Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Telmo Menezes
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 3:30 AM, LizR lizj...@gmail.com wrote: On 12 November 2013 14:04, Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com wrote: Every science whose conclusions have effects in politics has a high risk of being manipulated. In the URSS and here. From Anthropology to long term

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
Hi Telmo There maye have been a hint of sarcasm in my comment, to be honest. I don't think we will better the scientific method, although we may be able to improve how we implement it, as it were - the human part of the equation. But I'm glad I stimulated your interesting comments, anyway! --

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Alberto G. Corona
2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/11/2013 5:04 PM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: Every science whose conclusions have effects in politics has a high risk of being manipulated. In the URSS and here. From Anthropology to long term Meteorology to everything in the middle. The one that

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Alberto G. Corona
2013/11/12 LizR lizj...@gmail.com On 12 November 2013 14:04, Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com wrote: Every science whose conclusions have effects in politics has a high risk of being manipulated. In the URSS and here. From Anthropology to long term Meteorology to everything in the

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 12 Nov 2013, at 03:38, LizR wrote: On 12 November 2013 14:14, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/11/2013 4:29 PM, LizR wrote: On 12 November 2013 13:03, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/11/2013 3:39 PM, LizR wrote: On 12 November 2013 09:37, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 12 Nov 2013, at 04:35, LizR wrote: On 12 November 2013 16:03, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/11/2013 6:38 PM, LizR wrote: Benjamin Button lived his life in reverse. Oh, right, like the guy in Martin Amis' Time's Arrow (itself a rip off from An Age by Brian Aldiss).

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Telmo Menezes
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 10:36 AM, LizR lizj...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Telmo There maye have been a hint of sarcasm in my comment, to be honest. I suspected as much, but wanted to babble anyway :) I don't think we will better the scientific method, although we may be able to improve how we

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Alberto G. Corona
So what would you suggest as a replacement? The scientific method is, to paraphrase Winston Churchill on democracy, the worst system we have apart from all the others we've tried. Following your analogy. when the the media, and the politicians of majority parties form a coalition to defend their

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 12 Nov 2013, at 04:44, meekerdb wrote: Experience may be like that; everything has 'experience', it's just not human experience and when you stop having human experience you're dead. Why? If by dying we remember being something different from human, I would still feel like I am

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 12 Nov 2013, at 06:23, Chris de Morsella wrote: From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com ] On Behalf Of Bruno Marchal Sent: Monday, November 11, 2013 7:43 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Our Demon-Haunted World On 11 Nov

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Alberto G. Corona
To spudboy: Reason alone does`n move to anything, not even to knowledge. If you think that your passions are bad for looking for the truth, you are wrong. What you must say is that some passions are an obstacle for other higher passions, for example the passion of using the reason to reach the

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 12 Nov 2013, at 11:54, Alberto G. Corona wrote: So what would you suggest as a replacement? The scientific method is, to paraphrase Winston Churchill on democracy, the worst system we have apart from all the others we've tried. Following your analogy. when the the media, and the

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Jason Resch
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 7:14 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: Benjamin Button lived his life in reverse. So I'll ask you the same thing I asked Quentin, what's you inference from the fact you, and every body you've ever heard of died before reaching age 150? That observation is

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Jason Resch
Also, I found this related thread on QTI, archived by James Higgo, which took place on this list many years ago: http://higgo.com/qti/rplaga.htm Jason On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 9:19 AM, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote: On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 7:14 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Alberto G. Corona
2013/11/12 Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be On 12 Nov 2013, at 11:54, Alberto G. Corona wrote: So what would you suggest as a replacement? The scientific method is, to paraphrase Winston Churchill on democracy, the worst system we have apart from all the others we've tried. Following your

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread spudboy100
I agree and understand, Alberto, with your elegy. Mitch -Original Message- From: Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Nov 12, 2013 6:42 am Subject: Re: Our Demon-Haunted World To spudboy: Reason alone does`n move to

RE: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Chris de Morsella
Climategate a Fox News generated tempest in a teacup. Much ado about stupid human behavior in order to keep the focus off of the salient facts that global mean temperatures have been rising (within the backdrop of natural weather cycles, such as the El Nino oscillation); that global mean sea

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 2:37 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: Both with Comp and with Everett-QM we have lost that unique theoretical evidence, because our best current explanation (comp, or QM) makes that mind-brain identity non sensical. I don't see anything about QM that makes mind is what a brain does

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 2:50 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 12 Nov 2013, at 04:35, LizR wrote: On 12 November 2013 16:03, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/11/2013 6:38 PM, LizR wrote: Benjamin Button lived his life in reverse. Oh, right, like the

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 2:55 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 12 Nov 2013, at 04:44, meekerdb wrote: Experience may be like that; everything has 'experience', it's just not human experience and when you stop having human experience you're dead. Why? If by dying we remember being something different

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 4:14 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 12 Nov 2013, at 11:54, Alberto G. Corona wrote: So what would you suggest as a replacement? The scientific method is, to paraphrase Winston Churchill on democracy, the worst system we have apart from all the others we've tried. Following

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 7:19 AM, Jason Resch wrote: On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 7:14 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net wrote: Benjamin Button lived his life in reverse. So I'll ask you the same thing I asked Quentin, what's you inference from the fact you, and

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 10:24 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 7:19 AM, Jason Resch wrote: On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 7:14 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net wrote: Benjamin

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 10:24 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 7:19 AM, Jason Resch wrote: On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 7:14 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: Benjamin Button lived his life in

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 11:15 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 10:24 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 7:19 AM, Jason Resch

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 11:15 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 10:24 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 7:19 AM, Jason Resch wrote: On Mon, Nov 11,

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Alberto G. Corona
You said it: the calentological comunity, acting as a single entity, denied their data. to scientists with different points of view. That is not science. that is a sectarian organization that, because are working with public funding are breaking not only the law and the decency, but the last bit

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 11:30 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 11:15 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 10:24 AM, Quentin Anciaux

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 11:53 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: You said it: the calentological comunity, acting as a single entity, denied their data. to scientists with different points of view. But they didn't. They only discussed it and noted that some of the data didn't belong to them but had been

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Alberto G. Corona
Thus said, because there are eternal laws, there are eternal truths. For the materialists, Konrad Lorenz said something extraordinarily profound that connect two universes of knowledge: The Kantian apriori of knowledge have been inserted in our brain/mind/soul by evolution in the form of

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 11:30 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 11:15 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 10:24 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Alberto G. Corona
So you say that because the data was finally available against their will, they are good scientists that welcome the challenges and the scientific method? : Their practices tell absolutely the contrary. And the fact that their data leaked out is not in their merit, in the contrary. All what you

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 12:23 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: This is ASSA, and I find that absurd, there is no absolute probability of being alive, probability is only meaningful between two moments... But there's a probability of being alive at time t in the future, and that can become arbitrarily small,

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 12:23 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: This is ASSA, and I find that absurd, there is no absolute probability of being alive, probability is only meaningful between two moments... But there's a probability of being alive at time t in the

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 12:30 PM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: So you say that because the data was finally available against their will, they are good scientists that welcome the challenges and the scientific method? They were not compelled, they agreed to provide the data after discussing whether there

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 12:23 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: This is ASSA, and I find that absurd, there is no absolute probability of being alive, probability is only meaningful between two moments... But there's a probability of being alive at time t in the

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
On 13 November 2013 05:19, Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com wrote: And the fact is that there are plenty of energy and materials everywhere. The only lacking resource is the inteligence and ingenuity of more people to learn to use them. That at least you have got right. -- You

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 12:45 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 12:23 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: This is ASSA, and I find that absurd, there is no absolute probability of being alive, probability is only

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
On 13 November 2013 06:40, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: I knew you didn't live on this planet or care for it's future. Quite clearly - I have my own dirt to attend to ignores the existence of the commons we all share in. If Alberto wants to move to Mars then fine, he is no longer

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 12:45 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 12:23 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: This is ASSA, and I find that absurd, there is no absolute probability of being alive, probability is only

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Alberto G. Corona
As human beings they were reluctant to provide hard earned data to those who had proved to mere critics - like you - with no interest but to spread doubt. Can ever have been a more clear confession of sectarianism ? Doubt about what? about what yours affirm that is truth and must be taken as

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 1:02 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 12:45 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 12:23 PM, Quentin Anciaux

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread spudboy100
Brent, try cruising Wikipedia. I don't know of any biologist or physician, that didn't approve of this nonsense. I am not aware of anyone speaking out authoritatively, as a scientist that opposed eugenics. Maybe you can, but I don't recall anyone on the hero side. Whether is was pro-birth

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 1:02 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 12:45 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 12:23 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: This is ASSA,

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 1:36 PM, spudboy...@aol.com wrote: Brent, try cruising Wikipedia. I don't know of any biologist or physician, that didn't approve of this nonsense. I am not aware of anyone speaking out authoritatively, as a scientist that opposed eugenics. Maybe you can, but I don't recall anyone

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread spudboy100
Indeed. I look at things a bit different, perhaps. then yourself. I see it, us, as being set against obliteration versus existence. Mitch -Original Message- From: Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com To: everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, Nov 12, 2013 3:12

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 1:37 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 1:02 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 12:45 PM, Quentin Anciaux

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread spudboy100
Probably both, if my reading of history books about this time. Which I am using as a reminder that we need to be cautious about how to react to this, AGW might be completely true, but I am worried that world socialists, and a cadre of billionaire supporters want this for other reasons then to

How the people of Iceland solved their debt crisis:

2013-11-12 Thread Roger Clough
How the people of Iceland solved their debt crisis: They said, wait a minute. We didn't cause this problem. The govt and the bankers caused ity. So they threw the bankers and other causers of the debt into jail. Hmmm. Sounds tempting. - Roger Clough http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-BJgwWx57U#

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 1:37 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 1:02 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 12:45 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12

Re: How the people of Iceland solved their debt crisis:

2013-11-12 Thread Richard Ruquist
Good move. But they are still in debt On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 4:55 PM, Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net wrote: How the people of Iceland solved their debt crisis: They said, wait a minute. We didn't cause this problem. The govt and the bankers caused ity. So they threw the bankers and

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Richard Ruquist
Every one of the perhaps inifinite copies of you will grow old and die in less than 150 years. There is no quantum immortality On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 4:57 PM, Quentin Anciaux allco...@gmail.com wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 1:37 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote:

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread John Mikes
Liz wrote: (and I try to interject my remarks in plain lettering) *Sequence is determinative because that's how the universe works. * I would say: how WE explain the workings of the universe (- rather Multiverse). * Tomorrow, and tomorrow, and tomorrow, creeps in this petty pace from day to day,

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 1:57 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: So *you* Quentin Anciaux (incidentally, how do pronounce that?) don't necessarily continue. It is just that there is a continuation of 1p POVs. So we're down to the question of what constitutes a 1p POV. I know what is my own,

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 1:57 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: So *you* Quentin Anciaux (incidentally, how do pronounce that?) don't necessarily continue. It is just that there is a continuation of 1p POVs. So we're down to the question of what constitutes a 1p

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2013/11/13 Quentin Anciaux allco...@gmail.com 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 1:57 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: So *you* Quentin Anciaux (incidentally, how do pronounce that?) don't necessarily continue. It is just that there is a continuation of 1p POVs. So

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2013/11/12 Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com Every one of the perhaps inifinite copies of you will grow old and die in less than 150 years. There is no quantum immortality Well it's cool asserting things... but you should develop more, all I'm saying is that if MWI is true, the argument

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
On 13 November 2013 10:55, spudboy...@aol.com wrote: if you want us to give up the bad, dirty, power, then please provide a clean, affordable, abundant substitute. Faster, please. The Sun, of course. Produces millions of times more power than we need. Trouble is the fossil fuel industry

Re: How the people of Iceland solved their debt crisis:

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
Sounds like a good start. Throw them in jail and confiscate their assets. Free the 32 trillion! On 13 November 2013 11:04, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: Good move. But they are still in debt On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 4:55 PM, Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net wrote: How the

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
On 13 November 2013 10:30, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: But that's part of what bothers me about this idea. How crippled/brain-damaged can you be and still count as a continuation? Are there degrees of continuation? If so, why can't the degrees asymptote to zero? That bothers me

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
On 13 November 2013 11:12, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: Every one of the perhaps inifinite copies of you will grow old and die in less than 150 years. There is no quantum immortality A pretty bold statement. I don't see that the laws of physics require this - there must be a

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Quentin Anciaux
Le 12 nov. 2013 22:53, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net a écrit : On 11/12/2013 1:37 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 1:02 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2013/11/12 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/12/2013 12:45 PM, Quentin Anciaux

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
On 13 November 2013 11:16, John Mikes jami...@gmail.com wrote: Liz wrote: (and I try to interject my remarks in plain lettering) *Sequence is determinative because that's how the universe works. * I would say: how WE explain the workings of the universe (- rather Multiverse). Yes of

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
On 13 November 2013 11:22, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 1:57 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: So *you* Quentin Anciaux (incidentally, how do pronounce that?) don't necessarily continue. It is just that there is a continuation of 1p POVs. So we're down to the question of

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Jason Resch
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 11:15 AM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 2:37 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: Both with Comp and with Everett-QM we have lost that unique theoretical evidence, because our best current explanation (comp, or QM) makes that mind-brain identity non

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 3:49 PM, LizR wrote: On 13 November 2013 10:55, spudboy...@aol.com mailto:spudboy...@aol.com wrote: if you want us to give up the bad, dirty, power, then please provide a clean, affordable, abundant substitute. Faster, please. The Sun, of course. Produces millions of

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Jason Resch
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 11:45 AM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 2:55 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 12 Nov 2013, at 04:44, meekerdb wrote: Experience may be like that; everything has 'experience', it's just not human experience and when you stop having human experience

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Alberto G. Corona
2013/11/13 LizR lizj...@gmail.com On 13 November 2013 10:55, spudboy...@aol.com wrote: if you want us to give up the bad, dirty, power, then please provide a clean, affordable, abundant substitute. Faster, please. The Sun, of course. Produces millions of times more power than we need.

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Jason Resch
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 4:12 PM, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: Every one of the perhaps inifinite copies of you will grow old and die in less than 150 years. There is no quantum immortality I guess that settles it. Jason -- You received this message because you are subscribed

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 4:13 PM, LizR wrote: On 13 November 2013 11:22, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 1:57 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: So *you* Quentin Anciaux (incidentally, how do pronounce that?) don't necessarily continue. It is

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Jason Resch
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:57 PM, LizR lizj...@gmail.com wrote: On 13 November 2013 11:12, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: Every one of the perhaps inifinite copies of you will grow old and die in less than 150 years. There is no quantum immortality A pretty bold statement. I

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 4:59 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 11:45 AM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 2:55 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 12 Nov 2013, at 04:44, meekerdb wrote: Experience may be like that;

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 5:14 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:57 PM, LizR lizj...@gmail.com mailto:lizj...@gmail.com wrote: On 13 November 2013 11:12, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com mailto:yann...@gmail.com wrote: Every one of the perhaps inifinite copies of you will

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Jason Resch
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 7:18 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 4:59 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 11:45 AM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 2:55 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 12 Nov 2013, at 04:44, meekerdb wrote: Experience

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Jason Resch
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 7:20 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 5:14 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:57 PM, LizR lizj...@gmail.com wrote: On 13 November 2013 11:12, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: Every one of the perhaps inifinite copies of

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 5:27 PM, Jason Resch wrote: There is a continuation from being anesthetized to waking up from anesthesia. Did you leave out a no? There is a continuation, but not of consciousness. Would you say the same true for an amnesiac being anesthetized? I think so. An amnesiac is

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
On 13 November 2013 14:09, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 4:12 PM, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.comwrote: Every one of the perhaps inifinite copies of you will grow old and die in less than 150 years. There is no quantum immortality I guess that settles

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Richard Ruquist
Simple. Shooting yourself with a gun or whatever means you use to end your life in one universe does not guarranttee that you do not grow in all other universes. Unless the laws of physics differ across the multiverse, which I understand to be incorrect, your copies will grow old and die in every

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
On 12 November 2013 22:56, Alberto G. Corona agocor...@gmail.com wrote: This is laughable. Not a SINGLE article against human warming was publised in the main scientific magazines and you said that the process was perverted by the deniers? I have no option but to think that you believe en

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
On 13 November 2013 16:19, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: Simple. Shooting yourself with a gun or whatever means you use to end your life in one universe does not guarranttee that you do not grow in all other universes. Unless the laws of physics differ across the multiverse, which I

Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

2013-11-12 Thread Richard Ruquist
As I see it, the problem is connecting atmospheric disaster events to global warming. I have been looking for such a connection in the scientific literature and even in AGW blogs w/o success. Before going into physics I was an undergraduate student of mechanical engineering. In our fluid dynamic

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Richard Ruquist
My email service does not allow me to interleave comments. Regarding your reply, the laws of biophysics does MANDATE growing old and dying. I think the more advanced understanding of the multiverse is that incredibly unlikely things do not happen. As I recall the argument was based on

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 7:28 PM, LizR wrote: On 13 November 2013 16:19, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com mailto:yann...@gmail.com wrote: Simple. Shooting yourself with a gun or whatever means you use to end your life in one universe does not guarranttee that you do not grow in all other

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
On 13 November 2013 16:51, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: My email service does not allow me to interleave comments. Well in that case maybe you could cut and paste the relevant quote. There was an awful lot of text after your comment, I still have no idea what you were replying to.

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
On 13 November 2013 17:03, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 7:28 PM, LizR wrote: On 13 November 2013 16:19, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: Simple. Shooting yourself with a gun or whatever means you use to end your life in one universe does not guarranttee that

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 8:08 PM, LizR wrote: On 13 November 2013 17:03, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 7:28 PM, LizR wrote: On 13 November 2013 16:19, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com mailto:yann...@gmail.com wrote: Simple. Shooting

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Jason Resch
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 8:12 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 5:27 PM, Jason Resch wrote: There is a continuation from being anesthetized to waking up from anesthesia. Did you leave out a no? It was intentional, I meant there is a continuation, as in subjectively

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread Jason Resch
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 9:19 PM, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: Simple. Shooting yourself with a gun or whatever means you use to end your life in one universe does not guarranttee that you do not grow in all other universes. Unless the laws of physics differ across the multiverse,

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread meekerdb
On 11/12/2013 9:38 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 8:12 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 5:27 PM, Jason Resch wrote: There is a continuation from being anesthetized to waking up from anesthesia. Did you

Re: Spacetime is (nonphysical, platonic) mind

2013-11-12 Thread LizR
On 13 November 2013 17:20, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 8:08 PM, LizR wrote: On 13 November 2013 17:03, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 11/12/2013 7:28 PM, LizR wrote: On 13 November 2013 16:19, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: Simple. Shooting