Re: Softimage mailing list: 2019 by the numbers

[Graham Bell]

it was March 2014 that the announcement was made, so it will be 6 years
this coming March.

On Tue, Jan 14, 2020 at 9:31 AM Jordi Bares  wrote:

> Thanks Matt, 5 years then.
>
> On 13 Jan 2020, at 22:40, Matt Lind  wrote:
>
> The announcement was 5 years ago, going on 6. Not 8 years.
> Matt
> Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2020 11:19:14 + From: Jordi Bares
> jordiba...@gmail.com Subject: Re: Softimage mailing list: 2019 by the
> numbers To: "Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
> Regarding your question, I am also interested, it has been more than 8
> years since the announcement so it is quite telling there are still artists
> using it. XSI was so freaking good!
> jb
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Re: Improving Maya.... - no seriously :)

[Graham Bell]

Nothing that new really, this has been around for years, easily 5 if I
recall.

It used be known as Small Annoying Things and the Big Ideas. Max also had
the same.
On Tue, 5 Jun 2018 at 16:08, Andres Stephens  wrote:

>
>
> Sounds like they got nervous from the speed and community development of
> Blender and their development methodologies.
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__blender.community_c_rightclickselect_&d=DwIFaQ&c=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA&r=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA&m=W0Wk_nBr_TVq8WppCFTEzB0VpbRR1QrLgGs3tr0wMNk&s=7PFi5diJHquiw6DojLpHufuWBGgFHdrP6n1nHfNjnMM&e=
> 
>
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__developer.blender.org_&d=DwIFaQ&c=76Q6Tcqc-t2x0ciWn7KFdCiqt6IQ7a_IF9uzNzd_2pA&r=GmX_32eCLYPFLJ529RohsPjjNVwo9P0jVMsrMw7PFsA&m=W0Wk_nBr_TVq8WppCFTEzB0VpbRR1QrLgGs3tr0wMNk&s=UIVTKTMUeGxH7JLSy1xZIQRcjCN8mxSsbBp-cEtgMBY&e=
> 
>
>
>
>
> -Draise
>
>
> --
> *From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com <
> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com> on behalf of Morten Bartholdy <
> x...@colorshopvfx.dk>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, June 5, 2018 8:09:23 AM
> *To:* Userlist, Softimage
> *Subject:* Improving Maya - no seriously :)
>
>
> So I stumbled over this one via the XSI group on FB – worth a shot if it
> can make our lives a bit easier along the way.
>
> https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/maya-ideas/idb-p/968/tab/popular
> 
>
> https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/maya-ideas/idb-p/968/tab/most-recent
> 

RE: Any Dinosaurs Still Lurking?

[Graham Bell]

Yep I still lurk.

Have been on this list and its bloodline since ‘96

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
 On Behalf Of Robert Cole
Sent: 22 May 2018 17:55
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Any Dinosaurs Still Lurking?

 

Yes, sill here, forced to work in MAX for real-time asset baking and industrial 
animations, but I get to sneak over into XSI world when nobody's looking to do 
the serious work that can be ported back to MAX. Luckily I can work from my 
studio in Hawaii most the time.

Robert

 

 

On 5/11/2018 6:23 AM, Bradley Gabe wrote:

Just curious?

Now that I’m a resident in San Antonio, I was reminiscing about old SIGGRAPHs 
on the Riverwalk, and came to the realization that the Softimage mailing lists, 
for me at least, were my Facebook before there was official social media.

San Antonio still owes me a camera! -- Softimage Mailing List. To 
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subject, and reply to confirm.

  

 


  

 

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RE: XSI licenses

[Graham Bell]

My AD knowledge has expired, but I recall a couple of years ago this came up 
and at that time I asked an Autodesk legal counsel, the reply I received was 
that, it was Autodesk's belief that their current Transfer of License Policy is 
compatible with the UsedSoft case. Therefore customers were advised to follow 
the Transfer of License policy.

 

This may still be the case but this was at least 2 years ago now, so I would 
advise contacting AD, if possible or your nearest AD channel partner for more 
information.

 

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Rob Wuijster
Sent: 05 July 2017 10:17
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: XSI licenses

 

If you live in the EU, I think this still counts:
http://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=d1ff4369-afcc-4879-97fa-7a8afd8b3380

Rob
 
\/-\/\/

On 5-7-2017 11:00, Morten Bartholdy wrote:

Last time I heard you have not been able to sell/transfer licenses since 
shortly after the Autodesk aquisition since they only license the right to use 
their property, you no longer own the software, hence you can't sell it.
 
We purchased our last (I guess) Softimage license last year, having to go for a 
Entertainment Creation Suite since they no longer were selling Softimage 
separately. Perhaps ask AD for that.
 
Good luck with it.
 
Morten
 
 
 

Den 4. juli 2017 klokken 10:39 skrev Patrick Neese  
 :
 
 
Anyone respond to this? What do licenses go for now days from private
individuals, with transfer/reassignment costs from autodesk?
 
On Jun 27, 2017 3:22 PM, "Michael Amasio"   
 wrote:
 

Bump on this...
Is anyone bowing out of the Softimage arena and would like to kindly sell
their license?
I'm finally in a position that I can force it's use in a studio.
I've been hammering AD about buying some licenses but they're being AD.
 
Let me know.
 
Michael
 
 
 
On Fri, Jun 16, 2017 at 1:25 PM, Sven Constable  
 
wrote:
 

Someone told me or maybe I read on the list here, that you can buy a
license from someone else and have AD to register you as the new owner and
issue a new license file. I also wanted to have one more seat but didn't
find anyone willing to sell me their *precious* XSI license. :) I would ask
AD about the procedure. I think it's not different from giving the same
costumer a new license file.
 
Or did you mean to just access (use) a license from another place? It's
possible to access flexlm from the outside.
 
 
 
Sven
 
 
 
*From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
  [mailto:
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
 ] *On Behalf Of *Steve Parish
*Sent:* Friday, June 16, 2017 5:15 PM
*To:* Softimage
*Subject:* XSI licenses
 
 
 
This inquiry is more whimsical probably at this stage but I was wondering
if it was still possible to transfer a Softimage license to someone /
somewhere else?
 
 
 
There are just a couple of tools I'd love to use on a project and my
request for Houdini isn't being heard...
 
 
 
Thanks
 
 
 
Steve_P
 
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RE: CAD files from rhino

[Graham Bell]

We use the npower plugins, converting rhino to Max files which then have a 
modifier applied in the stack. We’ve tried others but npower seem to work best 
for us, and we work with a lot of CAD, often 1000’s of files

 

We’ve used STEP a lot, but am now looking at using JT instead.

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Eugene Flormata
Sent: 13 June 2017 19:34
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list 

Subject: Re: CAD files from rhino

 

oo thx for the heads up and the offer,

yea the files arn't big for rhino or simlab. just MOI
but if anything huge comes up that chokes those, I'll have to keep an eye open

 

On Tue, Jun 13, 2017 at 7:50 AM, Jonathan Moore mailto:jonathan.moo...@gmail.com> > wrote:

I’ve got another solution that isn’t as cheap as MOI but one that copes well 
with massive CAD assets.

 

Modo and Power Translators in combination.

 

Modo is now available as a rental ($599 per annum) but comes with a fully 
functional 30 day demo and you can get a demo license from Integrity-ware 
directly for Power Translators, just be sure you ask for the Modo version of 
Power Translators.

 

https://www.npowersoftware.com/NewContact.html

 

Really powerful combination that’s especially effective on massive CAD models 
with lots of components. It’s no magic button but the options aren’t complex, 
just be thoughtful about the available options.

 

If you get the demo’s more than happy to help you out with the available 
options. Or if you have an asset your client is happy to pass on to a third 
party, more than happy to test here as I run both Modo and Power Translators. 
At least this way you won’t waste any more time learning and testing new tools.

 

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RE: CAD files from rhino

[Graham Bell]

If you’re exporting the data as a STEP or JT file, then once it’s been meshed 
then it’s probably better to fix that mesh in Max/Maya/whatever. Not much point 
going back to Rhino, although sometimes though mesh normal appear fixed, 
they’ve shown up in renders and we’ve had to go back to Rhino.

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Eugene Flormata
Sent: 08 June 2017 23:29
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list 

Subject: Re: CAD files from rhino

 

yeah it's a step file

whoops, I'm exporting out to polymesh, fbx. from a step file.
even if I re-import the mesh back into rhino, and try to clean the non-manifold 
vertices the mesh normals get all messed up



On Thu, Jun 8, 2017 at 3:26 PM, Graham Bell mailto:bell...@gmail.com> > wrote:

STEP file or maybe a JT file?

 

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RE: CAD files from rhino

[Graham Bell]

STEP file or maybe a JT file?

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Eugene Flormata
Sent: 08 June 2017 22:47
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: CAD files from rhino

 

does anyone know how to export from rhino, nurb meshes that don't have 
non-manifold vertices?

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Re: Getting close to a 3 year old EOL annyversary

[Graham Bell]

I agree with Matt, I'm not sure we'll see a new player come into the market
now. Anything new will be plugin-ish based and will solve a specific
problem that everyone has. That's how the best ones have become successful.

I think the key thing for me, is what's the next generation step for the
current crop of DCC's like Max, Maya, et al.
Maya is approaching being 20 years old, XSI would have been close behind if
it had continued. Both of those are now older than their predecessors were,
when they were first released.
Will there be a big paradigm shift or a next generation of product with a
new name etc? I'm not sure we will now.



On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 9:20 AM Sebastien Sterling <
sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Make dcc great ag ...
>
> On 2 Mar 2017 05:50, "Gregor Punchatz"  wrote:
>
> Not that AD would ever revive XSI, but if they did I know that we at ASC
> would buy a few cuts.  I am using my copy to use do crowd work as I type
> this.
>
> G
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 1, 2017 at 1:35 PM Sven Constable 
> wrote:
>
> Didn't want to sound flippant, that was most likely due to my bad english.
> :)
> It was just the newest production I found on the roll and I thought is was
> worth mentioning.  I know that Lightwave was also a player in TV series and
> got famous for beeing in that area. Maybe it's still active there.
>
> Can we just agree that Lightwave is dead?
>
>
>
> *From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Jonathan Moore
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 01, 2017 10:04 PM
>
>
> *To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list
> *Subject:* Re: Getting close to a 3 year old EOL annyversary
>
>
>
> Thank you for correcting me and pointing that out. Lightwave was used in
> many productions, like  "The Force Awakens" in  2015 and many more.
>
>
>
> Now, now, no need to be flippant. :)
>
>
>
> That's actually why I made reference to the TV stuff we all know to be
> factual like Battlestar Galactica, 24, Lost, all the Star Trek TV stuff
> etc, etc. Not bad for a product that failed to penetrate it's target market.
>
>
>
> On 1 March 2017 at 20:46, Sven Constable  wrote:
>
> Thank you for correcting me and pointing that out. Lightwave was used in
> many productions, like  "The Force Awakens" in  2015 and many more.
>
>
>
> *From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Jonathan Moore
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 01, 2017 9:28 PM
>
>
> *To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list
> *Subject:* Re: Getting close to a 3 year old EOL annyversary
>
>
>
> I just wanted to say that it's more likely that AD revives XSI, than
> Newtek will gain substantial grounds with Lightwave. :)
>
>
>
> That's maybe a little unfair to lil' old Lightwave considering XSI is not
> only dead but long since become one with the daisies. Lightwave to it's
> credit still draws breath and I'd be pretty proud of being behind the DCC
> that was the primary technology used on so many well known FX driven TV
> shows through the nineties and noughties. Surely you reached that part of
> the wiki page to read the roll call.
>
>
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LightWave_3D
>
>
>
> On 1 March 2017 at 19:42, Sven Constable  wrote:
>
> I just wanted to say that it's more likely that AD revives XSI, than
> Newtek will gain substantial grounds with Lightwave. :)
> Personally, I would like to see Lightwave raise from the dead even I never
> worked with it. The first time I heard of it was ,when its was called a
> "video toaster addon" for the amiga system and the last time was when it
> was used on Seaquest. There was more, as I just found out on Wikipedia.
> I honour the work Newtek put into it. But it didn't play a mayor role in
> the business it was targeted for. Even 10 years ago.
>
>
>
> *From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [
> mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
> ] *On Behalf Of *Jonathan Moore
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 01, 2017 8:12 PM
>
>
> *To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list
> *Subject:* Re: Getting close to a 3 year old EOL annyversary
>
>
>
> ..talk about intuition
>
> ;)
>
>
>
> On 1 March 2017 at 19:09, Olivier Jeannel  wrote:
>
> Hey I loved Lightwave ! I made incredible stuff all alone with it  back in
> the days (incredible at my level, of course)
>
> I just quited it,  I knew it would soon die or not evolve much (the
> separated modeler and animation layout).
>
> I had the strong feeling that investing in XSI was the definitive next
> move.
>
> ..talk about intuition
>
>
>
> 2017-03-01 18:56 GMT+01:00 Sven Constable :
>
> Talking about the undead…it's not impossible AD will revive Softimage. Ok,
> very unlikely looking at ADs policy when a software was killed, it's
> killed. When Houdini grows even stronger and the whole proc

Re: Opinion gathering

[Graham Bell]

I don't know, I'm well out of the loop now.And any knowledge I did have has
probably expired by now.

I'd be surprised if was to be chopped. Just look at the public records and
you'll see that it makes alot of money.
Look at their folio and offerings, maybe AD are doing a reshuffle both with
people and product. Is Mudbox officially dead? Mobu has a core and niche
userbase. Do people still invest in Flames anymore?

On Mon, Feb 20, 2017 at 2:02 AM Eugene Flormata  wrote:

> On Sun, Feb 19, 2017 at 5:40 AM, Graham Bell  wrote:
>
>
> Regarding AD though, kinda hard to measure right now. I don’t hear many
> positive vibes. More recent cuts and layoffs including Eddie Perberg, the
> Max product manager. Even with my understanding it seems bizarre.
>
>
>
>
>
> does that mean max is next on the chopping block?
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Re: Maya

[Graham Bell]

I don't think people put a gun to the guys head, it was all part of the
campaign that was running at the time. The general consensus was that the
axe had already been wielded and fallen on Softimage and this was just lip
service. But that wasn't the case, from my knowledge anyway. At that moment
in time, there was some good intention to push the product forward in order
to properly find it's place. I'm sure some people may have read between the
lines, but internally myself and others still believed there was a future.

The problem was the timeline of events has they unfolded.
The video and event was done for launching the 2014 product line in March
2013, but also around this time there was a management change, from that
changes happened and the EOL announcement was made, more or less a year
after Daniel had said it was ok. Personally and imo, I don't believe there
was ever an intention to deliberately mislead people, but certainly the
timeline can make it look that way. People can choose to believe that or
not.



On Mon, Feb 20, 2017 at 10:45 AM Andi Farhall  wrote:

> Yes, it probably was unprofessional for which I apologise. It was an
> offhand remark made after a few beers on a Saturday.  So probably not the
> best time to be posting.
>
>
> I might point out that the individuals who made him go on camera and tell
> everyone it was going to be fine when they had no intention of it being so
> were also being unprofessional.
>
>
> But I still apologise for the remark.
> --
> *From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com <
> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com> on behalf of Sven Constable <
> sixsi_l...@imagefront.de>
> *Sent:* 18 February 2017 18:30:42
>
> *To:* 'Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list'
> *Subject:* RE: Maya
>
>
> I would like to see the list staying professional as it was through the
> years. This was inappropiate.
>
>
>
> Sven
>
> *From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Andi Farhall
> *Sent:* Saturday, February 18, 2017 7:09 PM
> *To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list
> *Subject:* Re: Maya
>
>
>
> a face only a mother could love
>
>
>
>
>
> ...
>
> http://www.hackneyeffects.com/
>
> https://vimeo.com/user4174293
>
> http://www.linkedin.com/pub/andi-farhall/b/496/b21
>
>
>
>
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lord_hackney/
> http://spylon.tumblr.com/
>
>
>
> This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended
> solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any views or
> opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily
> represent those of Hackney Effects Ltd.
>
> If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you must neither take
> any action based upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone.
>
> Please contact the sender if you believe you have received this email in
> error.
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> 
> --
>
> *From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com <
> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com> on behalf of Tenshi Sama <
> tenshi...@gmail.com>
> *Sent:* 18 February 2017 12:05:14
> *To:* Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list
> *Subject:* Re: Maya
>
>
>
> :(
>
> https://youtu.be/WcDn8gVPY_8
>
>
>
> On Sat, Feb 18, 2017 at 1:22 AM, Andrew Prostrelov 
> wrote:
>
> > Just another day in the wonderful world of Maya...
>
> totally agree.
> The same stuff all over internet.
> Every one in a pain of Maya "great" UI design, legacy crap and bugs all
> over the place.
>
>
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>
>
>
> --
>
> Diseñador 3D/Multimedia
> web: https://tenshi.carbonmade.com
> # Cel/Whatsapp: (+593) 0984104698 <+593%2098%20410%204698>
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RE: Opinion gathering

[Graham Bell]

 

I had so many troubles with CAD data I really can’t say it is easier at all… 
From complex file formats from various vendors, standards like STEP that 
produces humongous files and the end result of advanced NURBS it is really not 
fun to deal with. I ended up using Rhino to have an export but I don’t 
understand how does not come as standard tool in 3D packages (and specially 
Maya given its connection with AD product line). -  Again, may be I am missing 
something here regarding CAD data..

 

 

*   I know what you mean, we do predominantly automotive, so we work a lot 
with CAD. STEP is a format we use a lot, especially with interop. Maya can take 
STP but only if you install Direct Connect that originally came from Alias. AD 
have appeared to replace that with some new file format translation stuff and 
removed (bizarrely) some export capability. But anyway, we don’t take STEPs 
into Maya/Max, we go through Rhino to clean it, we even wrote a Shotgun 
integration. Rhino is great, very very stable. But we have a bunch of tools 
that allows us to batch and process STEP files large and small, so for us we 
can handle CAD very well.

The key with CAD data is how its exported from the source, this can make a big 
difference and if someone receives CAD from a client, this can be where the 
problems start. 

 

 

 

>From what I saw with NEX, seemed to my naked eye (correct me if I am wrong) 
>like little more than the same tools we had for years in XSI (then Softimage) 
>so I was certainly not impressed.

 

Regarding the UV layout, it was bad Graham, very bad… the UVs were unusable 
with bad padding all over, non-coherent results from every iteration of the 
unfold… artifacts on the edges…

 

There were things in NEX that Soft did have, but also things it didn’t. It was 
by far the No.1 modelling plugin toolset for Maya, probably why AD bought it. 
In many Maya users would tell us to simply buy it and implement it properly and 
fully, so they did.

I’ve never minded Maya’s UV editor, but then production wise I’ve had an array 
of additional scripts and tools for it, which is both a plus and minus for Maya.

Out of the box, I’d say that Soft always had the best UV editor. 

 

 

I am sure any package has an audience and if it works for you, great… if you 
can make money out of it… well, that is the trick right?

 

My reasoning is that the things we were doing 6 years ago with Softimage (and 
still today), you can’t do today with Maya, Max or anything other than Houdini… 
and that is hard thing to swallow.

 

I would agree with that. Even now Soft has many things that are better than a 
lot of packages out there. It’s funny seeing the Max guys wax lyrical about the 
Max Creation Graph, which is as blatant a rip-off ICE as you can get. It’s both 
funny and sad seeing Max guys getting excited about doing stuff that we were 
able to do ICE 9 years ago!

 

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RE: Opinion gathering

[Graham Bell]

 

See for yourself...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cYNWzQWeHU 
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cYNWzQWeHU&spfreload=10> &spfreload=10

 

And you will find hundreds of examples that showcase how good Zbrush is on the 
hard surface modelling.

 

*   I’m still not completely convinced tbh. It’s great what people do, but 
for automotive you wouldn’t really do that. We couldn’t work like that and it’s 
actually easier to retopo from the CAD anyway.

 

 

True, Retopo has been improved a lot with the addition of the new tools but UV 
work in Maya was broken last time we used it… 

 

...that was 6 months ago so there wasn’t a lot to celebrate on my corner.

 

I may be missing something… what I have seen so far is small improvements over 
old toolsets but I would love to see advanced bevelling, complex boleans and in 
Maya that prove me wrong.


- I would say the improvements have been significant, but might depend on the 
benchmark they’re marked against. NEX was implemented, then build upon, then 
old legacy removed. Broken is a strong word and not 100% true, but I agree UVs 
still need work, but the nips and tucks they’ve done have been good. Feedback 
from Maya users was generally positive. I haven’t fully looked at Maya 2017 
yet, but comments haven’t been great.

 

 

 

IMHO I am afraid Modo is on a league on its own on all things modelling.

 

*   I would agree a lot with that, but my comparison was against more 
general usage. And for all of Modo’s power, personally I don’t see more 
widespread adoption. I always here of this mass migration away from Max/Maya, 
but I’ve yet to see it. The Foundry have to press a lot harder here. I think 
many just seem to default to Maya or Max.

 

 

Different context, AD has made sure we have to choose.

 

For the studios using Softimage the burden is unavoidable and the costs are now 
with H16 not too dissimilar so I can see a good scenario unfolding.

 

For those using Maya I am not sure, I am inclined to think it would probably 
depend on the work they do vs the costs to produce that work, that will be the 
trigger.

 

Said that, the costs of freelancers, training and adaptation are different so 
as long as there is talent available, this things in on.

 

*   I agree in terms of Soft users and studios, your hand was forced. For 
others, the factors you mention do have a baring and the biggest influence. We 
use mainly Max, which I Ioathe, but it gets the job done and does what we ask 
of it for what we do. In our context, Houdini unfortunately offers us little or 
nothing. I’d gladly take Fabric as a tools framework though.

 

 

  

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>  
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Jordi Bares
Sent: 19 February 2017 15:08
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com> >
Subject: Re: Opinion gathering

 

 

On 19 Feb 2017, at 13:40, Graham Bell < <mailto:bell...@gmail.com> 
bell...@gmail.com> wrote:

 

I think the problem Houdini has is penetrating the more ‘traditional’ 
modelling, UV, and animation workflows. Maya/Max still dominate here. C4D and 
Modo are trying hard but the former still seem to rule the roost.

 

This is already happening, Modelling tends to happen in Zbrush, UV tends to 
happen in UVlayout and you may only use Maya to do basic modelling and basic UV 
stuff.. although imperfect, that is easy to do in Houdini with today’s toolset, 
let alone H16 toolset.

 

Rigging and Animation are the two parts of this pipeline Maya has a stronghold, 
but IMHO it is only a matter of time to see a shift in that area too.






Is there a swing towards Houdini in this area? Or is it still an augmented 
option in a Maya/Max/Modo pipeline. That would be the interesting thing for me.

 

I have been long advocating to use Houdini as the backbone of the pipeline to 
avoid software fragmentation and the enourmous amount of glue, support, 
plugins, hidden costs that such approach brings… Just list the number of 
applications you would use if you didn’t have Softimage by your side.

 

Zbrush, Topogun, UVlayout, Marvelous Designer, Mari, Photoshop, Maya for Rig 
and Animation, Maya for Cloth sims, Arnold, Massive, Real flow… the list is 
insane!!!

 

I use this other approach;

 

Zbrush, Mari, Photoshop, Marvelous Designer and finally, Houdini for everything 
else.

 

Less glue, less going back and forth...

 

Plus let’s face it… an animator needs only very few tools and normally have the 
easiest transition in any pipeline to new packages. I can train an animator to 
do his job in Houdini in barely a day and in a week is pretty much as 
productive with Houdini as he is with Maya (and I have tested this in the past)

 

I had hoped to make the recent Houdini event but client deadlines intervened. I 

RE: Opinion gathering

[Graham Bell]

Zbrush for characters I can see, but for Hard Surface above something like 
Maya’s sudivs? I’m not quite sure.

And, whether anyone is prepared to admit it Maya’s tools have seen a big 
improvement, to a point where they reduced the need to even retopo in something 
like 3Dcoat or even UVlayout. 

 

Personally I’d put them above Max and even Softs. Soft’s weren’t bad by any 
means, but Maya’s improvements in this area have started to put it ahead in 
this area.

I’d put Modo as the closest competitor in this area now. 

 

I’m with you on a lot of everything else, but the problem that Houdini faces is 
the same as what we had with pushing Softimage/ICE. When faced with a studio 
that uses Maya/Max (for better or for worse), with a bunch of plugins/tools, 
unless faced with some a certain situation, they don’t really see a reason to 
switch.

They may like Houdini a lot, but they can do everything they need and more with 
what they have, so they see no reason to be burdened with the cost and upheaval 
of moving.

 

But who knows, I think the landscape has changed dramatically and is in many 
ways, still changing. I think the next 12-18months could be very interesting in 
terms of software out there.

 

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Jordi Bares
Sent: 19 February 2017 15:08
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list 

Subject: Re: Opinion gathering

 

 

On 19 Feb 2017, at 13:40, Graham Bell mailto:bell...@gmail.com> > wrote:

 

I think the problem Houdini has is penetrating the more ‘traditional’ 
modelling, UV, and animation workflows. Maya/Max still dominate here. C4D and 
Modo are trying hard but the former still seem to rule the roost.

 

This is already happening, Modelling tends to happen in Zbrush, UV tends to 
happen in UVlayout and you may only use Maya to do basic modelling and basic UV 
stuff.. although imperfect, that is easy to do in Houdini with today’s toolset, 
let alone H16 toolset.

 

Rigging and Animation are the two parts of this pipeline Maya has a stronghold, 
but IMHO it is only a matter of time to see a shift in that area too.





Is there a swing towards Houdini in this area? Or is it still an augmented 
option in a Maya/Max/Modo pipeline. That would be the interesting thing for me.

 

I have been long advocating to use Houdini as the backbone of the pipeline to 
avoid software fragmentation and the enourmous amount of glue, support, 
plugins, hidden costs that such approach brings… Just list the number of 
applications you would use if you didn’t have Softimage by your side.

 

Zbrush, Topogun, UVlayout, Marvelous Designer, Mari, Photoshop, Maya for Rig 
and Animation, Maya for Cloth sims, Arnold, Massive, Real flow… the list is 
insane!!!

 

I use this other approach;

 

Zbrush, Mari, Photoshop, Marvelous Designer and finally, Houdini for everything 
else.

 

Less glue, less going back and forth...

 

Plus let’s face it… an animator needs only very few tools and normally have the 
easiest transition in any pipeline to new packages. I can train an animator to 
do his job in Houdini in barely a day and in a week is pretty much as 
productive with Houdini as he is with Maya (and I have tested this in the past)

 

I had hoped to make the recent Houdini event but client deadlines intervened. I 
echo Andy’s comments though about the number of Soft users. For me Houdini is a 
no-brainer when looking for an ICE replacement, perhaps with some Fabric thrown 
in there for good measure.

 

Have a look at the screencast they did.. you will see why the excitement.

 

Interesting times ahead.

jb

 

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RE: Opinion gathering

[Graham Bell]

I think the problem Houdini has is penetrating the more ‘traditional’ 
modelling, UV, and animation workflows. Maya/Max still dominate here. C4D and 
Modo are trying hard but the former still seem to rule the roost.

 

Is there a swing towards Houdini in this area? Or is it still an augmented 
option in a Maya/Max/Modo pipeline. That would be the interesting thing for me.

 

I had hoped to make the recent Houdini event but client deadlines intervened. I 
echo Andy’s comments though about the number of Soft users. For me Houdini is a 
no-brainer when looking for an ICE replacement, perhaps with some Fabric thrown 
in there for good measure.

 

Regarding AD though, kinda hard to measure right now. I don’t hear many 
positive vibes. More recent cuts and layoffs including Eddie Perberg, the Max 
product manager. Even with my understanding it seems bizarre.

 

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Jonathan Moore
Sent: 17 February 2017 22:27
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List. 
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list 

Subject: Re: Opinion gathering

 

It's not what you asked for but I've got pretty much all Windows builds of 
Crate 2010 to 2017 in this archive.

 

https://d.pr/TTWU.rar

 

Not what you need now but it might come in handy another week. ;)

 

I'll ask around for a Linux build over the weekend if it can wait that long.

 

 

 

On 17 February 2017 at 22:11, Michael Amasio mailto:michael.ama...@gmail.com> > wrote:

After an intense amount of arguing I've settled on getting my laptop to sit on 
the network with my soft license intact.  AD wouldn't budge.
That'll go to crap once we finalize our 2 step authentication for marvel.

Clarisse's is like kakana but better for most things.  It's the most backwards 
architecture I've seen.  But the team is great and they plop things in releases 
we need within a week or two.  We've got our aov's going now and that was about 
we needed.
I know people looked at it as a layout tool, but I think that's really not 
worth the investment.  If you go with it it should be your renderer.
They've talked about supporting the substance painter shaders which would be 
really nice. 

Their docs are a little weak and their naming is ass-backwards for all the api. 
 Still they're making that cpu sing.  I'm excited to see what happens when they 
get things dumping to the gpu.  

We're doing layout in unreal with lo-res geo.  Textures and shaders are an 
approximation of final look.  Hi res assets are pushed live to clarisse 
simultaneously.
It's still getting on its feet, big snag is ue4 alembic readers on Linux.

Anyone with exp in this area, give me a shout.

Extra plug/extra apology (I can't actually post on this group) anyone have the 
exocortex crate compiled on Linux for Maya 2017?

On Feb 17, 2017 1:50 PM, "Jonathan Moore" mailto:jonathan.moo...@gmail.com> > wrote:

I don't have a huge amount of experience with Katana but I'd say they're very 
loosely similar. The big difference is that Clarisse at it's heart is a render 
engine crossed with a compositor and this in turn is connected to a scene 
description engine. You bring everything thing in as cache files to build your 
shot and because all assets are referenced in, it can handle poly counts in the 
billions with ease.

 

The really clever part is that you build and composite your shot within the 
viewport using the final shot renderer. It's an exceptionally artist focussed 
way of working and that's probably why it's gaining a strong affinity with 
environment artists. But that's too narrow a description.

 

I like that's been built from the ground up as a pipeline tool, so it's not 
weighed down with the baggage of a traditional DCC.

 

They have a very open PLE that you can explore at your leisure and the learning 
resources they've added recently are excellent. 

 

The team behind it include some old school XSI folk. And because they've gained 
a lot of traction in a relatively short space of time, there's a great vibe 
about the community. Considering it's a big pipeline grade tool, it luckily 
doesn't feature Foundry like pricing! :)

 

You should definitely check it out.

 

http://www.isotropix.com/clarisse

 

On 17 February 2017 at 21:08, Artur W mailto:artur.w...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Is clarisse katana like application?

 

Artur

 

2017-02-17 21:23 GMT+01:00 Jonathan Moore mailto:jonathan.moo...@gmail.com> >:

I'm using clarisse's new renderer and it's been a dream.  It's quickly becoming 
my favorite over redshift for shear polygon muscle.
I had 180 billion polygons (no proxy) in a scene on my laptop the other day. 
Still running 90 fps like a champ.

 

Absolute agreement. I'm building something right now in Clarisse - 120 million 
poly's (Alembic and LWO's and just about to add some VDB's into the mix). Not 
only is the frame rate flying along but the total memory registered in Task 
Manager is a sm

RE: Maya

[Graham Bell]

I agree. Daniel took a lot of flak for that and a lot more, all of which
wasn’t his fault.

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Sven Constable
Sent: 18 February 2017 18:31
To: 'Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list'

Subject: RE: Maya

 

I would like to see the list staying professional as it was through the
years. This was inappropiate.

 

Sven

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com

[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Andi Farhall
Sent: Saturday, February 18, 2017 7:09 PM
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list
Subject: Re: Maya

 

a face only a mother could love

 

 

...

  http://www.hackneyeffects.com/

  https://vimeo.com/user4174293

 
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/andi-farhall/b/496/b21

 

 

http://www.flickr.com/photos/lord_hackney/
http://spylon.tumblr.com/

 

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From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com

mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com> > on behalf of Tenshi Sama
mailto:tenshi...@gmail.com> >
Sent: 18 February 2017 12:05:14
To: Official Softimage Users Mailing List.
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/xsi_list
Subject: Re: Maya 

 

:(

https://youtu.be/WcDn8gVPY_8

 

On Sat, Feb 18, 2017 at 1:22 AM, Andrew Prostrelov mailto:prostre...@gmail.com> > wrote:

> Just another day in the wonderful world of Maya...

totally agree. 
The same stuff all over internet. 
Every one in a pain of Maya "great" UI design, legacy crap and bugs all over
the place.


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web: https://tenshi.carbonmade.com
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RE: Softimage EOL 2017 - The chronicles of a giant (documentary)

[Graham Bell]

I’m advocating not using Soft if it still works for you. I get that.

 

But that wasn’t what I meant. It’s the whole Autodesk bashing thing, but that’s 
just me.

 

 

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Mirko Jankovic
Sent: 07 December 2016 23:07
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Softimage EOL 2017 - The chronicles of a giant (documentary)

 

So what, people are supposed to let go of perfectly fine tool that gets the job 
done 4-5 times faster then other tools?

Where is logic in that?

  
<https://mailfoogae.appspot.com/t?sender=abWlya29qLmFuaW1hdG9yQGdtYWlsLmNvbQ==&type=zerocontent&guid=408a5607-dddb-47e0-9389-76d59ffbe163>
 ᐧ

 

On Thu, Dec 8, 2016 at 12:01 AM, Graham Bell mailto:bell...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Hardly that impactful when they’re now 20% up from last year.

 

At the time of the announcement I always figured in 2+2 equation of usage. 2 
years before end of support, then another 2 years before people finally give it 
up. Though I’m sure it will go longer, I used to still come across people using 
Combustion.

 

But seriously, it’s gone, get over it. For your own sanity, please let it go.

 

From:  <mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com> 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto: 
<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com> 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Saeed Kalhor
Sent: 07 December 2016 22:06
To:  <mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com> softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Softimage EOL 2017 - The chronicles of a giant (documentary)

 

And they got this for their wrong moves:


 
<http://www.cnbc.com/2016/11/30/autodesk-shares-drop-more-than-3-after-disappointing-guidance.html>
 
http://www.cnbc.com/2016/11/30/autodesk-shares-drop-more-than-3-after-disappointing-guidance.html

 

On Thu, Dec 8, 2016 at 12:15 AM, Chris Marshall mailto:chrismarshal...@gmail.com> > wrote:

I keep looking at the alternatives and still struggle to pick one to really 
dive into. Too busy with paying jobs to spend time learning a new language

 



On Wednesday, 7 December 2016, Perry Harovas mailto:perryharo...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Many people are currently being impacted by the EOL and even if they are not,

the bad feelings run high for many. Perhaps something like a documentary needs

the healing power of time before it would be more balanced...

 

A great idea, for sometime further into the future, I think.

 

On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 12:22 PM, Steven Caron mailto:car...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Right, and it would struggle to be a proper documentary instead it would be 
more like an anti-Autodesk hit piece. We have plenty of anti-corporate 
documentaries.

 

On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 8:33 AM, Dan Yargici mailto:danyarg...@gmail.com> > wrote:

 

My post was mostly a reaction to the feeling that this situation is somehow 
deserving of a documentary or the like...

 


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-- 






Perry Harovas
Animation and Visual Effects

 <http://www.theafterimage.com/> http://www.TheAfterImage.com

 

-26 Years Experience

-Member of the Visual Effects Society (VES)

 

-- 

Chris Marshall

Mint Motion Limited

029 20 37 27 57

07730 533 115

www.mintmotion.co.uk <http://www.mintmotion.co.uk> 

www.dot3d.com <http://www.dot3d.com> 

 

 


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-- 

Mirko Jankovic

http://www.cgfolio.com/mirko-jankovic

 

Need to find freelancers fast?

www.cgfolio.com <http://www.cgfolio.com> 

 

Need some help with rendering an Redshift project?

 <http://www.gpuoven.com/> http://www.gpuoven.com/

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RE: Softimage EOL 2017 - The chronicles of a giant (documentary)

[Graham Bell]

Hardly that impactful when they’re now 20% up from last year.

 

At the time of the announcement I always figured in 2+2 equation of usage. 2 
years before end of support, then another 2 years before people finally give it 
up. Though I’m sure it will go longer, I used to still come across people using 
Combustion.

 

But seriously, it’s gone, get over it. For your own sanity, please let it go.

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Saeed Kalhor
Sent: 07 December 2016 22:06
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Softimage EOL 2017 - The chronicles of a giant (documentary)

 

And they got this for their wrong moves:


http://www.cnbc.com/2016/11/30/autodesk-shares-drop-more-than-3-after-disappointing-guidance.html

 

On Thu, Dec 8, 2016 at 12:15 AM, Chris Marshall mailto:chrismarshal...@gmail.com> > wrote:

I keep looking at the alternatives and still struggle to pick one to really 
dive into. Too busy with paying jobs to spend time learning a new language

 



On Wednesday, 7 December 2016, Perry Harovas mailto:perryharo...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Many people are currently being impacted by the EOL and even if they are not,

the bad feelings run high for many. Perhaps something like a documentary needs

the healing power of time before it would be more balanced...

 

A great idea, for sometime further into the future, I think.

 

On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 12:22 PM, Steven Caron mailto:car...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Right, and it would struggle to be a proper documentary instead it would be 
more like an anti-Autodesk hit piece. We have plenty of anti-corporate 
documentaries.

 

On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 8:33 AM, Dan Yargici mailto:danyarg...@gmail.com> > wrote:

 

My post was mostly a reaction to the feeling that this situation is somehow 
deserving of a documentary or the like...

 


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-- 







Perry Harovas
Animation and Visual Effects

  http://www.TheAfterImage.com

 

-26 Years Experience

-Member of the Visual Effects Society (VES)

 

-- 

Chris Marshall

Mint Motion Limited

029 20 37 27 57

07730 533 115

www.mintmotion.co.uk  

www.dot3d.com  

 

 


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RE: Max has a new uv editor texture

[Graham Bell]

Heh, I wondered what many would think of that if it was picked up.

In some ways it does mean just a little bit of Softimage goodness lives on, 
which is what I always hoped for. Though when I first saw this some time ago, 
it did feel like a sucker punch to the gut.

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Artur W
Sent: 24 April 2016 11:24
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Max has a new uv editor texture

 

seriously?!

 

2016-04-24 11:44 GMT+02:00 James De Colling mailto:james.decoll...@gmail.com> >:

https://youtu.be/YHYXgZuTVhE?t=107

 

some of you might find this amusing.


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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Graham Bell]

We're still ok with it and I think we're doing some nice stuff with it
considering we're not in the vfx/game space.

But yeah, often it's like 'cmon guys, pick up the pace abit'.
I wonder now that AD is subs based, if that will have any baring at all.

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 8:16 PM Greg Punchatz  wrote:

> "We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development
> pace has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates and
> some nice stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still
> pending."
>
> This has been our observation as well... some basic things like
> the scheduling part of a production management software has been left to
> die. It seems that they have slowed WAY down since the acquisition.
> So disappointed, I pushed for shotgun in our company, now I am looking for
> other solutions while Shotgun tries to get there shit together.
>
>
>
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Re: Autodesk acquires Solid Angle

[Graham Bell]

We use Shotgun here and the general perception is that the development pace
has appeared to slow since the acquisition. There has been updates and some
nice stuff, but at the same time larger chunks that seem to be still
pending.

>From a brand view AD might keep SA/Arnold separate in the same way Shotgun
is, but behind the scenes it might be different.

Personally, I'm surprised it took them this long to get it announced. ;-)

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:15 PM Jason S  wrote:

>
>
> Indeed shotgun is one (of quite few out of -many-) packages that wasn't
> seriously compromised post acquisition, which is probably why shotgun is
> pasted all over Arnold press release, and I too wouldnt be surprised if it
> was one of those few, yet many would argue that shotgun barely
> (significantly) changed since it was purchased, and moslty relies on the
> fact that it's quite complete as it is (perhaps not unlike SI).
>
> But there remains a good chance (if not a probability) that efforts on
> Arnold would be mostly be around what the parent company is after, or what
> the buzzword of the day may be at a given time, in this case "cloud", and
> for the rest to be slowly moved to the back simply by not touching it, and
> thus becoming like the next MentalRay.
>
> In either case it could then be considered as "just" another casualty.
>
>
> On 04/18/16 18:55, Steven Caron wrote:
>
> I tried to touch on this with the last sentence in my reply. Their
> decision axe Softimage seemed irrational to us because we are emotional but
> if you reduce it to numbers, it made sense. It is a truth I don't like to
> admit but it is a fact that Maya and Max user numbers are just higher, so
> of course you axe Softimage and consolidate the dev teams.
>
> Others have touched on it, here and on the Arnold mailing lists... This
> case is different because they don't have 3 competing renderers now, they
> have at most two (ART in Max). Softimage wasn't a plugin for 7 different
> softwares, it wasn't 'agnostic' in the same way Arnold is. Since the
> Softimage purchase and axing, AD has bought Shotgun. This is an example of
> AD staying out of way and more value being brought to the product
> (additional access to RV). These are reasons why I think this case is going
> to be different.
>
> I am cautiously optimistic though, in 2 years or so we will see for
> certain.
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 3:29 PM, Artur W  wrote:
>
>> Many AD corporate decisions seem irrational and strange to us.
>> Why should this case be any different?
>>
>> I truly wish everything would go as we wanted. Constant progress and
>> development of Arnold.
>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
> "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
>
>
> --
> Softimage Mailing List.
> To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com
> with "unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.
--
Softimage Mailing List.
To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
"unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.

Re: New render layers in maya

[Graham Bell]

I never said it was a good track record. :-)

But yes I would agree, though some things have worked out ok, others
perhaps not.

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 9:59 PM, Jordi Bares  wrote:

>
>  Historically, AD have a track record of implementing a new
> feature/toolset, and then building it up in subsequent versions. So is it
> finished, probably not by a long chalk, but at least it’s a start. I guess
> we’ll see though.
>
>
> I disagree, AD has had a good track record of bringing some very good
> ideas on their first implementation and then abandoning them and let them
> rot. Which is surely the reason such a missed opportunity is so regrettable.
>
>
>
--
Softimage Mailing List.
To unsubscribe, send a mail to softimage-requ...@listproc.autodesk.com with 
"unsubscribe" in the subject, and reply to confirm.

RE: New render layers in maya

[Graham Bell]

To be fair here, considering what system Maya had, it’s certainly a big 
improvement.

 

Historically, AD have a track record of implementing a new feature/toolset, and 
then building it up in subsequent versions. So is it finished, probably not by 
a long chalk, but at least it’s a start. I guess we’ll see though.

 

It would be nice to have literally taken the system from Soft, but as always I 
don’t think it’s that’s simple.  Soft and Maya work in different ways, and Soft 
benefited greatly from the amount of work that Halfdan did to that system. (I 
think recall Luc-Eric even saying how many lines of code it was.) 

 

Even in this state, I’d still take the new Maya system over what I have to use 
in Max, and that’s saying something. :(

 

G

 

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Perry Harovas
Sent: 18 April 2016 20:00
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: New render layers in maya

 

The VAST majority of us will hate it because it is from AD, even if it is great.

 

Which it isn't.

 

I watched the whole video and it overcomplicated something that isn't that 
complicated, frankly.

AD owns the IP for Softimage Layers/Passes. Just use THAT!

 

Why does it have to feel like it is taking a step backwards?

 

Why does Maya always have to complicate things which are not all that 
complicated?

 

I have been using Maya for about as long as possible (years-wise, not time 
wise).

This has always been the way with Maya. 

 

Make it complicated. Always. That seems to be the #1 design goal (if there is a 
design).

 

Here's a thought: Just because it is complicated doesn't mean it is good.

 

Here is another thought: Just because it doesn't appear complicated, doesn't 
mean it isn't deep.

 

 

 

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 2:17 PM, Sebastien Sterling 
mailto:sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Nice ergonomics YOU MASSIVE WANKERS !

 

On 18 April 2016 at 19:12, Adam Seeley mailto:adammsee...@gmail.com> > wrote:

But don't make it round like the one over there.

 

A.

 

On 18 April 2016 at 16:43, Jordi Bares mailto:jordiba...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Let’s reinvent the wheel!!

 

 

 

On 18 Apr 2016, at 15:57, Daniel Kim mailto:danielki...@gmail.com> > wrote:

 

Strange thing is, I feel like AD make something with their own way, not based 
on human interface theory of stuff. Whenever I see their new release, I feel 
like 'that's freaking fxxked up interface... 

 

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 12:50 PM Ivan Vasiljevic mailto:klebed...@gmail.com> > wrote:

S many new windows in Maya.

Now we have property editor and render passes window. :)

Guess it just has to go that way, or not?

 

Cheers.

Ivan

 

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 12:36 PM, Mikael Pettersén mailto:mikael.petter...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Well, that goes without saying. If you only could hear the amount of cursing I 
do at work every day... ;)

 

From: Mirko Jankovic  
Sent: 18 April 2016 11:29
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com  


Subject: Re: New render layers in maya

 

 

Compared to old one yes.. compared to Softimage's.. not so ;)

 

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 12:19 PM, Mikael Pettersén mailto:mikael.petter...@gmail.com> > wrote:

I’m hardly a Maya fan, but I have to say that this looks like a big improvement 
to me. 

 

Cheers

Mikael

 

From: Mirko Jankovic  
Sent: 18 April 2016 10:30
To: Rob Wuijster  ; softimage@listproc.autodesk.com 
 
Subject: Re: New render layers in maya

 

Seems just like another attempt to push something that is not design with Maya 
nature at all and crammed it inside...

Ideas and workflows from Softimage simply doesn't work inside maya because it 
is wrong environment completely. 

You can;t get same workflow in something that was sometimes design in 
completely different logic in mind... and now even worse as it become this huge 
Frankenstein of misc workflows and ideas from all the purchased software and 
cramped in it.. pieces that by itself are maybe even good but when crammed 
together they simply don't talk to each other. 

Practically you have full house of workers that don;t talk to each other or 
understand each other and trying to make a building... 

 

On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 11:25 AM, Rob Wuijster mailto:r...@casema.nl> > wrote:

Well, I think we all decided a long time ago Maya will never be as efficient as 
Softimage. UI wise or workflow wise. ;-)
Like I said, I glanced over it, will have to do a bit more digging when I have 
the time.

cheers!
 
Rob
 
\/-\/\/

On 18-4-2016 11:13, Jordi Bares wrote:

I am afraid it is too much to write on an email, may be when I get a bit of 
time free I will but invite you to think about it a bit more, just the layout 
itself is a massive step backwards from a Softima

RE: cad

[Graham Bell]

I’d definitely look into Rhino. We use it for cleaning any CAD that comes from 
Teamcenter and its very good.

 

Max is our core 3d software (not my choice), so we use some of the 
npowersoftware tools for translation and continued working in Max.

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Eugene Flormata
Sent: 10 February 2016 08:17
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: cad

 

Thx, yeah we got an Moi license on one of the mac's with a lot of ram,
but it's stil pretty slow at opening files
Rhino, I've never looked into,

Maya I just use to import files
I usually end up rebuilding the models, or cleaning them quite a bit before 
actually using it.

thanks

 

On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 11:58 PM, Nono mailto:nnois...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Maya isn't perfect at all for this kind of job, you should give a go to Rhino 
or Moi for processing your file before.

 

 

Re: this is the end......

[Graham Bell]

Yeah, well, not wanting to go over old ground, but there was alot of
effort. Though I accept it might not have seemed like it.
Have to factor in different things like target audience, perception of
product, adoption, etc, etc.

Anyway



>
>
> @Graham; Without going too far into 'what-if' scenarios,
>
>On 02/02/16 17:08, Graham Bell wrote:
> I wish you luck with that.* It was hard enough trying to sell them
> Soft and ICE*. So Houdini could be even harder.
>
> If only had there generally been *some  *(or not to say  *any* *sort of*)
> effort on that front,
> other than at best, (re-)presenting it as not much more than a standalone
> particle plugin, .. or if only depreciation wasn't the point.
>
> But rest assured all such things is mostly water under the bridge by now.
>
>
>

Re: this is the end......

[Graham Bell]

I'm saying nothing, this is getting too close to becoming a 'where did it
go all go wrong' type discussion.
On Wed, 3 Feb 2016 at 18:49, Olivier Jeannel  wrote:

> Too bad there was no "lead" with a vision for the future of SI. I'm sure
> people would have follow if you guys had a produced some different ways of
> working and thinking... Isn't it what happened to us with ice ? At least
> for me, before  XSI 7 I wouldn't believed I'd do some vector math, and 1
> month ago I wouldn't believe I'd type some criptic vex code.
>
> On Wed, Feb 3, 2016 at 7:33 PM, Luc-Eric Rousseau 
> wrote:
>
>> On 3 February 2016 at 09:57, Olivier Jeannel 
>> wrote:
>> > Luc Eric, do you mean that ice modeling developpment was in a stall
>> state,
>> > with nothing to do to enhance it because of that glass "ceiling" ?
>>
>> Yeah, ICE modelling nodes expose the operator stack's low-level
>> commands we always had, and we have all the design with clusters and
>> properties to deal with, etc, and that's limiting.
>>
>> We did have to do something to add materials IDs that by-passes this,
>> as you know, because you can't modify a cluster during evaluation and
>> therefore would not have been able set a local material (kind of a
>> showstopper!), but the other tools in XSI do not "see" this material
>> ID concept.
>>
>> ICE really shines at processing data arrays in parallel, but when it
>> gets to modeling, you're constructing a linear sequence
>> single-threaded calls to the geometry engine and you'd need a
>> different kind of design approach to be able to got the next level -
>> and then update the rest of XSI to know about those new structures.
>> Meshes in XSI are not fundamentally arrays of points with attributes,
>> it's more like there is a mesh and there is a cluster somewhere else,
>> and then a property which might be inherited, and then, etc.. the
>> graph is more like a spider web of dependancies and you can't
>> elegantly modify it with a low level general procedural graph.  It's
>> designed for the operator stack.
>>
>> This whole cluster and property inheritance is not to be seen as a
>> "legacy burden", however, but rather it is a large part of the
>> elegance of XSI and what makes it easy to use.  So there is a design
>> and engineering conflict there.  I think the team pretty much did go
>> as far as they could in the totally reasonable implementation approach
>> that it adopted, except perhaps we didn't NURBS support if I recall.
>>
>> There was a similar problem with ICE Kinematic, where we could have
>> gone just not care about breaking all the Softimage tools and workflow
>> people are used to and tell people to just rebuild everything. ICE
>> Kinematic took instead the more conservative approach of allowing you
>> connecting to the existing Kinematic property rather than allowing you
>> to define your own arbitrary property (with maybe just a "rotateZ"
>> parameter). Helge had something working with that second approach, but
>> there would have been so much stuff to redo.
>>
>
>

RE: this is the end......

[Graham Bell]

I wish you luck with that. It was hard enough trying to sell them Soft and ICE. 
So Houdini could be even harder.

Correction though, it was never that people didn’t like Softimage or ICE, it 
was that many Max users appeared to struggle to really see how they’d adopt it. 
They would mention a few plugins that would pretty much do what they needed. 
Short sighted, some might say but they did what they what they needed.

Although I do have a wry smile when I see Max guys getting all giddy at what 
they’re now doing with the new MCG graph. Stuff that we were doing 8 years ago 
in ICE. :)

 

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Fabricio Chamon
Sent: 01 February 2016 15:05
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: this is the end..

 

Trying hard Olivier, difficult to sell Houdini to a max house... They like 
suffering =)

Em sábado, 30 de janeiro de 2016, Olivier Jeannel mailto:facialdel...@gmail.com> > escreveu:

Fabricio, do yourself a favor and move to Houdini.

 

On Sat, Jan 30, 2016 at 12:29 AM, Fabricio Chamon  > wrote:

Although I don't post a lot, just like to thank you all on this list for saving 
my ass countless times during the hard days I'm currently struggling with 
3ds max and its "lovely" state sets...all the mcg hype (did a basic point 
scatter in 5 hours!!! Wow, talk about speed), and maya with its spagetti node 
editor... Oh boy, it's hard. 

 

Anyway, alt+tab is a friend and Soft pops like a star when no one is looking 
around =)

 

So here's another freelance... All the usual ice stuff, generalist skills, 
arnold/nuke.

 

 

 

Re: this is the end......

[Graham Bell]

It's the start of the real end, as after April 30th, all support stops.
On Wed, 27 Jan 2016 at 22:26, Stefan Kubicek  wrote:

> Thx Cristobal, that's the one:
>
> http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1154841-REG/autodesk_977h1_wwr11c_1001_vc_maya_with_softimage_2016.html
>
> Two (ok, one and a half)  for the price of one?
>
> B&H?
>
> Goodbye softy lad ;(
>
> May the force be with you all.
>
> On Wednesday, 27 January 2016, Dave Gallagher Softimage <
> davegsoftimagel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> How could I buy an extra one today before it's too late? I don't see it
>> on their online store. Do I have to go through a reseller?
>>
>>
>> On 1/27/2016 6:46 AM, adrian wyer wrote:
>>
>> well seeing as today is the final day you can purchase stand alone
>> licenses of Softimage, i guess i'll be the first to say
>>
>>
>>
>> farewell old friend, long will you be remembered as the better app
>>
>>
>>
>> a
>>
>>
>>
>> ps. still use it everyday, but freelancers are hard to find..
>>
>>
>>
>> Adrian Wyer
>> Fluid Pictures
>> 75-77 Margaret St.
>> London
>> W1W 8SY
>> ++44(0) 207 580 0829
>>
>>
>> adrian.w...@fluid-pictures.com
>>
>> www.fluid-pictures.com
>>
>>
>>
>> Fluid Pictures Limited is registered in England and Wales.
>> Company number:5657815
>> VAT number: 872 6893 71
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
>
>

RE: So.. Maya rigging is still a thing...

[Graham Bell]

I’d take a look at the ngSkinTools plugin, a lot of people go to and use that 
instead of Maya’s default tools.

 

http://www.ngskintools.com/

 

 

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Sebastien Sterling
Sent: 24 January 2016 14:29
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: So.. Maya rigging is still a thing...

 

I remember skinning in max, not the best but definitely not the worst, it 
didn't have any pretences let's say, you HAD to use vertex weight selection 
assignments or "Weight Tool" (envelops are garbage), and they had a very 
practical little menu for that, with options for assigning a few default 
pre-sets, 0.1, 0.25, 0.5, 0.75, 1, as well as the ability to copy/past values.

selection assignment is the slowest method, not great for fast turn around, but 
it is also the most precise method.

 

Softimage kind of had something similar, plus a really good smoothing 
algorithm, (is it just me or was soft's smooth weight function, the bomb ?!)



Is there anything like this for maya currently, like max's weight tool i mean ? 
and the first words better not be "In Bonus tools ... !" so help me god !

 

On 24 January 2016 at 13:50, Graham Bell mailto:bell...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Man I feel you guys’ pain. 

I haven’t rigged in Maya for a while, but the thing is if you’ve been in Maya 
land for some time, then you kinda get to know how it works and get the best 
from it. Many guys like it, because they can get quiet deep into it, but like 
anything it’s not without its eccentricities. If you’re gonna keep on comparing 
to Soft though, then you’re in for constant disappointment. But holey moly 
don’t go near Max for rigging, imho. :)

 

As Adam says, there’s been a lot of talk on Beta about the rigging and without 
breeching NDAs there is a desire to start addressing stuff. It seems the work 
on the parallel performance in 2016 perhaps might be the start of that. 
Certainly that stuff has gone down well with people.

 

On the modelling front, Maya’s been going through an overhaul in recent 
versions. Up to 2016 there was a lot of overlap between what was the NEX stuff 
and the legacy Maya tools, but a lot of that got fixed in 2016 onwards. Imo I 
like the modelling in 2016, it’s in a very good state. The improvement in the 
pivot editing alone was worth it.

 

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>  
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com> ] On Behalf Of Sebastien 
Sterling
Sent: 24 January 2016 09:06
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com <mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com> 
Subject: Re: So.. Maya rigging is still a thing...

 

Hey Jordi Bear ! what is skinning like in Houdini ? and have you tried Fabric 
for rigging ?

 

On 24 January 2016 at 08:56, Jordi Bares mailto:jordiba...@gmail.com> > wrote:

It may not be the only solution, it is really up to you.

 

 

On 23 January 2016 at 18:54, F Sanchez mailto:youngupstar...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Its 2016 already. Is there no other app that will ever take the place of Maya? 
(Besides a future resurrection of Softimage which is not going to happen. ) 
Sure I can use XSI when working on my own but if you need to work on site it 
will now have to be Maya from now on. :(

 

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 8:49 PM, Sebastien Sterling 
mailto:sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> > wrote:

"I'm still holding out that fabric engine will become a solution for rigging"

Here, here man ! 

"I can paint weights and build a rig in Maya using fabric to do all the heavy 
work. I can paint weights and build a rig in Maya using fabric to do all the 
heavy work. "

so you can build a Rig in fabric, as a generalist ?

can you paint weights in it as well ?

I too hope Fabric blossoms into the next era of DCC's

 

On 23 January 2016 at 00:48, Michael Amasio mailto:michael.ama...@gmail.com> > wrote:

I'm still holding out that fabric engine will become a solution for rigging.  
It's not all that magical for something complex in Maya.  Which as I'm sure 
several of you have discovered is a bit of a Maya problem.  
I can paint weights and build a rig in Maya using fabric to do all the heavy 
work.  
But when it approaches the quality I require, fabric is providing all the 
computational speed I need , BUT all that speed is lost as it converts data 
back and forth between data Maya can use and KL.   I actually get faster 
results out of the new Maya GPU accelerated.
...but faster results out of XSI.  Good old XSI.
I love it when a studio has like one license for XSI.   I always snatch it up 
and never turn my box off.
I've made a career off of lurking in the background making stuff like 5 times 
faster in XSI. 

I know it's childish to e

RE: So.. Maya rigging is still a thing...

[Graham Bell]

Man I feel you guys’ pain. 

I haven’t rigged in Maya for a while, but the thing is if you’ve been in Maya 
land for some time, then you kinda get to know how it works and get the best 
from it. Many guys like it, because they can get quiet deep into it, but like 
anything it’s not without its eccentricities. If you’re gonna keep on comparing 
to Soft though, then you’re in for constant disappointment. But holey moly 
don’t go near Max for rigging, imho. :)

 

As Adam says, there’s been a lot of talk on Beta about the rigging and without 
breeching NDAs there is a desire to start addressing stuff. It seems the work 
on the parallel performance in 2016 perhaps might be the start of that. 
Certainly that stuff has gone down well with people.

 

On the modelling front, Maya’s been going through an overhaul in recent 
versions. Up to 2016 there was a lot of overlap between what was the NEX stuff 
and the legacy Maya tools, but a lot of that got fixed in 2016 onwards. Imo I 
like the modelling in 2016, it’s in a very good state. The improvement in the 
pivot editing alone was worth it.

 

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Sebastien Sterling
Sent: 24 January 2016 09:06
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: So.. Maya rigging is still a thing...

 

Hey Jordi Bear ! what is skinning like in Houdini ? and have you tried Fabric 
for rigging ?

 

On 24 January 2016 at 08:56, Jordi Bares mailto:jordiba...@gmail.com> > wrote:

It may not be the only solution, it is really up to you.

 

 

On 23 January 2016 at 18:54, F Sanchez mailto:youngupstar...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Its 2016 already. Is there no other app that will ever take the place of Maya? 
(Besides a future resurrection of Softimage which is not going to happen. ) 
Sure I can use XSI when working on my own but if you need to work on site it 
will now have to be Maya from now on. :(

 

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 8:49 PM, Sebastien Sterling 
mailto:sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> > wrote:

"I'm still holding out that fabric engine will become a solution for rigging"

Here, here man ! 

"I can paint weights and build a rig in Maya using fabric to do all the heavy 
work. I can paint weights and build a rig in Maya using fabric to do all the 
heavy work. "

so you can build a Rig in fabric, as a generalist ?

can you paint weights in it as well ?

I too hope Fabric blossoms into the next era of DCC's

 

On 23 January 2016 at 00:48, Michael Amasio mailto:michael.ama...@gmail.com> > wrote:

I'm still holding out that fabric engine will become a solution for rigging.  
It's not all that magical for something complex in Maya.  Which as I'm sure 
several of you have discovered is a bit of a Maya problem.  
I can paint weights and build a rig in Maya using fabric to do all the heavy 
work.  
But when it approaches the quality I require, fabric is providing all the 
computational speed I need , BUT all that speed is lost as it converts data 
back and forth between data Maya can use and KL.   I actually get faster 
results out of the new Maya GPU accelerated.
...but faster results out of XSI.  Good old XSI.
I love it when a studio has like one license for XSI.   I always snatch it up 
and never turn my box off.
I've made a career off of lurking in the background making stuff like 5 times 
faster in XSI. 

I know it's childish to enjoy, but I still enjoy a good rant about the pain of 
rigging in Maya. 

On Jan 22, 2016 3:31 PM, "Eugene Flormata" mailto:eug...@flormata.com> > wrote:

Yah, not sure why there's no improvement in the processflow for rigging in that 
much time, almost in any program i see, so many advancements in modeling. but 
nothing for rigging.
no zbrush of rigging so to speak.

I like how there's notes and tips even when you just turn on the quaddraw. 
feels really thought out.

a lot of maya feels like different programs just stapled together in a package
vs XSI's whole package made for one user mentality. 
I just thought quad draw had that feel to it.

I've not made any rigs in maya yet, and all my XSI rigs were pretty basic
but at least while I was rigging, i wasn't punished for something i wanted to 
go back and change in XSI whenever you learned something about your mesh you 
wanted to animate.
which the real benefit to the XSI over maya, it reduced the number of 
iterations in the learning process.



 

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 3:18 PM, Eric Turman mailto:i.anima...@gmail.com> > wrote:

I'm glad you are liking your new modeling tools, Eugene. However I believe that 
it is important to make the distinction that it is not about the confusion in 
Maya rigging--at least not for me; I do not find Maya confusing at all. What 
the huge issue with Maya is that its limited rigging tool-set combined with 
archaic workflow make the task of rigging drudgery. Drudgery is the key word 
more than confusion. I have made many character rigs in Maya over the past 
fifteen-plus yea

Re: OT Maya: (Please god tell me i'm not alone with this)

[Graham Bell]

You need to look in your selection preferences.

Click box size and the Select Dead space options could be the problem.
On Mon, 18 Jan 2016 at 19:45, Sebastien Sterling <
sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com> wrote:

> No, it's not snapping.
>
> is there some kind of radius sensibility setting ?
>
> also i use a tablet, does maya have some dedicated settings or parameters
> for tablets, that i am not seeing ?
>
> Am really hoping this isn't just the regular workflow. does anyone else
> "HAVE" to use marquee selections with the transformation tools, to prevent
> maya from nudging things out of there initial position or wild falling
> rotations? or to stop it selecting anything remotely close to your intended
> selection ?
>
> It's a nightmare. makes every process longer, and i find myself triple
> checking everything to make sure maya hasn't sneakily popped anything away
> from its initial position.
>
> Living in fear of a program :(
>
> I have no render tree and i must scream !
>
>
>
> On 18 January 2016 at 18:50, Luc-Eric Rousseau 
> wrote:
>
>> snapping is on perhaps?
>>
>> On 18 January 2016 at 04:01, Martin Yara  wrote:
>> > I see, I don't know any setting to change this behaviour or solution
>> other
>> > than use drag select instead of click select when you are using move or
>> > rotation tools for selection, or use the selection tool.
>> >
>> > I find this annoying when using tweaking for components, if I lack
>> precision
>> > I end up moving the object. In this case I usually lock translation
>> > attributes but in your case I don't think this would be a good solution.
>> >
>> > Martin
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 2:35 PM, Sebastien Sterling
>> >  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> This occurs when using the translate rotation or scale
>> tools/manipulators,
>> >> not the regular selection tool, the one with the cursor symbol is fine.
>> >>
>> >> On 18 January 2016 at 05:17, Sebastien Sterling
>> >>  wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> No, Pick/Marquee
>> >>>
>> >>> i've tried all of them.
>> >>>
>> >>> On 18 January 2016 at 05:14, Martin  wrote:
>> 
>>  are you using tweak mode ?
>> 
>>  Martin
>>  Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>  > On 2016/01/18, at 13:29, Sebastien Sterling
>>  >  wrote:
>>  >
>>  > Hey Guys.
>>  >
>>  > Am setting up an mGear biped guide. (mGear is not the problem,
>> cheers
>>  > Miquel it is really cool !)
>>  >
>>  > Every (FUCKING) time i go to select a control/mesh, it snaps to my
>>  > mouse, or activates a manipulator handle, moving the selection a
>> fraction
>>  > away from it's initial position.
>>  >
>>  > Sometimes it will even select something that is in the proximity of
>>  > what i want to select, and snaps it to my cursor.
>>  >
>>  > I have no idea why this is a thing. is it some (demented) selection
>>  > mode for animators to move stuff faster ?
>>  >
>>  > My workaround so far has been to draw selection boxes, when
>>  > endeavoring to select controls.
>>  >
>>  > Is there something that needs to be unticked to banish this Troll
>> like
>>  > functionality.
>>  >
>>  > If there is i have not found it.
>>  >
>>  > Does anyone know what the f... this is and how it can be dealt
>> with.
>>  >
>>  > PS: i hope whoever is responsible for this particular "feature"
>> gets
>>  > Ebola, and not the fun kind...
>> 
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >
>>
>
>

Re: Redshift users?

[Graham Bell]

I'd really like us to look at Redshift but too embedded with Vray. Keeping
an eye on the possible Max integration as that could turn heads.
How big a farm are people using for Redshift, because we do a lot of
rendering.
On Fri, 15 Jan 2016 at 16:57, balazs kiss  wrote:

> Hi Morten,
>
> we're also on redshift here, and I've made another small studio to switch
> too ( by showing a few frames and the corresponding render times ).. great
> stuff :)
>
> On Fri, Jan 15, 2016 at 2:54 AM, Kris Rivel  wrote:
>
>> Loove RS! Switched over after briefly playing with Vray and never
>> looked back. It has been amazing so far.
>>
>> Kris
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 8, 2016 at 8:11 AM, Ognjen Vukovic  wrote:
>>
>>> I thought they mentioned having rendermaps in soft actually working
>>> partially, they were just looking for a method on how to implement it
>>> across the board.
>>> I could be completely wrong though. Either way i would like  the volumes
>>> more :), sorry baking guys.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Jan 8, 2016 at 12:13 PM, Matt Morris  wrote:
>>>
 I'd say the timescale for rendermapping/baking will be months rather
 than weeks - seems like complex volume rendering will come before baking.

 On 8 January 2016 at 09:28, Ognjen Vukovic  wrote:

> It wasn't supported up till now, I think they will be introducing it
> in the coming weeks.
>
> On Fri, Jan 8, 2016 at 9:18 AM, James De Colling <
> james.decoll...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> sorry for the potentially silly question, but how is redshift with
>> Rendermap? we use it extensively with MR, and would need redshift to have
>> the same capability
>>
>> James,
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 8, 2016 at 8:01 PM, Morten Bartholdy > > wrote:
>>
>>> Wow, it is quite impressive what an impact Redshift has made already.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I have done a fair amount of testing with Redshift too and find on
>>> average scenes to be 5-10 times faster than Arnold with comparable 
>>> quality,
>>> plus a number of things are simpler to set up the way you want it, in 
>>> part
>>> because of the rapid feedback in the renderregion. I have yet to test 
>>> it on
>>> really complex scenes, so that will be the next thing to check. I agree 
>>> on
>>> a lack of shader support in certain parts, especially compared to
>>> Arnold/Sitoa, so it is reassuring that Burtnyk and Co are so responsive 
>>> :)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> We will likely also incorporate it to some extent when it supports
>>> vdb and volumetric rendering and see where it takes us.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Morten
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Den 5. januar 2016 kl. 19:50 skrev "Emilio Hernández" <
>>> emi...@e-roja.com>:
>>>
>>> Softimage and Redshift.Best marriage ever!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I have 4 licenses.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>


 --
 www.matinai.com

>>>
>>>
>>
>

Re: Soft licenses still available for purchase?

[Graham Bell]

I'm not sure its that simple. I looked into this EU ruling in my AD time
and l was told at the time by one of the legal guys that its is Autodesk's
belief that their license transfer policy is compatible with the EU ruling.
I would advise checking with Autodesk and/or one of their partners on this
though, if you wanted to take things further.
On Tue, 15 Sep 2015 at 22:29, Tom Kleinenberg  wrote:

> I believe in the EU second-hand trading of software licenses are legal.
> http://www.computerweekly.com/news/2240214493/Second-hand-software-legal-or-illegal
>
> Of course, finding somebody prepared to sell is possibly problematic.
>
> On 15 September 2015 at 22:49, Tenshi .  wrote:
>
>> I was saving for a Softimage license only, i thought i could get one from
>> a reseller but now it's clear that we need to spend 4k for a)software i
>> don't want. b)software that is already dead. This is real?
>> I want my machine to have at least one softimage license, not student or
>> something like that.
>>
>> Really i don't see what is the trouble selling a dead software, what is
>> the cost to that if they're saying those licenses are perpetual, so they
>> don't need any servers to keep checking online? .. I find this whole
>> situation absurd, really.
>> If we have money, we can't buy;, and if they gave us an option the only
>> one is spending too much for something i will not use.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 15, 2015 at 3:23 PM, Patrick Neese 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> As a hobbyist with a single license...I fear the day I create something
>>> worth while that I have to figure out how to render with more than one
>>> machine...since I only have one Mental Ray license for softimage.  I'm
>>>  trying to learn Maya...  It is unfortunate I can't have a softimage/mental
>>> ray license (or 20)  transferred to me from someone who just isn't using
>>> the software anymore...or...is that possible? It appears the LSA could
>>> allow for a transfer via written approval by Autodesk (2.1.1 of the
>>> 2014 LSA) :) It's worth a shot :)
>>>
>>
>>
>

Technicolor acquires The Mill

[Graham Bell]

Blimey.

http://www.technicolor.com/en/who-we-are/press-news-center/press-releases/te
chnicolor-acquires-visual-effects-leader-in-advertising-the-mill

 

RE: Continued use of Softimage question

[Graham Bell]

An interesting thread, so here’s my 2ps worth based what I had seen, up to 
relatively recently. So, naming no names and not stirring up the retirement 
debate…..

 

>From what I’d seen, hardly anyone has dumped Soft from their pipeline 
>entirely. It’s still being used in some shape or form. Most of (if not) all 
>people, if they hadn’t already started to think about transitioning away from 
>Soft, they were about to.

Some were further along already because they’d been running hybrid pipeline for 
some time, with the likes of Houdini, Fabric being the most common. Others had 
merely dabbled and were now putting serious plans together.

A Maya+Houdini+Fabric was a common discussion though.

 

It’s fair to say that many haven’t found a direct replacement for Soft (and 
ICE), and probably won’t, but there are some good things out there. The 
downside is that they’re not in one place like Soft. Maya might not have a lot 
of love from some, but it does have many positives, although the render 
layer/pass system and no real non-linear animation system has stopped many from 
fully adopting. Both of which, I believe, are on AD’s radar.

 

This was very common to see, many decent alternatives out there, but not many 
had mature enough features to match some of Soft’s. So, I don’t see Soft going 
away soon, but there will be a tipping point where people might have to jump, 
painful as it might be.

 

In terms of renderers, am seeing a lot of Redshift now, especially in Maya 
studios who are doing shorter turnaround stuff like commercials or tv work. The 
speed and quality has been too good ignore. Some now use it as their default 
instead of Arnold or Vray.

 

G

 

 

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Sandy Sutherland
Sent: 19 August 2015 11:08
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Continued use of Softimage question

 

Hi all,

 

After a stint out of the Softimage fold - mainly in setting up a Houdini 
rendering and VFX pipeline somewhere, and now I am at Axis animation, doing 
pipeline tools and setup - I wanted to get a feel for this - 

 

Who in the world is continuing to use Softimage?  Who might still be on the 
lookout for high end Soft Riggers, pipeline, tools etc...?

 

Just wondering, as I consider the future for myself and family.

 

Thanks

 

Sandy

RE: So this is where the MeshMixer dev has been hiding? Nice presentation.

[Graham Bell]

Ha, no, because there's no reference to an actual feature name, product name 
(other than the intro) and release date. The video has been removed now, but 
there probably was a safe harbour statement at the beginning which is usually 
sufficient for this type of thing. Anything deeper and you need an NDA. I used 
to do a lot of these presentations :-)

Over on the Foundry forums though, many there say that the content was good but 
the presentation & presenter were bad.

The main thing though is that AD are at least showing some small glimpses into 
what they have planned. And if it was me, I’d be on to them saying get me an 
NDA and tell me more.


G



-Original Message-
From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Leendert A. Hartog
Sent: 17 August 2015 10:06
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: So this is where the MeshMixer dev has been hiding? Nice 
presentation.

Isn't this " Ghost of Christmas Yet to Come" presentation stretching the limits 
of (the side-effects of) the fabled "Sarbanes-Oxley Act"?

Greetz
Leendert
AKA Hirazi Blue

-- 

Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue
Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com

NATS data visualisation

[Graham Bell]

Hi all

 

The video link below shows a great visualisation of UK airspace over 24hrs.
https://vimeo.com/110348926

 

I'm pretty sure this has been posted before and someone mentioned that they
had worked on it, or knew who'd done it. 

I hope I didn't imagine this, so apologies in advance for spamming the list,
but if I didn't reply and/or message me off list. I had some questions about
it, as it came up in conversation recently.

 

Thx

 

Bellsey

 

Re: GATOR - A feature in Softimage since 2008

[Graham Bell]

Many moons ago, I was demoing XSI to a certain very large Maya based games
company (who shall remain nameless), there were a couple of guys in the
room who were convinced that despite looking 'ok', GATOR wasn't anything
that special. And that Maya could already do pretty much the same thing
with an existing feature or a custom/modified tool.

They promptly spent the rest of the day (and evening) trying and failing to
match the demo workflow.

GATOR was always one of those features that would always grab an audiences
attention. At an event last year, after the main agenga for sh*ts &
giggles, I booted up Soft and did some demos. GATOR had people in shock. lol

The only thing I found that had a similar 'wow' factor, was the transfer
maps feature in Mudbox, that's actually very good.




On Thu, May 28, 2015 at 7:48 AM Raffaele Fragapane <
raffsxsil...@googlemail.com> wrote:

> GATOR might use that for the sampling, but I don't think those rely on
> GATOR itself, or even if they did it'd be more of a logistical thing than
> anything to do with what makes GATOR as good as it is (maybe there's an
> acceleration structure or some sampling methods that under the hood were
> implemented as part of GATOR and then used to service other parts of the
> SDK).
>
> Soft has a vastly superior, to ANYTHING out there, notion and handling of
> properties on meshes in general, even if, algorithmically speaking, Maya
> was to get all the maths across tomorrow, it still wouldn't be a fraction
> as powerful as the app in general, right now, is utterly lacking in
> abstractions and representations of mesh data and using them for
> deformation.
>
> On Thu, May 28, 2015 at 4:09 PM, Steven Caron  wrote:
>
>> All the GetClosest* functions on the geometry class? I would consider
>> that part of the GATOR sdk
>>
>> *written with my thumbs
>> On May 27, 2015 6:11 PM, "Luc-Eric Rousseau"  wrote:
>>
>>> GATOR was developed for/with one of our main game customers, Square I
>>> think.
>>> I'm not aware of a Gator "sdk", what is that?
>>> There are attribute transfers in other apps, but it's generally
>>> separate tools for textures
>>> vs rigging things, reflecting on their architecture vs XSI
>>>
>>> On 27 May 2015 at 19:27, Matt Lind  wrote:
>>> > For the record, GATOR was introduced in late 2005 with XSI v5.0, not in
>>> > 2008.
>>> >
>>> > GATOR was largely tailored for those switching applications and doing
>>> > rigging in a film/video pipeline.  For games development, GATOR has
>>> less use
>>> > out-of-the-box as the very things that made it nice for exchanging data
>>> > between XSI and Maya, for example, were the very same features that
>>> tripped
>>> > up game artists trying to do simpler things quickly in heavy
>>> repetition.
>>> >
>>> > I wrote a command based version of the tool using the GATOR SDK as
>>> artists
>>> > needed more micro-management of meshes and transfers.  Artists used it
>>> to
>>> > transfer UV's, normals, vertex colors, envelope weights, and many other
>>> > features.  I also extended, as well as exposed, many features from the
>>> SDK
>>> > GATOR did not expose directly such as transferring attributes in local
>>> > space, by raycasting, distance limits, transferring only selected
>>> > subcomponents, correcting numerical flaws found in UV transfer, and so
>>> on.
>>> > However, my use of the GATOR SDK was not limited to replicating the
>>> tool as
>>> > a command.  I also used it heavily for other tasks which weren't
>>> strictly
>>> > related to attribute transfer tasks such as animation remapping, pose
>>> > transfer, mesh fitting, and interactive editing of normals and
>>> symmetrical
>>> > envelope weighting of asymmetrical characters.
>>> >
>>> > To hear other applications don't have a GATOR equivalent in this day
>>> and age
>>> > is surprising considering it's so universally useful and isn't rocket
>>> > science to develop.  If you know anything about tree data structures
>>> and
>>> > linear algebra, you can write your own (even if it's not as efficient
>>> as
>>> > GATOR).  What makes the GATOR SDK nice is the algorithm is very fast,
>>> > accurate, and relatively easy to use.  Reverse lookups of
>>> subcomponents is a
>>> > pain as GATOR worked on triangles, not polygons, but that's minor
>>> compared
>>> > to all the benefits it provides.
>>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Our users will know fear and cower before our software! Ship it! Ship it
> and let them flee like the dogs they are!
>

Re: Is purchasing a new softimage license impossible?

[Graham Bell]

To begin with, yes. But I think it was opened up to anyone. I'd check on
that though.


On Thu, 14 May 2015 at 20:57, Sven Constable 
wrote:

> That only apply to existing costumers of softimage right? 3Dsmax or Maya
> only studios cannot buy any seats of softimage even within a bundle?
>
> sven
>
>
>
> *From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Scott Parrish
> *Sent:* Thursday, May 14, 2015 9:44 PM
> *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> *Subject:* Re: Is purchasing a new softimage license impossible?
>
>
>
> Thanks Stephen, I'll pass this along!
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 3:49 AM, Stephen Blair 
> wrote:
>
>
>
> Until April 2016:
>
>
>
> Customers who wish to purchase new or additional seats of Softimage 2015
> can do so by purchasing either the Maya with Softimage or 3ds Max with
> Softimage transition offering. These offerings are available via their
> local reseller and cannot be purchased through the Autodesk e-store.
>
>
>
> On Wed, May 13, 2015 at 5:44 PM, Scott Parrish 
> wrote:
>
> Asking a question for a friend, I still have a seat of Softimage from my
> 2015 bundle stuff..
>
>
>
> I know some people who like modeling in Softimage and at least in a game
> pipeline it's still pretty easy to model in whatever package and then push
> through to the mainline pipeline in Maya or Max or whatever.
>
> We were wondering is there NO way at all to obtain new licenses for
> Softimage now? I.e. if someone goes to a new employer and wants to obtain a
> seat of Softimage, is that impossible?
>
>
>
> I wondered how that works since Animal Logic is still working in Soft and
> must grow their license pool as shows ramp up, right?
>
> Or do they have a special deal with AD?
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> scott
>
>
>
>
>

Re: Friday Flashback #223

[Graham Bell]

I used to still have those, but lord knows where they are now.

I think I still have the TD love tour they did for launching that, or was
it for 5.0
Too long ago now.

I did recently discover one of the last Soft 3d 3.7(I think) demos with
Chinny wearing his Krusty the clown shirt. :-)
On Wed, 13 May 2015 at 23:57, Alan Fregtman  wrote:

> Myself I started with XSI 4.2. I still remember the big heavy box of
> manuals with the liquidy orangey flower art. :) Good times.
>
>
> On Wed, May 13, 2015 at 12:13 PM Adam Sale  wrote:
>
>> Ah yes, we can't forget Ms Charette.
>>
>> On Wed, May 13, 2015 at 6:31 AM, christian  wrote:
>>
>>> maggie and christine were always on fire on the list..
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, May 13, 2015 at 6:34 AM, Adam Sale  wrote:
>>>
 I began with Softimage 3d v3.0 in 1997. We ran it on r1's.
 Pierre Tousignant, Gino Vincelli, Maggie Kathwaroon to name a few.
 Good times.

 On Tue, May 12, 2015 at 5:13 PM, Daniel Harjanto 
 wrote:

> I start with Softimage 3D 1.5.2 back then, running on Personal IRIS
> Still come as QIC Tapes, and a bunch of hard cover manuals and with
> IRIX manuals, that took a lot of space on the shelves.
> Must be somewhere in 1990
>
> Go through terrible 2.0, which fix with 2.0.3
> My last version on Softimage 3D was 3.7
>
>
> On Wed, May 13, 2015 at 3:00 AM, Ponthieux, Joseph G.
> (LARC-E1A)[LITES]  wrote:
>
>> It must have been 2.6 to 2.65 then.  It would have been Mar 94,
>> whatever was current then.
>>
>> I'll certainly never forget 2.66. And 2.66b, and 2.66c, and..
>>
>> --
>> Joey Ponthieux
>> LaRC Information Technology Enhanced Services (LITES)
>> MYMIC Technical Services
>> NASA Langley Research Center
>> __
>> Opinions stated here-in are strictly those of the author and do not
>> represent the opinions of NASA or any other party.
>>
>> > -Original Message-
>> > From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:softimage-
>> > boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Matt Lind
>> > Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2015 3:03 PM
>> > To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
>> > Subject: RE: Friday Flashback #223
>> >
>> > Joey, if you started in 1994, then you likely began with v2.65 as
>> that was the
>> > first version released under Microsoft ownership and a lemon of a
>> release
>> > that took many patches to fix.  On the other hand if you began with
>> v2.4,
>> > then you likely started in 1991 or 1992 because I started in July
>> 1993 just after
>> > Jurassic Park hit theaters.  v2.6 was current at the time.
>> >
>> >
>> > Matt
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Date: Mon, 11 May 2015 13:46:42 +
>> > From: "Ponthieux, Joseph G. (LARC-E1A)[LITES]" <
>> j.ponthi...@nasa.gov>
>> > Subject: RE: Friday Flashback #223
>> > To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com"
>> >
>> > Actually for me it was 94. Softimage 3D 2.4 or something like that.
>> It was the
>> > SGI version in early 94 right before they switched to the Microsoft
>> compiler
>> > and all hell broke loose.
>> >
>> > Prior to that I had been using Cubicomp from 88-94. What a
>> difference a day
>> > made, the day I started on Soft!
>> >
>> > --
>> > Joey Ponthieux
>> > LaRC Information Technology Enhanced Services (LITES) MYMIC
>> Technical
>> > Services NASA Langley Research Center
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Daniel Harjanto
> Infinite Frameworks Studios
> TD
> http://misterdi.cgpot.com
>


>>>
>>

Re: Any equivalent to Custom Param sets in Maya?

[Graham Bell]

I believe that's what 'Asset's in Maya were supposed to do, but they never
really progressed that far. Some good ideas in there though.

On Wed, May 13, 2015 at 6:17 PM Eric Thivierge 
wrote:

> Yeah I could do that but animator's would kill me. I'd prefer to stay
> alive. :)
>
> Eric T.
>
> On 5/13/2015 1:02 PM, Ponthieux, Joseph G. (LARC-E1A)[LITES] wrote:
> > You could try something similar to
> >
> > Object
> > Null (MyControl)
> >- posx
> >- posy
> >- posz
> >- Null2 (MyCustomParamSet1)
> >-- customParam1
> >-- customParam2
> > - Null3 (MyCustomParamSet2)
> >-- customParam1
> >-- customParam2
> >
> > It won't be manageable via the Attribute editor the way you would like
> but it will be easily accessible via channel box by selecting the Null,
> Null2, or Null3 group nodes under the object from the Outliner. If you hide
> extraneous channels in each null it might be at least very presentable from
> an Outliner/Channel box workflow, but won't be what you want structurally
> from the back side and won't be presentable the way you would want from a
> single Attribute Editor display.
> >
> > To my knowledge Maya has never had a sense for "Custom Parameters" the
> way that Soft does it. Attributes have always been "node" level, if that's
> even a good way to describe it.
> >
> > And yeah, the Maya philosophy of visibility has no similarity to Soft.
> >
> > --
> > Joey Ponthieux
> > LaRC Information Technology Enhanced Services (LITES)
> > MYMIC Technical Services
> > NASA Langley Research Center
> > __
> > Opinions stated here-in are strictly those of the author and do not
> > represent the opinions of NASA or any other party.
> >
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:softimage-
> >> boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Eric Thivierge
> >> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2015 12:20 PM
> >> To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> >> Subject: Re: Any equivalent to Custom Param sets in Maya?
> >>
> >> Hey Joey,
> >>
> >> Yeah I know the standard workflow for attributes in Maya just wasn't
> sure if
> >> there was a new organizational structure in recent years.
> >>
> >> I basically want to make sets of attributes on an actual object, not a
> child
> >> object. Custom Param Sets in Softimage allow for this as you have a
> nested
> >> param set where more custom params can live.
> >>
> >> MyControl
> >> - posx
> >> - posy
> >> - posz
> >> - MyCustomParamSet1
> >> - customParam1
> >> - customParam2
> >> - MyCustomParamSet2
> >> - customParam1
> >> - customParam2
> >>
> >> The above structure doesn't seem to be doable in Maya and I'm currently
> >> using a very hacky method of creating locked enum attributes with a
> value of
> >> "" to divide up sections of attributes. Accessing these sets via
> scripting is
> >> annoying as these attributes aren't nested under a Param Set or other
> >> organizational type structure and thus breaking the parody between
> >> Softimage, Maya, and Kraken.
> >>
> >> I'm able to work around for now and make things work, it's just not
> elegant.
> >>
> >> The few things that I wish AD would implement in Maya as an offering of
> >> good faith for ending Softimage to me, would be non-inherited
> visibility,
> >> custom attribute sets and proxy-attributes. The latter being the largest
> >> inconvenience I've come across yet for Character setup in Maya.
> >>
> >> Eric T.
> >>
> >>
> >> On 5/13/2015 12:02 PM, Ponthieux, Joseph G. (LARC-E1A)[LITES] wrote:
> >>> As you probably already know custom attributes are added via
> >> Attributes>Add Attributes in an object's Attribute Editor.
> >>> You're asking, I think, can you have custom Attributes in a special
> panel like
> >> is done in Soft.
> >>> You can add attributes anywhere, to nulls, to objects etc. If you want
> an
> >> attribute with behavior applied to another object but need to manage
> >> separately you can add that to a group or null then formulate the
> attribute to
> >> work on a different object.
> >>> Custom attributes show up in the channel box of the object they are
> added
> >> to.
> >>> Or in the Extra Attributes section of the object where they can be
> isolated
> >> from the rest of the transform channels. You must execute "Load
> Attributes"
> >> for them to show up there.
> >>> If you want a similar kind of structure to what Soft permits, make a
> null
> >> object and parent it under the main object, rename it to Controls or
> >> something of the sort. Create all your custom attributes there and
> close all
> >> section to its attribute editor other than Extra Attributes. From the
> channel
> >> box you can "Hide" all the transform channels you don't want to see for
> this
> >> "control" object (Right click>hide selected on each channel) making
> this a bit
> >> more pleasant experience as a "custom  param" pane

Re: End of the ride

[Graham Bell]

Thanks, it would of been good to continue, but unfortunately AD made me
redundant.
On Wed, 13 May 2015 at 00:41, Gustavo Eggert Boehs 
wrote:

> Good luck Graham! Thanks for the interaction through all this years.
>
> Gustavo E Boehs
> Dpto. de Expressão Gráfica | Universidade Federal de Santa Catarina |
> http://www.gustavoeb.com.br/
>
> 2015-05-12 20:29 GMT-03:00 Adam Sale :
>
> I echo the sentiments of Eric and Angus. You have been a great help to our
>> community Graham.
>> Best of luck in your future endeavours!
>>
>> Adam
>>
>> On Tue, May 12, 2015 at 4:11 PM, Angus Davidson <
>> angus.david...@wits.ac.za> wrote:
>>
>>>  Dear Graham
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you for all you have been able to do , both here, on places like
>>> si-community and via email.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Where ever you end up I hope its at least free of Adobe installers ;)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Kind regards
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Angus
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>>  *From:* Graham Bell [bell...@gmail.com]
>>> *Sent:* 13 May 2015 12:59 AM
>>> *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
>>> *Subject:* End of the ride
>>>
>>>   I hadn't wanted to make any kind of announcement, but reading
>>> Stephens latest Flashback thread and the discussions on where peoples
>>> journey with Softimage first started, it's kinda made me realise that mine
>>> has basically ended.
>>> And as I'm posting here, I didn't want to fly under false colours, so to
>>> speak.
>>>
>>>  As of the start of this month, I'm no longer at Autodesk, The
>>> bloodline of european Softimage AE's from Ben, Chinny, and James, to myself
>>> has now ended.
>>>
>>>  Perhaps it's time to start earning an honest living again. lol :-)
>>>
>>>  This communication is intended for the addressee only. It is confidential. 
>>> If you have received this communication in error, please notify us 
>>> immediately and destroy the original message. You may not copy or 
>>> disseminate this communication without the permission of the University. 
>>> Only authorised signatories are competent to enter into agreements on 
>>> behalf of the University and recipients are thus advised that the content 
>>> of this message may not be legally binding on the University and may 
>>> contain the personal views and opinions of the author, which are not 
>>> necessarily the views and opinions of The University of the Witwatersrand, 
>>> Johannesburg. All agreements between the University and outsiders are 
>>> subject to South African Law unless the University agrees in writing to the 
>>> contrary.
>>>
>>>
>>

End of the ride

[Graham Bell]

I hadn't wanted to make any kind of announcement, but reading Stephens
latest Flashback thread and the discussions on where peoples journey with
Softimage first started, it's kinda made me realise that mine has basically
ended.
And as I'm posting here, I didn't want to fly under false colours, so to
speak.

As of the start of this month, I'm no longer at Autodesk, The bloodline of
european Softimage AE's from Ben, Chinny, and James, to myself has now
ended.

Perhaps it's time to start earning an honest living again. lol :-)

Re: Question about Normalmap

[Graham Bell]

Nvidia would do the invert Y because that was how most game engines
accepted normal maps. The problem then was that different 3D packages
didn't always conform to this.

What many do now is (depending on what they use, Maya/Max, etc) and to keep
maps consistent for the context, is generate the normal maps and then do
the invert to the Y green channel, in game. UE4 has setting to to this.
xNormal and nDo also have settings if you want to do the invert.

On Fri, May 8, 2015 at 2:03 PM Martin Yara  wrote:

> Hi, I have a really basic noob question, but after all these years I've
> realized that I'm not sure what I'm doing lol.
>
> Years ago, all I was using for normal maps was the NVidia plugin and we
> had to flip the Y axis (check in "Invert Y"). It was somewhat common
> knowledge back then. And since it was looking good in the DDC and game
> viewer I used those settings.
>
> Nowadays, I'm using xNormal and nDo, and I don't have to set anything to
> have similar results. But I just noticed that their preferences are in
> X+Y+Z+.
>
> So, my question is, NVidia's plugin is flipping Y by default so I have to
> re-invert Y?
>
> I've heard that Unreal engine requires to flip Y, so if I'm using NVidia
> plugin I should uncheck everything and have it by default? and if I'm using
> nDo or xNormal should I invert Y?
>
> Thanks
>
> Martin
>

Re: Friday Flashback #223

[Graham Bell]

My first Xsi was 1.5, but my first Soft was 3.7
On Sat, 9 May 2015 at 12:19,  wrote:

>   thanks, you guys make me feel so young again
>
>   *From:* Softimage 
> *Sent:* Saturday, May 09, 2015 8:55 AM
> *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> *Subject:* Re: Friday Flashback #223
>  Lol, you've got a "little" bit on me! Spaceward Supernova/Rodin backend
> of the 80's and then Symbolics, Poweranimator, didn't touch Soft till mid
> 90's, can't remember the number, possibly 3.0 or just before!
>
>
>
> On 9 May 2015, at 01:56, Stephen Davidson  wrote:
>
>  LOL...I meant Softimage 3D 1.0 (actually version 2.1, I believe) back in
> 1987...prior to XSI 1.0 in 2000
>
> On Fri, May 8, 2015 at 7:48 PM, Softimage  wrote:
>
>>  I was 1.0 as well but realistically I was going back and forth between
>> XSI and Soft a lot till 1.5!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 8 May 2015, at 22:42, Stephen Davidson  wrote:
>>
>>  Am I the only one here, left, that started with 1.0?
>> I think Joey did too, but I'm not sure.
>>
>>
>> On Fri, May 8, 2015 at 2:05 PM, Eric Thivierge 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Yeah I started on 4.0 / 4.2...  was wondering when Stephen was going to
>>> get to this release. :)
>>>
>>>  
>>> Eric Thivierge
>>> http://www.ethivierge.com
>>>
>>> On Fri, May 8, 2015 at 1:33 PM, Sven Constable >> > wrote:
>>>
 especially since it was the first really 'production ready' version,
 wasn't it? Remembering two presentations (I think it was v1.0 (lol) and
 3.0) And on the v3 presentation I thnk their claim was it's now 'production
 ready'. Well, I don't think it was it entirely but with version 4 they
 definetly got  it.

 sven

 -Original Message-
 From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
 softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Alen
 Sent: Friday, May 08, 2015 5:00 PM
 To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
 Subject: Re: Friday Flashback #223

  ah..my landing year on XSI ship. good times

 On 5/8/2015 3:46 PM, Stephen Blair wrote:
 > i am 4.
 > customization • speed • options • power • thought • imagination •
 > integration
 > SOFTIMAGE|XSI version 4.0 launch 04.19.2004
 >
 > http://wp.me/powV4-3cW



>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> *  Stephen P. Davidson*
>>
>> *(954) 552-7956 <%28954%29%20552-7956>*sdavid...@3danimationmagic.com
>>
>> *Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic*
>>
>>
>> - Arthur C. Clarke
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>
>
> --
>
>
> Best Regards,
> *  Stephen P. Davidson*
>
> *(954) 552-7956*sdavid...@3danimationmagic.com
>
> *Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic*
>
>
> - Arthur C. Clarke
>
> 
>
>

Re: Friday Flashback #223

[Graham Bell]

I started on 1.5 (such as it was) when you had to patch the Soft3d license
with the Xsi key.
Didn't start using it in real anger though until v3 though.
On Fri, 8 May 2015 at 19:13, Sven Constable 
wrote:

> whenever it was. It was going to get even better ;)
>
>
>
> *From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Eric Thivierge
> *Sent:* Friday, May 08, 2015 8:05 PM
>
>
> *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> *Subject:* Re: Friday Flashback #223
>
>
>
> Yeah I started on 4.0 / 4.2...  was wondering when Stephen was going to
> get to this release. :)
>
>
> 
> Eric Thivierge
> http://www.ethivierge.com
>
>
>
> On Fri, May 8, 2015 at 1:33 PM, Sven Constable 
> wrote:
>
> especially since it was the first really 'production ready' version,
> wasn't it? Remembering two presentations (I think it was v1.0 (lol) and
> 3.0) And on the v3 presentation I thnk their claim was it's now 'production
> ready'. Well, I don't think it was it entirely but with version 4 they
> definetly got  it.
>
> sven
>
> -Original Message-
> From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
> softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Alen
> Sent: Friday, May 08, 2015 5:00 PM
> To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> Subject: Re: Friday Flashback #223
>
> ah..my landing year on XSI ship. good times
>
> On 5/8/2015 3:46 PM, Stephen Blair wrote:
> > i am 4.
> > customization • speed • options • power • thought • imagination •
> > integration
> > SOFTIMAGE|XSI version 4.0 launch 04.19.2004
> >
> > http://wp.me/powV4-3cW
>
>
>

RE: OT: Lab for 3DSMax

[Graham Bell]

I’d go with that. I too, have never been able to get my head around working in 
Max.

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Raffaele Fragapane
Sent: 13 April 2015 02:57
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: OT: Lab for 3DSMax

I have to admit to never having got the hang of MAX.
I produced work professionally with Soft, LW, XSI, Maya, Houdini... MAX I never 
got, it's like it was made for some other species than humans AFAIC.

If MAX tastes like anything, I imagine it would taste like boiled broccoli left 
in the sun for a couple weeks.

On Mon, Apr 13, 2015 at 11:47 AM, pedro santos 
mailto:probi...@gmail.com>> wrote:
That MAX taste right? x)
But it touches some soft spots for me. Deformation and topology operations.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dN5NXLDjH1s&feature=youtu.be

On Mon, Apr 13, 2015 at 2:15 AM, Raffaele Fragapane 
mailto:raffsxsil...@googlemail.com>> wrote:
Why would anyone bother when they could use Fabric for free for the same thing 
and also have it go across packages?
The "now you can be a programmer too!" video style, complete with royalty free 
music loop, also made me throw up a bit in the back of my mouth :p

<>

RE: Subscription Transition for New Software Licenses

[Graham Bell]

No, more to do with being public listed company.

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Angus Davidson
Sent: 04 February 2015 17:11
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Subscription Transition for New Software Licenses

Am I the only one not impressed that they spent more of the press release 
covering their own ass.

Sign of the times.


--
Angus Davidson
ICT Project Leader - Digital Arts
University of the Witwatersrand


On 04 February 2015 at 3:25:51 PM, Leendert A. Hartog 
(hirazib...@live.nl) wrote:
This just dropped in my mailbox:
"Autodesk Details Subscription Transition for New Software Licenses"
http://news.autodesk.com/press-release/archived/autodesk-details-subscription-transition-new-software-licenses

Greetz
Leendert

--

Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue
Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
This communication is intended for the addressee only. It is confidential. If 
you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately and 
destroy the original message. You may not copy or disseminate this 
communication without the permission of the University. Only authorised 
signatories are competent to enter into agreements on behalf of the University 
and recipients are thus advised that the content of this message may not be 
legally binding on the University and may contain the personal views and 
opinions of the author, which are not necessarily the views and opinions of The 
University of the Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. All agreements between the 
University and outsiders are subject to South African Law unless the University 
agrees in writing to the contrary.




<>

RE: @autodesk maya request

[Graham Bell]

What version of Maya are you using?

There are some new pivot editing tools added to 2015 Ext 1. Make things way 
easier than before.


G

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Mario Reitbauer
Sent: 04 February 2015 10:21
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: @autodesk maya request

Snap to pivot/center in maya ?

Please ?

And no, not through some sort of menu or command. Just add another snapping 
option please which enables snapping to object pivots/centers.
<>

RE: Teaching Unreal vs Unity

[Graham Bell]

Thing is, there really isn’t much between Unreal and Unity now.
Not so long ago, many would go Unreal for high end PC/Console, and Unity for 
everything else, especially iOS and Android. But now, they’re both cross 
platform on just about anything.
I know some people, who have favoured Unreal because they like that it’s C++, 
and Unity leans a lot more towards C#, but others aren’t bothered.

Both have huge communities, Unity has done a great job in getting to smaller 
and indie devs, and Unreal has had UDK and the whole Unreal Tournament thing 
for years.
I see both engines being used a lot, though recently I have seen a lot more 
people adopting or even moving to UE4. I think the new pricing and license 
model from Unreal has really changed people’s minds and drawn them towards 
Unreal. And their new education policy has just made it so easy for people to 
adopt it, from Uni’s all the way down to primary schools.

Could you offer both, and let students go with what they prefer?

G

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Cristobal Infante
Sent: 19 January 2015 21:11
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Teaching Unreal vs Unity

Unity is probably easier to teach and learn right?

Had a quick look at Unreal and it does seems like a more technical package..

On 19 January 2015 at 21:07, Angus Davidson 
mailto:angus.david...@wits.ac.za>> wrote:
Thats a very valid point. Its the major point behind us going Maya in our 3d 
animation courses ;(

Kind regards

Angus


--
Angus Davidson
074 580 3744


On 19 January 2015 at 10:38:41 PM, Jordi Bares Dominguez 
(jordiba...@gmail.com) wrote:
The thing is that Unity produces content for Android, iOS, Mac, Windows, Web… 
and you can manage the output optimisation as you go along and have one single 
development in C# but then produce the content for each device/platform, this 
is the reason is getting so much traction, its simpler and cost effective so 
they will get a job easier I would imagine.

I would suggest you ask to the industry in your area and see.

cheers
jb

On 19 Jan 2015, at 22:28, Angus Davidson 
mailto:angus.david...@wits.ac.za>> wrote:

Hi Jordi

Every little bit helps ;)

We are currently only looking at PC/Mac  so being able to compile for all 
devices / platforms is not a requirement.

Unity does seem to have far more content which is definitely useful when you 
need to point the student towards additional tutorials.

The games they make are fairly small. as the focus is more on the design of the 
game itself (they do of course go hand in hand to a large extent,) In first 
year they don’t use a computer at all, focusing purely on analogue games to 
allow them to get to grips with gameplay design and theory.


Kind regards

Angus

--
Angus Davidson
074 580 3744



On 19 January 2015 at 10:07:43 PM, Jordi Bares Dominguez 
(jordiba...@gmail.com) wrote:
I like Unreal but Unity strength on multiple platform compilation and the huge 
user base and market place make it extremely attractive.

If you aim for pure games may be Unreal is more appropiate, if you aim to get 
your students to do games and web, and digital content and… then Unity is 
pretty much  the standard nowadays, specially with the upcoming Unity5 which 
looks very very good indeed.

hope it helps
jb

On 19 Jan 2015, at 22:03, Angus Davidson 
mailto:angus.david...@wits.ac.za>> wrote:

Hi All

Mostly out to educators , but very all opinions welcome as I know quite a few 
folks have played around with Unity and Unreal

We have a new Games design degree. We are now in the Fourth year which means 
our first set of student are in their final year. We are in a situation where 
we have started our 2nd and 3rd game design students in Unity3d (for the past 
year)

This went fairly well for a first year and we got some decent work out of it. 
However since paying for our first 30 EDU licences a few things have happened

1) Unlike last year the timetables make it impossible to only need 30 licences 
for 60 students
2) We now have a fourth year adding another 30 licences to that figure for a 
total of 90
3) As per the usual at a University our budget has been cut , however this time 
its been cut 40%
4) Our lovely currency has gone to crap vs the dollar
5) Unreal released a free edu version of their engine.

So the burning question is do we suck up the one year with Unity and move to 
Unreal or is Unity the better one to stick with for teaching purposes. its 
worth noting we are also stuck with Maya as the 3d App that they will have 
access to, as we are no longer allowed to teach our beloved Softimage :(

Apologies for the wide scope of the question but budgeting is currently giving 
me sleepless nights .

--
Angus Davidson
ICT Project Leader- Digital Arts
University of the Witwatersrand.
074 580 3744

This communication is intended for the addressee only. It is con

RE: OT: Visiting London in January, anybody wanna meet for beers?

[Graham Bell]

I’m up for Friday, and I might be able to bring a ‘special guest’

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Jordi Bares 
Dominguez
Sent: 07 January 2015 11:19
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: OT: Visiting London in January, anybody wanna meet for beers?

Exactly, let’s meet!

On 7 Jan 2015, at 09:24, Rob Chapman 
mailto:tekano@gmail.com>> wrote:

ok thanks for that Leendert, but back on topic.. seems there are a few softies 
who saw this and feel like going but are not as vocal, so can we get some 
consensus on date/time/place ?  I would tentatively like to pencil this Friday 
6.45pm front of white horse outside drinking area 16 Newburgh Street, Soho, 
London W1F 7RY, United Kingdom


cheers!

Rob-c ‎

On 6 January 2015 at 20:26, Simon Reeves 
mailto:si...@simonreeves.com>> wrote:
I'll be up for a drink sometime, shaston is quite small? What kind of 3d artist 
drinks inside in soho? :)


On Tuesday, 6 January 2015, Leendert A. Hartog 
mailto:hirazib...@live.nl>> wrote:
And that should have read "store', not "story" obviously. :blush:

--

Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue
Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com

--


Simon Reeves
London, UK
si...@simonreeves.com
www.simonreeves.com
www.analogstudio.co.uk



<>

UK London Softimage<>Maya training

[Graham Bell]

I know this is crap and apologies for this being very last minute

Due to some last drop outs, we have 3 places left on the last of our Softimage 
<> Maya training classes, next week Dec 8th-12th.
The training is classroom based, all week at Escape Studios, London. No cost to 
you other than travel, lunch, etc.

First come, first served. Email me off list.



Graham



P.s. Sorry no debate or discussion as to the context of this, location, future 
training, etc, etc. It is what it is. I’m just the messenger here.




<>

RE: Buy Softimage - > is this a real shop?

[Graham Bell]

5 minutes? So that means that, that if we can improve that, we reduce the time 
for your replies.

Damn, tricky dilemma. Hard to know what to do for the best here. Lol ☺


G

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Raffaele Fragapane
Sent: 13 November 2014 08:09
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: RE: Buy Softimage - > is this a real shop?


It was written between Maya crashes in the five minute intervals it takes for 
it to come back up :p
All in good spirit though Graham, you're still good people in my book ;)
On 13 Nov 2014 18:45, "Graham Bell" 
mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com>> wrote:
You spent way too much time on that reply. ☺

Funny though. ☺

From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>
 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>]
 On Behalf Of Raffaele Fragapane
Sent: 13 November 2014 02:26
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: Buy Softimage - > is this a real shop?

I know, right?

It's like someone had their pet murdered and minced by the vet who was saying 
"it's nothing, don't worry, he'll be fine", and a few years later they would 
still resent a lying, puppy killing vet.
In that story the vet also invoiced and got paid several times over while he 
was beating the puppy's corpse (and allegedly having necrophiliac farm sex with 
it, but it's never been proven).
In the vet's defence, he did send a leprous, blind Labrador that routinely 
shits on the carpet as a replacement for the puppy, and insisted it's much 
better and only going to get even better with age.

I totally can't see why or how people would be upset after all this time ;)

On Thu, Nov 13, 2014 at 9:53 AM, Graham Bell 
mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com><mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com<mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com>>>
 wrote:
Over 4 years ago, and people still won’t let it go…sigh.

From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com><mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>>
 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com><mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>>]
 On Behalf Of Eric Turman
Sent: 12 November 2014 22:46
To: 
softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com><mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: Re: Buy Softimage - > is this a real shop?

Kind of like Softimage's "bright" future ;P
On Wed, Nov 12, 2014 at 4:41 PM, Graham Bell 
mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com><mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com<mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com>><mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com<mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com><mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com<mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com>>>>
 wrote:
If something looks too good to be true, it probably is.

--




-=T=-



--
Our users will know fear and cower before our software! Ship it! Ship it and 
let them flee like the dogs they are!
<>

RE: Buy Softimage - > is this a real shop?

[Graham Bell]

You spent way too much time on that reply. ☺

Funny though. ☺

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Raffaele Fragapane
Sent: 13 November 2014 02:26
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Buy Softimage - > is this a real shop?

I know, right?

It's like someone had their pet murdered and minced by the vet who was saying 
"it's nothing, don't worry, he'll be fine", and a few years later they would 
still resent a lying, puppy killing vet.
In that story the vet also invoiced and got paid several times over while he 
was beating the puppy's corpse (and allegedly having necrophiliac farm sex with 
it, but it's never been proven).
In the vet's defence, he did send a leprous, blind Labrador that routinely 
shits on the carpet as a replacement for the puppy, and insisted it's much 
better and only going to get even better with age.

I totally can't see why or how people would be upset after all this time ;)

On Thu, Nov 13, 2014 at 9:53 AM, Graham Bell 
mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com>> wrote:
Over 4 years ago, and people still won’t let it go…sigh.

From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>
 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>]
 On Behalf Of Eric Turman
Sent: 12 November 2014 22:46
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: Buy Softimage - > is this a real shop?

Kind of like Softimage's "bright" future ;P
On Wed, Nov 12, 2014 at 4:41 PM, Graham Bell 
mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com><mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com<mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com>>>
 wrote:
If something looks too good to be true, it probably is.

--




-=T=-



--
Our users will know fear and cower before our software! Ship it! Ship it and 
let them flee like the dogs they are!
<>

RE: Buy Softimage - > is this a real shop?

[Graham Bell]

Over 4 years ago, and people still won’t let it go…sigh.

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Eric Turman
Sent: 12 November 2014 22:46
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Buy Softimage - > is this a real shop?

Kind of like Softimage's "bright" future ;P

On Wed, Nov 12, 2014 at 4:41 PM, Graham Bell 
mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com>> wrote:
If something looks too good to be true, it probably is.

--




-=T=-
<>

RE: Buy Softimage - > is this a real shop?

[Graham Bell]

If something looks too good to be true, it probably is.

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Sebastien Sterling
Sent: 12 November 2014 22:34
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Buy Softimage - > is this a real shop?

does that make it legit ?

On 12 November 2014 22:27, Eric Turman 
mailto:i.anima...@gmail.com>> wrote:
"Original Equipment Manufacturer"...software intended to be bundled with 
hardware as a value added deal (usually at a much reduced cost.) Some vendors 
used to skirt around the legalities or compliance of selling the software as a 
stand-alone package by including a defunct chip or other junk electronic 
component.

On Wed, Nov 12, 2014 at 4:25 PM, Ed Harriss 
mailto:ed.harr...@sas.com>> wrote:
It comes in a white box.

From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com]
 On Behalf Of Sebastien Sterling
Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2014 5:22 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Buy Softimage - > is this a real shop?

What does that mean ? OEM a studio sold its licensees ?

On 12 November 2014 20:14, Ed Manning 
mailto:etmth...@gmail.com>> wrote:
from their FAQ: Is there a need to register on the manufacturers website?

As we sell OEM programs, we have already registered our software and so there 
is no need for you to do this again.
uh-huh...

On Wed, Nov 12, 2014 at 9:21 AM, Leo Quensel 
mailto:le...@gmx.de>> wrote:
At this price point it screams scam/pirated software.

Gesendet: Mittwoch, 12. November 2014 um 15:17 Uhr
Von: "Vincent Langer" mailto:m...@vincentlanger.com>>
An: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Betreff: Buy Softimage - > is this a real shop?
hi there,

is this a real shop?

http://www.topsoftpoint.com/browse/search/?q=softimage

cheers,
Vincent

--
Vincent Langer
Uhlandstr. 29
71634 Ludwigsburg
+49 176 965 177 61
www.vincentlanger.com





--




-=T=-

<>

Was: Purchasing softimage 2015

[Graham Bell]

Hi Oz

You should really talk to your reseller about purchase options, you won’t find 
anything on the Autodesk websites.

You can’t buy Softimage 2015 on its own any more. Only existing Softimage 
customers with active Subscriptions are able to buy stand alone Softimage 2015.

See as you have 2013, if there aren’t on Subs, you will have to get current on 
Subs, before then being able to get 2015.



Thx,



Graham




From: Oz Adi mailto:oz@playtech.com>>
Reply-To: 
"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Date: Monday, 20 October 2014 16:13
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: Purchasing softimage 2015

Hi All,

We have 2 softimage 2013 licenses, and we need to upgrade to 2015
The only option I could find on AD site to get Soft 2015, is via the ultimate 
bundle..
Is this really the only option?
Can’t we upgrade our 2013 to 2015? Or buy new soft 2015 licenses?

I am breaking my head on AD awfull website, and can’t find the info I am 
looking for.

Cheers,
Oz.

This communication, which includes any attachments, is sent on behalf of 
Playtech plc or one of its subsidiaries (Playtech Group). It contains 
information which is privileged and confidential and is exclusively intended 
only for the individual(s) or entity named above (Recipient). If you are not 
the intended Recipient, or the person responsible for delivering it to the 
intended Recipient, you are notified that any review, disclosure, 
dissemination, distribution or reproduction of this communication in any way is 
not authorised by the Playtech Group and may be prohibited. If you receive this 
communication by mistake, please notify the sender immediately and then destroy 
any copies of it. Unless expressly stated to the contrary, nothing in this 
communication shall constitute a contractual offer capable of acceptance or 
indicate any intention to create legal relations. Please note that the Playtech 
Group monitors communications sent or received by it for security and other 
purposes. Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do 
not necessarily represent those of the Playtech Group. Details of the companies 
in the Playtech Group are available 
here. Playtech plc is registered 
in the Isle of Man (company number 008505V) with its registered office at 
Ground Floor, St George's Court, Upper Church Street, Douglas IM1 1EE
<>

Re: subscription for maya on linux

[Graham Bell]

Ah interesting. 

I noticed that you couldn¹t download Maya Linux education site, so I
wondered if educators would of obtained Linux through there Autodesk ARC
accounts instead. Perhaps not.

I double checked to correct myself and you can run Maya Linux in
Standalone license, but perhaps with education the Standalone activation
doesn¹t work for the reasons mentioned.

I shall defer to Jill though.



G



On 16/10/2014 16:15, "David Gallagher" 
wrote:

>
>
>On 10/15/2014 5:52 PM, Graham Bell wrote:
>> Hi David
>>
>> To the best of my knowledge, you can 'rent' Maya on Linux, certainly
>>here in the UK anyway, so I assume it will be the same in the US.
>
>Thanks for the info!
>> It shouldn't make a difference with education either, you should be
>>able to obtain a linux install, though I notice you can't download this
>>version from the EDU website.
>
>Someone from Autodesk here says the educational license doesn't work on
>linux?:
>http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/installation-licensing/licensing-maya2013-in
>-linux-just-not-valid/m-p/3839396#M60613
>
>
>>
>> Though this will have to be Network licensed, as Standalone
>>(node-locked) isn't available on Linux. Network licenses are not OS
>>specific, once their running on a server, any insall (Win/Mac/Linux) can
>>just point to the server.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thx,
>>
>>
>> Graham
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
>>[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of David
>>Gallagher
>> Sent: 16 October 2014 00:15
>> To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
>> Subject: subscription for maya on linux
>>
>>
>> Hello! We are planning on offering a linux version of AnimSchool Picker
>>for Maya.
>> www.animschool.com/pickerInfo.aspx
>> We don't have any linux licenses of Maya, and they don't offer them
>>through Autodesk's educational program,  so we're not sure how to
>>proceed.
>>
>> We just need to know if we can rent Maya on linux --long enough to
>>compile AnimSchool Picker. I called and chatted Autodesk and got
>>different responses from different people.
>>
>> Any Autodesk people here know?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Dave G
>>
>> 
>>
>> Autodesk Limited
>> Registered Office: One Discovery Place, Columbus Drive, Farnborough,
>>Hampshire GU14 0NZ
>> Registered in England and Wales, No. 1839239
>>
>

<>

RE: Humanize Maya effort alive? or - Effective customization??

[Graham Bell]

I rarely jump in like this, and I know I probably won’t convince you, but I 
must respectfully disagree with your comments about the modelling toolkit (NEX) 
in Maya.
It actually first appeared in Maya 2014 and has improved with each release and 
extension release since then. There’s some really good stuff in there now.


G

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Sebastien Sterling
Sent: 16 October 2014 10:47
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Humanize Maya effort alive? or - Effective customization??

Dry your eyes mate, we all hurt.
AD does not care about making Maya a good package for the individual, they do 
not conceive of the necessity of people having to use it outside the huge 
studio paradigm where 20 TD's and devs can "fix" it.
They are not a software developer, they have firmly demonstrated that they are 
a software leaser.
There is no heat, no passion to create the best user experience, there are only 
ZUUL (i mean quotas).
And that is effectively the crux of the problem.
They couldn't even integrate NEX properly, was talking to a maya rigger friend 
recently, apparently the new modeling tools clash horribly with the old, 
functionality unevenly spread over or compensated, having you jump all over the 
UI. he blatantly said, "forget about it they broke everything, what makes it 
good for rigging and animation makes it bad for modeling. best wait for what 
ever new package may come out, they will never fix this."
And always the bull shit excuse that these things take time and we are 
integrating it as fast as we can stick with us.
That it takes 3 years (or moar...) to implement something like bitfrost i can 
concede, it's bull shit but i can understand it, but then why EOL the only 
other package in existence that has anywhere close to the same functionality, 
before the bitfrost is completed.
Further more if it took you more then one year to integrate NEX, i'm sorry but 
you have failed ! this shit is not rocket science to any other dedicated 
software company.
Entering year 3 of NEX being in maya and it still not a paradigm that functions 
on its own merits for modeling. that's 3 years to integrate a piece of 
technology, that you didn't  EVEN HAVE TO WRITE !"!!
But then again i suppose it took them more then 15 years to fix rigging... ow 
wait what's that ? Ow yes that's right THEY didn't ! Instead They throw a new 
algorithm pinched from student papers every fucking year. expect to see delta 
mush in the next release, a feature develop by Rythum and Hues probably in 
1998, and readily hand replicated by users in maya houdini and softimage !!!

On 16 October 2014 09:48, skuby mailto:sku...@gmail.com>> 
wrote:
1. When, where and how is the Humanize Maya effort going (if at all?).
2. Has anyone made a dedicated effort to manually configure Maya's hotkeys and 
or UI?

I took a several months long, extremely dedicated effort to make a full jump 
back over  to Maya, after years of being with Soft and having left Maya behind 
for dead, and today I've finally had it, enough is enough, it's just not going 
to happen without further and very serious developments.

I am convinced, that a dedicated TD could fully work out the process of 
mimicking Soft's sticky key system with-in Maya.  The interface for recognizing 
keypress down and keypress release is already existing, however each command 
and tool would need to be assigned a well thought out place on the keyboard as 
well as a memory function script addended to each hotkey so that when it is 
pressed and held, the previous tool being used is recorded, so that after the 
mouse commands were entered (for splitting an edge loop at a selected place on 
the model for example) that the key can be released, and the last used tool or 
method was recalled (for example immediately go back to working in 
multi-component move mode).  Aka, by default in soft, I can be in 
multi-component tweak move mode, pushing and pulling around points, edges and 
faces as if my geo were a sculpture, and then at any moment, hold down the "]" 
key, click the mouse where I want to split in an edge loop - immediately giving 
me a loop where I want it, clicking again where and if needed to add further 
loops, and upon finally releasing the "]" key, I am automagically and 
immediately brought back to multi-component move mode where I can continue 
refining OR whatever previous function I was using in some other case.  This 
entire sticky key system is possible, I believe, to mimic in Maya, but it is a 
lot of work, and it is work unrelated to the direct process of being an artist 
and making 3D worlds and inhabitants and bringing them to life.  In other 
words, it's a major distraction for an artist to approach and would be better 
handled as a sold separate tool that one could buy to accompany their Maya 
installation.

I cannot seriously entertain a further continuation of using Maya as a primary

RE: Autodesk Rebrand Presentation Intro

[Graham Bell]

That’s just the intro to some of the video content we do. I actually really 
like it., especially compared to the previous stuff.
All the new branding, imagery, etc, itself was actually done in-house using (to 
the best of knowledge) mostly 3ds Max.


G


From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Ponthieux, Joseph 
G. (LARC-E1A)[LITES]
Sent: 15 September 2014 15:21
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: RE: Autodesk Rebrand Presentation Intro

Looks a bit like a mix between the XSI 2.0 and XSI 4.0 packaging it does

--
Joey
__
Opinions stated here-in are strictly those of the author and do not
represent the opinions of NASA or any other party.

From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
 [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Helge Mathee
Sent: Monday, September 15, 2014 10:14 AM
To: Thomas Volkmann; 
softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Autodesk Rebrand Presentation Intro

that actually looks like some of the wavy original softimage material.

On 15.09.2014 16:12, Thomas Volkmann wrote:
knowing that they used c4d for that is as much fun as the soccer-worldcup 
facepalm logo. made my day!

Ognjen Vukovic  hat am 15. 
September 2014 um 15:44 geschrieben:
Oh, the irony of it all.

On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:39 PM, Paulo Cesar Duarte 
mailto:paulocdua...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Looks like Cinema 4d it's a good alternative, nice motion graphics.

https://vimeo.com/100812737




--
paulo-duarte.com



<>

RE: SoftImage Artists take on Maya @ Escape Studios

[Graham Bell]

It’s not a problem. As I said before I’m not taking anything personally at all 
(honest), though I can see how it might look that way. Adrian’s right, I do 
have some company line to tow, but all I’m trying to do sometimes is to 
hopefully clarify some facts, then you can rant. ☺

As for the term “open”, Mark and I both used this term and I think it’s 
relevant when talking about Maya (even now after all these years), especially 
when looking at Maya for the first time from a ground zero point of view. I’d 
have to ride on Raff’s coat tails though in that his explanation (endorsed by 
Jordi) is the one I tend to use to describe the relevant Maya context.

I can’t really take any credit for the training though, its more down to people 
like Jill, Darren (who manages my team), Mark and Nikki.


G


From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Eric Turman
Sent: 10 September 2014 20:27
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: SoftImage Artists take on Maya @ Escape Studios

Graham, I apologize for calling you out on the personal bit, it was uncalled 
for.

Cheers,
-=Eric T.


<>

RE: SoftImage Artists take on Maya @ Escape Studios

[Graham Bell]

I accept all that, and I'm not taking anything personal at all. I'd actually 
flip that point a little and ask some to maybe do the same. :)

The point I wanted to make was, there was no agenda to this training, we 
weren't expecting to suddenly win people over. And using someone like Escape, 
provides a good context of neutrality.

G

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of adrian wyer
Sent: 10 September 2014 11:19
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: RE: SoftImage Artists take on Maya @ Escape Studios

didn't want to chime in on this thread, but can'tresist...

Graham, we know that as an autodesk representative, you have to, at least to 
some extent, tow the party line
but you have to face facts, we as Softimage users have had this situation 
forced upon us by a seemingly uncaring software behemoth

it will take YEARS for the resentment to fizzle out

just because the list has settled down of late (it's disappointingly like a 
ghost town in here most days) it doesn't mean the embers of our collective 
anger aren't still glowing away

occasionally, for many months to come, they will flare up

I welcome the initiative to help artists move across to maya, even seen as a 
purely financial one from the point of the company that makes the 'other' 
software
And i'll be honest, for every 10 things that i find, while stumbling blindly 
through the maya minefield, that are infuriating, there are usually a couple 
that are pleasantly surprising it's not 'all' bad!

i guess what i'm saying is keep up the initiatives, hold people's hands through 
this unwelcome transition, and in the long term, they'll appreciate it

but don't expect users not to throw abuse occasionally when you stick your head 
above the parapet!

cheers

a




<>

Re: SoftImage Artists take on Maya @ Escape Studios

[Graham Bell]

Actually, from what I could tell, there aren’t any direct comments from Mark in 
that blog post.

Personally, I thought I did a great job, but if you guys want to spin it into 
something it wasn’t, I guess that’s your prerogative.


G


From: Jordi Bares mailto:jordiba...@gmail.com>>
Reply-To: 
"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Date: Tuesday, 9 September 2014 19:08
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: Re: SoftImage Artists take on Maya @ Escape Studios

Happy to see the coments form Mark, valuable information and goes to confirm 
what I knew all along, AD killed the wrong product.

:-P

Jordi Bares
jordiba...@gmail.com



<>

RE: SoftImage Artists take on Maya @ Escape Studios

[Graham Bell]

Actually that wasn’t the tone (or the point) of the training at all, quote the 
opposite in fact.


G

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Sebastien Sterling
Sent: 09 September 2014 17:44
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: SoftImage Artists take on Maya @ Escape Studios

lol +1 Mirko
The problem is still the same Maya demands heavy customization and maintenance 
to be serviceable
you can't compare them out of the box or per maintenance cost.
and it will still be a problem for small studios, all of a sudden having to 
hire an extra employee, who's only there so there regular team can function.

You could argue this creates jobs, but what it really does is take two wheels 
of your car and replace them with wheels of cheese and have a cheese maker on 
standby to replace the cheese wheels every time they break down.
Tortured analogy check!
Sorry to TD's, i do not equate you all to cheese makers :P

On 9 September 2014 17:30, Mirko Jankovic 
mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>> wrote:
In short,

With Maya you workaround, with Softimage you work

On Tue, Sep 9, 2014 at 6:18 PM, Paulo Cesar Duarte 
mailto:paulocdua...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Softimage users having a first experience with Maya:

http://www.escapestudios.com/softimage-artists-take-on-maya-escape-studios/

"To summarise, Maya is extremely powerful, as is Softimage. Maya does not have 
the eloquence or the innovative interface and is overly complex but it has been 
designed to be entirely open. Maybe too open for this week’s class. This has 
perplexed a lot of the broadcast/commercials participants this week  who want 
to turn a job round quickly who thrive on the structure and organization of the 
exquisitely designed explorer. Developing their pipeline in Maya for these guys 
will be a tough call but they will have left this course with a good 
understanding of the difference in approach, what Maya is all about and what 
lies ahead of them."


Cheers.
Paulo Duarte


<>

Re: maya uv tool broken?

[Graham Bell]

Personally I never really got on with the interactive split tool when it was 
added, and would always revert back to the original Split Poly.
I’m really liking the updated Multi-Cit tool in 2015 though, which combines a 
few features, including those two.

G


From: "raffsxsil...@googlemail.com" 
mailto:raffsxsil...@googlemail.com>>
Reply-To: 
"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Date: Sunday, 7 September 2014 07:26
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: Re: maya uv tool broken?

Honestly, I'd have to see it to figure it out.
I have had general wonkyness here and there, the uncomfortable click and key 
combinations and stuff it uses can make for some odd interaction in my 
experience, but usually it's just that uncomfortable, not random.

A couple colleagues around me, who've never used anything other than Maya, had 
more or less the same experience, but tended to attribute it to randomness, 
until I took them over what the behaviour actually is in what conditions, and 
they eventually got over it and got used to the MTK in 2014/15 (some changes 
between the two).

Pre-2014 though I can't help you, I'd rather chew on broken glass and infected 
syringes than model something in Maya 2013 or prior.


On Sun, Sep 7, 2014 at 4:05 PM, Martin 
mailto:furik...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Speaking about Maya weird bugs and possible drivers issues, is it normal that 
the split tool and interactive split tool sometimes just don't create some 
edges I'm drawing? I'm working with 2013 and while the old split tool is more 
reliable, even with its snap not snapping, it still buggy.

Martin
Sent from my iPhone

<>

Re: EOL and using older Softimages

[Graham Bell]

I was referring to making financial sense for a customer. Essentially, 
Subscription helps give the best of both worlds – keeping up to date and 
retaining previous versions, for the lowest potential cost.

G

From: Mirko Jankovic 
mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>>
Reply-To: 
"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Date: Monday, 11 August 2014 18:46
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: Re: EOL and using older Softimages

It is not stupid.. for finance reasons as Graham already said. It makes perfect 
sense from financial point for AD.
It makes really bad one for people that actually have to use it. Or it is like 
target only latest one..the rest.. f*k them.. same message SI users already had 
in their face


On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 7:25 PM, Martin 
mailto:furik...@gmail.com>> wrote:
I think we all know that nobody uses the latest version for any project, or at 
least almost nobody (personally I've never used the latest version, only for 
testing). And some very long projects use 4 years old or more versions and you 
need to keep upgrading for the other projects that may use 2 or 3 years old 
versions. This is specially common in game development, right now I'm sill 
using 2011 in some projects.

Yet the only version you can buy or rent is the latest one, which nobody uses 
and can't save in previous versions, so it is completely useless for work. And 
subscription gives you only 3 versions that are clearly not enough.

So, the only way for a newcomer to enter this 3D business is to time travel, or 
buy a $6K+ software plus subscription per PC at least 2 or 3 years before you 
get into the 3D business.

Now how stupid is this system ?

Martin
Sent from my iPhone



<>

RE: EOL and using older Softimages

[Graham Bell]

Yes, I guess that’s one way you could look at it.
Another way might be that it might make more sense from the financial point of 
view, depending on your circumstances of course.
Previously, I think you could get away with dropping off subs for maybe a year 
or two, because the upgrade policy/price (for 3 versions back) was only 50% of 
the price of a new seat. Some were prepared to swallow that cost. Now that has 
changed and all upgrades are currently 70%, it's a far bigger hit. If you 
always want to be current, then being on Subs is the better option.
And as of Feb 1st 2015, users will be unable to upgrade old versions to the 
current version, so if you want the current version you have to buy a new seat. 
However, there’s more options for purchasing now, with the various Desktop 
Subscriptions options available.
Like with any kind of purchasing, the trick is to do your sums. Though I can’t 
comment about what other vendors do, as tbh, I don’t have all the facts.

As for versions that are older than 3 versions, this did come up in a previous 
thread some time ago. I couldn’t find the thread, but I believe I checked at 
the time and customers (via the Subscription Center) could request a license 
for an older version if you needed to access old data.

http://upandready.typepad.com/up_and_ready/2014/01/previous-use-license-request-running-software-that-is-more-than-3-versions-back.html




G








From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Mirko Jankovic
Sent: 11 August 2014 16:17
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: EOL and using older Softimages

How ever you put it it is stil fact that model was made ONLY to push people to 
subs meaning steady income for AD with less need to actually improve anything 
in each new version.
AND
That model is retarded for this kind o industry as there are a lot of people 
with need to access old projects that for this or that reason someone need to 
open up, some from 5 years ago.
That model is simply not something that works with what is reality as it is 
pointed out so many times here.


On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 4:00 PM, Graham Bell 
mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com>> wrote:
Point of note – the ability to have previous version usage has been a benefit 
to active Subscription customers (only), for some time now. And (barring some 
exceptions) this applies across the entire Autodesk portfolio, so Softimage 
isn’t being single out here.

Also Softimage 2012 is still available to customers with running 2015 and 
active Subscriptions.
Previous version usage, and support, is for the current versions and 3 versions 
back.

G

From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>
 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>]
 On Behalf Of pete...@skynet.be<mailto:pete...@skynet.be>
Sent: 10 August 2014 12:01
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: EOL and using older Softimages

> preventing the use of previous versions unless you basically commit forever,

and even then – only 3 versions back!

2012 is now officially off-limits for subscription customers.
I remember a message from an AD rep here, suggesting not to upgrade a few 
licenses just in order to keep access to an older version -
thus diluting one’s license park.
it’s anti-customer behavior, directed ONLY at licensed and paying customers, 
devaluating their investment.

what you did up to 3 years ago is being ‘obsoleted’ -
for long format work that’s like saying: your previous project is off bounds. 
This in an industry (entertainment) thriving on sequels !
funny reading just the other day about Weta’s own new renderer in that other 
thread – where they mention opening shots from “old” projects such as Tintin or 
the first Hobbit – and re-rendering them. Where this was actually a design 
constraint they set themselves.

And here’s AD going: hey, if we can prevent you from doing this, we will!

Sure, you can try and open those scenes on a newer version, and pray nothing 
breaks. Oh right, if you’re on Maya, don’t forget  to recompile all those 
plugins you don’t have the source code for. Doh.

> Personally can't wait for competition.

Amen to that. I stuck it out on Softimage, waiting for the next gen software 
from AD to replace Maya/Max/XSI.
Definitely not doing that anymore - at this point my ONLY criterium for a 
replacement is that it isn’t AD.




On 08/09/14 8:22, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote:

Yes you lose the right to run three versions back when the subscription lapses. 
  You can only run the last version you installed.
On Aug 8, 2014 2:09 PM, "phil harbath" 
mailto:phil.harb...@jamination.com><mailto:phil.harb...@jamination.com<mailto:phil.harb...@jamination.com>>>
 wrote:
What was the final verdict on using older ver

RE: EOL and using older Softimages

[Graham Bell]

Point of note – the ability to have previous version usage has been a benefit 
to active Subscription customers (only), for some time now. And (barring some 
exceptions) this applies across the entire Autodesk portfolio, so Softimage 
isn’t being single out here.

Also Softimage 2012 is still available to customers with running 2015 and 
active Subscriptions.
Previous version usage, and support, is for the current versions and 3 versions 
back.

G

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of pete...@skynet.be
Sent: 10 August 2014 12:01
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: EOL and using older Softimages

> preventing the use of previous versions unless you basically commit forever,

and even then – only 3 versions back!

2012 is now officially off-limits for subscription customers.
I remember a message from an AD rep here, suggesting not to upgrade a few 
licenses just in order to keep access to an older version -
thus diluting one’s license park.
it’s anti-customer behavior, directed ONLY at licensed and paying customers, 
devaluating their investment.

what you did up to 3 years ago is being ‘obsoleted’ -
for long format work that’s like saying: your previous project is off bounds. 
This in an industry (entertainment) thriving on sequels !
funny reading just the other day about Weta’s own new renderer in that other 
thread – where they mention opening shots from “old” projects such as Tintin or 
the first Hobbit – and re-rendering them. Where this was actually a design 
constraint they set themselves.

And here’s AD going: hey, if we can prevent you from doing this, we will!

Sure, you can try and open those scenes on a newer version, and pray nothing 
breaks. Oh right, if you’re on Maya, don’t forget  to recompile all those 
plugins you don’t have the source code for. Doh.

> Personally can't wait for competition.

Amen to that. I stuck it out on Softimage, waiting for the next gen software 
from AD to replace Maya/Max/XSI.
Definitely not doing that anymore - at this point my ONLY criterium for a 
replacement is that it isn’t AD.




On 08/09/14 8:22, Luc-Eric Rousseau wrote:

Yes you lose the right to run three versions back when the subscription lapses. 
  You can only run the last version you installed.
On Aug 8, 2014 2:09 PM, "phil harbath" 
mailto:phil.harb...@jamination.com>> wrote:
What was the final verdict on using older versions of Softimage,  I saw on the 
EOL page you could use up to 3 versions back.  Does that require the user to be 
on active subscription.  My case is I am on 2015 but my subscription just 
lapsed.


Phil Harbath
jamination

<>

RE: Maya 2015 Node Editor

[Graham Bell]

Yeah, I don't think much was done to the Node Editor for 2015, other than some 
fixes and minor tweaks. It's by no means a complete replacement for some Maya 
features yet, because you can't properly graph things like the Hypershade, 
Hypergraph, and Bifrost.yet. :-)

Eric, you need to get on the Beta.


-Original Message-
From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Eric Mootz
Sent: 15 July 2014 09:20
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Maya 2015 Node Editor

Hey guys,

Just installed Maya 2015, because I need its SDK to compile some plugins.

Out of curiosity I took a look at the new version, especially the node editor. 
A few weeks ago I heard or read that they had improved the node editor, but 
from what I saw it is the same unusable piece of crap as before... not even 
close to the ICE Tree editor in Softimage.

Did I miss something?? Is there a new node editor in Maya 2015 or not?

Thanks!
Eric


<>

Re: More acquisitions from Autodesk

[Graham Bell]

MayaLT is actually aimed specifically at the indie game developer, many of whom 
are developing for iOS/Android platforms.

The DX11 viewport support was a big thing for games guys and one of the reasons 
why it was done, as well as the .NET API support. That and the VP2.0 visual 
fidelity has been extended to FBX review, which is a free standalone viewer 
that work on mac, windows and now iOS.


G


From: Nicolas Esposito <3dv...@gmail.com>
Reply-To: 
"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Date: Tuesday, 10 June 2014 07:40
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: Re: More acquisitions from Autodesk

Wow, they're really pushing the game creation content lately...I guess they 
want a piece of cake of the Unity/Unreal Engine 4 marketand also they're 
copying Blender, since it has its own 3d game engine since...a couple of years 
maybe?
I don't know why they're not developing a fully functional realtime viewer 
inside Max/Maya...DX11 is quite nice, but not yet there in terms of shading and 
lighting...
I'm also glad about the Maya LT price drop...but FBX polygon export limit? 
seriously? c'mon, you can aim only to iOS/Android games whit that limit...



2014-06-10 4:18 GMT+02:00 Sebastien Sterling 
mailto:sebastien.sterl...@gmail.com>>:
what's the point if you can't make doomsday viruses with it...


On 10 June 2014 00:00, Emilio Hernandez 
mailto:emi...@e-roja.com>> wrote:
Autodesk Buys Bitsquid Game Engine Creator

Videogame Technology to Be Integrated in Visualization Tools for Other 
Content-Creation Products


http://www.studiodaily.com/2014/06/autodesk-buys-bitsquid-game-engine-creator/?hq_e=el&hq_m=2895337&hq_l=6&hq_v=231428e7f1
---
Emilio Hernández   VFX & 3D animation.



<>

RE: Photogrammetry - what do you use?

[Graham Bell]

Photo on ReCap 360 supports all lenses with standard optics. Exceptions are 
fish-eyes, which need to be removed before being processed.
Although Gopro Hero 3 and 3+ support has recently been added.


G

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Jens Lindgren
Sent: 09 June 2014 06:55
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Photogrammetry - what do you use?

And of course I found the answer in the PhotoScan documentation :)
FYI, PhotoScan wants completely unaltered images and handles the lens 
distortion itself.

/Jens



On Mon, Jun 9, 2014 at 7:31 AM, Jens Lindgren 
mailto:jens.lindgren@gmail.com>> wrote:
One more thing, is it a good idea to remove lens distortion and vignetting from 
the captured images as a pre-process, or is it better to let Recap / PhotoScan 
handle that automatically?

/Jens



On Wed, Jun 4, 2014 at 11:41 PM, Stephen Davidson 
mailto:magic...@bellsouth.net>> wrote:
this
http://3dprintingindustry.com/2013/09/16/3-sweep-sweeps-the-net-with-smart-2d-to-3d-conversion/

looks very promising, but still in development, I believe.

On Wed, Jan 29, 2014 at 10:08 AM, Marc-Andre Carbonneau 
mailto:marc-andre.carbonn...@ubisoft.com>> 
wrote:
Hello friends,

I am currently investigating photogrammetry and would love to get your advices, 
opinions, experiences with such systems.
What hardware do you use? Which software? Best practices?

Thank you for any info!
MAC


[cid:image002.jpg@01CDBD94.314AAF40]

Marc-André Carbonneau
Product Specialist








--

Best Regards,
  Stephen P. Davidson
   (954) 552-7956
sdavid...@3danimationmagic.com

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic

 - 
Arthur C. Clarke

[http://www.3danimationmagic.com/3Danimation_magic_logo_sign.jpg]


--
Jens Lindgren
--
Lead Technical Director
Magoo 3D Studios



--
Jens Lindgren
--
Lead Technical Director
Magoo 3D Studios
<>

RE: Photogrammetry - what do you use?

[Graham Bell]

I’m just highlighting something that you might already have access to.


From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Vladimir 
Jankijevic
Sent: 04 June 2014 17:09
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Photogrammetry - what do you use?

and then you tell me how this is more convenient than having a desktop solution 
for this kind of stuff? please try to convince me ;)

cheers
vladimir

On Wed, Jun 4, 2014 at 11:31 AM, Graham Bell 
mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com>> wrote:
If you have Maintenance Subscription or Desktop Subscription for Maya, Max, or 
Mudbox, you actually already have free access to ReCap 360. This includes the 
Photogrammetry service Photo on ReCap 360.

There is some limitation though, it’s capped at 50 images and export formats 
are limited, but it’s more than good enough for some things.
You can subscribe to the service for an annual of something like £45, then you 
can go up to 250 images and there’s more export formats.
The only things you’ll need are cloud credits for submitting data for 
generation.


G

<>

RE: Photogrammetry - what do you use?

[Graham Bell]

If you have Maintenance Subscription or Desktop Subscription for Maya, Max, or 
Mudbox, you actually already have free access to ReCap 360. This includes the 
Photogrammetry service Photo on ReCap 360.

There is some limitation though, it’s capped at 50 images and export formats 
are limited, but it’s more than good enough for some things.
You can subscribe to the service for an annual of something like £45, then you 
can go up to 250 images and there’s more export formats.
The only things you’ll need are cloud credits for submitting data for 
generation.


G



From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Esposito
Sent: 04 June 2014 16:10
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Photogrammetry - what do you use?

I'm using it for scans of my face for some reference, since its more precise 
then scanning with Kinect, and it does a pretty good job with 60 jpgs ( 
turntable, using a 1100D reflex ), even with my crappy 4 years old i7 2.7 Ghz 
in 15 minutes I have the scan ready, without any masking on the pictures, then 
directly into Zbrush for Zremesher and export :)

2014-06-04 16:36 GMT+02:00 Manuel Huertas Marchena 
mailto:lito...@hotmail.com>>:
hope this link works:
http://www.zbrushworkshops.com/content/jeffrey-wilsons-photogrammetry-webinar-replay?inf_contact_key=50b547bc23da9a70a5bec51783577fe7e0f16b49c92c9a6e534db770494136fd

is an agisoft webinar, jeff wilson goes in detail into the difference betwen 
versions if I am not wrong,
I am big fan of photogrammetry for environment creation but a bit new to 
photoscan that video helped me
understand the process.

you could also use 3dequalizer to generate a point cloud from stills or even 
nuke 8 with the still solver/model builder
although I have yet to try that.

The workflow I was used to is with image modeler but unfortunately its not 
available anymore, although if you have access
to it with your autodesk subscription I would defintetly give it a try it still 
does the job well.

Regards


-Manu




IMDB | Portfolio  | 
Vimeo | 
Linkedin


Date: Wed, 4 Jun 2014 16:14:48 +0200

Subject: Re: Photogrammetry - what do you use?
From: m...@vincentlanger.com
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com

depends on what you want to do.
I think the main difference to the professional version is the ability to 
orient the scene and to do 4D mesh generation (from video input).
cheers,
vincent


2014-06-04 16:02 GMT+02:00 Jens Lindgren 
mailto:jens.lindgren@gmail.com>>:
Thread resurrection time!
So I got a project that needs some photogrammetry and I'm looking at Agisoft 
PhotosScan right now. Only have one question: Standard or Professional? The 
price difference is huge!

/Jens

On Thu, Jan 30, 2014 at 5:00 AM, Francisco Criado 
mailto:malcriad...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hi Octavian, i used a couple of times skanect for people or indoor sets and 
must say its a time saver. If you can, give it a try!

Francisco.


On Wednesday, January 29, 2014, Octavian Ureche 
mailto:okt...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Interesting topic here.
Was just testing agisoft photoscan for some non commercial related work, and it 
seems to give pretty nice results with minimal user input.
Has anyone tried to compare a kinekt based approach such as skanect 
(http://skanect.manctl.com) with a photogrammetrical approach for object 
scanning?

I am curious about the pros and cons of both.

Cheers,
O

On Wed, Jan 29, 2014 at 7:36 PM, Ed Manning 
mailto:etmth...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Recap and 123D Catch from Autodesk do very well with some subject matter.

NukeX also has camera tracking, point-could generation and meshing, and can 
export geo and camera.

On Wed, Jan 29, 2014 at 10:08 AM, Marc-Andre Carbonneau 
mailto:marc-andre.carbonn...@ubisoft.com>> 
wrote:

Hello friends,



I am currently investigating photogrammetry and would love to get your advices, 
opinions, experiences with such systems.

What hardware do you use? Which software? Best practices?



Thank you for any info!

MAC





[cid:image002.jpg@01CDBD94.314AAF40]


Marc-André Carbonneau

Product Specialist













--
Octavian Ureche
 +40 732 774 313 (GMT+2)
 Animation & Visual Effects
  www.okto.ro


--
Jens Lindgren
--
Lead Technical Director
Magoo 3D Studios



--
Vincent Langer
Uhlandstr. 29
71638 Ludwigsburg
+49 176 965 177 61
www.vincentlanger.com

<>

RE: VERY OT: Nice ICE - Ron Jeremy video

[Graham Bell]

I have the video.somewhere.

That was of a time, that we do not speak of anymore. :)


From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Alan Fregtman
Sent: 29 April 2014 18:59
To: XSI Mailing List
Subject: Re: VERY OT: Nice ICE - Ron Jeremy video

I too saw this video, but I don't know where to get it.

I guess he probably asked for removal after he found out the party was full of 
softies. :p


On Tue, Apr 29, 2014 at 1:53 PM, Leendert A. Hartog 
mailto:hirazib...@live.nl>> wrote:
I know this is very OT, but it's also a piece of obscure Softimage history, 
that as such deserves unearthing IMHO...
An early video of the "nice ICE" party Softimage threw to commemorate the 
release of XSI 7 included a short sound-bite by Ron Jeremy, who apparently 
belonged to musical guest Vanilla ICE's entourage. Shortly thereafter this 
video was replaced by a new official edit and Ron Jeremy wasn't in it anymore. 
I have been looking all over for this original version of this video, but alas 
have so far been unsuccessful. So, before nobody knows what I am talking about 
anymore, I'm turning to you all, hoping one of you still has a copy of this on 
his/her hard drive...

Greetz
Leendert


--



Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue

Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com






Autodesk Limited
Registered Office: One Discovery Place, Columbus Drive, Farnborough, Hampshire 
GU14 0NZ
Registered in England and Wales, No. 1839239
<>

RE: Humanize Maya project

[Graham Bell]

Plus with Suites, Maya/Max users were a target for Softimage usage and 
adoption, so made more sense for those interaction modes, rather than the other 
way round.

-Original Message-
From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Brent McPherson
Sent: 11 April 2014 17:07
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: RE: Humanize Maya project

Suites were about interop and using the best features of each product so the 
suite development focused on this.

To that end it wouldn't have made sense to try and make any package in the 
suite emulate all the others. Softimage already had Maya/Max key bindings but 
this was pre-existing functionality and had it not existed I do not think it 
would have been developed for the suites.
--
Brent

-Original Message-
From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Leendert A. Hartog
Sent: 11 April 2014 16:24
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Humanize Maya project

Brent McPherson schreef op 11-4-2014 17:18:
> You almost never see market leaders making these types of moves as the 
> potential returns will be much smaller.
But once they started sharing suites together, the story changed ever so 
slightly, one would image... ;)

Greetz
Leendert

-- 

Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue
Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com


<>

Re: Transitional license & 2015 releases

[Graham Bell]

Question 10 of the Softimage transition FAQ answers the question getting
current in order to transition to Maya or Max.


10. I am on an older version and wish to transition to Maya or 3ds Max.
Can I? 
To be eligible to transition to either 3ds Max with Softimage or Maya with
Softimage you will need to upgrade your software to the latest
version of Softimage using standard Autodesk upgrade paths. Versions older
than 6 versions back are typically not eligible for upgrades
and other limitations may apply. Once you have upgraded to the latest
version, you must also purchase a Subscription contract to gain
access to the transition offerings described in question 5.
 
Please note that after February 1, 2015, Autodesk will no longer offer
software upgrades for purchase for all of its software products.



Also for having to use a reseller, you kinda have to, because you can¹t
get the upgrade or Subs via the online store anymore. (For Softimage
anyway)


G



On 09/04/2014 19:29, "Leendert A. Hartog"  wrote:

>Thanks
>
>-- 
>
>Leendert A. Hartog AKA Hirazi Blue
>Administrator NOT the owner of si-community.com
>

<>

RE: 答复: Re[2]: March 28, 2014

[Graham Bell]

I'm sorry I wouldn't necessarily agree with the second point below.

I'm not saying that we're perfect, but there are different levels of engagement 
and we're not as invisible as many might seem to believe. 

-Original Message-
From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Angus Davidson
Sent: 02 April 2014 15:40
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: RE: 答复: Re[2]: March 28, 2014

Hi Luceric

You conveniently seem to forget a few things

a) You are on the inside (with all the knowledge )looking out as opposed to 
have no information and looking in.
b) Places like the Foundry and SideFX engage with their clients on a level AD 
has even come close to. Even in the last month.
c) You should be worrying less about conspiracy theories and more about how 
unprofessional your last post makes you and by extension your employer look 
like.
d) Treating people with respect even when they are wrong goes down much better.
e) There is a big difference between calling people out and correcting things, 
and purposely trying to make them feel stupid.

So done here.












w unless the University agrees in writing to the contrary.  
 

<>

RE: Merge two meshes + transfer weights - Adapting Softimage workflow in Maya

[Graham Bell]

I never said there's the exact same GATOR functionality and feature in Maya, 
only you can do much of the same stuff.

This is where you start to see the differences between how Maya and Softimage 
structures data and you look at the different Maya nodes in the dependency 
graph. When you looks these nodes, you can do a lot of the GATOR stuff, but I 
agree that it's way way simpler, easier and cleaner in Softimage using GATOR.


From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Martin Yara
Sent: 25 March 2014 16:46
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Merge two meshes + transfer weights - Adapting Softimage workflow 
in Maya

Yes, pretty much everything requires a lot more clicking in Maya.

BTW, you can't change topology without messing up your weights, so you'll need 
to or save your weights by global position with an script like doraSkinWeights, 
or duplicate your mesh and keep it as a weight container to copy weights to 
your edited mesh.

I don't think there is a way to edit your mesh and keep the original weights 
just like they are, like you can in Softimage. You can get only approximations 
with copy weights or scripts, relying in UVs or global position.

After doing all of this, now you need one more edge in your model? well, start 
again with the whole process.

So yes, the workflow is a mess compared to SI and is a lot more time consuming.

I disagree with Graham. You can't do GATOR inside Maya. You can get a similar 
final results with 10x more clicks, but it isn't the same, and you don't have a 
Gator op alive.

The send to Softimage is a good alternative when you can do it (basically 
envelope, uv and mesh modeling). Sadly, there are a lot of features that can't 
be translated between them like Maya crease edges or sets, or Softimage hard 
edges, so you'll have to re-build them. I haven't tried shapes + send to SI.

Martin

<>

RE: Merge two meshes + transfer weights - Adapting Softimage workflow in Maya

[Graham Bell]

Yeah, you can do much of the stuff from GATOR inside Maya, but some things are 
scattered about.
The great thing about GATOR is that it's all in one place, kinda a 'one stop 
shop'

G


From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Esposito
Sent: 25 March 2014 08:58
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Merge two meshes + transfer weights - Adapting Softimage workflow 
in Maya

Good to know, it just requires more clicking...
Thanks Martin

I'm so tempted to use Houdini :)

2014-03-25 9:47 GMT+01:00 Martin Yara 
mailto:furik...@gmail.com>>:
I haven't used that much Mayas latest versions, but AFAIK no.

You would need to:

- Reset to Bind Pose
- Duplicate obj A and obj B
- Combine duplicated unskinned obj A to obj B (getting obj C)
- Select obj C and apply bind Skin.
- Select obj A, obj B and obj C and apply Copy Skin Weights (inside Animation / 
Skin, Edit Smooth Skin)
- Delete old obj A and obj B


Martin


On Tue, Mar 25, 2014 at 5:32 PM, Nicolas Esposito 
<3dv...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi all,

I already asked this question on a Maya forum and I didn't get an answer 
basically...

I'm merging together two rigs, one for the head and one for the body.
What I'm doing is parenting the root of the head rig to the neck bone of the 
body, then merge the two meshes and transfer the weights ( using the merge PPG 
), in order to keep the enveloping on both of them ( and later on a bit of 
smoothing on the weights ).
This is my simple workflow in Softimage, the main reason is to have a single 
mesh with both head+body rigged.

Now I'm translating the same workflow in Maya.
Parenting of the head rig to the body rig not a problem, done.
The problem is when I'm trying to merge and create a unique mesh with both 
envelopes...looks like the weights can't be transfered or some scripting is 
needed in order to do that
Well, nothing out of the box allow me to do that in Maya?

If I'm not wrong the merging operator act as GATOR, and I know that the tool is 
not available inside Maya, but seriously there's no way to merge and blend the 
weights between two meshes?

Sorry to bother you with quesion regarding Maya but looks like here some of you 
use both of them so better ask :)

Cheers

Nicolas


<>

RE: ICE - When will we have todays functionality in Maya?

[Graham Bell]

Can we perhaps avoid trying to pin Adrian up against a wall for a definitive 
answer? :)

I know that people are wanting to know more, but we might not be able to 
comment on future stuff too much, for the reasons Maurice as mentioned before. 
Much of this discussion might be suited for the Beta forums.


G

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Juan Brockhaus
Sent: 21 March 2014 17:16
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: ICE - When will we have todays functionality in Maya?

totally agree with Martin and Peter.
that's exactly what I'm also very much interested in.
will BiFrost be as versatile as ICE? ;-)

Juan

On Fri, Mar 21, 2014 at 5:09 PM, Peter Agg 
mailto:peter@googlemail.com>> wrote:
"Future releases could encompass more types of solvers (rigid, cloth, fluid, 
liquid, etc, all interacting). And from there, it would be amazing to see more 
procedural geometry generation, destruction and stuff like that."
Just stepping away from solvers etc for a moment though: could I use Bifrost to 
do something un-simulated and simple like (for argument's sake) add the frame 
number onto the vertex y positions on an object if they're inside the volume of 
a polygon sphere?
I know personally I'm not worried about the big effects, it's the small 
day-to-day 'simple' stuff which is where I'm concerned about not having ICE.

On 21 March 2014 16:53, Adrian Graham 
mailto:adrian.gra...@autodesk.com>> wrote:
Ah, but may I respectfully point out that this was one of the problems with 
ICE, in that its complete and total integration into Softimage makes it 
difficult to engineer and manage, from a software and, unfortunately, a 
marketing point of view.

Most modern software libraries are platform-agnostic, and this is what we're 
aiming for with Bifrost. The problem with ICE is that you had to use Softimage 
in order to gain access to it. Nothing against Softimage, just that you're 
limiting ICE's exposure to the industry at large.

Would a renderer be more or less popular if it only worked with Maya, and not 
with Max or Houdini? No, it should be available on all applications, on all OSs 
if you want it to be successful.

Adrian

From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com]
 On Behalf Of Chris Marshall
Sent: Friday, March 21, 2014 6:52 AM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: ICE - When will we have todays functionality in Maya?
I think we can see there's some reason to look into Bifrost, but I also have a 
nagging feeling it's simply never going to achieve the same level of 
functionality as ICE, for the very reason ICE is essentially being shut down. 
ICE does what it does and is so much more than a particle system, because it is 
built into the very core of Softimage. To attempt to make Bifrost 'future 
proof' they are deliberately *not* building it into the core of Maya, thus 
allowing for the potential for it to be standalone and / or plugged into other 
software / platforms at a later date. But by approaching it in this way, it'll 
only ever be a bolt on, that surely can never achieve that level of flexibility 
that we have with ICE at the heart of Softimage. It feels that the very thing 
that makes ICE such an amazing tool is actually causing it's downfall, and is 
the reason Bifrost can never replace it. And that totally sucks!


On 21 March 2014 10:29, Juan Brockhaus 
mailto:juanxsil...@gmail.com>>>
 wrote:

Hey Adrian,
this is some great info here. and makes me suddenly feel spmehow better ;-)
maybe in two/three years time, when Soft slowly falls back (just due to no 
further development) BiFrost will be in a state where it can take over...? 
(wishful thinking)
If I read between the lines I feel there is hope that BiFrost is not 'just' a 
fluid simulation system and can be used for far more.

Exactly what I personally (and many others) love about ICE. It is (contrary to 
past Autodesk-PR) NOT just a particle-simulation-system, but a swiss army tool 
which can manipulate almost every aspect of data in my scene/objects and build, 
create, deform, etc...
ie at the moment I build shapes/objects made out of dominos. All procedurally 
build in ICE. I made different compounds to stack and pile dominoes in 
different ways and methods. And if the objects I have to create (and even the 
domino) change (as usual in commercials..) it is all instantly updated.
Only right at the end I add a Sim node and the whole things collapses... 
(obviously controlled with nulls, forces, etc...) The Sim is basically the last 
5% of what I use ICE for.
If I can do stuff like this in BiFrost in the future I'm a happy camper.
Right now the only other software capable of that would be Houdini...
I'll k

RE: Experiencing the Maya User interface

[Graham Bell]

The Maya User voice might be a good starting point, its public but you can add 
and catergorise your suggestions. Or even vote for existing ones that have 
already been submitted.
It's moderated to avoid repeatition and if there's significant interest in an 
item, we place it 'under review'

Here's the main link, but there are two sections - Small Annoying things for 
those annoying little quirks or problems in Maya, and then Ideas for Maya which 
are for bigger projects and suggestions

http://mayafeedback.autodesk.com/forums/160514-ideas-for-maya-forum



From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Adam Sale
Sent: 21 March 2014 15:54
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Experiencing the Maya User interface


Speaking of humanization, is there a link where we can contribute ideas?
On Mar 21, 2014 4:37 AM, "Luc-Eric Rousseau" 
mailto:luceri...@gmail.com>> wrote:
these YouTube links are getting quite tiresome, but I must say this one is 
particularly cute.

On Friday, March 21, 2014, Nicolas Esposito 
<3dv...@gmail.com> wrote:
Could you show other examples other then Maya running on Linux? :-P

2014-03-21 10:43 GMT+01:00 Morten Bartholdy 
mailto:x...@colorshopvfx.dk>>:

Пингвины и неведомая фигня



MB

<>

Re: A confession

[Graham Bell]

Actually I didn’t.

And I’m both agreeing and disagreeing with Alastair (and others), but I’ll 
happily concede that I could of rephrased things better. I’ve always been a 
better talker than writer.

From: John Richard Sanchez 
mailto:youngupstar...@gmail.com>>
Reply-To: 
"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2014 16:58:34 -0400
To: Andy Nicholas mailto:a...@andynicholas.com>>, 
"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: Re: A confession

Graham totally missed the point to begin with.


On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 4:22 PM, Andy Nicholas 
mailto:a...@andynicholas.com>> wrote:
 That's a great post Jason, and I think it sums up the differences between Maya
and Soft incredibly well.


I'm sorry Graham, but I'm with Alastair on this.


A




On 19 March 2014 at 19:54 Jason S 
mailto:jasonsta...@gmail.com>> wrote:


>
>  > >  On 19 March 2014 15:26, Alastair Hearsum
>  > > mailto:hear...@glassworks.co.uk> 
> > >wrote:
> >  Graham
> >
> >  Would I be wrong in rephrasing your sentence to be:
> >  ".Maya's UI and workflow is crap but not totally"
> >  Alastair ___
> >
> >  > Here is a notable (& comprehensive) post on rigging from David Gallagher
> >  > in response to the super long and (seemingly purposefully) diluted
> >  > article comparing SI / Maya rigging (concerning rigging workflow -alone-)
> >  > weighing pro & cons, while overweighing pros, underweighing cons, and
> >  > identifying things like the ability to use "locators" as rig components
> >  > as a "con" So how long will it take to get there?
>
>  > >  David Gallagher
> >
> >
> >  Jan 8
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >  I rigged on quite a few characters in Maya at Blue Sky Studios and now
> > (Softimage) AnimSchool.
> >  We offer the well-known "Malcolm" rig for free.
> >
> >  There is no comparison to rigging in Softimage and Maya--not the kind
> > of rigging I do.
> >
> >  I often assume by now they have better workflows in Maya,
> >  but I'm often surprised to find how convoluted and limiting the
> > workflows are to this day.
> >
> >  Most Maya people must not know there are better ways of working
> >  or aren't doing the kinds of things I am, because the difference is
> > profound.
> >
> >  - At any point in the rigging process, you can make edits in the model
> > stack to change the shape and topology of the model.
> >
> >  After experimenting, you can freeze that part of the stack and continue
> > on with that new shape,
> >  retaining almost every bit of work you've done.
> >
> >  YOU CAN CHANGE THE TOPOLOGY. YOU CAN CHANGE THE SHAPE FREELY.
> >
> >  This difference is huge. You can work toward completion without fear of
> > losing work.
> >
> >  You can experiment freely--knowing it's fine if you want to make a
> > major change.
> >
> >  I'm never afraid of losing blendshape work.
> >
> >  And if the changes are really significant, you can always Gator your
> > way out of a jam.
> >
> >  - You can do blendshape edits directly on the geometry, modelessly,
> > instead of on a separate blendshape object.
> >
> >  - There is no comparison with corrective blendshapes.
> >  In Softimage, you go to Secondary Shape mode and drag a few points.
> >  In Maya, I wish you luck. You can install one of several plug-ins and
> > scripts and HOPE that it works.
> >  If the scenario is simple enough, it might.
> >
> >
> >  Several people here tried to help a student make a single corrective
> > blendshape on an elbow
> >   -- and we're all experienced Maya riggers--, after hours of
> > attempting, we threw up our hands.
> >
> >  There was something in that object's history that was making the
> > blendshape plug-in fail.
> >  The answer is what it often is: just start over.
> >
> >  - EDITING corrective blendshapes.
> >  In Maya, heaven help you if you want to edit that blendshape later.
> >  Start the process again and make a new one.
> >  In Softimage, drag a few points and you're done in seconds.
> >
> >  - For facial work, being able to make face shapes in conjunction with
> > the mixer,
> >  working directly on the main geo.
> >
> >  To see other shapes muted, soloed as you're working.
> >
> >  This allows you to craft shapes that work for different scenarios, with
> > just the right falloff.
> >
> >  You can make correctives for shape combinations quickly.
> >
> >  In face work, it's all about how the functions combine to make the
> > range of expressive results.
> >
> >  - The envelope weighting is far superior.
> >
> >  The smoothing is just better, and more reliable.
> >
> >  Negative weight painting actually works.
> >
> >

RE: A confession

[Graham Bell]

Ha, I see what you did there.

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Alastair Hearsum
Sent: 19 March 2014 15:27
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: A confession

Graham

I may well be imposing my own emphasis on the word "totally" in your sentence:

"I don't accept that Maya's UI and workflow is 'totally' crap."

But you have put quotations round the word. Would I be wrong in rephrasing your 
sentence to be:

".Maya's UI and workflow is crap but not totally"

Alastair


Alastair Hearsum
Head of 3d
[GLASSWORKS]
33/34 Great Pulteney Street
London
W1F 9NP
+44 (0)20 7434 1182
glassworks.co.uk<http://www.glassworks.co.uk/>
Glassworks Terms and Conditions of Sale can be found at glassworks.co.uk
(Company registered in England with number 04759979. Registered office 25 
Harley Street, London, W1G 9BR. VAT registration number: 86729)
Please consider the environment before you print this email.
DISCLAIMER: This e-mail and attachments are strictly privileged, private and 
confidential and are intended solely for the stated recipient(s). Any views or 
opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily 
represent those of the Company. If you are not the intended recipient, be 
advised that you have received this e-mail in error and that any use, 
dissemination, forwarding, printing, or copying of this e-mail is strictly 
prohibited. If this transmission is received in error please kindly return it 
to the sender and delete this message from your system.
On 19/03/2014 14:45, Graham Bell wrote:

I totally agree.



I'm not defending Maya as some kind of perfection, far from it. But at the same 
time, I don't accept that Maya's UI and workflow is 'totally' crap. I actually 
like various bits of Maya, but are there big chunks of it that need addressing? 
You betcha. And I'm all for change and I'd love to have Softs rendering 
'system' in Maya, but I would also echo what Marc Stevens said in that I 
wouldn't perhaps copy/paste a feature, but take the best and build something 
new.



G



From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>
 [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Jacob Gonzalez

Sent: 19 March 2014 14:28

To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>

Subject: Re: A confession



Hi Graham



Apart from a shot experience using Maya I also did the same with Houdini. And 
again i was rendering. With Houdini I was frustrated the first few days as I 
felt I could do things quicker in Soft. But it was much more interesting than 
Maya since I could see the potential. After 3 weeks rendering with houdini I 
was actually quite happy about it. It's flexible, powerful and let's the artist 
enjoy a rendering workflow. My experience with Maya was totally the opposite.



I don't have a massive experience with either Houdini or Maya, just a short 
one. But I am very experienced with Soft and I now what it works for me and 
what it doesnt.



If AD makes rendering in Maya as nice as in XSI, takes ICE into Maya, etc. 
I would be very happy, sincemost likely I will be switching to Maya -  but I 
doubt they will.



J



On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 2:08 PM, Perry Harovas 
mailto:perryharo...@gmail.com><mailto:perryharo...@gmail.com><mailto:perryharo...@gmail.com>>
 wrote:

Maya = WorkDrip

Softimage = WorkFlow







On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 9:59 AM, Gaël Honorez 
mailto:g...@nozon.com><mailto:g...@nozon.com><mailto:g...@nozon.com>>
 wrote:

We are using maya here for a dozen of years, but we are still trying to run 
away from it on every occasion possible.



Today, we read the what's new page for maya 2015.



"Maya 2015 addresses at least 30 workflow obstacles identified as high priority 
by customers".



That sentence make us laugh during all launch break. I don't know what 
customers you asked, but I can tell you 30 workflow problems in the color 
picker alone.



I just hope you forgot a 0 somewhere.









On 19/03/2014 14:25, Graham Bell wrote:

I'm not being disingenuous at all, only that this is a common problem when 
people jump from one software to another. I've seen this many times from users 
where they start in another package and try to do the exact same workflow, only 
to then become frustrated.



You can't jump to something else and expect it to work in the same way, you 
simply can't. It's a recipe for disaster. And it's all too easy to label 
something as being bad.

I'm not saying that Maya's workflow is superior either. There are things I like 
and hate about Maya, but you could also say the same about Softimage and any 
software package to be fair.

I think 

RE: A confession

[Graham Bell]

I totally agree.

I'm not defending Maya as some kind of perfection, far from it. But at the same 
time, I don't accept that Maya's UI and workflow is 'totally' crap. I actually 
like various bits of Maya, but are there big chunks of it that need addressing? 
You betcha. And I'm all for change and I'd love to have Softs rendering 
'system' in Maya, but I would also echo what Marc Stevens said in that I 
wouldn't perhaps copy/paste a feature, but take the best and build something 
new.

G

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Jacob Gonzalez
Sent: 19 March 2014 14:28
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: A confession

Hi Graham

Apart from a shot experience using Maya I also did the same with Houdini. And 
again i was rendering. With Houdini I was frustrated the first few days as I 
felt I could do things quicker in Soft. But it was much more interesting than 
Maya since I could see the potential. After 3 weeks rendering with houdini I 
was actually quite happy about it. It's flexible, powerful and let's the artist 
enjoy a rendering workflow. My experience with Maya was totally the opposite.

I don't have a massive experience with either Houdini or Maya, just a short 
one. But I am very experienced with Soft and I now what it works for me and 
what it doesnt.

If AD makes rendering in Maya as nice as in XSI, takes ICE into Maya, etc. 
I would be very happy, sincemost likely I will be switching to Maya -  but I 
doubt they will.

J

On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 2:08 PM, Perry Harovas 
mailto:perryharo...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Maya = WorkDrip
Softimage = WorkFlow



On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 9:59 AM, Gaël Honorez 
mailto:g...@nozon.com>> wrote:
We are using maya here for a dozen of years, but we are still trying to run 
away from it on every occasion possible.

Today, we read the what's new page for maya 2015.

"Maya 2015 addresses at least 30 workflow obstacles identified as high priority 
by customers".

That sentence make us laugh during all launch break. I don't know what 
customers you asked, but I can tell you 30 workflow problems in the color 
picker alone.

I just hope you forgot a 0 somewhere.




On 19/03/2014 14:25, Graham Bell wrote:
I'm not being disingenuous at all, only that this is a common problem when 
people jump from one software to another. I've seen this many times from users 
where they start in another package and try to do the exact same workflow, only 
to then become frustrated.

You can't jump to something else and expect it to work in the same way, you 
simply can't. It's a recipe for disaster. And it's all too easy to label 
something as being bad.
I'm not saying that Maya's workflow is superior either. There are things I like 
and hate about Maya, but you could also say the same about Softimage and any 
software package to be fair.
I think it was Luc-Eric who said in a previous post that apps have their set of 
compromises, which we essentially accept.

Chris has mention on work starting to improve Maya's UI and I welcome that. And 
if there some Softimage goodness in there, then I welcome that too.


From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>
 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>]
 On Behalf Of Alastair Hearsum
Sent: 19 March 2014 12:45
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: A confession

Graham

I think its disingenuous to ascribe the difficulties people have in doing 
things in Maya only to the workflow being different. It was simple example I 
gave and I would have hoped that it would have highlighted the Maya workflow as 
being, dare I say, bad. I hope you don't mind the analogy here but the first 
step to an alcoholics recovery is admitting the problem. Marc Stevens went as 
far as he could in the webinar in conceding that there may be qualitative 
differences in the Maya/Softimage interface workflow scenario and that it is 
something that you are looking at

So yes, different, but lets not shy away from calling a spade a spade.

Alastair

Alastair Hearsum
Head of 3d
[GLASSWORKS]
33/34 Great Pulteney Street
London
W1F 9NP
+44 (0)20 7434 1182
glassworks.co.uk<http://glassworks.co.uk><http://www.glassworks.co.uk/>
Glassworks Terms and Conditions of Sale can be found at 
glassworks.co.uk<http://glassworks.co.uk>
(Company registered in England with number 04759979. Registered office 25 
Harley Street, London, W1G 9BR. VAT registration number: 86729)
Please consider the environment before you print this email.
DISCLAIMER: This e-mail and attachments are strictly privileged, private and 
confidential and are intended solely for the stated recipient(s). A

RE: trying to looking on the bright side......

[Graham Bell]

Did no one post this?

http://www.fxguide.com/featured/bifrost-exclusive-first-in-depth-look/


From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of adrian wyer
Sent: 19 March 2014 13:20
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: RE: trying to looking on the bright side..

adding fuel to fire, but hearing that multi machine rendering doesn't work...

anyone care to confirm?

if so, better off using naiad/RF

a


From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
 [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Raffaele 
Fragapane
Sent: 19 March 2014 12:28
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: trying to looking on the bright side..


The caching thing is a bit of a resentful point to be honest. Soft doesn't have 
a flip solver at all, if it had one, you would be caching a fair bit :)
The transfer looks a bit klunky, but not knowing the data beneath I can't 
really tell if it's groan worthy or not.

Bifrost's first version is simply not ICE and shouldn't be compared, in this 
first version it's a crippled but renewed naiad, look at it like that.
On 19 Mar 2014 19:40, "Arvid Björn" 
mailto:arvidbj...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Like someone else said, I can spend days in an ICE tree before caching 
anything, it seems to me that the instantness of ICE would be lost in a 
round-trip to an external process. But I'm sure it has a lot of advantages. A 
big one for AD being that they don't have to venture too deep into the Maya 
code base to be able to integrate it.

On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 2:49 AM, Raffaele Fragapane 
mailto:raffsxsil...@googlemail.com>> wrote:

In my book that it's an external module is good for a very extensive number of 
reasons, and it has a good team behind it.

The  approach to the dev and release cycle though I find both questionable and 
insufficient to place it anywhere significant on the map any some than two to 
three years, and that leaves a massive gap for those coming from soft and 
incapable or unwilling to adopt or develop competing solutions.

Given autodesk propensity to rushed and whimsical decisions it also makes me 
unwilling to roll the dice on it at all since it might be a great thing that 
might still get canned if it doesn't  instantaneously produce results, results 
I question it can produce at all any time soon.
On 19 Mar 2014 04:48, "Arvid Björn" 
mailto:arvidbj...@gmail.com>> wrote:
I was really surprised that Bifrost was some external process, and then even 
more surprised that they tried to tout this as a good thing. Here's the mental 
image I got during that demo:

http://i.imgur.com/OUhV4wj.jpg
On Tue, Mar 18, 2014 at 5:08 PM, Morten Bartholdy 
mailto:x...@colorshopvfx.dk>> wrote:

Its probably like this..




<>

RE: A confession

[Graham Bell]

I'm not being disingenuous at all, only that this is a common problem when 
people jump from one software to another. I've seen this many times from users 
where they start in another package and try to do the exact same workflow, only 
to then become frustrated.

You can't jump to something else and expect it to work in the same way, you 
simply can't. It's a recipe for disaster. And it's all too easy to label 
something as being bad.
I'm not saying that Maya's workflow is superior either. There are things I like 
and hate about Maya, but you could also say the same about Softimage and any 
software package to be fair.
I think it was Luc-Eric who said in a previous post that apps have their set of 
compromises, which we essentially accept.

Chris has mention on work starting to improve Maya's UI and I welcome that. And 
if there some Softimage goodness in there, then I welcome that too.


From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Alastair Hearsum
Sent: 19 March 2014 12:45
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: A confession

Graham

I think its disingenuous to ascribe the difficulties people have in doing 
things in Maya only to the workflow being different. It was simple example I 
gave and I would have hoped that it would have highlighted the Maya workflow as 
being, dare I say, bad. I hope you don't mind the analogy here but the first 
step to an alcoholics recovery is admitting the problem. Marc Stevens went as 
far as he could in the webinar in conceding that there may be qualitative 
differences in the Maya/Softimage interface workflow scenario and that it is 
something that you are looking at

So yes, different, but lets not shy away from calling a spade a spade.

Alastair

Alastair Hearsum
Head of 3d
[GLASSWORKS]
33/34 Great Pulteney Street
London
W1F 9NP
+44 (0)20 7434 1182
glassworks.co.uk<http://www.glassworks.co.uk/>
Glassworks Terms and Conditions of Sale can be found at glassworks.co.uk
(Company registered in England with number 04759979. Registered office 25 
Harley Street, London, W1G 9BR. VAT registration number: 86729)
Please consider the environment before you print this email.
DISCLAIMER: This e-mail and attachments are strictly privileged, private and 
confidential and are intended solely for the stated recipient(s). Any views or 
opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily 
represent those of the Company. If you are not the intended recipient, be 
advised that you have received this e-mail in error and that any use, 
dissemination, forwarding, printing, or copying of this e-mail is strictly 
prohibited. If this transmission is received in error please kindly return it 
to the sender and delete this message from your system.
On 19/03/2014 11:31, Graham Bell wrote:

I've use both Maya and Softimage (XSI) for years, and the problem (imo) that 
many will make is that they're two different applications. You simply can't go 
into one and expect it to work in the same way to something else. This is no 
different to when jumping to Modo, Houdini, or Max.





From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>
 [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Martin Yara

Sent: 19 March 2014 11:19

To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>

Subject: Re: A confession



You shouldn't rely too much on the outliners, they are nowhere near what SI 
Explorer is. But if you must, and want to open multiple outliners ala 
Softimage, you can do it with something like this:



// MEL

//-

window -t "Outliner" -wh 200 500;

frameLayout -labelVisible false;

string $panel = `outlinerPanel`;

showWindow;

//-



Yeah, you have to script a lot in Maya. Even for stupid things like this.



Knowing basic scripting in SI is very useful, but in Maya, not knowing basic 
scripting may be critical.



Martin





On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 6:51 PM, Ivan Vasiljevic 
mailto:klebed...@gmail.com><mailto:klebed...@gmail.com><mailto:klebed...@gmail.com>>
 wrote:

You should go with something more simpler for start:

Try opening few outliners as you would often have few explorer opened in SI.



<>

RE: A confession

[Graham Bell]

Maya has 'contribution maps' that you can create on layers, which are kinda the 
same as Soft's partitions. I'm not saying they're better (and I don't want to 
get into a debate) but that's the equivalent.

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Jacob Gonzalez
Sent: 19 March 2014 11:43
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: A confession

The point I was trying to make is that not having partitions makes rendering in 
Maya much more difficult and less efficient than rendering in XSI. This is one 
the features I am put off by when switching to Maya.

 Agreed,  different 3D applications behave in different manners, and so you 
just need to change your way of working to adapt to it. Then it's not as 
horrible as you thought it was at first.But in the case of partitions I haven't 
come across any Maya user who had a workaround or method which was even close 
to XSI's built in features. And I have worked 4 years on a Maya / XSI based 
post house.

J

On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 11:31 AM, Graham Bell 
mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com>> wrote:
I've use both Maya and Softimage (XSI) for years, and the problem (imo) that 
many will make is that they're two different applications. You simply can't go 
into one and expect it to work in the same way to something else. This is no 
different to when jumping to Modo, Houdini, or Max.


From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>
 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>]
 On Behalf Of Martin Yara
Sent: 19 March 2014 11:19
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
Subject: Re: A confession
You shouldn't rely too much on the outliners, they are nowhere near what SI 
Explorer is. But if you must, and want to open multiple outliners ala 
Softimage, you can do it with something like this:

// MEL
//-
window -t "Outliner" -wh 200 500;
frameLayout -labelVisible false;
string $panel = `outlinerPanel`;
showWindow;
//-

Yeah, you have to script a lot in Maya. Even for stupid things like this.

Knowing basic scripting in SI is very useful, but in Maya, not knowing basic 
scripting may be critical.

Martin

On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 6:51 PM, Ivan Vasiljevic 
mailto:klebed...@gmail.com><mailto:klebed...@gmail.com<mailto:klebed...@gmail.com>>>
 wrote:
You should go with something more simpler for start:
Try opening few outliners as you would often have few explorer opened in SI.

<>

RE: A confession

[Graham Bell]

I've use both Maya and Softimage (XSI) for years, and the problem (imo) that 
many will make is that they're two different applications. You simply can't go 
into one and expect it to work in the same way to something else. This is no 
different to when jumping to Modo, Houdini, or Max.


From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Martin Yara
Sent: 19 March 2014 11:19
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: A confession

You shouldn't rely too much on the outliners, they are nowhere near what SI 
Explorer is. But if you must, and want to open multiple outliners ala 
Softimage, you can do it with something like this:

// MEL
//-
window -t "Outliner" -wh 200 500;
frameLayout -labelVisible false;
string $panel = `outlinerPanel`;
showWindow;
//-

Yeah, you have to script a lot in Maya. Even for stupid things like this.

Knowing basic scripting in SI is very useful, but in Maya, not knowing basic 
scripting may be critical.

Martin


On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 6:51 PM, Ivan Vasiljevic 
mailto:klebed...@gmail.com>> wrote:
You should go with something more simpler for start:
Try opening few outliners as you would often have few explorer opened in SI.

<>

Re: Idea- Just keep Mental Ray and FBX support - Softimage free w/Maya or Max or any Suite.

[Graham Bell]

Julian, I’m hardly the best person to answer that. Besides I think Maurice
may have already responded to suggestions of selling Softimage.
It might seem like simple and easy thing to do, but unfortunately things
don’t always work like that.



On 16/03/2014 08:47, "Julian Johnson"  wrote:

>On 15/03/2014 17:44, Graham Bell wrote:
>> I¹ve absolutely no doubt, but in all the time I¹ve demoed Softimage,
>>even
>> pre-AD, there was never anyone who didn¹t like the software, tech or
>> couldn¹t see the potential benefits. However despite this, it wasn¹t
>>easy
>> for people to simply adopt.
>> We could easily lead the horse to water, but never make it drink.
>
>Graham, as everyone at Autodesk seems convinced there is no market for
>Softimage what harm could there be in selling it? If the might of
>Autodesk's marketing resources had no impact then it stands to reason
>that no one else is going to be able to make a success of it. I mean
>you've tried your best, right? It's just not possible to market
>Softimage. Avid tried and failed, you tried and failed. It stands
>absolutely no chance of ever  becoming a competitor to Maya or Max as
>it's too hard to adopt. Why not, therefore, sell it on to an interested
>third party who could solely cater for the niche Softimage audience?
>Don't we all win that way? We have an interested 'owner' - you can focus
>your resources on Maya and Max and walk away with a lump sum for
>'innovative' R&D and you still have no competition. You no longer have
>an alienated and hostile Softimage customer base.
>
>Better still, as soon as Maya becomes a more attractive option we then
>have the choice to adopt or not. Given the myriad improvements listed by
>Chris that adoption in a few years time should be a no-brainer for us,
>shouldn't it?  We can once more re-enter the Autodesk fold willingly and
>migrate to the better product. If you, Chris and Maurice genuinely
>believe in 'new' Maya and Autodesk's own marketing abilities it should
>be relatively easy to sell it to Softimage customers in a few years
>time. I'm sure we're going to be blown away by the new innovations that
>Maurice talked about. With the current roadmap and user input Maya will
>undoubtedly be a better product than Softimage is now. I know you
>wouldn't be asking us to transition to an inferior product - that just
>wouldn't make business sense. No billion dollar business would treat
>their customers that way.
>
>Fundamentally, it seems as though if the initial decision to buy XSI was
>motivated by a desire to move the product forward and market it in
>earnest (with a genuine business case that demonstrated either more
>sales or additional revenue - and why else would you have bought XSI?)
>then there has been a colossal failure in that business plan by
>Autodesk. The burden of that failure has been placed solely on the
>customers to whom, surely, Autodesk has some level of responsibility.
>
>And yet, that burden of responsibility doesn't seem to have been
>reflected in the manner in which Softimage is currently being EOL'd. I
>can't think of a more brutal scenario - immediate cessation of
>development; no prior warning; no safe-harbour alternative option; no
>pre-planning or understanding of the essential migratable features in
>Softimage; no in-place transition training; no concept of recompense for
>your failure; and no willingness to negotiate or ameliorate the terms of
>the EOL in any substantial way.
>
>Julian

<>

Re: Idea- Just keep Mental Ray and FBX support - Softimage free w/Maya or Max or any Suite.

[Graham Bell]

I¹ve absolutely no doubt, but in all the time I¹ve demoed Softimage, even
pre-AD, there was never anyone who didn¹t like the software, tech or
couldn¹t see the potential benefits. However despite this, it wasn¹t easy
for people to simply adopt.
We could easily lead the horse to water, but never make it drink.
 



On 15/03/2014 17:34, "Christoph Muetze"  wrote:

>Not preaching a religion here... In the 15+ years i've been using
>Softimage products i've "converted" more hardcore Max and Maya users by
>just outrunning them time and time again than i can count. Admittedly
>realtime graphics is a very special field of profession and also very
>rare outside of the gaming industry so it's kinda easy to become a user
>of a tool that was just not designed to deliver here... and those users
>are more likely to learn a new app if its vastly superior...which
>Softimage (still) is.
>
>Chris
>
>On 15/03/14 18:15, Graham Bell wrote:
>> Interestingly, you could flip that around and apply that to a Maya/Max
>>guy/studio talking about Softimage. In fact more often than not, they
>>did.
>>
>>
>> From: Christoph Muetze mailto:c...@glarestudios.de>>
>> Reply-To: 
>>"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>"
>> 
>>mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
>> Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2014 18:04:56 +0100
>> To: 
>>"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>"
>> 
>>mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
>> Subject: Re: Idea- Just keep Mental Ray and FBX support - Softimage
>>free w/Maya or Max or any Suite.
>>
>> On 15/03/14 17:24, Greg Punchatz wrote:
>>
>> I want to use the best out of the box 3d DCC app in the world, if one
>>day that is Maya, I am all aboard.  Right now it is not, its kinda just
>>a fact.
>>
>>
>> I'm so with you on this..
>>
>> We did take Autodesks offer a while back and upgraded two of our groups
>>seats to the Maya Entertainment Creative Suit. Mainly for Mudbox, but
>>also to have a deep look at Maya.
>>
>> Fast forward 1 year and i'm more than convinced that Maya doesn't offer
>>what i need on a day to day basis.
>>
>> It's not only that there are many things not available in Maya but also
>>that the tools that are available take more time away from me than their
>>Softimage counterparts. And in the field that i work in with its super
>>tight deadlines (where you have days, sometimes only hours to deliver)
>>every click counts.
>>
>> If anyone can beat me with another tool i will instantly drop
>>Softimage. But this hasn't happened so far and i highly doubt it will
>>happen in the next 2 years with someone using Maya.
>>
>> Chris
>

<>

Re: Idea- Just keep Mental Ray and FBX support - Softimage free w/Maya or Max or any Suite.

[Graham Bell]

Interestingly, you could flip that around and apply that to a Maya/Max 
guy/studio talking about Softimage. In fact more often than not, they did.


From: Christoph Muetze mailto:c...@glarestudios.de>>
Reply-To: 
"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2014 18:04:56 +0100
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: Re: Idea- Just keep Mental Ray and FBX support - Softimage free w/Maya 
or Max or any Suite.

On 15/03/14 17:24, Greg Punchatz wrote:

I want to use the best out of the box 3d DCC app in the world, if one day that 
is Maya, I am all aboard.  Right now it is not, its kinda just a fact.


I'm so with you on this..

We did take Autodesks offer a while back and upgraded two of our groups seats 
to the Maya Entertainment Creative Suit. Mainly for Mudbox, but also to have a 
deep look at Maya.

Fast forward 1 year and i'm more than convinced that Maya doesn't offer what i 
need on a day to day basis.

It's not only that there are many things not available in Maya but also that 
the tools that are available take more time away from me than their Softimage 
counterparts. And in the field that i work in with its super tight deadlines 
(where you have days, sometimes only hours to deliver) every click counts.

If anyone can beat me with another tool i will instantly drop Softimage. But 
this hasn't happened so far and i highly doubt it will happen in the next 2 
years with someone using Maya.

Chris
<>

Re: Keep up the noise... (but don't be a dick)

[Graham Bell]

Just to add to this.

By all means, reach out to Chris, as Greg mentions. But if there are any if you 
in UK/EMEA, then please feel free to contact me off list if you have any 
questions, queries etc, even about Maya.
And before anyone comes up with some theory that I’m being forced onto Maya, 
blah, blah, I should point out that ( as well as Soft), I’ve also been using 
Maya since v1.0


Graham



From: "g...@janimation.com" 
mailto:g...@janimation.com>>
Reply-To: 
"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2014 12:20:00 -0600
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: Keep up the noise... (but don't be a dick)

Keep up the noise people!!

Change has already happened keep up the pressure folks. Write to your 
congressman..Ermm, I mean this guy...

chris.vienn...@autodesk.com

Please PLEASE... don't name call... but for god's sake let him know why this is 
a BIG MISTAKE for his company and yours! It's worse for them than it is for us, 
for them to kill soft..it simply makes no short or long term sense. They are 
doing nothing but alienating users, not just on the Softimage side---as I have 
not met a single Maya or Max user that actually likes the company called 
Autodesk.

Let him know that there is a market for Soft..and the ONLY reason they are not 
making a killing on it is that they won't invest and market it...that's 
it...otherwise it would have been gaining and growing the user-base like mad.

It also gives AD a safety net... Maya is busting at the seams...
they are now having to make programs that run outside of Maya to do a tenth of 
what ICE does...Biofrost... Bio-hazard is more like it from the word on the 
street.

If it falls apart, and AD falls on its face, as it has many times with 
attempted "rewrite" (Toxic any one?..remember that was supposed to turn into 
the 3d app too..lol, how quickly people forget ADs blunders. How many millions 
were wasted on that dev...vs what it costs to buy and maintain soft???). Soft 
is the only recently rewritten core...major overhaul was done for ice.. major)

What Autodesk needs is a Walt Disney, a John Lassiter or dare I say a Willy 
Wonka? It needs a visionary leader that has been in the trenches of all aspects 
of 3d and compositing. Who understands the needs of the big and small shops 
alike...

One who knows the future is not in a code base which is more than 24 years old. 
One that understands that if the customer is happy, the stock holders will be 
happy. The person should not be driven by board meetings, but rather exciting 
the entire 3d user base instead of alienating them.

One who understands that what makes a great development team is great and 
transparent interaction with its beta testers..

One who is not afraid to let one product outshine the rest on its own 
merits...(like the Whiskey Tree elysium demo that was axed at siggraph last 
year since it outshone the Disney technology AD licensed.)

One that understands there should be a production team at AD using their 
products to produce short films, so they have a freaking clue what the real 
world needs...this is how both softimage and alias used to do it...before they 
were bought by companies that simply don't understand how creativity works...

One that the user aspires to be like..because that person "makes the cool 
stuff"

AD you are making creative software...AD needs to foster a creative 
culture...period. IF AD thinks you have, I can assure you that you have not... 
your results speak for themselves.

Don't kill Soft, prop it up and keep it viable...and MARKET IT!
It can already do so much your other two 3d apps can't...

Do the same with the rest... keep them alive..until AD delivers a new modern 
app that we will all be happy to move to.
<>

Re: Mark's good bye

[Graham Bell]

To me, he’s always be The Guv’nor.

:-)


From: "gustav...@gmail.com" 
mailto:gustav...@gmail.com>>
Reply-To: 
"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2014 20:07:25 -0300
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: Mark's good bye

http://area.autodesk.com/blogs/marks/thanks-for-all-your-brilliance

<>

Re: Softimage 2015 Last Release Announcement

[Graham Bell]

Now we’ve gone public with the official announcement, I can stick my head above 
the parapet.

Breaking the news to a loyal user base that their preferred software was being 
retired was never going to be easy, and Autodesk knew that. Rumours had begun 
to surface in the last few weeks, but myself and others were remaining silent 
so agreed plans and communications could be finalised. It’s unfortunately that 
some of our partners couldn’t honour these plans in same way.
I’m just really sorry for how it was done, because it was not quite what was 
originally intended.

I’d always intended on posting some thoughts and observations, but don’t want 
to get into a lengthy debate, so I’ll keep this post as short as possible, say 
my piece and get the hell out.
It’s sometimes hard to defend history, so I won’t try to. People will no doubt 
call BS at me and others over things said in the past, and that’s totally their 
prerogative. But personally I have always spoken in good faith and I’ve never 
deliberately misled anyone and I’ve always tried to be as honest as I can be.


On a personal note (takes Autodesk hat off), one thing I’d like to say is that 
I’m genuinely gutted and sad to see the end of Softimage.
I maybe be just another Autodesk idiot to some, but I’ve also been a customer 
and user. I joined Psygnosis in 1996, which was my first job in games 
development and where I cut my teeth in games. It was also where I was 
introduced to a 3D package that I would come to love – Softimage 3D. And from 
there my Softimage journey to this point would begin.

My wish and hope now, is that some of the amazing goodness from Softimage, (be 
it people, features, workflows and philosophy) continues in some way, shape or 
form. Some of that is already happening right now within Autodesk,  and that 
(imho) can only be a good thing. Because the more of that goodness that gets 
out there, then the less room there is for some of the crap.

Finally I’d like to thank you guys here, because through this community and 
others throughout the years, you guys made the product what it is. Sure you 
guys give us a hard time, but personally I wouldn’t have it any other way as it 
helps keep us on our toes. I have had some debates with some people here and 
si-community, but my goal has never been to antagonise. I’ve always tried to be 
as open and as up front as possible.
I really hope that communities such as the list and si-community don’t die off 
as that really would be a shame.




If you want some more information around the transition plans and our products, 
then Maurice is posting on the list, so let him know any queries you might 
have, as some of you already have.
If you want to ask me questions around this announcement, then of course pvt 
mail me off list. I’ll try my best to answer any queries.




Graham


From: Dave Thomlison mailto:dthomli...@gmail.com>>
Reply-To: 
"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2014 14:28:55 -0500
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: Re: Softimage 2015 Last Release Announcement

Suck a fat one, Autodesk execs.  This industry is already artist-hostile as it 
is.  And how can you possibly open a letter such as this with "committed to 
providing [y]our customers with the most technologically advanced products and 
highest quality customer service possible" ??


On Tue, Mar 4, 2014 at 2:23 PM, Steve Parish 
mailto:porkypar...@gmail.com>> wrote:
I don't actually see anything to aid the transition. How about some courses? 
Videos? The approach (so far) has been to "just use something else". For a 
company that has just screwed a portion of its users, I would have thought they 
would have bent over backwards to keep their loyalty.

Its funny, I've known about this for a while and yet I knew when the news was 
announced it would be done completely unprofessionally, thanks for living up to 
my expectations Autodesk.


On Tue, Mar 4, 2014 at 12:20 PM, Alex Arce 
mailto:aa.li...@gmail.com>> wrote:
2015 feature set...
http://area.autodesk.com/userdata/products/What's_New_in_Autodesk_Softimage_2015_latest.pdf

would have liked to see something a bit more exciting.




--
Dave Thomlison
<>

RE: new upgrade policy

[Graham Bell]

Well of course it's limited, because the upgrade policy itself is changing next 
year.

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Scott Parrish
Sent: 26 February 2014 22:39
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: new upgrade policy

It's not news, no. But it is a pretty anti-consumer change in policy.
The 70% discount is for a limited time only.

It says right there in the FAQ:
How can a customer get current if they have an older version of software after 
February 1, 2015?
Customers who wish to use the latest release after February 1, 2015 will have 
the option to purchase the latest version at SRP (Suggested Retail Price).

As a customer I'd like to be on paid maintenance because there is some sort of 
benefit that it provides. Not because there is a gun to my head that I lose my 
investment in purchasing the software and risk paying full price for upgrades 
in the future otherwise.


On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 2:34 PM, Graham Bell 
mailto:graham.b...@autodesk.com>> wrote:
This isn't anything new, this has already been announced last year and 
discussed here and on other forums.
Also currently, upgrade pricing is 70% of the price of a new seat.

G

From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>
 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>]
 On Behalf Of Kris Rivel
Sent: 26 February 2014 22:15
To: Softimage List
Subject: Re: new upgrade policy

I'm looking at Modo, Houdini and anything else with some drive, passion and 
inspiration behind it.  I'll use Soft till it doesn't run anymore and just 
gives me a blue screen or something.

But this aggressive tactic just comes off as greedy and is poorly planned.  I 
wonder how many other holes they can put in their boat.

Kris
On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 4:19 PM, Daniel Sweeney 
mailto:dan...@northforge.co.uk><mailto:dan...@northforge.co.uk<mailto:dan...@northforge.co.uk>>>
 wrote:

I am as quick as I can off the autodesk rollercoaster. A few things have made 
my choice I will always love soft and use the tool when its needed but I think 
I need to look for another avenue. Looking at modo? Thoughts??

Autodesk bollocks.
On Feb 26, 2014 8:52 PM, "Kris Rivel" 
mailto:krisri...@gmail.com><mailto:krisri...@gmail.com<mailto:krisri...@gmail.com>>>
 wrote:
I read it and couldn't help but say WTH?!

Kris
On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 3:36 PM, Emilio Hernandez 
mailto:emi...@e-roja.com><mailto:emi...@e-roja.com<mailto:emi...@e-roja.com>>>
 wrote:
Seems they need to fill the vault...
[http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/8965/erojamailpleca.jpg]

2014-02-26 14:29 GMT-06:00 Kris Rivel 
mailto:krisri...@gmail.com><mailto:krisri...@gmail.com<mailto:krisri...@gmail.com>>>:

So...what's everyone's take on this gem?  So if I don't upgrade to latest 
version  now...then when I want that version I have to pay full price?

http://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/autocad/troubleshooting/caas/sfdcarticles/sfdcarticles/Frequently-Asked-Questions-about-the-Autodesk-Upgrade-Policy.html

Kris



<>

RE: new upgrade policy

[Graham Bell]

This isn't anything new, this has already been announced last year and 
discussed here and on other forums.
Also currently, upgrade pricing is 70% of the price of a new seat.

G

From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Kris Rivel
Sent: 26 February 2014 22:15
To: Softimage List
Subject: Re: new upgrade policy

I'm looking at Modo, Houdini and anything else with some drive, passion and 
inspiration behind it.  I'll use Soft till it doesn't run anymore and just 
gives me a blue screen or something.

But this aggressive tactic just comes off as greedy and is poorly planned.  I 
wonder how many other holes they can put in their boat.

Kris

On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 4:19 PM, Daniel Sweeney 
mailto:dan...@northforge.co.uk>> wrote:

I am as quick as I can off the autodesk rollercoaster. A few things have made 
my choice I will always love soft and use the tool when its needed but I think 
I need to look for another avenue. Looking at modo? Thoughts??

Autodesk bollocks.
On Feb 26, 2014 8:52 PM, "Kris Rivel" 
mailto:krisri...@gmail.com>> wrote:
I read it and couldn't help but say WTH?!

Kris

On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 3:36 PM, Emilio Hernandez 
mailto:emi...@e-roja.com>> wrote:
Seems they need to fill the vault...

[http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/8965/erojamailpleca.jpg]

2014-02-26 14:29 GMT-06:00 Kris Rivel 
mailto:krisri...@gmail.com>>:

So...what's everyone's take on this gem?  So if I don't upgrade to latest 
version  now...then when I want that version I have to pay full price?

http://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/autocad/troubleshooting/caas/sfdcarticles/sfdcarticles/Frequently-Asked-Questions-about-the-Autodesk-Upgrade-Policy.html

Kris



<>

Re: Survey - how would you do this?

[Graham Bell]

Matt makes some valid points and to me shows some of the (even these days)
major differences between games and film/tv pipelines.

It¹s not that ICE isn¹t capable of doing amazing things, there¹s plenty
example of that, but that when it comes to creating games assets and
pipelines, its perhaps not best suited to some of the requirements. It¹s
not much good creating custom ICE nodes and compounds, but they can in
effect be useless, unless you can reflect the tool/tech in the game engine
and/or get the exported. Sure you can bake as many have mentioned, but
that doesn¹t always apply in all cases. Also it creates more data that has
got to be loaded in game and memory, and as Marc says games is so often
about balancing budget to get things running.
Even when you have assets built to spec, you can still end up cutting back
anywhere you can, to get the framerate. 30 fps was realistic, 60 was very
often a dream.

Game devs are renown for building lots of proprietary tools and
technology, some of which is justifiable, others times they¹re reinventing
the wheel. But I think some of that is changing. Whereas in the past games
would literally write everything, more are now buying off the shelf with
middleware for some things, and focusing their resources on the right
things. It¹s simply not always realistic and financially viable to write
everything bespoke.

I used to be a firm believer of having a DCC as a game editor, as I¹d seen
too many show off programmers thinking they could write their own Max/Maya
and while I have seen some good editors, most have been poor. But I think
Marc¹s points are very valid, I wouldn¹t take that approach now. I still
think in the right context the DCC could work, but it depends a lot on the
pipeline and the type of game being made. The game engine is always going
to be the best place to view assets, as its the end result, but I¹d
squeeze everything I could from a DCC before pushing my data through the
pipe.


 

I thought Matt challenge was great and very typical of the type of thing
you see now in mobile/casual gaming. Simple data, simple process, get it
down and get it out.





On 13/02/2014 23:48, "Marc Brinkley"  wrote:

>Just to tack on...
>
>Coming from UE3 and Unity, I can safely say that building engine
>dependent tools\editors into a DCC is decidedly not the way to go. If you
>can avoid it at all costs, I would highly recommend that.
>
>It's a slippery slope. You realize that most of the infrastructure you
>want is already in a DCC so it makes sense to use that as a base...months
>and years later you realize that was not a good decision. :) And now...
>
>My mantra over the last several years has been...the DCC is just that, it
>creates digital content. Everything else is done in engine\editor.
>Materials, post FX, physics, VFX, Fluids, lighting, animation sequencing,
>cameras, terrain generation, scene assembly and so on should only ever be
>done in your engine and editor.
>
>And I got there from having tried to build the DCC into our editors. Both
>with Soft and with Maya. Both were the wrong choice.
>
>
>My team of nearly 50+ environment artists live a daily struggle because
>we made that choice.
>
>__
>_
>Marc Brinkley
>343 Industries
>Microsoft Studios
>marc.brinkley [at] microsoft.com
>
>-Original Message-
>From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
>[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Matt Lind
>Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2014 3:16 PM
>To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
>Subject: RE: Survey - how would you do this?
>
>I cannot reveal what our plans are, but I can say what we need is an
>environment that has an open and deep SDK to allow us to build tools on
>our terms, and not on the application's terms, so we can make our own
>infrastructure without having to re-invent the wheel and reduce risk from
>pipeline changes/regressions from commercial software.  Allows us to
>define our own primitives, data structures, and treats those data
>structures as first class citizens in the API.  Not have licensing which
>ties the content creation product into our released product, and is very
>cost effective for very large teams working across multiple sites.  Can
>be set up quickly and easily and is a light install, and not require
>engineers to make usable or explain to artists.  In concept, Fabric
>engine most closely fits that paradigm, but it needs to mature before we
>can give it a serious look.  I would not be surprised if we develop our
>own tools a la Pixar or the other mainstays of the industry.  The trend
>in this space is to build your creation tools into your engine so you can
>take advantage of real time feedback from iteration (a la Valve).  Since
>we built our own engine from scratch, we have full control to implement
>such features on our terms.
>
>Max, Maya, and Softimage don't cater to the MMORPG space very well.  You
>can use the products, as man

RE: Survey - how would you do this?

[Graham Bell]

I'd go with animated sprites for the asteroids.

As for jitter, the old school way would be to the coder to do it in the game 
engine. Otherwise, I'd animated the torus size very slightly with some offsets

-Original Message-
From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Eric Thivierge
Sent: 11 February 2014 20:16
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Survey - how would you do this?

$10 says you can't use instances

On Tuesday, February 11, 2014 3:13:50 PM, Emilio Hernandez wrote:
> Well, a quick solution will be
>
> 1. create a group of asteroids and add the animation of the asteroids.
> 2. create the torus that will hold up the asteroids belt.
> 3. Instanciate the group of asteroids.
> 4. Create a object to cluster constrain of the asteroids group in 
> dispersed points in the torus.
> 5. Randomize the torus to create the jittering of the position of the 
> asteroids group.
> 6. Animate the rotation of the torus.
>
>
>
>
>
> 2014-02-11 14:06 GMT-06:00 Matt Lind  >:
>
> I should probably mention we don’t do realism here.  Think comic
> book style with a little Anime thrown in.
>
> __ __
>
> Given the dimensions of the belt, asteroids could be up to 1 SI
> unit in diameter for the really large rocks.  The camera might
> move through this belt, so the fact they’re small shouldn’t be so
> readily dismissed.  This isn’t film/video where you can sweep the
> stuff you don’t see under the carpet.
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
> Matt
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
> *From:*softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
> 
> [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
> ] *On Behalf Of
> *Bradley Gabe
> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 11, 2014 11:48 AM
> *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> 
>
>
> *Subject:* Re: Survey - how would you do this?
>
> __ __
>
> Considering that the typical distance from one asteroid to the
> next is many thousands of kilometers,  you really shouldn't have
> any issues with collisions if you scale them properly. 
>
> __ __
>
> At your scale of 40 SI units for the asteroid belt, each asteroid
> would be well sub-pixel in diameter anyway, so I would create a
> torus to represent the belt, make it only very slightly opaque and
> call it a day. 
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
> On Feb 11, 2014, at 1:23 PM, Matt Lind  > wrote:
>
> An artist came to my desk yesterday asking how to do what I
> felt was a simple task, but after getting 80% through it I ran
> into a speed bump realizing it needed custom scripting or
> other advanced tools to fully resolve to satisfaction.  I had
> to give him a procedure that was ‘good enough’.  This problem
> has multiple solutions, but I am curious how others would
> solve it:
>
> 
>
> The problem:
>
> 
>
> Artist must create an asteroid belt around a planet.  The
> asteroids are likely 2D sprites which must face the camera and
> tumble as they orbit, but could be 3D objects as well.
> Asteroids must vary in size, shape, and animation speed
> (linear as well as rotational).  Asteroids cannot collide with
> anything.  Movement is generally slow – like a screen saver
> for your computer desktop.  Asteroid positions are jittered
> within the belt.
>
> 
>
> The question:
>
> 
>
> Dispersing objects into a ring is fairly straightforward
> through a number of techniques, but how do you apply the
> random jitter to the object positions?
>
> 
>
> The rules:
>
> 
>
> __-__Cannot use ICE
>
> __-__Cannot use custom scripts, custom operators, or 
> shaders.
>
> __-__Must only use tools out of the box that a junior or staff
> level artist would know how to use.
>
> __-__Must be able to create the asteroid belt, from scratch to
> completion, in less than 30 minutes – and be iteration
> friendly to react to art director feedback.
>
> __-__Ideally, the belt could be made a child of the planet in
> encompasses so it can be reoriented with respect to changes in
> the planet’s size/shape/tilt/orbit.
>
> __-__Final output must be able to exist with full integrity on
> its own in a vacuum.  Cannot not have dependencies on custom
> code, external assets, or special case logic.
>
> __-__Asteroid belt fits wi

RE: rumor, Soft dead within the next year

[Graham Bell]

Ah, the Dreamcast, a fine console but flawed form the beginning. The tech was 
ok, but really just a pc and essentially the predecessor to the Xbox.
The problem with the Dreamcast was that it launched right in the middle of when 
a lot of developers were looking to retool for the PS2. People were caught in 
the middle of whether to go short for the Dreamcast, or go long for the PS2. 
Most went with the PS2 and then eventually the Xbox.

On the Soft and Maya usability front, personally I don't mind both, but then 
I've always been used to jumping between the two, even back in the Power 
Animator and Soft3d days.
I've often heard that Maya is hard to learn, or its UI is tricky, but I think 
this is one of those myths. It's really no better, or worse than any other 
package to learn really. The one thing to remember about Maya, is that it's 
very open, it was designed that way. So there can be different (some would say 
to many) ways to do the same thing. Also, Maya has a lot of preferences, so you 
can actually change many things, including the UI. It's mastering those things, 
that can often be the trick. I still see people now, some experienced Maya 
vets, who aren't using the hotbox or marking menus correctly and they can be 
key to Maya's UI and usability.

However I'd still like some Softimage fairy dust sprinkled on some of Maya's UI 
though. Now when it comes to Max, don't get me started...:-)



From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Dan Yargici
Sent: 06 January 2014 09:44
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: rumor, Soft dead within the next year

Softimage is the Dreamcast of DCC apps.

Playstation had the slick marketing, Dreamcast had the tech but got chewed to 
pieces by the Playstation hype machine and Playstation won.  When Sega finally 
gave up on the console business every man and his dog came out singing the 
praises of the Dreamcast.




On Mon, Jan 6, 2014 at 11:21 AM, Stefan Kubicek 
mailto:s...@tidbit-images.com>> wrote:
Is it just my biased point of view that all studios that closed or filed for 
bancruptcy last year were Maya based?
It could of course be that there are more Maya based studios closing than 
Softimage based ones simply because there are more Maya based studios, but I 
still smell a pattern there.

I always felt that the number of  users on Softimage is directly related to 
marketing efforts. I remember Alias/Wavefront doing a remarkable job in the 
early days of Maya in this regard. I never saw anything like that happening for 
Softimage at any time of it's existence.
Ultimately, there are only two types of 3D artists: those who use Softimage, 
and those who have never tried. -> Get more prople to seriously try it.






So guys, I spent a weekend working with Maya...HOW THE F@CK THIS PROGRAM IS 
USED IN PRODUCTION?


This is the same question I always ask myself after using Maya when required... 
 and Maya being the "Industry Standard" makes you understand so many things 
about the industry standards...

[http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/8965/erojamailpleca.jpg]

2014/1/6 Szabolcs Matefy mailto:szabol...@crytek.com>>
So guys, I spent a weekend working with Maya...HOW THE F@CK THIS PROGRAM IS 
USED IN PRODUCTION?

Ok, I can use Maya, I have a quite solid background working with Maya, but 
seriously guys...It's so overcomplicated, and brainkilling...In Softimage 
almost everything is just fine (OK, we need development), but in Maya, the 
easiest task takes quite long compared to SI...Finally I found myself fixing 
UVs, Unfolding, etc. in Softimage...Anyway, I need some samples in Maya, so I 
take a big breath, and continue working with Maya...But seriously, Softimage is 
way better in many point of view. It has no artisan, has no PaintFX, but for 
example rendering is way faster (with MR), shading setup is way faster, 
modeling is lot faster, and so on. So I really don't understand, how come that 
Softimage is not acknowledged at all. I swear guys, that I'll spread the Word 
of Softimage


Cheers

Szabolcs

From: 
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com]
 On Behalf Of Henry Katz
Sent: Sunday, January 05, 2014 8:18 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: rumor, Soft dead within the next year

Good thing I asked.

On 01/04/2014 05:40 PM, Stephen Blair wrote:
Softimage doesn't support Python 3.x


On Sat, Jan 4, 2014 at 3:26 PM, Henry Katz 
mailto:hk-v...@iscs-i.com>> wrote:
Steve,

No issues with python 3.3 as well, before I bruise my knuckles on the bleeding 
edge?

Cheers,
Henry
On 01/03/2014 02:47 AM, Steven Caron wrote:
really?

install pyqt
set softimage to use system python, uncheck... file>preferences>scripting>use 
python installed with softimage
run the example scripts

Re: rumor, Soft dead within the next year

[Graham Bell]

Ok, time to put this rumour to bed…..it was Lord Lucan riding Shergar, jumping 
over piles of odd socks.


G



From: Adrian Wyer 
mailto:adrian.w...@fluid-pictures.com>>
Reply-To: 
"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2013 17:45:05 +
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: RE: rumor, Soft dead within the next year

i heard a rumour, Hitler was seen riding a dinosaur past the pyramids, 
accompanied by a flying shark who sang show-tunes !!

boom!!

yes, i am drinking



a


From:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com]
 On Behalf Of Kris Rivel
Sent: 20 December 2013 17:42
To: Softimage List
Subject: Re: rumor, Soft dead within the next year

I'll use it till it no longer runs.  My only problem is that if I need 
additional help/talent...harder to find.  If I want to join another team 
working on something else...I pretty much have to use something else.  I've 
mentioned Softimage maybe to a dozen clients the past few months and they look 
at me and say "whats it called?"  Its annoying..they have no clue.  Maya, Max 
and C4D are so common that its like Coke and Pepsi...even my retired neighbor 
knows what it is.  Just venting...but I can't complain.  I'm still using it, 
loving it and...knock on wood...busy s I'll just stop now.

And yes...great work Walter...really really nice piece!

Kris

On Fri, Dec 20, 2013 at 12:36 PM, Emilio Hernandez 
mailto:emi...@e-roja.com>> wrote:
PS.  Congratulations Walter amazing job!

[%20]

2013/12/20 Stefan Kubicek 
mailto:s...@tidbit-images.com>>
Wow, that must have been a lot of work! Looks f***ing awesome.


Merry Xmas and a happy new Year:

done with one of the last version of softimage:

http://www.bang-awards.com/en/movie/362-mite



--


Walter Volbers
Senior Animator

FIFTYEIGHT 3D
Animation & Digital Effects GmbH

Kontorhaus Osthafen
Lindleystraße 12
60314 Frankfurt am Main
Germany

Telefon +49 (0) 69.48 000 55.50
Telefax +49 (0) 69.48 000 55.15

mailto:w...@fiftyeight.com
http://www.fiftyeight.com



ESC58
Eine Kooperation der escape GmbH und der FIFTYEIGHT3D GmbH

http://www.ESC58.de


--
---
Stefan Kubicek
---
keyvis digital imagery
Alfred Feierfeilstraße 3
A-2380 Perchtoldsdorf bei Wien
Phone: +43/699/12614231
www.keyvis.at ste...@keyvis.at
-- This email and its attachments are --
--confidential and for the recipient only--



No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2013.0.3462 / Virus Database: 3658/6935 - Release Date: 12/19/13
<>

Re: SIC London Christmas Drinks tonight

[Graham Bell]

Sadly can’t make tonight, but happy to try and catch up in the new year.

Have a good one.

G


From: Chris Marshall 
mailto:chrismarshal...@gmail.com>>
Reply-To: 
"softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2013 15:31:24 +
To: "softimage@listproc.autodesk.com" 
mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>>
Subject: Re: SIC London Christmas Drinks tonight

anyone in Cardiff friday for beer? Not wanting to hijack this thread...


On 18 December 2013 14:58, Matt Morris 
mailto:matt...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Stuck in Bath with a project, can't make it down tonight. Humbug. Enjoy the 
festive boozin sesh!


On 18 December 2013 14:51, Rob Chapman 
mailto:tekano@gmail.com>> wrote:
see you there from 7pm  - with bells on!


On 18 December 2013 12:51, adrian wyer 
mailto:adrian.w...@fluid-pictures.com>> wrote:
afternoon all, just a polite reminder that we're meeting at the White Horse on 
Newburgh St (just off Carnaby St) tonight for some festive ales

i would imagine from about 6:30 ish

bring your drinking pants, or not, as the case may be

a

Adrian Wyer
Fluid Pictures
75-77 Margaret St.
London
W1W 8SY
++44(0) 207 580 0829

adrian.w...@fluid-pictures.com
www.fluid-pictures.com

Fluid Pictures Limited is registered in England and Wales.
Company number:5657815
VAT number: 872 6893 71





--
www.matinai.com



--
[http://mintmotion.co.uk/img/mint.png]
Chris Marshall
Mint Motion Limited
029 20 37 27 57
07730 533 115
www.mintmotion.co.uk

<>