Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 12 May 2019, at 20:38, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Sunday, May 12, 2019 at 12:31:12 PM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > Concerning mathematical logic and theology, an incredible book is: > > Cohen J. Daniel, 2007. Equations from God, Pure Mathematics and Victorian > Faith, John Hopk

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Sunday, May 12, 2019 at 12:31:12 PM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > Concerning mathematical logic and theology, an incredible book is: > > Cohen J. Daniel, 2007. Equations from God, Pure Mathematics and Victorian > Faith, John Hopkins Press, Baltimore. > > That book shows that the whole fie

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 10 May 2019, at 15:38, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Fri, May 10, 2019 at 7:53 AM Bruno Marchal > wrote: > >> On 8 May 2019, at 17:44, Jason Resch > > wrote: >> >> SNIP >> >> OK. >> >> It is just that this is verified by “m

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Fri, May 10, 2019 at 7:53 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > > On 8 May 2019, at 17:44, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 7:57 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> >> On 26 Apr 2019, at 02:50, Jason Resch wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 9:57 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> >>> On

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 8 May 2019, at 17:44, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 7:57 AM Bruno Marchal > wrote: > >> On 26 Apr 2019, at 02:50, Jason Resch > > wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 9:57 AM Bruno Marchal >

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 7:57 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > > On 26 Apr 2019, at 02:50, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 9:57 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> >> On 23 Apr 2019, at 03:32, Jason Resch wrote: >> >> >> >> On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 7:47 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > > On 26 Apr 2019, at 02:38, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 9:45 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> >> On 23 Apr 2019, at 01:24, Jason Resch wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> >>> On

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 26 Apr 2019, at 02:38, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 9:45 AM Bruno Marchal > wrote: > >> On 23 Apr 2019, at 01:24, Jason Resch > > wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal >

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 26 Apr 2019, at 02:50, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 9:57 AM Bruno Marchal > wrote: > >> On 23 Apr 2019, at 03:32, Jason Resch > > wrote: >> >> >> >> On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everyth

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Friday, April 26, 2019 at 9:04:46 AM UTC-5, Jason wrote: > > > > On Friday, April 26, 2019, > wrote: > >> >> >> On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 7:29:08 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 2:48 AM Philip Thrift >>> wrote: >>> On Monday, April 22, 2019

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Friday, April 26, 2019, wrote: > > > On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 7:29:08 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 2:48 AM Philip Thrift wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> On Monday, April 22, 2019 at 6:24:37 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: > The above reminded me of this quote fr

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 7:29:08 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: > > > > On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 2:48 AM Philip Thrift > wrote: > >> >> >> On Monday, April 22, 2019 at 6:24:37 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: >>> >>> The above reminded me of this quote from Alan Turing: >>> >>> Personally I think that s

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 9:57 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > > On 23 Apr 2019, at 03:32, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < > everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > >> >> >> On 4/22/2019 4:24 PM, Jason Resch wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tue, No

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 9:45 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > > On 23 Apr 2019, at 01:24, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> >> On 5 Nov 2018, at 02:56, Martin Abramson >> wrote: >> >> Consciousness is a program. >> >> >> Consciousness might be related

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 2:48 AM Philip Thrift wrote: > > > On Monday, April 22, 2019 at 6:24:37 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: >> >> >>> The above reminded me of this quote from Alan Turing: >> >> Personally I think that spirit is really eternally connected with matter >> but certainly not always by the

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 23 Apr 2019, at 07:13, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List > wrote: > > > > On 4/22/2019 6:32 PM, Jason Resch wrote: >> >> >> On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List >> mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> >> wrote: >> >> >> On 4/22/2019 4:24 PM, Jaso

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 23 Apr 2019, at 03:32, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List > mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> > wrote: > > > On 4/22/2019 4:24 PM, Jason Resch wrote: >> >> >> On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal >

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 23 Apr 2019, at 01:24, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal > wrote: > >> On 5 Nov 2018, at 02:56, Martin Abramson > > wrote: >> >> Consciousness is a program. > > Consciousness might be rel

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Monday, April 22, 2019 at 6:24:37 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: > > >> The above reminded me of this quote from Alan Turing: > > Personally I think that spirit is really eternally connected with matter > but certainly not always by the same kind of body. I did believe it > possible for a spirit at

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 12:13 AM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > > > On 4/22/2019 6:32 PM, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < > everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > >> >> >> On 4/22/2

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On 4/22/2019 6:32 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List > wrote: On 4/22/2019 4:24 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal mailto:marc...@ulb.ac.be>> wrote:

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > > > On 4/22/2019 4:24 PM, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> >> On 5 Nov 2018, at 02:56, Martin Abramson >> wrote: >> >> Consciousness

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On 4/22/2019 4:24 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal > wrote: On 5 Nov 2018, at 02:56, Martin Abramson mailto:martinabrams...@gmail.com>> wrote: Consciousness is a program. Consciousness might be related to a pr

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > > On 5 Nov 2018, at 02:56, Martin Abramson > wrote: > > Consciousness is a program. > > > Consciousness might be related to a program, but is not a program, that > would identify a first person notion with a third person notion, like a > glas

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Thursday, December 27, 2018 at 6:55:34 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 24 Dec 2018, at 14:55, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Monday, December 24, 2018 at 6:55:46 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 23 Dec 2018, at 13:39, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Sunday, Decembe

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 24 Dec 2018, at 14:55, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Monday, December 24, 2018 at 6:55:46 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 23 Dec 2018, at 13:39, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Sunday, December 23, 2018 at 5:20:57 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 21 Dec 201

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Monday, December 24, 2018 at 6:55:46 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 23 Dec 2018, at 13:39, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Sunday, December 23, 2018 at 5:20:57 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 21 Dec 2018, at 11:06, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Friday, December

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 23 Dec 2018, at 13:39, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Sunday, December 23, 2018 at 5:20:57 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 21 Dec 2018, at 11:06, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Friday, December 21, 2018 at 3:18:26 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 20 Dec 201

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Sunday, December 23, 2018 at 5:20:57 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 21 Dec 2018, at 11:06, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Friday, December 21, 2018 at 3:18:26 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 20 Dec 2018, at 14:49, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> The psychical (experien

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 21 Dec 2018, at 11:06, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Friday, December 21, 2018 at 3:18:26 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 20 Dec 2018, at 14:49, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> The psychical (experiential) states of matter (brain) > > Why a brain? If matter can be conscious,

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Friday, December 21, 2018 at 3:18:26 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 20 Dec 2018, at 14:49, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > The psychical (experiential) states of matter (brain) > > > Why a brain? If matter can be conscious, what is the role of the > (non-digital) brain? > > > > > >

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 20 Dec 2018, at 14:49, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Thursday, December 20, 2018 at 5:41:07 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 19 Dec 2018, at 19:36, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Wednesday, December 19, 2018 at 9:19:50 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 18 De

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Thursday, December 20, 2018 at 5:41:07 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 19 Dec 2018, at 19:36, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Wednesday, December 19, 2018 at 9:19:50 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 18 Dec 2018, at 16:40, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> snip >> >> > >> >>

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 19 Dec 2018, at 19:36, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Wednesday, December 19, 2018 at 9:19:50 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 18 Dec 2018, at 16:40, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> snip >> >> >> I should add: Why is fictionalism compelling? >> >> When you get down to th

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Wednesday, December 19, 2018 at 9:19:50 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 18 Dec 2018, at 16:40, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, December 18, 2018 at 9:24:12 AM UTC-6, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tuesday, December 18, 2018 at 5:04:32 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 18 Dec 2018, at 16:40, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, December 18, 2018 at 9:24:12 AM UTC-6, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > On Tuesday, December 18, 2018 at 5:04:32 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 17 Dec 2018, at 14:32, Philip Thrift > wrote: >> >> >> >> On Monday, Dece

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tuesday, December 18, 2018 at 9:24:12 AM UTC-6, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, December 18, 2018 at 5:04:32 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 17 Dec 2018, at 14:32, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Monday, December 17, 2018 at 6:51:19 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >>> >

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tuesday, December 18, 2018 at 5:04:32 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 17 Dec 2018, at 14:32, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Monday, December 17, 2018 at 6:51:19 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 16 Dec 2018, at 19:24, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Sunday, December

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 17 Dec 2018, at 14:32, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Monday, December 17, 2018 at 6:51:19 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 16 Dec 2018, at 19:24, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Sunday, December 16, 2018 at 11:27:50 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> > On 15 Dec 2

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Monday, December 17, 2018 at 6:51:19 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 16 Dec 2018, at 19:24, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Sunday, December 16, 2018 at 11:27:50 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> > On 15 Dec 2018, at 00:00, Brent Meeker wrote: >> > >> > >> > >> > On 12/

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 16 Dec 2018, at 19:24, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Sunday, December 16, 2018 at 11:27:50 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 15 Dec 2018, at 00:00, Brent Meeker > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > On 12/14/2018 2:59 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >>> On 13 Dec 2018, at 21:24, Brent Me

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 15 Dec 2018, at 00:12, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Friday, December 14, 2018 at 5:00:33 PM UTC-6, Brent wrote: > > > On 12/14/2018 2:59 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 13 Dec 2018, at 21:24, Brent Meeker > > >> wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> On 12/13/2018 3:25 AM, Bruno Marchal w

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Sunday, December 16, 2018 at 11:27:50 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > > On 15 Dec 2018, at 00:00, Brent Meeker > wrote: > > > > > > > > On 12/14/2018 2:59 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >>> On 13 Dec 2018, at 21:24, Brent Meeker > wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On 12/13/2018 3:25 A

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 15 Dec 2018, at 00:00, Brent Meeker wrote: > > > > On 12/14/2018 2:59 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: >>> On 13 Dec 2018, at 21:24, Brent Meeker wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On 12/13/2018 3:25 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: > But that is the same as saying proof=>truth. I don’t think so. It sa

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 14 Dec 2018, at 12:01, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Friday, December 14, 2018 at 4:49:33 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 13 Dec 2018, at 21:05, Brent Meeker > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On 12/13/2018 3:18 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: Automating Gödel'’s Ontological Proof of God

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Friday, December 14, 2018 at 5:00:33 PM UTC-6, Brent wrote: > > > > On 12/14/2018 2:59 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 13 Dec 2018, at 21:24, Brent Meeker > wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> On 12/13/2018 3:25 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: > But that is the same as saying proof=>truth. > >>>

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On 12/14/2018 2:59 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 13 Dec 2018, at 21:24, Brent Meeker wrote: On 12/13/2018 3:25 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: But that is the same as saying proof=>truth. I don’t think so. It says that []p -> p is not provable, unless p is proved. So []([]p -> p) -> p or in ot

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Friday, December 14, 2018 at 4:49:33 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 13 Dec 2018, at 21:05, Brent Meeker > > wrote: > > > > On 12/13/2018 3:18 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > *Automating Gödel'’s Ontological Proof of God’s Existence ¨ with > Higher-order Automated Theorem Provers* > htt

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 13 Dec 2018, at 21:24, Brent Meeker wrote: > > > > On 12/13/2018 3:25 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: >>> But that is the same as saying proof=>truth. >> >> I don’t think so. It says that []p -> p is not provable, unless p is proved. > > So []([]p -> p) -> p or in other words Proof([]p -> p

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 13 Dec 2018, at 21:05, Brent Meeker wrote: > > > > On 12/13/2018 3:18 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: >>> Automating Gödel'’s Ontological Proof of God’s Existence ¨ with >>> Higher-order Automated Theorem Provers >>> http://page.mi.fu-berlin.de/cbenzmueller/papers/C40.pdf >>>

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On 12/13/2018 3:25 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: But that is the same as saying proof=>truth. I don’t think so. It says that []p -> p is not provable, unless p is proved. So  []([]p -> p) -> p  or in other words Proof([]p -> p) => (p is true)  So in this case proof entails truth?? For exam

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On 12/13/2018 3:18 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: *Automating Gödel'’s Ontological Proof of God’s Existence ¨ with Higher-order Automated Theorem Provers* http://page.mi.fu-berlin.de/cbenzmueller/papers/C40.pdf Gödel took the modal logic S5 for its proof, which is the only logic NOT available for

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 9:30:10 PM UTC-6, Brent wrote: > > > the mathematical idea of "true" is very different from the common one. > > Brent > > > This reminds me of the "truth" the guys on *The Big Bang Theory* refer to a lot: They have arguments of what would be the case (be "true

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 13 Dec 2018, at 04:30, Brent Meeker wrote: > > > > On 12/12/2018 9:18 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 12 Dec 2018, at 12:54, Philip Thrift >> > wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 5:09:00 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >>> O

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 12 Dec 2018, at 19:37, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 11:18:48 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 12 Dec 2018, at 12:54, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 5:09:00 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 11

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On 12/12/2018 9:18 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 12 Dec 2018, at 12:54, Philip Thrift > wrote: On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 5:09:00 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 11 Dec 2018, at 12:58, Philip Thrift > wrote: On Tuesday, December 11, 201

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 11:18:48 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 12 Dec 2018, at 12:54, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 5:09:00 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 11 Dec 2018, at 12:58, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tuesday, D

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 12 Dec 2018, at 12:54, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 5:09:00 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 11 Dec 2018, at 12:58, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tuesday, December 11, 2018 at 5:41:49 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 11 Dec

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Wednesday, December 12, 2018 at 5:09:00 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 11 Dec 2018, at 12:58, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, December 11, 2018 at 5:41:49 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 11 Dec 2018, at 12:11, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> Nothing is "confirm

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 11 Dec 2018, at 12:58, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, December 11, 2018 at 5:41:49 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 11 Dec 2018, at 12:11, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> Nothing is "confirmed" and "made precise". >> >> (Derrida, Rorty, …) > > That would make Der

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On 12/11/2018 3:58 AM, Philip Thrift wrote: On Tuesday, December 11, 2018 at 5:41:49 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 11 Dec 2018, at 12:11, Philip Thrift > wrote: Nothing is "confirmed" and "made precise". (Derrida, Rorty, …) That would make Derrida and Rorty into ob

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tuesday, December 11, 2018 at 5:41:49 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 11 Dec 2018, at 12:11, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > Nothing is "confirmed" and "made precise". > > (Derrida, Rorty, …) > > > That would make Derrida and Rorty into obscurantism. Confirmation does not > make an i

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 11 Dec 2018, at 12:11, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, December 11, 2018 at 4:21:07 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 9 Dec 2018, at 21:45, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Sunday, December 9, 2018 at 6:03:27 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 7 Dec 2018,

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tuesday, December 11, 2018 at 4:21:07 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 9 Dec 2018, at 21:45, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Sunday, December 9, 2018 at 6:03:27 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 7 Dec 2018, at 21:17, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Friday, December 7,

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 9 Dec 2018, at 21:45, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Sunday, December 9, 2018 at 6:03:27 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 7 Dec 2018, at 21:17, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 9:39:15 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 7 Dec 2018, at

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Sunday, December 9, 2018 at 6:03:27 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 7 Dec 2018, at 21:17, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 9:39:15 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 7 Dec 2018, at 12:38, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Friday, December 7, 2

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 7 Dec 2018, at 21:17, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 9:39:15 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 7 Dec 2018, at 12:38, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:14:20 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 6 Dec 2018, at

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 9:39:15 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 7 Dec 2018, at 12:38, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:14:20 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 6 Dec 2018, at 12:33, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Thursday, December 6,

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 7 Dec 2018, at 12:38, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:14:20 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 6 Dec 2018, at 12:33, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Thursday, December 6, 2018 at 5:05:55 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 5 Dec 2018,

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:14:20 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 6 Dec 2018, at 12:33, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Thursday, December 6, 2018 at 5:05:55 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 5 Dec 2018, at 19:20, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Wednesday, December

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 6 Dec 2018, at 12:33, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Thursday, December 6, 2018 at 5:05:55 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 5 Dec 2018, at 19:20, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Wednesday, December 5, 2018 at 5:29:44 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 4 Dec 201

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Thursday, December 6, 2018 at 5:05:55 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 5 Dec 2018, at 19:20, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Wednesday, December 5, 2018 at 5:29:44 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 4 Dec 2018, at 17:48, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> On the truth of

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 5 Dec 2018, at 19:20, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Wednesday, December 5, 2018 at 5:29:44 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 4 Dec 2018, at 17:48, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >>> >>> >>> On the truth of computationalism, I mean to express emphatically that >>> computationalism i

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Wednesday, December 5, 2018 at 5:29:44 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 4 Dec 2018, at 17:48, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > >> >> >> On the truth of computationalism, I mean to express emphatically that >> *computationalism >> is indeed false*, and it should be replaced by what I call *

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 4 Dec 2018, at 17:48, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, December 4, 2018 at 6:37:01 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 4 Dec 2018, at 11:39, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tuesday, December 4, 2018 at 4:25:37 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 3 Dec 2018,

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Mon, Dec 3, 2018 at 6:05 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: >* It is very simple. Never claim to have the truth, and always present a > theory having verifiable consequences.* > Your theory is a working Turing Machine can be made without using matter or physics, so don't show me more squiggles, show me

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tuesday, December 4, 2018 at 6:37:01 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 4 Dec 2018, at 11:39, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, December 4, 2018 at 4:25:37 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 3 Dec 2018, at 23:01, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Monday, December 3,

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 4 Dec 2018, at 11:39, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, December 4, 2018 at 4:25:37 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 3 Dec 2018, at 23:01, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Monday, December 3, 2018 at 1:24:30 PM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 2 Dec 2018, a

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tuesday, December 4, 2018 at 4:25:37 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 3 Dec 2018, at 23:01, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Monday, December 3, 2018 at 1:24:30 PM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 2 Dec 2018, at 13:24, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Sunday, December 2,

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 3 Dec 2018, at 23:01, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Monday, December 3, 2018 at 1:24:30 PM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 2 Dec 2018, at 13:24, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Sunday, December 2, 2018 at 5:23:15 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 29 Nov 2018, a

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Monday, December 3, 2018 at 1:24:30 PM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 2 Dec 2018, at 13:24, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Sunday, December 2, 2018 at 5:23:15 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 29 Nov 2018, at 20:00, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Thursday, November 2

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 3 Dec 2018, at 12:24, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Monday, December 3, 2018 at 5:05:57 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > You assume a primary physical reality. I do not, and on the contrary show > that this idea is contradictory with the Mechanist theory. > > > > > Since Matt

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 2 Dec 2018, at 13:32, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Sunday, December 2, 2018 at 5:26:14 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 29 Nov 2018, at 20:24, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Thursday, November 29, 2018 at 10:44:05 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 27 Nov 20

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 2 Dec 2018, at 13:24, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Sunday, December 2, 2018 at 5:23:15 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 29 Nov 2018, at 20:00, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Thursday, November 29, 2018 at 10:27:00 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 27 Nov 20

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Monday, December 3, 2018 at 5:05:57 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > > You assume a primary physical reality. I do not, and on the contrary show > that this idea is contradictory with the Mechanist theory. > > > Since Matter (a material computer) can compute Mechanism, I don't see how M

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 30 Nov 2018, at 20:52, John Clark wrote: > > On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 1:53 PM Bruno Marchal > wrote: > > >>All I ask you to do is follow the scientific method. > > > I do, which is not so frequent in theology > > The scientific method in theology? You must be k

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Sunday, December 2, 2018 at 5:26:14 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 29 Nov 2018, at 20:24, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Thursday, November 29, 2018 at 10:44:05 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 27 Nov 2018, at 20:21, Brent Meeker wrote: >> >> >> What is this "primary

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Sunday, December 2, 2018 at 5:23:15 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 29 Nov 2018, at 20:00, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Thursday, November 29, 2018 at 10:27:00 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 27 Nov 2018, at 18:50, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tuesday, Novemb

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 29 Nov 2018, at 20:24, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Thursday, November 29, 2018 at 10:44:05 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 27 Nov 2018, at 20:21, Brent Meeker > >> wrote: >> >> >> What is this "primary matter" of which you speak? > > > X is Primary means basically that w

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 29 Nov 2018, at 20:00, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Thursday, November 29, 2018 at 10:27:00 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 27 Nov 2018, at 18:50, Philip Thrift > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tuesday, November 27, 2018 at 4:32:53 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 24 Nov

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 1:53 PM Bruno Marchal wrote: >>All I ask you to do is follow the scientific method. > > > *> I do, which is not so frequent in theology* > The scientific method in theology? You must be kidding. > *You are the one invoking your ontological commitment when defining real >

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 29 Nov 2018, at 16:36, John Clark wrote: > > On Wed, Nov 28, 2018 at 9:08 PM Martin Abramson > wrote: > > > How do they replicate themselves with the exact same memory engrams as > > before? Thanks for the response. m.a. > > The exact mechanism depe

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

What does this mean in terms of (the possibility of) making a Star Trek transporter? :) [ https://www.thoughtco.com/star-trek-instantaneous-matter-transport-3072118 ] - pt On Thursday, November 29, 2018 at 8:34:23 PM UTC-6, Monterey wrote: > > My original question was about copying memorie

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

My original question was about copying memories between identical carbon atoms. How does that work with DNA molecules? Are they composed of carbon atoms? On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 10:37 AM John Clark wrote: > On Wed, Nov 28, 2018 at 9:08 PM Martin Abramson > wrote: > > > *How do they replicate th

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Thursday, November 29, 2018 at 10:44:05 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 27 Nov 2018, at 20:21, Brent Meeker > > wrote: > > > What is this "primary matter" of which you speak? > > > > X is Primary means basically that we have to assume X (or something judged > enough equivalent). > >

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Thursday, November 29, 2018 at 10:27:00 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 27 Nov 2018, at 18:50, Philip Thrift > > wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, November 27, 2018 at 4:32:53 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 24 Nov 2018, at 17:27, John Clark wrote: >> >> >> >> >> Turing explained

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 28 Nov 2018, at 00:44, John Clark wrote: > > On Tue, Nov 27, 2018 at 5:32 AM Bruno Marchal > wrote: > > >>My commitment is with the scientific method, so when you make outlandish > >>claims (matter is not needed to make calculations Robison arithmetic alone > >

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 27 Nov 2018, at 20:21, Brent Meeker wrote: > > > > On 11/27/2018 2:38 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 25 Nov 2018, at 15:41, John Clark >> > wrote: >>> >>> On Sun, Nov 25, 2018 at 4:40 AM Philip Thrift >> > wrote: >>> >>> D

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 27 Nov 2018, at 18:50, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, November 27, 2018 at 4:32:53 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 24 Nov 2018, at 17:27, John Clark > >> wrote: > > > >> Turing explained how matter can behave intelligently, > > No. He showed how a person can be atta

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Wed, Nov 28, 2018 at 9:08 PM Martin Abramson wrote: > *How do they replicate themselves with the exact same memory engrams as > before? Thanks for the response. m.a.* > The exact mechanism depends on the specific example, computers have many different ways to duplicate information. In the

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