RE: CSGenerators

[Rodney Samuelson]

I bought mine from silver gen and make quart each day.  I bought to to deal
with Lyme disease and had a Herx for 3 months and now no herx.

 

  _  

From: MaryAnn Helland [mailto:marmar...@bellsouth.net] 
Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2011 8:30 AM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: CSGenerators

 

Just learned that my cousin-in-law has ordered a CS generator from Bob
Livingston -- does anyone know anything about him or his generator?  Thanks.

MA

Re: CSGenerators

[MaryAnn Helland]

Thanks Rodney.  Glad to hear that you're not herxing anymore -- hope it means 
that all of the bugs are killed.

I was looking for information specifically on a generator made or sold by Bob 
Livingston -- can't find any info on Google.
MA





From: Rodney Samuelson rsamuels...@cox.net
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sun, September 18, 2011 12:59:48 PM
Subject: RE: CSGenerators


I bought mine from silver gen and make quart each day.  I bought to to deal 
with 
Lyme disease and had a Herx for 3 months and now no herx.
 



From:MaryAnn Helland [mailto:marmar...@bellsouth.net] 
Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2011 8:30 AM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: CSGenerators
 
Just learned that my cousin-in-law has ordered a CS generator from Bob 
Livingston -- does anyone know anything about him or his generator?  Thanks.
MA

Re: CSGenerators

[Tel Tofflemire]

Subject: Re: CSGenerators

Jut thought I should respond to this post.
I have used Colloidal Master for 13 years now and the
first one I orderd is still just like new, works well.
I use a tiny fish tank bubblier with an in line
valuve, and a in line filter, I have made hundreds of
gallons with my Colloid Master, This one
makes a gallon at a time (Like all of them)
 Where to buy = (http://www.wishgranted.com)

Tel Tofflemire
Dewey, AZ.
WWW.QuailwoodHerbal.com


  
 Thanks for your replys to my last question.  I
 recently asked  about a 
 generator sold to me by Mike Metcalf.  I don't know
 how good  this one is because I 
 get black residue (flakes) from the silver wires if
 I use  it for more than 
 one batch, then I have to clean them.  Does  anyone
 know if this happens 
 because I have the unit on between batches?  I  have
 been looking at the SiverGen 
 and the Colloid Master Universal.  The colloid
 model is at  _www.wishgranted.com_ (http://www.wishgranted.com) .
  The Colloid  Master has a kit which comes 
 with a distiller.  Both of  these seem like much
 better units, please give me 
 any of your  opinions.  I don't get on line all
 everyday but it is good to  
 talk to others who feel similar to myself with
 regard to the silver  usage.  I 
 do appreciate the information I have gotten from
 this  site, thank you, Lynn.



  



 

Re: CSGenerators-colloid master

[Sandee George]

Hey there Bob - thanks a million for this tip - I can now pass it on to
all my boat friends.
Sharing is always the best way to go - Pay it Forward !!
Regards
Sandee

Peace is easy ... it is a Mindset
http://www.alive-again.net/


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RE: CSGenerators-colloid master (UNCLASSIFIED)

[Medwith, Robert J Mr CIV USA AMC]

Classification:  UNCLASSIFIED 
Caveats: NONE

Sandee  More tips. I only have a 13 gallon holding tank (but it is just
for Head, toilet)
I use as little as possible water to flush. I have some of the normal
blue chemical for toilet in a jug, but
it has CS in it also. After flushing I pour some of the blue stuff with
CS in it in toilet.
This helps smell in Head also.
Bob 

-Original Message-
From: Sandee George [mailto:oha...@juno.com] 
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2008 10:20 AM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSGenerators-colloid master

Hey there Bob - thanks a million for this tip - I can now pass it on to
all my boat friends.
Sharing is always the best way to go - Pay it Forward !!
Regards
Sandee

Peace is easy ... it is a Mindset
http://www.alive-again.net/


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Classification:  UNCLASSIFIED 
Caveats: NONE

Re: CSGenerators-colloid master

[Clayton Family]

I am idly wondering who is the person behind the Colloid Master?  There 
is quite a bit of information on the site, but I had a bit of trouble 
figuring out if it is a constant current machine. Maybe it is just me, 
and it is right there staring me in the face.


Kathryn

On Feb 13, 2008, at 5:57 PM, Tel Tofflemire wrote:


Jut thought I should respond to this post.
I have used Colloidal Master for 10 years now and the
first one I orderd is still just like new, works well.
I use a tiny fish tank bubblier with an in line
valuve, and a in line filter, I have made hundreds of
gallons with my origanal Colloidal Master, This one
makes a gallon at a time. (http://www.wishgranted.com)

Tel Tofflemire
Dewey, AZ.
--- les...@aol.com wrote:



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Re: CSGenerators-colloid master

[marmar845]

 I am idly wondering who is the person behind the Colloid Master? There 
 is quite a bit of information on the site, but I had a bit of trouble 
 figuring out if it is a constant current machine. Maybe it is just me, 
 and it is right there staring me in the face.

 Hi Kathryn.  The person who owns WishGranted (Synergenesis) is Vince 
Goetsch.  I believe that it's a constant current machine, but it switches 
polarity on a timed basis.  There used to be a lot more information on the 
website, but he was forced to remove it.  He also no longer sells his booklet 
*Colloidal Silver Maker  Researcher's Manual*.  Sad.  MA 

Re: CSGenerators-colloid master

[Sickleave48045]

I like the machine, I never clean the silver coins I use. When it switches  
polarity the stuff falls off the coins.
I just strain through 4 brown coffee filters (a slow drip through filters).  
I use a plastic tube with a plastic valve on end and regulate flow to drip  
through multi filters. I brew a gallon at a time it takes a long time depending 
 
whether I seed the brew (with some CS). I also use something that stirs the  
brew, the jar sits on top a rotating magnet. You put a short piece of plastic  
tube with a metal roller bearing in brew jar and you can see it rotate  
around mixing the brewing CS. I use Canadian Maple Leaf coins hung on  S  hooks 
made from some 
99.99 wire I bought from one of the members on this site. I also purchased  
the stirring device from one of the members also. I have experimented by making 
 my own CS brewer using a DC power source and a 1 mill amp diode current 
limiter.  I made some brewers for friends, when I first started I bought 2 of 
the  
Colloidal Masters so I would have a spare. Any constant current brewer is  
interesting to watch using a volt meter as you can see voltage change when you  
move silver closer or further apart. The constant Mill Amp limiter changes  
voltage up or down (with in limits of power source) to matins the rating of the 
 
limiter. I have a 5 gallon old glass water jug filled with CS (emergency 
supply)  or is I need a quick gallon to give away.
I have a plastic 2 gallon jug with a spick et for use as I need the CS. I  
use CS in my holding tank (waste)
on boat (from head, toilet). I can go some times 2 to 3 months before I  need 
a pump out and it does not smell even in the hot Weather. I also use CS  
where ever I have a mold problem on boat it stops mold till CS coating is 
washed  
away. Bob



**The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy 
Awards. Go to AOL Music.  
(http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp0030002565)

RE: CSGenerators

[bob Larson]

i use a colloid master with an added magnetic stir plate and must clean the
silver between batches.
sometimes i clean the mid-batch, but usually don't bother.

the stronger the batch the more the black builds.
the mag stir plate delays/lessens the black and also accelerates the
brewing.
  -Original Message-
  From: les...@aol.com [mailto:les...@aol.com]
  Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 11:01 PM
  To: silver-list@eskimo.com
  Subject: CSGenerators


  Hi,

  Thanks for your replys to my last question.  I recently asked about a
generator sold to me by Mike Metcalf.   I don't know how good this one is
because I get black residue (flakes) from the silver wires if I use it for
more than one batch, then I have to clean them.   Does anyone know if this
happens because I have the unit on between batches?  I have been looking at
the SiverGen and the Colloid Master Universal.  The colloid model is at
www.wishgranted.com.  The Colloid Master has a kit which comes with a
distiller.  Both of these seem like much better units, please give me any of
your opinions.   I don't get on line all everyday but it is good to talk to
others who feel similar to myself with regard to the silver usage.  I do
appreciate the information I have gotten from this site, thank you, Lynn.

Re: CSGenerators

[Clayton Family]

It seems to me that when one is not using a silver generator, it should 
be turned off, and disconnected from the power supply if necessary.  I 
have heard good things about the silverpuppy generator, too.


On Feb 12, 2008, at 10:00 PM, les...@aol.com wrote:



Hi,
 
Thanks for your replys to my last question.  I recently asked about a 
generator sold to me by Mike Metcalf.   I don't know how good this one 
is because I get black residue (flakes) from the silver wires if I use 
it for more than one batch, then I have to clean them.   Does anyone 
know if this happens because I have the unit on between batches?  I 
have been looking at the SiverGen and the Colloid Master Universal.  
The colloid model is at www.wishgranted.com.  The Colloid Master has 
a kit which comes with a distiller.  Both of these seem like much 
better units, please give me any of your opinions.   I don't get on 
line all everyday but it is good to talk to others who feel similar to 
myself with regard to the silver usage.  I do appreciate 
the information I have gotten from this site, thank you, Lynn.



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Re: CSGenerators

[Tel Tofflemire]

Jut thought I should respond to this post.
I have used Colloidal Master for 10 years now and the
first one I orderd is still just like new, works well.
I use a tiny fish tank bubblier with an in line
valuve, and a in line filter, I have made hundreds of
gallons with my origanal Colloidal Master, This one
makes a gallon at a time. (http://www.wishgranted.com)

Tel Tofflemire
Dewey, AZ.
--- les...@aol.com wrote:

 Hi,
  
 Thanks for your replys to my last question.  I
 recently asked  about a 
 generator sold to me by Mike Metcalf.   I don't know
 how good  this one is because I 
 get black residue (flakes) from the silver wires if
 I use  it for more than 
 one batch, then I have to clean them.   Does  anyone
 know if this happens 
 because I have the unit on between batches?  I  have
 been looking at the SiverGen 
 and the Colloid Master Universal.   The colloid
 model is at 
 _www.wishgranted.com_ (http://www.wishgranted.com) .
  The Colloid  Master has a kit which comes 
 with a distiller.  Both of  these seem like much
 better units, please give me 
 any of your  opinions.   I don't get on line all
 everyday but it is good to  
 talk to others who feel similar to myself with
 regard to the silver  usage.  I 
 do appreciate the information I have gotten from
 this  site, thank you, Lynn.
 
 
 
 **The year's hottest artists on the red
 carpet at the Grammy 
 Awards. Go to AOL Music.  

(http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp0030002565)
 


Tel Tofflemire
Dewey, AZ.


  

Be a better friend, newshound, and 
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.  Try it now.  
http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ 


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Re: CSGenerators

[Ode Coyote]

  Mark Metcalf has been selling boxes of batteries for decades for as much 
as $150 and made a FORTUNE back in the 80s...which he spent.
His latest attempt to repeat that gold mine was 
www.flowerpowergenerator.com where he promoted making your own silver chloride.
It apparently didn't go as well with all the better priced, better designed 
and better quality competition these days.


 A similar [actually somewhat better] generator can be had for a decent 
price at James Allisons site http://www.sunstoneherbals.com/cs-shop.htm


Ode

At 01:49 PM 2/5/2008 -0600, you wrote:


I do not know about it- what are the details? website, maybe?

I googled love 2 geberator, and did not see it.

Kathryn


On Feb 4, 2008, at 9:03 PM, les...@aol.com wrote:



Hi, I am new at making colloidal silver.  I have a Love 2 generator
that I purchased from Mark Metcalf about 6 mos. ago.  I just recently
started reading this digest and was curious if anyone had experience
with this  model?  I saw the silverGen SG6A and it looks like it is
better unit, more  accurate.  Any info would be appreciated, thanks,
Lynn



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Re: CSGenerators

[Clayton Family]

I do not know about it- what are the details? website, maybe?

I googled love 2 geberator, and did not see it.

Kathryn


On Feb 4, 2008, at 9:03 PM, les...@aol.com wrote:



Hi, I am new at making colloidal silver.  I have a Love 2 generator
that I purchased from Mark Metcalf about 6 mos. ago.  I just recently
started reading this digest and was curious if anyone had experience
with this  model?  I saw the silverGen SG6A and it looks like it is
better unit, more  accurate.  Any info would be appreciated, thanks,
Lynn



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RE: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[Ode Coyote]

  A solar cell puts out about one half volt regardless of size.
However much area it takes to output a couple of milliamps in full sun is 
the concern.

.03 watts per square centimeter is the power figure I get.
It looks like surplus market calculator cells would be a way to go, some 
wired in parallel for area and some in series for voltage.


Ode



At 12:12 PM 7/30/2007 -0500, you wrote:


Morning Dan,

 At 08:08 AM 7/30/2007, you wrote:


 If you are just going for a colloidal silver maker in Iraq, you do not
need batteries.  There is plenty of reliable sun.  You just need a solar 
cell and a current limit circuit.

   Likely this application needs the smallest solar charger in the world.

   It sure seems like a Near nothing solar panel.

I would guess, 2 X 2 inches or 3 X 3 inches at most.

I read some of the articles (  links on this list, I think ) about home 
built solar panels.


Even in the primitive countries they could come up with the 
materials.  Plus, charity groups make regular donations for some 
causes.Average income per person is $ 20.00 per year, or less.


What surprised me, is that there are a few knowledgeable and educated 
people in these countries.  I feel sure many of them help the ones that 
are not.


The batteries will just cause more expense and they will probably be 
taken out for  a more important purpose, like powering up the walkman or 
whatever they use these days...


  Yes, I agree.  Not sure why the person wants to integrate the CS power 
with other more complex and powerful applications.


If he is going to distill water, he must have a reasonable decent and 
powerful solar cooker.  These have been in the evolution stage now for 
many years so proven ideas exist.


I found several small solar panels but they are too expensive for the 
primitive countries.


Wayne





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Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[Ode Coyote]

  Typically, food distribution is controlled by whatever gangs 
[militias] are in charge in order to control people, so even if the food 
is made available, it doesn't reach the hungry unless they are doing the 
bidding of the gangs.
Therefore, supplying food just feeds your enemy with power over the local 
populace...a *no win* situation, damned if you do and damned if you don't
This is what Somalia/ Mogadishu was all about. All the aid was going into 
the hands of the war lords at gun point.  Deprivation makes any supply all 
the more powerful a tool.
It's the #1 tool of control that any unofficial group has...and since 
that's where the food comes from the *gangs* become your ONLY 
friend.  Your only alternative is to leave...with a very high risk of 
getting shot in the back as you do.
 If you DO manage to leave and those you went to don't win, you get shot 
in the front later on.
  You can dump tons of food in there but nobody but the local militia and 
flunkies get to eat.  Even if you *find* an MRE, it has to be turned in or 
you die right now of bullets or cordless hand drills at the hand of fed 
enforcers, rather than later of hunger.

 The Iraqi government knows full well how it all works.
Being not much better than the preferred gang themselves, it wouldn't 
surprise me that they'd use the same tactics as much as the puppet masters 
[USA] lets them get away with.
And every time they *have to* supply an area they don't control, they know 
without a doubt they are making the enemy stronger.


Our problem is that we can't morally operate on that level of absolute 
uncaring ruthlessness and can't win unless we do.
Really, the only option an outsider has is to just shoot everything that 
moves till nothing moves, then feed what's left *if* they behave, just like 
they all do it... but that ain't gonna happen.
 Turning a blind eye to the traditions of absolute control, letting the 
most favored gang operate as ruthlessly as it takes, is the only other option.
 That gang may have a desire to change the paradigm, but first, it must be 
in control.  If it's not sufficiently ruthless, it won't be.


People who can't comprehend that way of things will complain and 
condemn.  Those who do will be heartbroken, but that's how it works over 
there and has for centuries.
It was that way before the rise of Islam virtually everywhere, but the 
tactics and traditions of absolutes were Codified by Mohammed, thus Islam 
has had the greatest success at remaining the same over the centuries. The 
same old endless war where a common enemy is the only friend of unity possible.
 The code of Islam makes *everyone else* that enemy. If it wins, it loses 
along with everyone else and in the mean time, it can't decide *who* IT is 
either. It only thinks it knows *what* it is. [What it really is in the 
end, is it's own worst enemy.]

Unfortunate, to say the least.

The only Muslim who has a prayer of a peace that's not life fought to an 
impoverished standstill is the apostate Muslim,  the moderate too 
frightened to show a face of resistance to the true unadulterated and 
complete *faith* as written by Mohammed which is nothing short of being a 
process of raising endless armies for endless wars playing a huge mindless 
game of King Of the Hill


Ode


At 08:39 PM 7/30/2007 +0200, you wrote:


Dan , today OXFAM produced a report stating that the Iraqi Govt ( a
creation of the US Govt )  is failing to provide water, food ,
sanitation and shelter  for 8 ( EIGHT ) MILLION people - every single
day.  I doubt that powering up a walkman  or whatever they use these
days  is on the top of their priority list but it is a happy thought
- thanks- Richard
On 30/07/2007, at 15:08, Dan Nave wrote:


 If you are just going for a colloidal silver maker in Iraq, you do
not
need batteries.
There is plenty of reliable sun.  You just need a solar cell and a
current limit circuit.

The batteries will just cause more expense and they will probably be
taken out for
a more important purpose, like powering up the walkman or whatever
they
use
these days...

Dan

-Original Message-
From: Jonathan B. Britten [mailto:jbrit...@cc.nakamura-u.ac.jp]
Sent: Saturday, July 28, 2007 11:23 PM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

Maybe simple is best.  You can't get simpler than four 9-V ni-cad
solar
rechargeable batteries.

The only really desirable addition would be the electronics to produce
automatic shutoff and  constant current.

Constant current, in my personal experience, makes a big difference.
Without that, there's a sudden surge  that produces a big cloud of
particles before the device shuts off.




On Sunday, Jul 29, 2007, at 11:44 Asia/Tokyo, CWFugitt wrote:


Keep in mind that near 100% of such devices have an overhead and a
direct effect on efficiency.



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Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[Sandee George]

Hi There Ode - thank you for the reality check as per usual well said - 
Have a super wonderful day
Sandee

Peace is easy ... it is a Mindset


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Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[Lee Nash]

what about a solar water distiller?

Leslie
- Original Message - 
From: Ode Coyote odecoy...@alltel.net

To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 4:05 AM
Subject: RE: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees





  A solar cell puts out about one half volt regardless of size.
However much area it takes to output a couple of milliamps in full sun is 
the concern.

.03 watts per square centimeter is the power figure I get.
It looks like surplus market calculator cells would be a way to go, some 
wired in parallel for area and some in series for voltage.


Ode



At 12:12 PM 7/30/2007 -0500, you wrote:


Morning Dan,

 At 08:08 AM 7/30/2007, you wrote:


 If you are just going for a colloidal silver maker in Iraq, you do not
need batteries.  There is plenty of reliable sun.  You just need a solar 
cell and a current limit circuit.

   Likely this application needs the smallest solar charger in the world.

   It sure seems like a Near nothing solar panel.

I would guess, 2 X 2 inches or 3 X 3 inches at most.

I read some of the articles (  links on this list, I think ) about home 
built solar panels.


Even in the primitive countries they could come up with the materials. 
Plus, charity groups make regular donations for some causes.Average 
income per person is $ 20.00 per year, or less.


What surprised me, is that there are a few knowledgeable and educated 
people in these countries.  I feel sure many of them help the ones that 
are not.


The batteries will just cause more expense and they will probably be 
taken out for  a more important purpose, like powering up the walkman or 
whatever they use these days...


  Yes, I agree.  Not sure why the person wants to integrate the CS power 
with other more complex and powerful applications.


If he is going to distill water, he must have a reasonable decent and 
powerful solar cooker.  These have been in the evolution stage now for 
many years so proven ideas exist.


I found several small solar panels but they are too expensive for the 
primitive countries.


Wayne





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Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[CWFugitt]

Leslie,

At 09:20 AM 7/31/2007, you wrote:

what about a solar water distiller?


Solar Heaters and Solar Cookers are a different world from Solar Panels 
that produce voltage to use or charge batteries.


You can make a solar cooker from a cardboard box and tinfoil.

Mirrors, glass, and other materials make better ones.

Don't confuse the two.

Solar Panels ( chargers ) , depending on size, are relatively expensive.

Wayne



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Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[Ode Coyote]

  DC/DC voltage doublers have been around for a long time.
Neat trick, but they eat more power than just using 2 batteries to get that 
voltage.

The only advantage is space savings.

 A couple of 6 volt bicycle generators for lights will do the job nicely 
and are not uncommon in the third world already.
Some vanes attached to the spokes made out of old plastic bottles , tin 
cans or pieces of bark, sit bike upside down facing the wind...windmill.


Ode


At 10:21 AM 7/29/2007 +0900, you wrote:

I'm thinking of a 4-9V rechargeable Nicad setup.  A custom solar charger 
to hold 4 9-V batteries might do the job nicely.   If the same device had 
a switch to go from charging to output that would be neat.
It could have a simple built-in constant current controller and heavy-duty 
alligator clips.


The idea would be to give these devices away through some existing, 
trustworthy agency, so the cost would have to be very modest, especially 
because the few people involved in this have no funding at present.


SOTA Instruments has a patented method to turn the output of one 9-V 
battery into 36 volts in their low-cost Silver Pulser Lite.I think 
that device is constant current also.


We'd not be aiming to do blood electrification, though, just make the EIS, 
and at $110, the Lite would be much too Heavy (expensive, that is.)


The 4-9 plan might be cheaper and easier but I'm no engineer and am not 
sure.   Bottom line, though:  I am pretty sure the idea is workable, and 
could alleviate some of the misery the invasion and occupation have produced.



JBB



On Saturday, Jul 28, 2007, at 23:34 Asia/Tokyo, mborg...@att.net wrote:


What about using solar powered batteries?



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RE: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[Dan Nave]

 If you are just going for a colloidal silver maker in Iraq, you do not
need batteries.  
There is plenty of reliable sun.  You just need a solar cell and a
current limit circuit.

The batteries will just cause more expense and they will probably be
taken out for 
a more important purpose, like powering up the walkman or whatever they
use 
these days...

Dan

-Original Message-
From: Jonathan B. Britten [mailto:jbrit...@cc.nakamura-u.ac.jp] 
Sent: Saturday, July 28, 2007 11:23 PM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

Maybe simple is best.  You can't get simpler than four 9-V ni-cad solar
rechargeable batteries.

The only really desirable addition would be the electronics to produce
automatic shutoff and  constant current.

Constant current, in my personal experience, makes a big difference.  
Without that, there's a sudden surge  that produces a big cloud of
particles before the device shuts off.




On Sunday, Jul 29, 2007, at 11:44 Asia/Tokyo, CWFugitt wrote:

 Keep in mind that near 100% of such devices have an overhead and a 
 direct effect on efficiency.


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Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[Sandee George]

Hi There Wayne - would you please let me know where you found the solar
panels for
powering EIS makers - very interested as an alternative to no electricty
- I make my own
makers so this would be a great thing to have for the future !
Thanks 
Sandee

Peace is easy ... it is a Mindset

Yours :
I found several small solar panels but they are too expensive for the 
primitive countries.
 
Wayne


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RE: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[CWFugitt]

Morning Dan,

 At 08:08 AM 7/30/2007, you wrote:


 If you are just going for a colloidal silver maker in Iraq, you do not
need batteries.  There is plenty of reliable sun.  You just need a solar 
cell and a current limit circuit.

   Likely this application needs the smallest solar charger in the world.

   It sure seems like a Near nothing solar panel.

I would guess, 2 X 2 inches or 3 X 3 inches at most.

I read some of the articles (  links on this list, I think ) about home 
built solar panels.


Even in the primitive countries they could come up with the 
materials.  Plus, charity groups make regular donations for some 
causes.Average income per person is $ 20.00 per year, or less.


What surprised me, is that there are a few knowledgeable and educated 
people in these countries.  I feel sure many of them help the ones that are 
not.


The batteries will just cause more expense and they will probably be taken 
out for  a more important purpose, like powering up the walkman or 
whatever they use these days...


  Yes, I agree.  Not sure why the person wants to integrate the CS power 
with other more complex and powerful applications.


If he is going to distill water, he must have a reasonable decent and 
powerful solar cooker.  These have been in the evolution stage now for many 
years so proven ideas exist.


I found several small solar panels but they are too expensive for the 
primitive countries.


Wayne





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Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[Richard]

Dan , today OXFAM produced a report stating that the Iraqi Govt ( a  
creation of the US Govt )  is failing to provide water, food ,  
sanitation and shelter  for 8 ( EIGHT ) MILLION people - every single  
day.  I doubt that powering up a walkman  or whatever they use these  
days  is on the top of their priority list but it is a happy thought  
- thanks- Richard

On 30/07/2007, at 15:08, Dan Nave wrote:

 If you are just going for a colloidal silver maker in Iraq, you do  
not

need batteries.
There is plenty of reliable sun.  You just need a solar cell and a
current limit circuit.

The batteries will just cause more expense and they will probably be
taken out for
a more important purpose, like powering up the walkman or whatever  
they

use
these days...

Dan

-Original Message-
From: Jonathan B. Britten [mailto:jbrit...@cc.nakamura-u.ac.jp]
Sent: Saturday, July 28, 2007 11:23 PM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

Maybe simple is best.  You can't get simpler than four 9-V ni-cad  
solar

rechargeable batteries.

The only really desirable addition would be the electronics to produce
automatic shutoff and  constant current.

Constant current, in my personal experience, makes a big difference.
Without that, there's a sudden surge  that produces a big cloud of
particles before the device shuts off.




On Sunday, Jul 29, 2007, at 11:44 Asia/Tokyo, CWFugitt wrote:


Keep in mind that near 100% of such devices have an overhead and a
direct effect on efficiency.



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RE: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[Dan Nave]

I am speaking from experience...

Dan 

-Original Message-
From: Richard [mailto:r...@xxicenturysilver.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 30, 2007 1:39 PM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

Dan , today OXFAM produced a report stating that the Iraqi Govt ( a
creation of the US Govt )  is failing to provide water, food ,
sanitation and shelter  for 8 ( EIGHT ) MILLION people - every single
day.  I doubt that powering up a walkman  or whatever they use these
days  is on the top of their priority list but it is a happy thought
- thanks- Richard
On 30/07/2007, at 15:08, Dan Nave wrote:

  If you are just going for a colloidal silver maker in Iraq, you do 
 not need batteries.
 There is plenty of reliable sun.  You just need a solar cell and a 
 current limit circuit.

 The batteries will just cause more expense and they will probably be 
 taken out for a more important purpose, like powering up the walkman 
 or whatever they use these days...

 Dan



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Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[CWFugitt]

Evening Sandee,

At 12:12 PM 7/30/2007, you wrote:

This one would fit in the shirt pocket or purse.  It would charge a battery 
also.


Rechargeable batteries come in 1000 sizes today.  Many are shirt pocket size.

Remember you need sunshine.  Some parts of the midwest have little 
sun.  Recently there has been little sun over much of the USA.


Some low cost units here.
http://shopping.msn.com/results/shp/?bcatId=10576,page=4


Small, Special Purpose Units, higher in cost.
http://www.kaboodle.com/kateshaffer/a-wishlist-2-fun-little-stuff.html

  I make my own makers so this would be a great thing to have for the 
future !


You may or may not need a very small unit.  I have several that are 12 X 12 
inches.


They come in a huge variety of Voltages, Wattages, and current outputs.
Most of the small ones have no circuitry to regulate battery charge current,

The output of the unit balances out with the internal resistance of the 
battery and generally does very well in this respect.


Unless you plan to transport it in the purse, back pack, or survival bag, 
you likely do not need a miniature panel.


Look and Search as thousands exist.  Likely one from $ 15.00 to $ 50.00 
will fill the bill.


The Local AC power is less trouble, as long as it is there.  For 
emergencies, your thinking is in order.

Lugging about gallons of distilled water is not so easy.

Wayne





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Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[Jonathan B. Britten]

This is the reason any effort can help.  Dr. Jones' solar stoves can 
cook food, sterilize water, and maybe make distiller water for EIS, 
with a few adaptations.   One stove could help several families.   It 
would be a start.   He's donating the stoves, but in time we'll have up 
a PayPal site for donations to pay for packing and shipping.


Oxfam also says that Bush's new Executive Order is scaring the hell out 
of charitable groups;  the man says he can seize the assets of anyone 
hindering reconstruction.   If a decent group like OXFAM is worried, 
that's worrisome.





On Tuesday, Jul 31, 2007, at 03:39 Asia/Tokyo, Richard wrote:

Dan , today OXFAM produced a report stating that the Iraqi Govt ( a 
creation of the US Govt )  is failing to provide water, food , 
sanitation and shelter  for 8 ( EIGHT ) MILLION people - every single 
day.



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Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[mborgert]

What about using solar powered batteries?

-- Original message --
From: Jonathan B. Britten jbrit...@cc.nakamura-u.ac.jp

 List,
 
 I am discussing an interesting idea with the inventor of an effective 
 solar stove, which might be adapted for rapid water distillation.
 
 My idea is to make an integrated unit (preferably with a solar-powered 
 generator)  to make EIS for use by the millions of Iraqi refugees, who 
 generally have no access to medical care, antibiotics, and so forth.
 
 It seems to me that generators could be mass-produced at very, very low 
 cost.  Features like stirring, automatic cutoff, and so on, would not 
 be crucial, I think.
 
 The idea would be to make a very rugged, simple unit that could be 
 distributed for free, with manufacture and distribution subsidized by 
 benefactors, whether wealthy large-scale donors or ordinary folks 
 making PayPal contributions.
 
 Any advice or offers of help would be welcome.
 
 
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Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[Meggan Gaumer]

I love the idea...cant wait to hear more

On 7/27/07, Jonathan B. Britten jbrit...@cc.nakamura-u.ac.jp wrote:
 List,

 I am discussing an interesting idea with the inventor of an effective
 solar stove, which might be adapted for rapid water distillation.

 My idea is to make an integrated unit (preferably with a solar-powered
 generator)  to make EIS for use by the millions of Iraqi refugees, who
 generally have no access to medical care, antibiotics, and so forth.

 It seems to me that generators could be mass-produced at very, very low
 cost.  Features like stirring, automatic cutoff, and so on, would not
 be crucial, I think.

 The idea would be to make a very rugged, simple unit that could be
 distributed for free, with manufacture and distribution subsidized by
 benefactors, whether wealthy large-scale donors or ordinary folks
 making PayPal contributions.

 Any advice or offers of help would be welcome.


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-- 
Meg'gan Gaumer
food for thought:
'Happiness is nothing more than good health and a bad memory.'
-Albert Schweitzer

'The cell is immortal. It is merely the fluid in which it floats that
degenerates.'
-Dr. Alexis Carrel, Nobel Prize winner

'The countless names of illnesses do not really matter.  What does
matter is that they all come from the same root cause...too much
tissue acid waste in the body!'
-Theodore A. Baroody, N.D., D.C., Ph.D.

'There are two paths you can go by, but in the long run, you still
have time to change the road you're on.'
-Led Zeppelin

Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[Jonathan B. Britten]

I'm thinking of a 4-9V rechargeable Nicad setup.  A custom solar 
charger to hold 4 9-V batteries might do the job nicely.   If the same 
device had a switch to go from charging to output that would be neat.  
It could have a simple built-in constant current controller and 
heavy-duty alligator clips.


The idea would be to give these devices away through some existing, 
trustworthy agency, so the cost would have to be very modest, 
especially because the few people involved in this have no funding at 
present.


SOTA Instruments has a patented method to turn the output of one 9-V 
battery into 36 volts in their low-cost Silver Pulser Lite.I think 
that device is constant current also.


We'd not be aiming to do blood electrification, though, just make the 
EIS, and at $110, the Lite would be much too Heavy (expensive, that is.)


The 4-9 plan might be cheaper and easier but I'm no engineer and am not 
sure.   Bottom line, though:  I am pretty sure the idea is workable, 
and could alleviate some of the misery the invasion and occupation have 
produced.



JBB



On Saturday, Jul 28, 2007, at 23:34 Asia/Tokyo, mborg...@att.net wrote:


What about using solar powered batteries?



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Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[CWFugitt]

Evening JBB,

SOTA Instruments has a patented method to turn the output of one 9-V 
battery into 36 volts in their low-cost Silver Pulser Lite.I think that 
device is constant current also.


Keep in mind that near 100% of such devices have an overhead and a direct 
effect on efficiency.


In a very low current application they might be acceptable.

Inverter systems also have a loss of efficiency.
Watts used to Watts Out.  Nothing is 100%

Most will range from 65 % to a higher number, 80 to 85 %.
This will depend on loading.

Wayne







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Re: CSGenerators for Iraqi Refugees

[Jonathan B. Britten]

Maybe simple is best.  You can't get simpler than four 9-V ni-cad solar 
rechargeable batteries.


The only really desirable addition would be the electronics to produce 
automatic shutoff and  constant current.


Constant current, in my personal experience, makes a big difference.  
Without that, there's a sudden surge  that produces a big cloud of 
particles before the device shuts off.





On Sunday, Jul 29, 2007, at 11:44 Asia/Tokyo, CWFugitt wrote:

Keep in mind that near 100% of such devices have an overhead and a 
direct effect on efficiency.



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Re: CSGenerators

[M1marine]

_http://www.padrak.com/beck/CSMANUAL.html_ 
(http://www.padrak.com/beck/CSMANUAL.html)
_http://www.lwpub.com/downloads/CS_archives/make_a_silver_generator.html_ 
(http://www.lwpub.com/downloads/CS_archives/make_a_silver_generator.html) 



** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

Re: CSGenerators

[ccdirectt]

I have the same one.No regrets here.I make about 2
gal. a month.





 

Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. 
Try the free Yahoo! Mail Beta.
http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/mailbeta/features_spam.html


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Re: CSGenerators

[Jodi W Menard]

Hi Seth - I just love the
Silver Puppy. But I don't think it can make a gallon at a time. Maybe
a half gallon, but I make a mayonnaise jar at a time. I make between 1
and 14 batches a week and the thing just runs and runs and runs without
any problems. Plus, I've only had to buy new silver electrodes (only
$15.00) one time in the (approximately) 5 years since I bought it.
[grin] I'm a very happy customer. Jodi

seth sato wrote on 3/5/2007, 11:47 AM:



  I was curious about various machines
to produce C's and wanting to know what people recommend. 
  
  
  





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RE: CSgenerators

[Ivan Anderson]

Yes I was chuffed, Tracy, and yes, all you need really is to 'up-scale' your
generator. I can supply you with silver strip of the appropriate lengths.

Talk to you soon.

Ivan.

 -Original Message-
 From: Nick Grant [mailto:nwgr...@inet.net.nz]
 Sent: Wednesday, 22 August 2001 15:00
 To: silver-list@eskimo.com
 Subject: CSgenerators


 Hi all you committed, eager to share your knowledge people -

 please help me - I want to build a bigger generator.  I need a few clear
 instructions as I am not tech. minded.

 At present I make 500 mls a time, warm the water initially, and leave to
 cool stir occasionally, and leave for 1 and a half hours.  This all works
 well - but I want to make more at one time.

 If I went to say a 2 litre container, do my rods need to be
 longer, how long
 do I leave the CS to brew, etc, etc

 Any helpful hints would be very much appreciated.

 Also, IVAN - do you sell CS generators that make about 2 litres - or do I
 just need, as mentioned above, to by longer wires from you?
 Could I pay you
 to make me one?  I will see what response I get from this and how easy it
 is, I will be in contact soon anyways.]

  THANKS GUYS FOR ALL CARING ABOUT ME IN THE EARTHQUAKE - GRIN  I didn't
 even know about it till someone mentioned it. I live in the South
 Island, Ivan lives in the North - he is much closer to the site
 of the quake
 than we are they sure are scary things wherever you are!  I
 think it was
 really nice that someone cared enough to enquire of Ivan - I am
 sure he was
 quite chuffed!

 Tracy



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Re: CSgenerators

[Robert L. Berger]

Hi  Tracy;

If you want to do four times the voume of water then have four times the amount
of wet silver and four times the current.

Making CS does scale up.

Ole Bob




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Re: CSgenerators

[Brickeyk]

In a message dated 8/21/2001 9:27:55 PM Pacific Daylight Time, 
nwgr...@inet.net.nz writes:


 Please help me - I want to build a bigger generator.  I need a few clear
 

I doubled my production by adding a second 16 ounce container complete with a 
silver wire and a stainless wire.  I connected it in parallel using two wires 
with alligator clips bought at Radio Shack.  I am sure that my 30 VDC wall 
adapter has enough capacity to have four containers all connected, if not I 
could add a second wall adapter.  I also power individual stirring motors in 
both containers all connected to a wall adapter except I connect them in 
series to slow down the motors.
Brickey

Re: CSgenerators

[Robert L. Berger]

Hi Brickey,

You are corrct. Just make sure that the silver wires and connectedto the
positive lead of your supply. If not you will not make CS.  You 30
ma.wall transformer is big enough for four 16 oz cells.

I hope that you have a meter in the circuit so you can know what is
going on.

Ole Bob

brick...@aol.com wrote:

 In a message dated 8/21/2001 9:27:55 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
 nwgr...@inet.net.nz writes:



 Please help me - I want to build a bigger generator.  I need a few
 clear
 instructions as I am not tech. minded

 I doubled my production by adding a second 16 ounce container complete
 with a
 silver wire and a stainless wire.  I connected it in parallel using
 two wires
 with alligator clips bought at Radio Shack.  I am sure that my 30 VDC
 wall
 adapter has enough capacity to have four containers all connected, if
 not I
 could add a second wall adapter.  I also power individual stirring
 motors in
 both containers all connected to a wall adapter except I connect them
 in
 series to slow down the motors.
 Brickey

Re: CSgenerators

[Roger Barker]

Hi all you committed, eager to share your knowledge people -

please help me - I want to build a bigger generator.  I need a few clear
instructions as I am not tech. minded.

At present I make 500 mls a time, warm the water initially, and leave to
cool stir occasionally, and leave for 1 and a half hours.  This all works
well - but I want to make more at one time.

If I went to say a 2 litre container, do my rods need to be longer, how long
do I leave the CS to brew, etc, etc

Any helpful hints would be very much appreciated.


THANKS GUYS FOR ALL CARING ABOUT ME IN THE EARTHQUAKE - GRIN  I didn't
even know about it till someone mentioned it. I live in the South
Island, Ivan lives in the North - he is much closer to the site of the quake
than we are they sure are scary things wherever you are!  I think it was
really nice that someone cared enough to enquire of Ivan - I am sure he was
quite chuffed!

Tracy

I'm with you on this one Tracy as I'd like to make larger quantities.

Nice to hear of peoples concern re the quake. I'm living in the countryside
a few miles from Rotorua and we get a bit of action from time to time. A
year or so ago we had a 4.9 with the epicentre just over a kilometre away.
Pity I wasn't into making CS then as it would have saved me buying a
stirring device.  :-)

Roger B

RE: CSGenerators and Methods

[Ivan Anderson]

James,

http://www.belmarpharmacy.com/aurasol/aurasol.html

Scroll down to Reference Library.

Cheers Mate,
Ivan.

 -Original Message-
 From: James Osbourne, Holmes [mailto:a...@cybermesa.com]
 Sent: Tuesday, 10 July 2001 14:08
 To: silver-list@eskimo.com
 Subject: RE: CSGenerators and Methods
 
 
 Hi Chip,
 
 Can you remember any pointers to the gold/IQ study?
 
 James-Osbourne: Holmes
 


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Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Leo Keaveney]

Hi all,
Thank you Roger.

Leo
- Original Message -
From: rogalt...@aol.com
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 8:22 PM
Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods


 In a message dated 7/8/01 12:34:20 PM EST, leo.keave...@oceanfree.net
writes:

  Subj: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
  Date:  7/8/01 12:34:20 PM EST
  From:  leo.keave...@oceanfree.net (Leo Keaveney)
  Reply-to:  silver-list@eskimo.com
  To:silver-list@eskimo.com

  Hi all,
  Roger, have you had any experiences resulting from your use of
  Colloidal Gold, if so, will you share them with us please.

  Leo 

 Leo: I have very little experience. Check Ole Bob's posts on this subject
 roughly 3-4 months ago. Roger


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RE: CSGenerators and Methods

[Ode Coyote]

  I've found thet if the water is too hot, it will make a golden CS.
 About 80 to 110F degrees seems to be the magic range.
 Ken

At 05:57 PM 7/8/01 -0400, you wrote:
I made CS one night with distilled water boiling it on the stove and then 
making it with a Beck purifier for 30 minutes. I set it in the fridge and 
the next morning it was gold.

Good, Bad or A okay?

LLB
Raji

-Original Message-
From:  rogalt...@aol.com [SMTP:rogalt...@aol.com]
Sent:  Sunday, July 08, 2001 3:22 PM
To:silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject:   Re: CSGenerators and Methods

In a message dated 7/8/01 12:34:20 PM EST, leo.keave...@oceanfree.net 
writes:

 Subj: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
 Date:  7/8/01 12:34:20 PM EST
 From:  leo.keave...@oceanfree.net (Leo Keaveney)
 Reply-to:  silver-list@eskimo.com
 To:silver-list@eskimo.com

 Hi all,
 Roger, have you had any experiences resulting from your use of
 Colloidal Gold, if so, will you share them with us please.

 Leo 

Leo: I have very little experience. Check Ole Bob's posts on this subject
roughly 3-4 months ago. Roger


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Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Chip Hoyle]

Leo,

I am currently using colloidal gold.  I used for about a month several months
ago.  It cost so much that I had to gather together all of the stuff to generate
it myself.
I have found that the most profound effect is on my mood.  I seems to keep me
happy and stress free.  I have less anxietyand worry.  My memory seems to be
improving as well.  I can't address the long term effects at this poin, as I've
only been taking it again for about a month.

Check out Bill Fernalds site www.colloidalgold.com for more information.  I
thought that many of the benefits attributed to the use of gold must be
marketing, but Bill offered those on the list a 50% off deal and I decided to
try a couple of bottles.  I liked the effects so much I decided to make my own.

Chip Hoyle

Leo Keaveney wrote:

 Hi all,
 Roger, have you had any experiences resulting from your use of
 Colloidal Gold, if so, will you share them with us please.

 Leo
 - Original Message -
 From: rogalt...@aol.com
 To: silver-list@eskimo.com
 Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 1:19 PM
 Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods

  In a message dated 7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST, liat...@flash.net writes:
 
   Subj: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
   Date:  7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST
   From:  liat...@flash.net (brooks bradley)
   Reply-to:  silver-list@eskimo.com
   To:silver-list@eskimo.com

 
  Thanks Brooks for your most valuable post. Your quantified results confirm
  what most of us have (has? -- where's Marshalee when we need her)
 suspected
  for quite some time. However, there are at least two remaining questions
 that
  are of great interest. So if you're ready to answer them I would be most
  grateful.
 
  1. The primary reason I use HVAC instead of current controlled LVDC is
 that
  the HVAC product ALWAYS has an indefinite shelf life whereas the current
  controlled LVDC CS product has a shelf life that appears to be highly
  dependent on the skill of the operator. Some claim their CS has an
 indefinite
  shelf life (Ivan, for example), but others, myself included, get much more
  modest stabilities. Care to comment?
 
  2. The HVAC process appears, under certain circumstances (using a
 colloidal
  gold setup, for example), to have the capability of making a form of CS
  that is almost totally particulate as opposed to the normal form of HVAC
 CS
  which produces almost 100% ionic CS. Have you tested the efficacy of
 these
  two types of products using in vivos and/or in vitro methods?
 
  Thanks, Roger
 
 
  --
  The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver.
 
  To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to:
  silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com  -or-  silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com
  with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line.
 
  To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com
  Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html
  List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
 
 

Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Ode Coyote]

 Storing cold too fast tends to make the CS change color even to a murkey
violet.
Ken


At 10:20 PM 7/8/01 EDT, you wrote:
In a message dated 7/8/01 6:33:38 PM EST, bober...@swbell.net writes:

 Roger;
 
 WHY do you boil the water  It is not needed.
 
 The gold color says large particles. Did you continually stir the CS?? If
not
 then you got what you have. Stirrin gis some form is a must.  WQhat di the
 T.E. look like before and after the color change??
 
 I don't know where you got your instructions but go back in to the archives
 and learn something about making CS.
 
 Ole Bob: 

Ole Bob: I didn't do it. I'm innocent, I tell you. I'm innocent! Roger


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Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Marshall Dudley]

I just reviewed that site.  I find one discrepancy though.

The articles the site shows for the efficacy of colloidal gold are using 15 or 
more
mg of gold a day (and a CG of 1000 or higher PPM).  The gold they offer is 10 
ppm.
Thus to duplicate the quantity taken in the studies would require 1.5 liters of
their CG a day which is about 6 bottles costing about $200.

Are there any studies showing an effect at lower dosages?  A teaspoon of 10 ppm 
CS
would be less than 1/1000 of the dosage used in the studies. :  Is there any
evidence that CS made by the arc method is superior to the method used in the
studies?

Marshall

Chip Hoyle wrote:

 Leo,

 I am currently using colloidal gold.  I used for about a month several months
 ago.  It cost so much that I had to gather together all of the stuff to 
 generate
 it myself.
 I have found that the most profound effect is on my mood.  I seems to keep me
 happy and stress free.  I have less anxietyand worry.  My memory seems to be
 improving as well.  I can't address the long term effects at this poin, as 
 I've
 only been taking it again for about a month.

 Check out Bill Fernalds site www.colloidalgold.com for more information.  I
 thought that many of the benefits attributed to the use of gold must be
 marketing, but Bill offered those on the list a 50% off deal and I decided to
 try a couple of bottles.  I liked the effects so much I decided to make my 
 own.

 Chip Hoyle

 Leo Keaveney wrote:

  Hi all,
  Roger, have you had any experiences resulting from your use of
  Colloidal Gold, if so, will you share them with us please.
 
  Leo
  - Original Message -
  From: rogalt...@aol.com
  To: silver-list@eskimo.com
  Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 1:19 PM
  Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
 
   In a message dated 7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST, liat...@flash.net writes:
  
Subj: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
Date:  7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST
From:  liat...@flash.net (brooks bradley)
Reply-to:  silver-list@eskimo.com
To:silver-list@eskimo.com
 
  
   Thanks Brooks for your most valuable post. Your quantified results confirm
   what most of us have (has? -- where's Marshalee when we need her)
  suspected
   for quite some time. However, there are at least two remaining questions
  that
   are of great interest. So if you're ready to answer them I would be most
   grateful.
  
   1. The primary reason I use HVAC instead of current controlled LVDC is
  that
   the HVAC product ALWAYS has an indefinite shelf life whereas the current
   controlled LVDC CS product has a shelf life that appears to be highly
   dependent on the skill of the operator. Some claim their CS has an
  indefinite
   shelf life (Ivan, for example), but others, myself included, get much more
   modest stabilities. Care to comment?
  
   2. The HVAC process appears, under certain circumstances (using a
  colloidal
   gold setup, for example), to have the capability of making a form of CS
   that is almost totally particulate as opposed to the normal form of HVAC
  CS
   which produces almost 100% ionic CS. Have you tested the efficacy of
  these
   two types of products using in vivos and/or in vitro methods?
  
   Thanks, Roger
  
  
   --
   The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver.
  
   To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to:
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   List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
  
  

Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Arthur Rambo]

Chip, when you say that you had to gather all the equipment yourself, do
you mean that a different type of equipment is needed other than the
kind we use for CS? 


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Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Chip Hoyle]

Arthur,

My generator setup for colloidal gold is an an underwater arc powered by a
15kv 60ma neon sign transformer.  I am currently experimenting with
different size batch containers of 1 qt and 1 gal.  I'm not aware of anyone
producing CS by this method.  Ole Bob has tested this method for CS and
gotten very large particles.

I have seen claims that some LVDC generators can produce colloidal gold, and
I do not believe them.  Using 15kv to run the arc it takes about 5 hours or
more produce colloidal gold to a good color (color changes while generating
from violet in low concentration to different shades of blue as it becomes
more concentrated).  I don't know of any other way to make it.  Others may,
and if so please share your process.  Ole Bob is investigating a new
process now, and I'm sure he will share his findings with whomever is
interested.

The generators I have seen that are designed to produce colloidal gold sell
for upwards of $900.  I have invested about $300-$350 in equipment to
produce colloidal gold.

Chip Hoyle


Arthur Rambo wrote:

 Chip, when you say that you had to gather all the equipment yourself, do
 you mean that a different type of equipment is needed other than the
 kind we use for CS?

 --
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 List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com

Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Frank Key]

Chip wrote:


 My generator setup for colloidal gold is an an underwater arc powered by a
 15kv 60ma neon sign transformer. 

I have measured the particle size of the colloidal gold produced using this 
technique. The size of the particles produced is typically 70 -90 nm diameter.

frank key


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Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Chip Hoyle]

I am not aware of any studies using a lower dosage.  If my memory serves me, 
this study
measured increases in IQ over a period of time while using 30mg per day of 
colloidal
gold.

I can not comment on the superiority, or lack thereof, of arc produced 
colloidal gold
vs. any other type.  The arc type is the only type I with which I have had any 
personal
experience.

It is conceivable that one could afford to drink 1.5 liters of CG per day if it 
is made
in quantity at home.  You would have to have lots of spare time to generate it 
though,
as my one gallon batches take about 5 hours to produce.

My own experience with colloidal gold has been positive enough to lead me to 
invest
about $350 in equipment and many late night hours attempting to produce it.

Perhaps all of the effects are due to the placebo effect and I've just blown 
lots of
spare time and 350 bucks!

Comments are welcomed.

Chip Hoyle

Marshall Dudley wrote:

 I just reviewed that site.  I find one discrepancy though.

 The articles the site shows for the efficacy of colloidal gold are using 15 
 or more
 mg of gold a day (and a CG of 1000 or higher PPM).  The gold they offer is 10 
 ppm.
 Thus to duplicate the quantity taken in the studies would require 1.5 liters 
 of
 their CG a day which is about 6 bottles costing about $200.

 Are there any studies showing an effect at lower dosages?  A teaspoon of 10 
 ppm CS
 would be less than 1/1000 of the dosage used in the studies. :  Is there any
 evidence that CS made by the arc method is superior to the method used in the
 studies?

 Marshall

 Chip Hoyle wrote:

  Leo,
 
  I am currently using colloidal gold.  I used for about a month several 
  months
  ago.  It cost so much that I had to gather together all of the stuff to 
  generate
  it myself.
  I have found that the most profound effect is on my mood.  I seems to keep 
  me
  happy and stress free.  I have less anxietyand worry.  My memory seems to be
  improving as well.  I can't address the long term effects at this poin, as 
  I've
  only been taking it again for about a month.
 
  Check out Bill Fernalds site www.colloidalgold.com for more information.  I
  thought that many of the benefits attributed to the use of gold must be
  marketing, but Bill offered those on the list a 50% off deal and I decided 
  to
  try a couple of bottles.  I liked the effects so much I decided to make my 
  own.
 
  Chip Hoyle
 
  Leo Keaveney wrote:
 
   Hi all,
   Roger, have you had any experiences resulting from your use of
   Colloidal Gold, if so, will you share them with us please.
  
   Leo
   - Original Message -
   From: rogalt...@aol.com
   To: silver-list@eskimo.com
   Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 1:19 PM
   Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
  
In a message dated 7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST, liat...@flash.net writes:
   
 Subj: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
 Date:  7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST
 From:  liat...@flash.net (brooks bradley)
 Reply-to:  silver-list@eskimo.com
 To:silver-list@eskimo.com
  
   
Thanks Brooks for your most valuable post. Your quantified results 
confirm
what most of us have (has? -- where's Marshalee when we need her)
   suspected
for quite some time. However, there are at least two remaining questions
   that
are of great interest. So if you're ready to answer them I would be most
grateful.
   
1. The primary reason I use HVAC instead of current controlled LVDC is
   that
the HVAC product ALWAYS has an indefinite shelf life whereas the current
controlled LVDC CS product has a shelf life that appears to be highly
dependent on the skill of the operator. Some claim their CS has an
   indefinite
shelf life (Ivan, for example), but others, myself included, get much 
more
modest stabilities. Care to comment?
   
2. The HVAC process appears, under certain circumstances (using a
   colloidal
gold setup, for example), to have the capability of making a form of 
CS
that is almost totally particulate as opposed to the normal form of HVAC
   CS
which produces almost 100% ionic CS. Have you tested the efficacy of
   these
two types of products using in vivos and/or in vitro methods?
   
Thanks, Roger
   
   
--
The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver.
   
To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to:
silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com  -or-  silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com
with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line.
   
To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com
Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html
List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
   
   

Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Chip Hoyle]

Thanks Frank!

Chip

Frank Key wrote:

 Chip wrote:

  My generator setup for colloidal gold is an an underwater arc powered by a
  15kv 60ma neon sign transformer.

 I have measured the particle size of the colloidal gold produced using this 
 technique. The size of the particles produced is typically 70 -90 nm diameter.

 frank key

 --
 The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver.

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 silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com  -or-  silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com
 with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line.

 To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com
 Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html
 List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com

RE: CSGenerators and Methods

[James Osbourne, Holmes]

Hi Chip,

Can you remember any pointers to the gold/IQ study?

James-Osbourne: Holmes

-Original Message-
From: Chip Hoyle [mailto:cho...@hampsuites.com]
Sent: Monday, July 09, 2001 1:02 PM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods

I am not aware of any studies using a lower dosage.  If my memory serves me,
this study
measured increases in IQ over a period of time while using 30mg per day of
colloidal
gold.

I can not comment on the superiority, or lack thereof, of arc produced
colloidal gold
vs. any other type.  The arc type is the only type I with which I have had
any personal
experience.

It is conceivable that one could afford to drink 1.5 liters of CG per day if
it is made
in quantity at home.  You would have to have lots of spare time to generate
it though,
as my one gallon batches take about 5 hours to produce.

My own experience with colloidal gold has been positive enough to lead me to
invest
about $350 in equipment and many late night hours attempting to produce it.

Perhaps all of the effects are due to the placebo effect and I've just blown
lots of
spare time and 350 bucks!

Comments are welcomed.

Chip Hoyle

Marshall Dudley wrote:

 I just reviewed that site.  I find one discrepancy though.

 The articles the site shows for the efficacy of colloidal gold are using
15 or more
 mg of gold a day (and a CG of 1000 or higher PPM).  The gold they offer is
10 ppm.
 Thus to duplicate the quantity taken in the studies would require 1.5
liters of
 their CG a day which is about 6 bottles costing about $200.

 Are there any studies showing an effect at lower dosages?  A teaspoon of
10 ppm CS
 would be less than 1/1000 of the dosage used in the studies. :  Is there
any
 evidence that CS made by the arc method is superior to the method used in
the
 studies?

 Marshall

 Chip Hoyle wrote:

  Leo,
 
  I am currently using colloidal gold.  I used for about a month several
months
  ago.  It cost so much that I had to gather together all of the stuff to
generate
  it myself.
  I have found that the most profound effect is on my mood.  I seems to
keep me
  happy and stress free.  I have less anxietyand worry.  My memory seems
to be
  improving as well.  I can't address the long term effects at this poin,
as I've
  only been taking it again for about a month.
 
  Check out Bill Fernalds site www.colloidalgold.com for more information.
I
  thought that many of the benefits attributed to the use of gold must be
  marketing, but Bill offered those on the list a 50% off deal and I
decided to
  try a couple of bottles.  I liked the effects so much I decided to make
my own.
 
  Chip Hoyle
 
  Leo Keaveney wrote:
 
   Hi all,
   Roger, have you had any experiences resulting from your use of
   Colloidal Gold, if so, will you share them with us please.
  
   Leo
   - Original Message -
   From: rogalt...@aol.com
   To: silver-list@eskimo.com
   Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 1:19 PM
   Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
  
In a message dated 7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST, liat...@flash.net writes:
   
 Subj: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
 Date:  7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST
 From:  liat...@flash.net (brooks bradley)
 Reply-to:  silver-list@eskimo.com
 To:silver-list@eskimo.com
  
   
Thanks Brooks for your most valuable post. Your quantified results
confirm
what most of us have (has? -- where's Marshalee when we need her)
   suspected
for quite some time. However, there are at least two remaining
questions
   that
are of great interest. So if you're ready to answer them I would be
most
grateful.
   
1. The primary reason I use HVAC instead of current controlled LVDC
is
   that
the HVAC product ALWAYS has an indefinite shelf life whereas the
current
controlled LVDC CS product has a shelf life that appears to be
highly
dependent on the skill of the operator. Some claim their CS has an
   indefinite
shelf life (Ivan, for example), but others, myself included, get
much more
modest stabilities. Care to comment?
   
2. The HVAC process appears, under certain circumstances (using a
   colloidal
gold setup, for example), to have the capability of making a form
of CS
that is almost totally particulate as opposed to the normal form of
HVAC
   CS
which produces almost 100% ionic CS. Have you tested the efficacy
of
   these
two types of products using in vivos and/or in vitro methods?
   
Thanks, Roger
   
   
--
The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal
silver.
   
To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message
to:
silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com  -or-
silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com
with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line.
   
To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com
Silver-list archive:
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List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
   
   

Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Marshall Dudley]

http://colloidalgold.com/today.htm

James Osbourne, Holmes wrote:

 Hi Chip,

 Can you remember any pointers to the gold/IQ study?

 James-Osbourne: Holmes

 -Original Message-
 From: Chip Hoyle [mailto:cho...@hampsuites.com]
 Sent: Monday, July 09, 2001 1:02 PM
 To: silver-list@eskimo.com
 Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods

 I am not aware of any studies using a lower dosage.  If my memory serves me,
 this study
 measured increases in IQ over a period of time while using 30mg per day of
 colloidal
 gold.

 I can not comment on the superiority, or lack thereof, of arc produced
 colloidal gold
 vs. any other type.  The arc type is the only type I with which I have had
 any personal
 experience.

 It is conceivable that one could afford to drink 1.5 liters of CG per day if
 it is made
 in quantity at home.  You would have to have lots of spare time to generate
 it though,
 as my one gallon batches take about 5 hours to produce.

 My own experience with colloidal gold has been positive enough to lead me to
 invest
 about $350 in equipment and many late night hours attempting to produce it.

 Perhaps all of the effects are due to the placebo effect and I've just blown
 lots of
 spare time and 350 bucks!

 Comments are welcomed.

 Chip Hoyle

 Marshall Dudley wrote:

  I just reviewed that site.  I find one discrepancy though.
 
  The articles the site shows for the efficacy of colloidal gold are using
 15 or more
  mg of gold a day (and a CG of 1000 or higher PPM).  The gold they offer is
 10 ppm.
  Thus to duplicate the quantity taken in the studies would require 1.5
 liters of
  their CG a day which is about 6 bottles costing about $200.
 
  Are there any studies showing an effect at lower dosages?  A teaspoon of
 10 ppm CS
  would be less than 1/1000 of the dosage used in the studies. :  Is there
 any
  evidence that CS made by the arc method is superior to the method used in
 the
  studies?
 
  Marshall
 
  Chip Hoyle wrote:
 
   Leo,
  
   I am currently using colloidal gold.  I used for about a month several
 months
   ago.  It cost so much that I had to gather together all of the stuff to
 generate
   it myself.
   I have found that the most profound effect is on my mood.  I seems to
 keep me
   happy and stress free.  I have less anxietyand worry.  My memory seems
 to be
   improving as well.  I can't address the long term effects at this poin,
 as I've
   only been taking it again for about a month.
  
   Check out Bill Fernalds site www.colloidalgold.com for more information.
 I
   thought that many of the benefits attributed to the use of gold must be
   marketing, but Bill offered those on the list a 50% off deal and I
 decided to
   try a couple of bottles.  I liked the effects so much I decided to make
 my own.
  
   Chip Hoyle
  
   Leo Keaveney wrote:
  
Hi all,
Roger, have you had any experiences resulting from your use of
Colloidal Gold, if so, will you share them with us please.
   
Leo
- Original Message -
From: rogalt...@aol.com
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 1:19 PM
Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
   
 In a message dated 7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST, liat...@flash.net writes:

  Subj: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
  Date:  7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST
  From:  liat...@flash.net (brooks bradley)
  Reply-to:  silver-list@eskimo.com
  To:silver-list@eskimo.com
   

 Thanks Brooks for your most valuable post. Your quantified results
 confirm
 what most of us have (has? -- where's Marshalee when we need her)
suspected
 for quite some time. However, there are at least two remaining
 questions
that
 are of great interest. So if you're ready to answer them I would be
 most
 grateful.

 1. The primary reason I use HVAC instead of current controlled LVDC
 is
that
 the HVAC product ALWAYS has an indefinite shelf life whereas the
 current
 controlled LVDC CS product has a shelf life that appears to be
 highly
 dependent on the skill of the operator. Some claim their CS has an
indefinite
 shelf life (Ivan, for example), but others, myself included, get
 much more
 modest stabilities. Care to comment?

 2. The HVAC process appears, under certain circumstances (using a
colloidal
 gold setup, for example), to have the capability of making a form
 of CS
 that is almost totally particulate as opposed to the normal form of
 HVAC
CS
 which produces almost 100% ionic CS. Have you tested the efficacy
 of
these
 two types of products using in vivos and/or in vitro methods?

 Thanks, Roger


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 silver.

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Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[ROGALTMAN]

In a message dated 7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST, liat...@flash.net writes:

 Subj: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
 Date:  7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST
 From:  liat...@flash.net (brooks bradley)
 Reply-to:  silver-list@eskimo.com
 To:silver-list@eskimo.com
  

Thanks Brooks for your most valuable post. Your quantified results confirm 
what most of us have (has? -- where's Marshalee when we need her) suspected 
for quite some time. However, there are at least two remaining questions that 
are of great interest. So if you're ready to answer them I would be most 
grateful.

1. The primary reason I use HVAC instead of current controlled LVDC is that 
the HVAC product ALWAYS has an indefinite shelf life whereas the current 
controlled LVDC CS product has a shelf life that appears to be highly 
dependent on the skill of the operator. Some claim their CS has an indefinite 
shelf life (Ivan, for example), but others, myself included, get much more 
modest stabilities. Care to comment?

2. The HVAC process appears, under certain circumstances (using a colloidal 
gold setup, for example), to have the capability of making a form of CS 
that is almost totally particulate as opposed to the normal form of HVAC CS 
which produces almost 100% ionic CS. Have you tested the efficacy of these 
two types of products using in vivos and/or in vitro methods?

Thanks, Roger   


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Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Leo Keaveney]

Hi Brooks,
   Thank you, it's great to have all this information on one
page.
My experience so far with CS (LVDC) is a year old itch in my groin has
disappeared.
My wife and myself both experienced overall light skin itch, not severe,
after we started drinking CS. This started a it's peak severity and
diminished gradually over a period of about one week. We viewed this itch in
a positive light, an indication that our CS was working and were delighted
with it.


Leo.

- Original Message -
From: brooks bradley liat...@flash.net
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 2:49 AM
Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods


 Dear Leo,
 Since I am sidelined todaywith an aggravation of an
 ancient knee injury (football 1943), I am pandering to a series personal
 biases-and your inquiry has struck another nerve,
 As the bulk of the older  list membership is aware, we have---over
 the past 5 years---invested sizeable effort and resources in evaluating a
 rather wide array of generation techniques for producing acceptable
 colloidal silver solutions.  The principal goal of our endeavors was not
to
 identify  the state-of-the-art protocol, but rather to identify acceptable
 means achievable by the intelligent but untrained individual.to
 economically produce a CS substance yielding results near the middle of
the
 spectrum for proven/measureable CS solutions then extant (RMS nomograms
 derived from CS generated from Current/Voltage controlled variations of
LVDC
 (49VDC AND LESS);  HVDC up to 240 vdc;  half-wave DC, from 60 hz
 source.up to 200 volts;  and HVAC  FROM 5 TO 15 KV).   These data were
 achieved against a variety of some of the more prevalent
 pathogens-of-consequence---both viral and bacterial.
 A brief summary of our data reveals some interesting
information
 including:  (1)  Neither the HVDC or HVAC systems produced a product
 superior enough to the voltage-regulated LVDC (30 to 40 volt
range)..to
 justify (in our view) the additional complications imposed upon the
 technically challenged.  (2)  We were unable to verify ANY effectivity
 advantage of the HVAC/HVDC products over the monitored generation LVDC
 ones..in direct comparison evaluations in vitroexcepting a time
 advantage in favor of the HVAC  (especially in tests involving the more
 virulent viral pathogens).  However, even this advantage, rarely over 2 to
 1, would not seem to be great enough to pre-empt use of LVDC cs in favor
of
 HVAC--for the typical do-it-yourself experimenter.  e.g.  A typical
 comparison was flu virus (several types);  10 min. average for replication
 nullification for HVAC;  18 min. for LVDC.
  In vivo comparisons were so close (due to the problems of
 anecdotal nature of tests) as to  prevent any detectable difference in
 efficacy.
   It is of consequence to mention that all LVDC solutions were
 generated using low-grade instrumentation (e.g.$8.00 DVM., LOW-COST  Reg
DC
 power supplies..less than 50.00).  Evaluations using high-quality,
 lab-grade DC supplies did not improve the product quality.
 The single, most important LVDC parameter revealed to be
the
 current flow both as a determinant of ppm magnitude.and particle
 size.  For  dc voltages at or below 40 vdc,  consequential excursions in
 particle size did not occur until the current level rose beyond 12 MA for
 single element electrodes with 5 wetted exposure...and 20 MA for dual
 element electrodes.  Above these levels the particle size began to rise
 rapidly.sometimes exponentially.   Note:  Scanning Electron Microscopy
 revealed ABSOLUTELY NO comfirmable increase particle size differentiation
 populations between current levels of   .75 MA and  5.65 MA   at regulated
 D.C. voltages (at constant settings) between 30 and 40 vdc.  One other
 anomaly we discovered may serve to precipitate contention/controversy by
 some on the list.  However, we determined---beyond any reasonable
 doubtthat the use of a properly installed aquarium air pump and
bubbler
 to be equal toor superior in some casesto the various stirring
 motor/magnetic stirring techniques employed.  The most simpleand cost-
 effective system we evaluated proved to be one composed of  a small air
pump
 (Aquaculture 10 gallon model) obtained from Walmart for a cost of  about
 $6.00; silicone rubber hose (8' for $1.25);  plus the small, cylindrical,
 ceramic bubble-stone (About $1.00).   This inexpensive system, with the
 bubble-stone placed upon the bottom of either a 32 ounce or 64 ounce glass
 container (Mason jars)---and located between the electrode
 assembliesworks splendidly.  The volume of air is quite large and the
 aggitation achieved is more than adequate for a continual
 mixing/dilution..even for the half-gallon container.   Contenders
 holding this is inferior to low-cost motor-driven stirrers

Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Leo Keaveney]

Hi all,
Roger, have you had any experiences resulting from your use of
Colloidal Gold, if so, will you share them with us please.

Leo
- Original Message -
From: rogalt...@aol.com
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 1:19 PM
Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods


 In a message dated 7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST, liat...@flash.net writes:

  Subj: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
  Date:  7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST
  From:  liat...@flash.net (brooks bradley)
  Reply-to:  silver-list@eskimo.com
  To:silver-list@eskimo.com
   

 Thanks Brooks for your most valuable post. Your quantified results confirm
 what most of us have (has? -- where's Marshalee when we need her)
suspected
 for quite some time. However, there are at least two remaining questions
that
 are of great interest. So if you're ready to answer them I would be most
 grateful.

 1. The primary reason I use HVAC instead of current controlled LVDC is
that
 the HVAC product ALWAYS has an indefinite shelf life whereas the current
 controlled LVDC CS product has a shelf life that appears to be highly
 dependent on the skill of the operator. Some claim their CS has an
indefinite
 shelf life (Ivan, for example), but others, myself included, get much more
 modest stabilities. Care to comment?

 2. The HVAC process appears, under certain circumstances (using a
colloidal
 gold setup, for example), to have the capability of making a form of CS
 that is almost totally particulate as opposed to the normal form of HVAC
CS
 which produces almost 100% ionic CS. Have you tested the efficacy of
these
 two types of products using in vivos and/or in vitro methods?

 Thanks, Roger


 --
 The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver.

 To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to:
 silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com  -or-  silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com
 with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line.

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 Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html
 List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com

Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[brooks bradley]

Dear Roger,
Unfortunately, our controlled/monitored stability tests
were not conducted beyond 60 days.  There was, essentially, no consequential
change (physical or therapeutical) within this time envelopefrom among
any of the samples.
We have conducted no efficacy evaluations based upon
ionic versus particulate population percentages.
 The  principal factor,  recommending. (to us ) HVAC for
commercial endeavors is based on  process control
conveniences/standardizations..expecially for addressing large volume
production.
I must go now.
Sincerely, Brooks.
- Original Message -
From: rogalt...@aol.com
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 7:19 AM
Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods


 In a message dated 7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST, liat...@flash.net writes:

  Subj: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
  Date:  7/7/01 9:13:18 PM EST
  From:  liat...@flash.net (brooks bradley)
  Reply-to:  silver-list@eskimo.com
  To:silver-list@eskimo.com
   

 Thanks Brooks for your most valuable post. Your quantified results confirm
 what most of us have (has? -- where's Marshalee when we need her)
suspected
 for quite some time. However, there are at least two remaining questions
that
 are of great interest. So if you're ready to answer them I would be most
 grateful.

 1. The primary reason I use HVAC instead of current controlled LVDC is
that
 the HVAC product ALWAYS has an indefinite shelf life whereas the current
 controlled LVDC CS product has a shelf life that appears to be highly
 dependent on the skill of the operator. Some claim their CS has an
indefinite
 shelf life (Ivan, for example), but others, myself included, get much more
 modest stabilities. Care to comment?

 2. The HVAC process appears, under certain circumstances (using a
colloidal
 gold setup, for example), to have the capability of making a form of CS
 that is almost totally particulate as opposed to the normal form of HVAC
CS
 which produces almost 100% ionic CS. Have you tested the efficacy of
these
 two types of products using in vivos and/or in vitro methods?

 Thanks, Roger


 --
 The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver.

 To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to:
 silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com  -or-  silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com
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 To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com
 Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html
 List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com

Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[ROGALTMAN]

In a message dated 7/8/01 12:34:20 PM EST, leo.keave...@oceanfree.net writes:

 Subj: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
 Date:  7/8/01 12:34:20 PM EST
 From:  leo.keave...@oceanfree.net (Leo Keaveney)
 Reply-to:  silver-list@eskimo.com
 To:silver-list@eskimo.com
 
 Hi all,
 Roger, have you had any experiences resulting from your use of
 Colloidal Gold, if so, will you share them with us please.
 
 Leo 

Leo: I have very little experience. Check Ole Bob's posts on this subject 
roughly 3-4 months ago. Roger


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Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Wayne Fugitt]

Evening Brooks,

  The  principal factor,  recommending. (to us ) HVAC for
commercial endeavors is based on  process control 
conveniences/standardizations..expecially for addressing large volume 
production.


   I don't want to do large volume or commercial production.  I would 
however like to use the best methods.


Could you please define  HVAC  .. or does it simply mean  High 
Voltage AC.


If so, I normally think of High Voltage as AC voltage from 1000 volts up to 
13,800 Volts.


I have some neon sign transformers in my shop, as well as some 120 input 
and 480 output, and a variety of others.


Of course everything is relative, as in high and low.

Still a bit confused.

Wayne





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Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Robert L. Berger]

Wayne;

On this list HVAC generally means using a 12 kv of 15 kv NST.

From my investigations of HVAC, I have tried the two wet electrodes, the one
wet with the other slightly above the surface of the due so as to form a cone,
an the arc method where the arc electrode is about 0.40 above the DW.

The smallest particle size and most stable is with the arc method. I do not
sell machines. I just investigate and give away CS.

From the T.E.M. the HVAC ARC method also produces a structure in the water.

To use the arc method there are two ways;
1. The arc electrode is a Bosch platinum spark plug and no cover gas. I
personally have not had much success with that although there is a person that
is selling HVAC gens that use it.

2. The use of dry ice in an enclosed chamber with an opening into the free
board above the DW, and using a silver arc electrode. I f you want instructions
just ask.  Without the CO2 one forms whole bunches of NO3, and that is not very
good.

Ole Bob




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RE: CSGenerators and Methods

[Roger Daymude]

I made CS one night with distilled water boiling it on the stove and then 
making it with a Beck purifier for 30 minutes. I set it in the fridge and 
the next morning it was gold.

Good, Bad or A okay?

LLB
Raji

-Original Message-
From:   rogalt...@aol.com [SMTP:rogalt...@aol.com]
Sent:   Sunday, July 08, 2001 3:22 PM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject:Re: CSGenerators and Methods

In a message dated 7/8/01 12:34:20 PM EST, leo.keave...@oceanfree.net 
writes:

 Subj: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
 Date:  7/8/01 12:34:20 PM EST
 From:  leo.keave...@oceanfree.net (Leo Keaveney)
 Reply-to:  silver-list@eskimo.com
 To:silver-list@eskimo.com

 Hi all,
 Roger, have you had any experiences resulting from your use of
 Colloidal Gold, if so, will you share them with us please.

 Leo 

Leo: I have very little experience. Check Ole Bob's posts on this subject
roughly 3-4 months ago. Roger


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Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[ROGALTMAN]

In a message dated 7/8/01 6:12:03 PM EST, r...@midohio.net writes:

 Subj: RE: CSGenerators and Methods
 Date:  7/8/01 6:12:03 PM EST
 From:  r...@midohio.net (Roger Daymude)
 Reply-to:  silver-list@eskimo.com
 To:silver-list@eskimo.com ('silver-list@eskimo.com')
 
 I made CS one night with distilled water boiling it on the stove and then 
 making it with a Beck purifier for 30 minutes. I set it in the fridge and 
 the next morning it was gold.
 
 Good, Bad or A okay?
 
 LLB
 Raji 

Raji: OK, but the particles are on the large side, and apt to grow larger 
over the next few days to weeks. Roger


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Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Robert L. Berger]

Roger;

WHY do you boil the water  It is not needed.

The gold color says large particles. Did you continually stir the CS?? If not
then you got what you have. Stirrin gis some form is a must.  WQhat di the
T.E. look like before and after the color change??

I don't know where you got your instructions but go back in to the archives
and learn something about making CS.

Ole Bob:





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Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Allisons Apothecary]

I've been reading the list lately, and haven't really jumped in a lot because 
I've been away for so long, and I wanted to get a good bearing on what's been 
happening the past year.  It's nice to see that everybody is still in search of 
that ideal solution, and I see that people still think their way of doing it is 
the best.  I just wanted to jump in and say your way may be the best, or it may 
not!

It is my firm belief that almost any kind of colloidal silver is going to be 
beneficial, and it doesn't matter if it's HVAC or LVDC or made in the dark or 
made under a full moon or made with or without stirring.  Who's to say that 
gold colored isn't as good as clear?  Who's to say that LVDC is better than 
HVAC?  Who's to say that stirring is better than air bubbles is better than 
sitting still is better than shaking vigorously ever 2 minutes for 10 seconds?

It is my strong belief (and I base this on no scientific evidence, just a 
logical mind (alright, some may disagree with that logical part, but what the 
heck, I could be delusional from 10 or so years of drinking CS), that gold 
colored CS gives you a bit of a wider spectrum of particle sizes, which may in 
fact, be a good thing.  It might not be, but the point is we don't know for 
sure.  Or do we?  Have you ran the double blinds, and documented the case 
histories?  I haven't.  If anybody has, I would love to see the results.

You could tell me that your way is best because it's helped a lot of people, I 
can say the same about mine, and him over there in the corner could most likely 
say it as well.  I just talked to a customer of mine whose sister has cancer 
and was given two weeks to live, three months ago.  Her sister was put on CS 
made with my generator, and she's doing great (except for a twisted ankle, 
turns out she felt so good one morning, she jumped outa bed to fast and landed 
wrong)!  Does this mean I have the best?  NO!  It simply means that once again, 
colloidal silver came through in a pinch.  I have heard similar stories from 
people who have tried CS made with all sorts of different methods as well!

I guess the point I'm trying to make is that no matter how strongly we believe 
that a certain way is the best, the fact of the matter is that IT'S ALL GOOD 
(well almost, you do need to use a little common sense).  

What we do know, is that in almost all cases, no matter how one makes their CS, 
it is usually beneficial.  So lets not get into a tug of war over methods, and 
just realize that it's all good.  We can make the process as simple or as 
complicated as we want, and still end up happy and healthy.

Do yourself a favor, pick a method and make a batch and drink some, or go to 
your local healthfood store and buy a bottle and drink some.  Did it work?  Do 
you feel better?  Good, I thought you would!

Let's keep searching for the ideal, however, let us not forget that at a base 
level, CS, made almost any way, is going to help.

OMG, now I've done it, I've rambled.  I started this with the intent of one or 
two short sentences, but once again, my fingers have taken on a mind of their 
own.  Such is life.  Please forward all complaints to somebody else, as my 
opinions are my own, and I don't need the negativity :)

Yours in health,
James Allison

RE: CSGenerators and Methods

[JudytheK]

Thanks, James -- I appreciate your thoughts on the subject.
It's actually serious philosophy, even if rambling. Easy does it.
 Amazing how quickly we can get into right-wrongm though.
I am especially fascinated by the ramifications of this stuff for the
pharmaceutical industry, doctors and hospitals.
They could be the buggy-whip manufacturers of tomorrow.
Judy Down Maine
  -Original Message-
  From: Allisons Apothecary [mailto:apothec...@home.com]
  Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 8:00 PM
  To: silver-list@eskimo.com
  Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods


  I've been reading the list lately, and haven't really jumped in a lot
because I've been away for so long, and I wanted to get a good bearing on
what's been happening the past year.  It's nice to see that everybody is
still in search of that ideal solution, and I see that people still think
their way of doing it is the best.  I just wanted to jump in and say your
way may be the best, or it may not!

  It is my firm belief that almost any kind of colloidal silver is going to
be beneficial, and it doesn't matter if it's HVAC or LVDC or made in the
dark or made under a full moon or made with or without stirring.  Who's to
say that gold colored isn't as good as clear?  Who's to say that LVDC is
better than HVAC?  Who's to say that stirring is better than air bubbles is
better than sitting still is better than shaking vigorously ever 2 minutes
for 10 seconds?

  It is my strong belief (and I base this on no scientific evidence, just a
logical mind (alright, some may disagree with that logical part, but what
the heck, I could be delusional from 10 or so years of drinking CS), that
gold colored CS gives you a bit of a wider spectrum of particle sizes, which
may in fact, be a good thing.  It might not be, but the point is we don't
know for sure.  Or do we?  Have you ran the double blinds, and documented
the case histories?  I haven't.  If anybody has, I would love to see the
results.

  You could tell me that your way is best because it's helped a lot of
people, I can say the same about mine, and him over there in the corner
could most likely say it as well.  I just talked to a customer of mine whose
sister has cancer and was given two weeks to live, three months ago.  Her
sister was put on CS made with my generator, and she's doing great (except
for a twisted ankle, turns out she felt so good one morning, she jumped outa
bed to fast and landed wrong)!  Does this mean I have the best?  NO!  It
simply means that once again, colloidal silver came through in a pinch.  I
have heard similar stories from people who have tried CS made with all sorts
of different methods as well!

  I guess the point I'm trying to make is that no matter how strongly we
believe that a certain way is the best, the fact of the matter is that IT'S
ALL GOOD (well almost, you do need to use a little common sense).

  What we do know, is that in almost all cases, no matter how one makes
their CS, it is usually beneficial.  So lets not get into a tug of war over
methods, and just realize that it's all good.  We can make the process as
simple or as complicated as we want, and still end up happy and healthy.

  Do yourself a favor, pick a method and make a batch and drink some, or go
to your local healthfood store and buy a bottle and drink some.  Did it
work?  Do you feel better?  Good, I thought you would!

  Let's keep searching for the ideal, however, let us not forget that at a
base level, CS, made almost any way, is going to help.

  OMG, now I've done it, I've rambled.  I started this with the intent of
one or two short sentences, but once again, my fingers have taken on a mind
of their own.  Such is life.  Please forward all complaints to somebody
else, as my opinions are my own, and I don't need the negativity :)

  Yours in health,
  James Allison

RE: CSGenerators and Methods

[Roger Daymude]

Allison, Ole Bob, Roger and list.

I started out making CS about two years ago. A fellow at one of our 
meetings was selling two 6 silver wires for $3.00. He instructed me to use 
one 9 volt battery and run it in a glass of water until it was cloudy. I 
felt the only good it did for me was when I got ear infections it would get 
rid on them with drops in the ears and nose. After I started candling my 
ears I didn't get ear infections anymore.

After I bought SOTA's blood purifier I started making CS again with it. One 
day I received a news letter in the mail from Health and Awareness.( I 
Think!! ) I think it was from buying the four Beck instruments that I 
received this news letter. It is information about the Beck and Clark 
protocols. They also have a web site. In the last news letter I received 
there was an article about the best way to make CS. Cold distilled water, 
boiled distilled water and making it while the water is boiling. The last 
was the best with the second coming a close second. They did a study on the 
CS's affects on different bacteria and shelf live.

I hadn't heard about stirring CS until I joined this list. So if they 
proved CS is better making it while boiling the distilled water then you 
wouldn't have to stir it.

As far as it turning gold on me, the first time I noticed it was when I 
boiled a quart and ran the CS maker for 1/2 hour and put it into the 
refrigerator. The quart glass was clear and the next morning it was a nice 
gold. Of course I store it in the fridge in a dark bottle. God forbid if 
the light would stay on with the door closed. Hehe  I made a quart of CS 
and 3 parts of water and keep in on the counter for the pets in a solid 
color milk jug. They seem to like drinking it.

So that is where I heard about making CS with hot water. If I can find 
their web site, I'll post it.

LLB
Raji



-Original Message-
From:   Allisons Apothecary [SMTP:apothec...@home.com]
Sent:   Sunday, July 08, 2001 8:00 PM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject:Re: CSGenerators and Methods

  File: ATT9.html  I've been reading the list lately, and haven't 
really jumped in a lot because I've been away for so long, and I wanted to 
get a good bearing on what's been happening the past year.  It's nice to 
see that everybody is still in search of that ideal solution, and I see 
that people still think their way of doing it is the best.  I just wanted 
to jump in and say your way may be the best, or it may not!

It is my firm belief that almost any kind of colloidal silver is going to 
be beneficial, and it doesn't matter if it's HVAC or LVDC or made in the 
dark or made under a full moon or made with or without stirring.  Who's to 
say that gold colored isn't as good as clear?  Who's to say that LVDC is 
better than HVAC?  Who's to say that stirring is better than air bubbles is 
better than sitting still is better than shaking vigorously ever 2 minutes 
for 10 seconds?

It is my strong belief (and I base this on no scientific evidence, just a 
logical mind (alright, some may disagree with that logical part, but what 
the heck, I could be delusional from 10 or so years of drinking CS), that 
gold colored CS gives you a bit of a wider spectrum of particle sizes, 
which may in fact, be a good thing.  It might not be, but the point is we 
don't know for sure.  Or do we?  Have you ran the double blinds, and 
documented the case histories?  I haven't.  If anybody has, I would love to 
see the results.

You could tell me that your way is best because it's helped a lot of 
people, I can say the same about mine, and him over there in the corner 
could most likely say it as well.  I just talked to a customer of mine 
whose sister has cancer and was given two weeks to live, three months ago. 
 Her sister was put on CS made with my generator, and she's doing great 
(except for a twisted ankle, turns out she felt so good one morning, she 
jumped outa bed to fast and landed wrong)!  Does this mean I have the best? 
 NO!  It simply means that once again, colloidal silver came through in a 
pinch.  I have heard similar stories from people who have tried CS made 
with all sorts of different methods as well!

I guess the point I'm trying to make is that no matter how strongly we 
believe that a certain way is the best, the fact of the matter is that IT'S 
ALL GOOD (well almost, you do need to use a little common sense).

What we do know, is that in almost all cases, no matter how one makes their 
CS, it is usually beneficial.  So lets not get into a tug of war over 
methods, and just realize that it's all good.  We can make the process as 
simple or as complicated as we want, and still end up happy and healthy.

Do yourself a favor, pick a method and make a batch and drink some, or go 
to your local healthfood store and buy a bottle and drink some.  Did it 
work?  Do you feel better?  Good, I thought you would!

Let's keep searching for the ideal, however, let us not forget

Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[ROGALTMAN]

In a message dated 7/8/01 6:33:38 PM EST, bober...@swbell.net writes:

 Roger;
 
 WHY do you boil the water  It is not needed.
 
 The gold color says large particles. Did you continually stir the CS?? If not
 then you got what you have. Stirrin gis some form is a must.  WQhat di the
 T.E. look like before and after the color change??
 
 I don't know where you got your instructions but go back in to the archives
 and learn something about making CS.
 
 Ole Bob: 

Ole Bob: I didn't do it. I'm innocent, I tell you. I'm innocent! Roger


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RE: CSGenerators and Methods

[James Osbourne, Holmes]

If I applied your logic to this post, I would ask you to take your
philosophical discussion off-list. I won’t though, because I enjoy the
digressions.

James-Osbourne: Holmes

-Original Message-
From: JudytheK [mailto:apea...@midcoast.com]
Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 6:40 PM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: CSGenerators and Methods

Thanks, James -- I appreciate your thoughts on the subject.
It's actually serious philosophy, even if rambling. Easy does it.
 Amazing how quickly we can get into right-wrongm though.
I am especially fascinated by the ramifications of this stuff for the
pharmaceutical industry, doctors and hospitals.
They could be the buggy-whip manufacturers of tomorrow.
Judy Down Maine
-Original Message-
From: Allisons Apothecary [mailto:apothec...@home.com]
Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 8:00 PM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods
I've been reading the list lately, and haven't really jumped in a lot
because I've been away for so long, and I wanted to get a good bearing on
what's been happening the past year.  It's nice to see that everybody is
still in search of that ideal solution, and I see that people still think
their way of doing it is the best.  I just wanted to jump in and say your
way may be the best, or it may not!

It is my firm belief that almost any kind of colloidal silver is going to be
beneficial, and it doesn't matter if it's HVAC or LVDC or made in the dark
or made under a full moon or made with or without stirring.  Who's to say
that gold colored isn't as good as clear?  Who's to say that LVDC is better
than HVAC?  Who's to say that stirring is better than air bubbles is better
than sitting still is better than shaking vigorously ever 2 minutes for 10
seconds?

It is my strong belief (and I base this on no scientific evidence, just a
logical mind (alright, some may disagree with that logical part, but what
the heck, I could be delusional from 10 or so years of drinking CS), that
gold colored CS gives you a bit of a wider spectrum of particle sizes, which
may in fact, be a good thing.  It might not be, but the point is we don't
know for sure.  Or do we?  Have you ran the double blinds, and documented
the case histories?  I haven't.  If anybody has, I would love to see the
results.

You could tell me that your way is best because it's helped a lot of people,
I can say the same about mine, and him over there in the corner could most
likely say it as well.  I just talked to a customer of mine whose sister has
cancer and was given two weeks to live, three months ago.  Her sister was
put on CS made with my generator, and she's doing great (except for a
twisted ankle, turns out she felt so good one morning, she jumped outa bed
to fast and landed wrong)!  Does this mean I have the best?  NO!  It simply
means that once again, colloidal silver came through in a pinch.  I have
heard similar stories from people who have tried CS made with all sorts of
different methods as well!

I guess the point I'm trying to make is that no matter how strongly we
believe that a certain way is the best, the fact of the matter is that IT'S
ALL GOOD (well almost, you do need to use a little common sense).

What we do know, is that in almost all cases, no matter how one makes their
CS, it is usually beneficial.  So lets not get into a tug of war over
methods, and just realize that it's all good.  We can make the process as
simple or as complicated as we want, and still end up happy and healthy.

Do yourself a favor, pick a method and make a batch and drink some, or go to
your local healthfood store and buy a bottle and drink some.  Did it work?
Do you feel better?  Good, I thought you would!

Let's keep searching for the ideal, however, let us not forget that at a
base level, CS, made almost any way, is going to help.

OMG, now I've done it, I've rambled.  I started this with the intent of one
or two short sentences, but once again, my fingers have taken on a mind of
their own.  Such is life.  Please forward all complaints to somebody else,
as my opinions are my own, and I don't need the negativity :)

Yours in health,
James Allison

Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[brooks bradley]

Dear Wayne,
You are correct that HVAC means High Voltage
AC.   We do not consider any voltage below 5k  to qualify as a high voltage
systemfor CS generation.  If you have workable neon
transformers-almost any will work adequately.especially from 10k and
up.
If you will refer to the Archives, you can find several systems
referred to which work splendidly.
Personally, I prefer the submerged electrode systems because
they are easier to adjust and seem to generate less noxious gas.
I hope this addresses your question sufficiently.
Sincerely,  Brooks Bradley
- Original Message -
From: Wayne Fugitt wa...@fugitt.com
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 2:38 PM
Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods


 Evening Brooks,

The  principal factor,  recommending. (to us ) HVAC for
 commercial endeavors is based on  process control
 conveniences/standardizations..expecially for addressing large volume
 production.

 I don't want to do large volume or commercial production.  I would
 however like to use the best methods.

 Could you please define  HVAC  .. or does it simply mean  High
 Voltage AC.

 If so, I normally think of High Voltage as AC voltage from 1000 volts up
to
 13,800 Volts.

 I have some neon sign transformers in my shop, as well as some 120 input
 and 480 output, and a variety of others.

 Of course everything is relative, as in high and low.

 Still a bit confused.

 Wayne




 --
 The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver.

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 silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com  -or-  silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com
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 Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html
 List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com

Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[Leo Keaveney]

Hi All,
At this time I am unable to afford a HVAC generator and therefore
some innovation is called for.
I made a 175volt DC unit by using voltage doubling electronics (diodes 
capacitors).
When making the CS I clean the negative electrode frequently and stir the
solution in a circular motion.
As the solution saturates with silver and the current rises near 3mA I swap
the positive lead to one with a resistor connected in series.
The electrodes are separated by about 3 apart to keep the current down and
the bubbles on the negative electrode are very small, barely visible.
When I started making CS first I used an air ioniser with the current
limiters shorted out.
This made half a pint of crystal clear CS over a period of about two days,
at first I thought that I had failed to make CS until I measured it's
resistance with an multi meter.
Be careful using a modified air ioniser, my one rectifies the 220V ac mains
voltage supply, then doubles it 14 or 15 times, removing the current
limiting resistors makes it lethal to go near when the power is applied as
the voltage would be in the order of 15,000volts and will arc or leap half
an inch or so, I don't know just how far, I'll probably find out some day
when I'm careless.

Leo

- Original Message -
From: Wayne Fugitt wa...@fugitt.com
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Friday, July 06, 2001 2:58 PM
Subject: CSGenerators and Methods


 Morning Dean,

   You're treating CS as if it were a medicine.  It's not.

 Thanks for making that so clear.   Generally, I think as you do, but
 still like to see other peoples methods.

 I have been using CS for about two years.  In my realm of friends and
 enemies, we have over 100 people locally using it.   I think many of them
 are still confused as to the best methods for use.

 Honestly, I am still a bit confused on the absolute best way to make CS.
I
 have made it with several generators,
 and a variety of voltages from batteries.

 The highest voltage I have used is 75 Volts DC.  The longest time interval
 has been 4 hours, but not with the
 75 VDC.

 I would be interested  what others consider the very best generator, time
 intervals, ppm,  use of saline, ect.

 Wayne





 --
 The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver.

 To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to:
 silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com  -or-  silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com
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 List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com

Re: CSGenerators and Methods

[brooks bradley]

 detailed examination, we found it an obvious conclusion
that a commercial producer would be well-served to utilize HVAC
methodologies for product preparation...but found no such compelling
reason for the average do-it-yourselfer.
Sincerely,
Brooks Bradley


 Original Message -
From: Leo Keaveney leo.keave...@oceanfree.net
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Friday, July 06, 2001 6:48 PM
Subject: Re: CSGenerators and Methods


 Hi All,
 At this time I am unable to afford a HVAC generator and therefore
 some innovation is called for.
 I made a 175volt DC unit by using voltage doubling electronics (diodes 
 capacitors).
 When making the CS I clean the negative electrode frequently and stir the
 solution in a circular motion.
 As the solution saturates with silver and the current rises near 3mA I
swap
 the positive lead to one with a resistor connected in series.
 The electrodes are separated by about 3 apart to keep the current down
and
 the bubbles on the negative electrode are very small, barely visible.
 When I started making CS first I used an air ioniser with the current
 limiters shorted out.
 This made half a pint of crystal clear CS over a period of about two days,
 at first I thought that I had failed to make CS until I measured it's
 resistance with an multi meter.
 Be careful using a modified air ioniser, my one rectifies the 220V ac
mains
 voltage supply, then doubles it 14 or 15 times, removing the current
 limiting resistors makes it lethal to go near when the power is applied as
 the voltage would be in the order of 15,000volts and will arc or leap half
 an inch or so, I don't know just how far, I'll probably find out some day
 when I'm careless.

 Leo

 - Original Message -
 From: Wayne Fugitt wa...@fugitt.com
 To: silver-list@eskimo.com
 Sent: Friday, July 06, 2001 2:58 PM
 Subject: CSGenerators and Methods


  Morning Dean,
 
You're treating CS as if it were a medicine.  It's not.
 
  Thanks for making that so clear.   Generally, I think as you do, but
  still like to see other peoples methods.
 
  I have been using CS for about two years.  In my realm of friends and
  enemies, we have over 100 people locally using it.   I think many of
them
  are still confused as to the best methods for use.
 
  Honestly, I am still a bit confused on the absolute best way to make CS.
 I
  have made it with several generators,
  and a variety of voltages from batteries.
 
  The highest voltage I have used is 75 Volts DC.  The longest time
interval
  has been 4 hours, but not with the
  75 VDC.
 
  I would be interested  what others consider the very best generator,
time
  intervals, ppm,  use of saline, ect.
 
  Wayne
 
 
 
 
 
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  The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver.
 
  To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to:
  silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com  -or-  silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com
  with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line.
 
  To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com
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  List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
 
 

RE: CSGenerators and Methods

[JudytheK]

Wayne, please clarify on your comment that CS is not a medicine.
Is this merely samantics? I took some for a bad cough of 2
months' duration (probably mold/fungus kinda thing) and I was
cured within 3 hours. Surely that was used medicinally.
Isn't the purpose the deciding factor?
It can be a preventive, a cleanser, a biocide, a medicine,
a supplement ...etc.


-Original Message-
From: Wayne Fugitt [mailto:wa...@fugitt.com]
Sent: Friday, July 06, 2001 9:59 AM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: CSGenerators and Methods


Morning Dean,

  You're treating CS as if it were a medicine.  It's not.

Thanks for making that so clear.   Generally, I think as you do, but
still like to see other peoples methods.

I have been using CS for about two years.  In my realm of friends and
enemies, we have over 100 people locally using it.   I think many of them
are still confused as to the best methods for use.

Honestly, I am still a bit confused on the absolute best way to make CS.  I
have made it with several generators,
and a variety of voltages from batteries.

The highest voltage I have used is 75 Volts DC.  The longest time interval
has been 4 hours, but not with the
75 VDC.

I would be interested  what others consider the very best generator, time
intervals, ppm,  use of saline, ect.

Wayne





--
The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver.

To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to:
silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com  -or-  silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com
with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line.

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List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com

RE: CSGenerators and Methods

[Wayne Fugitt]

Wayne, please clarify on your comment that CS is not a medicine.


  That was Dean that said that, not me.


Is this merely samantics? I took some for a bad cough of 2
months' duration (probably mold/fungus kinda thing) and I was
cured within 3 hours.


   Of course, I have heard similar statements many times.


Surely that was used medicinally.
Isn't the purpose the deciding factor?
It can be a preventive, a cleanser, a biocide, a medicine,
a supplement ...etc.


   Seems one of the old proverbs, states.

One mans medicine is another mans poison.  or.. similar.

What about this one.

Let thy food be thy medicine and thy medicine be thy food. Hippocrates

I consider water a medicine, and virtually everything else I eat.

Wayne

Re: CSGenerators, Current regulation, etc

[Ivan Anderson]

Hi Trem,

Thanks.
I stand by what I said.
Current density is found by the  expression: I(Amps) / A(mm2) =
Amps per square millimetre.
One can lessen the current density by either increasing the
electrode area or decreasing the current, both have the same
result.
Which method one chooses has to do with the relationship one
desires in total current vs resistance vs voltage.
As for current density vs particle size... I believe silver is
stripped from the anode and enters the water as single ions no
matter what the current, whatever causes aggregation occurs after
this.

Ivan

 Hello Ivan,

 Well said.  I guess the only thing I might disagree with is the
electrode
 surface area not being a function of particle size.  My feeling
is that if
 the current density is high, the particle size increases
because the ions
 are being more forcibly ripped off the electrode.  It rings
true with me and
 is borne out in my experiments that more surface area makes
better CS if the
 current is held low.  That's why I originally chose to use flat
electrodes
 in order to get more surface area.  The current density theory
mentioned by
 Bob Lee about starved electrodes makes it ring more true.

 I hope we're getting to the end of this discussion.  It's like
the blind
 guys trying to describe the elephant without being able to see
the whole
 thing.

 Trem

 - Original Message -
 From: Ivan Anderson i...@win.co.nz
 To: silver-list@eskimo.com
 Sent: Friday, August 06, 1999 4:11 AM
 Subject: CSGenerators, Current regulation, etc


 
  I notice the discussion of current regulation, electrode
geometry
  etc.
  Here is my 2 cents worth.
  Every one is correct in this discussion as far as they go.
  All generators work in exactly the same manner, that is
sintering
  silver atoms from the anode (positive electrode), and all
produce
  perfectly good CS within certain boundaries and limits.
 
  The difference in generators is really in the ease of use and
the
  concentration they are able to produce.
 
  The simple 3 or 4 battery method has the advantage of short
  generation time, but requires constant attention (stirring,
  electrode wiping etc.). these generators produce fine CS in
the 5
  to 10 ppm range. The conductivity of the water past this
range
  allows too high a current flow, and that coupled with a quite
  high voltage causes a high particle mobility. The consequence
of
  this is that many particles contact the cathode (negative
  electrode) and are reduced to the residue or treeing we see.
This
  residue enevitably finds its way into the solution which
results
  in the cloudy, dark and unstable colloid we see many
questions
  about.
  Hot water limits these factors to some extent, mainly by the
  convection currents in the water mixing the silver plume
through
  out the solution.
 
  Constant current (current limiting) generators over come many
of
  the problems described above by limiting the current to a
value,
  where the number of particles coming off the anode is not so
  great that they cannot be spread throughout the solution
before
  they meet the cathode. As the resistance in the solution
falls
  (with the introduction of silver particles) in this type of
  generator, the voltage drops and therefore so does the
particle
  mobility. This is a most beneficial set of circumstances. The
  more particles there are in the water, the less energy they
have
  in movement, and the less likely they are to be reduced at
the
  cathode and the less energy do they have to overcome
  electrostatic repulsion when they encounter each other. As
long
  as the voltage stays above about 1V the generator will
continue
  to disassociate silver ions from the anode.
  These generators can produce clear or light yellow colloid to
  high concentration (10 ppm +), but are more technical and
  expensive to implement, and require more time to generate a
given
  concentration.
 
  The pulsed generators and polarity switching generators can
be
  thought of as current limiting hybrids and seem to exhibit
many
  of their positives and negatives.
 
  Low voltage generators (9 to 15volt) are very simple to
implement
  and also display the positives of current limit devices, due
to
  the slow manner in which they dissasociate the anode into the
  water, but above a certain point they behave like the higher
  voltage units. Good up to about 15ppm. Long generating time.
 
  Electrode configuration and crossection affect CS generation
only
  in as much as they have an influence on the maximum current
draw,
  and the distance the silver ions have to travel before they
meet
  the cathode. An arrangement that is constant in geometry will
  have reproducable results.
 
  Particle size is a much discussed and overly emphasised part
of
  CS generation. Particle size, as determined by colour, is
  effective from clear through yellow-green, yellow and gold.
The
  range is apparently 1nm to 15nm (.001micron  to .015micron)
  and, as you can see, the 

Re: CSGenerators, Current regulation, etc

[CARMEN SPENCE]

Hullow Ivan,

Thanks for the information, can yiou tell me the differences between your cs
machine and Jims?Carmen
- Original Message -
From: Ivan Anderson i...@win.co.nz
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Friday, August 06, 1999 9:11 PM
Subject: CSGenerators, Current regulation, etc



 I notice the discussion of current regulation, electrode geometry
 etc.
 Here is my 2 cents worth.
 Every one is correct in this discussion as far as they go.
 All generators work in exactly the same manner, that is sintering
 silver atoms from the anode (positive electrode), and all produce
 perfectly good CS within certain boundaries and limits.

 The difference in generators is really in the ease of use and the
 concentration they are able to produce.

 The simple 3 or 4 battery method has the advantage of short
 generation time, but requires constant attention (stirring,
 electrode wiping etc.). these generators produce fine CS in the 5
 to 10 ppm range. The conductivity of the water past this range
 allows too high a current flow, and that coupled with a quite
 high voltage causes a high particle mobility. The consequence of
 this is that many particles contact the cathode (negative
 electrode) and are reduced to the residue or treeing we see. This
 residue enevitably finds its way into the solution which results
 in the cloudy, dark and unstable colloid we see many questions
 about.
 Hot water limits these factors to some extent, mainly by the
 convection currents in the water mixing the silver plume through
 out the solution.

 Constant current (current limiting) generators over come many of
 the problems described above by limiting the current to a value,
 where the number of particles coming off the anode is not so
 great that they cannot be spread throughout the solution before
 they meet the cathode. As the resistance in the solution falls
 (with the introduction of silver particles) in this type of
 generator, the voltage drops and therefore so does the particle
 mobility. This is a most beneficial set of circumstances. The
 more particles there are in the water, the less energy they have
 in movement, and the less likely they are to be reduced at the
 cathode and the less energy do they have to overcome
 electrostatic repulsion when they encounter each other. As long
 as the voltage stays above about 1V the generator will continue
 to disassociate silver ions from the anode.
 These generators can produce clear or light yellow colloid to
 high concentration (10 ppm +), but are more technical and
 expensive to implement, and require more time to generate a given
 concentration.

 The pulsed generators and polarity switching generators can be
 thought of as current limiting hybrids and seem to exhibit many
 of their positives and negatives.

 Low voltage generators (9 to 15volt) are very simple to implement
 and also display the positives of current limit devices, due to
 the slow manner in which they dissasociate the anode into the
 water, but above a certain point they behave like the higher
 voltage units. Good up to about 15ppm. Long generating time.

 Electrode configuration and crossection affect CS generation only
 in as much as they have an influence on the maximum current draw,
 and the distance the silver ions have to travel before they meet
 the cathode. An arrangement that is constant in geometry will
 have reproducable results.

 Particle size is a much discussed and overly emphasised part of
 CS generation. Particle size, as determined by colour, is
 effective from clear through yellow-green, yellow and gold. The
 range is apparently 1nm to 15nm (.001micron  to .015micron)
 and, as you can see, the difference is slight. All exhibit very
 good stability and antimicrobial proterties.

 Ivan






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Re: CSGenerators, Current regulation, etc

[Ivan Anderson]

 Hullow Ivan,

 Thanks for the information, can yiou tell me the differences
between your cs
 machine and Jims?Carmen

Sorry Carmen,
Its not really my place to tell you about Jims machine.
I shall contact you off list.

sincerely
Ivan


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Re: CSGenerators, Current regulation, etc

[Marshall Dudley]

I agree with everthing you said but the following.

Ivan Anderson wrote:

 Particle size is a much discussed and overly emphasised part of
 CS generation. Particle size, as determined by colour, is
 effective from clear through yellow-green, yellow and gold. The
 range is apparently 1nm to 15nm (.001micron  to .015micron)
 and, as you can see, the difference is slight. All exhibit very
 good stability and antimicrobial proterties.

 Ivan

I do not believe that particle size is being overly emphasised.  If we
assume that the effectiveness of the colloid is proportional to the number
of particles (a logical assumption with most of the assumed methods of
operation), then the .001 micron particle size colloid will have 3375 as
many particles per ounce as .015 micron particle size colloid.  That would
translate into an effectiveness that is over 1000 as much for the same ppm.
If this is valid then I believe that the particle size is being under
empahsised if anything.

Marshall


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Re: CSGenerators, Current regulation, etc

[Trem Williams]

Hello Ivan,

Well said.  I guess the only thing I might disagree with is the electrode
surface area not being a function of particle size.  My feeling is that if
the current density is high, the particle size increases because the ions
are being more forcibly ripped off the electrode.  It rings true with me and
is borne out in my experiments that more surface area makes better CS if the
current is held low.  That's why I originally chose to use flat electrodes
in order to get more surface area.  The current density theory mentioned by
Bob Lee about starved electrodes makes it ring more true.

I hope we're getting to the end of this discussion.  It's like the blind
guys trying to describe the elephant without being able to see the whole
thing.

Trem

- Original Message -
From: Ivan Anderson i...@win.co.nz
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Friday, August 06, 1999 4:11 AM
Subject: CSGenerators, Current regulation, etc



 I notice the discussion of current regulation, electrode geometry
 etc.
 Here is my 2 cents worth.
 Every one is correct in this discussion as far as they go.
 All generators work in exactly the same manner, that is sintering
 silver atoms from the anode (positive electrode), and all produce
 perfectly good CS within certain boundaries and limits.

 The difference in generators is really in the ease of use and the
 concentration they are able to produce.

 The simple 3 or 4 battery method has the advantage of short
 generation time, but requires constant attention (stirring,
 electrode wiping etc.). these generators produce fine CS in the 5
 to 10 ppm range. The conductivity of the water past this range
 allows too high a current flow, and that coupled with a quite
 high voltage causes a high particle mobility. The consequence of
 this is that many particles contact the cathode (negative
 electrode) and are reduced to the residue or treeing we see. This
 residue enevitably finds its way into the solution which results
 in the cloudy, dark and unstable colloid we see many questions
 about.
 Hot water limits these factors to some extent, mainly by the
 convection currents in the water mixing the silver plume through
 out the solution.

 Constant current (current limiting) generators over come many of
 the problems described above by limiting the current to a value,
 where the number of particles coming off the anode is not so
 great that they cannot be spread throughout the solution before
 they meet the cathode. As the resistance in the solution falls
 (with the introduction of silver particles) in this type of
 generator, the voltage drops and therefore so does the particle
 mobility. This is a most beneficial set of circumstances. The
 more particles there are in the water, the less energy they have
 in movement, and the less likely they are to be reduced at the
 cathode and the less energy do they have to overcome
 electrostatic repulsion when they encounter each other. As long
 as the voltage stays above about 1V the generator will continue
 to disassociate silver ions from the anode.
 These generators can produce clear or light yellow colloid to
 high concentration (10 ppm +), but are more technical and
 expensive to implement, and require more time to generate a given
 concentration.

 The pulsed generators and polarity switching generators can be
 thought of as current limiting hybrids and seem to exhibit many
 of their positives and negatives.

 Low voltage generators (9 to 15volt) are very simple to implement
 and also display the positives of current limit devices, due to
 the slow manner in which they dissasociate the anode into the
 water, but above a certain point they behave like the higher
 voltage units. Good up to about 15ppm. Long generating time.

 Electrode configuration and crossection affect CS generation only
 in as much as they have an influence on the maximum current draw,
 and the distance the silver ions have to travel before they meet
 the cathode. An arrangement that is constant in geometry will
 have reproducable results.

 Particle size is a much discussed and overly emphasised part of
 CS generation. Particle size, as determined by colour, is
 effective from clear through yellow-green, yellow and gold. The
 range is apparently 1nm to 15nm (.001micron  to .015micron)
 and, as you can see, the difference is slight. All exhibit very
 good stability and antimicrobial proterties.

 Ivan






 --
 The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver.

 To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to:
 silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com  -or-  silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com
 with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line.

 To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com

 List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net





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To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: 
silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com  

Re: CSGenerators, Current regulation, etc

[Marshall Dudley]

Trem Williams wrote:

 Hello Ivan,

 Well said.  I guess the only thing I might disagree with is the electrode
 surface area not being a function of particle size.  My feeling is that if
 the current density is high, the particle size increases because the ions
 are being more forcibly ripped off the electrode.  It rings true with me and
 is borne out in my experiments that more surface area makes better CS if the
 current is held low.  That's why I originally chose to use flat electrodes
 in order to get more surface area.  The current density theory mentioned by
 Bob Lee about starved electrodes makes it ring more true.

 I hope we're getting to the end of this discussion.  It's like the blind
 guys trying to describe the elephant without being able to see the whole
 thing.

Apparently there is a difference between the LVDC and HVAC method.  The particle
size increases when the electrode area increases in the HVAC process.  I believe
that the sputtering of the particles is accomplished primarily by OH radicals in
the LVDC process and by free electrons in the HVAC process.  This might account
for the apparently opposite effects.

Marshall



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Re: CSGenerators, Current regulation, etc

[ZARKON7L]

Hi,

I new to the list and notice that several of you manufature generators of 
various types. Some of you have web pages. Would everyone who has a web page 
concerned with CS please post it so I can keep them on file? 

Thanks allot.

Jim Wright


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Re: CSGenerators, Current regulation, etc

[James Allison]

 I new to the list and notice that several of you manufature generators of
 various types. Some of you have web pages. Would everyone who has a web
page
 concerned with CS please post it so I can keep them on file?

I am willing to put a link to every colloidal silver generator manufacturer
(who desires to be listed) on my WebPages.  The only prerequisite I have is
that the manufacturer needs to have been in business for at least a year.
The link will be at...

http://apothecary.hypermart.net/cs-links.htm

Just private email me at apothec...@home.com to have your site listed.  As
soon as I get around to it (probably a month or so), a randomizer script
will be added so each time the links page is pulled up, it will show those
listed in a different order so that no favoritism will be shown.

Yours in health,
James Allison

Allisons Apothecary
http://apothecary.hypermart.net
Home of the $49.95 Colloidal Silver Generator




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