/adapter:
Why are we having this whole discussion again?
Steve pointed out some problems with the syntax, which
the above examples should make obvious.
Was there something wrong with the code? :-S
Nope.
Jim
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I want to thank everyone who's participating in this
thread. The input is extremely valuable.
Garrett Smith wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
> We don't. In fact, one could argue that adaptation is a bit like
> a different kind of traversal. In fact, in Zope 3, we already have
> a
something. :)
Jim
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Evan Simpson wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
IMO, if we take this route, we should think of the notation as
providing an alternate traversal operator. That is, there is
syntax that either modifies or replaces "/", so of the examples
above, only:
context/*dc/title
In that case, I'd be ha
Tres Seaver wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
Sidnei da Silva wrote:
| So far, I like:
| | foo/bar->dc/title
| | the best.
OTOH, for 'valid' xhtml, u would have to write:
You mean well-formed.
foo/bar->dc/title
Totally defeating the purpose. One may argue that this would not be
part of
ditors (at least nxml-mode).
Wrong. Double check the spec. (I did. :)
http://www.w3.org/TR/2004/REC-xml11-20040204/#NT-AttValue
You only need to escape the less-than because there's no way to
mistake "a->b" as a tag.
Jim
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Casey Duncan wrote:
On Fri, 21 May 2004 09:07:24 -0400
Jim Fulton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
I've posted two proposals:
http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/TALESPathExpressionAdapters
Proposes a mechanism for easily using adapters in TALES expressions.
http://dev.zop
es. Rather, I
see '/' as the "traverse" operator, and ":" as the "adapt" operator.
Right, and the "adapt" operator can be thought of as a specialized form of
traversal.
Jim
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Ian Bicking wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
One disadvantage I see with the cast notation is that it's
a bit jarring in:
a/b/(adapter)c/d
as the adapter is applied to a/b/c. The order just doesn't
seem quite right.
That is indeed jarring, especially since c isn't an object, it's j
Evan Simpson wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
...
Unless I'm misunderstanding something fundamental here, in the TALES
context an adapter is essentially a function accepting a single
argument.
Yes, except s/function/callable
> The "adapted" object that results from applying the a
Stephan Richter wrote:
On Friday 21 May 2004 09:07, Jim Fulton wrote:
So far the cast syntax seems to be the most popular:
(adaptername)ob (dc)context/title
Why don't we use adaptername(ob)? Then it looks exactely like in Python! Less
to memorize.
Because that would be the top
Jim Fulton wrote:
I've posted two proposals:
http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/TALESPathExpressionAdapters
Proposes a mechanism for easily using adapters in TALES expressions.
http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/ZPTVariableNamespaces
proposes a mechanism for qualifying names defined in TAL and used in
Evan Simpson wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
I thought you had proposed this, but I couldn't find a proposal
or documentation.
You say this is implemented in Zope 2? Where is it documented?
Actually, it's only implemented on evan-pathprefix-branch. It has been
quite a while since I had a
Evan Simpson wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
I've posted two proposals:
http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/TALESPathExpressionAdapters
Proposes a mechanism for easily using adapters in TALES expressions.
I'm not at all clear on how the proposed mechanism is superior to the
implementation of pa
ments are welcome, here or in the pages.
Jim
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Casey Duncan wrote:
On Wed, 19 May 2004 16:00:43 -0400
Jim Fulton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I've posted two proposals:
http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/TALESPathExpressionAdapters
I have to say I am not found of "*",
I'm not attached to '*'. Feel free
. Keeping track of many different licenses is a burden to
users.
For more information, see: http://www.zope.org/Resources/License
Jim
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Jim Fulton wrote:
There is a problem with the public subversion access. The 'svn' urls
are currently disabled. 'svn+ssh' urls are still working as is web access.
I expect to have this problem resolved today.
This has been resolved. 'svn' urls are enab
There is a problem with the public subversion access. The 'svn' urls
are currently disabled. 'svn+ssh' urls are still working as is web access.
I expect to have this problem resolved today.
Jim
Jim Fulton wrote:
The conversion is done. All "trunk" development sh
tagged the cvs head with the
cvs-to-svn-conversion tag. If you have outstanding head work, you should be
able to update to that tag and then use cvs diff to generate patch files to
be applied to subversion checkouts.
Jim
Jim Fulton wrote:
I'm about to begin the conversion now. Please don't
I'm about to begin the conversion now. Please don't make any more changes to the
Zope, Zope3, ZODB, ZConfig, zLOG, or zdaemon CVS heads.
Jim
Jim Fulton wrote:
I plan to do the transition tomorrow, Tuesday may 11.
I'll begin at 10am US/Eastern and be done by 5pm US/Eastern.
Duri
x27;. When I'm done, I will remove all files from the
heads of the preojects in CVS, except README.txt files giving subversion access
instructions.
Jim
Jim Fulton wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
Sorry for the false start.
I totally missed a flaw in subversion's handling of text-file line
end
Chris Withers wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
...
Now, when we set up the Zope 3 repository, we will create the ZConfig
package in Zope 3 by copying a *tag* from the ZConfig project:
svn copy svn+ssh://svn.zope.org/repos/ZConfig/tags/T1/src/ZConfig \
svn+ssh://svn.zope.org/repos/Zope3
Indeed. Although the stuff which stopped me was shear carelessness
(things like just using unix path seperators rather that os.path.join,
etc)...
Jim
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self.x = foo
requiring:
self.x = persistent.wref.ref(foo)
Anyway, you ask a reasonably question. Let's continue this discussion after
I write a proposal for cross-database references.
Jim
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Jim Fulton wrote:
Sorry for the false start.
I totally missed a flaw in subversion's handling of text-file line endings.
I suspect that this is fixable, but it's not going to be fixed today.
I think that this issue has been "resolved". I have updated my cvs to svn
conversion
Lennart Regebro wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
Thoughts?
Only that the Subversion people are wrong. Ad-hoc is not good enough. It
must be able to be configurable on the server.
You may be right. This was certainly my initial reaction. I think, though,
that we should at least try handling this the
ow is to *finally* support cross database
references.
Jim
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Jim Fulton wrote:
...
http://subversion.tigris.org/servlets/BrowseList?list=users&by=thread&from=184061
Ken pointed out that the links on this page don't work. :( Sigh
Here are links that do work:
http://subversion.tigris.org/servlets/ReadMsg?list=users&m
ersion developers ad hoc approach, then I
think we could move forward with the transition sooner, perhaps the week after next.
(I still need to arrange for setting the property during conversion, but I think
I can manage that.)
Jim
Jim Fulton wrote:
Tim Peters wrote:
[Jim Fulton]
...
You will
ested in participating in a sprint after the conference,
please let me know ASAP, including which days you would be participating.
Jim
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Max M wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
I've done a conversion of a snapshot of the CVS database from yesterday.
This is just to allow people to play with subversion and see what the
respoitory
might look like when we do cut over.
To browse the respository:
http://svn.zope.org/
It seems to
o svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main//trunk
or, to do a writable checkout:
svn co svn+ssh://svn.zope.org/repos/main//trunk
Jim
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t back to this for a month
or so. If you want to help, let me know.
The next time we try this, I'll build a longer testing period
into the plan, and, probably a more gradual migration (e.g.
only move the ZODB head first.)
Jim
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Tim Peters wrote:
[Jim Fulton]
...
You will be able to do read-only anonymous checkouts like so:
svn co svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main//trunk
For example:
svn co svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZConfig/trunk
FYI, I tried that on Windows (XP), and it worked fine.
One glitch, which may be all
Paolo Invernizzi wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
None. The files were not added or imported. They were input
via cvs2svn, which uses dump files. The cvs2svn utility apparently
doesn't set mime types, or any other property except cvs2svn:cvs-rev.
So, given your explanation, why did Tim get bad
s, or any other property except cvs2svn:cvs-rev.
So, given your explanation, why did Tim get bad line endings I wonder.
Jim
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than I'd hoped.
Let's try to sort these issues out today. If we can, maybe we'll try again tomorrow.
If not, the transition may need to wait a few weeks.
Jim
Tim Peters wrote:
[Jim Fulton]
...
You will be able to do read-only anonymous checkouts like so:
svn co svn://svn.zope.o
Jim Fulton wrote:
Tomorrow, as planned. I'm going to move the main development branches for
Zope 2, Zope 3, and ZODB to subversion. I will start the move at 10am
US/Eastern time tomorrow. I plan to be done before 5pm US/Eastern time.
During this time, I ask that no one make checkins to th
Tim Peters wrote:
[Jim Fulton]
The Zope project includes a number of interrelated subprojects,
such as:
- Zope 2
- Zope 3
- ZODB
- ZConfig
Software from the ZODB and ZConfig projects are shared by Zope 2
and Zope 3.
Note that ZODB also depends on ZConfig.
Yup and zdaemon and zLOG
print and then send the filled out and signed agreement to us in
one of 3 ways:
- Ordinary mail to:
Zope Corporation,
513 Prince Edward Street
Fredericksburg, VA, USA, 22401
- Fax to 1.703.995.0412
- Email a scanned form to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Jim
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Jim Fulton wrote:
I'm working on the cvs to subversion conversion for the ZODB, Zope 2, and
Zope 3 projects. I'm currently doing the conversion of the full history
with
tags and branches. This is taking a long time and creating a huge
repository, which is OK, but, do we really need
Barry Warsaw wrote:
On Mon, 2004-04-26 at 15:42, Jim Fulton wrote:
The reason that I hate merge messages like this is that I find it
very difficult to find the branch checkin messages in thye log. It's
possible, but so difficult that I generally would rather not
bother.
I agree, but histo
Jim Fulton wrote:
Barry Warsaw wrote:
On Mon, 2004-04-26 at 15:23, Jim Fulton wrote:
2. Convert the mainline history, but leave off the branches.
Would this mean we'd lose the log messages too?
Yes, you'd lose the branch log messages.
> If so -1 because often
merge message
Barry Warsaw wrote:
On Mon, 2004-04-26 at 15:23, Jim Fulton wrote:
2. Convert the mainline history, but leave off the branches.
Would this mean we'd lose the log messages too?
Yes, you'd lose the branch log messages.
> If so -1 because often
merge messages aren't very he
://svn.zope.org/repos/trunk/ZODB
which seems unnecessary to me.
Thoughts?
Jim
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nches will
remain in CVS.
I think that option 2 provides a nice compromise. The main disadvantage
of it is that it will leave current development branches high and dry.
I'm not sure how big an issue this is. In theory, these could be committed
to the subversion heav via patch files.
Thought
Andreas Kostyrka wrote:
On Sun, Apr 25, 2004 at 12:48:30PM -0400, Fred Drake wrote:
On Sunday 25 April 2004 12:29 pm, Jim Fulton wrote:
>cvs co svn+ssh://svn.zope.org/repos/Zope3/trunk Zope3
That should be:
svn co svn+ssh://svn.zope.org/repos/Zope3/trunk Zope3
>cvs c
Fred Drake wrote:
On Sunday 25 April 2004 12:29 pm, Jim Fulton wrote:
>cvs co svn+ssh://svn.zope.org/repos/Zope3/trunk Zope3
That should be:
svn co svn+ssh://svn.zope.org/repos/Zope3/trunk Zope3
>cvs co http://svn.zope.org/repos/Zope3/trunk Zope3
and this would be:
epos/Zope3/trunk Zope3
for public checkouts.
Jim
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retty selectively.
Initially, we'll convert only parts needed for Zope 2, Zope 3 and ZODB.
Jim
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I'd like to plan to convert the repository heads to subversion this Wednesday.
I'll confirm this on Tuesday. It will be best of no one does any work on
the head on Wednesday.
Jim
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we can merge changes
made between the two tags.
A similar technique can be used for external software, as described in:
http://svnbook.red-bean.com/svnbook/ch07s04.html
Jim
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face interfaces.
Jim
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) and the nget together on irc.freenode.net #zope-dev...
I don't mind being the "official announcer and hassler" if people are
happy for me to have that role :-)
+1
Doesn't really need to be "official" though, does it?
Jim
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Chris Withers wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
FYI, there's a similar zip file now containing the same kind of thing
for a
current Zope3 checkout (s/Zope2/Zope3/ in the URL).
If this is good enough for people trying to work from CVS on Windows,
let me
know and I'll update them from time to
o do more than this (which is just a trivial zip+upload step
beyond the builds I have to do anyway).
Thanks Tim.
Jim
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Philipp von Weitershausen wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
2. Especially Andreas expressed his worries about the current release
policy in Zope 2 and its future regarding maintainance and support. I
have to say that I share some of his skepticism regarding Zope 2. I
personally have never fully
Philipp von Weitershausen wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
Philipp von Weitershausen wrote:
Why would they switch to Zope 2.8 if not for the component architecture?
To stay current? To get MVCC? To get new-style extension classes, and
thus access to many modern Python features. Later releases will
know that we have succeeded.
This exactly the sort of feedback we need.
Thanks.
Jim
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Jim Fulton wrote:
Martijn Faassen wrote:
Hey there,
I understand from:
http://dev.zope.org/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/Zope2.8/MilestonePlan
Zope 2.8 is now planned for june.
This is, of course, a function of people's availability to help.
I still need to fix ZClasses, and I need to get th
think I'd do this after we do the svn conversion.
I *hope* to do that next week.
Jim
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lease (e.g. 2.8, 2.9) identify a small
team of release managers. This team would be responsible for
planning and executing the release, including bug-fix releases
for that base release. That team could establish the policy for
changes to that release, possibly including vetting fixes.
It would be gr
them? As soon as we found out about them,
we mobilized the whole company to work on them. This was a big deal that we
put a lot of effort into over a fairly short time. How is this evidence that
we were a bottleneck?
Jim
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Martijn Faassen wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
I'm surprised to read this. Could you be more specific about your
concerns?
Did you read Andreas Jung's mail? He was pretty specific, but I had to
hunt around as in my mailreader his reply had broken the thread.
I was responding to Philipp, n
but never as an
insult.
Since I am the one who asked Mike to speak up I would feel bad if it
created any bad feelings.
Bad feeling don't last long with me. I couldn't be an open-source
developer if they did. :/
Jim
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ter if we kept the legacy support available longer?
The deprecation warnings are a way for people to find out when somethings
coming.
Jim
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;s in Zope 2, then use Zope 2.
Zope 3 isn't there yet. OTOH, Zope 3 does have some advantages for some
applications. That's why people are building production apps with it now,
even though there isn't a production release. That's why we're working
very hard to make a produc
uld you be more specific about your concerns?
Jim
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_
uty of our approach is that, having built what we've
built, we'll be able to take advantage of that code in the current platform.
Jim
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t from other projects.
That's natural and healthy? Has development on Zope 2 stopped?
No. ZC still puts more work into Zope 2 than into Zope 3.
I expect that to continue for some time.
Jim
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Jim Fulton wrote:
Based on recent discussions, I've created a proposal:
http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/RenameTheZopePackage
to rename the "zope" package to "z". Unless there are strong
objections, we'll do this after we move the Zope repository head to
subversion
Chris Withers wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
Lennart Regebro wrote:
From: "Jim Fulton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Initially, I propose to move just the repository heads. Maintenamce
branches (e.g. Zope 2.6 and Zope 2.7) will remain in CVS.
What is the rationale behind not moving it all?
e
the evolution of the data as a step=by-step progression and that we can
update a database through the orderly application of independent changes.
Feel free to ad a note to the proposal that the scope includes the sort of
scenario you described.
Jim
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le to Zope 2 and other ZODB
applications.
Comments are welcome.
Jim
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Based on recent discussions, I've created a proposal:
http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/RenameTheZopePackage
to rename the "zope" package to "z". Unless there are strong
objections, we'll do this after we move the Zope repository head to
subversion at the end of
Barry Warsaw wrote:
On Thu, 2004-04-15 at 09:25, Jim Fulton wrote:
From the zope package README.txt:
"Zope Project Packages
The zope package is a pure namespace package holding packages developed as
part of the Zope 3 project.
Generally, the immediate subpackages of the zope pa
I don't like it. 'z' is better then. Of
course that means that suddenly the component architecture is called z
No, the component architecture is z.component.
Jim
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Sidnei da Silva wrote:
On Thu, Apr 15, 2004 at 08:59:44AM -0400, Jim Fulton wrote:
| >So, what about this:
| >
| >zope.component
| >zope.interfaces (?)
| >zope.configuration
| >zope.testing
| >zope.schema (soon-to-be-dead?)
| >
| >- All move to 'ca.*'
|
| Mo
osing.
This is pretty rough. Probably there are more stuff that should move
to 'ca', and some stuff which should be grouped into packages, so that
'zope' doesn't get excessively broad.
I think the depth vs breadth balence we have now is about right.
Jim
--
Jim Fulto
Jim Fulton wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
...
Give the responses. I need to recast my question as a selection
among alternatives. But, before I do that, we will need to consider
alternatives a bit more.
OK, here's another.
What about renaming the Zope 3 zope package to "z".
- I
Marius Gedminas wrote:
On Wed, Apr 14, 2004 at 11:06:37AM -0400, Jim Fulton wrote:
What about renaming the Zope 3 zope package to "z".
Examples (from the buddydemo example):
import z.interface
from z.app import zapi
from z.app.event import publish
from z.app.event.objectev
Stephan Richter wrote:
On Wednesday 14 April 2004 11:08, Jim Fulton wrote:
...
What about "z.app.foo" or "z.i18n"?
The shortness of this example is very attractive, but it is still a compromise
in my opinion.
Again, I think educating is easier than anything else. Pe
se is the only
thing different.
Me too, the more I think about it.
> It's would be insanely difficult (not to mention
embarrassing) to document, should the two codebases merge in some unholy
fashion at some point as is on the 2.9 roadmap.
Actually, the Zope 2.8 roadmap. :) Zope 2.
d otherwise work
with Zope 3 in Zope 2 should not have to be changed to be used with Zope 3.
I would hate to have imports like "z3.app.foo" or even "z3.i18n".
Why?
What about "z.app.foo" or "z.i18n"?
Jim
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Jim Fulton wrote:
...
Give the responses. I need to recast my question as a selection
among alternatives. But, before I do that, we will need to consider
alternatives a bit more.
OK, here's another.
What about renaming the Zope 3 zope package to "z".
- It fits with the exp
Jim Fulton wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
...
I should have been clearer.
The first question is:
Is it a problem to have two packages with names differing only in case?
I haven't gotten as many responses on this as I expected. I'll try to
summarize
Wrong. People don't find the
Philipp von Weitershausen wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
The first question is:
Is it a problem to have two packages with names differing only in case?
I don't see a problem at all; IIRC, we agreed that the backports from
Zope3 would live in a 'src' directory, while Zope 2 stuff con
Kapil Thangavelu wrote:
On Wed, 2004-04-14 at 09:00, Jim Fulton wrote:
The first question is:
Is it a problem to have two packages with names differing only in case?
Perhaps we can get more input on whether there's a problem.
A response with a positive sign (e.g. +1, +0, +2, ...) indi
Jim Fulton wrote:
Zope 2 has a package named "Zope". Zope 3 has a package named "zope".
Starting with Zope 2.8, parts of Zope 3 will be included in Zope 2.
As things stand, this will require having both "Zope" and "zope" packages.
Python can handle this fi
;t
a big deal.
Of course, having two packages with names differing only in case is a
bit ugly.
Do we want to consider renaming one or both of these packages
to avoid the conflict?
Jim
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Jim Fulton mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Python Powered!
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Jamie Heilman wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote:
I propose to move from CVS to subversion for the Zope and ZODB projects;
http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/MovingSCMToSubversion
No complaints from me. I do wonder though... one thing I've noticed
about ZC's CVS usage in the past is that you folks ne
Lennart Regebro wrote:
From: "Jim Fulton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Initially, I propose to move just the repository heads. Maintenamce
branches (e.g. Zope 2.6 and Zope 2.7) will remain in CVS.
What is the rationale behind not moving it all?
- Reduce risk
- Provide a more gradual
propose to make this
a topic of discussion at the upcoming Zope commnity IRC chat:
http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-announce/2004-April/001409.html
Jim
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Jim Fulton mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Python Powered!
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ave to do it
again?
You should write it against the Zope 3 interfaces.
Could I instead leap ahead and use the Zope X3 interface module in
Zope 2.7?
Yes.
Also, since I'm posting to Zope3-dev as well -- what do you think of the
SubInterface concept?
As we discussed on zope3-dev, it
This would be a good time for people interested and knowledgeable
about packaging systems and who want to influence the direction we
take with Zope 3 to get involved. :)
Jim
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Jim Fulton mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Python Powered!
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ope 2 head.
Specifically, broken object support will partially go away
until we do milestone 3.
Note that ZClasses are already broken on the Zope head.
There were no tests to detect this when I merged the
ExtensionClass rewrite and ZODB 3.3.
Jim
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Jim Fulton mailto:[EMAIL
Dieter Maurer wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote at 2004-1-16 18:54 -0500:
...
For security checks, the accessed object should be the driving factor
and not the particular way the access is made.
Well, sorry, that's not what this is about. We are talking about what
to do when accessing objects wi
pe2.8
including the milestone plan:
http://dev.zope.org/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/Zope2.8/MilestonePlan
We're mostly interested in the ZODB 3.3 features, i.e., getting rid of
Extension Classes.
Well, I hope you've been trying out the ZODB 3.3 releases and
providing feedback.
Jim
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