modules. 6831 cells. 621 cells per module. 3.6 volts tmes 11 is about 40 volts. (that doesn't make sense!) I'm assuming that within each module is even more multiple parallel strings? On 7/5/07, Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: multiple parallel strings. On 7/5/07, Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The Tesla Roadster battery pack has 6,831 cells. The Tesla Roadster, I've heard, is supposed to be 375 volts. Hmm...Lithium Ion batteries are rated at 3.6 nominal voltage. So3.6 volts times 6,831 cells obviously doesn't equal 375 volts!!! What's going on here? -- Zeke Yewdall Chief Electrical Engineer Sunflower Solar, A NewPoint Energy Company Cell: 720.352.2508 Office: 303.459.0177 FAX documents to: 720.269.1240 [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.cosunflower.com CoSEIA Certified Certified BP Solar Installer National Association of Home Builders Quotable Quote In the dark of the moon, in flying snow, in the dead of winter, war spreading, families dying, the world in danger, I walk the rocky hillside sowing clover. Wendell Berry -- www.electric-lemon.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I for one am very interested in it. I don't think that it would be very highway stable but I haven't driven it. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of TrotFox Greyfoot Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 12:50 To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: the eVette John, I'll grant that you're correct. I was assuming that Tom was showing this as a design that's ready to use by the general public, on the roads. I do not doubt that his videos are real and that the car is drivable and generally stable. If that is not the case, I apologize. It woulda been nice if he'd Said so though. Trot, the un-bristled, fox... On 7/5/07, John Fisher [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You guys have missed some essential points about Tom's car, IMO. In treating it as some sort of challenge to be debunked, you haven't noticed what he has achieved, assuming the small pix and video are fair representations. -- | /\_/\ TrotFox \ Always remember,
EV digest 6989
-Encoding: 7bit Thanks for the advice everyone, Danny, have you ever used arctic silver/alumina to bond an IGBT to a heatsinking case? Or do you just think it will work? If this is an epoxy its not going to be easy to remove? You don't think strain in the IGBT is an issue? Danny Miller wrote: Gasket sealers don't conduct heat. For a thermal and mechanical bond, you need arctic silver or arctic alumina thermal epoxy. The key here is it's a relatively strong thermal conductor. Still a bit high relative to thermal joint compound, but way better than silicone or anything else. Ideally you should just bolt it and use joint compound. Thermal joint compound has a better thermal conduction, is not bothered by thermal expansion, and can't fail by breaking off. Note that flatness and rigidity of the heatsink surface is important. If the case is thin metal, it will distort and pull in around the bolt and separate near the pad. Joint compound will not do a great job of filling the gap, the thermal conduction coefficient will be awful and thus severely reduce the device's capacity. Danny GWMobile wrote: There are high temperature gasket sealers made for ice motors that might work. On Tue, 3 Jul 2007 5:49 pm, Lee Hart wrote: From: Thomas Ward I am considering bonding an integrated IGBT DIP module to the aluminum base of a watercooled box. Is this sensible? I wouldn't depend on any kind of adhesive as the sole means of support in an application like this. I assume the IGBT will be producing heat, so there will be thermal stress on the bond. -- Excellence does not require perfection. -- Henry James -- Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart-at-earthlink.net www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming and the melting poles. www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images. From: Dale Ulan [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: RE: Dessicant Date: Tue, 3 Jul 2007 23:31:29 -0600 Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Is it a good idea to put dessicant sachets inside a controller? It will not be effective. The design really needs to be sealed properly. If the assembly is potted, the potting needs to stick effectively to everything and form a seal. Any air expansion area really needs to be treated as if it were full of water. The traditional potting compound used for automotive controllers is a two-part silicone gel that never sets. It is self-healing and resists water. It is commonly found in ignition modules. Even with the remarkable sealing properties, occasionally water damage still occurs. If the assembly is not potted, it needs to be sealed but allowed also to breathe with a water impermeable membrane such as a Gore-Tex plug. These are commonly used on IC engine control modules for this purpose. The Bosch M7 controllers are commonly found underhood, and these have such a plug. Motorola ICE controllers (Cummins, Saturn, Chrysler, Mercury Marine) have these plugs - you can see them easily. If you do not have a pressure equalizing plug, any moisture tends to get drawn in by temperature fluctuations - even up the wires!!! Many years ago GM had a problem with coolant being drawn into the engine control computer via the coolant temperature sensor wires. -Dale Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Nikki Bloomfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: BVS track day Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2007 06:38:24 +0100 To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Hi Folks, We had a great time. I only went on the Saturday as I was busy on the Sunday starting work on my Lithium Ion conversion. I couldn't take the City El as I don't have towing on my license and it was a bit too far for the El to travel on Lead. We took our Prius and an electric bike though and had a great time. There's some more photographs here http://flickr.com/photos/aminorjourney/sets/72157600590946651/ and of course some coverage on the BVS' new website at http:// www.batteryvehiclesociety.org.uk/wordpress/ . I can't wait till next year! On Jul 4, 2007, at 12:37 AM, Rod Hower wrote: Paul, Nice looking bike! Sorry about the motor mishap. Hopefully the Alltrax survived the motor meltdown. Rod Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2007 22:59:14 -0700 From: Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Dessicant Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit If it is sealed, then the dessicant gets the last little bit of moisture out of the air that was around during assembly and the little bit the creeps in over time. If it is not well sealed then it just saturates and stops helping
EV digest 6990
EV Digest 6990 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Wheel alignment Or How to significantly reduce rolling resistance! .. hill climbing .. by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: might be the electric car of the future by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: might be the electric car of the future by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: .. hill climbing .. by M Bianchi [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Evette by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: [EV] Re: might be the electric car of the future by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Free energy by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: The Pontiac Fiero as an EV by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: BB 600's by Steven Ciciora [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) RE: BB 600's by Garret Maki [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) RE: BB 600's by Steven Ciciora [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) OT: Free energy by Lawrie, Robin [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: BB 600's by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: High voltage cable protection and color coding by joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Hill climbing (Was: Re: Wheel alignment) by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Motor Inquiry And Response by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Motor Inquiry And Response by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Highlighting EV's To Others by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Motor weight by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: OT: Free energy by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: [EV] USA Today sticks foot in mouth with 25 cars that made a difference. by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Free energy by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Hill climbing (Was: Re: Wheel alignment) by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: BB 600's by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: BB 600's by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: Hill climbing (Was: Re: Wheel alignment) by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) conversions by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- At 07:36 AM 7/3/2007, peekay wrote: ev's are totally unsuitable for up-hill climbs Why? Cause it uses more energy? So cars with gas engines are unsuitable for hills cause they use more gasoline? My Sparrow handles both of the 1 mile long hills I have to travel over just fine. Just takes a bit more power out of the batteries. -- John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream http://www.CasaDelGato.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hi Bob, Good morning, don`t know a Jim Sines, could be a relation. yes it is a great car, and fun to drive. Tom Sines -Original Message- From: Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Jul 3, 2007 1:27 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: might be the electric car of the future Tom Sines? Any relation to JIM Sines, who was in the Connecticut DOT EV program, years ago?Aren't very many Sines aroundg? A Sine of the times? Sorry! Couldn't resist. Interesting car ya got in the works. Seeya Bob PeoplePC Online A better way to Internet http://www.peoplepc.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hi Jeff, Actually the car will turn in irs own tracks. I`ve beem driving this car for years, and it runs great. Its also a lot of fun to drive. As it turns out,the car is so maneuverable it can stay out of bad situations. Tom Sines -Original Message- From: Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Jul 3, 2007 10:59 PM To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: might be the electric car of the future A conventional vehicle pivots around a point at the center of it's turning radius, this is usually ~30 feet? It looks like the evette can claim a turning radius of -1/2 the track? So a total failure that allows the wheels remain tracked makes a uncontrolled stop in basically a straight line a failure that allows a wheel to go to lock and the vehicle tracks in a striaght line at 1/2 the turning angle, 25 degrees Although a severly dangerous situation, the failure modes have limited range. Also at the instant that you have for example a 25 degree shift in the steering, you don't get it. The vehicle will push. Just stand on the brakes and the front wheels will lock and it will go in a straight line, the natural reaction of the driver. In the evette the powered and steering wheels are togather. So what happens when 1 motor fails on and the driver slams on the brakes? 1 wheel locks and the other is fighting the motor ? The ability to turn 90 degrees in the width of the vehicle is kinda scary to me. The failure mode has to much range. PeoplePC Online A better way to Internet http://www.peoplepc.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- peekay wrote: ev's are totally
EV digest 6984
EV Digest 6984 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Zilla emergency shutdown by Dave Cover [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: might be the electric car of the future by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) RE: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) RE: PVC Glue by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Evette by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Zilla emergency shutdown by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) RE: Max Speed of BLDC Motor by Steven Ciciora [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: PVC Glue by joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) RE: Max Speed of BLDC Motor - Magnaview paper by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: battery carrying straps wtb?? by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Wheel alignment Or How to significantly reduce rolling resistance! by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Poles And Phases by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) RE: Max Speed of BLDC Motor by Dale Ulan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Evette by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Wheel alignment Or How to significantly reduce rolling resistance! .. hill climbing .. by peekay [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: tesla car .. tango .. motor ? by peekay [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: might be the electric car of the future by Michaela Merz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: tesla car .. tango .. motor ? by peekay [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Motor weight by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Honda Insight by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- I have to provide a means to shut down my car in an emergency. The state wants me to provide a way for emergency personel to shut 'er down if I run into a tree. The emergency people want to be sure that the pack is positively disconnected, which means the contactors are open. My preference is to interrupt the power at the 12 volt level so the controller will shut itself down. I have my eye on one of those big red buttons you mash to kill things. I'd place it in a very prominent location under the hood to give them the warm and fuzzies. They can also just turn off the key in the ignition. Parameters: 1 - protect the Zilla 2 - sacrifice the contactors if need be 3 - make sure the system shuts down and contactors open I have a very standard configuration with one exception. I have an additional contactor on the negative side of the pack which is energized when the key switch goes to the on position. I use the start position to tell the Zilla to start up, and it decides when to pull in the positive side contactor. 1. Can I use the kill switch to open the negative side contactor? It will zorch the contactor if it's carrying current, but will the Zilla suffer? 2. Should I interrupt the 12 volt directly to the Zilla pin 3, Key Input (just like turning off the key)? What will happen if under power? 3. Is there a specific connection on the Zilla for this purpose? Thanks Dave Cover ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hi Greyfoot, For higher speeds we can put on a wheely bar.In general its not needed. Occasionally motor has gone out, nothing much happens, inertia kicks in and I steer it to a stop with left and right brake. Front brake on this car is not a good idea, using plug braking, and feft and right brake works fine. Its a Lamborghini. Tom Sines -Original Message- From: TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Jul 3, 2007 7:35 AM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: might be the electric car of the future So... how do you keep the front end on the ground at speed? I see no front-end spoiler for lift compensation and in the video where you turned the car in the street the front end was bouncing badly. Have you given any thought to the age old, what if my controller failed open possibility? With dual motor drive and differential steering that could make a mess of your day in a hurry. Does the front wheel have a brake? If not you're not going to have very good stopping performance in emergency situations. Weight transfer is not your friend when there's no front brake! Is the body from a Fiero rebody kit? Trot, the curious, fox... On 7/3/07, Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Peekee, Good to hear from you. The car is experimental so we use different motors, that this time we`re using smaller motors to make the car less expensive, the car doesn`t care that much. The wheels are independent. Yes two curtis, two zillas would made this car go like a scalded duck. The car will take up to 40 batteries, we hook them up various ways. disc brakes. front wheel is not really a load bearing wheel, nor does it steer the car. Tom Sines -- | /\_/\ TrotFox \ Always remember, | ( o o ) AKA Landon Solomon \ There is a | \_/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] \ third
EV digest 6985
EV Digest 6985 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Fuel Cells by torich1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Fiero conversions..? by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Evette by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) bike spedos in evs by Brian Pikkula [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Evette by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Wheel alignment Or How to significantly reduce rolling resistance! .. hill climbing .. by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: tesla car .. tango .. motor ? by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: might be the electric car of the future by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: tesla car .. tango .. motor ? by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: bike spedos in evs by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: bike spedos in evs by Jeff Mccabe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: might be the electric car of the future by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Evette by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) RE: battery carrying straps =?UTF-8?B?d3RiPz8=?= by Tim Humphrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Fuel Cells by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Evette by Ian Page-Echols [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Zilla Controller by Ralph Merwin [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: tesla car .. tango .. motor ? by Dmitri [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: DC Circuit breaker by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) by Marc Geller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: might be the electric car of the future by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Honda Insight by damon henry [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) RE: bike spedos in evs by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: might be the electric car of the future by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: Zilla emergency shutdown by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: bike spedos in evs by Brian Pikkula [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: might be the electric car of the future by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 28) Re: Evette by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 29) Re: might be the electric car of the future by Andre' Blanchard [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Getting Better!! http://www.greenoptions.com/2007/06/28/honda_fcx_continues_evolution_of_fuel_cell_technology ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I'd have to agree with John, I have a light weight VW bug (lots of fiberglass parts and 10 12 v orbitals. I barely get 15 miles between charges. We all need to be very realistic when we talk about range. Unless this guys trips are all downhill there is no way he gets 50 mi per charge. --- John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello to All, Adrian DeLeon wrote: A guy in town has been driving a Fiero conversion for quite a while. 9 ADC, Curtis 1231, and 10x 12V marine batteries (Interstate?). Very nice installation and super clean setup/wiring. He mentioned a 50 mile range, which I highly doubt with the hills here. But I have no idea where/how he drives it. I've never seen it on the road. I'd say he's not a good source of credible info! 50 miles in a heavy Fiero on just 10, 12V marine batteries? Give me a break! I ran my 1000 lb. lighter Datsun 1200 sedan on 2 more of the same battery type, 12, 12V marine batteries. The car also had a Curtis controller and a 9 ADC motor. Again, weighing a full 1000 lbs. 'less' and with 20% more battery capacity, the car delivered 20-25 miles range per charge. See Ya...John Wayland Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links. http://mobile.yahoo.com/mobileweb/onesearch?refer=1ONXIC ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- what if one motor loses power and the other is full on? Tom S. wrote: Hi Dan, Yes we`ve had it up to 60 mph, it runs great. Inertia makes the car want to go straight. Tom Sines -Original Message- From: Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Jul 3, 2007 7:53 AM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Evette It's a funny car but it seems like a very dangerous configuration. have you tried driving it at high way speeds? not sure but seems to me that the slighest flick of the hand at full speed could be fatal, let alone an actual failure in the controllers. Dan PeoplePC Online A better way to Internet http://www.peoplepc.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Has anyone put a bicycle spedo (aka computer) in their ev? Are there any other options for speedometers? http://cgi.ebay.com/BICYCLE-ODOMETER-SPEEDOMETER-BIKE-CYCLING-COMPUTER_W0QQitemZ330142869559QQihZ014QQcategoryZ30108QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem -- Brian in TX http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/960 http://www.evdub.blogspot.com/ It may seem like I am doing nothing, but on a cellular level I'm really quite
EV digest 6986
no idea what I can replace it with, what little research I've done hasn't helped. Jack I found a nice vacuum pump for power brakes: http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1part=SSB%2D28146N=700+400336+4294821918+115autoview=sku $279.95 includes everything you need. storm connors wrote: * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ---REMAINDER OF MESSAGE TRUNCATED---* * This post contains a forbidden message format * * (such as an attached file, a v-card, HTML formatting) * * Lists at sjsu.edu only accept PLAIN TEXT * * If your postings display this message your mail program * * is not set to send PLAIN TEXT ONLY and needs adjusting * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- How about an inertia switch? Ford has these on their cars, I think. You hit something it turns the car off. I think the Tour de Sol cars had to have these but can't recall and anyone get easily get one. I opened one up years ago. I think it had a ball bearing or something inside that would release upon impact and strike a relay. It was mounted under the dash on the firewall. It's all a 12 volt affair so it would be just like any other relay in series with the key switch. I think it's on the Electric Ford Ranger, but I'm sure you can get them somewhere. These folks are going overboard on the safety issue as far as an emergency kill switch. Are they going to require the same thing on OEMs. Granted we do at NEDRA but even the gassers have to have an emergency cut off switch on the back. Chip Gribben NEDRA http://www.nedra.com On Jul 3, 2007, at 1:31 PM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote: From: Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: July 3, 2007 1:23:12 PM EDT To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Zilla emergency shutdown Hi Dave; Didn't the State want a Kill button OUTSIDE the damn car, like a Big Red Button in the BACK, OUTSIDE like the Nedra rules? That's wgat I thought that paper sez. The state is as clueless about EV's as I am with nuclear Fissin'! I sorta set my BIG fuseholder up in a positition in my Jetta trunk , planning a steel Cam Over setup you could pull outside the car, right above where it sez; :Led Sled which would pop the 200 amp fuze out. If forced onto the issue? Not crazt about an obviously marked thing like that in public.CDOT didn't have that on any of their Forces from Solectria. CT DID have an intreaging program, in the DOT with a few EV's. Thats wHY the Electric tag is taken. I asked, was willing to actually PAY Corrupticut for ann Electric Tag.Maybe Lectrik or something like that? I'm too cheap to PAY for a specuial tag, it doesn't give me any better range? Does it? I like your plans to Kill the car. If UI were the inspecter??OK by me.Isn't there inertional type switch thingies in some gas rigs that kill THEM if hit?Or what turns on the Airbags? Of course the firepeople will probably want to hack up as many cables they can find, in a wreck? They LOVE to do that! So try to stay consious, after the wreck, to protect yur investmentG They CLIMBED all over Tony's Rabbit in Worchester during HIS fire. Christ! They coulda pushed the car to safer ground, unharmed! Punched out a window in his Isuzu pickup! Why? Because they COULD, to quote Tony. What do ya do? Tow the car over to DOT in Weathersfield?This must be an ongoing thing? I can't wait for the emmissions folks to hit me up for a testg! I hope that goes as smoothly as before with the Rabbit?? They never LOOKED at the car, took my word for it that it was electric. Do I have a trusting voice??As a dedicated CT Taxpayer? No hassle, guy was very nice, we chatted close to an hour! Changed my VIN to electric powered, as they SHOULD for yur Porsche. VIN is how they go, if car was Born with a Diseasel or Gas engine THAT'S what it is in CT's archives, until ya hit the right guy! Good Luck Bob - Original Message - From: Dave Cover [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 8:08 AM Subject: Zilla emergency shutdown I have to provide a means to shut down my car in an emergency. The state wants me to provide a way for emergency personel to shut 'er down if I run into a tree. The emergency people want to be sure that the pack is positively disconnected, which means the contactors are open. My preference is to interrupt the power at the 12 volt level so the controller will shut itself down. I have my eye on one of those big red buttons you mash to kill things. I'd place it in a very prominent location under the hood to give them the warm and fuzzies. They can also just turn off the key in the ignition. Parameters: 1 - protect the Zilla 2 - sacrifice the contactors if need be 3 - make sure the system shuts down and contactors open I have a very standard configuration with one exception
EV digest 6987
. It's all a 12 volt affair so it would be just like any other relay in series with the key switch. I think it's on the Electric Ford Ranger, but I'm sure you can get them somewhere. These folks are going overboard on the safety issue as far as an emergency kill switch. Are they going to require the same thing on OEMs. Granted we do at NEDRA but even the gassers have to have an emergency cut off switch on the back. Chip Gribben NEDRA http://www.nedra.com On Jul 3, 2007, at 1:31 PM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote: From: Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: July 3, 2007 1:23:12 PM EDT To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Zilla emergency shutdown Hi Dave; Didn't the State want a Kill button OUTSIDE the damn car, like a Big Red Button in the BACK, OUTSIDE like the Nedra rules? That's wgat I thought that paper sez. The state is as clueless about EV's as I am with nuclear Fissin'! I sorta set my BIG fuseholder up in a positition in my Jetta trunk , planning a steel Cam Over setup you could pull outside the car, right above where it sez; :Led Sled which would pop the 200 amp fuze out. If forced onto the issue? Not crazt about an obviously marked thing like that in public.CDOT didn't have that on any of their Forces from Solectria. CT DID have an intreaging program, in the DOT with a few EV's. Thats wHY the Electric tag is taken. I asked, was willing to actually PAY Corrupticut for ann Electric Tag.Maybe Lectrik or something like that? I'm too cheap to PAY for a specuial tag, it doesn't give me any better range? Does it? I like your plans to Kill the car. If UI were the inspecter??OK by me.Isn't there inertional type switch thingies in some gas rigs that kill THEM if hit?Or what turns on the Airbags? Of course the firepeople will probably want to hack up as many cables they can find, in a wreck? They LOVE to do that! So try to stay consious, after the wreck, to protect yur investmentG They CLIMBED all over Tony's Rabbit in Worchester during HIS fire. Christ! They coulda pushed the car to safer ground, unharmed! Punched out a window in his Isuzu pickup! Why? Because they COULD, to quote Tony. What do ya do? Tow the car over to DOT in Weathersfield?This must be an ongoing thing? I can't wait for the emmissions folks to hit me up for a testg! I hope that goes as smoothly as before with the Rabbit?? They never LOOKED at the car, took my word for it that it was electric. Do I have a trusting voice??As a dedicated CT Taxpayer? No hassle, guy was very nice, we chatted close to an hour! Changed my VIN to electric powered, as they SHOULD for yur Porsche. VIN is how they go, if car was Born with a Diseasel or Gas engine THAT'S what it is in CT's archives, until ya hit the right guy! Good Luck Bob - Original Message - From: Dave Cover [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 8:08 AM Subject: Zilla emergency shutdown I have to provide a means to shut down my car in an emergency. The state wants me to provide a way for emergency personel to shut 'er down if I run into a tree. The emergency people want to be sure that the pack is positively disconnected, which means the contactors are open. My preference is to interrupt the power at the 12 volt level so the controller will shut itself down. I have my eye on one of those big red buttons you mash to kill things. I'd place it in a very prominent location under the hood to give them the warm and fuzzies. They can also just turn off the key in the ignition. Parameters: 1 - protect the Zilla 2 - sacrifice the contactors if need be 3 - make sure the system shuts down and contactors open I have a very standard configuration with one exception. I have an additional contactor on the negative side of the pack which is energized when the key switch goes to the on position. I use the start position to tell the Zilla to start up, and it decides when to pull in the positive side contactor. 1. Can I use the kill switch to open the negative side contactor? It will zorch the contactor if it's carrying current, but will the Zilla suffer? 2. Should I interrupt the 12 volt directly to the Zilla pin 3, Key Input (just like turning off the key)? What will happen if under power? 3. Is there a specific connection on the Zilla for this purpose? Thanks Dave Cover -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.9.14/885 - Release Date: 7/3/2007 10:02 AM ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- JB Weld is nothing more than a high temp epoxy with an metal powder filler and a helluva lot of good marketing. It cannot do much that epoxy cannot do except for high temp work. The filler is helpful in some circumstances and detrimental in others, because it's a somewhat thicker mix which doesn't gap-fill as well. PVC is generally bondable with epoxy. If you start with something like PVC
EV digest 6988
EV Digest 6988 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: bike spedos in evs by Paul Compton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: battery carrying straps wtb?? by MIKE WILLMON [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Inertia Switch by Daniel Eyk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) RE: High voltage cable protection and color coding by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) RE: High voltage cable protection and color coding by Steve Peterson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: battery carrying straps wtb?? by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Dessicant by Thomas Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Thermally effective adhesive by Thomas Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) RE: High voltage cable protection and color coding by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: battery carrying straps wtb?? by MIKE WILLMON [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) RE: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) RE: High voltage cable protection and color coding by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) BVS track day by Paul Compton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) USA Today sticks foot in mouth with 25 cars that made a difference. by Lawrence Rhodes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) RE: High voltage cable protection and color coding by Steve Peterson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: battery carrying straps wtb?? by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: BVS track day by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) RE: bike spedos in evs by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: bicycle computers... in your ev by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: High voltage cable protection and color coding by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) RE: Zilla emergency shutdown by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Honda Insight by David Roden (Akron OH USA) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) RE: bike spedos in evs by Claudio Natoli [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: USA Today sticks foot in mouth with 25 cars that made a difference. by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: [EV] USA Today sticks foot in mouth with 25 cars that made a difference. by Eduardo Kaftanski [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: Thermally effective adhesive by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 28) Re: Dessicant by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 29) Re: [EV] Re: might be the electric car of the future by Eduardo Kaftanski [EMAIL PROTECTED] 30) Re: The Pontiac Fiero as an EV by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Quite an elegant solution; http://www.trailtech.net/ Paul Compton www.evguru.co.uk www.sciroccoev.co.uk www.bvs.org.uk www.morini-mania.co.uk www.compton.vispa.com/the_named - Original Message - From: Brian Pikkula [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 4:40 PM Subject: bike spedos in evs Has anyone put a bicycle spedo (aka computer) in their ev? Are there any other options for speedometers? http://cgi.ebay.com/BICYCLE-ODOMETER-SPEEDOMETER-BIKE-CYCLING-COMPUTER_W0QQitemZ330142869559QQihZ014QQcategoryZ30108QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem -- Brian in TX http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/960 http://www.evdub.blogspot.com/ It may seem like I am doing nothing, but on a cellular level I'm really quite busy. -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.9.14/885 - Release Date: 03/07/2007 10:02 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I searched all over the internet and couldn't find the ones I wanted to show you. But I found these: http://www.sjdiscounttools.com/kdt2279.html expensive $10 ea http://www.sjdiscounttools.com/kdt205.html less expensive $4 They're spendy. I got one from Batteries Plus here in Anchorage for $2. Its just a rubber strap with hooks on each side that hook into the lifting eyes on the batteries. Mike, Anchorage, Ak. - Original Message - From: mike golub [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Monday, July 2, 2007 11:31 pm Subject: battery carrying straps wtb?? To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Does anyone recommend any decent pair of battery carrying straps/handles??? Thanks Mike Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story. Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games. http://sims.yahoo.com/ ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- The inertia switch that Chip mentioned is available from EV-America. I bought one and plan to install it in my S-10 Conversion. I don't remember what they cost, but it wasn't that much as I got a couple of items for about $80 including shipping. Here is their link. Hope this helps. Dan Eyk http://www.evamerica.com/ Daniel Eyk Vancouver, Wa. Electric S-10 project E-15 project Looking for
EV digest 6980
EV Digest 6980 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) PVC Glue by Bill Dennis [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: PVC Glue by rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: PVC Glue by Michael Barkley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: PVC Glue by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: PVC Glue by John A. Evans - N0HJ [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: A battery test algorithm that I recently came up with by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Would you build if you could buy? by Michael Perry [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: A battery test algorithm that I recently came up with by Joe Smalley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: PVC Glue by Michael Perry [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: PVC Glue by Thomas Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) RE: Zombie Rips into the 11s by Pestka, Dennis J [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) article: evDaytona: electric motocycle with turgid windscreen by Paul Wujek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Flooded Nicads? by Tom Gocze [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: article: evDaytona: electric motocycle with turgid windscreen by lyle sloan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Wheel alignment Or How to significantly reduce rolling resistance! by Markus Lorch [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Wheel alignment Or How to significantly reduce rolling resistance! by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- I've got a few PVC body parts to which I need to affix some metal L-brackets, which will then get bolted to the frame. One suggestion I got was to use Gorilla Glue. Does anyone have any other recommendation for a good glue or mastic to attach the L-brackets to the PVC? Thanks. Bill Dennis ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Bill Dennis wrote: I've got a few PVC body parts to which I need to affix some metal L-brackets, which will then get bolted to the frame. One suggestion I got was to use Gorilla Glue. Does anyone have any other recommendation for a good glue or mastic to attach the L-brackets to the PVC? Thanks. Bill Dennis JB Weld ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Could you sandwich the L-Brackets between the main PVC part, and another cutout piece of PVC that mimicks the shape of the main PVC part? Then use JB Weld to adhere all three items as one. M. Barkley www.texomaev.com http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1135 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- With existing vehicle A/C solution you only substitute external pulley drive with motor drive. Everything else stay the same, not requiring re-engineering. Not that it's a rocket science but why bother if you can reuse most of the well designed system? With window unit you need to install whole setup - radiators, evaporators, valves, hoses and all that stuff. Mounts, brackets, etc. Not undoable but more work involved. Not to mention that stock system components are already sized for the job in *this* car. I kept most of the stock stuff in place, just moved compressor itself. Very simple mod. But I may agree if you create A/C from scratch in the vehicle which never had it in a first place, window unit may be somewhat self-contained OK solution. Victor Danny Miller wrote: Frankly, I think you guys are going the wrong way with these solutions. If you have a 120V nom pack, you can take apart a 15,000 or so BTU windor air conditioner unit. The compressor and motor are integrated, which at first seems terrible since the motor is AC, but that motor is way smaller and cheaper, largely because it is cooled by the freon running through it. Far, far more practical design for the application. Really if you have a 120VDC pack or more, driving a 120V AC motor is hardly rocket science. This is a fairly simple inverter circuit as things go, it should be able to handle somewhat higher pack voltages by just reducing the duty cycle of the waveform but I'm not sure how much higher. It's only 15 amps or so and the inverter only needs to switch at 60Hz so switching losses are generally easy to manage. I might be interested in doing this design. A DC/DC converter could certainly accomodate higher or lower voltages, though it's more complicated than just a 60Hz inverter. Well, the buck/boost ratio isn't that great and that always makes these converters easier to pull off. These guys who pop up periodically who want to build their own EV controller, this is the direction to send them in. Danny Victor Tikhonov wrote: When I've done this - almost 10 years ago - I used 180V 6.7A Leeson PM DC motor running straight off of 120VDC nom pack (~130V actual) It was consuming about 5.5A at that voltage which translates to 715W which is less than 1hp. But CRX compressor is tiny and efficient, so may not take that much power. Starting current surge must of been 20-25A or so, but I never bothered to measure.
EV digest 6981
EV Digest 6981 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Odyne Corp. Signs Agreement to Provide Its Battery System Technology for up to 2,000 Cars in Mexico City Fleet by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Dave Wilker [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: DC Circuit breaker by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: DC Circuit breaker by Eric Poulsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Odyne Corp. Signs Agreement to Provide Its Battery System Technology for up to 2,000 Cars in Mexico City Fleet by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: DC Circuit breaker by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Flooded Nicads? by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) check out electricevette.com by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: check out electricevette.com by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: VW Rabbits-conversion suggestions by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: article: evDaytona: electric motocycle with turgid windscreen by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: check out electricevette.com by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Wheel alignment Or How to significantly reduce rolling resistance! by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: PVC Glue by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Electric EVette by Tom S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Fiero conversions..? by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Flogging a dead horse - L91 vs X91 by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) RE: J150 Battery by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Wheel alignment Or How to significantly reduce rolling resistance! by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: J150 Battery by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Fiero conversions..? by Jack Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Max Speed of BLDC Motor by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: DC Circuit breaker by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: DC Circuit breaker by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: DC Circuit breaker by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Hig perf lithium by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) Re: Motor weight by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Hi Beth, So Odyne will supply battery management and chargers. Azure the propulsion systems. Can you tell us what the batteries will be? Jeff --- Beth Silverman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.electricdrive.org/index.php?tg=entryidx=morearticle=1528id g=1 Got a little couch potato? Check out fun summer activities for kids. http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mailp=summer+activities+for+kidscs=bz ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Plus, window units are made to be stable, not moving about. They have no flex in the lines. This is so they can keep the gasses from escaping better by using the harder lines. David C. Wilker Jr. USAF (RET) - Original Message - From: Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Sunday, July 01, 2007 8:05 PM Subject: Re: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? With existing vehicle A/C solution you only substitute external pulley drive with motor drive. Everything else stay the same, not requiring re-engineering. Not that it's a rocket science but why bother if you can reuse most of the well designed system? With window unit you need to install whole setup - radiators, evaporators, valves, hoses and all that stuff. Mounts, brackets, etc. Not undoable but more work involved. Not to mention that stock system components are already sized for the job in *this* car. I kept most of the stock stuff in place, just moved compressor itself. Very simple mod. But I may agree if you create A/C from scratch in the vehicle which never had it in a first place, window unit may be somewhat self-contained OK solution. Victor Danny Miller wrote: Frankly, I think you guys are going the wrong way with these solutions. If you have a 120V nom pack, you can take apart a 15,000 or so BTU windor air conditioner unit. The compressor and motor are integrated, which at first seems terrible since the motor is AC, but that motor is way smaller and cheaper, largely because it is cooled by the freon running through it. Far, far more practical design for the application. Really if you have a 120VDC pack or more, driving a 120V AC motor is hardly rocket science. This is a fairly simple inverter circuit as things go, it should be able to handle somewhat higher pack voltages by just reducing the duty cycle of the waveform but I'm not sure how much higher. It's only 15 amps or so and the inverter only needs to switch at 60Hz so switching losses are generally easy to manage. I might be interested in doing this design. A DC/DC converter could certainly
EV digest 6982
? Fugghedaboudit. Adrian ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hello Joseph and All, Joseph T. wrote: I know it's off topic, but I had a question about the Honda Insight. Yeah, it is a bit off topic, but it 'is' about batteries, so maybe we can squeeze it in here for a quick answer. I was wondering whether the Honda Insight is reliable. (I've heard about battery problems.) I know that there is 100,000 mile warranty on the Insight. If you buy this car from a person, can you go to the dealership in case of battery failure and they'll fix it for free? This isn't set in stone, but in general, only the first issue 2000 model had battery pack problems, and only a small percentage did. My beloved Insight was one of them, though it took six long years to manifest itself. The Insight's IMA system that included the NiMH battery pack was factory warranted for 8 years or 80,000 miles, not 100,000 miles. Prius, yes, 100,000 miles from the get-go, but not Honda...at least, not right away. Because the Insight was being developed in the late 90's, the first NiMH batteries were designed early on as well...these batteries were what came in the 2000 model. Honda stepped up and replaced my battery pack with a new pack made from the improved 2nd generation NiMH cells that have a very good record of reliability. They also swapped out the IMA controller and BMS for newly designed ones at the same time...all for free. On top of that, last year Honda announced that all of the existing 8 year, 80,000 mile pack warranties were being extended to 10 year, 100,000 mile warranties...cool! Everyone I know that has a 2001 or later Insight, has not had any battery pack issues. Does Honda have a stockpile of Insight parts, or are replacement parts pricey and expensive. Don't know. My car hasn't needed a single part replaced in 7 years of driving. It's extremely reliable (exception to the above mentioned warranty issue). Honda has a good reputation on its parts situation from all accounts. OK, back to real EVs. See Ya.John Wayland ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lawrence Rhodes Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 10:05 PM To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List Subject: victor Tikhonov Need email for Victor. [EMAIL PROTECTED] this is no good. Lawrence Rhodes.. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Jim Husted wrote: There are actually a few motors that use solid pole shoes... I've often wondered how this effects that motor compared to if it were to have been built with laminated shoes. Solid pole shoes increase the magnetic losses (eddy currents and hysteresis). These don't matter too much if the field current is pure DC (such as for a motor running on a contactor controller). But they are a problem if you use a PWM controller that tries to use the field winding as its inductor. The magnetic field produced by the armature also dithers back and forth a bit as the brush switches from commutator bar to bar. This creates some magnetic losses at the very tips of the pole pieces close to the armature. would laminating the whole housing shell (vs it being solid) offer better properties or in fact worsen them in a DC motor? It would not worsen performance; it would in fact help it if you were using the motor with a PWM controller. But the improvement isn't worth the cost (at least to the guys making the motor :-) In trimming down the ends I found this particular ADC9 housing has at least a .200 difference between the thick and thin areas of the housing! ... would this cause a field imbalance and if so by what degree? Yes, it would unbalance the field, and try to pull the armature off to one side. How strong this force is depends on the field current. The greater the current, the worse the problem. The lack of iron on one side could also result in the iron on that side saturating earlier (at a lower current). If this happens, the side pull could become *really* large! Lastly, The small 6.7 GE motors have a much thinner housing than their Prestolite or ADC's compatable direct replacement motors which usually amounts to a 10 lbs difference between them Again, that means it would saturate at a lower current. I've actually seen some motors that had an *extra* band of iron added around the middle, right over the field pole pieces. -- Ring the bells that still can ring Forget the perfect offering There is a crack in everything That's how the light gets in--Leonard Cohen -- Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net ---End Message---
EV digest 6979
EV Digest 6979 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: tesla car .. tango .. motor ? by Bruce Weisenberger [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) VS: RE: BMS system basic requirements...Re: Cheap by Jukka [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) RE: Fuse recommendation for a 108v pack by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Flooded Nicads? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: WZ cool advertising was: Zombie Rips into the 11s by Derek Barger [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: AC HP or kW by Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Adapter Problem by Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Yale Electric Forklift by Jack Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Yale Electric Forklift by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: How To View These Messages? by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: tesla car by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: J150 Battery by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Fastest EV conversion ever! by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Hybrids done right, Re: Would you build if you could buy? by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Google Link by Dave Wilker [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: tesla car .. tango .. motor ? by Dave Wilker [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Fastest EV conversion ever! by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: J150 Battery by Ev Performance (Robert Chew) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) A battery test algorithm that I recently came up with by Steve Powers [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) a/c for EVs by Michael Mohlere [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: tesla car .. tango .. motor ? by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Flooded Nicads? by RobAmy Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Flooded Nicads? by David Roden (Akron OH USA) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: tesla car .. tango .. motor ? by Dave Wilker [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: J150 Battery by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: A battery test algorithm that I recently came up with by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Thanks for the update John. With you racing the Zombie hands in Netgain, Working on the Tango and giving interviews and post on EVDL its a wonder you have time to go to work and earn money. If Everyone had as much drive as you do this list would be obsolete and every one would be driving EV's already. Thanks for all your hard work. --- John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello to All, I'm very familiar with the Tango, so I thought I'd answer a few of these questions: Peekay wrote: i am curious about the motor used by the 'tango' It uses a pair of direct-drive (through gear reduction) brushed series-wound motors powered by a mighty Zilla Z2K and charged by a mighty liquid-cooled custom model Manzanita Micro PFC charger. strangely the tango seems quite a dead topic :-(( Oh, I feel slighted :-( I take it, you don't read 'all' my posts? I recently wrote quite a bit about the Tango when the third one I've had my hands on passed through for a visit here at the Wayland EV Juice Baryou must have missed that one. Ian Hooper wrote: IIRC the Tango uses two AdvancedDC 8 motors, one for driving each rear wheel (independently). You remember incorrectly :-) It uses a pair of '9 inch' Advanced DC motors, not eights. Pretty impressive performance. Yes, indeed! You ought'a drive one! The instantaneous launch torque from the twin 9s fed with 2000 amps is a face-distorting, gut-wrenching affair! Commuter Cars' 0-60 estimate of 4 seconds is a bit conservative in my opinion. I'd say it's in the 3s for sure. I wonder how Commuter Cars are going with them? I've had the pleasure to know the Woodbury family now for more than 10 years and have been honored to be a part of the development of this unique car. The red Tango serial # 0 has been torn down, modified, and stereo-ized here at the Wayland EV Juice Bar on many occasions. Black Tango serial # 1 is George Clooney's car and has been here as well, and I did some special work on it at one of Clooney's homes in '05. Tango looks mighty sweet in super gloss black! Primer grey Tango serial # 2 (still not yet completed) was here as I said, recently and is pre-sold to a programmer at Google. It has a custom designed and built NiMH battery pack. The boys at Commuter Cars are working on Li Ion packs, too. So yes, things are well at Commuter Cars and orders are coming in from high dollar types willing to put their environmental money where their mouths are. See YaJohn Wayland Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out. http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=listsid=396545469 ---End
EV digest 6969
EV Digest 6969 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Project #3 is a Lawn Mower by Joe Smalley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: n00b in your midst by John Labrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Would you build if you could buy? by peekay [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Weird Questions by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Weird Questions by Danny Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Jet Industries Ford Courier pickup for sale by Roger [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Slightly OT: Painting your EV for less than $100 by lyle sloan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Thundersky Exchange by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) electric bicycle - need help by James Drysdale [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) electric bicycle - need help by James Drysdale [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Cheap by Tony Hwang [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) RE: electric bicycle - need help by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Would you build if you could buy? by Marvin Campbell [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Series/Parallel and Forward/Reverse contactors by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Series/Parallel and Forward/Reverse contactors by (-Phil-) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Google presses for 100 MPG vehicle by (-Phil-) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Improving hillclimbing without mudering the pack? by (-Phil-) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) NiMH pack strategy by RobAmy Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: electric bicycle - need help by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- If you use a PM motor and power it with the recommended voltage, it will self govern without a speed control. If you use a shunt wound motor, it behaves like a PM motor but you have the option of field weakening to increase the speed. If you use a series wound motor, you run the risk of overreving the motor if/when a belt breaks or the clutch is disengaged. If you install a rev limiter, there is no problem. I got a PM motor for mine but have not had time to install it. Joe Smalley Rural Kitsap County WA Former owner of 48 Volt Fiesta NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: mike golub [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 12:34 AM Subject: Project #3 is a Lawn Mower Well, I am almost done with the 98 Chevy Metro, and I have driven over 6,000 miles on the 86 Toyota Pickup. I recently purchased a MTD riding mower it looks like the same model as Wayland's http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/38 Of course, it is still stock and has a 12 HP BS, a 38 cutting blade. So I was looking for motor recommendations. I will keep using it as a mower...And I was wondering if it was necessary to put a controller on the motor or just use the mowers speed control? It has reverse and forward. I also picked up a 78 Polaris snow machine, but I'm not too concerned about that at the moment. Thanks Michael G, Fairbanks ___ You snooze, you lose. Get messages ASAP with AutoCheck in the all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta. http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/mailbeta/newmail_html.html ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hi Jeff Sorry I will spend some time in the archives and websites. Thanks for the heads up. Regards John -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Shanab Sent: 29 June 2007 04:46 AM To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List Subject: Re: n00b in your midst Dan does not speak for the list, and certainly not for me. This topic comes up many times and I urge all to check archives before re-hashing this discussion. This may be something we should add to the instruction page. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- - Original Message - From: damon henry [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 3:26 AM Subject: Would you build if you could buy? This is as I look out at my 2001 Honda Insight that I bought brand new and still love. I always wonder why these hybrid folks want to roll their own when they can just go out and buy one straight from the factory. in a recent report on TV honda insight hybrid sales in japan have crossed the one million mark .. how come they are not so much visible outside japan ? and japanese users are probably as discerning as usa users .. they wouldn't buy if those were not worth buying ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- First of all, charging one set while running off a second is not a good strategy with Lead-Acid batteries. You'll get better range by running both sets at the same time and using your charging current to reduce the load on the batteries. Second, 200 lbs worth of Lead-Acid batteries won't last 5 miles at 60 mph. Probably only 4 miles, and that assumes that the batteries are paralleled. If you use them as separate packs
EV digest 6963
EV Digest 6963 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Sailboat Conversion by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: Weird Questions by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) RE: reed switch application by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) RE: reed switch application by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Typical EV Motor by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: To Gear or Not to Gear a Motorcycle (was Manly EV's, etc.) by Tom Parker [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Controler space by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: S10 transmission by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Chains and belts (was Re: ft-lbs or lbs-ft by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Cheap by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) RE: Typical EV Motor by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) n00b in your midst by John Labrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) RE: n00b in your midst by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) RE: n00b in your midst by John Labrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Weird Questions by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Chains and belts (was Re: ft-lbs or lbs-ft by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) RE: n00b in your midst by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Cheap by Tim Humphrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Sailboat Conversion by Mark Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) RE: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Sailboat Conversion by jerryd [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) RE: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) RE: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Nobody wants my money.. (rant for the day) by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) RE: To Gear or Not to Gear a Motorcycle (was Manly EV's, etc.) by Alan Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- you could give it a lead acid keel then : ) keep the batteries in a custom pod downthere and serve a dual purpose :) ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Rob, Your idea would work but I think you would not be able to maintain 60mph for very long. You would need a 156V or better system with a lot of AH to go any appreciable distance. How about going the other way around? Use the electric drive for your in town driving and the gas engine for highway speeds? To do this on a focus all you would have to do theoretically is replace the back axle with a ford mustang rear end. Couple the pumpkin flange to a pulley and mount the electric motor to the axle and attach a chain system between the two. That way you can work out optimal gearing to achieve at least 45 mph in direct drive. Netgain technology has worked out a controller that makes it possible to drive an electric motor while the engine is running for a parallel motor hybrid vehicle. Currently their system is only for trucks but there are tons of OBD2 interfaces out there that could give you the LOD (engine load) input or speed input necessary to use the electric motor. There are also plenty of people who are familiar with the CAN protocol to help you program a system that would ask the gas engines ECU the right questions. That way you can have Full electric (gas engine in neutral), full gas, electric assist (hybrid mode). I hope this helps. jody -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rob Hogenmiller Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 8:04 To: EV Discussion Subject: Weird Questions I thought I might take a moment to explain the basis of a few questions I've asked, as they might seem a little weird. What I'm hoping to build is an EV-Hybrid. The Concept. Use an existing gas powered vehicle (in my case a 2007 Ford Fusion) to propel the vehicle up to 60mph (legal highway speed in my state). Once reaching 60mph, flip the electric motor on to maintain 60mph. So basically I'm trying to learn the terminology and also understand what kind of components I would need to accomplish this project. Currently I'm thinking of something very simple a on off switch no controller, and cut off switch (not sure if that is the right term) when the brakes are applied, basically like the way cruise control works. I would then set my cruise control on the car at 55mph, or whatever to kick in if the electric motor became under stress. This should bump my gas mileage very high, I'm hoping for well over 100mpg. Obviously this type of setup would not benefit all, but would be a nice setup for a commuter that has a fair share of highway traveling/commuting. You can see some of the things I'm learning/progress at www.7change.com ---End Message---
EV digest 6964
Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hey guys, a friend of mine as some Hawker - Enersys - Powersafe batteries, model SBSC11. They are brand new, but with date codes of around 2006, they were still in crates when he unboxed them. I've just setup a 24volt pack to separately power the field winding on my aircraft generator/motor. Would these be good in a main battery pack? The link below shows the specs: http://www.enersysreservepower.com/documents/US-SBS-RS-002_0205.pdf M. Barkley www.texomaev.com http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1135 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Crap. I realized later WHY you would want the reed switch in there - hills or anytime you want to move the car while holding the brake. I think you would want the reed switch to engage a little earlier than 150 amps though as mentioned in another post. Hmm .. not really. 150A is a 'normal' current draw for my S-10 lead sled (at about 60 mph) . I just want the reed-switch as failsafe, 'controller-full-on-failure' style. mm./ ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Good but extremely pricey. I saw a price of 239 for SBS40 batteries on the web. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michael Barkley Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2007 11:20 To: EVDL.ORG EVDL.org Subject: Hawker SBSC11 Batteries - Good Bad or Ugly ? Hey guys, a friend of mine as some Hawker - Enersys - Powersafe batteries, model SBSC11. They are brand new, but with date codes of around 2006, they were still in crates when he unboxed them. I've just setup a 24volt pack to separately power the field winding on my aircraft generator/motor. Would these be good in a main battery pack? The link below shows the specs: http://www.enersysreservepower.com/documents/US-SBS-RS-002_0205.pdf M. Barkley www.texomaev.com http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1135 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- IEEE has some sort of online seminar about battery charging technology. I think it's mostly a PR event, but it may be of interest to those of you with Li-Ion BMS problems. http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/webcast/5176 Cory Cross ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- --- Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu wrote: EV Digest 6963 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Sailboat Conversion by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: Weird Questions by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) RE: reed switch application by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) RE: reed switch application by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Typical EV Motor by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: To Gear or Not to Gear a Motorcycle (was Manly EV's, etc.) by Tom Parker [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Controler space by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: S10 transmission by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Chains and belts (was Re: ft-lbs or lbs-ft by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Cheap by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) RE: Typical EV Motor by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) n00b in your midst by John Labrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) RE: n00b in your midst by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) RE: n00b in your midst by John Labrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Weird Questions by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Chains and belts (was Re: ft-lbs or lbs-ft by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) RE: n00b in your midst by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Cheap by Tim Humphrey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Sailboat Conversion by Mark Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) RE: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Sailboat Conversion by jerryd [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) RE: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) RE: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Nobody wants my money.. (rant for the day) by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) RE: To Gear or Not to Gear a Motorcycle (was Manly EV's, etc.) by Alan Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2007 13:38:19 +0200 From: Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Sailboat Conversion you could give it a lead acid keel then : ) keep the batteries in a custom pod downthere and serve a dual purpose :) Subject: RE: Weird Questions Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2007 08:40:57 -0400 From: Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Rob, Your idea would work but I think you would not be able to maintain 60mph for very long. You would need
EV digest 6965
EV Digest 6965 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Sunrise Project by JS [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: To Gear or Not to Gear a Motorcycle (was Manly EV's, etc.) by Mark Eidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: To Gear or Not to Gear a Motorcycle (was Manly EV's, etc.) by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Brush timing advance, nothing new :-) by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) RE: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) RE: Infrared coating and airsuspension packagesSubjects for faqs by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Sunrise Project by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: To Gear or Not to Gear a Motorcycle (was Manly EV's, etc.) by Mark Eidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) RE: Infrared coating and airsuspension packagesSubjects for faqs by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) VW Rabbits-conversion suggestions by Gordon G Schaeffer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Infrared coating and airsuspension packagesSubjects for faqs by Andrew Letton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Sunrise Project by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Best Place for Trojans in NorCal? by (-Phil-) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Cheap by Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Wayland Invitational ramblings (Re: Nobody wants my money.. ) by damon henry [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Any Rabbit EV owners here? by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: VW Rabbits-conversion suggestions by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Infrared coating and airsuspension packagesSubjects for faqs by Danny Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Sunrise for a Force? by Todd Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Jim, Saturn Guy [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Bob Rice wrote: Anyhow, IF ya wanna help the cause, send Lee some money! It has been mostly Lees dime on this project. I'm tooting his horn, here. He's too much of a gentleman to ask. * It's easy! Just send your donation to [EMAIL PROTECTED] via PayPal. Try 10% of what your EV saves you in gasoline. That's my minimum! Lee's contributions to this list have more value than that! ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Thanks. The weight is very low and is hanging below the suspension. It works better than I thought it would. The suspension geometry prevents dive on braking. Most everything is aluminum. I need to weigh it but my wife won't let me use the bath room scale.300 for battetres, 80 for the motor, 170 for everything else, frame, wheels, controller. air compressor. Charger not on bike. me On 6/28/07, Alan Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark, Cool ride. I can see lots of thought and time went into your frame. How do you get the single air suspension to stay balanced, both front and rear at ride height? Is there a spring or two that assist at traveling height? How did you keep the curb weight so reasonable? Does the aluminum frame contribute a lot to that? Very nice! Alan Brinkman -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark Eidson Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 5:46 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: To Gear or Not to Gear a Motorcycle (was Manly EV's, etc.) Following similar logic I have arrived at this design: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/preview.php?vid=1231 Hopefully I will get the 15 mi range at a reasonable DOD. I won't be going over 50MPH often or for long stretches. Need to get it on the licensed and on the road and find out. me On 6/27/07, Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think I understand now. Regardless of pack voltage and gearing, when I demand acceleration the system has to generate X watts. Once the limits of pack voltage are reached, X watts are achieved by increasing amperage. Right? Correct. When I look around, though, there doesn't seem to be a one-size-fits-all solution for every application. Absolutely, there is no solution that fits every problem. Vehicles, especially EVs are a compromise. Do we want better handling or more comfort? Lower weight and drag or more interior space? Multispeed transmission, or more batteries? Most of the respondents here have suggested that direct drive is the way to go. with a motorcycle? Abolutely. The trade off is that without a multispeed transmission, the motor has to develope more torque and/or RPM to give the same performance. With a car this means larger or more motors and more powerful controllers. It means the same thing with a motorcycle, however motorcycles are smaller to begin with so using a normal car size motor/controller already gives you the needed torque advantage. That may be true, but I'm curious whether that's the general
EV digest 6957
Subject: Testing Torque Cabilities I have a motor that I can't find any specs on and can't find any information from the manufacturer or on the internet. I was wondering how I might test it's torque capabilities? If I hooked it up to a torque wrench that would give me an idea but then it would be near it's stall very quickly too. Any ideas how I might test it's capabilities? God bless - Original Message - From: John A. Evans - N0HJ [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 6:46 AM Subject: Re: ft-lbs or lbs-ft Ft-lbs (foot pounds) are the units of torque. If you had a lever arm, say like a crescent wrench on a bolt and the arm was one foot long, applying a pound of force at the end of that arm would result in a foot pound of torque being applied to the bolt. Hope this helps, john Rob Hogenmiller wrote: What does a ft-lbs mean? Does a foot-lb, mean that something has the ability to move something one foot that weighs one pound? ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- At 08:35 AM 6/26/2007, Philippe Borges wrote: please boys, plase don't feed the troll !!! let this guy (Dan) talking with himself, smart as he claim he is, he's going to learn lots of things this way :^) He's still posting? More people ought to learn about email filters. I don't see his posts anymore. There was an interesting study some years ago (hmm, I need to find my copy). The jist of it is that Incompetent people not only don't realize they are incompetent, but they are completely unable to recognize competency in others. So they always know they are right, and anyone that disagrees with them is obviously stupid. Sound familiar? -- John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream http://www.CasaDelGato.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- The E-Max and Kasea 48 volt scooters are using them. They are running two parallel packs for a capacity of 40 Ahrs. I work on those scooters but don't own one personally. However, I'm using two of those batteries in parallel on my Black and Decker mower and it has plenty of power to mow the whole yard and then some. My lot is about 12,000 square feet. So there is something to be said for their capacity. I do have a customer that needs a new set after they've had their scooter for a year. So that has me concerned. It could be the charger since some of those that came with the scooters have had bad diodes or it could be a bad set of cells in this particular scooter. But I haven't heard complaints about the batteries from my other customers running E-Max scooters. These batteries are heavy. 8 of them in scooter brings the weight up to 300 pounds, both scooter and batteries so they are heavy for 20 amp hour batteries. They are sealed. Chip Gribben http://ElectroScooterWorks.com On Jun 26, 2007, at 11:41 PM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote: From: Aaron Richardson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: June 26, 2007 7:59:16 PM EDT To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: silicon batteries I have not seen this battery discussed in this group. It appears that the electric scooter market is moving to these batteries. They are claiming better life cycles, higher current (charge and discharge), and better temperature range over lead (sealed??). Anyone have anything good or bad to say about this type of battery? thanks, Aaron ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- If you've got a belt- or chain-driven setup for say 5:1, and you want to reduce the ratio to 4:1 or 3:1, does it matter whether you increase the diameter of the sprocket on the motor shaft vs. decreasing the diameter of the sprocket on the wheel? Mathematically they seem to be equivalent, but are there other factors to consider? Thanks. Bill Dennis John A. Evans - N0HJ wrote: Ft-lbs (foot pounds) are the units of torque. If you had a lever arm, say like a crescent wrench on a bolt and the arm was one foot long, applying a pound of force at the end of that arm would result in a foot pound of torque being applied to the bolt. Hope this helps, john Rob Hogenmiller wrote: What does a ft-lbs mean? Does a foot-lb, mean that something has the ability to move something one foot that weighs one pound? ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Yes - there are other things to consider: 1. Chain speed. A larger motor sprocket means the chain speed ( ft/sec) will be higher. There is a maximum speed rating for the chain - make sure you don't exceed that. 2. Chain tension - a smaller motor sprocket will result in higher chain tension for the same motor torque. Again - there is a maximum rated chain tension. 3. Number of sprocket teeth. When sprockets get very small, the number of teeth can get low enough to cause problems - rough running, and high tooth and/or chain wear. Again - the manufacturer's info can help
EV digest 6958
EV Digest 6958 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Home built hybrid-electrics by Tom Eberhard [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: vroombox and EV ? by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) DC motor commutation by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: All this battery talk and still it depends on who you ask by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by Kaido Kert [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by Ian Jordan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Home built hybrid-electrics by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: AGM vs Gel by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: vroombox and EV ? by john fisher [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) J150 Battery by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) RE: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Alan Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) S10 transmission by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Fw: programmed controller for use in recharging batteries... by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) RE: Fw: programmed controller for use in recharging batteries... by damon henry [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Hi, I'm building a hybrid electic car and am interested in getting in touch with other people that have started or completed similar projects. Does anyone have the email address of this guy: http://www.teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?t=29720highlight= (I registered on the site but the admins there have not blessed my request) For anyone who's interested, I post weekly updates of my progress here: http://www.gassavers.org/showthread.php?t=3070 and occasionally on my own site: http://www.GreenPlanetGarage.com Best Regards, Tom. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- On Wed, 2007-06-27 at 12:07 -0500, Danny Miller wrote: You are underestimating the power requirements of a car A/C compressor. While it varies by make and model and I have no hard numbers, car A/C is sized like a huge wall unit, people have said 20K-30K BTU equivalent which would be something like 4 or 5 HP. The draw varies substantially with temp differential as far as I know- I saw this powering a 6500 BTU off an inverter, I got 80A @ 12V at start and it worked up to like 120A eventually. I've been worried about this too. I may be forced to use a belt for this reason, so I can reduce the size of the motor pulley, and then just deal with the underperforming A/C. At the size of my 2HP motor (5 inch diameter, about 10 inches long, and heavy) I can't imagine a 5HP motor of the same design. Doesn't a compressor require a substantial surge power to turn on? No prob if it's just a mattor of not being within the motor's continuous rating but if it exceeds the motor's max stall torque then the system will never get turning in the first place. If the system is not pressurized, I believe that the compressor will automatically soft-start as it builds up pressure over the first few seconds of operation. I believe that building A/C units often have a timer to prevent the system from being switched on until a suitable delay has expired, to allow the system to depressurize through the expansion valve, for this reason. Maybe such a timer would be in order here too. -- Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://ohmbre.org -- 1999 Isuzu Hombre + Z2K + Warp13! ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- - Original Message - From: john fisher [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 2:23 PM Subject: Re: vroombox and EV ? Bob when some aggressive fool in an oh-so-correct EV knocks your 85 year old Mom down in a crosswalk, you might not be so keen on so-called Darwinian selection. ;) Its important to remember that not all people are 25 yr old athletes, who only eat granola, and don't own a cell phone. Some people are toddlers, and some are blind, and some are simply stoned all the time. Still not ok to mow them down. Hey John I DIDNT say that! I just was being sarcastic, people who know me..You have to be SUPER carefull handling two tons of deadly, silent steel, no matter WHAT form of traction it employs. With stuff they you don't steer, Locomotives, you use the HORN, Loud and clear. IF yur 85 year old Mom is on the RR traks, SHAME on you for not Handling her properly! Same for toddlers, had enough near misses with trains! In fact pedestrians should have the right of way. They are using a lot less resources than any motorized vehicle, after all. In CA they do have the right of way in a cross-walk, not
EV digest 6959
EV Digest 6959 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) v by Ricky Suiter [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) OT Re: Make it by Lock Hughes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Shaun Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) RE: Cheap by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: AGM vs Gel by Tehben Dean [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Potential BMS solution for lithium-ion packs. by Shaun Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: ???kWh EV battery pack by Tehben Dean [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Electrical/Mechanical Engineering by [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dana Havranek) 12) RE: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) To Gear or Not to Gear a Motorcycle (was Manly EV's, etc.) by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: ???kWh EV battery pack by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Home built hybrid-electrics by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Cheap balancer for A123 pack by Bill Dube [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: To Gear or Not to Gear a Motorcycle (was Manly EV's, etc.) by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) RE: EV air conditioning, how to connect motor? by Jim, Saturn Guy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: To Gear or Not to Gear a Motorcycle (was Manly EV's, etc.) by Mark Eidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: S10 transmission by Jim, Saturn Guy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Controler Oil by Phelps [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Brush timing advance, nothing new :-) by Bill Dube [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) I have an IDEA! by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: Brush timing advance, nothing new :-) by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- From: Ian Jordan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2007 12:03:40 -0700 Work is work. If you put a gearbox in in order to convert torque to RPM, this is identical to upping the voltage and reducing the current via a battery pack. The gearbox will just require more amps from the battery, so this is the same as dumping in more current. There's no way to continue to accelerate without generating at least X watts. Those watts either come from volts or amps. Choose one. Ian - you may understand this, but in case others don't: You need BOTH voltage and current to produce power. One is not enough. The product of the two (at least for DC) is power in units of watts. Phil Marino On 6/26/07, Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Of course I'd love to just dump in more voltage or current, but design constraints won't allow it. Will changing gears allow me to stay in the fat part of the motor's torque curve while continuing to accelerate to max speed, or should I just wring the motor out and accept whatever output it's capable of as current demand outstrips pack capacity? _ Get a preview of Live Earth, the hottest event this summer - only on MSN http://liveearth.msn.com?source=msntaglineliveearthhm ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- GEM's and Ford Th!nk neighbor's both use the Deka 8G31 as their stock gel battery (although both re-label them and charge a premium of course). They both use a 350 amp GE controller and both seem to get good battery life with them. I know this doesn't sound too impressive, but for a NEV it is. A person recently posted to the Yahoo NEV's group saying he was finally replacing his 2 year old Deka's after about 9,000 miles of use. He drove it about 20 miles a day on average (one cycle) so they were getting good discharges regularly. He did specifically order a car that the dealer did not have on their lot so he would get a brand new one with a brand new fresh pack. I'm just now getting some time on them in the field (I fix NEV's on the side) but thus far they seem to be staying very balanced, and granted we're only talking 6 batteries in series, but they seem to be staying more balanced voltage-wise than their flooded option of Trojan 30XHS's. Later, Rick 92 Saturn SC conversion AZ Alt Fuel plates ZEROGAS Glendale, AZ Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2007 00:44:13 -0800 From: Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: AGM vs Gel To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu David, how about the 8G31's? Would that be a big enough battery so as to handle the 300 Amps Tehben is looking at? Mike, Anchorage, Ak. Food fight? Enjoy some healthy debate in the Yahoo! Answers Food
EV digest 6951
EV Digest 6951 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Understanding my motor (ADC L91 X91 6.7 motors revisited) by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Controller by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Understanding my motor (ADC L91 X91 6.7 motors revisited) by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Make it by Cory Cross [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: EVgrin - RAVolt takes first EV trip by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: firefly batteries? by Bruce Weisenberger [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: An Ebay find? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: firefly batteries? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Electrical/Mechanical Engineering by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) AGM vs Gel by Tehben Dean [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) ???kWh EV battery pack by Tehben Dean [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: AGM vs Gel by Joe Smalley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: AGM vs Gel by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: ???kWh EV battery pack by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Cheap balancer for A123 pack by Bill Dube [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: An Ebay find? by lyle sloan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: An Ebay find? by Danny Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Make it by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS RE: Make It by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) RE: Electrical/Mechanical Engineering by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: AGM vs Gel by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) RE: ???kWh EV battery pack by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Where'd all the NEDRA folks go? by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Latest honoree of the Troy Heagy award, was Re: Make it by [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Jeff Major wrote: Those slots have 2 wires in them, don't they? I thought it was one, but I'm going by memory. Jim Husted would know. Jin, you got your ears on? Have you seen the internals of an ADC L91 and X91 for comparison? -- Ring the bells that still can ring Forget the perfect offering There is a crack in everything That's how the light gets in--Leonard Cohen -- Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Phelps wrote: Building a fancy mechanical switch... Is that so hard? Maybe... Maybe not? You certainly can build mechanical PWM switchers. Commutator are mechanical switchers, and they obviously work. The big challenge with a mechanical switcher is to be sure that there is always a path for the inductive current, to minimize contact arcing. Electronic controllers use a diode for this. Purely mechanical PWMs, built in the good old days before semiconductors, had to use other methods. The classic method is to set up a resonant circuit, with the motor's inductance and a large capacitor (called a buffer cap). The switch is mechanically resonant at the frequency of this electrically resonant circuit. The PWM switch closes; the current resonantly goes from 0 to 2x the desired current, and then resonantly rings back to almost zero current again. At this instant, the switch opens. There is therefore minimal arcing at the switch because it opens and closes at zero current. The off-time between these cycles is varied to control the percent on-time of the motor. On the surface of it, it sounds easy. In practice, the parts are physically large, the currents are high, and there is a great deal of finesse required to get it all working right. -- Ring the bells that still can ring Forget the perfect offering There is a crack in everything That's how the light gets in--Leonard Cohen -- Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hey Lee, Jeff The L91 has just one wire per slot, although there is a bottom and a top winding, so depending on how you count it, lol. I've not seen the X91. Hope this helps 8^) Jim It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Dan Frederiksen wrote: I alot of people have claimed that it must be that expensive but I don't believe they have offered specific reasons why to sum up: the electronics parts cost circuit board any bussbar casing, cooling plumbing and prettyfication assembly/programming is either of those super expensive in your opinion and if so which and how much? I don't consider the design a cost since that's a one off so don't mention that Want to pay my design costs then? do you have any costs to add? Dan ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Congrats on the
EV digest 6952
EV Digest 6952 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Cheap balancer for A123 pack by Shaun Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_Cheap_=22balancer=22_for_A123_pack?= by [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS RE: Make It - Enough! by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: firefly batteries? by Frank John [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: An Ebay find? by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: vroombox and EV ? by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) RE: Electrical/Mechanical Engineering by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Understanding my motor (ADC L91 X91 6.7 motors revisited) by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Controler by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: EVgrin - RAVolt takes first EV trip by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Make it by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by Rush [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Make it by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Electrical/Mechanical Engineering by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: firefly batteries? by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) RE: Electrical/Mechanical Engineering by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: how to control my separately excited DC motor by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Electrical/Mechanical Engineering by John A. Evans - N0HJ [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: How low can you go? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: vroombox and EV ? by Marty Hewes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: A123 and Shauns website by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- On 6/27/07, Bill Dube [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lots of questions that have been asked and answered before on this list. Here are the answers again: Cycle life = 10,000 cycles to 90% DOD to 50% remaining capacity. (1000 to 95% remaining capacity) Larger cells are going to happen in a year or so. (Small cells parallel excellently, so I don't get why folks care about this.) Cycle life = 10,000 cycles to 90% DOD to 50% remaining capacity. (1000 to 95% remaining capacity) Larger cells are going to happen in a year or so. (Small cells parallel excellently, so I don't get why folks care about this.) Hello Bill and other fellow EVers, I've been a lurker of the EV list archives for a few years but it is only now that I've decided to sign up and participate. The reason for this is A123 batteries (and the discovery of Gmail!) I'm very excited about the potential for A123 batteries to change the automotive industry, particularly with PHEVs initially. They appear to be a very switched on company, backed up by a superb product. The RC guys (oh, for a cheap hobby!) seem to have done a lot of excellent real-world testing of the M1 cells at the micro level and are very pleased with the results, particularly when compared with other's like Kokam etc. and that's good enough for me. There are two hurdles that I see obstructing my investment in them however. 1. Upfront Cost. 2. BMS. I've had a quote from A123 Systems for 1500 of the M1 cells and their price was competitive with other Li when life-cycle is considered (10,000 cycles to 50% is awesome), however I'd hope that a group purchase might bring this price down closer to what I can realistically afford upfront. I'm not asking for you to comment on this because I know it's not your area. So, on the BMS issue; In rough dimensions I'd probably have approximately 40 groups in series, with 30 paralleled cells in each group, to replace my current 12 X 12V 100Ah(C20) lead pack. My first question is; Do the 30 individual cells in a parallel grouping need individual attention or can I treat them as one because they are in parallel with each other? In other words, when charging all that I need to do is make sure each group of 30 cells reaches 3.6V but no more? Sorry if you've answered this question before but I haven't managed to stumble across it in the archives. Thanks for your time and thank-you to all the other outstanding participants in the wonderful EVlist community. Shaun Williams. www.electric-echo.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Shaun Williams wrote: So, on the BMS issue; In rough dimensions I'd probably have approximately 40 groups in series, with 30 paralleled cells in each group, to replace my current 12 X 12V 100Ah(C20) lead pack. My first question is; Do the 30 individual cells in a parallel grouping need individual attention or can I treat them as one because they are in parallel with
EV digest 6953
EV Digest 6953 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: How low can you go? by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: Custom Gears by Alan Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Understanding my motor (ADC L91 X91 6.7 motors revisited) by MIKE WILLMON [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Electrical/Mechanical Engineering by Deanne Mott [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) RE: Make it by Michael Wendell [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: EVgrin - RAVolt takes first EV trip by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Understanding my motor (ADC L91 X91 6.7 motors revisited) by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Make it by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Cheap by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS RE: Make It by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Make it by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Custom Gears by Eric Poulsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: vroombox and EV ? by john fisher [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by Dave Cover [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: vroombox and EV ? by Jerry Wagner [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Electrical/Mechanical Engineering by john fisher [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Anderson disassembly (AKA Duh ...) by Eric Poulsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Anderson disassembly (AKA Duh ...) by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) RE: Custom Gears by Alan Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) RE: Make it by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Chances of working for an Auto Company by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) by ProEV [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS by ProEV [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: Chances of working for an Auto Company by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Re: Anderson disassembly (AKA Duh ...) by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 27) RE: Chances of working for an Auto Company by Alan Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 28) Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 29) Re: Make it by Mark Eidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 30) RE: Ultimate magnetic motor design by Dale Ulan [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- You can set the LBVI in the option menu for about 5 volts higher then what you set the LBV, which will give you a advance warning that you are in with of the low voltage limit. Roland - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 9:44 AM Subject: Re: How low can you go? Thanks, Chris and Lee for the confirmation. My Zilla was set to 110 Volts for the low battery volts (LBV). That would allow 8.46 volts per battery if pushed with a low SOC. So, I reset it to 137 volts. Makes me more comfortable knowing I can't pull the pack below that level. Ken As I understand it, 1.75 volts per cell (10.5 volts for a 12V battery) is the lowest you should ever take any lead-acid battery under any circumstances. So, if you were to continue drawing 100A, soon the battery voltage would dip under 10.5 volts, and you'd know that you're then decreasing the life expectancy of the battery. I believe this applies regardless of discharge current, even letting them sit (self-discharge). -- Christopher Robison -Original Message- From: Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 10:44 am Subject: Re: How low can you go? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The Optima data sheet indicates that 10.5 volts is the cut off low voltage for the reserve capacity. Should that voltage also be considered the maximum “sag” voltage during a high current draw regardless of the state of charge or sag time? Yes; 10.5v is a good safe cutoff voltage regardless of current. You are very unlikely to reverse a cell if you don't go below this. If you *know* all cells are matched, and are trying to produce big numbers for a data sheet, you can discharge below this point. Battery manufacturers do this on their data sheets to inflate the amphour ratings. The real danger is that when a cell goes completely dead, it develops high resistance. The other cells in series with it, that still have charge, will force current to keep flowing through the dead cell. This high current and high resistance cause severe heating in the dead cell. The plates will warp, it will boil its electrolyte, and things will get very bad very fast! So, the 10.5v limit comes from the assumption that 1 cell out of the 6 in a 12v battery has gone dead. The 5 good ones are still delivering 2v each (2 x 5 = 10v) and there is just 0.5v left across the dead one (1 x 0.5v = 0.5v), so there is 10.5v across the battery as a whole. -- Ring the bells that still can ring Forget the perfect offering There is a crack in everything That's
EV digest 6954
) Ed Cooley Bill Dube [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 06/27/2007 00:19 Please respond to ev@listproc.sjsu.edu To ev@listproc.sjsu.edu cc Subject Re: Cheap balancer for A123 pack Unless you are talking about 100,000 cells, you don't have much hope of getting a discount. These are very popular cells. In nutshell, these cells are not going to be inexpensive in the near term. The BMS is the hard part. Someone must make one that will work for the home EVer market. No one has. Bill Dube' I'm very excited about the potential for A123 batteries to change the automotive industry, particularly with PHEVs initially. They appear to be a very switched on company, backed up by a superb product. The RC guys (oh, for a cheap hobby!) seem to have done a lot of excellent real-world testing of the M1 cells at the micro level and are very pleased with the results, particularly when compared with other's like Kokam etc. and that's good enough for me. There are two hurdles that I see obstructing my investment in them however. 1. Upfront Cost. 2. BMS. I've had a quote from A123 Systems for 1500 of the M1 cells and their price was competitive with other Li when life-cycle is considered (10,000 cycles to 50% is awesome), however I'd hope that a group purchase might bring this price down closer to what I can realistically afford upfront. I'm not asking for you to comment on this because I know it's not your area. So, on the BMS issue; In rough dimensions I'd probably have approximately 40 groups in series, with 30 paralleled cells in each group, to replace my current 12 X 12V 100Ah(C20) lead pack. My first question is; Do the 30 individual cells in a parallel grouping need individual attention or can I treat them as one because they are in parallel with each other? In other words, when charging all that I need to do is make sure each group of 30 cells reaches 3.6V but no more? Sorry if you've answered this question before but I haven't managed to stumble across it in the archives. Thanks for your time and thank-you to all the other outstanding participants in the wonderful EVlist community. Shaun Williams. www.electric-echo.com ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Actually Joseph it depends on what you want to do. You said designing cars. I can take a stab at that. Any school that teaches Industrial Design would be the place to start. Industrial Design with a focus on Automotive Design is where I would look to first if you actually want to design cars. There is a group of accredited Design schools around the nation. Art Center College of Design in Pasadena is probably the school that puts out the most in terms of automotive designers. Alot of the car companies also have design centers in Pasadena, including Toyota and GM. There is also Detroit's College for Creative Studies. Both Detroit and Pasadena are top design schools. I'm not exactly sure what the entry requirements are now. I had to have a portfolio review to get into design school. At the time SATs were just a formality (thank goodness). But it was the portfolio review that was important. So if you want to get into a design school start drawing now. That's if you want to design cars. There is also the Engineering track. Find a school with a solid Mechanical and/or Automotive Engineering design program that also is a partner with the Society of Automotive Engineers. Also find a college that has a racing program. That looks good on a resume and provides real-world experience. Either of those tracks will point you in the right direction. We also can't forget Marketing and Electrical Engineering as well. Chip Gribben NEDRA On Jun 26, 2007, at 3:49 PM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote: From: Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: June 26, 2007 3:01:27 PM EDT To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Chances of working for an Auto Company What do you guys think are the chances of working for an Auto Company? (you know, designing cars and stuff) ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Too messy to paint with spray. Just about $20 (~ 2L, ~0.5 gal) of Rustoleum or $80 of Interlux Brightside for a bit better gloss. Check out http://www.electric-lemon.com/?q=node/174 Brian On 6/26/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Why not just spray it yourself? It'll cost about $150, but you can get a decent paint job at home. BTW, I'd be interested where you'd get enough paint for $100. House paint, right? On Thu, June 21, 2007 8:32 am, Brian Pikkula wrote: Since the majority of our EVs are 10 years old, the paint on them isn't like it used to be. However, I have a hard time justifying spending $2k for something that will not propel my EV. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Of course, being able to slip the clutch seems like it would have help a lot in reverse. damon From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
EV digest 6944
EV Digest 6944 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Carbon Fiber Batteries by David Dymaxion [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Ultimate magnetic motor design, CVT, controllers by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Custom Gears by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Ultimate magnetic motor design, CVT, controllers by Jack Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) firefly batteries? by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) RE: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) by Pat Galliher [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) RE: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) by Pat Galliher [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: firefly batteries? by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Custom Gears by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Motor for mower by Tad Coles [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: How is AGM battery perfomance impacted by orientation? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Cheap balancer for A123 pack by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) RE: Ultimate magnetic motor design by Dale Ulan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS RE: Make It by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Make it by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Cheap balancer for A123 pack by Bill Dube [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) RE: whats the difference between gearing a motor for speed vs distance by lyle sloan [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Well, sort of, not really. This is my understanding... Amps x Volts = Watts What are watts? Watt is power, NOT energy! What are amps? Well, amps are how quickly the electricity moves. More amps, which means the electricity is moving faster, which means more watts (power) Now to describe voltage you'll need to understand something else first. A Negative charge and a positive charge attract, right? Well the attraction between a negative and positive is voltage. That electrical attracting force is voltage. More voltage, more force, more watts. (power) And when you multiply the two together you get watts! More amps means more power, and more voltage means more power too. Now, more amps basically creates torque, which is good for acceleration. Using more voltage basically means more rpm (rotation per minute) which is better for achieving a high speed. So basically... amps= torquevoltage=rpmamps x volts=watts AMPS seem to be how long the vehicle can go Amps-hours is how far the vehicle can go, NOT amps. An amp-hour is one amp running for one hour. That's all I know about amp-hours really. (Well, there's Peukert's Exponent but that's something else.) To everyone out there: Please correct any mistakes I made. We can't have electrical blasphemy on this mailing list! On 6/24/07, Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So far I've come to the conclusion that VOLTS is the major power contributor, the higher the VOLTS the more power the motor can make the vehicle go. AMPS seem to be how long the vehicle can go, the more AMPS the batteries have the longer the vehicle can drive before being charged. There also seems to be some correlation with the AMPS in regards to power. Does anyone have any quick comments or suggestive reading. God bless ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I was pretty excited when I first saw these, hoping they were like the firefly batteries. Alas, carbon fiber refers to the decorative case. The specs seem pretty good. Disclaimer: I have no financial interest in their success or failure. http://www.brailleauto.com/productcart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=16idproduct=6 Park yourself in front of a world of choices in alternative vehicles. Visit the Yahoo! Auto Green Center. http://autos.yahoo.com/green_center/ ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- I have just salvaged a motor like you described. Its an Intramat mac 115B servo motor, Its fairly heavy at about 75lbs or so. From what I can tell it has 230V stator coils, PM armature, built in cooling motor, tach and encoder. Continuous current at 66 amps with peaks at 205 amps, unless the fan is not working. The bad news is its a 2000 RPM motor. So it seems powerful enough to drive a small EV but what can I drive it with? Must I use the encoder with a custom inverter or can I use a variable freq like the MES-DEA 400? Maybe its just better suited for a generator of some sort. It just looked too pretty to be in the landfill. Oh and unfortunately someone got to the inverter it came with before I got there. Rick Miller In a message dated 6/24/2007 1:23:12 PM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL
EV digest 6945
EV Digest 6945 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Make it by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog, In Training, again. by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Make it by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) RE: Custom Gears by Alan Brinkman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) RE: VOLTS vs AMPS by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) regarding the Solectria Sunrise by gulabrao ingle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) RE: VOLTS vs AMPS by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) RE: Make it by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Make it by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: vroombox and EV ? by Florian Schmidt [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Understanding Motor Specs Torque by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) 55 MPH Part II by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Understanding Motor Specs Torque by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by Tom Parker [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- I feel the same way. a cheaper controller certainly can be done. a lot cheaper a sub 500$ zilla1k equivalent if someone foxconn'ed it (mainstream mass production, not typical b2b pricing mentality) unfortunately those with experience don't want to take the 60 minutes it takes for them to design a simple practical circuit to this effect so others have to do the much greater task of getting training and experience first and then doing it some few will help out a little bit if asked about something isolated but most here will rather fight it Dan Phelps wrote: Sorry I live in your country and have different ideas than you.. Maybe you should burn me at the stake like a witch for thinking. Mitchell ---Original Message--- From: Peter VanDerWal Date: 6/24/2007 11:04:32 AM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Make it Imagination is the key for discovering new ideas. Making a cheaper controller is NOT a new idea. If it was practical to Make a controller that was significantly cheaper than existing ones, then The Chinese would be flooding the market with cheap controllers. Hell, they are quite capable of ripping off existing designs and copying Them. Their labor costs are cheaper, so they should be able to save a Bundle right? But they aren't, so ask yourself, Why not? Because the main reason the controllers are so expensive is because they Use expensive components. If you can discover a way to build them cheaper, awsome let us know. But if you are going to come here with the attitude that you are going to Solve this because you have more immagination than we do (or the rest of The world), please save the attitude until you have a working prototype to Display. Asking questions is great, so is learning from others. Just leave the Attitude at home please. Gee I would have thought that Imagination was the key . You have to dream a dream and then make it real... It cant be done because nobody have one it.. This is your song? Sounds like the world would still be flat if that was the case.. Only the rich and those who study at the university are cable of doing any thing hunn.. Nessesity is the mother of invention.. Which would go to reason that if a cheaper control; Can be made it will be by somebody that don't have one yet. Relax my friend and dream a little Mitchell ---Original Message--- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 06/24/07 02:42:02 To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Make it Some things have change a lot in 100 years. Going 15 miles an hour was fast In 1907. When you increase the speed to today's standards it requires much Higher Ah rate from the batteries. This is not a fair comparison getting there Faster is not done with the same amount of energy. If it was inexpensive to make the controller and could be done for what you Feel is a fair price someone would have done it. As pointed out below it is always more expensive to make anything in units Of one. Don Blazer Which is what I am doing asking questions.. How ever .. The way I see it .. Very little has changed in the E V area if the first car made 100 years ago Could get 40 to 100 miles on a charge ,, And I am not thinking better .. I Am thinking cheaper.. Which is better to me. We will see maybe I will have Nothing .. But it sure don't sound like shit to me .. A switch that turns on And off for 700 bucks.. Mitchell ---Original Message--- From: damon henry Date: 06/23/07 21:39:04 To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Make it Just be aware that there have been tens of thousands of people using their
EV digest 6946
EV Digest 6946 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: 55 MPH Part II by Tom Parker [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: 55 MPH Part II by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Understanding Motor Specs Torque by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) RE: vroombox and EV ? by Garret Maki [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) RE: Make it by Garret Maki [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Carbon Fiber Batteries by Evan Tuer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) RE: Make it by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) FW: Regen with Sevcon and Etek by Garret Maki [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) How low can you go? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: How low can you go? by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) by Brandon Kruger [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Understanding my motor (ADC L91 X91 6.7 motors revisited) by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) by Brandon Kruger [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) FW: Regen with Sevcon and Etek by Garret Maki [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Ultimate magnetic motor design by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS RE: Make It by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: FW: Regen with Sevcon and Etek by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: Make it by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- On Mon, 2007-06-25 at 07:30 -0500, Rob Hogenmiller wrote: From what I've been reading it takes about 60 ft/lbs of torque to maintain an average vehicle at 55mph. Or around 5-10HP. That sounds a little low. Maybe for a small slippery car. I've noticed that there inexpensive motors that produce the HP ratings no problem, but from what I'm reading the won't produce the torque requirements, for example this motor meets the HP rating but not the torque, http://www.electricmotorsport.com/PARTS/Perm.htm What other motors might I be eyeballing that could maintain 55mph? ( I will have the capability to use two motors, but prefer not too if not necessary.) How big are your wheels? Will you use direct drive or will you have a reduction drive? Remember the differential on most cars has around 3:1 reduction. Assuming 3:1 reduction reduces your required motor torque by a factor of 3 and increases the required motor speed by the same factor. Basically, work out your required power at 55mph, use your wheel radius to find the wheel torque and wheel speed, apply by any reduction ratio and you'll get a motor torque and speed. Then go shopping. If what you really want is 60ft/lbs and 10HP, then you could look at the Siemens 1L5118: http://www.metricmind.com/motor.htm but be aware that the maximum ratings quoted there will have quite short time limits before the system overheats. I only point you there because I had that page open. A motor designed for high torque, low speed operation would suit you better. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- From what I've been reading it takes about 60 ft/lbs of torque to maintain an average vehicle at 55mph. Or around 5-10HP. HP = torque x RPM If the motor has the HP to maintain the speed, but the torque is low, that just means that the RPM is too high. Gear the RPM down and the torque goes up by the same factor. I.e. 1 HP = 5252 ft/lbs per minute. That would either be 5252 ft/lbs of torque at 1 RPM, or 1 ft/lb of torque at 5252 RPM or 100 ft/lbs of torque at 52.52 RPM So let's say your vehicle requires 8hp to go 55mph and that this works out to 60 ft/lbs of torque at 700 rpm wheels. Let's say your motor 8hp, but it's at 10 ft/lbs of torque and 4200 RPM. What you need is a transmission (belt drive, chain drive, gears, etc.) with a 6:1 reduction ratio. That will reduce the RPM from 4200 to 700 and increase your torque from 10 ft/lbs to 60 ft/lbs. 8HP into the transmission, 8HP out. The universe is happy and everything works out. I've noticed that there inexpensive motors that produce the HP ratings no problem, but from what I'm reading the won't produce the torque requirements, for example this motor meets the HP rating but not the torque, http://www.electricmotorsport.com/PARTS/Perm.htm What other motors might I be eyeballing that could maintain 55mph? ( I will have the capability to use two motors, but prefer not too if not necessary.) I have a near unlimited run to reach 55mph so it's not important that I have a motor that help me reach 55mph quickly (I'll be using a gas engine to propel me to speed), I'm hoping to find one the will help me maintain that speed, to do some testing of theories on a budget.
EV digest 6947
EV Digest 6947 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: How low can you go? by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by Beth Silverman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Understanding my motor (ADC L91 X91 6.7 motors revisited) by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by Evan Tuer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: 55 MPH Part III by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Selling or buying an EV by bruce parmenter [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) RE: Selling or buying an EV by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by David Roden (Akron OH USA) [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Vectrix demo by Lawrence Rhodes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) 1200 Raptor help ! by Jeff Mccabe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS RE: Make It by Ian Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: vroombox and EV ? by john fisher [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Make it by Eric Poulsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Understanding my motor (ADC L91 X91 6.7 motors revisited) by Jeff Major [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: 55 MPH Part III Oops - equation error by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: FW: Regen with Sevcon and Etek by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) More folks converting cars to electric... by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) New EV controller to hit the market by Michael Barkley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS by Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: 55 MPH Part III by Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Selling or buying an EV by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: vroombox and EV ? by GWMobile [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The Optima data sheet indicates that 10.5 volts is the cut off low voltage for the reserve capacity. Should that voltage also be considered the maximum “sag” voltage during a high current draw regardless of the state of charge or sag time? Yes; 10.5v is a good safe cutoff voltage regardless of current. You are very unlikely to reverse a cell if you don't go below this. If you *know* all cells are matched, and are trying to produce big numbers for a data sheet, you can discharge below this point. Battery manufacturers do this on their data sheets to inflate the amphour ratings. The real danger is that when a cell goes completely dead, it develops high resistance. The other cells in series with it, that still have charge, will force current to keep flowing through the dead cell. This high current and high resistance cause severe heating in the dead cell. The plates will warp, it will boil its electrolyte, and things will get very bad very fast! So, the 10.5v limit comes from the assumption that 1 cell out of the 6 in a 12v battery has gone dead. The 5 good ones are still delivering 2v each (2 x 5 = 10v) and there is just 0.5v left across the dead one (1 x 0.5v = 0.5v), so there is 10.5v across the battery as a whole. -- Ring the bells that still can ring Forget the perfect offering There is a crack in everything That's how the light gets in--Leonard Cohen -- Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Solectria is not out of business -- we merged with Azure Dynamics in 2005. We are still at the same building where Solectria moved in 2001, outside of Boston, Massachusetts. Beth Silverman *** -Original Message- From: Lee Hart [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 10:53 AM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise gulabrao ingle wrote: I was reading the other day of a car known as the Solectria Sunrise, but surprisingly there is no information available about the specifications of the car or how it could get 375 miles on a single charge. Solectria is out of business, so most of what you find is old information. Where can I get detailed information, blue prints, technical specifications or even some hi-res photos of this car? From me! :-) I'm heading a team that is making a kit-car version of the Sunrise. Are there any owners of this car on the list at present? Yes, a number were sold to individuals. Stephen Taylor's is on the web at http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/655 What was so special about the construction of this car that it could get 375 miles on a charge? The Sunrise is an example of what Amory Lovins calls a hypercar. The entire chassis and body are carbon fiber composites, very light and strong, weighing about 400 lbs. It was designed from scratch as an EV, and so avoided the usual losses and inefficiencies of the make do parts you find in
EV digest 6948
EV Digest 6948 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) EVgrin - RAVolt takes first EV trip by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS by MIKE WILLMON [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: 55 MPH Part III by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Over-volted ADC: Warranty issue by Chuck Hursch [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: firefly batteries? by Lawrence Rhodes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Selling or buying an EV by Tom Shay [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: 55 MPH Part II by Eric Poulsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: vroombox and EV ? by Eric Poulsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: firefly batteries? by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Selling or buying an EV by John G. Lussmyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Selling or buying an EV by Lawrence Rhodes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Cheap balancer for A123 pack by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Controler by Phelps [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: 55 MPH Part III by Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Controler by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) how to control my separately excited DC motor by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Controler by Phelps [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) RE: Cheap balancer for A123 pack by Roger Stockton [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Cheap balancer for A123 pack by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Controler by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Controler by Phelps [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: FW: Regen with Sevcon and Etek by [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- All, I know the list loves good news: the RAVolt made her maiden voyage over the weekend! YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUv3wZQTcQE Rob H RAVolt.com EValbum 995 ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- You (and Dan) are correct. What I meant to state is that the charge flows near the speed of light and thus carries to the conclusion that Amps (or electrical current) is a measure of the amount of charge that flows past a certain point in 1 second. A coulomb of charge being equal to that of 6.023^23 electrons. I didn't mean to get into the tricky details of electron drift, which as you say can be on the order of mm/sec. The analogy that works for me is that of the little contraption with the steel balls suspended in a straight line from some string. Swing 1 ball out and let it go. It contacts the mass of other balls and (almost) instantly the Energy is transfered to the ball on the opposite end and it flies up into the air. Now the number of balls (analogy for the electrons) that move from one end of the line to the other is small (zero in this case). But the energy contained in the original ball has moved almost instantaneously. Without getting too technical but trying to remain technically correct, I meant to state that the propagation velocity of the charges remain nearly the same, at a high percentage of the speed of light, in a constant medium. Thanks for the correction. Mike, Anchorage, Ak. - Original Message - From: Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Monday, June 25, 2007 11:01 am Subject: Re: VOLTS vs AMPS To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu So you know, the speed at which electrons are moving in the conductoris a few millimeters per second. What you probably refer to is the time electric (or electromagnetic if AC) field propagation speed which makes electrons start moving - that is at light speed. Therefore you see light few miles away goes on as soon as you flip remote switch despite actual electrons moving few mm/sec. Not very accurate but obvious analogy is moving water in a pipe - assuming water is not compressible (which is almost he case), it can start flowing out of a mile long pipe as soon as you start pumping it in in the other end, though the rate of the water flow itself may be few inches per sec. Victor p.s. Without digging too deep, electrons themselves are not moving anywhere - their charge get carried from one to another and charge has no mass. If electrons were to move, the mass of conductor would have measurable weight change (you can cram in more than you take out but no one was able to detect any weight difference between charged and neutral conductor), not to mention that material itself would become different - copper with lost valence electrons is no longer really a copper... Mike Willmon wrote: To be technically correct electrons flow the same speed in a particular medium, which is some relatively high percentage of the speed of light. Amps (or electrical current) is a measure of the amount of electrons that flow past a certain point in 1 second. More amps is more electrons per second Joseph Tahbaz wrote: What are amps? Well, amps are how quickly the electricity moves. More amps, which means the electricity is
EV digest 6949
EV Digest 6949 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: firefly batteries? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: FW: Regen with Sevcon and Etek by Garret Maki [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) RE: FW: Regen with Sevcon and Etek by Garret Maki [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Controler by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by jerryd [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Controler by Andre' Blanchard [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: EVgrin - RAVolt takes first EV trip by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Understanding my motor (ADC L91 X91 6.7' motors revisited) by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Data Logging for Zilla by Mark Eidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: FW: Regen with Sevcon and Etek by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Make it by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Data Logging for Zilla by MIKE WILLMON [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS RE: Make It by Danny Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: EVgrin - RAVolt takes first EV trip by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Controler by Phelps [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) TdS Report #10: Photos - West Philadelphia High School K1 Attack by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: firefly batteries? by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Cheap balancer for A123 pack by Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Data Logging for Zilla by Joseph T. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) An Ebay find? by Tom Gocze [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Hello Lawrence One other difference then regular lead batteries. If I remember right they were to weigh like 1/4 the weight of lead acid batteries. I read about these at least 2 or 3 years ago. They even had the city they were in investing money into the new company. You would think they would have a battery out by now? Don Blazer In a message dated 6/25/2007 2:11:18 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: If what they say is true there won't be any difference between them and regular lead batteries except capacity, durability reliability. I suspect they won't even need regulators. Lawrence Rhodes - Original Message - From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2007 8:22 PM Subject: firefly batteries? Wondering if anyone has any thoughts on these? I sort of have an in with the company to test some in my EV (probably about 5 or 10% probability, but that's better than no contacts)... but as of yet all I've seen is hype, not specs. BMS required? Discharge rate? cycles? Thermal management? Not even sure if they really exist yet I supposed I could ask my contact there, but I figured someone on this list might have already researched them more than I have. Z ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Unfortunately the pack on there now is shot with only a mile or two of range. I'll try to give this a try and report back. Thanks for the info. Garret -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 12:35 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: FW: Regen with Sevcon and Etek Hello Garret If it is a smart controller it will not allow your batteries to be over charged during regen. Have you tried running down the batteries to say 60% and then try? Don Blazer ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Rick, I think I've got all this configured. I am using footbrake with a pot. Honestly considering the minor stopping force I am getting now, there is no advantage to the pot or over a switch, I am applying it full now with little affect so being able to taper the regen isn't useful yet. I'll try to drain the batteries more and try it again. I have the calibrator on loan right now, but need to return it soon. -Garret -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 4:39 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: FW: Regen with Sevcon and Etek The Sevcon Millipak is a very smart controller. It is basically made for fork truck and Walkie operation which means it has features you'll never use. It is not really set up to be a electric vehicle controller but with all of the features it can work very well as one. Sevcon Millipak braking levels are set using personalities 1.01, 1.02 and 1.03. each is stated in %. 1.01 is direction braking, it is activated by going from forward to reverse. 1.02 is Neutral braking level, it is activated by going to drive to neutral. 1.03 Footbrake braking, for use if you have a footbrake configured. Choose 100% for maximum braking or lower for less braking. There are also
EV digest 6950
EV Digest 6950 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Make it by Danny Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: Data Logging for Zilla by Claudio Natoli [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: regarding the Solectria Sunrise by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: firefly batteries? by Bruce Weisenberger [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Controler by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Make it by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Make it by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) RE: Make it by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Cheap balancer for A123 pack by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) RE: Data Logging for Zilla by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: firefly batteries? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) RE: FW: Regen with Sevcon and Etek by Garret Maki [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Make it by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: EVgrin - RAVolt takes first EV trip by Tony Hwang [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS RE: Make It by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- Well this isn't the first time controller design has come up. The microcontroller, or any method of generating PWM, is only one aspect of design and frankly it's small beans compared to the other parts of the design. We had a thread going for awhile where some of us were talking about the merits of a microcontroller and others die-hard against anything but a discrete component design. I had to point out periodically that the original poster on the subject seemed to have the missed the point that the greatest, most well-featured PWM generator ever only scratches the surface of controller design so all the debate was beside the point. The thermal issues, power stage, PCB design, and especially the gate driver are quite tough. Even case design and connecting a huge cable to a thin PCB are tricky. OK, not rocket science, many designers around who can make a complete design, simulate the transistor on computer and all. I don't want to dismiss it as an impossible task. An experienced designer still won't be able to make a cheap 1 amp ripple cap handle 10 amps and won't be able to get the 120A out of the 120A transistor with the 76A leads. But they can tell you what will work, and that will likely require much more expensive components that you have laid out. Danny Dan Frederiksen wrote: Granted I'm coming from the outside and many aspects are unknown to me but I'm no dummy and I still believe it can be done and you are just naysaying because the vision is not clear to you. It's true I was disappointed to hear of the need for high derating but I did already know about it in the small packages and I'm not sure I got a satisfactory answer from Lee whether derating was just as bad in the large IGBT modules like int-A and above. more importantly though the price did not triple as you suggest since Oatmeal has said that the IGBTs he uses for a zilla1k cost him 165$. so you're wrong. Similarly JB Straubel's ad hoc controller seemed very simple. the kind of simple I'm aiming for although I wouldn't be using 6 500A modules! A smart man could easily convey the needed knowledge to someone like me. Genius makes the complex simple. The reason I'm not so concerned with the microcontroller code is that I've already done some experimentation with an AVR. I am a computer scientist. It's a common fallacy to blindly trust those that went before.I've heard that the reality of flight was denied even years after the wright brothers flew. that despite public demonstrations the press wouldn't cover it because it was known to be impossible. don't be that monkey Dan Eric Poulsen wrote: Dan, You're not asking for a meatloaf recipe. To be frank, you're naivete in the area of power electronics (1) leads you to believe that controllers should be much cheaper than they really are. I'm personally developing a MOSFET based controller for my own use, but I am documenting my progress (nuancesystems.net). Right now, there isn't much there, but when I have a barely-working prototype up, I'll post more information than you can shake a stick at. Having said that, I've done many _MANY_ hours of research, and put many hours into my shop (garage) measuring, cutting, drilling, mounting, testing, etc. I've also put a lot of $$$ into it, and I'm realizing that while a lot of that money is a good investment (tools, etc), there are a lot of failed experiments that lead ... nowhere. And that's just for the mechanical layout. The task you're speaking of is not a 60 minute job. You _will_not_ find a simple and practical design for a 320KW controller. With regard to help out a little bit, it's a bit
EV digest 6938
in the back. It didn't look like the chase car had any trouble keeping up with it. A few more of those Hawkers and a Z1K and he coulda left that chase car ;-) - Original Message - From: Lawrence Rhodes [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Saturday, June 23, 2007 8:56 pm Subject: Jet powered C5 To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu http://www.jetpower.co.uk/c5home.htm If this puppy can be jet powered it certainly can be souped up to go faster than it's orginal speed in electricform.. Lawrence Rhodes.. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Granted, if you're going to be tooling around at 315 mph, then you'll definitely need a tranny, EVen with an AC powered prime mover. I just wonder how long it took him to get to the first 100mph though ;-) - Original Message - From: David Dymaxion [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Saturday, June 23, 2007 9:39 pm Subject: Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu I think we can put this manly/transmission/ACvDC debate to bed for once and for all. Is 315 mph manly enough? Nothing electric has gone faster. The Buckeye Bullet did 315 mph with a 5 speed tranny and AC. http://www.buckeyebullet.com/history.htm If you want to go truly fast, it'll take a transmission with multiple gear ratios. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- 4500 pound S-10 at 55 miles per hour on flat ground 50 amps at 380 volts. Don Blazer In a message dated 6/24/2007 12:11:15 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Sorry, but I can only give you the real world-- for a 3300 lb. EV, depending on hills, headwind, etc, it's between 200-300 amps. Don't know if that helps, --- Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What is the mathematical formula to determine how much HP I will need to maintain 55mph. For i.e. 5,000lbs vehicle x rolling resistance / 10HP= 50mph would eventually produce given a long enough run. (I know that isn't anywhere close to the true formula ust trying to get an idea) God bless Converting a gen. 5 Honda Civic? My $20 video/DVD has my '92 sedan, as well as a del Sol and hatch too! Learn more at: www.budget.net/~bbath/CivicWithACord.html __/__|__\ __ =D---/- - \ 'O'-'O'-' Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel? Are you saving any gas for your kids? __ __ Don't pick lemons. See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos. http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hi Amy and All, - Original Message Follows - From: Amy DeMaagd [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: RE: Milestones: Carbon fiber and blogs Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2007 18:34:36 -0400 Well, I did some talking with a man who builds experimental aircraft and learned a lot about composites. I think that if I were to do that part again today, I could probably be able to shave at least another 20% off of it and have it be stronger. A good layup person with a putty spreader can make a FG layup at less weight, more strength than a bad layup of CF. As you do more you will see how. You have to admit that carbon fiber does make for a good gimmick. It's real eye catching, and in terms of sponsorships, flashy is good. By far the biggest reason to use CF. Notice how often it is left clear where that will weaken it when exposed to sunlight. CF only decreases weight of a part 20% and as 20x's as expensive, just not wise other than looks or an aircraft, ect where each pound really matters. Don't get me wrong, CF has it's place when correctly used along loadlines. So, if it is only used on the top layer for looks, do I still have to worry about the loadline thing? Normally a car body is just a fairing to put style on and keep the weather out, strength is rarely a problem. I'm pretty sure that we wet it out well, since we used a roller to bring epoxy up from the backside. No visibility problems with that methodology A smart way to do it, from the bottom!! But don't think that's enough as it can stil have air voids. The whole shebang will probably need a core no matter what because the entire front end will be cast as one piece and a tilt front end will be fabricated, the airplane guy recommends nomex(sp?) honeycomb. He says that it can handle complex curves well, which is very necessary around the headlights and whatnot. Curves just like egg shells are self supporting so if any curve under a 6' radius rarely needs cores. Just the flat parts need cores. nomex is good bith so are many other cores. Be careful on honeycomb cores you don't fill the cells with resin!!! Kinda ruins the lightweight thing. Why is Kevlar not being used more if what you say
EV digest 6939
EV Digest 6939 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Milestones: Carbon fiber and blogs by Thomas Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: Milestones: Carbon fiber and blogs by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Batteries for the Newbie! by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Small guage wires on ADC motor, temp sensor? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dana Havranek) 5) Re: Invention to cool the inside of a car. by Marty Hewes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Make it by Phelps [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) RE: EV Scooter by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Invention to cool the inside of a car. by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) DVD your project by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Make it by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: 55mph, an' Stuff. by Bob Rice [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: DVD your project by Mike Chancey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: EV Scooter by Lawrence Rhodes [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: 55mph by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: Make it by Mike Chancey [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: 55mph by Christopher Robison [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) hey can anyone help me with batteries and construction by gulabrao ingle [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- As I understand although GRP is in general initially much stronger than carbon fibre the fatigue performance of GRP is poor, so realistically the carbon fibre is stronger. Having said that all the carbon fibre I have used has been unidirectional and its very hard to work with, so unless the work is designed and carried by someone experienced in using carbon fibres the GRP may actually end up stronger even after accounting for loss of strength due to fatigue. I guess this the same as what you are saying Jerry? jerryd wrote: A good layup person with a putty spreader can make a FG layup at less weight, more strength than a bad layup of CF. As you do more you will see how. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Carbon fiber is rarely used by itself, usually it is used in conjunction with kevlar. These are the perview mostly of high end race cars and aircraft because, with special techniques, they allow getting that last 10% -20% weight reduction for the strength. some trivia Carbon fiber is very stiff and very brittle, kevlar(arimid fiber) is very tough but flexible. The two can complement each other. Carbon fiber cannot touch aluminum. It starts a galvanic action corroding away the aluminum, regular S-glass is used to isolate. Carbon fiber and kevlar are hard to work with compared to glass and are usually used with pre-preg(Pre-impregnated cloth with controlled amount of gelled resin) Thermal expansion of CF can become an issue The technique used to make a race car tube is: layup in mold the outer skin, many layers at different angles. Consolidate and cure(put a vacuum bag on it and put it in an autoclave) autoclave: oven under 140psi nitrogen, think pressurecooker, nitrogen is because O2 at temp pressure with materials = explosive oxidation! Lay in a layer of neat resin(resin gel sheet without any fiber) Lay in Aluminum or Nomex Honeycomb and mounting blocks. Short Consolidate and cure. This use of neat resin and pre-pregs is how they avoid filling the honeycomb with resin while still getting full bonding. Lay in Inner skin of multiple layers at different angles and throw it back in the autoclave again. Through this they get the optimal resin to fiber ratio for minimal weight. We don't need that. I want to try makeing a car body/chassis glider in a modified SCRIMP process to get a similar effect without the super high cost and long cycle time of a race car body construction. SCRIMP is a way of pulling a vacuum thru a bleeder layer which pulls the resin thru the composite and around the core. I think we can make a body that is light and strong with a natural insulation value. It would have a replaceable front clip and tailgate. The cure time in production can be 10 min. (SCRIMP mixes catalyst on demand). Since repairing a chassis/body is out of the question replaceing is the only option if a traffic accident effects the main body. I really think we can achieve a higher level of crash safety with composites since we can re-direct the forces better than welded sheet metal. While I have done a fair amount of research, and touring of facilities, I haven't got in there and played with materials (did some prepreg in my oven LOL). Jerry is da man on composites and when I get this darn garage cleaned out and start on this project I will be asking the expert a lot more questions! ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hi Joseph, If you decide Gen.5 Civic, I've got lots of good stuff on the DVD (below) and website as well. Haven't done Zilla and 9. You'd want to do the del Sol front of vehicle mounting configuration, with the sedan
EV digest 6941
EV Digest 6941 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) by Jim, Saturn Guy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Energizer Bunny Batteries for EV's. by Jim, Saturn Guy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) RE: Carbon fiber, not for battery boxes (was: Milestones: Carbon fiber and blogs) by Myles Twete [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Energizer Bunny Batteries for EV's. by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Make it by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Invention to cool the inside of a car. by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Make it by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Energizer Bunny Batteries for EV's. by Michael Barkley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Plain Text? by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: hey can anyone help me with batteries and construction by Bob Bath [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) New e-mail!! by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Cheap balancer for A123 pack by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: New e-mail!! by John A. Evans - N0HJ [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: thundersky cells for cheap, prices by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) RE: hey can anyone help me with batteries and construction by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) RE: whats the difference between gearing a motor for speed vs distance by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Gasless on Greenwood 2007 - into the History Books by Steven Lough [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: Make it by John Wayland [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- All of the fans could be used and any of the larger 12 volt AMG batteries for the vehicle power system. What else is there. Is there any type of DC/DC converters in them? 96v,120v,144v, to 12v for vehicle power? Some of the low and high voltage relays could be used. Maybe some of the metal for battery boxes. And 0 to 5000 Ohm potentiometers in them? Possible the transformers for charging the battery banks in the EV's. I'm sure many of the parts can be re-used. I know I'm not thinking of all the possibility's. And back to the DC/AC UPS. Do you have a UPS that will except 120volt DC input for 120v AC output? Would love to get a hold of one. I think it's the easiest and least expensive way to accomplish what I want to do. Thanks again, Jim --- Pat Galliher [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's my dilemma, Jim. I don't know what is usable in the EV community. If it's in computers and/or office equipment, I probably have it Any help on what to look for? Pat -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim, Saturn Guy Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2007 9:15 AM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: RE: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) Would love to get a hold of one of those UPS units. I have a few myself, but they all only except 48 volts. Although they do have a 2,800 watt output at 120v. That would be enough. I thought of splitting my battery bank for the UPS, but it would be unbalanced and still over the voltage limit of the UPS. So what do you have available? And what other types of electronic components do you have that may be of use to the EV community? Thank you... Jim Dawson --- Pat Galliher [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jim, There are a number of existing computer system UPS that use between 120v and 132v DC and convert it to AC. It would be a very simple matter to connect one to the battery pack of your car. I'm an electronics recycler and also new to the forum. I have (literally) tons of stuff that comes through my place that I wonder if it could be put to good use on an EV. The UPSs that I get all have deep cycle batteries in them, but I think they are too small to be of any use. The largest I've noticed are 24 AH rated. Most are 7-12 AH rated. But it would seem some of the electronics could be used for EV projects. Pat -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim, Saturn Guy Sent: Saturday, June 23, 2007 6:34 PM To: EVlist Subject: DC/AC converter (EV to Grid/Home) Hello all. I just joined the list and have spent hours reading through some of the archives. I would like to pick your brains a bit and ask if anyone has built a DC/AC converter for an Electric Vehicle. I converted a 94 Saturn SL1 and have been driving it since January of this year. I would like to build an on-board DC/AC converter that runs off the 126 volt pack of my EV and puts out 110v ac to run vital parts of the house in the event of power outage. All that energy stored and only have it
EV digest 6942
EV Digest 6942
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: hey can anyone help me with batteries and construction
by bruce parmenter [EMAIL PROTECTED]
2) Motor Efficiency
by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
3) RE: Energizer Bunny Batteries for EV's.
by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED]
4) Dependable Batteries
by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
5) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog
by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED]
6) CVT (was Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog)
by David Roden (Akron OH USA) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
7) Re: EV Scooter
by Danny Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
8) Re: Energizer Bunny Batteries for EV's.
by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED]
9) Chargers!
by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
10) Re: Chargers!
by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED]
11) vroombox and EV ?
by Florian Schmidt [EMAIL PROTECTED]
12) Re: Ultimate magnetic motor design, CVT, controllers
by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED]
13) Re: Invention to cool the inside of a car.
by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED]
14) Re: Make it
by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED]
15) Re: vroombox and EV ?
by Andrew Kane [EMAIL PROTECTED]
16) Vacuum Pump from Cruise Control
by Michael Barkley [EMAIL PROTECTED]
17) Re: Need ideas for electric motor use
by Markus Lorch [EMAIL PROTECTED]
18) Re: Chargers!
by keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED]
19) RE: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog
by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED]
20) Re: Dependable Batteries
by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED]
21) Re: Milestones: Carbon fiber and blogs
by Mitch Patenaude [EMAIL PROTECTED]
22) RE: whats the difference between gearing a motor for speed vs
distance
by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED]
23) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog
by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED]
24) Re: Ultimate magnetic motor design
by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED]
---BeginMessage---
Hi Gulabrao welcome to the EV List.
I suggest you make several posts each with a different subject
asking each of your questions. Also, consider explaining what
your EV conversion project is to achieve: long range-low speed,
high speed-short range, etc. (tell the EV List what is important
to you.
An EV is a long term investment. Each person's EV conversion
has different needs. If your EV is designed to meet your needs,
your investment will pay off in the long term (do not be in
a hurry to make a mistake).
Do not be discouraged, and please be patient to gather all the
information you need before you start spending money: less-
mistakes mean more EV smiles (aka EV grin).
Please read as much as you can about EV conversions ( evdl.org ,
eaaev.org , web searches about EVs , etc.). Also use those
links to learn EV component sources.
I will try to answer a few of your questions, but Tom's
suggestion to posts each question individually would be better:
1. 27hp [ ref
http://www.wattsgenerators.com/product_info.php/products_id/58 ]
but are you making a hybrid or an EV?
2. 6V traction (aka golf cart) batteries allow for the deepest
healthy discharge. All others have less pack life and
less range. Are you making a 120 VDC EV?
3. Check the EV component sources, but an example is an 8
Advanced DC motor for sedans, and a 9 Advanced DC motor for
heavier vehicles.
4. 900kg=1984lbs, 100kmph=62mph
http://www.aluminumbottles.com/cgi-bin/webman/elemental/conversion
120VDC EV conversion: I suggest a light truck, or a larger
sedan with the room for 20 6V batteries.
5. I do not suggest this. Convert the vehicle 1st, then consider
adjustments/enhancements later.
6. Check the EV component sourcesI mentioned above.
7. Read the EV faq's I mentioned above.
8. Read the EV faq's I mentioned above.
9. Read the EV faq's I mentioned above.
10. See #2 read the EV faq's I mentioned above.
11. No most off-the-shelf EV component will work fine. My
guess-timate is a light truck converted to Electric
using a 120 VDC pack of 20 6V traction/golf-cart batteries,
will go 65mph, and have a range of 45 miles at a
steady 55mph (72km at a steady 88kmph on a flat highway)
If you do not get a response, or the answer you want, consider
your post's subject and its wording might be the cause. Try
reposting, focusing the subject to one question, and be
patient.
I hope this has helped you.
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
'
~/__|o\__
'@- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
= Undo Petroleum Everywhere
: MEPIS Linux WiFi powered :
Bored stiff? Loosen up...
Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games.
http://games.yahoo.com/games/front
---End Message---
---BeginMessage---
On
EV digest 6943
EV Digest 6943 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Chargers! by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: CV Trans WAS Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) All this battery talk and still it depends on who you ask by Steve Powers [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: New e-mail!! by joe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Chargers! by Rich Rudman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Wheel Hub Motors? by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Manly EV's, RE: EV are for girls blog by Rich Rudman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Dependable Batteries by Richard Acuti [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) How is AGM battery perfomance impacted by orientation? by Ed Thorpe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: Wheel Hub Motors? by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: All this battery talk and still it depends on who you ask by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Ultimate magnetic motor design, CVT, controllers by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Ultimate magnetic motor design, CVT, controllers by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: How is AGM battery perfomance impacted by orientation? by dale henderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Making it. by Rich Rudman [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) VOLTS vs AMPS by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: VOLTS vs AMPS by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Chargers! by Rich Rudman [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- It is call a Manzanita Micro PFC charger. Models are PFC20, PFC30, and PFC50. The web site is: www.manzanitamicro.com or just type in Manzanita Micro PFC charger in your search engine and a several sites will come up with extensions of /PFC20 or PFC30 or PFC50 you can choose from. Roland - Original Message - From: keith vansickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2007 5:17 PM Subject: Re: Chargers! Rolland, what name brand description of charger sounds verry versitle keith --- Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Joseph, I find that a multi voltage, multi ampere charger works best for me. It can charge a 12 volt battery or to over 400 volts of batteries at very low ampere below 1 amp to at or over 50 amps with any input voltages from 60 vac to 250 vac. No input VAC voltage adjustment is required. I can plug my EV into a 110, 115, 120, 125, 208, 220, 230, 240 or 250 vac receptacles. Depending the voltage of the battery pack, just adjust the voltage to about 7.5 volt for every 6 volt battery or 15.0 volt for every 12 volt battery, and adjust the ampere from 0.01 to 50 amps, depending on the receptacle rating. I am using a 180 volt pack of 6 volt batteries, so 7.5 volts x 30 batteries = 225 volts for the maximum charge voltage. For a balance charge, which I do every 4 months its about 7.78 volts per battery or the maximum is about 233.5 volts for me. Lets say I lose a battery, than I install a jumper that I had made up in my EV tool box, and then I can lower the charging voltage to 225 - 7.5 = 217.5 volts until I get it replace. I can add more batteries if I want, which depends on the maximum voltage rating of your controller. I can go up to 300 volts if I want to which is the maximum pack volt I would use on the Zilla I have now. The charger I am using is a PFC-50 charger made by Manzanita Micro by Rich Rudman who is on this list, and even may respond to this e-mail. After removing 50 AH from my 260 AH batteries, it may only take about 60 minutes or less to charge the batteries to 90 to 95 percent, of which the battery voltage will be at the maximum voltage that is dial in. It may take another 30 to 60 minutes to put in the last 10 percent if you need to get the range you need for a safe level discharge which is about 50% DOD. My batteries are now going on 6 years using this type of charger and plan to go another 6 years with it. Roland - Original Message - From: Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2007 2:20 PM Subject: Chargers! On electroauto's website they show the Zivan NG3 charger using either 115 Volts for a slow charge or 240 volts for a faster charge. I could use the 115 volt charger, just put it in the trunk, and then I charge at any 110 volt outlet, right? Plus, a slower charge will enhance cycle life, correct? Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell. http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/ ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- HI, Loni I'll add my comments within your post: From: Loni [EMAIL
EV digest 6935
EV Digest 6935 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Side or top mount by Phelps [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Re: Need ideas for electric motor use by Phelps [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: red hot chili motor is here by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Side or top mount by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: [EV] Re: red hot chili motor is here by Eduardo Kaftanski [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: [EV] Re: [EV] Re: red hot chili motor is here by Eduardo Kaftanski [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) RE: red hot chili motor is here by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) EV Scooter by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Tell Toyota to Get With the Program! by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Milestones: Carbon fiber and blogs by Amy DeMaagd [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) Re: [EV] RE: red hot chili motor is here by Eduardo Kaftanski [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) Re: Side or top mount by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Milestones: Carbon fiber and blogs by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) HTML posts (was Re: Internal Resistance?) by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: charging w/ one battery missing by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Need ideas for electric motor use by Tad Coles [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: charging w/ one battery missing by Joe Smalley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) RE: Another thought, quarter mile by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Need ideas for electric motor use by Peter VanDerWal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: *SPAM* Re: charging w/ one battery missing by Tony Furr [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: Another thought, quarter mile by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: EVLN(CO rear wheel EMIS hybrid conversion business) by Bruce Weisenberger [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) Re: Understanding Motors II by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) 24 Volt Solenoid by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25) Re: Understanding Motors II by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- When connecting the batteries together in your E V.. .. Which is the rule of thumb.. Using the side mount on the batteries or the top mount..,.. I like the idea of using the side mount .. But It looks like It is not as good of a connection as the top mount.. Your thoughts.. Mitchell ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Make a electric bicycle Mitchell ---Original Message--- From: Tad Coles Date: 6/22/2007 11:43:21 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Need ideas for electric motor use Needed - creative thinker! I have come across an electric motor and am looking for ideas on how to put It to use. It is old and heavy (35 LB) and not very powerful. It was made by Marathon Electric Mfg. Corp. In Wausau, WI. The plate on it states it is: Direct current, 12 volt, 1/3 HP, 35 amp, 600 RPM, 5 minute duty, Relay-none, Model 2A56E8E5A W, Inspected Electric Motor for Hazardous Location, Class T, Group D, F567698. The story is that these motors were used in electric wheelchairs, which Seems odd with the 5-minute duty rating. I thought about using it as a winch On my truck, but when I compared it to winch motors available today it seems Like an inefficient proposal since $75 will buy a motor and winch drum that Would out perform this old beast. Thanks, Tad Coles ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hey Eduardo Might as address this here 8^) Man it just ticks me off something aweful! It looks like it's the aluminum end bell that's cracked and had to have come from a pretty good fall as I boxed it up best one could. Not sure why you say it was from the guys on your end unless they admitted something, lol. Do you know if they inspected it in L.A. before forwarding it to you? Anyway what a bummer 8^( It needs to have that end bell replaced and it'll be an easy swap over to do in house there, won't even have to remove any bearings. I'll have to order in another plate and get it out to you. You'll be able to get everything fitted while you wait but still a big time drag, heck it wasn't even a big guy to pick up, dang freight guys wouldn't last a day at the shop, LMAO. Again sorry for the hassle. I'll keep ya posted. BTW other than it looking destroyed when you got it, what did ya think? LMAO! Cya Jim Husted Hi-Torque Electric PS: You really are the Plasma Boy of Chile, hell you broke it before you EVen got it 8^P --- Eduardo Kaftanski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: pictures of its different states... http://www.nn.cl/Autos/EV/Motor/ yes, it has a crack in the brush holder, courtesy of the trucker that moved it from the airport to my office. I am asking Jim if I should worry about it or just loosen the bolt and move it to where it should be and leave it there, it looks like its not a stressed part... anyway, I'll start converting soon, it
EV digest 6936
EV Digest 6936
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: EVLN(CO rear wheel EMIS hybrid conversion business)
by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
2) Re: Understanding Motors II
by Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED]
3) Re: Side or top mount
by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED]
4) Re: Side or top mount
by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
5) Re: Side or top mount
by Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
6) Re: Milestones: Carbon fiber and blogs
by jerryd [EMAIL PROTECTED]
7) Re: Side or top mount
by Roland Wiench [EMAIL PROTECTED]
8) Re: Ultimate magnetic motor design
by Dave [EMAIL PROTECTED]
9) RE: 24 Volt Solenoid
by damon henry [EMAIL PROTECTED]
10) RE: red hot chili motor is here
by damon henry [EMAIL PROTECTED]
11) Re: Cheap
by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED]
12) Re: Understanding Motors II
by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED]
13) Re: thundersky cells for cheap, prices
by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED]
14) Re: thundersky cells for cheap, prices
by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED]
15) Re: charging w/ one battery missing
by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED]
16) Re: 24 Volt Solenoid
by Lee Hart [EMAIL PROTECTED]
17) Re: Ultimate magnetic motor design
by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED]
18) Make it
by Phelps [EMAIL PROTECTED]
19) Re: Side or top mount
by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED]
20) Re: charging w/ one battery missing
by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED]
21) Re: Understanding Motors II
by David Roden [EMAIL PROTECTED]
22) Re: [EV] Re: Side or top mount
by Eduardo Kaftanski [EMAIL PROTECTED]
23) Re: Ultimate magnetic motor design
by Dave [EMAIL PROTECTED]
24) Relay on Vacuum pump
by Deanne Mott [EMAIL PROTECTED]
---BeginMessage---
H. Interesting idea. I wondering why it can only be used with
automatic transmission vehicals?
On 6/23/07, Bruce Weisenberger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Looks like the News Guys need an EV education. At
least they added a website link for the real story.
The conversion needs a 48 to 72 volt battery pack that
will require a charger and will plug in. Won't operate
with just the Aux Battery. At least is was a good Plug
for Netgain and their newest products.
--- bruce parmenter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
EVLN(CO rear wheel EMIS hybrid conversion business)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public
EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for
reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.themountainmail.com/main.asp?SectionID=19SubSectionID=75ArticleID=11207
Salida business taps into hybrid vehicle market
Friday, June 15, 2007
As a certified dealer and installer of EMIS, Pete
Hansen and his
partner Mike Jones at Salida Conversions retrofit
rear wheel
drive 1996 and newer vehicles with an electric
assist hybrid
system.
The result is a vehicle that reduces gas consumption
an average
of 26 percent, Hansen said.
As described on the business Web site,
www.salidaconversions.com,
EMIS is a high torque, high powered electric motor
that attaches
to a vehicle drive train and plugs into the onboard
computer.
It works particularly well in city driving and up
and down hills,
he said, adding the worse gasoline mileage a vehicle
gets, the
better the system works.
To install the system, the drive shaft is removed
and the
electrical assist system is attached. It is then
replaced and the
system is wired into the vehicle's onboard computer,
taking a
maximum of three days, he said.
The electric motor is wired to the vehicle battery
and doesn't
need to be plugged in for recharging.
Cost of the system ranges from $5,000-$7,000 and
Hansen estimated
the system could pay for itself in gasoline savings
within 24
months.
In addition, a Colorado income tax credit is
available for
vehicles converted to use alternative fuel.
Those interested can also purchase the system from
Salida
Conversions and install it themselves.
Hansen will discuss the hybrid conversion and full
electrical
conversion technology during question and answer
sessions from
2:30-4:30 p.m. Saturday at Bongo Billy's Salida Café
and from 11
a.m. to 1 p.m. June 23 at Mothers in Buena Vista.
Dates of other question and answer sessions are
posted on the
business Web site.
More information is available from Hansen at
539-6212.
Content (c) 2007 The Mountain Mail
Software (c) 1998-2007 1up! Software, All Rights
Reserved
===
http://www.salidaconversions.com/emis.htm
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
'
~/__|o\__
'@- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
= Undo Petroleum Everywhere
: MEPIS Linux WiFi powered :
Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect.
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EV digest 6931
to draw a ridiculous amount of current in order to spin. In a series wound motor a given voltage corresponds to a given RPM. With no load on a series motor the rpm rapidly shoots towards infinity (I think). As far as I can tell the current drawn by a motor is some function of the difference between the commanded RPM (or the rpm that corresponds to the current voltage) and the actual RPM of the motor. So if you are putting 12 volts through the motor and it wants to be revving at 1000 RPM but it is stalled at 0 RPM then it will try to draw as much current as it possibly can (until the resistance of the motor itself comes into play) in order to spin up to 1000 RPM. This is just my hypothesis from my personal observations of my motor and may have no basis in reality at all... So, take it with a grain of salt and listen to the experts... -Jeremy On Jun 22, 2007, at 6:41 AM, Rob Hogenmiller wrote: I must not be posting my question right. There is no controller. I hook a ground wire and a positive wire to the electric motor. What spec on the motors information would tell me the most amps it could draw from a battery? God bless - Original Message - From: Jeremy Green [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 10:44 PM Subject: Re: Understanding Motors II I wouldn't think so. I read that to mean that it will start to overheat after 30 seconds at 300 amps (or that is what it is rated for). It may draw more amps if allowed by the controller. It will overheat much more quickly at higher amp draws. Hope this helps... On Jun 21, 2007, at 11:32 PM, Rob Hogenmiller wrote: If a motor specs reads it can do 30seconds at 300amps and 100amps continous. Does that mean the most it can ever draw from a battery is 300amps if you connect it straight up to a battery? God bless ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hi Jim, I'm still trying to comprehend it, but I think I got it. I'll have to check with the meter to verify the setup. Time is ticking. My wife wants me to haul the thing to the dump tomorrow. Argghh. That's the first thing she asked me at breakfast today. Are we making a run to the dump this weekend? From the quick test I did the motor does run. Just got to get the rest figured out per your suggestions and to test the controller and relays. If those major components test out, it should be salvageable. My dream with this was to use it as a tug to haul my son's electric Jr. dragster at the race track (when he gets old enough to race). Chip On Jun 22, 2007, at 1:44 AM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote: From: Jim Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: June 21, 2007 11:43:21 PM EDT To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: 24-volt Electric Utility Cart Motor Question Hey Chip Now I'm not saying that your motor's like that, just an idea. Lansing does it by using two wires (as one) which gets like 11 turns from memory. They then seperate the wires into 4 connections per coil (now it's two seperate and opposite wound coils interlaced. Anyway the way they wound it is you only use half the coil mass at a time as every other wind is a reverse polarty wire. Hope that explaines it. I doubt you have this exact setup but with just three wires it's got to be something like this which does make for easy motor reversing. Hope this helps Jim Husted Hi-Torque Electric ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- --- Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I must not be posting my question right. There is no controller. I hook a ground wire and a positive wire to the electric motor. What spec on the motors information would tell me the most amps it could draw from a battery? None actually, lol. I'm not sure what you are looking to find out. The controller doesn't add or subtract the current that the motor will draw but is determined by how it's wound. If using just one 12 volt battery most brushed DC motors will run somewhere between 20 to 40 amps and 2000 to 4000 RPM's running free spin (un-loaded). Under 12 volts this is the max it will draw, until you put it under load. Anyway I guess I am lost as to what it is you're looking at understanding. Maybe you're looking to see if your motor is good or not? If you wire it to 12 volts and she draws 100 amps (0 load), well then your motor probably has an issue as I'm gonna guess it should be drawing about 30 amps give or take. Does this make sense or answer your question? I missed what motor you are actually using so that info (or shootng me a pic) will offer some better idea of what she should draw under 12 volts, that is if that's actually what you're looking to find out. Hope this helps Jim Husted Hi-Torque Electric Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find
EV digest 6932
transportation, the work that everyone is doing through the Tour de Sol is critically important. In closing, I would like to thank everyone that has helped with the Tour de Sol over the many years that I have been associated with it. Please see slide for this list. I would also like to thank those that are carrying the ball forward. Ollie Perry, Paul Kydd, past Tour de Sol volunteers, and many others that I know were working behind the scenes in birthing the 21st Century Automotive Challenge. In closing I'd like to show you a photograph taken in 1989 -- at the start of the Tour de Sol. The young boy in the foreground is Rob's son Tyler -- who is now a college student. I'd also like to share with you an oft-cited quote from Margaret Mead, renowned sociologist. ``A small group of thoughtful people could change the world Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.'' I challenge everyone reading this to pick up the torch and run with it. The future is in your hands. - - - - The 2007 TdS Reports are actually about the 21st Century Automotive Challenge hosted by the The Eastern Electric Vehicle Club (EEVC). The complete set of Tour de Sol Reports for 2007 can be found at: http://www.AutoAuditorium.com/TdS_Reports_2007 The complete set of past Tour de Sol Reports can be found at: http://www.FovealSystems.com/Tour_de_Sol_Reports.html - - - - The above is Copyright 2007 by Michael H. Bianchi. Permission to copy is granted provided the entire article is presented without modification and this notice remains attached. For other arrangements, contact me at +1-973-822-2085 . - - - - For more on the 21st Century Automotive Challenge, see the web page at http://www.EEVC.info ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- On Jun 19, 2007, at 12:55 PM, trev scribby wrote: Below is the power curve for a Honda 9HP motor, i have the overseas-ebay equivalent. Not sure exactly how to read the chart, but hopefully you guys can help. http://www.trupower.com/honda/270/gxperg270.gif It looks like you need around 14 ft/lb of torque over a rpm range that an electric motor would be happy with. How long does the engine/motor operate each pull? This looks like something that a golf cart motor and controller could handle. Beat up old ones with dead batteries are often cheap. Paul neon G. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- you can look at www.movecars.com at auto haulers imfo. i have used DAS (dependable auto shippers) before and had good luck. Mike young - Original Message - From: William Brinsmead [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Sent: Friday, June 22, 2007 3:35 PM Subject: Auto Transport Companies ?? Hi All , I have seen this discussed in the past but it is probably out of date by now. Does any one have experience with auto transport companies ? I need to get a quote to ship a EV to be form Indiana to Nevada, there is just a bewildering glut of them on the web. I am hoping that some one knows of a few good companies left. Thanks Bill Brinsmead ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Thanks everyone for explaining all of this to me. I think I'm going to run with the installed temp probe and run lines to a warning light on the dash. Not as precise as a gauge but certainly acceptable to me. My motor has the vented head so I'll assume that there is an impeller fan on the shaft inside. I think I'll get make a small hose coupling from some thin metal and have it tack-welded to the brush vent. Then I'll install a small squirrel cage fan and run a duct between them. Probably not necessary but certainly won't hurt. I think I'm also discovering that my driving style may need adjustment. In an attempt to give the motor rests and not drive too fast, I've been taking secondary roads. These roads have a lot of traffic lights and a lot of small hills and a low speed limit. It's difficult to keep the motor at it's most efficient speed and the stop 'n start draw a lot of amps. I seem to be better off on the highway maxed out in 2nd gear and maintaining a constant 55-60 mph. Even a steady 65-70 mph in 3rd gear seems to be easier on the equipment than the secondary roads. I'm basing this on the final voltage when I arrive at my destination as well as the motor temp. It'll be easier to tell for sure when my ammeter gets here. Rich A _ Get a preview of Live Earth, the hottest event this summer - only on MSN http://liveearth.msn.com?source=msntaglineliveearthhm ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Yes, if you get individual emails rather than the digest and your mail pgm allows you to view message source then you can see the original message. --Steve On Fri, 2007-06-22 at 13:26 -0600, John A. Evans - N0HJ wrote: Is anyone else actually able to view the posts with this notice? I
EV digest 6923
EV Digest 6923 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Lead Acid Batteries by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) RE: Motor speed by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Does twisting matter? by Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Dc to Dc by Dan Frederiksen [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Does twisting matter? by Rod Hower [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) Re: Motor speed by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Motor speed by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Re: Internal Resistance? Peukert's Exponent? Voltage Sag?!?! by Joe Smalley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Does twisting matter? by Tehben Dean [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Motor Speed by Storm Connors [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) RE: Lead Acid Batteries by Cor van de Water [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) RE: Internal Resistance? Peukert's Exponent? Voltage Sag?!?! by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) Re: Internal Resistance? Peukert's Exponent? Voltage Sag?!?! by Joe Smalley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Re: Lead Acid Batteries by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) RE: Internal Resistance? Peukert's Exponent? Voltage Sag?!?! by Joseph Tahbaz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) Re: Chargers? by Joe Smalley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) Re: Internal Resistance? Peukert's Exponent? Voltage Sag?!?! by Joe Smalley [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Re: Lead Acid Batteries by Danny Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: 55mph by Peter Gabrielsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Improving hillclimbing without mudering the pack? by Markus Lorch [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) RE: contacting Electro Automotive (electroauto.com) by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) Re: 55mph by Victor Tikhonov [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23) RE: Motor speed by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- I was wondering what kind of distance I could get out of a two (12V) 31 group batteries. If I have a 24 volt system, with a two 100amp continous max output motors, how long would the battery last? They have 1200 Amps, and a reserve capacity of 195 minutes. If my math is correct it would be: 195minutes x 2 batteries / 8 (draw of amps by two motors)= 48.75 minutes. Are we allowed to put link addresses on here of projects we are working on? God bless ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Storm, My WarP9 finds its sweet spot around 3500 RPM, which in 2nd gear happens to be 35 mph. at 37mph I can feel acceleration start to taper and seems the perfect shift point to 3rd gear. Mike -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Jim Husted Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2007 6:01 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Motor speed Hey Storm Actually you don't want to lug the motor and you have plenty of room and would say it'd be happier at the 3000 to 4000 rpms, you got lots more rpm to play with 8^) Hope this helps Jim Husted Hi-Torque Electric --- Storm Connors [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I got the tachometer installed, now the big question. What is the best speed to aim for with my ADC 9 motor pushing almost 3500 pounds? I have been keeping it between 2000 and 2500 RPM generally. My thinking is that if the revs are too low under load, there is the potential of overheating. I have red lined it at 5000 so as not to break the motor. What do you think? I have been treating it like an ICE but don't know if that is right. Never miss an email again! Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Very convincing. Are hundreds of EVers going to go re-wire everything now? Yikes! http://www.ppminc.com/Does_Twisting_Matter2.pdf ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- To avoid running down one battery or having an extra battery Phelps wrote: What the propose of that?? You all ready have D C and if you got 8 batteries you can use and combo to get ant voltage you want.. I don't get the reason for it. Or I could throw in one more battery and a dc to ac converter and run any thing I wanted T V heater radio.. Mitchell ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- No, probably not. I previously worked at GE-EVS on golf carts, utility vehicles and electric greens mowers. The greens mower would not even work without having the wires from the accelerator pedal twisted. This is probably worst case, but it provides incentives for those building an EV conversion to pay attention to details like this! Twisting the wire may make the AM radio sound better, or in other situations make the EV actually work. Rod Twisting wires with my electric drill! --- Loni [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Very convincing. Are hundreds of EVers going to go re-wire everything now? Yikes!
EV digest 6924
EV Digest 6924 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: Motor speed by Mike Willmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2) Cheap balancer for A123 pack by Tony Hwang [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3) Re: Cheap balancer for A123 pack by Marcin Ciosek [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) Re: Improving hillclimbing without mudering the pack? by jerryd [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Re: Improving hillclimbing without mudering the pack? by Thomas Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] 6) DCDC converter and balancer in one? switch between 12V cells by Tony Hwang [EMAIL PROTECTED] 7) Re: Internal Resistance? - Now- cable resistance by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) RE: Internal Resistance? Peukert's Exponent? Voltage Sag?!?! by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Re: Heater efficiency (was: EV parts ordered! - ?questions?) by TrotFox Greyfoot [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Re: Motor speed by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) RE: Clutch, Keepin' it. Ruland shaft coupler by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12) RE: 55mph by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 13) RE: Cheap balancer for A123 pack by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) RE: DCDC converter and balancer in one? switch between 12V cells by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15) Re: DCDC converter by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 16) RE: 55mph by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 17) RE: DCDC converter and balancer in one? switch between 12V cells by Phil Marino [EMAIL PROTECTED] 18) Improving hillclimbing without mudering the pack? by Jeff Shanab [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Re: Motor speed by Rob Hogenmiller [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) RE: 55mph by Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) Re: DCDC converter by [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---BeginMessage--- I pull my RPM reading off the tach sensor mounted to the end of the auxiliary shaft on the WarP9 motor. If you look at the picture on my EVAlbum page (the one with the under-the-hood shot) http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/756 you can see the black thing on the octagonal plate on the front of my motor. Thats the tach sensor the Zilla uses to read RPM right from the motor shaft. I forgot to put in my last post that you can see some acceleration simulations for my 192V setup with typical limits you would come up against in several lower power configurations. It also notes speeds at certain RPM's. If you know what gear I'm in you can calculate the speed knowing the RPM. http://home.gci.net/~saintbernard/ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Rob Hogenmiller Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2007 7:57 PM To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Re: Motor speed When you type 3500rpm for an electric motor, where is that determined at? By/at the shaft circumference point, inside the motor, or some other location? God bless ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hi all, I'm trying to make an A123 pack for an eBike type application, and wonder if this shunt regulator balancer would work. A 1 watt 3.6V zener, plus a 1W 1.6ohm resistor in series with each battery. Basically when the voltage across each sell is over 3.6V, it will bleed across the zener. It would regulate during charge also. I don't expect the voltage across a cell during charging to get over 4V, so assuming 4V, the current through the regulator would be: 4-3.6 = 0.4V 0.4V / 1.6ohm = 0.25amps, which is fine for the zener diode (3.6V * 0.25 amps = .9 Watts), and more than fine for the resistor. My question is, would this work, and would this be enough to balance say, a 8 series, 8 parallel pack? I know, not much Ah, but man it would be capable of being really fast. :) I figure even if it doesn't get completely balanced during charging, after charging, the overcharged cells would discharge through the regulators (I've seen A123 packs up to 3.9V after being overcharged). - Tony ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Tony, recently I bough 1900 LiFP cells (not from A123 but it doesn't matter) and the voltage difference between highest and lowest value was 7mV !! Assuming you will start from similar point you balancer will do the trick as long as zener diodes won't differ too much (usually tolerance of of shunt voltage is 5%). That's my opinion. I would add a protection circuit preventing cells from deep discharge. If you don't need fancy BMS that would cost (for you configuration) 400E this will work fine. Marcin ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Hi Markus and All, - Original Message Follows - From: Markus Lorch [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@listproc.sjsu.edu Subject: Improving hillclimbing without mudering the pack? Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2007 10:10:34
