Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On 20 Aug 2013, at 14:13, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, That's gross. albeit it would have been better if Bin Laden had focusses only on legitimate military targets like the White House, the US Congress, the Senate and the Pentagon. My bag of evidences that 9/11 is a false flag has grown bigger than the bag of evidences that Bin Laden is the responsible one. The main evidence for the false flag is the total lack of seriousness of the NIST official report. I am afraid the war on terror is as much fear selling than the war on drugs. Bruno Citeren Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net: The Nazi history of the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jk4a3Kk6-Y Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] See my Leibniz site at http://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything- l...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
For a pure economic study of the crises of the middle ages, I recommend The rise of the western world http://www.amazon.com/The-Rise-Western-World-Economic/dp/0521290996 It is plenty of insights about why happened what. It is a bit hard for non economists but it worth the pain. 2013/8/29 spudboy...@aol.com So very true. During that time we had the Black Plague (1st of 4) and even before this we had the start of the Little Ice Age, which caused starvation, and weakend the populations of Asia, Africa, and Europe (hunger produces children with weaker immune systems) and again a high death rate. Perhaps 25%-33% of the continent. It was a time of calamities-human and otherwise. And yet the greatest mass murderer of all history remains Genghis Khan… lest we forget. The Mongol hordes of Genghis Khan murdered so many people that there was a corresponding measurable drop in humanities global carbon footprint, because so many people were wiped out that huge areas reverted back to forest because there was no one to farm the land. Human brutality to other humans (and our planet) has a long and bloody history, and the champion genocidalist (if I may coin the word) of all time committed his crimes more than 800 years ago, and without modern technology. -Chris -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 27, 2013 12:34 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood And yet the greatest mass murderer of all history remains Genghis Khan… lest we forget. The Mongol hordes of Genghis Khan murdered so many people that there was a corresponding measurable drop in humanities global carbon footprint, because so many people were wiped out that huge areas reverted back to forest because there was no one to farm the land. Human brutality to other humans (and our planet) has a long and bloody history, and the champion genocidalist (if I may coin the word) of all time committed his crimes more than 800 years ago, and without modern technology. -Chris *From:* everything-list@googlegroups.com [ mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.comeverything-list@googlegroups.com?] *On Behalf Of *spudboy...@aol.com *Sent:* Tuesday, August 27, 2013 4:29 AM *To:* everything-list@googlegroups.com *Subject:* Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood As someone who voted for Al Gore in 2000 (he liked hydrogen cars, what can I say?) I don't believe it was corruption that won Bush jr. his election, but the idiocies of the electoral process. Hanging chads or accusations of Deibold voting machines not withstanding. Democracy, is not a thing most Muslims seem to like, or like the communists and the Nazis, appear to see it as a stepping stone to power and what they wanted in its ultimate form. What most governments today are not Republics-although the voting methods still are, we are corporatist governments. Corporatism is not just corporations, but something else. Please view Wikipedia's corporatism article its splendid because its informative. What is lacking from this forum/thread is the awareness of the perfidies of socialism, as well as capitalism-a one way street. If we want to lambast capitalists for mass murder (and you guys do!) the look no further than Belgium's rubber plantations in central Africa. (sorry Bruno!) where 8 million Africans were worked to death, because of incentives offered by the Belgian government at the time-an incredible history there. Finally, the Nazis couldn't have gained power without the German communists cooperation with the SA, where as they began to stage street battles SA v. the Red Scarves in order to undermine Weimar, as being ineffective to make the streets safe. For an intense look at the Nazi-Soviet ear, please consider reading Tim Snyder's The Bloodlands-Between Stalin and Hitler. Siding with totalitarian Al Qaeda, is also foolish, as their goals are Sharia Law worldwide. Secondly even is Saibal's view is accurate (attack the military only) it wound up have the US push the Taleban from power, and the wars in the middle east gather so many fanatical jihadists there that it was a magnet for their destruction (unintentionally) because the US and Nato forces turned many of them into non-combative corpses-reducing the jihadist troops. Under Obama, with his policies-their fortunes have reversed. I am guessing they are planning some nasty surprises for the US, which will no doubt make Smitra all jolly. -Original Message- From: chris peck chris_peck...@hotmail.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Sun, Aug 25, 2013 8:22 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood corruption in politics (US elections 2000) is good in hind sight because it led to democracy in Afghanistan and Iraq. or one more up Saibal's street: In hind sight the end of the Raj was a bad thing
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On 28 Aug 2013, at 17:24, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: Hi Chris, ... This is why physics and not philosophy is the best way to describe the world. But that's a philosophical point. And it is technically (quasi) refuted by comp (+ some amount of occam). Physics is the best way to describe one aspect of reality, but it is an emergent structure from the (highly redundant and structured) set of all computations (in Turing sense and thus pure arithmetical objects). Bruno Citeren chris peck chris_peck...@hotmail.com: Hi Saibal No I don't need to invoke morality, the price I pay for that is to have to explain explicity what I mean by a good outcome, what measure I choose here to determine this, etc. Saibal, by using the terms 'good'/'bad' and 'right'/'wrong' you can not help but invoke morality because that is the language of morality. And we are able to see what standard of morality you are invoking by examining your justifications. You are a consequentialist. You assess the rightness/wrongness of supporting Nazis by balancing outcomes. You judge 9/11 to have been good or bad because of the outcomes it had for x,y,z. This is consequentialism and it is a moral perspective. You don't escape that fact by also claiming you have no time for morality, all that does is reveal you to be inconsistent. 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, despite the perpetrators not having good intentions, i.e. the perpetrators of 9/11 wanted to achieve something that I would not have preferred. You are invoking the concept of moral quality of an act, not me. No, Saibal you invoke the moral quality of the act by describing it as a good thing. What else do you think your doing by describing something as a 'good'? Having a cup of tea? The fact that the intentions of the perpetrators plays no role in your judgement is paradigmatic of the teleological nature of consequentialism. One of the many reasons so many people find that kind of reasoning unconvincing and shallow. Moral philosophy???. Well, I consider philosophy to be pseudoscience, I already told you what I think about morality, so I don't have to tell you what I think about moral philosophy. I'm assuming that you are using 'pseudoscience' pejoratively here which is silly coming from someone who believes in multiple realities which amount to a bunch of subjectively calculated sums. But the truth is that philosophy isn't even close to being a pseudoscience. Philosophy is all very 'meta' and exists to draw out the flaws in reasoning we all engage in. I'm going to ignore your disdain for philosophy, mate, because it is too embarrassing to watch people who engage in little else besides pseudoscience and metaphysics shoot themselves in the foot. :) Morality in previous centuries has been invoked to justify the burning of people at the Stake for blasphemy, no one at the time argued that this was immoral based on a reading of all those philosophers. Rubbish. Take slavery : for a long time justified by teleological claims that the suffering of the few was outweighed by the benefits for the many it was eventually over thrown by deontological concerns about the sanctity of self determination. And of course people did argue that slavery was immoral. Of course people did argue that burning people at the stake was immoral. And it was precisely because people did engage in moral philosophy and those ideas dissipated into society that we are now at a point where we can argue about the morality of eating a cow and can take it as given that torture is wrong. John is a good example, he doesn't read past the first sentence when I wrote hat 9/11 was a good thing to have happend, Well I did read past the first sentence, but I needn't have. Look, if the gears in your brain are grinding away and delivering up moral statements like '9/11 was a good thing' then its time to visit the brain mechanic for a moral m.o.t. Maybe, if you really fancy yourself as a moral nihilist, then change the gaskets and abandon the use of moral terminology. Compare: Supporting the Nazis was useful for the Arabs way back when with Supporting the Nazis was the right thing to do way back when Do you see the difference? I think having a go at people for taking you at your word is foolish. All the best. Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 03:07:46 +0200 From: smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Chris, No I don't need to invoke morality, the price I pay for that is to have to explain explicity what I mean by a good outcome, what measure I choose here to determine this, etc. 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, despite the perpetrators not having good intentions, i.e. the perpetrators of 9/11 wanted to achieve something that I would not have preferred. You are invoking the concept of moral quality of an act, not me
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com wrote: I am just asking you to acknowledge you were incorrect in characterizing the popular and democratically elected leaders of sovereign states as two bit leaders. Would you prefer a Banana Republic Leaders? In Iran in 1953 women, half the human race, were not allowed to hold office or even vote, but today the elected officials accurately carry out the wishes of the majority of their superstitious constituents. And that is why Iran is such a hellhole, imprisoning people for naming their Teddy Bear Mohamed, forcing young girls to undergo genital mutilation, and making woman wear the equivalent of a hazmat suit 24/7. How about this, in the future I promise to give such democratically elected leaders all the respect they deserve. You have acknowledged that you were in fact incorrect Where the hell did I do that?? I am going to have to disagree with your peonage to the fascist regime of the Pavlavi family dynasty; don't think it was a good thing to install that brutal fascist regime and associate our country with all the repression, torture and killing that the Savak - the Sha's secret police -- engaged in. Oh the Shah was a brutal monster no doubt about it, but he didn't murder significantly more of his own people than the typical leader of a Islamic country, and he was a pussycat compared to the leaders of Iraq or Syria or Indonesia. Most important of all from the CIA's point of view he didn't try to push the rest of the world back into the ninth century. The 1979 revolution in Iran has roots that can be convincingly traced back to that earlier CIA backed coup It was a very bad thing that in 1979 a bunch of loonies took over Iran who were so stupid that they actually took the imbecilic teachings of the Islamic religion seriously, but it would have been even worse if they became boss in 1953; at least from 1953 to 1979 the human misery caused by that mind virus was largely confined to the borders of Iran. But is the world really a better place because of the CIA's action 60 years ago, would the Islamic revolution really have happened in 1953 not 1979 without their intervention? I think it probable that it would have but I could be wrong and reasonable men can disagree about this. But I do not think a reasonable person can say that the world is a better place because of 911, nor that the world is a better place because the Arabs supported Hitler, in fact I think such a person, and anybody who fails to denounce him (and I'm looking at you Chris) has all the morality and intelligence of a baboon in heat. To my mind if something is democratic that does not automatically mean it occupies the moral high ground. Hitler gained power legally, and a recent opinion poll showed that 64% of the Muslims in Egypt and Pakistan think the death penalty should be invoked for anyone who leaves Islam, and in Afghanistan 78% think so. And in Iraq andAfghanistan 60% think that the killing of female family members by men should be legal if the women sully the family honor. Would you really be upset if somebody prevented these democratic practices from being implemented? I wouldn't be. Are you trying to say that it was the correct and moral course of action to overthrow these two democratically elected leaders and then to support the fascist regimes that we installed in their place? I'm saying that being democratic and being moral are not the same thing, I'm saying that replacing a evil democratic regime which exports grief worldwide with a evil fascist regime that just torments its own people is probably a very good idea, or at least a better idea than doing nothing. It worked pretty well in Iran for 26 years, and may have been the best worst decision. John K Clark * * -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
So very true. During that time we had the Black Plague (1st of 4) and even before this we had the start of the Little Ice Age, which caused starvation, and weakend the populations of Asia, Africa, and Europe (hunger produces children with weaker immune systems) and again a high death rate. Perhaps 25%-33% of the continent. It was a time of calamities-human and otherwise. And yet the greatest mass murderer of all history remains Genghis Khan… lest we forget. The Mongol hordes of Genghis Khan murdered so many people that there was a corresponding measurable drop in humanities global carbon footprint, because so many people were wiped out that huge areas reverted back to forest because there was no one to farm the land. Human brutality to other humans (and our planet) has a long and bloody history, and the champion genocidalist (if I may coin the word) of all time committed his crimes more than 800 years ago, and without modern technology. -Chris -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 27, 2013 12:34 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood And yet the greatest mass murderer of all history remains Genghis Khan… lest we forget. The Mongol hordes of Genghis Khan murdered so many people that there was a corresponding measurable drop in humanities global carbon footprint, because so many people were wiped out that huge areas reverted back to forest because there was no one to farm the land. Human brutality to other humans (and our planet) has a long and bloody history, and the champion genocidalist (if I may coin the word) of all time committed his crimes more than 800 years ago, and without modern technology. -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 4:29 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood As someone who voted for Al Gore in 2000 (he liked hydrogen cars, what can I say?) I don't believe it was corruption that won Bush jr. his election, but the idiocies of the electoral process. Hanging chads or accusations of Deibold voting machines not withstanding. Democracy, is not a thing most Muslims seem to like, or like the communists and the Nazis, appear to see it as a stepping stone to power and what they wanted in its ultimate form. What most governments today are not Republics-although the voting methods still are, we are corporatist governments. Corporatism is not just corporations, but something else. Please view Wikipedia's corporatism article its splendid because its informative. What is lacking from this forum/thread is the awareness of the perfidies of socialism, as well as capitalism-a one way street. If we want to lambast capitalists for mass murder (and you guys do!) the look no further than Belgium's rubber plantations in central Africa. (sorry Bruno!) where 8 million Africans were worked to death, because of incentives offered by the Belgian government at the time-an incredible history there. Finally, the Nazis couldn't have gained power without the German communists cooperation with the SA, where as they began to stage street battles SA v. the Red Scarves in order to undermine Weimar, as being ineffective to make the streets safe. For an intense look at the Nazi-Soviet ear, please consider reading Tim Snyder's The Bloodlands-Between Stalin and Hitler. Siding with totalitarian Al Qaeda, is also foolish, as their goals are Sharia Law worldwide. Secondly even is Saibal's view is accurate (attack the military only) it wound up have the US push the Taleban from power, and the wars in the middle east gather so many fanatical jihadists there that it was a magnet for their destruction (unintentionally) because the US and Nato forces turned many of them into non-combative corpses-reducing the jihadist troops. Under Obama, with his policies-their fortunes have reversed. I am guessing they are planning some nasty surprises for the US, which will no doubt make Smitra all jolly. -Original Message- From: chris peck chris_peck...@hotmail.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Sun, Aug 25, 2013 8:22 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood corruption in politics (US elections 2000) is good in hind sight because it led to democracy in Afghanistan and Iraq. or one more up Saibal's street: In hind sight the end of the Raj was a bad thing because it led to the partition of India and Pakistan, wars over Kashmir and nuclear friction. There must be loads of counter-intuitive and flame worthy comments that can be rendered using Saibal's hokey logic. We should give some monkeys typewriters and throw a banana to the ape that generates the best one. all the best. Date: Sun, 25 Aug 2013 15:01:27 -0700 From
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
From: smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Chris, No I don't need to invoke morality, the price I pay for that is to have to explain explicity what I mean by a good outcome, what measure I choose here to determine this, etc. 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, despite the perpetrators not having good intentions, i.e. the perpetrators of 9/11 wanted to achieve something that I would not have preferred. You are invoking the concept of moral quality of an act, not me. Moral philosophy???. Well, I consider philosophy to be pseudoscience, I already told you what I think about morality, so I don't have to tell you what I think about moral philosophy. Morality in previous centuries has been invoked to justify the burning of people at the Stake for blasphemy, no one at the time argued that this was immoral based on a reading of all those philosophers. So, it's of no use other than to condemn people we don't like. Not invoking morality will force you to use rational arguments. John is a good example, he doesn't read past the first sentence when I wrote hat 9/11 was a good thing to have happend, because he has programmed a concept of morality in his brain to create a mental block in such a case. Whatever explanation I give has to be wrong because his sense of morality (which he can't expand on), tells him so. Saibal Citeren chris peck chris_peck...@hotmail.com: Hi Saibal When you say something is good you have some concept of morality in mind whether you like it or not. Otherwise comments like 'this is good' or 'that is good' are meaningless gibberish. In your case it is very obviously consequentialism you have in mind because you are attempting to balance outcomes in order to quantify the moral quality of an act. Typically the fact an event like 9/11 can, through some specious reasoning, be equated to a 'good' has been regarded as a reason to abandon the kind of reasoning you are fumbling with. But I suspect you are too stubborn to acknowledge a few thousand years of moral philosophy and rather than stand on the shoulders of giants prefer to swill around in the gutter. This is why John is right to call you an ass. Your 'arguments' show no more moral wit than a donkey. --- Original Message --- From: smi...@zonnet.nl Sent: 28 August 2013 6:14 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Morality is an ill defined concept, you can just as well invoke religion. I never appeal to any notion of morality, when I say that something is good, then I have some specific outcome in mind. I think I did explain that. An alien visiting the Earth may well conclude that the right thing to do is to exterminate all humans from the face of the Earth, citing the damage we do to the environment and the fact that we are not going to be persuaded to change our ways. From an animal life conservation point of view that decision can be argued to be the right decision. Citeren John Clark johnkcl...@gmail.com: A professional ass who goes by the pseudonym smi...@zonnet.nl because he's understandably too embarrassed to give his real name wrote: The modern history of Guatemala was decisively shaped by the U.S.-organized invasion and overthrow of [blah blah] Dear Mr. Ass Once somebody knows that you said supporting the Nazis was the right thing for the Arabs back then and I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, why on earth would anybody who was not drooling and locked inside a rubber room be interested in your opinion of the morality of ANYTHING? John K Clark ** -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
As someone who voted for Al Gore in 2000 (he liked hydrogen cars, what can I say?) I don't believe it was corruption that won Bush jr. his election, but the idiocies of the electoral process. Hanging chads or accusations of Deibold voting machines not withstanding. Democracy, is not a thing most Muslims seem to like, or like the communists and the Nazis, appear to see it as a stepping stone to power and what they wanted in its ultimate form. What most governments today are not Republics-although the voting methods still are, we are corporatist governments. Corporatism is not just corporations, but something else. Please view Wikipedia's corporatism article its splendid because its informative. What is lacking from this forum/thread is the awareness of the perfidies of socialism, as well as capitalism-a one way street. If we want to lambast capitalists for mass murder (and you guys do!) the look no further than Belgium's rubber plantations in central Africa. (sorry Bruno!) where 8 million Africans were worked to death, because of incentives offered by the Belgian government at the time-an incredible history there. Finally, the Nazis couldn't have gained power without the German communists cooperation with the SA, where as they began to stage street battles SA v. the Red Scarves in order to undermine Weimar, as being ineffective to make the streets safe. For an intense look at the Nazi-Soviet ear, please consider reading Tim Snyder's The Bloodlands-Between Stalin and Hitler. Siding with totalitarian Al Qaeda, is also foolish, as their goals are Sharia Law worldwide. Secondly even is Saibal's view is accurate (attack the military only) it wound up have the US push the Taleban from power, and the wars in the middle east gather so many fanatical jihadists there that it was a magnet for their destruction (unintentionally) because the US and Nato forces turned many of them into non-combative corpses-reducing the jihadist troops. Under Obama, with his policies-their fortunes have reversed. I am guessing they are planning some nasty surprises for the US, which will no doubt make Smitra all jolly. -Original Message- From: chris peck chris_peck...@hotmail.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Sun, Aug 25, 2013 8:22 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood corruption in politics (US elections 2000) is good in hind sight because it led to democracy in Afghanistan and Iraq. or one more up Saibal's street: In hind sight the end of the Raj was a bad thing because it led to the partition of India and Pakistan, wars over Kashmir and nuclear friction. There must be loads of counter-intuitive and flame worthy comments that can be rendered using Saibal's hokey logic. We should give some monkeys typewriters and throw a banana to the ape that generates the best one. all the best. Date: Sun, 25 Aug 2013 15:01:27 -0700 From: meeke...@verizon.net To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood On 8/25/2013 9:36 AM, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: If I think that: With hindsight 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, it ended up exposing the fascist Neo-Cons for what they were. That's sort of like saying it's good that the Nazi's killed all those people in death camps because that exposed what a dangerous philosophy of government Nazism is. Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com wrote: I was correcting your mischaracterization of two democratically elected and popular leaders who were overthrown in bloody CIA backed coups and replaced by fascist dictators Yes Chris, the CIA staged those coups, but some countries violently change their brutal 2 bit tin horn dictators with a new brutal 2 bit tin horn dictator more often than I change my underwear, so its a little hard for me to get all weepy about it; particularly when placed in the perspective (as I did in my post) of the tens of millions of there own people that the communists have murdered. As for IRAN I think the CIA probably did a good thing in 1953, yes it placed the country in the hands of a brutal 2 bit dictator, but from 1953 to 1979 it probably prevented the country from falling into the hands of brutal 2 bit dictators who were driven by their imbecilic religion to push their country back into the ninth century. Of course a lot of this is supposition, we'll never know for sure what the world would be like today if the CIA had not been involved in those coups; but I do know that even if what they did wasn't right it was little more than being mischievous compared with the horrors committed by Lenin or Stalin or Mao Zedong or Kim Ll-sung or Mr. Ass's favorite, Hitler. You had mischaracterized these two popularly elected heads of state as 2-bit leaders. I find that to be a strange choice of words to describe a democratically elected head of state. To my mind if something is democratic that does not automatically mean it occupies the moral high ground. Hitler gained power legally, and a recent opinion poll showed that 64% of the Muslims in Egypt and Pakistan think the death penalty should be invoked for anyone who leaves Islam, and in Afghanistan 78% think so. And in Iraq andAfghanistan 60% think that the killing of female family members by men should be legal if the women sully the family honor. Would you really be upset if somebody prevented these democratic practices from being implemented? I wouldn't be. John -- Not interested in placing any more wear and tear on your brain. Thank you, but I'm concerned that you ignored my question. Either we discuss or we don’t. Before we can talk more about moral issues I need you to answer the question I asked you in my last post, because discussing matters of morality with somebody who makes excuses for a creature who says supporting the Nazis was the right thing for the Arabs back then and I believe that 9/11 was a good thing would be like debating with a baboon over the correct way to solve a problem in Calculus. And I have better ways to allocate my time than that. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
And yet the greatest mass murderer of all history remains Genghis Khan. lest we forget. The Mongol hordes of Genghis Khan murdered so many people that there was a corresponding measurable drop in humanities global carbon footprint, because so many people were wiped out that huge areas reverted back to forest because there was no one to farm the land. Human brutality to other humans (and our planet) has a long and bloody history, and the champion genocidalist (if I may coin the word) of all time committed his crimes more than 800 years ago, and without modern technology. -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 4:29 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood As someone who voted for Al Gore in 2000 (he liked hydrogen cars, what can I say?) I don't believe it was corruption that won Bush jr. his election, but the idiocies of the electoral process. Hanging chads or accusations of Deibold voting machines not withstanding. Democracy, is not a thing most Muslims seem to like, or like the communists and the Nazis, appear to see it as a stepping stone to power and what they wanted in its ultimate form. What most governments today are not Republics-although the voting methods still are, we are corporatist governments. Corporatism is not just corporations, but something else. Please view Wikipedia's corporatism article its splendid because its informative. What is lacking from this forum/thread is the awareness of the perfidies of socialism, as well as capitalism-a one way street. If we want to lambast capitalists for mass murder (and you guys do!) the look no further than Belgium's rubber plantations in central Africa. (sorry Bruno!) where 8 million Africans were worked to death, because of incentives offered by the Belgian government at the time-an incredible history there. Finally, the Nazis couldn't have gained power without the German communists cooperation with the SA, where as they began to stage street battles SA v. the Red Scarves in order to undermine Weimar, as being ineffective to make the streets safe. For an intense look at the Nazi-Soviet ear, please consider reading Tim Snyder's The Bloodlands-Between Stalin and Hitler. Siding with totalitarian Al Qaeda, is also foolish, as their goals are Sharia Law worldwide. Secondly even is Saibal's view is accurate (attack the military only) it wound up have the US push the Taleban from power, and the wars in the middle east gather so many fanatical jihadists there that it was a magnet for their destruction (unintentionally) because the US and Nato forces turned many of them into non-combative corpses-reducing the jihadist troops. Under Obama, with his policies-their fortunes have reversed. I am guessing they are planning some nasty surprises for the US, which will no doubt make Smitra all jolly. -Original Message- From: chris peck chris_peck...@hotmail.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Sun, Aug 25, 2013 8:22 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood corruption in politics (US elections 2000) is good in hind sight because it led to democracy in Afghanistan and Iraq. or one more up Saibal's street: In hind sight the end of the Raj was a bad thing because it led to the partition of India and Pakistan, wars over Kashmir and nuclear friction. There must be loads of counter-intuitive and flame worthy comments that can be rendered using Saibal's hokey logic. We should give some monkeys typewriters and throw a banana to the ape that generates the best one. all the best. _ Date: Sun, 25 Aug 2013 15:01:27 -0700 From: meeke...@verizon.net To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood On 8/25/2013 9:36 AM, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: If I think that: With hindsight 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, it ended up exposing the fascist Neo-Cons for what they were. That's sort of like saying it's good that the Nazi's killed all those people in death camps because that exposed what a dangerous philosophy of government Nazism is. Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Citeren meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net: On 8/25/2013 9:36 AM, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: If I think that: With hindsight 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, it ended up exposing the fascist Neo-Cons for what they were. That's sort of like saying it's good that the Nazi's killed all those people in death camps because that exposed what a dangerous philosophy of government Nazism is. Brent It depends on how the two scenarios one would assume where it happened and did not happen. I believe that 9/11 led the US to commit mistakes that were seen to be mistakes by a large fraction of the US population. Had 9/11 not happened, the US would have evolved more gradually in the Neo-Con direction but then that would have had far greater acceptance from the US public. Saibal -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Morality is an ill defined concept, you can just as well invoke religion. I never appeal to any notion of morality, when I say that something is good, then I have some specific outcome in mind. I think I did explain that. An alien visiting the Earth may well conclude that the right thing to do is to exterminate all humans from the face of the Earth, citing the damage we do to the environment and the fact that we are not going to be persuaded to change our ways. From an animal life conservation point of view that decision can be argued to be the right decision. Citeren John Clark johnkcl...@gmail.com: A professional ass who goes by the pseudonym smi...@zonnet.nl because he's understandably too embarrassed to give his real name wrote: The modern history of Guatemala was decisively shaped by the U.S.-organized invasion and overthrow of [blah blah] Dear Mr. Ass Once somebody knows that you said supporting the Nazis was the right thing for the Arabs back then and I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, why on earth would anybody who was not drooling and locked inside a rubber room be interested in your opinion of the morality of ANYTHING? John K Clark ** -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
And I have better ways to allocate my time than that. Coming from a cuckoo clock/roulette wheel... LOL. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Hi Saibal When you say something is good you have some concept of morality in mind whether you like it or not. Otherwise comments like 'this is good' or 'that is good' are meaningless gibberish. In your case it is very obviously consequentialism you have in mind because you are attempting to balance outcomes in order to quantify the moral quality of an act. Typically the fact an event like 9/11 can, through some specious reasoning, be equated to a 'good' has been regarded as a reason to abandon the kind of reasoning you are fumbling with. But I suspect you are too stubborn to acknowledge a few thousand years of moral philosophy and rather than stand on the shoulders of giants prefer to swill around in the gutter. This is why John is right to call you an ass. Your 'arguments' show no more moral wit than a donkey. --- Original Message --- From: smi...@zonnet.nl Sent: 28 August 2013 6:14 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Morality is an ill defined concept, you can just as well invoke religion. I never appeal to any notion of morality, when I say that something is good, then I have some specific outcome in mind. I think I did explain that. An alien visiting the Earth may well conclude that the right thing to do is to exterminate all humans from the face of the Earth, citing the damage we do to the environment and the fact that we are not going to be persuaded to change our ways. From an animal life conservation point of view that decision can be argued to be the right decision. Citeren John Clark johnkcl...@gmail.com: A professional ass who goes by the pseudonym smi...@zonnet.nl because he's understandably too embarrassed to give his real name wrote: The modern history of Guatemala was decisively shaped by the U.S.-organized invasion and overthrow of [blah blah] Dear Mr. Ass Once somebody knows that you said supporting the Nazis was the right thing for the Arabs back then and I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, why on earth would anybody who was not drooling and locked inside a rubber room be interested in your opinion of the morality of ANYTHING? John K Clark ** -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
From: John Clark johnkcl...@gmail.com On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com wrote: I was correcting your mischaracterization of two democratically elected and popular leaders who were overthrown in bloody CIA backed coups and replaced by fascist dictators Yes Chris, the CIA staged those coups, but some countries violently change their brutal 2 bit tin horn dictators with a new brutal 2 bit tin horn dictator more often than I change my underwear, so its a little hard for me to get all weepy about it; particularly when placed in the perspective (as I did in my post) of the tens of millions of there own people that the communists have murdered. As for IRAN I think the CIA probably did a good thing in 1953, yes it placed the country in the hands of a brutal 2 bit dictator, but from 1953 to 1979 it probably prevented the country from falling into the hands of brutal 2 bit dictators who were driven by their imbecilic religion to push their country back into the ninth century. I truly hope you change your underwear more often than countries change regimes... for all concerned. Did I ask you to get weepy? I am just asking you to acknowledge you were incorrect in characterizing the popular and democratically elected leaders of sovereign states as two bit leaders. You have acknowledged that you were in fact incorrect and that is all I care that you do. Whether you want to get all weepy is your own concern not mine. I am going to have to disagree with your peonage to the fascist regime of the Pavlavi family dynasty; don't think it was a good thing to install that brutal fascist regime and associate our country with all the repression, torture and killing that the Savak - the Sha's secret police -- engaged in. In fact I think you are completely wrong. The 1979 revolution in Iran has roots that can be convincingly traced back to that earlier CIA backed coup (instigated by the way by British Petroleum that had been enjoying 90% take on the sale of Iranian oil until the democratically elected government of Iran of the time nationalized Iranian oil reserves. It was in fact British pressure that involved the US in Iranian affairs in 1953. Of course a lot of this is supposition, we'll never know for sure what the world would be like today if the CIA had not been involved in those coups; but I do know that even if what they did wasn't right it was little more than being mischievous compared with the horrors committed by Lenin or Stalin or Mao Zedong or Kim Ll-sung or Mr. Ass's favorite, Hitler. Correct they are just suppositions. You had mischaracterized these two popularly elected heads of state as 2-bit leaders. I find that to be a strange choice of words to describe a democratically elected head of state. To my mind if something is democratic that does not automatically mean it occupies the moral high ground. Hitler gained power legally, and a recent opinion poll showed that 64% of the Muslims in Egypt and Pakistan think the death penalty should be invoked for anyone who leaves Islam, and in Afghanistan 78% think so. And in Iraq and Afghanistan 60% think that the killing of female family members by men should be legal if the women sully the family honor. Would you really be upset if somebody prevented these democratic practices from being implemented? I wouldn't be. Are you trying to say that it was the correct and moral course of action to overthrow these two democratically elected leaders and then to support the fascist regimes that we installed in their place? John -- Not interested in placing any more wear and tear on your brain. Thank you, but I'm concerned that you ignored my question. As I will continue to do if I think they are rhetorical or just plain silly. Either we discuss or we don’t. Before we can talk more about moral issues I need you to answer the question I asked you in my last post, because discussing matters of morality with somebody who makes excuses for a creature who says supporting the Nazis was the right thing for the Arabs back then and I believe that 9/11 was a good thing would be like debating with a baboon over the correct way to solve a problem in Calculus. And I have better ways to allocate my time than that. I do not respond to your imperative demands very well now do I... amazing how that works (or doesn't work) Allocate your time however you choose to allocate it. Stop dialoging with me if you must -- I am fine with that outcome. It really is no skin off my back. Cheers, -Chris John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Chris, No I don't need to invoke morality, the price I pay for that is to have to explain explicity what I mean by a good outcome, what measure I choose here to determine this, etc. 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, despite the perpetrators not having good intentions, i.e. the perpetrators of 9/11 wanted to achieve something that I would not have preferred. You are invoking the concept of moral quality of an act, not me. Moral philosophy???. Well, I consider philosophy to be pseudoscience, I already told you what I think about morality, so I don't have to tell you what I think about moral philosophy. Morality in previous centuries has been invoked to justify the burning of people at the Stake for blasphemy, no one at the time argued that this was immoral based on a reading of all those philosophers. So, it's of no use other than to condemn people we don't like. Not invoking morality will force you to use rational arguments. John is a good example, he doesn't read past the first sentence when I wrote hat 9/11 was a good thing to have happend, because he has programmed a concept of morality in his brain to create a mental block in such a case. Whatever explanation I give has to be wrong because his sense of morality (which he can't expand on), tells him so. Saibal Citeren chris peck chris_peck...@hotmail.com: Hi Saibal When you say something is good you have some concept of morality in mind whether you like it or not. Otherwise comments like 'this is good' or 'that is good' are meaningless gibberish. In your case it is very obviously consequentialism you have in mind because you are attempting to balance outcomes in order to quantify the moral quality of an act. Typically the fact an event like 9/11 can, through some specious reasoning, be equated to a 'good' has been regarded as a reason to abandon the kind of reasoning you are fumbling with. But I suspect you are too stubborn to acknowledge a few thousand years of moral philosophy and rather than stand on the shoulders of giants prefer to swill around in the gutter. This is why John is right to call you an ass. Your 'arguments' show no more moral wit than a donkey. --- Original Message --- From: smi...@zonnet.nl Sent: 28 August 2013 6:14 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Morality is an ill defined concept, you can just as well invoke religion. I never appeal to any notion of morality, when I say that something is good, then I have some specific outcome in mind. I think I did explain that. An alien visiting the Earth may well conclude that the right thing to do is to exterminate all humans from the face of the Earth, citing the damage we do to the environment and the fact that we are not going to be persuaded to change our ways. From an animal life conservation point of view that decision can be argued to be the right decision. Citeren John Clark johnkcl...@gmail.com: A professional ass who goes by the pseudonym smi...@zonnet.nl because he's understandably too embarrassed to give his real name wrote: The modern history of Guatemala was decisively shaped by the U.S.-organized invasion and overthrow of [blah blah] Dear Mr. Ass Once somebody knows that you said supporting the Nazis was the right thing for the Arabs back then and I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, why on earth would anybody who was not drooling and locked inside a rubber room be interested in your opinion of the morality of ANYTHING? John K Clark ** -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Hi Saibal No I don't need to invoke morality, the price I pay for that is to have to explain explicity what I mean by a good outcome, what measure I choose here to determine this, etc. Saibal, by using the terms 'good'/'bad' and 'right'/'wrong' you can not help but invoke morality because that is the language of morality. And we are able to see what standard of morality you are invoking by examining your justifications. You are a consequentialist. You assess the rightness/wrongness of supporting Nazis by balancing outcomes. You judge 9/11 to have been good or bad because of the outcomes it had for x,y,z. This is consequentialism and it is a moral perspective. You don't escape that fact by also claiming you have no time for morality, all that does is reveal you to be inconsistent. 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, despite the perpetrators not having good intentions, i.e. the perpetrators of 9/11 wanted to achieve something that I would not have preferred. You are invoking the concept of moral quality of an act, not me. No, Saibal you invoke the moral quality of the act by describing it as a good thing. What else do you think your doing by describing something as a 'good'? Having a cup of tea? The fact that the intentions of the perpetrators plays no role in your judgement is paradigmatic of the teleological nature of consequentialism. One of the many reasons so many people find that kind of reasoning unconvincing and shallow. Moral philosophy???. Well, I consider philosophy to be pseudoscience, I already told you what I think about morality, so I don't have to tell you what I think about moral philosophy. I'm assuming that you are using 'pseudoscience' pejoratively here which is silly coming from someone who believes in multiple realities which amount to a bunch of subjectively calculated sums. But the truth is that philosophy isn't even close to being a pseudoscience. Philosophy is all very 'meta' and exists to draw out the flaws in reasoning we all engage in. I'm going to ignore your disdain for philosophy, mate, because it is too embarrassing to watch people who engage in little else besides pseudoscience and metaphysics shoot themselves in the foot. :) Morality in previous centuries has been invoked to justify the burning of people at the Stake for blasphemy, no one at the time argued that this was immoral based on a reading of all those philosophers. Rubbish. Take slavery : for a long time justified by teleological claims that the suffering of the few was outweighed by the benefits for the many it was eventually over thrown by deontological concerns about the sanctity of self determination. And of course people did argue that slavery was immoral. Of course people did argue that burning people at the stake was immoral. And it was precisely because people did engage in moral philosophy and those ideas dissipated into society that we are now at a point where we can argue about the morality of eating a cow and can take it as given that torture is wrong. John is a good example, he doesn't read past the first sentence when I wrote hat 9/11 was a good thing to have happend, Well I did read past the first sentence, but I needn't have. Look, if the gears in your brain are grinding away and delivering up moral statements like '9/11 was a good thing' then its time to visit the brain mechanic for a moral m.o.t. Maybe, if you really fancy yourself as a moral nihilist, then change the gaskets and abandon the use of moral terminology. Compare: Supporting the Nazis was useful for the Arabs way back when with Supporting the Nazis was the right thing to do way back when Do you see the difference? I think having a go at people for taking you at your word is foolish. All the best. Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2013 03:07:46 +0200 From: smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Chris, No I don't need to invoke morality, the price I pay for that is to have to explain explicity what I mean by a good outcome, what measure I choose here to determine this, etc. 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, despite the perpetrators not having good intentions, i.e. the perpetrators of 9/11 wanted to achieve something that I would not have preferred. You are invoking the concept of moral quality of an act, not me. Moral philosophy???. Well, I consider philosophy to be pseudoscience, I already told you what I think about morality, so I don't have to tell you what I think about moral philosophy. Morality in previous centuries has been invoked to justify the burning of people at the Stake for blasphemy, no one at the time argued that this was immoral based on a reading of all those philosophers. So, it's of no use other than to condemn people we don't like. Not invoking morality will force you to use rational arguments. John is a good example, he doesn't
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
A professional ass who goes by the pseudonym smi...@zonnet.nl because he's understandably too embarrassed to give his real name wrote: Agree or disagree with me, but it's something that can be debated. Dear Mr. Ass I'm a bit confused by your use of the word debated. In your previous post you proved your expertise in the art of copying and pasting stuff from the internet that you found on Google, and by saying supporting the Nazis was the right thing for the Arabs back then and I believe that 9/11 was a good thing you proved your expertise in the art of being a self righteous moral imbecile, but I didn't see any debating. ** You, on the other hand, are an ideologue Yes, my ideology is that supporting the Nazis was NOT the right thing for the Arabs back then, and my ideology is that 9/11 was NOT a good thing. And my ideology is that anybody who says such things can not be a good person. And my ideology is that anybody who sits at the feet of such a degenerate cretin and listens with respect while he pontificates about morality can not be a good person either. who is not capable of reading past the first sentence You are absolutely correct, I will not continue reading if the post is a critique of the morality of various historical events and the first sentence is supporting the Nazis was the right thing for the Arabs back then or I believe that 9/11 was a good thing. I will not continue reading because that is equivalent to shouting at the top of your lungs LOOK AT ME EVERYBODY, I AM A MORAL MORON. And Mr. Ass unlike you I am not embarrassed by what I have written so I will give my real name, it is John K Clark. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On Sun, Aug 25, 2013 at 2:37 PM, Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.comwrote: And yes half a century ago the CIA over through some 2 bit leaders in Chile and Iran, big deal. John you are either grossly ignorant of history, or squeeze it like toothpaste through the aperture of your ideological point of view. Chris, before I debate the morality or lack of morality of those 2 historical events with you I need to know if I will be placing wear and tear on my brain cells for no purpose, in short I need to know if you too are a self righteous moral moron. So Chris, what is your honest opinion of the morality of somebody who says supporting the Nazis was the right thing for the Arabs back then and I believe that 9/11 was a good thing? John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
John -- Not interested in placing any more wear and tear on your brain. Either we discuss or we don't. I was correcting your mischaracterization of two democratically elected and popular leaders who were overthrown in bloody CIA backed coups and replaced by fascist dictators (one of whom had dynastic aspirations). You had mischaracterized these two popularly elected heads of state as 2-bit leaders. I find that to be a strange choice of words to describe a democratically elected head of state. And I said so. Now you could just acknowledge that it may have not been the best way to describe them, otherwise you risk portraying yourself as a - to use your words - self righteous moral moron. It's your choice really. Oh, and I am not interested in playing the game you seem to want to play. Have a good day, -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of John Clark Sent: Monday, August 26, 2013 7:51 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood On Sun, Aug 25, 2013 at 2:37 PM, Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com wrote: And yes half a century ago the CIA over through some 2 bit leaders in Chile and Iran, big deal. John you are either grossly ignorant of history, or squeeze it like toothpaste through the aperture of your ideological point of view. Chris, before I debate the morality or lack of morality of those 2 historical events with you I need to know if I will be placing wear and tear on my brain cells for no purpose, in short I need to know if you too are a self righteous moral moron. So Chris, what is your honest opinion of the morality of somebody who says supporting the Nazis was the right thing for the Arabs back then and I believe that 9/11 was a good thing? John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On Sat, Aug 24, 2013 smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: With hindsight 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, You sir are an ass. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
If I think that: With hindsight 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, it ended up exposing the fascist Neo-Cons for what they were. The Neo-Con ideology was defeated on the battlegrounds of Iraq. It is sad that it had to happen that way with all the innocent victims in the US and Iraq, but I believe that the US and the rest of the World are today better off with these things having happened. I'm not going to decide not to say this just because someone doesn't like statements to be made about 9/11 that doesn't fit in his ideology, who will selectively quote things out of context, point to that selective quote and call me an ass. Citeren John Clark johnkcl...@gmail.com: On Sat, Aug 24, 2013 smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: With hindsight 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, You sir are an ass. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On Sun, Aug 25, 2013 at 12:05 PM, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: With hindsight 9/11 was a good thing to have happened You sir are an ass. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
If I think that: With hindsight 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, it ended up exposing the fascist Neo-Cons for what they were. The Neo-Con ideology was defeated on the battlegrounds of Iraq. It is sad that it had to happen that way with all the innocent victims in the US and Iraq, but I believe that the US and the rest of the World are today better off with these things having happened. I'm not going to decide not to say this just because someone doesn't like statements to be made about 9/11 that doesn't fit in his ideology, who will selectively quote things out of context, point to that selective quote and call me an ass. Citeren John Clark johnkcl...@gmail.com: On Sun, Aug 25, 2013 at 12:05 PM, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: With hindsight 9/11 was a good thing to have happened You sir are an ass. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 9:39 PM, Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.comwrote: Fascism unlike Communism (at the level of lip service at least) never preached a Universal Fascist state – an 1000 year Reich of one tribe over other inferior races maybe, but that idea lacks universal appeal. And lip service (who wouldn't want a workers paradise?) is the only reason that today people would have far more sympathy for Senator McCarthy if he'd gone after Neo-Nazis instead of Communists, and in general lip service is the one and only reason Communism has always seemed more respectable than Nazism even though it has caused at least as much misery in the world. In the 30's Stalin murdered millions of his own people and in the 20's Lenin forced people to abandon their private farms and go to huge corrupt monumentally inefficient collective farms with the result that millions died of starvation; In the 50's Mao did the exact same stupid thing in China in the name of communism and at least 30 million starved to death. In the 70's in Cambodia the communists murdered a greater percentage of their population than any regime in the history of the world. In the 90's in North Korea, a nightmare country as bad as anything George Orwell could dream up, communism caused two million to starve to death while South Korea, a country with the same culture and language but without communism became a world economic powerhouse. And yes half a century ago the CIA over through some 2 bit leaders in Chile and Iran, big deal. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On Sun, Aug 25, 2013 at 12:36 PM, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: With hindsight 9/11 was a good thing to have happened You sir are an ass. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
https://sites.google.com/site/faydowkerarchive2003/home/mariarosario The modern history of Guatemala was decisively shaped by the U.S.-organized invasion and overthrow of the democratically elected regime of Jacobo Arbenz in June 1954. Since that time, while Guatemala has remained securely within the U.S. sphere of influence, badly needed economic and social reforms were put off the agenda indefinitely, political democracy was stifled, and state terror was institutionalized and reached catastrophic levels in the late 1970s and early 1980s. The U.S. establishment overthrew the Arbenz government in 1954 because it ...found the pluralism and democracy of the years 1945-54 intolerable. Since that time ...not only has Guatemala gradually become a terrorist state rarely matched in the scale of systematic murder of civilians, but its terrorist proclivities have increased markedly at strategic moments of escalated U.S. intervention. In 1966, a further small guerrilla movement brought the Green Berets and a major CI [Counter-Insurgency] war in which 10,000 people were killed in pursuit of three or four hundred guerrillas. It was at this point that the 'death squads' and 'disappearances' made their appearance in Guatemala. The United States brought in police training in the 1970s, which was followed by the further institutionalization of violence. The 'solution' to social problems in Guatemala, specifically attributable to the 1954 intervention and the form of U.S. assistance since that time, has been permanent state terror. With Guatemala, the United States invented the 'counterinsurgency state.' During the Reagan years, the number of civilians murdered in Guatemala ran into the tens of thousands, and disappearances and mutilated bodies were a daily occurrence. Studies by Amnesty International (AI), Americas Watch (AW), and other human-rights monitors have documented a military machine run amok, with the indiscriminate killing of peasants (including vast numbers of women and children), the forcible relocation of hundreds of thousands of farmers and villagers into virtual concentration camps, and the enlistment of many hundreds of thousands in compulsory civil patrols. The number of civilians murdered between 1978 and 1985 may have approached 100,000 [one-hundred thousand], with a style of killing reminiscent of Pol Pot. As AI [Amnesty International] pointed out in 1981: The bodies of the victims have been found piled up in ravines, dumped at roadsides or buried in mass graves. Thousands bore the scars of torture, and death had come to most by strangling with a garrotte, by being suffocated in rubber hoods or by being shot in the head. The holocaust years 1978-85 yielded a steady stream of documents by human-rights groups that provided dramatic evidence of a state terrorism in Guatemala approaching genocidal levels. The spectacular AI [Amnesty International] report of 1981 on 'Disappearances: A Workbook,' describ[ed] a frightening development of state terrorism in the Nazi mold.” Human-rights monitoring and protective agencies have had a very difficult time organizing and surviving in the 'death-squad democracies' of El Salvador and Guatemala. Between October 1980 and March 1983, five officials of the Human Rights Commission of El Salvador were seized and murdered by the security forces. Guatemala has been even more inhospitable to human-rights organizations than El Salvador. Guatemalan Archbishop Monsignor Prospero Penados del Barrio asserted in 1984 that 'It is impossible for a human rights office to exist in Guatemala at the present time.' 'Disappearances' as an institutional form began in Guatemala in the mid-1960s and eventually reached levels unique in the Western Hemisphere, with the total estimated to be some 40,000 [forty thousand]. Protest groups that have formed to seek information and legal redress have been consistently driven out of business by state-organized murder. The Association of University Students (AEU) sought information on the disappeared through the courts in the course of a brief opening in 1966 but after one sensational expos\'e of the police murder of twenty eight leftists, the system closed down again. [...] In the 1970s a Committee of the Relatives of the Disappeared was organised by the AEU with headquarters in San Carlos National University. As Americas Watch points out, ``It disbanded after plainclothesmen walked into the University's legal aid center on March 10, 1974 and shot and killed its principal organizer, lawyer Edmundo Guerra Theilheimer, the center's director.'' Another human-rights group, the National Commission for Human Rights, was created in the late 1970s by psychologist and journalist Irma Flaquer. Her son was murdered and she herself ``disappeared'' on October 16, 1980. According to the British Parliamentary Human Rights Group, in 1984 alone there were an average of one hundred
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
A professional ass who goes by the pseudonym smi...@zonnet.nl because he's understandably too embarrassed to give his real name wrote: The modern history of Guatemala was decisively shaped by the U.S.-organized invasion and overthrow of [blah blah] Dear Mr. Ass Once somebody knows that you said supporting the Nazis was the right thing for the Arabs back then and I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, why on earth would anybody who was not drooling and locked inside a rubber room be interested in your opinion of the morality of ANYTHING? John K Clark ** -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Because I at least explain why that's the case. Agree or disagree with me, but it's something that can be debated. You, on the other hand, are an ideologue who is not capable of reading past the first sentence if that looks like contradicting whatever you believe in. Citeren John Clark johnkcl...@gmail.com: A professional ass who goes by the pseudonym smi...@zonnet.nl because he's understandably too embarrassed to give his real name wrote: The modern history of Guatemala was decisively shaped by the U.S.-organized invasion and overthrow of [blah blah] Dear Mr. Ass Once somebody knows that you said supporting the Nazis was the right thing for the Arabs back then and I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, why on earth would anybody who was not drooling and locked inside a rubber room be interested in your opinion of the morality of ANYTHING? John K Clark ** -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
The modern history of Guatemala was decisively shaped by the U.S.-organized invasion and overthrow of [blah blah] Obviously the genocide of the indigenous people in Guatemala in which something like two hundred thousand human beings (ethnic Maya mostly) were tortured, killed and disappeared by a brutal US installed dictator Rios Montt. US financed and backed death squads, controlled and operated many out of the US embassy in Honduras with Ambassador Negroponte (Ambassador death squad) directing operations on the ground - during the mid-eighties and operating fascist paramilitary death squads in El Salvador and Nicaragua as well. Genocide, torture, ethnic cleansing and mass rape are inexcusable crimes of war. It appears as if the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people at the hands of brutal fascist death squads means very little to you. What kind of person does this make you, who have been calling others by the name Ass (and over and over too)? If you do, indeed entertain this don't-give-a-shit attitude about the murder of hundreds of thousands of people in Guatemala, then perhaps the epithet you are so freely tossing around might instead more or less apply to your own person. -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of John Clark Sent: Sunday, August 25, 2013 10:34 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood A professional ass who goes by the pseudonym smi...@zonnet.nl because he's understandably too embarrassed to give his real name wrote: The modern history of Guatemala was decisively shaped by the U.S.-organized invasion and overthrow of [blah blah] Dear Mr. Ass Once somebody knows that you said supporting the Nazis was the right thing for the Arabs back then and I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, why on earth would anybody who was not drooling and locked inside a rubber room be interested in your opinion of the morality of ANYTHING? John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
And yes half a century ago the CIA over through some 2 bit leaders in Chile and Iran, big deal. John you are either grossly ignorant of history, or squeeze it like toothpaste through the aperture of your ideological point of view. The actual historical facts are that both Chilean president Salvador Allende and Iranian president Mohammad Mossadegh were democratically elected and popular leaders of their respective nations. Your choice of words 2 bit leaders actually says a lot about the kind of person you are. a person who is cavalier with the facts and who is prone to distort events to fit the ideological prism you inhabit. I suppose the many thousands of people who were tortured to death and dumped into the Pacific Ocean by Pinochets death squads were just two bit people as well in your esteemed opinion. Does your clearly self-evident and shockingly casual disregard for the truth - when it comes to politics -- extend to everything you do and say or is your willingness to lie and grotesquely mischaracterize history, limited to the political and religious spheres of existence and by some strange mechanism you are able to see things with a clear and open mind in areas of discussion that do not involve your own peculiar political beliefs? -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of John Clark Sent: Sunday, August 25, 2013 9:53 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 9:39 PM, Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com wrote: Fascism unlike Communism (at the level of lip service at least) never preached a Universal Fascist state - an 1000 year Reich of one tribe over other inferior races maybe, but that idea lacks universal appeal. And lip service (who wouldn't want a workers paradise?) is the only reason that today people would have far more sympathy for Senator McCarthy if he'd gone after Neo-Nazis instead of Communists, and in general lip service is the one and only reason Communism has always seemed more respectable than Nazism even though it has caused at least as much misery in the world. In the 30's Stalin murdered millions of his own people and in the 20's Lenin forced people to abandon their private farms and go to huge corrupt monumentally inefficient collective farms with the result that millions died of starvation; In the 50's Mao did the exact same stupid thing in China in the name of communism and at least 30 million starved to death. In the 70's in Cambodia the communists murdered a greater percentage of their population than any regime in the history of the world. In the 90's in North Korea, a nightmare country as bad as anything George Orwell could dream up, communism caused two million to starve to death while South Korea, a country with the same culture and language but without communism became a world economic powerhouse. And yes half a century ago the CIA over through some 2 bit leaders in Chile and Iran, big deal. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Chris and Smitra are performing a collective filtering of history, in which barbarism is merely a feature of capitalism while jolly, socialists, are completely ignored because, if a socialist tortures, or slaugters the innocent, that's different. Because they are ultimately,, 'helping mankind.' Stalin and Pol Pot, and the Kim dynasty of North Korea, and Mao's Great Leap Forward, were all 'undertandable excesses in desparate times' and so forth and so on. This is the kind of thinking that most Leftists capitulated with, when Stalin achieved his Pact of Steel with Herr Hitler from 1939-41. Nobody has a higher body-count of the massacred, then the Left and this is coming from someone who's blood relatives were slain by dear Adolf. In fact, I am betting had not the Furher decided to turn against his chum, Stalin (Dzugadashvilli) the socialists and the national socialists would be fine friends. I would reccomend The Bloodlands, as a history book of both Josep and Adolf, but there'd be no readers here. Ideology rules all I suppose? -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Sun, Aug 25, 2013 2:37 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood And yes half a century ago the CIA over through some 2 bit leaders in Chile and Iran, big deal. John you are either grossly ignorant of history, or squeeze it like toothpaste through the aperture of your ideological point of view. The actual historical facts are that both Chilean president Salvador Allende and Iranian president Mohammad Mossadegh were democratically elected and popular leaders of their respective nations. Your choice of words “2 bit leaders” actually says a lot about the kind of person you are… a person who is cavalier with the facts and who is prone to distort events to fit the ideological prism you inhabit. I suppose the many thousands of people who were tortured to death and dumped into the Pacific Ocean by Pinochets death squads were just two bit people as well in your esteemed opinion. Does your clearly self-evident and shockingly casual disregard for the truth – when it comes to politics -- extend to everything you do and say or is your willingness to lie and grotesquely mischaracterize history, limited to the political and religious spheres of existence and by some strange mechanism you are able to see things with a clear and open mind in areas of discussion that do not involve your own peculiar political beliefs? -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of John Clark Sent: Sunday, August 25, 2013 9:53 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 9:39 PM, Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com wrote: Fascism unlike Communism (at the level of lip service at least) never preached a Universal Fascist state – an 1000 year Reich of one tribe over other inferior races maybe, but that idea lacks universal appeal. And lip service (who wouldn't want a workers paradise?) is the only reason that today people would have far more sympathy for Senator McCarthy if he'd gone after Neo-Nazis instead of Communists, and in general lip service is the one and only reason Communism has always seemed more respectable than Nazism even though it has caused at least as much misery in the world. In the 30's Stalin murdered millions of his own people and in the 20's Lenin forced people to abandon their private farms and go to huge corrupt monumentally inefficient collective farms with the result that millions died of starvation; In the 50's Mao did the exact same stupid thing in China in the name of communism and at least 30 million starved to death. In the 70's in Cambodia the communists murdered a greater percentage of their population than any regime in the history of the world. In the 90's in North Korea, a nightmare country as bad as anything George Orwell could dream up, communism caused two million to starve to death while South Korea, a country with the same culture and language but without communism became a world economic powerhouse. And yes half a century ago the CIA over through some 2 bit leaders in Chile and Iran, big deal. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
period, on Aug. 15, Brig. Gen. Francis W. Farrell, chief U.S. military adviser to the South Koreans, recommended the U.S. command investigate the executions. There was no sign such an inquiry was conducted. A month later, the Daejeon execution photos were sent to the Pentagon in Washington, with a U.S. colonel's report that the South Koreans had killed thousands of political prisoners. The declassified record shows an equivocal U.S. attitude continuing into the fall, when Seoul was retaken and South Korean forces began shooting residents who collaborated with the northern occupiers. When Washington's British allies protested, Dean Rusk, assistant secretary of state, told them U.S. commanders were doing everything they can to curb such atrocities, according to a Rusk memo of Oct. 28, 1950. But on Dec. 19, W.J. Sebald, State Department liaison to MacArthur, cabled Secretary of State Dean Acheson to say MacArthur's command viewed the killings as a South Korean internal matter and had refrained from taking any action. It was the British who took action, according to news reports at the time. On Dec. 7, in occupied North Korea, British officers saved 21 civilians lined up to be shot, by threatening to shoot the South Korean officer responsible. Later that month, British troops seized Execution Hill, outside Seoul, to block further mass killings there. To quiet the protests, the South Koreans barred journalists from execution sites and the State Department told diplomats to avoid commenting on atrocity reports. Earlier, the U.S. Embassy in London had denounced as fabrication Winnington's Daily Worker reporting on the Daejeon slaughter. The Army eventually blamed all the thousands of Daejeon deaths on the North Koreans, who in fact had carried out executions of rightists there and elsewhere. An American historian of the Korean War, the University of Chicago's Bruce Cumings, sees a share of U.S. guilt in what happened in 1950. After the fact — with thousands murdered — the U.S. not only did nothing, but covered up the Daejeon massacres, he said. Another Korean War scholar, Allan R. Millett, an emeritus Ohio State professor, is doubtful. I'm not sure there's enough evidence to pin culpability on these guys, he said, referring to the advisers and other Americans. The swiftness and nationwide nature of the 1950 roundups and mass killings point to orders from the top, President Rhee and his security chiefs, Korean historians say. Those officials are long dead, and Korean documentary evidence is scarce. To piece together a fuller story, investigators of the Truth and Reconciliation Commission will sift through tens of thousands of pages of declassified U.S. documents. The commission's mandate extends to at least 2010, and its president, historian Ahn Byung-ook, expects to turn then to Washington for help in finding the truth. Our plan is that when we complete our investigation of cases involving the U.S. Army, we'll make an overall recommendation, a request to the U.S. government to conduct an overall investigation, he said. Charles J. Hanley and Jae-Soon Chang, The Associated Press Citeren spudboy...@aol.com: Chris and Smitra are performing a collective filtering of history, in which barbarism is merely a feature of capitalism while jolly, socialists, are completely ignored because, if a socialist tortures, or slaugters the innocent, that's different. Because they are ultimately,, 'helping mankind.' Stalin and Pol Pot, and the Kim dynasty of North Korea, and Mao's Great Leap Forward, were all 'undertandable excesses in desparate times' and so forth and so on. This is the kind of thinking that most Leftists capitulated with, when Stalin achieved his Pact of Steel with Herr Hitler from 1939-41. Nobody has a higher body-count of the massacred, then the Left and this is coming from someone who's blood relatives were slain by dear Adolf. In fact, I am betting had not the Furher decided to turn against his chum, Stalin (Dzugadashvilli) the socialists and the national socialists would be fine friends. I would reccomend The Bloodlands, as a history book of both Josep and Adolf, but there'd be no readers here. Ideology rules all I suppose? -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Sun, Aug 25, 2013 2:37 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood And yes half a century ago the CIA over through some 2 bit leaders in Chile and Iran, big deal. John you are either grossly ignorant of history, or squeeze it like toothpaste through the aperture of your ideological point of view. The actual historical facts are that both Chilean president Salvador Allende and Iranian president Mohammad Mossadegh were democratically elected and popular leaders of their respective nations. Your choice of words 2 bit leaders actually says a lot about
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Hey spudboy maybe you may want to lay off the crack From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com Sent: Sunday, August 25, 2013 12:56 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Chris and Smitra are performing a collective filtering of history, in which barbarism is merely a feature of capitalism while jolly, socialists, are completely ignored because, if a socialist tortures, or slaugters the innocent, that's different. Because they are ultimately,, 'helping mankind.' Stalin and Pol Pot, and the Kim dynasty of North Korea, and Mao's Great Leap Forward, were all 'undertandable excesses in desparate times' and so forth and so on. This is the kind of thinking that most Leftists capitulated with, when Stalin achieved his Pact of Steel with Herr Hitler from 1939-41. Nobody has a higher body-count of the massacred, then the Left and this is coming from someone who's blood relatives were slain by dear Adolf. In fact, I am betting had not the Furher decided to turn against his chum, Stalin (Dzugadashvilli) the socialists and the national socialists would be fine friends. I would reccomend The Bloodlands, as a history book of both Josep and Adolf, but there'd be no readers here. Ideology rules all I suppose? -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Sun, Aug 25, 2013 2:37 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood And yes half a century ago the CIA over through some 2 bit leaders in Chile and Iran, big deal. John you are either grossly ignorant of history, or squeeze it like toothpaste through the aperture of your ideological point of view. The actual historical facts are that both Chilean president Salvador Allende and Iranian president Mohammad Mossadegh were democratically elected and popular leaders of their respective nations. Your choice of words 2 bit leaders actually says a lot about the kind of person you are. a person who is cavalier with the facts and who is prone to distort events to fit the ideological prism you inhabit. I suppose the many thousands of people who were tortured to death and dumped into the Pacific Ocean by Pinochets death squads were just two bit people as well in your esteemed opinion. Does your clearly self-evident and shockingly casual disregard for the truth - when it comes to politics -- extend to everything you do and say or is your willingness to lie and grotesquely mischaracterize history, limited to the political and religious spheres of existence and by some strange mechanism you are able to see things with a clear and open mind in areas of discussion that do not involve your own peculiar political beliefs? -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com? ] On Behalf Of John Clark Sent: Sunday, August 25, 2013 9:53 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 9:39 PM, Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com wrote: Fascism unlike Communism (at the level of lip service at least) never preached a Universal Fascist state - an 1000 year Reich of one tribe over other inferior races maybe, but that idea lacks universal appeal. And lip service (who wouldn't want a workers paradise?) is the only reason that today people would have far more sympathy for Senator McCarthy if he'd gone after Neo-Nazis instead of Communists, and in general lip service is the one and only reason Communism has always seemed more respectable than Nazism even though it has caused at least as much misery in the world. In the 30's Stalin murdered millions of his own people and in the 20's Lenin forced people to abandon their private farms and go to huge corrupt monumentally inefficient collective farms with the result that millions died of starvation; In the 50's Mao did the exact same stupid thing in China in the name of communism and at least 30 million starved to death. In the 70's in Cambodia the communists murdered a greater percentage of their population than any regime in the history of the world. In the 90's in North Korea, a nightmare country as bad as anything George Orwell could dream up, communism caused two million to starve to death while South Korea, a country with the same culture and language but without communism became a world economic powerhouse. And yes half a century ago the CIA over through some 2 bit leaders in Chile and Iran, big deal. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On 8/25/2013 9:36 AM, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: If I think that: With hindsight 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, it ended up exposing the fascist Neo-Cons for what they were. That's sort of like saying it's good that the Nazi's killed all those people in death camps because that exposed what a dangerous philosophy of government Nazism is. Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
corruption in politics (US elections 2000) is good in hind sight because it led to democracy in Afghanistan and Iraq. or one more up Saibal's street: In hind sight the end of the Raj was a bad thing because it led to the partition of India and Pakistan, wars over Kashmir and nuclear friction. There must be loads of counter-intuitive and flame worthy comments that can be rendered using Saibal's hokey logic. We should give some monkeys typewriters and throw a banana to the ape that generates the best one. all the best. Date: Sun, 25 Aug 2013 15:01:27 -0700 From: meeke...@verizon.net To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood On 8/25/2013 9:36 AM, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: If I think that: With hindsight 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, it ended up exposing the fascist Neo-Cons for what they were. That's sort of like saying it's good that the Nazi's killed all those people in death camps because that exposed what a dangerous philosophy of government Nazism is. Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On Tue, Aug 20, 2013 at 8:09 AM, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: Supporting the Nazis was the right thing to for the Arabs back then. [...] Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing You sir are an ass. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Sex would be more interesting, purely, from a Hugh Everett the 3rd point of view of course. -Original Message- From: Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Fri, Aug 23, 2013 2:48 pm Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood To talk about politics in a group is like sex exhibition: it exert an irresistible attention that disturb the whole group. That is one of the main reasons why sex exhibition (and politics) is prohibited in most real and virtual places: It makes impossible any other activity. it is like a black hole that disolves the stablished network of pacific exchange of information about different interests. The same happens with politics and maybe other things that attract an instinctive attention. I hope not to have switched the discussion to sex. 2013/8/23 spudboy...@aol.com Surprising the uprising against Morsi, was centrally about economic stagnation, food prices, inflation, and unemployment-not per se' a political issue or even a religious one. These people, for the most part, were not objecting to Islamic Law (Sharia) for example, but being able to purchase enough rice, and lamb. One writer, this week, compared the resistance of the Egyptian Army to the roll-over of the Wehrmacht, in Germany, in the 1930's. The old Prussian ruling class did suspect adolf would lead them into a bad (for Germany) military situation, but went along, as the people seemed to support the fuhrer, and wanted to avoid bloodshed in the streets, as we see in Egypt today. The military in Egypt may have chosen to take the less, disastrous, path, since Morsi's MB collectives, may have induced a calamity, in which Cairo and Alexandra would be vanished. Your support of the Islamist agenda (De Facto) is indeed, troubling. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Thu, Aug 22, 2013 10:17 am Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood In these sorts of polls the proper context is missing. Then you can asily fall in the same trap as the Germans who supported Hitler. In gypt you actually see this very clearly, a large fraction of the opulation who are against the Muslim Brotherhood are saying that the undreds of dead civilians are not the responsibility of the security orces that these civilians deserved to die for supporting the Muslim rotherhood. This is fascism, it is not per se that you have some evil dictator in ower who is doing bad things, but it is a government who does bad hings with the support of a large fraction of the population, and hat then these bad things are perceived to be good things. Saibal Citeren spudboy...@aol.com: Its a solid majoritarian opinion by the Umah (Islamic nation) tho' their are huge schisms within Islam..Sunni v Shia, Amadi's (the good guys). A PEW opinion survey of Islamic states bears Alberto's views out-sorry to say. It's not bigotry, if is true, nor is it propaganda, if one is not, using a little truth to tell a big lie. It's telling a big truth, about how the Faithful view the world, and to educate, and accept the facts as they are. What to do about this if we are correct is complicated. Frankly, I am guessing that we might mitigate this dilemma by focusing on the prime motivation within Islam--Life after Death. It is, as we yanks say, what gets them out of bed in the morning It's even more central to Islam then it is to Christianity we can put our collective efforts there instead of focusing on personal attacks, or ideological correctness. Mitch -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Aug 21, 2013 8:52 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood More hateful stereotyping of a diverse group numbering over a billion human beings by our very own fascist troll From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Alberto G. Corona Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 4:02 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
With hindsight 9/11 was a good thing to have happened, it ended up exposing the fascist Neo-Cons for what they were. The Neo-Con ideology was defeated on the battlegrounds of Iraq. It is sad that it had to happen that way with all the innocent victims in the US and Iraq, but I believe that the US and the rest of the World are today better off with these things having happened. Citeren John Clark johnkcl...@gmail.com: On Tue, Aug 20, 2013 at 8:09 AM, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: Supporting the Nazis was the right thing to for the Arabs back then. [...] Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing You sir are an ass. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Well, to stay on topic, the Muslim Brotherhood, which is alive and well today, and is influential, as it is funded by different elements within the Islamic world. The Saudis will fund the Brotherhood, but not in Egypt, but Qatar will. Go figure. Is the MB fueled by hatred? No doubt at all. Did fascism and Nazism inspire them? Again, doubtless. In Jabotinsky's case, he looked to leverage against British rule, in Palestine. In the MB's case, they liked the organizational skills and philosophy of Adolf, and liked his thing about the Jews, as it seemed to them a quicker rout to paradise, to fulfill the Quaran, and the Buhkhari. Jobotinsky failed, miserably, with Mussolini, but, let us note. Since Smitra spawned this post, we end up talking about his views that supported Al Qaeda, but not their attacks against civilians, and seemed hold that Western Imperialism,' bad, but Islamist Supremacy was just peachy. This is a view held by Progressives, round the world, and is exemplified by the ISM, International Socialist Movement. I suppose these guys view Islamists as useful, fellow, travelers, to quote Stalin. -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Thu, Aug 22, 2013 12:37 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Jabotinsky, who is one of the most important historical figures of the development of Zionism in Israel was a great and open admirer of Mussolini and of the fascist ideology. Fascism – during that period of history was seen as a futurist/modern ideology and was admired by many including many Americans of the time. Does this mean Zionism and all modern Zionists love fascism – a fair number of them seem to Lieberman for example – but I hope you see how it is not fair to use Jabotinski’s great admiration for fascism and for Mussolini to characterize modern Zionism. His affinity for fascism certainly probably influenced his development of the Iron Wall ideology of Zionism (read about it) so it has certainly shown up, especially amongst his ideological heirs in the Likud Party, but one cannot therefore characterize all Israeli’s and even more all Jews as being therefore suspect of being fascists. That kind of idiocy would be shot down straight away; why is the same kind of false parallelism not shot down when the subject comes around to Muslims? Why the double standard? Hope this illustration helps you understand how problematic it is to put, the peculiar affinities (for our way of looking at things) of historical figures into a modern context and use their ancient statements and beliefs to characterize whatever the movement or ideology, they had a part in founding, has evolved over the course of history since their times. -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 5:49 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood The Al Bana brothers who essentially started up the MB, as opposed to similar movements, like Abu Salafia. They started the MB formally in 1928, and liked Mussolini's fascists (everybody did back then!) and followed forward in their love of Adolf when he achieved state power. Alberto is correct about the Baathists in Syria and Iraq, and many Muslim writers compare (favorably) Mein Kampf (struggle) with the commands to perform Jihad (struggle) against the Qfar (infidels). These writers and jurists see it as the same, sad to say. Christopher Hitchens (the atheist) and his friends got in a fight with members of the Syrian Nazi Party (part of Assad's coalition), and now Dawkins is actually comparing the Jihadist actions to the Reich (bully for Dawkins waking up). Cheers for Alberto's post as well. Mitch -Original Message- From: Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Aug 21, 2013 7:02 pm Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Surprising the uprising against Morsi, was centrally about economic stagnation, food prices, inflation, and unemployment-not per se' a political issue or even a religious one. These people, for the most part, were not objecting to Islamic Law (Sharia) for example, but being able to purchase enough rice, and lamb. One writer, this week, compared the resistance of the Egyptian Army to the roll-over of the Wehrmacht, in Germany, in the 1930's. The old Prussian ruling class did suspect adolf would lead them into a bad (for Germany) military situation, but went along, as the people seemed to support the fuhrer, and wanted to avoid bloodshed in the streets, as we see in Egypt today. The military in Egypt may have chosen to take the less, disastrous, path, since Morsi's MB collectives, may have induced a calamity, in which Cairo and Alexandra would be vanished. Your support of the Islamist agenda (De Facto) is indeed, troubling. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Thu, Aug 22, 2013 10:17 am Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood In these sorts of polls the proper context is missing. Then you can easily fall in the same trap as the Germans who supported Hitler. In Egypt you actually see this very clearly, a large fraction of the population who are against the Muslim Brotherhood are saying that the hundreds of dead civilians are not the responsibility of the security forces that these civilians deserved to die for supporting the Muslim Brotherhood. This is fascism, it is not per se that you have some evil dictator in power who is doing bad things, but it is a government who does bad things with the support of a large fraction of the population, and that then these bad things are perceived to be good things. Saibal Citeren spudboy...@aol.com: Its a solid majoritarian opinion by the Umah (Islamic nation) tho' their are huge schisms within Islam..Sunni v Shia, Amadi's (the good guys). A PEW opinion survey of Islamic states bears Alberto's views out-sorry to say. It's not bigotry, if is true, nor is it propaganda, if one is not, using a little truth to tell a big lie. It's telling a big truth, about how the Faithful view the world, and to educate, and accept the facts as they are. What to do about this if we are correct is complicated. Frankly, I am guessing that we might mitigate this dilemma by focusing on the prime motivation within Islam--Life after Death. It is, as we yanks say, what gets them out of bed in the morning It's even more central to Islam then it is to Christianity we can put our collective efforts there instead of focusing on personal attacks, or ideological correctness. Mitch -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Aug 21, 2013 8:52 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood More hateful stereotyping of a diverse group numbering over a billion human beings by our very own fascist troll From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Alberto G. Corona Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 4:02 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Alberto. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
To talk about politics in a group is like sex exhibition: it exert an irresistible attention that disturb the whole group. That is one of the main reasons why sex exhibition (and politics) is prohibited in most real and virtual places: It makes impossible any other activity. it is like a black hole that disolves the stablished network of pacific exchange of information about different interests. The same happens with politics and maybe other things that attract an instinctive attention. I hope not to have switched the discussion to sex. 2013/8/23 spudboy...@aol.com Surprising the uprising against Morsi, was centrally about economic stagnation, food prices, inflation, and unemployment-not per se' a political issue or even a religious one. These people, for the most part, were not objecting to Islamic Law (Sharia) for example, but being able to purchase enough rice, and lamb. One writer, this week, compared the resistance of the Egyptian Army to the roll-over of the Wehrmacht, in Germany, in the 1930's. The old Prussian ruling class did suspect adolf would lead them into a bad (for Germany) military situation, but went along, as the people seemed to support the fuhrer, and wanted to avoid bloodshed in the streets, as we see in Egypt today. The military in Egypt may have chosen to take the less, disastrous, path, since Morsi's MB collectives, may have induced a calamity, in which Cairo and Alexandra would be vanished. Your support of the Islamist agenda (De Facto) is indeed, troubling. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Thu, Aug 22, 2013 10:17 am Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood In these sorts of polls the proper context is missing. Then you can easily fall in the same trap as the Germans who supported Hitler. In Egypt you actually see this very clearly, a large fraction of the population who are against the Muslim Brotherhood are saying that the hundreds of dead civilians are not the responsibility of the security forces that these civilians deserved to die for supporting the Muslim Brotherhood. This is fascism, it is not per se that you have some evil dictator in power who is doing bad things, but it is a government who does bad things with the support of a large fraction of the population, and that then these bad things are perceived to be good things. Saibal Citeren spudboy...@aol.com: Its a solid majoritarian opinion by the Umah (Islamic nation) tho' their are huge schisms within Islam..Sunni v Shia, Amadi's (the good guys). A PEW opinion survey of Islamic states bears Alberto's views out-sorry to say. It's not bigotry, if is true, nor is it propaganda, if one is not, using a little truth to tell a big lie. It's telling a big truth, about how the Faithful view the world, and to educate, and accept the facts as they are. What to do about this if we are correct is complicated. Frankly, I am guessing that we might mitigate this dilemma by focusing on the prime motivation within Islam--Life after Death. It is, as we yanks say, what gets them out of bed in the morning It's even more central to Islam then it is to Christianity we can put our collective efforts there instead of focusing on personal attacks, or ideological correctness. Mitch -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Aug 21, 2013 8:52 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood More hateful stereotyping of a diverse group numbering over a billion human beings by our very own fascist troll From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com everything-list@googlegroups.com?] On Behalf Of Alberto G. Corona Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 4:02 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
-contradictory. You've got to follow your own theories to their logical conclusions. *Which* Western/third world would have been better off if WW3 hadn't happened? Since everything happens in some branch of the multiverse, surely there are innumerable branches in which the world is better off for not having undergone the horrors of WW3. Or are you saying that, if you summed human happiness in the branches of the hypothetical branch of the multiverse in which WW3 didn't happen, and compared it to the sum of human happiness in the branches in which it did, it would be higher in the ones in which it didn't? Put that way, it becomes a rather absurd claim wouldn't you say? And dubious - since first of all the additional happiness in those non-WW3 branches has to make up for the staggering, unimaginable misery of the holocaust, the Russian front, Hiroshima etc etc before getting ahead at all, and secondly because this is all based on the theory that Nazism not being debunked (It was exterminated) would have led to an incorporation of fascist ideology into the mainstream of global social organization, an extremely debatable proposition. Extremism is fostered by economic desperation. If the world had had time to fully recover from the depression, notions of invading the world would have looked a lot less attractive to the fat, comfortable citizens of an affluent western Europe, and Nazism may well have died a quiet death without the need for apocalypse. But of course I won't argue that's what *would* have happened, because making predictions about the consequences of any single event or change in world history is impossible. If you'd like to disagree, please tell us all what the consequences of the Arab uprisings will be in twenty years' time. We'll check back in then and see how well you performed. On Wednesday, August 21, 2013 8:56:57 AM UTC+10, smi...@zonnet.nlwrote: Roger may start a discussion on politics and presents some very narrow minded views, but I can present a different view that may be totally politically incorect but is i.m.o. the right view. Not only is the 3rd World better off with WWII having happened, the Western World is also better off. Without WWII, Nazism would not have been debunked and we would gradually have evolved to become less free societies. Ideas that are totally politically incorrect like euthanizing old and handicap people to save health care costs would have been business as usual. The fundamental mistake Roger makes is to think that the core moral values we have today are universal and that you can look back many decades and then condemn e.g. the Muslim Brotherhood for having supported the Nazis back then. In the end, Roger's brain is just executing a prgram, whatever is against his moral values is encoded in his brain and that information did not come out of thin air. Had history run a different course (and history has run a different course in different sectors of the multiverse), Roger would have supported Nazi policies himself. In fact we can be sure that such a Nazi version of Roger exsts in the multiverse, because all possible programs exists. Saibal Citeren spudb...@aol.com: I do not see why Roger, needs, politics in this forum, but, so be it. Smitra expresses a view that decides the US, has to be ruined for the evil it has conspired against the wonderful, and innocent, people's of the 3rd world. I am guessing that when the ISI strikes India, using enhanced fission devices, he will be content that they detonate it only on legitimate military targets? Enjoy. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everyth...@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 20, 2013 8:13 am Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, albeit it would have been etter if Bin Laden had focusses only on legitimate military targets ike the White House, the US Congress, the Senate and the Pentagon. iteren Roger Clough rcl...@verizon.net: The Nazi history of the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood https://www.youtube.com/watch?**v=9jk4a3Kk6-Yhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jk4a3Kk6-Y Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] See my Leibniz site at http://independent.academia.**edu/RogerCloughhttp://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.**com. To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/** group/everything-list http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/**groups
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
The Al Bana brothers who essentially started up the MB, as opposed to similar movements, like Abu Salafia. They started the MB formally in 1928, and liked Mussolini's fascists (everybody did back then!) and followed forward in their love of Adolf when he achieved state power. Alberto is correct about the Baathists in Syria and Iraq, and many Muslim writers compare (favorably) Mein Kampf (struggle) with the commands to perform Jihad (struggle) against the Qfar (infidels). These writers and jurists see it as the same, sad to say. Christopher Hitchens (the atheist) and his friends got in a fight with members of the Syrian Nazi Party (part of Assad's coalition), and now Dawkins is actually comparing the Jihadist actions to the Reich (bully for Dawkins waking up). Cheers for Alberto's post as well. Mitch -Original Message- From: Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Aug 21, 2013 7:02 pm Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Alberto. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Its a solid majoritarian opinion by the Umah (Islamic nation) tho' their are huge schisms within Islam..Sunni v Shia, Amadi's (the good guys). A PEW opinion survey of Islamic states bears Alberto's views out-sorry to say. It's not bigotry, if is true, nor is it propaganda, if one is not, using a little truth to tell a big lie. It's telling a big truth, about how the Faithful view the world, and to educate, and accept the facts as they are. What to do about this if we are correct is complicated. Frankly, I am guessing that we might mitigate this dilemma by focusing on the prime motivation within Islam--Life after Death. It is, as we yanks say, what gets them out of bed in the morning It's even more central to Islam then it is to Christianity we can put our collective efforts there instead of focusing on personal attacks, or ideological correctness. Mitch -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Aug 21, 2013 8:52 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood More hateful stereotyping of a diverse group numbering over a billion human beings by our very own fascist troll From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Alberto G. Corona Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 4:02 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Alberto. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
In these sorts of polls the proper context is missing. Then you can easily fall in the same trap as the Germans who supported Hitler. In Egypt you actually see this very clearly, a large fraction of the population who are against the Muslim Brotherhood are saying that the hundreds of dead civilians are not the responsibility of the security forces that these civilians deserved to die for supporting the Muslim Brotherhood. This is fascism, it is not per se that you have some evil dictator in power who is doing bad things, but it is a government who does bad things with the support of a large fraction of the population, and that then these bad things are perceived to be good things. Saibal Citeren spudboy...@aol.com: Its a solid majoritarian opinion by the Umah (Islamic nation) tho' their are huge schisms within Islam..Sunni v Shia, Amadi's (the good guys). A PEW opinion survey of Islamic states bears Alberto's views out-sorry to say. It's not bigotry, if is true, nor is it propaganda, if one is not, using a little truth to tell a big lie. It's telling a big truth, about how the Faithful view the world, and to educate, and accept the facts as they are. What to do about this if we are correct is complicated. Frankly, I am guessing that we might mitigate this dilemma by focusing on the prime motivation within Islam--Life after Death. It is, as we yanks say, what gets them out of bed in the morning It's even more central to Islam then it is to Christianity we can put our collective efforts there instead of focusing on personal attacks, or ideological correctness. Mitch -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Aug 21, 2013 8:52 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood More hateful stereotyping of a diverse group numbering over a billion human beings by our very own fascist troll From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Alberto G. Corona Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 4:02 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Alberto. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Jabotinsky, who is one of the most important historical figures of the development of Zionism in Israel was a great and open admirer of Mussolini and of the fascist ideology. Fascism - during that period of history was seen as a futurist/modern ideology and was admired by many including many Americans of the time. Does this mean Zionism and all modern Zionists love fascism - a fair number of them seem to Lieberman for example - but I hope you see how it is not fair to use Jabotinski's great admiration for fascism and for Mussolini to characterize modern Zionism. His affinity for fascism certainly probably influenced his development of the Iron Wall ideology of Zionism (read about it) so it has certainly shown up, especially amongst his ideological heirs in the Likud Party, but one cannot therefore characterize all Israeli's and even more all Jews as being therefore suspect of being fascists. That kind of idiocy would be shot down straight away; why is the same kind of false parallelism not shot down when the subject comes around to Muslims? Why the double standard? Hope this illustration helps you understand how problematic it is to put, the peculiar affinities (for our way of looking at things) of historical figures into a modern context and use their ancient statements and beliefs to characterize whatever the movement or ideology, they had a part in founding, has evolved over the course of history since their times. -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 5:49 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood The Al Bana brothers who essentially started up the MB, as opposed to similar movements, like Abu Salafia. They started the MB formally in 1928, and liked Mussolini's fascists (everybody did back then!) and followed forward in their love of Adolf when he achieved state power. Alberto is correct about the Baathists in Syria and Iraq, and many Muslim writers compare (favorably) Mein Kampf (struggle) with the commands to perform Jihad (struggle) against the Qfar (infidels). These writers and jurists see it as the same, sad to say. Christopher Hitchens (the atheist) and his friends got in a fight with members of the Syrian Nazi Party (part of Assad's coalition), and now Dawkins is actually comparing the Jihadist actions to the Reich (bully for Dawkins waking up). Cheers for Alberto's post as well. Mitch -Original Message- From: Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Aug 21, 2013 7:02 pm Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com mailto:everything-list%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com . To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Alberto. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Ah yes, I can see you subscribe to the notion of some scary monolithic Muslim menace. the Umah Godzilla -- well good luck with your nightmares LOL. Though you do in passing mention the sectarianism, which is just as prevalent in the Muslim world as it is in the Christian world - if we want to see the world through that narrow reductive optic, you continue to treat more than a billion human beings as a single monolithic block marching to the same ideological beat and framing these billion separate individual human beings as some kind of existential menace to our way of life. Is this an accurate assessment of your political beliefs? You are so wrong, the various histories and inner beliefs; the customs, practices and modalities of the many different peoples who have in common a religious faith - if one can describe a religion so fractured along sectarian lines as having much in common at all -- are in fact quite varied and you cannot understand a Malay, or a Taureg etc. solely through your read of Islam without also understanding their particular histories. You are being grossly reductionist and in reality there is a huge diversity in customs, beliefs, and practices amongst the world's Muslims and in much of the Muslim world there are also many who do not believe in these ancient fairy tales, any more than for example I believe in the Christian fairy tales. There is not a Muslim world and a Christian world; we all live on the same planet. there is only one world. We are all the same animal species and share the same mental physiology and are all driven by the same desires essentially - to have food, shelter, comfort, safety, happiness, family.. and for some to discover the truth behind the veil. There are plenty of Muslim fundy assholes, but then there are Jewish, Christian, Buddhist, Hindu (etc.) fundy assholes in abundance as well. We have our own American Taliban - our own wild eyed fundamentalist medieval minded crazies. What real difference is there between a Jewish/Zionist or Christian fundamentalist and an Arab/Muslim fundamentalist? Not a whole lot - IMO. I agree with those who are concerned about the rise of fundamentalism in our world, about this return to an iconoclastic, medieval and Manichean world view, but when it is suggested that this is somehow a Muslim phenomenon and not a human folly that is festering in all societies and can turn any society into one that finds itself living through a Torquemada experience, that is where I get off of the boat and begin to criticize those who selectively criticize other cultures while ignoring the very same phenomena when they crop up in their own societies. -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 6:01 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Its a solid majoritarian opinion by the Umah (Islamic nation) tho' their are huge schisms within Islam..Sunni v Shia, Amadi's (the good guys). A PEW opinion survey of Islamic states bears Alberto's views out-sorry to say. It's not bigotry, if is true, nor is it propaganda, if one is not, using a little truth to tell a big lie. It's telling a big truth, about how the Faithful view the world, and to educate, and accept the facts as they are. What to do about this if we are correct is complicated. Frankly, I am guessing that we might mitigate this dilemma by focusing on the prime motivation within Islam--Life after Death. It is, as we yanks say, what gets them out of bed in the morning It's even more central to Islam then it is to Christianity we can put our collective efforts there instead of focusing on personal attacks, or ideological correctness. Mitch -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Aug 21, 2013 8:52 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood More hateful stereotyping of a diverse group numbering over a billion human beings by our very own fascist troll From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com? ] On Behalf Of Alberto G. Corona Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 4:02 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On 8/22/2013 4:47 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: Hitler invented nothing Yes, he didn't invent anti-semitism. That was invented by the Catholic Church in the Spanish Iquisition and by Martin Luther. But Hitler made great use of it. Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
There's a lot of difference between admiring Fascism and admiring Nazism. Fascism was the idea that a nation was a kind of super-organism consisting of people in different stations of life working together to achieve collective goals. It's not a philosophy of government I like, but it's not crazy either. It's roughly the way army's work. Nazism added superstitious beliefs in blut und volk and a virulent hatred of Jews and Roma as responsible for degeneration of a mythical Aryan culture. It adopted genocide as the policy for solving the Jewish question. Brent On 8/22/2013 9:36 AM, Chris de Morsella wrote: Jabotinsky, who is one of the most important historical figures of the development of Zionism in Israel was a great and open admirer of Mussolini and of the fascist ideology. Fascism -- during that period of history was seen as a futurist/modern ideology and was admired by many including many Americans of the time. Does this mean Zionism and all modern Zionists love fascism -- a fair number of them seem to Lieberman for example -- but I hope you see how it is not fair to use Jabotinski's great admiration for fascism and for Mussolini to characterize modern Zionism. His affinity for fascism certainly probably influenced his development of the Iron Wall ideology of Zionism (read about it) so it has certainly shown up, especially amongst his ideological heirs in the Likud Party, but one cannot therefore characterize all Israeli's and even more all Jews as being therefore suspect of being fascists. That kind of idiocy would be shot down straight away; why is the same kind of false parallelism not shot down when the subject comes around to Muslims? Why the double standard? Hope this illustration helps you understand how problematic it is to put, the peculiar affinities (for our way of looking at things) of historical figures into a modern context and use their ancient statements and beliefs to characterize whatever the movement or ideology, they had a part in founding, has evolved over the course of history since their times. -Chris *From:*everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *spudboy...@aol.com *Sent:* Thursday, August 22, 2013 5:49 AM *To:* everything-list@googlegroups.com *Subject:* Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood The Al Bana brothers who essentially started up the MB, as opposed to similar movements, like Abu Salafia. They started the MB formally in 1928, and liked Mussolini's fascists (everybody did back then!) and followed forward in their love of Adolf when he achieved state power. Alberto is correct about the Baathists in Syria and Iraq, and many Muslim writers compare (favorably) Mein Kampf (struggle) with the commands to perform Jihad (struggle) against the Qfar (infidels). These writers and jurists see it as the same, sad to say. Christopher Hitchens (the atheist) and his friends got in a fight with members of the Syrian Nazi Party (part of Assad's coalition), and now Dawkins is actually comparing the Jihadist actions to the Reich (bully for Dawkins waking up). Cheers for Alberto's post as well. Mitch -Original Message- From: Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com mailto:agocor...@gmail.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Aug 21, 2013 7:02 pm Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Nazism took it somewhere much darker, but Fascism already was exulting the fever pitch of ethno-nationalism. Fascism may have become a generic word we use now a days for that kind of totalitarianism, but in its time and in history, time after time, fascist regimes and parties have always exulted in ethno-fetishism and have promoted an us versus them Manichean world view. In each country where Fascism has arisen it has been characterized by pronounced nationalism most often framed and presented in ethnic terms. Nazism clearly took this notion and ran with Aryan Supremacism, but all the other Fascists then: Mussolini, Franco, and yes Jabotinsky as well (because he was a Fascist) they all saw themselves as leaders of ethnically rooted nationalist movements. In fact show me a famous fascist who was not also a virulent ethno-nationalist. Fascism unlike Communism (at the level of lip service at least) never preached a Universal Fascist state – an 1000 year Reich of one tribe over other inferior races maybe, but that idea lacks universal appeal. Communists sang Internationale as expressed in a line from the lyrics in English: “There simply IS a ruling class, and there is a working class. One day the majority must triumph over the oppression and terror of the minority.” They clearly framed their struggle as an international class struggle. Their slogan was workers unite… or as expressed in the Chilean protest song against Allende “El pueblo unido jamás será vencido” Fascism instead has always been nationalist (as opposed to internationalist) and framed in terms of ethnic and cultural chauvinism… so if there is a difference between Hitler and Nazism and the other fascist Parties and personalities it is a matter of degree and not of substance. -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of meekerdb Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 5:51 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood There's a lot of difference between admiring Fascism and admiring Nazism. Fascism was the idea that a nation was a kind of super-organism consisting of people in different stations of life working together to achieve collective goals. It's not a philosophy of government I like, but it's not crazy either. It's roughly the way army's work. Nazism added superstitious beliefs in blut und volk and a virulent hatred of Jews and Roma as responsible for degeneration of a mythical Aryan culture. It adopted genocide as the policy for solving the Jewish question. Brent On 8/22/2013 9:36 AM, Chris de Morsella wrote: Jabotinsky, who is one of the most important historical figures of the development of Zionism in Israel was a great and open admirer of Mussolini and of the fascist ideology. Fascism – during that period of history was seen as a futurist/modern ideology and was admired by many including many Americans of the time. Does this mean Zionism and all modern Zionists love fascism – a fair number of them seem to Lieberman for example – but I hope you see how it is not fair to use Jabotinski’s great admiration for fascism and for Mussolini to characterize modern Zionism. His affinity for fascism certainly probably influenced his development of the Iron Wall ideology of Zionism (read about it) so it has certainly shown up, especially amongst his ideological heirs in the Likud Party, but one cannot therefore characterize all Israeli’s and even more all Jews as being therefore suspect of being fascists. That kind of idiocy would be shot down straight away; why is the same kind of false parallelism not shot down when the subject comes around to Muslims? Why the double standard? Hope this illustration helps you understand how problematic it is to put, the peculiar affinities (for our way of looking at things) of historical figures into a modern context and use their ancient statements and beliefs to characterize whatever the movement or ideology, they had a part in founding, has evolved over the course of history since their times. -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 5:49 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood The Al Bana brothers who essentially started up the MB, as opposed to similar movements, like Abu Salafia. They started the MB formally in 1928, and liked Mussolini's fascists (everybody did back then!) and followed forward in their love of Adolf when he achieved state power. Alberto is correct about the Baathists in Syria and Iraq, and many Muslim writers compare (favorably) Mein Kampf (struggle) with the commands to perform Jihad (struggle) against the Qfar (infidels). These writers and jurists see it as the same, sad to say. Christopher Hitchens (the atheist) and his friends got in a fight with members of the Syrian Nazi Party (part
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On 8/22/2013 6:39 PM, Chris de Morsella wrote: Nazism took it somewhere much darker, but Fascism already was exulting the fever pitch of ethno-nationalism. Fascism may have become a generic word we use now a days for that kind of totalitarianism, but in its time and in history, time after time, fascist regimes and parties have always exulted in ethno-fetishism and have promoted an us versus them Manichean world view. Sure, that's part of the idea of the nation as a super-organism: If you're not part of it, you're an enemy of it. There's no room for individualism or dissent. In each country where Fascism has arisen it has been characterized by pronounced nationalism most often framed and presented in ethnic terms. But also in cultural terms. As a super-organism, a nation should strive for glorious achievements as an individual should. This generally meant conquering some 'inferior' people and bringing them into the glory of your superior culture. Nazism clearly took this notion and ran with Aryan Supremacism, but all the other Fascists then: Mussolini, Franco, and yes Jabotinsky as well (because he was a Fascist) they all saw themselves as leaders of ethnically rooted nationalist movements. In fact show me a famous fascist who was not also a virulent ethno-nationalist. Fascism unlike Communism (at the level of lip service at least) never preached a Universal Fascist state -- an 1000 year Reich of one tribe over other inferior races maybe, but that idea lacks universal appeal. Communists sang Internationale as expressed in a line from the lyrics in English: There simply IS a ruling class, and there is a working class. One day the majority must triumph over the oppression and terror of the minority.They clearly framed their struggle as an international class struggle. Their slogan was workers unite... or as expressed in the Chilean protest song against Allende El pueblo unido jamás será vencido Fascism instead has always been nationalist (as opposed to internationalist) and framed in terms of ethnic and cultural chauvinism... so if there is a difference between Hitler and Nazism and the other fascist Parties and personalities it is a matter of degree and not of substance. Enough degrees and they become a substantial difference. Fascism was admired (as was communism) for making the trains run on time. I don't think Nazism would have had admirers if the death camps had been known about at the time. Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Because it happened in some alternate universe J From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Stathis Papaioannou Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 12:14 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood On Wednesday, August 21, 2013, Pierz wrote: ...since first of all the additional happiness in those non-WW3 branches... What I mean of course is the additional happiness in the WW3 branches. The non-WW3 branches are much *less* happy right Saibal? All these posts about WW3. Did I miss a war? -- Stathis Papaioannou -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
. The fundamental mistake Roger makes is to think that the core moral values we have today are universal and that you can look back many decades and then condemn e.g. the Muslim Brotherhood for having supported the Nazis back then. In the end, Roger's brain is just executing a prgram, whatever is against his moral values is encoded in his brain and that information did not come out of thin air. Had history run a different course (and history has run a different course in different sectors of the multiverse), Roger would have supported Nazi policies himself. In fact we can be sure that such a Nazi version of Roger exsts in the multiverse, because all possible programs exists. Saibal Citeren spudb...@aol.com: I do not see why Roger, needs, politics in this forum, but, so be it. Smitra expresses a view that decides the US, has to be ruined for the evil it has conspired against the wonderful, and innocent, people's of the 3rd world. I am guessing that when the ISI strikes India, using enhanced fission devices, he will be content that they detonate it only on legitimate military targets? Enjoy. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everyth...@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 20, 2013 8:13 am Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, albeit it would have been etter if Bin Laden had focusses only on legitimate military targets ike the White House, the US Congress, the Senate and the Pentagon. iteren Roger Clough rcl...@verizon.net: The Nazi history of the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jk4a3Kk6-Y Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] See my Leibniz site at http://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. - ou received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. o unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email o everything-li...@googlegroups.com. o post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. isit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. or more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
A rapid descent into extremism can be caused by factors such as economic desperation. However, you can also have a gradual change in society and then people are always indioctrinated that their current norms and values are correct. Of course we regard our norms and values as correct. They are our norms and values. However, history shows a steady flow towards more humane rather than less humane norms and values. So, there was a time when when drawing and quartering was a normal form of punishment, and we gradually moved away from that. Quite. we have gradually moved away from that kind of obscenity rather than towards it. We are thus more vulnerable to extremism due to gradual changes in society No, by your very own example we are more sensitive to it. Like you point out, we have gradually moved to the point where barbarities like drawing and quartering are less acceptable. We now regard kicking a dog as barbaric let alone public execution. So, Hitler could have remained a popular dictator in Germany and the Holocaust would have had a completely different character. By your own argument so far this is a non-sequitur. Moreover, you have failed to show how Hitler could ever have come to power in the absence of economic desperation. You haven't even argued for it. You ought to be demonstrating a gentle creep into barbarity but you demonstrate the opposite. From the point of view of an extremist, the extremists views are the norm. So, the extremist doesn't see that he is an extremist. It is only in case of a rapid descent into extremism that there will be many other people who are not extremist who can see this, also the extremists would find them having to defend their views more. We gradually moved from societies in which slavery was an accepted norm to ones which regard it as barbaric. This happened without cataclysm. This amounts to a falsifying example. This may help: http://abyss.uoregon.edu/~js/glossary/principle_of_falsification.html You an then also ask if we are actually already extremists from some reasonable point of view that our distant descendants may have. E.g. the way we run the World economy with billions of people living in poverty could be called totally immoral by people who live a century from now. This has been regarded as immoral for a very long time. You should read up on this gentleman. http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/marx/ But, in any case, yes, our descendants will view some of our norms and values as troubling. Just as we do our ancestors. This is because there is a gentle creep away from barbarity rather than towards it. They could judge us in a similar way as the would judge Nazis. If they were stupid. Intelligent judges from the future would recognize that by the 21st century the gradual reduction in barbarity over millenia had reached a point where poverty, womens rights, animal rights, gay rights, could come to the forefront of the moral agenda. Its not the case that poverty was not an issue before, but that prior to the past 50 years or so there have been more pressing and blood thirsty barbarities to quell. All the best. Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2013 14:41:43 +0200 From: smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood A rapid descent into extremism can be caused by factors such as economic desperation. However, you can also have a gradual change in society and then people are always indioctrinated that their current norms and values are correct. So, there was a time when when drawing and quartering was a normal form of punishment, and we gradually moved away from that. If you move very fast away from this, then there will be big differences in the opnions of people about wthe current system being ok. or totally unacceptable. We are thus more vulnerable to extremism due to gradual changes in society, e.g. a Hitler coming to power who doesn't need to start a war (suppose e.g. that Poland would ahve been annexed without the Western powers declaring war on Germany). So, Hitler could have remained a popular dictator in Germany and the Holocaust would have had a competely different character. From the point of view of an extremist, the extremists views are the norm. So, the extremist doesn't see that he is an extremist. It is only in case of a rapid descent into extremism that there will be many other peole who are not extremist who can see this, also the extremists would find them having to defend their views more. You an then also ask if we are actually already extremists from some reasonable point of view that our distant descendants may have. E.g. the way we run the World economy with billions of people living in poverty could be called totally immoral by people who live a century from now. They could judge us in a similar way as the would judge Nazis. Or, as in a recent SF movie, you can have
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
wrote: Roger may start a discussion on politics and presents some very narrow minded views, but I can present a different view that may be totally politically incorect but is i.m.o. the right view. Not only is the 3rd World better off with WWII having happened, the Western World is also better off. Without WWII, Nazism would not have been debunked and we would gradually have evolved to become less free societies. Ideas that are totally politically incorrect like euthanizing old and handicap people to save health care costs would have been business as usual. The fundamental mistake Roger makes is to think that the core moral values we have today are universal and that you can look back many decades and then condemn e.g. the Muslim Brotherhood for having supported the Nazis back then. In the end, Roger's brain is just executing a prgram, whatever is against his moral values is encoded in his brain and that information did not come out of thin air. Had history run a different course (and history has run a different course in different sectors of the multiverse), Roger would have supported Nazi policies himself. In fact we can be sure that such a Nazi version of Roger exsts in the multiverse, because all possible programs exists. Saibal Citeren spudb...@aol.com: I do not see why Roger, needs, politics in this forum, but, so be it. Smitra expresses a view that decides the US, has to be ruined for the evil it has conspired against the wonderful, and innocent, people's of the 3rd world. I am guessing that when the ISI strikes India, using enhanced fission devices, he will be content that they detonate it only on legitimate military targets? Enjoy. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everyth...@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 20, 2013 8:13 am Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, albeit it would have been etter if Bin Laden had focusses only on legitimate military targets ike the White House, the US Congress, the Senate and the Pentagon. iteren Roger Clough rcl...@verizon.net: The Nazi history of the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood https://www.youtube.com/watch?**v=9jk4a3Kk6-Yhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jk4a3Kk6-Y Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] See my Leibniz site at http://independent.academia.**edu/RogerCloughhttp://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.**comeverything-li...@googlegroups.com . To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/**group/everything-listhttp://groups.google.com/group/everything-list . For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/**groups/opt_outhttps://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out . - ou received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. o unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email o everything-li...@googlegroups.**comeverything-li...@googlegroups.com . o post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. isit this group at http://groups.google.com/**group/everything-listhttp://groups.google.com/group/everything-list . or more options, visit https://groups.google.com/**groups/opt_outhttps://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out . -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.**comeverything-li...@googlegroups.com . To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/**group/everything-listhttp://groups.google.com/group/everything-list . For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/**groups/opt_outhttps://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out . -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscribe@**googlegroups.comeverything-list%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com . To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.**comeverything-list@googlegroups.com . Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/**group/everything-listhttp://groups.google.com/group/everything-list . For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/**groups/opt_outhttps://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out . -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Mercantilist plantation systems, economic hegemony of the developed center and neo-colonialism have absolutely nothing to do with it right? Spud your world view is limited by the narrow slits you view it through. From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 7:51 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Nazism would have gobbled down so many races and ethnic group that eventually it would have gone after yours? It's the love of tyrants that condemns the Third world to perpetual war and genocide. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 20, 2013 6:57 pm Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Roger may start a discussion on politics and presents some very narrow minded views, but I can present a different view that may be totally politically incorect but is i.m.o. the right view. Not only is the 3rd World better off with WWII having happened, the Western World is also better off. Without WWII, Nazism would not have been debunked and we would gradually have evolved to become less free societies. Ideas that are totally politically incorrect like euthanizing old and handicap people to save health care costs would have been business as usual. The fundamental mistake Roger makes is to think that the core moral values we have today are universal and that you can look back many decades and then condemn e.g. the Muslim Brotherhood for having supported the Nazis back then. In the end, Roger's brain is just executing a prgram, whatever is against his moral values is encoded in his brain and that information did not come out of thin air. Had history run a different course (and history has run a different course in different sectors of the multiverse), Roger would have supported Nazi policies himself. In fact we can be sure that such a Nazi version of Roger exsts in the multiverse, because all possible programs exists. Saibal Citeren spudboy...@aol.com: I do not see why Roger, needs, politics in this forum, but, so be it. Smitra expresses a view that decides the US, has to be ruined for the evil it has conspired against the wonderful, and innocent, people's of the 3rd world. I am guessing that when the ISI strikes India, using enhanced fission devices, he will be content that they detonate it only on legitimate military targets? Enjoy. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 20, 2013 8:13 am Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, albeit it would have been etter if Bin Laden had focusses only on legitimate military targets ike the White House, the US Congress, the Senate and the Pentagon. iteren Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net: The Nazi history of the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jk4a3Kk6-Y Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] See my Leibniz site at http://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. - ou received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. o unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email o everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. o post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. isit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. or more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
You are utterly full of it. You make these statements like you knew.. What a pompous blow hard you are.. A very big mouth affixed to an atrophied brain is a guarantee of stupidity, and you my friend are an exemplar of this sad phenomena. From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Alberto G. Corona Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 8:50 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Hitler continues to be the most respected historical figure in muslim countries, as well as in muslim minories in other countries. Therefore it is not a surprise to me what smitra says. By the way this third-word mentality and this ate to the first world in the intelectual elites of third word countries is the mindset that keep these countries in the misery. Fortunately this is changing. I will send to Roger yet another personal mail begging it to stop sending spurious mails to this list 2013/8/21 smi...@zonnet.nl A rapid descent into extremism can be caused by factors such as economic desperation. However, you can also have a gradual change in society and then people are always indioctrinated that their current norms and values are correct. So, there was a time when when drawing and quartering was a normal form of punishment, and we gradually moved away from that. If you move very fast away from this, then there will be big differences in the opnions of people about wthe current system being ok. or totally unacceptable. We are thus more vulnerable to extremism due to gradual changes in society, e.g. a Hitler coming to power who doesn't need to start a war (suppose e.g. that Poland would ahve been annexed without the Western powers declaring war on Germany). So, Hitler could have remained a popular dictator in Germany and the Holocaust would have had a competely different character. From the point of view of an extremist, the extremists views are the norm. So, the extremist doesn't see that he is an extremist. It is only in case of a rapid descent into extremism that there will be many other peole who are not extremist who can see this, also the extremists would find them having to defend their views more. You an then also ask if we are actually already extremists from some reasonable point of view that our distant descendants may have. E.g. the way we run the World economy with billions of people living in poverty could be called totally immoral by people who live a century from now. They could judge us in a similar way as the would judge Nazis. Or, as in a recent SF movie, you can have an alien visiting us who then judges us to be guilty of mass genocide against the environment and who then decides that we should all be exterminated so that life on Earth can be saved from us. If in one reasonable value system something can be genocide on an unimaginable scale, while in another one it is business as usual, then the processes that led to this being flagged as business as usual in our brains have their origin in arbitrary events in our history, as there is no preference for the flagging as business as usual being preferred given the way our brain works. Saibal Citeren Pierz pier...@gmail.com: ...since first of all the additional happiness in those non-WW3 branches... What I mean of course is the additional happiness in the WW3 branches. The non-WW3 branches are much *less* happy right Saibal? On Wednesday, August 21, 2013 9:49:59 AM UTC+10, Pierz wrote: Self-contradictory. You've got to follow your own theories to their logical conclusions. *Which* Western/third world would have been better off if WW3 hadn't happened? Since everything happens in some branch of the multiverse, surely there are innumerable branches in which the world is better off for not having undergone the horrors of WW3. Or are you saying that, if you summed human happiness in the branches of the hypothetical branch of the multiverse in which WW3 didn't happen, and compared it to the sum of human happiness in the branches in which it did, it would be higher in the ones in which it didn't? Put that way, it becomes a rather absurd claim wouldn't you say? And dubious - since first of all the additional happiness in those non-WW3 branches has to make up for the staggering, unimaginable misery of the holocaust, the Russian front, Hiroshima etc etc before getting ahead at all, and secondly because this is all based on the theory that Nazism not being debunked (It was exterminated) would have led to an incorporation of fascist ideology into the mainstream of global social organization, an extremely debatable proposition. Extremism is fostered by economic desperation. If the world had had time to fully recover from the depression, notions of invading the world would have looked a lot less attractive to the fat, comfortable citizens of an affluent western Europe, and Nazism may well have died a quiet death without the need
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. I know nothing from you except what you say in this thread. The bad thing about discussing subjects like this is that it attract undesirable people that really are not interested in the group. What do you think about the multiverse hypothesis what about the relation between matter math and mind? 2013/8/21 Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com You are utterly full of it. You make these statements like you knew…. What a pompous blow hard you are…. A very big mouth affixed to an atrophied brain is a guarantee of stupidity, and you my friend are an exemplar of this sad phenomena. ** ** *From:* everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto: everything-list@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Alberto G. Corona *Sent:* Wednesday, August 21, 2013 8:50 AM *To:* everything-list@googlegroups.com *Subject:* Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood ** ** Hitler continues to be the most respected historical figure in muslim countries, as well as in muslim minories in other countries. Therefore it is not a surprise to me what smitra says. ** ** By the way this third-word mentality and this ate to the first world in the intelectual elites of third word countries is the mindset that keep these countries in the misery. Fortunately this is changing. ** ** ** ** I will send to Roger yet another personal mail begging it to stop sending spurious mails to this list ** ** 2013/8/21 smi...@zonnet.nl A rapid descent into extremism can be caused by factors such as economic desperation. However, you can also have a gradual change in society and then people are always indioctrinated that their current norms and values are correct. So, there was a time when when drawing and quartering was a normal form of punishment, and we gradually moved away from that. If you move very fast away from this, then there will be big differences in the opnions of people about wthe current system being ok. or totally unacceptable. We are thus more vulnerable to extremism due to gradual changes in society, e.g. a Hitler coming to power who doesn't need to start a war (suppose e.g. that Poland would ahve been annexed without the Western powers declaring war on Germany). So, Hitler could have remained a popular dictator in Germany and the Holocaust would have had a competely different character. From the point of view of an extremist, the extremists views are the norm. So, the extremist doesn't see that he is an extremist. It is only in case of a rapid descent into extremism that there will be many other peole who are not extremist who can see this, also the extremists would find them having to defend their views more. You an then also ask if we are actually already extremists from some reasonable point of view that our distant descendants may have. E.g. the way we run the World economy with billions of people living in poverty could be called totally immoral by people who live a century from now. They could judge us in a similar way as the would judge Nazis. Or, as in a recent SF movie, you can have an alien visiting us who then judges us to be guilty of mass genocide against the environment and who then decides that we should all be exterminated so that life on Earth can be saved from us. If in one reasonable value system something can be genocide on an unimaginable scale, while in another one it is business as usual, then the processes that led to this being flagged as business as usual in our brains have their origin in arbitrary events in our history, as there is no preference for the flagging as business as usual being preferred given the way our brain works. Saibal Citeren Pierz pier...@gmail.com: ** ** ...since first of all the additional happiness in those non-WW3 branches... What I mean of course is the additional happiness in the WW3 branches. The non-WW3 branches are much *less* happy right Saibal? On Wednesday, August 21, 2013 9:49:59 AM UTC+10, Pierz wrote: Self-contradictory. You've got to follow your own theories to their logical conclusions. *Which* Western/third world would have been better off if WW3 hadn't happened? Since everything happens in some branch of the multiverse, surely there are innumerable branches in which the world is better off for not having undergone the horrors of WW3. Or are you saying that, if you summed human happiness in the branches of the hypothetical branch of the multiverse in which WW3 didn't happen, and compared it to the sum of human happiness in the branches in which it did, it would be higher in the ones in which it didn't? Put that way, it becomes a rather absurd claim wouldn't you say? And dubious - since first of all the additional happiness in those non-WW3 branches has to make up for the staggering, unimaginable misery of the holocaust, the Russian front, Hiroshima etc etc before
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On 8/21/2013 7:01 AM, chris peck wrote: But, in any case, yes, our descendants will view some of our norms and values as troubling. Just as we do our ancestors. This is because there is a gentle creep away from barbarity rather than towards it. But I don't think this is just a moral evolution. I think it is driven by technology. As societies become richer they become less competitive and insular and more compassionate and open. If global warming or running out of oil or some other widespread diminution of ease and wealth occurs there will likely be a corresponding diminution in empathy and compassion. Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
A suggestion don't spam the group with your right wing political ideology if you are truly interested in the group. You state things as facts which you have no way of knowing are in fact facts. You make a pompous and outrageous statement that Hitler is the most respected figure in the muslim world -- and call it a FACT. Show me the exhaustive research you have done in order to arrive at this conclusion and that supports your assertion that this is in fact a fact. You cavalierly refer to a vast heterogeneous collection of different peoples on different continents with very different historical and cultural backgrounds that have sharing a faith in common -- and based on your profound ignorance you make sweeping broad statements characterizing all of them. Not the sign of a keen mind at work; rather more symptomatic of an ideologically blinded idiot blundering through their mental fog and making loud obnoxious noises, mistaking them as a sign of intelligence. You are so full of it; I wonder how your gut holds itself together. Hopefully I have made my opinion of you and your stereotyping of others not exactly like you abundantly clear. Try to educate yourself about history and about other cultures.. maybe, just maybe you may judge less and possibly learn more. From: Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 11:48 AM Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. I know nothing from you except what you say in this thread. The bad thing about discussing subjects like this is that it attract undesirable people that really are not interested in the group. What do you think about the multiverse hypothesis what about the relation between matter math and mind? 2013/8/21 Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com You are utterly full of it. You make these statements like you knew…. What a pompous blow hard you are…. A very big mouth affixed to an atrophied brain is a guarantee of stupidity, and you my friend are an exemplar of this sad phenomena. From:everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Alberto G. Corona Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 8:50 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Hitler continues to be the most respected historical figure in muslim countries, as well as in muslim minories in other countries. Therefore it is not a surprise to me what smitra says. By the way this third-word mentality and this ate to the first world in the intelectual elites of third word countries is the mindset that keep these countries in the misery. Fortunately this is changing. I will send to Roger yet another personal mail begging it to stop sending spurious mails to this list 2013/8/21 smi...@zonnet.nl A rapid descent into extremism can be caused by factors such as economic desperation. However, you can also have a gradual change in society and then people are always indioctrinated that their current norms and values are correct. So, there was a time when when drawing and quartering was a normal form of punishment, and we gradually moved away from that. If you move very fast away from this, then there will be big differences in the opnions of people about wthe current system being ok. or totally unacceptable. We are thus more vulnerable to extremism due to gradual changes in society, e.g. a Hitler coming to power who doesn't need to start a war (suppose e.g. that Poland would ahve been annexed without the Western powers declaring war on Germany). So, Hitler could have remained a popular dictator in Germany and the Holocaust would have had a competely different character. From the point of view of an extremist, the extremists views are the norm. So, the extremist doesn't see that he is an extremist. It is only in case of a rapid descent into extremism that there will be many other peole who are not extremist who can see this, also the extremists would find them having to defend their views more. You an then also ask if we are actually already extremists from some reasonable point of view that our distant descendants may have. E.g. the way we run the World economy with billions of people living in poverty could be called totally immoral by people who live a century from now. They could judge us in a similar way as the would judge Nazis. Or, as in a recent SF movie, you can have an alien visiting us who then judges us to be guilty of mass genocide against the environment and who then decides that we should all be exterminated so that life on Earth can be saved from us. If in one reasonable value system something can be genocide on an unimaginable scale, while in another one it is business as usual, then the processes that led to this being flagged
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Rather than speak economic history, which is an interesting topic, I merely stated what I see the facts to be. More clearly, that when Adolf ran out of Roma, Jews, and the mentally weak, to gas, and Poles and Great Russians to shoot, his camps would 've discovered other Untermenschen to slaughter, if only for bureaucratic reasons-to justify the process of racial hygiene, as it was termed. Adios, Arabs, Africans, South Asians and eventually, East Asians too. Both Adolf and Stalins murdering was like a heavy addiction, couldn't stop and wouldn't dream of it. As for seeking justification for the killing of Americans, I do take issue with this, and am likely immovable on this segment. The history of the people's of the world, before, the advent of the European imperialists, was no shinning glory of freedome and peace. This is usually the selective readings by Progressive progagandists seekinng the demise of the US and a few other nations. Which is really the whole point. -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Aug 21, 2013 12:52 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Mercantilist plantation systems, economic hegemony of the developed center and neo-colonialism have absolutely nothing to do with it right? Spud your world view is limited by the narrow slits you view it through. From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 7:51 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Nazism would have gobbled down so many races and ethnic group that eventually it would have gone after yours? It's the love of tyrants that condemns the Third world to perpetual war and genocide. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 20, 2013 6:57 pm Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Roger may start a discussion on politics and presents some very narrow minded views, but I can present a different view that may be totally politically incorect but is i.m.o. the right view. Not only is the 3rd World better off with WWII having happened, the Western World is also better off. Without WWII, Nazism would not have been debunked and we would gradually have evolved to become less free societies. Ideas that are totally politically incorrect like euthanizing old and handicap people to save health care costs would have been business as usual. The fundamental mistake Roger makes is to think that the core moral values we have today are universal and that you can look back many decades and then condemn e.g. the Muslim Brotherhood for having supported the Nazis back then. In the end, Roger's brain is just executing a prgram, whatever is against his moral values is encoded in his brain and that information did not come out of thin air. Had history run a different course (and history has run a different course in different sectors of the multiverse), Roger would have supported Nazi policies himself. In fact we can be sure that such a Nazi version of Roger exsts in the multiverse, because all possible programs exists. Saibal Citeren spudboy...@aol.com: I do not see why Roger, needs, politics in this forum, but, so be it. Smitra expresses a view that decides the US, has to be ruined for the evil it has conspired against the wonderful, and innocent, people's of the 3rd world. I am guessing that when the ISI strikes India, using enhanced fission devices, he will be content that they detonate it only on legitimate military targets? Enjoy. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 20, 2013 8:13 am Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, albeit it would have been etter if Bin Laden had focusses only on legitimate military targets ike the White House, the US Congress, the Senate and the Pentagon. iteren Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net: The Nazi history of the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jk4a3Kk6-Y Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] See my Leibniz site at http://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. - ou received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
push polls maybe From: meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 12:51 PM Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
You merely stated what you see as the facts is true; I am sure you do see them as the facts and herein lies the problem. You have not looked very hard at history and the evolution of societies and cultures according to the pressures that force them to develop in this way or that. Who is guilty of the selective reading of history -- the one who states that people in 3rd world countries somehow love to live under despotism; or the person who calls that peculiar view into question? And betraying your true beliefs you go on to say that those who do not subscribe to your twisted view of history are progressive propagandists diligently working to bring about the demise of the US? -- The implication being that they therefore could and perhaps should be considered enemies of freedom -- and all those other self righteous and empty words -- and more to the point that these hated progressives are enemies of the state. How neat; dare to disagree with your particular ideologically motivated frame of reference and you risk becoming branded as an enemy... nice work there... what a goose stepping thing to utter. Totalitarian minded people everywhere applaud your way of non-thinking. From: spudboy...@aol.com spudboy...@aol.com To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 2:07 PM Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Rather than speak economic history, which is an interesting topic, I merely stated what I see the facts to be. More clearly, that when Adolf ran out of Roma, Jews, and the mentally weak, to gas, and Poles and Great Russians to shoot, his camps would 've discovered other Untermenschen to slaughter, if only for bureaucratic reasons-to justify the process of racial hygiene, as it was termed. Adios, Arabs, Africans, South Asians and eventually, East Asians too. Both Adolf and Stalins murdering was like a heavy addiction, couldn't stop and wouldn't dream of it. As for seeking justification for the killing of Americans, I do take issue with this, and am likely immovable on this segment. The history of the people's of the world, before, the advent of the European imperialists, was no shinning glory of freedome and peace. This is usually the selective readings by Progressive progagandists seekinng the demise of the US and a few other nations. Which is really the whole point. -Original Message- From: Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Aug 21, 2013 12:52 pm Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Mercantilist plantation systems, economic hegemony of the developed center and neo-colonialism have absolutely nothing to do with it right? Spud your world view is limited by the narrow slits you view it through. From:everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com?] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 7:51 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Nazism would have gobbled down so many races and ethnic group that eventually it would have gone after yours? It's the love of tyrants that condemns the Third world to perpetual war and genocide. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 20, 2013 6:57 pm Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Roger may start a discussion on politics and presents some very narrow minded views, but I can present a different view that may be totally politically incorect but is i.m.o. the right view. Not only is the 3rd World better off with WWII having happened, the Western World is also better off. Without WWII, Nazism would not have been debunked and we would gradually have evolved to become less free societies. Ideas that are totally politically incorrect like euthanizing old and handicap people to save health care costs would have been business as usual. The fundamental mistake Roger makes is to think that the core moral values we have today are universal and that you can look back many decades and then condemn e.g. the Muslim Brotherhood for having supported the Nazis back then. In the end, Roger's brain is just executing a prgram, whatever is against his moral values is encoded in his brain and that information did not come out of thin air. Had history run a different course (and history has run a different course in different sectors of the multiverse), Roger would have supported Nazi policies himself. In fact we can be sure that such a Nazi version of Roger exsts in the multiverse, because all possible programs exists. Saibal Citeren spudboy...@aol.com: I do not see why Roger, needs, politics in this forum, but, so be it. Smitra expresses a view that decides the US, has to be ruined for the evil it has conspired against
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Alberto. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Plugging most Arab dictators name these days in Arabic yields mass dissatisfaction equating them to tyrants like Hitler. But what about “Hitler” by itself in Arabic into Google? What will you find? https://www.google.es/search?q=%D9%87%D8%AA%D9%84%D8%B1oq=%D9%87%D8%AA%D9%84%D8%B1aqs=chrome.0.69i57j0j69i62.772j0sourceid=chromeie=UTF-8 It gives around 6 million entries. Translate the entries for yourself with Google translate: The first Arabic website was a blog that introduces him: “Hitler was not an ordinary individual to be spun by the wheel of history to sprinkle him behind as dust to be forgotten across this vast globe. He was neither the king of the German people alone. He is one of the greatest few. Here is the king of history.” Westerners might think that the first commenthttp://v.3bir.com/77183/ on such an article would be in disgust. Hardly. Muhammad Jasem posted: “If the greatest leaders gather together, they would not equal the magnificence of Hitler.” The rest of the comments were not far off. The second hit was a YouTube page titled “The Cowardly Jews,”http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8C_Nq-P7bg showing a Hitler lookalike walking the streets with Jewish passersby supposedly terrified as they move out of his way. This “proves that Jews are cowards,” the commentators interpreted. 2013/8/22 Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Alberto. -- Alberto. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Do you mean to tell me that the foundation of your facts is the number of search results returned by a google search... along with a spurious reference to some ad hoc quotation -- you cherry picked -- that was auto-generated for you by the google translator algorithm? Do you realize just how pathetic this meager evidence you have produced makes you look? You made an incendiary statement, characterizing a vast swath of humanity in an ugly stereotypical manner, which you very clearly framed as being a FACT and then all you can do is come up with this BS. What you have succeeded in doing is providing some real evidence of your prejudice and willingness to spew hatred slander on a billion human beings because of your own irrational prejudicial frame of mind. If you think the small little pile of BS you just presented would make you look good to anyone -- who is not already on board with your own strange ideological set of preconceived notions -- you are indeed more of a fool than even I thought you were? Did I just call you a fool? Yes, you heard me, I just did. Have a great day stewing in your hatred of others not like you. -Chris From: Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 4:14 PM Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Plugging most Arab dictators name these days in Arabic yields mass dissatisfaction equating them to tyrants like Hitler. But what about “Hitler” by itself in Arabic into Google? What will you find? https://www.google.es/search?q=%D9%87%D8%AA%D9%84%D8%B1oq=%D9%87%D8%AA%D9%84%D8%B1aqs=chrome.0.69i57j0j69i62.772j0sourceid=chromeie=UTF-8 It gives around 6 million entries. Translate the entries for yourself with Google translate: The first Arabic website was a blog that introduces him: “Hitler was not an ordinary individual to be spun by the wheel of history to sprinkle him behind as dust to be forgotten across this vast globe. He was neither the king of the German people alone. He is one of the greatest few. Here is the king of history.” Westerners might think that the first comment on such an article would be in disgust. Hardly. Muhammad Jasem posted: “If the greatest leaders gather together, they would not equal the magnificence of Hitler.” The rest of the comments were not far off. The second hit was a YouTube page titled “The Cowardly Jews,” showing a Hitler lookalike walking the streets with Jewish passersby supposedly terrified as they move out of his way. This “proves that Jews are cowards,” the commentators interpreted. 2013/8/22 Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to mailto:everything-list%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Alberto. -- Alberto. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
I mean to tell you nothing. I don't want to waste my time 2013/8/22 Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com Do you mean to tell me that the foundation of your facts is the number of search results returned by a google search... along with a spurious reference to some ad hoc quotation -- you cherry picked -- that was auto-generated for you by the google translator algorithm? Do you realize just how pathetic this meager evidence you have produced makes you look? You made an incendiary statement, characterizing a vast swath of humanity in an ugly stereotypical manner, which you very clearly framed as being a FACT and then all you can do is come up with this BS. What you have succeeded in doing is providing some real evidence of your prejudice and willingness to spew hatred slander on a billion human beings because of your own irrational prejudicial frame of mind. If you think the small little pile of BS you just presented would make you look good to anyone -- who is not already on board with your own strange ideological set of preconceived notions -- you are indeed more of a fool than even I thought you were? Did I just call you a fool? Yes, you heard me, I just did. Have a great day stewing in your hatred of others not like you. -Chris *From:* Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com *To:* everything-list@googlegroups.com *Sent:* Wednesday, August 21, 2013 4:14 PM *Subject:* Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Plugging most Arab dictators name these days in Arabic yields mass dissatisfaction equating them to tyrants like Hitler. But what about “Hitler” by itself in Arabic into Google? What will you find? https://www.google.es/search?q=%D9%87%D8%AA%D9%84%D8%B1oq=%D9%87%D8%AA%D9%84%D8%B1aqs=chrome.0.69i57j0j69i62.772j0sourceid=chromeie=UTF-8 It gives around 6 million entries. Translate the entries for yourself with Google translate: The first Arabic website was a blog that introduces him: “Hitler was not an ordinary individual to be spun by the wheel of history to sprinkle him behind as dust to be forgotten across this vast globe. He was neither the king of the German people alone. He is one of the greatest few. Here is the king of history.” Westerners might think that the first commenthttp://v.3bir.com/77183/ on such an article would be in disgust. Hardly. Muhammad Jasem posted: “If the greatest leaders gather together, they would not equal the magnificence of Hitler.” The rest of the comments were not far off. The second hit was a YouTube page titled “The Cowardly Jews,”http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8C_Nq-P7bg showing a Hitler lookalike walking the streets with Jewish passersby supposedly terrified as they move out of his way. This “proves that Jews are cowards,” the commentators interpreted. 2013/8/22 Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to mailto:everything-list%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.comeverything-list%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com . To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Alberto. -- Alberto. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
It's not my time you are wasting with your posting of ideological prejudices; you waste everyone's time with this troll like behavior. From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Alberto G. Corona Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 5:04 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood I mean to tell you nothing. I don't want to waste my time 2013/8/22 Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com Do you mean to tell me that the foundation of your facts is the number of search results returned by a google search... along with a spurious reference to some ad hoc quotation -- you cherry picked -- that was auto-generated for you by the google translator algorithm? Do you realize just how pathetic this meager evidence you have produced makes you look? You made an incendiary statement, characterizing a vast swath of humanity in an ugly stereotypical manner, which you very clearly framed as being a FACT and then all you can do is come up with this BS. What you have succeeded in doing is providing some real evidence of your prejudice and willingness to spew hatred slander on a billion human beings because of your own irrational prejudicial frame of mind. If you think the small little pile of BS you just presented would make you look good to anyone -- who is not already on board with your own strange ideological set of preconceived notions -- you are indeed more of a fool than even I thought you were? Did I just call you a fool? Yes, you heard me, I just did. Have a great day stewing in your hatred of others not like you. -Chris From: Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 4:14 PM Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Plugging most Arab dictators name these days in Arabic yields mass dissatisfaction equating them to tyrants like Hitler. But what about Hitler by itself in Arabic into Google? What will you find? https://www.google.es/search?q=%D9%87%D8%AA%D9%84%D8%B1 https://www.google.es/search?q=%D9%87%D8%AA%D9%84%D8%B1oq=%D9%87%D8%AA%D9% 84%D8%B1aqs=chrome.0.69i57j0j69i62.772j0sourceid=chromeie=UTF-8 oq=%D9%87%D8%AA%D9%84%D8%B1aqs=chrome.0.69i57j0j69i62.772j0sourceid=chrom eie=UTF-8 It gives around 6 million entries. Translate the entries for yourself with Google translate: The first Arabic website was a blog that introduces him: Hitler was not an ordinary individual to be spun by the wheel of history to sprinkle him behind as dust to be forgotten across this vast globe. He was neither the king of the German people alone. He is one of the greatest few. Here is the king of history. Westerners might think that the first http://v.3bir.com/77183/ comment on such an article would be in disgust. Hardly. Muhammad Jasem posted: If the greatest leaders gather together, they would not equal the magnificence of Hitler. The rest of the comments were not far off. The second hit was a YouTube page titled http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8C_Nq-P7bg The Cowardly Jews, showing a Hitler lookalike walking the streets with Jewish passersby supposedly terrified as they move out of his way. This proves that Jews are cowards, the commentators interpreted. 2013/8/22 Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to mailto:everything-list%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Alberto. -- Alberto. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
More hateful stereotyping of a diverse group numbering over a billion human beings by our very own fascist troll From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Alberto G. Corona Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 4:02 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com mailto:everything-list%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com . To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Alberto. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Hi Brent But I don't think this is just a moral evolution. I think it is driven by technology. As societies become richer they become less competitive and insular and more compassionate and open. I agree. I think trade imparticularly creates a symbiotic relationship between people which gets internalized. Pragmatically it makes sense to see people as friend rather than foe if we want them to buy our stuff and this pragmatism then gets solidified in our moral sentiment. I think there are other factors too. I read somewhere that the development and popularity of the novel as a literary form encouraged people to see the world through others' eyes and this had some effect on empathy. There's probably a plethora of factors that lead to this trend, but I think trade is a major one. f global warming or running out of oil or some other widespread diminution of ease and wealth occurs there will likely be a corresponding diminution in empathy and compassion. I agree. All the best From: cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2013 17:52:42 -0700 More hateful stereotyping of a diverse group numbering over a billion human beings by our very own fascist troll From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Alberto G. Corona Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 4:02 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.netOn 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote:That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Alberto. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
I agree. I think trade imparticularly creates a symbiotic relationship between people which gets internalized. Pragmatically it makes sense to see people as friend rather than foe if we want them to buy our stuff and this pragmatism then gets solidified in our moral sentiment. Interesting point. Killing your customer is usually not a good business practice; except if you are a tobacco company perhaps. From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of chris peck Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 6:17 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Hi Brent But I don't think this is just a moral evolution. I think it is driven by technology. As societies become richer they become less competitive and insular and more compassionate and open. I agree. I think trade imparticularly creates a symbiotic relationship between people which gets internalized. Pragmatically it makes sense to see people as friend rather than foe if we want them to buy our stuff and this pragmatism then gets solidified in our moral sentiment. I think there are other factors too. I read somewhere that the development and popularity of the novel as a literary form encouraged people to see the world through others' eyes and this had some effect on empathy. There's probably a plethora of factors that lead to this trend, but I think trade is a major one. f global warming or running out of oil or some other widespread diminution of ease and wealth occurs there will likely be a corresponding diminution in empathy and compassion. I agree. All the best _ From: cdemorse...@yahoo.com To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2013 17:52:42 -0700 More hateful stereotyping of a diverse group numbering over a billion human beings by our very own fascist troll From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Alberto G. Corona Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 4:02 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com mailto:everything-list%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com . To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Alberto. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
On Wednesday, August 21, 2013 5:13:43 PM UTC+10, stathisp wrote: On Wednesday, August 21, 2013, Pierz wrote: ...since first of all the additional happiness in those non-WW3 branches... What I mean of course is the additional happiness in the WW3 branches. The non-WW3 branches are much *less* happy right Saibal? All these posts about WW3. Did I miss a war? Oopsies :) Some synapses relating to the prefix www and those relating to wars had an unauthorised conversation... -- Stathis Papaioannou -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
of an affluent western Europe, and Nazism may well have died a quiet death without the need for apocalypse. But of course I won't argue that's what *would* have happened, because making predictions about the consequences of any single event or change in world history is impossible. If you'd like to disagree, please tell us all what the consequences of the Arab uprisings will be in twenty years' time. We'll check back in then and see how well you performed. On Wednesday, August 21, 2013 8:56:57 AM UTC+10, smi...@zonnet.nlwrote: Roger may start a discussion on politics and presents some very narrow minded views, but I can present a different view that may be totally politically incorect but is i.m.o. the right view. Not only is the 3rd World better off with WWII having happened, the Western World is also better off. Without WWII, Nazism would not have been debunked and we would gradually have evolved to become less free societies. Ideas that are totally politically incorrect like euthanizing old and handicap people to save health care costs would have been business as usual. The fundamental mistake Roger makes is to think that the core moral values we have today are universal and that you can look back many decades and then condemn e.g. the Muslim Brotherhood for having supported the Nazis back then. In the end, Roger's brain is just executing a prgram, whatever is against his moral values is encoded in his brain and that information did not come out of thin air. Had history run a different course (and history has run a different course in different sectors of the multiverse), Roger would have supported Nazi policies himself. In fact we can be sure that such a Nazi version of Roger exsts in the multiverse, because all possible programs exists. Saibal Citeren spudb...@aol.com: I do not see why Roger, needs, politics in this forum, but, so be it. Smitra expresses a view that decides the US, has to be ruined for the evil it has conspired against the wonderful, and innocent, people's of the 3rd world. I am guessing that when the ISI strikes India, using enhanced fission devices, he will be content that they detonate it only on legitimate military targets? Enjoy. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everyth...@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 20, 2013 8:13 am Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, albeit it would have been etter if Bin Laden had focusses only on legitimate military targets ike the White House, the US Congress, the Senate and the Pentagon. iteren Roger Clough rcl...@verizon.net: The Nazi history of the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jk4a3Kk6-Y Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] See my Leibniz site at http://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. - ou received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. o unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email o everything-li...@googlegroups.com. o post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. isit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. or more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com javascript:. To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.comjavascript:. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Supporting the Nazis was the right thing to for the Arabs back then. In fact, in India you had a similar sentiment, some people wanted to support the Japanese in order to liberate their country. This is not something the typical Westerner knows about, but in India these people have a lot of respect. The sad fact is that without Hitler, the West would still be a colonial power committing human rights abuses on a unimaginable scale. To defeat evil, you need a far bigger evil, which is exactly what happened. Saibal Citeren Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net: The Nazi history of the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jk4a3Kk6-Y Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] See my Leibniz site at http://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, albeit it would have been better if Bin Laden had focusses only on legitimate military targets like the White House, the US Congress, the Senate and the Pentagon. Citeren Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net: The Nazi history of the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jk4a3Kk6-Y Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] See my Leibniz site at http://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
I do not see why Roger, needs, politics in this forum, but, so be it. Smitra expresses a view that decides the US, has to be ruined for the evil it has conspired against the wonderful, and innocent, people's of the 3rd world. I am guessing that when the ISI strikes India, using enhanced fission devices, he will be content that they detonate it only on legitimate military targets? Enjoy. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 20, 2013 8:13 am Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, albeit it would have been etter if Bin Laden had focusses only on legitimate military targets ike the White House, the US Congress, the Senate and the Pentagon. iteren Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net: The Nazi history of the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jk4a3Kk6-Y Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] See my Leibniz site at http://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. - ou received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. o unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email o everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. o post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. isit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. or more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
Self-contradictory. You've got to follow your own theories to their logical conclusions. *Which* Western/third world would have been better off if WW3 hadn't happened? Since everything happens in some branch of the multiverse, surely there are innumerable branches in which the world is better off for not having undergone the horrors of WW3. Or are you saying that, if you summed human happiness in the branches of the hypothetical branch of the multiverse in which WW3 didn't happen, and compared it to the sum of human happiness in the branches in which it did, it would be higher in the ones in which it didn't? Put that way, it becomes a rather absurd claim wouldn't you say? And dubious - since first of all the additional happiness in those non-WW3 branches has to make up for the staggering, unimaginable misery of the holocaust, the Russian front, Hiroshima etc etc before getting ahead at all, and secondly because this is all based on the theory that Nazism not being debunked (It was exterminated) would have led to an incorporation of fascist ideology into the mainstream of global social organization, an extremely debatable proposition. Extremism is fostered by economic desperation. If the world had had time to fully recover from the depression, notions of invading the world would have looked a lot less attractive to the fat, comfortable citizens of an affluent western Europe, and Nazism may well have died a quiet death without the need for apocalypse. But of course I won't argue that's what *would* have happened, because making predictions about the consequences of any single event or change in world history is impossible. If you'd like to disagree, please tell us all what the consequences of the Arab uprisings will be in twenty years' time. We'll check back in then and see how well you performed. On Wednesday, August 21, 2013 8:56:57 AM UTC+10, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: Roger may start a discussion on politics and presents some very narrow minded views, but I can present a different view that may be totally politically incorect but is i.m.o. the right view. Not only is the 3rd World better off with WWII having happened, the Western World is also better off. Without WWII, Nazism would not have been debunked and we would gradually have evolved to become less free societies. Ideas that are totally politically incorrect like euthanizing old and handicap people to save health care costs would have been business as usual. The fundamental mistake Roger makes is to think that the core moral values we have today are universal and that you can look back many decades and then condemn e.g. the Muslim Brotherhood for having supported the Nazis back then. In the end, Roger's brain is just executing a prgram, whatever is against his moral values is encoded in his brain and that information did not come out of thin air. Had history run a different course (and history has run a different course in different sectors of the multiverse), Roger would have supported Nazi policies himself. In fact we can be sure that such a Nazi version of Roger exsts in the multiverse, because all possible programs exists. Saibal Citeren spudb...@aol.com javascript:: I do not see why Roger, needs, politics in this forum, but, so be it. Smitra expresses a view that decides the US, has to be ruined for the evil it has conspired against the wonderful, and innocent, people's of the 3rd world. I am guessing that when the ISI strikes India, using enhanced fission devices, he will be content that they detonate it only on legitimate military targets? Enjoy. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl javascript: To: everything-list everyth...@googlegroups.com javascript: Sent: Tue, Aug 20, 2013 8:13 am Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, albeit it would have been etter if Bin Laden had focusses only on legitimate military targets ike the White House, the US Congress, the Senate and the Pentagon. iteren Roger Clough rcl...@verizon.net javascript:: The Nazi history of the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jk4a3Kk6-Y Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] See my Leibniz site at http://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com javascript:. To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.comjavascript:. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. - ou received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List
Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
...since first of all the additional happiness in those non-WW3 branches... What I mean of course is the additional happiness in the WW3 branches. The non-WW3 branches are much *less* happy right Saibal? On Wednesday, August 21, 2013 9:49:59 AM UTC+10, Pierz wrote: Self-contradictory. You've got to follow your own theories to their logical conclusions. *Which* Western/third world would have been better off if WW3 hadn't happened? Since everything happens in some branch of the multiverse, surely there are innumerable branches in which the world is better off for not having undergone the horrors of WW3. Or are you saying that, if you summed human happiness in the branches of the hypothetical branch of the multiverse in which WW3 didn't happen, and compared it to the sum of human happiness in the branches in which it did, it would be higher in the ones in which it didn't? Put that way, it becomes a rather absurd claim wouldn't you say? And dubious - since first of all the additional happiness in those non-WW3 branches has to make up for the staggering, unimaginable misery of the holocaust, the Russian front, Hiroshima etc etc before getting ahead at all, and secondly because this is all based on the theory that Nazism not being debunked (It was exterminated) would have led to an incorporation of fascist ideology into the mainstream of global social organization, an extremely debatable proposition. Extremism is fostered by economic desperation. If the world had had time to fully recover from the depression, notions of invading the world would have looked a lot less attractive to the fat, comfortable citizens of an affluent western Europe, and Nazism may well have died a quiet death without the need for apocalypse. But of course I won't argue that's what *would* have happened, because making predictions about the consequences of any single event or change in world history is impossible. If you'd like to disagree, please tell us all what the consequences of the Arab uprisings will be in twenty years' time. We'll check back in then and see how well you performed. On Wednesday, August 21, 2013 8:56:57 AM UTC+10, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote: Roger may start a discussion on politics and presents some very narrow minded views, but I can present a different view that may be totally politically incorect but is i.m.o. the right view. Not only is the 3rd World better off with WWII having happened, the Western World is also better off. Without WWII, Nazism would not have been debunked and we would gradually have evolved to become less free societies. Ideas that are totally politically incorrect like euthanizing old and handicap people to save health care costs would have been business as usual. The fundamental mistake Roger makes is to think that the core moral values we have today are universal and that you can look back many decades and then condemn e.g. the Muslim Brotherhood for having supported the Nazis back then. In the end, Roger's brain is just executing a prgram, whatever is against his moral values is encoded in his brain and that information did not come out of thin air. Had history run a different course (and history has run a different course in different sectors of the multiverse), Roger would have supported Nazi policies himself. In fact we can be sure that such a Nazi version of Roger exsts in the multiverse, because all possible programs exists. Saibal Citeren spudb...@aol.com: I do not see why Roger, needs, politics in this forum, but, so be it. Smitra expresses a view that decides the US, has to be ruined for the evil it has conspired against the wonderful, and innocent, people's of the 3rd world. I am guessing that when the ISI strikes India, using enhanced fission devices, he will be content that they detonate it only on legitimate military targets? Enjoy. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everyth...@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 20, 2013 8:13 am Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, albeit it would have been etter if Bin Laden had focusses only on legitimate military targets ike the White House, the US Congress, the Senate and the Pentagon. iteren Roger Clough rcl...@verizon.net: The Nazi history of the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jk4a3Kk6-Y Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] See my Leibniz site at http://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http
RE: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood
The sad fact is that without Hitler, the West would still be a colonial power committing human rights abuses on a unimaginable scale. I suppose we should expect multiverse theorists to present as fact counterfactual histories which can't be falsified. Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2013 16:49:59 -0700 From: pier...@gmail.com To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Self-contradictory. You've got to follow your own theories to their logical conclusions. *Which* Western/third world would have been better off if WW3 hadn't happened? Since everything happens in some branch of the multiverse, surely there are innumerable branches in which the world is better off for not having undergone the horrors of WW3. Or are you saying that, if you summed human happiness in the branches of the hypothetical branch of the multiverse in which WW3 didn't happen, and compared it to the sum of human happiness in the branches in which it did, it would be higher in the ones in which it didn't? Put that way, it becomes a rather absurd claim wouldn't you say? And dubious - since first of all the additional happiness in those non-WW3 branches has to make up for the staggering, unimaginable misery of the holocaust, the Russian front, Hiroshima etc etc before getting ahead at all, and secondly because this is all based on the theory that Nazism not being debunked (It was exterminated) would have led to an incorporation of fascist ideology into the mainstream of global social organization, an extremely debatable proposition. Extremism is fostered by economic desperation. If the world had had time to fully recover from the depression, notions of invading the world would have looked a lot less attractive to the fat, comfortable citizens of an affluent western Europe, and Nazism may well have died a quiet death without the need for apocalypse. But of course I won't argue that's what *would* have happened, because making predictions about the consequences of any single event or change in world history is impossible. If you'd like to disagree, please tell us all what the consequences of the Arab uprisings will be in twenty years' time. We'll check back in then and see how well you performed. On Wednesday, August 21, 2013 8:56:57 AM UTC+10, smi...@zonnet.nl wrote:Roger may start a discussion on politics and presents some very narrow minded views, but I can present a different view that may be totally politically incorect but is i.m.o. the right view. Not only is the 3rd World better off with WWII having happened, the Western World is also better off. Without WWII, Nazism would not have been debunked and we would gradually have evolved to become less free societies. Ideas that are totally politically incorrect like euthanizing old and handicap people to save health care costs would have been business as usual. The fundamental mistake Roger makes is to think that the core moral values we have today are universal and that you can look back many decades and then condemn e.g. the Muslim Brotherhood for having supported the Nazis back then. In the end, Roger's brain is just executing a prgram, whatever is against his moral values is encoded in his brain and that information did not come out of thin air. Had history run a different course (and history has run a different course in different sectors of the multiverse), Roger would have supported Nazi policies himself. In fact we can be sure that such a Nazi version of Roger exsts in the multiverse, because all possible programs exists. Saibal Citeren spudb...@aol.com: I do not see why Roger, needs, politics in this forum, but, so be it. Smitra expresses a view that decides the US, has to be ruined for the evil it has conspired against the wonderful, and innocent, people's of the 3rd world. I am guessing that when the ISI strikes India, using enhanced fission devices, he will be content that they detonate it only on legitimate military targets? Enjoy. -Original Message- From: smitra smi...@zonnet.nl To: everything-list everyth...@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Aug 20, 2013 8:13 am Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Also I believe that 9/11 was a good thing, albeit it would have been etter if Bin Laden had focusses only on legitimate military targets ike the White House, the US Congress, the Senate and the Pentagon. iteren Roger Clough rcl...@verizon.net: The Nazi history of the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jk4a3Kk6-Y Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] See my Leibniz site at http://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com. To post
