do not repay evil with evil or insult with insult 1 Pet. 3:9 NIV
From: leaking pen [mailto:itsat...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, January 03, 2013 4:08 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:something to consider
I'm pointing out an inconsistency in a
, Zell, Chris
chrisz...@wetmtv.commailto:chrisz...@wetmtv.com wrote:
Hasn't Prof. Graneau identified arc explosions in water as overunity? That a
turbine should be engineered to take advantage of the effect as free energy?
Papp did mention water vapor in his engine patent, if I recall correctly
Just exploring? Would you like more of these sort of comments from Hansen,
perhaps?
Or maybe people with some authority trying to compare climate deniers to
pedophiles, as recently reported on Drudge?
http://www.oocities.org/waterfuel111/water_explosion_menu.html
The above isn't exactly Acta Physica but it has some interesting links and
claims
From: ChemE Stewart [mailto:cheme...@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2013 10:02 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
election. We need some kind of moderation on
this list. Who needs this kind of inane diversion? Too bad, it used to be a
thoughtful group.
BTW - there have been many replication attempts of Graneau's water arc - and
none that I recall was positive.
Jones
From: Zell, Chris
http
http://www.rexresearch.com/barbat/barbat.htm
... the light (or low mass) electron LME sounds a bit like Ken Shoulders EVO
ideas
From: Zell, Chris
http://www.conspiracyoflight.com/waterarc/waterarcexplosion.html
Try the above as to success
The fact that many or most Americans do not fear the government is not
something to celebrate. The erosion of rights under the Constitution is
shocking - if most people understood or cared - and Obama has become worse than
Bush.
While Congress hotly debates budgets, just hours away from a
Hasn't Prof. Graneau identified arc explosions in water as overunity? That a
turbine should be engineered to take advantage of the effect as free energy?
Papp did mention water vapor in his engine patent, if I recall correctly.
The Russians did a lot of work on the Electrohydraulic effect
How about some Klonopin or other treatments for OCD? That's what I'm seeing
here ( yes, from my own experience). I can't imagine anything more pointless
than arguments about religious dogma.
Time would be better spent discovering/developing free energy - by which means
the entire Middle East
It's impressive, initially - but why not throw in a few diodes and filtering
circuit and make it into DC?
I never understand why these inventors keep working with AC, often both in and
out, when DC would end all accusations of power factor issues?
Are we seeing real overunity or just some sort
I'm looking for a little help here.
Some years ago, J. Naudin published the Synergetics theory of a French
scientist. His models of this theory appeared to offer overunity.
Unfortunately, the stuff is mostly in French and Babblefish is kinda
approximate.
The scientist claimed that Tomakak
http://www.businessinsider.com/quantum-imaging-university-of-rochester-radar-stealth-f-35-fifth-generation-2012-12
A new imaging technology has been developed that may make stealth obsolete.
May put a crimp in all that bombing and strafing.
4, 2012, at 5:59 PM, Zell, Chris
chrisz...@wetmtv.commailto:chrisz...@wetmtv.com wrote:
A lack of threats? That depends what side offers safety and acceptance.
http://www.climatedepot.com/a/1096/Execute-Skeptics-Shock-Call-To-Action-At-what-point-do-we-jail-or-execute-global-warming-deniers
If this 'bribe 3000' scientists can be taken of an example of the logic that
supports global warming, I am shocked.
I would hope that anyone reading these posts would gather that threatening
deniers would suffice - or just informing all that inquire that the science is
settled' as the BBC is
I beseech thee in the bowels of Christ, think it possible ye may be mistaken.
There is a degree of logic in what you say but...
There are MANY conspiracies that involve large numbers of people that are quite
successful. At least one 9/11 debunking site has protested as to why so many
.
From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2012 3:01 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Bribing 2,000 climatologists
Zell, Chris chrisz...@wetmtv.commailto:chrisz...@wetmtv.com wrote:
There are MANY conspiracies that involve large numbers
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Bribing 2,000 climatologists
Zell, Chris chrisz...@wetmtv.commailto:chrisz...@wetmtv.com wrote:
This deception was practiced openly(???). I can also offer definitions of
'oxymoron or 'contradiction in terms', if that would help.
Many deceptions are openly
I sincerely hope that our civilization is prepared for a possible Carrington
event - that could dwarf any global warming effects. Another point, not often
admitted is the possible influence of the TBTJ banks - which largely control
governments. They want to profit from running carbon tax/permit
It is sad indeed to realize that politics and entrenched financial interests
dominate science - or what passes for it- but the notion that global warming
denial is just triggered by oil companies and the like is naïve. There are
powerful interests on the other side - and, in addition, because
In regard to the power of the international banks and their scofflaw
privileges, the extreme nature of the situation is kept out of the mainstream
press. It would be too frightening for most people to know just how sociopathic
and immune to the law they are.
Take the case of Andrew McGuire -
A lack of threats? That depends what side offers safety and acceptance.
http://www.climatedepot.com/a/1096/Execute-Skeptics-Shock-Call-To-Action-At-what-point-do-we-jail-or-execute-global-warming-deniers--Shouldnt-we-start-punishing-them-now
Should they be executed? Or just sent to jail? Is
It may be to our advantage that Rossi and others are thought to be fools or
frauds. Let the PTB find out otherwise amidst surprize and their own ruin.
I have often wondered how a free energy technology could be introduced at large
if an 'accident' or sudden 'heart attack' or murder by a lone
I've never liked Obama but I did have to give him credit for telling the
Israeli government No to starting WW3 over Iran. His re-election is a big step
for peace in that respect and I hope for more world progress if free energy
emerges.
I hope Obama knows what to do, I don't.
Release a Presidential Pardon for anyone who exposes free energy or alien
technology. If you're a skeptic, you have nothing to fear. None of that
exists, right?
Make peace with Iran and tell the Israelis they have 30 days to do a two state
solution or
I am looking for any reported anomalies with regard to pulsing or causing a
permanent magnet to oscillate. Here's one, as claimed:
http://www.rexresearch.com/maccanti/maccanti.htm
Someone over at Overunity.com did an excellent photo analysis of the Marks
device and concluded that it involved
A redistributist economy is inevitable. I say this sadly because I have
libertarian impulses but realize that technology is leading us into a state
like StarTrek - in which no one has secure employment except for the guy who
fixes the Replicator.
-Original Message-
From: Jojo Jaro
These discussions about the rich are starting to sound like generals in WW2,
prepared to fight the previous war.
I have not read a single commentator talk about the future problem of being
rich: first, as to stocks, the markets are highly correlated - even more so
than in the '08 crash.
These battery pulsing/shuttling devices have been around since the Ed Grey
motor. Whatever it is, it gets rediscovered and rediscovered.
I personally think that Ed Shoulders Charge Clusters explain both LENR and
these devices. If have ever read his main patents, you are witness to a huge
I was wondering if there was a way to get electrical energy by using a
permanent magnet in a conductive path with iron wire. I think the Roy Meyer
device worked this way, as well as perhaps the Coler devices that were exposed
by British Intelligence after the war.
To explain: Ed Shoulders is not some ill-educated crackpot. He discovered a
'particle' he initially called Electron Validum, later changed to charge
cluster. Some Russians independently made the same claim, calling them ectons'
or something.
Anyhow, they are transient structures of huge
RV stuff is too tricky and approximate to be reliable. They made over 100K on
silver futures but could never do it again. Russell Targ's daughter did
predictive viewing of roulette at the top of the hour and got asked to leave
casinos but could only specify red or black.
The big thing to
see:
http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/12/01/24/161240/pirate-bay-to-offer-physical-item-downloads
Pirate Bay is offering downloadable files to create objects via newly available
3-D printers. Almost like transmitting a physical object over IP.
Remember this it might be a moment in
Once upon a time, a fellow named Ralph challenged GM because of their dangerous
products. How did they respond to this technological/legal issue? Simply
apologize and fix the problem with the Corvair's rear axle (I owned one)? No,
GM hired investigators to dig up some dirt on Ralph Nader and
Defective analogy. The cars for sale are real and functional, aren't they?
Even if the business is dishonest.
From: Mary Yugo [mailto:maryyu...@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 4:09 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Rossi comments on the It
this Rossi stuff.
From: Mary Yugo [mailto:maryyu...@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 4:34 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Rossi comments on the It was sent back statement
On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 1:17 PM, Zell, Chris
chrisz
Edison was a greedy liar and cheat who was cruel to animals. Schrodinger was a
bigamist. MLK and possibly Einstein were plagiarists. Werner Von Braun was a
Nazi and may have held rank in the SS. Tesla was a OCD-laden nutball.
I'm not sure I'd buy a used car from any of them. OTOH, I still
nowhere. but don't be naive about risk
From: Mary Yugo [mailto:maryyu...@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 5:24 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Rossi comments on the It was sent back statement
On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 2:11 PM, Zell, Chris
Yes, the bankruptcies will be massive. However, some entities will survive
based on oil/gas used as a petrochemical feedstock. For them, it ain't gonna
be pretty.
From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, January 07, 2012 12:04 PM
To:
If I had a complete, working, practical free energy device - and wisely feared
for my life - I would consider finding someone who is a staunch Zionist/Israeli
patriot, with a scientific background and donating it to him. Political
jiu-jitsu, I say.
At this point, I think many of us are so
are desperate, as the mass/demand economy
dries up. Hit them with free energy and watch the fun really start.
The idea that free energy might wreck strong governance is an old sci-fi theme.
Godspeed to that.
Zell, Chris wrote:
At this point, I think many
, but it
will leak to the workers and small businesses...
for me it will behave like the big productivity gains of the 50s-60s... be good
for the weak too... unlike today.
2011/12/27 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.commailto:jedrothw...@gmail.com
Zell, Chris wrote:
At this point, I think many
I have to feel stunned by the naivete of some of you. Major corporations are
entirely capable of murder or theft. I suggest you read up on John Perkins and
his book Confessions of an Economic Hitman in which he cites various
coincidences of third world leaders who met with an accident after
I've been watching this soap opera for months now and wonder greatly how
persons of such education are blind to the pathological nature of this Rossi
discussion.
This endless debate isn't about honest concern for science or anything else.
This is pure OCD and having been afflicted with that
I absolutely hate to admit it but these disruptive technologies will force
income redistribution on the world to a degree never seen before. Indeed, I
think that's already starting to happen. While mobs in NYC protest the evil
1%, wiser heads understand that this 1% now pays 43% of NYC tax
How much government spending goes to the richest 1%? Very little, I think.
You have to allow for some discretion, for God's sake!
They invest in Congress (lobbyists, re-election cash and outright bribes) and
get - not outright cash in return but rather legislation that inhibits
competition,
they privatize
globalization those 30 last years (since reagan/thatcher)...
that is the danger but lenr hace bad caracteristic for that unlike green helps
2011/12/14 Zell, Chris chrisz...@wetmtv.commailto:chrisz...@wetmtv.com
How much government spending goes to the richest 1%? Very little, I think
If Cold Fusion or other forms of nearly free energy emerge, obviously there
will be radical change in the world. 'Free' energy will have a profoundly
deflationary effect on the world economy. Oil will move towards a price
consistent with being a chemical feedstock, eventually, as automobiles
Anyone can see that GM is on the verge of extinction, and management is
at fault. Look at their stock price, and the fact that they have offered
a buy out to every single remaining employee. This is de facto
liquidation.
GM and Detroit in general cannot build small fuel efficient cars at a
Maybe the vanadium flow cells were more expensive.
-Original Message-
From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2007 12:35 PM
To: vortex-L@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]:Utility plans 1,000 MW of batteries including PHEV
A power utility is installing gigantic
I hope I got this right. If not, it's on Keelynet
http://cjunk.blogspot.com/2007/02/quacks-cranks-and-junk-science.html
Are global warming skeptics really cranks and kooks?
-Original Message-
From: Terry Blanton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2007 9:51 AM
To:
I realize that completely eliminating all contamination is difficult but
if protons can be popped out of the vacuum by an arc discharge, then I
think we need
to take another look at the Steady State theory of the universe. This
could be one of those little experiments with big implications.
What conspiracy fans miss is that if all their theories are correct,
it's all futile and irrelevant. How so?
Because it would mean that vast numbers of people in and out of
government are utter traitors and sociopaths - and that they are little
more than obsequious thralls
to a nearly all
are - and have built an
astounding conspiracy in 9-11 to perpetuate themselves in rulership.
It's amazing.
On 2/23/07, Zell, Chris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
What conspiracy fans miss is that if all their theories are
correct, it's all futile and irrelevant. How so
The Russians keep complaining that they aren't getting paid by the
Iranians for nuke technology.
no one is claiming there were suicide pilots on the planes, of
any race, you just show how little you've looked into it to say
something like that.
It's only a theory if there isn't absolute proof.
On 2/22/07, Zell, Chris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Perhaps the answer lies in the Monty
In regard to the spreading of plans, it is true that few people will
bother to build anything BUT I am unaware of any real Free energy
device out there, in the big
wide world that actually works. Almost without exception, such claims
are vague as to critical details and disappointing as to
I read about this effect and I don't understand it's relationship to
supposed free energy. I've read stuff by Aspden about it and I don't
comprehend why
he sees this effect as having a bearing on free energy generation.
On the other hand, I think he has some good points about ether. If
empty
These Irish guys are claiming to have discovered free energy and
have challenged the world by putting an ad in the Economist to evaluate
their
stuff. One of their patents is WO2006035419 but I can't get espace to
open the document.
Is this a version of Bearden's MEG all over again?
I think it's www.steorn.net
What is disturbing also are the bogus assumptions that pass for thinking
about terrorism. Such as:
Appeasement: the biggest one of all. Europeans love appeasement.
Ignore the terror, pay them off, hope for a better tomorrow. If that
doesn't work, so what?
If your art
Comparing the Japanese to modern suicide warriors brings little
satisfaction. Their suicide was in defense of a nation with borders,
not some vague fanatical notion
Of a Muslim people. Thus, defeat or victory was easy to define.
In addition, the suicide spirit was cultivated in wartime Japan,
I agree that cutting off the flow of oil derived wealth is the likely
solution to most of the terror. Many Arab countries might be better
off if their oil disappeared
and they were forced to develop real, balanced economies that involve
manufacturing and trade - like Turkey.
If oil wealth were
When 9-11 happened, what depressed and horrified me the most was not the
actual losses of life and property, although they were bad enough.
What horrified me most was hearing that the Muslim men involved might
have attended college, gone to strip clubs and consumed alcohol. In
short, they
had
I noticed that Stuart Licht's Polysulphide battery patent will expire in
another year, relative to the '87 filing date. ( 4828942)
It claims to be a cheap, efficient flow cell unit with 3 times the
storage capacity of lead/metal systems. I can't find any evidence
that it was ever built.
I wonder
Has anyone ever attempted to use cavitation as a form of propulsion?
Perhaps that's what Schauberger or Clem were doing.
You might not agree with the answer!
I attended a seminar held by Russell Targ - who helped start the CIA's
psychic viewing program in the '80's. He pointed out that somebody
wrote a book about
an unsinkable ocean liner called the Titan , years before the Titanic
sank. Many of the fictional
I wonder about Paul Brown. He warned everyone he was being threatened,
discontinued his work - then re-started it later and died in an
accident soon after.
If tens of thousands die for oil in war, should inventors be off
limits? Most of us have enough sense to avoid walking thru crime ridden
Has ANYONE ever replicated Meyer's results? Even the Puharich patent
doesn't seem as dramatic.
OT, I feel more strongly about the work of Paul Brown - who, it appears
to me, was far more rigorous and publically demonstrated than any
ZPE/free energy
enthusiast.
Yet, I never hear about anyone
I must confess I've never heard of this. It sounds somewhat
astonishing.
http://www.peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Butanol
A gasoline substitute that's cheap and fully equal in BTU energy
True, but in this case we are storing the best form of energy,
electricity as opposed to a car engine. You might need cheaper
electricity to make this
gadget more than a marginal improvement over what we're stuck with now.
20% is also about the efficiency of an ICE, which is also a bit
The thing to analyze is the efficiency. 20% for the Euro device is a bit
painful.
As I look into the archives, I see Chris Zell originally posted on this Al
bettery some time ago.
US patent 6,482,548 describes a similar technology with almost as great an
energy density:
Home Power magazine ( June 06) did a nice analysis of a Ford hybrid vs
non hybrid. The guy intends to keep it for ten years @ 20K miles a
year. He projects
coming out well ahead - and throws in a battery change in year 6.
I'd still like to hear more evidence about superior gas mileage on
:
Zell, Chris wrote:
Consumer Reports claims hybrid gas mileage is 19 mpg lower than the
EPA says and are among the worst in mileage exaggeration.
http://autos.msn.com/advice/CRArt.aspx?contentid=4023460
But they are the best in mileage! According to the Consumer Reports
list
Consumer Reports claims hybrid gas mileage is 19 mpg lower than the EPA
says and are among the worst in mileage exaggeration.
http://autos.msn.com/advice/CRArt.aspx?contentid=4023460
Given the cost premium over a regular vehicle, it's likely that hybrids
are actually wasting more energy thru
When electric cars are developed, the operating costs are going to be
compelling for households with two or more vehicles and businesses that
operate
fleets of cars locally. Even with $3 gasoline, electric vehicles are
going to be much cheaper to operate per mile. The obstacle will be the
Guys, many of us have two ( or more ) cars in our households. So, you
can buy a electric car for short trips for wifey and a gasoline or
hybrid for
longer distances.
Better yet, just buy the hybrid and charge it overnight, saving the
engine for those long trips to the relatives.
This is the title of an editorial in the May 2006 copy of Evaluation
Engineering magazine, page 6. Some quotes:
. Altair Nanotechnologies, a supplier of advanced nanomaterials,
has developed a lithium-ion battery that could enable an electric
vehicle to perfom
equally as well as a
http://www.prweb.com/releases/2006/5/prweb379366.htm
The choice: risk air pollution with depoly schemes or risk water
pollution by continuing to bury refuse. Still, it's a step forward.
See:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7231843493488769585q=thermite;
pl=true
Lots of fun with thermite
I believe you should check out Kozyrev ( sp?) on this subject. He
claimed that motion could change mass ( at non relativistic speeds).
Rex research might have one or more of his papers.
-Original Message-
From: Harry Veeder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2006 1:26
new way
to fix the energy storage problem.
-Original Message-
From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2006 6:07 PM
To: vortex-L@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: Simple comparison electric car versus gasoline
Zell, Chris wrote:
This lack of additional generating
This lack of additional generating capacity need is partly why a Really
Good Battery would have such a dramatic effect on society. You create
electric cars
that run much cheaper per mile without much need for additional fossil
fuel generator use. Indeed, I think that such a device would
From the Financial Times Jan. 30, 2006 page 6
In 2003, nearly 70 percent of Austria's domestically produced power
came from renewable sources. Biomass fuelled 11.2 percent of Austria's
total primary
energy supply and 21 per cent of heat production Not only do forests
grow back, they absorb
See:
www.techbriefs.com/techsearch/tow/ethanol.html
Produces profitable ethanol and silica from waste plant material.
Market already exists for rice growers to use device, to profit from
present waste.
http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/A
rticle_Type1c=Articlecid=1141599010468call_pageid=970599109774col=Co
lumnist971715454851
The above is exactly what I've hoped for in regard to batteries. If
they can perfect this, the whole world changes : the trade
If the link is too difficult to use, do a web search on EEStor and
their ceramic ultracap. The rumors spilling out are stunning.
-Original Message-
From: Zell, Chris [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 3:20 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: New Battery Hope
I'm sorry, I don't want any sham
poo
I want the real poo.
From: Frederick Sparber
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 03, 2006 9:26
AMTo: vortex-l@eskimo.comSubject: Re: Cow Poop to Miles
Per Gallon
True, Richard.
In a phone conversation with Pete Domenici years ago we
The oldest question: If it's real, you should be able to make it self
running, with an output of excess power.
If this seems possible, I would try to design something using a bunch of
ultracapacitors to hold the juice - and thereby avoid any questions
about batteries
being a circuit element, as
Ah, Thorium!
An encyclopedia will tell you that there is more energy in the world's
thorium deposits that all the oil, gas and coal combined.
Trouble is: how do I power my car with it?
-Original Message-
From: Harry Veeder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, February 10, 2006
if we want to live like third-world peasants. We are headed in that
direction.
More sad hysteria
horrendous and totally uncontrolled pollution caused by ethanol
production
You are not even aware it exists.
Amazing - and now you're a mind reader
Jobs in rural areas that also reduce
www.worldnetdaily.com/biznetdaily/
We haven't had any new nuclear power plants built in many years.
Since any notion of NIMBYism is to be rejected ( despite overwhelming
political
evidence that it is real), the clear answer is THAT URANIUM HAS PEAKED!
The same goes for the rich Cape Cod elitists who don't want wind
turbines
off
Well, that settles it. The voice of God has spoken and settled the
matter for us.
His 2003 study claims that Brazil dropped subsidies because ethanol
production was ineffective. Yet, ethanol has expanded there, along with
ethanol exports
doubling recently.
Apparently, they found ways to become
-Original Message-
From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 10:38 AM
To: vortex-L@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: Do we have peak uranium, too?
At 10:24 AM 2/3/2006, you wrote:
Zell, Chris wrote:
We haven't had any new nuclear power plants built
-Original Message-
From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 10:32 AM
To: vortex-L@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: Message from D. Pimentel
. This comment is petulant and sophomoric. You should read his papers
carefully and then if you find a technical
, 2006 11:54 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: Do we have peak uranium, too?
Zell, Chris wrote:
We haven't had any new nuclear power plants built in many years.
Since any notion of NIMBYism is to be rejected
You are misconstruing a lot of things here.
Peak oil was predicted quite a long
-Original Message-
From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 11:48 AM
To: vortex-L@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: Message from D. Pimentel
Zell, Chris wrote:
As for Brazil and the rest - so now ethanol is a human rights issue?
You're getting desperate
-Original Message-
From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 3:21 PM
To: vortex-L@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: Message from D. Pimentel
Zell, Chris wrote:
I think US farmers can handle this without a return to slavery.
Absolutely! They do
Much of the criticism about ethanol is simple pessimism, and ignores the
likelihood that the technology will improve as it develops.
www.abc.net.au/science/news/stories/s1556439.htm
-Original Message-
From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006
Title: Message
From: John Coviello [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 6:19 PMTo:
vortex-l@eskimo.comSubject: Re: Are Big Oil Conspiracies Really
Off-Base?
The way I see it, our dependence on oil is the product of one of the most
far flung social engineering
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