Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Ken, With the ut most respect here let me say that I personally never intended to be disrespectful to you, Geremy, or Jim over the issue of what programming language you use. However, I can't help but feel that if you would head over to Book Share and grab a couple books on Visual Basic .Net and learn the language your games would be better off for it in the long run. While I don't currently have the time to write a game in VB .Net for demonstration purposes I could send you books on the language if you were interested in looking at VB .Net. Besides that, you really should read a few books on .Net anyway, because no single open source application can teach you all the ins and outs of the .Net API. There are thousands of classes that wrap the Win32 API and to write anything you should probably have a decent understanding of what libraries are available, what they do, and what classes are available to you as a new .Net developer. Handing you a simple application like Chopper Patrol written in VB .Net will only scratch the surface of what is available to you. Please, consider that as constructive criticism rather than merely grinding your nose into the fact VB 6 is old, outdated, etc. As for myself I don't really care what you guys do any more. Since I've pretty much replaced all my computers here at home with Linux rather than Windows what language you guys use doesn't effect me personally. I'm working on getting all of the current Windows games I have to work using Wine 1.3 for Linux, and if a Windows game won't run on Wine I'm probably not going to play it or buy it. As it happens Wine works pretty decently with VB 6 applications and as long as that is the case I can't complain too much about the games being written in VB 6. As for giving up and quitting that's definitely not the way to handle the situation. Especially, if you like what you are doing personally. People have complained about some of the things I have done as well like spending time writing MOTA and the G3D Engine in C# .Net and then changing to C++ mid way through the development process. Recently I switched over to FMOD 4.34 for audio output and people are complaining about the fact it doesn't sound like DirectSound. they may have some valid points, but I no longer let their complaints bother me. I'm doing what I'm doing for personal reasons, and people can either like it or lump it. I'm moving towards a cross-platform design so I can play my games on Ubuntu Linux, which I use 90% of the time, and if FMOD doesn't pan exactly like Directsound that's just too bad I'm not going back to Windows. So I do understand why and how you feel upset about having your nose being constantly ground into the fact you are using VB 6 rather than VB .Net. Its not easy doing something that goes against popular opinion. On 6/9/11, The Addictor kenwdow...@neo.rr.com wrote: Isn't funny how many people want to jump down our throats for using vb6, when our games are free? When somebody makes a game, or games, there should be a hundred times as much gratitude and constructive criticism than there is complaining and negative criticism, but it's the other way round most of the time. I have been brought to the edge of simply stopping programming, just because people here are so gung-ho against vb6. We devs--most of us anyway, are very well aware how out-dated vb6 is, that Microsoft doesn't support it, (as if that matters much since they're constantly disarranging their software to make it better,) and so on. Found a bug? Great--tell us about it. Got a way for the game to work better? That's great, but stop grinding our noses into the fact that vb6 is so old. Jim Kitchen, Jeremy and I use it, and it's what we know. Sorry if this causes discomfort and inconvenience. For my part, if a great open-source audio game comes out in vb.net, I'll look at it and eventually switch over, since I know how versatile .net is and so on. Until then, I'm happy to use vb6, and I'm not in a hurry to rush around and change up everything right away, especially since I make my games mainly for my own enjoyment, as do my colleagues. If I were trying to sell these games, the complaints about using outdated software would be relevant, but I'm not. (The exception, of course, is Phrase Madness, but that's written in Basic4PPC and uses .net framework, so it's up to spec--relatively.) Also, since I'm venting, there is one other thing I have to point out, and that is this. Even if a game is abandonware, it's not cool to just modify it without the programmer's concent. Damage Extreme is an attempt to make Enemy Attack even funner to play, and I would have gladly concented to the rewriting of it, but I wasn't asked, nor was the work I did on Enemy Attack even mentioned anywhere in the game. I'm not one who cares about such things in general, but this is different. It's not about feeling ticked because my name wasn't on the credits
Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine
Hi Jacob, Would it be to much to ask for a non-Windows specific version of this engine? All you probably need to do is recompile it to pyc files and redistribute those unless you are using some Windows specific modules in your engine. The reason I am asking is Python is very cross--platform and is well supported on non-Windows platforms like linux. I've got Python 2.7 installed on a Ubuntu 11 Linux system, and I'd like to try out the cross-platform potential of this engine if you will let me. Especially, since I don't see any reason how or why this engine should be Windows specific since you are most likely using a cross-platform language and modules to begin with. Cheers! On 6/8/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: If you want to try this out, and let me know if the python to executable plugin has worked at all in making this an actual command line executable for windows machines, you can download the following: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13327195/mapData.zip (roundabout 4Mb) In there it would be best to currently run mapData.exe from an actual command line since I see it sort of throws away the last, outro message if you succeed on the quest as such, and while am busy putting in a way to actually hide the contents of your mission's data files, you'll see that there are some text files there that provide the information/background for the whole (small) thing: mapData.txt mapDataObjects.txt mapDataNPC.txt While might try explaining the contents of those files a bit better later on, there are sort of comments in there, that should make some sense, and the primary initial thing I'd like to know/find out is if this executable can run on many windows machines at all as such, since while it includes the MS C runtimes needed for some things, I do have full versions of visual studio.net installed on all my machines as such, so not 100% sure what will happen on all machines, but anyway. Also, haven't gotten around to trying to generate forms of executables for other platforms as of yet, but let's see if even this will work for real first. The basic command set is the following, but you can also be prompted this during game play by just typing in something like ? and hitting enter: N, S, E, W, U and D - all directional commands - and last 2 are up and down T and P - take and put, followed by item/object name C - communicate with an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter V - commit violence on an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter L - look or when combined with an item name, it gives you the details - if you've already picked it up X - exit R - review travel directions available H - review your health I - review your inventory Might have forgotten some as of now, and there might be various bugs in this code, etc., but would still like to know if usable at all as such, and only other trick is in a new location, you'll need to look for something before knowing if it's there to take as such. This is also just currently generating command line output, but on windows anyway, I can also tell it to talk using some screenreaders, or sapi etc. at some stage. Lastly, there are 2 of the items you'll need to pick up and go and place in other locations/areas to finish off this test mission - and that's as far as will go for now...smile Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine
Only current (possible) windows specific things might be a couple of small windows operating system commands have put in for things like cls (clear screen), and maybe one or two pause commands - as in press any key, but think replaced most of those with a python specific one. Anyway, wasn't sure if .pyc files would be good enough, but let me quickly go and try take out any windows specific things - won't take long, and see if can get interpreter to generate .pyc files to pass on, or else, will send you the actual python source .py files directly. And, yes, would definitely like to know if/how it works on linux, etc. Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message --- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 04:33:16 -0400 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Hi Jacob, Would it be to much to ask for a non-Windows specific version of this engine? All you probably need to do is recompile it to pyc files and redistribute those unless you are using some Windows specific modules in your engine. The reason I am asking is Python is very cross--platform and is well supported on non-Windows platforms like linux. I've got Python 2.7 installed on a Ubuntu 11 Linux system, and I'd like to try out the cross-platform potential of this engine if you will let me. Especially, since I don't see any reason how or why this engine should be Windows specific since you are most likely using a cross-platform language and modules to begin with. Cheers! On 6/8/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: If you want to try this out, and let me know if the python to executable plugin has worked at all in making this an actual command line executable for windows machines, you can download the following: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13327195/mapData.zip (roundabout 4Mb) In there it would be best to currently run mapData.exe from an actual command line since I see it sort of throws away the last, outro message if you succeed on the quest as such, and while am busy putting in a way to actually hide the contents of your mission's data files, you'll see that there are some text files there that provide the information/background for the whole (small) thing: mapData.txt mapDataObjects.txt mapDataNPC.txt While might try explaining the contents of those files a bit better later on, there are sort of comments in there, that should make some sense, and the primary initial thing I'd like to know/find out is if this executable can run on many windows machines at all as such, since while it includes the MS C runtimes needed for some things, I do have full versions of visual studio.net installed on all my machines as such, so not 100% sure what will happen on all machines, but anyway. Also, haven't gotten around to trying to generate forms of executables for other platforms as of yet, but let's see if even this will work for real first. The basic command set is the following, but you can also be prompted this during game play by just typing in something like ? and hitting enter: N, S, E, W, U and D - all directional commands - and last 2 are up and down T and P - take and put, followed by item/object name C - communicate with an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter V - commit violence on an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter L - look or when combined with an item name, it gives you the details - if you've already picked it up X - exit R - review travel directions available H - review your health I - review your inventory Might have forgotten some as of now, and there might be various bugs in this code, etc., but would still like to know if usable at all as such, and only other trick is in a new location, you'll need to look for something before knowing if it's there to take as such. This is also just currently generating command line output, but on windows anyway, I can also tell it to talk using some screenreaders, or sapi etc. at some stage. Lastly, there are 2 of the items you'll need to pick up and go and place in other locations/areas to finish off this test mission - and that's as far as will go for now...smile Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers
Re: [Audyssey] Other Game Ideas?
Hi Dark, Dark wrote: I think so long as there are some! games around, and so long as all game developer is stil done by indi devs with their own time and money, pushing multiple accessible too much would hurt everyone in the long run. My reply: Agreed. Its really impossible to create a game that takes in account everybodies needs at once. Over the last three years or so I've had suggestions for this, that, and the other thing and the assumption is that this or that will be really easy to add. i could just add an on/off setting for it and so on. What people don't realize is that it will increase the complexity of the project and i'd have to break the code up into multiple if statements and spend extra time checking if this, that, or the other thing is true or false before executing the code. then do this or that. It is both complicated, from a long term support aspect, and requires a lot more time and energy to design. As a single developer I'm not getting paid enough to put that extra work into it. Dark wrote: Btw, also an interesting point is that some access changes are good for some disabilities and bad for others. My reply: Oh, that's definitely true. There is no way to make a game like Shades of Doom, for example, playable by a deaf-blind player without making some extensive modifications. Adding braille display support, making it turned based, whatever might help a deaf-blind gamer, but would not be compatible with a real time FPS game that Shades of Doom is suppose to be. Likewise Shades of Doom has 3d audio support via DirectX, but that would be of no use to a deaf-blind gamer, but is very helpful for me in a real time FPS environment. So there is no practical way that multiple accessibility can be addressed in a single game unless the developer takes a lowest common denominator approach, and even then its not 100% perfect. As you said what helps one group won't necessarily help another group of disibilities. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Jeremy. While I can see you feel very strongly about this, my question was not meant as an attack. Instead I think we as a community should come up with a solution. I just read an article where some companies project that at least 40% of all netbooks will have arm processors at the end of next year. As netbooks are a cheep form of computing, I can see many blind gamers going that route. The majority of audiogames will be affected, as they use older technology from microsoft which they don't seem interested in updating for arm. These games include Jim Kitchen's games, GMA, LWorks and many fun games like BSC games that are no longer developed actively. Many gamers are also moving to other platforms like linux, as the cost and restrictions related to windows software is becoming prohibitive. On 6/7/11, Jeremy Kaldobsky jer...@kaldobsky.com wrote: If we all focused on what the next operating system will be, what the next popular devices will be, or what the next popular programming language will be, it would take 10 times longer to produce any games. I think there are enough examples of this exact thought process to prove my point. We do! need some people to be thinking that way, but you also need people who worry more about here and now. --- On Tue, 6/7/11, Willem dwill...@gmail.com wrote: From: Willem dwill...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Lunimals version 2.5b To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Date: Tuesday, June 7, 2011, 3:27 AM Hi. I know that visual basic support have been discontinued by microsoft. What will happen when the next virsion of windows comes out that can run on arm devices? I'm pretty sure copying and registering a dll won't make it work. - Original Message - From: Jeremy Kaldobsky jer...@kaldobsky.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Monday, June 06, 2011 8:49 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Lunimals version 2.5b I don't have any plans to do that. I know it would prevent anyone from having to register Direct X7, but most people don't end up having to do that anyway, and those who do, only have to do it once and they are set for any game that uses Direct X7. Registering the file is pretty easy to do, and only a few people seem to have had trouble following the steps in the read me file. Eventually I'll stop being lazy, and I'll move over to a newer version of Direct X, but I have no real incentive to do so right now. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine
Hellow, I've just tested the .exe file on my computer and it runs fine on this windows7 64 bit machine. Hope that helps, Harmony. -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Jacob Kruger Sent: 08 June 2011 21:29 To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine If you want to try this out, and let me know if the python to executable plugin has worked at all in making this an actual command line executable for windows machines, you can download the following: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13327195/mapData.zip (roundabout 4Mb) In there it would be best to currently run mapData.exe from an actual command line since I see it sort of throws away the last, outro message if you succeed on the quest as such, and while am busy putting in a way to actually hide the contents of your mission's data files, you'll see that there are some text files there that provide the information/background for the whole (small) thing: mapData.txt mapDataObjects.txt mapDataNPC.txt While might try explaining the contents of those files a bit better later on, there are sort of comments in there, that should make some sense, and the primary initial thing I'd like to know/find out is if this executable can run on many windows machines at all as such, since while it includes the MS C runtimes needed for some things, I do have full versions of visual studio.net installed on all my machines as such, so not 100% sure what will happen on all machines, but anyway. Also, haven't gotten around to trying to generate forms of executables for other platforms as of yet, but let's see if even this will work for real first. The basic command set is the following, but you can also be prompted this during game play by just typing in something like ? and hitting enter: N, S, E, W, U and D - all directional commands - and last 2 are up and down T and P - take and put, followed by item/object name C - communicate with an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter V - commit violence on an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter L - look or when combined with an item name, it gives you the details - if you've already picked it up X - exit R - review travel directions available H - review your health I - review your inventory Might have forgotten some as of now, and there might be various bugs in this code, etc., but would still like to know if usable at all as such, and only other trick is in a new location, you'll need to look for something before knowing if it's there to take as such. This is also just currently generating command line output, but on windows anyway, I can also tell it to talk using some screenreaders, or sapi etc. at some stage. Lastly, there are 2 of the items you'll need to pick up and go and place in other locations/areas to finish off this test mission - and that's as far as will go for now...smile Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine
Ok, here's a link to the zip file containing all the .pyc files, along with those text data files, and I now included what's meant to be a cross platform module that can clear screen, and beep, called clsbeep, so there shouldn't be any windows specific requirements in here as such: http://www.blindza.co.za/uploads/mapData_pyc.zip Sorry, but am also laughing now, since it totals like 13Kb - as opposed to the roundabout 4Mb in the windows only version...smile Obviously, the starting point would be the file, mapData.pyc, and will also just mention that if you made changes to a copy of the mapData.txt etc. data files, the command line argument to tell it to look for something specific is just adding something like a map=mapData on there. Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message --- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 04:33:16 -0400 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Hi Jacob, Would it be to much to ask for a non-Windows specific version of this engine? All you probably need to do is recompile it to pyc files and redistribute those unless you are using some Windows specific modules in your engine. The reason I am asking is Python is very cross--platform and is well supported on non-Windows platforms like linux. I've got Python 2.7 installed on a Ubuntu 11 Linux system, and I'd like to try out the cross-platform potential of this engine if you will let me. Especially, since I don't see any reason how or why this engine should be Windows specific since you are most likely using a cross-platform language and modules to begin with. Cheers! On 6/8/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: If you want to try this out, and let me know if the python to executable plugin has worked at all in making this an actual command line executable for windows machines, you can download the following: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13327195/mapData.zip (roundabout 4Mb) In there it would be best to currently run mapData.exe from an actual command line since I see it sort of throws away the last, outro message if you succeed on the quest as such, and while am busy putting in a way to actually hide the contents of your mission's data files, you'll see that there are some text files there that provide the information/background for the whole (small) thing: mapData.txt mapDataObjects.txt mapDataNPC.txt While might try explaining the contents of those files a bit better later on, there are sort of comments in there, that should make some sense, and the primary initial thing I'd like to know/find out is if this executable can run on many windows machines at all as such, since while it includes the MS C runtimes needed for some things, I do have full versions of visual studio.net installed on all my machines as such, so not 100% sure what will happen on all machines, but anyway. Also, haven't gotten around to trying to generate forms of executables for other platforms as of yet, but let's see if even this will work for real first. The basic command set is the following, but you can also be prompted this during game play by just typing in something like ? and hitting enter: N, S, E, W, U and D - all directional commands - and last 2 are up and down T and P - take and put, followed by item/object name C - communicate with an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter V - commit violence on an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter L - look or when combined with an item name, it gives you the details - if you've already picked it up X - exit R - review travel directions available H - review your health I - review your inventory Might have forgotten some as of now, and there might be various bugs in this code, etc., but would still like to know if usable at all as such, and only other trick is in a new location, you'll need to look for something before knowing if it's there to take as such. This is also just currently generating command line output, but on windows anyway, I can also tell it to talk using some screenreaders, or sapi etc. at some stage. Lastly, there are 2 of the items you'll need to pick up and go and place in other locations/areas to finish off this test mission - and that's as far as will go for now...smile Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or
Re: [Audyssey] Other Game Ideas?
Hi Jim, I honestly can't see any way to make a live action game like MOTA playable by a totally deaf-blind gamer. At least not if we are going to do everything in real time. A person has to have a reasonable amountof hearing to play it. As for using text in Windows games it can be done, but sometimes it requires creating sets, scripts, etc for your application for each screen reader. That's not exactly ideal since there are several different screen readers out there these days. The only solution I've found is not to draw my own window and output text directly to the console using the command prompt window in Windows. Most of the modern screen readers like Window-Eyes 7.5, Jaws 12, and NVDA 2011 all read the text as soon as it changes in the command prompt window without scripts, sets, frames, whatever. So its pretty reliable for my wrestling game. On 6/8/11, Jim Kitchen j...@kitchensinc.net wrote: Hi Thomas, Yes, and then besides people who can not do stereo panning, there are the people who are totally deaf and thus can not play audio only games at all. Not so sure how plausible it would be to try to create fast paced live action games that were text based and could be played via braille display. I still do not even like using text in Windows games for the fact that it can not be done so that the text is automatically read by all screen readers like I could in dos. And in Jaws for dos there was a key that would report row and column of the cursor so that I could be sure to keep the text organized and looking good. I am not sure if I was dreaming or what, but I have the thought that someone told me of a key like that for JFW, but I can not remember the key or who might have told me that. BFN Jim Error - Operator out of memory! j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine
Thanks, Harmony, and, yes, while the primary development machine for this thing has been a windows7 32 bit machine, my other primary machine is also a windows7 64 bit machine, but it does also have all the other MS dev tools on it, so wasn't too sure about it running on other machines easily enough - thanks again. Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message --- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine From: Harmony Neil harmon...@googlemail.com Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 10:15:18 +0100 To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Hellow, I've just tested the .exe file on my computer and it runs fine on this windows7 64 bit machine. Hope that helps, Harmony. -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Jacob Kruger Sent: 08 June 2011 21:29 To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine If you want to try this out, and let me know if the python to executable plugin has worked at all in making this an actual command line executable for windows machines, you can download the following: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13327195/mapData.zip (roundabout 4Mb) In there it would be best to currently run mapData.exe from an actual command line since I see it sort of throws away the last, outro message if you succeed on the quest as such, and while am busy putting in a way to actually hide the contents of your mission's data files, you'll see that there are some text files there that provide the information/background for the whole (small) thing: mapData.txt mapDataObjects.txt mapDataNPC.txt While might try explaining the contents of those files a bit better later on, there are sort of comments in there, that should make some sense, and the primary initial thing I'd like to know/find out is if this executable can run on many windows machines at all as such, since while it includes the MS C runtimes needed for some things, I do have full versions of visual studio.net installed on all my machines as such, so not 100% sure what will happen on all machines, but anyway. Also, haven't gotten around to trying to generate forms of executables for other platforms as of yet, but let's see if even this will work for real first. The basic command set is the following, but you can also be prompted this during game play by just typing in something like ? and hitting enter: N, S, E, W, U and D - all directional commands - and last 2 are up and down T and P - take and put, followed by item/object name C - communicate with an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter V - commit violence on an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter L - look or when combined with an item name, it gives you the details - if you've already picked it up X - exit R - review travel directions available H - review your health I - review your inventory Might have forgotten some as of now, and there might be various bugs in this code, etc., but would still like to know if usable at all as such, and only other trick is in a new location, you'll need to look for something before knowing if it's there to take as such. This is also just currently generating command line output, but on windows anyway, I can also tell it to talk using some screenreaders, or sapi etc. at some stage. Lastly, there are 2 of the items you'll need to pick up and go and place in other locations/areas to finish off this test mission - and that's as far as will go for now...smile Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be
Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine
Hi Jacob, That works for me. If we run into issues, and I had the py files I could probably debug the linux support and send the revisions back to you as needed. Not sure what version of Python you are running, but I got Python 2.7 here. It might be helpful to know what version of Python you are using so we can factor that into testing here. Cheers! On 6/9/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: Only current (possible) windows specific things might be a couple of small windows operating system commands have put in for things like cls (clear screen), and maybe one or two pause commands - as in press any key, but think replaced most of those with a python specific one. Anyway, wasn't sure if .pyc files would be good enough, but let me quickly go and try take out any windows specific things - won't take long, and see if can get interpreter to generate .pyc files to pass on, or else, will send you the actual python source .py files directly. And, yes, would definitely like to know if/how it works on linux, etc. Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message --- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 04:33:16 -0400 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Hi Jacob, Would it be to much to ask for a non-Windows specific version of this engine? All you probably need to do is recompile it to pyc files and redistribute those unless you are using some Windows specific modules in your engine. The reason I am asking is Python is very cross--platform and is well supported on non-Windows platforms like linux. I've got Python 2.7 installed on a Ubuntu 11 Linux system, and I'd like to try out the cross-platform potential of this engine if you will let me. Especially, since I don't see any reason how or why this engine should be Windows specific since you are most likely using a cross-platform language and modules to begin with. Cheers! On 6/8/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: If you want to try this out, and let me know if the python to executable plugin has worked at all in making this an actual command line executable for windows machines, you can download the following: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13327195/mapData.zip (roundabout 4Mb) In there it would be best to currently run mapData.exe from an actual command line since I see it sort of throws away the last, outro message if you succeed on the quest as such, and while am busy putting in a way to actually hide the contents of your mission's data files, you'll see that there are some text files there that provide the information/background for the whole (small) thing: mapData.txt mapDataObjects.txt mapDataNPC.txt While might try explaining the contents of those files a bit better later on, there are sort of comments in there, that should make some sense, and the primary initial thing I'd like to know/find out is if this executable can run on many windows machines at all as such, since while it includes the MS C runtimes needed for some things, I do have full versions of visual studio.net installed on all my machines as such, so not 100% sure what will happen on all machines, but anyway. Also, haven't gotten around to trying to generate forms of executables for other platforms as of yet, but let's see if even this will work for real first. The basic command set is the following, but you can also be prompted this during game play by just typing in something like ? and hitting enter: N, S, E, W, U and D - all directional commands - and last 2 are up and down T and P - take and put, followed by item/object name C - communicate with an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter V - commit violence on an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter L - look or when combined with an item name, it gives you the details - if you've already picked it up X - exit R - review travel directions available H - review your health I - review your inventory Might have forgotten some as of now, and there might be various bugs in this code, etc., but would still like to know if usable at all as such, and only other trick is in a new location, you'll need to look for something before knowing if it's there to take as such. This is also just currently generating command line output, but on windows anyway, I can also tell it to talk using some screenreaders, or sapi etc. at some stage. Lastly, there are 2 of the items you'll need to pick up and go and place in other locations/areas to finish off this test mission - and that's as far as will go for now...smile Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to
Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine
Hi Jacob, Well, I just downloaded and tested it. You will be happy to know your cross-platform version works fine on linux. I tested it with both Speakup and Orca on Ubuntu 11.04 and no access issues at all. Thanks for writing this. I think you got a head start on a decent RPG engine here. On 6/9/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: Ok, here's a link to the zip file containing all the .pyc files, along with those text data files, and I now included what's meant to be a cross platform module that can clear screen, and beep, called clsbeep, so there shouldn't be any windows specific requirements in here as such: http://www.blindza.co.za/uploads/mapData_pyc.zip Sorry, but am also laughing now, since it totals like 13Kb - as opposed to the roundabout 4Mb in the windows only version...smile Obviously, the starting point would be the file, mapData.pyc, and will also just mention that if you made changes to a copy of the mapData.txt etc. data files, the command line argument to tell it to look for something specific is just adding something like a map=mapData on there. Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message --- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 04:33:16 -0400 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Hi Jacob, Would it be to much to ask for a non-Windows specific version of this engine? All you probably need to do is recompile it to pyc files and redistribute those unless you are using some Windows specific modules in your engine. The reason I am asking is Python is very cross--platform and is well supported on non-Windows platforms like linux. I've got Python 2.7 installed on a Ubuntu 11 Linux system, and I'd like to try out the cross-platform potential of this engine if you will let me. Especially, since I don't see any reason how or why this engine should be Windows specific since you are most likely using a cross-platform language and modules to begin with. Cheers! On 6/8/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: If you want to try this out, and let me know if the python to executable plugin has worked at all in making this an actual command line executable for windows machines, you can download the following: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13327195/mapData.zip (roundabout 4Mb) In there it would be best to currently run mapData.exe from an actual command line since I see it sort of throws away the last, outro message if you succeed on the quest as such, and while am busy putting in a way to actually hide the contents of your mission's data files, you'll see that there are some text files there that provide the information/background for the whole (small) thing: mapData.txt mapDataObjects.txt mapDataNPC.txt While might try explaining the contents of those files a bit better later on, there are sort of comments in there, that should make some sense, and the primary initial thing I'd like to know/find out is if this executable can run on many windows machines at all as such, since while it includes the MS C runtimes needed for some things, I do have full versions of visual studio.net installed on all my machines as such, so not 100% sure what will happen on all machines, but anyway. Also, haven't gotten around to trying to generate forms of executables for other platforms as of yet, but let's see if even this will work for real first. The basic command set is the following, but you can also be prompted this during game play by just typing in something like ? and hitting enter: N, S, E, W, U and D - all directional commands - and last 2 are up and down T and P - take and put, followed by item/object name C - communicate with an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter V - commit violence on an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter L - look or when combined with an item name, it gives you the details - if you've already picked it up X - exit R - review travel directions available H - review your health I - review your inventory Might have forgotten some as of now, and there might be various bugs in this code, etc., but would still like to know if usable at all as such, and only other trick is in a new location, you'll need to look for something before knowing if it's there to take as such. This is also just currently generating command line output, but on windows anyway, I can also tell it to talk using some screenreaders, or sapi etc. at some stage. Lastly, there are 2 of the items you'll need to pick up and go and place in other locations/areas to finish off this test mission - and that's as far as will go for now...smile Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' --- Gamers
Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine
Will send you the source files as well, and, am running Python 2.7 (r27:82525, Jul 4 2010, 09:01:59) at the moment. Also just made one small corrective change to both the compiled for windows and pyc versions that uploaded to my website, since my brother found one small bug - he attacked the non-aggressive NPC, Peter, and it didn't like the fact that his weapon was a nul/None object...LOL! Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message --- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 05:36:06 -0400 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Hi Jacob, That works for me. If we run into issues, and I had the py files I could probably debug the linux support and send the revisions back to you as needed. Not sure what version of Python you are running, but I got Python 2.7 here. It might be helpful to know what version of Python you are using so we can factor that into testing here. Cheers! On 6/9/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: Only current (possible) windows specific things might be a couple of small windows operating system commands have put in for things like cls (clear screen), and maybe one or two pause commands - as in press any key, but think replaced most of those with a python specific one. Anyway, wasn't sure if .pyc files would be good enough, but let me quickly go and try take out any windows specific things - won't take long, and see if can get interpreter to generate .pyc files to pass on, or else, will send you the actual python source .py files directly. And, yes, would definitely like to know if/how it works on linux, etc. Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message --- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 04:33:16 -0400 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Hi Jacob, Would it be to much to ask for a non-Windows specific version of this engine? All you probably need to do is recompile it to pyc files and redistribute those unless you are using some Windows specific modules in your engine. The reason I am asking is Python is very cross--platform and is well supported on non-Windows platforms like linux. I've got Python 2.7 installed on a Ubuntu 11 Linux system, and I'd like to try out the cross-platform potential of this engine if you will let me. Especially, since I don't see any reason how or why this engine should be Windows specific since you are most likely using a cross-platform language and modules to begin with. Cheers! On 6/8/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: If you want to try this out, and let me know if the python to executable plugin has worked at all in making this an actual command line executable for windows machines, you can download the following: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13327195/mapData.zip (roundabout 4Mb) In there it would be best to currently run mapData.exe from an actual command line since I see it sort of throws away the last, outro message if you succeed on the quest as such, and while am busy putting in a way to actually hide the contents of your mission's data files, you'll see that there are some text files there that provide the information/background for the whole (small) thing: mapData.txt mapDataObjects.txt mapDataNPC.txt While might try explaining the contents of those files a bit better later on, there are sort of comments in there, that should make some sense, and the primary initial thing I'd like to know/find out is if this executable can run on many windows machines at all as such, since while it includes the MS C runtimes needed for some things, I do have full versions of visual studio.net installed on all my machines as such, so not 100% sure what will happen on all machines, but anyway. Also, haven't gotten around to trying to generate forms of executables for other platforms as of yet, but let's see if even this will work for real first. The basic command set is the following, but you can also be prompted this during game play by just typing in something like ? and hitting enter: N, S, E, W, U and D - all directional commands - and last 2 are up and down T and P - take and put, followed by item/object name C - communicate with an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter V - commit violence on an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter L - look or when combined with an item name, it gives you the details - if you've already picked it up X - exit R - review travel directions available H - review your health I - review your inventory Might have forgotten some as of now, and there might be
Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine
Glad to hear it, and thanks for saying that, since while I am primarily using it as practice, I also like the whole idea of a platform independent engine like this that doesn't take too much to be used. Thanks again. Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message --- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 05:54:23 -0400 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Hi Jacob, Well, I just downloaded and tested it. You will be happy to know your cross-platform version works fine on linux. I tested it with both Speakup and Orca on Ubuntu 11.04 and no access issues at all. Thanks for writing this. I think you got a head start on a decent RPG engine here. On 6/9/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: Ok, here's a link to the zip file containing all the .pyc files, along with those text data files, and I now included what's meant to be a cross platform module that can clear screen, and beep, called clsbeep, so there shouldn't be any windows specific requirements in here as such: http://www.blindza.co.za/uploads/mapData_pyc.zip Sorry, but am also laughing now, since it totals like 13Kb - as opposed to the roundabout 4Mb in the windows only version...smile Obviously, the starting point would be the file, mapData.pyc, and will also just mention that if you made changes to a copy of the mapData.txt etc. data files, the command line argument to tell it to look for something specific is just adding something like a map=mapData on there. Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message --- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 04:33:16 -0400 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Hi Jacob, Would it be to much to ask for a non-Windows specific version of this engine? All you probably need to do is recompile it to pyc files and redistribute those unless you are using some Windows specific modules in your engine. The reason I am asking is Python is very cross--platform and is well supported on non-Windows platforms like linux. I've got Python 2.7 installed on a Ubuntu 11 Linux system, and I'd like to try out the cross-platform potential of this engine if you will let me. Especially, since I don't see any reason how or why this engine should be Windows specific since you are most likely using a cross-platform language and modules to begin with. Cheers! On 6/8/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: If you want to try this out, and let me know if the python to executable plugin has worked at all in making this an actual command line executable for windows machines, you can download the following: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13327195/mapData.zip (roundabout 4Mb) In there it would be best to currently run mapData.exe from an actual command line since I see it sort of throws away the last, outro message if you succeed on the quest as such, and while am busy putting in a way to actually hide the contents of your mission's data files, you'll see that there are some text files there that provide the information/background for the whole (small) thing: mapData.txt mapDataObjects.txt mapDataNPC.txt While might try explaining the contents of those files a bit better later on, there are sort of comments in there, that should make some sense, and the primary initial thing I'd like to know/find out is if this executable can run on many windows machines at all as such, since while it includes the MS C runtimes needed for some things, I do have full versions of visual studio.net installed on all my machines as such, so not 100% sure what will happen on all machines, but anyway. Also, haven't gotten around to trying to generate forms of executables for other platforms as of yet, but let's see if even this will work for real first. The basic command set is the following, but you can also be prompted this during game play by just typing in something like ? and hitting enter: N, S, E, W, U and D - all directional commands - and last 2 are up and down T and P - take and put, followed by item/object name C - communicate with an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter V - commit violence on an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter L - look or when combined with an item name, it gives you the details - if you've already picked it up X - exit R - review travel directions available H - review your health I - review your inventory Might have forgotten some as of now, and there might be various bugs in this code, etc., but would still like to know if usable at all as such, and only other trick is in a new
Re: [Audyssey] Other Game Ideas?
Hi Dark, Yeah, I do still wish that putting text on the screen in Windows would read automatically with all screen readers like it would in dos, but otherwise I agree with you that sapi5 works well. I do also wish that I could have pretty graphics in my games so that sighted people would play them, but I can not do that. Likewise as you said it is not going to be possible to make games that are totally accessible for any and all challenges that people may have. If having a key to announce a position like in Mach 1 and Puppy 1 is possible and does not ruin the game play, then I am happy to do that. BFN Jim To be sure of hitting the target, shoot first and call whatever you hit the target. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Ken and Jeremy, Yeah, I still do not know what the big deal is about us programming our games in VB6. I mean installing my winkit.zip file is minuscule and simple to do as compared to needing to install the 300 meg latest net frame work and the very latest DirectX. But hey I have been creating blind accessible games for over 20 years and found out a very long time ago that I need to have a thick skin because no matter what I do, I am not going to totally please every one. But I am very happy in that I always have and still do get allot of very positive feedback from my games. Now not always from the Audyssey list, but in private Email and phone calls. That is not to say that I don't from the Audyssey list as well, but... I am still having fun creating games and plan to keep on doing so for the foreseeable future. Lets all just have fun and get along. grin BFN Jim Kitchen's Inc, for games that are up to 110 percent funner to play. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Jeremy, True, but people could just as easily argue the point that you aren't even properly supporting the technology that exists here and now let alone what comes next. I'm not out to change your mind, but simply state my position on this issue which is simply this. The current Windows operating system is Windows 7 and anyone who is going to buy a new computer today will likely buy Windows 7 as part of their new PC. As a result Visual Basic 6 is not natively supported on that system nor is DirectX 7. You are asking that user to install and configure a bunch of extra old outdated libraries to play your games, that are not officially supported, when you could just as easily switch to something like .Net and have all of your software up to date. It doesn't make any practical sense to me why you would want to stick with Windows 98 era programming languages, tools, and development libraries when you could be spending that time constructively developing games and applications for Windows 7 and beyond using current technology. That doesn't mean I don't appreciate the work you are doing. Far from it. I think some of the games you are writing are revolutionary, very interesting, and definitely is a switch from the same old thing we often see here. It just seems a shame you have decided for whatever reason to ignore the fact that you are building these great games using outdated technology when you could just as easily be looking ahead at what technology most developers are using now. HTH On 6/7/11, Jeremy Kaldobsky jer...@kaldobsky.com wrote: If we all focused on what the next operating system will be, what the next popular devices will be, or what the next popular programming language will be, it would take 10 times longer to produce any games. I think there are enough examples of this exact thought process to prove my point. We do! need some people to be thinking that way, but you also need people who worry more about here and now. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Willem, Yes, I've read something similar to that. We are definitely in a transitional period from the 32-bit world of the Pentium processor to things like the AMD64 as well as the arm processors expected to ship in the next gen netbooks. I don't want it to sound like an attack, but Jeremy and others who are basing their games on VB 6 are setting themselves up for some serious technical problems as we, I.E. the community as a whole, move away from the Windows 98 era languages, libraries, and 32-bit processors. Also as you mentioned there seems to be splintering going on in terms of what operating systems the blind users are using. For the moment Windows still has the majority, but I've seen both the blind Linux and Mac OS communities slowly growing too. I foresee a day when a developer will have to use Python, Java, or some other cross-platform language to produce games simply because Mac and Linux will have substantial markets that could be of interest to a game developer. Is this speculation? Yes, but its certainly something to look at. Its something we need to think about, perhaps prepare for, rather than wait until its upon us and then begin dealing with it. Hopefully, people can understand our point of view rather than seeing it as an attack. Cheers! On 6/9/11, Willem Venter dwill...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Jeremy. While I can see you feel very strongly about this, my question was not meant as an attack. Instead I think we as a community should come up with a solution. I just read an article where some companies project that at least 40% of all netbooks will have arm processors at the end of next year. As netbooks are a cheep form of computing, I can see many blind gamers going that route. The majority of audiogames will be affected, as they use older technology from microsoft which they don't seem interested in updating for arm. These games include Jim Kitchen's games, GMA, LWorks and many fun games like BSC games that are no longer developed actively. Many gamers are also moving to other platforms like linux, as the cost and restrictions related to windows software is becoming prohibitive. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Shaun, Ah...Excuse me for pointing out that the user interface is only a small part of what has changed in Windows Vista/Windows 7. On the contrary many of the APIs have been replaced or vastly updated giving something like Windows 7 quite a lot of changes under the hood from Windows XP. For example, the Windows mixer has been updated/rewritten in Windos 7 and really isn't fully compatible with Microsoft Directsound 8. Instead there is a new API, XAudio2, that Windows 7 developers should be using to handle audio output on Windows 7. As XAudio2 has now officially replaced Directsound on XP, Vista, and Windows 7 that is primarily what developers should probably be using to stay up to date. As for VB 6 goes its not surprising Microsoft completely pulled it from Windows 7. The .Net languages have pretty much replaced everything from the Windows 9x era, and .Net 4.0 is integrated directly into the Windows 7 OS. Most developers today are writing apps in C++ .Net, C# .Net, or VB .Net so it makes sense to target windows consumers using one of those languages since the Windows 7 development platform is primarily .Net now. That wasn't true a few years ago when there wasn't a single API for all Windows releases and programming languages the way .Net has been designed to do for the modern developer. That is probably the biggest change or difference between Windows 7 and XP. On 6/7/11, shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com wrote: thats true jeremy. And the way lifecycles are going, xp goes away, comes, back and then it does it again. I think though we can safely say that there probably won't be any major changes for a really long time, I mean we only just changed the interface in the vista/win7 system. It looks like ms is going to stay with that moddel as it is maybe for a while. And even if it changes its probably going to stay basically the same. Directx9 has stabelised mostly, and this could be the next standard to aspire to for now anyway. Once xp is not used anymore by anyone we could move to higher directx versions, but then again they are always moving foreward. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Jim, Smile. I can answer that question with a question of my own. The problem is simply this. Its true that your games can be played on Windows XP, Vista, and Windows 7 currently by installing your Winkit setup. That's all well and good. Question is, when some of these newer technologies are mainstream and Windows X will no longer run your games what will you do about it? That's the problem. We don't want to attack you, put you down, but question your desire to use VB 6 under those circomstances. Its our worry/concern that one day sooner or later we are all going to not be able to play any of your games on a modern PC because changes in technology will require you to personally upgrade and change the way you do things or we have to simply stop playing your games. NOw, since all of your games are free you are under no obligation to do anything for us let alone give us a game at all. However, it does seem like a shame if I or someone else were to upgrade to Windows X only to find none of your games work any more, and you have no desire to upgrade to the new technology. Does that clarify our position for you? also before I close I want to make a little note about .Net. Its true for Windows XP users that they may have to install a 300 MB update simply because .Net does not ship with XP by default. However, were you using Windows 7 that would not be an issue/problem since .Net 4.0 is integrated directly into the OS and is preinstalled by default. So where I have to install something extra to run VB 6 apps on Windows 7 I don't have to install anything at all to run VB .Net apps as the .Net stuff ships with Windows 7. HTH On 6/9/11, Jim Kitchen j...@kitchensinc.net wrote: Hi Ken and Jeremy, Yeah, I still do not know what the big deal is about us programming our games in VB6. I mean installing my winkit.zip file is minuscule and simple to do as compared to needing to install the 300 meg latest net frame work and the very latest DirectX. But hey I have been creating blind accessible games for over 20 years and found out a very long time ago that I need to have a thick skin because no matter what I do, I am not going to totally please every one. But I am very happy in that I always have and still do get allot of very positive feedback from my games. Now not always from the Audyssey list, but in private Email and phone calls. That is not to say that I don't from the Audyssey list as well, but... I am still having fun creating games and plan to keep on doing so for the foreseeable future. Lets all just have fun and get along. grin BFN Jim Kitchen's Inc, for games that are up to 110 percent funner to play. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Other Game Ideas?
Hi Jim, Well, there is a way to get screen readers to read the text in a Window when it changes and it is to set the screen reader to speak all or say all when launching the game/application. Its certainly a hack, not perfect, but I've used that plenty of times to use something like Winfrotz to read the text automatically when the text in the window changes. However, I agree that using Sapi 5 generally works better in the long run. On 6/9/11, Jim Kitchen j...@kitchensinc.net wrote: Hi Dark, Yeah, I do still wish that putting text on the screen in Windows would read automatically with all screen readers like it would in dos, but otherwise I agree with you that sapi5 works well. I do also wish that I could have pretty graphics in my games so that sighted people would play them, but I can not do that. Likewise as you said it is not going to be possible to make games that are totally accessible for any and all challenges that people may have. If having a key to announce a position like in Mach 1 and Puppy 1 is possible and does not ruin the game play, then I am happy to do that. BFN Jim To be sure of hitting the target, shoot first and call whatever you hit the target. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine
Hi Jacob, That works for me. I'm running the latest Python 2.7 build for Linux, and as I said earlier everything seems to be working decently on my end. I didn't try attacking Peter, but glad you found that bug so quickly. On 6/9/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: Will send you the source files as well, and, am running Python 2.7 (r27:82525, Jul 4 2010, 09:01:59) at the moment. Also just made one small corrective change to both the compiled for windows and pyc versions that uploaded to my website, since my brother found one small bug - he attacked the non-aggressive NPC, Peter, and it didn't like the fact that his weapon was a nul/None object...LOL! Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message --- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 05:36:06 -0400 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Hi Jacob, That works for me. If we run into issues, and I had the py files I could probably debug the linux support and send the revisions back to you as needed. Not sure what version of Python you are running, but I got Python 2.7 here. It might be helpful to know what version of Python you are using so we can factor that into testing here. Cheers! On 6/9/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: Only current (possible) windows specific things might be a couple of small windows operating system commands have put in for things like cls (clear screen), and maybe one or two pause commands - as in press any key, but think replaced most of those with a python specific one. Anyway, wasn't sure if .pyc files would be good enough, but let me quickly go and try take out any windows specific things - won't take long, and see if can get interpreter to generate .pyc files to pass on, or else, will send you the actual python source .py files directly. And, yes, would definitely like to know if/how it works on linux, etc. Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message --- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 04:33:16 -0400 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Hi Jacob, Would it be to much to ask for a non-Windows specific version of this engine? All you probably need to do is recompile it to pyc files and redistribute those unless you are using some Windows specific modules in your engine. The reason I am asking is Python is very cross--platform and is well supported on non-Windows platforms like linux. I've got Python 2.7 installed on a Ubuntu 11 Linux system, and I'd like to try out the cross-platform potential of this engine if you will let me. Especially, since I don't see any reason how or why this engine should be Windows specific since you are most likely using a cross-platform language and modules to begin with. Cheers! On 6/8/11, Jacob Kruger jac...@mailzone.co.za wrote: If you want to try this out, and let me know if the python to executable plugin has worked at all in making this an actual command line executable for windows machines, you can download the following: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13327195/mapData.zip (roundabout 4Mb) In there it would be best to currently run mapData.exe from an actual command line since I see it sort of throws away the last, outro message if you succeed on the quest as such, and while am busy putting in a way to actually hide the contents of your mission's data files, you'll see that there are some text files there that provide the information/background for the whole (small) thing: mapData.txt mapDataObjects.txt mapDataNPC.txt While might try explaining the contents of those files a bit better later on, there are sort of comments in there, that should make some sense, and the primary initial thing I'd like to know/find out is if this executable can run on many windows machines at all as such, since while it includes the MS C runtimes needed for some things, I do have full versions of visual studio.net installed on all my machines as such, so not 100% sure what will happen on all machines, but anyway. Also, haven't gotten around to trying to generate forms of executables for other platforms as of yet, but let's see if even this will work for real first. The basic command set is the following, but you can also be prompted this during game play by just typing in something like ? and hitting enter: N, S, E, W, U and D - all directional commands - and last 2 are up and down T and P - take and put, followed by item/object name C - communicate with an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter V - commit violence on an NPC - you'll be offered a list of
Re: [Audyssey] Lunimals version 2.5b
I don't think your speculating, because if you get a computer now it will have a 64bit op. That is what all the screen readers are moving towards. If those that know VB6 would of just looked or tried one of the .nets. They would see how some of coding is easier and how some is not, but at least lacking the hair pulling of not knowing why your stuff don't work on todays op. Its not pulling teeth! Its just keeping in step so what you right works instead of being yesterdays left overs like dos is now. I tried to run a straight dos program on my win7 64bit op and it just sat there. So did the rest of the op, frozen in time and just as useless. So they maybe lucky now there stuff can be made to work. The question is will it on next op? Because you know as soon as it comes out. New boxes will ship and the VI will be getting them from those hand out orgs! So remember time is real short for VB6 and you can stand by it all you want. Alone! personally, I won't tech a out of date program. Just to hard trying to get libs that are no long there. Here is a good example. There are a lot of us out hear doing the flight sim thing. Most are using FS2000 or better like FSX. All of them came out before 2006 and take some doing to get working on todays ops. The problem is with it you have to move up or the new code has a harder time working with the sim. Just like those using FS2000 or FS9 use FS navigator. Will FS navigator along with those versions of sims are no longer supported or even offer support. The new sim called flight sim took 5 years to come out and was stopped, because it already was left behind by the ops and hardware. Something to think about, not even released and already game over! At 06:42 AM 6/9/2011, you wrote: Hi Willem, Yes, I've read something similar to that. We are definitely in a transitional period from the 32-bit world of the Pentium processor to things like the AMD64 as well as the arm processors expected to ship in the next gen netbooks. I don't want it to sound like an attack, but Jeremy and others who are basing their games on VB 6 are setting themselves up for some serious technical problems as we, I.E. the community as a whole, move away from the Windows 98 era languages, libraries, and 32-bit processors. Also as you mentioned there seems to be splintering going on in terms of what operating systems the blind users are using. For the moment Windows still has the majority, but I've seen both the blind Linux and Mac OS communities slowly growing too. I foresee a day when a developer will have to use Python, Java, or some other cross-platform language to produce games simply because Mac and Linux will have substantial markets that could be of interest to a game developer. Is this speculation? Yes, but its certainly something to look at. Its something we need to think about, perhaps prepare for, rather than wait until its upon us and then begin dealing with it. Hopefully, people can understand our point of view rather than seeing it as an attack. Cheers! On 6/9/11, Willem Venter dwill...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Jeremy. While I can see you feel very strongly about this, my question was not meant as an attack. Instead I think we as a community should come up with a solution. I just read an article where some companies project that at least 40% of all netbooks will have arm processors at the end of next year. As netbooks are a cheep form of computing, I can see many blind gamers going that route. The majority of audiogames will be affected, as they use older technology from microsoft which they don't seem interested in updating for arm. These games include Jim Kitchen's games, GMA, LWorks and many fun games like BSC games that are no longer developed actively. Many gamers are also moving to other platforms like linux, as the cost and restrictions related to windows software is becoming prohibitive. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
i do see where you come from Jim, but its a lost cause and here is why. I got one game that I liked called PZ98. Now that was a very nice game to play and have spent hours and even days at that tank. I had a problem with getting it running and Phil and Kelley took the time to get mine working. I can get it to work on everything but win7. It will run but not how it was made to run. That my friend is where you will be sitting. Your stuff works now but is getting very short time All the time spent bitching about it could of ben spent looking at .net or anything being used today. A rock that don't move gets no moss but a lot of bird... At 06:26 AM 6/9/2011, you wrote: Hi Ken and Jeremy, Yeah, I still do not know what the big deal is about us programming our games in VB6. I mean installing my winkit.zip file is minuscule and simple to do as compared to needing to install the 300 meg latest net frame work and the very latest DirectX. But hey I have been creating blind accessible games for over 20 years and found out a very long time ago that I need to have a thick skin because no matter what I do, I am not going to totally please every one. But I am very happy in that I always have and still do get allot of very positive feedback from my games. Now not always from the Audyssey list, but in private Email and phone calls. That is not to say that I don't from the Audyssey list as well, but... I am still having fun creating games and plan to keep on doing so for the foreseeable future. Lets all just have fun and get along. grin BFN Jim Kitchen's Inc, for games that are up to 110 percent funner to play. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Jim has put out a lot of free fun for blind gamers as a hobby over the years, and I think we should appreciatively let him continue his endeavours as he sees fit. if a game doesn't work on your system, don't get it. Shepherds are the best beasts! On Jun 9, 2011, at 7:12 AM, Trouble troub...@columbus.rr.com wrote: i do see where you come from Jim, but its a lost cause and here is why. I got one game that I liked called PZ98. Now that was a very nice game to play and have spent hours and even days at that tank. I had a problem with getting it running and Phil and Kelley took the time to get mine working. I can get it to work on everything but win7. It will run but not how it was made to run. That my friend is where you will be sitting. Your stuff works now but is getting very short time All the time spent bitching about it could of ben spent looking at .net or anything being used today. A rock that don't move gets no moss but a lot of bird... At 06:26 AM 6/9/2011, you wrote: Hi Ken and Jeremy, Yeah, I still do not know what the big deal is about us programming our games in VB6. I mean installing my winkit.zip file is minuscule and simple to do as compared to needing to install the 300 meg latest net frame work and the very latest DirectX. But hey I have been creating blind accessible games for over 20 years and found out a very long time ago that I need to have a thick skin because no matter what I do, I am not going to totally please every one. But I am very happy in that I always have and still do get allot of very positive feedback from my games. Now not always from the Audyssey list, but in private Email and phone calls. That is not to say that I don't from the Audyssey list as well, but... I am still having fun creating games and plan to keep on doing so for the foreseeable future. Lets all just have fun and get along. grin BFN Jim Kitchen's Inc, for games that are up to 110 percent funner to play. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi, Yes, I agree that Jim's games are fun. I started with them when I started playing games for the blind. But, you said if the game can't work on your system don't get it. The problem is that in a year, two or three, there will be noone that uses the systems that are popular now. Who of you is using windows 98? And if someone is using it, why? That's why the gamers are talking about that. They only want the developers to go ahead and do their job, but noone will want to remain with Win 95 or earlier only because of a game. Best regards! Milos Przic msn: milos.pr...@gmail.com skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2011 3:49 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b Jim has put out a lot of free fun for blind gamers as a hobby over the years, and I think we should appreciatively let him continue his endeavours as he sees fit. if a game doesn't work on your system, don't get it. Shepherds are the best beasts! On Jun 9, 2011, at 7:12 AM, Trouble troub...@columbus.rr.com wrote: i do see where you come from Jim, but its a lost cause and here is why. I got one game that I liked called PZ98. Now that was a very nice game to play and have spent hours and even days at that tank. I had a problem with getting it running and Phil and Kelley took the time to get mine working. I can get it to work on everything but win7. It will run but not how it was made to run. That my friend is where you will be sitting. Your stuff works now but is getting very short time All the time spent bitching about it could of ben spent looking at .net or anything being used today. A rock that don't move gets no moss but a lot of bird... At 06:26 AM 6/9/2011, you wrote: Hi Ken and Jeremy, Yeah, I still do not know what the big deal is about us programming our games in VB6. I mean installing my winkit.zip file is minuscule and simple to do as compared to needing to install the 300 meg latest net frame work and the very latest DirectX. But hey I have been creating blind accessible games for over 20 years and found out a very long time ago that I need to have a thick skin because no matter what I do, I am not going to totally please every one. But I am very happy in that I always have and still do get allot of very positive feedback from my games. Now not always from the Audyssey list, but in private Email and phone calls. That is not to say that I don't from the Audyssey list as well, but... I am still having fun creating games and plan to keep on doing so for the foreseeable future. Lets all just have fun and get along. grin BFN Jim Kitchen's Inc, for games that are up to 110 percent funner to play. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 6192 (20110609) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 6192 (20110609) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
All the more reason to keep one perfectly working older PC aound. Eveything doesn't have to be upgraded. Think of it as a blind person's game machine, so to speak? Shepherds are the best beasts! On Jun 9, 2011, at 6:25 AM, Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Jim, Smile. I can answer that question with a question of my own. The problem is simply this. Its true that your games can be played on Windows XP, Vista, and Windows 7 currently by installing your Winkit setup. That's all well and good. Question is, when some of these newer technologies are mainstream and Windows X will no longer run your games what will you do about it? That's the problem. We don't want to attack you, put you down, but question your desire to use VB 6 under those circomstances. Its our worry/concern that one day sooner or later we are all going to not be able to play any of your games on a modern PC because changes in technology will require you to personally upgrade and change the way you do things or we have to simply stop playing your games. NOw, since all of your games are free you are under no obligation to do anything for us let alone give us a game at all. However, it does seem like a shame if I or someone else were to upgrade to Windows X only to find none of your games work any more, and you have no desire to upgrade to the new technology. Does that clarify our position for you? also before I close I want to make a little note about .Net. Its true for Windows XP users that they may have to install a 300 MB update simply because .Net does not ship with XP by default. However, were you using Windows 7 that would not be an issue/problem since .Net 4.0 is integrated directly into the OS and is preinstalled by default. So where I have to install something extra to run VB 6 apps on Windows 7 I don't have to install anything at all to run VB .Net apps as the .Net stuff ships with Windows 7. HTH On 6/9/11, Jim Kitchen j...@kitchensinc.net wrote: Hi Ken and Jeremy, Yeah, I still do not know what the big deal is about us programming our games in VB6. I mean installing my winkit.zip file is minuscule and simple to do as compared to needing to install the 300 meg latest net frame work and the very latest DirectX. But hey I have been creating blind accessible games for over 20 years and found out a very long time ago that I need to have a thick skin because no matter what I do, I am not going to totally please every one. But I am very happy in that I always have and still do get allot of very positive feedback from my games. Now not always from the Audyssey list, but in private Email and phone calls. That is not to say that I don't from the Audyssey list as well, but... I am still having fun creating games and plan to keep on doing so for the foreseeable future. Lets all just have fun and get along. grin BFN Jim Kitchen's Inc, for games that are up to 110 percent funner to play. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi, That's exactly the issue in a nutshell. Its not that I or anyone else has any particular issue with VB 6 and/or the developers that use it, other than the fact that some day every single program written in that language will stop working and the developer is going to have to deal with that reality sooner or later. Unfortunately, as the majority of accessible games are based on VB 6 if we, as a community don't take steps to upgrade now, there may come a day when Windows X will no longer run any games written in VB 6 and then what will we do? The same argument can apply to Directplay, Directsound, and a number of other APIs that are now deprecated. Yes, they currently still work on Windows 7 now, but don't expect that state of affairs to last forever. The one and only reason they still work is Microsoft is trying to maintain backward compatibility with XP era software and many of their libraries are their for compatibility reasons rather than active development. When XP goes out of support so will DirectX 8 and a number of APIs that came with XP. Rather than wining about it the smart thing is to start looking at updating to something current now. Cheers! On 6/9/11, Trouble troub...@columbus.rr.com wrote: i do see where you come from Jim, but its a lost cause and here is why. I got one game that I liked called PZ98. Now that was a very nice game to play and have spent hours and even days at that tank. I had a problem with getting it running and Phil and Kelley took the time to get mine working. I can get it to work on everything but win7. It will run but not how it was made to run. That my friend is where you will be sitting. Your stuff works now but is getting very short time All the time spent bitching about it could of ben spent looking at .net or anything being used today. A rock that don't move gets no moss but a lot of bird... --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] Disrespect for devs and notes on operating systems
Amen to charles on that one. also, keep in mind you can still play DOS stuff on win 7 if I'm not badly mistaken. I remember playing Zork on xp a few years ago, as long as there is a demand for emulators out there, we could be playing Jim's life right up until the end of ours. On the OS front, all this talk of linux versus macs versus windows etc. seems to be missing something. How long before android becomes the operating system for not just your phone, but your main computer, which may actually end up being your phone, your car, your fridge, etc. One way or the other, the days of expensive operating systems for home users are numbered as everything moves to the cloud, and those that think linux is coming out on top of that battle are dreaming the big dream as well. Linux is not going to gain mass appeal, but look how quickly iOS and android have spread. when something gets that ubiquitous that fast, and folks get used to it, its position is sealed for a long time to come. Already, the teenagers in my family can fly on android and iOS, get what they want done on it, and don't bother that much with the desktops at all. Their digital world is android and iOS, and windows, Mac OS etc. is becoming an after thought. just a matter of time before these free OS' take over, and with the power and money google and apple have, you can bet they will be pushing the demise of windows hard. and yes, i know android has a long way to go, ditto for iOS before being able to do all we want as a computer system, especially the accessible stuff, but you can bet your bottom dollar a large chunk of folks will be running android or a variant of it on their main systems before the decade is out. so to that end, you guys abandoning windows and going with linux are in the same boat as everyone else, the only difference is your efforts will probably have a shorter shelf life than anything jim has put out, barring the ocasional ports and emulations on next gen operating systems. having said all that, i've spent considerable time and efort on my games for windows, and i'm confident there are quite a few years of enjoyment to be had from them in the accessible community. bottom line, nobody is getting rich off accessible games, if you want to program them in vb 6, or aim them at macs and linux, or whatever, as long as your enjoying it, go for it, and don't let anyone else throw a wet blanket on what your doing. the digital landscape is covered in ice, who knows for sure where we're headed, but there is no point in slamming anyone else for how they choose to bring their digital creations into this world, we need all the creative minds we can get in the accessible gaming community, thats the important part, not the tools your using. Later, Che, AKA The Swami On 6/9/2011 8:49 AM, Charles Rivard wrote: Jim has put out a lot of free fun for blind gamers as a hobby over the years, and I think we should appreciatively let him continue his endeavours as he sees fit. if a game doesn't work on your system, don't get it. Shepherds are the best beasts! On Jun 9, 2011, at 7:12 AM, Troubletroub...@columbus.rr.com wrote: i do see where you come from Jim, but its a lost cause and here is why. I got one game that I liked called PZ98. Now that was a very nice game to play and have spent hours and even days at that tank. I had a problem with getting it running and Phil and Kelley took the time to get mine working. I can get it to work on everything but win7. It will run but not how it was made to run. That my friend is where you will be sitting. Your stuff works now but is getting very short time All the time spent bitching about it could of ben spent looking at .net or anything being used today. A rock that don't move gets no moss but a lot of bird... At 06:26 AM 6/9/2011, you wrote: Hi Ken and Jeremy, Yeah, I still do not know what the big deal is about us programming our games in VB6. I mean installing my winkit.zip file is minuscule and simple to do as compared to needing to install the 300 meg latest net frame work and the very latest DirectX. But hey I have been creating blind accessible games for over 20 years and found out a very long time ago that I need to have a thick skin because no matter what I do, I am not going to totally please every one. But I am very happy in that I always have and still do get allot of very positive feedback from my games. Now not always from the Audyssey list, but in private Email and phone calls. That is not to say that I don't from the Audyssey list as well, but... I am still having fun creating games and plan to keep on doing so for the foreseeable future. Lets all just have fun and get along.grin BFN Jim Kitchen's Inc, for games that are up to 110 percent funner to play. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Charles, The problem with that approach is that the system won't last forever. The older the PC the harder it is to get parts for it if it breaks down, and I've seen enough PCs die over my lifetime to know it is often more expensive to fix it than it is to throw it away and buy a new e-machine. Which is really the problem here. A persons XP machine that works fine today, can be retired as a gaming machine, while the owner goes out and buys a new Windows 7 64-bit machine with the works. Maybe that lasts a couple of years, and then the old XP machine breaks down. The problem here is that the hardware is rapidly changing all the time and you can't just go to Best Buy and get compatible hardware. You may have to hit Ebay and get a used piece of hardware or pay extra for an unused older piece of hardware to replace the one in the broken down PC. Wouldn't it be simplar if the game or application was regularly maintained by the developer so you could just install it on Windows 7 64-bit and forget the other XP machine? Cheers! On 6/9/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: All the more reason to keep one perfectly working older PC aound. Eveything doesn't have to be upgraded. Think of it as a blind person's game machine, so to speak? Shepherds are the best beasts! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
The problem with old pcs are that they break sooner or later. I am currently studying and there is simply no space for two computers in my room -original message- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b From: Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net Date: 09/06/2011 4:05 pm All the more reason to keep one perfectly working older PC aound. Eveything doesn't have to be upgraded. Think of it as a blind person's game machine, so to speak? Shepherds are the best beasts! On Jun 9, 2011, at 6:25 AM, Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Jim, Smile. I can answer that question with a question of my own. The problem is simply this. Its true that your games can be played on Windows XP, Vista, and Windows 7 currently by installing your Winkit setup. That's all well and good. Question is, when some of these newer technologies are mainstream and Windows X will no longer run your games what will you do about it? That's the problem. We don't want to attack you, put you down, but question your desire to use VB 6 under those circomstances. Its our worry/concern that one day sooner or later we are all going to not be able to play any of your games on a modern PC because changes in technology will require you to personally upgrade and change the way you do things or we have to simply stop playing your games. NOw, since all of your games are free you are under no obligation to do anything for us let alone give us a game at all. However, it does seem like a shame if I or someone else were to upgrade to Windows X only to find none of your games work any more, and you have no desire to upgrade to the new technology. Does that clarify our position for you? also before I close I want to make a little note about .Net. Its true for Windows XP users that they may have to install a 300 MB update simply because .Net does not ship with XP by default. However, were you using Windows 7 that would not be an issue/problem since .Net 4.0 is integrated directly into the OS and is preinstalled by default. So where I have to install something extra to run VB 6 apps on Windows 7 I don't have to install anything at all to run VB .Net apps as the .Net stuff ships with Windows 7. HTH On 6/9/11, Jim Kitchen j...@kitchensinc.net wrote: Hi Ken and Jeremy, Yeah, I still do not know what the big deal is about us programming our games in VB6. I mean installing my winkit.zip file is minuscule and simple to do as compared to needing to install the 300 meg latest net frame work and the very latest DirectX. But hey I have been creating blind accessible games for over 20 years and found out a very long time ago that I need to have a thick skin because no matter what I do, I am not going to totally please every one. But I am very happy in that I always have and still do get allot of very positive feedback from my games. Now not always from the Audyssey list, but in private Email and phone calls. That is not to say that I don't from the Audyssey list as well, but... I am still having fun creating games and plan to keep on doing so for the foreseeable future. Lets all just have fun and get along. grin BFN Jim Kitchen's Inc, for games that are up to 110 percent funner to play. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You
Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine
Nice. I'm also starting to make a very basic text adventure thing, so let me know if you need any help. -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Jacob Kruger Sent: 09 June 2011 10:34 To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine Thanks, Harmony, and, yes, while the primary development machine for this thing has been a windows7 32 bit machine, my other primary machine is also a windows7 64 bit machine, but it does also have all the other MS dev tools on it, so wasn't too sure about it running on other machines easily enough - thanks again. Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message --- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine From: Harmony Neil harmon...@googlemail.com Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 10:15:18 +0100 To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Hellow, I've just tested the .exe file on my computer and it runs fine on this windows7 64 bit machine. Hope that helps, Harmony. -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Jacob Kruger Sent: 08 June 2011 21:29 To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine If you want to try this out, and let me know if the python to executable plugin has worked at all in making this an actual command line executable for windows machines, you can download the following: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13327195/mapData.zip (roundabout 4Mb) In there it would be best to currently run mapData.exe from an actual command line since I see it sort of throws away the last, outro message if you succeed on the quest as such, and while am busy putting in a way to actually hide the contents of your mission's data files, you'll see that there are some text files there that provide the information/background for the whole (small) thing: mapData.txt mapDataObjects.txt mapDataNPC.txt While might try explaining the contents of those files a bit better later on, there are sort of comments in there, that should make some sense, and the primary initial thing I'd like to know/find out is if this executable can run on many windows machines at all as such, since while it includes the MS C runtimes needed for some things, I do have full versions of visual studio.net installed on all my machines as such, so not 100% sure what will happen on all machines, but anyway. Also, haven't gotten around to trying to generate forms of executables for other platforms as of yet, but let's see if even this will work for real first. The basic command set is the following, but you can also be prompted this during game play by just typing in something like ? and hitting enter: N, S, E, W, U and D - all directional commands - and last 2 are up and down T and P - take and put, followed by item/object name C - communicate with an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter V - commit violence on an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter L - look or when combined with an item name, it gives you the details - if you've already picked it up X - exit R - review travel directions available H - review your health I - review your inventory Might have forgotten some as of now, and there might be various bugs in this code, etc., but would still like to know if usable at all as such, and only other trick is in a new location, you'll need to look for something before knowing if it's there to take as such. This is also just currently generating command line output, but on windows anyway, I can also tell it to talk using some screenreaders, or sapi etc. at some stage. Lastly, there are 2 of the items you'll need to pick up and go and place in other locations/areas to finish off this test mission - and that's as far as will go for now...smile Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please
Re: [Audyssey] Disrespect for devs and notes on operating systems
Che, androyd is linux. -original message- Subject: [Audyssey] Disrespect for devs and notes on operating systems From: Che blindadrenal...@gmail.com Date: 09/06/2011 4:22 pm Amen to charles on that one. also, keep in mind you can still play DOS stuff on win 7 if I'm not badly mistaken. I remember playing Zork on xp a few years ago, as long as there is a demand for emulators out there, we could be playing Jim's life right up until the end of ours. On the OS front, all this talk of linux versus macs versus windows etc. seems to be missing something. How long before android becomes the operating system for not just your phone, but your main computer, which may actually end up being your phone, your car, your fridge, etc. One way or the other, the days of expensive operating systems for home users are numbered as everything moves to the cloud, and those that think linux is coming out on top of that battle are dreaming the big dream as well. Linux is not going to gain mass appeal, but look how quickly iOS and android have spread. when something gets that ubiquitous that fast, and folks get used to it, its position is sealed for a long time to come. Already, the teenagers in my family can fly on android and iOS, get what they want done on it, and don't bother that much with the desktops at all. Their digital world is android and iOS, and windows, Mac OS etc. is becoming an after thought. just a matter of time before these free OS' take over, and with the power and money google and apple have, you can bet they will be pushing the demise of windows hard. and yes, i know android has a long way to go, ditto for iOS before being able to do all we want as a computer system, especially the accessible stuff, but you can bet your bottom dollar a large chunk of folks will be running android or a variant of it on their main systems before the decade is out. so to that end, you guys abandoning windows and going with linux are in the same boat as everyone else, the only difference is your efforts will probably have a shorter shelf life than anything jim has put out, barring the ocasional ports and emulations on next gen operating systems. having said all that, i've spent considerable time and efort on my games for windows, and i'm confident there are quite a few years of enjoyment to be had from them in the accessible community. bottom line, nobody is getting rich off accessible games, if you want to program them in vb 6, or aim them at macs and linux, or whatever, as long as your enjoying it, go for it, and don't let anyone else throw a wet blanket on what your doing. the digital landscape is covered in ice, who knows for sure where we're headed, but there is no point in slamming anyone else for how they choose to bring their digital creations into this world, we need all the creative minds we can get in the accessible gaming community, thats the important part, not the tools your using. Later, Che, AKA The Swami On 6/9/2011 8:49 AM, Charles Rivard wrote: Jim has put out a lot of free fun for blind gamers as a hobby over the years, and I think we should appreciatively let him continue his endeavours as he sees fit. if a game doesn't work on your system, don't get it. Shepherds are the best beasts! On Jun 9, 2011, at 7:12 AM, Troubletroub...@columbus.rr.com wrote: i do see where you come from Jim, but its a lost cause and here is why. I got one game that I liked called PZ98. Now that was a very nice game to play and have spent hours and even days at that tank. I had a problem with getting it running and Phil and Kelley took the time to get mine working. I can get it to work on everything but win7. It will run but not how it was made to run. That my friend is where you will be sitting. Your stuff works now but is getting very short time All the time spent bitching about it could of ben spent looking at .net or anything being used today. A rock that don't move gets no moss but a lot of bird... At 06:26 AM 6/9/2011, you wrote: Hi Ken and Jeremy, Yeah, I still do not know what the big deal is about us programming our games in VB6. I mean installing my winkit.zip file is minuscule and simple to do as compared to needing to install the 300 meg latest net frame work and the very latest DirectX. But hey I have been creating blind accessible games for over 20 years and found out a very long time ago that I need to have a thick skin because no matter what I do, I am not going to totally please every one. But I am very happy in that I always have and still do get allot of very positive feedback from my games. Now not always from the Audyssey list, but in private Email and phone calls. That is not to say that I don't from the Audyssey list as well, but... I am still having fun creating games and plan to keep on doing so for the foreseeable future. Lets all just have fun and get along.grin BFN
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Charles and all, the issue has nothing to do with appreciation. I certainly appreciate all the work Jim does, and like several of his games. Its actually the fact because I appreciate those games I want to see them improved and made to meet current development standards and practices. Saying the games don't work on Windows X so don't upgrade is simply not an answer for most people. Given a choice I would upgrade and forget about the games, but it would certainly be better to upgrade and still be able to play the games too. In a sense I've already done that. You all know I am running Linux not Windows on my laptop, and am currently looking at getting various games running under the Windows emulator, wine, and if that doesn't pan out so be it. I'm not going to cry over not playing various games I can't take with me. Obviously, though, I want to keep and play as many games as I can. Bottom line, given a choice of buying a new PC with Windos X on it or sticking with Windows XP for the rest of their life to play Jim's games isn't a contest. I'd say most people would buy the new PC and request Jim upgrade his games, but playing his games wouldn't stop them from upgrading in and of itself. Cheers! On 6/9/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: Jim has put out a lot of free fun for blind gamers as a hobby over the years, and I think we should appreciatively let him continue his endeavours as he sees fit. if a game doesn't work on your system, don't get it. Shepherds are the best beasts! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
That is what happened to many dos games. People simply stopped playing them because it was too hard to run them. There is always emulation, but to mention an example, running a game like shades of doom under wine is a no go, because the game crashes when you open a door. -original message- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com Date: 09/06/2011 4:40 pm Hi Charles and all, the issue has nothing to do with appreciation. I certainly appreciate all the work Jim does, and like several of his games. Its actually the fact because I appreciate those games I want to see them improved and made to meet current development standards and practices. Saying the games don't work on Windows X so don't upgrade is simply not an answer for most people. Given a choice I would upgrade and forget about the games, but it would certainly be better to upgrade and still be able to play the games too. In a sense I've already done that. You all know I am running Linux not Windows on my laptop, and am currently looking at getting various games running under the Windows emulator, wine, and if that doesn't pan out so be it. I'm not going to cry over not playing various games I can't take with me. Obviously, though, I want to keep and play as many games as I can. Bottom line, given a choice of buying a new PC with Windos X on it or sticking with Windows XP for the rest of their life to play Jim's games isn't a contest. I'd say most people would buy the new PC and request Jim upgrade his games, but playing his games wouldn't stop them from upgrading in and of itself. Cheers! On 6/9/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: Jim has put out a lot of free fun for blind gamers as a hobby over the years, and I think we should appreciatively let him continue his endeavours as he sees fit. if a game doesn't work on your system, don't get it. Shepherds are the best beasts! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Tom, It's all just a matter of personal preference, in my opinion. Computers aren't half as fun without any games. To be honest I'm not a big Windows fan myself, but it's what I'm used to and have been brought up with. After playing with a copy of Vinux and a friend's Mac I came to the conclusion that I'd be better sticking with Windows. Not only from a games point of view, but interfaces, development, familiarity etc. Even after playing around with a Vista computer I didn't like that as much as XP. I can't speak for Windows 7 since I have never tried it, but if a game that I spent a lot of time playing didn't work on Windows 7 I wouldn't even consider upgrading. Most of my days are spent playing if not making games, therefore I'd be lost if I upgraded and a game didn't work as expected. Just because I make my own games doesn't mean that I'm going to stop playing games that Liam, Justin, David, Phil etc have come out with just because they use VB6 or an old language that only supports old systems. I'd rather have as many games to play as possible than forfeit them just because I may want to upgrade to a better system. Now if a game was updated and for whatever reason it didn't support XP, then I may have to purchase a second machine to run Windows 7 just so that I can play that game. But I would probably use my XP machine as my main one, at least until I got fully accustomed to my Windows 7 one and I was sure that all my favourite games would work on it. Regards, Damien. - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2011 3:35 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b Hi Charles and all, the issue has nothing to do with appreciation. I certainly appreciate all the work Jim does, and like several of his games. Its actually the fact because I appreciate those games I want to see them improved and made to meet current development standards and practices. Saying the games don't work on Windows X so don't upgrade is simply not an answer for most people. Given a choice I would upgrade and forget about the games, but it would certainly be better to upgrade and still be able to play the games too. In a sense I've already done that. You all know I am running Linux not Windows on my laptop, and am currently looking at getting various games running under the Windows emulator, wine, and if that doesn't pan out so be it. I'm not going to cry over not playing various games I can't take with me. Obviously, though, I want to keep and play as many games as I can. Bottom line, given a choice of buying a new PC with Windos X on it or sticking with Windows XP for the rest of their life to play Jim's games isn't a contest. I'd say most people would buy the new PC and request Jim upgrade his games, but playing his games wouldn't stop them from upgrading in and of itself. Cheers! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Disrespect for devs and notes on operating systems
Hi Che, I don't know if you are aware of this but Android is actually a Linux varient. So when you say us Linux users are dreamers, doesn't have mass apeal, and then announce that we all could be using Android in a few years you are defeating your own argument since Android is a mobile version of Linux designed for Android phones. Besides that Linux is showing up in all kinds of devices cell phones, your Play Station III, on network servers, some Del netbooks, etc. So regardless what you say Linux does have mass apeal and support for Linux is growing. Especially, in the handheld devices market. The success of Android, which is based on Linux technology, proves the success of Linux in the mainstream market. The one thing I do agree with you on that Android phones, IPhones, IPods, etc have become extremely popular, and it would not surprise me in the least if tomorrows computers are no bigger than a cell phone and they run a mobile version of Linux like Android or Apples IOS. Which of course will only prove my point that developing games based on Windows 98 era programming languages, tools, and libraries probably is not a good idea given that Android, IOS, etc is probably in our future. In either case you are right for the moment though a person should do what makes them happy regardless of what I say or anyone else says. Cheers! On 6/9/11, Che blindadrenal...@gmail.com wrote: Amen to charles on that one. also, keep in mind you can still play DOS stuff on win 7 if I'm not badly mistaken. I remember playing Zork on xp a few years ago, as long as there is a demand for emulators out there, we could be playing Jim's life right up until the end of ours. On the OS front, all this talk of linux versus macs versus windows etc. seems to be missing something. How long before android becomes the operating system for not just your phone, but your main computer, which may actually end up being your phone, your car, your fridge, etc. One way or the other, the days of expensive operating systems for home users are numbered as everything moves to the cloud, and those that think linux is coming out on top of that battle are dreaming the big dream as well. Linux is not going to gain mass appeal, but look how quickly iOS and android have spread. when something gets that ubiquitous that fast, and folks get used to it, its position is sealed for a long time to come. Already, the teenagers in my family can fly on android and iOS, get what they want done on it, and don't bother that much with the desktops at all. Their digital world is android and iOS, and windows, Mac OS etc. is becoming an after thought. just a matter of time before these free OS' take over, and with the power and money google and apple have, you can bet they will be pushing the demise of windows hard. and yes, i know android has a long way to go, ditto for iOS before being able to do all we want as a computer system, especially the accessible stuff, but you can bet your bottom dollar a large chunk of folks will be running android or a variant of it on their main systems before the decade is out. so to that end, you guys abandoning windows and going with linux are in the same boat as everyone else, the only difference is your efforts will probably have a shorter shelf life than anything jim has put out, barring the ocasional ports and emulations on next gen operating systems. having said all that, i've spent considerable time and efort on my games for windows, and i'm confident there are quite a few years of enjoyment to be had from them in the accessible community. bottom line, nobody is getting rich off accessible games, if you want to program them in vb 6, or aim them at macs and linux, or whatever, as long as your enjoying it, go for it, and don't let anyone else throw a wet blanket on what your doing. the digital landscape is covered in ice, who knows for sure where we're headed, but there is no point in slamming anyone else for how they choose to bring their digital creations into this world, we need all the creative minds we can get in the accessible gaming community, thats the important part, not the tools your using. Later, Che, AKA The Swami --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Willem, Yeah, unfortunately you are right. Using emulators work to a point, but they always have problems too. The issue with Shades of Doom crashing on wine is a prime example. I've seen similar issues with other accessible games under wine and its certainly frustrating. And the issue isn't just wine either. I use an Atari 2600 emulator called Stella and not every single Atari 2600 game will operate correctly with Stella. I've had weird things happen like the graphics appear screwed up on screen, games freeze for no reason in the middle of game play, and things like that. If that happens with a rather simpl game like Pacman how can we expect modern games to fair any better as we try to maintain playing/using them on more modern PCs via emulation. On 6/9/11, dwill...@gmail.com dwill...@gmail.com wrote: That is what happened to many dos games. People simply stopped playing them because it was too hard to run them. There is always emulation, but to mention an example, running a game like shades of doom under wine is a no go, because the game crashes when you open a door. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Damien, You are right. What all of this does come down to is personal preference. Which is always what is the real issue behind the arguments being made here on list. My preferences obviously aren't the same as Jim, Jeremy, etc and my reasons for not using VB 6 are more valid taken in my personal context rather than theirs. Fir instance, you said you didn't like Windows Vista. Since the user interface in Windows 7 is exactly the same as Vista I doubt you would like it any better. As for myself I like the U.I. changes in Windows 7 over XP, but there are things I don't like such as the 3d arrow interface that eats 1 GB of ram and slows a 3.6 GHZ system way down to the speed of perhaps a 1 GHZ system just to run all that extra graphical animations and so on. So while I do like the changes in U.I. I certainly don't appreciate giving over more ram and processor power to run it though. Weather Windows 7 is better or worse than XP is purely a matter of point of view. On 6/9/11, Damien C. Pendleton dam...@x-sight-interactive.net wrote: Hi Tom, It's all just a matter of personal preference, in my opinion. Computers aren't half as fun without any games. To be honest I'm not a big Windows fan myself, but it's what I'm used to and have been brought up with. After playing with a copy of Vinux and a friend's Mac I came to the conclusion that I'd be better sticking with Windows. Not only from a games point of view, but interfaces, development, familiarity etc. Even after playing around with a Vista computer I didn't like that as much as XP. I can't speak for Windows 7 since I have never tried it, but if a game that I spent a lot of time playing didn't work on Windows 7 I wouldn't even consider upgrading. Most of my days are spent playing if not making games, therefore I'd be lost if I upgraded and a game didn't work as expected. Just because I make my own games doesn't mean that I'm going to stop playing games that Liam, Justin, David, Phil etc have come out with just because they use VB6 or an old language that only supports old systems. I'd rather have as many games to play as possible than forfeit them just because I may want to upgrade to a better system. Now if a game was updated and for whatever reason it didn't support XP, then I may have to purchase a second machine to run Windows 7 just so that I can play that game. But I would probably use my XP machine as my main one, at least until I got fully accustomed to my Windows 7 one and I was sure that all my favourite games would work on it. Regards, Damien. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine
Cool. You could already try out editing the mapData.txt, mapDataObjects.txt and mapDataNPC.txt files if you want to just play around with my thing..? Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message - From: Harmony Neil harmon...@googlemail.com To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2011 4:36 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine Nice. I'm also starting to make a very basic text adventure thing, so let me know if you need any help. -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Jacob Kruger Sent: 09 June 2011 10:34 To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine Thanks, Harmony, and, yes, while the primary development machine for this thing has been a windows7 32 bit machine, my other primary machine is also a windows7 64 bit machine, but it does also have all the other MS dev tools on it, so wasn't too sure about it running on other machines easily enough - thanks again. Stay well Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' - Original Message --- Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine From: Harmony Neil harmon...@googlemail.com Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 10:15:18 +0100 To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Hellow, I've just tested the .exe file on my computer and it runs fine on this windows7 64 bit machine. Hope that helps, Harmony. -Original Message- From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Jacob Kruger Sent: 08 June 2011 21:29 To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: [Audyssey] Test version of RPG engine If you want to try this out, and let me know if the python to executable plugin has worked at all in making this an actual command line executable for windows machines, you can download the following: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13327195/mapData.zip (roundabout 4Mb) In there it would be best to currently run mapData.exe from an actual command line since I see it sort of throws away the last, outro message if you succeed on the quest as such, and while am busy putting in a way to actually hide the contents of your mission's data files, you'll see that there are some text files there that provide the information/background for the whole (small) thing: mapData.txt mapDataObjects.txt mapDataNPC.txt While might try explaining the contents of those files a bit better later on, there are sort of comments in there, that should make some sense, and the primary initial thing I'd like to know/find out is if this executable can run on many windows machines at all as such, since while it includes the MS C runtimes needed for some things, I do have full versions of visual studio.net installed on all my machines as such, so not 100% sure what will happen on all machines, but anyway. Also, haven't gotten around to trying to generate forms of executables for other platforms as of yet, but let's see if even this will work for real first. The basic command set is the following, but you can also be prompted this during game play by just typing in something like ? and hitting enter: N, S, E, W, U and D - all directional commands - and last 2 are up and down T and P - take and put, followed by item/object name C - communicate with an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter V - commit violence on an NPC - you'll be offered a list of possibles after typing this and hitting enter L - look or when combined with an item name, it gives you the details - if you've already picked it up X - exit R - review travel directions available H - review your health I - review your inventory Might have forgotten some as of now, and there might be various bugs in this code, etc., but would still like to know if usable at all as such, and only other trick is in a new location, you'll need to look for something before knowing if it's there to take as such. This is also just currently generating command line output, but on windows anyway, I can also tell it to talk using some screenreaders, or sapi etc. at some stage. Lastly, there are 2 of the items you'll need to pick up and go and place in other locations/areas to finish off this test mission - and that's as far as will go for now...smile Jacob Kruger Blind Biker Skype: BlindZA '...fate had broken his body, but not his spirit...' --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Well it seems that while I've been sleeping, this argument over programming languages has flared up once again. It seems like this happens at some point each month, and that is exactly why some of my fellow VB6 users view it as attacks rather than suggestions. In other aspects of life, you've undoubtedly had someone disagree with you about something, and they felt compelled to share their view in an effort to get you to do things their way. That's normal, and should be expected during life. If you listened to their opinion, but stuck to your own, at what point does it become inappropriate for them to bring it up again and again? Perhaps you'll listen to the same arguments 3 or 4 times, but when the other person is compelled to repeatedly push their opinion on you, it becomes a hostile situation. I'm not writing this to any one specific individual, so please let me make that clear. This is being written, generally, to the long list of people who are still pushing the same views after months and months. Actually, this has probably been going on for a lot longer, but I haven't been on audyssey for very long. I want to dispel this idea that we VB6 users are only using it because we don't know any other languages. I feel that view paints us as ignorant programmers who are only rejecting your view because we don't know any better. This is not the case, and I, for one, happen to know just as many languages as the people who don't want me using VB6. Admittedly I would be rusty with most of them, since I haven't used them in years, but I prefer to be viewed as a peer rather than a programming novice who isn't experienced enough to know what's best for him. From my experience, there is a stereotypical progression in how programmers think. When they start out, they stick to what they know because it is all they know. Like a child clinging to pool floaties, it is scary to first venture away from what is keeping you safe. As the programmers begins learning more, they become excited by everything that's out there, and so they quickly begin learning everything they can about everything! This is usually when a programmer will fill their belt with several programming languages they have learned to use. When they've branched out sufficiently, they begin to see the need to narrow their focus back down, and so they will use friends and society to form strong opinions about why one/some languages and methods are superior. This becomes their justification for abandoning their previous way of thinking, and often leads programmers to become so opinionated that they will attack others who do not agree with them. The programmers in this category, and believe me I've known more than I'd like to, defend their views with the same level of passion you see on protest picket lines, political debates, and religious arguments. Personally I think it is a terrible shame, but programmers or not, people are still people, and people suck. Like an old person who eventually stops caring what other people think, sooner or later programmers break out of their opinionated shell. When you are so passionate about a single view, you may be able to admit their is another side, but you can't ever weigh it in in an unbiased way. A person who is stuck focused on compatibility issues is going to view everything through those goggles. For my fellow VB6 programmers, we simply have to accept that everything and anything we say will be viewed from that perspective and we stand no chance in changing it. Countless times in movies we see the diplomat and the war general facing some situation. No matter how events unfold, good or bad, the diplomat will twist it and view it as an opportunity to grow and build relationships, and the war general will twist and view it as a trap or security risk. These are common examples of how people all into a particular way of thinking and are then trapped to interpret all situations in that way. While the movies entertain us with the conflict between those characters, and how they each view each situation so differently, but in the end neither is able to change the other. They simply have to accept how each other are. The people who are focused on compatibility are not going to be swayed. The VB6 users who have already heard opinions about changing, yet remained firm, are not going to be swayed by those same arguments revived a month later. We have to stop trying to convince each other to change, since each perspective has value and needs to be present for a healthy overall community. I believe it is important for me to focus on rapid development, but I don't constantly post long messages telling other developers that taking 6 months on a game is unnecessary. I could easily push my own opinion onto others, but I have long ago moved past the drive to do so. If my personal views put importance on rapid
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Jeremy. You completely missed my point. As an end user, I don't care if you use smoke signals to code your games, as long as I can run them on a normal pc. Up to now it has usually been possible, all be it with a little effort in some cases. I really like all your games. I spent hours on lunar animals alone the past weeks, not to mention the other free games from Jim Kitchen that I would hate to lose, but if they don't work, they don't work and that's where what language you use becomes the end user's problem, as I won't be able to run your games if I get a new arm-based pc for christmas. That is only half of the issue. I spent hundreds of dollars on non-free audio games which will also stop working in the immediate future from what I can deduce from the information microsoft have been releasing the passed while. Again, it has nothing to do with you or the language that you chose to use, and everything to do with incompatibility. Please stop being oversensitive. On 6/9/11, Jeremy Kaldobsky jer...@kaldobsky.com wrote: Well it seems that while I've been sleeping, this argument over programming languages has flared up once again. It seems like this happens at some point each month, and that is exactly why some of my fellow VB6 users view it as attacks rather than suggestions. In other aspects of life, you've undoubtedly had someone disagree with you about something, and they felt compelled to share their view in an effort to get you to do things their way. That's normal, and should be expected during life. If you listened to their opinion, but stuck to your own, at what point does it become inappropriate for them to bring it up again and again? Perhaps you'll listen to the same arguments 3 or 4 times, but when the other person is compelled to repeatedly push their opinion on you, it becomes a hostile situation. I'm not writing this to any one specific individual, so please let me make that clear. This is being written, generally, to the long list of people who are still pushing the same views after months and months. Actually, this has probably been going on for a lot longer, but I haven't been on audyssey for very long. I want to dispel this idea that we VB6 users are only using it because we don't know any other languages. I feel that view paints us as ignorant programmers who are only rejecting your view because we don't know any better. This is not the case, and I, for one, happen to know just as many languages as the people who don't want me using VB6. Admittedly I would be rusty with most of them, since I haven't used them in years, but I prefer to be viewed as a peer rather than a programming novice who isn't experienced enough to know what's best for him. From my experience, there is a stereotypical progression in how programmers think. When they start out, they stick to what they know because it is all they know. Like a child clinging to pool floaties, it is scary to first venture away from what is keeping you safe. As the programmers begins learning more, they become excited by everything that's out there, and so they quickly begin learning everything they can about everything! This is usually when a programmer will fill their belt with several programming languages they have learned to use. When they've branched out sufficiently, they begin to see the need to narrow their focus back down, and so they will use friends and society to form strong opinions about why one/some languages and methods are superior. This becomes their justification for abandoning their previous way of thinking, and often leads programmers to become so opinionated that they will attack others who do not agree with them. The programmers in this category, and believe me I've known more than I'd like to, defend their views with the same level of passion you see on protest picket lines, political debates, and religious arguments. Personally I think it is a terrible shame, but programmers or not, people are still people, and people suck. Like an old person who eventually stops caring what other people think, sooner or later programmers break out of their opinionated shell. When you are so passionate about a single view, you may be able to admit their is another side, but you can't ever weigh it in in an unbiased way. A person who is stuck focused on compatibility issues is going to view everything through those goggles. For my fellow VB6 programmers, we simply have to accept that everything and anything we say will be viewed from that perspective and we stand no chance in changing it. Countless times in movies we see the diplomat and the war general facing some situation. No matter how events unfold, good or bad, the diplomat will twist it and view it as an opportunity to grow and build relationships, and the war general will twist and view it as a trap or security risk. These are common examples of how people all into a
[Audyssey] Help trying to connect to core exiles using miranda
Hi all, Are there any core exiles players on here that use the irc channel for ce chat? If so then can someone please help me to connect to ce chat using miranda? I can't seem to get it to work at all. Many thanks in advance. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Jeremy, Very well written man, one of the best emails i've seen on here in a long time. I agree that everyone is entitled to their opinions and all that, but what bugs me about the preaching from on high attitude regarding programming languages is the attacks on other languages and methods and the fact that this might impact folks trying to get started with programming in a negative way. in the recent discussion about python, some folks painted python in a way that made it seem like nothing serious could be done with it, which is just total crap. As the famous quote goes, your entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts. to discourage folks from learning what may be a great system for them because you personally don't like it is something that just shouldn't happen on this list in my opinion, especially since this list seems to have a lot of bright young minds on it that are anxious to learn more about programming, and who knows, one of them might end up making a killer game that helps us get away from a mind set that most accessible games need to be modeled on 25 year old arcade games. later, che --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Very good post, Willem. As you said, the problem with VB6 isn't that it's a bad programming language. The problem is that people can't play the games. It doesn't matter that VB6 is a great platform. It doesn't matter that developers have dev tools and big libraries and tons of experience with it. It doesn't matter that the games are free. What matters is that people can't play the games, and that every year there will be fewer and fewer people who can play them. Developers have three options: 1) Do nothing and watch the number of players dwindle to zero; 2) Write emulators and/or libraries to allow the games to work on new platforms; 3) Change languages. All the other arguments are irrelevant. Dennis Towne Alter Aeon MUD On Thu, Jun 9, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Willem Venter dwill...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Jeremy. You completely missed my point. As an end user, I don't care if you use smoke signals to code your games, as long as I can run them on a normal pc. Up to now it has usually been possible, all be it with a little effort in some cases. I really like all your games. I spent hours on lunar animals alone the past weeks, not to mention the other free games from Jim Kitchen that I would hate to lose, but if they don't work, they don't work and that's where what language you use becomes the end user's problem, as I won't be able to run your games if I get a new arm-based pc for christmas. That is only half of the issue. I spent hundreds of dollars on non-free audio games which will also stop working in the immediate future from what I can deduce from the information microsoft have been releasing the passed while. Again, it has nothing to do with you or the language that you chose to use, and everything to do with incompatibility. Please stop being oversensitive. On 6/9/11, Jeremy Kaldobsky jer...@kaldobsky.com wrote: Well it seems that while I've been sleeping, this argument over programming languages has flared up once again. It seems like this happens at some point each month, and that is exactly why some of my fellow VB6 users view it as attacks rather than suggestions. In other aspects of life, you've undoubtedly had someone disagree with you about something, and they felt compelled to share their view in an effort to get you to do things their way. That's normal, and should be expected during life. If you listened to their opinion, but stuck to your own, at what point does it become inappropriate for them to bring it up again and again? Perhaps you'll listen to the same arguments 3 or 4 times, but when the other person is compelled to repeatedly push their opinion on you, it becomes a hostile situation. I'm not writing this to any one specific individual, so please let me make that clear. This is being written, generally, to the long list of people who are still pushing the same views after months and months. Actually, this has probably been going on for a lot longer, but I haven't been on audyssey for very long. I want to dispel this idea that we VB6 users are only using it because we don't know any other languages. I feel that view paints us as ignorant programmers who are only rejecting your view because we don't know any better. This is not the case, and I, for one, happen to know just as many languages as the people who don't want me using VB6. Admittedly I would be rusty with most of them, since I haven't used them in years, but I prefer to be viewed as a peer rather than a programming novice who isn't experienced enough to know what's best for him. From my experience, there is a stereotypical progression in how programmers think. When they start out, they stick to what they know because it is all they know. Like a child clinging to pool floaties, it is scary to first venture away from what is keeping you safe. As the programmers begins learning more, they become excited by everything that's out there, and so they quickly begin learning everything they can about everything! This is usually when a programmer will fill their belt with several programming languages they have learned to use. When they've branched out sufficiently, they begin to see the need to narrow their focus back down, and so they will use friends and society to form strong opinions about why one/some languages and methods are superior. This becomes their justification for abandoning their previous way of thinking, and often leads programmers to become so opinionated that they will attack others who do not agree with them. The programmers in this category, and believe me I've known more than I'd like to, defend their views with the same level of passion you see on protest picket lines, political debates, and religious arguments. Personally I think it is a terrible shame, but programmers or not, people are still people, and people suck. Like an old person who eventually stops caring what other people think, sooner or later
[Audyssey] Links for Old Titles
Hey everyone, As previously mentioned, I have modified the old games to state they are abandonware and have therefore offered them for temporary download using Dropbox. They will be up until Monday 13th June, so anyone who wants to host them on a more permanent site may download them during these times and do so. The games and their links are as follows: The Savage Gamut: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5285041/gamut.exe Note: Includes the Savage Gamut, Savage Gamut Redemption and Savage Gamut Trainer all in one package. It lets you customise the installation to include or exclude any one of these titles from being installed. Danger City: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5285041/dc02.exe Acefire: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5285041/acefire20setup.exe Self Destruct: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5285041/selfdest.exe Note: Also installs the keygen to the correct location and provides access in the start menu. All games have been modified in the following ways: 1. References to the personal or business names of developers have been removed wherever possible from the game executables and documentation. 2. The installers clearly state that they are abandonware before installation to give the user chance to exit or continue as they wish. 3. All reported and known issues have been well documented. 4. The Self Destruct and Savage Gamut installers have been completely rewritten, in order to make them neater and easier for maintenance by the end user. For example, the Savage Gamut packages are now in one customisable package, Self Destruct installs cleanly, the uninstaller also works as opposed to the last version, etc. 5. A couple of minor details have also been modified in the Acefire application and a few bugs were fixed before final release. Hope this helps. Regards, Damien. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
I understand that the issue is about users being able to play the game. For many years, since Microsoft first stopped supporting VB6, people have been saying that any day no one will be able to use software written with it. Obviously with each passing year this gets closer to the truth, but we have different opinions on the seriousness of this problem right now. As I've said, when things change, I'll re-evaluate my position on the languages I use. You're probably right that the next generation of windows won't support VB6 at all, but then again, you might be wrong. Before Vista released, many people told me that it would be impossible to run VB6 applications on it, and it didn't turn out that way. It's entirely possible that some small change will allow VB6 apps to run on Windows X, just as it has allowed Windows Vista and Windows 7 users to run them. If not, then that's life and we will deal with the new situation. We are both playing a guessing game, clearly some of you guess that all VB6 titles will be lost forever, and I am guessing that probably won't be the case, or at least I'm not so convinced that I'm willing to change how I'm currently doing things. Dennis, when you say people can't play the games, I assume you mean the theoretical date when some new windows absolutely can't run VB6 games. As things stand at the moment, I'm unaware of any version of windows (2000 and later) that can't run VB6 games. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] Registering Self Destruct was:Re: Links for Old Titles
Hi everyone, I know these games are no longer supported, but I wanted to see if anyone has any idea on how to fix this error. I reinstalled the new version of Self Destruct with the Key Gen in the start menu, and I keep getting this error when I click on it: Error There was an error with your product ID. The game cannot continue. The product ID does not exist. keygen Run-time error '424':Object required Does anyone have any idea on how to fix this? I'd really like the full version of the game. I don't understand why I can't get it to work. -- Original Message -- From: Damien C. Pendleton dam...@x-sight-interactive.net To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] Links for Old Titles Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 22:02:05 +0100 Hey everyone, As previously mentioned, I have modified the old games to state they are abandonware and have therefore offered them for temporary download using Dropbox. They will be up until Monday 13th June, so anyone who wants to host them on a more permanent site may download them during these times and do so. The games and their links are as follows: The Savage Gamut: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5285041/gamut.exe Note: Includes the Savage Gamut, Savage Gamut Redemption and Savage Gamut Trainer all in one package. It lets you customise the installation to include or exclude any one of these titles from being installed. Danger City: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5285041/dc02.exe Acefire: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5285041/acefire20setup.exe Self Destruct: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5285041/selfdest.exe Note: Also installs the keygen to the correct location and provides access in the start menu. All games have been modified in the following ways: 1. References to the personal or business names of developers have been removed wherever possible from the game executables and documentation. 2. The installers clearly state that they are abandonware before installation to give the user chance to exit or continue as they wish. 3. All reported and known issues have been well documented. 4. The Self Destruct and Savage Gamut installers have been completely rewritten, in order to make them neater and easier for maintenance by the end user. For example, the Savage Gamut packages are now in one customisable package, Self Destruct installs cleanly, the uninstaller also works as opposed to the last version, etc. 5. A couple of minor details have also been modified in the Acefire application and a few bugs were fixed before final release. Hope this helps. Regards, Damien. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. Groupon#8482 Official Site 1 ridiculously huge coupon a day. Get 50-90% off your city#39;s best! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/4df14961491e3e8bf6st02vuc --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Registering Self Destruct was:Re: Links for Old Titles
Hey Ryan, This is one of those issues that have been reported to me in the documentation. As I said, I believe in the docs and on list, I don't have the reg system nor key generation code and therefore was unable to fix it. In fact, due to the fact that Jason obviously deliberately failed to provide the reg system, and not so wisely also failed to remove all references from the code and the project file itself, I have been unable to get the game to compile or run at all, therefore the source code as was given to me is utterly useless. Regards, Damien. - Original Message - From: Ryan Conroy staindadd...@juno.com To: gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2011 11:28 PM Subject: [Audyssey] Registering Self Destruct was:Re: Links for Old Titles Hi everyone, I know these games are no longer supported, but I wanted to see if anyone has any idea on how to fix this error. I reinstalled the new version of Self Destruct with the Key Gen in the start menu, and I keep getting this error when I click on it: Error There was an error with your product ID. The game cannot continue. The product ID does not exist. keygen Run-time error '424':Object required Does anyone have any idea on how to fix this? I'd really like the full version of the game. I don't understand why I can't get it to work. -- Original Message -- From: Damien C. Pendleton dam...@x-sight-interactive.net To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] Links for Old Titles Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2011 22:02:05 +0100 Hey everyone, As previously mentioned, I have modified the old games to state they are abandonware and have therefore offered them for temporary download using Dropbox. They will be up until Monday 13th June, so anyone who wants to host them on a more permanent site may download them during these times and do so. The games and their links are as follows: The Savage Gamut: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5285041/gamut.exe Note: Includes the Savage Gamut, Savage Gamut Redemption and Savage Gamut Trainer all in one package. It lets you customise the installation to include or exclude any one of these titles from being installed. Danger City: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5285041/dc02.exe Acefire: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5285041/acefire20setup.exe Self Destruct: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5285041/selfdest.exe Note: Also installs the keygen to the correct location and provides access in the start menu. All games have been modified in the following ways: 1. References to the personal or business names of developers have been removed wherever possible from the game executables and documentation. 2. The installers clearly state that they are abandonware before installation to give the user chance to exit or continue as they wish. 3. All reported and known issues have been well documented. 4. The Self Destruct and Savage Gamut installers have been completely rewritten, in order to make them neater and easier for maintenance by the end user. For example, the Savage Gamut packages are now in one customisable package, Self Destruct installs cleanly, the uninstaller also works as opposed to the last version, etc. 5. A couple of minor details have also been modified in the Acefire application and a few bugs were fixed before final release. Hope this helps. Regards, Damien. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. Groupon#8482 Official Site 1 ridiculously huge coupon a day. Get 50-90% off your city#39;s best! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/4df14961491e3e8bf6st02vuc --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list,
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Are there games that are designed to be played using DOS that absolutely cannot be played on most systems? How long ago was it said that DOS would be no more? How about a paperless society with the advent of being able to send files to one another? We now use more paper than ever before. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. - Original Message - From: Jeremy Kaldobsky jer...@kaldobsky.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2011 4:24 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b I understand that the issue is about users being able to play the game. For many years, since Microsoft first stopped supporting VB6, people have been saying that any day no one will be able to use software written with it. Obviously with each passing year this gets closer to the truth, but we have different opinions on the seriousness of this problem right now. As I've said, when things change, I'll re-evaluate my position on the languages I use. You're probably right that the next generation of windows won't support VB6 at all, but then again, you might be wrong. Before Vista released, many people told me that it would be impossible to run VB6 applications on it, and it didn't turn out that way. It's entirely possible that some small change will allow VB6 apps to run on Windows X, just as it has allowed Windows Vista and Windows 7 users to run them. If not, then that's life and we will deal with the new situation. We are both playing a guessing game, clearly some of you guess that all VB6 titles will be lost forever, and I am guessing that probably won't be the case, or at least I'm not so convinced that I'm willing to change how I'm currently doing things. Dennis, when you say people can't play the games, I assume you mean the theoretical date when some new windows absolutely can't run VB6 games. As things stand at the moment, I'm unaware of any version of windows (2000 and later) that can't run VB6 games. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] from an end user - Re: disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
I might get some geeky answers to this, and I might not. Anyway, this whole issue about what programming language should or should not be used, and why or why not, is interesting to me, but might not be to others. What it boils down to, to me, is this: A program, or in this case a computer game, is what? It's a set of instructions that the programmer wants a computer to read, process, and follow based on the commands given by the end user. Does the end user care about the language used to instruct their computer? No. The end user cares about whether their computer does or does not interpret the programmer's instructions correctly. Does this game, regardless of how it was written operate as it should on my computer? That's what counts. If a programmer writes programs that won't work on my PC, I'm not going to want more programs from that programmer. The industry dictates that I buy a new machine that is capable of using the most up to date operating system, and now all the games I have spent my money on, and the games I have gotten at no charge won't work on the newest technology. So, I buy the new PC. What about all this fun software of the past? It's obsolete. It's useless. Now, games are designed to work with Windows 7, which I have. Will they work on Windows 12 10 years from now? Here we go again. And it doesn't stop. I don't think that Shoot #'97 would work on the PC I currently have. It was a fun game, though. Wouldn't it be great if there were such a program as a language converter that could translate a program that won't work on your new system into something that would? There are so many programming languages, each with it's good and bad points, you probably couldn't handle them all. But how about the most commonly used ones for running on Windows 98, XP, and Windows 7? Oops, there are more and more Mac users all the time, and that other open source OS that I never can remember the spelling of. Linnex? There's the compatibility issue. This message was longer than intended. I gotta relax. Now, where's that nineteenth beta of MOTA! Whew! Good thing I've got it! --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. - Original Message - From: Jeremy Kaldobsky jer...@kaldobsky.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2011 11:14 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b Well it seems that while I've been sleeping, this argument over programming languages has flared up once again. It seems like this happens at some point each month, and that is exactly why some of my fellow VB6 users view it as attacks rather than suggestions. In other aspects of life, you've undoubtedly had someone disagree with you about something, and they felt compelled to share their view in an effort to get you to do things their way. That's normal, and should be expected during life. If you listened to their opinion, but stuck to your own, at what point does it become inappropriate for them to bring it up again and again? Perhaps you'll listen to the same arguments 3 or 4 times, but when the other person is compelled to repeatedly push their opinion on you, it becomes a hostile situation. I'm not writing this to any one specific individual, so please let me make that clear. This is being written, generally, to the long list of people who are still pushing the same views after months and months. Actually, this has probably been going on for a lot longer, but I haven't been on audyssey for very long. I want to dispel this idea that we VB6 users are only using it because we don't know any other languages. I feel that view paints us as ignorant programmers who are only rejecting your view because we don't know any better. This is not the case, and I, for one, happen to know just as many languages as the people who don't want me using VB6. Admittedly I would be rusty with most of them, since I haven't used them in years, but I prefer to be viewed as a peer rather than a programming novice who isn't experienced enough to know what's best for him. From my experience, there is a stereotypical progression in how programmers think. When they start out, they stick to what they know because it is all they know. Like a child clinging to pool floaties, it is scary to first venture away from what is keeping you safe. As the programmers begins learning more, they become excited by everything that's out there, and so they quickly begin learning everything they can about everything! This is usually when a programmer will fill their belt with several programming languages they have learned to use. When they've branched out sufficiently, they begin to see the need to narrow their focus back down, and so they will use friends and society to form strong opinions about why one/some languages and methods are superior.
Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi Charles and Jeremy. Charles, on the new windows 7 machines, some dos programs stop working or have random errors. This is because the machine's architecture have changed too much to run them like a normal program. A dos mode is emulated by the machine, which doesn't always give the expected results, as there as so many things that could go wrong with an emulation. Jeremy, it's not a question if it won't work, I'm telling you visual basic applications won't work on any arm-based machine as things stand. This is because arm processors use a different instruction set that is not compattible with intel's x86 or x64 instruction set. I'm pretty sure microsoft won't recompile the visual basic libraries. They already refused to include the vb libraries in windows 7 even though they were compatible. On 6/9/11, Charles Rivard woofer...@sbcglobal.net wrote: Are there games that are designed to be played using DOS that absolutely cannot be played on most systems? How long ago was it said that DOS would be no more? How about a paperless society with the advent of being able to send files to one another? We now use more paper than ever before. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. - Original Message - From: Jeremy Kaldobsky jer...@kaldobsky.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2011 4:24 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] disrespect for gamers: was Re: Lunimals version 2.5b I understand that the issue is about users being able to play the game. For many years, since Microsoft first stopped supporting VB6, people have been saying that any day no one will be able to use software written with it. Obviously with each passing year this gets closer to the truth, but we have different opinions on the seriousness of this problem right now. As I've said, when things change, I'll re-evaluate my position on the languages I use. You're probably right that the next generation of windows won't support VB6 at all, but then again, you might be wrong. Before Vista released, many people told me that it would be impossible to run VB6 applications on it, and it didn't turn out that way. It's entirely possible that some small change will allow VB6 apps to run on Windows X, just as it has allowed Windows Vista and Windows 7 users to run them. If not, then that's life and we will deal with the new situation. We are both playing a guessing game, clearly some of you guess that all VB6 titles will be lost forever, and I am guessing that probably won't be the case, or at least I'm not so convinced that I'm willing to change how I'm currently doing things. Dennis, when you say people can't play the games, I assume you mean the theoretical date when some new windows absolutely can't run VB6 games. As things stand at the moment, I'm unaware of any version of windows (2000 and later) that can't run VB6 games. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] Lunimals version 2.5b
Hi jeremy, Agree. If you focussed on keeping up with the so call best programming language, you will end up writing and rewriting mission 1 and will never move on. Your news update on Lunimals will not be new missions available. it would be what programming language you changed to for whatever reason instead. We gamers will be playing mission 1 over and over again for years to try out the results of the same game in different programming language. Enough examples of that. Btw, I'm halfway through mission 10 now. Thanks for the great game. Steady Goh - Original Message - From: Jeremy Kaldobsky jer...@kaldobsky.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Wednesday, June 08, 2011 12:11 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Lunimals version 2.5b If we all focused on what the next operating system will be, what the next popular devices will be, or what the next popular programming language will be, it would take 10 times longer to produce any games. I think there are enough examples of this exact thought process to prove my point. We do! need some people to be thinking that way, but you also need people who worry more about here and now. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
