the major issue I see in this is how to get the blind to play.
Its fine with the new gen of blind, ie those born in say the last 10 years
say 2000 up or even 1995 or 1993 up, but anyone in the older generation
which a lot are, have been used to blind games that will do everything
because they
: Sunday, March 20, 2011 12:27 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Shaun,
I take your point about cost and space, and am well aware of those as
issues for many blind gamers.
For instance, you mention not having enough space for 5.1 speakers and
would have to stack them. The problem
Yeah and thats not cheap.
Currently I am sorting out a good mic solution for my brother who
needs it for draggon.
He can't afford it even in our currency.
So its cracked right now.
I am desperately looking for a price which is not 330 bucks which is
what he needs.
I have managed to save 80 on
the issue of this ofcause is how to keep the gamer interested in the
game after they fail.
Most of us are likely to cheat, try to make the game legally or
otherwise playable or just leave it all together and or loose confordence.
Its for this reason I havn't managed to beat superliam.
I have
the major issue I see in this is how to get the blind to play.
Its fine with the new gen of blind, ie those born in say the last 10
years say 2000 up or even 1995 or 1993 up, but anyone in the older
generation which a lot are, have been used to blind games that will
do everything because they
Well I never have got use to coords systems or even degrees on compas
propperly.
I can guess but am not used to that.
At 08:42 a.m. 18/03/2011, you wrote:
Hi Tom.
no, that isn't actually what I was thinking at all.
imagine a system of coordinates, and you are on a ledge at 3-2, but
here
well ofcause all the challenge is how to put what is mostly graphics
into sound and eventually we may get some or all of it but it will
take time and skill.
At 06:31 a.m. 19/03/2011, you wrote:
Hi Damien,
Well, it all comes back to what I said earlier on list. What you call
advanced is what
Hi,
Yes, temperarily. As I just mentioned to dark beta 18 is practically
ready for release, and I'd like to begin wrapping things up this week.
I'd rather not try and spend an extra week or two on rewriting the G3D
targeting code to add a 2d look up/down feature when I can disable the
existing
Hi Shaun,
I take your point about cost and space, and am well aware of those as
issues for many blind gamers.
For instance, you mention not having enough space for 5.1 speakers and
would have to stack them. The problem with that is you can't stack
those kinds of speakers and have them do what
I aggree.
- Original Message -
From: dark d...@xgam.org
To: Philip Bennefall phi...@blastbay.com; Gamers Discussion list
gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 8:15 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Philip.
these are actually some of the ideas I
Hi Tom.
funny enough that sounds like the same setup I have in my flat.
I will say though, despite having an extremely good set of logitech speakers
which my very hifi orientated friend and I picked out as the best choice
available, and which are wonderful for music and films, stil, if I
Hi Damien,
Oh, I see. That makes sense. It does help to know the technical
language being used. Otherwise whatever you are reading about doesn't
make any sense at all.
However, there are mailing lists etc for creative writers I've found
helpful over the years. There are some people on those
Hi Dark,
That's a good question and one I presently do not have an answer for.
As I said before I absolutely hate using pitch changes in some cases
because it totally changes the way the sound effect sounds ruining the
effect I'm aiming for. At the same time pressing m to speak the
location of
Hi Ken,
Have you looked at FMOD EX by any chanse? The reason I ask is because
FMOD Ex works with Visual Basic .Net and has an extremely good 3d
audio engine. It is regarded my many game developers to be the best
comercial sound engine/API on the market. For free games FMOD is free,
and comercial
] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Dark,
That's a good question and one I presently do not have an answer for.
As I said before I absolutely hate using pitch changes in some cases
because it totally changes the way the sound effect sounds ruining the
effect I'm aiming for. At the same time pressing m
Hi tom.
One idea which has occurred to me, is rather than changing the pitch of the
monster, you might have a sound which is played at the same time the as the
monsters' original sound and indicates it's position.
this wouldn't break up the game the way aa nearest monster2 speech key
would,
Hi Ken,
Yes, if you know what you are doing you can simulate a 3d effect
simply by using some calculations to position the sound in the stereo
field and to have the volume roll off correctly. A couple of years ago
I was looking at writing the Genesis 3D engine in Java. The only
problem was that
Hi Dark,
That’s my whole point. IN beta 18 the harpies are not on the same
level as you. To attack them you have to aim up to shoot one down as
they are actually flying and attacking from above you. They are not on
the ground on the same level as you. Not only that, but now that I
have activated
Hi Damien,
Well, it all comes back to what I said earlier on list. What you call
advanced is what most mainstream gamers would call normal. As I’ve
said many times there is a huge difference between accessible games
and mainstream games that is like the difference between night and
day. For a lot
, 2011 5:31 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Damien,
Well, it all comes back to what I said earlier on list. What you call
advanced is what most mainstream gamers would call normal. As I’ve
said many times there is a huge difference between accessible games
and mainstream
Hi Damien,
Ah, I see. Well, I’m no expert with guns etc either, but at least I’ve
seen them up close and have fired a few so have that much experience.
That said, it never hurts to do a little research on a topic, because
only by doing research will you be able to make the game act more
thomasward1...@gmail.com
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Friday, March 18, 2011 5:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Damien,
Ah, I see. Well, I’m no expert with guns etc either, but at least I’ve
seen them up close and have fired a few so have that much
Ah,
Too bad it won't work with vb.net. I've thought about porting Heli over but
there's no point unless I can get a better 3d engine than DX. I tried
experimenting with Openal, but I can't even install the thing--and if it is
installed, it doesn't like my hardware, and the software aspect
: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Ah,
Too bad it won't work with vb.net. I've thought about porting Heli over but
there's no point unless I can get a better 3d engine than DX. I tried
experimenting with Openal, but I can't even install the thing--and if it is
installed, it doesn't like my
to change enemies pitch or similar?
Beware the Grue!
Dark.
- Original Message -
From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Friday, March 18, 2011 4:29 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Dark,
That’s my whole
Personally tom, i'd love to see people be able to enjoy the sort of fun i do
everytime I fire up a game like Turrican, metroid or mega man in audio.
I've enjoyed them for years and stil do and will love to have exploration
platformers with multidirectional enemies.
Pluss this also means, if
Hi Dark,
That is quite a number of interesting points you raised here. I happen
to agree with you on all points. In fact, this is in large part why
Mysteries of the Ancients beta 18 is taking so long to release. I
decided to go back in and rewrite some of the various game mechanics
such as
Hi Philip,
Well, I for one, happen to feel the same way you do. I'd much prefer
some sort of audio feedback rather than always having a verbal message
saying this or that. It ruins the atmosphere and feel of the game for
me having Sapi or some other voice saying this or that all the time.
To: Philip Bennefall phi...@blastbay.com; Gamers Discussion list
gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2011 11:25 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Philip,
Well, I for one, happen to feel the same way you do. I'd much prefer
some sort of audio feedback rather than always
Hi Phil,
Smile. You are in luck. As it so happens running jumps have been one
of the requests I've actually gotten around to adding to MOTA in beta
18. If you use shift+control+left arrow or shift+control+right arrow
Angela will run up to a pit, spike trap, etc then jump over it. With
the new
Hi Philip,
Wow! Glad to hear it. It sounds like you are taking a page out of my
playbook with the min and max range for weapons. That's something I
have had in Mysteries of the Ancients for a long time now, and it
definitely changes the strategy of the game somewhat. If you have a
shotgun you
Hi Dark,
Actually, there have been a few accessible games to use a true
analogue system for jumping. If you remember the original Montezuma's
Revenge written by Alchemy Game Studios used an analogue jump system.
For the life of me I can't remember why I didn't go ahead and use it
in the USA Games
Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2011 12:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Philip,
Wow! Glad to hear it. It sounds like you are taking a page out of my
playbook with the min and max range for weapons. That's something I
have had in Mysteries
Hi Dark,
Its funny that you brought this topic up as I think you and I have
been thinking on the same wave length lately. I've been considering
this same issue for a number of months, and I agree one thing
accessible games universally lack is realistic and dinamic movement.
In Q9, for example,
Hi Philip,
Smile. Oh, I wasn't accusing you of copying MOTA. I was merely
remarking/commenting on how glad I was that you were implamenting some
of the more advanced features/concepts I've used in developing my own
games. One thing I'm very interested in is realism. I.E. if you have a
shotgun you
Comfort!
The pleasant way to experience massage!
It's the Caring
without the Staring!
- Original Message -
From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2011 6:58 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi
...@blastbay.com; Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2011 1:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Philip,
Smile. Oh, I wasn't accusing you of copying MOTA. I was merely
remarking/commenting on how glad I was that you were implamenting some
of the more
Hi Tom.
Fantastic that a game is finally implementing this, in fact the lava ledge
jumping you describe very much resembles a section from the first bowser
castle in the first mario brothers.
I'll deffinately be looking forward to trying this.
As to difficulty, it'll be really nice to see
Hi Tom.
Actually, I've only tried alchemy monti a couple of times last year and each
time I got to a point where the game crashed (sinse the last usa games beta
I have is far more complete and playable), so gave up with it, so I never
noticed the analogue jumps.
I never played it at the
You can also use 3d audio to let you know if things are above or below you,
though you'll have to find something better the Directx for that. There is
a program called AM3D that is wonderful, being the same one used in the
Blind Eye--but you don't really get a feel for how awesome it is by
Hi tom.
Glad to here about the analogue system, but I do take the point regarding
pitch only going so far, however there is another fact to considder, namely
that of necessary information.
I do not have a wide field of vision, and need to sit fairly close to the tv
in order to see anything
Hi Philip.
this ai business sounds interesting certainly and I have seen occasions in
mainstream games where certain enemies used tactics based on the players'
actions and thus fought semi inteligently even going back to the nes era.
however, what I've tended to find in audio games is that
...@xgam.org
To: phi...@blastbay.com; Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2011 2:25 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Philip.
this ai business sounds interesting certainly and I have seen occasions in
mainstream games where certain enemies used
Hey now--those are some pretty smart animals--knowing what type of weapon
you have and what it does. I hate to see how devilishly smart your people
are! Evil Grins
Ken Downey
---
Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org
If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to
,
Damien.
- Original Message -
From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com
To: Philip Bennefall phi...@blastbay.com; Gamers Discussion list
gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2011 11:51 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Philip,
Wow! Glad to hear
Wow! Phil and Thomas making me looking forward to the release! I'm excited.
Tommy
- Original Message -
From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2011 5:58 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Philip,
Well, all I can say is you are right. Good high quality artificial
intelligence is something that has been sorely lacking in most audio
games to date. Of course, how advanced the artificial intelligence
needs to be is dependant on the style of game in question
For example, in Final
Hi Damien,
Well, what Philip and i are talking about isn't so much the mechanics
of guns, but simple logistics when firing them. If you have a shotgun
or rifle three feet long there is no way on earth you can point it at
a target one feet away because there is not enough room between you
and the
Hi Ken,
that's a big part of the problem though. Most VI gamers frankly don't
have the right hardware/software to do 3d audio properly. I know
XAudio2 is pretty good if you have a 5.1 surround sound set of
headphones and/or speakers, but there we go looking at $99 or more
just to obtain some
Hi Dark,
Oh, you noticed? Super Mario Brothers is exactly where I got the idea
for the lava pit from. Although, it doesn't appear in the demo since
the demo only goes to level 2. However, there are a number of
side-scrollers out there that have this style of jump onto a distant
ledge, then use
well I think pitches with tones, success bells and falier buzzes or
whatever could work.
if a game is arcade then you should have sfx of that machine for things.
At 01:30 a.m. 17/03/2011, you wrote:
Hi Philip.
I do agree that relying entirely upon numeric look commands is not
good, that's why
Hi Philip.
I'm afraid as an exploration fan and a fan of diverse enemies I myself would
rather like more attacks to avoid, giving each enemy something unique and
making something new for the player to adjust to in each level, then again I
also enjoy large areas to explore as well.
Certainly
Hi Tom.
oh come on, you can deffinately aime at a targit in front of you with a
three foot rifle, you just need extremly bendy elbows!
yes I can see it now, the new super heroe, Yoga man, no position too
complex, no contortion too hard, villains will bend to his superior double
Hi Tom.
no, that isn't actually what I was thinking at all.
imagine a system of coordinates, and you are on a ledge at 3-2, but here
nothing to the right of you, just a long pit.
However, if you activate the look up command, instead of hereing just that
pit to the right of you, you will
Hi Tom.
Funnily enough there is a very similar 2D version of that style of puzle in
junk man's stage in MEga man 7 for the Snes, where using one of Mega man's
weapons can cause metal bricks to fall down from the cieling into a pit of
liquid metal. Only problem is, they start sinking so you
HI Dark,
Oh, I see. As it happens MOTA does have a look up/down feature, but it
was disabled prior to beta 18. The problem I have with your idea is
that as you climb up/down ropes you actually need to here where the
dripping ledges are in relation to you as you climb. IN a case like
that looking
, March 17, 2011 6:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Damien,
Well, what Philip and i are talking about isn't so much the mechanics
of guns, but simple logistics when firing them. If you have a shotgun
or rifle three feet long there is no way on earth you can point
but this will probably turn things around for me as far as
gaming goes.
Regards,
Damien.
- Original Message -
From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2011 7:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Tom.
that is true regarding ropes, though with the harpies example I was going on
the basis that something flying above you is not at the same level as you
and thus cannot attack unless it's dropping bombs or similar.
At the moment, for all gameplay purposes the harpies seem to be on the
Hi dark.
I have read this with interest. I never quite thought about it in the way
you have described.
The thing is though I'm not entirely sure how you would get around that in
an audio medium. Visually you can judge when you jump and how high you jump.
But without adding extra sound into the
Hello Darren.
Actually thinking about it, you've probably hit the nail exactly on the
head.
You talk about showing in audio how far to jump say like in Jim's
golf game where your told what a shot is and then must judge the distance.
However, in a graphical game you are never told this
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 12:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hello Darren.
Actually thinking about it, you've probably hit the nail exactly on the
head.
You talk about showing in audio how far to jump say like in Jim's
golf game where your told what a shot
Hi Dark,
I would like to play a game with a feature such as a running jump.
For example you have a chasm that is too wide to jump normally from a
standing stop at the edge.
But you could jump it if your were running.
This would require an auto run feature so you don't have to hit a key to
Hi Philip.
these are actually some of the ideas I was very much thinking of, especially
the business about running.
I'll be interested to try this one when it's ready.
All the best,
Dark.
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Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Dark,
I would like to play a game with a feature such as a running jump.
For example you have a chasm that is too wide to jump normally from a
standing stop at the edge.
But you could jump it if your were running.
This would require an auto run
Hi Phil.
i agree this would be a good thing (though the business about damage for
over jumping seems unnecessarily harsh to me), but I think your over
complicating the situation more than it would need to be.
As I said, the relative width of pits could be shown by altering the pitch
of the
Hi Philip.
I do agree that relying entirely upon numeric look commands is not good,
that's why I think more could be done with pitch as an indicator, either
bying having relative wind sounds, or altering the sound denoting a certain
ledge or obstacle according to it's distance.
A look key
it but shut up if you don't need it.
Phil
- Original Message -
From: Philip Bennefall phi...@blastbay.com
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 8:18 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Phil,
I like this idea, but the thing
Yep, that's why I don't play too many games anymore. It's too much like
playing Bopit.
Ken Downey
President
DreamTechInteractive!
And,
Blind Comfort!
The pleasant way to experience massage!
It's the Caring
without the Staring!
- Original Message -
From: dark d...@xgam.org
To:
way to experience massage!
It's the Caring
without the Staring!
- Original Message -
From: darren harris darren_g_har...@btinternet.com
To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 7:38 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi dark.
I
!
- Original Message -
From: Philip Bennefall phi...@blastbay.com
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 8:07 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Dark,
In Q9 you do hear monsters from across pits etc, but as you say the
attacking
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 8:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Dark,
I would like to play a game with a feature such as a running jump.
For example you have a chasm that is too wide to jump normally from a
standing stop
:07 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Dark,
In Q9 you do hear monsters from across pits etc, but as you say the
attacking and jumping mechanics are quite flat. In my upcoming game I have
a very different setup. I have spent a lot of time on mechanics, such as
the fact
!
And,
Blind Comfort!
The pleasant way to experience massage!
It's the Caring
without the Staring!
- Original Message -
From: dark d...@xgam.org
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 8:25 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Phil.
i
to...@sirinet.net
To: Philip Bennefall phi...@blastbay.com; Gamers Discussion list
gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 10:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
On the Q9. That would be cool that you could unlock more characters each
one of them have different
@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 12:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hello Darren.
Actually thinking about it, you've probably hit the nail exactly on the
head.
You talk about showing in audio how far to jump say like in Jim's
golf game where your told what a shot
...@neo.rr.com
To: phi...@blastbay.com; Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 2:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hey Philip,
how about basing maximums speed reached on the number of hit points, the
type of shoes-boots being worn etc instead
: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 1:48 PM
Subject: Re: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
hi philip. how's the developed of this new game? we haven't eard
anything since last year, i know that you don't like giving rlease dates
and stuff, but the game is almost complete, or it will still take
Discussion list
gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 1:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hey Philip,
how about basing maximums speed reached on the number of hit points, the
type of shoes-boots being worn etc instead of the flat 5 steps?
Ken Downey
President
I like the one in q-9 when he goes hurrteling down to oblivian, it's a good
efect.
- Original Message -
From: Ken the Crazy kenwdow...@neo.rr.com
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 1:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 2:00 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
On the Q9. That would be cool that you could unlock more characters each
one of them have different story. That's would be awesome!
Tommy
- Original Message -
From: Philip Bennefall phi...@blastbay.com
in the way characters were
damaged tec didn't do this.
Beware the grue!
Dark.
- Original Message -
From: Philip Bennefall phi...@blastbay.com
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 2:10 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi Ken,
You only really have one type of boots and I am trying to avoid slowing
down the character's actions based on health. This is mainly because a few
injuries would give you such a serious
Hmmm ron.
I think you got the wrong end of the stick there.
I'm not talking about a game, but an aspect of gameplay, ie, the space
around your character.
You might considder having a look at the gamers list public archives for the
full discussion.
Beware the grue!
Dark.
---
Gamers
To: Philip Bennefall phi...@blastbay.com; Gamers Discussion list
gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 11:58 AM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
While I've seen some games that penalize an ability due to low health, eg,
taking a power up off you when you get hit, I think
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 2:17 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hmmm ron.
I think you got the wrong end of the stick there.
I'm not talking about a game, but an aspect of gameplay, ie, the space
around your character.
You might
To: Gamers Discussion list
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hmmm ron.
I think you got the wrong end of the stick there.
I'm not talking about a game, but an aspect of gameplay, ie, the space
around your character.
You might considder having a look at the gamers list public archives
To: Philip Bennefall; Gamers Discussion list
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Reviewing space in audio
Hi if it's better than q-9 then it'll be a knock out! As long as it's got
wepons Smile
- Original Message -
From: Philip Bennefall phi...@blastbay.com
To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org
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